The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Football GM: Super Bowl LVII picks, Aaron Rodgers' and Lamar Jackson's future, coordinator moves, and more

Episode Date: February 8, 2023

On this edition of The Football GM, Mike Sando and Randy Mueller discuss where Aaron Rodgers and Lamar Jackson could be in 2023, dig into all the coordinator moves across the NFL, and consider the lingering head coaching vacancies in Indianapolis and Arizona. Then, the guys make their picks for Super Bowl LVII.Follow Mike on Twitter: @SandoNFLFollow Randy on Twitter: @RandyMueller_Subscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTubeToday's episode is brought to you by...Atlassian: For projects impossible alone, visit www.atlassian.comPeloton: Try Peloton risk free with a 30-Day Home Trial, New Members only at onepeloton.com/home-trialBurrow: Show Burrow you’re listening to The Athletic Football Show by shopping at burrow.com/mays and get 10% off your first orderAllbirds: Discover your perfect pair of Wool Runners at Allbirds.com todayBlue Nile: Find the perfect piece of jewelry for life’s special moments and save up to 50% now at bluenile.comBetter Help: Visit BetterHelp.com/mays today to get 10% off your first month4:43 How the Eagles and Chiefs weathered change11:10 Sando's big offseason predictions12:26 Aaron Rodgers will be traded18:22 Lamar Jackson will play on the tag25:40 Giants keep Daniel Jones and Saquon Barkley29:10 Derek Carr's market34:46 Tom Brady is staying retired35:34 No major changes to officiating...unless Andy Reid gets screwed in the Super Bowl37:33 What's next for Sean Payton and the Broncos?46:52 Colts HC search51:13 Cardinals HC search53:14 Coordinator movement57:14 Brian Flores to the Vikings60:33 GM Notebook64:11 Super Bowl LVII picks Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Football Show. Welcome everybody to the Super Bowl Week edition of the Football GM podcast. Mike Sando here from The Athletic, along with Randy Mueller, the GM. Mr. GM, how you doing? I'm doing great, Mike. Looks like you got your hands full in Phoenix this week. I'm envious. It sounds like a good time.

It really is. You know, I love, I never get tired of coming to the Super Bowl. I mean, who would? And each town's a little different, but, you know, it is sunny here, cool, not cold, but sunny. And it seems like just a great Mexican restaurant on every other corner. I've had Mexican food yesterday and again today. You know, I'll probably do that all week because it's just when you can go to a place where it's really authentic and good, man, nothing beats it. And in our corner of the world up in the northwest, you can find it, but here you've got to be good, right?

you're going out of business because they know. And it is some amazing stuff. So I've been doing that, trying not to gain too much weight, but having a good time. And I'm going to hit stride, I think, tomorrow and visit the teams and go. I think they have the assistant coaches available tomorrow. And I always enjoy that. The whole roster you can go and talk to people you know or meet some people you don't know. And I like kind of that aspect of it.

So is the Monday night media extravaganza close to what it used to be when they had the Tuesday media deal or whatever it was? I don't think so. You know, no, it's not. I think it's deteriorated. And I didn't even go last night. I had some work to do. And I was even strategic today and didn't go to the teams because it was a limited number of availability. It's all pretty formal.

I really like, you know, I think Wednesday and Thursday, it's not. a circus like the media night thing where people are running around trying to make it a side show media night you know you have everything but people getting shot out of cannons you know and jumping off into tiny pools from the 10th story right it's it is a circus and they try to make it that so I like for me just to be able to actually talk to people and sometimes on a Wednesday or Thursday hotel ballroom tables set up everywhere there's a special teams coach right he may have one person sitting there with him or nobody well that's a great great opportunity to have an actual conversation, right?

And that's really what I enjoy. So that's what I look forward to later in the week. Hopefully we can get some of my work done before then, and we'll do that. And we'll be on to the game, Randen. I guess if you had told us before the season that it would be Philadelphia and Kansas City, we wouldn't have fought you too hard, but still pretty impressive that they both got here with a question of a quarterback

coming into the season on Gelen Hertz and a question at wide receiver for Kansas City with Tyreek Hill leaving. Yeah, I think you're right. I think both these teams have been the best teams really in their conferences all year long. So it doesn't shock us that they're here now. But I think the route that they've taken is a little peculiar in that they were both recently in Super Bowls with really different rosters, one with a different quarterback and a different head coach. So I know we'll discuss some of that.

