The Ariel Helwani Show - Sean O'Malley, Khalil Rountree Jr., Deontay Wilder, Malcolm Wellmaker, Michael Chiesa, weekend recap

Episode Date: June 16, 2025

Khalil Rountree Jr. joins the program before his UFC Baku main event against Jamahal Hill to discuss headlining the first UFC event in Azerbaijan, almost giving up on MMA, his coach John Wood, growing after his loss to Alex Pereira, his path back to a title shot, and more (02:15).Deontay Wilder, American heavyweight great, previews his return to the ring against Tyrrell Herndon. "The Bronze Bomber" talks about dealing with betrayal, coming back from losses, speaking to a sports psychologist, his future, and more (52:55).Ariel Helwani is joined by the Boys in the Back to recap Kamaru Usman’s decision win over Joaquin Buckley at UFC Atlanta, plus the news and notes from around the sport (1:40:52).Sean O’Malley calls in after his defeat to Merab Dvalishvili at UFC 316 to break down the submission loss, his viral lifestyle changes, differences in the rematch, his future at featherweight, the state of the bantamweight division, and more (2:04:24).Malcolm Wellmaker, surging UFC bantamweight contender, joins after his devastating win over Kris Moutinho and gets into his KO streak, fighting in Atlanta, his childhood and early career, quitting his job as a pipefitter, and more (2:37:33).Michael Chiesa looks back at his hard-fought victory over Court McGee and discusses his feelings around the fight, dealing with negativity, his three-fight win streak, his change in mindset, his success in commentary, Islam vs. JDM, and more (3:08:49).The Boys rejoin to wrap up the day and are greeted by a special guest and longtime friend of the program, Jon Bier. Then they answer your Super Chats (3:46:40).

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Errorio Hawaii Show! Back in your life! On this Monday, June 16th, 2000. And 25. Hello again everyone! Hi Sher, hope you're doing well. I sure am. You know, I've been thinking about this particular date, June 16th, 2025, for quite some time. I was thinking about how I'd feel on this date. I was thinking for a very long time what my body would feel like, what my emotions would be. Of course, the Monday after my son's bar mitzvah,

and I kept thinking, what is life going to be like on this date? And I sit here today, a very proud, happy, fulfilled, relieved, proud, emotional, happy, excited young man. And so it's great to be here, had a lovely weekend with my friends and family. It was special, it was memorable, it was everything I dreamed of and more, and I'm so very weekend with my friends and family. It was special, it was memorable, it was everything I dreamed of and more,

and I'm so very proud of my son. So in case you're wondering, that's how I feel. This morning, my mom said to me, you doing the show today? How you doing the show? Aren't you tired? I said, the show goes on, mama. And so the show goes on and we have a super duper stacked

show. Yeah, that's right, Rampage. I am that. We have a super duper stacked show on this Monday.'s right Rampage. I am that. We have a super duper stacked show on this Monday and in fact we are going live because we don't want to keep our first guest of the day waiting. Back into the show we shall be joined by Michael Chiesa. He had the big win over this weekend in Atlanta at the State Farm Arena against court McGee Malcolm Wellmaker who is taking the bantamweight division by storm. Incredible knockout win over Chris Montino. He's going to join us. What about Sugar Sean O'Malley in his first non-podcast.

And what I mean by that is like he did one on his own show, but first interview outside of that world. He'll come on the show to talk about what happened two weekends ago in Newark. The Bronze Bomber himself returning June 27th. The Alate Wilder is going to join us in the first hour. We'll get to the weekend recap in the second hour. But first things first, it's a great honor and it's a great privilege to be joined once again

by one half of the main event for this Saturday's big show in Baku, Azerbaijan, the UFC's first trip to that part of the world. And it's a fantastic, very important light heavyweight fight headlining the card. It's Jamal Hill against Khalil Rountree Jr. There's the poster. Rountree's first fight since his incredible, thrilling,

potential fight of the year battle against Alex Praira back in October in Utah. And the aforementioned Khalil Rountree is very kind enough to join us from all the way in Baku. Here he is. Hello, my friend. How are you? Yo, I'm doing well, man.

How are you? Happy Father's Day, by the way. Thank you so much. I really appreciate that. And happy Father's Day to all the fathers out there. Man, I am so excited to talk to you because honestly, eight months later, I'm still in awe of what you did against Alex Pera back in Utah in October.

It was such a fun fight. It was such an enjoyable fight. I had a really hard time not giving it the fight of the year because to me, there was something so magical. It was down to that one and Islam Emporia for me last year. And I know you're removed from all of it. And I'd love to talk to you about it in a moment, but I just wanted to say congratulations on that performance.

This is the first time we get to speak to you since then. It was really magical to see you step up to the plate and fight the way in which you did back in October of last year. And thanks, Ariel. I'm glad you were entertained, as, you know, it seemed like most of the world was. Yeah, I definitely, you know, put my whole heart into that fight. So here we are again. like most of the world was. Yeah, I definitely, you know, put my whole heart into that fight. So here we are again. Could I ask, you know, everyone I'm sure was like giving you props and

congratulating you and telling you how much respect and admiration they had for you after the fight, but you wanted to win. Like you weren't there to be second place. And so how did you, how did you balance like, hey, I should be proud. I'm getting love, but also, you know, the job wasn't done. You know, I think the best thing that I did to balance it was just get back to training and just realize that, you know, I still got to keep climbing. So it was nice to have the motivation

and the support from the fans and you know and gain the attention of the fans. But I think that you know that mixed with getting back to training to to get back to a title fight. I think the training helped the balance for sure. Did you need some time off after the fight or did you get right? I mean obviously your body had to heal a little bit but just from the sport from the, did you have to take an extended time off? Yeah, I took some time. I went on a small family vacation to celebrate my father-in-law's 80th and then obviously I needed to let my scars heal up, my nose and the other things in the eye. But yeah, it took maybe like a month, month and a half

for them to close up fully. And yeah, and then I went right back into training probably like the beginning of the year, yeah. Before you got that title shot, I remember when we were talking about you fighting on the Apex cards and I was telling you how I felt like you had advanced from that, you had graduated from that

and wanted to see you get a big opportunity. Did you ever wonder like, hey, if I ever did get this opportunity, how would I perform? Would I be able to hang with the best? And did you feel like you proved to yourself in the world that you are one of the very best fighters in the world after that performance?

Well, I think that I remember in the Apex, I specifically, you know, called out like I wanted to fight Alex, I think I thought in my mind that it would be an exciting fight. So, you know, the both of us being, you know, strikers primarily and I called for it. So I think that I wasn't necessarily surprised or shocked when the opportunity came and when you know and when the lights were on Because I just envisioned it and so I think it happened, you know exactly the way that I wanted to minus You know the result but Yeah, it was no shock. I was prepared for just going in chronological order here He returned in in March and he lost.

When you saw that performance and how it was maybe a little bit different than the Alex that you saw in the cage back in October, what was your reaction? It was surprising for sure. Yeah, in the moment it was definitely surprising. And then, you know, just after time passed and he was able to come back and just

Kind of say like yeah, maybe you know his body was tired and you know fighting so many times in one year It all made sense But I think in the moment it was a bit surprising to me You were scheduled to fight in April in Kansas City against Jamal surprising to me. You were scheduled to fight in April in Kansas City against Jamal. When they first came to you with this fight, obviously it didn't come to fruition. We'll get to the change of dates in a moment, but were you happy with it? Did you like the booking? Did you think it made sense coming off the prayer fight? Yeah, I think the booking made sense to me. I was

definitely happy with it and prepared to get back into the cage. So as soon as I got the call, it was a no-brainer. I said yes, absolutely. When you came to the realization that it was going to be pushed almost two months later and go from, you know, Midwest America to Baku, uh, where the UFC has never been and, and quite far away from home. What was your reaction? Well, obviously it's, it's a bit devastating to get, you know, postponement news, uh, you know, four weeks out from the fight after, you know, preparing and doing all the preparation it takes.

So in the moment, that initial news right off the bat is pretty devastating, but UFC was really cool with rescheduling it and giving me updates. And they mentioned Baku, and I don't think anyone really expected for this place to be as amazing as it is So I was open to it Just because there weren't many other options, so I immediately just you know I said yes, but um The moment that I landed here was You know I was I was super excited that I that I said yes as quickly as I did. We're showing some footage from your relatively

new YouTube channel, which has tremendous production and really great insight and looks into your career. So I highly suggest everyone check it out and subscribe to it. And that opening shot is you entering the arena and it seemed like you were almost like a little bit emotional as you were taking it all in. What were you experiencing? Well, it's an arena that I've never experienced before.

Um, you know, it's, it's nothing like any arena that I've ever been to in the States, it's nothing like the T-Mobile. It's nothing like anything. Um, it's, it's got a, it's got a very different feel to it. Um, it definitely feels authentic to Baku. This place is, it's tremendous. I I'm I've just been in awe of everything that I've experienced here. So the the the arena was just, you know, one of those experiences.

It's it just feels like a special place. It's got a it's got a different energy to it. I can't even explain it. It's like, it's not high up, you know, it's kind of like low ceilings, but the floor is really wide. And I would just imagine it being packed with people. And yeah, it just, it kind of brought me some children. Yeah. And, you know, we're seeing some photos

of how happy you seem to be there. When did you actually get to Baku? I got to Baku today, Monday, so I got here very late last Saturday. So like a little over a week ago? Yeah, I've been here a little over a week now, yeah. Because in that video, you talked about the jet lag and how much it was kind of like affecting you a little bit at the beginning. How are you doing?

How are you dealing with that now? How is it? Oh, I'm fully adapted now. Like I feel great. Yeah, my body's acclimated, normal sleep schedule, normal training schedule. But yeah, the first few days were definitely a bit rough for me. I'm not going to lie. When you are out and about and just talking to people, you're one half of

the main event. Usually when the UFC goes to a country for the very first time, there's an intense excitement, the build up, the posters, the billboards, people out and about. Are you sensing that as well? Or are a lot of people coming up to you thanking you for coming? Showing you love are you feeling all of that? I've never gotten this Just joy and support Anywhere in the world that every single fan every single person is super excited about this card It's it. I don't know. It's it's unreal honestly. So yeah the first the first week even now it's everybody's is really excited which is is is really crazy man to be honest.

They've definitely got some some dedicated fans here and it just seems like the people are excited to to have the UFC here in Baku for the first time. It's one of these things where you got to be here to really experience how excited these people are to have us. No knock on Kansas City, but it's just a bit of a different vibe, right? It's, yeah, no knock on Kansas City, but I'm telling you, the people's smiles on their faces, the fact that they're having a UFC here in their city, their smiles are through the roof. It's crazy. I heard you talking about John Wood, your coach in Las Vegas at Syndicate, and how much he's meant in your life. I saw that he was in Georgia with Murav. He had a big weekend a couple of weekends ago. I'm assuming he'll be there,

right? He'll be coming from Georgia, Tabaku? Yeah, John Woods is already here. He got here a few days ago. He came here directly from Georgia. And yeah, as soon as he touched down, we got right to training. He's a busy man with, you know, with a lot going on, a lot of success. Congrats to Marab. That was, you know, an amazing performance and congrats to John for just all the hard work he's put in. But yeah, he's here and yeah, we're on to the next event. You told a story also on your YouTube channel, which I suggest everyone checks out, about like 10 years ago, seeing John when you were working construction and how you kind of thought that you would maybe not pursue this anymore.

And he convinced you to come to the gym and work with him and that you're too talented to stop fighting now. Who was that guy 10 years ago? And were you done, almost done with MMA working construction at that point? You know it was actually the very beginning of my pro career so I really I wasn't done but I didn't really know what was ahead of me. I had I think you know maybe one or two fights in the RFA at the time and I just didn't really know what was possible.

Or I was just I think I was just too young and green to know what it took to get to where I'm at today. And so John was just that guy who, you know, who was able to kind of guide me in the right path to to show me what was possible. So yeah, I was very green, very new. And yeah, I was working construction because it was putting food on the table. And it seemed like the safe and the secure route to go at the time until John told me like, yeah, it's going to take sacrifice, but you know, John told me like, yeah, it's gonna take sacrifice, but you know, you're you've got too much, you know, talent and and skill to to just give it up this early. And so I'm definitely grateful for that. That young man, would he have ever believed the story would play out like this?

You know, I don't think in I don't think he would have fully believed, you know, I think at the time I, you know, I think, you know, when you're young and you want something and like, you know, I want this, I want this new car, I want this, but you don't really realize, and you might imagine it, but you don't really realize the work that it takes to get there. So I could have imagined it, but I would have never imagined the road and how hard, how hard and how hard it would have taken to get here. But now it kind of feels like it's all like it's really all coming together for you main event after main event, title fights, title contention. It does sort of feel like the stars are aligning, no? Yeah, yeah I think that the stars are aligning. I've been through what I feel like I've been through the fire, you know, in my career,

just getting into the UFC pretty early, you know, having to go through, you know, just different types of losses, different types of challenges. So I feel like I'm at a point now where I understand what it takes. I understand the game. And yeah, now I'm just I'm locked in. So yeah, things things are aligning. But I think it's all because of the journey. We talked about John, obviously being a big part of your team.

You've recently started training with Marcus Buchaca, who's a legend from the world of BJJ. Was that right after the Pereira fight? And because of stuff you experienced in the Pereira fight, and how did it all come about? Yeah, I started training with Marcus after the Pereira fight. I'd say sometime around March of this year. We have mutual friends and sponsors with Santo Studio.

We're building, I don't know if you've seen that, but Santo Studio, we're building, I don't know if you've seen that, but Santo Studio, we're building just an incredible team of athletes, not only in MMA and Jiu-Jitsu, but motocross, surfing, skateboarding. We've got just an incredible team of people behind this brand. And Buccecce just is one of our Jiu-Jitsu athletes. So with that being said, we, we linked up, we joined, we joined forces and, you know, I was helping him with some striking stuff. He was helping me with some grappling stuff. And I think it wasn't for anything, you know, that I experienced in the Alex fight, particularly, it was just more just knowing like, as I continue to climb this mountain of getting

to the belt, I'm just going to have to be prepared and in the best way possible and in all areas. And, uh, I was just blessed enough to be able to cross paths with which Etch and, and, and get in, you know, some sessions with him and, and learn from him and Leo Vera and Bernardo Tablaro and just Jansen Gomez who just, you know, killed it in, uh, in the IBJJF world. So yeah, I just, for some reason, yeah, the star of the line there. And I got to start to train with some, some high level grapplers. When you found out that Jamal couldn't fight on the 26th of April,

was there ever any talk of just having a replacement opponent and staying on that date? No, I, uh, I don't think that anybody was available from what I remember hearing from the UFC. I think everybody was pretty much booked. Yeah, and that was pretty much it. So yeah, the postponement was the only option. To the best of my knowledge, you were ready to go, right? Yeah, yeah, always.

So how did you, I mean, that was, I remember it was like early April when we got word and then they put in Gary and Pratchett. So you're pretty damn close to fighting at that point. What did you do to take your foot off the gas so that you don't peak, you know, two months early? And yeah, I just kind of switched back to, how do I say it? Like, I mean, that's the term that I use. I just, you know, kind of took my foot off the gas a little bit. But I just went back to some learning and brushing up on some stuff that, you know, that I wanted to practice. And yeah, just kind of did my best to dial down the intensity but but

remains you know remain learning remain active Jamal you know he he's outspoken he has a YouTube channel some guys he's got a good relationship with that he fights some maybe not so much him and Pereira went back and forth him and Yuri went back and forth what is your relationship like with him? We actually don't have a relationship. There's not too much dialogue. Yeah, there's nothing really there. Okay. You know, from my perspective. There's no good blood, there's no bad blood, there's just nonexistent blood. Yeah, from my perspective, yeah. Okay. Your thoughts on him as a challenge, based on the skill set that you see from him, what do you think?

Yeah, I mean, man, former champion, you know, I think that says enough. Former champion, so I feel like it's just the time for me to, you know, really go in there and do my best against a former champion. You don't get that, you know, you don't get that title with, you know, without having skill and experience to back it up. So I've done everything that I can to be prepared for this one. Have you or your team been told you win this fight?

You're right back in the title picture? Is that, what is at stake here, especially if Magomed wins? You know, there's not too much, there hasn't been too much talk. I mean, there's been talks of, you know, what we'd like after this. And I think that the UFC, you know,

they have their own ideas and thoughts on what they would want. Um, but I, I, my plan is to, you know, put on a performance that, you know, makes a title shot again, undeniable, if that makes any sense. You said what you, what you'd want, you sort of expressed that. What do you want? Like, is it, is it clear that you will, you will you will if you get a great performance you will ask for a title shot yeah I'm definitely sure that uh that I'm ready to be a champion and I'm ready to be the champion and everything that I'm working on and doing

is to be prepared for that again and so so, yeah, that's, that's absolutely what, what I want and what I'm, what I'm gunning for. So my plan is to put on, yeah, an undeniable performance so that I can get that chance again. I know a few things have to happen, but is the dream that Alex, you know, gets the belt back and that you can beat him to become champion? You know, to be honest, I really don't. I don't really care who the champion is until it until it's me. I get it. To be honest, like, yeah, yeah, I think that that would be a great fight.

I'm sure that people would want to see, you know, a second fight between us for the belt again. You know, that's like, I think that would be exciting. But it's nothing that I'm like, you know, hoping for. Yeah, whoever has it, I'm doing whatever I can to prepare to fight whoever has it. So, yeah. I saw that you framed your gear from, from that fight. Do you usually do that after your fights or was it just that one?

No, just that one. Um, I think to me, it was just, it was, that was just a reminder for me. Like I, that was a big fight for me. Um, and it was my first fight and my first time fighting for a belt and it was an amazing fight and I knew that I gave, I gave my, time fighting for a belt. And it was an amazing fight. And I knew that I gave my all in that fight. And it's one that I never wanted to forget. And even though I didn't get the result,

I think that I got other results. Like I grew inside from that fight. And so that's something that I just, you know, I just wanted as a memory and something that, you know, when my time's up, hopefully I can pass to my children or leave to somebody in my family or, you know, I just felt like that was something that was worth framing.

I love the idea of you growing after the fight and you're always very thoughtful when it comes to your performances. How do you think you grew? How do you think you're a different person this time around, the guy that we're seeing now? Well I think I was able to see, like I was, I saw how far I was willing to go. You know, like I was really tested like to the very end in that fight. And, um, yeah, I just, I went, I went as far as I possibly could. And in my mind, I enjoyed the whole thing. I enjoyed it all the way through.

And, um, and it was just something that I remember. I, you know, I gave my absolute all in that fight. And so I got to experience what that feels like. And I think that it just, it helped me just grow and not necessarily be afraid of the fire, for lack of better words. Like I've been through the fire and although I didn't make it out victorious,

like I've been there and I felt that, I felt it. And so I think that it it out victorious like I've been there and I felt that I felt it and so Um, I think that it it toughened me up a bit. Have you ever felt that after a fight? Um, I mean I not that I can really remember if I sat here and and really like dove internally and and tried to remember Then I probably could but nothing no fight stands out to me like that one does as far as having to go into deep waters. Okay, and just a couple more and then I'll let you go again.

Thank you for the time. I know it's late over there. Can I ask about Cooper? You posted about your dog. I'm sorry, I'm trying to hear that. So, if people who keep up with me or follow me know that, uh, my coach Lorenzo has been in my corner for a really long time, uh, probably over 10 years and Cooper is Lorenzo's dog and Preston in the back with the, with the

sleeveless shirt. Um, that's Lorenzo's son who's like a brother to me. And so Cooper was a part of the family. He, he went through, he's been almost every training camp with me for the past 10 years. You know, he has run mountains. He was 15 years old. He's done it all. Um, he was just like the community, uh, you know, the community guy, everybody who, you know, who came in contact with Cooper,

had a relationship with him and loved him. So it was my coach Lorenzo's dog, but it was just a family dog, man. He was the community dog and 15 years old. And it was just, it was just his time age got to him, but it was a tough one because, you know, because he was always a part of my camps and I saw him literally every single day. It's just one of those weird things, like, you know, because he was always a part of my camps and I saw him literally every single day.

It's just one of those weird things like, you know, just relationship with dogs. And as I saw he was getting older, I was like, man, you got to stick around. Like, I'm, I'm gonna bring you the belt back, Coop. Like, I'm gonna bring the belt back home for us, you know, just, you know, just some people may call it weird, but I just, you know, that was my relationship with the dog. And that was, you know, that was, you know, that was kind of my, uh, my promise to him. So, um, he was there, you know, through this, through this fight camp and right towards the end is, is when, uh, he, he passed. So definitely have him in my heart. Uh, lost two, two close like family dogs

within a week of each other. So my heart goes out to, you know, my coach and to my closest friend, Pat and Andrea who lost their dog. So, you know, it's just, yeah, it's tough, but you know, I stay strong for them and I keep them with me for sure. I'm sorry to hear that. There's, as you know, and not to go too deep into it,

but there's a little unrest in that region right now. Are there any sort of precautions, issues, security concerns or anything like that that you've had to deal with? Yeah, very unfortunate, you know, what's happening in these regions for sure. But thankfully, we in this like in Baku, there's, there's no unrest, there's no, you know, we really wouldn't be able to tell that there was anything going on if it weren't for the news. So we're, you know, we're, we're definitely blessed to not be affected by it here. Glad to hear that.

Final question, how do you foresee this playing out on Saturday? From what you envision, you've had a lot of time to think about this fight because you were supposed to fight two months ago. What are you feeling right now? Oh man, so I'm feeling very happy. I'm feeling very confident.

I definitely foresee me victorious in this fight. There's no doubt about it. And, you know, as far as how it's gonna happen, it can happen many different ways, but all in all, I'm prepared and I'm confident that I'm gonna come out with the W for sure. Love it. Love that you're back. Congratulations on a great stretch for you again on the amazing fight. But now we turn the page and we look forward to this one on Saturday. Very much looking forward to it.

Good luck to you and really appreciate the time. Thank you so much Khalil. It really means a lot. Thank you. Thank you man. I appreciate it. All the best to you. Yes, sir. Yeah. Good luck. There he is. One of the best light heavyweights in the world. Always the best to you. Yes, sir. Good luck. There he is. One of the best light heavyweights in the world, always entertaining, always produces. And you'll recall when they announced that fight against Jamal for April of this past

year, I was super pumped about it. Love the fight. Love the fight on paper. And they're getting a great one in their very first trip to Baku. So if you're in the area and that video of him, the YouTube channel is really great. The production is great. The videos are great great and you see that video that we showed like when he walked into that arena he was getting really emotional. It's a very cool arena to have the F1 in Baku now. Again as he said and I'll be honest when someone told me about, I think it was

when I heard about Horiguchi's return and they said it's happening in Baku and I was like what? The UFC is going to Azerbaijan What like it not not exactly a place that you often hear being discussed for? UFC events but it is it is growing and There's a there's a growing fan base and a growing Faction of fighters coming out of there and they love their martial arts, so why not? And another one of those who are obviously

paying for the UFC to come, and that's a byproduct of the UFC's success these days. They're gonna go to regions, to cities, to countries that are gonna pay the site fee, so why the hell not? We'll talk more about that card, obviously, throughout the week. I had to kind of get into the interview because he was waiting. So usually in the first hour we'll talk about the weekend

that was. Don't worry, that will happen in the second hour. In about five minutes we're going to be joined by Deontay Wilder, who is one of the greatest heavyweights of the past, I don't know, decade plus. He's returning on June 27th. But a quick recap of UFC Atlanta, which came and went. It was highlighted by the return of Kamaru Usman, his first fight in almost two years, his first win in almost four years. To be exact, his first win since a November 2021 win over Colby Covington. And that's notable because the guy he was facing, Joaquin Buckley, was coming off a win over Colby Covington and perhaps, you know, like a sort of like a step up win for him. Like that was the win I think in December that people said, all right, Buckley is a player.

