The Aspiring Psychologist Podcast - Reflective Growth Across a Psychology Career - Trainee Clinical Psychologist

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hi there, it's Marianne here. Before we dive into today's episode, I want to quickly let you know about something exciting that's happening right now. If you've ever wondered how to create income that works for you, rather than constantly trading your time for money, then you'll love the Race to Recurring Revenue Challenge with my business mentor, Lisa Johnson. This challenge is designed to help you build sustainable income streams. And whether you're an aspiring psychologist, a mental health professional, or in a completely different field,

Starting point is 00:00:32 the principles can work for you. There are also wonderful prizes to be won directly by Lisa herself. And if you join the challenge by my link, you can be in with a chance of winning a one-to-one hours coaching with me, Dr. Marianne Trent. Do you want to know more? Of course you do. Head to my link tree, Dr. Marianne Trent, or check out my social media channels, or send me a quick DM and I'll get you all the details. Right, let's get on with today's episode. Coming up today, get ready to dive into the roller coaster ride of a third year trainee

Starting point is 00:01:06 clinical psychologist's journey. We're about to spill the beans on personal and professional growth. And trust me, it's anything but boring. Whether you're into self discovery, figuring out your own career chaos, or just love a good story of transformation, then this episode is for you. We are peeling back the layers of the ups and downs of a psychology career and exploring how we all go through some pretty significant changes and growth as a result. Hit play, grab a cuppa and let's get real about the messy, beautiful evolution we call life as a psychologist. Hope you find it so useful. Hi, welcome along to the Aspiring Psychologist podcast. I am Dr. Marianne Trent and I'm a

Starting point is 00:01:56 qualified clinical psychologist. So I am joined today by Phil and yeah, I think you're going to find it a really interesting episode. I found it such a privilege to speak with him. So I will catch you on the other side. Just want to welcome Phil Pamperlove to the podcast today. Welcome along, Phil. Hi, Marianne, and thanks for having me. Oh, thanks for saying yes. I reached out to you via LinkedIn because I saw your research. So you are a trainee clinical psychologist and we will come on to what that's been like for you. But you are currently doing your research kind of recruitment drive, I think. Is that fair to say you're still in that cycle currently?

Starting point is 00:02:37 Definitely. Yeah, lovely. So could you tell us before we kind of get into all of that, could you tell us a little bit about yourself and how you got into psychology? Yeah, gosh, where do I begin? So basically, I when I was at school, I didn't really know, you know, like many, many children exactly what I wanted to do at the very start. I know some people are like, I want to be a nurse when I grow up. I wasn't quite like that. And also bearing in mind that I grew up in

Starting point is 00:03:05 Bulgaria, that's where I went to school. So I think that's kind of that cultural difference is important as well. So I remember going through a period in secondary school where I was thinking, I want to be a film director, I want to be a teacher, I want to be this and that. And I didn't fully kind of know really what I wanted to do. Yeah, it was definitely my teenage years where I kind of started thinking about it a bit more fully and thinking, who, you know, who am I? What's important to me? Where do I see myself? I knew that I wanted to work with people and also knew I wanted to help people to kind of help understand themselves. And obviously, again, that's not, you know, that's still such a broad thing to think about. But I remember saying to myself, you know, psychology is such a big field,

Starting point is 00:03:42 you know, and this is where you do work a lot with people not in like a very kind of corporate but in the more sorts of you know empathetic way so I thought to myself you know let me do a psychology degree and see what you know where exactly that's going to take me because psychology in itself is so so vast as a discipline so I did my undergraduate degree between 2011 2014 in the UK during the first year again I kind of found myself in that place where I was like I don't know what I want to do like again I knew I wanted to work with people but didn't know exactly where within psychology to sort of go and I think it was during the second year maybe where I was sort of thinking around the clinical psychology route in particular and thinking to myself you know I remember reading the description of what a clinical

Starting point is 00:04:29 psychologist does and I was like this is literally me in a nutshell this is quintessentially me because you've got everything in there that I really you know love I'm someone who enjoys kind of doing different things if I do the exact same thing every day in, day out, I know that that's not going to sit well with me. And I really loved all these different facets of psychology in terms of working with clients, but also with teams, working kind of on a broader level in terms of service development, working collaboratively, doing research, leadership things as well.

