The Ariel Helwani Show - Jon Feliciano

Episode Date: May 19, 2022

The New York Giants offensive lineman joins the show for a wide-ranging discussion about his NFL career, mental health struggles, and his less-than-ideal upbringing. Feliciano tells Ariel about: The end of his magical three-year run with Ariel's favorite team, the Buffalo Bills (4:10) His relationship with Bills QB Josh Allen (17:27) How he made it to the NFL despite being homeless while in high school (33:05) His life-threatening battles with depression and anxiety, including feeling suicidal (53:00) Dreams of being an MMA fighter one day (57:03) And much more.For more from Jon, you can follow him on Twitter @MongoFeliciano.If you want to support our show, simply give "The Ariel Helwani Show" a 5-star rating on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. It goes a long way!Theme music: "Frantic" by The Lovely Feathers

Hey everyone, it's Ariel Helwani. Welcome back to a brand new edition of The Helwani Show. It is Thursday, May 19, 2022. I hope you're doing well. Thank you very much to my good friends, The Lovely Feathers, for this great theme song. It's called Frantic. I can't wait for the reunion. I'm very excited about today's program, my friends. Very, very, very excited. As you probably know, I'm a lifelong Buffalo Bills fan. I've been a fan since 1990. So since I was eight years old, I was watching the Super Bowl when they played the Giants back in the day, Tampa,

they lose last second, wide right, Scott Norwood, you know the story probably. And I was heartbroken for these guys that I didn't really know much about. And all of a sudden, I decided, that's my squad. I'm going to be a fan of these guys. And ever since then, I've been a Bills fan, have been following them for quite some time, and for a very long time, it was not very fun being a Bills fan. It is fun being a Bills fan now.

And you can imagine my excitement, my joy, my surprise when a member of the Bills named John Feliciano was retweeting, liking some of my MMA content. All of a sudden, I was like, holy smokes, a guy who actually plays for the Buffalo Bills, a living, breathing human being who actually plays for the Bills is a fan of my work, or at the very least, a fan of MMA. And so because of that, we grew to, you know, become friendly with each other. And he's been on my ESPN radio show back in the day. And it was great. I had an actual person who I knew on the Bills. Unfortunately, this offseason, he was released by the Bills. And now he's a member of the Giants. If he can't be on the Bills, because, you know, close to where I live, there's a lot of familiar faces on the Giants. And he's a great guy who deserves a big time opportunity.

And he's going to get one with the Giants. He's been in the NFL since 2015. He's played for the Oakland Raiders, the Buffalo Bills, and now the Giants, drafted by the Raiders. Known to be a scrapper, the kind of guy that you want on your squad, in the foxhole with you,

battling for you. There's a famous moment where he just like rams a member of the Chiefs because he's standing over Josh Allen two years ago in Kansas City. Just seems like the ultimate teammate. And he's a big MMA fan, like I said as well. He has, though, an incredible backstory, and he has been through so very much. Essentially, he was homeless for a period of time. When he was in high school, he's been through a lot with his family, with his parents, with his siblings. His story is one of, I mean, in my opinion, great inspiration. There's a lot to learn about not giving up, about believing in yourself, about not succumbing to the pressures of life. And he really opens up about that period in his life. And also when he made it to the NFL, feeling very depressed and also, as he put it,

suicidal. So it's a great conversation with an NFL star, a starter for the New York football Giants, a former Buffalo Bill, about his departure from the Bills, about signing with the Giants, about his tough past, about overcoming all of that, and about his love of MMA. A great conversation with a great guy, his name, John Mongo Feliciano. He is our guest this week. I hope you enjoy it. So a lot has happened. You're now with the Giants, no longer with the Bills. And I have mixed emotions here, John, because you're one of my favorite players. We're buddies with the Giants, no longer with the Bills. And I have mixed emotions here, John, because you're one of my favorite players. We're buddies. We love MMA. We text sometimes. We DM this and that. And it was so cool to me, John, that I actually knew a living and breathing

player on the Buffalo Bills, my lifelong favorite team since 1990. You re-signed last year. I'm like, this is great. We got, what, three more years of Mongo on the team? And then you leave in the offseason. Shoot straight with me. What happened here? Why aren't you on the Bills anymore? I was fired. Come on. How did this happen?

I mean, I think it's a combination of a bad case of injuries the last two seasons. There's nothing but love there. There's, you know, things happen. I could have been better some places. They could have been better some places.

You know, it's a business, and it's bittersweet, but I'm super excited to be home in new york and i'm just excited to be a giant right now okay so there's a lot that i want to ask you about that first of all i see a lot of the giant media guys the new york guys talk about this being home for you i know you were born on long island but you rep miami like everything about every sports team i see you rooting for is miami the whole thing is miami is this really home for you or is this a nice little storyline no no it's uh it's home it was more home before college because after college but before college i would be in new york every spring break every summer every christmas break

i have so much family up here that as soon as I sign with the Giants, my phone just boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Everyone's texting me. My uncle's been a Giants fan for years. It's definitely home, but I definitely rep Miami a lot. True or false, you actually

grew up as a Jets fan. True. I was a big Curtis Martin, Wayne Corbett, Santana Moss, Chad Pendleton, John. I'm like, you know,

I was a Jets guy. But that's dead. And that died when I went to Buffalo originally. Really, when I went to Oakland because we played

a couple times. But, you know, I'm happy to be a G-man. So, going back to last season with the Bills, you say you could have done some things better. I mean, you had a G man. So going back to last season with the bills, you say you could have done some things better. I mean,

you had a lot of bad luck, right? The injuries COVID, what could you have done better in retrospect? You know, I see, I see you biting your tongue on me here, John,

come on. This is a safe space. I'll give it to you. The real, I mean, you know, over there, they talk about, you know, i mean you know they over there they uh talk about

you know they want you to be yourself and sometimes i was a little bit too much of myself and i could have been a little more professional as in like yelling at a couple guys i probably should have yelled at uh like the stars no more, more upstairs people. Got it. I get it. But, you know, it goes both ways. I mean, they could have, you know, it's business, whatever. But at the end of the day, there was no hard feelings.