Buckley is legit. Look what he just did to Colby Covington, a former welterweight title contender. Well, Usman went in there, five rounds, and dominated. It was somewhat vintage Usman. And it was the type of performance that I think he needed, obviously, to break the losing streak, but also just to sort of remind him and the rest of the sport, as the great Roy Jones once said, y'all must have forgot, I'm still here, I'm still a force, I'm still a guy. He was very emotional afterwards. as the great Roy Jones once said, y'all must have forgot, I'm still here, I'm still a force, I'm still a guy. He was very emotional afterwards. You may have seen in the

Post Fight press conference, he was very emotional. Was choked up a few times. Some nice stuff from Mooseman, here he is on Saturday night. That you were able to pull off a performance like this and remind people just how great you are at this spot. about you. I swear because I'm a fucking girl dad. Damn it. This one, it's hard. I mean, it's been a while since, not just with getting back in here, but obviously getting

in the win column. I battled with a lot of things just to get here. Just repairing my body, just physically, personally, a lot of things that I had to just kind of, I guess expression would be fight a lot of demons just to get back in here but uh yeah a lot that I had to go through but thankfully I'm blessed with a great team great support system great family and I'm back here, so I just want to recognize them. I want to recognize my family, my mom, dad, brothers, sister, T-Baby, Sammy Lulup, Zena Baby, I love you guys, my coaches, Henry, Trevor, George, Ben, teammates, Justin, Archie, all these guys. So there you see, very emotional. He was also very emotional in the in the cage and the post-fight

interview as well. A big win for him, an important win for him. He was asked about fighting Bala Muhammad. There seems to be a thing, I don't know, I feel like their whole feud is a little bit of a work, same management team, I feel like they're friends, I don't know. But he was asked about Bilal who tweeted right after the win, congrats, see you soon. This is what Kamaru had to say. I have to ask you, I know, I think I know what you're even going to say, but Balor Muhammad quickly tweeted, see you soon. I know your eyes are on a title fight, but if the UFC comes to you, that's also a pretty

big fight for former champ, a lot of backstory. Is that something you would entertain if the UFC came to you about it? Who was it? Balor Muhammad. Who was it? Former welterweight champion, Balor Mohammed. Who's that? Former welterweight champion, Balal Mohammed. Next. I forgot it.

Next. Work or shoot, I don't know. The guy that made you cry on your podcast, I don't know. It feels like a word. But maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm a cynic. My highlight of the entire weekend was seeing Francis Ngannou back in the mix at a UFC event. Not fighting, hasn't signed, but look at him up there rocking the Venom gear with his boy, Kamaru. Loved that. Seeing him accompany him at the ceremonials and then backstage.

Great to see Francis. Izzy obviously not there, but two-thirds. He's back. No, it was great. It was, but two-thirds of the three kings. Izzy's video about the fight was pretty funny. Him talking about Buckley was pretty funny. I think Buckley has even responded to him. But Buckley seemed to take it all in stride. He seemed to be in great spirits, posting on social media afterwards afterwards feeling good. I think Sort of insinuating that he thought that you know He did better than other people thought and that he could have gone the I think he was talking about the fifth round in any event It's not a huge setback for Joaquin Buckley

Obviously with the welterweight division being so competitive right now You got to stay on a winning streak. You've got the like, Proches has now taken a step back because he lost. Buckley takes a step back because he lost. Ian's forward, Brady is forward. I think most people would consider them to be the next two. I did see Henry Tsuhito say on his podcast that he thinks JDM versus Issam will fight in Abu Dhabi. I mean, I think that's everyone's guess. He got the date wrong, but I think everyone thinks that Islam will fight in Abu Dhabi. There was always some deal that that Khabib had to fight there, and when Khabib left,

it was going to be Islam. So yeah, I think that's a good guess. Let's get Sean and Ian in there. By the way, wouldn't hate Joaquin in Proches as a next top contender fight. I think that would make a lot of sense as well. So you know, things have to evolve, things have to sort of move on at 170, which I maintain is one of the most interesting weight classes, if not the most interesting weight class in the UFC. And now all of a sudden, who would have thought, I think most people thought, okay, Buckley gets by Usman, and now he's very much in the mix. Here's Kamar Usman still out there. I think the most interesting question right now 170 is What does happen to Usman? Where does he go from here? And so we'll talk about that with the

the gents When we reconvene to talk about all this in the second hour Rosadam Eunice got back on track She had a hard-fought win over Miranda Maverick who revealed afterwards that she tore her ACL early in the fight. These two used to train together and here's Rose still doing that damn thing. Still winning, still fighting, still a very, very tough out And so that was great to see. Congratulations to her. She'll actually join us on the show tomorrow to talk about this win. I'm looking forward to that. Edmund Shabazzian versus Andre Petrosky.

Wasn't necessarily one for the highlight reel, but a hard-fought win for Shabazzian. Haoni Barcellos beat Cody Garbrand. It was looking like a great start for Cody. New look and all. The cornrows, the eye tattoo. But then towards the end, it got a little bit tougher. But Cody's still such a big name and, you know, he's not getting knocked out or anything like like that I don't think that's the last we've we've seen of him but barcelos gets to win Mansour Abdul Malik beat Cody Brundage via decision as well. Alonzo Menafield beat Omar Sivie a decision. Paul Craig versus Hidalgo Bellato was a very weird one. The fight ended in a no contest due to an illegal kick off his back. I think a

lot of people thought Bellotto flopped in that moment. There was, I mean even that right there looks a little bit exaggerated and the way he fell just seemed a little bit suspect. Craig saying afterwards that he felt it was suspect. Chris Weidman tweeting, what the heck was that? Was that a legit flop in the UFC? Moicano, bro? WTF? He fell looking to the referee and then was out. Angela Hill. Am I crazy for thinking he faked this? How do you look at the judge and complain on the way to being KO'd? It was weird. Michael Keese, who'll be joining us at the end of the show, he had a hard-fought win over Court McGee. That was sort of the theme of the night, hard-fought wins, but Malcolm Wellmaker, from the walkout to him fighting in his home state of Georgia to the knockout over Chris Moutinho,

to him fighting in his home state of Georgia, to the knockout over Chris Mutino, a sequence that he clearly was working on. He faked the kick. First, he lands the body kick. So Mutino's thinking about it, thinking about it, fakes the kick after landing the body kick, and then knocks him out with the most beautiful, the most precise right hook that you'll ever see.

I mean, the thing, it sounds like a firecracker going off, but just the technique, the way he throws the punch, the way he set it up, was nothing short of amazing. It really was. And he is an absolute stud and someone that you need to pay attention to. Now, 10-0 in his pro career, 2 and 0 in the UFC, two first round knockouts, both of them via right hook, and oh by the way, a win on Contender Series by right hook. He's the second coming of Paul Daly except it's the other hand. Unbelievable. I can't wait to talk to him for the first time. He was on The Boys in the Back Unbelievable. I can't wait to talk to him for the first time. He was on The Boys in the Back a couple months ago and he was tremendous after his debut. And this fight only came together

very, very recently. Jose Ochoa with the win over Cody Durden. Knockout win for him. Ricky Simone gets the win as well. Phil Rowe had an incredible victory and we'll have him on the show tomorrow. I'm looking forward to that. He was emotional afterwards as well. And shout out to Canada's Jamie Lynn Horth, who picked up the unanimous decision win over Vanessa Demopoulos. Saturday was a busy night in combat sports. Over at the theater at Madison Square Garden, there was a great one between Richardson Hitchens and George Kambosas, maybe Kambosas's last sort of big one and a homecoming of sorts for Hitchens. Hitchens was

phenomenal. There you see him dropping Kambosas, the pride of Australia who does a great job selling fights, great job promoting fights, but he went to the body, he boxed beautifully, and that was all she wrote. Afterwards, Hitchens, who's quite the character, got on the microphone and may have irked his promoter Eddie Hearn, he did announce that he was going to be a free agent, but he also had a great call out of one Devin Haney take a look. I mean that is that is Chilson and Fuck Devin Haney and Bill Haney! Pussies! New York, stand up baby, we here baby! I mean that is, that is Chael Sonnen Anderson Silva-esque. Here's Haney responding, we could get it at 147. Alright.

A lot of people want to fight Devin Haney right now. Glory had their 100th event, shout out to Rico Verhoeven winning in the main event. Of course he did, That's all he does. He wins. And he was headlining their centennial event, a victory over Artem Vakitov. See some of the action here, courtesy of our friends at Dazon. Vakitov, of course, with the win over Alex Pereira. A Contender Series win. Chose to say no to the Contender Series UFC contract and fight this fight. We'll see if he sticks around. Not a typical heavyweight, so you could see the size difference there.

But shout out to Rico Verhoeven for the win. Shout out to Phil DeFries. All he does is win as well. He is on an incredible run and he won on KSW. So you had two of the most successful and decorated heavyweights fighting outside of a major MMA slash major boxing promotion doing their thing on Saturday afternoon. What was that now for Phil DeFries? Like 10 in a row, 11 in a row, something crazy.

Look at that, one, two, three, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 in a row for this guy. Americana choke on Saturday. The great PT Carroll wrote a great story on Phil DeFries, who's part of that amazing team, led by the great Tom Aspinall. There it is. Phil DeFries, the silent reign of MMA's most dominant heavyweight champion ever, up right now on Uncrowned.com. So it was kind of cool to see these two guys who don't get maybe the same type of attention as the

the John Joneses or the Tyson Furies or the Anthony Joshuas of the world, fighting at almost the exact same time on Saturday afternoon. PFL was back on Thursday, late, late show, and it was highlighted by Thad Gene picking up a big win in advancing to the finals. He picked up the win over Jason Jackson in their welterweight tournament. So shout out to the pride of Haiti. Oh, by the way, Dirty Boxing had another event on Saturday and Jairzinho Rosenstreich was making his debut,

his first fight since he left the UFC. Some tremendous action here from Biggie Boy. Yes, the Pride of Suriname. You see the Suriname flag right there? I gotta say dirty boxing. The production is very nice. I like the look. You know, obviously they're not fighting in arenas per se, but there's something sort of down and dirty about it all. Warehouse, smoker vibe, old old school vibe. I like it.

Shout out to biggie boy. Uh, perhaps the, uh, the best strike thrown all weekend, uh, actually happened at city field. I don't know if you guys saw this, but, uh, Tiffy time WWE champion Tiffany Stratton was on display on the mound with one of the all-time great ceremonial first pitches. I mean, you really have to do something special to throw it like that. The best part was she yelled Tiffy Time right before throwing it, so she leaned into the gimmick and then almost knocked out the cameraman.

I mean, look at that. Shout out to the cameraman, by the way, and the cameraman. I mean, look at that. Shout out to the cameraman, by the way, and the photographers. Unflappable in the face of that deadly strike. That one definitely up there with the likes of Connor, 50 Cent, there have been some bad ones. But did any of those come on and say, it's tiffy time?

No, we almost have to play the full audio to enjoy the grandeur of it all. Here it is, here it is. It's tiffy time. No, we almost have to play the full audio to enjoy the grandeur of it all. Here it is, here it is. Oh by the way, in case you were wondering, we we had a young man an 18 year old named Adam Maka in studio on Wednesday I know a lot of you were unfamiliar with him he was making his pro debut at the theater on Saturday he talked a big game well this is how he looked in his pro debut yeah not too bad. Second round, TKO win. For the pride of the UK and Albania. He said afterwards that, well, actually he said before the fight in our studio

that he could beat Naoya in a way right now. Right now, he said. I'm Alpha. I don't know about that. But got to get him with with our boy Action Bronson representing Albania. Well I mean not bad not bad for your debut. Not bad for your debut. In a couple of moments we're gonna be joined by Deontay Wilder. So stay tuned for that.

Sugashano Malley is going to join us at 3 o'clock. Malcolm Wellmaker is going to join us at 3.30 and then we'll round out the day with one, Michael Chiesa. In case you were wondering what the real highlight of UFC Atlanta was, it was in fact that our own GC was in attendance. Actually there was a huge uncrowned contingency that was in attendance at the State Farm Arena and I saw on social media, GC's seats were phenomenal.

How did you score those? What was that? Section 100? Section 100? Nah, section 216. Did anyone recognize you up there and say like... The guy at the end of the row was like, Oh, what's up GC?

What strip club are you going to for fight feasts after this? Oh, wow. Yeah, it was tight. I can't lie. It's tight up there. Like you're squished in there and there's not much room in between each seat. It was tight. $229 a person to get in there. It was expensive, man. between each seat, it was tight. $229 a person to get in there.

It was expensive, man. Is section 200 the top or is there a 300? Nah, it's the top. Damn. Yeah, I was up there. Was it full? I was even with the Jumbotron. Yeah, it was a sold out crowd.

The crowd was into it. They definitely let the fighters know, especially on that main card with all the decisions that they were not happy with the performance. The guy next to me a couple seats down was pissed. I mean, so during the main event, it essentially got to the point where Usman was just taking him down every round and then just mauling him.

Probably about halfway through the third round, you would have thought it was like a blowout basketball game. People just started heading to the exits. People just flowing out. Serious? Yeah, for the last like two and a half rounds of the fight, man, and the dude next to me left during the fourth round and he was like, man, this is bullshit.

I paid $300 to be here. This is the card I get. Like this sucks. And he stormed out. Wow. Did you storm out? No, no. You stayed till the end. I stayed all the way through Usman's speech.

Like it wasn't the most exciting fight. I will admit that he was essentially doing what he wanted to especially through the course of the first four rounds. But no, I thought it was cool to see Usman put on a vintage performance. I thought the speech was great. Card overall, not great. My-

You're on a tough streak right now. I've had two main events end in injury, the Manon Firo, Aaron Blanchfield card, and now this one, all six fights, technically going to a decision. We got a no contest in there ahead, but the Malcolm Wellmaker was the highlight of the night. Oh my god. Walking out to Oh Let's Do It by Waka Flock. So explain to us like why, because I heard him talk about it and I

know he's from Atlanta, right? But like is this like a theme? Is this an anthem? Why is it such a big deal? I mean it's a famous song. Waka Flock is just known for making hype music. I mean it's kind of past his time now. He was like a theme? Is this an anthem? Why is it such a big deal? I mean, it's a famous song. Waka Flocka is just known for making hype music. I mean, it's kind of past his time now. He was like a mid 2010s dude. But yeah, it was just, everyone was turning up in the crowd, getting hyped, and everyone in the crowd recognized it. And he came out like bopping.

He was jumping and high-fiving everyone. It was sick. And then to put on a finish like that, that was definitely the peak of where the crowd got. Did you feel like they knew who he was? Cause he's an Atlanta guy, but he's only had one fight in the, excuse me, Augusta guy. How far is Augusta from Atlanta by the way?

It's like two and a half hours. Okay, so relatively close. Yeah, I think some people knew who he was. I think him walking out to Waka Flocka was enough to get the crowd on his side. And then when you get a finish like that, then everybody was hyped for him. Was he the only local guy?

Cody Durden, also from the Repsialana area, unfortunately wasn't able to get the dub. And then Joaquin Buckley, when he did walk out, he did like a whole mix tape of Atlanta music, which got the crowd pretty hyped, like six different songs mixed together. Was he the fan favorite because of that? He was until Usman got that first take down,

and then the whole crowd started chanting Usman. That is kind of funny. Yeah, people were hyped for him. And so like overall, because you know we talk a lot about okay the UFC is killing it, well I say that because of the gates and the money and stuff like that, but if you let's just say you were a regular dude, you saved up for this, this is your big night out. This is the, like, are you thinking twice now because of the experience? I'm thinking twice as someone who's a diehard fan

of the sport. That's probably the last fight night I'm gonna go to. I'll go to a pay-per-view, but man, the amount of money that it costs, $229, just to get upper deck tickets, and then the entertainment value that I got from it. Yeah, it's just like, I'd rather just sit there and watch this on TV, be able to go to the bathroom

whenever I wanted to, food, snacks right there. Yeah, I was with four other people that aren't really into the sport and a couple of them were like, man, I had a good time, you know, spending time with the boys, but I think I'm gonna pass next time. Next time they come to Atlanta.

So yeah, I mean, it's sad to see like the pricing out and like the UFC always celebrating, you know, record gates, everything like that. I would hope that eventually the prices come down, but I know they're not going to because people pay for them. They sell out everywhere they go. And by the way, was that like secondhand or? It was secondhand, but those were like,

that was like the lower end. Because we had five people, so like to get five seats together, you would have had to pay like 400 a piece to go lower bowl. Damn, all right, well we'll talk more about the results and where the notable winners go from here in a bit. But for now, let us turn our attention to our next guest.

Do we have him, is he ready to go? Oh yeah. Okay. He is one of the most popular, one of the most celebrated, one of the most exciting heavyweights of the past decade plus. He returns to action in 11 days time, June 27th in Wichita, Kansas.

It's going to be airing on BLK Prime Video and he'll be going up against Tyrell Herndon It's a big comeback fight for the man They call the bronze bomber and that means that the bomb squad is in the house Let us say hello to the one and only Deontay Wilder who is kind enough to join us. Hello, sir. How are you? I'm doing well and yourself. I'm doing great. Thanks for joining us. I really appreciate it Very excited to see you back in action. In fact, it's been now officially a little over a year since we last saw you. And so can I ask what's the difference between this Deontay that we're

talking to today and the one that we saw in June of 24 in Riyadh? I mean, this Deontay, why he more at peace, you know, mentally, physically and emotionally, at peace, you know, mentally, physically and emotionally. You know, a lot of things that I was doing, I did for others, you know, I was selfless. I took care of a lot of people, you know, and you know, you're going to do so much for so many people and in certain times you can do it for a certain length of time, really not appreciative. You know what I mean? And, but you don't really understand anything until time passed and to situations happen and you start lingering around and you start noticing certain things

and you start understanding things. And then you realize it's time to let certain things go. At this moment in time, I'm selfish. I've many times in my life I was selfless. This point in time I'm selfish. And it's all about me at this point. It's all about me, it's all about me having fun and going then and just having a great time, you know?

And that's the difference, you know? I feel more free. When you do it for yourself, you ain't and that's the difference. You know, I feel more free when you do it for yourself. You ain't worried about letting no one down. You ain't worried about, you know, making mistakes. You ain't worried about anything, you know, when you do it for self is all about you yourself. And if you do make mistakes, if anything do happen, then, you know, it's all,

it's all on you, you go back and you sit back and you decide if you want to continue to do something or not, or you continue to go on, or what makes you happy, what's not. And that's the big difference. It's just like I'm sitting out now and feeling this breeze. And that's how I'm feeling with everything overall.

Picture of everything, even with life. I feel like a breeze now. You know what I mean? Wow. What was the turning point? Like how did you get to this point? A lot of betrayal. You know what I mean? So that's interesting.

And if you don't know nothing about betrayal then. I don't mean to interrupt you because I saw that in an interview that you did with TMZ, you used that same word. You said with the betrayal that I have in my heart right now, like I am coming, you know, I've got betrayal in my heart. So what do you mean when you talk about that and how does that translate into being a good fighter?

This is a lot of interview right now, baby. I'll be the enemy, okay? Be the enemy, okay, mama? Oh, you got everyone there. All my daughters. Yeah, how many you have? I have seven children. Wow.

That's a handful, man. Happy Father's Day. When you say happy Father's Day, it's a big happy Father's Day. Yeah, that's incredible. But I enjoy it though. I enjoy it, I love it all. You know, this is who I work for,

this is who I live for, you know. And there's no greater feeling than being someone's father. You know, I tell people all the time, especially men, that we are so important. Now don't get me wrong, the mothers, females, they are very important. Nine years, nine months or less that they get to carry the baby.

But when that baby come out, it's daddy time. And I always consider myself daddy goose, because I'm here to share, to protect, to comfort and provide for my children. When I know they're with me, they have everything that they need. Even over love, they're over love when they with daddy. So, you know.

Respect. Can we go back to that word betrayal? Yeah. So when you say that you have that in your heart and that's what the turning point is How does that translate into being a fighter? I? Mean once if you know what is if one have dealt with betrayal you you you You understand the feeling of it you understand the pain that comes behind it You understand the feeling of it. You understand the pain that comes behind it

especially when you'd have done stuff for for so many people you done took people to places where they never would have Been without you in their lives or present at any given time and then when they betray you it's like a It's like a dagger in your heart. I tell people it's 10 times worse than a heartbreak. But for me, it's just been a domino effect year after year after year. It's like an orange. People are squeezing until they feel like all the juice is out of you. And then when all the juice out of you, they'll throw away the hull.

But the saying is, another, the saying is for one man trash is another man's treasure. And if you understand anything about oranges and hulls and different things that you can use to cook, you know that the hull, you don't throw it away because it can become edible. You can still use cook, you know, that the hull, you don't throw it away because it can become edible. You can still use it, you know? And it's like they threw away the hull,

but for me, I collected myself and gathered myself and refreshing myself, you know? And got rid of a lot of the different things, you know? I can't go in too much of details of a lot of things because it makes me go down memory, memorandum, a lot of things. Give me a lot of PTSD or some other things. It got so bad for me that I had to get a sports psychologist.

Oh wow. But it really helped me out in many ways. It allowed me to put a lot of things on the shelf where we would describe it. And these things are on the shelf and the result comes to who I am right now. I'm still here to be able to smile, to be able to talk, be able to have good health, be able to have a great sense of humor, life and all things around me. It didn't still take me back. It didn't still take back the fact that I still help out people, but I'm cautious. I'm laid back even more so than ever now and I'm more protected than I have ever been because

when you do certain things for certain people and you realize that it all went in vain, that it really wasn't worth it all this time and it was just trying to hold on to your cold tail until a certain point in time and then it don't go as planned like you see when everybody benefit from you and you don't benefit zero from them and also it's a terrible feeling, you know what I mean? It makes you unfocused. I mean, it makes you, it makes a lot of things, you know. I'm not here to sit, I'm not here to to really just explain everything but understand that I'm in a different space, a different place in my life. I'm just free, man. I'm just free. There's a lot of things I can say,

but I've always told my trainers as we work hard, as we put in over 450-something rounds in, as I've told my manager many times throughout the day how I feel mentally, physically, emotionally, I can say what I want, but my action is gonna be the proof in the play. And it's gonna be that, many times I have said things to try to convince myself in the moment of time

that I would be okay, it's gonna be all right. I got all this weeks of training left. I'll be able to get myself a little bit meaner. I'll be able to get myself a little bit fitter. And then when it's time to go out on that grand opening, that grand night of that day of that fight, that I'll be ready to go. But that's just all of me convincing myself at the moment in time, while on the other side, I got a deep dark presence that's over me, that's trying to kill me, bro. It's trying to get rid of me. We all have things going on in life,

no matter who you are in life. But once you accept it and understand it, you have to understand it first and then accept it and then apply it to be able to get the help that you need and then so forth and so on. As men, we are the most stubborn of it all because we feel like we don't need certain things, we don't need help, we can figure it out.

We shouldn't cry, cry show weakness and all that. But the concept of everything is all wrong. And that's why we why we mostly as men have the most problems in the world than anyone. Because we because of our toughness, because of our pride. And I always told myself many times and to others that knows me around them, I probably would probably be the one to get me killed out of anything. You know, but I'm happy to say that I'm a different person at this moment in time, mentally, physically, emotionally, you know, and I'm ready to go, you know,

I'm in a happy, happy, happy place. And yeah, man. I love that. It's all to explain. I get it, I get it. It's all to explain, there's so much I can say, but I only go say what my heart is wanting me to lead to. And if you understand and you understand, I always buy by the saying what's understood

don't have to be explained. That's why I've always enjoyed watching and listening to your interviews because you're not afraid to speak from the heart. And so we appreciate this very much. You mentioned the sports psychologist. Was this the first time that you've worked with one and how long ago did that start? Yeah, yeah, this has this the first time that you've worked with one and how long ago did that start? Yeah, this has been the first time this first time that I

Had to deal with a sports psychologist, you know, and I've been with him like over a year now Dr. Kirk Jones one of the best in the world and Yeah, we've been going it's like like my father, man, he's like my, all of my brother, my father, like everything in one, my protector, you know what I'm saying? He's just, you know, it's been incredible being with him, working with him, you know, get my mind right because we just, you know, in life, we don't understand who's going through what, what's going through, you know, mental health is a huge issue. It's a big deal And um a lot of people are coming up about different things and stuff and i'm you know over the years it has been

And i'm glad that this is a top subject now in the world because we all deal with a lot of shit You know, I mean Even from birth, you know, I mean just growing up in certain situations Certain times in life seeing certain things Man, I should have get your PTSD for show and then when you get in the environment of certain type of sort No matter how successful you have been in life When you go back and you see certain things that shit go back down memory lane, bro And if you ain't settled with the situation or you ain't handling the problem, it's gonna bloom back up. It's gonna loom back up and it's

gonna be active in your life current today because in the past it was active but you didn't handle it. So it's like, I ain't going nowhere motherfucker, I'm still here. So when you do get into a situation or a place or an environment that reminds you of a certain thing, it become active again. And, you know, with Dr. Jones, we've done many things. He taught me many things. And I've understand a lot of things that, you know,

that was dealing with what I was dealing with especially with the betrayer and stuff like that just mentally getting myself back together because I really lost confidence in myself and that was kind of hard for me to even say like damn I lost you know I'm saying because I'm the most confident person I know in the world you know and when things start happening to you and you start losing focus, you know in life Then you can't handle you can't do things on your job, you know They always say don't carry don't carry your problems. I was don't carry your problems outside into your workplace, but when it depending on certain things or

Yeah, when it when it's when these certain things sometimes you just can't help it Even though you try to avoid it you try to block it out. You don't want to bring it to the to the place of work Sometimes you just can't help it just there in your head and and most time it be a situation where you like I can't fucking believe this happening to me Not all I've done. All I've done for people is still, it's never enough. And you know, you get a lot of people that successful that understand the structure or go down the same, go down the same tunnel that I'm explaining right now,

you know, and most time is always the ones that close to you. And the ones that close to you most time consider your family or people that you call family, you know, and that'd be the ones that, that hurts you the most because outside strangers can't do that because they're not close enough. So it just bounced off, off, off, off one wall to another. And everyone knows that when it comes to me, that I don't, I'm a homebody. I don't really go to many places.

