The Ariel Helwani Show - Inside Boxing | Sebastian Fundora dominates and stops Keith Thurman, Moses Itauma knocks out Jermaine Franklin

Episode Date: March 29, 2026

Dan Canobbio and Chris Algieri open up the show by reacting to Sebastian Fundora’s dominant stoppage victory over Keith Thurman, discussing his chances against the top talent at super welterweight. Is he ready for a Vergil Ortiz, 'Boots' Ennis or Xander Zayas (00:47)? Next up, they discuss 21-year-old prodigy Moses Itauma's knockout of Jermaine Franklin. Who will he fight next and could he one day share the ring with heavyweight icon Oleksandr Usyk (28:38)?

Hi, everyone, we are back. It's another episode of Inside Boxing, presented by ppv.com. And association was Uncrowned in Yahoo Sports. It's Dan Kenobio. It is Chris Algeri, and we're coming to you off of the heels of Sebastian Fondor, dominating Keith Thurman. Sixth round stoppage. He retains his 154-pound title at WBC,

and he looked pretty damn good in the process. Keith Thurman, probably the end of his long, illustrious career. I guess I said Moses Atalma put a hurting on Jermaine Franklin, which we'll get to as well. We'll start with Sebastian Fundora, putting the beat down on Keith Father Time, Thurman. Chris Al Jiri, how are you?

Yeah, I'm good. I'm good. Late 90 fights, obviously. My show on ProBox TV, calling those fights, got done, calling it with Christina Pontchere and Pulling La Anaji. Great team. Fantastic fights tonight, as always on Pro Box TV. But yes, we're talking Fondora and Thurman.

Not great fights. Not as good as a card as we had expected. But yeah, I mean, I had to speak in some people in Fight Week, and this is kind of expected in terms of the performance. But I don't know. Fondora looked good. I thought he looked smarter than usual. I thought the progression that we saw in the Tim Zoo rematch

was apparent once again. You know, he had the little bit of push-pull. He was getting better at using his length and his size to his advantage, which was silly that he used to always give it up. But also, he is a destructive puncher, and he's very smart in the way that he utilizes his weaponry. You know, the guy can land a short uppercut from halfway across the ring. You know, he can hit you at any point in the ring because he's that tall and long.

You know, he throws a rear uppercut from long range. He throws a lead uppercut from mid-range. So he's a wildly dangerous puzzle to figure out. And Keith had no answer. And I guess in hindsight, that's probably not that surprising. Keith was not a 54-pounder. But yeah, it was underwhelming, I should say. I expected a little more from Keith.

Talks to the big game. You know, had that illustrious run at 147. But ultimately, like I said, father time. over one time. By the time gets everybody, he just looks slow, the legs weren't there, and also you're fighting a guy,

like you said, with an 80-inch reach, and has also noticed how to use it now. That's what we're seeing from Fondora, his first couple of fights of his career when he was fighting on TV, it was like, all right, look who is this freak?

Look at this tall guy, and he was like, Bambi. He couldn't barely walk and move at the same time, and we slowly watched him grow up before our eyes and gained more momentum, and gain more confidence. And then the first zoo fight was impressive. The second zoo fight is where I think now Thurman, I mean, Fondora can settle in now,

and this is like what he's going to be. He's going to be a guy that pumps his jab. He's going to be a guy that throws power shots and lands power shots. I mean, his jab was really impressive. He threw 44 jabs per round in this fight. We're talking about a guy that never used to throw the jab. We always wondered, why does he fight in the inside when he's, He has a billion-inch reach advantage over his opponents, but he's now settling in.

And he started with the jab. And then he didn't even get out of first gear. Like, did you see, I didn't see Fondura exert any extra energy in this fight. He stuck behind his jab and threw short, concise power shots and just kept finding a home for them until the fight was ultimately stopped. I think Fondora is really coming into his own, but we've got to see him now with an elite, a level opponent. I mean, the zoo, we've seen what zoo has become, obviously Keith Thurman's at the end of his career. Fadour's 28 years old. He's an elite level talent.

We've got to see him with an elite opponent, whether it's Virgil or cheese, whether it's one of the names at 154. There's a lot to choose from. But that's outside of maybe his control. But, I mean, this guy, we're looking at a guy in Fondora who's really coming into his own at 28. I don't agree. I don't think we learned a goddamn thing tonight. Keith didn't try to win. He didn't bring anything.

You're talking about the evolution of Sebastian Ford. He didn't have to show one. He didn't have to go out of first gear. He didn't fight out of his... He said after the fight, this is the biggest fight of my career, and I was nervous because of Keith Thermon. He didn't do anything outside of... You know, he fought his fight.

I will say that. You're right. Thurman was atrocious. What is his fight? Trying to walk down a guy who's... Fondura. Yeah, but that's what I mean? Like, what is his fight?

That's not his fight. That's not his fight. He didn't fight. There wasn't a fight tonight. It wasn't a fight. Dermin didn't fight. I know he didn't fight, but Fondora did. I expected more of a fight as well, and I thought Dermon was going to try a lot more.

You know, you could see right away his legs are not there. He was getting stopped with basically just an arm post by Fondora. He got stung with a left hand and got caught with a shot that was not hard at all. And even Fondora smiled at there was like, Oh, dude, I didn't even hit you. And this is, this is what we're going to deal with. This is what it's going to be? Okay.