So, you know, I got that call from Bean and Sean. You know, we knew it was coming. You know, the money I was going to make and the direction I think they were deciding to go, we kind of knew it was going to happen. And that conversation was nothing but love. And, you know, I understand the business. And I definitely appreciate Buffalo for the growth that I was able to have when I was there. And who knows what happens. I'm on a one-year deal with the Giants. If they don't extend me, you know, who knows.

There's hope. I thought maybe they wanted to part ways because you ragged on their pizza. A very controversial take that you had before the separation. Or that point did you know that you were leaving so it was safe no i already knew i already knew um i mean i knew when i was i was leaving probably when uh i came back and i wasn't starting really from that yeah from that on uh you kind of get the sense. Whatever. It happens. Was that tough?

Definitely. It was really tough. I gave so much to that organization. I really embraced being in Buffalo and being a Bill. And then being buddies with Josh and all the guys um it was definitely very tough uh i read a book about it as an undefeated mind i started reading that probably in january because i i knew i knew you know i knew it was gonna be tough as when you give when you play like i play and and you really try to embrace the culture embrace the team it's like breaking up with the girlfriend breaking up with your they're having a divorce

um so mentally it was tough january february march you know those three months not knowing kind of knowing but not it not happening then. But again, when I talked to Bean and Sean on that phone call, it was no hard feelings. We all understood the business of it. We all kind of, it was a, it was a, it was a, I've never been cut before. It was my first time being cut.

But it was definitely like, never been cut before that was my first time being cut um but it was definitely like i don't think i wouldn't say like a normal cutting because we were all like that laughing but we were all in good spirits and all understood what yeah because you know when you when you know it's coming for that long i kind of had already started the process of grieving um so kind of when i got the call it was kind of like a breath of fresh air, like, okay, now we can move on to the next step. That book that you mentioned, what did you learn from it? I'm not familiar with it, but what did you learn and why did you feel like it was necessary to read that in that moment?

I took some notes. Oh, wow. Just because... And who recommended it to you? I'm pretty sure I probably saw it on the JRE podcast or something. So there was one, two, three, four, five main things that I took from the book,

which was articulate your life's mission, turning poison into medicine, endure pain, conquer fear, and gain inspiration from others who gain an undefeated mind. Just because I knew the toll it was going to take on me mentally. Just because when I was there, I kind of... Buffalo's a special place in that it's not everywhere where linemen, D-emen or O linemen, get embraced like that, like in the city.

You know what I'm saying? Like Kyle was the man out there. Lorenzo, when I got there, there was always like they appreciate the big man. And I kind of saw myself as, you know, one of the Lorenzo left trying to step into that role to be the fat man in charge out there. So I knew that it was a tough thing. I'd never been cut before. I prided myself on that. And I knew it was coming.

I knew myself. I wanted to make sure mentally I was all right. I think you were hospitalized, correct, due to the COVID battle. How bad was it? Yeah. So Saturday I felt fine. Went to bed around like 1030, and then 1 o'clock rolled around. I was like bad.

I was sweating. I was like I had really bad back pain for some reason, like pain, real bad pain. I was like in the shower, like curled up, like just with water. I was like trying to just gut through it. And then 5.30 rolls around and I'm like, all right, we play out one. So I'm like messaging Nate Breski, who's our head athletic trainer. And, you know, he's sleeping. He's not getting the messages.

So like around six, I was like, I can't take it anymore. I had to call him. And I was like, dude, like I'm effed up. Like I just need to like get some fluids and maybe like something to take the pain away. Because at that time, I was like, I'm going to play this game, especially because coming off of an injury, you know, they didn't put me back in right away. So I was like, like, I'm not missing this game. So then he was like, it was like seven o'clock around this time.

And he was like, why don't you just go to the hospital, get a, get a bag of IV. And I'm still trying to make the game. So, cause I would go to the stadium, but the IV people don't get to the stadium until like 10. So I was like, you know, if I can get IVs and maybe get like a two, three hour nap in, I'll be ready to go. But then, you know, I got to the hospital and the pain is just really bad. Um, and the classic, you know, sick, sick feeling. And then they're like, you know, we're going to have to test you. And I was like, damn, I was hoping, you know, we can kind of bypass that. We pull some strings or something. Um, but yeah, I got the test and came back positive.

And then I was out maybe like 20 minutes after that. I didn't stay in the hospital too long. I went to the hospital so I can get some fluids and try to make this game. If you don't, I mean, hindsight 2020, all that stuff. But if you don't get COVID, do you think you're still on the bills? Yeah, probably. Potentially. Because I mean, yeah, I think so. all that stuff but if you don't get covid do you think you're still on the bills yeah probably potentially because i mean yeah i think so that's a crazy thing and i know everyone's had to deal with it i mean the team in in like in many respects i felt like was at the epicenter of

all of it with the stuff with cole internally did it create any sort of drama within the team i mean it seemed like a lot of noise and i saw you would always have his back and other players on the team when i was back and i know you're very close to him um but there was a lot of drama and stuff that players don't usually have to deal with very personal stuff it almost felt uncomfortable to read this stuff right like i don't know if you've gotten your flu shot and i don't really care if you got let alone that stuff but it became such a big deal and especially about the bills, what did it do to the locker room? Speaking of B's, when worlds collide, his album just dropped.

That's right. Get it. It's great. You going to bring him to the Giants? I'm trying. We're trying. But our cap is pretty tight cap right now. Honestly, no.

Like, in the building, nothing changed. I mean, we're honestly, like, I know, like, they try to make it into a bigger thing than it was. But, honestly, nothing changed. Even when Jerry had his, he said his stance about it, there was never any combativeness inside the locker room. In the locker room, you can actually talk, say your piece, say what you want, listen to him. You can still be cool. You know what I'm saying?

Jerry's wife and B's wife, can still be cool you know what i'm saying um you know jerry and jerry's wife and beat his wife they're super cool you know like that their families are really good like real cool like they're both from texas they both had that texas connection there was never anything within the locker room that cause rifts concerning COVID. And I promise I'm not only going to ask you about the Bills, but I just have a few more questions about... I get it. That's your peeps. Yeah, man. I'm here for you. I appreciate that. I appreciate that.