I sit around, I build on my compound and I've been building for over six years. And this is where I build. I build everything here so I wouldn't have to go nowhere. I like to be out at times, but at times I just like to be alone with my children, enjoying them, teaching them, loving on them, providing for them, and educating them. That's the best part of my life, being able to have so many.

I have seven children, but I'm looking to have seven more. If it was up to me, I have 50. I love being a father. I love being able to educate. And the things that I went through in life, I explained to them. And as they get older, I explained even more. And every age they get, I explain even more

what they didn't understand before. I'm like, wait, when you turn this, I'll explain a little bit more so that you get it. You know, we all want our children to be able to go through life with understanding of all things. And sometimes you're going to miss some things along the way, but that's okay. Because I tell my kids, I prepare you, I give you the tools to succeed in life. And along your journey, you're going to be able to pick up some more tools to put in your backpack.

But long you know the fundamentals of what you need to learn and the things that I pass down to you, you're going to be all right. You're going to make it because they have so much to look forward to. So many things I've done for them with life trust and being able to be up for them. They were in Harris thing. They would have a huge head starting life, one that I've never could imagine in my life But they will and that's the beauty of it all man being able to see a situation A dark situation and in turn and put light on it and make it positive, you know, and um, this is where I am I'm still human at the end of the day

I'm not the one to to to To complain about too much. I just kind of what I have to do and get back out there. I try to be open and honest as possible with society or the way of the world or human beings, whatever one of our people, whoever, however you wanna label them. A lot of people will look at you, look at your situation. The many things that I've said, I tell people, I haven't lied about nothing that I've said.

Anything that I've said has been my truth. And if it's my truth, if it's my truth, then they say the truth will set you free. So that means I sleep good every fucking night because I've bled my truth. Now many times people will take my truth and they are dissecting and they say oh, that's an excuse Well, if them if my truth is your excuse then that's up on you because I've told you the truth Now you can take it and you could dissect it and you could display it in the type of way that you want You can chop it up and you can you can you can come out and make whatever you want But I've told you my truth and you want to make it my your excuse then so be it be happy with it I'm all about happiness in life and

whatever one have to whatever they going through and they have to dissect one one something that one have said and to make it in some type of sense of humor or make laughter out of to be able to go about that day then so be. You know, for me, I revealed the truth and like I said, the truth has set you free. So here I am, once again, getting myself back together and it's not a comeback, it's the return of the king, man. It's not a comeback, it's the return mentally, physically, emotionally. I just feel like a different person at this moment in time because of the burden that

I had to cut loose. You know, God sent me a message that said, I can't let you continue. You can't rise, you can't prevail in this life when you got so many evil entities around you. You have to cut the burdens. It's just like a hot air balloon having weight on it. No matter how much you try to Ignite it with the fire. It ain't going up and you don't understand. I'm like I've been down this road 50 times man Why I can't go no more and you can't see that you got fucking heavy baggage around you

You can't understand it right now You feel trying to and this motherfucker ain't going nowhere. Until you realize that the people that surround the baggage that you're holding, you know, the burden that's that need to be cut is still lingering around. And once you start cutting shit, then it's when you start floating up, you start elevating, you start rising. Because God said, I mean, you let these people ride with you for so long They'd have benefited off you your fruits of your label you risk your life for others entertainment

But everybody want what you have but want to don't want to put the same amount of equal work that you have provided And put in to they just want to benefit from you. And there's no more, you know what I mean? There's no more. But these times that took this for me, I would have never seen a lot of things, still elevating in life, still doing certain things. I would have never seen certain things. So I'm glad God had to show lessons because in lessons come

blessings. But only if you apply knowledge to life to become wise, you'll understand that true meaning of that blessing that have came through this lesson. And here I am now. If we would have talked, Deontay, on June 2nd of last year, so the day after the Zhang fight, would you have believed that you'd still be fighting? Did you think that you would continue? Because everyone was sort of writing, you know, writing your career sort of obituary, for lack of a better word. But did you think like, nah, I'll be back. I just need a bit of time to figure this all out. What were you thinking back

then? Yeah, I mean, I've never thought about giving up, you know what I mean? I never thought about quitting. I never thought about retiring. You know, these are all rumors and stuff and these are the things I be saying. People don't know nothing. You know, most people want to be first and then being correct. You know, we are living in a world today where, you know, you want to put everything out on social media to get clicks and likes to make some money. And whatever that means, whether I have to, you know, whether I don't know the full story. I just know a little bit

I'm gonna make the rest of as I go You know, I hope I can get a good story out You know because I'm one of those guys that I'm not accessible, you know I don't make myself assess by light being at peace. I'm a peaceful man You know, I'm not people don't really see me out in the world like that. You know what I mean? I'm, and you know, everybody have their own thing that they like to do, they like to go,

they like to be around certain people. I don't, I don't really like to go a lot of places. I don't really like to be around a lot of people. I got, I know the right people in this world that I need to know. And I go to, you know, and I, and I travel where I need to, you know what I mean? And, and that's all I need in this world.

I don't need a hundred friends. I don't need to be able to have to travel 50 different places. I don't need much, you know what I mean? As you just seen my babies, as they come out as soldiers one by one, they say daddy. That's a sweet thing is hey daddy, daddy.

They want to talk. But you know, right now they have to wait because I'm handling something. But just to see those faces, man, you know what I mean? They make you get up every day. Like, all right, what's next? It's almost being like a service dog,

being ready to work every time you get up. What's next? You know, I'm like that with my children. You know what I mean? I love providing, I love educating, I love teaching. You know, and when they come and say those sweet words, come off their lips, daddy, it's like I'm ready to go. I'm ready for service, man.

Teonte, when you said a few years back that, I remember when you said this, and I actually on my show, I'd never met you before, but I was sort of defending you because I remember when you said that you wanted to catch a body, when you wanted a body on your resume. And I was like, everyone's kind of, everyone came after you for saying that you shouldn't say that if you're a boxer this is not the right thing to say.

I understood where you were coming from you know the same thing we say I want to go out there and knock out my opponent I want to kill my opponent I didn't take it literally but a lot of people did and I'm only asking that because I'm wondering does that same guy exist do you want that guy to exist anymore or are you a different fighter than the one who said that? Look, look, look, nothing that I say that I don't regret saying. I don't take it back. People got to understand the structure of the business that I'm in. This is not, we don't play, we don't, this is not no sport that we play.

You can't put play on boxing. Because it's not a sport. Now to say boxing is a sport, it's a masking agent to cover up what the real thing, this is a fucking gladiator sport. You gotta have a heart of a line. It's one of, it's a 1%. That's why you don't see many people in this business

because they won't do it. They're scared to do it. That's why you had to put, take your hat off for every fighter that step inside that ring over those ropes or under those ropes because they're the one percent that I get in there that'll do it many people on the outside can talk they can say many things or whatever they want but if I say something and you don't agree with it if I say I wanted to kill him and all that then you just as good as me because your ass pants to see it happen Yeah

Because you don't understand what we have to do what we have to provide mentally physically and mostly and you as you see all my beautiful children that come out, but I Certain points of the time I had to get in the ring. I had to fight I don't know if I'm gonna get out of this motherfucker when I step in it. That's facts. Over 13 fighter dies a year. And it's probably up more than that.

That's just only been reported. How many other fighters, how many other athlete dies in their sport? Because in boxing, we don't play shit. We ain't practicing for nothing. We're training nothing we're training we're training to kill and you got to understand the concept when others on the outside looking in and they look at boxing they got to understand the

structure of what this is so when a man say I want to do this I want to do that then that's just how he feels that's how he get his warrior mentality spirit to pump them so far to get in that fight that night knowing that he can lose his feels. That's how he get his warrior to make some type of sense in your own world, then, you know, go on with yourself. Keep it moving. Don't question what I say. Continue to watch what I say. And hopefully, what I say don't happen.

But at the end of the day, we signed up for this shit. And he trying to do what I'm trying to do to him. I'm just the one that being open and willing to speak my piece to you. then the other person that willing to be they're willing to sit up and Be completely politically correct. I'm not a politically correct type of person and when I die in this world People always remember that that man right there said what was from his heart. He didn't give a fuck He told the truth. He told you how he felt. He told you the realness of it.

And I wish other people would be real with themselves and be real with the things that go around. I ain't got time to be politically correct with people to piece things up to make it seem like it's safe or it's gonna be, oh, we just gonna have a good time and no, I hope no one get hurt man. Fuck that shit This is what we in here for to hurt you This is a different between other sports. This is not a sport. We can't say we play nothing

We don't play no football. We don't play basketball. We don't play baseball. We don't play soccer. We don't play tennis We don't play basketball. We don't play baseball. We don't play soccer. We don't play tennis. Motherfucker, we're practicing. We're training. Understand me? And anything you talking about training,

the military train to kill. Gladiators train to kill. Any other animal in the animal kingdom, they hunting to train to kill. And this business that we're in, we're training. This ain't no practice because we ain't playing. This is training because in this business right here is no play.

Me no play, no games. Understand me? And once other people also understand that, they understand the concept of where I come from or what I mean when I say certain things Not just because I want to kill a man and she like that other than that That's easy to do so if I wanted to kill them by I just go get my gun and shoot somebody That's about the easiest thing I can do but unfortunately

This is a business This is what we do. We train. That's why you ain't having your average mother or father trying to get their son or their daughter to participate in this business that we call boxing, is it? They'd rather for them to go play basketball or go be a doctor or get your education where you can be a business person or get your education where you can be a lawyer or some shit like that people avoid this this this this people avoid this man they avoid trying to be boxers and you know parents getting their kids to be there because this is why here you ain't playing brother bro. You training you training to hurt somebody

Now you you you can butter it up all you want But I like to keep it real with people I don't want them to to be around trying to figure out what he trying to say Well, he don't need to say that what you need to shut the fuck up if you ain't gonna Just pay attention and body fight or go to the fight and see me do what I say I was gonna do because that's all you that's all you don't you just as guilty if it's a sin for me to say that Then you you get to buy association

And that's a simple way I can explain Incredible. Thank you for that and we'll only keep you for a couple more minutes because I know you I know you have a busy day Could I just ask I know I know you've talked, you know, you're hoping to fight at least twice this year, maybe three times. You have Tyrell next, you're not looking past him, June 27th, BLK Prime, Wichita, Kansas. Do you already know who the next fight is? Is that already a done deal? You could say so.

You know, I don't want to talk about it. But I have the other netizens. Can I talk about it, but we got things going on. I don't know the, uh, the opponent yet. It'd be out of the country. Okay. Oh, no, sir. It'd be one of the guys over there in the country that I'm going to which country we had that one day and looking to have one more in December as well.

I gotta make sure I'm right. You know what I mean? I got to make sure that how I feel, how I feel, I got to make sure it's right, you know what I mean? I don't want to, I don't want to coach myself, I don't want to to to hype myself thinking that it's something that is really not. I've been there, done that, that shit didn't work. It's something that is really not I've been there done that That shit didn't work But that's the only thing that I had to try to get myself together to understand what the hell is going on

Because you don't knock 42 fools out and come back in and things start happening It's things start going wrong in a negative way. You don't do it don't happen You know? But uh, man, I'm just glad to be here, bro. I'm just glad to be here to be able to lead by example. The King has returned. Even I go through things in life. I mean, you know, we all go through things. I'm just the one that's not afraid to express myself when I'm going through certain things or To show certain things, you know I mean You just never know who you gonna help may help a lot of people

In the end in the end when it's all said and done and this is the greatness that you provide to your legacy Your legacy, you know, I mean it ain't just about being a a great boxing in the ring to be the greatest of all time dope consider just a Undefeated record or a great being a great fighter To be a legend to be the greatest of all time consider what you do on the inside As well as what you do and provide on the outside You know me and that's as well as what you do and provide on the outside.

You know what I mean? And that's, that's why I wanna be legendary. And not only what I put into work in the inside, but also what I do on the outside, the motivation, the inspiration, the education, the knowledge that I've been able to teach and provide and pass on to so many more or so many others that may be going through the same situations, maybe in a different situation

But it's a similar situation and they may not know how to have gotten out of that But listen it to me and like damn I didn't think about that. Oh, wow Maybe I should be real with myself And not worry about what others may think or may say about me because we live in a society where people are always Worried about what people gonna say or what they think about them But I give a fuck About what the other say And I had to go down with eyes, you know back in the day is the eyes

That's me man, I'm just being since I have a good sense of human man, you know, I appreciate it educate and be able to help people to understand certain things and look in on the situation and know that a lot of things happen to a lot of us, the best of us. But that don't mean give up. That don't mean quit. I'm not throwing in my red, my, my, my white flag because there's no surrendering. I die for what I believe in. And that's crossed my heart. You understand?

That's right there, branded inside of me. So no matter how many times I may fail, understand, as many times I may fail, it's going to be the equal times I get my ass up. Because on one of those try It gonna come through for me I'm gonna be successful and when I look back I'm like man damn if I would have gave up I would have never known the strength in this if I would have gave up. I would have never known how much Resilience I have in myself if I would have gave up. I would never know how how to press a view into a hard situation Especially when they're dealing with a worldwide

stage, when the whole world is watching. Sometimes when the whole world is watching, a lot of people just don't know how to bounce back because maybe they're too embarrassed. Maybe they're worrying about what people may think of them or what they may look at them as. or what they may look at them as. But for me, it's not that case. I block all that out because I understand that I am the king of my family. I provide for them. And when I look around,

I understand all my good days, I weigh my bad. So there ain't no complaints. They all took care of every last one of them. Everything that's around me. I look at my hands I look at my career and what I've done with my career and what I've done with my hands I look at the structure all this this compound that I'm on the things that I've built things that I've obtained The things that I'm setting back for my children so they can inherit it from me something that I never would have

understood coming up because my father wasn't able to back for my children so they can inherit it from me, something that I never would have understood coming up because my father wasn't able to and his father before him. But I told pops, I said, I broke the chain, bro. What you need? I got you. I broke the chain, not only for him, but for my family as well, for my seed. So no matter how many I have it's just gonna be a generation of Wilders a generation of wealth of things going For me I own everything that I have Pay it up on taxes. They need to get rid of that shit. Don't tired of it and I and I'm dead free Take too many people say that

I'm living good, I'm living life. But now it's time for me to be selfish in this business that I'm in. I got to enjoy it for myself and not for others no more. I got into this business because of my daughter that was born with spina bifida. I promised her that I'll be able to take care of her beyond her belief. And I didn't know where I was, I didn't know no direction of how I would get there because I didn't, I didn't, I'm coming from Tuscaloosa, Alabama.

Most things about football here, little basketball as well. So as a child, you see what you wanna become and I was around that. So I saw that, I saw the glory of it. I saw the hype behind it, you know, the fans and stuff like that. So you only want to be what you see. But God had other plans for me.

When he blessed me with a daughter that was born with spina bifida, it made my life even more harder. I wouldn't say harder, but more challenging, I would say. And I like a life with challenging it, because if not, then it become a boring life and then you try to figure out as you go, what can I do to be entertained?

Or what can I do to make myself have a little fun and stuff? Certain people can't even be in silence for five minutes. They have to be around somebody. They have to be at a certain place. It's too quiet. It's too boring. Maybe you need that in life to understand who you are because you can't show love if you don't have love to give.

You can't have, you know, you can't say you love me if you don't love yourself. You still trying to figure out but you talking about you love me so much.'t love yourself. You still trying to figure out but you talking about you love me so much. And then that when the betrayal come because they really didn't love themselves. So how can they pour something into you if they don't have if it's empty inside of them they don't have nothing to give. But the only thing about that is you learn that valuable lesson when that glass breaks. When that picture that they thought they had

something that they can pour into as far as a level of love but it's dry inside it ain't no more left and when they pick it up it will slip out of the hand and it's great it's nothing it could be contained in it no more so how can I give you anything when I came and ball nothing up no more my container have broken So now you really realize the monster that I am that I've been around you all this time And I'd a nibbled off your ass. I was like a parasite and I only fed off the good time because the bad time well nobody I want to go through that We gonna let you go through that yourself, but the good times call me Leroy. I'll be here waiting on you to have a good old time. Don't threaten me with a good time

But I'm gonna let you I'm gonna let you deal with this it's pain this heartache this sorrow I'm gonna let you deal with this by yourself Let you figure it out and that's fighters, you know when we win we win with everybody else But when you lose you lose by yourself It's a hard reality and a lot of people will under won't don't would never understand How a fighter would feel and why we say the things we say or why we say the things? Why we do the things we do you'll never understand You know

In which you made some things, you know, some things you'll never understand. You know? In which you may some things, you know, some things you can't understand unless you get in it. And there's a lot of people ain't getting in this, you know? But you know, man, I can go on and on, bro. I'm just in a great place at the moment of time. I'm looking forward to June the 27th. Can I ask you one last one? And I can't wait.

I'll ask you one last one. What do you want? When the music stops, what do you want your legacy to be? How do you want people to remember Deontay Wilder? I want people to win when the music stopped with me and I don't mean I'm going to be dead. No, I mean, I mean the fight music. Yeah.

I understand. When the music stopped for me in the fight business I want people to understand that he was a great man he feared nothing and even in his failures he came back he corrected them he wasn't scared he didn't surrender he did give up many times what we thought he would or we would expect on our own with our own observance of looking on the outside, looking in. And maybe because you care some money, he's here retired. I don't want to see him get hurt.

I wanted him to see that I ain't give up at all. I got up on knees, bending knees and I got up and I started back gathering myself and got myself back out there each and every time because I wasn't satisfied with the last performance or the last thing I've done in my life. I always feel like it's more to do in this world no matter what I've obtained or what I may have in life. I still feel like there's more to do and I want people to remember me as that a great man. Not only a man that just had a statue because of what all he done in the world and stuff or for his city or for His state or for the world, you know, I mean, I

Wanted to say he was a real warrior a king of God army a Man that that that saw life so different than others that saw life so different than others. That's why I want them to remember me as, you know, not just being a great father, but what I put in the inside and outside of this world, what I've fed to people as far as inspiring and motivating and encouraging. And no matter how hard life may get for you

It's never too late You could continue to go you continue to be great. I Tell people all the time we all have greatness in us for sir We all have greatness in us for service is only to put your we all have greatness in us But greatness is only determined by service And for me to say that I must apply that to my life as well I can't say one thing and then do another then I would be considered a hypocrite But I only must apply

What I I say to myself And to life I must be a I must be I must follow I must lead by example And that's what I'm doing, you know, so when that music stopped man I hope it's beautiful music while it's playing and then when it stops It still lingers and rings and people ears And when they hear in like I want to hear it again But this time they won't be seeing that they won't be seeing dances They'll just be seeing the melodies floating in the air

and be like, man, that was a great man. That was a great king. What a great leader. And I get a standing ovation every time they hear that music playing. Although they can't see it no more of me doing my action on my dance, but they can imagine it

while hearing that music play, baby. Much respect, Yonte. Thank you. And I feel like I could run through a wall right now. Wishing you the best. June 27th in Wichita. It's great to have you back. And I'm happy to hear that you're in a great spot.

Again, happy Father's Day and good luck to you. We'll be watching and looking forward to it very much. My man, blessings. I'll be having a beautiful rest of the day. Same to you. Thank you so much. There he is. The one and only, the inimitable Deontay Walder. We've had a lot of classic interviews on this program. I remember there was one with Henner Gracie back in the day where I think he gave us like a 13-minute answer or something like that. There's obviously been some Nate Diaz interviews. That one is up there where you just kind of have to let someone, as the kids like to say, cook, you just have to let them go. And, uh, Deontay is one of the most interesting characters in the

history of combat sports, not just boxing. Uh, a fascinating individual who, by the way, the way is 39 years young, 43, 4 and 1. 42 of his 43 wins via knockout, 2008 Olympic bronze medalist, hence bronze bomber, 2007 US national and Golden Gloves champion. Has been fighting as a pro since 2008. Former WBC champion. And what's interesting about the current state of his career, the average age, so he's 39 turning 40 in October,

the average age of the ring top 10 heavyweights is 33. The youngest in the top 10 is Daniel Dubois, 27. The oldest is Zhilei Zhang, number 8, 42. Dubois, number 2, returning July 19th against Alexander Usyk. Speaking of Usyk, he's 38. Fury's 36. Ten of the top eleven are in their ths, 4 are over 35. I say this to perhaps say he's not, if you look at the rest of the top 10, top 11, he's not exactly over the hill past his prime. Now obviously you have to win, obviously you have to perform. His last win was a first round knockout of Robert Hellenius in October of 2022. He's lost two fights in a row against two of the better fighters in the heavyweight division, Joseph Parker, December of 23.

And then of course, Xi Lei Zhang, June of 24. And we all thought if he would have won that fight over Zhang, he could have gotten the AJ fight that didn't come to fruition. And there's a story, I was going to ask him about that, but we sort of ran out of time there. There's been a constant theme in boxing recently where it's like, hey, if you win this one, you got the big one coming up. And it sounds like he's got something coming up.

But don't look past Tyrell Herdin, who obviously is not, you know, a top 10 guy. And one would suggest that, you know, this is a tune-up fight, a comeback fight, whatever you want to call it. But he is 24-5. He's on a 12-1 run. Four of his five career losses are via KO. And it's happening in Wichita. So this feels like, okay, it's a little bit out of the limelight. It's an opponent he could beat who has been knocked out. Alright, let's see. And then if he could get back, there's a couple big fights. The AJ fight is still out there. We had Dave Allen on the show coming off the big win over Johnny Fischer saying that he wants him. There's a ton of guys. There's

Bacolii. There's a ton of guys out there at the, you know, heavyweight division level that he's fighting at that he could face next. It's airing on BLK Prime. It's this, no, not this Friday, next Friday, June 27th. It's a very busy few days in combat sports. There's PFL that night. There's obviously International Fight Week on the 28th. Jake Paul, Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. on the 28th as well. This is the promo. By the way, have you guys seen Deontay Walder's gym? He has one of the all-time great home gyms. I was going to bring it up as well, but again, I was just letting him cook. This is his home gym. How is this possible?

I mean, he lives in Tuscaloosa. This? This is not... This is his home gym? I thought this was like an AI 3D rendering the first time I saw the video. What the... How is this possible? It's like the nicest gym in the world. Yeah, it's pretty legit. That's the compound? Bro.

What is that? What is this, a humidor? Look at that, it's a throne. Mike in the middle? Mike in the middle. Want to introduce him? Yeah, just for like a regular training session on a Tuesday afternoon, he's got to get introduced. What a fascinating guy.

I feel like you need key card access to get in the gym. I feel like you got to put your eye up to scan. Yeah, the eye scanner. By the way, you were talking about like some of the all-time. Yeah Yeah, I feel like off the top of my head Diego Sanchez told you about the change to the nickname Lionheart was like, oh my god. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes Yes, and then we did a video like where we sped it up. Yeah, that's right Pt's are for keeping you waiting there, but like Deontay was cooking

So actually we we told Pt see that were going to throw to him for the next question. Oh, sure. He stayed locked in. And then we told him, like, hey, we're just messing around. Boy, what question did you have ready to go? Pitsy didn't have much, didn't have much. I'm not going to lie to you. I was lost. I felt like I was at mass there. Fair play to him. We're going to do something like, are you sure?