I don't think we'll learn a goddamn thing about Fondora tonight. I think we're on a lot more in the second zoo fight. This, yeah, this is, this was, I don't know what this was. This was an exhibition of just, you know, Fondora beating the old guard, I guess. And listen, I've heard people talking about, oh, he's going to fight Charlo next. And Spence, I don't want to see him fight any of these old guys anymore. Go fight the real guys. We're 54. There's a ton of studs. Go fight those guys. I don't want to see him run through the PBC

gamut of the guys who are good 10 years ago. I don't want to see him with Spence. I don't want to see him with Charlo. I want to see him fight the studs that are in this division. Zandar Zias, Geron Ennis, Virgil Ortiz, Behochuk, Brandon Adams, Katsurakis. I want to see him fight tough guys. I don't want to rematch with Mendoza, which is like the lowest rung on the ladder. There was a loss tonight. I know, he did, but like, it's still, like he got knocked you out. Like, go, go, go get that back. No, I totally agree.

You might not agree with me that I thought, with the Fondora point, I think he stayed within his, in his game plan. And obviously, he wasn't going up against much, but that, that matters to me a little bit. But I will agree with you on the fact that he needs to fight someone around his age and someone around his skill level. It's the one thing I said to open up the show. Virgil Ortiz. I felt bad for, I honestly, I felt bad for Herman because he was throwing shots and missing

by 18 inches because he's just, his timing was off. He hasn't been in the ring. His timing was off and he wasn't, he didn't have, he didn't want to get inside. Like it was hilarious. Like they go, I think it was a fifth round, fifth heading. His coach goes, you can't stay on the outside is too dangerous. You got to get inside. It was like, all right, I get inside.

Then what? I think Moro, it was actually hilarious. Morro was like, easier said than done, corner man. Because it was like, you're, You're not getting inside. Like, it's the fifth round, and you haven't figured out of way. You're also 37 years old. You've made millions.

Like, getting inside on Fondora means you're going to get beat up even more than you're already beat up. His face was splattered. So I thought the stoppage was early, and then I saw his face, and I was like, I see where the ref was coming from. I still thought it was early. And Keith did argue the stoppage, but. For about a second.

For, yeah. I mean, but he was getting hammered. and Fondor was starting to turn, just starting to turn on. Like just starting. Like I said, he was in that first gear for a while. Maybe he would have gotten to second gear

and then put a real exclamation point on it. But Fondor out landed Thurman 96 to 28. Thurman only landed 28 punches in this fight, 26 of 25 of them power shots. Fondor landed 50% of his power. I don't think he landed that many. I didn't see that many punches land. How many are you wrong?

Now you're attack. I can comp you box. What is going on here? 28 punches is not a lot of punches, Chris, in six rounds. Yeah, I know. I watched the fight. That's four landed punches around for Thurmond. Point being is Fondora landed 50% of his power shots,

and he threw 44 jabs around. That is a recipe that I want to see him in there with elite level talent. That's a recipe that could have him beating some of the bigger names at 154. fight in the rear view, and let's hope that Fondora steps in there with Virgil Ortiz. Virgil Ortiz needs a dance partner. Let's hope Virgil Ortiz figures it out with his promoter, and Golden Boy. They're going to run them through the PBC gamut, guarantee it. So what?

Who's it going to be then? Charlo. No one. Charlo Fondora this summer? I think there's an expectation that Spence is going to beat Zoo, and then we're going to get Spence and Vondora. This is this is writing on the wall

We'll see if it happens I mean you know Boxing is boxing But yeah Again They're gonna run the PBC gamut Well if you go through the top 10 But I'm looking at the Ring magazine

Zias and Boots is signed They both pretty much confirmed it today On social media It's great for the formal announcement But they did but it was kind of like crypto Like it was it was cryptic It was pretty obvious Boots I mean they're both

Now interacting with other But why? But why not be like, I'm fighting this guy? Probably because they need the zone to announce it first. Then why announce it at all? Why not? They're fighting each other. Virgil.

Boots is fighting Zias. So Virgil Ortiz is out there. Like you said, he's got promotional issues, so we don't exactly know. We're talking about potential opponents for Fondura. But Dreamoff, you got Josh Kelly, who's a champion. You got Mertazalev, you got Brandon Adams, you got Abbas Barow. This is the top 10. Then you also have not in the top ten.

And fighters that you believe Fondora will be fighting is an Errol Spence who is apparently he's going to lock horns with Tim Zhu. And then Jermel Charlo, who was in attendance on Saturday night. And has been in the gym. And has been shown in the video. He's been sparring with or training with Spence. Yeah. Watch.

Yeah. I would not be surprised. I mean, I know we know how the business works. I mean, we come on the show and we talk about what we want to see. That's why I think we have a successful podcast here because we say, this is what we want to see. This is what should happen. Fondora should fight Virgil Ortiz. Fondora should look for the winner of Zias and boots.

But you hear him in the ring afterwards. He's such a good soldier, Fondora. Like my dad is my manager. He's guided me along. You know, PBC has done so much for me. Samson Lucas has done so much for me. Yes, they have. But you see a guy in Fondora who, like, it almost like they tell him what's going.

what it's going to be, and he just says, okay. Yeah, he's a warrior. I don't knock him for that. I mean, at one point of his career, he'll have to take the reins. But, like, right now, I get it. And listen, if they're going to feed you the old guard, you take it. But there's going to be a point where he's like, you know what, I actually am the best in the world.

