The Ariel Helwani Show - Joe Pyfer, Mike Perry, Ilja Dragunov on leaving WWE for AEW, Ade Oladipo, news & notes

Episode Date: October 20, 2026

Ariel Helwani kicks off the show with Joe Pyfer, who responds to recent comments by Bo Nickal on the show, describing his interactions with Nickal previously, the area of his game he expects Nickal to try to exploit, being offered Anthony Hernandez before accepting the fight against Nickal, his framing of the fight as “poor kid vs. rich kid,” and more (06:01).Mike Perry is back to talk about recovering from the shoulder injury he suffered in August, having to take a pay cut for his Duel Arena fight, still having hard feelings toward Dillon Danis, his relationship with BKFC and whether he’ll fight for them again, when we’ll see him next, Sean Strickland’s recent pay dispute, and more (29:45).Ilja Dragunov joins the show to discuss his WWE departure and signing with AEW, touching on details about WWE’s offer, being a polarizing performer, feeling like he can now unlock his creativity, and AEW dream matches. Plus, he offers memories of Pac, who recently passed away (1:03:53).Old friend Ade Oladipo returns to break down the biggest boxing stories, including Zuffa Boxing’s recent run and its shocking release of Shakur Stevenson, what happens with Devin Haney, fallout from Daniel Dubois’ massive knockout of Fabio Wardley, Filip Hrgovic’s newfound personality, Canelo’s fight against Christian Mbilli still being planned for Saudi Arabia, and more (1:46:09).Ariel answers your Super Chats to close the show (2:38:24).

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Earth. Tuesday, October 20th, 2000, and 26. Hello again, everyone. I sure hope you're doing well. I have been waiting for this particular date for essentially 33 years. Tonight, my friends, in about five and a half hours from now, myself, my two boys, Oliver and Walter, 19 or so

thousand of my best friends and millions and millions across this great world will finally witness the NBA Champions banner go up to the rafters

of the world's most famous arena and the world's most famous ceiling as well for the first time in 53 years I will be in the building Nick's hat right over here back page of the New York Post I'm like Regis Philbin out here

remember that back in the day raise the roof oh thank you to on Air Jordan for this gift. I can't believe it. The vibes cannot be higher. My mood cannot be better. I can't believe it's actually happening

that I'm going to get to witness Ring Night. I think they're going to go with this one. Ring night. Cup banner. They're going to go championship banner. And then we're going to lay the smackdown on the Philadelphia 76ers,

which is kind of like an afterthought. I just want to see all that. Mike Breen, emceeing it. I mean, if you've been on this journey with me, if you've been on this ride with me, there were some dark, dark days in the midst of hosting this show, right? I mean, like some 17 win seasons,

awful, like a drought between 04 to 12 without a single playoff appearance without a single win between, I think, 01 to 12, no, to 13, without a single win in the playoffs. And then some bad years, recently, a litany of coaches, NBA champions, defending champs.

I'm going to get to witness that. I can't freaking wait. It's going to be a great day to be a New Yorker, to be a Nick fan. And I know there's a vast majority of you out there that don't care about any of this, and I understand that. But please indulge me for one more day

because it feels like today is the culmination of the greatest summer of our lives. Oh, my God. I can't believe it's actually happening. We have a great show for all of you. Back into the program, Adeo Lodipo, is going to be joining us. My good friend Adey to talk about

the wild and wacky world of boxing. Wow. Shakur Stevenson gone from Zufa boxing. Obviously, predictably, Eddie Hearn speaking earlier today to his good friends over at IFL TV, spiking the proverbial football dancing right now over this news. And let's see how it all plays out. It continues to evolve and change, but he's very happy. We'll give you some of that sound and do suggest that you check out that interview.

Prior to that, chat with Adde, Ilya Dragonov is going to be joining us. the newest member of the AEW roster. He debuted on Saturday in Orlando at Russell Dream. He had left WWE in August, not released, decided not to resign, had not been seen since April. Contract expired in August, leaves in August, and here we are in late October. He finally debuts. It was a little dicey with the visa. He has not talked to anyone.

He did a scrum after Russell Dream on Saturday. This is first chat looking forward to talking to. one of the most gifted wrestlers in the world, hailing from Russia, obviously has also spent some time in Germany. If you know about his story, he's a tremendous fit for the AEW roster, and I'm really looking forward to talking to him. That is going to be at 2 o'clock. Stay tuned for that. At 1.30, Mike Perry, in what I do believe is his first chat since that wacky, wacky event, also in Orlando at the Kia Center. That was the one where he was supposed to fight Dylan Dennis, and then Brandon Jenkins stepped in on very short notice. He ended up separating his shoulder.

We haven't heard much from him since. It appears as though he's doing better. We heard from David Feldman yesterday. We brought you that sound of him talking about, it seems like he's not coming back to BKFC after all. That was an interview that he did over the weekend. So we'll get the story from Mike Perry at about 1.30. In a matter of moments,

We're going to be joined by Joe Pfeiffer. You may recall Joey Pfeiffer was talked about yesterday on the program. We had Bo Nickel on, and Bo Nichol is going to be fighting him at some point in 2027. We thought that they'd be fighting on December 12th. Nickel apparently injured. The fight got postponed. I was hit up late last night by his team saying he wants to respond to some of the things that Bo Nichols said about him.

And so I can't wait to hear what Joe Piper has to say. I remind you, as we show you today's line. lineup, this four-pac. I remind you that today's program is, as always, brought you by our good friends over at Kalshi. Think of Kalshi as a marketplace where the price on something is basically the odds of it happening, sports, politics, whatever's going on. That price moves in real time based on where people are putting their money, so you aren't playing against a house like you would on traditional sports books. Trade $25 right now with the code Halwani. That's H-E-L-W-A-N-I, and they'll add another 25 to your account right away.

It's that easy. Support them because they support us. Calci trade responsibly. All right. In a matter of moments, we're going to be joined by Joey Pfeiffer. Looking forward to this chat. Of course, we last saw him in March. He had that amazing win over Israel Adesignia.

Very curious to see what he would do next. We spoke to him in May. We had the live show in New York. He had some big plans. We found out early October. It's Bo Nicol. We thought it would be December 12th. Now we hear it's early 2027.

We spoke to Bo yesterday. Now let's get Joe's side of the story. He's kind enough to join us on this Tuesday afternoon. And we appreciate his time very much. Hello, Joe. How are you? Hey, what's up, very? How are you?

I'm doing great. Great to talk to you. So if you don't mind, I'd love to break the fourth wall for a moment. When this fight was announced in early October, I did reach out to your manager, Lloyd Pearson, and said, we'd love to have Joe on. he told me that you were laying low and I totally understood that reached out to Bo he didn't get back to me

then I heard the news about the fight being moved Bo came on yesterday and if I'm being 100% honest I got another text from Lloyd which I said was very exciting saying Joe heard a few things and would like to respond is that an accurate representation of what's happened here yeah absolutely I texted him last night

I wanted to wait until closer to the fight because I thought it was going to be in December and I like to just focus you know but this is far enough out that, you know, let's get the talking out of the way and just my perspective and yeah. Yeah. I'm wondering what piqued your interest

from what Beau had to say yesterday because clearly you saw a clip or two or maybe even the whole thing. What did he say that perhaps made you feel like, you know what? I'd like to say a few things myself. Nothing in particular. It's just, you know, it's good.

I'd rather do it now than do it later. and I have nothing against Bo. I know he was like, I just want to address, like, he thinks I have a problem with him. I don't have a problem with him. It's just my perspective on how our paths are. I think one is paved and mine is forged.

So that's all. You know what I mean? So, and I just don't, you know, if you say you're going to smash somebody, like me and Bo are cool. I didn't like Bo at first. You know, I had addressed him in New York when he was fighting Rodolfo

because he was like kind of dismisses of me, but that was bad. when I was like super hyper reactive. But yeah, he said he was going to smash me. And I'm just like, he's never smashed anybody at my caliber. And, yeah, I don't like when people talk about smashing. We're going to go fight and we'll see who wins. But to say you're going to smash me, it's just like, yeah, I don't take kindly to that.

Can you tell us about that interaction? What happened there? You went up to him because you didn't like something that he said? It was just super dismissive of everybody. I think Beau's grown a lot as a person. He was just very dismissive. a confident guy, but he was very dismissive of the entire UFC middleweight roster. And then obviously, you know, he, you know, he took, and look, don't get me wrong. Well, Bo's Donna is awesome. I was cheering

for him, uh, even when I didn't like him. And I'm cheering for him even now that I like him. Um, just not against myself, of course, but yeah, no, he just, uh, was dismissive. That's all. And when he tried to shake hands, I wasn't that friendly to him. And then I went up and I told him what my problem was, and if he didn't like what I had to say, I told him, I said, I'll pull for you, and obviously I hope that you win. I'm team USA all the way, and if you don't like it, then call me out. You know, he never did, and then

now, you know, this has come to fruition, and I'm very excited for it. So I don't understand why everybody's so confused by the matchmaking, you know, the division's kind of stuck. And I think the fight makes sense a lot. Okay, I think maybe, and I'll be honest, I was surprised, as I said to him yesterday, you beat a

former champion like Izzy, I think we all expected. I remember we're speaking to you about it in May in New York and you were expecting a big fight in Philadelphia, perhaps. I didn't think that you would maybe go backwards in the rankings. That's not taking a shot at Bo, I think, the world of him. But you beat Izzy, you think maybe you're getting another former champion, you know, or someone who's a top, top, top contender. And so when you were offered Bo, you weren't surprised by it. You didn't like think like, hmm, this is not exactly what I was expecting? Yeah, I wasn't expecting Bo at all, to be honest,

but I was very excited about it. I think it's a great fight. It's to battle the gingers. He said he's never lost to a ginger, neither have I. And I'm evil, Beau. So, yeah, I'm excited for it, man. I had no ill will against him. I like him, especially now.

He's a brother in faith, and I recently got saved. So I think, yeah. You know, obviously he said he thinks he sees something while he likes a matchup. I see a lot of things that I love about this matchup. I think it's going to be a fun fight. And, yeah.

So, I know what they're banking on. I'm not going to tell you what I see, but I know what he sees. He thinks they're going to play the game with trying to wait for me to gas out. You know, I made one mistake going into a Jackramantle fight where I did really bad. And I didn't even do that bad, to be honest. I trained two five, five-minute sessions that entire camp. and I had pneumonia and then I had two staff infections and I still fought. So if anything, I showed, I'm a dog and I can fight, you know, even on my worst day.

It's just sometimes you don't get the win on your worst day. But yeah, no, it's, I think his illusion of game planning to stall, to run, to clench, to wait for me to get tired. Let's not forget this is his first round, his first five-round fight. And yeah, I don't know. I just don't think he's ready for five rounds, man. It's one thing to prepare for it in a gym. It's another thing once you get in there. Once you feel my presence, won't you feel the intention?

And people kind of freeze up. He mentioned the five-round thing a couple times yesterday. Are you surprised at how into it he seems to be? Not at all, man. He's the world. Listen, if we were straight up wrestling, he whipped my butt. I think something he did say is he is one of the few MMA guys who can go wrestle some of the best wrestlers

and keep it competitive. I think there's a couple others, obviously, you have guys like Henry Suhudo. He's not active MMA anymore, but maybe some Jacoby Smith or some other wrestlers. They could be competitive, but probably not to the level of wrestlers that he's going against.

So I agree with that, but, you know, I've been doing jiu-jitsu since I was four and a half. I've been boxing since seven or eight years old. I wrestled in high school, right? So, like, I've, and that's all I have as far as, accolades and wrestling, but I've been fighting my whole life. And, you know, I think people understand there's a powered threat, but there's also an IQ thing. Like, sometimes people mistake the fact that I like to stand and bang as like, I can't make an adjustment.

You know, with the Izzy fight, it was about crowding space. being in a dog fight and that obviously went in my favor the same thing with a boost. I felt terrible. I don't know if I'm breaking up for you. You're fine. You broke up a little bit. You still hear me? Yeah, yeah, we hear you fine. I'm sorry. I got strength conditioning at 130, so you only got me for like 20 minutes.

No problem, no problem. But yeah, you know, I, my style is pressure and, you know, depending on the game plan. And then you've also seen me being able to fight on my back foot. I can fight anywhere, man. So I just, I don't think there's anywhere he's going to be able to beat me. He's explosive. He's fast, but he's never been in a five-round fight.

You can train as hard as you want. I've trained as hard as I want. It doesn't prepare you for what you feel in there. So I don't know. I'm just super excited, man, and he's got me supercharged. And I, my faith is strong, my discipline, just my happiness. And I'm in a really good spot, man. He deserves the shot, just like I deserve the shot, right?

I got the shot against Izzy. He's getting a shot against me. He has nothing to lose, but I also view it as I have nothing to lose. And this is just another fight. The reason I took this fight is because it's just another fight that gets me closer to the title. He's on a two-fight win streak. People think he's improved. I think he's improved.

And I'm excited to go out there and, you know, put a stop to it. You alluded to perhaps his demeanor towards the rest of the division prior to the RDR, our loss and as you just said he's won to since then. Do you feel like he's changed? Do you feel like he's been humbled or do you still think that he feels like he's better than everyone? I think he's humbled up a little bit. You know,

I wouldn't say like dramatically, but I think he's humbled a little bit. I think he's a little bit more wise to understand that you can't just go in there and wrestle anybody. Like, MMA wrestling is completely different than what he's been doing his whole life. And a lot of ways, like you don't get to start in your tie-ups and risk control and all these other things.

you have to use your strikes to set up. What up? You have to use your strikes to set up everything and, you know, be able to get inside safely. And I'm not a guy that you can get in on easily. Yeah, he might be looking at the jack fight. He might be looking at the Izzy fight. But I still have never even had my best performance yet, man. I've always had injuries.

The only thing is a little annoying is like, you know, I like the card for December. And I'm ready to go. and then he takes the fight and then I guess he's injured or whatever but I've always been injured I've had five surgeries in five years and something's always messed up with me going into a fight so I think you just needed more time to be honest and I want Beau at his best I want no excuses I want Bo at his best is it true that they they offered Fluffy to replace him and you stay on that card and if so why didn't you why didn't you like that? Yeah, I think it's simple.

It's not that I didn't like it. I like Fluffy. I would love to fight him one day. But currently I'm on a four-fight win streak, and this is a business, right? So I'd rather beat somebody who's on a win streak than beat somebody who's on a losing streak. Not that he can't compete with me. Styles make matches. It's not saying he's not worthy of the fight.

But given the options, would I rather wait for Bo who has a big name? Or would I rather wait for somebody who has like the same name as me? Me and Fluffy aren't that popular. So would I rather fight a guy who's 0-2 who lost to the champion and then recently just lost to Rodriguez? Or would I rather fight Bo, who's getting his momentum back? He's got a big name. You know, he's a prospect still. I think that puts me in a great title contention.

I'll be the only guy inside the top five, I think, besides Brendan Allen, what five wins. And I make a strong case for, you know, the belt necks depending on how I beat Bo. I saw you sort of label this as Rich Kid versus Poor Kid. why do you feel that way? It's just more, nothing necessarily about money. It's just the mentality, like the way that our careers have gone, right? Like, and when I say fake dreams, yeah.

So I necessarily had a dream. I want to go to the UFC. You know, I know he's a goal or any guy. I'm not stupid, but, you know, this is something he decided he wanted to do and that he set goals to go do it. That's great. But this is something I dreamed of that I set goals to, that I have basically his path has been paid,

my path has been forged and I think that's a much deeper, deeper, deeper love for the game than his I think he's fascinated with it I think he's learning great I think he's doing amazing I think he's done amazing things already with how little he has been in this game

but you know the kid's got 10 professional fights already he's got a wealth of wrestling knowledge he's probably a very good learner but you know he's kind of been at the top of a sport and I think once you get to a top of any sport it kind of dims the light as to how Brady can be when you've never experienced it, you know. And like, I've never been the top in any sport

and now I'm working my way to the top. He's already been at the top of a sport now. He's just like, his life's already set. So I'm sure he does well. I'm sure his finances are good and all that. So I just think I think I'm a little bit more of a dog than he is. And like I said, I got nothing against Bell. We've done content together.

with the Alps stuff he was in my gym right before the Philly card I was supposed to be on the Philly card but you know my opponent got hurt there too so I think everything is God's timing man and this is this is a great fight and yeah I got nothing against them I just want to compete against them and but I don't take likely lightly to people saying they're gonna smash me this and that bro at the end of the day we're fighters and I'm gonna chirp back bro and no pushover who were you supposed to fight on the Philly card? Bara'a Barhalio Okay, and what happened? He got hurt? Yeah, he got some type of surgery. He was hurt. Okay, was that a bummer? I know you really wanted to fight on that card. Yeah, of course, man. I like Kaya too, you know? I like fighting people I like. Honestly, it's great for me, you know? And I just think where I'm at in my life, man, like I'm not obsessed with a win or a loss. It's just effort. That's all I can control is effort.