Or would you like the word that another way? What do you even say? Like at that point, you know, I was worried for Ariel. What does he say? You know, does he find a gap here to sign off? It was, uh, I was like, I was trying to, yeah. And I know he can't see me. I was, I was trying to, but you know, you know, what's the thing that's a

little bit heartbreaking about it all. Like he, he keeps bringing up a trail and you know, there have been reports about, you know, things that he's had to deal with in his personal life and you feel like he's still working through it right. And not the the first fighter to speak like this necessarily but I appreciate him just sort of bearing his soul there but it does seem like he's still, when you have that betrayal in your heart and whatever those emotions are, you're still working through something. So I am curious to see what it translates into. And I don't know if you guys remember, P.T., you were in America when he got knocked out. It was the same day as Poirier

Makhachev, the newer card last year. And when he got knocked out, I was like, okay, that's probably it for Deontay Wilder. So let's see. Let's see what it all translates into come next Friday. Mr. P.C. Carroll, what do you want to see Kamara Usman do next? I think we were all kind of assuming as we transition back to this past weekend, we're all kind of, okay, Buckley is going to, you know, he's going to get by him. And now he's in that Brady Rachmanov, Gary territory. He's not, it's actually Usman. What does he do now? Yeah. First of all, I think, you know, he, you know, Buckley was a big favor.

And I think if you look at what's been happening in the welterweight division, I think we were all kind of expecting this to fall in line with what's been happening. And that is the younger line eating the older line. That's what we've been seeing in this division and we've been seeing these new guys emerge in the title fray. The division is completely different to when Ousmane was champion. And I think the most impressive thing about what Ousmane did is if you look around all the other guys who were trying to get to that title, they've all kind of fallen out with

that conversation. Leon obviously losing to Bilal, then losing to Brady, Bilal being beaten by Jack Dylan-Madalena, Colby Coventon has been beaten by Buckley, Jorge Masvidal is just getting back into the promotion. You wouldn't imagine he's anywhere near the title conversation. For Usman to come back after so long out and look that dominant and look vintage in many ways. It was so impressive and unforeseen. I really didn't expect that to happen. I do think it solves a problem for the UFC in that we were kind of talking about it on

Friday on the crack and I know the lads were as well. We're reaching a situation here where the UFC were going to have to be kind of forced to match some of these prospects against each other. Unfortunately for Roosman, he's put himself back in play to be another, like to be, you know, to play kingmaker for one of these guys into the title conversation. I think that kind of suits the UFC because at Buckley one, there is a whole bunch of guys there you could have put into a title conversation.

And I think that's what makes the division so fun at the moment, these new guys voying for titles, these new guys you can put in title situations. I think Ousmane can act as a buffer as the litmus test for one of our championship progressions where it'd have to be Gary Brady, who knows at this stage. He probably won't be too happy about that but having been the champion for so long I think he'll understand how the game works and he will definitely be used as a test for one of those guys and getting them into the title mix as far as I'm concerned. Can I tell you what I'd like to see? I would like to see so we are obviously getting Islam versus JDM. I would like to see Brady versus

Gary. Gary tweeting about Brady over the weekend. Did you see that? No. He said, I think we have the tweet, right? Do we have the tweet guys? There it is. Sean Brady apparently saying I'm avoiding him by calling out Bilal. I'm calling out Bilal because he's a former champ that is currently ranked number one and KO'd you. But if you wanted it, I'm in. I've never said no to anyone and everyone knows that. And so that's the fight that I'd like to see. As far as Usman is concerned, there's only two options for me. But if you wanted it, I'm in. I've never said no to anyone and everyone knows that. And so that's the fight that I'd like to see. As far as Usman is concerned, there's only two options for me. Number one is the Bilal fight.

The Bilal fight makes a lot of sense for multiple reasons. Number one, they've been going back and forth. Okay, there's a storyline there, work or shoot, who knows? And number two, you're not risking knocking off a future title contender because I don't think the UFC, for just being a thousand percent honest, is too eager to put Bilal in there.

And I don't know if they're too eager to put Usman back in there. And so the point is, no matter who wins or loses, it's not like there's a fear of, oh, if this guy beats this guy, now we're eliminating this guy, if you know what I'm saying. And so to me, it's either Bilal or Rachmanov.

I kind of feel like at this point, the period in which Rachmanov can claim being the top guy is sort of running out. It's probably going to be almost a year since he last fought. And so, a fight against Usman could put him back in there, or it's a win for Usman over the top guy. Now he's him back in there or it's a win for Usman over the top guy now he's really back in there. Brady, Gary, Islam, JDM and then depending on who's ready when and how long Usman wants to take you know as far as time off in between fights because remember this was almost two years between fights that's what I'd like to see as far as what's next for him. Bilal versus

Usman or Rachmanov versus Usman. EJ what do Bilal versus Ustman or Rachmanov versus Ustman. EJ, what do you think about that? I like Rachmanov versus Ustman more. Why? I don't think you solve much of a problem with Bilal versus Kamaru because whoever wins that is going to think that they deserve the title shot. So while you're not eliminating one of the young up and comers or the, you know, these guys are in their thirties, but while you're not eliminating one of the fresher names, you are creating now an Usman or Bilal claim to a title shot.

So I don't think it like, it doesn't close off an option, but it now creates another potential title shot for somebody who is been there, done that type name. Um, he was talking title shot afterwards, but like, no. If he beat, if they match him up with Bilal and he wins. Oh no but after this one. He has a claim. Not after this one. No no. But if he beats Bilal who's the number one contender. Now you're like okay if I'm Kamaru Usman I want a title shot. Bilal isn't the number one contender though. No he's the number one in the rankings. He's the number one in the rankings but like in actuality. That's what I meant by the way. I'm not saying like I consider him the number one contender but he is number one in the rankings and so I would rather see young versus old again. I would rather see Shavkat versus Kamaru, see if Kamaru still got it. By the way he's been game to do that. I mean the need we remind the short notice fight he took against Hamza Shamiyev and look pretty good in it. The dudes a savage, Shavkat versus Kamaru. That's for me, that's what I want.

What do you think GC? I mean that's a great fight that he mentioned. I still feel for Shavkat if he has to take another fight having already gotten the title than taking the Ingari fight, everything like that. This happened to a lot of people, Charles. I understand, I understand. I mean honestly, when you think about it more,

when are we going to get Islam versus JDM? October? I think October. I think that Abu Dhabi card. Man, so it's just like this, you have this very long line and now we're gonna wait, you know, four or five more months before we finally see the title.

Shavkat versus Usman is nice. I really wanna see Brady versus Gary. I think the heat there and they're two young guys. That will decide who can be next for the title between them two. And then yeah, I guess from there, it's just like if you do Shavkat versus Usman, then what do you do with Balal? Michael Morales? I mean, could you do Buckley? Could you do Buckley by the way? They both lost around the same time.

You know, I think it's not the worst fight. If you're Balal though, that's going to say real step down. Feels like you're going down the rankings. Joaquin versus Leon? Yeah, no, I'm fine with that one too. I'm not really thinking. The Bilal situation is kind of a problem. Here's the thing though, right? See, yeah, Shavkat is ready to go and you have Ian fighting Brady. Ian, it's safe hypothetically, Ian beats Brady. Are people going to get upset that Shavkat is then overlooked if he's ready to go for a title fight and Ian's there and they push Ian into that title fight? You know

Shavkat I think it's unfair because he's obviously been injured but he's undefeated. He is the guy. You know, recently Boias is playing all types of games against him now but you know I've had to be reminded of this myself because I was very high on Brady after the Leon fight and I was reminded of like how could you not push Shavkat in at this stage? Like he's undefeated. He is, he was meant to be in there. He didn't get the chop because of injury. If he comes back after this fight, even if Gary and Brady is played out, would people get upset that Shavkat is not getting the fight even though he defeated Ian, albeit by a very slim margin. But then beat him next. Shavkat gets the next one.

Beat it like a Kamara Usman, and then hop right in there. You're next up. Yeah, I think with the timeline, Shavkat is gonna have to fight again. He'll have very little momentum by the time all this plays out. You know what I mean?

I really am. I am curious in, I guess, nine months or so, who is fighting for the title after the JDM-Islam fight? Yeah, you get the idea that Shavkat's knee is in a bad way. It's been a long time now. Like that is worrying. Like just from a fan point of view, from a guy who covers the sport, with this guy with so much mystique, the boogeyman for sure, even though Usman disagrees, as he said in his post-fight interview on Saturday. You know, this is a worrying length of time he's been out for now at this stage. You know what's crazy? You look at the top of those

those rankings right there, man, like JDM, welcome to the top of the the mountain. Like look at the killers that are waiting for him, you know? And not included in this list Islam Makashev. Oh, oh yes. Great. And by the way, go all the way down to number eight, there's a boogeyman waiting there who I think is going to be like the guy. There's always that one guy I feel like in every weight class, everyone's like, yeah, no thanks. You know, uh. That was Shavkat.

Yeah. Two undefeated guys that are icing everyone. That was Shavkat, but not that long ago. Remember it was also Carlos Prochez and then that quickly didn't happen. So these things are just all. It was all these guys. Honestly, Watkin was looking pretty unbeatable

at 170. He was like, I'm minus 300 And it was Ian Gary. It was all these guys. Honestly, Joaquin was looking pretty unbeatable at 170. He was like a minus 300 against Kamaru Usman at one point. Brady. This is why the argument is- Brady was undefeated going into the ball off fight. I forgot about that. But it's almost like you can't ignore those guys anymore.

Morales to me is just, he's terrifying. He's gigantic for 170. Could this be a golden age for a while to weight, you know, yeah like all these guys We're going through here lads like all were like the guy, you know, we're like he's the boogeyman They were like actually every single one of these guys actually I'm the boogeyman Essentially the entire Walter way to be yeah, Pete. See I think it's a great era My hot take is that we've granted these title shots a little too willy nilly. Everybody's number one contender.

Everybody deserves a title shot. I just don't think it's true. Like outside of Shavkat, I really don't think like everybody's done that much to be in this like vaunted territory. Like he and Gary just lost to Shavkat. He just lost to Shavkat. I know he beat Proches, but like he just lost to Shavkat. This is not like

an undeniable guy, just quite frankly. Like do more. Ian beat a Bilal, beat Sean Brady. Now I'm more into the conversation. Outside of Shavkat, I don't see anybody as really like Teflon. Maybe the fight by the way for Buckley is Israel Adesanya. That would not be a bad one. That would not be a bad one. The heat between them. That's spicy. We can't even read all the stuff here. I mean we'd get we get killed. It's like just go look it up for yourself. Is he just sitting there in his classic Sunday morning spot where he does the fight reaction videos and he's just like I hate this guy. Which what I appreciated about it was it felt like he was just a regular dude you know

you're watching a fight like I just don't like this person or I love this person he's like I just don't like this guy I don't like him and then I guess that got clipped off and then Buckley responded to him but he has fought at 85 before but you know I don't know if that's something that makes sense for him at this point but it could be something. By the way, speaking of 185 MVP versus Jared Cannon, year added to the Chicago card in, in August. I don't know who that was that PT who did that?

Yeah. You like that one? You like that one? PT? No, not really. Why? Well, I mean, like from venom page a a situation like that is another middleweight fight. That is different.

You know what I mean? That's a big boy. Yeah, it's crazy. I didn't think he was going to stick around at middleweight after the sharp. I thought it was just like a fun thing. And then I'm going back to 170. I don't, I don't know if I ever really. Doesn't even coat weight.

Yeah. You know, like he's not a big guy. Um, canton here is a very different story. We know the thing that about can and there is he's knocked people out at heavyweight, light, heavyweight and middleweight. He is a unit. Like he, he, he is dynamic. He can take it down.

He can bulldoze you. I don't know, man. Like I love watching Michael venom page fight. And I think, uh, there's lots of fun fights to make for him. Even, even at welterweight still. Um, I don't know, dude, I think, I think there's lots of fun fights to make for him, even at welterweight still. I don't know, dude. I think the size difference is gonna be crazy. Can I make one counterpoint?

I would study that Caio Ohio tape. Like, he struck with Kannonier for five rounds, looked pretty good doing it. I think there's a path to victory there for Venom Page if it's not a takeoff fest. Oh, he definitely has a path to victory. What about Izzy versus Kananier? Yeah but this is different. Now we're going back to like world championship level guy. I'm talking like I mean actually Kyle might be but that fight was expected to be like Kyle's gonna take him down and control

him. Stood with him for five rounds, looked like the more competent striker if we're being honest and I think Cannonier is fantastic. I think Venom Page is live in this as long as he can avoid takedowns here. Now if I'm Cannonier, you know that looks like a easy path to victory but no I agree with you Pete C. Physicality wise like different, different levels but if it turns into a striking battle I think Venom can can pull that off. Just just a counterpoint to that I think the reason why Kaio had so much success in the striking department is the constant fear of, if this guy takes me down, I'm fucked.

The training will certainly be different for MVP versus Kaio. He's not worried about a single leg coming from MVP. Imagine, that'd be great. Yeah. Yeah. Look, he has a serious pair of balls on him. MVP. And I love watching him fight. I just think if, if I was picking fights for him, that wouldn't have been in the top 20. But fair play to him. It's, it's, it's 70, right? I would rather see him at 70. Yes. That's why it wouldn't be in my top 20 because I just thought that that was just a one-off, a fun fight Shara Bullitt so he's gonna stick around he's not just sticking around he's like there's a gap

between Cananier and Shara Bullitt. He's trying to get into the top 10 at 185. Yeah I mean you beat Cananier you're you're you're you're talking about top five guys at that point you know what I mean in my opinion um he's still he's still very much in the mix by the way am I crazy or Caio Bahalio still doesn't have a fight, right? Not that I'm aware of. Like I would have suspected Kyle versus Kedenear more so than Kedenear. We've been doing this thing with... Who is this guy?

We've been doing this thing with Nasridian, right? Where it's like, he won't fight me, no he won't fight me. And they're just like going back and forth when that is the natural fight to make. That is the fight to make. And we just won't get that fight for. He hasn't fought since August, the Canineer fight. And he's been ready to go, like super frustrated that we were getting comes out,

that we were getting a whole bunch of fights. By the way, speaking of international fight week, Peyton Talbot fighting on international fight week. He got a new fight that was announced, when was it? Maybe late last week. So there it is, Peyton Talbot, Felipe Lima. Not an easy fight. No, not at all.

14 and one, man. Throwing him back in there. No sort of tune up, no bounce back fight. I'm happy that they're putting him on this card, so they still believe in him, but I'm very curious to see what he looks like. You know what I mean? This would be a really nice win for him.

We've got one over nine, miles, Jones. This would be a, this would be a nice one. It's a incredible how quickly it changes, right? Oh my gosh. Like in terms of how you get matched, like you lose one, you're like, all right, let's fucking see then. Let's fucking see now.

We're just going to throw you in there with some more salvage, whoever can swim, we will go with him. It's, it's, he's the underdog. He's going to minus 900 or whatever he was against the only bar cells to a plus one 35 against Felipe Lima. Wow. Speaking of that card, international fight week, obviously a lot happened with Islam and the belt and Ilia moving up. There's some talk right now between Ilia and Patty. I've said it. If Ilia wins, I feel like they'll try to make that fight for the belt and Ilya moving up there's some talk right now between Ilya and Patty I've said it if Ilya wins I feel like they'll try to make that fight for the belt Umar Nurmagomedov was on a podcast talking about this whole situation and

how it played out let's take a listen and react to it Why did he come? How did it happen? He came himself. He was very immersed in his work. Actually you know what let's go to the beginning of the thing and I'm gonna read the subtitle in case you're just listening to this because if you're listening to this, we're kind of screwing you here. Okay, let's start again and I'm gonna read it as it goes on. Here it is. Why did Hunter come to Dagestan? He came to see Islam. He's deeply involved in his job. He's the person who organized Khabib versus Qan Khan. He is the person. He is a big fan.

As far as I understand, he is a big fight fan. He is talking about Hunter here. He wants to organize big fights. He came here. To be fair, I don't know if I should say this or not, but they wanted Islam to move up. They wanted to make Toporia champion at 155. So it's not because Islam wants to move up, it's because they want Toporia to be a champion at 155. So it's not because Issam wants to move up, it's because they want Toporia to be a champion at 155 because they think he will sell fights. So Hunter himself comes all the way and asks you to move up. The plan was if Bilal wins, Issam will defend his belt at 155 against Toporia. Now, since Bilal isn't there anymore,

Issam will move up to 170. He will be a double champion in Shalah. So I understand and I think that's what we all suspected, but it's like this isn't pro-wrestling. Bilal could have won that fight. And so if they won, if the theory is they wanted Ilya to be champion so badly, they were still going to book Ilya versus Islam if Bilal won. If Bilal wins one round, one extra round in that fight in Montreal, we're getting Ilya versus Islam. And that meeting was before the title fight.

So I don't know. I guess my conclusion is, I wish we were just getting Ilya versus Islam in 11 days. Yeah, of course. How about Hunter showing up to Dagestan to be like, listen, you're a great champion, but we like this other guy. That sounds mental.

That is mental. Like, you're a great champion, but we like this other guy. That sounds mental. That is mental. Like, listen, you've been great Islam pound for pound. What about moving up, mate? We have another lad sells a lot of pay per views. What do you think?

And he's like, yeah, all right. That's crazy. I don't think that happened. We're missing a few caveats here, I believe. Even if that wasn't the combo, right? Cause I don't, I'm with you, I don't believe that was the combo. That's what happened in practice. They literally took the belt off the longest reigning champion. Well, what's the revision?

They literally stripped the guy with the longest championship reign right now. And we're like, yeah, just take it, fight for it, Ilya. Like they did that. That's why I said they did it, but there was no way that was the pitch. Why? That's not the pitch to Islam, but, just take it, fight for it, Ilya. Like, they did that. Well, that's why I said- They did it, but there was no way that was the pitch. No, no, that's not the pitch to Islam, but they literally did it. Why couldn't we have seen Ilya versus Islam? Islam wins, he goes and fights for double champ status.

I mean, if you're following the narrative that they've laid out, it's because Islam's going to beat Ilya and they're not going to get Ilya as their champion. And Islam fully understands. But by the way, isn't that better for Islam because then he can be double champ? Isn't that what he wants? Isn't that what he always wants? Well, he thought he was going to be double champ regardless, but the plan's got a little changed up.

But certainly, I think we can all agree we're playing a game of telephone here. I don't know how Umar laid that out. We're playing a game of telephone through a translation as well yeah we translate just like yes but truly umar off the dome about a trip like two months ago through a Russian translation but but a couple things might be getting lost there while we're joking about it they literally just did it they were just like yeah it's so that's right. So thanks. Thanks for your service Go fight go fight Jack your titles now gonna be disputed by by Charles Amelia. Great. Thank you

It's just I don't know. It's sloppy man So speaking of which now you got Justin Gaethje coming out there and saying like hey, well his manager is saying he's gonna retire If he doesn't get the next title shot saying he's going to retire if he doesn't get the next title shot. Uh, so that means him fighting. And by the way, him versus Ilya or Charles is a fine fight, but it doesn't, I remember when they booked that UFC 300 fight against Max Holloway, I was like, why would you take this fight? The title fights happening in two months. You're next.

You're next. And now he's out there saying, well, that was just an exhibition that shouldn't count. Have you guys seen this? Yeah. I have. They owe me a championship fight. I'm three in one of my last four. I'm not going to fight any of these motherfuckers for fun unless they pay me so much more money.

And then he also continues to call, do we have that clip where he continues to call the, we don't have the clip. Okay, well, he said said it you could find it he continues to call the the the max BMF title fight an exhibition which but they owe Armand a fight then as well they owe loads of that's for it's I just disagreeing that they own yeah a title shot I mean he's three and one in his last four two of them were against Fazeev who's not even the top ten at

lightweight he's also gotten two cracks at the lightweight belt as well. And just the depth at 155. I'm just, I'm not certain that they own the title shot. DOC don't owe anyone shit. That is their stance. Like, fuck you. You know what I mean? We're gonna do what we want.

Like that is what they do. And that's what they'll continue to do as far as I'm concerned. It's just a shame because the people that lose the most are the champions, which is how is this possible? The most important people in the company, the people who will make the most money for you, the ones that will earn the most money for you, are the ones that are being disrespected the most.

Tom Aspinall could be on a second defense, third defense by now if this thing was resolved. The Islam on this crazy win streak is losing his belt. Iliad Zipporia, after being this incredible boost to the featherweight division, is no longer a champion. It's bizarre, man. The business is in a weird spot. I understand, you know, he's at the very end of his career. He wants one more crack. He sees Dustin get another shot, this and that, but the truth is, he probably would have been next if he didn't take that BMF title fight, and he did, and it's going to hurt you. And then there's other guys like Patti who have come up since. To me, Patti versus Justin is the fight to make. That's the move. That's the best thing you can go for right now. And if he beats Patty, he's probably right there.

Right. I mean, yeah. And I think a lot of people would favor him in that fight. Yeah. Patty's shit at the moment, but everyone would, you know, we've seen it before when Patty gets matched with a guy like this. And we think a lot of people would obviously look at what Gagey did, the Chandler and think this could be a harder fight. We've heard for years about Gagey's take down the fence. Obviously that, that, that was kind of destroyed by his fights with Habib back in the day and losing

by submission and everything, but he's still a brilliant fighter, like a legend of this division. And honestly, I think it's a great fight for Paddy as well. Like it's a more fan friendly fight than Armin or someone like that. So if he, maybe he does feel like he's in a good position to get a title shot. If he'll be a beads Charles, but a fight with Justin Gaethje certainly isn't there is no snow. Like that would be a massive, massive fight, whatever card it was on. Speaking of Armand Serukian, I did see that he tweeted that he's the backup fighter for

UFC's, um, upcoming title fight, UFC three 17 lightweight title fight. He said I'm the backup for UFC's upcoming title fight, UFC 317, lightweight title fight, he said, I'm the backup for UFC 317. I sent that to his management team and asked if this was in fact the case because it would seem to suggest maybe a mending of the fences because it seemed like they were upset that he didn't go through with the title fight and I didn't get a word back.

So let's see. What gave you that impression that they were upset? Just feeling the vibes. I didn't get a response. Let's see. But I don't think that that would be the craziest thing in the world. Alright, let us move along now. Great, great. Pleasure. Very excited to speak to our next guest. He is always very gracious with his time. He's always ready and willing after, you know, the majority of his fights, which are wins, sometimes they don't go his way. He's always coming on and providing great perspective and he was on his own YouTube channel last week with his head coach Tim Welch. I thought providing very smart, measured, mature

providing very smart, measured, mature reactions to what transpired in new work a little over a week ago. We're speaking to Sugashon O'Malley, who is kind enough to join us right now to talk about it all. Looking forward to this and appreciate this very much. And there's the little guy. Hello, sir. I'm speaking to the little guy. Uncle Ariel, what's up, brother? What's happening? Is that Mateo? Mateo, yep, Mateo Montana. I love it. How old now?

Three weeks. Three weeks. You know what's crazy about this, Sean? I'm watching, I never watch embedded, if I'm being honest. I don't know why. And it just popped up on my YouTube and this is like the week of the fight and the thumbnail is you with a baby. And I'm like, what the heck? And not, I know your daughter's a little older

and this, like you didn't say this to anyone. I know you were kind of off social, but it just kind of, it just kind of happened. You kept it to yourself. Yeah. I mean, I did with Elena too, actually, but this time just, it wasn't necessarily intentional. It just wasn't on social media. So it just never got brought up. And going through a camp, and obviously your partner's doing all the work. She's the one who's actually pregnant, but like, you know, it's a lot going on, right? How was it balancing the two lives?

Yeah, it wasn't too bad. It's funny timing. He was conceived about 10 days before the first Marab fight and he was born about 10 days before the second one. So she was pregnant the entire, you know, from the first fight with Marab to the last fight with Marab. So it was pretty crazy timing. Happy Father's Day, by the way. Now Father too. Thank you.