Starting point is 00:05:03 So it was working with different models and learning about all of these models all of that was just like yes yes and yes yeah and then at the end of the third year i was thinking to myself do you know what i know i'm not going to get on as soon as i apply after an undergraduate degree but let me see what that's like so i remember like going through the application process to sort of see what that's like i didn't even even submit it. I just sort of wanted to see what kind of questions might come up. And the year after that, I did a master's in foundations of clinical psychology, which was, yeah, it was one year, but within that one year, I feel like a lot of things happened very quickly in a short span of time, because I managed to find a bit like a placement where one day a

Starting point is 00:05:46 week I was a voluntary and honorary assistant psychologist in a local service and then the rest of the week was sort of lectures and study time and during that time I was also a voluntary research assistant so I was kind of involved in clinical stuff and research stuff and then doing my studies alongside and again I thought to myself, this is exactly where I want to be heading. And yeah, after I did my master's, I was really lucky to kind of get a paid position within that service where I was on placements. And I was also working part-time as a support worker

Starting point is 00:06:16 with services with autism and or intellectual disabilities. And I was kind of juggling the two. And then later on, I got another part-time assistant psychologist post and then they kind of juggling the two and then later on I got a another part-time assistant psychologist post and then they kind of complemented each other and I was split two and a half and two and a half days and again I was really looking back I think like I was really lucky to kind of land both of these knowing how much of a gold dust sort of thing they are now but they were two very different services two very different teams and I really learned a lot from them and I do miss you know the people I work I remember you know every colleague

Starting point is 00:06:52 and every patient I've worked with very very well and then I remember applying for the doctorate probably four years I'm trying to remember how many years it's been and you know I definitely had moments when I was thinking to myself gosh is it worth it you know this is really draining this is a really hard process and then I would go you know when I was sort of when I had no's basically for one or two or three years or whatever and I was like hmm you know let me re-evaluate you know where I wanted to be I knew this is where I wanted to be heading so reviewed my whole application I completely changed my sort of personal statements in there yeah and then I managed to get a couple of

Starting point is 00:07:31 interviews and even though I wasn't successful after those interviews that I was like yes I'm on the right track with this you know something's different and they were really good learning experience in themselves and then lo and behold in 2021 I managed to to get an interview at a university I really really wanted and I was yeah I was so so chuffed with myself my family and friends again they were like you really really deserve this and it was definitely a very memorable moment for me that phone call that I got so that was a big waffle there Marianne it wasn't a waffle it was wonderful I could listen to you speak for hours I think Phil I'll just zip my mouth you're like really really interesting to listen to and you know I'm always struck as I'm

Starting point is 00:08:16 as I'm also struck by my own story as well of just this perseverance and this determination and I was listening to you speak and I was thinking gosh moving off to a whole new country like where you don't know anyone that's such a big deal and then I thought oh yeah you you did do that too mine was Wales but it was still three and a half hours away you know it's it's a big thing we do you know yours was obviously a whole different culture it's not just England to Wales but we do move around a lot for our passions don't we did you always know that you would want to come to UK and do your professional qualification in the UK would that have been an option to stay in Bulgaria or was that just not what you wanted

Starting point is 00:09:02 yeah good question and I think it's a very complex and nuanced question because yes I did I did have the the option to you know to to go to Bulgaria and stay there and complete my studies there but I just didn't really feel that that was where I really wanted to sort of thrive and even now like nothing's stopping me you know after I finished my studies to go to Bulgaria and practice there if I wanted to but I just I feel like yeah there's something about the cultural mentality as well where you know at that time when I was applying for university I had friends who were already in the UK and saying really positive things about it and I just yeah I remember being going through a period in secondary school where I was like really interested

Starting point is 00:09:43 in the UK and the British mentality. And I was like, yeah, I could see myself sort of in there. I felt like, yeah, in Bulgaria, certain things are kind of moving a bit slower than the West. And I think that's understandable considering what some of the values and beliefs in there are. So, for example, I'm the oldest of my siblings and being the only male for my siblings I've kind of reflected on that as well what that's meant in terms of having those expectations on me to sort of perform well to know a lot of stuff to kind of lead the way to be that Pathfinder you know like in the snow where you sort of you've got some really thick snow and

Starting point is 00:10:24 you sort of wondering where to go and you see that someone's already gone through that snow I kind of felt like I've been the person who's done that but yeah as you said it wasn't easy you know moving in itself for anyone whether it's from Wales or Bulgaria or wherever I was 18 at the time when I first started my undergrad and there were so many things I had to get you know to get used to, things I wouldn't even think about, like how to set up a bank account or a contract for your phone in another country.