You know what I mean? And I feel free. I feel like I can be creative. I feel like I've made leaps and bounds. even from the Izzy fight just mentally. And that'll transpire into, you know, physically and just being more free out there, you know. So, yeah, I got a good head on my shoulders now, whereas before I was very sporadic and, you know, uncontrollable. But now, you know, I got a good head on my shoulders and I got a good routine. I got a good discipline, which I've always kind of had. But yeah, man, I'm excited, man. good and this is a great fight and I hope everybody enjoys this fight and I cannot wait.

Do you have any idea when it will be? Uh-oh. Would you say? Do you have any idea when it will be? Yeah, in February. Okay, so by the time it happens, it will be almost a year between fights, but you weren't hurt. Is that frustrating that you couldn't like capitalize on the momentum of the Izzy win? Do you look at it that way? No, man, I am capitalizing. I'm in the top five. I'm number five now because Brendan won, so I think rightfully so. He's number four. He's doing great. And yeah, no, I'm not upset about it.

I needed time away, man. I went through something very, very dark before the Izzy fight and then becoming saved and then just practicing, you know, my faith and getting my life together outside of fighting. This has been a great time. I've been training. It's not like I'm completely fat and out of shape. You know what I mean?

Like, I wrestle just to stay busy. So that was fun. And, yeah, man, I'm. I'm in good spirits. I don't feel like it's been that long. I feel like I fought yesterday. And I'm just, yeah, I'll be ready. I'll be ready.

You wait and see, I'll be ready. I'm looking forward to it. And I'm going to let you go in a moment because I know you have to go train, but I'm just curious, because it's your weight class, the Sean Strickland stuff, definitely making a lot of noise and headlines right now. How do you feel about what he's saying?

Do you think he has a point? Or do you feel what the UFC is basically saying, which is like, hey, man, you just signed this contract. You can't complain now. Yeah, I mean, I said I understand his petition to get more money. I'm always going to support the fighter making more money. You know what I mean? I'm not shying away from that.

I think he could have just pulled Dana into the office and had a conversation. Maybe if they were like, hey, F, off, you know, then you kind of go to the media to put some pressure. But I don't think the way he's going about it is going to work out too well for him. And in the end, I think they're just going to be like, hey, you signed a contract. It is what it is. They're good business people, you know what I mean? And I think, you know, if you're in their good graces, they will work with you

but yeah I don't blame Sean for his position you know I just don't like like they've already clickbait put out stuff like I was talking crap but it's just imavav didn't have to do all that you know what I mean Sean Strickland's struggle has nothing to do with fighting

imov again it has to do with can I justify beating somebody or fighting somebody I already beat for the same amount of money or less that I just won the belt for that's all I'm saying so So yeah, it's not my business, but yeah, I always support the fighter trying to make more money. Did you enjoy doing ref?

Yeah, it was great. Chad and Izzy are awesome, and it was great. It was great to compete against the guy like Luke. You know, I've never done a freestyle match in my life, but I've always felt like it kind of favored my style of wrestling. And so, yeah, it was fun, man. It was good. I look forward to doing many more. And, yeah, man, it's like, it felt like being in high school again.

I miss that. I miss wrestling. Last one for you. I know you've trained a little bit with Kyle Dachas. He's Bo's last opponent. Were you impressed by that performance, knowing who Kyle is? I know he's coming off a tough loss this past weekend as well.

But knowing who Kyle is and being in the room with him, were you impressed with what Bo did to him? No. Kyle is either on or he's not. And I love Kyle to death. But, yeah. You know, it's hard to answer that because there's things I see from him and I love him, but they're just, sometimes he's just not, he doesn't seem to be present.

And I think Bo is not the better fighter than Kyle, but, you know, Bo is not afraid to pull the trigger right when he needed to. And Kyle kind of froze in the moment. Kyle's not used to kind of big moment fights like that, I don't think. And I think being on the White House froze him. I don't know what that did do is confidence, but going in there against Mark Andre Beryl. He's kind of just, he kind of lets people into the fight a little too much.

And I'm not that type of guy. You're going to have to earn every single thing. So I don't think people really give me much credit for my cardio, but that was a high-paced two rounds in the Izzy fight. And sure, I'm allowed to get tired, but I can recover in between rounds. That's something I've done so much better with. and you know everybody says my cardio shit because i got tired against jacker manson but you know it was also because he kicked me about 35 times in a calf after i got punched in my eyeball i saw

four people instead of one you know so i just kind of retreated to being on my back foot big mistake in that fight but yeah man i uh i really strongly feel that what the bow camp thinks is that i'm going to slow down and they think i'm going to go headhunting trying to knock them out because look I have so much respect for Bo as far as a competitor, as far as my next opponent, and I will train to be my absolute best, and I will train like he's going to be his absolute best. I will never sleep on anybody again. I kind of slept on Jack thinking I could just go out there, one hit or quitter, knock him out. I tried to do the one hit or quitter against Kelvin, but I was also very cautious in that fight

because of his ability to take damage and then give it back. So the game plan was a little weak after the first round, but, you know, I mean, like, I haven't taken any damage in my last four fights, besides, you know, hurting myself, basically, with my hand and whatnot. So, and outside of fighting. But yeah, man, both deserves this shot. I got nothing but love for bro. Like I said, he's a brother in faith.

We're both God-fearing men. I don't know if he'd beat me in a Bible quiz, though, so we'll see. Maybe that'll be the rematch based on what happens in, February. For now, though, I'll let you go. Thanks for doing this, Joe. I know you have a busy day, so appreciate you stopping by. Good luck in training, and can't wait to see this fight early next year. Let's go, baby. There he is. Evil Joe Nickel. Okay. All right. I like that. Evil Joe Nickel, there he is. Body bags as well. And so it sounds like it's happening in February. and so let's see what happens as far as a date

and it seems like it's going to be Cleveland. I think it's the Quicken Loans. Is it still the Quicken Loans? That was the arena, by the way. Rock and Mortgage, yeah. That was the one where the Knicks won. Actually, I have the Daily News from that one too. That's the one where they got the Eastern Conference, right?

On to the finals. Yeah. That was a good one. Yeah, yeah, that was a good one. That was, I think it was Memorial Day, Monday. That was a nice one. I like that one. Some sick pictures in next row.

You see this? What's what's what was it? Oh yeah. Oh my God. Stop. Stop. Is that real? Is that AI?

Is that some AI shit? What is that? Do we have the other ones where they're like draped in it? Hold on. Hold on. In real time. This is real time? It doesn't feel real.

Jordan. It doesn't feel real. Look at that. Look at that. You know what I love when people are like, one and done never again yeah oh sham wow it's your guy it's your guy oh it's like do you think I care that it's one and done if it is in fact one and done who says it's gonna be one and done that's my oh look at that that can't be real right I saw this I also it's like that is insane what F them

picks F them picks is it real what do you think I can't tell of course it's real of course it's real F them picks yeah savage mckell that trophy on your desk I hope he's on the desk. You know, it's nicer than that? The only thing nicer than those pictures right there, Peirre Jan shorts for Saturday. I saw this, and I almost fell off my chair. I mean, look at these bad boys.

This is a masterpiece. Elite. What's the bottom left there? What's to say, no mercy? Piotr? Yeah. It's a big flag, huh? Yeah, it's going to be the Georgian flag versus the Russian?

The unrivaled. Why is it the unrivaled? Why is it called that? Is that what they call the champion shorts? Why is it that the boxers are allowed, like the high level boxers are allowed to wear their own thing, but not the UFC fighters?

Why is it that the high level boxers are allowed to get released and not the UFC fighters? I do wonder about all that. This is going to be interesting. We're going to talk more about that with Mr. Ade Oladipo. I just saw a really interesting tweet here,

speaking of the bantamweight division from the great Josealdo. He was speaking to Guillermo Cruz, the Brazilian beast of MMAFighting.com regarding Mofsar Yvlovev, quote, I'd wait for him to lose for the first time and then I'd cut him because he's a guy who doesn't sell, a guy who puts on boring fights, a guy who doesn't draw attention. Golly, Jose, dropping the hammer. Could you imagine if Mofsar loses on Saturday and they cut him? I said the bantamweight division. Well, I guess I went from, like, Jan to bantamweight Jose to featherweight. Mofsar.

You get what I was trying to do. But could you imagine if he loses and then he gets cut? I feel like that may have. Has that ever happened where someone lost a title fight as a challenger and got cut? I feel like that happened once before. Montanio? I don't think she fought. Yeah.

I'll rack my brain. Jedi probably knows. Anyway, still to come, Adiola Depot, Ilya Dragonov in his first interview since leaving WVE and signing with AEW. he debuted in Orlando, and that is where our next guest resides. And that's where we last saw him compete as well. It was a bizarre one. It was a bizarre event.

I've been nagging him a little bit, wanting to hear his side of the story. He's kind enough to join us on this Tuesday afternoon. Our old friend, Platinum Mike Perry. There he is. Hello, Mike. How are you? What's up, Ari? I'm doing good, bro.

How's everybody? Everyone's great. As you know, I've been bothering you a lot because I wanted to, and you needed some time. Maybe one of the few times ever that you were like, I'm not feeling it this time. And so that, you know, I felt that when you said it because I knew it was a frustrating weekend and a sequence of events for you. How, most importantly, off the bat, how are you feeling? How is the shoulder? Because that looked gruesome.

It was hard to see. Thanks. Yeah, it was hard to go through, I guess. I'm doing okay. I was just at training, sparring with the guys. I got some rounds in. So not doing as many rounds as I want, and that's not because of the shoulder that's more like, I don't know, I'm just slowly building. I'm super humble now. Like, you know, the game has humbled me. And, you know, I thought I was on this. Like, I was trying to be great. And it's like I saw these things like, oh, you, you wouldn't have moved if I didn't give you something to make you. And, you know, so. You know, so. So now it's like kind of less pressure.

I just want to be my healthiest, be my best. And people can say what they want to me. I don't want to get so angry over anything anymore. And, you know, I'm happy to be in the gym motivated by the guys who are there working and training. And I try to get as much of that in as I can. And when I feel done, I'm done. And then I go back, you know, I'm probably going to go back tonight, be my like first two a day.

And, you know, just little by little, man, trying to grow, maintain, be great again, but in a different way, in a more grown-up way, and just, you know, take it for what it is. Man, I'm grateful to be here in this position, and I've had some great moments, and I'm hopefully going to have some more for sure. What exactly happened to the shoulder? Yeah, I had a partial laboral tear. Wow. I guess and it just, it dislocated it.

Like, I'm sure you guys saw the picture that I posted on my story of the X-ray. And then as far as like the MRIs where you can see like a partial tear in the laboral. But, you know, I guess it was just out of place. I was, I think one thing that has. happen, no excuses, but one thing that I think kind of affected me was like I was 176 and I was waiting to, I was going to go to the gym that night and cut weight. And instead, I went to the steakhouse and I had some waters and I had some Diet Coke. And I also kept drinking my distilled water that I had from, that you use for weight cut, which like distil kind of dehydrates you.

And, you know, I didn't go into chugging pediolites, I don't think. And maybe it was minuscule. Maybe it didn't have that much to do with it. Maybe there were some other things. My body couldn't calm down. I was trying to calm down when the shoulder went out in the ring. After the fight, I was trying to let them pull on it. And it just didn't seem to feel better anywhere.

I could get a couple pops. And so now I'm just working, man. I don't know. I can get away with some stuff. I'm building up a lot of strength. I'm doing a lot with my right arm, which I'm like, sometimes I'm strangling people with just my right, which is kind of cool. And, you know, hopefully my left will build up stronger and stronger. And I think 2027, man, there should be some pretty big announcements. Okay, okay. And I'll get to that in a moment, but just to be clear, no surgery, right? So I've had So through the The hospitals and the doctors and everything And the people who reviewed the scans and stuff

The guy is like no Let's give you three weeks I went back in three weeks And then he goes come back in eight weeks And that'll probably be your graduation day That'll be sometime in November I'll have that appointment And yeah he said like

You know I don't think you're going to need surgery all of the muscles and everything around the area that the partial injury was looks really strong and can support it in healing. But it's definitely different, but I'll take it as, you know, God's plan for me to figure out and how to get stronger in this. And some people have said, like, you know, under their professional opinion, they would think that I would need a surgery with that type of injury. But, I mean, I was just at the gym sparring, man, and I'm getting pretty good again.

That event was a wacky one, man. And there's a few things that I want to ask you about it. But one report that, you know, I wrote up in the lead-up to the event was that you were essentially asked to take a 50% pay cut in order to go from Dylan Dennis to Brandon Jenkins. Can you talk about that for a moment? How did this happen? And why did you agree to do this? You know, with the quick change, maybe they had to make an adjustment of what they had to offer the overnight opponent. You know, Brandon Jenkins, man, he came in and humble and he was happy to be there.

And he got the, you know, he won something that night for sure. You know, he got me. He threw the body kicks that, you know, kind of I couldn't defend. offend, but, you know, I was there to fight. It was a one night's notice, whatever, and, you know, it wasn't quite 50%, but it was a little better than that, but it was still something. And it was Orlando. I was the main event. I had all these people, all these fighters, too, and all these people come in and, you know, obviously part of the job, part of the gig is, Like, I get to compete.

I get to be the reason that the show goes on. So, you know, why don't you? These things happen. Stuff falls out. And maybe it confused me a little bit all the way, you know, stuff always changes. And so, you know, I got to get more skill that dealing with that. As it comes, I just got to be more grateful, man, and more happy. to get the opportunities that I'm getting.

And, you know, the online concept of the, like, when I was doing great and I've been killing it and been coming back and, you know, I always seem to get this. Like, I peek, I'll peek, and then, oh, the Jake Paul fight, then I peek, then I peek, and then I peek, and then, oh, fucking dislocated my shoulder. But now it's different. The dislocation, losing a fight for that reason. it felt really weird. It didn't feel like, ding, I got beat up.

I didn't even get the chance to have a barn burner fight and have that battle and feel the blood on my face. You know, it just, it was really unfortunate. So now I'm just looking at the game from the outside in in a totally different way and trying to do my best with it. So, yeah, your question I kind of answered it, and then I went somewhere else, didn't I? No, no, it's all good. I'm wondering, though, do you regret taking the fight? I mean, obviously, you know how it played out, but you don't feel like...

No regrets, bro. All right, all right. What about the event? You know, there was all this stuff that came out after, like people holding swastikas and it got a little weird there with the brawls and all that. It just, to me, if I'm being 100% honest, it seemed beneath you, Mike, to be a part of an event like this. And even the Kia Center put out a statement, you had just fought on Netflix. I felt like you were above all of this. And this is not an indictment on you, but... but it was a lot of trash, in my opinion, and I didn't love that you were associated with. I felt like it sort of soiled everything that you had built and all the goodwill that you had built. And again, you had nothing to do with it, but I just wondered if in the aftermath you felt like, eh, I shouldn't have done that one.

No, I mean, you can't do that. You can't. You had the opportunity. It's like, yeah, I was going to get, I was in a position with the Netflix fight, I beat Nadeez, And it's like in that type of position, you get the call to fight and beat one of these online trash talkers who's probably not going to show up, which literally happens. And then you get another guy who's like, he's in the game, you know, he's trying.

He's giving it his best. And the performance is getting to put on the event and getting to put on the show. And mind you, before the event happens, none of us know how the crowd is. I guess you could kind of see it with some of the fighters on the card, their online presence. I guess you could take a guess or an assumption. And, oh, man, you know, just don't take too much too seriously. Like, that was my whole lesson in the fight because of the dislocated shoulder didn't allow me to perform. I thought I was going to at least, I thought, you know, you get in the ring and either you bleed or they bleed or we both bleed.