Could I just say one of my favorite Feliciano Bills moments, and you might think this is weird, but it's the reason why I'm such a fan of yours and why I grew up loving guys like Charles Oakley in basketball that game against the Chiefs two years ago when you know Josh is on the... It cost me 20k Damn 20k

you come out of nowhere but you had your guys back like you freaking sprinted over there to have your guy back that cost you 20k did you pay for it or did Josh pick up the check No I pay for it or did you did josh uh pick up the check no i i paid for it i didn't ask him i didn't ask him to uh what about you like makes you want to do that why do you do that knowing that there's going to be repercussions right honestly i like i wish i wouldn't really it's not worth it um i wouldn't say that. I like watching

the clip over and over. You're on Instagram and you're flipping through stories and then you see, I'm like, oh, that's me. I mean, I think it goes back to what I was saying before and just embracing being a

Buffalo Bill which I'm going to do here, being a giant. Same thing. No one's going to touch Daniel like that. I mean, it was just like, you know, it was a cheap shot. I get it. Like, you're happy you had a sack. But, you know, I just, I play the game the right way, I feel like.

There's only one way I know how to play the game. And if I'm not playing like that, I don't believe I'm as good a player. Speaking of Josh, it seemed like you guys had a great relationship, still do have a great relationship. I remember the video when you were hurt and he's bringing you a glass of wine, I believe. Yeah. What is he like as a teammate?

And how would you describe your relationship with him? You know when you're like 9 or ten and you have like your best friend and you guys just silly all the time pushing each other and just doing all the little boy things that's what josh is he's like a 10 year old trapped in a man's body uh he is he makes the like the dread of the season you know week whatever there's there's always like a week nine to whatever like there's always like that that grind part of the season where josh always shines to and and making you laugh or i'm i don't know if you can tell, but I'm very grumpy in the morning. Okay. Like this. From like six to like whenever after individual is, when we get into team stuff, then I'm happy.

But Joshua just always just try to mess with me and just make me laugh. And I would be like so mad in the morning. And then I would get him back and like walk through or something. But he's just a fun dude to be around he you you want to play for him because he just doesn't care about his body you know on Sundays he'd be or Mondays he'd walk in just like limping like beat up but like every week he's out there just giving it his all and throwing his body around and doing stupid stuff that is amazing that we get nervous about. And then he does it and you're just like, yeah, let's go. But yeah, he's a great dude. I love him.

I'm assuming you've talked since you left the team. Did he reach out to you? Did he say anything to you that you can share about your departure? Yeah, I mean, he was sad. It's, he knew I had his back, even if that made me stick out a little bit. And I'm trying to read between the lines here, but what you're saying. I would say things that needed to be said that would help the team ultimately. Okay. Can you elaborate on the team ultimately. Okay.

Can you elaborate on that? No. Okay. I had to ask. But in your opinion, it was for the greater good of the team. Yeah. Yeah. And like I said before, I don't think there's any ill will on either side.

It was just the business. I was making X amount of dollars this year, potentially, which it would have been this year. And I didn't stay healthy. It happens. How do you feel about the fact that you can sign a long-term deal in the NFL, but then they can cut you? It actually reminds me a bit of MMA. MMA, you can sign a six-term deal in the NFL, but then they can cut you. Like, you know, it actually reminds me a bit of like MMA, MMA, you can sign a six fight deal and everyone's celebrating, but then you lose one fight and then they can cut you. They can cut you, but you can't leave. Right.

Like you couldn't call the bills and say, I'm out, but they can do that to you. Is that fair? Should that change? I feel like it's starting to change a little bit. Especially the last like year or two. I feel like you know how in the NBA players get whatever they want because it's a player-living league. I feel like the NFL is going in that way. Social media helps that a lot. You see guys like Buddy from the 49ers or k1 taking

all his instagram stuff out i think the players starting to get a little more power in that sense um but like yeah like if the coach gets fired he still gets his money yeah so it'd be nice it would be nice if the players got that but i I also understand the other way because, you know, there's 53 players for, you know, 46 on Sundays, 60, whatever, on a team. It's kind of harder when, you know, NBA, I think there's like 15 guys. So there's a lot more guys. That's a lot more money to go around. But there should be some give and take from each side, I feel like. Knowing that it was probably coming to an end in January, can you describe how you felt in Kansas City? I mean, heartbreak. I don't even know if I'm over it, to be honest. But because you probably wanted to be more involved

and you know maybe the run is coming to an end for you, I would imagine maybe a mix of emotions. Can you describe how you felt maybe the uh the run is coming to an end for you i would imagine maybe a mix of emotions can you describe how you felt in the locker room after the game um i mean to be honest i was like i don't know if i i mean i was definitely like sad for my my player my my teammates. I did what I can on the sideline. I don't like, I was coaching up people. I was, every time Gabe scored, I was on his hip. I was like, I'm there for you.

But I mean, you can't lie. There was a part of me that wasn't like, oh, y'all got what you deserve. Because, you know, I feel like I would have been, honestly, when you look back at that game, there wasn't, it was like they were playing football. There was no like – everyone was just going through the motions, as in like not – like there wasn't anyone like challenging

like in the face of the KC's defense or like – there was no attitude out there, I feel like. And I feel like that's what I bring. And I feel like potentially if there was that that it would have been such a close game but who knows i might be wrong sure no i understand you have confidence in yourself that i i've heard some stories that like the the kickoff the 13 seconds left kickoff was actually a mistake that it was not supposed to go into the end zone it was supposed to be a squib but the i guess the uh the play didn't get to the the kickoff team is that true uh honestly i'm not sure i'm not

uh like if if i knew i would tell you but honestly i'm not like at that point um i was definitely like celebrating with josh and i was we're talking we're at that point we I was definitely celebrating with Josh. At that point, we were talking amongst the O-line and all this other stuff. So I wasn't sure about that one. I believe in my heart, you guys win that game, you're winning the Super Bowl. There was no chance you're losing to Cincinnati at home and then Rams get out of here. That would have been such a hard game for Cincinnati to come into Buffalo. The crowd would have been insane.