Starting point is 00:10:54 They became actually really big things because now I'm the one responsible for doing this. I'm creating this independence, but it's not an easy step to take. So going back to your question yes I did have the option for that but I think I wasn't sort of ready for that I don't think it felt kind of right and the thing is that I've got a lot of family and friends in Bulgaria who I do visit at least once a year and it's it's kind of difficult because yeah I can't sort of they don't live

Starting point is 00:11:23 around the corner and I can't go and visit them as often as I'd like to. But I do feel sort of sometimes sad for the people who are still in Bulgaria who have to deal with lots of kind of political turmoil. And, you know, it's one of the poorest EU countries as well. So it often gets portrayed that way. You hear lots of narratives about Bulgaria that way. And I want to show another side to Bulgaria as well so I've often reflected on that on my course as well what it means for me to be someone who's got dual nationalities a Bulgarian and a British person. Yeah absolutely and when we look at the diversity of your cohort this year like the one that you're in how is that faring in terms of gender in terms of

Starting point is 00:12:06 background in terms of diversity how many are on your cohort and what's that looking for like for you at the moment yeah so I'm in my final final year I'm in my third year now on my course and I think yeah compared to other cohorts and maybe other courses as well, I think we are a fairly diverse cohort. Again, I think overall within the whole country, there's still that kind of the, you know, there's not as much diversity as we want to, but I think we are kind of getting there. So for example, we are at the moment we're 28.

Starting point is 00:12:43 We did start with a few more people. We had a few mums on our cohort who've given birth. So we have six males, including myself, out of 28. So again, that's, you can see what the gender ratio is there, but it's still better than like one or two or none, none at all and I think for me that's quite important being a male sort of I've actually thought about that what is it for male trainees not just where I am but in other courses as well to be in such an environment and to be with predominantly sort of female cohorts it's yeah it's I'm not sure how voiced or unvoiced it has been, but I've definitely sort of thought about that. Yeah. My cohort was really, really small. Mine was 15.

Starting point is 00:13:32 And of those, there was three men. But I loved the male opinion, you know, and just the male dynamic as well that stopped it being a group of 15 women. I really valued that. And when you kind of got to do role play with the the men versus the women young women whatever we were whatever people identify as um I just really valued it yeah I think there's so much to learn from each other regardless of our background regardless of our gender regardless of our culture like I just love how you come together as a cohort and you know like when we're learning about group you know that forming storming norming performing I love

Starting point is 00:14:11 I love being part of that but I also love hearing other people's stories about how that develops and hopefully you want to still see some of them or maybe even all of them by the time you graduate you know that's the hope that actually it's been it's been a enriching nourishing experience rather than one where you just like I can't wait to not see you again ever hopefully not yeah I'm just thinking to myself what it would have been like for me to be in a cohort of 15 people. Because, yeah, obviously, with recent years, there's been a lot more funding for places. And I'm thinking the group dynamics could change as a result as well. So, yeah, now, as you're saying that, I'm sort of thinking, I wonder what it would have been like if it was the same amount of men, like six, but in a group of 15.

Starting point is 00:15:04 Would that have sort of changed things I find it you know at the time one of my friends was in a cohort of 40 whilst I was in 15 because of course there have been bigger universities I loved it it meant that we all had like a common room that we hung out in and there was just enough room for us all to sit on these super comfy sofas and squash up together and we all tended to spend all of our break times not necessarily all of the lunch times because sometimes you go out into town but we all tended to spend all of our break times and probably most of our lunch times together as a group and it was really really nice for my purpose but I can speak for myself you know I loved it you know and we'd on a Friday after after our personal development group we'd tend to all as a standing