And it comes down to it. Somebody wins. Somebody loses. But we had the time. You know, it was a great time. But this was totally new. I didn't even get to perform after all the hard. work and everything I had done built up this tension and then the the crowd is you know I think the

type of people there were some people in the crowd that was definitely not their crowd and they felt very uncomfortable and that's very unfortunate and then there was people who were having a good time in the crowd whether they were beating up people who were being racist or you know getting beaten up for being racist. There was lots of fights going on in the crowd. That's been happening in combat sports. I think it happens, you know, in the UFC and anywhere else, too. Sometimes fans get drunk, belligerent, and, you know, things ensue.

But, you know, they attempted to be professionals. A lot of the people behind everything. They run into issues and a true professional, you know, has to help the event. The event was built around me, but it was also built around those other online presences that, you know, have their own algorithm. Yeah. No, I understand that. And again, you and I do that you didn't promote any of that stuff.

And so, you know, you kind of move on at this point. Do you have any sort of feelings towards Dylan? Like you say you weren't sure that he was going to show up. How do you want to try to run it back with it? How do you feel about this guy after what happened? And we still haven't heard anything from him since then. See, it's crazy. You know, you've got to keep some things to yourself.

Oh, okay. You can really, oh, no, trust me. There's no professional business being done between me and that guy. I was upset with that guy. But maybe I shouldn't be, right? Like I said, I got to learn to take things with a grain of salt. Everyone said he was going to do that. I was like, no way, no way, no.

Maybe he's coming, he's coming, he's coming. But, you know, he didn't dig into me in a nasty way and then not show up, you know, with his trash talk and this and that. So I can't be upset about stuff that I can't control. And you never know what's going to happen tomorrow. What did Uguer say? Yesterday is history. Tomorrow's a mystery.

And today is a gift or something like that. Something like that. So, you know, see, I don't want to snitch on myself prior to anything that could happen. I don't know what you're talking about, though. Exactly. There's no profession. Are you...

Not. I'm saying if I see... You know, I'm like, look, I don't want to go to Tampa because my most important thing to me is like family and going to the gym and training and building my strength every day, every day, every day, a little bit, 1% whatever. Every day. I have to be stronger. And then it's like, oh, man, is he supposed to wrestle?

for RAF I could go viral and go down these are thoughts I have but I'm not gonna do it so I can tell you okay oh if I saw Dylan Dennis I like I gotta give them

we got a fight in the street like we just gotta have a fight at this point so for free anywhere at any parking lot if I you know if I took a pay cut

well now I'll pay cut myself and I'll just fucking but I'm snitching on myself already oh I see you If I see him, we got a squabble, bro. So you're saying it's on site when you see him. It's on site.

Yeah. But it's got to be. R-A-F, no? Maybe it's not this time. This weekend they're in Vegas. Oh, they're in Vegas. He's going up against Armine. I could still flew to Vegas and they messed up their whole show.

I'll be there. You want to pull up? You'll be my plus one. my bro i can't just go to los vegas this weekend my kids got school my wife needs help shit like that you know what i got you i'd rather be there doing something more important be at home where it counts building my strength that way than i mean it sounds tasty though if i would to just put my money where my mouth is put up or shut up go to fucking Vegas and just mess up their whole shit

because I got my shit messed up. But did I? It was just weird and I'm still confused about it. So see, I have the right plan in mind. Go to the gym. Keep your head on straight. Stay focused. Get stronger. Take care of the kids.

That, I mean, he's probably going to lose anyways. He's going to try to do some submitting shit. Is he going to show up? It's all funny. By the way, it was said that he injured his elbow, but then some people thought it was an old, like, do you even know what happened?

Yeah, it obviously happened a while back. He was injured. You know, I met some kid that they did like a sparring video. He beat up this little kid who's trying to be a fighter on video. And he already had the scars or whatever. So it's like when did it happen? How healed was it? Okay, but you've been known about this.

But, you know, what? You kept people intertwined that you weren't coming, and then, you know, maybe that's why businesses want to work with him because he helps the show somehow, even though he pulled out. Hmm. You alluded to some big news. What, if anything, can you tell us that's on the horizon? Yeah. Yeah, I might, you know, I might have a big, I might be having another big

MMA opportunity here soon. With MVP? I can't say. Okay. Big opponent? Yeah, I think so. Rematch? I think that's the platinum business now. We're going to have some good fights. And when Mike Perry makes his way back. That's what I was going to say. It's like the stigma, like when I was doing well, people was kind of down on me online and then and then after I did bad. But then this time, this time everybody's being nice to me and I'm like, oh, some, no one has been like, are you, you're terrible. You suck so bad because your shoulder went out. Like they're just like, you'd be back, bro. So I'm kind of taking that into training.

I'm like, everyone's super confident. And I'm coming back and I'm going to be stronger and better than ever. So that's what I'm hoping for. That's what I'm praying for. And I'm just trying to stay humble about it. Is it a rematch? I don't think so. Okay.

Actually, like, the opponents, obviously look, the opponents could change. Okay. We never know. Sure. Maybe there could. be a rematch. That sounds good. I'd like to give it another go. Were there any series talks about the Diaz fight? Because, you know, I remember when that happened, the one in May that was talked about maybe in December. I don't know if they were

serious about that. They're just talking. Like, Diaz is at a point where he can do whatever he wants and try to give his best in his career as well. And, you know, he had no hate on me. for, he's like, that's what happens when you try and chase a bag. And I'm like, well, yeah, but shit. I just didn't see that coming. You can train for everything that you think is going to happen. Then something else is going to happen that you didn't see coming. So, you know, whatever fight they announced, when they announced that Platinum Perry is competing,

you best believe I'll be there. no matter if the opponent changes or not. And, you know, really cool the other night we got to see in our local regional scene our coach from Fusion, coach Jay Will, man. He won his retirement fight. And it didn't matter the opponent or anything. You know, the guy was going to come out. Jay Will threw some hands with him. And we all was hype as hell, man.

The whole arena was just going crazy for him. having this fight and as soon as he shot his take down like we know j wills like once he get them claws on you you're in the the the jaws of life and he's gonna take it so he did that that was really cool motivating man just been trying to be in the gym at least every day once a day at least you know i love that and and congratulations to him i i feel like i can i can rule out bkFC because i saw an interview with Dave Feldman saying that essentially he doesn't think you're coming back. This was this past weekend in New Jersey. So a year ago, you were fighting in New Jersey against Jeremy Stevens this past weekend, a year from this past weekend. Is that an accurate

description of where things stand between you and BKFC? Yes. Yeah, it's good to get that out. You know, I've kind of had some feelings about it. It's like the BK cheat code, man. That bare knuckle stuff is like a cheat code, I guess, in those two-minute rounds. And it's like I was good at it. It was fun. I made some noise doing it. And I'm ready for another challenge. And, you know, so I think MMA is in my foreseeable future. And I'm going to give it my best shot. It is wild to see Darren Till now a BKFC veteran. and you're not there anymore, but it just seems...

A veteran? Well, two fights. Makes you a veteran, right? I mean, it's more than one. That's multiple fights at this point. What did you think of his performance against YOL? I mean, in my opinion, Yol won the fight because he put more damage.

But there was not a knockdown on either side throughout the five rounds, so more needed to be done. It was in Darren's country. You know, Yowell traveled and fought at an amazing 50 years old, 49 years old, like incredible athlete. So he didn't really lose anything from it. He's still the people's champ. He's always super humble.

It's just so much to look up to with that guy. He's such a warrior, man. So thanks for the motivation, Yowell. Congrats to Darren because, I mean, he went through hell to get you. to the end of that fight. He had a nasty cut on his face. And, you know, he's carrying, he's holding his chin high and he's ready to compete some more in there. He's done good in boxing and he's going to bounce around maybe for his next couple years of boxing and bare-knuckle boxing. I don't know. So, you know, I just, safe to say that I don't think that that's, that Mike Perry and Darren Tilling bear-knuckle is a thing.

Damn. I kind of did my thing over there, and now it looks like we're going a different way. So to the fans of mine who love to see me in Barranuckle, there's still a chance that I barrenuckle squabble, Dylan Dennis, out here in the streets somewhere. But, you know, I think it's gloves for me, and I'm going to keep that as, like, close to my heart as, like, I'm a high-level professional and I'm getting to build something here. And it's very challenging. It's harder a five-minute round with everything, with the grappling and the boxing and the kicking.

And I'm in a great place in Central Florida with a great gym, Fusion Excel, full of great guys who are just trying to get better. And some have skills in Muay Thai. some have skills in boxing, some have skills, like great skills in jujitsu and wrestling. So it's just great to challenge myself and try everything. And yeah, stay humble, man. Do you think there's a chance you never fight BKFC or like a sanctioned bare-knuckle fight again?

I know what you were saying about the deal and stuff, but do you think that you refer to it as a cheat code and it certainly helped revitalize your career, but do you think you're done with that chapter? Let at least say two years. Okay. At least. Okay.

Interesting. I'm going to give something a good shot here. Oh, I like this. I just, a couple years at least I won't be going back. And then I got some fights I'll have to focus on. So, you know, staying straight and everybody beat well, man. Let's raise the kids. Let's have fun with them.

Let's be good dads, good parents. Let's try to. Wives are tough. Lives are super tough because we just got to be nice to them. And I just don't want to just lay down and take everything that they got. That's some of our biggest battles. But that's neither here nor there, man. I got to stay focused on the plan ahead.

We're building, you know, shout out Mosaic. Danny Mosaic, man, my camera guy, he's great. We're building my YouTube channel and we're trying to build everything outside of the ring as well. you know, we got the platinum picks and predictions we've been pretty consistent with. And, you know, shout out to all the Platinum Perry fans who follow me on IG and Twitter and YouTube. Can I ask before I let you go, Mike? You know, you're one of those guys who, in my opinion, sort of bet on himself, went out there and made a hell of a living outside of the UFC. And obviously, you were known in the UFC for quite some time, and then you did incredible things and had an even greater run outside.

and lately Sean Strickland has been very upset about his pay and has said he wants to leave, but he just signed a new contract. Now, you could say, why did you sign a new contract if you wanted to eventually leave? Why did you agree to those terms? But I'm just curious, as someone who is on the outside and made a very good living on the outside and fought on some very big platforms, how do you feel about how this whole Sean Strickland thing is going down? I feel like, you know, he's playing his cards, just the way he feels.

He needs to play him. He's, you know, obviously in a different position than me and mentally. So he's the champ. He's done it. He's become the greatest. He's obviously had a crazy online presence from saying just very intense things sometimes. You know, they had them in Canada. Mm-hmm.

speaking like public politics or something like it was at a protest politics yeah or something like it was so good for sean strickland man Dana doesn't take anything to heart as you could see with Buckley not shaking his hand this and that but then we we saw what happens I just think it's bad luck yeah bad luck don't shake the dude's hand or Mike Malib was going to do that anyways that's always the thing with these fights is we don't really know. But I'm going to try to do everything. You can try to do it all right. Like Kanye said, your whole lives is a test.

You know, we don't like test day is when we have the most anxiety. You got to get good at being in bad positions and dealing with the anxiety. So, you know, Sean Strickland is the champ, man. He's going to have a fight no matter where the fights at, whether he gives up the 85, five belt or his two options to fight are you know he he should want to fight du plesi again because du plesi got him right du plesi it kind of got his nose so it's like just work on not getting that nose snagged and that's a really good fight between du plessie and you should want to get your get backs right but sometimes the fight game doesn't let you get your get back sometimes

it goes a different route and you just got to stay focused on your path and yeah it's okay to say like yeah you want more money sometimes that's kind of what these guys do that's what we do some fighters get paid 30 million dollars for nothing some fighters get paid 200,000 for the battle of their lives or less 2,000 sometimes not in the UFC UFC 12,000 like minimum. Right. So it is what it is, man. You got to enjoy the journey. One last one for you. You tweeted after the injury. A few things. You also posted something on Instagram, but I was just curious about one last line that I wanted to ask you about. You said the gym helps the process of growing your strength, but strength is needed in other areas of life and should be exercised

everywhere we go. Organized, be consistent, more recovery and stretching, taking knowledge into my future endeavors, more to work for, more work to do. A very mature, I thought, a very sort of evolved version of you. What were you speaking of there when you say, like, it should be exercised everywhere we go in other areas of life? You know, in the aftermath of the injury, I was curious about what else you were talking about there. Yeah. Without the injury, I wouldn't have seen it. I was probably being such an asshole.

I was probably, you know, thinking I'm too good for stuff. And that's never good. It's like, you know, the OGs in the gym, man, the old guys who come around and just, like, they're just there in support. Like, you've got to appreciate that. You don't have to hate on that or you just can just appreciate it and keep it moving. And you got to be grateful for things like that. So, you know, being nice to the kids, like, it's hard. Sometimes they upset you and you got to catch yourself.

I'm getting better at catching. myself in the middle. And you just got to remember that there's more important things. And yes, sometimes when it's fight week, you feel like that's the most important thing. But the most important thing, you know, is like doing right by God. No matter your religion. Like that's, it's doing right by what God says is what your God says is right. right, do that, do the right thing. And then love your wife and love your children, teach them well,

eat healthy as you can. Sometimes you can have a cheat day. You know, just everything, anything. Try to curse less. Like sometimes my kids got potty mouths now. And I'm like, dang, I got bad potty mouth. Like, you know, so just everything is just that, you know, I think about the Bruce spelling. They call it spelling. And my daughter's always like, is that magic, Daddy? Is that magic? I'm like, yes. Everything is magic. It's just, you know, your words can be powerful and they can be damaging too. So maybe it does, maybe it doesn't, but the best you can do is give it your best. Wise words. Mike, the evolution of Platinum Mike Perry is one of my favorite stories over the past 10 years is really one of the best things that we've ever experienced. It's really truly

amazing. Happy for you that you've gained this perspective, even though it was a really bad thing that happened, the silver lining, if you will, the proverbial silver lining. Hopefully you heal up, and I can't wait to hear what this news is. I'm very excited about this, but it sounds like it's exciting, so can't wait for that, and I'll probably be bothering you to come back on to talk about it whenever it comes out. So until then, we thank you for coming on and hope to talk to you soon, Mike. Thanks again, my brother Ariel. Shout out to all the fans.

Thank you, Ariel. And stay tuned, man. We'll bring him more back. Let's go. See you soon. Can't wait for that. There he is. The great platinum, Mike Perry,

kind enough to join us. As always, a great chat. And yeah, if you go back to our very first chat some 10 years ago, him outside talking about the money and the nickname and all that stuff, I mean, he has just come such a long way. It's quite remarkable. Still to come, Adelaideo L'Ole Depot, we're going to talk about Shakur Stevenson,

leaving Zufa boxing, all the craziness there, a little Canelo, obviously Daniel Dubois, Sebastian Fondora, there's a lot going on. So an old school Tuesday, Ariel and Adi, but I'm so very excited to talk to our next guest. He left WWE in August, and it wasn't your typical shock departure

in that he was not released. It wasn't one of those that we've seen, obviously quite often these days. His contract expired and based on reports, and we'll find out more in a second here, he decided to walk away. And so then everyone was wondering, where would he end up?

It seemed like all signs pointed to all elite wrestling. We got a hint or two last month. And then on Saturday at Russell Dream 26 in Orlando, the big debut happened. And what a debut it was. Holy smokes. An incredible debut. The clip on the AEW YouTube channel alone

has well over a million views at this point. A lot of people are very excited. And he's going to make his AEW in-ring debut tomorrow on Dynamite. For now, though, we get the chance to speak to the Mad Dragon himself, Ilya Draganoff. He's kind enough to join us on this Tuesday afternoon.

Hello, Ilya, how are you? I'm good, Ariel. How are you doing? I'm doing great. Great to talk to you, and you're always so very dapper. I appreciate your sense of style. Much respect to you.