It would have been a night game, hopefully, potentially. That's a hard place to play that late in the season with that fan base and that quarterback let's be honest let's be honest josh josh makes that thing go oh my god i mean that game that game against new england the week before was one of the greatest performances i've ever seen on a football field yeah he's outrageous and outrageous. Even when he's dealing with injuries, he's out there, you would never know. He had a bad injury after that Tampa Bay game on his ankle or heel or something. I forgot who he played after that, but he went off and acted like there was nothing wrong. He had a pretty substantial injury. And that's what he does. That guy, I wish him the best. And he makes that thing go.

Your job, in essence, is to protect the quarterback, boiling it down to its simplest form. Not to name names, but throughout your career as a football player, have you ever had to protect someone that you didn't like? like you thought this guy was a bit of an a-hole and does it make things a lot more enjoyable when you actually genuinely like the guy that you have to protect um no i've had pretty great quarterbacks okay so you've never had a guy that you're like i don't really like this guy and i wouldn't mind if he actually gets sacked a few times. No, okay. No, they're,

they're usually pretty good guys. Um, I'm trying to think, ah, Derek's a great guy. You can't say nothing bad about Derek. Josh is Josh. Daniel's a good dude. Um,

I mean, not that he wasn't a bad dude, but my second year with Oakland, Derek broke his ankle right before the playoffs. Then we played in Houston, and we had Connor Cook at the quarterback, and we were like, ah. You know what I'm saying? He's out of the league now.

No disrespect to Connor. He's a good dude. But it wasn't Derek. I think we would have had a pretty good chance that year, too, with Oakland if Derek didn't get hurt. What is your favorite memory as a Bill? Favorite game, favorite performance? Probably when I came back from my pec injury uh 2020 2020 uh the game against the patriots when

i played center uh i think i moved in i think mitch got i don't remember if i started at center or mitch got hurt and i went into center um but it was just like the emotion of, I mean, dudes, when they tear their pick, sometimes they miss the whole season. Um, and, uh, thanks to Joe Mika, uh, trainer out there who really, and Joe Collins, those two guys out there that really, uh, did everything they could to help me get back that quick. And then they come back and and have a significant role in winning the game uh i mean i was in tears after like at the end of the game i was like balling in the locker room wow that is amazing um when you when the news came out that you were

leaving i think everyone was like oh he's definitely going to the Giants. Dayball's there. Bobby Johnson's there. It just seemed like the natural move. Did you even talk to anyone else? I did. I did. But it's a funny story that our last offensive meeting after we lost to the Chiefs,

I don't remember if Dave's had already taken the job or it was like he was going to get another interview for the job. But I already knew that i was most likely gonna get cut uh so in passing i was like hey daves it'll be a lot easier to run your offense with the center that knows what he's doing and he just laughed and like kept going and then you know turns out that i'm here but yeah there was other interest but um there was a lot of interest at guard um but you know daves and and og bobby johnson he uh they knew

what i can do at center and and they're you know they're pretty adamant about me going to be able to play at play center here it seems like that It was kind of a no-brainer. Why is playing center so important to you right now at this point? Just because, honestly, it's been my best position forever. But when I was in Oakland, they had Rodney Hudson, who's been the best center in the league for the last five, six years. And then when i signed with buffalo like no one see me play like bobby knew because bobby was in oakland with me but i only played

center with oakland in that playoff game that i was talking about the texans and i only played like maybe a quarter and then rodney came back they see me play a lot of guard. I play left guard and right guard in Oakland. So that film was what helped me get to Buffalo along with Bobby. And then that same year they signed Mitch, who's a great guy, great, good center. And, you know, the money, I think he was the highest paid center at one point. So like I just get plugged in at guard, which like you were saying, the way I play the game helps me.

That's why I'm usually on the field. And I'm a lot better right guard than I am left guard. So that was another reason why I didn't want to really you know that that split between me and Buffalo was great from good for me and good for them as well um and being able to play center which I consider myself very smart uh football was um so dissecting a defense making the mic point making changing protections like all that crap gets me up in the morning. That's what I'm so like, I haven't had this much fun playing. I know it's only OTAs and we haven't done much, but I'm having a blast out here right now.

Just being able to really lead the room in Buffalo. There was kind of like, no one really knew who the leader was. There was, you know, everyone was trying to between, you know, usually the knew who the leader was um there was you know everyone was trying to between you know usually the center is the leader um so we had that like mitch is really okay mitch might be the leader i was trying to lead and then you know dion was another guy so here being able to have clarity and and have the final saying things because i'm the center uh it's been great can you describe the vibes right now that you're experiencing because as you said ota is starting um you're the new kid but you know the o-line coach you know the head coach i mean you've gone to war with these guys

i've seen you talk about they will like facetiming you almost every day just to chat so it seems to give a great relationship so it's like you're the new kid on the block, but you have an intimate relationship with the important player. So what are you experiencing right now? New teammates, right? New quarterback. Yeah. New setting, but you know these guys.

It's been, like, great. I'm not even going to lie. I'm not even trying to stay up here and just say it because I'm on the team. But honestly, with Bobby as well, like, Bobby, he's been able to truly be himself out here. And it's been great around here. Like the old line room has been great. Well, it's been fun to sit back and kind of watch day ball be a head coach.

Cause you know, sometimes when guys become head coaches from being a coordinator, they switch up and they try to act like someone they coached before or like a head coach that they coached on there before. And honestly, that's not – Davis has been great, man. It's been fun out here. We've been having a lot of fun. He's been talking a lot of trash as he does. He hasn't changed, and that's really refreshing.

And I think we're building a culture out here that is similar i feel like we are if i can really like give a good picture i think when i first went to buffalo in 2019 i feel like that's kind of where we are right now as the giants um 2019 i think we signed six O-linemen at Buffalo, and we did the same thing here. And I think Daniel is similar to Josh, maybe not as athletic, but definitely arm talent is up there.

And I feel like he just needs some time. Your story, John, you don't need me to tell you this, is quite inspiring. It's incredible that you're even in the NFL and have had thus far a very successful career in the NFL, went to the University of Miami, graduated, had a great career there as well. Correct me if I'm wrong, you were born with a foot deformity?