But you've got to credit these, I think, ownership groups, the front offices, they've gone through some change. And it's been interesting to follow and watch, but you've got to give them credit. And like we said last week, where I thought the best four teams were still alive, I think these are two of the best teams that they could put forward. And thus, we have a real tight point spread. We have all kinds of different angles on the game like we always do, but a little different. I mean, I think the Eagles offense sets themselves apart. It's hard to prepare for because they can impose their will on you. It's completely different than in normal times in the NFL, which is really a passing league, right?

It's really a seven-on-seven league. And that's not necessarily the way the Eagles play. So I think the chiefs are what they are, but they have been outstanding in that they've done it different this year with no Tyreek Hill. So I'll be anxious to talk about some of that. Yeah, you know, one of the points you made when we were just talking before the podcast started was teams not being afraid of change, right? What do you mean by that? Because there is a lot of change on these rosters. and there's change in the NFL every year, but usually that change doesn't include going to the Super Bowl multiple times.

Well, I think you're right. I've always thought that the NFL is built on change. The only thing for sure, in my opinion, was that you would change a third of your roster every year. That's just fact. And I don't think that has differed this year. These teams have changed rosters, but the amount of money they've spent at the top have varied. And like you mentioned, Kansas City is eye-popping exactly. example of losing what some thought was their best non-quarterback on their team, didn't want to pay

Tyreek $25 million a year or whatever it ended up being in Miami, and chose to move on. I think the guts that they showed to do that and their philosophy of being able to stick with how they want to build it and not put it in the hands of a non-quarterback. And that's nothing against Tyreek Hill. We get it. He's a really good player. But there's a lot of ways to build your team. and I think it's hard in this day and age, and having been in that position, a lot of, a lot of front offices around the league are not necessarily controlled, but they have an eye on what the public says. They have an eye on what the media says, and sometimes they resist change because of the fear

that they would be criticized. These are two franchises that really don't care what the outside world says, and I believe that. I've followed them enough to know that they really don't care, and I love that philosophy. not that it's arrogance. It's just that they're going to do it the way they want to do it. They're not going to resist change. They understand that they're going to have players come and go, but the systems are what they believe in, the coaches and the philosophy is what they believe in. And in the Eagles case, with a new quarterback and a new coach, they've built a system around that in no time to get them up to be in one of the best teams in the league.

So that's what I mean is they've controlled the amount of change. but it's been in their decision-making process. They haven't let others control it for them. Two things standing out about that to me. One is that Andy Reid is an empowered, offensive-minded head coach who calls the plays and designs the offense. Randy, you trade the best wide receiver in the league. The one weapon who is most feared in the league, usually that would be a really tough sell to your head coach, right?

Who designs the offense, depending on them? come back, they're better. I think it's just a real validation of Andy Reed and Patrick Mahomes, the ability that you're able to do that. But when I look at this team back in the Super Bowl, what really stands out to me was when they played Tampa, they got overwhelmed

up front. Remember? They just couldn't, they couldn't function, and Mahomes was running all over the place, and so they have an almost entirely new offensive line. I think that's, they're right back where they were two years ago. They're playing another great defensive front, and so we're going to see if

those investments pay off because if they give Patrick Mahomes enough time or just keep him somewhat clean, not under a complete siege, I really like their chances against anybody. Yeah, I think you're right. And I think you hit the nail on the head when you talk about an empowered coach like Andy Reid is. He's willing to put his system and the offensive philosophy first and foremost. He pushed all his chips saying, hey, we will change players, but this is the system we're going to run. Now, it's easy to do that when you have Pat Mahomes, and most would view as the best quarterback in the league. So you can move some pieces around.

He's the constant. But we even saw last week where he was really operating on one leg and they still were able to be successful throwing the ball and picking their spots. So I think it is a testament to the decision making of Andy, his leadership, and then Pat Mahomes to kind of carry them through the change that has occurred all around their roster. And I like that idea. I think it's really a testament to the decision. decision makers in a front office, whether it's a GM or a head coach, in that if you really believe

in what you're doing, you can find players to replace even the greatest, even like you said, the best receiver. You can group together the right guys, and it's all about options. I'm sure when they went to Andy Reid and said, hey, we can pay Tyreek Hill, we can pay him this, but here's the three things that we can't do. Well, I don't know. I can just see Andy sit back in his chair and straighten his glasses and say, I'm not sure I want to do that. Maybe in that case, because the money was so high, maybe it's four or five things that they couldn't do if they signed Tyreek Hill. So they make choices, and choices are hard.