And congratulations on this very big moment in your career. I have a million questions, But first I'll ask, were some, I don't know, 72 or so hours removed from the big debut, a lot of emotion, the metronome, the music. I mean, everything was just top tier. Have you come down from that high? Because I can't imagine what you were feeling like after being on the sidelines for the last few months. I mean, I'm a very, very emotional human being, as a lot of people can tell from my way to perform. So, no, I didn't.

because this day at Russell Dream was a fairy tale for me, from all the nuances to the warm welcome of the fans, to all the work that AW put into that, I am, I don't know, I'm not a very relaxed person, and I've been very, even more unrelaxed since then. A lot of fans going crazy again over the entrance, the metronome, the music, how much did you have to do with all of that? Because it was, like I said, it was perfect,

And you were just playing into it so much as the czar, you're moving, you're grooving out there. Was that your thinking? Was that theirs? Did you collaborate? Tell us about the backstory. That is the best part about this. Since the works has begun, it has been always a collaboration. It has been always a working together. So all the ideas that came from the company side and all the ideas that I had in my mind creatively were just flowing still well into another. Like, that was such a beautiful procedure to work and to even just get one little detail that was one of that touched my heart the most is that even the entrance music, that it was possible to get this specific entrance music. I don't know how many people in the States are aware of that, but when I started my very young, young path in Germany, in independent wrestling Germany, that was my entrance. music. Wow. This guided me through the youngest, youngest years to my biggest moments that put me on the platform in Europe, got me to the United Kingdom, got me to the States. So so much all of my career

is based on that music. And when I heard this music and did my entrance on Saturday at Russell Dream, I felt like a child again in that business. Wow. And I was craving this feeling for a very, very long time. And that song is Soviet March. When did you pick that and why did it feel like it, you know, was the right type of music for you when you were starting out your career? Because it's putting together so many layers of my persona. I'm a Russian-born, but German-race boy.

Okay? And I have a lot of roots to my German side of culture, but also to my family, Russian side. And in the beginning, of course, when you try to find your own persona and professional wrestling. Everybody was betraying me, of course, when I started like, okay, you're the Russian, so we need a Russian music. And I love classical music, so it has this classical vibe,

but it has also the orchestra vibe. And it also very heavy, and it all just fitted so perfectly with my over-the-top artsy orchestra composer-like persona. It fits just all the boxes. So if you hear this music, it exactly tells you how I perform. Tony Kahn at the post-event press conference told the story about how you texted him at about 2.30 your time on the Wednesday prior to Russell Dream, saying that your visa finally got approved and that you could be there over the weekend.

Sounds like, you know, a crazy turn of events. And obviously, getting the visas in 2026 for, you know, a foreigner could be a little bit tricky. How difficult was this process for you? from your perspective and how much were you sweating? Obviously, I'm sure you were chomping at the bit to try to finally make your debut in AEW. And so tell us about the process for your end and how stressful it was.

I mean, it's not the first time that I need to apply for a visa in the United States. So that part was already quite familiar to me. But of course, since I want, everything I want to do is work and fight and perform, I just couldn't wait for the things to happen quickly. quicker, but from the company side, they were helping me in that process in every way possible. So it was absolutely smooth.

It took around, I guess, like around the month, which was still too long for me, but it was putting perspective like very, very fast. And after appointments got done, everything was so extremely quick. So on that day when I realized that I could travel back to the States, it was like two. am in the morning. I was awake anyway around that time because my beautiful girlfriend is currently touring with Sendai girls in Japan. So it's kind of like correlates with the time where we usually call each other. So I was looking through my emails beforehand and I realized, okay, today is actually the day I can pick up my passport. So I immediately thought like, okay, if I can pick up my password today, I can be back in the States today because you travel kind of like back in time

if you come from Germany to the States. So I reached out to the company. Everything went extremely quick. Everything got booked. And I was in no time within like seven hours. I was on my flight back to the States. And that's the perfect way for me because I didn't want to work a single. I didn't want to wait another single second anymore.

I would love to get some clarity and maybe more intel. from you on what exactly happen regarding your departure from WW because I do believe this is one of if not your first chats since leaving the company in August. And so to go backwards, the last time we saw you in action was in April, Andre the Giant Memorial Battle Royal, and then we find out in August that you have left, contract expired, you chose to leave. Can you tell us in April, did you know that that was going to be your last time competing in a W.W. Ring? No, absolutely not. And everything I've got to tell about that is also not very hollow very exciting.

I didn't know at that time that I was leaving. I was just waiting. Again, I'm a person. I love what I do. I want to compete. I want to work. I want to do this and this and that. And it just got a little stuck.

It was like, but it's nothing new to anybody. It was pretty obvious. So at the time just passed by. And then I reached the expiration of my contract. And like I already said, after the show at the press conference, the Russell Dream, I felt over time that's okay with how everything is working out and how I'm feeling because I do, I make a lot of things depending of how I feel about it. I always had the courage to do so. I feel it is time to breathe some new fresh air. Your contract expired in August.

That was the end. Did they try to resign you? I mean, a lot of the things were written over the internet, and I think some of the guys were... I don't read the internet. That's why you're here to clear that up. Yeah. That was definitely, there was no intention of the company to let me go. Was it a deal that you liked?

Was it more about what you were feeling inside than the money, or were you unhappy with what they were offering? No, there was accumulation of a lot of things. There was an accumulation of, of course, the offering, because we all know is the, the end of the day, it's the business. But also, it's definitely based also on my feeling of like, how do I want to work creatively? Do I need a scenery change? Is the scenery change something where I will can see myself stay for like forever? Because you got to, you got to consider a lot of factors. Like, I spent the most of my 20s in WW. That's a very, very long time. And the landscape and this beautiful business changed. So the beautiful thing is nowadays we have a lot of,

we have other opportunities. And for me personally, after such a long time being with a company to not seek out new opportunities, maybe even a place where I see myself more fitting, who wouldn't do that? I guess I'm wondering between April and August, why did we not see you? Did they know in April you weren't coming back? That seems to be the general consensus, they knew that you weren't going to stick around, so they kept you on ice until the end of your contract. Is there another story? Again, everything I can say, it's not as exciting as people made it. Like, of course, at some point of time, you just don't have creative.

At some point of time, you're just waiting for the next opportunities to come, because a lot of new people came up. A lot of stories were full, and we all know that there's only a certain amount of time for certain people. And all the things are not as definite to go too deep into that. But everything I knew is that the expiration of my contract came and that the negotiations didn't lead anywhere. Could I ask you, you don't have to give us the exact number, obviously, but were they offering you a raise? Were they offering you a pay cut? Were they offering you the same amount? To be honest, I'm too much discreet and too much of a businessman and a gentleman myself to

talk about these kind of things. Everything I can say is there was nothing that I felt satisfying and nothing that gave me the perspective of like, okay, I must stick with what I hear. When you make a decision like that, sometimes it's easier to make that call when you know that there's something waiting for you on the other end. Were you able to put some feelers, you, your management to see okay?

Is there interest out there? because otherwise it's a very scary thing to say thanks but no thanks to WWE and not know if there's going to be obviously in the back of your mind you know you're very respected and incredibly talented but not know concretely that there's any openings for you in another promotion. How do you go about making that decision? That's a very, I would say it's a very sort of challenging and courageous thing that you did. Yeah. I mean, you study yourself. It's a courageous thing to do. Like there is one thing that you learn and I'm nothing special in that. those regards, I'm just a very good example, is especially if you come from the Indies,

which is next to no money. If you're not like a very big name, you struggle for years to make a living, you work a second job, you eat the dirt. Then you got to have some faith. I had always faith in myself. And one thing I never did was questioning my beliefs and I never questioned to bed on myself. So for the most part, I can only say that I had a gut feeling. And the beautiful thing is that my gut feeling in my life so far, which is oppressive, never, never tricked me, is that I think things will work out for me, that I can battle myself. Because on one thing, you're going to be pretty honest with yourself.

There are many, many people who say that they are uncomfortable with the situation. There are many people that say, I won't change. but this change always requires guts it requires courage it requires to also deal with the possibility that things could not work out your way and I was aware of all these things

because again you said I was the in April it was the last point of time where I was in the ring okay the feeling that I got that I maybe am not right anymore where I am I had it already before which is healthy it's not to blame anybody because there are a bunch of of beautiful people that I spent time with in the last seven years that I spent with

WWE. But it was, it all came down to bet on myself and believe it's going to be all right. That's what I did my entire 14 year long professional wrestling career. Do you remember when you started to feel like maybe this isn't the place for you anymore? I think, I think, I mean like my, after I, I've torn my ACL. I've been fortunate to win a championship straight back on my comeback, which was an amazing moment for me that is still cheeryish.

I think that after I dropped the belt, things kind of went into directions where I feel like, okay, it could have been better. It could have been more time to go into a story, into something that is outside of just holding a championship, captivating for the people. So I think around April, maybe even the month before that, I was already like, just thinking about it.

It doesn't change, it never changed anything about my work mentality because I love what I do and I make every minute count for myself. But I mean, we all have feelings and we all want to, especially if we were in the business like this, we want to devote ourselves to this. But I also know it's just a part of the business. I'll change that. Shortly before that, as you may recall, was the Royal Rumble in Riyadh, and a lot of your fans were very upset about a certain spot in that match between you and Brock Lester in the midst of your U.S. championship run, where he essentially no-sold all your offense. Did you feel disrespected by that?

They seem to be disrespected on your behalf, and if not, why? I mean, first of all, that's a shout-out to all the fans that are feeling. with me and are passionate with me and get angry with like for me yeah in that sense like i love all of you guys and uh you've been sticking in robbing me for forever so i appreciate your concern but i said it before honestly like if you really understand the persona that i have been in the ring for the most part of the time like i've been facing monsters you know and at the end of the day you can't change something things. You have a person like Brock Lassar standing in front.

Like most people would run away as soon as that happens. You know, that's simply what would happen. But me as a persona, me as Ilya Dragonov, who is tough mentally and physically. I think for what I was given and how this whole situation occurred, I did the best what I could do about it. And I can't change anything about it. But my best career moments were made by my vulnerability. I wasn't becoming a name by being the person who dominates at all times. I became a name on moments where I got beaten down, like beaten down badly.

I don't know how good the camera angle is, but my nose is actually making a right turn because it has been broken a couple of times. Right. Right. But it's always the way how I fought back and how I recovered after those moments because these moments make great stories. So I don't see it as a defeat. I'm glad that people are upset for me and maybe it could have worked out a different way. I don't know it today, but I can tell you so much that I didn't spare a second or third thought about it.

Okay. Do you leave with any regrets? No. I mean, like, why should I? Why should I? I just celebrated a beautiful, beautiful next chapter in my career. I definitely made a name for myself. I was highly successful in NXT UK.

I was highly successful in NXT. I still consider myself pretty successful on the main roster because, again, I have a beautiful fan base, but I was never the character. Like, for me, it's very clear to know that, I have only two, there are only two categories of people that watching my work. Either people who are extremely behind me, really get me, really get emotionally invested into me, or is the polar opposite, the people that think I'm the craziest person in the world and

what not. I don't even know all the critique that is towards my person. But I love it that way because people care. and that's what you want to do as a performer. You want to make people care, and you're another good performer if you're not polarizing the masses. You know, it seemed like, at least from my perspective,

about two or so years ago, AEW was trying to find its way, started off very strong, then a whole bunch of stuff happened. They were trying to find their identity, and it seems to me, especially in the last year, they've hit this groove. You know, Tony likes to talk about

this is where the best wrestle. The shows have been great. The show at Wembley was tremendous. Osprey, all the stuff that's happened has really been, you know, very interesting to watch. And I'm wondering when you say, all right, around April or so, this is when you started to feel like this wasn't the place for you. Was it because you were watching what was going on over there and thinking, I'd be a much better fit over here? I want to wrestle the guys over there. I just feel the vibes different over there.

Is that what kind of helped you make this decision? Were you paying attention to what they were doing and were captivated by it? I mean, obviously, but as a part of the business, you always look left and right. I think this is like being just an open-minded person towards all different types of things. I mean, I pay a lot of attention to many things outside of professional wrestling even. Like I love arts. I love to read. I love to get inspiration for a lot of different fields.

But if you specifically talk about AW, of course, I was seeing what the people were doing. A lot of my former friends from the humble indie days are here, Carl Fletcher, for instance. A lot of people I was looking up to when I started to wrestle. For instance, a Samoa Joe. Yeah? I, of course, I pay attention what these people are doing. If you look at the world champ, Will Osprey,

I shared a locker room with him a couple of times. So I always were aware what his kind of path-ish has been. And if you see somebody is following us, certain style. If you see people that actually inspired you to be the person who you are today and to pursue this wonderful art and this wonderful business, then of course you pay attention to the other side. That's obvious. Speaking of Kyle Fletcher, it seemed as though he kind of let the cat out of the bag on social media about a month ago. How did you feel about him posting that on Twitter? I noticed. Ah, I mean, I was basically, that's funny because I was basically asking myself

to what he actually wanted to say until I was reading the letters from up to down. Yes, yes. And I felt good because I didn't feel like I'm the only person who was kind of like hard to get it. But then I was reading it and I thought like, oh, that's very nice. Like, yeah, Kyle and I, we go way back. Like in his humble indie days, he also spent a lot of time in Germany with his partner, Davis, like a former taking partner. And we had some matches and different tag team constellations.

We know each other for a while. We have respect for each other. And that just is one kind of support is just reminding me. It's like everything right now feels very brand new, but also very nostalgic at a certain point. And this is a very beautiful feeling to me. And this is a feeling I try to hold on to and give it a little bit of, touch of my endless passion and just make the whole future count like nothing else. Perhaps, dare I say, sort of like feeling like your home, right?

When there's a brand new element, but there's some nostalgia that kind of feels like home comfort. It feels like it feels a bit like I get back and I get pushed back into my, into my humble indie days where everything was less a business and it was. all just passion because if you wrestle for no money in front of crowds that sometimes are some random German cities with 20 people sitting there you've got to have a passion for this you're going to really love this to go through this and yeah it's definitely this hard touching feeling that that yeah i i kind of missed can ask did you speak to any other promotions

about their interest or was it only AW? If I got to be honest, like everything went down so fast, everything I did was just giving myself a rest. That's pretty much what I did for the most part. But when things clicked, they clicked very fast. So it was only AW that you spoke to? Yes. And when did you actually sign with them?

I think it possibly would have been just like a, like a minor time after my college expired. Okay, there wasn't a period where you couldn't do that because it expired. It wasn't like a release or anything like that. Sometimes it's 30, 60, 90 days. You didn't have to deal with that. No, it was a very easy-going expiration. Okay.

And so the reason why it took about like two months for you to debut is simply because of the visa? Because exactly of that, because I'm still a German citizen and I need to have a visa to work in the state. Did you feel like you were getting antsy, you know, seeing all this. Antis, like, anxious. Like, you wanted to, like, you wanted to let the shackles off and finally debut in your new home. Were you feeling, you know. Oh, yeah. Oh, for sure.

I mean, like, again, I'm everybody who knows me, my best friends, family, the love of my life, they all know that the only thing that I really am absolutely terrible at is even, like, sitting here right now. It's just, it drives me crazy because I want to move. and I want to do things. And yeah, I literally couldn't wait. And when this beautiful day on Saturday approach, it was an absolute relief for me to let it all out.

And yeah, upcoming like tomorrow on Wednesday on Dynamite, it's going to be the next relief when I'm going to finally debut and have finally the option to fight again and express my heart. Do you know who you'll be competing against? At this point of time, I don't. Okay. But whatever poor soul is going to hit, I just want them to know already, this is nothing personal. It's just my devotion to professional wrestling.

Do you think you'll be a little more nervous? Maybe not like your rookie days, so to speak, but do you feel like you'll have those jitters because you'll be, you know, re-debueing, so to speak? Depends on if you talk about anxiety, no? If you talk about excitement, for sure. But I never had, I never lost that anyway. like I'm always shaken before I step out in front of the audience. But I realize for myself because I'm thinking a lot and I'm very in touch with my own emotions.

It is that it never is never being nervous because it always ends up good or better than I expected. it is more like just the excitement of how I see professional wrestling as a fighting business, it is fighting for me. And no, no, I do what I feel like I dedicated my life to. And this is the air that I breathe. This is the new fresh air that I breathe. And if I can't breathe, I can't live. To a degree, the reason why I asked you that question is I've heard you talk about battling panic attacks and this being a constant in your life and also being the inspiration behind your neck tattoo, which I find fascinating as someone

who has talked a lot about mental health and anxiety, these types of topics. And so I'm wondering, do you still deal with that? And if so, how do you combat it? How do you continue to deal with it and thrive on massive stages in front of all these people? Well, that is a beautiful question. Thank you for talking about this,

because I feel like this is a topic, a lot of people, especially now, I think there's more awareness about this nowadays, but I feel like it's still a topic that people need to talk about more, is I still have that. Sometimes I have this very bad, sometimes I have it less, but it's a consistent thing that is like kind of a part of my life. But I came to the conclusion, and especially when you're younger, you try to fix everything. You try to find like this simple answer to complex questions, which the phrase itself explains that it's not possible.