And I need to prove it because there's other guys in this weight class who have championships. There's other guys in this way class that people are saying are the best in the world. I got to go beat them. There's going to be a point where he does that. And he says that. And that's when there's going to be a real change. But for the time being, yeah, I mean, if you want to feed him these 37-year-old guys, former champions in different weight classes, then, yeah, why not?

So now you're good with that jarlow fight then? Oh, I'm not good with it, but I'm like, it's going to happen. I'm just, I'm just, it's a foregone conclusion. You're coming to terms with it? You're coming to terms of it. I came, I came to this, this talk today, this TED talk that is going to be these guys. And it's just, that's just the way it is. And we have to accept the fact that he fought Keith Therm.

is crazy. With all the talent in this division, you've got to bring up a 47-pounder who had one fight at this weight class who has not been relevant in five, six, seven years. Yeah, no. I mean, come on. I don't, I know, we just, we like Keith.

We'd like Keith. That's why we were like, yes, this fight is starting to make sense as you get closer to it. But then when you watch the fight, you're like, okay, that's what was always going to happen. Oh, yeah. I mean, I thought that would be more moments,

but yeah i thought i thought i thought i thought i thought i thought he'd got too much money he's got too much he's at the end of his career this was the final payday for him he didn't want to make it that type of fight uh but yeah obviously but but but okay so so so you didn't want to make it that kind of fight but you still got beat the fuck up and your face got like destroyed they got hammered like i mean i listen i was a guy always went on my shield i've been i've been knocked out i've been stopped like i tried to win every fight i was ever been like i tried to win you know like even even when I was an old man fighting young guys, like I still tried to win.

And listen, I got my head knocked off, but like, I still, I go to sleep at night and I'd be like, yeah, I've tried to win. You know, like, yeah, I made a lot of money too. So I don't think Thurman tried to win. Did he look like he tried to win? No, I didn't. He had like one moment.

He landed one good shot. Yeah, he's in the fought the wrong range. He just stood in them. He was in like in the middle. No man's land. That's not where you want to be. No man's land is correct. That's where he was.

You don't want to be in no man's land against Fondor. And I said this about Fondora because it's really hard to fight. I'm not knocking Keith. It's really hard to fight Fondora because being all the way out and all the way in is such a huge gap. To be all the way out, you basically have to be in your corner and he's in his corner because he can hit you at any time. He's going to make you work hard. In hindsight, thinking about this fight, you got a 37-year-old set of legs. And Keith was not a head movement guy.

He's not going to stand in front of you and be slick and Mike you missed. He was a footwork guy. He would make you miss by being out of range and being explosive. and being athletic enough to like dive that around, should then slip, slip, slip, slide. You know, like he wasn't like a big head-moving guy. He was more of a footwork guy. And you explode in.

That's a really tough style to make work at 37 when you've got a guy you can hit you from 75% of the ring. So, yeah, I mean, the writing was on the wall for this. Who out there could beat Fundura? Virgil. Geron. I think Xander would have a lot of trouble with that style.

It's a tough style, man. It's a nightmare for absolutely everyone. That's what I was trying to say at the beginning. It's like he's honing in his ridiculous attributes. And mentally he seems like he's locked in. And he's using his jab and he's fighting smart. And then he is unloading. That's dangerous.

This guy is dangerous, man. I'm going out of limb. He's number three to me. I have Virgil and Boots as the flip-flopping one and two. And he's number three. Zias four. Strong force. I really like, I really like Zias.

I really, and I think he's an ever-improving fighter, and I think he's a nightmare for everybody as well. But yeah, that's my top four at 54. That's crazy, because two of those guys are fighting each other. Yeah. For a tournament. That's what we want. That's what we want.

But I don't think we're not going to see Virgil for a long time. His arbitration is not for another 90 days, according to Rick Murgan. You're locked into the news now. You're hosting these lives. You're more locked in than I am, because I didn't even know that. I know. I'm a host now.

It's crazy. So I didn't actually know the Virgil's situation, so 90 more days until he could even get to the table? Arbitration, yep. Yeah, merging, he really messed that up. I don't, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.

I don't know what the right answer is. He tried something? and it blew up in his face. They tried to dance around Oscar. They tried to make the fight without Oscar. They thought they had a loophole with the DeZone broadcast of the lapse in the contract. And then it failed.

It blew up in his face. There's no doubt about it. Like Virgil was on the shelf now. And he's watching his super fight go out the window to a guy in Zias. Zias boots now this summer. Not Virgil this summer. Part of the thing is

It's People underestimate Oscar And you really shouldn't He's a very smart guy He's got more money than Rick Mauritian You got better lawyers He's also just He's smart

He understands And people are gonna probably knock me For saying Oscar's smart But you're wrong if you don't think he is He's a very smart guy And he's very aware Yes he says a lot of wild things Yes his delivery is really

Interesting Is a nice very smart guy Yeah Because he's a very smart guy. He's very aware of this sport. He understands the business very, very well. And if you notice, he was never sweating the deal. He was never sweating the lack of network deal.