Starting point is 00:15:52 date all go to the pub when we finished um whether or not people drinking and then or driving or you know whatever we'd go and just kind of finish off the week spending time as a 15. And if one of us couldn't make it one day, it was a bit like, oh, no. It was really nice. Whereas I know if it had been any bigger than that, that would have made it tricky because you need a bigger room or you split up or you get like small clusters. And even within that group, there were obviously people that I was closer to than others. But I really liked it being that size but I guess it's just you you you learn what you experience don't you and you that becomes your norm so you know it's yeah it's different strokes for different folks but of course probably a smaller

Starting point is 00:16:36 course maybe appealed to me yeah yeah there's just so much to kind of think about yeah and I think it's kind of inevitable the bigger the group becomes, kind of the more likely it is to have these sort of smaller pockets of people. Yeah, and I think cohesion is a really important thing because you kind of feel like you're in this together. I remember one of our very first days when I started training, we were told, you know, up until this point, you've been competing to get here.

Starting point is 00:17:04 Now you're not competing with each other. You're working with each other. So it kind of made us feel, or at least made me feel, a bit less stressed about the whole thing, thinking, yes, I've made it. Let me, you know, form connections with these people because, you know, who knows where we're going to be when we all qualify. Absolutely. Absolutely. And there's a couple of things cropping up to me as you as you spoke there like the the image of you know during the pandemic there was that we're all in this together oh yeah it's like a really choppy sea but some people were in speed boats and some were in like little kind of leaking sieves and you know even within a cohort you might have that you're physically in the same place expected to do

Starting point is 00:17:45 the same job but you might well have very different resources and kind of differences in terms of your kind of diversity and the barriers and the oppression and you know your your kind of privilege and you know there's absolutely that within within there but I remember I don't know if you had anything like this maybe not maybe your ego is more robust than mine but looking out on my on my first day and like I'd always been like the psychologist in my friends you know oh ask Marianne or you know it's about mental health like you know ask Marianne whatever um and I really liked that you know so I'm not married to a psychologist and I don't know if I could be like I like being you know the psychologist and then looking out like all these 14 other people and thinking oh there's nothing special about me like I found that almost a little bit tricky to begin

Starting point is 00:18:38 with you know who am I if I am not like if I'm not the psychologist which sounds really narcissistic doesn't it but it was yeah like just being able to bring myself and help myself develop as a trainee clinical psychology alongside these people was almost part of the journey for me as well I think. No I think it's almost like an existential point that you reach in your adulthood where you're like thinking what sets me like apart like who's Phil basically what does who does Phil want to become and even as I've been going through the different placements and now I'm in my final placement for example I've kind of realized which therapy models are more aligned with or what kind of realized which therapy models are more aligned

Starting point is 00:19:25 with or what kind of populations I enjoy working with the types of services which is really handy when it comes to applying for jobs when you can kind of you know not apply for every single job you've seen but sort of really think about where you would be happy to work and yeah that's just an example of like something I've been thinking about throughout the whole three years you discover more about yourself about what you what you like what you don't like for example one of my values is that I really value being part of a team so seeing people face to face is important to me so I can't imagine myself working in a service where everything is online for example and I also really value connecting long-term connections with people

Starting point is 00:20:04 including with clients so you know i would struggle to sort of be in a setting where i'm only seeing a client for like a one-off sort of thing and then you know off you go so i've kind of been reflecting on that as well what does that mean for me why how come you know I've got these sorts of values? So we can go really deep here. But yeah, it's just, I like having these sort of self-reflective moments because you do start thinking, I'm a psychologist and all these other people are psychologists, but each one of us is bringing something different. That's the beauty of it, isn't it?

Starting point is 00:20:39 All of us are individual in that sense. Isn't it just? And that's what I love about clinical placements as well is you get the chance to enter someone else's world for six months you get to try everything on you know and you get to think which bits do I like which bits don't I like which will I keep you know which will I leave here and then never never ever return to again and sometimes you know you get that opportunity that people are like oh well we've got maybe a qualified band seven job coming up we'd love it if you consider coming back which is just like and then you're like well do I want

Starting point is 00:21:16 that and you know it's really really nice it's part yeah like you say it's part of training that you kind of get to figure that stuff out but when I qualified actually it was in a very different economic climate which maybe I hope we're not heading towards again because of the increased importance and highlighting about how important mental health is whereas in 2011 when I qualified they sort of decided to save money by axing places for mental health training which has probably contributed to some of the mental health training, which has probably contributed to some of the mental health crises we see, not just from psychology, but they did it across different disciplines as well. Even there was some dalliances with mental health nurse funding, wasn't there?