I think getting to know myself so much through professional wrestling, I realize that it's sometimes in life you need to give up in a certain way. You need to just to accept that things are the way they are. Because first of all, it gives you a peace because you realize that you don't need to fix everything about yourself. and second of all, you can let go. And you can accept it the way it is because it's not only something negative. Like this kind of panic or this kind of like feeling that I carry with myself

is also letting me perform harder. It let me put more effort and more devotion to what I'm doing and then lets me love for. You know, I'm a big overthinker, but I'm also a big over-lover. I overlove the people in my life and I over love the business that I'm, thankfully, you're part of. So I realized, to summarize all of that, that I work very, very hard for my strengths,

but I also really, really earned all of my weaknesses. When's the last time you had like a really bad panic attack? Well, that's a good question. I guess I guess at least multiple times every week. Really? I don't even, I don't even pay. attention to that much because again, that's what I said like

I don't try to be a Polish person. We people are more than more than a person. We people are more than a persona. I think that all people have so many multiple layers that make the person as a whole in the big

picture. So as soon as I kind of like accepted myself and saw the good sides of these things because nothing is just black and white. There are a lot of gray areas. It gave me the option to deal with that way easier. And I believe the best improvement is for a person, is to let go, is to accept some things and live with them, not in shame, but with a certain pride. Again, I work for my

strength as much as I work for my weaknesses. It makes me a person. And it makes me for most certainly relatable and the most important part for all my performances, it makes me authentic. I agree with all those statements. I'm just wondering, has it ever happened in guerrilla, like seconds before you're about to walk? And so how do you, how does, like, because I hear this and I'm like, well, then how do you combat this? How do you deal with it? How do you then perform? It's one thing to have a panic attack in the comfort of your home. Now you're about to compete in front of a million people. How do you deal with that? You accept. You try to go. I mean, the thing is like it gives me a lot of pride because I had this in the middle of a fight. I had this on my

entrance. I had the seconds before where I felt like I was forgetting my whole match. But I worked so hard for the skills that I have that I, that I'm resilient enough to still do my job. And thankfully, and that prides me very much. And that's the reason I was So I'm very proud of myself at certain days. It's exactly that I never give in. You know, I accepted it. I dealt with that. It made my performances for myself even more real.

Because that's what I want to do. I want to portray a real fight. That's professional wrestling. You know, it's a dramatic, dramatic fight that you portray. And I could do this even more intense. So this thankfulness for this, call it burden or whatever, it helped me to go for this. By the way, and I saw this online, so I'm not going to take credit for it. Shout out to Fightful for posting the graphic.

Did you realize you debuted October 17th of this year. You won the U.S. championship upon returning October 17th of last year. I mean, that is some crazy stuff. No? How do you react to this? Did you know that? Did you realize that beforehand? I did actually realize that and I was talking with my girl about it which is like it's it's so poetic in some kind of way it's so it's like two so important memorable moments for me that I cherish that it's kind of like just funny how things work out it's it's really I I mean the best things in my life always happened when I never expected them which is also a way that

makes me let go much easier to the capacity that I, of course, can. But yeah, this is just crazy. Before I let you go, and again, thank you for this. This has been a great chat, and I really appreciate it. I did see you comment on the shocking passing of Benjamin Satterley, aka Pak. And I would imagine you've crossed past with him over the years, Indies, European scene. I couldn't find if you've ever wrestled him, so perhaps you can shed some light on that. but I'm just wondering, you know, your emotions after finding out about this, this awful, tragic news and how you want to remember Benjamin Satterley.

You know, the thing is about this, like a lot of people, and goodness, it's still so terrible. And like many, many people knew him way better than I did. Okay. I only crossed past with him once in a show in Ireland for over-the-top wrestling, where he had a whole different match. So I didn't even have the chance to wrestle him, which is like, just for me personally, also a tragedy. But just how that this happened is just like he, for me personally, he was just one of the major people that I was watching when I didn't even know how to put on a headlock. Yeah, I don't want to know. And I'm sending all the, all hope and and feelings to the people that were much closer to him.

hand that I was, but like this person was so influential, like one in a million performer. He shaped the business, he shaped the independent wrestling business and even the business in the bigger leagues in a way that nobody else could. And not knowing him as a person, he must have been a wonderful person as well as I talked to some colleagues of mine. So yeah, this, this. this very much touch me. It's very sad. Still to this day. Yeah, it's still very fresh. And I appreciate that. Two last things, if I can, before I let you go, obviously you had a great relationship with

Walter, aka Gunther. I've been rather outspoken about how he's been used over the course of the last year. I didn't like the retirement match, the AJ Styles match, and I sort of predicted that what would happen is exactly what would happen here, that they wouldn't benefit from from what they put him in. Can I ask, like, how do you feel about how he's being used now and how they sort of used him post those two big retirement matches? I mean, I guess my feeling is the same feeling as a lot of other people share. Like, if you are the person to retire, John Cena,

it's kind of like a standard that you should keep a certain level of debt, in my opinion. Yeah, for me, he is one of the best. he will be one of the best of all time he is a dear friend of mine for I don't know meanwhile maybe since 2014-15 yeah I mean

we are dear friends to each other and I want to I know he's good I know he will always do good and whatever he does is going to be it's going to be awesome but I can of course imagine that after the standard that he set and the standard that how he got portrayed

that this is not necessarily the level that we are working at right okay by the way shout out to you keeping the name i guess it's because you had it on the indies and you kept it is that is that the secret so perhaps the lesson is try to keep your own name if you signed so that you right yeah i mean i was always in the dragon off i was always in the dragon of then that never changed and uh everybody kind of knows it how did you not change it when you sign with them because usually even if you're well i mean look at look at Gunther, I know he was Walter in NXT, but how did you convince them to keep your name that you had an indie so that it would benefit you here post-W-E? Oh, I did not change my name, because nobody ever asked me to.

Nobody ever asked me to, so it always stayed my property. And that's the easiest answer I can give you. Like, there was never the conversation about me changing my name. Wow. Yeah. Incredible. All right, so we just talked about an anniversary. A year ago, you win the US title.

A year later, you debut. In the next year, top three opponents that you want to face in AEW. Can you give us the ranking? I think I did it. I think I did it already, kind of like the ranking. As nice as this person was already treating me, it's time to compare some craftsmanship. So give me Fletcher.

I got a wrestle one of the absolute killers in that business, which is Samojo. And if you talk about killers and talk about the match that physically and emotionally can captivate people, give me moxley as well. And I think I already mentioned them on the press conference. Yeah. That's a pretty good list of names. I know there are others that can be included as well. Looking forward to the debut tomorrow.

It's AEW Dynamite Wednesday night. Are you in the States right now? Did you go back home or are you staying in the States? I'm staying in the States. Okay, okay. I have a lot of travel very comfortable home. There's a lot of travel back and forth. Thank you so much for the time, Ilya.

Really enjoyed us immensely, and congratulations. What a debut you have set the bar very high. I have a feeling you will supersede that and do great things in AEW. So looking forward to what you do over there and wish you nothing but the best. Thank you very much, Ariel. It was a pleasure. Same here. There he is, Ilya Draganov, aka the Mad Dragon,

making his debut on Saturday at Russell Dream in Orlando. A lot of fans super excited about what he's going to do in AEW. Had a great run in WW. He did tear his ACL, 2004 to 25, came back, won the U.S. Belt, ended up dropping it in early 26, Andre the Giant Battle Royal. His last singles match was in March, so it's been about seven months since we've last seen him in a singles match. That changes tomorrow, AEDA.

dynamite. Congratulations to him on the deal and to AW as well. Matter of moments will be joined by Adelaidea Depot to talk about some boxing yesterday. Some shocking news hit the wire right before we went live and that's Chaucer Stevenson leaving Zufa boxing, getting released, whatever the hell you want to say, parting ways and we were just waiting for Eddie Hearn to react to it all. And so he did speak to IFL TV from I do believe his yacht somewhere in the Mediterranean. I think, and predictably he was quite happy about the turn of events. Take a look at this from Eddie Hearn. They have not done a show in America for five months,

and they won't do one for six or seven months in America. Please somebody play those interviews now and tell me, judge us by the end of the year and watch our body of work. awful, disaster, monstrosity, embarrassments. Is this slow down? The capitulation. I think it is. Capillary busting.

Blood pressure rushing. And in the words of one of my old nemesis, I think just 10 months in, it's all over, over. Look at that smile. That smile is not a mistake. I think the audio might have been slowed down a little bit. Maybe he was just speaking that way.

He's loving this. He's absolutely loving this. He was asked about the state of things as far as the production is concerned for Fury Joshua, the story that will never die. Here's what he had to say. Dana has stepped down. He's back down. He came out.

He said he's the promoter of the show, right? He said, you've got to listen to the little word. words and nuances that are thrown in and changed. So, like the one about judges after at the end of the year to now it's judges in a few years, right? So he's come out, he said, I'm the promoter to show, I did the venue deal, the fights taking place in America, but all of this stuff that was untrue, right? But still you have MMA journalists going, yeah, I mean, you haven't said anything that isn't true so far, right?

he's now saying I'm one of the promoters I'm involved on helping like whatever he now wants to pivot to say he's doing the production okay so

under our contract he can't so that's really where we stand on it and seller have confirmed to us in writing that Dana White

and the UFC are not doing the production for this show so we have to go through the same process, blah, blah, we'll speak to Netflix, and guess what? Whisper, the production company, right, you know, that did the production for Fury MacMadov, they have a contract to do the production for Fury v. AJ on Netflix.

So, look, read the production. If they want to speak to us about changing the contract about the production, I'm open to a conversation. Show me how it looks. I don't really care. I've won our battle. And the main battle was, don't let this fight happen in America. Don't take this fight away from British fight fans.

And we won. The main battle was him thinking he's the promoter of the event. Now he's saying, oh, no, I mean, there's a lot of us promoting. And I'm doing a post here on Instagram. So, of course, I'm promoting. Look, I'm promoting now. It's weak as fuck. All right, so there's Eddie Hearn talking about the story that will never die.

We will be talking about who's going to be producing this event until probably December 11. But obviously his comments on Shakur parting ways with Zufa fascinating and must see TV. You should go check out that interview over on the IFL TV YouTube channel. My favorite part of the interview, by the way, is in the middle of it all. Kugan has to go answer the door. Someone just rang his doorbell and he just leaves. He just leaves the interview.

And Eddie's just singing and talking to himself. It's tremendous theater. Let us talk about all of this and more. Maybe not that bit right there. all this news dying to get the two cents for my old friend, Adé Oladipo, on a Tuesday afternoon, just like the good old days. There he is. Doesn't that song feel like a warm blanket ade?

It just feels so, it's like mac and cheese. I don't know if that's a big thing over in the UK, but it's just comfort food, right? It's massive mac and chief. Yes, it warms my heart. It really does hearing it. And look, thanks for having me on, it's been a crazy 24 40 hours in the world of Bokhton, right? I mean, loads, loads that's happened. It almost, like this Shakur news, is almost overshadowed what happened at the O'Too-Ree.

Oh, yeah. I thought I was just coming and talk about DeWiardy. All of a sudden, Shakur Stevenson just drops this big bombshell on us. So it's been a crazy few days. Well, to be honest, yeah, I asked you to come on on Sunday well before all of this to essentially talk about that, Fondora, et cetera. And then this comes on Monday. By the way, what's going on with your microphone?

Why does it sound so funky? Frank? What do you have to say? Does it sound funky? Frank? Frank, what do you have to say? I think the audio device gets switched on Zoom. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

Because it sounds like you're speaking into the computer, not the mic. Okay, wait, wait a minute. You used to a certain standard from you, you know, your top tier usually, your production values. To me now, too, yeah. Okay, if only we had an audio engineer who would speak in my ear and say, you know, he's speaking into the wrong microphone, he needs to change the source. That thought didn't cross anyone with mind? We're good now? Oh, it sounds fantastic.

We're good now? Frank, speak for yourself here. What happened? Frank shocking. Frank shocking. What's handle that? Okay, well, this sounds phenomenal. The other way, not so great.

You sound tremendous. Okay, great. 24 hours removed from this massive news that no one saw coming. Chikor signs July 9th, we're sort of like bored to death from the back and forth with Haney, but it sounds like based on things that Dana White is saying like, oh, it's coming. November 28th, maybe Atlanta, they're going to figure this out, maybe on the zone. That's weird in its own right. And then he's released.

You've had 24 hours to digest this now, Aday. What do you make of it? Initially, when I first heard it, I was like, okay, this is a massive black eye for Zufa. And look, to an extent it still is. There's no way of getting around it. I remember Dana White said, judge us at the end of the year. The end of the year is fast approaching. And I think he's going to want to extend that judging timeline.

Because if I was to judge them now, it doesn't look great, does it? I mean, Shakura Stevenson is their biggest signing, was their biggest signing. I mean, the other signings have been good. Jaya Pataya, to an extent, Conner Bend, but that's more because of the story of Eddie Hearn and others, right, Carlos Saddam is, but Shakura Stevenson was the jewel in the crowd. He will be, and I still think potentially is the face of US boxing. So to lose him after not having a fight is embarrassing.

Let's just cut out all the rubbish. This is embarrassing, it's diabolical. But what confuses me is surely in getting somewhere as high profile Shakur and the contracts that are on the table. Shorter there is this thing where Shacour walks in to Dana White's office and everyone's there, right? Nick Kahn, Turkey might be there. Okay, this is the amount you're signing for. These are the fights that we have for you.

We can get these fights. And I think that's the most important part here. Sign on the dotted line. And Shikul's like, I'm in. I'm in. I'm fully in because, you know, I'm going to be your flag bearer. I'm going to be the marquee signing. You guys have been wanting since you decided to come in and, you know, hear all the words.

about taking over the sport. For you to not secure those things is bad. It's worse than bad, actually. It's horrendous that you haven't secured it. And I guess to release Shakur is almost the admitting that you can't get what he wants. And that's even worse. And look, when Shakur signed,

I mean, Shakur had this fight with Tia Flemal Opus at 140, and I immediately looked at who Zoufa have on their 140 resume. I was like, they've got no one. They've got, I don't know, Jose Villanuela. I was like, Shikur's not fighting Jose Vellan'suela and they're not going to pay him 15 million to fight Jose Vellanswela. So who else have you got? And then there was this talk so, okay, we could get Devin Haney.

Devin Haney then signed a big deal with DeZone, which hasn't yet been fully announced, but it's there, it's going to happen. I was like, okay, could they maybe get Tio over for a rematch? Could they keep Ryan? Could something happen there? They weren't able to secure any of these ones that I thought they were going to secure.

So all of a sudden, you've got this big marquee signing in Chikour Stevenson and you have no dance partner for him. You have no dance porn at 140. You have no dance porn at 135. And that's a problem. So I just feel like it's, I don't know, I almost feel like there are too many cooks in the kitchen, but there's no head chef, if you like.

There's no one actually really controlling what's going on. And if you're Shakur, I think you've made the right decision. You're 29, which shocks me to say that, by the way, because I still look at Shakur as like a 25-year-old. He's 29. You're at the peak of your powers. You're coming off a really good win against Tio. This is the wrong.

time to stall. Take your career back and make some big decisions going forward because right now Zoufa is not working for you. So as you know, promotions in combat sports and boxing in particular, they come and go. If Zufa boxing was this sort of like fly by night, rich guy, doesn't know what he's doing, you know, maybe like PBC, Circa, whenever that was, 2015, 16, 17, be like, okay, this makes sense. They bid off more than they can chew. They want to cut bait. he's asking for too much money, he's being difficult, whatever. All right, they're going to go there separate ways.

This entity that allowed him to just walk away three months after signing is the same entity that will do whatever they can to keep UFC fighters under their roof, not go free, guys ask to leave. There's a guy named Paulo Costa who's begging for a fight with one fight left and they are dragging their feet.

Neidez went through this. Sean Strickland is asking for his release. Oh, by the way, there's this entity called WWE. where the athletes are treated very similar to the UFC athletes, and those guys want to leave at times, they don't let them. And so the idea of TKO all of a sudden being like, yeah, okay, we can't figure this out, like, see ya. It doesn't compute.

It doesn't make sense to me. I don't understand it. They're too smart. I feel like there's more to this story. Now, something very interesting happened yesterday. The news came out. He broke the news. And then shortly thereafter, I started to see a whole bunch of tweets

and commenters, YouTubers talk about, okay, here's what I'm hearing about, about Shakur Stevenson. He wanted 15 million to fight Jose Valenzuela. They were offering him $7 million to fight in Newark. The juice wasn't worth to squeeze it. Everyone was saying that there was like five or six people saying the same thing. And I was like, oh, this is 100% coming from Zufa. They're trying to change the narrative on him.