And that always stuck out to me. I'm like, he doesn't seem too worried about not having this network deal. And then you look at Golden Boy, and they were still doing shows. They were doing one-offs in between the negotiating. Obviously, they were talking. Obviously, he was negotiating. Obviously, he knew there was a deal getting worked out with their lawyers. and he sat with that

and he held that over Rick and Virgil in terms of their situation and I know they were holding that as a big point because listen you lose your network deal and you got a star you get a big problem

it's part of the contract he never sweat that that was an indication that he has something in the works and obviously he did because the deal got done yeah I mean Austria's got his own way about doing things

he is a former fighter and a former fighter is a current fighter because fighters never go, never die. So he still got that, but yeah, I don't know. I think people really underestimate Oscar's ability to do these things. And I'm a guy who knocks Oscar as a disruptor for deals. But at the same time, I mean, he's telling you, and he knows this business.

Well, I kind of understand where Oscar, he doesn't have a huge table. And he's not going to let one of his star fighters just dip, like a minute before they're about to fight in the biggest fight of their career. That's, I understand where Austin's coming from. I understand where Marigen was coming from because he's like, all right, I can see this fight slipping away. So let me try something here. He tried and it failed.

And Oscar's like, you know what? Like Virgil, if you do fight boots, it's going to be with me because I've invested in you for years now. So the whole shake out of that is that we're going to see Boots versus Zias June 27th at the Barclays Center. And hopefully Fondora gets in the mix. That's what we're trying to get out here, right? The top four guys are all right there. the same age and they're all fighting around the same time. So we should be able to see that.

But you know how this business works. And I would not be shocked if Fundura fights Jamel Charlo. Not shocked at all this summer or late summer. Houston. I'm going to check up Polymarket and see what their betting line is for that. This is a Draft Kings podcast, but yeah, I agree. The markets. Well, Draft Kings doesn't bet on if a fight's going to happen.

They will. They will. They should. They should get into it. They should also get into like how long Trump's inauguration speech is going to be just like Pollymarket. My brother just had it up. It's crazy. He was looking at.

And Dan is going to drop that ball during one of these episodes. No, I got the five-one favorite. This thing's tight. Tight. Yeah, so Fondora, I thought, fought within his means and did what he was supposed to do the night. Keith didn't put up much of a fight. Fondora moves on. But after doing that to Keith Thurman, because Keith Thurman is a big name.

And Fondura did say that after the fight to Jim Gray. I was nervous this morning because Keith is such a big name and this is a big fight for me. But now, as any elite fighter out there's going to become new pressures on Fondura, you have to fight. We want to see you with an elite guy now. I want to see how you stack up with the top guys at 154 or even the top 10 at 154 because Zoo isn't. And Thurman definitely is it. So as impressive. And Charlo's not.

Charlo's not. I mean, these are names, yes. And that's the PVC is, that's how they survive is off of names. It's time for Fondora to get in there with a top 10 guy at the ring, you know, a ring rated top 10 guy or top 10, consensus top 10 guy. Because you start peeling back Fondora's resume. You did this on Friday's episode. I mean, it's zoo.

It's zoo and it's Thurman. And it's Lubin. The fight was a million. years ago, the Lubin fight, and he hasn't... And Quirdle Booker. Yeah, no, I mean, it's not the top level guy. Five fights ago, he was getting starched by Brian Mendoza, who lost on the undercard, by the way. Yeah.

Let's get into the undercard. That was some nasty stuff. Also underwhelming. Ewenly Hernandez. He's a beast. He's a beast. He is a problem. I really like him.

Really like him. He is going to be a big time. If he stays at 160, and 160 keeps playing out the way it's been. playing out and Adamas leaves, he's the guy at 160. The guy's got a neck like a fullback. Yeah. His shoulders and neck. And he's just, he's athletic.

He's having fun in there. He's so, he's super talented. You know, and how do you say his name? Gouche? Is it Gouche? Gauta? I can't even, I can't believe I don't know how to say. And he's fought how many PC cards?

I know. He's fought everyone. And it's no respect. He's a great fighter. I think they were saying Gauchet. I've been saying Gauchet on the... I've been saying Gauchet for a long time, but I've...

That's what they were saying on the broadcast? All right, Gauchet, it is, Gauchet. So, we're going with Gauchet. And a very tough guy. He's kind of like the litmus test for a lot of fighters

as they step, you know, into that next range. But, like, he gave Zhu hell. He dropped him, but, you know, Zhu showed his class and was able to get past him. Obviously, this is an older version of him.

But yo-yo is super talented. I really like what I see from him, and I think he's going to be a big problem. He reminds me of like a Carlos Adomas, except more dynamic. And I think, I think at 160, I think you're right. I think he, he's going to be a real problem. Yeah, he's ranked number two right now in the ring. At 60? Yeah.

Wow. So if Adamas was to stay at 160, they could fight for the vacant ring title, but Adamas is already moving up to 168. He said it last week. Maybe he'll stay. No one wants to fight you in Lee Hernandez. No. He offers very little final.

financially, and he's an absolute beast. There's not many other names at middleweight. You know how bad middleweight is. I thought he looked good. Tejas got a win over Mendoza, nasty headbutt early on in the fight. He could have easily gotten out of that fight with that, and he chose not to and fought on against a tough guy.