And some teams would have paid him and said, hey, I don't want to take the criticism. We're not going to let the best receiver walk out the door. Well, I think Andy, as you mentioned, is confident in his scheme. He's confident in his quarterback, and those changes are easier to make. Yeah, we're going to circle back to the game and the matchup when we make our pick. at the end of the show. Let's hit into some newsy items because the league doesn't stop, Randy.

I mean, with all of the stuff going on, we've got a bunch of stuff that we can get to in some of the hirings and some of the coordinator moves and some of that. Certainly with Sean Payton is sort of getting going in Denver. We want to talk about that. But I wanted to run you through an exercise

that I kind of went through in my Monday column looking at some off-season big headline-type topics and making a few predictions. I want to get the truth. I mean, look, I can do my column and talk to people in the league, but then we come back for the real story, the real insight from Randy. We'll get the real story straight. And by the way, everybody, I do have, even though I'm not in my office, I can see Randy here so I can see if he is rolling his eyes or not.

And usually he does. Do your eyes get tired during the show? Randy? Do you guys get tired from rolling them back? You're giving people a false impression. Okay, no. Randy, I don't think Randy does that, but he should for some of the stuff that I come up with. But here were some of them. I'm going to read some of these through, and I'm interested in your reaction.

Okay. Prediction. Aaron Rogers will be traded this off season. By the way, Aaron Rogers said on some show he appears on, I think it's called the Pat McAfee show, that he's going to spend. four days, four 24-hour cycles. By the way, the McAfee show is set up here in Radio Row. Saw it over there yesterday. Saw McAfee. Did not see Rogers over there. Anyway, Rogers said he's going to spend four days, four-24-hour days in total darkness and isolation. Hey, he could be an assistant

coach. That's what those guys do when they're breaking down the film. I mean, shoot, this guy, this guy could be quality control. Welcome to my world getting ready for the draft. This is nothing. He thinks four days in total darkness and isolation. Try it for four months. Uh, anyway, so he's going to do that so he can, quote, do a little self-reflection in some isolation. And after that, I feel like I'll be a lot closer to that final, final decision. So off of that, we know the retreat is not going to take place on a Tuesday because he ain't missing McAfee, Randy.

He's not missing it. Unless he's been on it so many times now. I think he could probably do it in his sleep, in the dark, whatever the case might be. He's calling in from that retreat if it happens on a Tuesday. I know you, like a lot of people, have. wearied a little bit from, I don't know if you call it Rogers Act, but do you agree with the basic premise that he's going to be traded this offseason finally putting an end to all this stuff? I do think he will be traded. I think it's probably the best thing for both sides. I think there's a

lot of questions while he takes his four-day sabbatical in the cave in the mountains of northern Idaho, the rest of the world must go on. And I think the Packers, are trying to figure out what they might want to do. I do have one question. Does he have a no trade clause in his contract or not? That's the one question I would like to know, because I don't think he does, right? Rogers does not have a no trade clause,

but, yeah, there's no trade clause. So what does that mean to you? I mean, you can't send him somewhere he doesn't really want to be, right? Shoot, you think he's a problem now. What's he going to do? What's he going to do? retire. Every time I hear him talk, Mike, it doesn't sound like anybody who's even thinking about retirement, whether it's at the golf tournament, Pebble Beach, whether it's on the McAfee Show.

He does, yeah, he does not sound like anybody that's going to retire. So I think we can drop that one. The other question I would have from the Packers is, how long does this guy want to play? Because that's going to determine the value that we get. Is he going to play for one year? Is he going to play for two years? Nobody's going to give you a package of picks if this guy's going to play for one year. I think it's going to be a struggle to get a first round pick for one year. It doesn't make sense. So his decisions are, in my opinion, not necessarily where he goes, but how long he wants to play. And we're assuming that he wants to play.

So that would be the decision that would be keeping me awake at night if I'm Brian Gutikist. I've got to figure out the best value I can get, and it's probably time to move on. I don't think the franchise wants to be held hostage any longer, and maybe that's the way the rest of the world thinks too. but they went through this was Brett Farr. That lasted about three or four years, and they drafted Aaron Rogers. And Aaron Rogers wasn't playing great when they drafted Jordan Love. Now he's put together a couple MVP years, and Jordan Love's probably ready to play. So to answer your question, I do think you'll be traded.