Yeah, but I don't really remember that much. I guess I was a little bow-legged, and I had to wear these braces to straighten my leg out a little bit. Sort of like Forrest Gump, right? Yeah, I guess so. And your mom, I read, would have to massage your feet and had great faith that you would get it. Apparently, the doctor told her you wouldn't play sports or wouldn't be incredibly athletic.

You wouldn't be able to run properly. That's incredible. How old were you when you got over that? Honestly, I, I didn't even know that it was even a thing until that came out. They told my mom, I didn't even realize. She kept it from you? I guess it was, I might've, it might've been when I was a lot younger. So, you know, you don't really remember stuff when you're like one or two.

But yeah, man, it's been a hell of a ride. It's been a... It's definitely, like, I pride myself in still being here. A lot of my former teammates, like, in college and stuff who I thought were, you know, better, like, in different positions or, like, got more notoriety or whatever, to still be here and outlasting some of the guys, it feels good. And I hope you don't mind me bringing up a bit of your past, but your story is really something else. And I've gone to learn more about it.

So you grew up in New York until you're 10. Your parents get divorced, your mom. So I was three. My parents got divorced when I was three my parents got divorced when I was three yeah oh wow down to South Florida moved to Miami I spent um good seven years bouncing around in South Miami uh then I moved up to Broward County when I was in fifth grade I was like 10 those early days in miami those days in south florida fair to say that we're tough on the family yeah definitely um well yes and then no my mom had a

pretty good boyfriend then who uh really kind of things didn't really start feeling weird until like fifth grade when my mom and her then boyfriend broke up and then we moved out of the house we spent like a month living i was living on the floor like in my mom's friend's house wasn't going to school and then we moved out to david florida got a trailer out there and then everything was pretty normal again until uh high school and then um my mom worked at a nightclub um so money was never really we never really had a lot of money um and then around 10th grade, our trailer was deemed condemned for some reason. Then my mom and my older brother left and moved in. My mom moved in with my grandparents in New York.

My little brother was in New York already with my dad. My older brother, I'm pretty sure, went to New York or he went to like Michigan just to grow weed for some reason um so and my dad was always like since I since I was young my dad always like tried to get me to move up to New York but uh I was just hell-bent on becoming a Miami Hurricane and I knew they I was like I only started playing football in ninth grade I wasn't like a big name athlete like a big name prospect and I was like I need to stay down here to if I want to go to Miami um so from like 10th grade to like the summer before 12th grade I was just bouncing around different homes uh my then-girlfriend, Alexis Vanestrand, their family was really great to me, clothing me and feeding me and giving me a place to sleep.

And my best friend who's passed, his family, Sean Cole, his family, that's where I spent most of my time, just sleeping in his room on a little twin bed on the floor. It was like that for a good year and a half. But, you know, I honestly, I thought it was normal. I didn't, you know, I didn't realize that that wasn't out of the norm. So, yeah, I was basically homeless for a year and a half. Uh, that's why I have a really big, like really strong connection with my high school and just Davie, Florida and the whole, because they, in high school, they would, you know, slip me a public gift card to, to go get food.

Um, my basketball coach, Steve Todd and, and my football coach, Rashad West, like those guys, I just immersed myself into sports. So I wasn't, I was at school all the time. So like when I went home or went to where I was staying, it was like,

they would feed me dinner or, and then I would, you know, go to take a shower and go to sleep and then just wake up and do the whole thing again. You know, you keep your head down and keep just grind. And sometimes you would even go back to that condemned home. Yeah. No electricity, no water. Yeah. Why? This, you know, I felt like a burden. Uh, my, my buddy's trailer was literally like, if I stood up, my head would be like this, like grazing it. My head like ducking.

And, you know, they weren't well off. My buddy's mom worked with my mom for a while. And then they were a single family home. Like his dad and mom were divorced too. They didn't have that much money. And, you know, I just felt bad. I didn't want to feel like a burden to people and basketball was your first love not football what kind of basketball player were you great yeah just like the miami heat that's right yeah i don't know i mean i see the heat tweets

and they're in the eastern conference finals in some way somehow they always seem to figure it out like the heat don't know how to rebuild. Pat Riley, baby. Pat the rat. Pat the rat. The godfather. That's what we call him here in New York. No, but it's cool. Listen, Heat culture, it's such a great thing. Everyone talks about Heat culture.

Meanwhile, the fans don't show up until the second quarter. What's up with these fans? Because there's a club in the stadium. There's a club. There's gourmet food out in the back. They're there. They're just making their way to the seats. Slowly but surely.

When you were 7th grade, 8th grade, the dream was to play in the NBA, not the NFL, right? Kind of. I was like, I would say younger. I played basketball on AU from like kindergarten to fifth grade. My mom's boyfriend was the coach.

So I would like get to go do sports. And then when we moved to Davia, my mom worked at night. So she wasn't really around to take me to, like, practice or do anything. So then we started playing football in the trailer parks, and I fell in love with football, especially when I got fat, when I got pretty big. I was like, all right, I can still ball. You know, I can still go to the Y and play some basketball. But then I felt, before my mom and her boyfriend broke up,

he had took me to a Canes game. And it was after it was, they played Washington. It was like after Washington broke their 50 or I think it was 56 game win streak at home. So it was like the grudge match and they put, they scored like 60 on them. I think Washington scored like three or something and being in this in the stands and watching the Canes run out the smoke and watching you I think Sean Taylor and and Ed Green all those guys out there ball uh I fell in love with football that

that moment and from that moment on it was like I want want to be a hurricane. Is it true that the hurricanes didn't show you a lot of love? And then one day you and your high school coach went to a spring game. And like, again, talk about inspiration. He literally like guided you to go where the bus was and you had a tape and you just passed it off to one of the coaches. Like that's what you had to do to get them to notice you. Yeah. To be fair no one really uh was really looking at me no one showed you okay yeah no like my high school wasn't uh they're a lot better now but then we weren't like you know we were stuck with getting beat up by st thomas all the time

and we weren't like really good um but yeah so we went to the spring game and we were in the stands and you can see like on the field where all their high high name prospects were and everyone's like getting love and we're like all right after the spring game we're gonna run on the field and you know see we could what we can do and then they wouldn't let us on the field so i was like all sad like a crying puppy dog like sad face and my coach as we're walking to the car my coach is like coach west was like i have an idea and like he like knew where the buses were so we went over to buy the buses and we just waited and coach uh thomas robinson um thomas robinson um i i can't i always remember what he said because

he looked me up and down and was like you you've got the frame for it or something. So we handed him my tape, and then about a week goes by, you don't hear anything. And then probably like 10 days after, I had a call from Coach Stoutland. And they're like, oh, we want you to come for unofficial, blah, blah, blah. So we set up the unofficial. I didn't even need unofficial. I already knew I was going to commit.