I was very impressed. Very, very impressed. I'm a fan of Tejas for taking that decision, because he had an easy out. Getting paid either way. getting paid either way didn't have to go on chose to go on

and fought a very very top Brian Mendoza and was still very much in control and fought a very smart fight absolutely part of me I was watching that he took like the full five minutes it was like a head-on collision

a lot of blood I mean a fucking gallon of blood was on the canvas and their corner did a phenomenal job didn't bleed for the rest of the fight but you're right I thought when he took the full five and he looked dazed

I was like, Cray, well, a lot of fighters are going to, are going to be able to go on with the fight and you're going to

get no decision and that's that. No, he definitely won over a lot of the crowd. He won over a lot of fans and he's looked good since that lost to Boral.

That was the undercard. First Friday night, the big, the goog, heavyweight stopped. Had a nice win there too. So yeah, it was a fun card,

pbccc, pbv. dot com, but we want to see Earl Newman Jr. upset over Elijah Garcia. Huge. I'm so pissed. I didn't bet that. That was the one I was looking at. Did you see Roy Jones' corner work?

So I was working the ProBox TV show, so I did not see the fight. But if you would have asked me, I would have told you that Earl was going to win. I've been speaking to Earl this week. We used to spar back in Vegas 10 years ago. and Elijah is another guy that I've called a bunch of his fights, and he's just so up and down, and I know that, not Earl, that Newman has been, Kevin, I said Earl. Earl Newman's, Nicknames, Earl Newman's.

Earl's another Newman that is from New York, but Kevin, yes. He is a guy that I've talked to over the years and really, really good, really good dude, and has been looking for his moment, and this week we were talking, and I'm like, hey man, this is a really good fight for him. I'm excited for you, and he's like, it's my time. And he saw him at the way in. They look like they're in two different weight class. Kevin looked jacked and heavy and strong.

And Elijah was just, you know, he looked flat. And he missed weight, Elijah. And he missed weight. It was like 172. Yeah. Second time he's done that. And this guy with Elijah Garcia, they had such high hopes for him, PBC. He beats Resendez.

And then he knocked him out. He knocked him out. It's crazy. And then he loses, you know, back to back or two. To Kiron Davis. Kyron Davis, he loses to him. And now Kevin Newman. Yeah.

Who you sport, no offense. He's old. I mean, well, yeah. Yeah. But Roy had a phenomenal moment. It's gone viral. You get bitched out. That's what he said when he was, the fight was slipping away.

Awesome moment. Awesome. Like Roy's defining trainer moment. He obviously had so many moments. Because, you know, Roy's, he's not the best train. Like, he's never going to become close to what he was in the ring. like weird when you see a fighter that talented become a coach. Like you very rarely see, like, Larry Bird came a really good head coach in the NBA.

But like Wayne Gretzky was a horrendous NHL coach. So when you see a guy as good as Roy in the corner, it's like, do what I did in my career, you know, jump. Do some. Well, no. Kevin's the only guy who actually does things Roy used to do and actually does them well. Like a lot of his style actually does mimic Roy. He just doesn't have the power, the speed, you know, he isn't, you know, a lot of things he has. But you know what I mean?

Like, Roy's had some great moments as a trainer. But, like, this is going to go, I should live on for a long time. It's the new, we are firemen. Yeah, with Tim Bradley and Teddy Atlas. And so what's some of the other ones? You know, you can't handle your speed. You're blowing it, kid. The famous one, the most famous of all time.

You're blowing it, kid. You're blowing it. And then he, Freddie Roach to pack you. He can't handle your speed, son. So there have been some phenomenal moments in the corner, but it's really cool to see Roy. And then it was an upset. I think he was plus 280 underdog. Yeah, I wanted to bet that.

I couldn't draft Kings was not working for me in California, so I couldn't make bets on any of the card tonight, which I would have won a bunch on ProBox. Well, you would have lost on that Thermat bet, though. What was my bet on the Thermal? You're going to spread the CO. Oh, yeah, yes, right. That's right.

That's right. That's right. I missed out on Talmo, which we're going to get to right now. By Sprinkle, I was going to put $20. By the way. I put my, this is what I was going to do. I was getting down to a very small amount in my draft King's account. So I was like, whatever I have left, I'm putting on Atama, rounds three and four.

If that wins, then I'll put it on Thurman. I lost because the Talma knocked out in the fifth round. I missed it by a damn round. That was brutal, dude. Yeah, let's talk about that. So I was actually watching that during the ProBox TV podcast, a telecast. Like, we was like right before we started and then a little bit into our first fight. And I'm looking at it.

I'm watching it with Pauli, and I'm pointing, because, Because Zatama was breathing really hard at the round two. And I'm like, whoa. I'm like, this guy blow his load? Like, what's going to happen? No, he's just a big super athlete. He's really a nightmare to deal with. And God damn, he can punch.

Bro, people forget or not forget, or he's 6'5. I forget. I forget. I kept saying to deploy, I'm like, I forgot how big he is. He's 6'5. He's a big guy. 240, because you look at it, he's so fast. He should not be that fast.

Should not be that fast. fast. Way too athletic, way too fast. It's crazy. He is a freaking demon. Like, Moses Atama is a demon. We're watching a demon. We're watching a phenom. We're watching the future of heavyweight boxing. He stops Jermaine Franklin. Franklin's never been down, never been stopped. He stopped him. He said, I wanted to get the knockout earlier. I went back to basics. And Franklin wasn't really participating in this fight. He was not throwing a lot. And as you know, if you watch a lot of boxing, it's very hard to knock out a stationary target who's that's not throwing so atama had to generate all that on his own and it was a phenomenal uppercut and i think franklin was out on his feet and they got hit with another shot on the way down but atama's a problem this was a huge statement i understand franklin is not coming he wasn't looking at to win and uh you know atama was supposed to win but there's a lot of pressure when you're supposed to win a fight and the whole entire arena is there to watch you have a spectacular knockout, then you deliver one at age 21, freak. Boxing's in good hands.

