The Ariel Helwani Show - Pat McAfee

Episode Date: September 30, 2021

Heelwani's biggest enemy joins Ariel to put their feud aside to discuss real life matters, such as McAfee's childhood dreams of getting rich (10:18), how he created the "dumbest life of all-time" and what it was like playing alongside Peyton Manning with the Indianapolis Colts (22:25). Later on, the guys also talk about the 2010 arrest that turned McAfee's life around (28:10), his time with Barstool Sports, his rocky relationship with ESPN, Aaron Rodgers' regular appearances on his show and SO much more.Pat McAfee is the host of "The Pat McAfee Show," a popular daily sports YouTube show that also airs on SiriusXM. He spent eight seasons as a punter for the Indianapolis Colts, retiring in 2017 to pursue a media career that's taken him to Barstool Sports, ESPN and the world of professional wrestling.You can follow Pat on Twitter and Instagram @PatMcAfeeShow. For more episodes of The Ariel Helwani Show, please follow the show on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your shows. To get more from Ariel, subscribe to his YouTube channel, read his writing on Substack, watch his work for BT Sport and follow The MMA Hour or The Ringer MMA Show.Theme music: "Frantic" by The Lovely Feathers

Hey everyone, it's your old friend Ariel Helwani. Welcome to episode two of the Ariel Helwani show. I am so excited about this. We are rolling now. Last week we had a very successful debut episode with current WWE champion Big E, which I enjoyed very much and I hope you did as well. And if you haven't heard it yet, I do highly suggest you check it out. This week, we have a great second guest. But before we get into our second guest, I want to give a special shout out to the people behind the music that you are hearing. The Lovely Feathers, my good friends, in particular, Mark Kupfert. I grew up with the guys behind the Lovely Feathers in Montreal. We went to high school together. Some of them I went to elementary school with. And they were one of my favorite bands growing up. They all came together around college time.

And they had this very successful run as the Lovely Feathers. I used to listen to them all the time when I was in college, post-college, living in New York. I was very sad when they stopped performing. And I always loved this song called Frantic, which was an amazing song, part of their repertoire. And when I was thinking about doing this show, I thought that the music at the beginning of Frantic, which you hear in the intro, would be the perfect soundtrack to this show. It puts me in a very good mood. And they have a ton to choose from,

but this was the one that kind of caught my eye. So thank you very much to them. They will be a part of the history of this show. They're going to be a part of the soundtrack of this show. And I really appreciate them letting me use this great song, Frantic, as part of the sound and the vibe and the texture of this program. Now, as for today's guest, it's Patrick McAfee. Yes, the one and only Pat McAfee, the host of the Pat McAfee Show, the critically acclaimed sports program, which you can hear on Sirius XM every Monday through Friday, also on his own YouTube channel. He is absolutely killing it since he retired from the NFL in his prime in 2017. He was a pro bowler, big part of the Indianapolis Colts, played in a Super Bowl, played less than 10 years, but then in 2017 just said, I'm done and I'm going to pursue

a career in media. And at the time, a lot of people, including our good friends over at PTI, said that this was a ridiculous decision. It was an ill-advised move. He was leaving a lot of money on the table. It's a crazy thing to do. And he's become, in my opinion, one of the most influential voices in sports media and one of the smartest men in sports media. I've had the pleasure of being on his show. I've had a couple of feuds with him. All in all, it is in good fun. I enjoy him immensely. And he has also turned into one of the best wrestling broadcasters in the game. And I think it's probably part of the reason why we get along so much is because he grew up a wrestling fan.

He kind of gets the entertainment. He gets the showmanship aspect of it all. And he's now the color commentator for WWE SmackDown on Fox. This after a bit of a run as an actual wrestler on NXT. He's a man of many talents, many good traits. He's become a friend, somewhat of a confidant, if you will, through the ups and downs of the past year in my life. And I really wanted to learn more about him, his journey, his rise, where he's going, where he's from, and all that. And he's had some downs as well. It hasn't all

been ups for Patrick McPhee, even was arrested famously back in 2010. We talk about all of that, plus his feud with ESPN and a whole lot more on this episode. Heelwani, Patrick McAfee. And you know, it's so amazing that you're here, Patrick, because after what I do believe, 14, 15, 16, maybe even, dare I say, 19 appearances on your Rinky Dink podcast, you have finally returned the favor and have come on the hottest new show on the Internet, Independent Heelwani, everyone talking about it. And everyone wanted to hear this interview. Everyone wanted to see me interview you. Finally, someone asking you the hard questions, not a guest on your show, you know, kissing your behind. And it's amazing because when I decided to go this route and be a trailblazer and do this on my own, unlike anyone has ever done in sports media before, I wrote down a list of a hundred names that I wanted to have on the show to interview, you know, outside of the MMA world to really learn more about. And amazingly, I found out that this isn't MMA. These people don't know me. They weren't available. So I went to number 102. There you were quick text, boom, Patrick on the Heelwani show. This is big. Thank you for

doing it. It's an honor to be number 102 in your wishlist. And I am thankful every time you come on our show makes us all look much better because you come in and make an ass of yourself. But now you are actually doing something independent here for yourself on your own channel. I couldn't say yes faster. I'm incredibly happy for you. And I can't wait for this conversation, brother. Yes. And you're doing it on the set of the critically acclaimed Patrick McAfee show, which kind of feels a little surreal to me because again, usually, you know, I'm the guest here. So I appreciate you taking the time to make this even extra special. A lot to talk to you about, a lot to ask you about it. And we're probably just to steal a phrase from the world that you live in. We're going to break kayfabe here for a little bit because truth be told, I think we kind of like each other. I think I i can even consider you a friend even though i've only met you once in person for 10 seconds at madison square garden i do really like and respect you and so there's not going to be a lot of uh you know tension here if i would have asked you patrick back in 2017

when you retired when you said you know i'm done even though you probably could have still played and you're going to go down this media route that it would have turned out like this the next, you know, four to five years. Would you have believed me? Has this exceeded your expectations? You know, I think to break kayfabe, I mean, you're still a sack of shit. I mean, let's not, you know what I mean? No, I'm joking.

I'm a big fan of yours. I've been very thankful that you have come into our lives. I think you're a hysterical and an incredibly hard worker, which is maybe the biggest compliment I can give anybody. So I'm proud of you, Ariel, and I'm very thankful to be here and excited. But I think I knew that there was going to be, I don't want to say I knew, I thought there was going to be a good chance for success just because I was looking around the sports media landscape and there wasn't a lot of people like

me. I was getting a great opportunity while I was playing the game to do shows like Bob and Tom, which is a nationally syndicated morning show here in Indianapolis, Indiana, where they have, I think they're on like a hundred some stations, comedians come through and I got to guest host that like once a week. So I kind of got my chops a little bit. I did a standup comedy tour while I was still playing. I had a merch business while I was still playing. I got to do some media. And I had had a lot of success, and I was feeling true fulfillment out of that as opposed to just kicking balls. So I don't know if I would have expected this, but I think I knew that there was a chance for some success at some point. And I'm very lucky for the people that I've met along the way, yourself included, that I could

kind of learn from, watch, kind of do my own thing and continue to mold in this. You know, it's a modern day gold rush, which is what the internet is right now. And I'm just enjoying the hell out of it, brother. Why did you pause the standup comedy? Because that seemed to be a big thing when you walked away, but obviously you don't do it anymore. I know you don't have a lot of free time, but why did you stop doing that? Yeah, because I'm not great at it. Like I can't, I mean, obviously every show I've ever done standing ovation multiple times. I mean, I feel like everybody's got their money's worth. I had a lady shit her pants in the crowd one time from, I mean, yeah, yeah. Shoot. Shoot. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. She had to get kicked out. I didn't

find out until I was walking off the stage and my friends that were there were like, yo, yo, yo, a lady had to get escorted out here because she actually shit her pants. And I was like, are you kidding me? They're like, no. So I had to go back out, obviously, and give a thank you to the crowd. Ball State, Chirp Chirp up here in Muncie. They were wild. They were very intoxicated, but all my crowds knew me, you know? So it was a celebration. It was a party. I couldn't do the same story. And I think this is the incredibly impressive thing about stand-up comedians and why I inevitably was like, I need to not do that anymore until I'm better at it, because they have this ability to craft a story and deliver the story with the same enthusiasm,

emotion and jokes and everything like that. I was just going up there and literally a lot of the times other than the tour that I did, which is four straight cities and four nights. And by the third night, I was already sick of all the material. I was already like, this is not funny. I'm over this. I was literally telling these stories to a public forum for the first time when I was going on stage. So I had a 6,000 seat theater I sold out in Purdue. And I was the first time I was going up there was telling all these stories. So it was kind of like, you know, living in the deep end of a pool and it went well. My fans were incredibly nice to me. But whenever you watch people like Chappelle and Burr and you start doing it and Tom Segura and guys that I look up to a lot,

I watch, I'm like, all right, I'm not going to disrespect the stage until I have time to put together a real one. So I think that is why I kind of stepped away from it. I enjoyed the hell out of it. I had a lot of fun with it. I rented the theaters myself, sold the tickets myself. So it was a pretty profitable business too, if I was ever to get back into it. But I feel like I should respect the stage a little bit more. You know what I mean, Ariel? Absolutely. When you were a kid growing up, obviously you had aspirations to make it to the NFL. You were a football player. You were an athlete. Did you watch, emulate, study broadcasters as well? When I was a kid, I tried to copy Marv Albert, Bob Costas, these guys, because I didn't think that I was good enough to make it to the NBA. I wanted to be like them.