You love babies, right? You do. Thank you. I heard you talking by the way, now Father 2. You love babies, right? Thank you. I heard you talking about the smell, the calmness, the peace. Oh yeah, this right here, this right here. You know, this makes a loss a lot easier to deal with coming home to, you know, a healthy family. Yeah. And, you know, so definitely, definitely helps. It's different when you come home and like maybe you're alone and you just sit there and ponder. I've always said kids provide like the best balance in life. Like even when you're working, even if you're not a fighter, if you're just a

regular guy, you can't get too hung up on the work because they need you. And if you're thinking about this, you're not present here. So they almost force you to be a more balanced person, right? Yeah, no, I would totally agree. And so here you are just chilling. It looks like you have a nice scenery behind you. You have a healthy baby in your arms.

It seems like life is good. You're okay. We're doing well, Ariel. We're doing well. Life is good. No complaints over here. How are you processing what happened two weeks ago? You know what? compliance over here. How are you processing what happened two weeks ago?

You know what? It was a lot easier to deal with the second time around, not having to get, you know, the first time having to get surgery right after the fight. That was, you know, coming off a loss and surgery back-to-back, that's that's difficult. Coming off, you know, coming off the loss, still healthy, feel good, family's healthy, everything's good, you know, it's a lot easier to deal with. Rob's good. I mean, his, you know, leg is number two on the pound-to-pound list right now. And, you know, he's just, he's got a good style to beat me. And, yeah, it is what it is. So, you know, when you're in there and you're getting ready for, by the way, the yawning is unbelievably cute, I just have to say.

It's unbelievable. What an amazing blessing. When you're getting ready for the fight and you're saying all the right things, you're telling us that you're healthy, you're in a good space, was any of that for the interviews for the show or is there truly no excuses? Were you 100% healthy? Were you truly in a great place? Was it all accurate in the aftermath?

I mean, I don't think anyone goes in there 100% healthy, you know, but I had a, you know, there was, there's definitely, I had a great camp, you know, I was able to wrestle, was able to do most of what I need. Like I was, I went in there very confident, very, you know, ready to go. Everyone was dissecting all the little things that you were doing and saying, you know, ready to go. Everyone was dissecting all the little things that you were doing and saying. Number one, you didn't dye your hair this time. How come? I just didn't want to sit and, you know,

it's a long process and I just really didn't want to sit and, you know, in that chair for eight hours. Okay. Are you superstitious? Um, not necessarily. No, I don't think so. Okay. So you're not the type of guy who's like, Oh, I've died it for X amount of fights. I have to die it. You just didn't feel like doing it. So you didn't do it. Well, I mean, Danny, my wife does my hair too. And she also was kind of like, you know, not enough because it not not in the right, you know, she was only a couple

days out of pregnancy. She didn't really want to do it either. Sure. I don't blame her. You changed, this is an incredible view, by the way, and it's just very symbolic of like the person that you've become and how you've evolved into this guy. Look at you. This is incredible. You're holding the baby properly. It's just wonderful. Do you change diapers too? Oh, yeah. Change diapers. I wanted to be a, I remember wanting to, you know, be a dad of middle school. I was, I was ready to change diapers and you know,

a lot of, you know, a lot of guys right after their baby's so little born and a little hesitant to hold the baby. I'm, I'm, I was, I was excited for it. I love this phase. Middle school. That's a little early. Oh yeah. It was a little early early I broke up with a girl in middle school because she didn't want to have kids So I was like, I knew I wanted I knew I wanted to have kids if she was down You would have you would have had kids back then. No, not then. No, okay I'm just saying in general she didn't want to end up having kids ever. So it was like that was just Hey, let me give him to his mom real quick. Okay. All right. All right. No problem. Sorry about this. No problem Danny, will you come grab him?

It's a beautiful thing. Especially. She's coming to grab him. Yeah, she's coming to grab him. I didn't want to leave too long, but you know, it's hot here in Arizona. It's 110 degrees. So little dudes probably just getting a little warm. Oh, and there's the dog as well. Look at you. You're living the dream. Can I ask, I was surprised with the, there he goes. Congratulations. If she can hear me, I don't know if she can. Air pod.

Okay. Yep. Yep. Different walkout music. Why the switch? Yeah. I don't know. It just, you know, I don't know. I just randomly kind of wanted to switch it up. And then I had that song in mind and then I said, Trump's going to be there. I was like, man, all these signs are, these are all great signs for me to win. Didn't happen.

But you know, it was still the walkout was, you know, that was a cool, it was a cool memory. That was a, that was bad cool memory. That was bad ass. Okay, so no regret. It didn't put you in a different spot. You know, sometimes the music gets you in a different head space. No regrets about any of that.

No, no, I was feeling super American. You know, I watched that Netflix, the Osama Bin Laden one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was just, I watched that a couple weeks before the fight and I was just feeling American as fuck. And I was like, let's go, let's go beat this little Russian or little Georgian or whatever little dude.

Okay so the fight is playing out first round he's obviously taking you down you're stuffing some of them I think in the end you stuff seven of his 12 attempts how are you feeling after five minutes? The first round you know ideally was going to go in there not get taken down the first round, you know, ideally was going to go in there, not get taken down the first round. That was the plan. Um, I think they take me out once or twice that, you know, I thought it was a fine round. I thought it was close. He probably won the round, but I was, you know, I wasn't too, I was good going into the second round, second round, stuff every takedown I think I'd take it down once. I was wrestling really well, you know, felt good. Third round, I don't remember how he took me down, but he took me down and, you know,

I think I got up three times and he took, he would, Matt returned me, Matt returned me, Matt returned me and made a mistake. He went to a guillotine. I didn't think he was going to go me and made a mistake. He went to a guillotine. I didn't think he was going to go to that, you know, that kind of a guillotine. I thought he was going to sit in a front headlock, kind of like how he usually does. And I regret trying to wrestle up from there knowing how much time was left now. You know, that was just a, you know, mental, it was a mistake, obviously. Fucking got caught and that sucked.

Really fucking sucked. Were you aware of how much time was left? Like, did you hear the clapper or anything like that? No, no, there was 18 seconds, so I didn't hear. Oh, right, right. I didn't hear, you know, I didn't know how much time was left. I felt like, in the moment, I remember thinking,

like, I've been on my back way too long. This is not what we wanted to do. I wanted to get up back up to my feet and I was like, I have to get up. I have to get up. And I just had, I made a mistake in getting up. Jane, watch out. Made a mistake and getting up and he, you know, lost me the fight. He felt strong. That little fucker felt way more strong than he felt the first time. Okay, I was literally just gonna ask, differences between him this time and back in September.

Strength, obviously, as you just mentioned. Strength, he just felt really fucking strong. Really, interesting. And you weren't expecting that, obviously. I mean, how much- I mean, I knew he was strong. First fight, he felt really strong too. Like Like he definitely didn't feel weak by any means. He just, yeah, the little fucker was, you know, he was strong. Was there anything else that surprised you about him this time as opposed to last time

or since last time? No, not really. I mean, no, not really. Other than just feeling strong as hell. I mean, I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong.

I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong.

I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I knew he was strong. I mean, no, not really. Other than just feeling strong as hell. What do you think, if you fight Murab 10 times, 10 in a row, what do you think your record is? 8-2? No, I don't know. I feel like this, you know, for me to earn another shot at Marab, I got to be undeniable. I have to go on a streak. I have to win a lot of fights in a row. There's a world that happens.

I know I'm capable of beating Marab. I also know he's capable of beating Rob. I also know he's capable of beating me but There's still part, you know, there's gonna be part of me that always wants to get that one back you know, he's the only guy that to ever beat me and You know Cheeto beat me, but I got that one back I proved that one was you know, that one played out the way it was supposed to the first time. Um so that one that one I Want to say bug me because at the end of the day,

if I play out my career and I never get that one back, I'll be happy with how everything played out. But there's a world where I'm undeniable and get that one back. But yeah, I'm happy for him. At the end of the day, I don't hold anything. It's not like I'm, you know, Merab's fucking, he's on a crazy streak right now.

He's the greatest bantamweight of all time. Yeah. There's absolutely no shame in losing to him. And I could foresee him sticking around as champ for a bit. What about you? Like just looking at the landscape, you talk about you being undeniable. Do you think he's going to be around for a bit

at the top of the mountain here? Yeah. I mean, what is he? 30,'s, he's definitely getting up there a little bit. Um, you know, I think he's in his prime right now. No, no, no denying that. So I think he's still got another, you know, solid year or two to stick around. How do you think San Hagan does against them? I don't know. There's one way to find out. Let's get those guys in there eventually. But, you know, Corey in my eyes is one of the best in the division.

I mean, hands like skill for skill, competitiveness, just, you know, finding ways to win. He's up there. So it'll be interesting. I know it's relatively fresh, but do you think, have you even started to think a little bit about whether you'll fight again this year? 100% I'll fight again this year. Okay questions when yeah, what are you thinking? What are you feeling? To be determined we'll see we'll see how things play out

We'll see. Sometimes when these things happen we hear fighters call up Hunter or Sean or Dana whomever and say like get me right back in there I want to fight in a month I want to fight in two months are you feeling like that now or are you thinking like back into the year? Ariel Ariel. Bro I feel I feel like what do you mean I feel like you have a fight already based on your demeanor. No, I, I'm, we're seeing, we'll see. I'm gonna see how this week goes.

You know, I gave myself a solid week, 10 days to just kind of relax. And, you know, I'm gonna see how I feel this week. I don't have an answer for you right now, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna see how I feel this week. I'm just looking at who's available. I mean, I feel like we're gonna see International Fight Week at this point.

You never know. You're healthy, right? Yeah, I think, you know, for the most part, I'm pretty healthy. Again, I don't think any fighters ever just like, all right, I'm 100%, you know, you're always dealing with some bullshit, or dealing with a little something, something, so. but for the most part, I'm feeling pretty good.

Yeah. Um, when you came on before the fight, we talked about the, the potential of you moving up to 145 and we spoke to Tim about it as well. Tim Welch, um, is that in the cards in the immediate future? Now that this has played out or not yet? Uh, I wouldn't say immediate future. God, I was talking to Tim about that the other day. It's like, I can make 35, like it sucks.

I suffer, I die. Everyone does it. They get down to their weight. But I was like, how much, cause I know I'm stronger than I felt in there, but I don't know how much, if losing a certain amount of muscle makes sense to get to 35 for me,

start to get to 35. But I don't know, I'm still, definitely next fight will be at 35 for sure. But eventually someday, yeah, I think we'll move up. Is it getting harder at the cut? I wouldn't, I mean, they're all always equally as hard. They're all just, I mean, they're all, you know, nine, 10 out of 10 hard. They, they're all, you know, nine, 10 out of 10 hard.

They're, they're, they're always, always, you know, you're on the brink of fucking feeling like you're going to die, but you get there, we get there. Yeah. We saw on your, on your YouTube channel, we just showed it. Everyone should go check it out. Like it doesn't look fun. I mean, and I know, I mean, we saw Kayla's footage as well. Okay.

It looks like hell truly. Yeah. No, it says, I mean, it makes you very grateful for being able to just kind of take it, like be able to drink water whenever you want or kind of, at that point, you don't care about food. It's not like you want a cheeseburger or a piece of pizza. You want liquids, you want some aminos, you want some electrolytes.

So you want those kind of things. So it makes you very grateful to be able to drink those throughout the day whenever you want. Is the weight cut easier when you're a father? And I say easier because it's like you can't quit. You're not just fighting for yourself anymore. Do you think like that or is that putting too much on your shoulders? um No, I mean you definitely think of stuff like you know You think of your family when you're going you're sitting that hot tub for the you're on minute 20

And you just your hearts pound in and your mouth is so dry I mean you think of your family you think of stuff like that for sure, but I mean at the end of the day I'm going to make it regardless. I mean, I made the weight before I had a family. I'm going to make it with that. That doesn't necessarily change anything. It's fucking, you know, I guess you could say it's a little boost of motivation. How'd you like Newark? It was interesting. That was the hood. I mean, we stayed in the hood. It was very, it was interesting. That was the hood. I mean we stayed in the hood. Really? It was very cool. We had a very nice little Airbnb set up, you know, which was nice. We had the whole

team out there, but Newark was different. It was really good memories though. Great memories. couple rainy days, you know, cruising with the squad to, to the train in the afternoon or in that night. And at Plinyos, Alex Pahedas coaches gym and, you know, it was great memories the whole team we had a really good time. I saw you doing the the prayer Plinyo shuffle there you'd see it seemed like you were loving it. Yeah, that was pretty it was funny. Yeah, good, that was pretty, it was funny. Yeah, good memories.

You know, I thought, I thought for sure I was going to get that one, get the W. I thought, you know, everything was just the signs were the stars were aligned and I thought for sure this was it was the moment but damn it. Why? And I hope this doesn't come across the wrong way. But like, why does it seem like you're taking it so well? A lot of people are sometimes depressed, devastated. You seem to be handling this so well. How is that? I remember hearing, I think it was Neval said happiness is a skill a long time ago,

and I do, I believe that. And, you know, I think it's just like, life's about perspective. And if I put everything, you know, all the good things in my life, if I, you know, think about those things, it's hard not to be happy. It's hard to be sad. I did feel almost guilt.

I'm like, God, I feel like I should be more sad. I'm such a competitor. I want to win so bad. I put so much effort into this fight camp, so much, you know, blood, sweat and tears into this fight camp. I feel like I should be more upset. But then I'm like, you know, ask myself, why, why, why do I think that it's like, I wanted to win bad. I gave it everything I had. And, uh, you know, I came up short and I'm, I gave it everything I had and you know I came up short and I gave it my best effort. That's all that you can do and you know I think back to routine for me. You know routine is very important for me.

Back to eating healthy, back to sleeping you know sleep schedule, eat good, hydrate, workout like check all those bases off and it's hard not to be happy. So you know it's on to the next. You talked before the fight obviously about no more weed things like that. Are you gonna partake again or are you sticking with no more? Yeah it was funny how that whole lead-up was about all the stuff that I quit doing. Yeah. You know to beat so I could beat Marab. And you know, to beat, so I could beat Merab. I'm going to quit all this stuff so I could beat Merab. It was never about that.

You know, I didn't quit, get off social media, quit smoking and do all this stuff so I could beat Merab. I did all that stuff just to put my mind more at ease, more at peace. Like even before all that, I felt like I'm like, I felt like I was a happy person, didn't really deal with anxiety or depression or anything like that. But there was this like low level of anxiety I felt like I was a happy person, didn't really deal with anxiety or depression or anything like that.

But there was this like low level of anxiety. I kind of would always have. I'm like, you know, I don't, I didn't feel like I should have that. I'm like, why would I have that? I don't, I didn't think it was anything I needed to add. Oh, I need to add this so I can feel that way. I was like, okay, maybe it's something I need to subtract. Maybe it's something I need to take away from. And it was, you know, so I stopped. maybe it's something I need to subtract, maybe it's something I need to take away from. And it was, you know, so I stopped. Marijuana is great. I took a couple of puffs when I got home and I just, I didn't really like the way it made me feel.

It kind of made me this paranoid feeling. It's like, I don't know, ever since I was a kid, it changes almost a little bit. So I didn't really like the weed too much. So not really been, haven't been smoking, haven't been on social media. And that still feels, you know, that wasn't something I was gonna do for fight camp so I could beat Marab.

That was like a life changing thing. It wasn't just like a fight camp changing thing. So that and that's every form, right? Snapchat, X, IG. Yeah. Snapchat, IG, Facebook, all that. Nothing. Not.

Don't get on at all. Haven't once this year and it's a hundred percent been life changing for me. And there was no sort of pull to go on at, okay, the fight's over, let me just go dip my toe back into all of this. I feel like if I would have won, I would have wanted to get on Twitter a little bit,

maybe get on IG, look at some highlights and shit. I don't think I would have, cause I also know like just that one little, you know, that one little, you know, you swipe up, or ah, that'll get you. So I don't think I would have, but losing made it easier not to get on. I don't want to see that shit anyway.

So yeah, no, I haven't had any, any desires or urges to do that. It is wild how big of a storyline that was going into the fight. The weed, the social media, your hair. I mean, you're doing interviews to be as crass as possible. You're doing interviews about your masturbation. This is crazy.

You know what I mean? You're sitting there with the UFC backdrop and people are asking you straight up questions about that. That's wild, man. That's not really a normal thing for an athlete to talk about before a performance. I mean, I think a lot of it to do was like the first fight, you know, he beat me, it looked dominant in some people's eyes.

No one, there wasn't a, like the rematch wasn't necessarily the biggest, I mean, I think it was probably the biggest fight you could make at the time just the way that a vision was laid out and I don't think it was, you know, wanted super, it wasn't like, the fans weren't craving it too much and that was kind of what got picked up was that stuff so, it is what it is. I've talked to some fighters who say they don't go on and stuff like that but it's annoying for them. I've even gotten voice notes who say they don't go on and stuff like that, but it's annoying for them. I've even gotten voice notes from them saying, please don't send me anything.

Not that I was like a mass thing where it's like, don't send me this guy talking about me. Don't send me this clip. Do you have to tell people in your life? Because I feel like your friends and family are always inclined, like someone talks shit or someone does this, they'll send it to you. You don't want to see any of it because then it goes down this rabbit hole. Have you had to do that as well? Pretty much everyone that has my number is being good. I am off social. I don't want to...

The reason I'm off social is because I don't need to see all this shit. But the thing, I do still see stuff on... I still watch YouTube. Got it. need to see all this shit. But the thing I do still see stuff on, I still watch YouTube and, uh, you know, I'll still see things, um, way less, but I still see, I still see things. Um, I saw Cody Garbrandt saying I looked like shit against Marab.

That dude looked sharp last fight. That's all I'll say. Okay. So when you see that stuff, do you feel some sort of way? Does it piss you off? Does it. Um, it was a little annoying. You know, it was annoying is like when I saw his hair was braided and he's got those face tattoos. I was like,

That's how people see me. And it was just so embarrassing. I was like, Oh God, I need to fucking get a new look. That was embarrassing. I was like, Holy shit. That was an eye opener. I was like, god damn it. That's how people probably look at me. It was embarrassing. Did you watch his fight? I did. I did. What about Wellmaker though? The dude that knocked out Mourinho. Yes, yes, but that right hook. Yeah, that was nasty. I saw the highlights of it. I didn't see the, was that first, second round?

First round, like two minutes in. First round. Second straight, right hook knockout in the UFC. Third if you count the tender series. He's nasty, man. Wow. Yeah, I'm gonna have to go check him out, but I did see the highlight of that,

and that was a nice right hand. That was beautiful. Poor Montino, fuck. Yeah. Still feel for that guy. Yeah, you know him. He was tough against you. And so that speaks to, you know, just how talented Malcolm is. Also, Jan, maybe you may have seen in the immediate aftermath, sort of reveling in your loss. Did you? Peter?

Yeah. I did not see that. Inform me. Okay. No I don't want... Go ahead. He was just... Go ahead. Go ahead. I don't want to be the guy. I don't want to be that guy. No you're fine. I'm curious now. Okay, okay. Well let me just pull this up here. It was literally seconds after the fight he said, this is what happens when you're handed things you didn't earn back in line buddy. 21,000 likes. Wow. Like minutes later, 1.36am.

So yeah, there it is in case you want to read it. This is what happens when you're handed things you didn't earn back in line buddy. Alright, well. Got no good reply. He's fighting my buddy Marcus though. My buddy Marcus, that'll be an interesting fight. Marcus is super skilled. I'm excited for that fight.

Marcus McGee. Yeah. Is this one that you think is inevitable? You versus Jan at some point again? I wanted, I wanted, I wanted to fucking win and get that, you know, me versus Yon for the title rematch would have just been so epic. You know, I'm sure we'll run it back one of these days, but maybe not. Maybe I'll just let, maybe I'll just, we'll never give them the opportunity and I'll just have that one over and forever.

And just like, just him and Aljo can, can, uh, can bitch and complain about their losses to me together. maybe maybe I just never give him that one. Yes Aljo was on our show last week talking about you know the the the loss and and how you know he didn't get an immediate rematch against you. You got- Ah shoot that sucks. Do you think he should have gotten one? gotten one? The reason I got a rematch against Marab, it was, you know, it was I won, I thought I won three rounds. I won two rounds, he won three, me versus Aljo, I knocked him out in seven minutes. So I mean, it depends to who you ask. I was watching your breakdown with Tim and Smitty, right? That's what you call him? Yep.

Yeah, he was pushing for you versus Umar. Yeah, Smitty was pushing for me versus Umar. I heard Umar's, I think he's out for a little bit, isn't he? Okay, I don't know. I mean, I think you know a lot more than you're leading on, to be honest. Hmm. But did you like that idea?

I mean, Umar, yeah, that's definitely interesting. There's, I think, there's, we'll see how the division plays out here soon. Oh, wow. I feel like I'm gonna open my phone tomorrow morning. He's back. Yeah. UFC wow. I feel like I'm gonna open my phone like tomorrow morning. He's back. UFC 3. We'll play this too. We'll see. We'll see. No, no, it's good. I think this is good. This shows that you're not just sitting there licking your wounds in a dark room. the show goes on, as they say. The show goes on, yeah.

I'm, I want to, you know, capitalize on, on my youth. I'm 30. I want to, you know, take advantage of being, you know, when I'm healthy. I definitely don't want to sit around and not fight, you know, this is what I do for a living. This is what I want to do and I get to do this. And yeah, I definitely don't want to sit around.

Did you talk to the president? Just, you know, shook his hand after the fight real quick that that was it. But yeah, no, no, nothing other than that. He didn't offer any words of encouragement, wisdom? Unfortunately not. That's all right. You didn't need it. Yeah, no, I'm all right. Life's good.

And you're not gonna go on vacation or anything now because you just had a baby. My life is a vacation area. Even if I am gone, I'm like, I wanna go home. I love my house, I love my property. I'm building up my custom dream house right over there. I got all my recovery tools and cold plunge and sauna and all my stuff at my house.

So it's like, anytime I leave anywhere, it's pretty much just want to go back home. Yeah, it's an inconvenience. So what you're building, so where are you living now? If you're building the house. I'm living in the house it's an inconvenience. So, so the, what you're building, so where are you living now? If you're building, I'm living in, I'm living in the house that I that's on the property. I'm building a house, another house, just a yeah. And then what will you do with the one you're currently living in?

Um, I haven't fully decided yet. I do want to, I'll probably put a little poker room in here put a little poker room in here a little poker room in the living room Have a couple offices in the house You know guest house for if someone you know some kind of some family needs to come over Maybe need to bring a training partner in for a specific opponent. Just have a have it up open for that I was wondering if I could come by But I really are more than welcome anytime Once the the new build should be up in November, December.

Oh, wow. Moved in. So more than welcome to come try the Java house, Tim's coffee shop, check out the gym. I'm going to be on Tim's pod on Thursday, actually. There we go. OK. You need to come do it in person. I would. Oh, gosh, I would love that.

I mean, look at this weather. It looks fantastic. We would do the Timbo Sugar Show. We'd come back, we're doing special episodes only whenever I feel like it. And that would be a special episode. That would be incredible. We will do that. And let me just ask you, as far as like the house is concerned,

what makes it the dream house? Like what makes it special as far as what you're putting in there, the one that you're building? It's just a huge master bedroom and bathroom. And the living room and kitchen are super open and huge ceilings. I'm putting a slide in there for my daughter. Wow.

From the top, from the upstairs down to the bottom. I'm gonna put a a really cool indoor kids, like jungle gym room upstairs, and it's gonna be epic. That's incredible. Well done and well deserved. Last question. Could you tell us, you don't have to tell us

the actual name, but is there a name on your mind right now as far as who makes sense for your return? Yes. There is. Yeah. And who is the name? It's a bit, I mean, it's, I don't know. We'll see.

We'll see how I feel this week. Okay, but there is someone there. Is there a date as well? Just depends on how I feel. There's, you know, it depends on, the date depends on how I feel. The's, you know, it depends on the date, depends on how I feel the date or how I feel. It depends on, you know, there's a lot, there's a lot to unravel.

But as of right now, I'm chilling, recovering, hanging out, you know, I'm going to continue and to, I'm going to go, I went and drilled a little bit this morning and didn't really train too much, but a drilled a little this morning. So we'll see how I feel this week. Love it. Thanks for doing this, man.

Really appreciate it. Of course. Happy Father's Day again. Great performance and we don't take it for granted. So really appreciate the time and looking forward to seeing this fight in like a couple of weeks that you're hinting at. I can't wait.