Yes. If he is the future of heavyweight division and we always say that the boxing lives and dies by the heavyweight division, it matters tremendously for the health of the sport. Yes, it's in good hands because Moses Atama is the total package. And this is a really impressive victory. I was a guy that was saying, hey, Benjamin Franklin, man, Ben Franklin. Germain Franklin is a guy This man created electricity. Yeah, I mean, he curled electricity, and he still...

Turned the lights on. Still got put his lights put out. No. So, yeah, he's a guy that I was always impressed with the way that he fought Anthony Joshua. He took it to him. He was outgunned. He had a guy with major firepower.

Philip Dylan White could also really punch. So it's a guy, he's durable at least. He throws a lot of punch. He got fast hands. He was a national, a world champion, actually, in the amateurs. And then Mosetama, who has zero, sorry, zero, has like 20-something amateur fights,

goes out there and what, 14 pro fights and looked as good as he did, controlling the space, fought hard, got pushed a little bit, put him down, finished him with a, I mean, a brilliant highlight real knockout with the uppercut. He is a motherfucking problem. Big time problem, bro. And, yeah, he did what he was supposed to do, and he delivered. That's the most important thing he delivered. and you could, maybe there's some pressure on him heading in.

And he actually said that after the fight. He said, I did something that a lot of British fighters couldn't do to this opponent. Suttles shot. That's what you're looking for. Yeah, subtle shot. He didn't mention A.J. by name, he didn't mention the other was. Dillian. Dillian White.

He didn't mention him by name, but we knew what he was talking about. I mean, he already destroyed Dillian in a round, so. Oh, yeah. So, yeah, he gets the win at Talma. And then afterwards, like, this fight was a foregone conclusion. it was just a matter of how many rounds. Like, it's under the six and a half, not the third or fourth round.

It loves my bet. One's in the fifth. And then you get to the post-fight interview, which I thought I added Al-Adeipo did a phenomenal job with, like, let's just get right to it. Let's just get right to it. Who's next? So Frank Warren says that Atama will fight in July,

and that he will fight for a world title by the end of the year. So if Ussick's tied up with Verhoven and Wardley is tied up with Dubois. I mean, those are the title fights? So are we going to see another type of Franklin opponent in July for Atama? He said he wanted Hergavik. Hergavik is fighting Dave Allen for some reason. So I'm curious about what we're going to see next because that's what we want to see is like him gradually step it up.

Will it be another Franklin type opponent because they foresee a title shot at the end of the year, which he's now ranked number one in two different organizations? I want to see him with a young guy. I want to see him against Richard Torres. Yeah. That's the fight I want. Torres is fighting Frank Sanchez for the IBF mandatory position. If Frank Sanchez's need doesn't explode.

Yeah. Every day. I want to see Richard Torres and Moses Atama. I want to see him a young, hungry guy who's going to bring it because Richard will. He's already called him out. I tip my hat to Richard. He wants all the smoke with the toughest guy in the division that everyone's talking about. That's exactly how I want young heavyweights to move.

So that's the fight that I want next, which I think will prepare him. I got to see him with a young guy. I got to see him with a young hungry guy because we haven't seen that yet. We've seen him, you know, starting to take out the old guys. And he does it in a spectacular faction. I want to see him with a young guy who's got a lot to lose, who's undefeated, who doesn't know how to lose. And that's Richard Torres. Do you think

Queensberry would do that given the scenario? I'll be talking about this on Friday's episode. I said it's a huge risk. It's a huge risk. I would love to see that fight. It'll probably be Jared Anderson because he was just signed to Queensberry

and that's another... It fills the... It fills the category that I just said. A young guy with a good record who's talented, who's also, you can introduce him to American audience.

So Jared answered would fill that. think. Oh, if Atalma comes over here, that would be nice. Yeah. You stage a fight in Vegas with Jared Anderson and Moses Atalma. You introduce American audiences to Moses Atalma. He has to defeat a guy like Jared Anderson who looks the part, fights the part, talks the part that American audiences are familiar with. You know, he took a loss to Bacoli. But yeah, I think that's, that's, you know, he's had wins since then. Yeah. I mean, he needs, he needs to fight a young guy an American guy,

and either one of those guys fits the bill, but Queensberry just signed Jared. You think they're not signing him to feed him to Atama? Atama's the future. I don't think it will be Torres. I think Torres is going to go

that IBF route. I think it's too risky because, like we said on Friday show, Atama's being moved so much, it's getting moved so much differently than a 21-year-old 14-fight guy. He's already number one in two different organizations.