That's why I went to Syracuse. Did you do the same thing or did you only kind of catch the broadcasting bug towards the end of your career and thus allowed you to retire early? So this sounds and by the way, I think you've done a great job and people are looking up to Ariel Helwani now, which is wild for you. Yeah. Especially, you know, cause we're talking in your basement right now, you know, and that whole thing, but there's a lot of people looking up to you now. And I think that's incredible, especially in the broadcast and journalism world. For me growing up, all I wanted to be was rich. I didn't care how it was, what it was. I, there was moments in time. And I think people have seen me do a lot of different things now. And that's because for a certain stage of my life, I wanted to do that because I knew that the end game was a lot of money.

So this sounds so incredibly shallow, but it's real. And this isn't like a woe is me thing, but I grew up in a family with not a lot of cash. I mean, my dad was a truck driver. My mom was a secretary, grew up in a very small house at the bottom of a hill in a hilly town. I mean, this is legit there. Right. So I always just I wanted to be rich. So if I watch Monday Night Raw every single Monday and I saw guys like Ric Flair and I saw The Rock and Stone Cold and it was the Attitude Era and Triple H and I knew they were making a lot of money. I was like, oh, I feel like I'm athletic. I got a pretty good personality and they're making money. I want to do that. I saw comedians. Oh, they're making a lot of money. I want to do that. I wanted to be a soccer player for a long time, played overseas a few times. I mean, that was made my main sport. I knew they made a lot of money. Then once I started kicking footballs, I was like, okay, this feels like the right decision. My parents and I actually had to like have a business conversation. Cause I had, I don't know, about a hundred X, the amount of school was interested in me for soccer than for football.

And it just it felt like the right decision. I was going to kicking camps when I was in high school and there was nobody that could kick the ball like me. I got a chance to kick a ball with Jeff Reed, who was the kicker of the Steelers, and I was bombing it over his head as a high schooler. And I was like, OK, this guy made a lot of money doing this. I potentially could do this if everything lines up. So literally all my goals were so I can make some money and hopefully get my family some freedom. And the kicking aspect just ended up being the right one. And then now I'm getting a chance to dabble with all the dreams that I've had. And I'm incredibly lucky, just one of the most incredibly lucky humans of all time, Mario.

When you don't often hear people say, I don't really care what it is. I just want to be rich. I just want to make money. Was that because I would imagine as a kid, maybe you didn't have the things that other kids had. You felt like you were lesser than, how tough was that? Were you around kids who had money and you felt like you were an outcast? No. I mean, not a lot of my friends were like rich kids, but like, I don't know, watching your mom and this Sally is one of the sweetest souls on earth. So like, I think this range true even more, but like when you got to put something on layaway, that's like a hundred bucks or like your credit card's about to get declined. And I'm sitting there with her in public. And I know my mom is feeling potentially anxiety while the credit

card's being run, you know, like it's those moments. And this is once again, I am not saying anything like that, but it's those things I think that continue to happen where I was like, OK, I want to go like I got a chance to play soccer with a lot of kids that potentially had a lot of money, either from the other side of town or from other states that I got to play with and just watching how they went about their lives and live their lives. And then watching on TV Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous, Wild On, I think with Brooke Burke on E. I would see all these things on TV and I'm like, OK, I want to go do all these things.

And the only way you can do all these things is if you have money. So not only like the anxiety of my parents or certain things, my dad like remortgaged the house like five, six times so that I could continue to play sports. So not only that, but also like I want to go live and experience things. My dad like remortgaged the house like five, six times so that I could continue to play sports. So not only that, but also like, I want to go live and experience things. So my only, and it sounded so bad. And my teachers literally in my school hated me every, like almost every one of them. I only had a good relationship with like three, four of my teachers, because what do you want to be when you grow up is a question that is asked. And, you know, some of my peers would say like, oh, I want to be a teacher. And they were like, oh, you're, you're such a good person. Like, and I'm like, I agree. You are a good person. And I have family members that are firemen and EMS and paramedic and everything

like that. And they're incredible people and everything like that. But I've seen our holidays as well. It's not like, you know what I mean? We're not like celebrating and giving the biggest gifts of all time. So I've always appreciated everybody, but all I ever really wanted was to make money so I could kind of take care of everybody and live and experience things. And I've been very fortunate to do that. Are you a smell the flowers kind of guy? Because now I follow you on Instagram, of course, and I see every Friday you're taking a PJ from the show to SmackDown. I mean, it seems like you have a pretty good life. It seems like you're very comfortable. Do you ever sit back while you're

on that plane flying back from a SmackDown show? I mean, you're like, holy smokes, I had nothing. You're talking about the credit card and all that. And now I'm on a private plane being a chauffeur here. Do you have those moments where you just can't believe that it all turned out the way you wanted it to turn out? Every day of my life, dumbest life of all time. I think everybody has heard me say it and it's a real thing. And that's, I think the dumbest life of all time is me kind of, you know, kind of taking it all in for a little bit in the private jet has to happen because Indianapolis only has like flights, like five cities. So if I was to still do my show and then go to SmackDown, I would have to leave on like Wednesday to make it to wherever.

So being in Indiana is a gift and a curse in a couple of different situations. Traveling is tough. But the private plane situation when I'm flying on there, when I got my guys with me and they're flying on private planes as 25 year olds, 26 year olds, 24 year olds, it's just full slapdicks. We're flying around on this thing and we're showing up and we're getting a chance to go talk to Vince McMahon, you know, and all the people over there. It's the dumbest life of all time. I literally try to enjoy every single day. And I think, I don't know if we'll get to this, but that is one of the biggest factors into me retiring from the NFL when I probably could have played for another 10 years if I really wanted to, as I wasn't enjoying it anymore. So, you know, I watched my dad wake up and go to work for not a lot of money very early, come home, take me to practice, work his ass off, do everything he does. And I never saw him like happy. It seemed like,

so I was always like, I'm going to enjoy what I'm doing. I'm always going to enjoy my life. And as soon as I don't, you're probably going to see me make a change. And that's been kind of routine through my entire life. So yeah, I'm trying to smell the flowers every single day, man. Every single, I'm trying to smoke the flowers and enjoy the flowers every single day, man. That's what I try to do. We'll get to the retirement in a second. But considering you put that kind of pressure on yourself, not to just succeed, but to get all this money to become rich and famous, when you're in college- I don't want to be famous. I never wanted to be famous. There's a difference to you?

Oh yeah. But if you want to be famous. I never wanted to be famous. There's a difference to you. Oh, yeah. But if you want to become a sports star, inevitably you are famous. Yeah. But when I was a punter, I mean, I'd go out to the bars. I'd buy, I guess they call it what nature would do. I'd buy a hundred shots for everybody in the bar for all my friends. Everybody just thought I was some, you know, some son of a rich guy, some drunk frat kid who just had his dad's credit card. It was awesome. Nobody really had a clue who I was. And then I got arrested in my mugshot, got projected to everybody in Indiana. My life changed that complete day.

But I just wanted money so I could take care of everybody and have a good time. The fame. I mean, there's a lot of rappers that say you can keep the fame or whatever. I'll take the money. I've never really. And I, you know, my wife and I have been talking about this. There's some people on the Internet, I think, and it's kind of the the'll take the money. I've never really, and I, you know, my wife and I have been talking about this. There's some people on the internet, I think, and it's kind of the world of the internet. Attention is the money, right? Like if you have attention on you on the internet, that probably means that you're, you know, doing things and moving the needle and becoming that. I don't need the attention. I'm cool with it. I'm cool with the attention. Like if I'm going to have

the attention, I'm cool with it, but I don't need it. You know, it's not like what I'm yearning for. Everything for me is just basic freedom for my people. That's all I'm really looking for. My people, I mean, family, friends and everything that, that makes sense. Did you feel a lot of pressure though in college? Like I have to make it because I put all this time and effort into this and this is my ticket to get rich. And if I, you know, you could get nailed, your knee blows out the whole career, you know, comes crashing down. Did you feel, did you feel like you were putting too much pressure on yourself at some point? It all worked out, but that's a lot to say, Hey, I need to do this.

I need to succeed in order to get rich, to help all these people around me. Yeah. And my parents never really expected it from me. You know, they never put that pressure on me. So I don't think I ever felt like that external pressure, but the internal pressures of me on myself in high school, oh, geez, in college, sorry about that, in high school and in college, much more than in the NFL. Like I now granted in college, there's a story of, you know, I got like $40,000 out in student

loans so we could go have fun, me and my friends, you know what I mean? Because I was on a full scholarship for kicking balls. I got out, there was this late night I got home from, I don't know, maybe it was penny pitchers or drink till you drown Thursday, or maybe $5, all you get, whatever. I got home from something and there was a commercial on the TV.

And it was like, hey, you can get a loan right now, basically, if you're a student. I got in there and I got like a $15,000 loan. And literally three days later, I had the money. Now granted, it was like a 40% interest rate. And I mean, it was absurd and it was a terrible decision. But I did that until I got like 40 grand. So I was still trying to enjoy life and have a good time. But the internal pressure is for sure much more in college and high school than once I finally got a paycheck in the NFL. Yeah, absolutely. Because you just don't want to blow it, you know, because I

had the leg strength to do it. Everybody on earth knew that if I was able to kick balls well, I could make a living doing this. It was just whether or not I was going to be able to do it. And I was able to ride the coattails of a lot of really incredible football players to a lot of big moments, made some kicks, missed some kicks, did some things, lost some awards, won some awards. But yeah, I was, I was stressing a bit, you know, through high school and college, probably so much so that I wasn't even like, I wasn't able to really enjoy everything that was going on. I think, you know what I mean? What's interesting about that is I can relate to that kind of pressure and to wanting to make it and be rich or whatever. But I was too afraid, like in college, I had no friends and that was self-inflicted because I locked myself. I know you're going to

make a joke here, but I just locked myself in my room, because I was like, I need to graduate and get this broadcasting degree so that I can go on to be Costas and Marv Albert. You had that dream, you had that aspiration, but you also partied a lot and drank a lot. And so you could have been the reason why you didn't become rich. Why would you be so focused and have this dream at a young age to make it and succeed, but then also hurt yourself by acting a fool? I don't know, man. I think, I don't know.