I just don't know what for, and I think that's the big thing, until Rogers says how long he's going to play. And really, if I'm him, do I really want to come clean and say, hey, I'm going to play three or four more years? That may soothe his ego, but then the team I'm going to. going to is going to be stripped of a lot of chips, a lot of tools that they send back to Green Bay. You follow me? So it's a little bit forward thinking. And if I'm Rogers, he can pat his ego or he can really soothe it to where the acquiring

team doesn't pay a lot and puts better pieces around me when I get there. Yeah. Yeah, I hope they have a lot of dark places for him there when he needs to make these decisions in the future. It could be every year, right? I mean, he's not going to make a, he's going to have to drag this out. The McAfee ratings could suffer if he doesn't have a, you know, a decision to make every couple weeks throughout the off-season. If I were an acquiring team, I guess, I mean, he can still play really good ball, so maybe a fresh start and all of that, and you're fine with it.

If you're an acquiring team, does this stuff turn you off or you don't care because he can turn your team around overnight? It would be a concern. I don't think any team will appreciate the McAfee trolling and Aaron trolling the rest of the world every week and having the answer to that. I think his situation in Green Bay is unique, and he's chosen to be the mouthpiece of really the whole locker room per se. And it's all from his viewpoint, so I get it. I don't know if it would prohibit me from making a deal for him. I would definitely probably have a discussion with him about what he wants to do in the future. It can be a distraction without a doubt. And I think one of the bigger questions I would ask if I was an acquiring team was, remember the list of players that Rogers wanted to resign?

Are we going to have to do this when you get to Tennessee or the Raiders or wherever else he goes? Are we going to have a list of players or a list of other things that we need? You know, it sounds like a... Yeah, the minute he's gone, all those players will be available on the market, probably, because they're all about 50 years old. You're right about that. I don't think they'll be reassigned because those aren't going to move the meter. They're not going to move the meter for the Packers, I can tell you that.

Yeah, yeah. Team B signs Mercedes-Lewis. He's entering his 17th year or whatever it is. All right, prediction number two. Lamar Jackson will be franchise tagged. There will be no long-term deal, and next season will be a continuation of this season, but with Jackson staying in Baltimore.

for another year. They could tag him and can get a little bit tricky at that point, you know, in terms of a trade. If there's an offer sheet involved, they could get two first-round picks and returned. If you want more than that, it could get a little tricky. But do you believe that he's going to play for the Ravens this year on the tag, or do you see a different way, either long-term deal or trade? I don't see a long-term deal. I do think he'll be tagged.

I think he will then disappear somewhere and say he's not going to play. How far he wants to push that is totally up to him. I think the team would say, hey, at some point, if he wants to get paid, he's going to have to come play for us. Maybe they entertain a trade down the road. But I don't think even he, short of a fully guaranteed deal, is going to sign a long-term deal. And I'm pretty sure the Ravens aren't going to acquiesce and turn over a new leaf and decide they're going to adopt a whole new organizational philosophy. I just don't think that's going to happen.

So I could easily see him being somewhere else where I don't know. I mean, we've talked about Atlanta here on the show as being a possibility with Arthur Smith and his offense. That could be a possibility. The question that's still unanswered is the Ravens don't have an offensive coordinator yet. And so once that offensive philosophy has been defined, I think that could go a long ways toward what happens with Lamar. I don't think they're going to let Lamar walk, so I do think they will end up tagging him, and then we'll see how it plays out after that. What if they had drafted Jaylen Hertz a couple years ago?

You think it would be a little bit of a different situation there in Baltimore? You've talked about always having to have options. I think it'll be very interesting, Randy, this year. Obviously, the draft comes after free agency, but, you know, of what they do. And the other thing is, if he's franchise tagged, does somebody do an offer sheet for him knowing then if it's after the draft, they don't give up a pick this year, right? You give up a couple picks in the future. I don't know if it'll get to that, but those are just some things I was thinking of

because they just can't be completely dependent on every little thing he does this offseason. They need some kind of an option. And the interesting thing about that is they'll, you know, they get anybody of any significance and that's going to be a potential issue too in their relationship, right? I think it's malpractice to not do something, Mike. I'll be honest with you. They can't be held hostage. I think, and we've said it, like you mentioned, I think options are what this is all about.

If the Ravens have no options, they're going to make a bad deal. So I think they've got to give themselves options, and nobody's looking to run off Lamar Jackson. I get it. But there comes a different style if he's not your quarterback. So they've got to have some options in mind. They're going to have to play an option card no matter how much John Harbaugh does not want to play an option card and not consider any alternatives. I just think they have to as a franchise, have some other ideas in mind of what they want to do offensively. They have some good players.

