The Ariel Helwani Show - UFC 312 reaction, Zhang Weili, Luke Rockhold, Din Thomas & Rory Karpf in studio

Episode Date: February 10, 2025

Ariel Helwani reacts to UFC 312, Dricus du Plessis and Zhang Weili's one-sided title defenses against Sean Strickland and Tatiana Suarez, what's next for both, plus more (06:57).Din Thomas discusses his criticism of Sean Strickland's performance at UFC 312, Dricus du Plessis vs. Khamzat Chimaev, how he became the UFC's cageside corner analyst, the lightweight GOAT debate and more in an in-studio appearance (01:34:23).Rory Karpf and Din Thomas discuss working on UFC's "Dana White Lookin' For A Fight," the release of their new action thriller "Grace Point," and much more in a joint in-studio interview (02:14:00).Luke Rockhold discusses Sean Strickland's tepid performance against Dricus du Plessis, his past gym run-in with Strickland, whether Strickland had staph infection, getting traded in GFL to pave the way for a Chris Weidman rematch, and more (02:44:54).Zhang Weili discusses her UFC strawweight title defense over Tatiana Suarez at UFC 312, why she asked to fight Suarez, a potential superfight with Valentina Shevchenko next, acting in her first big movie, her relationship with Joanna Jedrzejczyk and more (03:15:13).

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R.R And 25. Hello again, everyone. I sure hope you're doing well. Welcome back to the program. Welcome to a post-pay-per-view Monday right here on the Ariel Helwani Show. It's great to be here following UFC 312. A lot of hot takes following UFC 312. Some that are a little bit surprising to me. We kind of knew what the card was going into it. And in the end, I actually thought, believe it or not,

believe it or not on this Monday afternoon, I actually thought the card over-delivered. Yes. And perhaps my expectations were so low that it was easy to over-deliver. But I will tell you why in a moment, why I thought it over-delivered. Of course, the sun is out. Everyone's happy. The birds are chirping.

Spring is about to sprung, and the good news is the NFL season is over. We can finally turn our attention to better things. Who cares about the National Football League or football? We can move on. We can move on with our lives. Hope you all enjoyed the Super Bowl. In case you're wondering, I did end up watching it, and I have many thoughts on that as well. Perhaps we'll get into all of that and

more on this post-UFC 312 pay-per-view Monday. A lot to get into. As always, a lot has happened since we last spoke from the world of MMA and the world of boxing. All kinds of craziness with Jake Paul and Canelo Alvarez and Turkey Alshake, so we'll get into that as well.

Can't wait for that discussion. Back into the show. Last guest of the day will be the MVP of UFC 312. The biggest star of them all. And in my opinion, now the number one pound for pound women's MMA fighter. And I know a lot of people out there thought she was already the number one women's MMA fighter on the planet. Well, I think Saturday night sealed it. I can't imagine anyone not picking Zhang Weili as the best female pound for pound fighter in the world. And she is going to join us. And it's been a while

for various reasons why we haven't had her on the show. One of those major reasons is, you know, she lives in China. I know she does train sometimes in the United States as well, Las Vegas, this particular camp. She trained in Thailand. She is kind enough to join us. She is still in Sydney, so she'll be waking up early Tuesday morning, their time to join us, back end of the program. Can't wait to talk to her, blown away by what she did against Tatiana Suarez, blown away by how good she looked, how well-rounded she looked, how after the first round clearly didn't go her way, she was smothered, she was stifled, she figured it all out, and you can't say it was smooth sailing.

It was still Tatiana Suarez trying to take you down, but she was stuffing takedown after takedown after takedown, and even landed her own takedown, which had never been done before to Tatiana Suarez in one of her fights. Supremely impressive stuff. I thought she won 49-46. I believe most of the judges did as well. I believe most of you at home and the media did as well. And now there are some big questions about her future. Obviously, in the main event, we had Drikus Duplessis defending his title successfully against Sean Strickland in a very, very one-sided fight. He is still the middleweight champion, and we presume that Hamzat Shemaev, not Alex Pereira, will be next for him. More to that, we're going to be joined by Dean Thomas in studio. Dean has turned into one of the very best analysts in the sport, doing work for the UFC, UFC on ESPN, Fight Pass, ESPN Radio, Sirius XM as well. So we'll be talking about his career. We'll be talking about a lot of the things going on. He was on the post show on Saturday on ESPN Plus and thought once again that he did a great job. He was on

there with Anthony Smith, Gil Melendez, Brendan Fitzgerald, and had some pretty harsh things to say about one Sean Strickland. So looking forward to having him in studio. Also, we will have Rory Karpf in studio. He may not be a household name to all of you, but I do believe he's been on the show before. I could be wrong about that, but I'm pretty sure he has. He has produced and directed a whole host of shows that I'm sure you have watched. One of them includes Looking for a Fight. He has been the head man for that program for many, many years. A ton of 30 for 30s, the Ric Flair one, one that I was in. I still hate Christian Laettner, about Christian Laettner and that Duke team in the early 90s. One about the Manning family, all kinds of stuff. He'll be in studio to talk about his new film, scripted film, called Grace Point, which stars the likes of Dean Thomas, Aljamain Sterling, Chris Weidman makes a cameo, James Storm of TNA fame as well. And so we'll talk about that. He even had a fight in 2021. He was in his forties and decided to have a fight. And it was pretty

cool. He had some famous people by his side. Jared Gordon was in his corner. So very, very talented and smart man. And I think you'll enjoy that conversation as well. Prior to them being in studio, we'll talk to Luke Rockhold, the former UFC middleweight champion, and he'll be coming bearing gifts. He'll have some breaking news as well. And obviously we're talking about the middleweight division and he was once the man in Strikeforce and in the UFC as far as the middleweight division is concerned so been a while since we caught up with Luke Thomas Luke Thomas Luke Rockhold

why did I think Luke Thomas there he is been a while since we caught up with Luke Thomas as well but look at Luke Rockhold with that fur coat what is going on over there he's looking fly is that a fur coat I think it is a fur coat yeah He's looking fly. Is that a fur coat? I think it is a fur coat. That is a fur coat.

Yeah. He's looking fantastic. So we'll catch up with Luke Rockhold, not Thomas, in about an hour and a half's time. So looking forward to that very, very much. But let's kick things off with some UFC 312 thoughts. We obviously had the watch party on Saturday. The boys in the back did a great job. We had the post show. You can catch all of that. And obviously that stuff comes, you know, that comes to you in real time. Like it's, you know, it's 1am, you're sitting there

watching, not bad card. But now on the Monday, we're able to digest, we're able to dissect, we're able to marinate, we're able to let our minds kind of think about what transpired and so let's start with Drikus Duplessis and and his performance against Sean Strickland you know sometimes I'll I'll sit here and and I'll ask the guys after a dominant win was that you, more to do with the guy who won, what he did to the opponent, or was it the opponent who didn't do enough? Was it the opponent who couldn't figure out, the guy who won, that sort of thing? On Saturday, if you get what I'm trying to say, on Saturday, to me, the story was quite simple. That was just a case of Sean Strickland not doing enough. I don't think it was anything necessarily that Drikus did. Obviously, Drikus in front of you is a tricky puzzle to

figure out. He's a very unorthodox fighter. He's a very awkward fighter. And you can use those words in a negative or a positive way. I use them in a positive way. He just has a very unique style. And so you have to be on your P's and Q's, but it was, uh, it was somewhat of a letdown to see Sean Strickland never really tried to do anything. It seemed to me to try and figure him out. Um, he was, he was very predictable as his coach, Eric Nixick said, uh, he was just kind of plotting forward, moving along, moving along, throwing a jab, throwing another jab, a right, another jab, a right, wasn't mixing things up, wasn't throwing combos, wasn't showing different parts of his game, wasn't throwing leg kicks, wasn't attempting takedowns, wasn't even threatening to attempt takedowns. I would imagine as far as DDP is concerned, no fight is easy.

You're fighting another human being in a cage, but I don't feel like he was ever nervous. I don't feel like he was ever in trouble. I don't think, I don't think he was ever seriously hurt in the fight as well. Sean talked the big game, uh, before the fight saying that he was going to fight to the death and, and there wasn't much of that. And so I can understand why a lot of people were disappointed in the fight. I didn't have high expectations for this fight. I didn't want to see it again. I didn't think their first fight was terribly entertaining. I didn't think this rematch was warranted.

You know, DDP beat Sean Strickland. He had never successfully defended the title. He had just beaten Israel Adesanya. DDP beat him fair and square. I know some people thought otherwise. I thought it was a, you know, it was a pretty clear cut win for DDP. Sean Strickland comes back and beats Paolo Costa in a very ho-hum fight right here in this area, in New Jersey, in Newark. And DDP beats Israel. I wanted Hamza Chamayev to get the next title shot. I wanted that to be the next title fight. There haven't been too many times where a champion

wins a belt, never successfully defends it, wins one fight, and then gets to go back in there against the same guy. Haven't been a lot of those circumstances. And maybe the timing didn't work out. Maybe it's the travel stuff. Who the hell knows? But my expectations were not super high. And I said before the fight, I thought that the gap would be even more evident between DDP and Sean Strickland. Uh, DDP is turning into, you know, a very, very good fighter. He's already there. Nine wins in a row in the UFC, undefeated in the UFC. Is he on the level of a of an Anderson Silva obviously not is he is does he have the resume that you know some of the other middleweight greats have had Rich Franklin Israel Adesanya no but he is the man for a reason he is the absolute man for a reason uh he he continues

to win he continues to show that he is the man at 185 and he's about to face a very tough test. Maybe his toughest, maybe, maybe his toughest so far at 185 pounds. But I didn't think that Sean was going to do anything, anything more that he did in the first fight. And I thought because they had a fight, DDP was going to show his, his class. He was going to show that there's a greater gap. And that's what we saw. And perhaps people were, I don't know, maybe fooled, convinced by all the pre-fight talk, but we didn't see any of that. And Sean's getting a lot of hate in the aftermath saying, you know, there are a lot of people who either say they're going to fight to the death or don't, but fight to the death. And we don't want anyone to die, but you know, you understand the insinuation, like lay it all on the line. Each and every time they went to the corner, each and every time we heard Eric Nixick talk to him, who I think is one of the very best in the game

and keeps it real and is able to communicate with his fighters, he kept telling him, let's go. This is too predictable. You have to get going. You have to mix it up. You have to throw more than ones and twos. You have to go for the finish in the fifth round. There was no sugarcoating. And at times it seemed like Sean didn't really want to listen to him. It was wild stuff. It was truly wild stuff. I would be very, very surprised. He threw less strikes than the first fight by about 32. Um, but he's, he's become more refined. He's better with each and every fight. He gets better. He, he becomes more comfortable. He's, he's settling into the role of being champion. This is his second successful title defense. Um, the question is how does Sean get back here? And, and, and as long as DDP is the champion, he's now in that, you know,

Joseph Benavidez territory when DJ was champion, Uriah Faber when Dominic Cruz was champion, Gustafson when Cormier was champion, or Jon Jones. Whitaker. Thank you, PT. Whitaker with Izzy. Like, on and on it goes. On and on it goes.

And so, yeah, it's a tough spot for him. But A, it's not like, you know, there's going to be like, oh, man, that second one was so close. We got to see it again. No, there was nothing close about it. There was absolutely nothing close about it. The only discussion afterwards was did he win a single round? And I don't think he did. I thought he lost five rounds to none. I thought it was a fairly easy fight to score, 50 to 45. And afterwards,

DDP said, you know, it looked like he was talking to Alex Pereira. That's not the fight. The fight to make is Hamzat Shemaev. That has to be the fight. Dana sort of insinuated that that's the fight. And that's the one we all want to see. And that's the one that makes the most sense for the division. Now, I know that Hamzat hasn't been so active at 185, but he reminds me a lot of Tatiana Suarez and that we have been talking about this, him fighting for a belt since he came into the UFC in 2020. And it's about damn time that he just fights for the belt already. And so let's see it for once and for all, let us see it. Let us see him fight for a belt. And I'm not certain, just like with Shafqat and Bilal,

just like with Tatiana and Zhang, we sort of anoint these people before they get to title fights. I don't think it's going to be a cakewalk for him. I think a lot of people think it's going to be a cakewalk. Like at this point, if you continue to doubt Drik is du Plessis, if you continue to think that he can't figure out someone like Hamzat, and I know, style, way different than Sean, way different than, you know, Izzy, way different than the first Sean, way different than Whitaker,

way different than Darren Till. I get that, but this guy figures out a way. He just figures out a way. It's unbelievable. So I'm not going to doubt him. I'm absolutely not. Am I saying, you know, with great certainty that he wins? No, absolutely not. We need some time. We need to think about it. We don't know when it is, how soon of a turnaround, all that stuff and more, but I am not going to doubt him. And I would love to see that fight.

And it's the fight that I wanted to see on Saturday. And so now we can move on and, and, and hopefully see that, that fight very soon. I'll get the boys thoughts on that in a moment but very quickly to me why this fight why this fight card exceeded my expectations is because of one person and one person only what we saw to Zhang Weili on Saturday night in the co-main event was unbelievable was nothing short of outstanding was sensational it was it was to some degree stunning if only because Saturday was supposed to be the coronation of Tatiana Suarez Saturday was supposed to be five six seven eight years in the making she finally gets what's hers she finally becomes champion all the bad luck pre-UFC all the bad luck post-UFC all that is righted on Saturday In Sydney That was all the talk She was the favorite Just the second time in Zhang's UFC career

That she's the underdog She's the big bad wolf at 115 She was going to go in there and dominate And what did we see early on? Domination At least in the first round Now we didn't see a lot of damage We didn't see a lot of strikes thrown We didn't see a lot of strikes thrown. We didn't see her mixing up the offense. It was just takedown, smother,

a little bit of damage, a little bit of offense. And you figured when you were watching that, more of this is to come. That did not happen. Second round, Zhang Weili figures it out, and the momentum keeps growing in her favor. Second, third, fourth, fifth, fourth, she lands a takedown. Second and third, she stuffs all the takedowns, and she coasted. at some point in the fight, somewhat unclear as to how and when this happened, but that had to have affected her. That can't be fun. That has to be uncomfortable. But let's be honest, that was Zhang Weili's night. And that was emphatic. And here's what I've understood. Zhang Weili fought at UFC 300. After UFC 300, Zhang Weili told the UFC, she wants to fight at 125. She wants to fight, at the time, Alexa Grasso. Well, the UFC said, all right, well, we have to play out Grasso Shevchenko. If Grasso wins, you get Grasso. She said, all right. Grasso didn't win. Shevchenko won. And so at this point,

she's kind of faced with a situation like, okay, what do I do? Do I go up to 125? That's what I want. And so she threw that out to the UFC. But apparently, from what I'm hearing, Shevchenko was a little bit banged up. And there's also Mano Fiora out there. And so there's this big talk about what happened with the Suarez-Virna-Jean-Giroba fight. What I was told was,

and you saw how Dana spoke of Zhang Weili, whatever she wants, she gets. She said, give me Tatiana. Everyone says that Tatiana Suarez is the boogie woman give me her and that's why they canceled the fight that's my understanding and so they made the fight for this card in uh in Sydney she asked for Suarez and and knowing that in the aftermath obviously it's like yeah clearly she knew something but if you find out about that before

the fight you're like holy shit she just signed her own death wish clearly not best pound for pound female fighter in the world unbelievable has come so far um again i've talked about this a couple times when she was booked to fight jessica andrej in 2019 for the belt in china her last time fighting in china by the way and she certainly deserves a homecoming it felt like a gimmick fight like what really andrej is going to defend her title in china against a chinese-born fighter the ufc is trying and she certainly deserves a homecoming. It felt like a gimmick fight. Like, what, really? Andrade is going to defend her title in China against a Chinese-born fighter? The UFC is trying to will this into existence. She smoked Andrade.

She had a great first run as champion, lost the belt, and has since come back and now has tied the great Ioana Janjicek for most wins at 115 pounds. Unbelievable. These are the uncrowned women's pound for pound rankings which just came out. You have Zhang Weili, number one,

totally agree with that. Shevchenko, number two, agree with that as well. And then you go down the line, Cyborg, Kayla, Juliana, Manos, obviously in the mix, Grasso Pacheco, Dakota, and Zika Asawa. I think earlier we showed the men's rankings as well. I may have missed that, but worth noting that Drikus Duplessis is now finally ranked. I do believe he is number six

in the men's pound for pound rankings. You have it right there. This is according to a very, very esteemed group of voters. Islam number one,, Teporia, two, Alex, three, Murab, four, Pantoja, five, Jones, six, excuse me, Drik is seven, Aspinall, eight, Francis Nganou, number nine, and Bilal Muhammad, number two, 10. Why did I say two? I was looking at Teporia, too. We saw Teporia there, his brother won. Shout out to him. Now, to me, the stories going into Saturday were those two fights. They were the stories coming out of Saturday as well. No doubt about that.

Obviously, some other performances that we can talk about as well. But let me bring in everyone to get their thoughts. Let's re-rack the tape here and go back to the main event. Drikus Duplessis successfully defending his title against Sean Strickland, still the champion at 185 pounds. Did everyone go home? Okay, there they are.

Hey guys, how are you? How's everyone? Do you want us to say something? No, I just wanted to see you. Yeah, I didn't see anyone. I thought about going home. Yeah, no. You were killing it. Guys, it's good to see you again. Great job by the boys on the watch

party. Pete, we have yet to hear from you. Your thoughts on what we saw from Drikus and quite frankly, what we didn't see from

Sean Strickland. Yeah, it was a very one-sided fight, to be honest. I think Drikus definitely improved on his first show against

Strickland. And I was surprised to hear there was only 32 strikes he landed more than the first fight because it did feel like his output... Through. 32 more strikes thrown. Right, right. Okay. I thought, just watching it, I felt like there was a lot more output from Drik's side. Strickland just didn't seem to offer anything. And I was watching Nixick in his corner very

closely between rounds and you could see him just becoming so frustrated there was two points where maybe more maybe three where strickland put together this three punch combination and maybe one of the punches landed every time but it was something you know and i was like oh he's gonna come he's gonna go back to the well with this. Didn't seem to happen. Just couldn't take the momentum away from Drikus. And honestly, what was going through my head, and I spoke to Ben and Shaheen about this on Friday, like, how many times do we have to see guys

coming into fights with staph infections to know that they're not going to be right? We had the classic case of Benoit Saint-Denis against Dustin Poirier, where he absolutely blew his load in the first round and they just died in the second and I don't know like based on what we know Sean Strickland the guy with a high output a guy that will look to point for it his way to victory every time to not win a single round that's pretty shocking to me it's either that or Drikus has improved a

lot which is what he said in the post-fight press conference. But yeah, very surprising. And believe me, it was a tough one to watch here at five o'clock in the morning when those boys got going and fair play to Drikus. But it didn't seem like Strickland was there at all to me. It's a great shout regarding Strickland's arm. It was very clear that I think on his left arm,

right, there was something there. On Thursday we saw it. And by the way, he's wearing a cutoff shirt. So, I mean, you can't miss it. And it was the side that he was facing off. And then it looked like it got a tiny bit better come Friday's weigh-in face-off. But you're 100% right.

It always seems to be somewhat of a telltale sign. Now, we thought we saw something similar with Murab's shin come to find out that he was doing something crazy on, on, on some stairs. It wasn't a staph infection and it didn't seem to deter him. But Murab is a freak.

He is in fact a machine. And so those things don't seem to bother him very much. Strickland is getting a lot of shit. He's getting a lot of shit by, by everyone. All his, all his enemies are coming out. The fans are coming out.

Like I said, Dean Thomas on the post show. And, and sometimes those post shows feel like state-run TV. Like he was very, very, very honest saying, and brutal saying, like, he's not that guy. He's not the guy that he says he is. He may be a gym warrior, but he is not the guy that actually fights to the death. Kudos to him for, you know, rearranging his nose that was clearly broken and you see all the blood coming out but in terms of the actual style like it's it's it's not exactly it's not fun stuff

he's just kind of walking forward walking forward you know sort of like this throws out the jab throws out the jab a right throws out the jab plotting a little bit flat-footed and that's basically it and so rick let me ask you is is the hate warranted on this monday that sean strickland is getting no because i think the style is dependent upon the opponent sean strickland is bringing a very um uh established style to to the octagon every single time and it's why when we were when we were breaking down the fight on boys in the back me and connor i was like i kind of know what I'm getting out of every single strong Strickland fight. The only way I see he could win this fight is if he doubles his output. Instead, he halved his output. And now whether that was due to staph infection, recovery or anything else, that was not going to be a winning formula because Drick is two plus C proved in the first fight that he could stand there and strike with him. And he proved again in the second fight that not only can he stand and strike with him, he's going to do it better. And so the only style that I thought was going to be successful for Sean is if he doubled up his attack somehow,

right? And he already had thrown 400 punches in the first one. But against Israel Adesanya, that looks exciting. That looks fun. Somebody who's going to allow him to kind of get his style off and look for counter shots, it looks good. Against somebody like Drikus, who's actually the one pressing forward and moving the action, it doesn't look as good because he's not really doing anything to thwart the attack, right? He's sound defensively, he's keeping himself safe, and he's putting out a high-ish volume, not as high as the last fight. And it's really just not that thrilling, not that compelling. But I don't think it's fair as a whole that his style is going to come into question or that he can't be exciting. I think it's very matchup dependent.

These two, it's not going to be the most thrilling. I didn't really have a problem with it. I wasn't sitting there bored. I just was wondering, what is plan B for Sean Strickland? Because plan A seems to always be exactly the same. And this is not effective against St as du Plessis. Uh, the, the, um, the first time they fought, he threw about 419 strikes on Saturday, two 63. So it's, it's, uh, I mean, it's, it's, it's right there. He just doesn't, he doesn't have power. Right. So, and if you're only going to engage in the striking,

right. Sean Strickland is not shooting takedowns in most fights and in this fight, certainly not. And in the first fight, certainly not. If you're only going to engage in striking and you don't have power to really put Drikus down, the only thing you can do is throw more punches. That is literally the only thing you could possibly, maybe you throw a different type of attack, right? You're throwing more kicks or whatever.

But if you're primarily a jabber and somebody who's looking to set up something with that jab, you just have to throw more. That's the only path to victory that I could possibly see, and he just wasn't able to execute that. Go ahead. I was just going to say, you get what you get in a Sean Strickland fight. This is nothing new. Before the Adesanya fight, people were complaining when we went back-to-back, the cannonier into the Imavov, and we got back-to-back Sean Str, the main events, and people were like, oh, great, here we go again, like another 25 minutes of just throwing out the jab, teep kicks and everything like that.

People were complaining about that, and then he beat Adesanya, he became champion, he brought on this persona, and people became fans of him. But the fighting style never changed. We knew exactly what we were going to get from this. So the hate, I don't think, is deserved. I mean, it's just his fighting style. And so I was actually just going to, to refresh everyone's memory. Like you go back, let's say,

oh, I don't know, 2021. Judko decision, Uriah Hall decision. All of these in the apex as well. He was, he was like an apex fighter before. Split decision against Hermansen, KO'd by Pereira with, with the awful game plan. Remember that it just lasted lasted 2.36.

Yeah, that one wasn't great. The Kananier split decision. The Imovov decision in his way. The Magomedov TKO win. That was a big one. Yeah, it might have been the lone bright spot as far as aggression

and getting a finish. And then gets the performance bonus. By the way, he also nearly got killed in the first round of that and then finished him because he was gassed completely out. It wasn't exactly

coming in there and being Francis and gone. It was kind of just still the Sean Strickland game plan. And also worth noting that somewhat, and please, hopefully this doesn't lead to a 45-minute YouTube breakdown, somewhat like Jamal Hill, he is a byproduct of circumstance and luck in terms of getting his title shot and winning his title.

He would have never gotten that title shot if DDP was able to fight. Remember, DDP fought Robert Whitaker in July and they needed a quick turnaround to fight Izzy. And remember, Izzy was, you know, calling him Dirkus, Doop, whatever, whatever, all that stuff. And then he did the video, but he like, fine, give me Strickland. Remember that it was never supposed to be DDP versus Izzy. Just like with Jamal Hill and the, and the, and the, you know, the injury and then the draw, and then he gets the Glover fight. And again, these things happen, but it wasn't like he's the number one guy, he's done enough.

And now here he is fighting for the belt. A few things had to, you know, bounce his way. And you look at other guys like Murab, like a Volkanovski, like a Bilal. Like they had to scratch and claw their way just to get the title shot. He did not have to do that. He just happened to be in the spot when they needed an easy title fight. Yeah. And that's the one side of it to his credit though when the opportunity came he beat a pound for pound great you know on that moment i'm not trying to do revision no no i know i know you're not i know you're not i know you're not trying to revise what happened there but you're

you're 100 right that he owes israel to sanya for that opportunity because israel israel and the ufc israel wanted to be on that card. The UFC needed him on that card. And they had, as you said, there was no like rightful contender other than Drikus. Drikus was the one that everybody was like, yeah, this is the one. And so Sean stepped into that opportunity. Then he maximized it. Then he made the most of it.

He found some new support from fans and was able to capitalize on that. And I think a lot of times what happens is when he's up, right? When he's winning and the fans are behind him, it feels like, yeah, he's exciting, but it's really mostly the stuff on the mic. It's really mostly like the interviews and the, let me tell you something, guys, it's more of that than it is the fighting style. The fighting style has been the exact same for as long as we can remember. There's nothing thrilling about it, nor do I find it boring, right? I'm not, I'm not up or down on the Sean Strickland fighting style, but it's kind of always exactly

the same. You don't find it boring? No, I don't. I find it fine. I'm just plotting forward, throwing ones and twos. Like there's nothing to it. He's just walking forward. If you can stop him, I'm more interested in that.

And Drikus has found a very successful way to stop him. If you can stop him, isn't, isn't the answer to if it's boring or not like that is not an exciting stuff there's nothing forget about the the the discussion of like can you stop him or not you're not popping in that tape to show someone about the best of mma you're not you're not showing them a sean strickland fight no because i don't think it's particularly like varied or anything like that but i don't find it boring i find it fine i find it average i'm not bored by sean strickland fights or his style nor am i particularly thrilled right i'm not going you need to see this guy um but but i think it's a super effective and kind of clean stuff okay so as a counter let's just devil's advocate was gsp style like the most

exciting gsp mixed it up way more mix it up sure up, sure. Was he exciting? I would not put GSP in the same conversation. I'm asking you a direct question. Yes, I was into it. Now, I'd have to say he was equally kind of ho-hum in terms of the stuff. Sean Strickland?