Thanks, Sean. You're the man. Yep. Peace out, guys. There he is. The great Sugha Shana O'Malley. Very much appreciate him coming on. And that's interesting because sometimes it's like, hey, you know, I'll be away for six months.

Sounds like there's something cooking, right? It sounds like there's something there. What is it? Well, let's just look at the roster here. Umar, he says that for a bit. Jan's got to fight. Corey's fighting. Is it Song? Is it Davison?

Is it Batista? No, they're kind of boys. Is it Rob Font? Cheeto? Henry? Is it Henry? Is it Habi? I don't know who it is.

Hey, maybe it's our next guest. Maybe it's me. Maybe it's our next guest. Our it's me. Maybe it's our next guest. Our next guest stole the show this past Saturday in Atlanta. He wanted to fight in his home state. He's from nearby Augusta. He got the fight in Atlanta, the UFC's first fight back in Atlanta since 2019.

And yeah, obviously, Usman gets to win, Rose gets to win, former champions, legends. But I feel like everyone was talking about Malcolm Wellmaker, about his vibe, his entrance, the knockout, how he set it up, the post-fight stuff, everything. I mean, it feels like we are watching a future star, a future superstar, a future champion develop, blossom in front of our eyes. He had a tremendous contender series showing right hook knockout. He had a tremendous UFC debut a couple months ago right hook knockout. He had a tremendous return back home to his

home state of Georgia right hook knockout. He's kind enough to join us right now. Let us say hello for the first time on this program to Malcolm Wellmaker. There he is. Hello Malcolm. How are you? I'm good brother, how you doing? I'm doing great. Man, it's such a pleasure to watch you compete. Just watch you, man. Always a massive smile on your face. You're so happy, you're so positive.

You're so appreciative and grateful. And then you perform like that. Just, I just want to say off the top, congratulations on everything going on in your life because it's a real joy to watch you from afar. Thank you so much, man. I try to stay humble, you know, I try to take in every moment and I know everything I got right now. Just some of the biggest blessings I dreamed up for a long time. So I'm glad to be here. Have you always been this type of person, just constantly smiling and being positive or has this developed over time?

Yeah, I think as far back as I can remember, man, I've always been a pretty happy guy, somewhat bubbly. And yeah, man, I realized how much the people resonate with it. So I just lean into it even more. And so obviously this was a big opportunity for you, right? You were talking about this. You're from nearby Augusta. If they would have gone through the card and for whatever reason you couldn't get a fight,

they said it's full whatever, would you have been bummed would you have been devastated if you weren't fighting on Saturday? Yeah I was bummed because I thought I wasn't gonna fight you know I mean we was getting close you know matchups wasn't happening and I badly you know wanted to compete on the Atlanta card so I was bummed and when it came through man it was a dream come true. Because it was just a couple of weeks ago, right? Yeah, it was I got the phone call on June 3. It was 11 days out.

And where were you when you got the call? I was asleep. My phone was ringing. And I woke up, I turned over, it was my manager. The previous matchup we had fell out because of an injury. And my manager was an 18 second call Jason House. He said, the green hair kid fought Sean O'Malley, Chris Mutino, you wanna fight him? I said, hell yeah. And he said, okay, I'm on it. And hung up, that was it.

That's incredible. And now at that point, were you like sort of coming to terms with the fact that this won't happen, this won't come to fruition? Yeah, after the last guy we had, we found out he got injured. I thought it was over with, but my manager, you know, like I said, he held on to it and he kept saying it was going to happen.

Did you know who Chris Metina was? Yeah, I watched Chris Metina fight Sean O'Malley live. I remember it. And I even remember seeing him get the ice cream sandwich afterwards and being a fan of him and how tough he was was how much heart he had and You know rooting for him. So when the name came across I was very familiar with him And so we're talking about your demeanor and how you you look at life because you were fighting at home Were you super anxious? Were you nervous? Did you feel the pressure of trying to impress your you know, your your your your state your city?

Yeah, I felt that pressure naturally, but not enough for it to actually affect me. When I was in the warmup room, I had the nerves a little bit, not much more than usual, but once I walked out and they dropped my song and the crowd went crazy, man, I was right back to the place I am when I'm in front of the lights.

Okay, we'll get to the song in a moment, but speaking of the warmup room, the footage that was dropped afterwards of you doing the exact same sequence that you pulled out, like look at this. Hey. Bro, what the hell? I mean, this is beautiful.

You go to the body, then you fake to the body with the same kick, and then you knock him out, except the difference is that wasn't a hook. That's more of like a straight right overhand. So tell me how you did this, because I think I've watched that knockout like a thousand times now. Everything from the first kick, the setup, then the fake, then how precise and clean that right hook is.

I mean, it's one of the most beautiful knockouts I've ever seen. It really was. Yeah, man. Man, my coaches are geniuses. If I wish I could, I might even start doing it, recording them and saying they think this is gonna be it and lining it up with the knockout.

The past two fights, the two knockouts before him, it was the same exact scenario. They predicted the exact entrance, the exact shot, and it just so happened that we were working the concept at least for the knockout that happened this time. You know, they knew working the legs, working the body was gonna make the knockout so much easier. And that's where I started at.

Once I started seeing him really bite on the face and knowing that the damage to the body was hurting, I knew it was only a matter of time that the knockout was coming. If you could, could you describe, what does it feel like to connect with a right like that? And the body just go like that clean, that beautifully, perfectly.

What does that feel like to a human being like you? It's absolutely insane, man. You know, the same motion that you do when you hit a bag, but instead you hit a target and the body that you hit just responds by collapsing and the sound of the shot, the sound of the crowd, you know, reinforcing the moment, brother, it's astronomical. It's incredible.

I can't even put it into words. How many times have you watched it? I can't count them more than you have. I bet. I bet. All the different angles as well. There's like one from the cage, the broadcast, fan cams, right? Yeah man, it's too good man. Every time I have a moment to sit down and watch it and look at the shots that led up to it man, I'm just admiring it and man it's perfect. It's gonna live on for a long time. You've had some great knockouts. Fair to say that's number one.

Yes, sir. Um, what about the walkout? So, so you want it to represent, I saw you say at the post-fight, you had a bunch of songs, you had two, and then you went with a different one. Right. So tell me how we got to that song and what that song means to Atlanta. Yeah, man. So it's a ton of, so even regionally, whenever I fight, I always try to pick a song that's

special and has some type of tie with me and my audience. And a lot of times when I fight in Atlanta, because I fought in Atlanta regionally plenty of times, I always go into an Atlanta artist. So I wanted to come out to the future of Or Young Thug. And I narrowed it down to two songs that really get me in the zone. But I felt like it was a little bit too underground. It was a little less known. And so for the week of the fight,

I was putting together an Atlanta artist playlist just for me to warm up to, move around to, hit myths. And I came across, oh, let's do it. And I was like, man, why did I not make this the song? And so fortunately enough, I hadn't sent them the song yet And I played it and one time was all I needed to make a hard decision that that was gonna be the one You also said a few times in the post fight that you were looking to get ratchet. I think it was the word What is what is ratchet? What is it? What does that mean to you ratchet when you say that?

Man getting right to this just you know a good time, getting a little rowdy, breaking a couple rules with the guys that I grew up with, man. We all got a little checkered background, you know what I mean? And we have a good time. We got so many crazy memories. And those was all the guys that came to the fight.

So that's kind of what I was talking about. Did you actually, in the end get ratchet? No, I didn't. You didn't? Fortunately enough, no, because- I thought you wanted to get ratchet. I did, but by the time the fight started, it was like one in the morning,

I met up at the hotel lobby with all the people who come to see me, from Augusta, Atlanta, just so many local guys. And by the time I got done, taking pictures, shaking hands, and holding conversations, it was like four in the morning, man. And it was time for me to go home. So no Ratchetness yet in Atlanta,

but this weekend I might make up for it. And forgive me for asking, is Ratchet the same as Lit? Is it the same as Crunk? Or are these different levels? Yeah, they're all brothers. Okay, all right. Is Ratchet an Atlanta or a Georgia thing? Probably, I would say so.

It's probably more often used in this area. And could I ask, what about this, you said Checkered Pass. What is this Checkered Pass that you're talking about? So particularly, I mean, most of my Atlanta homeboys is guys that I went to college with. So I went to Georgia Southern, but I got expelled from Georgia Southern.

And at the time when I was out there, man, we was all pretty wild boys. I mean, we partied all the time. A lot of the guys that was also out there at Georgia Southern with me was guys that I went to high school with. I also got kicked out of high school and went to alternative school.

I got a spotty history, man. It's not necessarily the focus of what a lot of people know about me It's more so the blue collar stuff But man before I got into the trade man in school always got in trouble You know, I ran into the law a couple times and me and my friends, you know When we look at where I came today That's the kind of stuff that makes it so valuable because you know

I lived far from a life that you would have thought would have led to something like this. Why did you get expelled? From the high school or the college. Oh okay well let's start with the high school. Well I was at this school it was actually a school that had a big drama program and like music program and stuff like that and I was a problem child always getting in fights they always you know was giving music program and stuff like that. And I was a problem child always getting in fights. They always, you know, was giving me detention and stuff like that. Well, one year I found out how to make fake tickets

to this big show that they was doing. And I got caught making counterfeit tickets and pushing them at the school. So they kicked me out to that. And then in college, I got into an altercation with a police officer during a fire drill where they was trying to search my apartment, long story short.

It's a lot of details, but that's essentially what happened and ended my career at Georgia Southern. Okay, and what year were you in? I went to Georgia Southern in 2012, 2013. No, meaning like, was that your freshman year, your junior? Yeah, that was my freshman year. Okay, so I wasn't there long at all.

What did you do after that? I came back to Augusta, and I stayed at my mom's house for about six months. I worked at Food Lion, and then I picked up a second job at a car center making 850, and I worked two jobs. And me and all my ratchet homeboys moved into a house where the rent was $600, it was trapped out. And we stayed there for six years, bro.

Me and my, the guys that do my videos, nah, the camera guys, my brother and my best friend, they stayed with me in this house. We rented that house for six years, and that was around the time when I got into the apprenticeship for pipe fitting, and then shortly after, started fighting. So at this point, in these early days, you are not a fighter, So at this point in these early days,

you are not a fighter, right? You're not practicing martial arts, you're not doing anything, right? No, I never had a boxing lesson, Jiu-Jitsu, wrestling class, not a single anything before the age of 22 when I was in my second year of apprenticeship already. Who introduces you to this?

I had a guy in particular, his name was Kyle Mathis and another guy named David Cornforth. Fitters and welders in the trade. I was working at a plant with him. And I was starting to get out of shape because I was drinking beer all the time. I was in the construction industry and the lifestyle was just getting worse and worse. And I wanted to get in shape. And these two guys in particular had done MMA or Jiu Jitsu in their past. And they were like, hey man, you should try MMA. You can get in shape and then you can learn

to defend yourself. And so that in turn led me to trying the gym that I'm at now, and I met those guys, the Faglans, and I never left, and it snowballed into this. Were you aware of UFC? Like did you watch fights? Were you a fan at all? No man, I knew Jorge Masvidal, John Jones,

and Anderson Silver, and that was literally about it. I knew nothing else. I never saw a live event ever. And when I got into the sport was when Conor McGregor was, I believe, about to fight Nate Diaz for the second time. And so I became, like, a Conor fan because the craze was, you know, all about him. And that's when, like when my UFC fan life started. So when you're just starting out,

are you taking to it right away or are you getting beat up? What are those early sessions like for you? This is a funny story we always tell, but on my first day I got dropped by two of my coaches. Wow. They hand kicked me and put me on my ass. And I was hard-handed enough to show back up the next day and they said they knew after that that I was gonna be able to make something

myself. But yeah it was bro I was the worst guy in the gym for a long time. I only did kickboxing so when I decided after about a year to transition into MMA I mean the high schoolers was putting me on my back and I was a grown man working a construction job. I mean, it was, I was the nail and never the hammer for years and years, but I was seeing progress and Pops, you know, Jake and Joel, my coaches' dad, convinced me I could be somebody and I bought in. When did you start to believe like this could actually

be a career for you and not just a fun thing on the side. I believe that I could actually do something with it when I got invited to fight for Jorge Masvidal on Icon FC. It was my second pro fight. A guy from first round reached out, he put me on the show and I got a knockout. It was one of my craziest knockouts against Langston Sykes and Jorge Masvidal gave me a thousand dollars in cash and told me that I was going to be famous. Wow, and that's when you were like, okay, this could be a thing.

Yeah, no, that was literally when I was like, okay, maybe I can go to the UFC, because I mean, locally I had Augusta shows and all the coworkers and family and friends were like, oh, you're gonna do big things and this and that. And I was doing good, but I didn't think I could go to the D-U-F-C, but when I made it to Icon and somebody who I've known for years and looked up to an admirer

Who's been on the highest level tells me from their own mouth that I'm going to be able to do it then I was like Okay, maybe maybe it's really real and according to your topology you had nine amateur fights. You went eight and one right? Some not a one nine and one. Okay and one, okay. So you're 10. A lot of guys don't have that many amateur fights. Why did you have so many? I had so many because my coaches wouldn't let me go pro. Oh man. I think I'm it.

But that's really the approach that they take. You know, they try to develop the guys in the amateur scene as much as possible, try to take the hardest challenges that we can find before we go pro so that when we do, we can really be active. And I think when I went pro, I took like my first five fights within a year because I was just at a place where I was ready

for that competition. And so those amateur fights, you're not getting paid for them, right? No. You were probably like, come on, man, let me go get paid, right? Yeah, I was sick of it. Even if it's a couple hundred bucks,

it's better than nothing. Yeah, man, fighting as an amateur is tough and especially when you get to the point where we were, like we was, I remember traveling to Florida, like driving seven hours. We even drove to Virginia once for a fight because eventually locally it's hard to find the tests and challenges that you need.

So it was real frustrating, but man, it paid off in the long run. And so when you're climbing the ranks and this is all coming to fruition, are you ever thinking like, yo, if these guys don't tell me to do this, what will my life be? Like, do you ever play that game?

And what do you think your life would be? Like, who would you be right now if you don't have these two guys in your life who say like, hey, you should try this out. You could defend yourself, have some fun. What would you be doing now? You know, I think about that a lot. And I honestly don't know.

I don't want to throw like the cliche out there like that. I got a lot of friends that's like dead and in jail because thank God a lot of people that are growing up wouldn't care about none of them are dead. But I do have a lot of friends that are either in jail or have a criminal history or just have you know careers that's somewhat dead end and I never thought myself to be somebody that was going to be significant or have an impact on the people around me or even be memorable. So I have no idea where I would be I mean I'd probably be in the construction industry you know saying as I was already ended but um other than that I really I really have no idea where I would be. I mean, I'd probably be in the construction industry, you know, seeing as I was already in it.

But other than that, I really have no idea, man. How did you get into construction? Man, this is funny. So my mom, she worked in the office for a pediatric center. So she was at the front desk and there was this lady in the office who was dating a pipe fitter. was this lady in the office who was dating

a pipe fitter and this pipe fitter was like tricking off on her. I mean he was spending money on her and she always comes to the job talking about how her boyfriend's a pipe fitter. He make money, he do this, he do that. And my mom was like, what's a pipe fitter? How do you get in? And so she finds out about the union and finds out that they do the application process twice a year. So she gets the information and sends it to me. She's like, Malcolm, you need to go do this. They make good money. And I know at all what a pipe fitter was and what they did. But I went down to the hall, I did an application,

I did some interviews and they do like some standardized tests for math and reading. And I scored pretty high, man. And I think every year or twice a year, they do the rankings for everybody who applied. And as they need apprentices, they call down that list based off of the scores. And I was like score five out of over a hundred.

And less than three months maybe after I did that application process is when I got the phone call to join the apprenticeship. And I was in construction ever since. And how many years were you in construction for? Close to 10, a few months. Wow. So especially now that you've gone on everyone's radar,

I saw the videos that you were posting of you at your job. This is a tough gig, man. Look at this stuff. This is you preparing for your UFC debut. Like, look at this life that you had. That's 7.30 in the morning. So like, what was your typical day before you left the job? What's your typical day like?

So Monday through Thursday, I would have to clock in at 7 AM and we get off at five, 530 PM. Um, 10 hour shifts Monday through Thursday. Sometimes we work Fridays. Um, and this was the most recent job I worked. So the job I maintained for the last two and a half years of my pro career, this is what it was. And so Monday through Thursday, I get off at 530. I bolt to the house. I get to the gym by seven and I train from 7pm until about 930 or 10 depending on if I have partners that'll stay late and work with me. And then Friday mornings, I'd wake up and I'd go for a run Friday evening, I'd wrestle Saturday morning, I wake up and lift Saturday evening, I do rounds Sunday morning, I do juj a run Friday evening, I'd wrestle Saturday morning. I wake up and lift Saturday evening.

I do rounds Sunday morning. I do jujitsu and Sunday evening. I do conditioning. So working, training Monday through Thursday and two a day Saturday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Aren't you exhausted? Yes, I was exhausted. I was sick. I wasn't able to be there for my family, friends, events, vacations for years and years and years.

Um, but I held onto for years and years and years. But I held on to this dream and it paid off. Did you have any kind of social life during this period? Not really, man. My life is work, training, come home. And my complete social circle was just training partners, teammates, and just, just my close family. At any point are you like, man, I'm doing all this and I don't know if it's going to happen. Like, did you ever lose hope in the midst of it?

Once you start to believe, once you get the money from Asvidal, did you ever think like, maybe this is not going to work out for me and it will all be for naught? Yeah, man. I had many of those moments. You know, there were jobs that,

so when I worked at that two and a half year job, there were jobs where we had opportunities to travel out of state four weeks at a time and make big money. A lot of times I had to sit out on those jobs and I didn't get to get ahead like all the other guys. Crazy story, but in April, before my contender series fight, I had this truck, a F-250 I bought.

It got repossessed because I was going broke. I couldn't keep up with the bills I had. It was tough, man, and a lot of times it got dark and I didn't know if it would be worth it I didn't know if I would ever make it to the UFC or even if I'd have success in the UFC But like I said man pops Jake Joel man, they they kept they kept the belief in me. They kept pushing me they kept telling me it could be done and I stayed the course. That's wild because that contender series fight

was in August of last year, right? And here we are like, so this time last year, June of last year, you're on the verge of getting your car, you know, repossessed and not being able to, like, and look at you now. Would you believe this? If we talked this time last year, would you have believed any of this?

Nah, I wouldn't even believe that they told me I was going to be on your podcast, bro. My manager told me that you wanted to talk. I was, you know, over the moon. And so this is all crazy. My life has done a complete flip since, you know, even less than a year ago. Incredible. What a story. It really is amazing.

And it's for that reason that it's so fun to root for you truly. And then after your debut, you decide to quit, right? Why'd you do that? Because, you know, for me, being a union worker, first of all, you know, I can call at any point down to the hall as long as I got my dues paid and asked them to put me to work and they'll tell me where to go. It might be local, it might be up the road, but I can go get a paycheck in the industry any day that I need to.

So I always have that cushion behind me. I have a really good name in the local, so work's not hard to find. But with a cushion like $50,000, my bills are paid for a good chunk of time, and it gives me the ability to not have to be exhausted and not have to be tired and having just a little bit left in me at the end of the night in my training session.

I mean, I'm training twice a day, three times a day, and my energy levels are through the roof. I'm working with these guys at the Performance Institute, and I'm learning all this stuff I never knew. I mean, just my potential and my ceiling has risen so much. And it's because I was willing to take that chance at being a full-time athlete. And so you're done with that, right?

Like you have no interest in going back. Yeah, man, God willing, I will never have to put on a hard head again. What was that day like when you told them, thanks for everything, but I'm out? It was good, man. You know, all my coworkers were rooting for me. They watched the fight and they all knew that if I got a bonus, because they,

they, I told them if I get it, bro, I'm quitting. And so I woke up that morning. I had on sweats and a hoodie. I sat there, Bojangles got some biscuits and I came in and we all sat at the break table. We talked for about an hour. Just reminiscing on the knockout, talking about all the good times, the dirty jobs, and what my future looked like.

And we hugged each other. I rounded up my tools and I left the job site. Were any of those guys at the fight on Saturday? No, man, none of those guys. But guys that I've worked previous jobs in the actual, the local way have come to the fight though. Yeah. And I'm sure that made it supremely special. What about your mom?

Is she able to watch you fight? Yeah, man. My mom, she loves the fights. My auntie, my cousins, brothers, all of them, they was there in Atlanta. They was at the Airbnb when I went back afterwards to eat some pizza and breadsticks. And they came to the hotel too when I went to meet everybody.

So my family is huge, huge supporters of everything I got going on. Did your house get banged up from the hurricane last year? Yeah, it was bad, man. I actually, I got a lot of pictures on my social media, man. I had a tree that fell on top of my house. Yeah, oh, yeah, I got that. Yeah, you all know.

Yeah, I had to get my roof replaced. The yard was messed up. The fence got completely ruined. That was my close teammate's driveway. You know, he lost all his vehicles. A tree fell through his house. They're still currently cleaning up like the Riverwalk and the canal

from the mess and debris from that hurricane. It was the biggest tragedy we've had that I can remember. And is your house okay now? Yeah, my house is good, man. Other than the damage to the roof and a little bit of the siding in the yard, my house is fine, completely good. I'm in it right now and I'm not complaining at all.

Okay, so a relatively quick turnaround here. How fast do you want to come back? As soon as it makes sense, man. My manager asked me, you know, are you healthy? I told him, yeah, and I saw him go to type it on his phone. I don't know what he was looking at. But, you know, as soon as something good comes across, that's a great opportunity. I'm ready for it, man. You know, I pretty much live in the gym. I don't plan on taking too much time off at all. I got a little bit of soreness, not much, but I will be in the gym. I don't plan on taking too much time off at all. I got a little bit of soreness, not much, but I will be in the gym later this week

and probably next week implementing my full-time schedule all over again. Is it one of those things where maybe like your coaches are saying, okay, now, you know, we got a few, you don't want to go back, back, back, back to, back, to, back, to, back to where you're fighting too often, right? And burning yourself out or is everyone on board with you fighting as often as possible?

Yeah, no, they, they, they in support of whatever I want to do, man. If I told them I wanted to take some time off to enjoy, you know, the victories they before it. And if I tell them I want to fight every four to six weeks, you know, they are on board. They believe in me. And the place I'm in right now, I'm in such good shape. I'm mentally in such a good place where I want to compete very frequently and all the elements in my life Are you know aligned with my mission at hand? You know, I'm I'm in a little bit later than most and I know that this time frame I have has to be used

urgently, so I'm driven man, and I'm prepared to compete as often as necessary. Why do they call you the machine? Man my it was my very first kickboxing match coming up and Pop, he was just like, I got a nickname, we gonna call you Malcolm the machine. I don't even think my cardio was good back then. You know what I mean? I just think that it had a nice ring to it

and Pop said it, so when Pop said it, it's lost. So I ran with it and never let it go. And is Walla because of your last name? No, no, no. So it's a long story, but you know, this ratchet group of fans I was talking about, we all used to rap. And I didn't have a rap name.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I didn't have a rap name. And it was a story where this girl said I was cute like Koala and my friends went from cooking me, calling me Koala to being like, hey, your rap name should be K Walla and then we eventually dropped the K just went with Walla and from that point forward it was like when I was like 13 14 all my friends would be calling me Walla ever since so uh yeah that just been something that I've been running with

and I actually named my son Walla who was born on May 19th. Oh wow like just a couple weeks ago? Yeah three weeks ago he came on a fight trip with me. Wow, congratulations, happy Father's Day. Thank you. First son, first child? Thank you, thank you. Wow, what was that like? Incredible man, life is good, big blessing.

You know, after the fight, I went back to the Airbnb and I was holding him and that was the picture that I posted along with the one of me celebrating my victory in the cage, man Fatherhood is it's incredible man. It's big and I can't wait for him to grow up and go back and search all the things I'm doing right now. Amazing. You even have your own shirt. I think I see you rocking it. Yeah. Yeah, that's it My merch where can people get this? Grizzly fight co.com, man. This is uh, it's actually a company that a really close friend of mine does.

His name is Dill and he designs all these things, man. He fulfills the orders and we chop it up on the phone and come up with these ideas. And he's a absolute genius, man. So shout out to him, grizzlyfightco.com. We got a few of these left. It's a 404 themed shirt. So it's got like a 404 Atlanta billboard on it.