I don't know what's the truth. The one part I feel certain in saying is there is more to this story. It can't just be as easy as like, we couldn't figure it out. So, peace out. In this war with Eddie and everyone else, they're just letting him walk, that doesn't make sense. I just wonder, look, we've had three years of Read season, right? I mean, we've just gone past the anniversary of Fury versus Vanu. And obviously, the main purse strings there was his excellency Turkey al-Shake.

I just wonder if the purse strings have started to kind of pull back a little bit. I mean, Turkey was, you know, front and center at the press conference, AJ and Fury, and he spoke about, okay, you know, maybe I do take a step back, and I think we all aligned it to his health. and let's be honest as well in those three years of Riyadh season Turkey's overpaid and I just wonder now if everyone is starting to do the real calculations

okay Shakur you might have been worth this under Turkey's regime under our regime when we are trying to look at the pounds and pence or the dollars in the sense you're worth this and maybe they've come to agreement

as though okay we were going to pay you this when Turkey was fully invested and fully wanted to be involved now that he started or decided to maybe take a couple of steps back this is what we think you're worth. And I do wonder if this is going to come to a head with a lot of fighters they've got, Belanga,

Richardson Hitchens, maybe even Connor Ben, who knows. But I just, it's not a good look for Zufa, but ultimately, if you're overpaying for talent, maybe there is a case of, okay, we do need to look at what we're doing. If we are going to be here long term, you mentioned PBC. PBC were known for always overpaying, and that well ran dry very quickly.

And look, I think Zouffer and TK have got deeper pockets, but you've got to be smart about what you're doing as well. How much is Shikour Stevenson worth? I mean, you are severely over-panned, and I love Shikou, I think he's incredible. But you are over-pairn if you think he's worth 50 million to fight Jose Velenzuela. That's just not how it should be. So maybe it's smart on both sides to kind of just say, okay, this isn't working. This is a relationship.

Before we get to the altar, let's just call it quits. And they've done that. I don't disagree, but is it that much crucial? crazier than paying Connor Ben 50 million to fight Regis Progray? And so in other words, I don't blame Shakur for being, I'm better than this guy. It goes back to that decision, which again is still sort of like wreaking havoc because guys like Sean Strickland will bring it up and UFC fighters are upset about it, that decision to give Connor that big contract in the war with Eddie to bring him over. And then it's Regis Progray and then he loses in the second round to Ryan Garcia. And so

do you think that in retrospect that was a massive mistake for them? Do you think that they regret doing that? Yeah, of course they do. But sometimes, and we know how this works, sometimes at the gates, you've got to go a bit reckless. You've got to go a bit crazy. You've got to make noise. And they made a lot of noise with that Connor Ben sign. And they made a lot of noise with that Conner Ben sign. And maybe they had to overpay.

And they severely overpaid. But one thing you had with Conner is at least you had guys that he could fight. I mean, the Ryan Garcia fight was a big one. I was there. And I don't know if it did the numbers. The numbers were never released. I'm not quite sure it did what we thought it did or what we at least think it could have done. but there was at least opponents there

and there still could be in 147 or 154 or 160. I think the problem of signing Shakur is yes, you sign that talent but ultimately you've got to have dance partners for him. You can't sign a talent as good as Shakur Stevenson and you look around and look at the 135 landscape

and well Floyd's Goffield's over there we can't get that one. We can't get Abdullah Mason he's already thought William's a paider. We can't work with him anyway. And then at 140 we can't get Dalton Smith. We can't get Alberto Puello. And there's no one else. So they've almost signed this talent. And that's why when Eddie has this dig about saying there's no boxing people over there,

I wouldn't go that far because there's still smart people over it. But it's a strange signing to sign that mega talent and have no fights for him. It kind of doesn't make sense. And if you're Shakurin, you've been training for eight weeks and you're trying to almost make fights yourself, him and his manager with Devon Haney and others. Like, why are we doing this? Like, you guys should be doing this. I'm the talent.

I just turn up to fight. And if you can't get me the fights, get me the hell out of there. And that's why Shakur's David said, enough is enough. He's knocked on door and says, release me. I want out. And I think it makes sense. Okay, so he said in the video that he posted yesterday, he's taking his career in his own hands, going to have his own promotion.

And we've seen this from guys before, but like, what is the promotion, right? Like, Haney has a promotion, if he a female takeover, like, what is it? So do you think he did say when he signed, DeZone tried to match, but it was too late. Do you think he goes back to DeZone? and I recognize the fact that you do work for DeZone, so I'm not trying to talk to you as a DeZone representative here, more as a boxing pundit. Do you think he goes back to DeZone?

Do you think he really does his own thing? What's the move here for him? And who is it against? He has to go back to the zone. He has to. I mean, what else is there? This is, I guess, the good and the bad, right? DeZone have all the partners.

The zone have majority of the fighters. They have Golden Boy, they have PBC, they have matchroom. They have top rank in the UK, the Queensbury, Boxer, the matchroom. So you almost, there is nowhere else to go, which doesn't help Shakur Stevenson, by the way, when it comes to the bargaining table, all of a sudden, well, you can't go back to Zufar. You can only come with us, which means, I guess, your bargaining power, so to speak, the money you want might not be the money you left. So, yeah, he's going to go back to the zone.

Again, it depends upon what weight class, but I guess the zone can make the fights. I mentioned Floyd Schofield. Is it a big fight for Shakur? I'm not quite sure, especially when your last two fights have been Tiafima Lopez and Williams-Apader. Is that Abdullah Mason? I don't think so. I mean, there is a guy over here. You know him well, Dalton Smith, who fights Alberto Puello on the weekend. I mean, I saw Eddie was kind of celebrating what's happened. Could Eddie maybe give him that big money fight against Dalton Smith if Dalton Smith wins? Don't Smith wants to fight in the Hillsborough Stadium, Shepard Wednesday's home ground, which I guess

when fall could be 45,000. Could he get that stadium fight against Dalton Smith? Could he get paid the money he wants to fight Dalton Smith. So, I mean, there are options, but all the options seem to be aligned to the zone. So it wouldn't surprise me if he does sign this kind of promotional deal, as you mentioned, like Tio's done and like Devon's done with DeZone in the next coming days. The clock is definitely ticking, but the talk was that if he did, in fact, fight Devin Haney, it would be on DeZone in November, November 28th was thrown out in Atlanta. Do you think that's a possibility?

Could they revive that, or do you think that's completely dead? I think that's dead I think that's dead And I think Crazy Chikur's kind of put The nail in the coffin When he did

When he did his YouTube Yesterday by the way Where he was in the car And he's like Look 1 35 and 140 And then he said Give me a year or two And then I'll go to

147 And I was like I don't I don't hear sort of Devin Haney roots When I hear that He's very very comfortable At 140

And I reached out to him I think a few weeks Because he was on the scale And he showed That he's weighing 1, 4 or 5 And I was like, dude, you're kind of small. It's like, that's what I said everyone.

I started at 126. Everyone thinks I'm a big guy and he's actually not a big guy compared to all of these guys. So I think that Devon Haney fight is gone for now. And I think he just wants to focus on 135 and 140. I'm so comfortable with Shakur going to 147 to fight Devin Haney. Let's just, let's just do it. I mean, Devin Haney's not been at this weight for long either. It's not like Devin Haney's been up here for four years.

Devin Haney's only really just jumped up to 147. So I think it's a fight that makes sense, but I think Shakur thinks that Devin's just on the night going to be far too big. And we don't want fights where there's hydration caps and all these weight stipulations. If you're going to go, go. Like Terrence Crawford did.

I think Shakur knows that as well. There's no point sort of teasing the fans of these catch weights and these hydration weight classes. It's 140 or it's 1447. All this stuff in between I just don't like. You know, I have to say, it's all a bit frustrating. The last time we saw Shakur,

January, MSG, great win. No sign of him coming back. Devon, last time we saw him was November, it's going to be almost a year. And then the back and forth on Twitter and all that, like these guys need to get going. You know what I mean? It's very frustrating to see them not fight at this point.

Dude, it's annoying. I mean, again, the Devon one surprised me. November, Devin. And Devin's been, of all the guys, Devin's probably been the one that's been most active, but even he can't get a fight right now. And look, it could be the numbers. I mean, again, we're led to believe that Shakur wanted $15 million for Jose

Valenzuela. Maybe a lot of these guys are pricing themselves out. The broadcasters aren't silly. The broadcasters aren't in the business of making losses. They've got to make their money back. And sometimes you hear the numbers. And look, who knows what these numbers really are, right? Shakur could come on and say it's nothing like $15 million.

But let's just say it's $15 million. And let's say, Haynie wants $15 million. I mean, where are we making $30 million from? It's a lot of money to make back for everyone. So maybe these guys might need to lower their number down. I don't know. Who am I to say this, right? I mean, they're going in the ring and they're risking it all.

But sometimes in order to make these fights work for everyone, maybe the number needs to be lowered a little bit. But my fear with a lot of these guys, and I was speaking to someone that covers a lot in American boxing, it's like, we might need to find a new crop. This crop was once the young crop that, We thought was all going to just dominate American boxing for the next decade. And all of a sudden, as I said, Shakur is 29.

These guys are all, 29's not old, Ariel, but you're now at your peak. This is it. We want to see you fight like three times a year, at least twice a year. Right now, in the case of Devin Haney, it's once a year. It's just not enough. We don't see these fighters enough, which is why. And everyone says it, big time American boxing is dying. It's no longer a top 10 sport in a.

America, which is incredible, because when I was growing up and staying up until 5 in the morning, it was up there with American football and basketball. It's now sort of vanishing right in front of our eyes because the best fighters aren't fighting enough. It's that simple. Well, about this time last year, just as 2026 was about to kick off, Dana White was saying, you know, we're going to fix this thing, we're going to revive it, we're going to do X, Y, and Z. And he also continued to say, judge us at the end of the year. Predictably, Eddie Hearn continues to bring this up in his is having a field day in the aftermath of all of this. And so let me ask you, we're getting closer to the end of the year.

How are you judging Zufa boxing? Well, look, if I was to kind of score out of 10, it would have to be a two or three right now. I mean, when was the last big Zufra American show? I mean, if we're not counting, if we're not counting in Connor Ryan, exactly, July, dude. I mean, that's just not good enough. And you think of their big signings,

you think of the signings that have actually sort of shaken Zufa, they've all been non-American fighters Conor Ben, Johnny Fisher, Jaya, Carlos Adamas. Like, where are these big American signings?

I mean, unless people say Edgar Belanger and Richardson Hitchens, I thought there was going to be more. Honestly, I thought there was going to be more. I remember Dana White said,

I think it, I think he was quite smug with it as well. I remember when they signed Conner Ben, I think he said, we're going to sign everyone. And I was like, they really could.

I mean, this could go crazy. And it's been quiet. I mean, I like it to BBC, when BBC were doing their other. thing, and nearly a decade ago. And they did really sign everyone. It felt like they were

signing every single fighter, including UK fighters. This hasn't been the same. And look, I think the zone have done well to kind of combat that as well. I think they've almost, if you like, assembled the Avengers by saying, okay, let's put all the best promoters under one roof and let's work with each other. And they've done that well. And the fighters are getting paid and the fighters are active and there's so many shows and there's big shows as well. So yeah, I'd give it a three or four. it could be better. I've liked a couple of the UK shows. I think the Chris Billum Smith won against Ryan,

was it Rosnaki or Zickey? I think that was a good fight. They've got Shev Clark coming up against Chris Billum Smith. There's been a fight card in Ireland. It's been okay, but mainly from a European standpoint, from American standpoint, it's been very poor. In that interview that we just played with IFL from this morning,

Eddie's saying it's over, it's over. I don't know if I agree with that. Do you? No, no, I don't agree. that, I mean, you know the guys behind this a lot better than I do. And these are businessmen that don't like to fell. And most times, I've always succeeded in their businesses as well. So I don't think it's over.

I think they've got the money. My fear for them is that, and look, I know Dana's a boxing guy, and Dale would always scream that he's a boxing guy. But I think the real boxing guy, the person that was willing to, you know, splash the cash, so to speak, and I mentioned at the top, is Turkey. He was the one that came in and was like, okay, we're going to do this, we're going to do that.

And whether it be his health or just, you know, he's almost done what he wanted to do with the sport and he's put on so many incredible shows. But if he pulls back, if he decides to, you know, okay, I'm going to really step back, then Eddie could be right. And Eddie knows Turkey a lot more than I do. So maybe he's at those conversations. But I almost think it's down to him because if he says, you know what, enough's enough. And I'm going to, you know, step aside and let you guys control this for now,

then I think there could be a problem. But as long as he's involved with it, I think they'll be okay. You were there front and center at the O2 on Saturday. What a show it was from Daniel Dubois. What a build-up it was. What an evolution of his character as well. I feel like people didn't quite figure him out early on. And now they're starting to understand his quirkiness, if you will, how endearing he may be.

He's just a special kind of guy. I'm wondering what was your biggest takeaway from that. And I'll offer three sort of headlines, if you will. like Daniel coming back looking like a juggernaut and just completely annihilating Fabio Wardly. The other one I heard was Fabio coming back too quickly and the last three fights, you know, Hooney Parker and then the first Daniel Dubois fight

just sort of catching up to him. And then the third one is everyone piling on Ben Davison. Like, oh my God, what a stretch. Is he a fraud? Is he throwing in the towel too quickly? Is he not that guy? Is he not who he thought he was two years ago? He was the golden boy.

Now look at him. What was your biggest takeaway from what you saw on Saturday? Philip Hulgovich. Dude, I was saving the Hergevich. We played that whole thing on the show. I was saving Hergevich. He was phenomenal. We played the whole thing of him going down the line.

But that doesn't count. That doesn't count. Okay, I'll get to that. I'm talking about the fight itself. That was incredible. Yes. The fight itself was definitely the five months. And I mean the five months in between two fights.

Obviously, what, 161 days? It's not enough. It's just not enough. Like, fight camp should start now for Fabio. But it should be 161 days. rest and then you get into a fight camp and ideally you're fighting February late January. Like you shouldn't be fighting now and I'm sure behind closed doors as much as Ben Davison and Lee Wiling the team are getting stick. I'm sure they were kind of beating that

drum as well. But Ben's a smart guy. Ben can only work with what he's given and ultimately in Fabio, Fabio's hit that ceiling. I love Fabio but you know you're working with someone that had too many things to fix between fights. It's almost impossible. what we're asking Fabio to do. It's impossible. And I remember watching the first fight back a few days before the second fight. I was like, wow, like between rounds, after the second knockdown in round three, the war dominated. So as much as, you know, it fight of the year and because it was all bloody and it was like, rockum sockam, the war dominated from round three to 11. And we're asking Fabio to somehow turn into Muhammad Ali and rectify those problems. It was always going to be very, very

difficult for Fabio and you could see the trauma was there. So as soon as he got hit with that right hand, you could almost see all the trauma of the first fight coming back. Like, that's the guy that hurt me first time around and he's here again. And if you're Daniel, you're like, yes, this is the position we were in in round 11. Like it was a continuation of the first fight. There was no stop. It was exactly the same. So, yeah, five months was too quick. And Fabio always speaks so eloquently. He would never say this. He speaks well, but I interviewed him on the Thursday, the press conference there, and I looked at him and I was like, it's too soon. Obviously, it's difficult for me to say this. I'm not going to say it. He's in a Zen mode, if you like, but it's impossible. And then you ask fighters,

Darren Barker, Carl Frampton, and everyone's repeating the same thing. It's too soon. It's too soon. It's too soon if it was just a fight. If it was just a normal fight and you didn't get punished, it would be too soon. Let alone, you get it. beaten around the ring by a 260-pound monster. It's just too soon. What becomes a Ben now? Do you think it's just a bad stretch? It's a tough one, isn't it?

I mean, we praise these trainers when they have wins, and Ben's had his praise. I mean, everyone praised them for what he did with Tyson Fury and getting Tyson Fury back to shape and that first world of fight. And, you know, you look at the camp, and Ben's got an incredible camp of fighters. It isn't just Moses and Talma.