Yeah, look. Can I ask something about, because it pertains to what you guys are talking about, right? It's this guy who many people, regardless of what Rick or Ariel feel about it, many people online it's this guy who many people regardless of what rick or ariel feel about it many people online now criticizing this guy's story and gc mentioned this is something that happened many times before there was also times when we used to reach out to strickland's

management when we were doing the old show ariel and we'd be like did you see talk to this guy about what he's saying you know like some of the things he said were very outlandish a few years back and it seemed like these things did happen i think the most curious thing about the sean strickland story is this guy who seemed like the antithesis the antithesis of what the ufc wanted to put in a spotlight has somehow are we are we calling dana white privilege here in terms of how he got into these title situations twice you mentioned earlier the drick is style bender fight didn't work out he gets pushed into the fight against style bender everyone saw hamza as a rifle number one contender this division again ahead of this fight stricken gets put in the this spot again so a guy essentially

we're debating here whether he has a very boring style and we know has said things that maybe the promotion wouldn't agree with in the past. How has he become a golden shawl within this promotion? I think is a, is a better question. Because he's done a great job of selling himself because his press conferences are more

quote unquote entertaining than his fights. Certainly generate more interest, buzz, all that stuff and more. And so there's currency, there's value to that. But I do think quite strongly that if you sit there and start waxing poetic on everything but fighting, but draw a ton of attention to yourself, you better go and fight. You better go and deliver because otherwise then what are we doing here? What is the point of all of all this like if you're going to use that mic time to start talking about all this other stuff and and getting under people's skin or not but certainly i mean i saw sean strickland videos everywhere and not on your usual mma slash you know sports sites last week um for better or worse you have to go and deliver because then otherwise,

what are you? You're the guy who is able to use the mic time to his advantage for whatever reason. Why you want to wax poetic on all these things before a fight, I don't understand, but you are smart enough to recognize that it does make you more popular. It makes you more well-known. And there's, like I said, there's currency attached to that by the way we just recently see this with colby covington quite a bit right like when you're when you're successful when you're winning fights this gimmick this thing that you're doing i i i think i i consider strickland and covington a little bit different but a similar thing where their mic uh work is actually more uh exciting for the fan base than their fights in particular. But when you're down, it's a lot harder to swallow that this is the exciting part of fight week when the results don't follow.

And I think we're in a down moment for Colby. We're in a down moment for Strickland now where it seems like there's not a path back to the title where Dirk is his champ. And so, yeah, people are going to come out of the woodwork to jump on it. I will add Colby never won the undisputed title. He won the interim. Colby at his best, more entertaining and better

fighter than Sean at his best, despite the fact that he won the belt, in my opinion. Colby's output, remember Colby against Robbie Lawler, like what he did to Robbie Lawler in New Jersey? Colby's output. Remember Colby against Robbie Lawler? Like what he did to Robbie Lawler in New Jersey? Like Colby's output, his varied attack. I don't see them that much different. Classic point with Usman as well when he broke his jaw.

That one's a banger. I just thought for bang for your buck, Colby was a lot more entertaining. So now they have to decide. I don't think he's going anywhere. And maybe this is a teachable moment. Maybe this is an aha moment. And maybe with the belt not on the line Or a title shot not on the line

He just lets it go now Maybe the next time out he just lets it ride Because if he can do that Win or lose He's going to be so damn popular Right? Why would he though? You put it to it earlier

He's fought how many times since 2021? What did he have to lose against Ima Vov after he lost to Kandahar? He's not getting a title shot anytime soon At that point he's trying to work his way back up He's trying to figure himself out I'm just wondering The point is, in MMA

As we've talked about before Wins and losses don't mean as much If you deliver, if you are fun, if you're entertaining, they will adore you. They will absolutely idolize you, right? Like how much did the loss to Max Holloway really hurt Justin Gaethje? They announced Gaethje versus Dan Hooker

and everyone's going gaga. Everyone loves it. And so now maybe he doesn't have to worry about the politics. He doesn't, and I don't mean the politics of life and the world. I mean, the politics of MMA and matchmaking. He doesn't have to worry about the politics. He doesn't, and I don't mean the politics of life and the world. I mean, the politics of MMA and matchmaking. He doesn't have to worry about title shots.

Maybe he'll just let it fly now. Maybe we'll hear about the crazy or see the crazy Sean Strickland that we hear about in the gym from training partners and sparring partners. And what I would say is, if we do see that, that plus his personality and what he does on the mic would make him into one of the biggest stars in the UFC. Do you know what I mean? If he's a 500 fighter in the UFC but always delivers fun fights, he will be immortalized. But you can't be that guy and produce these fights. Now you're way too polarizing.

I just don't think he has it, though. Yeah, maybe he doesn't. His style is his style. People talk about him in the gym like he's a freaking Tasmanian devil. Well, he kind of is. It's just not power. He opened up against Alex Pereira and that ended up being an absolute mistake. Now, not everybody has the concussive force that Alex Pereira does,

but I don't know. Look, Sean Strickland can still beat a lot of fighters. That's the thing that I think is like his style is his style. It's not going to thrill everybody. That's fine. And it doesn't even throw me again. I just tolerate it. I'm fine with it. I don't hate it. I don't love it, but it's effective. It is effective and he can still beat a lot of good, a lot of good fighters. I mean, you know, he lost to Kenanir, but I think he thinks, and there are several others that thought he won that fight. There are several who thought he won the first

Drickus fight. Certainly not this one. Got absolutely outclassed. So, like, I don't know. He's still an effective guy. He just does not have power. That's the thing. I mean, the last 75 minutes he's spent in the Octagon have been with Israel Adesanya and DDP twice over, so he's clearly high level. Like, he can compete

at the highest level of middleweight Yeah I'm curious what they do with him next Rick you asked me on Saturday Izzy the more I think about it I don't love it Oh tell me You know what I want

I know Brendan Allen is fighting this weekend I want someone to get a shot against him I want Bo Nickel Bo Nickel shot against him. You're saying Bo Nickel. Somebody not. Bo Nickel, baby. Fucking hell. Bo fucking Nickel. Bo Nickel has a fight.

I know that. I don't know what it is. I was on his podcast. It's a great show. And he told me he has a fight. And this is before this fight. American versus American. I don't hate it.

Prideful American versus prideful American. I don't hate it. Do you think. All right, here's a question. Crazy idea. That's the bill. Do you like this? Who is more American. I don't hate it. Do you think, alright, here's a question. That's a crazy idea. That's the bill. Do you like this? Who is more American? No, no, no. Is Bo Nickel ready for

a guy who just fought? I don't know if Bo Nickel is ready. I mean, I would assume he thinks that, but I mean, the build to that would be fantastic. Sean Strickland going at Bo Nickel, basically just telling him, you're not ready for this, like you're not built for this, but Bo Nickel's going to mix it up. He's not just going to stand there and strike with him, I don't think. So it would be a fascinating matchup.

What about like Michel Pejeta? Sorry? Sean Strickland versus Michel Pejeta? Yeah. If he's willing to take it. I don't know. It feels like too big of a drop-off. That's a big –

Maybe too big of a drop-off. In terms of the rankings. Michel Pejeta is ranked higher than Bo Nickel. Oh. Wait, are you talking Bo Nickel versus Michel? No. Sean Strickland versus Pejeta. Oh, yeah, but that's Bo Nickel versus Michel? No, Sean Strickland versus Bejeda. Oh, yeah, but that's the name of Bo Nickel.

That's what I'm writing that off of. I mean, okay, so maybe Brandon Allen's fighting this weekend. I like where your head is at, though, in terms of like, Izzy versus Sean doesn't really do anything. He needs to get out of this. Do you guys think Sean Strickland will now remain on pay-per-views, be like headlining fight nights in arenas, or do you think they're moving back? Yes, absolutely.

He's still a name. Move back to the apex. No, he's still a name. He's still a draw. He lost to the champion. It just all kind of falls apart. Perhaps he was sick. I know it feels like a lifetime ago,

but he beat the brakes off Israel Adesanya. Like, absolutely destroyed him, crushed him, blanked him. Yeah, it feels like a lifetime ago. It feels like a lifetime ago. But that happened pretty recently. Like, he's, he's still good. I'm not, I'm not ready to toss the shots.

I'm not ready to toss them out, but anyone who's saying that they felt like that was like a bit of a letdown. Oh yeah. I'm not going to argue now on the flip side. Are you guys surprised that DDP didn't say anything about Hamza? It seemed like he, they said he was looking at Pereira when he said whatever he said, Alex Pereira,

who was there sitting, actually he was, he was there cornering Sean Strickland. So it seemed like he was talking to him, but nothing about Hamzat. That's the fight. Like there's, there's no one else, right? I mean, he said it in the post-fight press. Yeah. Yeah, but in the, in the freaking press. What does he need to do?

He's the champ. You come to me. So he's going to out-wrestle him. He said he got carried away in the cage. Like he, he had been watching movies and thinking of lines and he saw Alex Pereira and got carried away in the cage Like he had been Watching movies and thinking of lines And he saw Alex Pereira and got carried away But then he was very quick in the post fight What was the line he dropped?

It was from Troy wasn't it? Is there no one else? Oh yeah is there no one else Something like that yeah He addressed it in the post fight No doubt about it He looks so freaking evil in this. He said...

Look, it's easy. It's easy. Like, Pereira has to fight Ankeloev. He has to fight Hamza. Both divisions need to be sorted out here. There's no point in even... I think I read somewhere that Pereira came out to him in the back and was like, I didn't know what you were saying in the cage.

I got to deal with stuff at 205. And even if we do fight, it's got to be at 205. And to his credit, Drikus has said... By the way, my admiration for Drikus has said that, by the way, you know, my respect, my admiration for Drikus as a fighter just continues to grow. He said in the post-fight press conference as well, he wants to fight Alex Pereira, but it's not this like, I need a second belt. I need to do it next type of thing.

It's a, I think Alex Pereira is one of the legends of our sport, a modern day, like goat. And I just want his name on my resume because I want to be that one day. He's looking at Alex not as like, I need a second belt, I'm angling. You can always kind of see the machinations, right? When we hear Ilya Teporya talk about going up to 55, it just feels too soon. It feels like Drikus is not kind of taking that path.

He wants Hamzat because he wants to prove it. And then if he could beat Hamzat, he's like, a guy like an Alex Pereira is a challenge that I'd want. If he beats Hamzat and Alex Pereira beats Uncle Live, I mean, they have got a massive, massive fight on their hands. If DDP were to go up to 205 and challenge for the belt against Alex Pereira. You know what's so crazy about DDP? Like when you actually watch him and far be it for me to tell someone how to fight. But like he does this thing where he kind of like goes forward, lunges in, and then like retreats like this. Pulls it back. Yeah, it's crazy. It's wild to watch, but like he does this thing where he kind of like goes forward, lunges in and then like retreats like this.

Pulls it back. Yeah. It's crazy. It's wild to watch, man. But man, he can, as goofy and like awkward as he looks, he can snap those head kicks up there. Like, no, he actually pulls punches halfway through the movement.

Like he'll be here. Like, like some guys faint, but he's actually here. Like he's, he's, he's committed to the punch and then he'll come back. He'll committed to the punch. And then he'll come back to this. It's crazy. It's a little bit like watching two kids in a playground. They'll just throw a bunch of things and then on their way back go like this.

But it works. It absolutely works. The power is crazy too. The way that he broke Strickland's nose like that, that was incredible. I did not see this coming from him. When you were introduced to him early in his career and, and I'll be honest, I wasn't very familiar with him pre, uh, UFC.

None of it looked like a, like the guy, you remember the first time on the microphone, he's like telling us how to pronounce his name. Like none of it felt elementary. None of it felt like, oh my gosh, this is the next big thing. And just slowly, but surely all he does is win. And for the most part, he does it in an impressive fashion.

Here's the thing. Drikus is very rarely, if ever in boring fights. Is there one that you could think of? And so that's why I don't really blame him for this fight. And why should he have taken an insane amount of risk when his opponent who is the challenger was doing very little it was just working it was a systematic breakdown rack up a title defense and move on to the hamza fight i can assure you that the hamza chamaya fight will not be boring yeah be crazy and one thing about that the style ariel um one thing even right back to the kswW days when he was in that kind of beef with Soldich, if you ever talk to someone after they fight

Drikus Duplessis, they completely understand it. You know the way, like, we're watching it and we're going, what? This is so, you know, it can look clunky, it can look cumbersome, but he gets the job done. But if you talk to someone who's fought him, they're like, mate mate this guy is unbelievable he is so difficult to do anything to i can remember be uh before he won the title uh we

interviewed solich and solich was like i'm telling you this guy's gonna do it he's gonna win the belt he's gonna be trouble for everyone and i was kind of like yeah okay like i'd say that too if he had a win over me i know but it's proven to be the case he is he is so awkward and so powerful and i just can't wait to see how he'll react to hamsat's grappling onslaught you know because that's like he is a bigger guy than robert whittaker he is a bigger guy than israel it's gonna be very interesting to see that because it's also just his sheer size it's like fighting a fucking wardrobe well yeah amazing amazing uh uh illustration uh to imagine you have to think though also style wise everybody talks about dracus but it's the stand-up

right it's the awkwardness of that you have to imagine the way to negate that is to put him on his back and see what he can do from there because he doesn't have the opportunities to do that and you would assume if anybody can do that it is ham Hamza Chamayev. So we're meeting the true test. We are meeting the, the, oh, when Conor McGregor was coming up, ah, but all he is is a left hand. What, what happens when he faces a wrestler? We are fate. We are, we are meeting this again. We are finding out what happens when Drik is meets a wrestler of that caliber. Maybe down the line one day, he'll meet a Bo Nickel who also has that caliber. But for now, this is the most fascinating, one of the most fascinating things. I had it when we were doing our preview. I had

it as my number one thing. Hamza Chemaev versus whoever wins the title. And so Drekis Duplessis versus Hamza is the fight I am most highly anticipating. He's fought Marcus Perez, Trevin Giles, Brad Tavares, Darren Till, Derek Brunson, Robert Whitaker, Sean Strickland, Izzy,

Sean Strickland. Strickland, Derek Brunson, Robert Whitaker, Sean Strickland, Izzy, Sean Strickland. Strickland, no takedowns. Whitaker, one takedown. Brunson, one takedown. Darren Till, one takedown. Brunson, probably the best grappler that he's faced, but I mean, that's a different stratosphere than Hamzat. So he's never quite fought anyone quite like Hamzat, and I know no one is quite like Hamzat, but I can't wait to see that fight. And I hope we don't have to wait until October, but there's a chance that we will have to wait until October. Despite the fact that Dana White has said that there's nothing wrong with Hamzat's visa, travel, whatever. Hopefully we don't have to wait eight months for that fight. Now, what about Zhang Weili? Blown away by Zhang Weili, blown away by how she finding out afterwards that she asked for this fight, blown away by how she fought, how she lost the first round and then just figured it out for the next four rounds. And I mentioned that it feels like there's, it was Hamza and Tatiana,

right? The two people that we've been talking about for years, who we thought were going to be fighting for a belt many years ago, who we thought would be championed by now. Well, now we saw how it worked out with Tatiana. And she wasn't fraud checked and she wasn't anything like that. She just fought the number one pound for pound fight in the world. And she's not quite there. And oh, by the way, she hasn't fought for a year plus. And maybe that isn't the best recipe going into a fight against Zhang Weili.

But that was, it was stunning if only because she was able to beat her at her own game. She was able to hang with her on the ground. She was able to stuff her takedowns. She was just able to beat her up. And she's somewhat unassuming. She's freaking jacked. She is so strong. She is so fit and she's gotten so good. I just can't say enough good things about Zhang Weili. I cannot say enough good things about the fighter that she has turned into. And so many people were picking Tatiana going into this fight. And rightfully so.

She's a tremendous talent. And it seemed like because Zhang had never quite fought someone like her and we sort of felt like, you know, maybe her last couple of opponents weren't up to snuff that, uh, that maybe she would get, you know, uh, she would get a drubbing, she would get exposed, she would have a, a rough night, but it was the complete opposite. What did you think of her, PT? What did you think of what Zhang did?

Blown away. Yeah. And look, absolutely blown away. It's a virtuoso performance from round two to five. Uh, brilliant. But really when i was watching it what i was and this is in the first round and this one what i was really impressed

with her in the first round was she has this person on top of her who was this effortless ability you know like suarez at that point is effortlessly um running around our body picking uh different positions to pressure to keep her on the mat and the only thing you can do in that situation and this is white belt stuff this is like the first time you ever go on a mat and this is what you're taught and this was so impressed because obviously uh jang is the champion of the world when you when you're facing effortless ability which suarez has in that top position, takedown to top position, the only reply to it is maximum effort. And so you can see Wiley on the bottom, like a lunatic. She's having no success whatsoever.

She's just going, going, constantly trying to get back up. And I think in many ways that was a big sign early on to Suarez that, even if you get me here, I will fight you for every second you have me down here. Nothing will be easy. Then the second round comes along and she stuffs the takedowns. And so suddenly this effortless ability doesn't work anymore. So Suarez has to go back to effort, constantly efforting to get her down. By the time round three comes around she's actually she's

done as far as i'm concerned the corner conversations she's having are completely different beyond round three they're trying to will something out of her because that's what that's what she had taken from her at that point when she couldn't get her down in rounds two and three she had sapped the will from tatiana suarez and from then on it was a showcase performance from moylee zhang absolutely amazing sorry zhang moylee um she's brilliant i completely agree with From then on, it was a showcase performance from Wiley Zhang. Absolutely amazing. Sorry, Zhang Wiley. She's brilliant. I completely agree with you. Pound for pound, number one, without a doubt.

I love the idea of the Valentina fight as well. Looking forward to seeing if they can get it done. And I'd love to see a big homecoming for her in China now as well, because I think that would be quite a thing to see too. Does anyone remember when and how Tatiana Suarez cut her knee open? I think it was during the third round. I think it was second round. I mean, look at that. That's got to mess you up.

It looks like a bite mark. Yeah, like a cage or something. Like ripped it open bad. Oh, that's what they said. Right where it bends too. And in between one of the rounds, she was asking her corner, like how bad is it? Like she didn't want to look at it.

Yeah, that's got to mess you up. But, you know, it sucks. It really does suck. But she seemed broken by the end. She had nothing left. And she was able to get a couple takedowns towards the end as well. To me, that was an incredible performance. Amazing stuff out of Zhang.

She is turning into a superstar. And I really want to see that Valentina fight so badly. But there's Manon Fioro and and I feel bad about skipping her and so the the question is Manon Fioro last fought in March in Atlantic City against Aaron Blanchfield honestly this is why you don't do like they they they did the ultimate fighter thing and they waited for uh Noche UFC and that kind of delayed everything I mean that fight was in March Noche UFC was in kind of delayed everything. I mean, that fight was in March. Noche UFC was in September. She sat six months just to get to that fight.

And that fight was now five months ago. And so we'll see when it gets booked again. I have a theory as to when or where it should be booked. But I don't know. Like Zhang versus Valentina is a huge fight. Now, what happens if they do Mano F, Zhang versus Valentina is a huge fight. Now, what happens if they do Mano Fioro versus Valentina? What happens,

like, hey, when is that going to be? May? You know, I, the Montreal card, friends,

feels like it has Bilal versus Shavkat and Mano versus Valentina written all over it. Does it not? Yeah. Feels like it'll be the Bilal Shafkat. And I guess Manon.

You put a French woman on there. Quebec loves its French-speaking athletes. And what if Manon beats Valentina? Now you lose the Valentina and Jean. And are you doing Manon versus Jean? Are you doing Manon versus Valentina too? Maybe. But, you know, all of these fights that we're talking about

where potential champion facing champion, you're not giving that opportunity to someone who's just won the belt. You know, you need a reason to. You need the idea that this person has completely set himself or herself apart from her division. And at this point, this is the only thing you can do with them. So the idea of Ankeloyev or Hamzat or any of these guys going straight up or Manofe or Oyu you just mentioned seems ridiculous.

So what do you do? What do you do? You bypass her? Yeah. No, you got to let them fight. You got to let them fight and hope Valentina does it. Wiley Zhang versus Valentina. Really?

Yeah. It's just so good, but I feel bad. Is that bigger than... Nah, Kayla Harrison and Amanda Nunez has to be bigger, right? I'm trying to think of the biggest possible fight you can make in all the women's division. Listen, I love Manon Fierro. You don't have to tell me about Manon Fioro, but, man, I want that fight so bad.

Why is Jan going for double champ status? These are the breaks, man. It happens in the sport all the time. This young lady waited a whole year. It's going to be almost a year. She earned it. And she wasn't hurt. Yeah.

It hurts, man. As they say. The only other person out there. Yes, they do say that. The only other person out there is Vianna Gianjiroba, but she's fighting Yann Charnin. Can you even offer a compelling fight? Who, Gian? Grasso.

Do you give her Grasso? Oh, just as a non-title fight. Well, you're going to have to think of something to do with Mano Vero if you're not putting her in this spot. Oh, you're saying for Fiora. Give her a ticket to sit and watch and see who gets the winner. Yeah, okay. Now, there is a precedent. It hasn't happened a lot of times where someone gets paid just to sit out.

Yeah, here's a few bones. Here's a cage-side seat. Enjoy the show. You get winner in a big-time fight. That fight is so good who wins that fight let's wait for it to be booked before we start my prediction if you guys remember female fighter of the year my pound for pound number one the entire time we've been doing these rankings yeah i said she's gonna be tatiana suarez and then move up fight valentine's predictions are

looking good there was someone else that you predicted. Oh yeah, Loke Dog. Yeah, Loke Dog. Yeah, breakout fighter of the year. We're already well on our way to that. That was a great show. That was a great one. We'll see.

We'll see. Only February. My breakout fighter is poison. Who? My, my, every fighter I pick for breakout fighter

has a horrendous year. So, it's nearly like, I hope fighters are watching through their fingers next year. I hope it's not me. I hope it's not me because the first one was Benoit and then this one was Peyton. Horrific. Horrific picks

back to back. I think Zhang would be the favorite, right? Oh, I don't know, man. Moving up is tough. She might be after that performance on Saturday. Also, your picks, Pete, you were the one that got the

parlay pass. All three of us. Oh, yeah. It's so hot. You don't have to get into that. Do you know what's really interesting

about that? When I won, when my legs won, I never heard a well won Pete. We threw confetti. I gave you my winnings.

Can I understand? Can I understand? Why am I getting called very late into the week about this? What happens? I don't understand. You think you're a token invite? What I getting called very late into the week about this? What happens? I don't understand.

You think you're a token invite? What do you mean very late? Yes, a token invite. Is it Juliana Pena doesn't get onto you so you come looking for me? No, man. Is that what happens?

No, man. We do it on Thursdays. What do you want me to do? What I'll say to you. What I'll say to you. What I'll say to you is if I throw a dog a bone, I don't want to know

how it tastes. That's what I'd say to you alright We make our picks on Thursday man I don't know what you want me to do That's all I have to say When you get one right It'll be much better Yeah yeah yeah Pull out the Duke

Pull out the Duke man Are you going to start watching UFL now that NFL is over What was more entertaining UFC 312 or the Super Bowl? Super Bowl. Really? Yeah.

Really? Wow. Yeah. I guess John Wigley was the Eagles defense. I was torn all night because, as you guys know, well-documented, I said I wasn't going to watch. And I'll tell you why I ended up watching. I ended up watching because my older son, Oliver, was invited to his friend's house to watch the game.

And I remember being in seventh grade and I remember where I watched the Super Bowl in seventh grade. It was at Corey Levi's house. We watched the Niners Chargers Super Bowl, the first one without the Bills after four straight years. And I remember all of us sitting around and having sandwiches and a nice party. And it was a good time in his basement. And that's like kind of like the first Super Bowl party that I went to because the previous ones I wanted to watch the Bills. And my son chose to watch with me instead of his friends. And my daughter and wife went to my daughter's friend's house, but they were, you know, like, I don't love Super Bowl parties because a bunch of people talking.

I like to listen. I like to watch. I like to hear the commentary. I'm a loser like that. And right before the game started, I said to my son, my older son and my younger son, I said, there's going to be a time where you guys aren't going to be home. You're going to be in college. You're going to be with your friends and stuff like that. And I don't have many more of these left.

I really appreciate that you guys are here. I can't wait to watch this with you. And I'm going to many more of these left. I really appreciate that you guys are here. I can't wait to watch this with you. And I'm going to enjoy and relish this. And once I had that realization, I said, I need to drop the Bills thing and just enjoy this moment. Once again, like how I felt after the Bills lost, heartbroken, sad, kept thinking it should be Josh there. It should be us there. It should be the logo there, all that stuff. But it was, uh, it was special to, you know, uh, enjoy that with them. Started making picks and, you know, trying to, to get us into the game. And I, I, I couldn't quite

decide how I was feeling. Was I thrilled that they were getting their ass whooped or, or was I thinking the whole time and salty about the fact that it should have been us and then if it was us, would we have even beaten that version of the Eagles? I'm still not quite sure. But overall, I think I've settled on thrill that they got their ass whooped and there was no three-peat. I think that was my final determination. I will tell you something, though. UFC 312, way better than that halftime show.

Oh, yeah. Can we have an honest discussion who is the one person who went out on a limb in the midst of all the favoritism oh i mean this is one of the i mean i've never felt more alone you know when i'm when i'm when i'm when i'm supporting the state of israel i'm not as alone as when I say Kendrick is overhyped, and the only reason why people love him is because he's anti-Drake. And what happened? On the biggest of stages. Now, you'll have some people that come out and say,

oh, it's above your head, the subliminal messaging, all that stuff and more. Yeah, yeah, save it. Alright? Do that somewhere else. Not at the Super Bowl. He bottled it. Did he not bottle it? Can you guys... I thought it was the best part of the whole thing. He bottled it. Did he not bottle it? I thought it was the best part of the whole thing. I don't know.

This feels like a very biased thing. I thought it was the best part of the whole Super Bowl. Honestly. Did you see the crowd? Did you see the crowd? I heard them all saying A minor at one point. By the way, that's the only song of his that they know. That's literally the only song of his that they know. He starts playing these other songs that my kids actually like, Kendrick.

And they're like, oh, we don't know these songs. Bottled. I think a couple of them were off his new album. Jordan said that as well. Jordan was like, I wish he had performed some of his other stuff, his newer songs. So I guess that's not an unpopular opinion. I feel like some people might have wanted different things.

I will say it was just wild to me that he called somebody a pedophile on TV during the Super Bowl. Oh, he's so daring. And that, to me, wasn't that crazy because we all knew it was just wild to me that he called somebody a pedophile on TV during the Super Bowl. Oh, he's so daring. And that, to me, wasn't that crazy because we all knew it was going to happen. Every single person, yes, yes, yes, we knew it was going to happen. He didn't even say the word pedophile. All he did was do the A minor. Of course he insinuated it.

Of course he was going to play that. That's the whole reason he was there because of that beef. Like, none of that was shocking. So you agree with Ariel? That's the only reason you're not. Did you like it, though? I thought it was fine. He's the Sean Strickland. He's the Sean Strickland of the Super Bowl.

He said a whole lot of stuff. Nothing actually hit. It was fine. I do not care about a 20-minute concert inside a stadium that they quickly set up and then quickly break down. It's never going to be that quality. And then I'm watching it on TV. I've never cared about the Super Bowl halftime show. Usually in my mind though, I did hear a live vocal

throughout the thing, which is quite impressive for a rapper. The live part was respectable, yeah. More about the national anthem. It was respectable for the Grammy. Give me the B-22s or whatever flying over too. I fucking love that shit, man. I get hyped up.

I was shouting up the stairs they're doing it quickly did you take the over the under did you take the over the under on the natty anthem there pete i i i didn't i did have i lost loads of bets but i did have a horse to score first first touchdown i had a lot of squids on that so happy days wow this one that one narrowly cashed. You want to know the hero of the Super Bowl, actually? Me and my boys, every year we bet over two and a half players to attempt a pass.

Kenny Pickett, hero of the Super Bowl. Ah, yeah. Game in, garbage time. Oh, shit. Yeah, fourth down. Just took the snap, threw it away. Attempted a pass. Cashed it at the last minute.