Starting point is 00:21:56 They made it that you had to use, it was no longer bursary. They were trying to save money everywhere. So when it came to us applying for jobs, we absolutely had the things that we would consider, this is a bit of me, but we were literally having to apply for everything. And I don't know how my career would have unfolded had I not had that. Because actually, my first qualified job was a 27 mile trip each way you know up the m6 like it was not my first choice and you know I wouldn't necessarily have considered myself a CAMHS clinician but found myself working in a team that just was so good they won awards for safety that it really helped me develop incredible foundations for qualified work they were compassionate they were kind they were lovely I did so much work with kind of diverse families and client groups and you know using interpreters and it was just what I needed but I didn't know I needed it you know so yeah I ended up working

Starting point is 00:23:08 there for almost four years as well but where I would have done you know I would not probably nobody would necessarily choose to do that commute because it was probably up to an hour and a half each way I was worse off when I qualified because I then had to pay council tax and I obviously got no travel funding so I was worse off as a qualified than I was as a band six trainee but I wouldn't swap it because it made me the clinician I am today and I really like really like the clinician I am and the stuff I do so that is a complete other aside but yeah like I hope you have an experience where you're delighted with your first qualified role, even though it might be one that on paper looks already a bit more like a bit of you than mine did. Yeah. Oh, thank you, Marianne. And so kind of heartwarming to hear about your first job,

Starting point is 00:23:59 because I think it'd be quite scary for third years, especially thinking, oh, gosh, like I need to actually start applying for jobs and go to a job interview yeah and you sort of finding that you really loved that that job and the people we were with you learn so much from it and I think that's probably where the placements have been really important for me for me personally on our course I feel like I've learned so much from them and I'm not sure how it was on your course but with us we sort of do two adult placements in the first year both around five six months long and then two five six months placements in the second year one with children

Starting point is 00:24:38 and young people the other one with people with intellectual disabilities and in the final year you do one longer placement around 10 months-ish long and you can kind of select your top three choices for which way you sort of want to be so the final decision isn't yours but you've got a lot more control and i managed to get my first choice for my third year and i was so over the moon and i've said to my partner like I didn't for a second like regret making that choice because I really feel like I'm learning so much I'm kind of heading in the direction I want to be heading it's not just trainee Phil but also future qualified hopefully Dr Phil by the end of the year so um yeah I think placements are a really big part where you

Starting point is 00:25:25 can start learning a lot I've dealt with a lot of things in my placements that I wouldn't have even dreamed of doing when I was an assistant psychologist absolutely and you do just end up having to walk because you find yourself to be there and you know I felt quite emotional as you spoke then like I felt I had the feels like it made me feel like I might have a little bit of a cry like what a privilege you know to to be able to have that level of personal and professional growth and get paid for it you know and I know if you're a counselling trainee you're listening to this thinking I don't get paid and I have to pay and there's such an inequity and I wish that could be changed but you know speaking as a qualified clin psych who got paid to train it you know not every day was easy of course it wasn't but just incredible and I still think I've got the best job

Starting point is 00:26:14 in the world like I love it I love it yeah same and you just kind of feel when it's right that you sort of like it's hard to verbalize it but you definitely at the end of the day when you come back and like yes it might have been a tough day but there's something about this that I really really love yeah absolutely is there anything else on this topic around kind of what we learn along the journey that that we haven't said or that you think might be useful that comes to you for that kind of podcast topic title yeah and i guess i'm kind of addressing this to anyone who might be watching this not necessarily trainees qualified you know could be aspiring at whatever stage you are really pause and think about who you

Starting point is 00:26:57 are because i remember one kind of teaching that we had is where the lecturer said to us you know imagine an animal you know pick an animal that you want to represent you as a or where you would like to see yourself as a clinical psychologist it was something along those lines and i remember i thought really really long for that and in the end i chose a chameleon and so each one of us kind of went we went around and we sort of each one of us spoke about why they chose that animal. And I said, well, I chose the chameleon because I feel like, in a sense, I want to be someone who is flexible and adapts well to different environments and, you know, different needs. But at the same time, at the very core, I'm still the same person. So I might change sort of the colors, but I'm still there.