It's Royston Barnie Smith. there's other good fighters in there, but you are judged on the big ones. You are, like every sport, everything, you're judged on the big ones. The best players in the NBA judge when playoff comes around. You ain't judged on the regular seasons when the playoffs, everything. So this is almost like the playoffs for Ben and unfortunately, his charges are losing. So it's going to be difficult. I think he might even, you know, you know the worst thing for Ben is he can't take a break because he's got so many fighters in camp. Like, I think Ben, Ben, I think Ben, just wants to almost just take a break, take a ear out, but he can't because he's got a loaded

gym of very good fighters and he has to commit to them. But it is a tough stretch. I was right in the corner when Ben was going to throw the towel in in the first round. And when he threw it in the second round, there was a couple of members of Fabio's team. I'm not quite sure who they were screaming at Ben. How they have, F and L are you doing that? It's a disgrace. And I'm like, you can't win. Yeah.

He's trying to save your guy from taking an absolute paste in, and you're screaming at Ben. And I'm like, this is too tough. And Ben's a young man. It must be very, very difficult for him right now. But I don't know, man. It's just a stretch. It'll have a good win soon, and I think it will all be forgotten. But the problem with Ben is that he's getting it from fighters over here, former fighters,

pundits, other trainers. It's like everyone's piling on, and that's difficult to take. it's a wild thing because in MMA we often criticize trainers for never stopping the fight, like just letting their guys go out and die. And here's a guy who I think is doing nothing less or more than just truly caring for his guys and saying like no mass and not allowing his fighter to be put in that position to say it. He's saying it on their behalf because he's looking out for them. And so he's being criticized for that.

To me is very bizarre. That's what you want out of a trainer. And I don't view it as not believing in your guy. That fight could have been stopped in the first round. He was getting battered out there. And I know Worley has an incredible chin and he's come back before against Hooney and Parker,

but still, it looked like it was Fedra Complee. So I really feel for Ben, and I do still think that he's one of the best trainers in the game. I think we've seen this before, time and again in all forms of combat. Guys go through bad stretches and people rag on them

and then they go on a winning streak and everyone forgets about it. Let us talk about the Croatian sensation, Philip Hergevich, because I was watching that and I was like, where's this guy been? Where is this personality coming from?

What was that? He's like going down the line of contenders and pretenders and he's just like rag. It was like it was like a roast. It was like his version of a disc track. It was unbelievable. What are you thinking as he's doing all of this? I'm like so much has gone on in my head because ultimately I'm supposed to really bring in Andy Lee and Carl Frampton. But off camera, I kind of do that to Andy Lee and Carl like, stay away.

Like don't interrupt because this guy's on one right now. And then when he starts swearing, you know what it's like, in my ear saying, Adi, apologize. I'm like, I ain't apologising. Because if I apologize, no, no. He's going to be kind of startled and then that kind of ruins his flow. I'm like, just go and I will apologize if I need to after.

I mean, this is now 11.30 p.m. I mean, calm down. It's only a swear word, right? It's on normal TV. I'm just, as soon as he says, like to Jalalov, like delete him, I'm like, this could be golden TV. And I felt so bad because he said, he's boring. And they asked me, and I was like, yeah, he was a bit boring.

I was like, oh, and they don't do this to yourself. Oh, yes. And then when he said he doesn't know who Justice Hooney is, I was like, what's he doing? It was, but the best one, and I probably, I don't know, people are going to be upset with me, is when he called Gassia,

a midget from Russia. Yeah. I was like, tears. Ariel, tears in my eyes. I was like, this is exactly what the heavyweight division needs right now. Where has this been? Has he always been this arrogant. I've interviewed him a few times.

He's always been arrogant and overconfident. but he didn't have no hardware to back it up. As soon as you gave him that, sorry, the IBF belt, it was like a WWE belt for him. Like he had, he had like he's,

I think his nephew, literally walking around with the belt aloft. And it just reminded me of WWE. It reminded me of one of those managers that come out and just scream and shout about their fighter. It was just sensational. And only,

I think the only other person I think that could do that, that was on that list is probably Jarrell Miller. Jarrell Miller would probably do something similar, but that's it. The rest don't really have personalities. Maybe Tyson Fury as well, actually. But if you're frank, you're just rubbing your hands together thinking, we've got another one.

All of a side of him, we're going to Croatia, like we went to Germany for Cabiel. You've unearthed another superstar. What a heavyweight stable he has, by far the best in the game. And so who would you book Dubois against next? Are you doing the Hergevich fight? He went into the ring. I know Cabell was also discussed, what are you thinking as far as Hergevich? Hergevich.

So is Hergiv. You do the rematch. Yeah, let's go. I mean, look, there'll be people upset about mandatories, and I get that. But, I mean, unification should always be above mandatories for me. If you can make a unification, like we are wanting to see another undisputed, right? We are wanting to find out who is number one. Look, we can, Alexander Usook's almost in a land by himself.

But let's just say Alexander Usoc is done. There are at least four guys that genuinely believe they're the best. You have Hergovich, you have Caval, you have Dubois, and I guess Fury still thinks he's the man. let's get close to determining who's lying and who's not. So I would go straight with Dubois Hergevich, and then I would see what happens of Nelson, Heser and Cabiel, and somehow we get that, the winner fights, the winner.

I just want to see good fights. And look, he's on a run. Dubois on a run, Hergevich is on a run. Why stop now? Frank's done stadium fights and sold out arenas. You want to keep that momentum going. So let's just, let's do it. Daniel's in the form of his life.

Let's go. Why waste any time here? Who's the best heavyweight in the world? Alexander Usick. Still? Still, without a doubt. Removing him? Without a doubt.

Removing him, Daniel Dubois. Wow, okay. I think he's sensational. I think he's Ariel. You know what it is? He's almost like a lion that has the battle scars. And he's now come through everything. Like, you know, early you're a quitter thing with Joe Joyce and Alexander Usik.

I'm having to dig deep in fights like Jarrell Miller. He's done the stadium fights, AJ, Usik. He's done the big arena fights where he's been booed in and cheered out. He's perfect for Don Charles. They have this relationship. Like Don is like Stan, just a big imposing figure. And that relationship works. And then he's beating people that are unbeaten.

Sometimes when you go for a list of fighters' careers, you're like, yeah, you beat him, but ultimately he was old. Or yeah, you beat him, but he was done. Or you beat him, but yeah, he had five losses. He's beating people. and there's no excuses for it. Like, Jerome Miller was unbeaten, Hergovich was unbeaten, Wardley was unbeaten,

AJ was the favorite. Like, he's taking these scalps, legit scouts of people, and he's stopping them all. That's one thing I think people need to under, he's knocking them all out. He's not going to points and, you know, waiting for a decision.

He's actually saying, no, we're not going to the ref or judges. I'll do this myself. It's incredible what he's doing. And he's only 29. That's the crazy part. It feels like he's been around for so long. And he's only 29.

He will, Lennox Lewis is the number one in this country by some distance. I think Lennox is the top five heavyweight of all time. The argument is that Fury second and AJ's third. I would say he might have taken AJ. And he's chasing down Fury hard. Like he's chasing him down and it'll probably take Fury as well. And then can he catch Lennox? I don't believe he can.

But who am I to kind of talk about his career until it's over? I think he's incredible and I think he's a massive problem for all the heavy weights right now. Don Charles, by the way, was pretty damn funny over the course of the week as well saying don't compare me to a kindergarten teacher

and all this stuff regarding him and Ben Davison. Even the interaction, did you see that clip between the first and second round where he's like, Daniel, Daniel, and he's like, calm down, Don. Their dynamic is hilarious. Calm down, Don.

I've never heard a fighter talk like that to a trainer. It's amazing. No, of it. No, Don's, you know, Don, and I like Don a lot. I've spoken to him a few times. We were in Nigeria with each other a few months back, and we had a nice conversation. Don doesn't think he gets the credit he deserves and he's right.

You know, when Daniel does good stuff in the ring, everyone talks about Daniel's jab and Daniel's ability to kind of think on the fly and do this and do that. It's Daniel. And oh, one second, Don's his trainer. Why ain't Don getting any credit for this? When other trainers do it, other trainers get the credit. Don feels like he doesn't get the credit still. Almost like he's a bad carrier for Daniel.

And he's not. I mean, ultimately, he's turned Daniel into a two-time world champion. He's had Daniel in against very good people where Daniel's been the underdog and he's got big wins. Hurgovic, Daniel was an underdog,

underdog against Miller, underdog against AJ. And it was close between him and Wardley. So it's not like Don's taking him where he's been massive favorites and it's just, you know, easy wins. he's at to teach Daniel certain things

in order to get the victories and I think Don rightly so is like why am I not getting any credit other trainers getting credit I've got a world heavyweight champion who many believe is the number one in the world right now and no one's said

and I have done this and I understand why Don's angry and frustrated and I understand why he's upset with the comparisons with Ben Davison as well Don's old enough to be his dad and he's like come on man I've got way much more experience than this guy

It's a bit unfair on Ben because Ben never says a bad word about Don, but I can understand why Don's a bit frustrated. It was a fun day in boxing on Saturday, started obviously with that event, ended with Sebastian Fondora in Las Vegas, the towering inferno. I'm sure you've seen the finish of his fight against Ramal Hadrubeah, if I'm pronouncing that correctly.

Let's watch it together, though, just for the sake of this interview and for the viewers at home, tell me what you think of Thomas Taylor's decision to rule that final punch the knockout blow and to end the fight and not be a decision here it is

courtesy of our friends at Zon and TNT let's take a listen of Rommal Hadra Bayai as he has wobbled in the closing moments of this contest it's not fun

it felt late to me it felt a fraction late not it was a fraction late right he threw it right after the bell correct correct

yeah take nothing away from Sebastian Fondora he did start off a little bit slow, ended much better, he was going to win the fight, but I know there are a lot of people upset about that. There are, there are. I will say this. I think Thomas Taylor is the best in the business. I really do. I think he's so good. He gets a lot of stick online. You know, he does because he's quite a vocal riff. He likes to get involved. He's one of those that almost, some people

say he wants to be seen. It's about the fighters, but he wants his voice to be heard. But I like the fact that he talks to fighters, gets fighters instructions, gives them warnings. He speaks to to fires and fighters that respect him, it seems. But he got that one wrong. He got that one wrong. And then he calls it off as well. It's kind of wild. It's kind of a wild ending. What I liked was as he's walking out,

you see Terrence Crawford, I think, and it's Timothy Bradley, are kind of pointing down saying, look, dude, you got that wrong. They're smiling at him and saying, look, but dude,

you got that wrong. And they're kind of telling him, like, you know, that should have gone to points. And maybe the opponent deserved to go all the way. But it was late. It was a fraction late,

but it was late. And because I rate Thomas so high, that's a mistake. Any other ref, I'd say, okay, look, it's on the, But Thomas is, I think, as I said, the best in the business.

So that goes down as a big mistake from him in a world title fight as well. But it wasn't like Fendora wasn't on his way to win in it. I mean, Fendora was sort of miles ahead at the time. So it wouldn't have changed the course of anything. It's just a bad mistake. Okay, so now it seems like we're getting Boots versus Josh Kelly. And then we'd like to see an undisputed fight, right? Unify all the belts, let's go.

A, do you think Boots beats Kelly? B, do you think Fondora fights anyone in between, I hope not, but curious your thoughts, and C, who wins if it is in fact Boots versus Fondora, which with all due respect to Josh Kelly, I think that's the biggest fight. Yeah, I like Josh, and I don't know why I have to start by saying that. Yeah. That means bad news is coming next. Boots speech, Josh. Like, there's, I have no doubt in my mind. Like, I mean, Josh could box, and look, Josh last time out surprised me.

Good win. Legit champion, right? beat the boogeyman, but I think Boots is frightening. He's a whirlwind. I mean, that fight against Zander Zias, I mean, he's taking a few, but it shows that he will come through it and he trusts his chin. And Josh doesn't hit as hard, I don't think, as Zander Zeyas, so I don't see a way in which Josh can beat Boots. Should Fendora take one in between? Absolutely not. I mean, if they are talking, it depends about the timeline, but if they are talking about Boots versus Josh in January, and then if Boots does come through that one unscathed, I think

Fondora should wait till the summer for a big, big showdown with Fondora. As for Boots versus Fondora, I'm not ruling at Fondoria. I think Fondora, I mean, for a guy as tall as he is, he can work inside, he can work on the outside. He's got power as well, respectable power. I think he's got better. I think everyone almost looks at the knockout, defeat. He suffered, what, three, four years ago.

He's better than that. And he's almost a cheat code for the weight division. I mean, look at him. He really should be a 175 guy. How he balls down to 154, if he does ball down, I don't know. But if he makes the weight well and is strong and healthy, and me knowing that boots does get hit on the chin quite a bit, it's not a foregone formality that Sebastian Fendora can beat boots.

But I'd have to side of boots. Okay. We are 11 days away from Cannell Alvarez versus Christian and Billy. Are you scheduled to work that event? No. No. asked to, I was asked would I be interested in work in the event? And I was like, no. Okay. What do you think is going to happen? I think it goes ahead. I think it goes ahead.

I think the event will go as planned. I've spoken to a few people that are scheduled to go, people that their names were down and I can see the names cleared. I'm like, are you going? Is it still happening? And they're like, yes, they are going. It's still happening. I'm sure there is a plan. be because I think most people, understandably so, most people are mixed about whether or not they want to travel or not. And I think that's, it's fair to be that way. I don't think that's anything out of the ordinary.

But the events still will happen. Other events, as you know, have been cancelled, right? I mean, the snook has been cancelled. I think there was a wrestling event that's been canceled as well. The tennis has been postponed. The tennis is the big reason. There's wrestling on November 7th. I mean, the next month and a half, there's this event.

Then there's W.W.B. November 6th. Now they're talking about a Zufa event in Riyadh with Carlos Adame on November 14th, then November 21st in Qatar. Then there's UFC in Saudi Arabia. There's a lot of events. Obviously, UFC's in Abu Dhabi this weekend as well, and I know that's not Saudi Arabia, but pretty damn close. There's a lot of events happening over there, and I do feel for the production staff, for the people working these events having to leave their families. You know, Canello is going to be treated very well over there. can the same be said for everyone else?

You'd like to think so. Obviously, look, Canello's the superstar, right? Canello's treatment's going to be completely different from sound engineer. That's just pull out of the hat there. But yeah, if you're that sound engineer, I mean, and you're booked, you know, this is your money. You must not that you're forced to go, but you have to go. This is what you do. This is your job.

If you don't go, someone else goes and you might then lose that gig for a long time. So, yeah, I do feel like a decision from high above needs to be taken and needs to be taken quick on this. But, I mean, as it stands right now, as we're recording this right now, that event is going to take place October 31st. I mean, I think it would have been counseled by now if it wasn't taking place. A lot of fighters will be flying in right now. Normally you fly in what, as you say, normally it's two few weeks before the event. I wouldn't be shocked if fighters are already there. And there's obviously ways in which to get there.

Are they going to fly into Riyadh airport, which I believe will be open or is open now? Are they going to fly to Bahrain and drive down? They'll get there. They'll get there. But as for me, no, I'm not working in the event. Canelo has yet to say anything. By the way, I don't think it should happen there. And I would love to see the move into Mexico.

And I think that would be a great PR move, actually. I don't know if they could do it in such a short amount of time. But just curious, if, in fact, they do fight and, God willing, everything is safe and sound, who wins? Oh, Canello. Yeah. That's my boy, by the way. You know that's my boy. I was on that bandwagon before anyone. Dude, you've been singing Christian and Bealey's name for years. I think he pulls it off. And does he know how much you've been? No, I've never met the guy. I even tried to get him on the show and I can't get him on the show.

What? Yeah, I asked top rank. They're like, oh, you got to go this guy. I'm like, oh, this is too much trouble. That's crazy. That no one has shouted Christian and Bealey's name. Like, you shouted his name before I even knew who he was. Yeah, it's been like three years I've been talking about. Can't get him on. I find that wild. Mbili's good. But Canello, you know, Canada got beat by Crawford. I think we sometimes forget who beat him.

Yeah. And I don't think he was great against William Skullweaver, so maybe I'm still having visions of Canello from five years ago. But I still think he's got enough left in the tank, Canello. But farther time is far the time, and it could catch up with him. I just don't think Mbili's the guy to do it. But it would be nice. It would be nice to see fresh new faces and a batten being passed, so to speak,

but I just don't see Mbele as that guy. Okay, last one before I let you go. We have to talk about Fury and AJ and all this stuff. Eddie's talking about the production and all that. Any of this give you pause, or you think they'll figure it all out? Because he's still talking about they can't produce, and Dana's saying produce, like, something's got to give here. Does any of this give you pause?