So he's going to hold on to that. Careful which wish for. Yeah, I would like to see him fight the Wardley Dubois winner. I mean, they pretty much said, like, oh, he's not going to fight Wardley because they're stablemates. They're both trained by Ben Davison. That's not confirmed, but we're already hearing that nonsense. If Dubois gets passed Wardley, you can see Dubois versus Atama. Cabell is the WBC mandatory in the interim, so he's holding on hope to fight Usik.

and then you have the names that I liked is ranked 4, 5, and 6 in the Ring magazine right now right ahead of Atama at 7. That's Hergavik, Zhang, Bacoli. Any three of those I'd be fine with. And Atama said, I wanted

Hergavik for this fight right here, but he's fighting Dave Allen, which is a complete waste of time. Butama Bikoli, Atama Zhang. Now, it doesn't exactly fall into your young guy category, but Bacoli's 32. Zhang's 42. Still tests. Names.

You're still keeping him in the old guard, but they're more difficult than a Franklin. Because Franklin's test was his chin, because he's not a puncher. Zhang's test is his punch, because he's a puncher. So, you know, Dillion White was the first test of

the puncher. How does he deal with a puncher? But I think White was way past his prime, and I think he was chinned already. Zhang, he's been stopped, got stopped to the body. You know, it's another incremental test. One that I think that,

the Talma passes brilliantly, but very, very possible. Zhang is also willing to fight anybody. I know that about him and his team, especially at this stage of his career. Don't hate it, but Koli, another test of a guy who can punch.

He's also durable, not maybe that durable, because Parker starched him and Parker's not a puncher. How about Parker? Parker's a very stiff challenge. Is he suspended? I have no idea what's going on with that.

Yeah, that's really fallen by the wayside in terms of the news minute. That's a very stiff challenge. That's a big step up. That's a test positive for cocaine and then just is gone. Yeah. Also, that's, all right, I'm going to go,

who cares? It's not a performance that can drug. It's a party drug. If anything, it hurts you. Like, who cares?

You shouldn't, you shouldn't have a, a two-year ban for fucking Coke. You shouldn't have a year ban. Like, I don't know. I think Parker's too risky

for a time at this stage. I do too. I do too. I think he's way too much experience. Coli is actually perfect. It's a tough fight too, though. Very tough fight.

I think Zhang is a, is an easier, next incremental step where people are still going to be like, yeah, it's a step up, but like, because you're seeing

how they're moving them. They're moving him very smart. Frank Warren is very smart. Oh, dude, he's got every heavyweight. He's cornered the market on heavy weights, which is a brilliant move because obviously, very public, his problems with Turkey and Ring and Zufa. Frank's a bad guy to have as an enemy. He has cornered the market on the heavyweight division. What are you going to do with your heavyweights now?

He's got the young, he's got the middle, he's got the old. What are you going to do now? He's got him all. He's got cabal. He's got fury to a degree. Wardly, DuBois. Dubois? He's got the future of the heavyweight division in Talma.

Like, come on. Matt's just having a tie. He probably burns, Burns, Eddie, that he doesn't have Atama. Atama is clearly like the next ticket seller. He's, I don't know if he'll ever hit the Wembley status. I mean, they're talking about it. A thousand percent, Dan, he is going to be the future of the heavyweight division. He's just not like, yes, he's obviously in phenomenal prospect in the ring.

Does he have like the charisma? Doesn't need it. He's so goddamn good. Yeah, he's so good. He doesn't matter. Like, AJ, you got blinded by the charisma. He just, he just upper cutted Franklin's head off. That was sick.

The guy's never been down. He decapitated him. Went down like, like a video game. Like, no. Yeah, it was like, yeah, it was crazy. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Yeah, he should.

I hope he does. I'm really rooting on him to do that. Because boxing desperately needs it, even if it's not an American. I wish he was American, but he's not. Look at Usik's profile, Usox's personality. Took him a long time to break through. He just beats everybody. You beat everybody?

Yeah. And Ucic beats everybody by like incremental men. Like Atama knocks their heads off. That's huge. That's such a big difference. You're right. Because on the broadcast, they said, there is no one that fights like Atama in the heavyweight division. There is no one like Atama.

I'm like, does Usik? retire and Uzek die because I know unless they means like Usoc wasn't as powerful or yeah no he's not explosive yeah but he still has fair sure knockouts Uick he does especially lately but in cruiserie too and and and I mean the way he knocked out Bellew oh my god sent him guys asleep sleep on the bottom rope yeah so I'm glad you brought up Usset because I don't think we're ever going to see Atama versus Usoc I just don't think their timelines are going to match up I don't think we see Wardley Ussick I don't think we see Wardly Ussick I I don't think we see Atama Usik. I don't think we see Ajikabail Usik, honestly.

That's the discussion because Atama's jumping the line here. I have people in my mention saying it's Atama Usik right now, one, two in the heavyweight division. I just don't see it happening. I just don't think their timelines are on pace to see each other. I think Ussick is going to fight maybe one more fight after Verhoeven, two, if we're lucky, and it's just not going to be Atama. So I have no problem or I do have a problem because I want to see it. but I think Atama isn't going to get that passing of the torch moment. I'm not going to see a Joshua and a Klitsko type of fight where it happens in the ring. I think Ussick will retire and then Atama will take over the reins.

Yeah, I agree. I think we see Usoc one more time after RICO, and it's going to be Tyson Fury. Then we can rightfully judge UcS. Because the jury's still out. No, we can't. No, no, we don't. We just consider him retired. That's all.