I have a pretty good time. I enjoy having a good time, but also just because I was kicking balls in college doesn't mean that that's necessarily how I was gonna make a lot of money. I mean, it was a setup for me. I also knew that there's a huge aspect of like living, like you got to live

and enjoy your life and make friends and meet people and see things. And although I had a pretty tight circle, I just, I wanted to experience college as much as I could. Now, I do believe that I could have focused a lot more. All right. Hindsight is obviously 50-50. Cam Newton said that. But honestly, when I look back on it, there were some reckless decisions being made in college, classic college decisions, especially for somebody that was on his team as good as we were. And I think, I mean, there's a hilarious story about after my junior year, I missed two kicks in the first quarter of a game against our biggest rival. And if we would have won that game, we would end up going to national championship. We would have won the national championship that year with the team we had. I missed two kicks in the first quarter. We end up

losing 13, nine. So, I mean, death threats come at me a whole lot. I, I literally almost disappear. Like this is pre-social media. I hopped in my Jeep at the time that could barely go to speed limit on a lot of roads. And I just drove for like seven hours East. I ended up in deep in Maryland and down into Virginia or whatever. And I was just going to disappear because I felt like I let down everybody. You know, I let down not only my family, my school, but my teammates who were my best friends at the time, my roommates and everything like that. And there was an experience, you know, those next couple of weeks that I got a chance to have. And it may or may not have been with some mushrooms or whatever. And it seemed like the world came in much clearer. And I kind of focused in. My

friends and I kind of all made a decision for me. I was like, hey, let's just focus in and see it. I got one year left now, my senior year. Let's see if we can make it. Let's dial it in. And I wish I would have done that for four years. But then if I would have, I wouldn't have some of the memories I have with the incredible people, West Virginia, for the first three years. So there's a couple of moments that really made me lock in and focus. And I think it all revolves around that 13-9 night against Pitt where I thought about never seeing people again for a while. You know what I mean? And then everything kind of changed after that, focused in.

And, you know, my life has really changed since then. Apex of your NFL career. Like, when were you at your happiest? When did you feel, you know, my life has really changed since then. Apex of your NFL career. Like when were you at your happiest? When did you feel like, oh my, like I have reached the mountaintop here. What is that moment? So I told Jim Irsay this whenever I told him I was going to retire. I said, I always thought that once I got to the top of the mountain, the view would be so good that I wouldn't be enjoying it, you know, because being a punter, I was a kicker

and a punter in college, but punter in college, I would just run to the right, like an Aussie style. When I kick it and the ball would roll, I wasn't really a punter. I was a kicker. And when you're kicking, you're scoring goals. When I was a soccer player, I was a goal scorer. I mean, it was like, then when you become a punter full time, it's like, okay, you're literally going out there when the offense fails, you're sending the ball to the other team. It's a calculated turnover at home home games, you're getting booed when you're going on the field because your offense has failed. That's why you're punting.

Away games, I'm getting cheered. So I didn't necessarily love the culture of being a punter from my entire athletic days. I didn't necessarily love it, but I enjoyed the incredible opportunity with my teammates, and I was a part of something much bigger than myself, especially with the Colts. Peyton Manning was my teammate. Dallas Clark was my teammate. Joseph Adai was my teammate.

It was Gary Brackett. It was a dream come true. But my role wasn't necessarily something that I'd ever been used to in the entire sports world. So I just did my job, did my job. And I always thought to myself, like, if I get great at this, I'll enjoy it. I'll enjoy it. I'll enjoy it. And I did. I enjoyed the process of getting great. I enjoyed the late nights going to the indoor practice facility at like 1230 at night, one in the morning, trying to learn how to punt. Security is coming up to the building. Who the fuck is in here?

Oh, it's Pat. Like, I enjoyed that process. And then I told Jim Irsay, once I got to the top of the mountain, multiple time pro bowl pro, probably should have been voted more, to be honest with you. But people don't really know what they're talking about. I told Irsay that I didn't enjoy the view as much as I thought I would whenever I got to the top. For whatever reason, it was like all the work that I put in to become the guy, once I got up there, it was like, oh, it's still the same world. I love my teammates. I love my coaches. I just kind of got to the point where

it was like, maybe this isn't what I'm supposed to be doing love my coaches. I just kind of got to the point where it was like, maybe this isn't what I'm supposed to be doing with my life. Even though I've gotten everybody out of debt with my NFL money, I've gotten a chance to hit the reset button for a lot of people. I've gotten a chance to experience a lot of things. I have money accrued and saved. I have some investments. The NFL was a perfect starting point for my adult life. I was very lucky and still a massive fan, but I think the mountaintop, I don't know, I think maybe the first Pro Bowl I got voted into where I was like allowing others to almost empower my feelings. And then when I finally got voted into the Pro Bowl,

I went to the Pro Bowl, got to meet all the other studs, got a chance to learn about it. And I think that was maybe the highest high. I mean, I kicked off a Super Bowl, but I was scared to death because I had no idea how to punt at that point. That was my rookie year. So I didn't even really get to enjoy that because I was like, I do not want to be the reason we fucking lose this game. So I think probably the first Pro Bowl is probably the highest I had felt in the NFL personally from a personal standpoint as opposed to team wise. But even then it was like, all right, still a job. Got to fucking keep getting better.

No, because once you get on top, that's really when the work starts, you know, cause now you got to stay there. Right. So when you realize that the, the top of the mountain, isn't what you thought it was going to be, is that ultimately what kind of starts, you know, the decision of you walking away? I know you had an issue with the GM at the time and you maybe weren't all that happy. Um, and he's like getting mad at you for Instagram posts and all this nonsense. But like, once you realize that this isn't what you thought it was going to be, is that when you start thinking, okay, maybe I should call it a career? I think so. And by that point I got drafted into the Bill Pullian, Jim Caldwell was the coach, Peyton Manning was the quarterback and that regime was just like, I mean, I walked into the winningest decade in NFL history,

literally got drafted into the winningest decade in NFL history to a position that I didn't really fully know yet, you know? So it was, it was a lot of pressure, but getting a chance to watch them work was just so awesome. You know, it's like watching people at that super high level work. It taught me so much. Like I still carry a lot of the shit that I've learned from either Adam Vinatieri or Peyton Manning or Joseph Adai or Clint Session, these guys off the field into what I do now. And then when the new regime came in and just like anything, they kind of want to make it their own.

So they literally cut everybody, including Peyton Manning. I mean, his ass got cut. Everybody got cut. And I was one of the guys that stuck around. I think it's because Ursae liked me so much. Like me and Ursae bonded over a lot of things, especially whenever I got the public intoxication. And then on the other side of that, I wasn't drinking at all. I still don't really drink much at all.

And I think Jim, we kind of had a kindred spirit thing almost where he would come to practice. We start talking. So they tried to get rid of me as soon as my contract was up. I went into my contract year. Grigson was there for the first year. He was the GM. Chuck was there.

That was my contract year, their first year, which is supposed to be like your most important year. And it was, I mean, I obviously was not liked by the new people because I was kind of associated with the old regime. I think they kind of wanted me out of there. But Chuck and my coaches, I think, liked me because they got a chance to work with me on a daily basis. So I do believe those interactions with the front office and kind of a brand new building happening kind of led to me thinking like, oh, maybe this isn't what I'm

supposed to be doing. And then I just started like, you know, unrolling there, like everything started kind of rolling itself out for me. You know, I had like three knee surgeries in four years. I was going through rehab. I was only getting better though on the field. It was still a little bit of, you know, tensions between me and the GM. And I just was like, you know, fuck it. Like, this isn't what I want to sign up for. I almost retired like three different years. And then I finally did it almost, you know, I feel like to myself when I retired, it was like, I finally did what I had been wanting to do for the last couple of years. And although my teammates, I think, missed me there early and my coaches missed me. I think everybody now at this point is incredibly happy for me, you know?

Of course. I mean, why wouldn't they? You alluded to the arrest in 2010 a few times. Obviously, that was a major turning point in your life. Do you think that you got so much heat for that? Because people, as you said earlier as well, people like to make fun of the punter and it's like, look at this punter with the long hair who, you know, got drunk and jumped into the canal allegedly and all this. Allegedly. Yes. Yes. Do you think that was part of it?