No, I think they'll figure it out. You know, I will say this, though. As much as I was on board of Eddie saying Dana shouldn't promote it, because I think Eddie is the best promoter in boxing. In terms of production, you've seen pretty damn good when it comes to production. I mean, I think their production... Best in the business.

Yeah, I think their production values are fantastic. Yes. So I don't think that's one heel you need to die on. Like, if I'm Eddie, let them have production, because ultimately you want this to be the best product ever. We want this to be the best fight and the best valued fight for the fans. and the UFC, when they come to production, oh my God.

I even just seeing them for Ben versus Garcia and just the amount of cameras. I was like, I've never seen this and I've covered some of the biggest boxing events ever. I've never seen these amount of cameras and these amount of personnel. So I don't think production should be an issue. But yeah, look, it happens.

I will be there somehow, somewhere. Okay. Yeah, 100%. Not in a working capacity. Okay, okay. I thought you were breaking news. No, no, no, no. No, no, I wish I wish, dude.

I thought I'm gutted. I've absolutely gutted. AJ Fury, like, covered pretty much all their careers. But no, I'll be there just watching as a fan. And then I will get on Eddie's jet and go wherever Eddie's going to, wherever it be Monaco. Oh, that's right. Maybe Russia for Bivel Smith.

Right, right. Wherever I'm going to that. Wow, it must be nice. By the way, Deonté Jai, you like that? Yes and no Yes or no If I'm Jai I like it because if you want the Benavides fight to be as big as I think it can be

Then there's no shame in making your American fan base more known And Deontay win does that right You're fighting one of the known heavyweight American fighters of the last 20 years And also they're probably around the same weight Like Deontay is not a big heavyweight And Jai is actually a big cruiseway. So they probably walk around the same way. It's a bit risky for Jaya this one as well, by the way.

Deonti can still pull that trigger. And it's a very quick turnaround. I was there for Jaya versus Michelian. He got hit a lot in that fight. So maybe, again, we're trying to rush him back before he needs to. I would just, if Benavides is signed for May, just wait it out until May, dude. Like, just don't take any risk.

Why do this? Why dangle the carrot in front of his face and say, have another one? just wait it out until May and get it on with Benavides. But I can understand the pluses and for those that are said, no, I can understand the reasoning for both. This has been a lot of fun, as always. I love these chats.

You do a tremendous job on the boxing YouTube channel. You also have the football one as well. Do me a favor because I know you love football. Don't, there's a match happen. Don't look at the score. Do me a favor. Oh, don't. Don't look at the score.

Don't look at the score. Don't look at the screen real quick. Oh, my God. Don't look at the score. I said don't look at the score. I told you not to look at the score. All right, all right, all right. All right.

Bye. Okay, bye, Adé. We love you. We love you. Thank you. There he is. The great Adelaideopo. A big Liverpool fan.

They're currently engaged. Whoa, that was trippy right there. In a battle with Villa Real in a championship league. Via, Via, Via, Via. Spain. Espania, Univision, Telemundo. This is so great. that it? Yeah, Vieira. The first goal was pretty bad.

Thank you for that. That was a nice little parting shot. Jordan, we're three hours away from the banner being raised. Like, I'm giddy inside. You know, the last time I experienced this with my kids coming to meet me and then we'll walk over was before game three. I was nervous. Now we're going to celebrate. Now we're actually celebrating what we were nervous about in June. Like, could you have imagined? Imagine. Look at these. Okay, this one really does make the band. look really fake. I know.

Or it's just... It's so good. Why does it look like? Oh, look at Josh. What is that? You think it's smoke? Oh, yeah, I see that. Look at Jay.

You got to be like a replica banner, right? Look at the way it's tied. I was going to say, who's letting them tie the bag? No, no, it's a replica for sure. But it just looks so perfect. I just, during the show, I'm not going to lie, during the show, I got distracted. There was a letter that Jalen's mom.

Oh, I saw that Players Tribune. So good. So good. I actually sent to my mom, and I said that this is something. Because my mom always texts me before the show. Like, good luck. We're watching. She's not giving me, like, breakdowns like his mom is doing, but his mom seems like a saint of a lady.

But she watches every show? She's unbelievable, yeah. She'll tell me where she is. Now, is she watching every second? No, but she's usually sending me something at, like, 1259, something like that. It does really mean a lot. She is. What shoes you rocking tonight, by the way?

An unbelievable human. You got the new ones? Oh, the new Ewing joints. You got them? You know, I got it. Listen. You guys like to mock the Ewing joints. I saw they dropped a championship inspired pair, right?

Anyone? Listen, guys, if you want to get me something for my birthday, come on. Look at those gold bad boys. I mean, Hanukkah's sooner than that, but, you know. Come on. Ooh, wait. Yeah, nice. Look at that.

Look at that fat tongue. Oh, my. They literally drop a new one every day. It's one of my favorite things. Well, when none of them sell, it's easy to just, you know, create a design and put it out. Yeah, they don't have to actually manage it. They don't have to actually ship them or make them.

That's not very nice. By the way, shout at the GC rocking the jacket. Longtime Nick fan. We appreciate your support. Nick supporter caught the fever last summer. I thought you were saying you caught the fever because of the dream win, so now you're fully into the world of basketball. City I live in gets to raise a banner tonight.

the city I'm from gets to raise one whenever the next WMB season starts. Long series. It's 1-1 though. And we're going to win this year. Long series, seven games, game by game. Yeah. Congratulations to the Tampa Bay Rays as well.

I know you guys were locked in on that one. Oh, yeah. Raise Brewers. Catch the fever. Yeah, you see the reaction on that junior Camerro home run? Yeah, I did like that. I don't know if the Fox executives like it, but I do think it's a good story with the Brewers.

Have either of them ever won a world too? series? No. That's pretty cool. Brewers once 44 years ago and the raise made it a couple times in the last like 10, 15 years. Most recently, I think it was against the Dodgers, right, during the bubble in Texas. So shout out to them. By the way, shout out to our good friends over at Kalshi. And I did see that they have a fun little thing with Dylan Brooks. Did you guys happen to see this? Dylan Brooks has taken out a, I guess, or maybe Kalshi on behalf of Dylan Brooks, all around MSG. to, I guess, troll

LeBron James, King Blocker 9,000? There's Dylan right there. Canada's own? Are you tired of hearing about the greatest basketball player of all time, then you need the King Blocker 9,000.

It really works. I think we even have the ad here. Do we have the ad? We have it. Let's take a look. Are you tired of hearing about the greatest basketball player of all time?

Where he goes, what team is he playing for this season, what ridiculous new product he's endorsing. Yeah. Then you need the King Blocker 9,000, advanced breakthrough technology that will mute any mention of or as many nicknames like King's LB. They're chosen. Blot!

Sound good? Dylan the villain, man. It sure does. Visit the URL today. Shout out to Kalshi for teaming up with Dylan the villain, one of the great heels in professional sports right now. A couple other things before we go. By the way, how exciting is this? EA Sports Fight Night returning?

Oh, this is sick. For the first time in 15 years, they tweeted this out to everyone who stayed in our corner, Fight Night is coming back? The fight is never over? Man, they came out with that game undisputed. It was all right, but it wasn't Fight Night. Be nice. Be nice.

I was very excited about it. I'm also very excited for BK at C. Oh my God, Casey, G.C. and Rick are going to have an amazing time. It's just BKFC. Oh, okay. They wrote BK. at C here. Here it is, guys. Here it is. They have announced the lineup January 22nd to the 25th from Miami to Nassau, Bahamas. I see a lot of famous people there, a special guest. I don't see. Ruse Cruz, baby.

G.C., I don't see Rick. I don't see Casey. But we need to be there. And when I say we, you guys, you guys. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Who the fuck is win? Yeah, for sure, man. Come on, come on. Let's do it.

Let's do it, dude. Yeah, okay. All right. You get on that ship, I'm there. I can't wait to set sail for my hand. That's it? By the way, I think it's like a Thursday to a Sunday, right? I actually think it's a Friday to a Monday.

Oh, damn it. If only I didn't have a show. No, wait. No, we can do it. What is it? What is it? What is it? 22nd to the 25th?

Yeah. Yeah, Monday, damn it. intern Josh is in he just told me so he'd like to attend as well so there's a big contingency of people that want to attend a lot of verbal talk you know a lot of a lot of things being said the whole team is in we talked about it a lot of verbal commitments how many are actually willing to set set streaming the monday show from the cruise ship easy sounds great sounds great uh frankie do we have any super chats We have a banner ceremony to get to against intern Josh's

Philadelphia's 76 years. The only thing that could have made it better was really playing the spurs, I think. That would have made it amazing. Oh, here's Don Carlo, who says, Ewing sneaks in gold, NY NIC's limited edition.

What do you say, boys? Hard pass. Okay. Here's more from Don Carlo. Vista Brand Risk 16. Did you see Brand Risk 16? No. Aiden,

Tivouvo problems with the production Andy Frank or Jordan Is he saying that we need Andy Frank and Jordan to be working at event? Yeah, he said, are they willing to help? No. Te sentarias on the mass or participates on the interview

post-rere? Oh, do I want to do post-fight interviews? I think he's asking how you feel about like the table interviews that they do during it with the participants. Yeah, I don't mind that. That's kind of cool. On Crown Doc?

also? I'm yeah Um Mass or men Me too So you're answering for Frank Andy and myself That we don't want to help

If they're willing to pay us Yeah this is This is one that I'm taking Like a hard line stance on you know I gotta check my non-compete again Yeah Frank No no this is not my fault

Frank uh sometimes I think he dabbles for Paramount Plus right Look man I dabble for whoever's paying Dabble and harp too Damn right Here's another one Hey Ariel and the gang Now that DWCS is over

Who do you all think has the best potential Not including the fighters That already made their debuts Hmm I want to see Ronald Humphrey's back That's your boy Balal Hassan probably Gets there the quickest

I think Wintz got the easiest path Because heavy weight Yeah it's a good point Lise Hernandez looks great To the point Bilal Hassan seems to have the backing Fighting an MSG already in his second fight? I think he might be the most refined of the bunch.

But yeah, Wint probably. Holt gets laid out the game plan. Yeah, no, you're right. He's got a follow. I mean, he literally, he literally did. Is he as good as Hokka? Is he as good as a, you know, doesn't have... The early signs are pretty good.

Does he have the mic skills? Does he have the mic skills? Luis Hernandez as well looked very good. I would say those probably are the four that stood out the most. Apodaca. Yeah. Yeah. Got to see what happens with Apodaka.

Yes, shout out. Why are you saying that like when we do the Max Kellerman bit? Why are you saying it? Yeah. It does, bro. Laser being pointed at the earth. Yep. I'm taking Apodaca.

Oh my God. What was that again? Igudala, right? Yeah. Eddie's saying Zufa's last show in America was five months ago. Dinna Berlanga headline end of July, so technically less than three months ago. Yeah. And to add his point, like you can, like, Ryan, Connor was technically Zufa as well,

but it wasn't all Zufa guys. So, you know, you could play that game. So that was September. But their last, like, true Zufa show was end of July at the Infosus Theater. So I guess his math is wrong. That would be three months ago. Here's one more from Sammy, watching your show. My interest for wrestling has grown first.

It was only boxing in M.MA, but seeing these guests make me want to follow their journey. Ilya Draganov was great. I really enjoy talking to him. My man. Very thoughtful guy. and I love hearing that from fans. I know that our bread and butter and our connection with the MMA community

is probably the strongest, but I'm very proud of the fact that we have gotten some great guests and great chatter and hopefully proven that we can talk about all forms of combat and do our research and all that stuff. And I love to hear from MMA fans who say, like, I didn't really like boxing,

but you've introduced me to this guy or that guy, and I watch this, and I like that. I didn't like wrestling, but now I'm interested in this. We've had some great chat. chats with wrestlers over the course of this year have really enjoyed those, and today's was no different. So thanks to Ilya and thanks to A.E.W. for the opportunity to speak to him first after signing with the organization. Gentlemen, tomorrow on the program, we're going to have both Alex Pereira and Plinyo Cruz in studio. I cannot wait for that. Talk about, obviously,

his upcoming fight against Sergei Pavlovich. Talk about what happened with the rematch that he was trying to get against Cyril Gan. Always great to have Poetan and Plinyo in studio. Plinio coming off the win at Misfits less than two weeks ago. So I'm looking forward to that. Also, we're going to be joined by the aforementioned

Philip Hergevich. I'm looking forward to that very, very much. And Mandel Nalo, aka Rack Garbage. He doesn't go by that nickname anymore, but he'll always be Rack Garbage to me coming off the big win over Nameshawkins. landware. He will join us as well. So I'm looking forward to that chat, one of our own, a Canadian training out of TriStar in Montreal. Also, on the nose, areaohwani.com is where you can leave

all your questions and comments. The post is already up. Please do subscribe. Why? Because every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, you get a brand new newsletter. The Young Crown newsletter is often running. Our good friend duty of Georgia is doing such a great job, aka she loves the gloves. She is doing an amazing job every Monday, Wednesday, Friday of recapping everything. I really enjoyed yesterday because she recapped everything that happened in the world of combat over the course of the weekend since Friday, so that was tremendous as well. Amazon Fire TV, we love them over there. Shout out to them. New episode of the Uncrown Beat Beat will drop tonight. Myself, Dan Kenobio, Najee, Alan Dawson.

all going to be on to talk about more boxing craziness. It's definitely the most interesting sport to cover these days. So stay tuned for that. And if you don't have Amazon Fire TV, it'll be on on crown.com on late Thursday, early Friday, and then on the pod feed on Saturday. Wait, is this true? What? Someone just said that today is the peace and love day.

You would know, right? Peace and love. Peace and love. Today's the day? Ringo Star. What's it? What's it. Ringgo Star. Ringgo Star. Peace and love.

No more fan mail. Peace. And, okay, here it is. Here it is. Let's listen together. Wait. Okay, wait, here it is. Is it October 20th? It sure is.

This is a serious message to everybody watching my update right now. Peace and love. Peace and love. I want to tell you, please, after the 20th of October, do not send fan mail to any address that you have. Nothing will be signed after the 20th of October. If that has a date on the envelope, it's going to be tossed. I'm warning you with peace and love, but I have too much to do.

So no more fan mail. Thank you, thank you. And no objects to be signed. Nothing. Anyway, peace of love, peace of love. That's my favorite part. Anyway, peace of love, peace love. That was posted 17 years ago, guys.

58,000 views on the Beatles Bible YouTube channel, one of the greatest moments of all time. Actually, I see a clip from seven years ago, The Howard Stern Show, Ringo Star explains with peace and love why he doesn't accept fan mail. I wonder if he's ever signed anything since that date. But yes, today's the day, Frank. Thank you for letting me know.

What a day! Banner Night and the anniversary of peace and love, peace and love. Are the boys here yet? Who's to check? Nope. There are nowhere to be found. They're lost in New York. I can't wait.

Now the question is, do we just walk? Do we do the same thing that we did in June? And do we just walk? Temes Street's about a 30-minute walk. But Google Maps is saying it's about a 30-minute drive as well, some way somehow. Do you have parking? I don't have parking. I say you just walk.

Just walk and come back after the game. Yeah. Nice day. outside? How's the weather? 60s? Looks really nice behind you. Yeah, it does. Let's see. Sometimes it's 70 right now. Go ahead and take it.

Take it. Joy of the walk. I don't know if you saw... Banner night. Are you going to get a replica banner for the studio? I don't know if you saw this part. This, by the way, you know what I could use right now? A nice little sake. Dreams come true, Sake? You remember that, right?

Sure does. How could we forget? God, it's been over three months. months. Yeah. I can't believe the new season is already started. Crazy, right? I'm still in the high. I still need to celebrate. Am I going to get a replica? Yes, they've announced that everyone's going to get a replica banner on their seat. How do I get more than one? What am I supposed to take it off the road? I feel like that's what I appreciate. Take other people's? I'll ask you, son. I know he'll do it. Okay, I am walking away, hopefully with three. I got the two kids. Are they going to want to give it up? I'll put mine in the studio. How about that? They, I don't I don't know about you.

I think they'll sell them. Yeah, oh yeah, eBay. They might saw them. Anyway, peace and love, peace and love. What a great day. Thanks to all our guests. Thanks to all of you. Thanks to all of them.

To The Garden I Go. Back tomorrow. See, I'm out of here. Peace, I'm out of here. Peace and love. Peace and love.