So we set up the unofficial. We go there and then meet Coach Shannon. Great time. Get home. And then they call me when I get home and they're like, hey, we want to offer you, we're going to offer you blah, blah, blah. And I was like, all right, cool. I commit.

And then they're like, oh, you don't want to like take time and ask your mom or anything? And I was like, hey, mom, I'm committed to Miami. And that was it. At that point, was Miami the dream, like the end of the dream? Or did you think you could make it to the NFL? No, it was the end of the dream, or did you think you could make it to the NFL? No, it was the end of the dream. I remember my first year, I got redshirted. I was on the practice squad or whatever they call it in college.

And I was getting my face blasted in. I was like Olivier Vernon was kicking my butt. Regis, Marcus Forsten, I forgot his last name. But anyways, I was getting my face beat in. And I was like, damn, like, at least I'll get a good education. But, you know, I was almost ready to quit too. And I was like talking to Coach Stoutland. And, you know, they just like, they're I was talking to Coach Stoutland.

They're like, buddy, this is growing pains. This is what happens. Then going into that, after the first year I was redshirted, going into that summer, I just kind of worked my balls off. I ended up starting the second week of my redshirt freshman year against Ohio State, which was great because my older brother was a big Ohio State fan. I hated them. And then to be able to go out and then beat them, I was on cloud nine. And we don't have to get into your whole family history,

but you're glossing over a lot of stuff that I think people should know. Your mom's a two-time cancer survivor. Is she okay now? Unfortunately, we don't have a great relationship. Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah, but she's okay right now. Your father, former MTA bus driver, does he live in the area? Do you have a relationship with him?

Yeah, he's like, me Me and him are best friends. Growing up in a family that got divorced, it happens. Mothers hate the fathers. They talk down their bed about the guy. He was always so far you know being in new york and and honestly my dad is we have similar like attitudes he's very just like no bs borderline grumpy but once you get to know him like he's just a funny little a-hole. So me and him are really best friends.

Your younger brother, born deaf. Chris, yeah. How is he doing now? He's good. He's bouncing around, staying with my mom, being a kid. He needs to grow up, but me and him are really tight. And then you mentioned your older brother, who was the Ohio State fan. You had a bit of a tough relationship growing up.

I think he was very physical towards you, to put it proudly. Are you guys cool now? No. Okay. No, we don't really talk that much. I haven't really talked to him in like six, seven years. Okay, wow. I'm sorry to hear that, and haven't really talked to him in like six seven years okay wow i'm sorry to hear that uh and i don't mean to to bring up all this oh you're good family stuff i mean people

need to realize like people like like just because you know you make it in the league or whatnot like shane always like sunshine and rainbows people people try sometimes they you know they want to take advantage of you especially now because you got like a little bit of money um people expect a lot of things from you and if you don't do exactly what they want you to do then you're a piece of shit you know so my i really i did a good job of you know family to me is not always just blood i have a really tight group of friends and you know my dad and you know good family members uh but you know blood i feel like can only take you so far sometimes because you endured those hardships as a kid and now you're in the nfl you said you have a little bit of money um do you even remember what it was like like does that seem so far away having to

sleep in a condemned home with no electricity no water do you remind yourself of that constantly so that you don't forget what that struggle was like how do you because now i imagine life is completely different than what it was like when you were in high school in terms of the you know the the stuff that you have the security that you have um are you are you constantly reminding yourself to you know remain humble because of where you came from um or maybe I'm reminding you no there's definitely you, I definitely try not to remember some things. Um, but definitely, I, it's, you can't forget that. I feel like I can't forget where I came from because it was so, I don't want to say traumatic, that definitely, you know, I definitely people, I've definitely say that i feel like i've put that stuff behind me in the last year or two especially dealing with the death of my best friend uh sean cole who who i was living with and who knew everything who i could always talk to and not feel judged or whatnot um but yeah

it's it's hard it's hard to I can't forget where I came from. Yeah, and your best friend, as you said, Sean, passed away in a car accident. You named your daughter after him, which is an incredible tribute. You mentioned the anxiety and depression. Did you ever speak to a therapist? Do you still speak to a therapist? Is this something that you ever considered? I definitely considered it um to be fair i had a really few years ago really big psilocybin trip which was able to

put a lot of things to bed for me i feel like kind of is that like with ayahuasca and all that stuff no uh mushrooms mushrooms okay yeah um so i'm a really big advocate and there's a company called maps who uh is trying to legalize race cleaning mushrooms um and to just talk about the the the benefits of trips and whatnot um but yeah i mean losing sean was definitely my biggest thing i had to get over so that gave you clarity that trip? Yeah. I feel like it kind of, I mean, it was over a process a few years ago wife had always had a great relationship but i would do stupid things to kind of like break that up because i didn't feel like i deserved like happiness or deserve a family like like i have right now um and you know just honestly i feel like reading i started reading three years ago and, uh,

reading like self-help books, like the undefeated mind. Um, I feel like that's what helped me get through my stuff. Not saying that, uh, meeting with a therapist wouldn't have been beneficial. Uh, but I felt like, you know, I was, I never, I'm really to myself. Don't really like to talk to people especially about feelings and stuff.