Do you have a good one? I hit that. I hit DeAndre Hopkins' touchdown. Chiefs money line. Got rinsed on that bad boy. That one was over quick. Oh, so happy that they didn't get the three-peat. And I hate to be that guy,

but they've enjoyed enough. And I'm just wondering... When that A.J. Brown played, though? Did you, like, when they didn't call up for us? Oh, yeah. It was the same old, same old. And by the way,

worth noting, you know, my boy won MVP. That did soften the blow of the week. Yeah. There was no, like, I thought you would be more braggadocious about that. I mean, he like. MVP is great and all, but I wanted him to win the Super Bowl. I know, but we all said it was going to be Lamar. It was beautiful. It was beautiful. The speech was amazing. Do good, be good, God bless and go Bills. I mean, what's better than that? What's better than that? Him and Haley up there, I mean, they just look radiant. They looked unbelievable.

So he'll get his time. We'll say 100 for next year. He'll get his time. We'll say 100 for next year. He'll get his time. And by the way, next year in his neck of the woods, in NorCal, which is where he grew up. So it's all working out perfectly, just according to plan.

Can I just say one last thing about the halftime thing? Sure. Does it not feel like the tide is now turning? No, not at all. It goes worse than ever. I think people loved it. It's been double the pull. I think it was very polarizing. I think people either loved it or they hated it. So you feel like

Drake was sitting there watching that and happy? No. Oh yeah, I was celebrating. I was celebrating. I was celebrating. I don't think he had his ex-missus dancing to the song. I don't even think it was an ex. I think he's like tried to go after her and she's denied him. Says who? Also, I mean, like Serena coming in just to crip walk and that's it.

And like no words or anything. It's the subliminal message. She was on there for like 5 seconds That's it Top 3 female tennis player of all time Drizzy out there with a shirt with bullet holes on it Like he doesn't care He don't care

That's what everyone's talking about The smoking bullet vest Not the Superbowl halftime show If Drizzy was the halftime performer Would the show have been better? No. No. I don't know.

I like Drake. I like Drake. He's got more bangers. I like Drake, too. Yeah, he has way more bangers in terms of songs that people love to party to and bop around. Top 40 hits, you would say. So yeah, I mean, maybe.

And a bunch of weirdos. I knew what was going to happen. I tweeted, man with a Canadian flag. Oh my God. The weirdos that come out of the woodwork. I don't even know where these people come from. Half of them don't even follow me. And they come out of the woodwork.

And I'm just having a laugh. But to me, the best word in the dictionary is loyalty. And I'm loyal to my guy my canadian brother i'm loyal to him and unless told otherwise listen there are allegations i see them but i've not seen any proof of these allegations no one has come out and said x y and z i'm not going to just be a sheep and follow because there's a catchy tune attached to it i'm sorry and by the way i'm not trying to put Kendrick down. This is a fact.

You guys can agree on this. He actually thinks Kendrick is a Johnny Comer. Can you not agree? If that feud doesn't happen. He's not at the Super Bowl. I agree. Thank you. I agree with you. Thank you.

That's the only thing I want. I will also disagree. The tides are not turning. The tides are not turning. There's a meme out of him smiling, looking directly at the camera when he was like, hey, Drake. And people are like, if I send this to you,

just know that not only am I praying for your downfall, I also orchestrated it. I don't think it's much better. People are willing too much into existence here. Can I just ask? The engagement race. He did the flag in front of Donald Trump.

Did Trey get popular because of this? No. No, the tide's turning. That's willing that. There's always, there's always a, look, I saw a lot more hate. What has Drake done to do the tide turning? Oh, no, he didn't have to do anything. It was that performance made the tide turn.

That performance did it for him. I think it's polarizing. It was self-inflicted. I think if you wanted Jason Aldean to perform the halftime show, you probably didn't like the Kendrick one, but. I don't even you wanted Jason Aldean to perform the halftime show, you probably didn't like the Kendrick one, but... I don't even know who Jason Aldean is. I saw a lot of, like, uh, can I just say, we should do a country performer next year. Nah, fuck that.

I hate country. I just think, if you went into it thinking you weren't gonna like it... Hip-hop's my favorite kind of music. I'm not one of those people. Uh, the one a couple years ago with Eminem and Dre and all that stuff, that was incredible. That was great. Um, so I'm not on that, like, give me, uh, give give me i don't know whoever you shibuzi or something i'm down for shibuzi

it is kind of crazy that they've never had shibuzi had a nerds commercial last night he did shout out to him it is kind of crazy we don't get your commercials oh nerds gummy cluster shout out such a big candy you got a super bowl commercial it is it is kind of crazy that they uh that they didn't um they've not had uh taylor swift on yeah i don't know maybe she's too big yeah maybe too expensive she sold out uh the superdome like three nights in a row so she's she's performed there before do you feel like that's worn off as well like yeah which that's what i'm saying like yeah it was a thing for a while you know like oh there's there's tail and they'd shower like 25 times for the whole game kind of

feel like that's that's done now as well right yeah i'm like stupid i was never bothered by it i understand why they showed her she's a massive yeah i don't care about that got no eyes on the game she's just trying to hashtag grow the game also Also, early on, I didn't like the graphics. I kind of liked them towards the end. The score bug. Yeah. Score bug was utter shit to me the entire game, but I loved all the other graphics. Really?

Just the blocks, wasn't a fan. I didn't like the font, but I loved the simplicity of the font because before there used to be so much crap covered up, like the line and the colors and all this stuff. And then the stats just in the bottom right and left corner as the drive was going on. I didn't love that either.

You didn't love that? I do think it's interesting. It's like an unspoken rule that they debut next year's score bug and everything on the Super Bowl. Really? Yeah, that's going to be Fox's score bug next year. You've been doing it for like a decade now yeah none of it yeah man anyway uh so that was our super bowl talk um anybody having a good snack less rewarding great great snack what was that

at all like like in terms of i was saying you know staying up for usc 312 wasn't a very rewarding experience that was way less rewarding the super bowl year, you know, you put in the miles here, watching every fucking game, and then it comes down to just the complete blowout. Horrific. You know, to throw in the towel before the four quarter even begins. Can't believe it.

I'm ashamed of myself, but I also understand where I did it. Front runners. Frauds. By the way, Chiefs? Fraud checked. Yeah, that's right. Losers, front runners, frauds. By the way, Chiefs, fraud check. Yeah, that's right. The downfall of the Chiefs needs to be studied.

The downfall of the Chiefs needs to be studied. Fuck them. Fuck them. Let's talk about this. Let's talk about this Jake Paul Canelo Alvarez situation. This is a wacky one, my friends. This is a wacky one, my friends. This is a wacky one. So I had been hearing that Jake Paul and Canelo were kind of doing the dance. They were circling each other around the time of the Mike Tyson fight. Now, if you recall, in the ring after the Mike Tyson fight, I asked Jake about Canelo. That week he was starting to talk about Canelo. I asked him, he didn't kind of take the bait. And then, um, you know, we started, we, we, you know, we, we started to talk about the aftermath of the fight and that came up a couple of times. I remember without it, we spoke about like, I think

of, I think we're closer to the Canelo fight. Again, I remind you guys, like, I don't just say things for the sake of saying things. Okay. Like there's a, there's a method to the madness. Anyway. So we were getting closer. We were getting closer. At the same time, we were starting to hear about this Terrence Crawford versus Canelo fight in this, uh, potential three fight deal with, with Turkey Alshake and, and, and Riyadh season and all this stuff. And so this, this, you know, this was happening and it was almost happening in parallel. These two things were happening at the same time, but the plan was Canelo Alvarez versus Jake Paul in May, Crawford fight in September with Turkey and company, and then two other fights. Around this time last week, we started to hear that the Crawford Canelo fight was a real thing,

that it was being finalized for September 13th at Allegiant Stadium. I remember we came back on Tuesday and we talked about it being a real thing. At the same time, the Jake Canelo stuff started to come out as well. And so I believe both sides, I almost know this for a fact, that both sides knew about each other's presence in Canelo's life. But Canelo was, you know, kind of shaping this up to be one of the best years of his life from a monetary standpoint. You could go fighting Jake Paul in May for a boatload of money, close to $100 million in a fight that he should win easily. And then you get to fight a guy who's two weight classes below you at Allegiant Stadium,

mammoth, mega biggest fight of the year. Like what? I mean, the guy is making, I don't know, 200 million in 2025 alone. And so these things were happening at the same time. Now, come Wednesday, we find out that the Canelo fight against Crawford is in jeopardy. And by the way, all of this was coming from The Ring, The Ring magazine, which Turkey had just purchased. And so we all thought, like we've had these discussions behind the scenes saying, well, if it's coming from The Ring,

it's coming from Turkey. So it's gospel, right? Come Thursday, Eddie Hearn is starting to tell media in the UK, it's looking like a done deal deal Jake Paul versus Canelo in May and so everyone's thinking like wow Canelo chose Jake Paul over Crawford

my understanding was on the MVP side they never said pick and choose and for the longest time on the Riyadh season side it didn't have to be a pick and choose. But along the way, and at some point mid last week, it became a pick and choose on the Riyadh side. It became, no, we don't want you to take that fight in May.

We'll give you another fight. We'll up this to four fights, but you got to drop that one. There was a report that came out via ESPN where they said they're moving on, they're not going to do the fight, and it might be Terrence Crawford versus Boots Ennis in September instead. Boots has a title fight April 12th against Stanionis in Atlantic City. So, you know, a bit of a car before the horse. And I didn't believe, once that started to come out, I didn't believe. I didn't believe that the Craw started to come out, I didn't believe. I didn't believe that the Crawford fight was dead.

I didn't believe that it was in jeopardy, but I believe that there was a jockeying a position going on. It all comes to a head, essentially, late Thursday night when Turkey and Canelo announced that he has agreed to a four-fight deal starting Cinco de Mayo weekend, that he would be fighting someone. We didn't know at the time who it was, but he'd be fighting that weekend and he won't be fighting Canelo. And then you'll have the Terrence Crawford fight in September and then two more fights in, in 2026, a four-fight deal instead of a three-fight deal. So the May fight replaces the Jake Paul fight. Jake Paul, very upset. MVP upset, putting out things.

And so this is what I've gathered since then. One of the issues which Jake Paul talked about in the video that he released afterwards was Jake and his team wanted this fight to be on Netflix. Netflix was on board. Canelo and his team didn't want it to be on Netflix. They felt like it could be a massive pay-per-view fight. They thought two, three, four million. I disagree with that if only because Jake Paul fans don't buy pay-per-views. Historically, they just like to, you know, steal them, stream them. And, you know, they're a young fan base. They're not paying 70 or so dollars. But that's just what we've seen in his last few pay-per-view fights. They were going back and forth on that.

They had a commitment from Netflix. They had a signed agreement from Canelo to pursue this fight. That was the picture that Jake put in his video, the confidentiality agreement. It wasn't a signed contract per se. It was an agreement that we are going to pursue this fight for X amount of time and we're going to negotiate in good faith and that you're going to zero in on this. So take that for what it is. On the Riyadh side of things, they didn't want him to take this fight. And they didn't want him

to take this fight perhaps for two reasons. A, they didn't want him to go down the Jake Paul route. You know, once you go down that path, once you go down the influencer path, perhaps you're, you know, you're changing the way people view your reputation. You're now in an influencer world, all this stuff and more. And I do believe there's a bit of a feud going on, as you can see, between Jake and his team and Turkey and his team. And you've seen some harsh things being said about each other since then. I also do believe on the Turkey side of things, there's a little TKO involvement as well with Dana White and Nick Khan, and they're going to get into the boxing business probably with Turkey if all shakes out the way it's planned right now at some point, and perhaps they'll even be involved

in this Terrence Crawford fight in September. And so ultimately they convinced Canelo, don't take this fight. It's bad for you. It's bad for your reputation. Go with us. We'll give you the May fight. And that May fight has become an IBF title fight against one William Scull. And that will be on Cinco de Mayo weekend, which I believe is May 3rd in Riyadh Sunday morning. So I actually think it'll be May 4th, Sunday morning to air here. The first time that he fights outside of North America and he'll be fighting a Cinco de Mayo card in Riyadh.

I don't know how many Mexican fans will be in Riyadh for that card. So he's fighting Skull to get the IBF title. He already has the three other belts at 168 pounds. So it's a unification bout. It's for Undisputed. And that would mean that the Crawford fight, if he wins, would be for Undisputed. And it would be an opportunity for Crawford to become a three division Undisputed champ, just like we saw from Clarissa Shields. But this would feel,

in my opinion, a lot more significant and a lot more powerful. Where I think the, the, the Riyadh side made a mistake was, I think that Canelo goes in and he wipes the floor with Jake Paul. And I think that only makes him more popular. He's viewed as a savior of boxing. He's viewed as the guy who beat up the influencer. Um, good riddance, Jake Paul. Thank you, Canelo. Now onto the big fight. I think it only would have upped his profile, whether it was on Netflix, which I think it should have been, or on pay-per-view, it was going to be covered by everyone, talked about by everyone. It would be this sort of crossover fight that everyone's talking about. And I didn't think that this, while you could say like, oh, wow, you know, at this juncture in your life, you know, you're going down this path. There was so much

money involved. Take that money and run and then go on to the big fight. I didn't think that it would ruin the Crawford fight if honestly, like quite the opposite. I think it would have made the Crawford fight even bigger because I think he would have won that fight. Now I see a lot of people celebrating Canelo, you know, you, you, you did it for boxing. You did it for the sanctity of the sport you turned down that fight to take william skull you know in in in riyadh make no mistake about it canelo has always been a businessman canelo is only loyal to himself and i don't say this in a bad way at all eddie hearn like one of his biggest fans has said this like he looks out for himself he's a prize fighter who talks about payday and he just got paid more to take this fight against William Scull in Riyadh. And now Jake Paul's left with his hands in his pocket.

And I don't think that fight is dead. It's just not happening this year and maybe not next year, but it could certainly happen in two years. And it would still probably be a thing unless Canelo loses his next four fights in a row, which I don't think he is going to lose. And so it was just a fascinating thing to watch play out because it seemed like a lot of people were celebrating the fact that he gave essentially the middle finger to Jake Paul. And it seemed like a lot of people were happy that he was sticking down the path. Although, you know, you can't, in terms of like attention, you can't compare William Skull to Jake Paul, but they were happy that he was sticking down this traditional boxing path.

And there were other people who said like, yo man, you should have just taken that fight, held your ground, and the Crawford fight would have been waiting for you because Crawford doesn't have a lot of options. And it seems like the re-ed season folks really want to be in the Canelo business. And so maybe he could have held his ground. Maybe he could have gotten the cake and eaten it. But ultimately he chose to go with Turkey and sign this four fight deal. I think that would have been a huge fight. I think Canelo would have won the fight. I asked last week, it's amazing to me, like I asked last week, like, could he stumble this and that? Just because I'm asking questions on this show, you dummies. It doesn't mean that I believe this. It doesn't mean that I believe this. Of course, Canelo was going to win that fight. Of course, that fight would have been a relatively easy payday for Canelo Alvarez, unless he didn't

train for it and just, you know, took the fight very likely. But, you know, it was, as I put it on Friday, somewhat of a moral victory, I thought, because, you know, two years ago, Canelo was laughing at the idea of fighting Jake Paul. Two years ago, he said, come on, guys, ask me real questions. And now here he is, actively, seriously negotiating and if there wasn't this Riyad season slash Crawford fight waiting in the wings as a possibility, he takes that fight. He absolutely

takes that fight. No matter how much money they spend, they won't be able to make a bigger fight than me and Canalito. That irked them to the core and don't say, Connor, he's more washed than a laundromat. Dummies could have made Canelo's September fight so much bigger by letting us do our thing and me taking his name to the masses, but they knew I was going to KO his little ass. I don't think that was it.

I think they just didn't want him to be in the Jake Paul business, and they wanted to leave him at the altar. And so now we're seeing old school Jake Paul reemerge, talking all kinds of smack about Canelo. And it really came to a head with this video, not the one you're seeing right now, but this video from one of his vehicles where he goes nuclear on one of, on Canelo Alvarez himself. Take a look. Oh, Canelo, you puta.

And this fucking YouTuber. I just fight real fighters. Time to expose him. So we had a signed contract to fight. Here you can see Canelo's signature and my signature to the right. Claiming he's not fighting YouTubers. Bullshit. Look at the poster. We were announcing Tuesday, February 11th. Claiming he fights real fighters, but he's fighting Crawford, a 135 pound fighter and running from a real fighter like David Benavidez, you bitch. The truth is you can be bought. You're a money hungry squirrel chasing your next nut. The truth is these sports washing shady characters are paying you hundreds of millions of dollars to stop our fight from happening because they couldn't fathom the fact

that they can't create a bigger fight than me and you. Al Heyman has made you hundreds of millions of dollars and you turned your back on him for this check. Disloyal. And you were begging to do this fight on pay-per-view. But I have loyalty. Loyalty to Netflix. Doing the biggest numbers. And you call me a YouTuber,

but you've never had a boxing match as big as mine. Remember you told my team that your daughter came home and asked if you were fighting Jake Paul? She was all excited. You said that was the first time your daughter's ever asked you about a fight and you're screwing over all your Mexican fans by doing your fights in Saudi it just shows what type of person you are and I promise you one thing Canelo any fight that you do this year mine will be bigger so go fuck off to your boss you ring magazine employee you pink and orange bitch and oh fix that herpy on

your lip I you dirty puta. I mean, that felt like an old school Jake Paul video when he was going after Dana White and Conor McGregor. He was responding to a video that Canelo posted via The Ring magazine. I believe we have it. This is Canelo talking to Jake Paul. Hey, guys. Don't pay attention to anything. And this fucking YouTuber.

I just fight real fighters. Don't fucking around with Canelo. Come on, let's go. I love it. I love everything about this. And so now we have a true blue rivalry between one Canelo Alvarez and Jake Paul between Riyad's season and MVP. This is fascinating stuff. What I do know for sure is that they were seriously negotiating. He wanted to do both, but ultimately they upped the ante and he went with Turkey.

Now, what was really fascinating about it from a media standpoint, and a lot of you won't care about this, is that in an interview with ESPN's Mike Coppinger on Friday evening, Turkey admitted to putting out, I don't know, some smokescreens, some false information to both the ring and to ESPN while he was trying to get this done. And that is a fascinating thing. And of course. Didn't he say it too in ESPN interviewer as well? Yeah, he literally said it. He said it to Coppinger. While also saying like, I respect you. You're a great man.

He's like, oh, thank you. Thank you. I appreciate that. Um, as, as he's telling him straight up, like, yo man, I had to, I had to give you false info. Yeah. I played you.

I don't know why he had to do that, to be honest, but be honest, but, you know, there's perhaps more to the story. But, you know, this is what happens. When you own a media outlet, you can do this sort of thing.

And what are they going to say? Wait a second. Who are your sources? What is the ring going to say? They're like, we have to double check this one. We have to verify it. But they were, you know, they were ahead of it from the beginning.

It's on, it's off, it's back on. He's fighting this guy. What I thought was most fascinating was ESPN reporting on Thursday evening. They had all the information. Now you know where it came from. It obviously came from him. They had all the information about the May 3rd fight, and then they positioned it as in an 11th hour stunning reversal of, of, of, of, of, of his feelings, and oh my gosh, he was, he was just about to put pen to paper, and then he turned around, and he went there, no, that didn't happen, you guys got played,

you guys got played, and you were trying to, you know, you were trying to, to clean up the mess afterwards, it was told to you that this fight was happening. You ran with it. And then it was very clearly not done. As I reported on Thursday, by the way, that it wasn't done. And then this actual fight was done. And then you had to kind of reverse course and say, in a stunning 11th hour change of heart,

it is now going to be this fight, not that fight. PT, do you agree with this sentiment that the the crawford canelo fight would have been bigger if canelo fought jake paul first whether you like him or not he beats him probably in one-sided fashion maybe he lets him win a round or two and then everyone's like all right what's next oh now i'm going to fight you know a mega fight at a leg Stadium. I'll see you all in September. Yeah, absolutely. And you came on the crack on Friday to give us the lowdown on this.

And that was the first thing Ben Foulkes said when you went. He said, if I could have asked him one thing, it would have been about that. From Turkey's point of view, would he end up in like, this will put a massive spotlight in Canelo, which will bring to September. That says to me that there's other elements to this. It's not just about we want Canelo, which we'll bring to September. That says to me that there's other elements to this. It's not just about we want Canelo. It's nearly shoving Jake as well

as they're doing that. TKO's involved in this, 100%. I was watching Dana being asked about that at the post-fight press conference and I thought, what? He's acting like this is the first time I'm hearing this. It feels like there's definitely'm hearing this. It feels like there's definitely an alliance there.

It feels like that's played into it somewhat. This has been playing on my mind, Ariel. Am I right to say that Canelo has worked himself into a shoot here? Because initially, he was completely dismissive of this guy and all this stuff. And now suddenly, as you said,

no matter what way you want to look at this, there is a heated rivalry between Canelo Alvarez and Jake Paul. Yeah, there's something that's brewing. There's something that's brewing. Now, again, the hardest of the hardcore will tell you like, there's nothing there. We don't want to see this.

You know, I hope Jake Paul dies. But for the general public, there's definitely something there. And it only kind of upped the intrigue. Now, I have no problem with him fighting William Scull. In fact, on the show with Ade, I said before all this was like really a thing, I was like, well, what about William Scull?

Because, not because I want to see that fight, but because obviously he gets the IBF title and then you could promote the Crawford fight as an undisputed title fight for 168. So it makes sense. It will be a little bit weird that he's fighting a Cinco de Mayo fight in, in Saudi Arabia and not in Mexico. I think it would have been a great PR move to take him to Mexico,

you know, under the react season banner and say, look what we're giving you, right? We love boxing. We're giving you your guy, your hero in Mexico. I think that would have been a brilliant move.

But alas, not happening. If I could lay out those four fights, it would be Skull and then Crawford and then Benavidez and then Bivel. Those are the fights that everyone wants to see Canelo in. I don't know if he gets to all of those fights. And then on the fifth, can we get to Jake?

At that point, there'll be nothing left for him in quote-unquote real boxing. We know they left Canelo after those four points, for God's sake. Jesus Christ. A lot of people were dunking on Jake Paul saying that that wasn't a contract. His response was, I know none of y'all have had a fighter ever signed a contract, but you sign a LOI, letter of intent and confidentiality agreement with the person you're fighting. And then you shop that agreement to different media partners and platforms.

Once you negotiate with the platforms, you then sign full-length contract peasants still it wasn't a it wasn't a contract like they can't necessarily sue him um or i don't even say i'll take back necessarily they can't so it's not a contract contract and that's not the way he presented it in the video but the point is he's trying to say we were negotiating. He was interested. This idea that he never wanted to fight me or even think about this fight or engage is not true because look what I have. Look, here's the real question. Like, you've laid it all out there perfectly.

These four fights are going to happen. Like, this isn't, Jay Paul's not going to play a part in this. But honestly, like, if you're telling me now that these two guys won't fight at some point, I won't believe you. You know, like it feels like it's been written now. It's going to happen. Like what Jake Paul doing, like he looks like a petulant kid. Like if you don't understand what's going on here, he's simply building towards that fight that will happen beyond this four fight deal. I would imagine i i truly wonder though

is canelo going to be the target by the time these four fights are over right i imagine that there could be an opportunity for jake paul to have a different target by that time there's a lot that's going to happen in the boxing world between now and then jake paul is going to have to find an opponent that gives him the credibility that canelo would have i don't know if by the end of it jake pa Paul even needs Canelo at that point. His last fight was against Tyson though. Yeah, that's my point. He needs

somebody who's going to lend that credibility and he can't wait for Canelo to finish four fights for that. It's just not feasible for the timeline. And so who knows by the end of those four fights, if Jake Paul even has his eye on Canelo. Conor McGregor might be a free agent by then Who knows

He'll still be Canelo I don't think this is a foregone conclusion That these two are on a collision course I also don't think Canelo gives a shit about Jake Paul Like I don't think he cares about him He sees him as a payday The money finally got to the point where he can Actually seriously look at this

Before when he was asked about it he laughed it off But Canelo is one of the all time great businessmen In the history of prize fighting where he can, you know, actually seriously look at this. Before when he was asked about it, he laughed it off, but Canelo is one of the all-time great businessmen in the history of prize fighting. And so if the money is there, he'll consider it. I don't think he has anything to, I mean, like the notion, but, you know, Jake said something there that your daughter was interested in and all this stuff. If that is in fact true, there's got to be a part of him

that's like, oh, you know, this is a fun little side gig that I could do for 80 or so million dollars. There it is. My daughter asked me if I'm fighting Jake Paul. She never asked me about a fight before. We have to do pay-per-view. And I guess he's trying to say, like, if your daughter is asking you about it, why wouldn't you do it on Netflix? Pay-per-view doesn't make any sense.

G-T-F-O-H. You wanted to charge your fans to see you fight a YouTube. He's calling out the hypocrisy. Who knows? But it's all drama. It's fascinating, but I think we're four fights away from even having a conversation about it again.

It just does not feel relevant. Oh, it ain't happening now. That's for sure. It's a complete nothing at this point. Yeah, it ain't happening. Rick sold me on the idea before when he was like, but what if Canelo was pissed off

and he wants to make an example of him? I think Rick said this like two weeks ago. There's a great story to be told there. He's doing it for the sport of boxing, for the sanctity of boxing. He's going to shut up this guy who beat up the old man. We want someone to make an exhibition of Jake.

Well, you know, we want someone to put manners on him. And I think Canelo could do that after these four fights. I mean, I don't like the idea of him facing Benavidez at all, but you know. Yeah, but that's in two years. Like I think everyone was kind of hungry for that

to happen next right away in three months. Um, but it's not happening. And again, credit to Canelo. Uh, I can't even imagine the money that's being offered to him. These are huge, huge numbers. This is the guy that, that Turkey wanted. Um, a year ago they were at odds and now

here they are uh doing this massive deal and he's able to stick it to uh to jake paul and company um what about what about the video from turkey did you guys see this one which one this video from turkey is uh is brilliant stuff here's turkey announcing the deal. In Riyadh in May, the big fight in the history of boxing. In September, then two more fights in 26.

Don't miss with the line. Ah, there he is. The big dog. What a time. What a freaking time. He's having a vision as he's saying it. It feels like he's channeling someone as he's saying this to people.

Oh, my God. And what time is it? Because he posted that at like 11 or 12 a.m., which, no, it was before that? I don't know. It was like 6 a.m. wherever he was. I don't know when this was. All this was happening in the middle of the night, and they're eight hours ahead of us. So wild stuff.

And now we're getting Canelo May 3rd, May 4th in Riyadh, May 3rd over here. We found out during the UFC 312 broadcast, March 29th is going to be headlined by Brandon Moreno versus Steve Erceg. That's the UFC's return to Mexico City. I like that fight. That makes a lot of sense. In particular, Moreno getting to fight back home. Class. Erceg.

Seems unimpressed based on that photo. April 12th, UFC 314 in Miami. No main event announced for that, but Miami looks beautiful this time of year. I feel like that should be Volk versus Teporia. Teporia and Miami makes sense. Does it not, Pizzi? Yeah.

Yeah, I love it. I think Teporia would be a massive hit out there. Obviously a huge Latin community out there. He's a guy that's known for bringing everybody together. Look, Tepori is just going to be an interesting story, no matter where you put him, but I think Miami's perfect. Yeah, absolutely.