Cause you were, you were the butt of the joke here. Even I look back at the old TMZ, you know, article. And it's yeah. Way. So, you know, and it's the punter, you know, like, do you think that was part of it? Like you were shamed for it? I think so. Yeah. You know, like that was a big, if I would have continued to do once I got back

in the NFL, I mean, I was just having a good time. Right. Once I got into the NFL, I was just having a good time. I mean, I had money for the first time that off season, the first off season after a rookie year, we lose in the Superbowl to Drew Brees and his dumb baby. That first off season, I got a chance to go see everything that I seen on wild on. I had enough money. I went over, I was in Africa. I wrote a camel in Africa. I was over in Germany. I was in LA at parties. I was in Miami at parties. I was in New York at parties. And I like came back my second year with maybe 2000, $3,000 in my bank account. Everything was gone. I was like, I don't know if I'm ever going to get this again. So I'm gonna go live. And I did brought a lot of my friends along, got a chance to go see a lot of people, go do a lot of things. And I came back and I was just going and living and living

that off season rolled into the second year, I think. And if I were to just continue going without getting in trouble, I would never have made it. I would have never made where I was. I needed that night on October 20th, 2010 or whatever. But yeah, some of you, you know, you big J journalists and, you know, big mainstream folks mocked me pretty heavily as I deserved it. It was a bye week, you know, so I mean, here or there, but I needed that to kind of slow me down, settle me down. But I will say in New York, you know, and in L.A. and maybe a TMZ headquarters and wherever the hell you were, I might have been mocked and ridiculed, but here in Indiana that night, they said, Oh,

this is our guy because broad ripple is where basically everybody in Indiana hangs out at. That's where people go out. It's a rite of passage almost. So me getting in trouble there. I think a lot of people in Indiana who didn't even know I was the punter on the team had no idea I existed at that point. It was almost like, Hey, this might be one of our guys. And then that was really the turning point for me getting on Twitter and explaining to people. Cause as the media, you yourself probably included, if you were there,

we're calling me an idiot and all this other stuff. A lot of people in Indiana and a lot of people that knew me, I got a chance to go on Twitter and say like, yeah, I made a terrible decision. Uh, I'm going to get it right. I apologize. I embarrassed my family and everything like that. And that's really where everything kind of was built for me. I think from that moment of people being like, oh, if I had a friend in the NFL or a brother in the NFL, it'd probably be this doofus right here. And that's kind of where a lot of things change for me as well, both personally and almost professionally. If I had to, if I had to really put a pivot on something. Back in January, when I was on your

show, I asked you a few questions about this. You talked about the bologna sandwich that you got, and you said, no, thanks. The cream cookie, it smelled like poop. You said the toilets weren't working. That all sounds horrible. I would probably crumble and crawl into a ball in the corner if that happened to me. But I'm wondering if worse than all of that, even the TMZ article and stuff with the teammates and feeling like you let the team down and all that, is worse than all of that, I read that initially when you called your dad, he didn't accept the call. And then he drove something like four, five, six hours. And then you guys just sat on the couch and didn't say a word to each other for a few hours, like feeling like you let him down. When my parents told me that they were disappointed in me, that was like a knife in the heart. Was that the worst part of

all of this? Yeah, I think so. So I called my dad to get one phone call from jail, you know, and you would have withered away in there. I mean, just one look, you wouldn't have, you know what I mean? I mean, I was in solitary confinement because I was a special inmate, obviously. And I was in a glass cage, basically in a doctor's office waiting lobby or waiting room, which is where everybody else was sitting. And they could just stare at me. And word had made its way around on who I was. You know what I mean? So there are people knocking on the window. I'm waving at them. The toilets broke. I mean, it was quite a scene there. I was like in a zoo animal almost. But when I get out, when you're in jail, you get that one phone call. You know, you hear about it. You never think you actually have to make it. There's only one number I knew. And that was my dad's cell phone. dad, I fucked up. You know, he's like, Oh,

we know, you know, he's like, we know like your mom read it on TMZ this morning and it said you were wasted. And I, I think it was eight days or six days, whatever it was. And then he asked me if I was all right. I said, I'm okay. Or whatever, you know, like, I don't know what's going to happen. And then it cut off. So it was as if he hung up on me, you know what I mean? And I didn't get the full story from him until later. I guess they asked him if he hung up on me. You know what I mean? I didn't get the full story from him until later. I guess they asked him if he wanted to pay for more minutes to talk to me. And he, the way he explains it is your mom and I talked about it. And it was, we, I mean, there's no reason to spend any more money on this conversation. So like he thought they were going to

tell me though that like, Hey, it cut off. They obviously did not. So all I get is a hang up tone from my own fucking dad when I'm in jail. So I just hang up the phone. They take me back to my little glass cage or whatever. And it was at that moment I'm like, all right. So literally everybody hates me right now, you know, even my dad and everything. So once I get out, I go through my court sentencing in jail. I go out. There's media obviously chasing down the car as I'm coming out to get

in there because it's bi-week. There's nothing else to talk about. I'm literally the topic of conversation out here because I made such an idiot mistake, idiotic mistake and living so reckless and everything like that. But I get back to my house, my phone's broke, obviously water damage because it rained. That was obviously what it was. It was rain. I didn't really have any means of communication with anybody at this point, right? Like I am not a tech savvy person. There's a laptop sitting here. I have no idea how to really work this thing. I am just on my phone at all times. That is what I use. So my phone was gone. I didn't really want to talk to anybody. I get a knock on the door. I open it. It's my goddamn dad or whatever. He drove six hours from Pittsburgh out there to make

sure I'm okay. And I'm like, you hung up on me when I was in jail, dude. Like, what are you? I was in a little bit of a combative state. You know what I mean? At that point I was a little combative. He was like, I didn't. He does the whole thing. And we sat there, we chit chatted. My dad gave me like a motivational speech though. You know, like, Hey, you didn't, you didn't hurt anybody. You know what I mean? Like you didn't kill anybody. This could be a point for you to really change everything. Our name right now is being tarnished. My, our name, you know, my dad told me almost, and it was like, that conversation was one that really, I was like, you know what? You're right. Like I always wanted to make it for that, for us. I always wanted to

make it for my community, my friends, my family. I always wanted to make it for us. And now a guy who shares my name is like, Hey, right now our name is being buried almost. So it's like those moments in there. And then we turn on TV and the local news are live from the scene of the crime where McAfee jumped into the canal. We'll be here all day. It was just like wall to wall coverage. So, you know, that was a moment I had to have. And I I caused it for myself.

I created for myself. But that really became like a pivotal, almost launch off for me. And I think that conversation with my old man, almost launch off for me. And I think that conversation with my old man, not in jail, obviously, but whenever he came to the house is a massive part of it for sure. So when you walk away in 2017, you join up with Barstool and you start this media journey. And some people said you were crazy because you're still in your prime. When do you start to believe that this media thing is going to work, that you're onto something, that you're different, that you're developing a loyal following? When's that point where you're like, man,

this is actually working for me? Probably like 2015, maybe. I don't know. 2014 is probably when I started to realize like, okay. But you retired in 2017, no? Yeah. But I did a comedy tour while I was still playing. I did numerous comedy shows. I had a podcast while I was still playing. I had a merch business while I was still playing. I did numerous comedy shows. I had a podcast while I was still playing. I had a merch business while I was still playing. I was doing the Bob and Tom show every Tuesday while I was still playing. So I had a chance to realize that there is a chance to maybe make some money outside of the field. Now, I was focused on kicking balls, though. My number one priority was being the best ball kicker I could be for the Indianapolis Colts because that is where the current check is coming from. So anytime you go looking for

mo money and never focus on your for show money, you might end up with no money. So I had a chance to dabble in a lot of things in different fields, whether it would be comedy or sports media or podcasting or merch business or anything like that while I was still playing, while still being able to focus full time on kicking balls. And then once I finally got to the point where I was like, I would like to free my mind from having to worry about being the best ball kicker I can be for the Indianapolis Colts. And I enjoyed and was privileged to do that. I'm very honored to do all that. Very lucky to do all that stuff. But when I finally got to the point to free my mind, I was originally just going to make my own app and I was going to charge a buck a month.

I already have the, I think the something wire of an app. I forget what it's called. Some tech person. I think I still have the basic outline of what the app would be. It was already in motion. I had already paid for it to thing to be built. I was just going to make it like a subscription service, like a buck a month. And I was going to do a daily podcast and just create stuff on there because I had a really loyal, cool following, a great group of humans here in the Midwest that were following me. At that point, I think I had like 750,000 followers on Twitter, maybe 800,000 followers on Twitter. Everything I was doing was doing pretty well. So I think as my career was kind of winding down in the NFL, I knew there was a chance

to potentially make some money. And once again, I'm saying this, it's a real thing in the modern day gold rush that is the digital media space. Like if it is, if you've got a work ethic, I think you can go make it. If you've got something special, I think you can go make it. I got a chance to experience that. And then Dave and Erica had heard about it. They knew what I was thinking about doing.

And I got a chance to chat with Dave and for Erica. And he said, we got an investment and the investment is to bring along talent. So whenever you retire, because he had heard that I was potentially going to retire through, I think Big Cat told him at the time because Big Cat and I were, you know, friendly while I was playing in there. He said, instead of going to like ESPN or anything like that, at least let us have a conversation with you. You know, I think that was their big thing. Let, let us acknowledge or let you know what we think we could

do for you as well. So somebody that was acting as an agent for me, cause I didn't have an agent, uh, reach out to ESPN when I was going to retire. And at this point, remember everything I'd said I'd already done in the media world, ESPN returned and said, no, thank you. We have zero interest for anything. Okay. So that's what ESPN said back, NBC, Fox, CBS, everybody said the same thing. ESPN wouldn't even let me in their Superbowl party. Okay. And this was like around the same time that this was happening. So every mainstream network said no to me. And at that point I was still thinking like, all right, I'll just build my own app, do my own thing. And then I talked to Dave and Erica and anytime you get the chance to chat with like a trailblazing pioneer like Dave, and you're trying to go into a space that

he is captivated and taken over his entire conversation with me was like, Hey, let us just kind of, you know, we can at least at least show you how this whole thing works. Cause there's a lot of errors that can be made. I didn't want to move to New York though. I wanted to stay in Indiana because these were my people out here and I enjoyed the setup out here. So we came up with an idea that I would run a Barstool affiliate location out here in Indy. They'd still be in New York. And at that time, Barstool was blowing up. I mean, it was a rocket ship. And I think there was some miscommunication that potentially happened partially on my fault for not going to New York as much. Them blowing up, hiring new people, maybe not going to New York, New York as much them blowing

up, hiring new people, maybe not understanding who I am, what I am, why I am. So I got a chance to learn from the greats on the internet from them for like a year, year and a half. And then when I finally decided like, all right, I'm gonna go on my own here and do my own thing. I think, I think there was nothing but love from Dave and everybody over there. Cause they completely understood. And that was kind of the plan all along. But I look back sometimes and think back on it like if I would have moved to New York and done that, what the world would look like right now. Obviously, I think we can all realize that maybe it could have been massive and we're still friendly. And who knows if we ever get back into business together at some point. But I was very, very lucky to kind of learn from

everybody over there. They have so much talent over there and the way things operate behind the scenes. I was just very, very lucky to go over there for sure. So you mentioned the ESPN stuff. They wouldn't let you into the Super Bowl party. Obviously things change because you did some work for them. You show up on shows, sidelines, whatever. But a few months ago, there's a big story that comes out where ESPN talent, including myself, can't go on your show. And then it turns into a huge thing and you break the fourth wall and you call me and try to get me in trouble. I mean, it was a whole thing. Awesome, by the way.