Starting point is 00:27:44 The feel is still there. So I kind of want to incorporate that malleability and flexibility, but still stay true to what's important to me. And my partner drew a chameleon and gave it to me as a birthday gift later on. And I still have that. So every time I kind of see it, it sort of reminds me, yes, this chameleon is me. And I know why. Like, I understand why.

Starting point is 00:28:09 So really think about who you are and how other people would see you. I think that's such a nice reframe on a chameleon. Because for me, sometimes the term chameleon is almost lobbied about as a bit of an insult. Like, but I think you're right. Like, it's about survival, isn't it? It's about, you know, being a part of something and helping it. I don't know, helping what needs to happen, happen. But in a way that isn't putting all your own stuff and your own agenda onto what the process is I don't think I'm

Starting point is 00:28:47 explaining this very well but you know I get what you mean yeah it's not it's not an insult is it it's it's a real skill to be able to do that but of course to to remain like you said to still remain the same underneath but just to be able to it's an amazing survival strategy isn't it like it's amazing as a you know it makes me think about harry potter and his invisibility cloak like what would you get up to if you had one of those like yeah you know what can you do if you can just be yourself but know how to help others around you maximise everything that they're doing, you know? Yeah, and I totally get what you mean when you first say,

Starting point is 00:29:32 yeah, I wouldn't think about that. Because when I first thought about it, I was like, oh, but then people might think I'm like being a phony or like hypocrite or something and not really, you know, lying just to kind of please them or something. But I was like, no no I don't see it personally that way um the important thing is that bit about the core the core of you is always the same about you because if I'm always the same and like if I you know don't adapt to different

Starting point is 00:29:58 environments you know I'm not going to as you said yeah survive but also thrive I think that's the other important thing you know thrive in an environment where I feel happy and passionate about what I'm doing so that's that's kind of how I personally see it but yeah every time I see that picture I'm like yes it just warms my heart I come from a slightly earlier era in life where we actually used to write each other letters and put stamps on them um before emails dawned and one of my friends um used to write like a little quote or a little like pause for thought nugget on the back of every envelope because he didn't want the postman to be bored that's generally what genuinely why he did it and it reminded me of a little little communication because postman

Starting point is 00:30:42 must read postcards and he thought this isn't a postcard it's a letter and on the back of one of them it said if you've always done what you've always done then you'd always get what you've always got and that is you know that's that's in essence what that is isn't it I have loved our chat today like I'm so excited for just for you to, to become qualified for you to stand there in your graduation robes. And for me in terms of change, I think I noticed it most. I didn't go to my master's graduation because I think they forgot to tell me about it. Yeah. They sent me a certificate in the post like six months later where I said, well, where is it?

Starting point is 00:31:26 They didn't tell me. So I only went to my undergrad and my doctorate graduations. So I only went to my undergraduate and my postgraduate doctoral graduations. In my undergraduation, I felt a bit embarrassed. I felt a bit silly, felt silly in my robes. I felt a bit like a phony. I didn't feel like a psychologist because I guess what I know is that I wasn't one. And I was just a bit embarrassed. I loved being with my family. I loved being with my friends. I loved going out for dinner afterwards with our extended family, but I didn't necessarily feel proud whereas my doctorate graduation I honestly felt so very proud of

Starting point is 00:32:09 everything I'd achieved of wearing my little you know soft floppy cap of being there with all of these incredible people who I called friends and colleagues and I was so pleased and proud for them as well I had this moment of standing I did Coventry and Warwick uni and they take it in turns for the graduation one year will be in the Coventry Cathedral one year will be in the Warwick in the in their theatre there and we had the Coventry graduation and it was just like standing queuing up by these you know amazing stained glass waiting to go and get my handshake from the dean whatever it was with my parents watching and you know my who is now my husband was in a lecture theater with his parents watching elsewhere and just I just felt so incredibly proud. And that is safe to feel about yourself, but also really lovely.