And then you've got May 10th, the return to Montreal, La Belle Province, my hometown, finally 10 years after UFC 186, which as I noted on Twitter on Friday, one of the most depressing pay-per-views that I've ever attended. The whole entire upper region was tarped off. They could not sell tickets. I remember they gave me this. I was working for Fox at the time. I think they gave me like 15 tickets to give out to family and friends. Like they could not give away those tickets. DJ against Horiguchi, Fabio Maldonado against Rampage Jackson,

and he was on the card and he was off the card and he was on the card and he was off the card, and Michael Bisping was on that. That was the card where I did the interview with Michael Bisping in his hotel room where he was coming off the Luke Rockhold loss, and he said, okay, this is how it's going to roll. I'm going to beat Dalloway, then I'm going to beat this guy. It ended up being Tylos Leides. Then I'm going to beat that guy, it ended up being Tiles Ladies, then I'm going to beat that guy, ended up being Anderson Silva, and then I'm going to fight for the belt in about a year and a half,

and that's what happened, and he beat Luke Rockhold. And he couldn't have seen, he couldn't have been seen further away from the title picture at that point, but he called it. He absolutely called it. I've been watching that. Kelvin Gaslam versus Israel Adesanya is going into the Hall of Fame. That was announced as one of the inductees for the 2025 class. So that will be coming up in June. They had an incredible fight back at UFC 236 in Atlanta in 2019, one of the all-time great title fights. And there was a great moment between

Izzy and Dana White and Hunter Campbell, and they're all there and he's emotional and he had no idea. And then he called Kevin Gaslam on his phone. So lovely, lovely stuff there from Izzy and very happy for him. Perhaps a little sooner than he thought, I think he said at the press conference that he feels like he's still young, that he's an active fighter, that he doesn't need to be inducted into anything, but well-deserved, well-deserved. There's no real rhyme or reason, right? It doesn't really matter.

There's no like four years, five years, six years. They just do it whenever. I am curious as to how they pick that one now, like why that one, there are some older ones, but congratulations. All right, all right, all right. So Luke Rockhold is going to join us in about an hour's time.

After that will be Zhang Weili. Excited for all of that and more, but for now, let us get to our first guest of the day. Joining us in studio, this is a great honor, a great privilege to have this man in studio. He's turned into one of the best. Joining us in studio, this is a great honor, a great privilege to have this man in studio. He's turned into one of the best analysts in the game. There he is,

the legend himself, Dean Thomas. What's up, man? What's happening? Good to see you. Yeah, man, what's happening? Come on. It's been a while. Thank you. It's been a while. Thank you for coming in. It's my pleasure. You're doing quite well for yourself. I'm looking around. Look at this. It's not bad. It's not ESPN like you. Oh, stop. Stop. How are you doing with this weather? Your hands are freezing. Oh, no. I just, I walked here.

You walked here from where? From Florida. Yeah. No, I'm just kidding. No, I'm just staying right down the street. Okay, okay. But yeah, the weather's cool, man. I'm used to the heat.

So to get some cold air is good for me. I appreciate you doing this. I saw you on Saturday in Bristol. Bristol's an interesting spot, right? There's not much to do over there. I love it. You do like it? Yeah, I love, I'm older now. I saw you on Saturday in Bristol. Bristol's an interesting spot, right? There's not much to do over there. I love it. You do like it? Yeah, I love it.

I'm older now. I'm almost 50. That's crazy. I'm 48. So when I go to these places, man, I just want to stay in a room. Yeah. You get to marry it with the cookie? Yeah, I get the little cookie.

I'm like, yo. And they sting you on the cookie, too. I'm like, yo, give me another one. Nah, nah, nah. Give me one cookie. They warm it up for you. I want another one. Yeah.

But no, it's good, man. I'm having a good time, me another one. Give me one cookie. They warm it up for you. I want another one. Yeah. But no, it's good, man. I'm having a good time enjoying life. Life is good, man. You know?

Well, I'm very happy to have you in and talk because we haven't had an opportunity to do this and so much has happened

in your life and you're doing great and you've got this movie that you're a part of that's coming out and back end of this chat we'll bring in Rory, Rory Karp,

the great Rory Karp to talk about it called Grace Point Point here's the uh the the trailer right here you did a tremendous job thank you very much so we're going to get into all of that but I do want to I do want to tip my cap to you off the bat uh because this has been making the rounds and I was watching it live um your your analysis of uh the fight on Saturday the main event on Saturday brutally honest yeah um and especially in particular towards uh Sean Strickland, you essentially saying he's not

who he thinks he is or he's not who he tells us he is, right? Well, he's exactly who, he knows who he is. He's just not telling us that. Okay. What do you mean by that? He knows who he is. And that's what fighters do is that as a fighter, your job is to almost kind of conceal who you really are because in the moments when you fight, you go out there and try to do your thing. But of conceal who you really are because in the moments when you

fight you go out there and try to do your thing but you know who you really are and i think he you know he he couldn't hide from it this time that's interesting to me because you always hear people say like on the gym he's crazy yeah he brings so so what's the difference well the difference is the spotlight you know the lights man when them lights hit you, it's the real you shows up. The real you will expose itself when the lights hit you. And that's what's happening to him is that he's not that guy. And people think that I'm being mean. I'm not being mean.

It's just not many people. I'm not that guy. Not many people are that guy. Du P many people are that guy dupless he is that guy but he's not you know to go in there and be vulnerable and put your life on the line and go out there and fight really hard for 15 minutes to just go ahead and we we all do hard stuff in life but to do it in front of everybody when it's time i mean it takes a special person and he might have been there a few times in his career or or whatever but he that's not who he is now we've seen it his last couple of fights like he's just not willing to go in and be the dog that he

told us he was is he a fraud he's not a fraud okay it's not it's not because i think when people see that they'll be like oh man he's not that guy like so then who is he no but he wants to be like everybody wants to be when he says things like i'm gonna fight to the death i think i think he means it yeah like he means it like every i'm gonna do this i'm gonna do that i'm gonna bust you up but when you get out there and it's time to do it and you don't do it that's not who you are it's not that you're a fraud you just you got to come to terms with it you don't do it, that's not who you are. It's not that you're a fraud, you just, you gotta come to terms with it. Man, that me passed. It happens to every fighter.

Like, it happens, like at some point, in some careers, like everybody is that guy. If you're a good fighter, at some point you are. But you lose it and I think he might have just lost it. So you weren't expecting anything else? You knew who he was going into this fight? No, and that's why I picked him. So like he, I know. Oh, you picked him to win? I picked him to have just lost it. So you weren't expecting anything else. You knew who he was going into this fight. No, and that's why I picked him. So like he-

Oh, you picked him to win. I picked him to win. Oh, man. I picked him. So here's the thing. You fell for it. I fell for it. Here's the thing, though.

So they're going to- These guys always come at me every time I'm honest about them. Oh, man, you're not him. You fought bad. They come at me, but when I pick them to win, where's that energy? Yeah, yeah, yeah. When I pick you to win and you lose. Come back and apologize to me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what I'm saying? So why did you think he was them to win, where's that energy? When I pick you to win and you lose, come back and apologize to me.

You know what I'm saying? So why did you think he was going to win? He took that one fight against Paulo Costa. He waited. He said, I'm not doing another fight. I beat you the first time. I'm going to come back and beat you again. He said that.

That was him. He said, I'm going to come back. And he waited. He waited for this opportunity. I thought that his motivation would have been different different that he was going to go out there and say you know what i'm better than this guy i'm motivated to come back as the champion i'm going to go out there and beat this guy and that's what i thought his where his mind was going to be at but it wasn't there what about that that thing on his arm was that was that what it looked like

staff right definitely staff okay but when you see that, is that a telltale sign? Like, we always see these guys show up and it's like, no, no, no, it's nothing. And then after the fact, they never seem to perform well. It's got to affect you, right? I mean, I'm sure it does,

but at the end of the day, that doesn't affect your effort. That doesn't affect your motivation and your effort. Your energy and stuff? It might, but if you're a dog, you're a dog. Like, you just, you go out there and you go i know i'm tired but i deserve better i'm going to give myself over to this moment and i'm going to perform and that's he didn't do that and you can so what

happens is when you have like any type of distraction if you're not really there your motivation ain't really there you're going to find the excuse so he can come back and say well you know i had staff like all these guys the week before were like and notice all these guys the week before like the paint in the building was yeah i get it man for sure but when you're completely motivated and you've given yourself over to the game you don't let those things get in the way you don't let everybody look at all the chance i bet you i bet Drikus could have found a reason that he didn't perform. He could have been like, hey man,

listen, I got a lot of stuff going on. But champions don't do that. When you are motivated, nothing gets in the way. So in your opinion, was that more about what Drikus did or what Sean didn't do? Both. A little bit of both. A little bit of both.

Drikus is getting better. You know, we always criticize him and we say he looks bad. He looks a little bit of both a little bit of both um Drikus is getting better you know we we always criticize him and we say he looks bad he looks a little awkward but he's getting better and but when you look at his confidence and his demeanor and the way he carries himself there's no champion in the UFC that's got the total package like him I mean this guy just oozes championship in him. He walks out. He chests up. He says all the right things. And then when he fights, he delivers. He don't even look the best. He don't let that hold him back.

A lot of people are like, yeah, I'm not as good as these guys. I'm not as smooth as these guys. He don't let that hold him back. He goes out and he delivers. So I don't want to take anything away from Drikus. But Sean made it a little easier for him. You think Drikus beats Hamzat? Yeah, really I do I really do I think Hamzat is a sprinter I think if you were to

make fights one five minute round Hamzat beats anybody in the world any weight class but you can't fight championship level fights for five rounds at the pace where he's at his best if he fights like that at his best i think drichas is so durable and he's so smart that he'll be able to withstand that now they're swimming in deep water and hamza can't swim that deep wow yeah so what do you think it just goes into the championship rounds and he figures them out yeah i think that by the third round hamza it's like all, I don't really know. I can't, this guy's not going away. And also too, if Hamzat does,

let's say he does pace himself a little better, Drikus will just pour it on him. So I think that pacing is a big factor. We always talk about this cardio thing, but cardio is really just being able to manage whatever pace you have based on the skillset you have. That's really what it comes down to. Like if you have a very limited skillset and you're forced to be in situations that you're not comfortable in, you're going to have bad cardio. But when you have a very well-rounded skillset and you can

pace yourself better, you're going to have good cardio So, I mean, that's really what it comes down to. You alluded to this earlier. When you're so blunt, you're so honest about these guys, do you get a lot of shit back from them? Yeah, man, I get some stuff back from them every once in a while. Do you get a face-to-face? Do they hit you up? How does this happen?

Because I'll be honest with you. Sometimes, you know, it's different. I totally get it. This isn't a knock. But sometimes, like ufc shows come across as a bit like state-run tv where they don't want to be too critical when you watch a boxing broadcast there's no ties to the promoter so the analysts can say whatever they want but you know it's all one big family so you can't say that fight sucked because it's the promotion that's putting it on right but what i love about you is that you- No, I'm pretty honest.

Yeah, I like that. They've never given me a muzzle. They've never told me what to say and what not to say. Now, obviously, if I'm doing a pre-show, my job isn't to go in there and talk about how bad guys are. Like pre-shows, we're trying to sell a show. But when it's over, man, I dog everybody. Like if you fought a bad fight, I'm dogging you. And there's a reason for this.

Because I've been in this game so long and I've given so much to this game. I go to gyms to this day. I show up in the city, I go to a gym, and I'll teach for free. I reach out to them. I've been in extreme with Sean Strickland. I give these guys free game. Yo, this is what's working, this is what's not working, this is how you get better. Oh, man, don't worry about it.

I got it. I got it. I got it. So when I'm on the broadcast and I see you ain't got it, I'm going to talk about you. Because I've been willing to give free game my entire career. So if you don't want to take my free game, you're going to have to take the criticism.

Do they ever come to you face to face or you get a message or something? Sometimes it's like these little smarmy comments. Like, hey man, why you dog me? Like, man, listen, do better. You know what I'm saying? Like, do better. It's not me.

Don't be mad at me if you didn't do good. It's you because at the end of the day, like these guys, men and women, they dedicate their lives to the sport. Like if you're a fighter, your window's like five years. You dedicate your life to the sport. You perform once or twice a year, maybe three times, three, four times a year. Your window's like five years. You dedicate your life to the sport. You perform once or twice a year, maybe three times, three, four times a year. You have to be on.

That's your job. Your job is to be on. And if you're not on, I don't want to hear the excuse because you're supposed to be ready. That's what we're paying you to do. If not, then maybe find another job, but we're paying you to do a job.

So do the job. I think you do great on the desk, but also when they use you in between rounds. Eddie Bravo, way back in the day, used to do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember. In the world of boxing, there was a guy named Harold Letterman. Oh, I loved Harold Letterman. Okay, Jim.

29, 28. Canelo Alvarez. It was great. And you do a great job because it's not easy to come in for like 30 seconds there and then throw it back to the broadcast. How did this all start? When did this all start all start? It's tricky. You're right about that It's not easy because you know, those guys are playing off each other and they're flowing and I'm just sitting there and Then I couldn't that Dean you anything. All right. Yeah, bring me in so

To be able to get in and just start spitting for like 30 seconds is a little tricky, but it started Trevor Whitman used to do it actually that's right trevor did it so eddie bravo did it then trevor whitman did it that's right his apparel company took off and they asked me to do it but that whole thing started because um i was actually riding bikes with uh the producer the head guy and we were in abu dhabi and i was bike riding partners with the head producer at UFC. Zach? No, no, no. Above him.

Above him, okay. Above him. All right. And Craig. Craig Borsari. Yeah, Craig Borsari. And I didn't know who he was. You know what I'm saying?

Come on. He's been there forever. Dog. I'm so clueless, man. I go to work, man. I don't talk to nobody. I do my job. I talk fights. And he was like, yo, man, I'm riding bikes.

Let's ride. And we was riding bikes every morning in Abu Dhabi during the pandemic. And we just started talking about fights. He was like, man, you're really good at this stuff. You ever think about being on the desk? I said, man, that's not really me. And he's like, yeah, give it a shot. I gave it a shot.

Next thing I know, man, I got a job. So you were there just as a coach, right? I was in Abu Dhabi filming Looking for a Fight. Okay. Yeah. And so obviously he can make it happen. Yeah. And then they put you in.

And so it's probably been like four or five years. Yeah, it's been four, yeah, a couple of years. Got a couple of deals, a couple of deals out of it. You like it? Man, I love it, man. I mean, the reality is what we do, man, we like talking fights. I mean, you're much more knowledgeable about other sports. I don't even watch other sports.

I just talk fights, man. And they give me a platform to do it. So I couldn't ask for a better gig, man. I just, I don't got, I mean, I don't show up to be friends. I don't gotta be friends with nobody. I just go and be able to talk about fights. You know, what better can I have in my life, man? That's all I've done literally for the last 30 years

is talk about fights now for for the longest time you were at att and you left att yeah did you leave att because of this no no why did you leave att um you were one of the head coaches there yeah i was a head coach at att and this was right during the pandemic and you know just i want honestly i wanted to be able to work with like whoever i wanted to you know when you're on a team you're kind of limited to the resources of the team which we had a lot like att obviously is one of the biggest and best teams in the world but you know there's other guys i wanted to work with you know it's like you know i was like al jermaine is my man you know these, these guys. People outside of ATT. Yeah, people outside of ATT.

I wanted to work with just whoever I wanted to work with. I wanted some freedom and some autonomy to do whatever it is that I wanted to do in life. So right during the pandemic, you know, I was getting a weekly salary right during the pandemic. I'm like, you know what, man? I'm gonna quit my job.

Wow. Yeah, and I quit and I left. And is it because they told you that they didn't want you to work with other people outside of ATT? No, it wasn't that they didn't tell me not to. I mean, it was just implied. Okay. It's implied that this is the team. This is our roster.

These are the fights we got. Pick somebody, right? And I'm like, I don't like this guy. I don't like this guy. I don't like this guy I like this guy I don't like that guy well and you know just came down to like I just didn't really want to work with a bunch of guys there so I was like I want to work with who I want to work with right and how long were you there as a head coach so I had been a part of ATT I was a fighter being on a on ATT since 2002. Crazy. Yeah.

And then I had run my own schools and was a fighter. I retired in 2013. And then when ATT did the ATT versus Black Zillions tough, they brought me on as a coach. And then I was a coach ever since then. And so now, I believe you coach Jillian Robertson. Yeah, I still coach her.

So is she your only fighter? work with her sean brady and i'm doing a little bit of work with uh joe pifer and i work a little bit with like al jermaine sterling i watch his films and stuff like that so so she's in florida she's in florida they're in philly yeah so do you come to philly for their camps always okay yeah how did that happen man sean hit me up wow brady hit me up was like yo man i like your stuff man would you you mind coming out because and he knows i got ties in philly my family's from philly he was like if you're ever in philly man come by and i do and i've been hanging out with them guys for the last couple years what's his ceiling in your opinion he could be champ in terms of mentality he's got that drinkest thing that so focused so dedicated so hungry and he's also willing to continue to learn and i think that's one of the

biggest problems in mma today is that guys get to a certain level and they go well technique is equal so let's just get bigger, stronger, and faster. And I always tell them technique is never equal. It's almost saying like knowledge is equal, which is not a thing. And Sean Brady believes that technique is also never equal and he's continually trying to learn. Learn new ways of, and he's, and not to take,

I mean, he's just a horse, right? He's a stallion, but he's always learning and learning different ways of doing things and trying to increase his knowledge and tactics. He's really smart. So I think if he gets the right opportunities this year, no injuries, he could fight for a belt. They haven't announced his next fight yet, so you may know. I have no idea.

Who would you like to see him fight? Because I know he's called out Leon, he's called out Kamaruaru if it was up to you who who's the appropriate next step i mean they're all tough you know and they all present different challenges um maybe ian gary i mean that yeah so yeah uh ian gary would be a good one um usman would be a good one i just don't know you know not a lot of guys are lining up to fight him yeah it's tough are you his head coach no no john marquez okay and so like you so you have those three fighters is that cool with you or would you like to no that's cool with me you know in fact you know i'm always i'm see here's my problem man like i'm so into the game i'm like yeah let me get another one but the end of the day i'm like i don't want another one why not uh it's i mean

it's a lot of work. It's a lot. The investment in making a fighter good is heavy. You've got to put a lot into each person. And I'm so detailed. I'm always studying fights and looking at different ways to do things. And to give my all to a fighter is a lot. As far as a fighter that, and this might be a tough question, almost like asking who your favorite child is, but like the one that you're most proud of, that you took them from somewhere and brought them to somewhere else. Jillian Robertson.

Why is that? You know, a lot of fighters, even Tyron, like, you know, Tyron was a stud athlete. I mean, this guy wrestled in Mizzou, played football through high school, stud athlete. Sean Brady, stud, he's a stud athlete. I mean, this guy wrestled in Mizzou, played football through high school. Stud athlete. Sean Brady. Stud, he's a stud athlete. But Jillian Robertson literally comes from a background of just this quiet, shy little girl. And she started my kickboxing

program when I had a school, my women's kickboxing program at 15 years old. And she's one fight away from being in the top 10. Yeah, so. When you saw her initially, did you think that she? No.

Not at all. She's never played a sport. She's never, she's, and that counts, too. I remember talking to Duke Rufus about this. You always look at what somebody's background is. If somebody plays a sport, that's time served in terms of physicality. They know balance. Because all positions are the same.

Balanced positions are the same. Shoulders over knees. She didn't know any of that. That's crazy. She doesn't come from an athletic background. And most of the women that she's fighting against do. They played sports. She didn't even dance.

If you dance, to me that's you know that's also another way to you know use your body but she's never done anything that used her body that would help her in fighting so the fact that she worked so hard to get to where she is that's that means a lot to me so how does she go from like some like girl in your class to a ufc ranked fighter mentally i have no idea. Like, I don't know what is going on inside her head, but, uh, but just she works harder than anybody I know. You know, it's interesting. Um, when you, when you look at the desk and you look at the people who do analyst work for the UFC, they're either recently retired or some of them are still active, right? Anthony

Smith was on the desk with you, still active. Dom just retired. Gil retired probably a few years ago. You're probably like the- I'm over here. Okay. So what's interesting about that is I always like to do my research before a guest comes in studio and I was watching, you did an interview with Casuals MMA with these Guys and they do a great job and at one Point you mentioned just sort Of like in passing your fight against Kenny Florian and they were like you

Fought Kenny Florian and That's a knock on them actually funny Story about that I worked for Spike TV for one Week and my first My first like road trip Was you versus Kenny Florian. I sat in the truck. No kidding.

And I got to watch the whole thing on how they produced the event. I sat in the back, and it was your fight against Kenny Florian in 2007, I believe it was, in September. Yeah, no kidding. Yeah, crazy. But my point is, do you get a lot of people who are like, what do you know? Who are you?

Sometimes. And does that piss you off? No, it doesn't. It actually makes me feel good. Why? Because if they don't know that I fought before and I'm still in my position, then I feel as though I got in my position based on what I know not only because I fought. So I actually take that as a compliment. I'm here because I know what I'm talking about, not because I fought.

Okay. Right? So you don't get offended? You don't get worked up? Nope. Not at all. Not one bit. But I get it all the time.

A lot of people don't. I go to these events and people think I'm just like Dana's buddy. They're just like, oh, that guy. Because they're looking for a fight. Dana's homie. But yeah, yeah, that's my homie. But that's not why I got the gig. I got the gig because I know what i'm talking about yeah you know i got the not because i fought you

know in ufc 32 you know i'm saying yeah you know i mean i fought ufc 32 i fought you know three guys that are in the hall of fame but that's not why i'm on the gig because i'm on the gig because i know what i'm talking about looking for for a fight. How did that happen? You know, they had another gentleman during the show, Nick the Tooth. Yes. And he had it out him and Dana and Matt, they all kind of got in like a little argument and you know, and he kind of left them in a bad position. Like they were filming that weekend and he kind of left them in a bad position and they they were filming that weekend and they kind of left them in a bad position.

And they were like, yo, what are we going to do? Who are we going to get? And Matt called me. You know, it was like on a Tuesday. He was like, yo, man. And in fact, I was training Amanda Nunes to fight Misha Tate. Oh, wow. Yeah, I was training Amanda to fight Misha Tate.

For UFC 200. Yeah, for UFC 200. And I remember being in the gym. My phone rings. I see it's Matt. Man, what do you want? Yeah. And then I see it's Matt man what do you want yeah and then uh and then I see it again it's a 702 man who's this the next I know Matt sends me a text he'll pick up the phone I pick up the phone they're like hey man you ever seen the show looking for

a fight I'm like yeah of course I ain't never seen it but you know saying I got this man yeah he's like well we need a guy to come and give it a shot. I was like, sure. He's like, the catch is you got to leave tomorrow. Boom. Send me a ticket. Bag ready in the car. Let's go.

Give me an opportunity. Didn't think twice. Didn't think twice. You've never seen the show? I've never even seen the show. Wow. Never even seen the show. And that was the episode we went to LA and did stand-up comedy.

Oh, yeah. At the Laugh Factory and they were like you gotta write a set in two days to go out there and perform at the Laugh Factory I was like no yeah man it was crazy and since then you've been on it's still going on yeah

and you guys just did one where you were supposed to go to Korea yeah we were supposed to go to Korea but they had some political stuff going on so we ended up doing it in tampa right now watching the fight from the life a little bit different yeah a little bit different right around the corner from my crib that's right yeah did you have korean food while because usually you guys will eat like the local food and all that stuff did you try to at least dress it up like no no we just we just went straight tampa in fact um you know rory cough will be on the show

actually um produces yes that and you know i heard that the episode is really good so can't when's that come out i don't know rory might have a better idea okay you know those episodes are always really good i mean there's no one on the planet as entertaining and funny as matt sarah i'm i'm convinced of that i'm convinced that matt sarah is the funniest guy on the planet legend yeah legend of the game um i also i also saw an interview that you did with brandon fitzgerald where you talked about being sober yeah um and you guys had a wonderful conversation about that shout out to both of you for for getting to this point when you're on the road with these guys when you're on the road with it's you know you know

you know people like to go out on the friday night on the thursday night never any no well see that's my point that's why i like being in bristol i don't even go out but um but no i don't i don't drink um i'm pretty square uh i don't fall to peer pressure so yeah man it's pretty easy being sober and i feel better you know as you get older you you try to look for way more ways to feel better yeah you know it's almost like my little midlife crisis except for adding things i'm taking things out you know shrinking my circle to just taking things out just so i can be a little bit more did it ever get to the point where it was like a true problem what was the breaking point for you no it was never you know that's the thing though it was never really a problem either i guess that's what everybody says but i'm telling you it was never a problem like honestly i don't

even and this is why it was easy for me is because i never liked the taste of alcohol oh in fact i hated it i would just do it because it was so fun being drunk. Being drunk is a lot of fun. You could do wild stuff. But I wanted to get to the point in my life where I can do wild stuff regardless of whether I was drunk or not. That's really where I want to be. If you see some of the wild stuff I do now, I do it all on my own. I remember doing, when I would do improv comedy or whatever it is that i'm doing let me get a couple couple drinks let me get a couple drinks but i don't

need to now i just go out and just i don't have i don't have a crutch i have zero crutches i just do what i want when i want so are you still doing improv i just did i did a uh an improv set actually two weeks ago where was that that? In West Palm. So what is it? Do you go through classes or something or you just show up? I used to. I used to. But I have a lot of friends in West Palm that still do improv and they let me jump in and

do sets with them. So how many different things are you doing right now? You do the analyst work for UFC and ESPN, right? You do Looking for a Fight. Looking for a fight Sirius XM radio You and Anthony I was listening to you guys On I think it was Thursday

It was getting deep there with Anthony Yeah it was Right? I think it was Wednesday For Anthony yeah This is the best compliment that I could give anyone And I love Anthony as well I got home and I stayed in compliment that I could give anyone. And I love Anthony as well. I got home and,

uh, I stayed in the car to keep listening to you. No kidding. Yeah. I was listening to you guys on Sirius XM, Fight Nation. Because Anthony was getting deep and you were getting deep with him. He was,

I don't, you know, it seems like he's going through some stuff and he was talking about therapy and all this. I thought it was a tremendous conversation. Well, I appreciate that at his expense actually but but yeah he was he was vulnerable yeah he opened up he opened up and said how he really felt about his life and what the game has kind of done to him and where he's at in his life and that's real

stuff a lot of fighters are going through that and i'm glad he was able to open up about that because hopefully maybe somebody else heard that and was like you know what and i recommended him go back to therapy so i'm thinking you know as a fighter or as a person who's not doing all that well try therapy did you did you go through that when you had to retire not when i had to retire um much later i actually did two years of therapy just you know just life stuff right just never not just not being where you want to be or just whatever the situation may be but i did two years of therapy so i'll recommend people yeah post fighting okay well here's the thing too and i recommend fighters do it now so that it's not such a taboo thing for you but fighters typically solve all their problems with the gym you You know, you have a bad day, go to the gym, punch on some things.

Things ain't going right in your life, go to the gym, grapple with some guys, you feel better. But it kind of masks the real problem. And if you're going to continue to fight, you do that throughout your entire career. Then when you retire, you no longer have that. Now it's like, now what? And I think that's kind of what Anthony, his situation was.

He would always mask his problems with going to the gym. And he doesn't go to the gym as much anymore. So I think it's kind of weighing down on him a little bit. So in 2013 when you left, you had no identity crisis or anything like that? A little bit, man. A little bit. it wasn't it wasn't that easy like going back to fighting i didn't i didn't care about that like i started doing more acting stuff and being in front of the camera but i mean there was definitely

moments of like man what am i gonna do now and identity crisis stuff and there was a and there was a time and i've never told anybody this this yet, but this actually fueled me for a lot of things that why I'm such a hustler in life now. I remember being in Vegas after I retired and I was riding with, I can't even remember who it was, but he, on speakerphone, called Clay Guida's manager and he was making a joke. He was making a joke.