Yeah. How is your relationship now with ESPN? You know, I don't know. So I think, I don't know. I'd be lying if I said it was like a good relationship. I don't think it's a good relationship. And why is it not a good relationship? Because those same executives that had zero interest in me when I retired and told me I wasn't even allowed at their Superbowl party when like the group I was with was going or whatever. And this is after I'd made an all pro and everything like that. Like those same executives were there, you know? So the reason why you saw me on get up is because Mike Greenberg wanted me on get up. And that's like Mike Greenberg.

The only reason why you saw me on college game day is because Kirk Herbstreet wanted me on college game day. Right. So like any time that I've had to do anything with the executives that are over there, they just don't get it with me. Like they just don't understand it. I'm a punter. No punters should talk. I live in Indiana. I mean, there's no media business in Indiana that is happening. I don't think on a national level or ever has other than Bob and Tom and myself. So the executives just don't get it with me. They never have. They never will.

And I think, you know, they might have had learned about maybe some of the numbers we were doing, some of the things we were doing, either from our business partners that they were potentially trying to get into a relationship with. And then that caused the, oh, well, nobody's allowed on this then because we are potentially competing over the same business in advertising partners. So it's like, I don't know. There's some people over there that I would love to smack right in the fucking mouth because I think they've ruined ESPN. There's some people that, no, I'm not going to. I mean, that's not how I do it. That's how you do it. That's not how I do it. Like there are some people over there that like I definitely don't like, but it happens. You know, this happens in everything. There's some places in worlds that you're going to go into where people

don't necessarily like you. That has happened to me a lot because of who I am. I'm always the same exact human. I think a lot of people can say that and everybody has kind of attested to that. I'm always the same person. And there's just some people that don't like me over there, but they'll get phased out because they stink at their jobs. And then the next generation will come in and maybe we'll be able to do business together, you know? So you appeared on the Manning cast. Is that an example of like Peyton saying, you know, I want them on and they don't have a say. So every time you appear, it's usually like a guy who has a lot of power saying it's not necessarily an executive who's like, we want to be in business with you. Yes. Bingo. Because what happens is, yeah, I got a text from Peyton who was like,

hey, need you on the show. It's like, you got it. You know what I mean? Like that's, I was very lucky to be teammates with Peyton. I was very lucky to share a lot of great experiences with Peyton. And the fact that he put me on that thing, by the way, so cool. Cause all those execs, you know, that feel the way they do whenever I'm sharing stories of me and the Mannings, you know, basically getting along pretty well. You know, they have to kind of sit on that. You know what I mean? And I enjoy that. Those are moments that, Greeny, Herbie, Hasselbeck was the one that wanted me to do Thursday Night Football in those random cities around the country that were very nice and very good. But we had a remote broadcast. I mean, it was just I was spending I spent a million dollars in one fall to work for ESPN so I could fly to everywhere so I could fly to get up on Mondays with Greeny and still do my show. So I could fly to Winston-Salem, North Carolina for Thursday night football

and still do my show. They didn't pay for that? No, no, no. They gave me a payment, right? But it was nowhere near enough money. I had to build a box truck to put a studio in the back of it so I can continue to do my daily show in these cities I was in. And then Herbie had me on game day and I flew to game day every Saturday too. So I was on six planes a week for about 10 to 12 weeks. Cost me about a million dollars. We had obviously

sponsorship partners that helped with that whole thing. And we made vlogs and my incredible group of boys, we tried to make the most of it, which is what digital media is all about, what the internet's all about. And then we revisit a conversation, you know, and the money that they tried to offer me, it was like, you don't even, like you have no idea what's going on. It was just a basic slap in the mouth, you know,

because they view me as that punter still from Indiana, which is cool. I understand it completely, but I just felt like there was a massive lack of respect there, you know, like a massive lack of respect. And wouldn't you agree that being on the outside, looking in, being sort of the outlaw is the best spot for you. You don't need Fox ESPN TV. Like I would almost argue it would be a mistake to go down that path. This is like, you're the Howard Stern of sports media. And that's the best compliment that I could give to someone growing up a huge fan of Howard

Stern. This is best for you, right? Like correct me if I'm wrong. You don't have aspirations to be with those guys full time at any point anymore. Right? No, no, that is a hundred percent right at this point. No. And by the way, I'm not the outlaw. Like people like Barstool, Rogan, like there's a lot of people on the internet that are the outlaws and have kind of said like, Hey, you don't need the mainstream here. We can do this thing ourselves. And obviously, Joe had Fear Factor and now he has the UFC and Barstow has deals,

I think, with like Sling TV now or Hulu TV, and they had deals with ESPN, but they've majorly built up their own crew. So it's like watching these two just dominate via the Internet. It is very inspiring. But the platforms that ESPN has and Fox has and NBC has can't deny it. You know, like so I view everything as, OK, if I go and do this, is this potentially going to lead more people to watch the show? Right. To watch my show, my daily show with my boys, to watch our hammered down show, watch the pod, watch hockey talk. Well, it's almost like a commercial because the money that they pay is, is not enough for me to travel there and do my own show while still handling my business that I have to with my sponsors and my partners and everything like that. So I love the position I'm in, but everything's like risk reward is the pop, you know, worth the work it's going to take

to get there? Is the platform big enough for me to potentially have to go in the red a little bit on a certain day or for a certain month to get there and make this whole thing happen? Like that's the constant battle of what's worth it and what's not worth it. And I think once again, like getting a chance to watch Dave and Erica make those decisions from the inside has been an immense help here as I continue to grow older. In my opinion, the greatest color commentators in wrestling history, Ventura, Heenan, Lawler, and now you're in the discussion already. What you're doing is incredible. And what's so great about it is you're the same guy here as you are there you

hear these horror stories about what it's like with Vince in your ear and they try to turn you into something else you are the same they're letting you the leash that you have is incredible how did this come about not only to be you know we know about what you did at NXT and you're on the desk and all that stuff and again I hate that I'm giving you so many compliments but I think it's the greatest celebrity slash athlete debut in wrestling history. Your match against Adam Cole was unbelievable. And I can't imagine the work that went into that. But to get this job as the color commentator on Fox, on SmackDown,

alongside the great Michael Cole, and to be yourself, to be the same guy with the same gimmick that you have on your show, to me is a huge, huge deal. How did that all come about? How did that deal come about? How'd that deal come about? Well, shout out to bad bunny too. I mean, he had an incredible debut. Now yours is better with all due respect.

That was a tag match. So he's protected to a degree. Great. But there has to be one. It's you. It's you and Lawrence Taylor. And I, and I think you're, you're both. That was also another WrestleMania, I think, or SummerSlam with Bam Bam, right?

Yeah. WrestleMania. Yeah. That was, that's a huge, I mean, WrestleMania. I mean, you got to show up at WrestleMania. You know what I mean? I think the reason why you and I and I believe that as well. So thank you so much for the compliment that you put on. And Adam

Cole is a terrible human. Okay, we got to make sure everybody knows that. Adam Cole outright scumbag of a guy. But getting a chance to work with somebody who's that talented, even though he is a whole ass. You know what I mean? Getting a chance to work with somebody that talented, especially in the era that we had to do it, right? I mean, there was no fans. There was really no atmosphere. It was like 17 minutes, one-on-one match, no gimmicks,

by the way. There was no chairs. There was no tables. There was no referee interference. There was none of my boys were out there. Just a one-on-one match. I take a lot of pride in that because I dreamt about that ever since I was a kid, you know? So I was very, very lucky to do that. And to hear you say that, especially somebody that has won fake awards in this journalism thing, especially in combat sports, I appreciate that a lot. But I, you know, I was very lucky to work with NXT for like three years. I think I'd been doing the panel for them, the kickoff panel for them for a long time and getting a chance. Michael Cole was the one that actually called me

and asked me to do those panels years ago. And it was the takeover before WrestleMania in New Orleans. If I do recall, it was like a week before then or two weeks before then. I get a text, hey, this is Cole. Do you have time to answer? And I was like, who's Cole? And he was like, Michael Cole.

I was like, this is Michael Cole. Like being Michael Cole. I was like, this is Michael Cole. Like being a mark. I'm like, this is Michael Cole. And he calls me and it actually was him. I'm like, holy hell. Right. I am incredibly surprised. I was like, I can't believe this at this point.

I was almost starstruck. And he was like, is there any chance you would want to come down and do our kickoff panel for NXT TakeOver WrestleMania weekend and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, absolutely. Like, didn't even know if it was going to pay, how it was going to pay, what it was going to pay. But I had known since I was a kid that I wanted to get into the business. And I thought I was built for the business to be honest, like with my athleticism, the way I act, people have kind of treated me like a heel for a lot and baby face for a lot. I have that instant polar. People are going to react to me no matter where I walk into. It's always been like this soccer games.