And we got some other good ideas coming So yeah, grizzly fight cold icon Well, we love what you're doing here and and I think you met another member of the team when you were on his show A couple of weeks ago Connor who's also from here. Look at the shirt. He's wearing today. Look at this guy Rocking your shirt. Hey, shout out to your guy Dylan man. I actually met him story I met him on Saturday night. You know, you guys dropped this shirt right after you got the fight announcement.

Unfortunately, USPS messed it up, so I didn't get it in time. Dylan at the arena hand delivered it to me. So I had it on when you made the walk, man. It was incredible. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Look at that. Bro, thank you.

I remember you telling me you wanted one, and then I saw you said you ordered it. But with the, bro, the phone call coming on June 3rd, we had, I mean, that day I called my boys and I was like, bro, we gotta get this photo shoot done. And we immediately tried to put the website together, get printing done. It was just an absolute mess.

But even with that being said, he did such a good job at trying to make sure people got him, accommodating for people that didn't get them in time. And man, he's a, he's a superstar. So thank you for the support, man. And shout out to Dale. Hey, you're a superstar and it's amazing what you're doing and how far you're going to go. It's going to be a lot of fun to watch you rise up those ranks.

Well done. Congratulations on all the blessings going on in your life. Great to meet you and great to have you on for the first time. And hopefully the first of many. Thank you so much, Malcolm. Thank you so much, man. I had a blast. I can't believe I'm here, man. Y'all have a good one. You too. All the best. Wow. What a guy. Malcolm Wellmaker, aka The Machine. I love this guy. Thank you, man. I appreciate it. I absolutely love him. He's tremendous and he fights like a freaking stud as well. He's not just like a pleasure to talk to. He's not just, you know, I mean, look at the vibe look at the positivity look at the smile but did you see the knockout I wish we could played here but you've seen it you have to have seen it there's

a there's a guy named Jason who I follow last name escapes me I don't want to butcher it but it starts with an a a m a e g I I think it is in any event he posted like a like an almost like an octagon side. It was clearly like someone here shooting it like from the cage social media. And you just see the precision with which he throws and lands that right hook. Golly. And again, it's the setup. As they say, he's investing, he's investing in the body kick say he's he's he's investing he's investing

in the the body kicks he's investing he's investing and then he faints and so Moutinho bites goes down a little bit and it was oh my god standing straight and just freaking he's he's incredible yeah I also didn't know this about him Georgia Southern 2012 2012, 2013. I was also there. You were there? Who knows, maybe we crossed paths. I thought you went to Georgia.

Yeah, but I had to start at Georgia Southern. My grades in high school were shit. Wow. I couldn't get into Georgia right out of high school. Those same years? Yeah, we're the same age. We're both 31, so it would make sense that freshman year we were both there at the same time.

You know, it's wild that he's 31, because he only started, I think he only started training when he was 22 or something like that. God bless him, it feels like he's like 25. Yes, it feels like he's 23. He looks like he's 25. I was gonna say to him like,

you had a kid already, you're so young, he's 31. God, that's a superstar right there. The man, can't wait for his next one. Yeah, I hope Atlanta gets, you know, Atlanta fans are sort of notorious for not really getting behind their guys, right? I feel like we never get, who's the best UFC fighter from Atlanta?

No, just in general, in sports. Not like the most hardcore fans, right? I disagree. Hawks, never really sell out, Braves. Okay, Braves is, I can argue strongly. People love the Braves the most out of anyone But do they go to the games? Yeah, dude The game I was out on Friday was against the worst team in baseball rainy Friday night and it was completely sold out. All right

Falcons I'll give you a Hawks. I'll give you yeah, George. I will know well that's different college I know I know I know college is different. Well, let's talk to another big winner from Saturday he had a big win over the veteran, Court McGee, and he was representing in the greatest of ways. Let's talk to our pal, Michael Quesa, who was there, and Victorious. Hello, sir. Oh, look at that shirt.

That is a nice looking shirt right there. Golly, I love that. Can we just start off with this? First of all, congratulations. How are you? It's good to see you. But on Friday, you know, let me, I want to tell you a little bit of a backstory here. Uh, Mike, so this weekend was my son's bar mitzvah and I had been planning this for about a year.

And there were a lot of people coming in from out of town and there were a lot of things going on. And I was nervous and I was anxious and I was stressed. And there I am Friday afternoon evening and I get a text video from you. And I first I see it pop up and I'm like, what is this? Like he's fighting, like what could he possibly be sending me? It's probably like way in time. Can I play the video?

Absolutely run it. Okay, this is the video that Michael Casey sent me which put the biggest freaking smile you have no idea and actually made me chill out. It was a gift. It was a gift. It was a gift that you gave me. Here it is. You're gonna love me for this.

I just wanna say, fuck Trey Young, go Knicks! Ha ha ha! That was, yo, that was un-freaking believable, man. Well done. That was better than anything you did this weekend with all due respect for the fight. Incredible. And you know what I loved so much about it? The mascot thought you were going to say something nice.

He was all happy and then he wanted nothing to do with it. Bravo. Oh, it's pretty funny. And I talked to the guy that was wearing the suit afterwards and he was actually from New York. So it was pretty funny. Wow. It was pretty ironic.

Yeah. I don't think he was a Knicks fan still, but you know, I thought about it for my post fight speech I was like, man, maybe blow the top off a State Farm and You know give the fuck Trey Young You know go next thing on the mic, but never got to it. But nonetheless, I'm glad I got that video to send you Well, you dropped it in the post fight presser. You know what? I'm sort of happy you didn't if only because you're not a heel They would have booed you you didn't deserve that. I didn't want you to go through that from those people. Yeah, no, I agree. I got enough booze from

the fight as it is, but that was just kind of a tough crowd. Kind of a tough crowd. I kind of noticed it in Ricky Simone's fight, you know, but yeah, more booze. I don't think it really would have made a difference at that point. Maybe I was just going to go into the back. So now that you've had a couple, you know, you're very analytical, you also work as a great analyst as well. So I'm sure you've thought of the fight from an analytical perspective. How do you feel about the fight and your performance in particular? Well, I haven't gotten, I haven't gone back and watched it. I was going to watch it before I came on today. I just haven't gotten a chance to, but the thing is styles make fights

and Court McGee's kind of been on our radar for a while. And if you go back and watch his fights, unless you're Matt Brown or Jeremiah Wells, who, you know, were able to finish him, he's just a really hard guy to look good against. And I just knew this was a fight where I was gonna spend the majority of the fight on my feet. And if the opportunities that took

him down presented himself, I would take it. He didn't apply that heavier forward pressure that I was kind of expecting to give me those openings. And maybe I let the crowd get to my head a little bit. Maybe, you know, I kind of at times I would hear the crowd kind of booing and I would try to rush myself, get get extended let my chin come up But in hindsight when I look back on it, I am proud of myself. I stood up for 15 minutes I didn't shoot for one low-level takeout. I only attempted really one takedown in the whole fight

Now it's towards the end of the third. I Can tip my cap to myself for that? I think that you know, like I said courts a hard guy look good against, and I knew that this wasn't gonna be, like, Court's extremely resilient, he is impossible to submit. I've heard the stories from people in the training room that he's really, really hard to sub, and I'm just not a knockout artist,

I'm a submission guy, so I knew that this was gonna be a 15-minute fight. I just wasn't able to establish any dominance that I kind of was expecting from myself, just because I hold myself to that standard. And it never happened. But in hindsight, I'm glad I got the win, three wins in a row. The ball's rolling again. But it's just, like I said, it's just maybe I'll let the crowd get to me. It's like a mixed review online. I got some people that are like, hey, great fight, you know, way to stay, you'd stay on your feet, mix it up a little bit. And then of course I got the casual fans talking shit.

So it's like, you know, I just got to disregard the tweets, you know, shut off the message requests and stuff on Instagram. I don't want to fucking see it. I don't really care. I'm proud of myself. My team's proud of me. And um, yeah, you know, the ball's rolling again. That's what's most important. You're on a three fight winning winning streak you're winning in the UFC who gives a crap something they're not all gonna be you know highlight real submissions or knockouts or fight of the night it's like a win still a win and I

and a well-earned win is still a well-earned it's what you were gifted to the decision or anything like that like you won that fight. Yeah I feel like I won at fair and square like I said I said, I haven't gone, I've watched a few of the highlights, but I'm proud of myself, dude. I got out of my comfort zone. When have I ever stood for 15 minutes in a fight? Yeah, dude, I'm not Israel Adesanya, I'm not Alex Padeta.

Just cause I stayed on my feet, it's like you wanna criticize me for not going out and looking like I'm some elite sharp kickboxer. That's my base. Like, no, dude, I'm a grappler. Like that's, that's who I am. That's what I do. And for me to go out, get out of my comfort zone, win the fight the way I did show that I'm still evolving, show that I'm still growing 17 years into this sport. Um, you know, I'm proud of myself. So I was a little hard on myself at first.

And I had a really good phone call as well. I think you'll like'll like this. I have a good relationship with Chuck Liddell as you know Court McGee does as well that was his coach on Ultimate Fighter and he sent me a text he was like hey call me when you get a chance this was after the fight so I called him and I got back to my hotel room and he just said that you know it was kind of a hard fight for him to watch because he loves both of us you know we're both very close with him and just told me to be proud of myself no matter what. He said that he had Hakelman call him and tell him the results because he didn't want to watch the fight. Wow, wow. You know, and he just, you know, and I kind of expressed to him how I

kind of felt kind of the same sentiment that I said to you and he was just like, dude, I've trained with court so much and you don't hit him with the same thing twice. You tell him how to do something, you teach him something, he learns it and picks it up right away. He's just a good fighter, he's a savvy vet, he's seen it all. So, but it was a cool phone call because Chuck's a guy that's a close friend of mine,

someone I've looked up to since I was a kid and for him to kind of, you know, take the time to talk to me, it made me feel a lot better. And you know, obviously, you know, I lean on, I lean mostly on what my team tells me, but that adds a little extra something on top of it when the Iceman is giving you praise and you have that kind of conversation with him. I also saw you in court backstage, uh, exchanging shirts and whatnot.

So what was that like? It was awesome, dude. Court's a great guy. Like I really mean it when I say there's not as many people that I respect in this sport as a competitor as much as I respect Court McGee. I mean, his story is amazing. Everything he's overcome in his life, how much he helps people,

how much he puts himself out there, it just truly is one of the good guys of the sport. I'll never forget when I fought in Tampa in 2016, he gave me a bunch of free beard oil and I was just like, dude, what a guy, you know, just an awesome dude. So, you know, it's, it's one of those things where sometimes you got to kind of those people that you respect and you have the admiration for, you got to put that aside for 15 minutes or less and go fight them. And that's another thing about court. When you, when you talk

about his history and his past, you know, everybody knows the story of Court McGee. The guy doesn't feel pain, you know what I mean? He just doesn't stop coming. He has a bulletproof mind. He's one of the most mentally tough, physically tough guys in the sport. And like I said, he's just hard to look good against. He knows what he's doing, he knows how to fight.

He's been doing this for a long time. So considering how you feel about him, when you got this name, were you kind of like, oh man, like I don't really wanna fight this guy? A little bit, but there's also a weird part of it that's like, on the other side of the coin, it's like, you do kind of wanna lay it on the line against people like that, cause it's like,

well, if court gets the best of me, at least it's Court McGee, you know, a guy that, it's like, at least it's a good guy, you know, he's a real mensch, he's a good dude, you know? Like, I think, he think, you know, so there's one part it's like at least it's a good guy, you know, he's a real man. She's a good dude, you know, like I think he think, you know, it's so there's one part that's like, no, I like this guy a lot. This sucks. Then there's the other side. That's like, well, shoot me, the best man win. And if he gets the best of me, at least it's court McGee, a guy that I like, a guy that, you know, I maintain contact with, like we, we walked through the airport the next

day together for like 20, 20 20, 30 minutes just talking, talking about his kids, talking about the wrestling tournaments they have coming up and he's just a guy that I just genuinely like, you know? So sometimes it's good to fight those guys that you genuinely like and put on the other side of it, it kind of sucks as well. Yeah, by the way, I was looking through your stats

and maybe some of these aren't 100% and maybe you know otherwise. I believe this is the first time in your UFC career that you get a win and zero takedowns. Yeah, that is true. I didn't get a single takedown. I only really, there was one time in the fight when we got into a clinch situation early in the fight in open space and I thought about it and I was kind of feeling them out and I'm like, you know, Court's gas tank was kind of sitting in the back of my mind a little bit. I'm like, how much do I want to put into this takedown? And if I miss, and we're in open space, I do a better job on the fence sometimes. And then the second round, I kind of tried to drop for one and

just kind of slipped off. We're both pretty sweaty. But yeah, I think this is the first time I didn't shoot for a takedown. So yeah, it's like casual fans can go fuck themselves. Yeah, I don't care. You can say whatever you want to me. You know, I'm I don't want to see it, but it just doesn't it doesn't really matter. But like, I'm proud of myself. I'm still getting out of my comfort zone at 37 years old, trying new things. Just trying to expand myself as a competitor in terms of what I can do under the lights. And and yeah, like I said, I'm not a knockout artist. I doubt I'll ever get a knockout in my entire career. But the fact that I was able and willing to go out there and stand for 15 minutes,

I'm proud of myself. And no one can take that away from me. I remember when we spoke before the Tony fight, and so you were on the losing streak and you were kind of just sort of figuring things out. You needed to get maybe your confidence and mojo back. Here we are less than a year later, 10 months later, you've won three fights in a row. So what's the difference between you now and maybe June of last

year? June of last year I just was really, I was really unsure if I was even going to take the Tony fight. I just didn't know, physically I still felt good, but I just didn't know if it was my age getting to me. I know that in the past, you know, I've been pretty open about like struggling on what goes on between the years at times. But I think the biggest thing was just getting my confidence back. A lot of harsh conversations with myself, with my team, talking to my Uncle Joe, trying to sort out my mental woes. And I think at the end of the day, it's like, I just got to remember, like, I stress too

much about some sometimes about the people I'm fighting. And sometimes I got to remind myself, and people I'm fighting. And sometimes I gotta remind myself, and I gotta put my humility aside, and remind myself that I'm also a bad motherfucker, and I know how to fight. And these guys gotta worry about me as well. So, just a lot of that. And obviously, winning the Tony fight felt good.

Winning the Max Griffin fight felt a lot better. I felt like that was a fight where I was an underdog. Max hits really hard, he'd never been submitted and I went out there and did something that's never been done to him. That made me feel like I've definitely got my feet back underneath me and I still have something to give this sport.

So, and then I go out, and that's the thing too, is I go out and have this fight against Korten. Like I said, right after the fight, I'm just like, you would have thought I lost. I was just so mad at myself for some reason and After listening to my team and everything I just found things to like I should be proud of myself and I'm sure when I go back and watch it I'll feel even better than I do now about it But at the end of the day to win three fights in a row in the UFC to win one fight in the UFC is hard

Enough to win three in a row second longest win streak. I've been on since I've been in the UFC Yeah, dude, I'm proud of myself. You know, if you didn't like the fight, then fuck off. For lack of better words, shoot. And it's been workman-like and to do it at 37 is not easy as well. And so, well, like usually when you're 37, people are starting to ask like, okay, is this the end? Is this the end? Are you starting to think about the end? I feel like now all that is gone. Yeah, for sure. And the thing is too, it's like,

we just don't talk about the R word anymore. I used to like bring it up when I was like 30. Like I just, I way too young of an age to be talking about it, to be thinking about it. And the reality is like, you just go fight by fight and like I'll know when that time comes. But right now it's just not that time, you know? And I still,

I'm just going to go one fight at a time. I don't see myself really being a guy that's like, this is the last one. Like, this is going to be the last fight. I just don't think I'll be. I don't think that'll be my thing. I think it's just at some point in time, I'm just going to know it and I'll go with it. And I don't have to fight anymore. I really don't. I live a good life.

I have a second career outside of competition. I've been smart with my money. I don't have to do this anymore, but I'm doing this because I love it and I'm still able to. I might be so far removed from the title picture, but I still have little goals and things I can achieve along the way. I would love to beat Damien Maia's rear naked choke record. And so there's things, you know, I'd love to make it four fights in a row. So there's little things I want to achieve along the way that keep me hungry. And as long as I can put my feet to the fire and training with these young guys and still push my body and train the way that I have, while a little smarter than I used to. But as long as I can push myself the way that I did when I was in my 20s, I'm gonna keep fighting, man.

How far away are you from that record? I think I'm one win, one rear naked choke away from the tie and I think I need two to beat. But as it's, you know, records were meant to be broken anyway, so it's not like it's like I'm looking for some record to cement myself in the history books that you have seen, no, it's just, it's like a goal. Like it's, to get to the big goals, you have to win small ones along the way.

To win the war, you got to win a bunch of battles, you know? So it's like, for me, it's like, it's like if I'm still chasing big goals, my eyes always going to be at the top of the heap at 170 pounds. I got to set little goals along the way to try to achieve those, get closer to that. And I think the other thing about it too, Ariel,

is have fun. Like I just stopped having fun at some point. I just started to feel too much pressure. You lose to Luke A and then you feel the pressure. You gotta beat Shawn Brady and then now it's two in a row and again, two losses in a row for the second time in your career again. Now I gotta go beat Kevin Holland.

And it's like you just start dumping a bunch of unnecessary pressure on yourself and it takes away from the one thing that I love so much about this sport is how much, I mean, at the end of the day, it's fun. The fight day can be stressful, weight cutting can be stressful. There is definitely stress. You do have to manage fear. But in hindsight, I get to go travel the world with three of my best friends, Rick Little,

Sam Siciliano, Austin Arnett. These are guys I've been with for almost 20 years. I get to travel the world and do these things with them and we have fun. So it's like, make sure to still have fun while you're doing this. Don't let the pressure and the fear and all that bullshit get to you.

You gotta make sure to have fun. So at this point, how is your body, like the Monday after a fight, 37, I think you've been doing it like 17, 18 years. How does your body feel on the Monday after a 15 minute fight against someone like Court McGee? Surprisingly, I feel good. I think I fractured my foot.

I think I did it in the second round. So yeah, I definitely, yeah, my foot's pretty puffy. My toes are turning black. Okay. But body-wise, I feel good, man. Like in, this wasn't, you know, if there was more wrestling exchanges in that fight, I think I'd feel the wear and

tear a little more. We clashed heads really, really hard. I don't know if people were able to see it. That's why I kept rubbing the side of my head. I think that was without a doubt the hardest shot I took in that fight. That's one thing about me as well that's helped me extend my career is I have a big, I have a line I won't cross at this point. This kind of started probably like when I got in my 30s is no contact, no contact till I sign a contract. Like I'm not gonna go out and spar and put myself in harm's way unless I have a fight coming up. This is very important not just for myself but for my wife, for my family. I got to keep this as

intact as I possibly can while I'm still navigating a combat sports career. That headbutt was really hard, so I'm not gonna let my noodle get touched for a while. As the great Marshawn Lynch would say, you gotta protect your chickens. So right now I'm just protecting my chickens. I'll take some time off, help these young guys.

I think towards the end of the year, I'll get back in the mix. I got a lot of broadcasting stuff coming up July and June. I saw you hinting at some stuff that you didn't want to talk about but you said, I mean, like, it's right there. I know that's the dream for you. Yeah.

That's very exciting. Yeah, I'm, you know, I don't know if I can, I just... I don't want to get you in trouble. Yeah, I'm, you know, I don't know if I can, I just, I don't want to get you in trouble. I don't want, but I, you were at the presser and that's, everyone who's ever heard you talk about broadcasting knows where you want to be. You don't want to be on the desk. Like you want to be in the mix. It's very clear. And you hinted at some stuff coming up, which I'm delighted for you because you've been talking about this for as long as I've known you. Yeah, I love it, man. I just never thought, it wasn't a goal of mine

when I got in the UFC, but John Anik just planted that seed when I was an Ultimate Fighter and that seed has just grown and it's starting to sprout. And dude, I love getting on the other side of the camera and talking fights. I love it almost as much as I love competition. It's right there, it's neck and neck. And I just, I can't tell you how thankful I am and how much gratitude I have for my gamble paying

off. I really pushed my chips all in, in the middle and gambled on myself with this MMA thing, not just as a competitor but as a broadcaster. I don't have a gym. I don't have side businesses. I don't have a bunch of real estate rentals on the side. I was like, I'm going to take a shot at this broadcasting thing. They gave me an opportunity. They gave me a try and I gave it maximum effort and it's gotten me this

far to this point. And I think that for me, I think that if that day comes, maybe not if more of a when, when that day comes, you know, I get that commentary contract for the UFC, I think that it will validate my body of work. Nothing is guaranteed. So I just feel confident that I can get there. But I'm just very, very blessed. My family's blessed me and my wife that we have this second career of mine that just revolves around the sport.

I love it. But I have to admit, I have a thirst for more. When I get behind the desk Like I just I can't stop thinking about commentary like it's just like I even catch myself like there's a difference in between Being an analyst and sitting behind the desk and how you talk about the fights and how you approach commentary Obviously and for me I catch myself almost commentating these b-roll packages instead of Instead of like talking people through them.

It's like I'm having to catch myself pulling myself back. You're not there yet. You're not there. Focus on being an analyst. Continue to do this as best you can. But I have a thirst for more. I want more. I just feel like I can confidently say I'm ready to make that jump.

And I know it's going to be tough. It's just like your first UFC fight dude the brighter the lights the bigger the stage You're gonna have to manage your nerves and get yourself in a groove I know it's gonna be tough if that opportunity presents itself for me to become a UFC commentator But I'll figure it out along the way and I think that I could do a really good job at it Well people need to appreciate and understand is you weren't handed this someone didn't just say like hey Let's thrust you into this. You have to freaking work, scratch, claw your way into this spot.

Like maybe more so than anyone, honestly, because I think there was a time where you thought like you should have maybe gotten it sooner. But it all happened the way it should have. And you have had to fight for this. And so it's very, very commendable. That's why when I heard you say that on the press I was like fuck yeah man that's great I'm really happy yeah it's like I was the fun part about it is I want to be part of the narration of the fights like obviously I always say like the fighters tell the story and

like we get to help narrate the story you know we get a we get to be a little voice in the background that kind of gets to talk people through it the fights speak for themselves but it's like I want to have those soundbite type moments that you hear, you know, John Anik when he's talking about Leon Edwards being not cut from the same cloth, you know, things like that guy. I'm like, I'm like, God, I want to soundbite like that so bad someday. It just little things that I manifest in my mind. I think about them like, I just want to do that so bad. But the UFC knows what they're doing. I think that when I go back and look and I wonder how did I get here, because really, a lot of fighters ask to be on the desk, you know, and there are certain people that you can ask and

approach and a lot of fighters come to me and ask those names are and I just don't feel like I'm in a position to just offload a bunch of people onto those. They'll come find you. Usually you don't find them, they'll come find you. But I feel like they know what they were doing. I think they picked the right time and I think the right opportunities presented themselves. I think when COVID hit, and you know, cause I only did one show for Fox and then I did one for ESPN and Rio Rancho

and then we had the pandemic. And then I don't think I worked another death show until I think when I I think I did a paper view at my mom's in my mom's house in the basement in my shorts with a suit top but I got sent to Fight Island for a month they're like they this COVID was hitting people left and right they're like do you want to come out do three shows in a row and I think that I think I kind of showed that that I had some potential in those three weeks, especially when you have three consecutive weeks to do back to back shows to figure it out.

Cause usually your shows are spaced like a month apart, six weeks apart. When you get to do three in a row and you have John Anick and Daniel Cormier and Paul Felder and all these guys at your disposal for every show, I get to hang out with them for the week after and ask them, what did I do wrong? What should do better it just i think that that month in fight island is what put me over by the way uh speaking of of dc i know you

were on the ultimate fighter you got to go to wrestlemania with the guy geez louise what a time that would look at you man i'm jealous you have to go to wrestlemania get the vip treatment with dc how was it being back on the Ultimate Fighter, but on the other side of the fence, so to speak? You know, it was great, but I still feel like part of me, I didn't feel like a contestant, but you know how much I look up to Daniel Cormier. That's my guy. Like that's, I bought the same wrestling shoes as him when I was in high school. Um, so getting to be next to him for a month straight, as well as Bob as Bob cook You know the master mind of the sport the guys coached like almost 20 world champions Like I felt like I was learning a lot as well

Like it felt good to like lead these guys help him train. It was welterweight So I got to get on the mats with him and mix it up But kind of being around DC and seeing how he manages his life You know He's a really busy guy and seeing how he approaches his life, you know, he's a really busy guy and seeing how you approach his coaching his high school team is broadcasting obligations and all these other things like it kind of made me grow up a little more. I feel like I walked out of it a more more of a mature man than I than I did walking into it. But I love being on the other side of that. It's been on a bucket listing for me. I got to be a contestant.