He called Clay Guida's manager. I'm in the backseat and he's like, dean thomas wants to fight clay guida and his manager doesn't know i'm sitting in the back seat they're on speakerphone and his manager's like dean thomas that guy's washed up oh man he's a bum and i'm sitting in the back and the guy was mortified like i didn't expect that to happen they hang up and i'm thinking to myself like man is that really what the world thinks of me watch ah good for you yeah watch good for you yeah so and i think about that often man so like days when i'm like you know i don't feel like getting up i think back to that day sitting in the back of that car and clay guida's old

manager going dean thomas that guy's washed wow well how it's easy to say now when things are going great but like in the moment probably felt like crap oh man i was like crawl under a rock yeah like really well i mean it's just you know i think i'm you know no one you think you're okay right but then if that's the reputation, man, he's washed up. They think I'm washed. This is what I've dedicated my entire life to since I was getting out of high school,

dedicated my entire life towards the fight game, and you think I'm washed. Because, yeah, I'm not going to fight, but I'm going gonna make my mark somehow in the fight game and here i am oh my gosh yes in a big way so serious and did i miss anything else uh and then just coaching the the the fighters fighters that i have this is enough that's enough that's enough yeah again i'm trying to take stuff out trying to take stuff out i like doing i like doing serious i like doing serious.

I like doing looking for a fight. I like working the desk shows for UFC and ESPN. Love all that stuff. And I love the fighters I work with. And I'm trying to do movies. I'm actually in the process. I did Grace Point. I have another movie out just going through the film festival circuit called Brotherhood.

Eve Edwards and Rashad Evans is in that. Oh, wow. Yeah, it's a short film. And then I'm in the process of writing another short film. You're writing it? I'm writing it. Wow. Yeah.

Here you are on the set of Grace Point with Aljo. Look at me. Is that James Storm in the middle? That's James Storm. I mean, you guys look legit. Yeah, they thought I was homeless. Like people that were like just on set, they didn't know me. They were like, what's this homeless guy doing hanging around the set? Oh, the actual people working? The actual They were like, what's this homeless guy doing hanging around the set? Oh, the actual people working?

The actual people were like, what's this homeless guy doing here on set? Yeah, I really got into character for that. Did you enjoy it? I love the process of acting. And it's not about being a movie star or getting these big roles. Again, man, I do improv for 20 people. That's not what does it for me. It's the process.

I love the process of everything in terms of acting, creating a character, digging into that character, becoming a real person that doesn't exist that I have to create. That, for me, is exciting. It's fun. I remember you when you were a fighter.

I remember BJ Penn and Kawa Uno and Kenny Florian. I was there, all that stuff. It's fun to see. Here you are with BJ. He's so weak. And then bam, he knocked me out. That's some gnarly shit right there. People don't know.

People don't remember BJ. Yeah, I know. The new fans, they see like. Everybody's like, who's the best lightweight of all time? I'm like, BJ. Thank you. I said this. BJ.

Yes. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you. To me, it's not even close. That's not taking a shot at Islam. No. But like when BJ in his prime, there was nothing like him.

Nothing like him. He was running over every, like people don't know about the game back then. So it's, you know, recency bias. But BJ in his prime during that window was unbeatable. I thought his high point was UFC 107 against Kenny Florian in Memphis. That night I said that's the best fighter in the world. And that was like prime Fedor, Anderson was doing his thing, GSP. When he came back to lightweight and it was like Jens Pulver Joe Stevenson Sean Shirk

Kenny Florian he was unstoppable remember him against Sean Shirk he like got shot out of a cannon with the flying knee and he was busting those guys up like leaving them mercilessly in the pool of their own blood yes he was incredible yeah it's not even close to me like him not being the best lightweight of all time the what I was what i was getting at was um you you've you're you're an old head as you said and you've been through so much you told a story um i was watching on that pod where you said that you were arrested for putting on like a smoker fight you were put in jail for like five hours for that that's crazy i can't believe they actually with the the florida cops because because you couldn't do that you couldn't put on amateur fights in florida they actually went through with it like they didn't just give

you a fine no they they actually went through it it took them a couple of days actually to research it and realize that i was doing something illegal how did they find out it was a local gym like a local i guess uh competitor. It was like, yo, they want some fights over there. So the cops showed up. And as soon as they showed up, it just happened to be during this one fight where this guy got knocked out

really bad. And I think they probably would have just left. But then when the dude got knocked out really bad, they were like, Hmm. So they stuck around for a little bit and was like, we'll be in touch. A couple of days later,

I get a phone call. Dean Thomas, we coming to pick you up. Come on. again they put you in jail put me in jail how long i was in just a couple hours and then what i bailed out and then they um then i got a lawyer attorney actually my attorney actually trained with me okay so we did a little pro bono stuff and um and he knew the the prosecutor prosecutor who was like a martial artist from Virginia. And he was like, oh, that's a smoker. I know what that is. And they realized that it wasn't,

you know, nothing illegal. Okay. And they ended up throwing it out. Okay. And that's in the midst of your UFC career. Yeah, right. I don't remember this coming out. Yeah, no, it was right in the midst of my UFC career.

Did it like, did it make headlines? In fact, yeah, it made headlines. In fact, I was on crutches from the Kenny Florian fight. Yeah, that's crazy. It was right after that. You went to jail on crutches? No, no, no. Okay, okay.

During the thing, I had gotten the crutches off, but during the smoker, I was walking around on crutches. That's crazy. Did the UFC get mad at you? No, they didn't get mad at me. Yeah.

They didn't get mad at me. But right after that, then they didn't get mad at me. They didn't get mad at me. But right after that, then they legalized amateur fights in Florida. So I am a martyr. Thank you. You're the trailblazer. Yeah, I'm the trailblazer. So all amateur fighters in Florida, you're welcome.

Was that the only time you've been to jail? I went to jail before that, too. First other smokers? No. I hit a dude in the head with a wrench when I was 18. Well, I was 17, actually. You hit a dude in the head with a wrench when i was 18 yeah well i was 17 actually you hit a dude in the head with a wrench why um over a girl okay yeah you know like when you young and females i mean i probably still do it today yeah so you were you were both young and i and my and i had a female My girlfriend She broke up with me

Started dating another guy And I didn't like the way He was treating me So You went to his house? I went to her house And he was there Okay

And you had the wrench on you? Yeah Intentionally had it on me Yeah Like yo And what happened to him? If he gets slick Bop

Damn And he got slick Bop And then I went to jail for that And I did 50 weekends in jail what happened to him if he gets slick pop damn and he got slick bop and then i went to jail for that and i did 50 weekends in jail what happened to him um he pressed charges got stitches pressed charges i would i did 50 weekends in jail what does that mean 50 weekends show up on friday stay till sunday get out really is it because you were a minor uh no it was because it was a first offense. Oh, wow. So I actually did, because what happened was I was 17 when it happened. They put me in juvenile, and I did 21 days in juvie. And I turned 18 during that time.

And as soon as I got out, they put me in real jail, adult jail. And then I got out of there and then i got sentenced 21 days or i mean 50 weekends in real jail is that messed up because like you get to feel freedom and then you got to go right back in there every weekend you know what honestly i attribute a lot of my a lot of my mma uh knowledge to that because this was in 94 and i just remember all week i'd watch fights study fights train with my boy paul rodriguez who runs american top team in orlando we trained during the week on friday i go to jail get out on sunday on monday same thing training training training on friday go to jail so it kept me focused wow yeah it kept

me focused what kind of people were you around in jail was it like other kids no no in jail jail is like a bunch of dirty old men in there for like duis and you know stupid little crimes yeah 50 weeks a whole year a whole year damn you're missing everything that happens on the weekend go to jail on friday be there at six get out sunday at six did you get the girl back at least yeah i had my son with her come on yeah the same girl same girl no way yeah so in the end it was all worth it because of what you did well not because of what i did it just it worked out that way damn what a story i wasn't expecting that yeah normally you expect like oh, she never talked to me. No, we had a son.

Wow, okay. How old's your son? 19. Does he fight? No, no, no. He played soccer his whole life, but now he's going to school and hustling. Never wanted to fall on your footsteps? Nah.

He goes to the fights, though. He goes to the fights. He's a big fan of the sport. He didn't train or anything like that? Not really. You didn't want him to do it? Not really. Why not?

I mean, fighting is for knuckleheads. Yeah, yeah. He's smart. Okay. Yeah. But, I mean, we work enough for the street. He got a good right hand, good left hook, and can stop a takedown. That's not bad.

He can stop a takedown and got a good guillotine. That's all we a take now you know it's not bad hey can stop a take down and got a good guillotine that's all we need in the street you taught you taught him the basics yeah just just enough to handle somebody in the street uh let's bring in rory now yeah let's bring in rory let's bring in uh big man rory rory carp the uh director of grace point there he is rory who could kick both our asses. Slow down. What's up? Roy, the man. See you, man. These offices are awesome. How are you?

How are you? Great. Thank you for coming in. Good to see you. Can we share this mic? Yeah. No, no, no. He's wearing a mic. Oh, you got a mic.

Yeah, yeah. So you bring yours towards you. These offices are impressive. You like that? You've come a long way since... Remember I interviewed you for I Hate Christian Laettner? That's right. Your old office.

Yes, from the old one. Yes, yes, yes. Very old. This man gave me my break. Do you know that, Dean? Did. This man gave me my break. Do you know that, Dean? Did he? He gave me my break. He asked me to be in one of his 30 for 30 documentaries.

And people still bring it up to this day. No kidding. About Christian Laettner. Rory is a G, man. Like, Rory has been helpful to a lot of people. He has. And I love it. Thank you.

I wanted to cast Dean for a long time, but I kept getting calls from Clay Guida's manager telling me he's watched. Yeah, that guy has it in for you, man. Yeah. Look at Roy, man. You're looking fit. Oh, thanks. Jeez Louise. You know, I was disappointed when you said your greatest coaching accomplishment was Julian Robertson because Dean trained me for a fight.

That's right. When I would send him my videos he would just like send back these emojis like yeah yeah so you said that were oh yeah there i am look at that the gloves on the wrong hand this was what 2021 right uh yes 2021 it was it was right after we shot the movie and i remember when i was walking out uh dana yelled throw in the towel so he was there he came to it did he was watching uh on the on the phone okay yeah he had just landed we were actually so i did that fight yeah and then i changed my clothes and produced looking for a fight that was a looking for a fight card i remember yeah and i remember my pep talk from dean

was uh you know you might go out there there and your face may get rearranged. You might come out looking different than when you went in. But just don't embarrass me. Yeah. It's true. But were you? There he is. I won.

Never give up on yourself or your dreams. Thank you, Sly Stallone, for writing Rocky. And thank you to Dean Thomas, Sean Carrigan and Jared Gordon for training me. I'm now ready to retire undefeated at 1-0. Did you ever have another? No, I never had another. Yeah, I mean, to me, that was like a bucket list for like my life because I'd worked with, you know, the UFC for a number of years and I just always wanted to feel what it was like to take that walk just once in my life. And it actually started in Abu Dhabi just to kill time. Dean would let me hit pads and started training me.

And he was training me in, like, Dana's private gym. And one time, Dana opened the door, and he was like, Oh, I'm sorry, Dean, I didn't realize you were working with a fighter. I'm sorry. And then he kept the joke going like I was trying to I think I was trying to mic him or something or trying to convince him and he's like he's like man just relax you know you need just you need to sit back and watch these fights there's some potential opponents for you here so you know I just like part of me was like man I'm you know going to, kind of like Clay Guida's manager.

And the first round did not go well at all. In fact, I thought they stopped the fight. I know. Really? I took quite a beating. I don't remember that. I think I was mildly concussed. And I remember sitting down and Jared Gordon, who was in my corner, said, how are you feeling?

And I said, not good. And Dean was like, you're doing great. And he was so convincing of it. I was like, well, maybe I'm just wrong. Like, maybe I am doing great. I had to lie to him to get him back into the fight. That's a fascinating thing because we saw that on Saturday with Eric Nixick where Nixick's like, essentially, you're not doing great to Sean Strickland. So I guess you have to know who you're talking to, right?

Yeah, you got to know who you're talking to. For him, he's down. I'm like, come on, man, you're doing doing great to Sean Strickland. So I guess you have to know who you're talking to, right? Yeah, you got to know who you're talking to. For him, he's down. I'm like, come on, man, you're doing great. Stay in it. He's like, really? I am? Go for it. Yeah, go.

And he gave me advice because we were fighting a Southpaw who was actually trained by Bilal Muhammad. And he said, lead with the right. Don't lead with your left. So I led with the right and somehow pulled out a miracle. Amazing. How was he, by the way, he told the story about Nick the Tooth couldn't make it, and so they called him up.

When he came on, were you like, oh, man, we're cooked here, or is this a blessing in disguise? Man, I was just happy we were doing the show, but Dean wasn't that gregarious when I called him up. I was messing with him. Yeah, he was like, what do you want? And I'm like, I'm the producer looking for a fight. I was kind of giving him the rundown and whatnot, but

man, it was just like kind of natural chemistry. And what's great about Dean, and this is why he got on the show, is he's game for anything. I remember we shot a new open. I was like, hey, Dean, what do you think about jumping in the dumpster and then peeking open? And he was like, before I could even finish a sentence, he was in the dumpster. Wow. He's down to do anything. And, you know, that's why I wanted to cast him in the movie. I put you in Shaq life. Remember, you trained Shaq. Oh,

right. That's right. He trained Shaq for aiu-jitsu match against Greg Hardy, which I believe he won. Yeah, yeah. And, yeah, Dean just seizes on an opportunity. He doesn't ask questions or whatnot, and he just makes a person like me who's behind the scenes my job so much easier. So, obviously, I know you from the 30 for 30s. You did the CM Punk series prior to his debut, looking for a fight, a ton of other sports-related docs. Now you make a film, a scripted film. First one?

First scripted film, yes. Grace Point, which just came out. By the way, Rotten Tomatoes, what are you at, like 93% or something like that? 93% audience score. Really? Yeah. That's great. The audience likes it.

It's very difficult to get Rotten Tomato approved critics to review the film. Just to review it. Forget about a good review. Why is that? I don't know. Maybe the number of theaters it's out or whatnot. I mean, it's a small indie film. And we're on Amazon and Apple right now.

But I'm just trying to plead with people. Just watch it. You don't have to like it. Just give it a chance. This is the trailer right here. This is the trailer. Just watch it. You don't have to like it. Just give it a chance. This is the trailer right here. This is the trailer. I saw it. I watched it this weekend

and I sent it to a friend of mine as well. It's intense stuff. You called it a thriller. It is a thriller. There's Aljo right there. I was really impressed with Dean. I think that was Dean right there. Yeah.

I guess because I know you and you were telling me about why you wanted to do it, I kept thinking how hard it must have been to make this. Just like a documentary, you're sitting down, you're interviewing people, you get footage. This has to be, this is a whole other beast, right?

It was incredible. It was one of the best experiences of my entire life, not just my career, because it's something that kind of like the fight I've always dreamed of. I've always wanted to do it. And, you know, almost like, use you as an example, you probably could have stayed at ESPN and taken a certain path, and that's the comfortable path.

But I like going towards the uncomfortable. And I could just keep doing sports and everything, but I always wanted to do a scripted film. That's been a dream of mine. And just the whole process of, like, collaborating with the actors. We had great actors in the film. I was about to say, like, I think that made it easier, too, it easier to like have the actor like jim parrick and sean kerrigan yeah just really good guys to be around yeah and jim parrick who played cutter in the film he said he

listens to you every single day really well he gave me a call he was out of everything i've ever done he's the most impressed that i'm on your show wow thank you i appreciate that he's a big fan rob lowe's son rob lowe's son stars andrew mccarthy plays his that. He's a big fan. Rob Lowe's son. Rob Lowe's son stars. Andrew McCarthy plays his father. So there's a little Brat Pack reunion. And it's a coming of age thriller. It is a coming of age story. It's about a kid on his way to a rehab for drugs. And along the way, his father gets hurt.

And he kind of has to become the hero while he's detoxing from drugs and facing his demons. So everything I do, there's, I like to put a lot of heart into it. Even like shack life or shows that maybe on the surface seem goofy. There's always some kind of sentimental moments or something that's heartfelt. So I tried to do that the same with Grace Point. I don't know what you thought of it. Yeah. You know, it was funny. He sent me the link and I watched it and he said, you can watch it with your family. So I have two boys, 12 and 10. I'm like, guys, my friend made this. Let's watch this.

First five minutes, the kid goes in the bathroom and he starts doing coke. They're like, what is that? I'm like, oh, thanks, man. That's the only thing I told you about. That's the only thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, it is fine. It is totally fine.

It was really good and very proud of you. I mean, again, impressed with these guys. I know that it's hard for a fighter, for an athlete. How do you come about picking a Dean or obviously have the relationship of putting Aljo, putting him in there? James, like, how do you say, okay, like these guys, even though they're not known for this, would be good for these roles? Life's just about relationships. You know that too. And just spending time with Dean, I know no matter what it is, if you told Dean Thomas, like, hey, I want you to design a building for an architecture firm, he might start out saying, I don't know how to do it, but he's going to find out how to do it

eventually. And that's how he was with acting. He was taking these acting classes. He took it so seriously. If you look at Dean in the months leading up to filming the movie, you can slowly but surely in the studio at ESPN see him getting more and more disheveled. He was growing out his hair, his beard. He gained weight for the role. He just took it really seriously. Same with Aljamain was telling me that he was like a background extra on like Law and Order. And that he wanted to do acting.

You know how charismatic Aljamain is. And I did a short film about him. Yeah, I remember. For the UFC. And we kind of just connected. I said, hey, this is a smaller role. You have a few lines. What do you think? He's like, I'm game.

So I like giving people opportunities because I've needed opportunities. Dana gave me an opportunity. And, you know, so I try to kind of pay it forward. What's he like as a director? He's very easy to work with. He's an actor's director where he allows you the freedom to try things. And that's what you want as an actor is like some freedom to try things. I don't want somebody to read the line for me because it's like just do it yourself.

And, you know, he gives you a lot of freedom as an actor to just to experiment with stuff. And it was great. And again, I worked with him with a lot of freedom as an actor to just to experiment with stuff. And it was great. And again, I worked with him with a lot. And not only does he give you the freedom, but he also pushes you into doing things. And at times it may seem uncomfortable. But I always have to remind myself that when it does work, it's going to be memorable. For as uncomfortable as it feels right now, it's going to be memorable, so just do it.

And you gotta do it. Do you think he should pursue this? 100%. In fact, the gentleman I just mentioned, Jim Parrick, says that he thought Dean was one of the better actors he'd work with. This is a guy that's been on HBO True Blood. He was a lead cast member, Fast and the Furious 9. He's telling Dean to get more and more reps. In fact, to me,

the biggest compliment for the film is I sent it to Matt Serra. And in the past, Dean has sent some of his other work to Matt. And Matt can be a little critical. He doesn't hold back on his opinion. And when we were filming Looking for a fight he was like rory i'm this is good like like shocked he's like i'm really surprised he was telling me he's really into it then he connected me with his to his producer he has a podcast who uh to get on his show so he was very complimentary about it and he wouldn't hold back if he thought it sucked he would love to bust balls yeah he was he's looking for a reason. Yeah, yeah. Why didn't you put him in the film? Matt?

Yeah. I don't know if he's directable. Matt is not directable. And that's always I tell people about Matt Serra. Whenever I do work with Matt, I go just point, give him a five-hour energy, and just get out of the way. We did this scene for the last Looking for a fight where matt and dean do yoga with goats like are they actually real i had never real goats real goats and you're right about matt you just put him in the situation and make sure the cameras are rolling it's it's maybe in my opinion the

funniest scene we've ever filmed i'm looking for if i was editing it laughing while i was editing it the goats actually do yoga too? They just kind of what? Climb on you? Climb. They jump on you and just. They ram you with their head. Yeah. While you're doing yoga, they're like ramming you and crawling in between your legs and

jumping on you. But this is like a business you can go to. Yeah. Where people do this. Yeah. Where is this? In Tampa? It was in Tampa.

But I heard it's a lot of them. It's a lot of places. Really? Yeah. I never heard of that. So do you come up with like the stunts? Yeah, me and my team. I have a produced production team and then we get Dana's approval for for it and But these guys are the ones that kind of make it come yeah And when does that come out the Tampa one?

I'm not sure basic a lot of it revolves around when the fighters they pick are going to make their debut. And in previous episodes, it's been around the contender series. But I think these guys are going right into the UFC. And there was one fight in particular. I don't know if you remember that guy from the press conference who had Dana for a shot. Oh, that's right. He fought on that card. Yeah, he fought on that card.

Lost. He lost. And I don't want to give anything away, but Dana was impressed with his opponent. Ah, damn. What a swerve. Yeah. What a swerve. But again, shows you about opportunity.

Sure, sure. Yeah, I remember him saying afterwards that apparently he was like a bit of a headache to deal with. Dana said this at the press conference when he was talking about the looking for a fight that they had to film in Tampa, right? Because there was some unrest in Korea. You guys must have been upset that you didn't go to Korea, right? I was a bit upset because I really like Korea. Yeah. Like, Korea is a fun place.

They got dope music, you know what I'm saying? Dope culture. But Tampa, I mean, Tampa's Tampa. You know, it's around the corner from me, so. I just like making good content. Yeah. That's why I wanted to go because I think I'm just always amazed that we still get to do the show i love doing the show i love working with these guys i believe it's been how long it's been over 10 years right yeah it's been over 10 years and it's the first thing i ever did for the

ufc was the cm punk series but that came to fruition because i did a series with snoop dog that's how i got my for years i was trying to get in with the ufc i even applied for a series with Snoop Dogg. That's how I got my, for years I was trying to get in with the UFC. I even applied for a job with the UFC. Really? Like back in early days, 2007. Okay. And just couldn't hear back. I had a meeting with Craig. It didn't really go anywhere years later. And then finally, I was doing this show called Snoop and Son, where Snoop Dogg's son played football at Bishop Gorman High School. I remember, yes. And his teammate was Nico Fertitta. So I recognized Lorenzo Fertitta at spring training camps, just on the sidelines. So I approached him, and I showed him in my book bag, I had UFC DVDs.

I had the best of George St. Pierre. I'm like, look, I'm a fan. And then we miked his son during practice. And I think I gave the footage to Lorenzo, and he was super appreciative. And it sounds crazy, but he didn't really get recognized or much. And then I kind of convinced Snoop's son to go to a UFC event. I'm like, it'll be good for the show. You'll go with Nico.

And it was Conor versus Poirier 1. Okay, 2014. Yeah. UFC 178. Wow. How do you remember that? I don't know. You just remember that, huh? It was theor versus Poirier 1. Okay. 2014. Yeah. UFC 178. Wow. How do you remember that? I don't know. You just remember that, huh?

It was the main event. Demetrius Johnson against Chris Carrioso. Yeah, wow. This was kind of like almost, I don't want to say the birth of Conor, but where he was kind of ascending to that level. That was when we realized he was legit. Yeah. And I'll always remember this.

I was kind of in the back waiting where like the media waits. And one of the guys said to me, like, what are you doing here? And I said, oh, we're filming this event. I'm just waiting to go to Mr. Fertitta's like private room. And the guy kind of like laughed at me. He's like, you're not going there. Like, you're going to be here with us. And they had this like, you know know like a kind of paltry spread

and then this guy comes back and says hey lorenzo's ready for you now let's go back all right i'll see you later great we went back there and i'll always remember this there was a make a wish kid in the back and dana asked connor to come and this was like one fight before he was about to go out he was like in his trunks in his gloves and he was so relaxed he was like oh hello it's good to meet you and he was he told the kid what he was gonna do he's like i'm gonna give him one of these and he did exactly what he said he was gonna do we didn't film it i just like kind of witnessed it wow i was like wow and i remember lorenzo saying yeah he's gonna be our next big star the old connor that was the old the old connor but i saw dana back there and i just said hey man

i'd love to work with you guys if i could ever do anything and he's like yeah call call borsari definitely and then i i got borsari's email and i pitched i was like hey cm punk what do you think let's follow him this is gonna be epic you know a guy going from pro wrestling, and he's like, let's do it. And I was just off to the races. And then looking for a fight was totally Dana's idea. And he was like, hey, would you be interested in doing this? I'm like, man, I'll be interested in watching you shovel snow from your driveway. Whatever you want to do, I'm down to do.

And so now is it like twice a year, three times a year? Yeah, once to twice a year. I mean, yeah. We used to do like six episodes a season, the first couple of years. But, you know, Dean is just so busy. He's kind of ascended to like a whole other level, you know. And he's hanging out with the president. All the time.

Has he been on? Are there any cameos on Air Force One? Have you guys been on Air Force One? That would be a great episode. Yeah, yeah. If we could do Washington, D.C. We could go to the White House. Yeah.

Ride on Air Force One. I don't feel like you're that far away from this happening. That would be awesome. I would definitely be down for that episode. Yeah, of course. Let's make that happen. Are you going to make more movies, more scripted movies? I want to, Ariel. scripted movies i want to

ariel i really really want to um you know the way this movie happened is i got a scripted agent when i made this film called the book of manning i had an agent oh yeah he said what do you want to do i said it's my dream to make a scripted movie and there was a script it was like the beginnings of grace point but it was like a 25 million dollar movie. And like a lot of things in Hollywood, it kind of just gestated for a while, didn't really happen, and kind of just went away. And then I decided years later to just get the money myself, and we made it for like 500 grand. That's insane. You know, sometimes you just have to figure out a way. 500 grand is nuts for a movie. Yeah. I saw a quote and it said that

river doesn't go through rocks by power. It does it through persistence. And I feel like that's my story in life. So I definitely want to make another movie for sure. But right now I just hope people see Grace Point. Give it a chance. I was telling Dean, I didn't realize this.

I thought like, oh, you know, we'll cast some UFC guys. It'll be great. Then like, oh, you know, we'll cast some UFC guys, it'll be great. Then Dean's like, you know, you should check out some of the films of other former UFC guys. They're not necessarily the highest quality productions, but these guys, it's not a fight film,

and you know, Weidman even has a role in it. I cut out his speaking part, but he still appears. He'll never forgive you for that either. He still appears. Does he get an IMDB credit? He does have an IMDB credit. And he brought his sons to a showing of it that we had in Charlotte, North Carolina. That's amazing.

So, yeah, I just hope people give it a chance. It's on Apple and Amazon, and it would mean a lot. And, man, yeah, just give it a shot. If you like it, leave a review. If you don't like it, keep quiet. Nobody lot. And, man, yeah, just give it a shot. If you like it, leave a review. If you don't like it, keep quiet. Nobody asked. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Leave your opinion to yourself.

Amazon and Apple, I think? Amazon and Apple, yeah, either one. That's the best place to see it. Grace Point. And our IG is Grace Point Film. So we post on there every day. Yeah, man. Out of everything I've ever done in my career it's

probably i'm most proud and you've done some stuff i have i've been really fortunate to get to do some cool projects work with you know the i hate christian laytner i did a rick flair doc the manning shack stuff with the ufc but this one just to it was just non-stop persistence like being a force of will just to get this done and it was in production for four years we filmed it in like 2021 wow so it took a while i'm just happy that it's out and that people can see it uh dean can i ask you as as we wrap up we were talking about john whaley versus valentina shemchenko wanting to see that fight more than anything who would you say wins that fight if it happens this year?