I'm getting booed out of stadiums, having to have police walk me out to the bus. I mean, this is in high school. This is like the, this is kind of how it's been and I've been such a big fan. So Michael Cole calling me asked me if I want to do it was a huge moment in my life. I was so happy. I remember like it was yesterday. I was in my bedroom and I got the text and I stopped. And I think my wife even like walked into either the back of me or whatever.

She's like, what? I'm like, I think Michael Cole's about to call me. And he calls me, have this whole thing. I go down there and I do the kickoff panel. I get to meet that same weekend. I met Vince McMahon for like five seconds. Hello. You know, like a quick in and out.

Triple H is there, obviously, with NXT. I met Stephanie. I met Shawn Michaels. I met all these people. And it was like a kid. I was like, oh, my God, this is amazing.. I met all these people. And it was like a kid. I was like, oh my God, this is amazing. And I decided to wear shorts. Okay. I decided to wear jorts with it. And I knew from all the horror stories that you had talked about from following the business,

I was like, I'm going to go in there and I'm going to be me. And I think, and this is going to sound bad, but I wanted to set a precedent like, Hey, this is how I'm going to be. I'm not going to be able to be something that I'm not into their credit. Michael Cole, triple H Vince, everybody. If it works, I think throughout the history of the business, if it works, they're going to let you continue to go. If not, they're going to give you little things. I think, I'm not sure.

I don't know enough about the behind the scenes, but I think that's how it goes. That's how I believed it. And for those kickoff panels, I just got a. I don't know enough about the behind the scenes, but I think that's how it goes. That's how I believed it. And for those kickoff panels, I just got a chance to be myself in there. They kind of wanted me to be the idiot from the outside, be the fan, do whatever you got to do. I got to work with Sam Roberts, who is unbelievable at what he does.

I love Sam and Charlie was crushing it as well. So I got to do a couple of years of those. And I think they kind of got comfortable with me, used to me. I think they saw some of my content. I think there was a trust that was built up. Then whenever I was allowed to do the run with Adam Cole, because he broke my set, obviously, and were able to do that whole thing.

I just think I was able to, you always have to do this every single day with everybody. But I think I was able to build up some trust from some people about like, hey, I do understand a little bit about the business, not enough to act like I'm a genius or anything like that. I know what's potentially a good show because I do a show literally every single day. I'm not going to panic in any big moments because I've been in some of the largest of all time. And it's just I think they kind of and I'm always coming from a good spot. So I think they've kind of let me do that. And I'm very, very lucky to do that.

And now getting a chance to sit next to the greatest of all time and Michael Cole. I mean, I just go out there and have a blast. Like it's not a profitable thing for me, the SmackDown. I mean, aside from being in front of 3 million people every Friday night, which is incredibly huge, that's a massive commercial. When you're talking about just strictly cash in pocket, like that is not that profitable thing for me. I'm doing it because I love it so much. I have so much fun. I enjoy it. There's been a couple of things, obviously, that have been told to me like, hey, do this, do this, try to do this.

And I try to curtail it and keep it in there. But anybody that says you get a chance to hear a billionaire speak into your brain whenever you're talking about his show and acts as if that's a bad thing. I think that's incredibly short sighted, you know, getting a chance to chat with Vince McMahon, even if you think he's whatever, a lunatic or whatever, this is one of the biggest self-made dudes in the history of the world. So I take it as an incredible like opportunity. And I've been in, uh, in football and soccer where coaches have said terrible things to me, you know? So it's just, I almost have a callous buildup. So if Vince McMahon was coming to my

ear and say some of the things that people have said have happened in the past, I think my natural reaction would be to almost laugh. Like this sounds bad, but it'd be like, okay, all right, I get it. You know, like I get it. But I look at that as an incredible opportunity and something that's really cool. And I'm very thankful that they've let me kind of do my own thing in there. You mentioned the history with WWE, the relationship now, it didn't just start a few months ago. So you know what it's like backstage. Could I ask? I think wrestling is on fire right now. I think it's more interesting than MMA, which is where I bred my butter.

With what's going on with WWE and AEW, it feels like 20 years ago. I think a rising tide lifts all boats. I would say it to all of them at WWE. This is good for you. Competition is good. It raises your game. But what's it like? They're on fire, AEW. Let's not kid around. Your boy Adam Cole is getting massive pops as he walks out. Punk is going over. Brian is going over. We'll see if Bray Wyatt is going over. They have to be paying attention to what they're doing. If they're not, and I think they're very smart people, they are. But if they're not, that's a mistake.

Do you sense a difference backstage now that there's some competition, there's someone nipping at their heels? Do you sense a different vibe? This is going to sound so terrible, especially because everything you know about the business. Ever since I started doing kickoff shows and then I did the watch alongs, I'm very lucky. I fly in day of, my stuff and then I'm out. Right. So I don't really know, you know, the dynamics backstage. I, the only thing I know is that when we show up, it's always a celebration almost like, and it sounds terrible, but it really is when me and my guy Foxy, who's been with me for a lot of them, then Zito has been there and Nick's been there and Ty's been there, but normally it's just me and Foxy. When we show up, I'm, I think, I mean,

we have never really been around each other, but I always am just trying to like, Hey, let's just enjoy it. Like let's lift the mood. So I'm a big, Hey, how you doing? Great to see you. How's everything going? Saw you there. Boom. And then I kind of, you know, the full conversations are just those types of things. I have not had any conversations with anybody about any outside companies backstage. I'm sure they have to be happening because a lot of people's friends are over there doing their thing. Like Adam Cole is a terrible human. But when I heard that baby,

I was so incredibly happy for him. Like I was so incredibly happy for him. So I'm not 100% sure how the feeling is, whether it's from creative or executives or anything like that. But I do know that it feels like a lot of people are happy for their friends are going over and succeeding. And another thing is I'm incredibly pumped about the crowds, not just obviously the AEW crowds are fucking awesome. I mean, they know that they're a part of the show. They understand that because anytime I got, I didn't get a chance to go to any shows when I was a kid. I mean, that was just something that was not necessarily in the budget for me to go to a shows when I was a kid. I mean, that was just something that was not necessarily in the budget

for me to go to a WWE event. But then once I became an adult and I started going to shows, it's like if a pass to be the most absurd fan on earth, like that's what wrestling is. Like you're supposed to look somebody in their face and boo them right to their face. And you're supposed to tell them they stink. So anytime I got a chance to go in a crowd,

I mean, there's pictures in newspapers and people have seen it. I was losing my mind like I was a kid again. So the AEW crowds have been so awesome to see, but our crowds for SmackDown have been electrified. I mean, we have also had the awesome, incredible crowd. So I think it's great to be a wrestling fan right now. I'm happy for everybody doing their thing. Uh, and I'm just excited that I am on the best sports entertainment show on earth by a landslide. And, uh, I'm happy for everybody that's getting an opportunity to crush. Do you think you ever have another match? I don't know. I was so sorted. My body hurts so bad. I mean, I fractured my left big toe in that. Yeah. Shoot. Yeah. When I did that moonsault through somebody through the table, I forget who it was. Somebody was on table. I did a moons. It

was literally as soon as I got in the ring, as soon as I got in the war games match, I had to get, I had to get like four tables out from under the ring. Okay. That was, I was a winded obviously after that. It was very heavy. And then I went in and the first thing I did was a moon salt, I think, through somebody through the table. And I had never done one of them. I'd never done it. In theory, I thought I could do it. You know, I'd done it onto like a crash pad before my ring that I have in the office here. I bought a ring one time when I was in the NFL because I found out I could at like 2.33 a.m. So I have a full size ring. Yeah. It's right here in the office. Yeah.

It's right here. So I was able to do a moonsault on like a crash pad that we have here in the office, but I'd never actually done it on somebody. I mean, first minute I'm in that match, I do a moonsault and I don't turn my feet out. So my, my toe just goes straight into the, into the mat, fracture my big toe, literally the first minute I'm in there. And then obviously with the flip off the top and in the match with Adam Cole,

I got kicked so hard in the face in the middle of that thing. I mean, it was, my whole body was incredibly sore. The amount of respect that I had for every woman and man that gets in the ring after my first match. I mean, I obviously had a massive respect for them, but it grew. I mean, I'm a delicate flower, but let's assume I'm probably going to get back in there. I mean, let's assume at some point I got to win at some point. You know what I mean, Ariel? I can't just be completely defeated in there, but my body was beat up, dude. I was

very sore. It feels like everything's coming up big for you. It's all coming up, Pat McAfee, Patrick McAfee. The Aaron Rodgers relationship is gigantic, obviously. Could you explain that to me? Is he just doing this out of the kindness of his heart? Is there a deal here between you guys? It doesn't happen where the MVP just shows up on a rinky-dink podcast every Tuesday. What is the deal behind the relationship with Aaron Rodgers? Yeah, I think Aaron, I don't know. You never really know with Aaron Rodgers, right? You never really... And by that, I mean, you're talking about one of the most elite humans of all time, not just athletically and physically and being the greatest ball thrower to ever play the sport that is the biggest in the world and a Mount Rushmore quarterback in the NFL. But you're talking about one of the most smart humans walking this earth as well, like could go on Jeopardy, I think think, and win actual jeopardy and feel very confident and have a day. Cause he wasn't a celebrity jeopardy and went against, I think, um,

Mr. Wonderful and somebody else. And everybody thought he was potentially going to lose these business people. And he just dog walked everybody. And then obviously when he hosts it, he feels good. He has a lot of different interests and reading books and everything, but I think Aaron's going to be a part of our network for some time. I think. And it all started with he followed me on Twitter in the middle, out of middle of nowhere when I was playing.