Starting point is 00:33:08 And I hope that you have that similar pride when it comes to be your time as well, Phil. Thank you, Marianne. Yes, so fingers crossed that my graduation will be next year. I think they do it this summer after so there's quite a big kind of gap but hopefully a proud Phil proud Dr Phil could be standing there and I think we should be proud at any point in time even you know at the undergraduate that's that's massive you know that's a very big step in anyone's life yeah I guess that evidence is just how much I changed from the

Starting point is 00:33:47 age of 21 to the age of I think I was about 30 you know I'd grown a lot I've done a lot as well had a great time personally and professionally there'd been highs had been lows but genuinely and I guess by the time I did my graduation for doctor I'd already I think that was November I was just about I think to start my qualified role because I actually had some time of unemployed because there was no jobs but yeah I just I just loved it I loved it and yeah in terms of growth it you know there's nothing like it and then of course once you qualify you continue to grow and you absolutely should so yeah just yesterday someone had said they'd been stopped from progressing to 8a because someone had said well you haven't done a specialist core thing you haven't done a bolt-on therapy since

Starting point is 00:34:42 qualifying and that wasn't something I'd ever heard of but you know just in case people are listening just try to get some sort of therapeutic skills advancement when you first qualify in the first couple of years but that said you know you can go straight to 8a from qualifying so that's not always necessary but part of the podcast I like to kind of educate people as and when I hear things. So that might be something people might like to consider. So Phil, thank you very much. You are going to be joining us for another episode because I've so enjoyed our chat that we've decided we're going to do what was our original plan as a second follow-up episode because it's just been so lovely to speak to you have you got a last nugget of advice for helping people avoid burnout on their way as aspiring psychologists phil gosh uh i could say so much about that but i'll keep it simple you know yourself best so one thing at a time that's something that has personally helped me a lot both before and during the doctorate just chunking things otherwise you can easily get overwhelmed with how much stuff is

Starting point is 00:35:51 happening all together like nope I'm gonna do first this then that then that and obviously life doesn't work that way but I think even just saying it to myself helps a lot so give it your best shot if it doesn't work that's okay just be kind to yourself that's so nice and you know just keep doing it if you think it's a bit of you like it was for you you know what's another year between friends you know if this might end up being your fantastic beautiful joyful career exactly. Thank you very much. I've loved it. I've loved it, Phil. Thank you for sharing your time so warmly with our audience as well. And if people have enjoyed what we've said, then they can look out for our next episode,

Starting point is 00:36:38 which will be coming probably in the next five or six weeks. What an absolute pleasure it was to speak to Phil. I liked it so much that we are seeing him again for a future episode as well. So stay tuned for that in the next few weeks if you are intrigued to see what it is we're going to be talking about. I would love to know what you think to this episode. Come along and let me know in the Aspiring Psychologist community, which is my free Facebook group. If you like the way I do reflection, if you like the way that it sounds like I can help you to grow and to shape your experiences and to get to where you want to be on the psychology career ladder, please do consider coming along and joining the Aspiring Psychologist community, which you can do from just £30 a month with no

Starting point is 00:37:25 minimum commitment. Please take a moment to rate and review. And if you're watching on YouTube, please do subscribe, like, tell your friends, do all those good things. I hope you'll find some of the videos on screen coming up very shortly on YouTube to be useful for the next choice for you to watch. I will look forward to coming along and seeing you for our next episode of the podcast, whether you listen or whether you watch from 6am on Monday. Take care. Thank you so much for being part of my world. with this podcast that you're sad you'll be on your way to being qualified it's the aspiring psychologist my name's yana and i'm a trainee psychological well-being practitioner.

Starting point is 00:38:29 I read the Clinical Psychologist Collective book. I found it really interesting about all the different stories and how people got to become a clinical psychologist. It just amazed me how many different routes there are to get there and there's no perfect way to become one and this kind of filled me with confidence that no I'm not doing it wrong and put less pressure on myself. So if you're feeling a bit uneasy about becoming a clinical psychologist I definitely recommend this just to put yourself at ease and everything will be okay. But trust me, you will not put the book down once you start.

The Aspiring Psychologist Podcast - Reflective Growth Across a Psychology Career - Trainee Clinical Psychologist

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