I think if it happens sooner rather than later, while Weili's confidence is high, she wins that fight. Wow. If you let her marinate for a little too long, I think she starts to lose her confidence. She might not be able to beat Valentina. The problem is, I want to see it so bad, but you have Mano Fioro there.

It's not really fair to her to skip her over. I don't know what the problem is, why they haven't made that fight already. Right. But the fact that they haven't made it already, let's just forget about that. What? Let's put Weyland in it. Not necessarily Mano's fault, because remember, the Grasso fight was in September. Mano fought against Blanchfield in March.

She had to wait for that fight to be finished. I don't know if it's her fault. I don't know. Maybe some step-aside money? It might not be her fault. If it's not her fault, you gotta do it. But if it's her fault, too bad.

Oh, it's a gigantic fight. I just don't want to advocate for anyone to lose their dream. No, I get that. I mean, and Manon did everything they asked of her to do. Right. But if it's her fault, why is it taking so long? Yeah. You lose it. I just knew you'd lose. Hey, this guy's great.

Can I ask him a question? Yeah, go ahead. Do you think Amanda's going to ever come back? At this point, no. I think to her window of coming back passed. Really? Yeah. Even if Kayla wins? I just, I don't know. I can't see it happening. It depends. Now if Kayla wins and starts yapping,

starts talking, she's coming back. Do you think if Juliana wins, she comes back? No. No. Nothing to prove? Nothing to prove. But if Kayla wins and she starts talking, then I think Amanda comes back. Were you there when they trained together? Uh-huh. What'd you see? I mean, this is early Kayla, right? But they didn't really train together all that much okay they didn't know they didn't

train together all that much but i will say this though about a a few months to a year ago uh amanda did call me say hey i want to start training again oh wow yeah so would you consider that she's no longer att yeah i would consider that wow you know and like i said i'm very selective of who i train but amanda was one of the ones that I've always enjoyed working with. So despite that, you still think the window's closed? Yeah. It takes a certain level of hunger and motivation to be at that level consistently.

And it's easy to say it now when you're not training. It's easy to look at fighters and sit at the couch and be like oh i'm gonna come back but three weeks into a training camp dieting you know the process it's just not we filmed at her house we filmed that we did a show called the dean diaries oh yeah i remember yeah we we went and she just seemed to have a great life yeah she seems very happy. A couple of kids. And it's hard to go from that to going, all right, let's strip you of that.

We're going to take you away from your kids for a couple of weeks. And it's probably not worth it to her unless Kayla starts yapping. Right, right, right. Then she's got something to prove and I can see her saying, you know what? Nina, handle this for a little bit. I got business to take care of. Well, this has been a lot of fun, guys. Thank you. By the way, are this for a little bit. I got business to take care of. Well, this has been a lot of fun, guys. Thank you. By the way, are you guys Eagles fans? I'm an Eagles fan.

Both of you guys? Yeah. I've been hanging out in Philly. Congrats. You seem disappointed. I'm a Bills fan. There you are, Rory, from back in the day. When was that? That was at the Super Bowl. We went to... Did you guys win that one? Yeah, we did. It's when they played the Patriots. was at the Super Bowl. We went to... Did you guys win that one? Yeah, we did.

It's when they played the Patriots. That's with my cousin. We went in Minneapolis. Oh, yeah, because you also played the Patriots, like, back in the day in Jacksonville. I remember T.O. was on... That's right. That was the Donovan McNabb. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

This was just a few years ago. That was the Nick Foles Super Bowl. But I got to say, man, Ariel, for me, this is like being on The Tonight Show. Awesome. I mean it. Thank you. This is like a dream come true. And, like, you're the peak interviewer, I think, in MMA.

And people forget. Like, you were talking about how people forgot about Dean. People forget about you. Like, when I first started getting in the UFC, you were still around. You were on, like, the original internet shows, like, doing interviews in the back. So, man, you've earned everything in the back. So, man, you've earned everything. Thank you.

So you've been around as long as I have. I appreciate that. Thank you, guys. Just don't tell that to Dana. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. It's all good jokes.

It's all laughing jokes. Guys, thank you so much. Congratulations. Congratulations on the film. I urge everyone to check it out. Amazon, Apple, congratulations to you

on everything you're doing. You're doing incredible stuff and looking forward to more from both of you. So thank you for coming. I know you had to stay an extra day or two here on the East Coast, but I appreciate it. Appreciate you, my man. All right. We're going to take a quick break.

We're going to be back with Luke Rockhold, another OG, will join us. And then Zhang Weili. So don't go anywhere. I'll say bye to these guys. We'll be right back. Don't go anywhere. All right. That was my conversation with Cheael Sonnen from last Tuesday.

And that was a great conversation with Dean Thomas and Rory Karp. Go check out Grace Point. It's a great film for all the family. It truly is. And proud of Rory. He is a grinder. He is persistent. There's no doubt about that.

And he has done some amazing things. I'll never forget when he reached out to me i think it was around the punk time because i had interviewed punk a couple times and he said hey i'm doing a a doc a 30 for 30 on christian leitner do you have any feelings towards him and i said yeah i freaking hated that guy i hated him i was a i was a michigan fan i was a fab five he said, well, you'll be perfect for this. And still to this day, people will come up to me and say, hey, looking, not looking for a fight. I hate Christian Lader. You were great in it. And that was kind of like the, actually,

that was the, I think it was the first time I was ever on ESPN because 30 for 30 airs on ESPN. And so, uh, I very, very much appreciate him and, appreciate all the, the great work that he has done, not just in sports, but in MMA and, and, and now getting to do a scripted film. That is cool stuff.

And Dean is great as well. He has come a long way. I mean, what a career started his career in 1998 UFC debut 2001 The BJ Penn fight East Rutherford Fought Kawa Uno for the

Well in the lightweight tournament semis Beat Matt Serra At UFC 41 Fought a whole bunch of times in between then, and then reemerged on The Ultimate Fighter season four, won one, two, three fights in a row, and then met Kenny Florian in 2007, lost that fight, and then fought Josh Neer, had a few more fights And some interesting promotions HHP won the Patriot Act In 2009

SRP March Badness WEF Brasco vs. Weitzel Pure MMA Next episode So shout out to Dean Shout out to Rory In a moment and by the way

At about 4.20, we're going to be joined by the reigning defending UFC strawweight champion, the one and only Zhang Weili. Can't wait for that chat. In a moment, we're going to be joined by the former middleweight champion, the one and only Luke Rockhold, who will have some breaking news. He is a part of the GFL. We saw him last April, Karate Combat. He competed

on a Karate Combat card. He's competed in BKFC since losing his last UFC fight. That was in April of 2023, then came back and KO'd Joe Schilling in April of 2024. In August of 2024, he competed on the first CJI card. That's the Craig Jones Invitational. He went up against Patrick Downey. Obviously has been in the game for a very long time, was the former UFC middleweight champion, former Strikeforce middleweight champion for a couple of years. Wins over the likes of Michael Bisping, Liotta Machida, Chris Weidman, of course. That's how he became champion, UFC 194. Jacare, back in the day, that was his big win.

In 2011 in Cincinnati, I remember being there when he won that title. And a lot of people weren't picking him in that fight. Keith Jardine, he successfully defended his title against him. Tim Kennedy as well. So he has been there, done that. His last UFC fight, believe it or not, August of 2022. Three years this August. Where has the time gone?

That was against one Paolo Costa. Uh, he is a part of the GFL team, Dubai squad under Cain Velasquez and Javier Mendez. Obviously he has ties to them, uh, with the, uh, the AKA connection, uh, former training partner and coach. Uh has a few fights that could be of interest whenever GFL gets off the ground. At 185, Giger Musasi, Douglas Lima, Hector Lombard, Uriah Hall. But I think the big one that everyone would like to see is Chris Weidman. They were supposed to fight at UFC 199 in a rematch, and Weidman injured his neck,

and that injury led to a domino effect, which led to Michael Bisping getting a title shot, which led to Michael Bisping winning the belt. Crazy. Although I saw recently Bisping and Rockhold, and the buildup to that fight was very, very bitter. Bisping saying that he was the unofficial Strikeforce middleweight champion. The buildup was bitter, but now it seems like they're buds.

I saw on the Jackson podcast, Rampage Jackson's podcast, that they're now buddies. Look at them hanging out. Bisping taking out his eye. Rocco chilling. I mean, back in 2015, 2016, this would never happen. Were those a bunch of watches on the table?

Necklaces? Yeah, that's what Jackson is. Jewelry company. So they just have them on the table like that? I've never noticed that. I just haven't seen it from that angle.

If I'm not mistaken, the owner, founder, someone high up in Jackson is the host, yeah, Bear high up in the streets. Is the host, right? Is the host, yeah. Bear. Yes, yes, yes. Yes. All right.

Well, without further ado, let us say hello to our old friend, Luke Rockhold. He's kind enough to join us. And it has been a while since we last spoke. Hello, Luke. How are you? Good. How's it going, Ariel? It's been a long time.

Why do you seem so upset? No, I'm not. I just got out of a doctor's appointment. Okay. I screwed up the math. I screwed up the math. I really messed this up, so I hope it wasn't an inconvenience. No, no, no. We got it. We're good. Good to go. Everything okay at the doctor? Yeah, I got a little sickness From the The fires What was it Something was in the air

I got like influenza A And Oh no It led to There Sinus infection It's been a long Long month

But you know We're good now Okay We're looking The eye got a little messed up Oh damn I'm fresh It's a little something

But we're good now And your house okay? Yeah I'm in Orange County Now Okay I'm not I'm fresh. It's a little something, but we're good now. And your house okay? Yeah. I'm in Orange County now. Okay. I'm not, I'm not, I'm not up here, but I was, I was visiting and I got, I got the sickness through the, through the process somehow. Okay.

But yeah, we survived. Well, I'm happy. Yes. As always. We got to fight. We got to fight through the problems in life. You know what I mean? If someone breaks your nose

You gotta fight like a fucking man and sack up Oh, okay, let's get right into it Are you referring to Sean Strickland? Yeah, I'm just, you know We all watch the fight and we all hear The guy talk about to the death, Dutchman To the death, this motherfucker talks Such a big game, and then he bitches out

And basically quits in a fight after he breaks his nose like what are you worried about you have a title fight you know world titles online that's all you want that's all you dreamed of and you're more worried about fixing your fucking nose than fucking winning and biting down on your mouthpiece and doing what you got to do i mean it's just it shows your true character that's that's the cage is all about he about. He's getting a ton of shit in the aftermath of this fight. People saying that, you know, I had Dean Thomas in studio here saying, like, he's not that guy. He says he's that guy, but he's not that guy.

Do you agree with that sentiment? 100%. When has he ever fucking put his ass on the line and fucking bit down and really went for it through a whole process of a fight, not just the last 10 seconds of a round. I mean, the guy is non-stop. I mean, he's not finishing any big fights.

I'll tell you that. Look at him out there. Just talking and doing shit that's not even his. What do you mean by that last part? I'm just tired of fake people. I don't know. I mean, you just see everything that he presents himself as,

which he is not, you know? It's pretty simple. Yeah. Do you think it's part of the problem that, like, the press conferences become somewhat like open mic night where you just, like, say all this outlandish stuff stuff but if that doesn't translate at least to an exciting fight you are now susceptible to getting more and more hate right and i don't feel like this was often the case back in the day like when you were in the ufc like it just feels like every week we're dealing with everything but

fighting you know what i mean like everyone's saying all this crazy shit just to get people to talk about them and that's all well and good but if it doesn't lead to fun fights it kind of it gets a little tiresome yeah no 100 you gotta you gotta you gotta show up and lay claim to your words if you don't you get a lot of shit trust me i know i've got i've gotten my fair share of shit you know we all say things sometimes it doesn't work out you know the best way possible but you know um you you assume that you like certain things you say you got to try to do and then and then there's other you know versions that that don't come so true um your history with Sean what like how far back does it date um i know i think it was just just a couple times in the gym

i seen him in there one time he was just it was really annoying when he came back in the gym one day and i was like i would i was it was in the middle of the covid and i was a little hungover and i think i had nose my nose was broken i think at the time and uh i was so annoyed with this motherfucker just running his mouth and acting the way he did I went to the bathroom I got a fucking piece of paper towel I put it in my mouth pit And I stepped in there and put my glove just to spar the kid

Because I was so fucking annoyed Really? Wow, where was this? Which gym? It was at the old Ruka gym Okay You put paper towel in your mouth As a gum shield? Yeah, you know where they have the paper towel mouthpiece Where you roll it you fold it And then you fucking wet it

And then you like strip it up So I was like I was choking on that with a broken nose And I still supported the kid to put it down And how'd it go It was a close round I'm not gonna lie Okay what was he doing to piss you off He just fucking runs his mouth Like you hear him in the press conference

like he just has he's just a very deep insecurity of whatever wherever he is he always tries to act a fool and i've never seen the kid before and he walked in like he was just the fucking man so and he just he just disrespects everybody he can like you see the kid like here it's here here one of the guys and he kept trying to knock him out like cold knock him out with the same kick and he's on like comes on our turf asking for sparring and he was like trying to knock this kid out and i was just really sick of it and i was like who the fuck is this kid and so basically i put put my shit together and i went in there and fucking went to war. And after the round, what happens?

Nothing. It was just a good round and then the next morning, I was fucking tired. Did you see him again? I seen him a couple times in the gym but nothing really. Okay.

So when you see that fight on Saturday, is it like, you know, it's a middleweight title fight. Did that feel like a middleweight title fight to you? Did it feel like a middleweight title fight to you? No, it did not. Yeah, I didn't, I didn't. But I'm not a former middleweight champion. That's your weight class.

That's your belt. You held that belt. That didn't, that didn't feel, it didn't feel like the best of the best. It didn't feel elite. I mean, they are elite. I'm not going to lie. They're elite fighters. They've proven it. They've been through the ranks. But to put on a championship performance is different. And to really put your ass on the line.

I mean, Drikus, he does what he does every time. I've trained with Drikus a lot. He's just a fucking hard-nosed dude that just never gives up. And that's what he does. But Sean didn't play his role. I mean, if a championship fights, you've got to fight like a fucking champion. When did you and where did you train with Drikus? I was in Florida.

Drikus used to come to Hoof's gym back in the day for many, a year or two. I don't know, quite some time back in the day. And when you trained with him, did you think this guy has the potential to be a champion? You can identify he is tough for sure um he's well-rounded tough and just never gives up um i'm like i was i was i might have been a little further ahead technically and i think i was going at 205 at the time was maybe a bit bigger um so it was a problem for him for sure but he's he's he's so true to form and gotten better and better and he just never fucking gives up and energy is so much about winning you have to believe and understand where you're at at that place in time and put in the work and and it's

it's not always about the most technical guy you know it's the guy who wants it more and right now no one wants it more than that dude How do you think it fares against Hamzat? I think Hamzat is, you know, he's a go for broke kind of guy. Hamzat, if he can't out-wrestle you, if he can't control you in that fierce state of direction of what he does, you know, I think he'll break. Really. direction of what he does, you know, he's, I think he'll break. Really? I mean, I mean, if Hamza will get him,

if he'll get him, but if he can't get him, it's going to be a fucking, it's going to be a hard third, fourth, and fifth round. Right. I think that's going to be all,

all Drikus. So, so if it goes into the championship rounds, you like the champ? Yeah, a hundred percent. When, when you look at his style now,

like even on, on Saturday, and again, I'm, I'm not a fighter, but I've, I've watched a lot of fights and I could tell that this style is unique, how he kind of like lunges in and then he comes back like this. Like it's not smooth.

It's not crisp, but it works. He's won nine in a row. It's an incredible run. He's beaten some tough guys. But when you see him fight like that on Saturday, what do you think? Okay. Him and Sean Strickland are very, very similar in the fact

that they're both awkward. They both throw their head offline and they throw not technical punches. They throw fucking hand punches and angles and they're hitting from the inside of the hands and different angles. And Drikus' funk is funkier than Sean's funk.

He just steps on the gas pedal more. But they both, they dip their head. They don't look at targets and they just throw. The numbers add up. Sean just, he tries to number you and just get to you and number you and touch you. And Drikus kind of like, he just has a different sway, a different swag and it works, man.

It's not, maybe it's not the most, not the prettiest thing to watch, but they are effective whether you like them or not. Do you think Sean can get, like, can he be champion again in your opinion?

No, Sean will never make it back for sure. He'll never make it back to anything of substance. You think he's done? He proved it. He proved his, he just wants to exist. He wants to exist at the top

and be part of the show. That's all he wants to do from what I see. Does it annoy you when you see him fighting for the belt? Sean just annoys me straight up, 100%. Everything about him is fucking annoying. Surely you like his mustache.

It's his best look. Shaved head, mustache, supremacy, white supremacy, I'm sure is what he's going for. Did you see his arm? Staff? That was staff, right? 100%, that's staff, yeah. Do you think that they, I mean mean should they not let someone fight with that can that affect your performance can that affect your energy i mean yeah i mean i like i i had

cellulitis which is like kind of like a form of this in in my foot but there's no like there's no targeted space you know i mean we have that kind of a staff and it's showing it's it's very apparent matt hamill i remember I remember he had one back in the day. Oh, yeah. I think it's too... If it's early in the night, everyone else is susceptible to getting it too. You know what I mean?

Because it's going to be on the mat. So, I mean, as a main event, I think it's up to your opponent for a title fight. I think it's obviously, fuck staff. You title fight. I think it's obviously fuck, fuck staff. You're going to fight. Right. Sure.

Right. It's something, something you deal with and take the antibiotics afterwards. But you know, uh, I wouldn't, if I were a promoter, I would definitely cut the undercard if it were.

Um, so you're a part of the GFL now, Luke, and I actually got some breaking news. Oh, did you know this? Did you know this news let me uh you want me to hear some well okay so uh there it is thank you frank

okay so this is the breaking news i want to make sure that i get it right here because a lot has happened um okay this is the breaking news according to darren Owen, the acting commissioner and founder of the Global Fight League, they are trading you to Team LA. So that was it for you with Team Dubai. You're done to make the Chris Weidman trade, excuse me, to make the Chris Weidman fight happen.

The fight that I think he wants and that I would say probably you want. So you're now out of team Dubai. You've been sent packing and you're headed to LA. This is bigger than Luka Doncic heading to LA. Luke, Luke is going to LA too.

This is big. Team LA. I want that fight, man. Weidman and me, it makes the most sense, I think. And it's fun.

And so I think there's, there's rumors of a fight coming here to LA and, uh, I'm, I'm healthy, man. I'm healthy and I'm training and I'm here to LA. And I'm healthy, man. I'm healthy and I'm training and I'm back to it. So Weidman, I'd love to close that door, as Drikus would say. You know, you got to, I think I already closed it, but I'm going to secure that one.

Okay, so this is interesting. Can you explain, why did you have to be traded for this fight to happen, to the best of your knowledge? To the best of my knowledge, I don't understand the whole concepts, but I mean, obviously the team, the team Dubai,

I was in Dubai training. I'm not sure. Javier is, is my guy. So, uh, maybe something had to do with that, but,

um, fights need to be made. Uh, he's New York. I'm LA and I, I hear they're coming here to the LA area. So, um, come on, baby boy, let's bring it, I'm LA, and I hear they're coming here to the LA area. So, come on, baby boy.

Let's bring it. Bring what you got. I love it. This rematch was supposed to happen UFC 199 in LA, and obviously we know what happened then. So, what was that, 2016? Nine years in the making. Is that, wow.

Isn't that crazy? Let's see how it goes I think this one will be I like my chances this time around I think Webman is a little slower Than I've come off You know, I think I can keep up You saw his last couple of

Appearances in the UFC What'd you make of him? We just saw him in December I didn't I really didn't You didn't watch To saw him in December. I didn't. I really didn't. You didn't watch? To tell you the truth, I didn't watch. How do you know he's slower then? You just said he's slower. How would you know? I watched a little highlights, but I mean, guys like Eric Anders and who you're losing to, I'm not losing those fights these days. Okay.

That's what I'm seeing so what I mean like people age differently I I I've I have aged well I trust me I I still if I'm if I'm healthy I'm gonna all outflow and I'll be slicker than most anybody out there so I know what I'm capable of I just gotta get in shape obviously my last my last time out I fought Joe Schilling on three weeks notice or less. And, uh, you know, I broke my nose again, fought through it, got the knockout. Um, so, uh, I expect to have a full training camp and be ready to go and fucking ice this guy, put him, put him to sleep. Uh, by the way, 85 or 205?

I like 205. Hey, why, why not change it up you know uh you know i'm i'm open i'll see what see what darren's open to um but i just want to close this deal either way it really doesn't matter um i like to uh i like to i like that fight when do you think it happens what are you hearing uh i'm thinking late late april is what I'm hearing. Oh, wow. Okay. Getting right into it. Get right into it.

Get off the bat and get things cooking. And ultimately, why did you sign with GFL? Why did you make this move? I mean, there is money behind it. You know, they're taking care of me thus far. Um, and, and they've got a lot of potential fights that are, that are fun. So, um, and I miss mixed martial arts. You know, my legs were so beat up after the Paulo Costa fight and injuries and different things. So it was nice to take a break. I wanted to pursue some other things, uh, but I've

gotten healthier and, and really mma is is what i what i'm best at and uh i i still have some fire left in me and i love to to test that out so you had uh you had the karate combat fight when was it uh a year like april will be a year and then the year before that you did bkfc you did CJI in August with Craig Jones. But has anyone else approached you about fights in between? Yeah, there's been a couple of boxing offers, but just not, you know, I was just coming off of the back injury and off that. And then there's some other stuff right now, but just nothing is lining up. You have to have a training camp.

I'm not going to go show up into a boxing match against a good guy on four weeks, five weeks notice, going into a big fight. I'm down. I'm down to do it. I think my game has come a long ways in the boxing, and that's what I really wanted to do. But there's got to be adequate time to prepare for boxers in a boxing fight, which I've never technically done. So I'm still open to these doors, but just got to get healthy and start working. Was it ever close, you making your boxing debut?

Anything that you seriously considered? Yeah, I've considered for sure. Who was it against? There was an opportunity. I think it was Vidal Riley. Vidal Riley, they offered me for Mike Tyson, I think, on undercard. Damn. But fucking 11-0 boxer on six weeks notice off a bad back,

like with a back injury. I was like, no. On the Netflix card. Hold on. That was an opportunity. That was an opportunity. It was an opportunity. It was on my doorstep, but like I said, thank you for the opportunity, but I'm not going to walk in there and look like a fool, you know, against the guy's good. The guy's decent.

Yeah. Might you appear on a future MVP card then? There's possibilities. There's possibilities for sure. Who'd you like the box like i like like i said i hurt my back go like pretty bad going into that cgi thing i gotta i gotta had to get like steroid like cortisone injections before that so it's been a little bit but i'm healthy now and uh i think there's any i think darren till is fucking great i'd love to swing and test myself against someone like that um and we'll see we'll see what

else i mean vidal riley i still i still like that fight honestly give me give me eight weeks give me 10 weeks when i'm healthy for for an eight round boxing match i'm gonna i'm gonna fucking need my legs so um i just gotta be healthy for it but all these guys i like did you see Till's debut, his boxing debut? I mean, he went against a guy who was... So, I mean, I can't take that guy any serious. He's pretty bad the way everything about what he does and how he throws punches. There was no part of you impressed by this? I didn't see it.

I didn't really see it. I just saw the knockout. He's a pretty clean boxer forout. He's a good... He's a pretty clean boxer for sure. He's got skills. Damn, I would like to see that in boxing. I'd be down. You versus Till in boxing? Yeah, I like it.

I like it. Just give me some time. I know they're trying to put together a card on March 29th right now, but... Yeah. Did they approach you about that? I mean, there's always talk here and there, but that's, what is it, five weeks away? I just had my septum

fixed. Oh, geez. From that whole thing. So that's why the doctor's appointment I just had. So I've been dealing with that. And so, still on antibiotics. I'm not trying to walk into a boxing match on four weeks notice. Sure, sure, sure. I get that.

Do you have high hopes for GFL? Do you think they can be a true, you know, a true legitimate? You still there? Yeah. Do you have high hopes for GFL? What do you think? Man, I think we've got to go put together a big event. The first event's got to go hard,

and I think this is a great opportunity. Me and Weidman make some big matchups and come out hard and fucking put on a show, and you never know. So it's a great thing, 50% revenue split with the fighters. I mean, everything looks good, so I'm going to ride with them, and I'm going to get this fight. The rumor is the fight's going to happen, so let's get going. Could I ask, how do you feel about the current state of MMA?

And I was saying last week that I felt like there was a shortage of superstars in the sport right now. What do you think? Do you agree? Do you disagree? Um, I mean, I would say it's, uh, sorry, I'm, where are we at here? Shortage of stars. I don't, I don't, I think you got some, you got some fun fights out there. It's hard to say, but yeah, I mean, it,

it goes through hills and valleys. Sure. You never know who you're going to get, you know? Yeah. We'll see. Uh, Islam,

you know, it's been a while since I spoke to you. Are you, are you surprised by how good he's become or did you expect all of this? I mean, I always, I always expected it from Islam. Islam is,

he's a beast. You know, it was always Habib and Habib, and when Habib was going to retire, Islam was going to take over. And they have done it. I'm impressed by Usman. Usman's, you know, he's come a long ways. I've seen him back when he came in kind of late in the game at AK,

and he's come so far. It's nice to see him. I saw that kid, Paul Hughes, train one day over at Henry Huff's gym. I knew he was tough. That was a great fight for him, too. I've got to be honest now. I can't stop thinking about Luke Rockhold versus Sean Strickland. Let me go handle Chris Weidman and you never know.

You'd like that? I'd love to break that kid's nose. Again? Again. Again. Again. Yeah. You would seriously like that? You think that that would be, you know, you're a little bit older than him now, like you feel

like you can hang with him? I put in a training camp. I know I can fight with anybody out there right now still. Okay. It's got to be down to sea level and, and they're gonna fucking take it seriously. Get a good,

healthy training camp. All right. Well, first is Chris Weidman. Do we have a date? Do we have a specific date? Just late April? We're seeing,

we're, everything looks like late April. Uh, we're, we're, we're securing venues and locking in dates. So,

um, trade has been made. I'm on team LA. All right. One step down. Well done Well Luke great to catch up with you Feel better

Congrats on all this and good luck I'm looking forward to it I'll see you soon Thank you There he is the great Luke Rockhold Appreciate him very much And now he's on team LA guys Breaking news

Is this the first time we've ever broken a trade it was huge that was huge we were all stunned back here i don't know if you could hear it in the studio but jaws hit the floor and i couldn't hear it i couldn't hear it it was it was crazy the real question is who's heading to team dubai oh fuck i forgot to ask that question yeah who's who's heading to team dubai and yeah, I mean, it's crazy for Luke. He seemed to handle that well. He's got to pack his bag, sell his apartment, condo house in Dubai, and go set up shop in LA now.

This is all so foreign to me. I forgot to ask who's going to Team Dubai. So we broke half of our first trade. But also, didn't you say you broke the, and this is just my memory failing me. I bottled it. You broke the DJ for Aspen. Oh, yeah, I did break. Yes, I did break.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I did break that one. First on the show, though. On the Ariel Helwani show, first time you broke it. And that wasn't on the air. That wasn't on the air. That was just an article. And it was also, you know, we only got half the trade now.