I forget if it was because I was on NFL AM, which was a show that was on NFL Network in the mornings before Good Morning Football was on. And it was on every single TV and every NFL office, basically, because every NFL building watches NFL Network. And I got a chance to go on like once a week and I gained a lot of, I think friends and fans throughout the NFL from that show. I mean, I would do, they would Skype me in from the Indianapolis Colts facility and I would just

do my thing for 10 minutes, basically on the show, just banana land. I mean, at one point I dress up like Ed Hockley. I mean, I would just do it. So I started realizing after that, that normally players would come talk to Vinatarian warmups. I was always with Adam Vinatarian legend goat going to be a hall of famer. Normally people would just come talk to him and I would just be standing there and I'd like have to introduce myself to people. After that started happening, I realized that other NFLers, other coaches,

coaches would start coming up to me. I'm like, Hey, love, like love what you did on Bubba.. So I think things started to grow. I got a follow from Aaron on Twitter one time, one day. I forget what it was. And I remember texting a couple of my boys back home. I'm like, Aaron Rodgers just accidentally followed me, I think. I think he accidentally followed me. So I kind of watched it.

I followed him back. We had a couple exchanges. And then at a Hall of Fame game, the Colts were supposed to play the Green Bay Packers. That game inevitably got canceled because the field was so bad. They painted the field and then put a tarp over top of it. And the tarp was like a magnifying glass for the sun. And it

melted the paint into the turf. And it just became like this big, terrible turf over there in Canton so that we couldn't play on it. So we had to go. Game got canceled. Got a chance to meet him like in that pregame and kind of build on our relationship. You know, we had a relationship at the time, got a chance to say hello. And then we kind of just kept it a distant. Then I got invited to a golf tournament that he was hosting. We got to hang out for an entire weekend. I got to learn more about him. AJ Hawk and I became very good friends. He's one of

his good friends. And it just kind of has blossomed into this organic, incredible weekly conversation, especially because he was a guy who never talked to anybody about anything ever. There was a lot of narratives, false narratives that were being said about him for a long time. And he just said, I'll kill him with indifference. I'm not going to say anything because once I answer one, I'm going to have to answer everyone. He's always had that. So now that he's at the point of his career where I think he's very comfortable with his resume, I think he's very comfortable with himself. And he feels, I think, comfortable chit-chatting with us. He's much more open and we are incredibly lucky for that. And I look forward to Tuesdays during the football season,

almost more so than anything else professionally that I get a chance to do. I'm very lucky, very thankful for it. And I know everybody else is watching it to hear what he's saying. So I take a lot of pride in the information and what we get out of Aaron and what we potentially correct and what we can let people know about things in the past as well. It's a dream come true and I'm very lucky. And once again, dumbest life of all time. And I very much understand that. Okay. Just a couple of quick things and then I'll let you go. I don't want to tire you out. I know you have a show. I don't get tired, Ariel. Okay. I live with guilt. My

whole existence is just one guilt. This is helping wake me up, actually. This is helping. Okay. You're enjoying this. I'm enjoying it too. I'm loving this. It's great. So I never get to do this. I never get to be the one that answers questions. I feel like people probably hit you up all the time no i don't enjoy doing a lot of i know i know it's annoying because there's too much of me right now there's too much of me right now already i don't need to be forcing myself onto other people's listeners you know what i mean like i've been with me for 34 years i'm a lot okay especially right now there's a lot of me too much of me so i feel like i get very i don't want to say indifferent, but I do get kind of when

people ask me to come on their show, I'm always very thankful for it. Cause I know it's not easy to ask somebody to come on a show. Like you and I both know booking shows is not an easy thing to do. It's a, it's a big deal, but I never want to feel as if I'm being forced on people, especially with how much there is a me. So like I'm doing this for you because I feel like everybody that listens to your show has already listened to my show. The reason why they're listening to your show is probably because they listen to my show. So that is why I did this show. But like that, this is not something I normally get to do. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. How bad was COVID? I got it pretty bad there, man. I was vaccinated too. So I was fully vaccinated and, uh, we still don't know where

I got it. Like everybody just assumes it was at SummerSlam, but my wife was with me. Her friend was with me. Two pilots were with me afterwards. My boys were with me afterwards and nobody got it other than me. So I think it might've been a delivery guy, but, or maybe an Uber or a DoorDash or something like that that potentially gave it to me at the office, maybe 104 and a half degree fever. I thought I was really going through it. It was like, it was about, I don't know, probably 36 hours of like aches and chills. And then on

the other side of that, I kind of, you know, got going, but it was, it was a nightmare. I mean, the timing of it wasn't great, obviously, and dealing with it wasn't great and being scared that you're going to potentially harm somebody else. You know, I was scared to leave my house even after I had a negative test. I'm like, I don't want anybody else to potentially get this. And they have to miss work or potentially die, I guess, is the end game of this thing. So it was it wasn't fun. It wasn't cool, but it was great to get back into the office. Great to get back on Smackdown.

And I'm happy now. They tell me I can just drink COVID through a straw and I'm OK because I got the antibodies and the vaccines. That's goodness. You know? Yeah. You came back MSG and I was like literally front row and you heard me and no sold me. I'm with my kids.

I'm like, yo, you know, guys, I don't want to alarm you, but like, tell me you were there. I'm not that guy.

I'm not that guy. I'm friends with a lot of boys in the back. I'm not that guy. I don't text anyone. You know, I just show up. Yeah, I know.

And I understand that you're a rock star. understand you're you're popular and back or something like that that's not exactly what i've heard but the um the uh i'm joking but i have so much going on like i completely forgot you were going to be there i didn't even know and i always go left around because i want to do the whole thing i didn't even know you were there to the right and you were like i think like row four or five, right? I think like, no, no front front. You're probably like row six,

depending upon there. I completely forgot about it. So I tried to come over at the end and say, what's up, but I didn't want to dabble too much in the way and get anybody's way. Cause there was about to be a match, but it was good. So,

you know, I did feel bad though. No, I love the relationship from afar that you have with your wife. It seems like you guys are super tight. She travels with you. She's very supportive. You're supportive of her charity for the brand, if you are the brand.

If you don't have, you know, because I think, I have met people, by the way, and I'm sure you have as well, who get married and unfortunately the significant other impedes their progress, impedes their success. And I feel very lucky that my wife, I've known her since I was 12, never said, don't go to... Early in my career, I was traveling a gazillion times. I felt I needed to be at every single fight. Every single fight I had to be there, I had to be omnipresent. And it seems like your wife is very supportive of your career and your crazy schedule and everything that you do. Would that be an accurate assessment? And most importantly, when are you going to have kids?

Yeah, great questions. So, and by the way, shout out to your wife too, by the way. I mean, that is an incredible thing. It's not easy, by the way, especially for your significant others. And like you, I have seen others where maybe they get married and the dreams and goals do not align. You know, like, Hey, I think you've made enough. You've done enough. I think it's time to stay home and do this whole

thing. And I think with my wife, I'm very, very lucky. She was with me when I was in the NFL. So she got a chance to see that life. She got a chance to see the rehab, the, the knees. She was bringing me ice for my knees and things like that. She also saw the, you know, kind of, I don't want to say discontent, but like the, I don't even know if that's a word, but she saw me fall out of love with working in the NFL, I think. So she got a chance to see the behind the scenes of that. She got a chance to see, you know, the comedy tour script, our touring and the merch and the things that I've tried and failed at. So she's been through it all, including my retirement and my Barstool days and getting a chance to learn from them.

She's kind of seen it all and understand it all. And there has been some moments where she's like, aren't we doing too much? You know, like, isn't there a thing? But she has never once become an anchor, you know? And I think that is a beautiful thing. I'm very fortunate. I'm very lucky.

She holds it down. There's a lot that has to happen in her life. What she's doing with Fur the brand because our dog Valerie had to battle against canine cancer out of nowhere. And this is the first dog that I've really fallen in love with. And it kind of I mean, I almost like cried whenever I heard the diagnosis. And then once I found out how expensive everything was, I thought back to like my childhood and she thought back to her childhood. Like if that was our dog, whenever we were kids, we could never afford the procedure to save our dog's life. So that's where further brand was founded basically was to help people fund and pay for their canine cancer treatment, which is ridiculously expensive until you find out about it. And then, you know, it's your dog. So they pull on your heartstrings too, like, oh, well you can afford this. It's like, not a lot of people can. So I'm very lucky to have Samantha McAfee as my

wife. I'm very appreciative. Like every relationship, there are moments I think where she hates me. That's going to happen, I assume. And hopefully I've been with me a long time. I hate me a lot of the time too. So I understand that, but I'm very lucky. I love that lady to death. And whenever we create kids, I think we'll be, I think we'll be very excited about it. And she's going to be maybe the greatest mom to ever exist. So I can't wait to see it. If you need someone for the bris, I'm well-versed. If you want to go down that path, just throwing it out there, you know, take it or leave it. What's the bris? That's the old snip snip? Yeah, the old snip snip. Yeah. You know, it's become more common. It's not just a Jewish thing anymore.

I don't know if you know this. It's become very common. My kid's dick though. I just say it's, it's more of a health thing. If I'm being honest. Okay. Okay.

Got it. Got it. I'm sorry. I didn't know enough about it. That's on me. If you want to be the person, my child, I mean,

we'll have to call the authorities. Okay. Okay. Last thing, last thing for you. And then I'll let you go. I remember one time you threw out the Monday night football thing, kind of backfired.

People were thinking you were campaigning for someone's job. It was a bit weird. But listen, I respect you for shooting your shot. You wanted that. You were shooting for the stars, and you got to put it out there. And so I respect it. Who knows what goes on with that job in the future because the Mannings are killing it, and maybe that's the future.