Right. So I kind of took it upon myself to kind of get through my stuff. These feelings that you experienced, suicidal, the stuff with your wife, was this while you were in the NFL already? Oh, yeah. That's honestly when uh i know it's not like sounds crazy but that's honestly when that was the height of it that was like kind of in oakland that's kind of when it started

just like the realization of i got okay i got money. I'm in the NFL. Why am I not happy? It was just, I was covering. I was just keeping everything down. And then when I got to it, basically, I was keeping it down. Like, okay, once you get to the league, once you get money, everything's going to be great. And then when I got there and things aren't great family stuff is getting harder um then I lose my best friend a year and like in my second year then that's when it kind of

I was a mess how how far did you go like how how bad did it get um i mean it was like when i knew like i was really messed up was like i was sitting with my buddy at his like apartment and it was like three stories high. I was like, for some reason, in the back of my mind, there was something whispering in my head like, you know you can jump off. You can jump off right now.

It'll be over. That really scared me. Do NFL teams have people in place that can help players dealing with this stuff? Did you take advantage of that at all? I did. I met with a psychiatrist once when I was in Oakland. That was very beneficial.

I didn't open up to her like this. It was more like a me and my wife kind of thing. My wife dealt deals dealt slash deals with anxiety. So it was more like she was going there to talk to them. And then something happened in our relationship that I needed to go and, with them. And that was, I feel like, was very beneficial. Yet you only went once. Yeah, I know. You know, I'm a...yeah. But big step that you did that nonetheless. By the way, now you have, obviously, you're still with your wife. You guys are good, right?

Yeah. Yep. Great. Yep. How many kids do you have? have um you obviously you're still with your wife you guys are good right yeah yeah great yep how many kids do you have two i have a son that just turned two and my daughter turns five in like two weeks and uh will they move with you to new jersey 100 yeah okay like right now they're not with me so i'm like commuting every like thursday i get back to Fort Lauderdale uh and those four days without them is really it really sucks so yeah there's no way they're staying they're coming back with me um we have to talk about your love of MMA uh that's how we first sort of connected and in fact a lot of people might not know this I believe you went to high school with Miguel Baeza right yep uh yeah that's my guy what's up with miguel

it's a tough right he was looking so good he's fought some tough dudes and the last fight was a tough one as well andre fialio i think it's all i think it's all mental for him he is just i try to tell him all the time my bro like every like his first loss he's just always like apologizing to everybody like i'm so sorry i let you guys down i'm sorry like my bro like fuck saying sorry to us like yeah you're the one that's out there like putting your body on the line like this is like it's like stop like he just i feel like if i can um charles olivera i feel like him and i sent him a meme of it was like a meme of olivera's like first whatever fights and he's like barely 500 and then he went on this run now he's

the champ like i feel like that's very he's gonna be very similar to that i'm hoping um but honestly like once he gets his mental right and stops worrying about letting people down, you have the skill. You have everything. All his fights that he lost was the first fight. He was beating buddies. It might have been a fight at night. We went three rounds.

He has a hell of a ground game that I feel like he needs to utilize a little bit. What do I know? I play football. But I'm pretty sure he's a black belt in jiu-jitsu. And he put Buddy to sleep, that Asian guy. He has it all.

He just needs to work on his mentals a little bit. I remember around a year and a half or so ago, you pretty much guaranteed to me that when your football career is going to be over you will become an mma fighter is that still the uh the plan slash dream my wife is really uh not going for that i don't know it's like that the athletic part of me the the me i want to and uh right now i know i'm going to train it but it's it's really comes down to am i being greedy am i am i not looking out for am i putting myself before my kids because my kids you know deserve a dad that's not scrambled brains and so it's the it's it's still up in the air right now but I definitely like I want I want to know I want that feeling of I remember when I was at the Connor Dustin fight when he broke his leg but when they turn

out when they turn off all the lights and we'll play that no no no like the chills like that walk like i need like the competitor in me i want i want to be in there and uh i just gotta i gotta talk to my wife and get the okay i think it was lee smith who scored a touchdown and you you shot a double leg on him back in the day right i mean it's pretty damn nice i'm not gonna lie you train actually at at this like i know you said you wanted to go to att right yeah i'm no but and not to say like you know i'm good i'm cool with mazda and he's definitely like extended the invitation and i've been over at mma masters before with miguel and did a little groundwork over there. It's kind of like the training for MMA and football are definitely completely different. And the more I got into MMA, the less I spent time on football,

which could be a good thing and a bad thing. But when I get into something, like I go, I go a hundred percent into it. Um, so right now I kinda, I'm just, I'm keeping myself out of, out of there just until, until I'm completely done. Um, but you know, I have coach Henry, you know, an away that's like hey yeah he's like he would do it if you called up mark henry right now and said let's train at 3 a.m like i'm a big bills fan he puts i i mean like i would not even i'm not even one-tenth as big of a bills fan i

don't know like i've seen him tweet to you he puts up a shrine in his house every sunday when they play he's obsessed like that guy is legit obsessed yeah i talk to him a lot yes so he would do you don't need me to tell you this he would do anything for you just because you played for the bills and because he's just a genuinely amazing human being yeah he's a great guy yeah he's definitely like yeah that'd be sick i mean he doesn't push it but he's like hey you know i'm here i'm very close if you want to stop by oh my god that would be amazing uh He doesn't push it, but he's like, Hey, you know, I'm here. I'm very close. If you want to stop by. Oh my God.

That would be amazing. Uh, and by the way, since you're like such a proud Miami guy, I'm assuming you're a big King of Miami fan, Colby Covington, right? I was at that site.

I know you were sitting pretty close. I know. I got, I got the UFC hooked me up. My boy, Matt Perino. Oh, that's right. Yeah, Bill's being a great guy.

And Coach Henry. He put in a word, too. Wow, look at you. You got a bigger in with them than I do at this point. Yeah. No, he needs to stop calling himself that. I would. Well, you were about to say before he gets hurt but then he got jumped yeah right there's a lot of you know miami's a crazy place

and only takes one crazy dude to to not like what he what he does to for there to be big trouble and i don't want not saying i definitely do not want that, that Mazdal, Kobe beef. I mean, definitely not Mazdal, but like, that's not like I, I was at MMA masters and Kobe was there and like,

I wasn't going to like fight him or anything. I didn't, I didn't, I didn't say what's up to him. They were like, Oh, you want to meet Kobe? I'm good.