Fuck, I really screwed up. No, no, no. Didn't we break other trading, trade news? Didn't Darren come on and break trade news last week? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Felipe Lins. Felipe Lins against Antonio Carlos. Yeah, but I didn't break that. He broke that.

Felipe Lins sure was on the way. On the show. Shit. Luke Rockhold versus Chris Weidman. Luke Rockhold versus Darren Till. Sign me up. I'm in for all of it. No, no, no. Luke Rockhold versus Strickland is the fight to make. I mean, yes, but that's not happening, but yes.

And he really came out. Look at all these trades. Maybe they make a trade with the UFC. How Rockhold versus Strickland is the fight to make. I mean, yes, but that's not happening, but yes. And he really came out. Look at all these trades. Maybe they make a trade with the UFC. How old is Sean Strickland? 1991, 33. And how old is Luke Rockhold? Luke Rockhold. 40.

That's not... I mean, just turn 40. I like the Weidman fight. Yeah, I like the Weidman fight. I like the Strickland fight. Why? What is it about this? I think the shit talking would... What do you mean, what is it about it? Did you not hear him? Yeah, I like the Weidman fight. I like the Strickland fight. Why? What is it about this? I think the shit talking would be great.

What do you mean, what is it about it? Did you not hear him? Yeah, the shit talking would be great. No, but yeah. No, no, no, not for me. Chris Weidman. That's the one. Yeah, I guess.

LA versus New York. I can't believe how... A tale as old as time. I can't believe how much I screwed that up. I was so excited about breaking trade news that I didn't even find out who's going to Dubai. Well, let's find out right now. It's actually...

She's calling back. Wait, team Los Angeles GFL. Wow. It popped up. Official rosters. GFL draft results. Thank you, Uncrowned. Thank you, Drake Riggs.

Okay, Los Angeles. Wait, one, two, three, four. Sage, Aspen, Tony, Uriah. Corey McKenna, Chad Mendez, Lorenz Larkin. Wait, actually, it doesn't have to be for the same weight class, yeah? I guess not.

It could be anyone. Maybe he got traded For Rashad Evans The The Rashad Evans Who was Who was Who was a malcontent

Yeah He wanted out Maybe Maybe he got traded For a 2026 First round pick You never know

Oh that's right Elimile McFarlane Luis Glissman Tyler Diamond Leslie Smith Jessica Penne Dawoon Jung Chat, yeah

That may be a package deal Throw Dawoon Jung in there Yeah, oh, oh, oh He wrote back I got the answer Oh, here we go, here we go Break that news Frank

We're botching it We're bottling it We have guests that we need to get on with I love hearing Andy go Frank breaking news Breaking news Because we all look over at him He is lounging

He's just lounging What are you having? Some mandarins over there? I'm actually checking audio for our guests For the champ Yeah It's Grant Neal Grant Neal

Oh wow You should have told me that Sorry So there you have it Brother Jeff Do I Yeah. It's Grant Neal. Grant Neal. Oh, wow. You should have told me that. Yeah, yeah. Sorry. So there you have it. Brother Jeff. Do I get full credit now? By the way, this is like when Shams tweets out like, this guy's going to Soto and then in a follow-up tweet.

Yeah, exactly. Rockhold for Neal. Yeah. That feels like a good deal for Team LA. I'd say so. By the way, is he in fact Jeff's brother? Or were you just joking? No, if I'm not mistaken, is he not?

I don't know. Cousin? Not related at all? Like, it's out of Colorado. They're definitely related. Look at him. Yeah, he is. I know.

Yes, bro, he used to fight in Bellator. Grant Neal, Jeff Neal. Yeah, he is. He used to fight in Bellator. Grant Neal, Jeff Neal. He was 8-2 in Bellator. First video that comes up from James Lidge. UFC's Jeff Neal and Bellator's Grant Neal are not related. They look similar. What is that you said? Man, that entire time that he was fighting in Bellator,

I was like, oh, Jeff Neal's brother's fighting this weekend. Number one. The entire time that he was in Bellator. Oh, my God. I bet on him before based on the fact that he's Jeff Neal's brother. Well, this is crazy. The truth. Grant, the truth now.

Wait a second. Now, on-air Jordan is sending me a video where he's actually saying they're long-lost brothers no he's joking I can't I can't tell I'm reading the captions yeah I mean you know by the way they kind of do look alike right I'm not gonna Albrickson was a banger yeah yeah damn you think

Jeff is gonna to corner him? I mean, you'd figure. In his debut. Team Dubai debut. By the way, that's kind of shady, I have to say. It's a little bit shady on Javier Mendez's part. I mean, here he is. He's been with Luke Rockhold his entire career,

and you just ship him off before the first event. That's worse than the Mavericks and Nico Williams shipping off Doncic. I mean, he put in sweat equity. Yeah, no doubt. Going to hamper the relationship. I'm surprised. Yeah, I'm surprised. Rumors of an event in LA, is that what Luke said?

That's what he said, yeah. A little hometown advantage. For Luke. Yeah. Yeah. Against Weidman. Well, looking forward to that A lot going on

Do we have our next guest? Oh yeah Oh no not ready yet She's here we're just I'm very excited about this Like I said Blown away I said this on Saturday's post show I was in awe of Zhang away. I was,

I said this on Saturday's post show. I was in awe of Zhang Weili. I was in awe of what she did. I was in awe of how she fought. I was in awe of the fact that everyone thought, I don't want to say everyone, a lot of people thought that she was going to get work dominated. The wrestling wasn't going to be there for her,

that she was going to not be able to figure out how to stuff the takedowns how to get up it was a coronation it was inevitable it was five six seven eight nine years in the making and what did she do first round figured it out a little bit frustrated, and then proceeded to win rounds two, three, four, and five. And there was no controversy whatsoever, as clear as day. And I want to give a shout out to her jujitsu coach. He's been working with her since the first Ioana fight, so march of 2020 josh hinger working with her uh in in in thailand and you could see the evolution of her on the ground you could see what she was able to do when she was down there and when she wasn't down there like you could see the evolution of her grappling of a jujitsu and now she's turned into one of the most well-rounded fighters in the sport and only

that in my opinion the number one pound for pound fighter in the sport as well and uh starting to enter the conversation for greatest uh strawweight fighter of all time certainly she's tied yuani and jay check so she is in that conversation if you ask me so let us go down under and say hello to the reigning defending ufc strawweight champion the one and only zhangili. Hello, Zhang. How are you? Great to see you, Weili. Hello, Brian. Thank you.

Long time no see. Yes, long time. Thank you. Thank you for coming on. Yes, thank you. And we have an interpreter, Grace, with us as well, who has worked with you in the past, I believe at UFC 300.

So thank you for coming on, Grace. We appreciate you. Weili, I was saying before you came on uh i i was in awe of what you did on saturday i i i was so impressed with how you fought and uh how you dominated the fight and so could i just ask two days later how are you feeling about what you did in the cage well sunday morning over there in australia how are you feeling about what you did against Tatiana Suarez? She said that her performance the other day was very much at her advantage. And she wanted to ask, now that the game is over,

two days have passed, how do you feel now? I feel very calm. This fight, I feel very calm. Before, sometimes I'm a little bit nervous and a little bit very excited. This time, very calm and very like water, I think. I love that. Like water, like the great Bruce Lee used to say. Can I ask, why do you think you were so calm for this fight? Because you were the underdog.

A lot of people thought it would be your toughest fight, but yet here you're saying so calm. Why do you think that was? Because, you know, every day I'm training so hard. I think I have more confidence. I'm training so hard. BJJ, wrestling, striking, strategy conditioning, everything, you know. I've been training a lot, a a lot a lot time yeah so hard so i think i'm ready so i'm very calm and i think now i'm my mental with before it's different i i'm more intrigued i'm i'm so enjoy the cage in cage in autobahn

um you know you you were asked a bunch of times going into the cage in all the guns. You know, you were asked a bunch of times going into the fight about being the underdog, about her wrestling, all that stuff, and you always said the right things. It was always very professional. But now that the fight is over, can you tell us, were you a little bit annoyed? Were you a little bit bothered by the fact that it seemed like people had forgotten how good you were

and that they thought that she would just come in and beat you so easily and get that belt you can be 实际上你会不会还是在情绪上会觉得有一点烦人,总是他们这样说? 没有,no. Zero. Zero. You didn't feel disrespected or anything like that? Yeah. 我只是专注于自己。

就是我说,I speak Chinese. 是。 Yeah. 我英文词汇量不够。 就是我只是想专注我自己。 I speak Chinese. I don't speak enough English. I just want to focus on myself. I won't be disturbed by the noise outside. Because you've done something, the outside world doesn't know.

They don't know your training status. They don't know how hard you've trained. So they can only look at some data or look at some things to judge. Yeah, I don't let the outside voice or noise distract me because they don't see what I'm doing every day, how hard I train. All that's based on the past fights or some historical data, so it doesn't really matter.

Okay, much respect. Can I ask, what were you thinking during and immediately after the first round? That was the only round that she won. She was able to take you down and keep you down. Not a lot of activity, not a lot of offense, but clearly was successful in keeping you on the mat. What were you thinking as this was transpiring?

And then as you go to your corner to get ready for round two, what are you thinking and feeling?他想问一下就是说你在第一局的时候包括在第一局之后因为你的确被他邮报摔倒了 然后压制了你一段时间 虽然他没有对你造成伤害 但是那个时候你在想些什么 包括你第一局完了之后 到你的边角 准备好第二场的时候

心里的状态什么 想的是什么东西吗 其实我 这个就是上来被摔倒 我们也是预想到的 而且就是说 我这次摔跤柔术准备的非常非常多 而且我柔术教练

非常非常厉害 然后塔提安娜的 她的这个就是 抢手就是断头跟裸脚 然后我柔术教练的断头 也是世界上非常非常厉害的 所以我们准备的非常多然后这次的�教练的断头也是世界上非常非常厉害的所以我们准备的非常多 然后这次的训练

应是时间最长的 就是每天训练的时间最长的 对 我当时被他摔倒以后 其实我是知道 就是说我是知道有这个结果 因为他的摔跤非常厉害 而且他力量挺大的

就是我打到他以后 他的头搓着我的胳膊就抱进来了,非常快。 我根本没有来得及反应去反摔或者去做一些防摔动作,我已经倒地上了。 Okay, it was kind of expected that she would take me down, so it wasn't really a surprise to me. We kind of prepared for that. But to be honest, we do so many training in wrestling grappling she was known for being very good at guillotine and rhythm choke but that's okay because my coach is really good at those as well but i didn't notice that she was very strong very

powerful so when she took me down i just felt the force coming from her and i was down you mentioned your coaches. You have a great team that has helped mold you into the fighter that you are today. I wanted to ask you about Josh. I just spoke about him, Josh Hinger, who is your jiu-jitsu coach. And I know you've been working with him since 2020. And we really got to see your jiu-jitsu, your grappling on display in this fight. Can you speak about how special he is to you and how much he has improved you as a fighter,

but also on the mat as well?什么样的角色不仅说在帮助你在柔术上训练的进步啊 那整个在地面上 给你起到什么样的作用和帮助 其实我们是在 对就是三年前我们就认识 然后我们就是每次的训练营 他都会加入到我们训练营里面 然后每次就是

在一起训练 然后生活都非常开心 然后他的性格也特别好 他的技术也特别好 然后他的技术就是 我觉得像水一样 就是他经常跟我说的就是说 你就把你的对手当成

你在柔柔树的时候 你就像在冲浪一样 然后你的对手就是那个冲浪板 然后你只需要跟着他去动 然后你不需要 你把所有的路有的时候就知道他往哪条路上走然后你把所有的路都堵上了 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. and I, we started working together, like you said, three years ago. And we lived together, worked together. He pretty much joined every training camp that I have had so far. We really get along. But very importantly, that he really teach me how to be water.

He often teach me, say, hey, just look at this as surfing, right? Um, your opponent's a surfing board. You have to go with it. It's like you're riding the waves. Um, don't against it, just go with the depth to it. And you will be, you will be able to handle all the different situation coming from the opponent. Wow. I love that. Um, and, and, you know, um, this mentality that you keep talking about, would you say this is relatively new to your life and career, or did you always kind of feel this way? Did you always have this sort of approach to fighting, or did you feel like this is something that you've learned with the help of the likes of Josh and your other coaches,

Frank, et cetera, Frank Hickman?他想你谈一下你经常提到的像水一样他想到你说那这个像水一样的这种心态和感觉 是你一直对我的还是说你近几年慢慢的开发出来的一种感受 这就是像水一样 这个道理其实我在很小的时候就知道了 但是我一直不明白其中的怎么样去做 运用到生活和训练跟比赛当中。 但是通过这几年慢慢的训练,然后去沉淀自己,然后我就越来越觉得,其实不管是技术也好,很多东西,我们真的就应该像水一样。 Yeah. Yeah. So I always know about this knowledge about the water since I was a kid. However, I was too young to understand or resonate with what this means.

But now as I grow older, I'll supply different techniques or skills or mentality to understand the water. And now it makes sense to me now. My understanding, Weili, was that after the Yan Xiaonan fight, you wanted to move up to 125 to fight the champion at the time, Alexa Grasso, but she had the fight against Valentina. And so essentially you said, all right, I want to fight Tatiana. And Tatiana was booked against Virna Zhangjiroba, but they canceled that fight to make this fight. And so while everyone was thinking Tatiana was going to be this boogie woman to take you down and dominate you, you

specifically asked for this fight. This is what I was told. Is this boogie woman to take you down and dominate you. You specifically asked for this fight. This is what I was told. Is this true? Is this accurate?女小英和威尔纳打但是听说他说听说是你想跟 苏亚雷斯打 所以US就把他们的比赛给取消了 而转而安排 你和苏亚雷斯这一场 他问是不是这样的

其实不是这样的 就是说因为当时 因为当时怎么说呢 就是说这故事挺长的 就是说我一直想 我一直想上级别 上级别但是呢 就是因为各种原因吧

然后也没有上得去 然后这次呢就是比赛呢 然后就是我也 我正在那个训练呢 然后我也很迷茫我的对手是谁 然后我一直问一问谁 那我下一场跟谁打 因为现在所有的人都都安排完了我没有对手了我跟谁打我不想等太长时间 Yeah, I always wanted to go up one weight class.

I always wanted to do that, but it's never a good timing. And for a very quite long time, I was a little bit confused. Like, hey, who should I fight? Because, you know, they all have their own arrangements and match. But eventually, so workout was UFC because I really want to get a fight. Okay. And so there you were. You got a fight. Okay. And so there you were, you got the fight. And

after at the post-fight press conference, Dana White said that you and your team were waiting for him to speak to him. And he said that he likes you so much that you will get whatever you want next. And so could I ask, did you ask him to fight Valentina Shevchenko for the flyweight title. 之后比赛的细节还没有谈到,因为刚刚从赛场上下来,然后我感觉我马上从赛场上下来又谈下一场比赛,我感觉太紧了。 Yeah, there's no concrete plan or ask from our side just yet. Okay. 但是你想要大的子弹吗? 我觉得需要一个天时地利人和。 I think we need a person with a lot of potential. next fight to be at 125 against Valentina? Yeah, anything works.

If we ended up in the flyweight, then i don't have to go through so much pain to cut weight why not would you be one of those fighters some people say that when they go up they don't want to come back down um if you go up would you go back to 115 or would you stay at 125 or would you stay at 125? Yeah, UFC kind of want me to, if I actually go up to 125, just kind of stay in there, but I'm still considering it. You haven't fought in that Svirna Zandjiroba, but she's fighting Yan Xiaonan in April. Do you feel like you are running out of challenges at 115? And is that part of the motivation to go up? So now you're in the second round, and there's no one else after this Verna, you haven't fought, right?

Do you think this is an incentive to leave the second round and get a better chance? I think it's like this.你会想要离开这个量级身中的一个动力呢?我觉得是这样的,就是说,每个人,我就是希望可以突破我自己,可以跟高手,可以跟厉害的人比赛,这样的话,我就觉得,对我来说,就是, get out of my comfort zone, continue to outperform myself. So I wanted to find the best fighters. That's the only way that I can keep challenging myself. For you, is part of the appeal to fight a legend like Valentina or just to go up and try to see if you can fight for another belt and win that belt because I asked this because there's been talk of her fighting Manon Fiorot so let's say Manon beats her would you be just as interested to fight Manon if she's the champion or is it about the

challenge of fighting Valentina the greatest flyweight of all time所以他想问你,对你来说更大的吸引力是说你可以跟子丹姐这个传奇打一场比赛,还是说对你来说更大的吸引力是你可以到下一个量级拿到双冠王,所以每个队員来说是更吸引力的? 其实我觉得最重要的就是打有意义的比赛,打就是能让自己进步的比赛打 观众特别愿意看的比赛 Yeah, to me, what's most important is I wanted to have fights that's exciting, entertaining to the audience. Also, that's meaningful to me in a way that I can challenge output for myself. It's not that it's the same thing over again.

I feel, correct me if I'm wrong, Wei Li, I feel like you don't really like talking about this am i accurate My training camp just ended. I'm about to enter the next training camp. I'll listen to you. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. No more questions about Valentina. Can I ask you about something completely different? I was so excited in the summertime when I saw you with Steph Curry and De'Aaron Fox. I love the NBA also, so it was amazing. I was like, wow, look at Wei Li with Steph Curry. What a legend.

And you're playing, what is it, Mahjong, right? You're playing this. How did this happen? How did this come about? It's because we both are investors for the sports brand. And then he ended up in China for that purpose. And that's how I got the chance to show him the Chinese culture, play mahjong, eat hot pot. And he's really smart.

He just got a hand of the mahjong very quickly i love it i also uh really enjoyed when the the head coach of the boston celtics joe mizzoula um around your fight at the ufc 300 he was wearing your t-shirt when he was doing uh interviews before one of the uh the celtics playoff games did you did you see that and uh if so what did you think of that? That was pretty cool.我看到特别感谢马祖达教练对我的支持好几次我都看到他媒体采访 他穿的那个印有张伟利的T恤 我们之前是在拉斯维加斯见到过 然后他也跟赵老师练过柔术

后来他还去波斯顿跟莱姆斯打比赛 他去现场看了我的比赛 我觉得马祖达教练是一个非常好的教练 I saw that he was wearing my shirt. I really appreciate his support. We met in Vegas. He even trained with us a little bit. And he went to Boston to support my fight when I was fighting Lemos. And I think that he has a really good mentality or ideology about training. So I like that. I love it. Are you a big basketball fan?

Are you a basketball fan? Yes, I am a fan. I do pay attention to basketball. Who is the one you look up to the most? Who is your favorite player? Kool-Aid. Okay, I got that one. Kool-Aid.

Kool-Aid, yes. Steph Curry. By the way, how often are you studying English now? Because it's gotten so good. It's amazing to see how far you have come. How often are you doing this? Do you want to answer yourself? She said you're my coach.

Yes, she said you're learning English and training English often. Tell us about it. Actually, when I was in the training camp, many of my coaches were... Okay. Yeah, okay. Actually, now my mind is a little bit lazy. Yeah. I just want to relax so

you know I have camp I have Josh, Frank they speak English so every day me with my coach speak English so my English is more better okay i love it

it's amazing and did you get by the way you said in the press conference you wanted to get ice cream uh vanilla and chocolate did you get the ice cream for sure yeah you two flavors i eat vanilla and chocolate right yeah pistachio as well okay I love it and I know you said you don't want to talk about the

future and that's okay but can I just ask when do you think you'll come back when do you think you'll fight again or is it too soon你会再次比赛吗?还是太迟了? I have a movie coming out in April. It will be released on April 4th. I will be doing some movie previews after that. I will be back very important next thing I need to do is I have a film coming up to be released on April 4th in China. So after I go back to China,

a lot of activities, events have to be part of to promote the movie. Is that, yeah. Is that the, I'm going to, I'm going to butcher this. Zhai Yi Ji Tai Feng. Is that the name of the going to butcher this, Zhai Yi Ji Tai Feng?

Is that the name of the movie? Yeah, Xia Yi Ji Tai Feng. It was me and Yan Xiao Nan. Last time I played the UFC 300, I went back to China the next day. After I went back to China, I had dinner with my family and then I went to China. Right, last fight with Xiao Nan, literally right next day, I flew back to China, I had dinner with my family and then I went to China to do it. Right. Last time I was in Xiaonan, literally right next day, I flew back to China, had one meal with my family, and then I joined the filmmaking crew and started shooting this film. Wow.

And is that the first movie that you're a part of? Yeah. And are you fighting in the movie? No. No? What is the role? Yeah, this movie has nothing to do with fighting or kung fu. It's actually drama. Wow.

And will it come out here in America? Will it be released in the U.S.? Do you know? I don't know yet. But it's possible that it will be released. There should be a movie festival. There should be a translation version. There should be one.

Probably not going to be in the theater in the U.S., but possibly certain film festival, it will be released. Okay. Well, congratulations and good luck. I'll just ask you two last questions and then we'll say goodbye. So thank you. I love the relationship that you have with Joanna now. You know, you guys had two incredible fights and now there she is in Sydney supporting you. And it's very lovely to see and she showed you love on social media.

Can I ask, how did you become, you know, such good friends after fighting each other twice? How did you go from opponents to friends?对啊他想知道一下你跟乔安娜是怎么变成这么好的朋友的你们打了两次 然后现在好像闺蜜一样的关系这么好 其实这次比赛就我这场比赛定下来以后 我就给乔安娜喊一句 我说来悉尼看我的比赛啊 然后之前的时候我们也在一块包饺子呀什么的

然后我觉得就是之前我们俩打比赛 打完比赛以后 我就觉得乔安娜这个人特别好 Yeah, so as soon as my fight got confirmed, I texted her saying, hey, would you come to Sydney and watch me fight? And she came, that's great. And we also handled together before. Um, the reason we got really close because I, I feel that she's a really authentic, real person. I feel like, Hey, we can become friends with this, with this girl. So

that's how the friendship started. Amazing. And, and my last question for you, uh, Waylee is you come into the UFC in 2018. And I think a lot of the, uh, at least North American fans maybe didn't know, um, what to expect from you and hadn't heard of you. And now people are talking about you as potentially when it's all said and done, one of the greatest fighters of all time, pound for pound, number one, greatest straw weight. Did you expect all of this or are you now exceeding your own expectations? Are you turning out to be a better fighter than you even dreamed of? 你觉得你现在目前取得的在这个格斗上的这个成绩是你当时想到的吗? 还是说你也没有想到你今天会变成一个巨星会这么成功?

其实我进入UAC我的目标就一直是冠军。 我就觉得我肯定可以,然后一直坚信自己。 但是其实一直走到现在也是我没有想到的。 and keep trusting myself. But I never thought I would be this big today. Yeah, I always strive to be a champion in the UFC. That was my dream, always. But to be frank, I never thought I would be this big today. Wow. As far as your popularity and how people know you and follow you? But when you said you never thought you would be this big today,这次来悉尼在美国比赛,在中国比赛, I'm just baffled like so many people they shower me with support love they fly into whatever

destination i am at to fight to see me fight sometimes i ask myself i'm not i'm not good looking i just fight like what do i what did i do deserve all this love and support from from everybody are you uncomfortable with it? It's a very positive sport. So I think if so many people like it, it means that MMA will develop better and better. I'm very, very happy. And everyone can benefit from this sport. Yeah, I actually, I love it. This makes me very happy, not because of me getting all the attention.

It's because I see how MMA bring all the positive change or impact to people's lives. And I see this as a good opportunity for this sport to become more popular. Well, I have to say the sport of MMA is better because you're in it. We are lucky to be able to watch you

do what you're doing at such a high level. Like I said on Saturday, I was in awe of what you did. It was outstanding. So congratulations. Thank you for doing this early in the morning in Sydney. And can I say xie xie? Thank you.

Yeah. Thank you. I want to say one something. Sure. I want to say that after this competition, I met Tatiana at the restaurant.就是我想说一下 就是我这次比赛结束以后 我在餐厅见到了塔提安娜 然后她跟她的家人

她的为人 她妈妈 他们都在 然后当时我 她坐在我 我当时坐在这儿 然后她正好 他们一家坐在那边

其实我刚开始特别就是 我的内心很复杂 就是我不知道应该怎么样去 我看到了但是 我不知道怎么去安慰他 还是怎么去说 然后我心里当时 有点复杂

然后我过了一会儿 我心里想 我还是要去给他一个拥抱 然后我就走过去 去跟他的那个 他家人打招呼 然后去拥抱他拥抱了我就走过去去跟她的那个她家人打招呼然后去拥抱 她拥抱了塔蒂娜娜

然后也 我觉得她也是一个 非常非常好的人 她的家人也非常好 也恭喜我 对 我觉得这个运动 就是这样的 就是在场上我们

就是提现 去赢得比赛 然后去展示这种女性的这种力量然后在台下我觉得我们也是可以成为朋友的 So after the fight, I went to a restaurant and actually run into Tatiana and her entire family were in the same restaurant. And I really wanted to go up to her and give her a hug. But I was a little bit hesitating because I don't know how to approach that situation. But eventually, some of my courage, I walked up to her and gave her a hug. I knew she was very sweet as well. What I wanted to say is that this is how the sport is, right? We are opponents in the octagon, but it doesn't mean anything. We can still become friends outside the cage. That's all I wanted to say.

Wow. I love that. Respect. Thank you. Well done. You're a great ambassador. You're a great role model. Thank you so much, Wei Li. Really appreciate it. And hopefully it won't be so long until we speak again. I hope to interview you again soon.

I hope you're more willing. Okay. Okay. We can meet anytime. 她希望很快可以再采访到你 希望你更加不厌异 OK 随时我们可以约 Yeah She said anytime If you guys want to book more interviews Thank you so much And great job Grace

Thank you so much as well Thank you guys Bye bye There she is The great Zhang Weili How could you not love Zhang Weili Amazing to hear her say the great Zhang Weili. How could you not love Zhang Weili? Golly. Amazing to hear her say,

you know, why do people like me so much? What did I do to deserve this? Humility, incredible fighter, and that fight against Valentina. But I could tell by her body language, and I understand she just fought, but that's the fight that everyone's thinking about. You know, you go through these fights and some of them are just kind of there and their title defenses and they're important but

to get to the point where this actually makes sense where this actually matters um where it's actually something that people want is a testament yeah trying to read the tea leaves i get the sense that her discomfort with it is that it's not up to her. You know, ultimately, like, she's not the type to be like, I want Valentina, line her up, I'm going to beat her. I get the sense that she's like, she doesn't want to say it's the UFC's call or say something against what the UFC wants her to do. And ultimately, like, it is their call, right? Like, are they going to do it? Because she'll fight anybody, as is clear by the fact that she was

like okay if it's not uh alexa grasso give me tatiana suarez which most would say like yeah that's an insanely hard fight she'll fight she'll fight anybody anytime she's she's game as they come but i also feel like she's like the traditional martial artist you know she is very much in the spirit of like uh traditional martial arts i agree with what you just said there i'll push back on one thing what's up i do think it's up to her and i do think they want to do it and you've seen enough dana white press conferences where he's like we're not talking about this now or we'll talk about on tuesday did you see the press conference on on saturday night seemed intrigued not he was giving the sly smile we might see like okay but he was saying it without saying

it that's the most he's ever going to say for a fight like that that has a few like things that need to be worked out he doesn't usually say if it's not like if someone asked him after the islam fight oh is it going to be islam versus balal next he would have been like nah or you know in the past where other people drichus perfect example if someone would have said drrikus versus Alex next, he would have said no. He was saying it without saying it. I think it is up to her. I think if she asked, but the UFC is very smart.