We just consider him done. And we just, we go on to the next up and, coming guys. We go on to Wardley. We go on to Dubois. We go on to the next guard. The next guard is Wardley, Cabayel, Dubois, Atama, and there's nothing wrong with that. That's pretty good. That's why I'm a little upset with him. It's pretty fucking good. Because it's like

oh, he fought everyone, he cleared everyone out, beat him twice, he's allowed to have a cash grab fight. Yes, you are allowed to have a cash grab fight. Well, he's got Rico. That's his cash grab fight. And then he's got But what does he do after that, Usik? We still have to wait and see. We still, I can't fully eviscerate Usik because he's flirted with Cabell. Last week, he had a quote.

He said, maybe it's not Fury. Maybe it's Cabell. He fights Cabell, then okay, yeah. It's not going to be Atama. I just don't see it. I would be absolutely shocked if Usik fights Atama before the end of his career. I'd be shopped. He fights Wardley, too.

I know he's mentioned it and I don't see that. I don't see him fighting the winner of Wardley and Dubois. For one, Dubois wins, which he very well-mill. Very Will-May. No one cares to see that, so that doesn't happen. If Wardley wins, I don't think he fights Wardley. I think it's too dangerous of a fight. I don't think it's as big a profile he's probably looking for.

Which is a more winnable fight, Cabell or Wardley? Cabell by far. Yeah, because Worley's just got the one-hitter-quitter. He's way bigger. He's more athletic. Cabell had so much trouble with that Polish fighter. In the first two rounds that I fight, I was like,

Ah, Ussick's going to eviscerate this guy. And then he came back with some awesome body shots. And Cabell is super fun. He's the Otero Gadi of the Hayway Division. I love him, but I'm not knocking him. But the stylist, the style doesn't match up with Usek. What if Usoc ends his career? Rehoven, Kavayel,

Atama. Legend. Does he win him all? I don't know. Yeah, does it, like, I'll ask you right now. Usik Atama. How does that look? He stops Rico.

I think he actually stops Kabeel. But by the time he gets to Atama, I don't know. Because you've got to figure he's going to be like two years. It could be a year and a half. Yeah. So Uc, you know, he might not be able to move like he once did. And Atama is just getting better and better. Listen, the kryptonite for Usik is his body.

And Kabiel is the best heavyweight body puncher I've ever seen. Does that take? Fucking Atalma, though. I know, but he might even lose the Cabell in the way, is my point. It's like, if he, if an older Ussic gets caught with the body shots of Cabell, like, does he make it through that? But Atalma in like a year and a half. Atalma in 18 months versus Ucac in 18 months. Atalma in 18 months may be unstoppable.

It's possible. God, in WWE, if Vince McMahon is pulling the strings here. we get the Atalma Usik fight. It's like the biggest thing ever in the UK, passing of the guard. I mean, if there's been more of a Vince McMahon in boxing than Frank Warren, then let me know. Teflot. Frankie. He is... With the bullet dent in his head.

Yeah, I mean, he's from the movie Snatch. What was his name? Taking on the Saudis. Bricktop. He's Bricktop. From Snatch. Like, you can't, like, yeah. I mean, Frank, Frank probably feeds people to pig.

Like he's that much of a badass gangster. We don't have a lot of guests on this show. I would have Frank Warren on our show. I would love to have tea with Frank Warren. That would be a very cool afternoon. I wouldn't even, I wouldn't even to film it. I wouldn't nothing. No one needs to see it.

I just want to hang out with Frank Warren. Here is stories, right? Because like, hernd just sucks up so much of the attention over there. And over here, it's, you know, all the promoters we got here. Then you got Frank Warren just. Frank is the old guard. Frank is like Bob Aram, Don King. Frank Warren.

Like, that's, that's, that guard. Yeah, same milk. And they're the most interesting people. Bob Aaron's most interesting man I've ever met my life. I would like to see if maybe, maybe it's Frank. Where Frank stands there?

Where Frank, where he stands. Frank, if you ever hear this, which you never will, I'd love to, I'd love to have tea with you. You might, he might, you never know. Good episode, good times. Boxing World is starting to really get into overdrive here.

So Fondora wins. Moses Atama wins. We move on to next week where we got Wilder and Chisora. And then we move forward in April, some bangers in April. So a lot of good things. A lot of good things. Christian heading east. Head in east.

Yeah, I got an early flight tomorrow in like a couple hours. Go back home. I've been on the road 12 days. That's nuts. 12 days living out of the same suitcase. I've done two loads of laundry. I bought things along the way. I threw things out along the way.

I threw out shirts, underwear, I bought underwear, I bought socks. I threw out a pair of sneakers. You know, I'm just- Made memories, though. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no. Made money. Made money. Made money.

Made money. Made money. Made memories. I think I did eight days in Florida and I was ready to, I got COVID. I was ready to- I mean you're in the same place. I went from San Bernardino. I went to San Antonio.

I went to L.A. Went to Long Beach. Yeah. The San Antonio part is, that was a crazy side quest. Would you do an MMA event? I did an M-A event with streamers. I've been in four hotels, four. Luckily, two of them had laundry, so that helped.

All right, Chris, time to say goodbye. We're right in the middle of it, and your internet crapped out. Now you're back. And now you're ready to leave. Yeah, I'll be home tomorrow. It's fine. We're going to have good Wi-Fi from now on. Sorry, guys.

Chris Algerie, the traveling man, did a great job via hotels, trains, planes, and automobiles. We'll be back on Thursday. with another episode of Inside Boxing, keep your hands up at all times, protect yourself at all time. Stay out of those DMs. We're out.