But, um, but like, you know, I'm never like, that's not me. That's their business but i'm definitely on miles with my son there's that loyalty um one last thing is there a fight coming

up that you're super excited about there's izzy coming up yeah that i'm trying to i'm trying to get out to that that card is the izzy fight july 2nd what's second yeah i might be out of that one but yeah that card uh big valentina fan but she fights in a couple is it yeah yeah yeah so my wife loves like i got my wife into ufc hard and she's a big uh she loves watching women fight so she's a big wild team she loves she's like oh that dance she does at the end i love it and she just puts ass' asses. Yeah, she's great. I'm excited for that fight. I saw your emoji speaking of women's MMA with the rose kind of like that.

That was weird stuff, right? I feel like couldn't they just call it a draw? No one won that. You could have scored the first round of 10-10. Yeah. I guess Karla did get her down,

but every time she got her down, Rose popped back up. I'm a giant Rose fan. I've been a Rose fan since the Ultimate Fighter, which is how I kind of got into MMA. Not her season, but one of the seasons. It was the season with Kimbo.

I was just gonna say the heavyweights the heavyweights watching rampage freaking right rampage on the door yeah i was like yeah like that was the first like i didn't even watch ufc until after them like i was just watching i was just flipping through the channels and my thing was on spike and i was like oh what's this and then from that moment on i I've been a fan. But yeah, that Rose thing killed me. Yeah, it was tough. Very, very puzzling performance. By the way, do you see Frank Gore's knockout over the weekend?

Yeah. Yeah. Miami guy, Bill guy. Not bad. I love Frank. I don't think he should be fighting. I agree. Why is he doing this?

Because he's just, he, just he i would like when he was in the bills he would be there at six o'clock in the morning working out like getting a full workout on before practice before anything like that dude just knows one thing and that's to work and uh he's very competitive and you know i mean you guys might be saying the same thing about me that I said about Frank. Like, why is he in? And it was like, what,

like in a few years. So where, as I think he shouldn't be doing it, I love seeing him knock people up. Yeah, no, incredible. Especially,

I know the, the first fight didn't really go the way he wanted to against, uh, Darren Williams, but, uh, that was amazing. This has been amazing,

man. I really appreciate the time. I've always had a kind of weird feeling towards the Giants, if I'm being honest, because of the Super Bowl way back in the day. Why, Greg? Scott Norwood? I mean, that's actually how I became a Bills fan. I was eight years old,

and I was watching it at my uncle's house, and I felt so bad for those guys. Thurman, favorite player, and I was like, this is my team. And then, of course, they lose the next three Super Bowls and now I'm stuck with them for life. That being said, now because you're on the team

and because I live pretty close to the stadium, I will now be rooting for you. You'll be my NFC team. And hopefully we'll meet you in the Super Bowl. And then all bets are off. I'd love for you to win. But I'm just being honest. I just want that one. That's all. I just want that one.

That's it. We're not going to lie. When I'm walking in the facilities and I see they have all four of those trophies up. I see the one against the Bills. Nowadays, I'm just smirking a little bit. Would that be a dream, playing them in the Super Bowl?

No, that wouldn't be the dream playing them in the Super Bowl no I wouldn't be a dream I mean it would be cool definitely would want to win but you know I would feel bad for the guys especially too personal you'd rather just be some other team that you don't like yeah I'd rather play them like the regular season

yeah I'll like maybe go if I don't re with the giants if they don't you know whatever happens in the future if i have to go to another team i'm going to be too bad going back or going to a divisional team that i can play them twice a year right just not miami please okay if that's what you were referring to i just that would not be cool that one i can't i can't do the whole like I'll root for you just because you're on the team. Miami for life. Miami's definitely a hard sell. I can't deal

with their freaking song after they score. Yeah, the whole thing is just annoying. But I do have a lot of you. Anyways, I'm really happy to be a G man. Yes, it's going to be great and I love the connection to the B bills so it only makes sense you know there's so many uh familiar faces appreciate you my man all the best thanks for

you know sharing a bit about your story um and thank you thank you for everything you did for the uh the squad it was uh it was really great um getting to watch you play as a bill and thanks for rocking the shirt you're the man please you know when you walk into the stadium one day feel free when they take the photos of you guys feel free to rock it one day that would be nice obviously come on i'm not here for you well i've got a thug nose shirt too that's right that's right thanks john before we get out of here uh i just want to say you know thoughts and prayers with the whole community of buffalo um it's horrible what happened and it's horrible it's horrible what happened. And it's horrible regardless of where it happened, but especially, like, such a tight-knit community

and a great community that took me and my family in. I hate – it ruined my whole day to know that that happened, you know, in Buffalo and still thinking about them and i love i love the people out there in buffalo so thoughts and prayers with you guys all right what a great conversation that was uh really enjoyed it and i know he's not the kind of guy that likes to open up so i really appreciate him opening up the way in which he did and wish him nothing but the best this year with the Giants and certainly echo his sentiments at the end of the conversation regarding the great city of Buffalo and the horrendous, horrific tragedy that occurred this past weekend at the supermarket. When will this all end? I don't know. And I'm not going to get all political,

but no community, including that one, deserves that. No family deserves that. No one deserves that. And I pray, like a lot of people in this country and around the world, that these insane, senseless acts of terrorism end very soon. And so my heart grieves for Buffalo as well. And I echo every single thing that he said. And I appreciate him saying that at the very end of the conversation. Hope you enjoyed it.

If you want to watch it, go to youtube.com slash Ariel Helwani. That's where you can see that conversation and all the other ones that we've done over the past 10 or so months. There's been a lot of great ones as of late. I hope you're enjoying this show as much as I have been. I enjoy doing it every week.

I enjoy putting it out. I enjoy having my friends, the lovely feathers as the theme song. And so if you want to support us, all I ask subscribe on YouTube, give us a like a follow a comment or review here on the podcast platforms. And that's it. That's all I ask.

Appreciate you guys very much. Thank That's all I ask. Appreciate you guys very much. Thank you to our production team. Thank you to the listeners, the viewers. Love you guys. And of course, thank you to John Mongo Feliciano. What a gent, what a mensch, and best of luck to him this upcoming NFL season. Enjoy your weekend, my friends. I'll talk to you next week.