Zhang Weili fighting for a second title, given her fame and her growing popularity, would be gigantic for that region and worldwide fans. I think they're going to make it happen. A thousand percent. You don't get these opportunities often to make mega fights in the women's division, so you have to capitalize on it. I think they're going to make it happen. A thousand percent. You don't get these opportunities often to make like mega fights in the women's division. So you have to capitalize on it. I think they'll do it. I think it'll ultimately happen.

But the part that makes me think, again, it's in their court is her saying they wanted her to stay at 25 if she does it. And I think she has business to do at 115. And I don't think it's like, I don't think it's necessarily an easy decision for her to go. Yeah, I'll just go up to 25 when she's so dominant at 15 and could do this for a lot longer. I think the reason why they say that historically is because it's very important to have championship fights on pay-per-views, right? And so if someone has two belts, you're now essentially eliminating one of those slots. But I also think there's value in a double champion who is active and and i know she she last fought in april this i don't know if that was necessarily her fault right um i think it's because there isn't a queue and so if that is the sentiment just wait until

after the fight to make that decision because you want it to be champion versus champion and then for a moment if she wins you want her to be a double champion and at you know dc got to do it dc got to do it and look there's just not a lot of options right now it's just 115 also virna and and mckenzie but mckenzie needs to win a couple more to be in that conversation the other part of it is they're just not booking a lot of women's fights in general. I'm fairly confident if Zhang wanted to, she could defend both belts the same way Amanda Nunes did. I'm fairly confident she wouldn't have much trouble bouncing. That's my point. 100%.

100%. And I don't think she should have to. Basically, what I'm saying is I don't think she should have to choose. I think she can compete for the 125-pound title, keep the 115, and defend each as challengers arise. I don't think it'd be any problem. What do you do with Mano Furo? Like, I think Dean was wrong. I don't think Mano is the reason why this fight doesn't happen.

Remember, we can't forget, she won in March. Valentina had to fight Alexa to win the belt. Alexa was the champion this time last year. You forget. Not you guys, but in general. Yeah, yeah. And so she's not the holdup. She had to wait.

She waited. The fight happened in September. Valentina wins the belt. Valentina versus Manolo is actually a great fight. Fantastic fight. It's a great fight, a great style matchup. Two great strikers. Valentina showed tremendous grappling in her last fight.

But, I mean Champion versus champion Is champion versus champion I want to make very clear I'm not advocating For her to get skipped If anything I would love for that fight

To happen Relatively soon Even if it's Montreal By the way That's still in three months And then Are we looking Just risking

Losing Yeah you're risking That's right That's right This is a tough one man This is a tough one, man. This is a tough one. Zhang versus Firo does not carry the same weight as Zhang versus Val. Do you think if they gave Manon a step aside money, she takes it?

No, I don't. But also, I'll be honest, while I'm not as compelled in a fight perspective with Zhang versus Manon as I am as Zhang versus Valentina because I think those are the two top pound for pound. I was out of the room. I don't know if we discussed the pound for pound. I think those are the two top pound for pound women in the world

right now. I am compelled by the idea of Zhang getting a title shot regardless. I am compelled by the idea, even if it is Manon. Go for double champ status. But what you just said. One and two. An all-time great

pound-for-pound one versus pound-for-pound two, going for double champ status. You don't get these opportunities that often. She's defended against pretty much everyone in the division

that is a title contender. There's Vierna, but is it that warranted? I know she's won four in a row but it's not like this like it's almost it's it's almost like it's not like manon like manon has this clear yeah stake at the title so the only thing i'll push back against is like we just saw yan shan on in a very close fight against zhang weili like zhang weili not all of her performances are blowing people's doors off like i know look don't i have a you know we we had the uncrowned rankings i have her number one pound for pound

but i don't think it's like uh she can't have competitive fights at strawweight i think there's plenty and yan shanan showed that um but i do believe that this is the toughest challenge for her and would be the best fight um I'm compelled by her chasing a second title no matter who it is. This would be number one pound for pound and number two pound for pound, I think by most people's estimation, and also possibly the best strawweight ever versus the best flyweight ever, which I think Valentina has kind of like already secured. I think the arguments there for Zhang, I could hear other arguments against. I'd probably say she's the best at this point. There's a lot of legacy

at play there if you can make that fight. If certain things fall in certain ways, the UFC could in a period where people might be down on women's MMA for whatever reason, you can be looking at a year 2025 where you potentially get Zhang Weili versus Valentina Shevchenko

and Amanda Nunes returning against either Kayla versus or the winner of the Juliana fight. Kayla versus Amanda is gigantic. Juliana versus Amanda. Amanda coming back is gigantic. Kind of wild, right? What if we did Pena

versus Kayla in Montreal instead of Val Manone and then we do Jean Valentina International Fight Week and then we get Amanda Nunez versus the winner of Kayla Peña in the fall I mean I fucks with it I thought you were going to say

Manone versus Valentina in Miami I would have given I just go back to how good Manone Fierro is you are just risking that monster fight. Okay, so when they clip this off, it's not me saying this, okay? Because they got mad at me when I brought up something to Valentina, the coach, her husband, her boyfriend, whoever he is.

You know, they were in studio. They were lovely people. I was like, yo, man, I was just asking questions. I'm not advocating. So I want to make this very clear. They're incredible. She is an incredible fighter. Like, I know Ball. I beast i'm a i'm a big fan of monofiro but the opportunity you have in front of you to make pound for pound one versus two

double potential double champ status a fight with massive legacy implications one that would break through to the casual fan you just gotta you gotta capitalize on it while you have it uh two last quick things um number one i i do see sometimes people like to say that i there are certain fighters i don't like and that i say things about people based on who comes on the show and who doesn't let me perhaps for the final time well i don't really talk about it on this show, but like put this to bed at how ludicrous this is. Sean Strickland, nor Drikus Duplessis come on the show. And so any sort of criticism

that I've had towards Sean, which way smarter people in the sport have said way more over the last 48 hours about that fight, to imply that I'm saying that because he doesn't come on the show, Drikus doesn't come on the show anymore For whatever reason

I still don't understand why Because he's come on the show since we had our little Tiff and his coach went after me And all that stuff And so who cares There's nothing to gain by Doing any of that nonsense I don't do that

I couldn't care less We try to keep it real We try to tell it like it is. And, and overall, like I said, I thought the, the, the card kind of exceeded my expectations mainly because of the Zhang Weili, but I wasn't, I wasn't like falling asleep in the main event. It just, it was Drik is doing his thing and Sean not doing his thing, but I didn't have high expectations for that fight. All to all to say most importantly that that's not the way i do business i think a lot of you are projecting when you say these things i don't know how many more times i could uh i could i could kind of like bust this theory but this is the

perfect one to do it on neither guy comes on so like i see i see this one dude saying your boy ddp is going to take an l to hamza My boy DDP, he doesn't come on the show. Hamza don't come on the show. Strickland don't come on the show. What are you talking about? None of them come on the fucking show. So it doesn't, that's not the way it is, but there's plenty of other people who do like the champion Zhang Weili. And so this is nonsensical and you all sound very stupid when you say these sorts of things because you don't look at the history and who does and doesn't come on the show. Now, most importantly, before we go, would be remiss, and it's a shame to bring it up now, and I'd like to talk more about it throughout the week, maybe on On the Nose.

Dominic Cruz retired since the last time we spoke, and I will admit, when I saw it come through, when I saw his post, when I saw how he looked, I got emotional. I really did. I really did get emotional. And I've said it time and again, it's those guys that were there when I kind of broke in that you form bonds with, that you form relationships with, that you've stayed in contact with all these years. I'm talking 2008, 2009, that's 16, 17 years ago now. I mean, we're all getting very old. And Dom was one of those guys who always kept it real, who we saw get his heart broken. The fact that he's the last man standing from that era,

the fact that he outlasted all those guys despite the injuries, and he's turned into such a great analyst as well, is nothing short of amazing. And I hate the fact and i understand i heard dc talk about on the broadcast that it was sort of like poetic justice i hate the fact i wanted him to go out with a fight i wanted him to walk out of the cage i wanted him to get that one last moment i don't know if he beats you know rob font on february 22nd if he stays in the fight

but i just freaking i i just really wanted that for him i wanted him to go out on his own terms but he's the most you know matter of fact guy in the business he's the most you know call down the middle guy and and and he would say you know them's the breaks shit happens we move on with our lives but dominic cruz forever one of the greats forever one of the greats, forever one of the best bantamweights, one of the best champions, a trailblazer, a pioneer. He was the guy that ushered in the bantamweight era into the UFC, went from WC to UFC, was the face of the bantamweight division, and I still think till this day one of the greatest bantamweight champions of all time, and will go down forever and ever as one of the greats. You cannot talk about that division and not think about dominic cruz and just a special character

a one-of-one character i'll never forget after the ultimate fighter live he's coaching with uriah faber and and there's the knee injury and we do the interview it was after the ayakwinta kiesa fights we went to, it wasn't the Apex. It was just kind of like where they filmed the Ultimate Fighter. And I remember the interview that I did with him. And I asked him a question. And he's like, how do you think I should feel, Ariel? And I thought he was going to bite my head off.

And I was just asking a question for him to speak. But he just like, he didn't sugarcoat things. He didn't, he made you uncomfortable at times. We've had some uncomfortable conversations but we've had real conversations and i'm not going to say that i'm going to miss them because he's still going to be around the sport obviously we talked about this a couple of weeks ago but i'll miss watching him fight because he was an innovator he was an absolute innovator switching stances the movement um you know the the changing of levels the movement of

his head like all that was very unique and then t TJ adapted it and we've seen other people do the same, but he was the first to do that. He was the first to have that kind of style. And it was so successful and it was so much fun. And again, I can't speak about him without speaking about the two moments that will stay with me until I'm dead. He beats TJ Dillashaw. We're in Boston.

I asked him if it's the greatest moment of his life. And he says, no, the greatest moment of my life was when I realized I didn't need this belt to be happy. And that is without a doubt, one of the most profound things that any fighter has ever said to me ever, because they all chase the belt because the belt to them means happiness. The belt means that they did it. And here's a guy who got the belt and in that moment says, I didn't need this to be happy. I just wanted to do it. Fucking incredible. Love it. And I will never forget that. I'll never forget the chills that washed over my body when he said it, because I all thought, I mean, we all thought he was going

to say, of course, this is the happiest moment. I made it. I had to work three years to get back here, and I just beat the champion. Of course. No, the greatest moment was when he realized he didn't need the belt. And then, of course, not that long after, he fights Cody Garbrandt in an incredible performance from Cody, one of the all-time great performances by a challenger in a title fight. And he stands up in the press conference. And I was lucky enough to ask him, why are you standing?

He said, I'm always going to be standing. I'm always going to be on my feet, and that was profound as a guy who had multiple ACL surgeries standing up there, taking it like a man, and just dropping wisdom on us after a devastating title fight, a title fight that he was never really in. It was fairly one-sided, and at times, Cody's clowning on him.

He's doing the robot on him in the cage, and it got bitter beforehand. There was a rivalry, alpha male, all this stuff, and he stands up there in his suit and shades and answers all the questions like a G. So I will miss Dom. I got emotional thinking about him and his career and hated to see him go out that way, but know that we'll be hearing from him and seeing much more of him for many, many, many years to come. So just wanted to congratulate him on an incredible career.

We'd love to talk to him at some point when the time is right about closing this chapter and moving on. Super chats before we go. Can I just add one thing about Dominic Cruz? What I find so incredible about him, and it's pretty unique to him, maybe it applies also to BJ Penn, who you mentioned earlier with Dean. But, like, he could have been the biggest what if, right? Like, because of how many injuries there were, because of the layoffs, because of these things. But he achieved so much even in spite of that, right? Like because of how many injuries there were because of the layoffs, because of these things, but he achieved so much even in spite of that, right? He's, he's such a, a distinct

and kind of unique character in the sense that like, he is pretty much considered the bantamweight goat. There are many kind of making, you know, claims for it and pushing toward it. And, and, you know, that the conversation could be had, but he's up there in that Pantheon. Imagine what he could have done, you know, if, if his body had held up and all those things, but you don't need the fantasy scenario. You don't need the kind of like what if scenario, because he had achieved so much to that point already and was such a unique, uh, fighter, such a, an innovator, as you've said, and an incredible, uh, interview and somebody who always gave, uh, his perspective unfiltered in a way that

many don't. It's an incredible achievement to what he was able to do, even in spite of kind of that what if nature of his career, he became the GOAT or one of the GOATs. Completely unique, your words nailed it. And the resume is unique in itself. He makes his WC debut against Uriah Faber For the belt And that's where the feud starts Where Faber draws his Does a signature on his face When they're signing the posters

Loses that fight Comes back, fights 2008, 2009, 2009, 2009 He goes on an incredible run His win over Brian Bowles to win the belt, unbelievable, in Columbus. Beats Joseph Benavidez, beats Scott Jorgensen. That's the last WC fight.

And then fights Faber in the first bantamweight title fight in the UFC. Wins that fight. Three months later, fights DJ in Washington on versus. Remember it very well, the suplex, all that stuff. And then doesn't fight again for three years. October 1st, 2011, September 27th, 2014. By the way, UFC 178, the card we were talking about, starches Takemi Izugaki in just 61 seconds. Gets the title shot against TJ, beats him. Gets the fight against Uriah, beats him.

And then, of course, the Cody. Fought three times in 2016. After being out for three years. After the Cody loss, didn't fight for almost four years. Had a stretch of three years and four years where he didn't fight. And since 2020, of course, he came back and fought Henry Cejudo. That was the return fight. He's fought consistently 2020, 2021, 2021. And then the last fight was Marlon Veracito in 2022. So it's been a year and a half or so since he last fought, but nothing left to prove. One of one, unoriginal, a pioneer, a trailblazer,

a legend. Hall of Famer, if you ask me. What do we got, Frank? So ZZ Biggs asks, who will be main event in Montreal UFC 315? I will be a thousand percent honest. I have not asked. Believe it or not, I haven't looked into it. I feel like

it's got Shavkat versus Bilal written all over it for a couple of reasons. Number one, if you just look at the rankings, is Pantoja going to fight in Montreal? I mean, DJ fought Horiguchi in Montreal. That didn't go very well, but would seem weird. Don't know where the June... Well, actually, I do know where the June pay-per-view is. Actually, there's two in June, so we'll see. Marab, is he going to fight in Montreal? Probably not. Featherweight Teporia, I think he should fight in Miami. Islam, not fighting. I think Bilal would make

a lot of sense there. Not for nothing. Huge Muslim population. Oh, well, there you go. I didn't even know that. There's Bilal doing the eye emoji. Yeah, huge Muslim population in Montreal. It would make a lot of sense. He would get a lot of love. And that's my pick. But I haven't looked into it. We going up? We going up to the old hometown, to the stomping ground,

getting some orange juleps? Oh, yeah. Dovkov fight? Julep. You just had that ready. Damn right. I keep it hanging right here. Is it orange julep? It's julep, just had that ready damn right i keep it hanging right here is it is it orange julep

it's julep yeah yeah i don't know why earlier i said orange julius oh there is orange julius but that's like a chain yeah orange julep is one we all crash at the helwanis i'm just really i'm just really curious to know how the tickets will look like last time i i i said it was awful but i think the sport is in a much better place. So I think they sell it out regardless. But yes, you're all invited. I would love to go to Montreal for a ball fight. I mean, it's an easy drive up. Yeah, it's like six hours.

I got the passport ready to go. What else, Frank? Yeah, Jason Corning wants to remind us that Rose is still goaded. She won 2-0 versus... That is true. Man, people need to put some damn respect on Rose's name. There's a lot of disrespect towards Rose. I mean, you guys are out there trying to trade her.

It's crazy. I believe that was you. Nah. Trade her. Oh, to PFL. Yeah, not to GFL. I believe that was you. Yeah, I was just trying to...

You were trying to do that. What else, Frank? The Casuals MMA writes, Hey. Thanks for the shout-out during the Dean Thomas interview. We'd love to have you guys on as guests on the pod when you're on the West Coast. Hawani, Eric, Connor. This is written by Gilbert.

Wow, 1999 from the Casuals. By the way, I was impressed. You know what was fun? Good setup, good vibe, good questions. They had Wade on there. You know, one thing I like to do when I have someone in studio In particular I like to see if they've done anything recently You know you listen to it in the car

When you're not getting into accidents You're listening to it When you're walking your dog When you're on the Averon bike It's just a good way to get ready for the interview And he was on there Recently and I enjoyed the vibe i enjoyed the show keep it up but actually my takeaway was like they're not actually casuals like they know their

shit and so is that is that the whole point i think that's i think it's probably a little tongue in cheek that they're casuals i don't think they're casuals okay gilbert go on just give him a follow um shout out well yeah, shout out. What else, Frank? That's the end of the barrel. Okay, and I do believe Rick has a shout out. Yeah, I've got one more thing. We started a contest ahead of the Helwani Nose Awards. The contest has been decided.

It was decided right after, but we have winners, and I think they deserve a mention on the show um but they have also the winner has received uh their package so i just want to be clear they've they've this has been settled they've received it but i wanted to give a shout out to three top performers uh in the contest as a reminder and hopefully we can bring this back shout out to andy for kind of pioneering this and suggesting we do it. Hopefully we can bring this back for next year's awards because quite a few of you entered, but three people deserve a special mention. First,

Ian Wadsworth from Manchester. Ian killed it. Absolutely smashed this contest. Wadsworth, shout out. Anthony D'Alessandro from Montreal. Shout out. We were just talking about Montreal. Did fantastic. Great predicting. As a reminder, it was to predict

Ariel's picks for the awards. These people did quite well. And then lastly, our boy Cooper Musser from Brentwood, California. Shout out to those three. They killed it in the contest. Hope all of you enter next year when we do something similar. Dun dun dun.

They not like us. They not like us. So now you're in. You're on the train. No, I'm just saying those guys are not like us. They're good. They not like us So now you're in you're on the train No I'm just saying those guys are not like us They're good they nailed it Such a good song Oh so you love it now Oh guys guys did you see like when he did the flag Like it was just so high level

Like you just have to be so smart to get it Like it was just like I've seen like breakdowns Of like frame by frame It's just so high level It's just so high level It's no It's no like smoking It's just so high level Hoodie But

It's just It's just so smart Samuel L. Jackson Who's that? This is This is just Who Uncle Sam? Those fighting words

It's just so high level Was it Was that Was that actually Serena? What a What a weird corner Everyone at my Super Bowl party Was like That wasn't Serena I'm like That was a thousand actually Serena? What a weird corner Everyone at my Super Bowl party was like That wasn't Serena

I'm like that was a thousand percent Serena They're like no, no it wasn't That wasn't her Nah she was dancing Rick what did you say? What a weird what? What a weird hill to die on? Corner yeah basically

What a weird corner to be on Because I think it's all It's all sanctimonious stuff It's like oh Whomever's at the top You gotta try to take that to tear that guy down. And by the way, now- You did a good job.

The funny thing is that now I see people hating on Kendrick. I actually thought it was totally fine, if I'm being 1,000% honest. But you see everyone be like, oh, look at him. He folded. Oh, the momentum. Do you understand? All this is satire. Was there any-

The whole thing that I said here is satire. Has there ever been a universally loved halftime show? Yeah. Which one? I think Prince did really good. Yeah, the Prince one did go over pretty well. Oh, well, I hate it. Justin Timberlake and Janet Jackson.

The one. No, that one was like Janet Jackson. Shout out. Creed won with the guy with the wings who came down. No, that was Thanksgiving. Creed? They ain't doing no halftime show. No, that was Thanksgiving.

By the way, by the way, M&M. M&M and Trey. Didn't everyone love that? I feel like that was universal. 50 Cent hanging upside down? The weekend when he couldn't get out of the tunnel? Did everybody like Usher or no? And left shirt.

No, I hated Usher. Was it right shirt or left shirt? I'm just kidding. Well, what about Michael Jackson? I didn't see it, so I couldn't love it. U2. U2 I remember people loved in 2002 after 9-11. Did Coldplay ever do it?

Yeah, Coldplay did it. I love that one. Rune 5 did a good job. Coldplay, Beyonce, and Bruno Mars in 2016. Yeah, shout out. You have a recollection of this? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't.

According, by the way. Bruno Mars, man, still doing it. Got a hot single right now, APT. According, like old? I feel like, of course, he's yeah, yeah. I don't. According, by the way. Bruno Mars, man, still doing it. Got a hot single right now, APT. According, like old? I feel like, of course, he's still doing it. Apparently 40. According to billboard.com, number one is Prince, 2007. Number two is U2, 2002.

Number three is Drain, friends, 2022. How are they ranking it? They're just saying like their picks? How is this being selected? It's all blurb. I ain't reading. I'm just giving you something. Beyonce, 2013. Friends, 2022. How are they ranking it? They're just saying like their picks? Nah, it's all blurb. I ain't reading it. I'm just giving you something. Beyonce, 2013.

Oh, Beyonce. Bruce Springsteen in 2009. Oh, yeah, I remember that. Vaguely. Born to Run. Madonna in 2012. Oh, I remember that. I remember that.

Yeah, there were a lot of washed allegations going on around there. Lady Gaga, 2017. Oh, yeah, when she jumped from- MJ in 93. I don't remember any of them. Stone in 06. Except for- MJ in 93. MJ don't remember any of them. Stone's in 06. Except for-

MJ in 93. Shout out. Paul McCartney in 05. I mean, we've come a long way. Paul McCartney, Kendrick Lamar. I mean, golly, 20 years. A lot has changed. Rihanna, 2023.

Oh, I remember Rihanna. Rihanna was good. Great. It was great. I listened to Rihanna for a while after that. Katy Perry, 2015. I don't feel like she was loved. I liked that one out of my-

The shark. Yes, the shark like she was loved. I liked that one out of my... The shark. Yes, the shark is in the picture. Holy shit. Okay, but I remember the shark more than the performance. That's the problem. Janet and Timberlake. Were they together

or was it a cameo? No, no. No, I know they were together. Cameo by Janet Jackson, I think. No, no. Wasn't Janet the performer? Oh, cameo by Timberlake. Yeah, that was weird.

That was a weird... And then number 14 is Coldplay, Beyonce, and Bruno Mars. So you think... Hendrick number one. You think K-Dot is number 15 now? No, number one. Yeah, right. Honestly.

Honestly. You really think that was number one? Stop it. I don't know. You're doing the same shit. I'm the wrong guy. I'm the wrong guy. When you were watching that, you said, oh, it's so smart.

You see that? Like how they're moving? I don't know. Is that a narrative? Where is this narrative? Oh, yeah, yeah. People are saying it's like too elevated. Oh, he did it.

Like it's just so high level. I thought it was pretty not elevated. I thought it was pretty like. Subliminal stuff. Right, Frank? Were they not? I know what you're talking about. But what was subliminal?

Who is that? Even having Serena there was like, oh. He called him out by name. It wasn't very subliminal. He said, say Drake. And then he said it. He looked down he said it Smiled directly at the camera That's not subliminal That's like straight to your face

A lowercase a Yeah what was that A minor See the subliminals You didn't get it You didn't get it No wonder you didn't get the American League. By the way, my kids actually said to me, why is there a lowercase a?

And I was like, I don't know. I'm not hippopotamus. It's too high level for you, man. You wouldn't get it. No wonder you hated it. You know what? You know why? You don't even know Samuel L. Jackson?

Of course I know Samuel L. Jackson. You know why it's not the greatest diss track of all time? Because Hit Em Up was so intense and vulgar that no one can even fathom having it at the Super Bowl. That tells you, if it's good enough to be at the Super Bowl, if it's PG enough, then it's not good enough.

You always go Hit Em Up, but your guy Drake has a really solid diss track in back-to-back and everything. The Deke Mill War of 2016 was... Hit Em Up is number one. A really solid diss track And back to back And everything No no no Drake The big mill war Of 2016 was Hit em up is number one Didn't get em to the Superbowl

Undisputed Undefeated Yeah you think Tupac's Showing up doing No I'm saying Drake Drake had some diss tracks Didn't get em to the Superbowl Yeah that's crazy

That is crazy But That's Kendrick That's all good Grammys Won some Grammys Yeah listen I mean

You know what else You want a Grammy Pandering Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah Jordan did a deep dive On the lyrics earlier He actually

Has the song memorized now Oh okay Hit us Acapella I feel like it's Ack no Yeah well done Oh wow

I can tell you that Tomorrow's show Is pretty stacked guys Yeah what What what I'm waiting for the Stacked line Oh okay Sorry. I can tell you that tomorrow's show is pretty stacked, guys. Yeah, what, what, what? I'm waiting for the stacked line. Oh, okay. Sorry, sorry. I thought there was another trade or something.

Blew the doors off with this one. Let's see what we got. Tomorrow on the program, we're going to be joined by Eric McGracken, the great lawyer. Ah, fuck. I screwed this up. It's either lawyer or attorney. No, lawyer is Canadian. He lives in Canada, but he's a dual citizen.

Anyway, he has been one of the leading voices as far as the antitrust lawsuit is concerned. You know, they settled it. The payments are coming, but there's a lot of intel. A lot of fighters hit me up about things. And quite frankly, I'm not smart enough. You know, I don't understand what Kendrick is putting out there.

And I ain't knowing how you're getting your money. But this guy does know. And so we'll talk about that. I'm looking forward to that conversation. In addition to that, we are going to be joined by Eric Nixick, who is in the corner of one, Sean Strickland. So we'll get a lowdown as to what happens in the corner when you're just not vibing with your guy and where he goes from here. We'll also be joined by WWE Hall of Famer Bubba Ray,

a.k.a. Bully Ray. Never had him on the program. Looking forward to that conversation. And if that wasn't enough for you, the great KSI is going to join us as well. Have you heard March 29th, he's fighting Dylan Dennis in Manchester. So we've got a lot coming your way tomorrow on a Tuesday.

We hope to see you there. That's the poster. It's time to go. Let's go. Frank, did you see at the 3 minute and 49 second mark of his performance, when he looked to the left, what he was trying to say. You were supposed to look at the right camera. It does a weird thing.

Did you guys see how many people got out of that tiny car? Yeah, that was weird too. That was suspect. I don't get what's happening. It was an homage to the... No, and speaking of homages, he was wearing bell-bottoms because he was trying to say that in the 70s that's when we were at our best you see and and because he's born in the 70s it was an homage

to the time in which he was born see a lot of people didn't didn't make up yes got it and clowned him for his uh bell bottoms all the women at the Bowl party I was at loved the pants. Diaz, by the way, you can't spell Nate Diaz without L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y. And Drake has been on the record multiple times saying Nate Diaz is his favorite fighter. You know this, right? Even though Kendrick is from Cali. That's what... See, unlike that

that turncoat, DeMar DeRozan. Is that a song by Kendrick Jordan? Oh, okay. I think he actually played it last night. DeMar DeRozan turned on Canada. Literally played a song. How about LeBron?

LeBron turned on Canada. See, I can't do it. I know it's hip, but you know what? That's who I am. That's the kind of guy that I am. I'm a foxhole guy, all right? You don't have to turn on him to just acknowledge the league. No, no. I know it's hip, but you know what? That's who I am. That's the kind of guy that I am. I'm a foxhole guy, all right? You don't have to turn on him to just acknowledge the week. No, no.

I still like Drake. Appreciate all the guests today. What a show. What a day. Luke Rockhold, Rory, Dean, Jean-Guy Lee. Back tomorrow. Same time, same place. Peace.

I'm out of here.