But what is on the bucket list at the very top? I don't killing it. And maybe that's the future, but what is something like, what is on, on the bucket list at the very top? I don't know if there's much left with the wrestling now and being this, you know, juggernaut that you are, but is there something off the beaten path that you haven't talked about, that you haven't revealed that you want to accomplish that you want to do before it's all said and done?

I don't know, man. And I appreciate all those kind of words. And there was a couple of people in your journalist world that want to know. Listen, I don't don't pay me with that brush. The media guys didn't like it and they were giving you crap for it. You know, I'm talking about those two drones and they trended for like eight hours or something. Yeah. And I, you know, I don't necessarily think that I started like my people, I think, started that. And then I kind of fan the flames because I was like, yeah, it would be cool. I guess if I'm on Monday night

football and I think I could add to a game, like I think I could add to a game depending upon who I'm with, you know, like you can put me as a third man in the booth there and I'll be able to add, I think to the experience. I think I've proven that time and time again, I talk a lot on my show, the show's named after me and this I'm getting interviewed. I talk a lot, but I kind of, I feel like I'm pretty self-aware and I kind of understand situation. So I went with it. I thought it would be a good move. But also that was, you know, all those executives that are making that decision. You know, I was OK with them having to answer those questions. You know what I mean? Like I was OK with. So all those journalist people that were coming after me, they don't even know that I was potentially doing that strictly to troll the people that I didn't like, you know. So it's like it's one of those things where I am petty. OK, I am a petty person. I do recall things that are either done or said against me.

So there are some people that came out against me and that entire thing that I would never talk to probably in the sports media world because of it. Name names. Come on. Name names. No, I don't do that. OK, don't put them over. Name names. Come on, name names. No, I don't do that. Okay. Don't put them over. You don't want to put them over. Well, and also, there's no reason to make people, because there might be people that are fans of these people.

And just because my experience with them is that they're a douchebag doesn't mean that I should paint that image and maybe make other people notice that they are as well. You know, like that isn't my job. I want everybody to eat. I want everybody to make it. So I think that is what I most hated about that entire thing where people are like, oh, this guy's trying to take somebody's job and blah, blah. It's like, no, I'm not trying to take somebody's job. I'm just potentially saying like,

hey, I should be in this conversation. And if I'm not in a conversation, I would like these stooge execs to at least have to have the conversation about me because the power of my incredible people are amazing on the internet. So I don't know if that was a shot and a miss. I do believe I ruffled some feathers in some houses that I'm okay with ruffling some feathers in. So I enjoyed it. I had a blast, but I don't want to get into that. I don't know. You didn't answer the question. The thing about what's the one thing out there. I don't know. I love my daily show so much, man. I love it.

I enjoy it so much. I, um, and I know you're independent, you know? Yeah. You have like seven bosses now, but like he, uh, it's funny hearing that from you who went out and worked, you know, you have a serious sign behind you there. You work with my show. They pay for, I'm the boss. They pay me for my show. My show is a YouTube show. You know what I mean? All right, fair enough. Listen, I need baby steps. Yeah, I agree. And I'm appreciative and thankful that you took a step out on your own. We even talked shop a little bit.

Yeah. Just to, you know, it didn't work out. And by the way, I think my experience with Barstool is why we inevitably, potentially, I wasn't able to create the op because I think you got to be around. Like, I think if I was in New York, I had to be around. Like, I think it's a lot of my fault why the miscommunication happened because I wasn't in New York, you know, like I was 700 miles away. So with you being over there in New Jersey, New York, wherever you are and us here, it's tough to do that. But I was incredibly proud of you being like, you know what? I do have the skill. I do have the work ethic. I do have the

ambition to kind of go out and do it while also securing a comfort bag from a couple of people. so your family can be taken care of. You did it very smartly. But for me right now, I'm at this point where, I mean, I don't really answer anybody right now. And I am very, very okay with that. I'm very thankful for that. It's a lot of work. Obviously I got people, I got a sales guy, I got a CFO who I've been best friends with since kindergarten, and they have to do a lot of bullshit conversations. I have to come in, shake hands with since kindergarten, and they have to do a lot of bullshit conversations. I have to come in, shake hands, kiss babies, do my thing, run a business like everybody else has to that has to run their business. But right now I'm enjoying it so much. I'm enjoying what I'm doing right now that I'm not even really.

I mean, I would like to be a champion store golfer at some point. So being a professional golfer is something that I would like to do at some point. And champion store is the senior tour. AJ Hawk will owe me $20 million whenever that happens. That's a bet we have already made. But aside from that, I'm just trying to enjoy every single day and hopefully produce the best show possible every single day that I can with my boys who are incredibly talented. What a story. Honestly, jokes aside, I am very thankful to know you.

I, you know, I really look up to you. Your dog is as well. Yeah, the dog is killing me right now. But here I am, you know, in my basement. And these are the perks of being independent. But no, really impressed with what you've done. Consider you a friend. Consider you a mentor, believe it or not. I look at what you do. And I say that is the blueprint. You know, I used to think that the blueprint was, you know, Costas Albert to me and to a lot of other people in sports media, you are the blueprint. I used to think that the blueprint was Costas Albert to me and to a lot of other people in sports media.

You are the blueprint. I don't want to be the sideline guy anymore. I want to do what you're doing. And that's like the best compliment that I could give you. Obviously, I wanted AJ Hawk on here. He wasn't available. So I'm glad to have the second star of the show. One of these days, I'd love to have AJ, my good friend, on the program.

But thank you for this. I know you don't do it often. I appreciate it. Pat McAfee Show, I suggest everyone check it out. If you are listening to this or watching this, you probably check it out. But I do want you not to watch it on Mondays and Wednesdays between 1 and 4 because he went up.

I mean, I was there long before. I was doing the Mondays and Wednesdays when you were, you know, kicking field goals for West Virginia. Let's be honest. So I just want to let you know that you can watch his show on replay afterwards. Continued success. You're the man, Pat. Thank you for everything you've done for me, for, you know, putting me over, for putting

me on your show. And I hope that you have many, many, many, many more years of success and to your team as well. I'm envious, honestly, of your team. I'm a big loyalty guy. And I see the guys behind you and how they treat you and work for you. And I see like Evan and all these guys doing things. I was like, man, that's the dream right there to have a team, a squad who live and die by everything that you're doing. You prop them up. They prop you up. You go out, you give them money, fan. It's like, it's a beautiful thing. You really are blessed. So congrats, my man. Thank you so much. It's an honor. Thank you for

all the kind words. We also appreciate the hell out of the Helwani. We're big fans of yours over here. And we have a good culture. We have a good team over here. Everybody's kind of driven, same goals. Everybody kind of has the same work ethic. Everybody's ready to go. And that's a big deal. Building your culture, building your team is a massive, massive deal. And I'm very, very lucky for the boys that I have every single day and for people like you that give us a chance. And I appreciate you, man. Thank you for this opportunity.

And if I'm the blueprint, by the way, I mean, there's a lot of terrible decisions you got to make before you fall into success. And I hope you miss all those. I will miss those. Yeah, I'm a lot smarter than that. Yeah. Absolutely. End game. Yeah, exactly. The end game is the, yeah, I get it. And there's a lot of people before me and before you that we can all look to and hopefully lean on a little bit. But with that being said, when I was kicking field goals and you were on Mondays and Wednesdays,

you were still looking up to Bob Costas. Okay. Times have changed. You're an idiot for going up against me live on YouTube. I will continue to tell you that that is not a good decision. We've been here for years and our crew is a very loyal fan base. We tell them every single time, Hey, Ariel is, is live right now. If you'd like to go and we say our number jump as opposed to go down, our number goes up as opposed to go down. That's a very Shivani move right there.

I will continue to promote it. Okay. I will continue to say mankind just want, I will continue to promote it, but I thank you so much, bro. You're the best. Thank you,

Patrick. I appreciate it. Talk to you soon. Cheers, dude. All right. Great stuff there with Patrick. I feel like I could have talked to him for another hour.

What a personality, infectious personality, so much energy. Jeez Louise. He was going to do his show, a three-hour show right after that conversation. I was feeling bad the whole time that I was draining him of all his energy. But if you haven't heard the Pat McAfee show, it's just different. It's the closest thing I think we have to the Howard Stern show in sports. And it's just so great to see a guy leave a great job, like being a kicker

in the NFL, bet on himself, and now essentially do it all independently and is doing very well. He's flying around on his private plane, doing SmackDown, just doing great things and able to do them as himself. He's not trying to appease anyone. He's not trying to be something that he's not. It's always him. It's the same guy on all the different platforms, including when he's on linear television with ESPN or Fox. So I have an immense amount of respect for Patrick. He is an absolute jabron. There's no doubt about that. But you can't deny what he has built in a very short amount of time.

You can't deny his work ethic. You can't deny his brains. And I love that he's got this great team around him. Behind the scenes, AJ Hawk, everyone seems to support him. And that is the dream. So I enjoyed that very much. I hope you did as well. I hope you are enjoying this new project of mine, The Helwani Show. Thank you very much to our producers behind the scenes. And thanks to all of you who not only listen to this on the podcast feeds, but also can check out the full length interviews on my YouTube channel, youtube.com slash Ariel Hawani. Please subscribe.

Please rate, review, leave a comment, do all the things that you do. I don't know if any of them help, but I appreciate them very much. This is completely independent of anything that I'm doing. It's all on my own and I'm just enjoying it. And it's one of those things where, you know me, I like to stack each show that I do with a million guests. I'm already excited to do the next one. Like, oh my gosh, should we do twice a week now? And we've just started this two weeks in.

I'm a crazy person, but I'm loving this. Again, thank you very much to the Lovely Feathers for their great music. Thank you to Patrick McAfee. And most importantly, thanks to all of you back next week, back on Thursday for another episode. I appreciate you guys very much. Have a great weekend. Thank you.