It was great to be a coach. The fighters, we had a great team. Like we had some shows you get like a handful of fighters and you get a couple characters. And we all know what the characters are like. We had eight fighters, eight great fighters, eight great personalities. The training room was always rocking. Like these guys were willing to put in the work. Like we put them through some very, very hard workouts. They showed up left no stone unturned and the fights were were incredible. I mean we're what? Three fights in, tonight's or tomorrow's episode is gonna be awesome. I've got to tell you this, tomorrow's episode there's gonna be a first. Oh. And it's gonna be great. As long as they put the stuff in

that I think they're going to, this will be a first in Ultimate Fighter history. Wow. I can't say what it is, but you just have to tune in. It's going to be good. There's not a lot of firsts left. Not a lot of firsts left. It's just something that I don't think has ever happened in Ultimate Fighter history. I'm pretty confident it's never happened. That's a great tease. It's going to be good though, man. It's going to be good. And it's a great fight. It's a great fight. So tomorrow's episode should be a lot of fun. Okay. Appreciate that. Speaking of your weight class, by the way, were you surprised Usman Juan on Saturday?

You know, yes and no. I think Buckley, when I saw him beat Wonderboy, I said, okay, this guy can win a world title. This guy's got it. The work ethic, the drive, you could tell he's hungry, the way he fights, the ferocity, but mostly the hunger. And for him to, you would think that his stock would drop after the way things went the first

four rounds, but for him to come out that fifth round and just go out guns blazing, like he literally, if he was a gun, he didn't have a bullet left in his clip. He dumped out all the bullets around five and really tried to put tomorrow away and You got a commended for that. I don't think his stock dropped at all I think he learns a lot from this fight So I was a little surprised he lost because I thought maybe he'd be able to stop oosman But who's been went back to like vintage tomorrow oosman the heavy wrestling approach showed that he still is a force at 170 pounds Just makes this weight class that much more fun

because you're getting injected with all this new blood the Ian Garry's Shabkat Rachmanov Carlos Pratches there's so much young blood moving into the division and then you got Camaro you know really staking his claim that he's still the top dog so many fun fights he can make with him right now so i'm excited to see what they do with Camaro. I think that they do, if I was the UFC, I would do him and Balal. I think that's the fight that makes sense. I think that's the fight that definitely makes sense. But we'll see what happens. But so was I surprised? Yes and no. But nonetheless, I think both guys fought very well. Who's the champion of the welterweight division on January 1st?

Man I Just really hard to pick against Islam if Islam is really the guy that fights JDM. He's just got such a high Let's just take skills out of it. Let's just like look, you know, Jack della is an incredible boxer He's vastly improved with his ground game. You can tell the work with Craig Jones has been paying off these last couple fights Islam is just so well-rounded, but I just think Islam is just one of the smartest fighters on the roster, if not the smartest. He has such a high fight IQ and he's a dual threat. I mean he could take you down and submit you and he can knock you out on the feet. So if one thing's not working for him, he can always change gears and go the opposite

direction and still finish you. So it's just hard to go against, it's not even the skills, it's just the fight IQ. It's really hard to pick against the fight IQ of Islam. Now Islam and Shafkat, I think that could be a tougher fight, we'll see, but we're going to find out how good Islam is at 170 pounds when he fights JDM. So, and it's not, it's gonna really depend on how he wins. How hard of a fight is it? How well does he look up 15 pounds against guys that are bigger than previous guys that he's faced? It's gonna be pretty interesting.

By the way, life's going so well for you. You're now beating up couches in your, I think that's your backyard. What is that? What's going on over there with this couch? What is happening here? Look at this. Shout out to my guy, Brian at Spokane Furniture.

Brian Kuntzman, man, he, we talked in the past about getting some new couches and then COVID hit and we never got the deal done. And then I saw him at this viewing party for UFC 300. We like rekindled this deal, sitting on these nice new couches. I mean, Spokane Furniture, dude, they took great care of these. Yeah, those couches are sick.

I like that little. They're so nice. Yeah. But, so the plan was, I told him, let's make a video of me beating up my couch. And he was like, I don't want you to get hurt before your fight. And I was like, I'm not gonna get hurt, I'll be fine.

So when we're filming this video, we're out in front of my house, and I go out in the shop to get gloves. And I look at my boxing gloves And I go to grab them and I'm like no, let's grab fingerless gloves So I grabbed the fingerless gloves in that video when I flipped it dude I almost cut my finger down to the no and I I lied to was like, oh the cuts not that bad And this was like 10 days before my fight 11 days before my fight. I think it's like Tuesday or Wednesday

Dude, this thing was nasty. It didn't like go down to the bone was like 10 days before my fight 11 days before my fight I think it was like Tuesday or Wednesday dude this thing was nasty it didn't like go down to the bone it came in at like an angle so I had like this huge flap of skin and I was just like of course I've been injury free this whole camp and then I flip a couch with this video and cut my finger and I should have just got the boxing gloves or I should have just listened to Brian and not beat up the couch but he took good care of us, we're happy. My wife picked out the couches. She's amazing as always.

She knows what she's doing. Imagine, imagine the couch would have knocked you out of the fight, god forbid. That would have been. No, I would have fought no matter what. There's no way. I was already like coming up schemes in my mind of like how I would do this.

I think maybe even if I stitched it, I think they could have been out by then, but I was like definitely not thrilled. I was more worried about an infection. I kept thinking about Bilal's toe. Oh, geez. Speaking of Bilal, I kept thinking about Bilal's bad toe infection he had, and I'm like,

I still have to finish training. I still gotta use this hand. You know, so I was more worried about infection than anything. Gosh. It looks gnarly even 10 days later. It looks like it's a little bit still like, it's bad. Yeah.

It bothered you during the fight. No, I mean, it, it looked a lot worse than it was. It just could have been really bad. So it was just, it was just a matter of like changing the bandages. And then once, uh, I got done with like having to train a lot, I just took the band-aids off, let it dry out, clipped the skin and I was good. But I definitely felt bad. Like Brian was telling me like,

let's not beat up the couch, you have a fight. I'm like, no, it's gonna be fine. And then sure enough, I'm eating crow because I cut my finger. So. Last thing, if I may, tomorrow, Juliana is gonna be on the show. What's the advice for her

as she tries to get back on track here? You know, that's maybe a conversation I'd like to have with her. No problem. What I would tell her right now is who gives a shit. Who gives a shit what anybody says about the fight? There's so many. We've had times in this sport in the women's division when like Jermaine Duran avoided Cyborg, you know, and Juliana could have, you know, argued her ass off to fight somebody else

or, you know, argued for Nunes or just whatever. But she's like, okay, I'll fight the boogie woman, bring her in, like I'll fight Kayla Harrison. And Juliana's confidence, she believes she's gonna win as much as she believes the Sun's gonna come up tomorrow She's the most mentally tough human being I've ever met It's like to get to it just to speak to that a little bit You know, she talked about the story about what she fought the line cook leading up to her fight. I'm sure you saw that right? Yeah, yeah

I'll never forget this. She walked in the gym and when she walked in the gym after that happened her face was wrecked. And you could just tell you didn't get hit by a car. You didn't fight a chick. You got beat up by a dude. Like you looked at her face and you could just you could tell me and all the guys jump off the mat. We run up to her like what happened? Who did this to you? And she told us the story and we were like, all right, screw it. We're taking our gear off. We're going down to this restaurant.

We're gonna kick this guy's ass. And Giuliana was like, no, this is my fight. You guys are gonna stay out of it. That's just who she is. She's the most mentally tough human being I've ever met in my life. And so I don't know how much advice I could really give her. You know what I mean?

She's strong in areas where I've shown I can be weak and I have no problem admitting that. And that's probably why I admire her so much. I think she's an incredible human being and I think she'll be back. So we'll see what happens. But I don't know how much advice I could give someone like her.

The only thing I would say is just fuck what everybody else thinks, dude. You're still a two-time world champion. You're still one of the best in the world, if not the best in the world. So just try to keep your head up. 99.9% of humanity won't even dare to dream of a career that she's had and accomplished what she's had has accomplished as a athlete. And in addition to the stuff she's had to overcome like the injuries, the accident, all that stuff like it's incredible. 2013 she entered the Ultimate Fighter, here she is

still fighting for the title, 12 years later it's remarkable. So I agree with everything you're saying, I'm happy you're still around doing your thing as well. Congratulations, thank you for the video, thank you for repping. You did fly over from Washington to New York to see us get whooped by the Pacers. And you were trying to entice me to go too. And I was kind of happy, I'm not gonna lie, that I didn't end up going. And you had to make a much longer trip.

But we'll get them next year, Mike. We're getting them next year. For now, go Thunder is all I have to say. Cause I can't see those guys. What? What? Here's my problem, fuck it all so I can't see those guys. Well, no what what? Here's my problem. Oh, I don't really care for either team. Yeah, but I hate those guys, you know me Ariel I'm a two-team guy. I'm a two-team guy like Seahawks Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Yeah, okay Yankees Mariners

For me, I just have the Knicks. Yeah, but if I had the Sonics I would have I feel you You got I get it man. I get it. I get it. I get it. I'm just like, I just want to watch... No, actually, I think if I were you, I would root for the Pacers. No matter what, I'd root for the Pacers. Yeah. I just want to see good games. I just want to see good games. No, anyone from Washington should be rooting for the Pacers. I get that. I get that. So

I'll give you a pass. That's deep. That's deep stuff. So, all good. Congratulations. Well done. Thank you for coming on. Looking forward to the next one. Stay out of trouble with the couches and all that stuff. And good luck. Good luck with all the work coming up in August. Hey, thank you, Ariel. Thanks for having me on. And the last thing I want to say is, just got to thank my wife. Dude, she's like, she is such a trooper through these camps, everything that she does for me. I'll post this picture later on where she's just like helping me through my weight cut and I can't give that woman enough praise. I wouldn't be here where I'm at without her that's for sure. Amazing. You're a lucky man. Thank you.

Thank you Michael. All the best. There he is Michael Chiesa with a hard fought victory, a well-earned victory his third in a row at age 37 in the UFC. I am happy for him. He had the two subs. Don't forget about those. Griffin and Tony Ferguson. Court McGee is a tough out. Of Court McGee's seven pro... no, not seven. So, Court McGee has 14 pro losses. The amount of fights that he's lost via submission? Zero. So not surprising that Michael Keasa, a submission specialist, couldn't submit him. The amount of times that he's lost via knockout? Three. So obviously this

is a guy who's fought 36 times, three of 36. I'm not good at math, but what is that? 3%, 4%, 5%? Michael said it himself. Not a knockout artist. 11 via decision. Tough out. Been in the game a long time. Veter, gotta respect them. Gotta respect them. So as I mentioned tomorrow on the program, my friends, I, I actually have a, we have a WhatsApp group where I mentioned who's going to be on the show. We do?

Yeah. You, you definitely don't read it because we were talking about it earlier and he's like, so Khalil's gonna be on it too? No, he definitely reads it. He does to break the sometimes he gives us like the fire emoji Reaction to break the fourth wall after Merab One there was a there was a brief moment where he was potentially able to come in studio, but the plans changed Yeah, and, yeah. And I said, I mentioned something in a group chat,

maybe 10 minutes after the plans changed, hadn't seen the text yet and I was just like, oh, we should do this when Marab's in studio tomorrow and Frank just immediately was like, bro, what are you even talking about? Marab's not coming in. Oh, man. I was like, gosh, I didn't see the update, man, I'm sorry.

So he's reading it more than you are. Yeah, he's like, why don't you check the WhatsApp group? I mean, come on, this is not fair to Frank. It was sent like three minutes prior. You were telling a story that involved that and Frank was half listening and then- Yeah, no. He was more attuned to the WhatsApp.

I got a lot of love for Frank. Frank sent me a very nice text this weekend. Then I saw him cutting a rug on the dance floor. That rug needed to be cut. He was, you guys should have seen him yesterday. Suit looked incredible. He looked cut. He was, you guys should have seen him yesterday. Suit looked incredible. He looked fantastic. Tracey was beautiful.

All of you guys, Rick in the suit. Haven't seen Rick in a jacket. Rick looked great in a suit. I saw that picture in my eye, like I thought my eyes were messed up. Well, what do you mean Rick? Where's the suit? We're wearing a jacket.

We're in a little thing. Slacks as they say. Looked great. You know, I feel like part of his outfit. It was cashmere. No, you know. He still had the black t-shirt on. He still had the black t-shirt. I love it. You know, I feel like part of his outfit. It was cashmere. No, you know. He still had the black t-shirt on. He still had the black t-shirt.

You gotta be loyal to the gimmick. I am who I am. You had the suit, everyone was there. Got to meet Rick's son for the first time. Yes. Which was very exciting. Oh, big luck. Yes, I got to meet Andy's son for the first time.

Andy's husband. There was more opportunities for that. No, I mean, always on Thursdays, Saturdays. I met them all at the Venezuelan. Oh yeah, oh yeah. Yeah, we even see the invite. Big Logan was chilling in there, man. He was up in his high chair.

He was. Ripping his wounds. Yo, he's a great dancer as well. He's wearing a nice plaid as well, which I very much appreciated. What a time. I'm still kind of on a high. Oh we have the picture. Look at Big Rick. Yeah. John Beer. Little watch on Zoom. John Beer

is standing two feet from me right now. Is John Beer back there? Oh yeah let's go wide shot. Let's go wide shot. Step this way. Where is he? Oh there he is. The most interesting man in the world. There's a great story there. Can you even hear us right now? No, he can't. Oh, he can. Oh, he can. Frank got him a pack.

Wow, Frank. Oh, yeah. This is a great thing. Hello, John, how are you? I'm great, Ariel. I haven't been here since I came with the great Pete Selle about 15 years ago. That's right.

You're a real OG. Wait, don't walk away from the shot. We're talking. John Beer, a real day one, a real OG, actually a host of his own podcast. Give the pot a plug if you don't mind. It's the One Day Podcast with me, your host, John Beer. Yes, I've had the pleasure of being on once. But there's a great story here about John Beer because he went to summer camp with my wife way, way back in the day, Camp Walden in Lake George, New York.

And she ran into him when we moved to New York. It was like 04, 05. And she said he was on the streets of New York talking about Kevin Federline making his WWE debut. And she's like, you need to meet Ariel because you like fighting too. And then we met and it was instant. Love because then we would watch the boxing together, we'd watch the UFC together, he's become a proficient dare I say can I say this

like you like to you had an eight fart eight fart eight fight parlay victory last week right? The heavy favorites yes when I get some minus 500s I like to add them up. That's his thing I don't know if GC agrees with the strategy. I love a big. Eight fight parlay last week. Um, in any event. So, so we were, we were, uh, watching the fights and then we had the, uh, we had, we had the, the dream of opening up our own fight bar. This is around like, oh, seven.

We're both in dead end jobs. I'm at spike. He's a lawyer and we wanted to open up a bar that showed fighting 24 seven live or taped taped and it would be a place where everyone converges to watch fights John's Partner at the time wasn't such a big fan of it. Would that be accurate? That's true. Mine was like pretty into it, but like sort of apathetic towards the whole thing Anyway, I go down the production route. He goes into a route of being a PR marketing

empresario, a guru if you will. A couple of fight clients. The great round five, right? From back in the day, these dolls. Tokyo Five. Glory. On and on it goes. But now just absolutely smashing it and flew in to be here this weekend. But here's the best part of the whole story. The best part of the whole story is that when Vox bought the MMA Hour and MMA Fighting and all that stuff, we were building a new studio across from B&H, 34th Street. This is when we moved from the AOL studio, which by the way, John, I don't know if you know this, the original MMA hour was on this floor in this building. Because I know this, it looks a lot better now. It does, it does. Thank you.

Yahoo bought AOL and, and I referenced the Pete Selle interview. He knows he was here. Yes, Tokyo 5. Um, John came with me to the sort of dress rehearsal of the new studio and who's there? Who's there? A young buck named New York Rick. This is January of 20, I think it was 2010, if not 2011, Rick? 2010, 2011. I think this is 2012. 2012. Yeah. There carrying the plexiglass on his back, building the studio with his bare hands, and

John is acting as like the guest just to sit in because we needed someone to talk into the mic, and then they meet for the first time. John, I think, asks Rick for what? What did you ask Rick for? An iPhone charger. And what did Rick say? I don't know what that is. He says, I don't know what an iPhone charger is.

2012. In 2012. What does that even mean? He was an Android guy. He was an Android guy. So at the time, the MMR is a once a week show. And so what ends up happening is these two guys end up connecting and Mondays, Rick would work on the MMR.

And then Tuesday through Sunday Sunday he would work with John At his upstar company and then eventually Rick goes all full time John does this thing, but here we are all together Isn't this amazing? The real question is though. How many viewers did we just lose? This is great the real og fans will appreciate stories like this. And what was most special about it all, as I'll close with this, this weekend was very meaningful for me and my family because it was all my friends from Montreal, some of whom have never visited us, family from Montreal, some of whom have never visited us, coming together and meeting my new friends from where we live now and where we grew up and where we decided to raise our family

and plant our roots and all this stuff. And coworkers and like all these people in one room coming together as one, it was incredible to see. It really was. And when we first had Oliver, 2012, we didn't have a lot of friends and John happened to live right next door to us. And so he was sort of like the guy. He was the second dad. He was our Cosmo Kramer.

He was the first friend to come to the hospital for all three kids. He was there and gave my son an incredible gift this weekend, which means the world to him. And he wouldn't stop talking about it. And so anyway, he's here because he's What happened? What the hell am I getting blamed for Rick turning off the mic? Oh, you're wearing the Jack Taylor shirt. I like that. Yeah, and I didn't know I was going to be on camera here. I'm not... No, it's good.

It's good. I'd like to represent. But it was a wonderful weekend. You should be very proud of your family and all the people that came because it was powerful for everyone there. Thank you. Thank you. No, it was great.

I appreciate it and we're feeling good. So anyway, as I was saying before, I knew that John was in the house. We have this WhatsApp group. This is where it all started. And we have our guests. So tomorrow, why are you guys laughing? Some points.

That was a tangent. We took a journey. Yeah. We went through a, we went back 13 years. Phil Rowe on the program, had a great win. I think it might be the first time on the show, maybe second, but I think first. Andrzej Alofski, who's making his BKFC debut on the program.

Juliana Pena, in perhaps her first chat since the fight on the program. Rose Namaunis on the program, big win over Miranda Maverick. But here's the best part, in the group, I put TBD. I put TBD because I wanted to announce to the crew, I wanted to announce to everyone who the TBD guest is. And so tomorrow on the program, making his illustrious,

Haewani Show slash MMA hour debut, can I get a four box? Can I get something? I just want to see, or a three box? Is I get a four box? Can I get something? I just want to see, or a three box? Is there even a three box? There it is. Tomorrow. I have no idea where you're going.

Yeah. No idea? Oh, I know. Not even a single guess? Wait. The pride of Seoul, South Korea. I knew it. The Iron Turtle.

Let's go! It's now June Young Park. Wow! Wow! Let's go. Finally's out. I know it. June Young. Wow! Let's go. Finally. Oh my God. I don't think you possibly could have gotten a bigger pop.

No, that's it. Where are you going with this? Who could this be? Holy shit, wow. Joining us live from Baku. Mountains had to move for this to happen. Oh yeah. I actually booked this one like a month and a half or so ago.

I'm like, when's this guy fighting it? Oh yeah, Azerbaijan, we're getting him fight week. Long awaited. He doesn't even begin to describe it. Highly anticipated, does not even begin to describe it. Oh my God. I wanna see the chat. I wanna see, oh yes.

Put turtles in the chat. Turtles in the chat, everyone. Nice, a bunch of turtles here. Iron Turtle, LFG, I love it. Yes, so a stack show. I was just posting a wager on him earlier today. Is he the favorite? He is the favorite. Yes. So a stack show. I was just putting a wager on him earlier today. Is he the favorite? He is the favorite.

Okay. He's the man. So I look forward to that in another stack show. Paul Walter Hauser on the program on Wednesday, guys. Wow. Yeah. Big time. In studio. Hollywood. Mark Romundi in studio as well.

Nicest guy. Nicest guy in the biz. We have a lot to get to but for now we shall say goodbye. Oh Jesus Christ. I mean it's on brand. I was so ready. I was okay let's go, let's go. Cosmo Kramer asks, Iriel how was your son's bar mitzvah? Oh thanks. Well we could have slid that one in earlier. It was amazing. One of the greatest weekends of my life. I'm still in a high. I was very anxious about it, because it was a lot of planning, but really, really, really, really pleased and proud,

most importantly, of the young man, because he absolutely killed it, and really was a superstar all weekend. So thank you for asking, Cosmo. I appreciate it. What else? Slava P, sorry for having you read the same OT and question two weeks straight I don't finish the Wednesday episode until

Monday morning as we thought and assume it won't get read thank you for the great Monday to Monday content Slava P no problem Slava I get it I get it it was just funny that you said oh hey I watch every episode and then you're asking about something that we talked about it is he didn't think it was so funny you know he's trying I get it I. I get it. What else Levi? Love the well maker interview the will of determination are unreal also could I get an update on my lucha shirt order? 1181 I presume this is from the oh wow That's that's odd. I've not heard of any issues. I guess when did he order it? We'll follow up with that.

Okay, there it is, ariahohani.com. I've not heard of any issues for a while from the site, and that could mean no one's buying anything. By the way, we're coming out with some new stuff in I'd say maybe a month or two, but if you could just provide some extra context, there's also a place where you can send in emails. So if you wanna do that, you could do that.

Or just send another Superchat. I really appreciate story time earlier. I thought it was great, especially about Rick not knowing what an iPhone charger was. Yes, yes. Yesterday, Rick went- Wait, wait, wait, let it be known. Let it be known.

Got the charger. I mean- He did. He figured it out. He was crafty. He got it done. Well, good thing he's able to figure things out. We'll be testing that next week. Because yesterday, my man Ricky Jack found out that Boeing and Airbus are two different aircraft manufacturers

and that there is in fact nothing... There's no such thing as a Boeing Airbus. Hmm. Like competing. This was insightful. Yeah, that's good He was like this one land. It'll be fine because we're not taking So we're taking Airbus a Boeing Did this happen in the cocktails or during the dessert? I don't know. I just got nervous during the road trip

Could have been any time. I actually was this was this is being on an air bus. I said that to Frank earlier. I was like, thank God I'm on an air bus. Frank's playing himself off after that one. Well, we have a lot of exciting things coming up. We'll be at Fanatics Fest on Friday, everyone. We're going to be doing a live pod. You're actually going to get, well actually, no, live if you're in attendance but it won't air here, we'll post it after the fact. But in essence we're doing four episodes this week and there it is live from Fanatics Fest at the Jacob Javits Center right here in the heart of New York City. That's Friday June 20th. At least one guest confirmed working on another, and then next week's gonna be a different kind of week, but a lot of exciting things that will culminate

in us going to Las Vegas and doing a Helwani show on Thursday, on Friday, a watch party from Vegas on Saturday, post show on Saturday night from Vegas, and then first time ever a post pay-per-view show from Vegas. We've always come back but we're trying it out. We're trying it out. So a lot of exciting things to come in addition to all the great guests this week. Anyone watching the Club World Cup? Anyone into that? I've been tuning it. Did you see Bayern Munich win 10-0 against Auckland City? Oh yeah, I did.

I did. That is a little brutal. Poor guys from Auckland City were like, crazy. We got our chance in the Club World Cup. Got whooped. Yeah, it's over. Chelsea beating LAFC 2-0 right now. Alright, that's fun.

That's fun. So anyway, a lot to be excited about. For now though, we shall say goodbye. Thank you very much to all our guests today. What a fun show from Khalil Rountree to Deontay Wilder, Sugashan, Wellmaker and Kiesa. Thanks to you. Thanks to them. Thanks to John Beer. Peace right here.