It's not like this team is going to have to build from scratch if Lamar isn't their quarterback. They don't have the quality, regardless of Tyler Hundley's Pro Bowl appearance or whatever that was. I don't think they're willing to go down that route. They're going to have to upgrade from that. So I think that would be blind faith to think that's going to be good enough, and that hasn't worked to this day. So again, I don't know whether they draft a quarterback in the first round. That's not what I'm saying. But I'm saying they've got to find some way to function as a franchise again, or they're

going to be held hostage with Lamar Jackson and his chosen hill to die on with this fully guaranteed deal. I just don't think that's ever going to come to fruition. Taking a first round pick would be a great thing to do now that I think about it. Shoot, the Broncos did it with John Elway there. John Elway was in his first 10 years as a player, and they drafted Tommy Maddox. Now, that was when he was going through stuff with Dan Reeves and all of that.

But wouldn't that shake it up? What if they took one in the first round just said, hey, we need to have options here. We don't know what's going on with Lamar Jackson. What if they did that? Any problem? No, not at all. Not if it's a good player. I think that's the bottom line, and we'll get to that in a couple of the notes down the

But I have no problem taking a quarterback in the first round if he's worthy of it. But just because some media evaluators that we hear on TV or the radio or any place else say these are first round worthy quarterbacks, that's not reason to take one. I pump the brakes and hope that the NFL teams, the NFL teams will sort that out for us throughout this process. I heard there's about a 5-7 guy, 160 pounds. You'd think he'd be a good guy to take in the first round. Okay, prediction. Now you're seeing my eyes roll. Now you're seeing my eyes.

No, no, no, you're coaching. You coach us all up. Okay, prediction. Now, this one, I don't know if I, I went back and forth on this one, but I have trusted the Giants in their sort of, you know, they didn't go overboard in their first year by any means in making dumb, short-sighted roster moves and putting lipstick on a pig, right? They sort of went with what they had, made the most of it,

and it was impressive. So a prediction would be that they would be able to keep Daniel Jones and Sequin Berkeley without going above what the franchise tag numbers are for those positions. So it's $32 million a year for Daniel Jones. I think it's maybe $10 for Saquan Berkeley as a running back. They're talking to Berkeley now. Maybe they can get that done and freeze up the tag to use if they have to on Daniel Jones. do you think that that's realistic?

And then beyond that, are you willing to risk Daniel Jones leaving because, hey, we got Brian Dayball as our coach and no one thought Daniel Jones was going to do much. We can find somebody and be good. And we may need to look for somebody anyway, long term, just like we did when we were in Buffalo and we had whoever Tyrod Taylor

and then went on and got Josh Allen. what do you think? I think they would be a static to be able to do what you just painted that picture of stability. I think even if they paid a ted bit over the franchise numbers, I think stability is worth something. I think if they could find a way to sign Barclay and give him some security long term and either use the tag on Daniel or sign him, I think they would love to do that.

I don't think Brian Dayball will want to start over at the quarterback position in particular. I think that's the one, that's probably the game breaker, the deal breaker. I don't think they're going to find somebody on the street that can process things like Daniel has done this year without having to take a step back to get there. I just don't think they're going to do that as a franchise. And I agree with you. I think they've done a great job. They haven't spent a bunch of money.

Not that they had any to spend cap-wise, but they went through and like you said, played the cards they had, added some smaller pieces along the way. I think that's smart. I think they've done it exactly how its textbook fashioned. And I think at some point they will want to put their spin on it, but I don't think they're going to want to take a step back and absorb a bunch of change at the quarterback position. So if they could find a way to sign Barclay, great.

I think that's, he would be the one guy. I don't think they would tag. But if for some reason they can't get a deal done with him, I think then they'll try to go to Daniel Jones, but knowing that the tag is going to be available for one of these two guys. And I think they'd prefer to use it on Daniel to make sure he doesn't hit the open market. And you would do that before you would go way higher than that or anything, right? I mean, just to keep him for a year.

And if he plays well again, you can just pay him more in a long term. Or even tag him again. Yeah, I think you have options if you do that. I'm a Daniel Jones supporter. I don't know if you remember, but I was one of those guys a year ago that saw the upside to Daniel Jones. And I think they've done nothing but make him better and better. And he's finally got some stability there. yeah, I would tag him. I would try to sign him. I'm not saying I'd pay him $40 million.

That's not what I'm saying. But somewhere in the interim, I think everybody gets what they want, and I think there's a deal there to be made. So let's talk then about that quarterback market, because Derek Carr could be hitting that market pretty soon. I don't know that they're going to find somebody who's going to trade for his contract that would be $40 million, you know, payment on February 15th. So it would be likely that he will hit the market. Now, the prediction, which, you know, really the prediction is our just a way to discuss the topic. I don't know that we're taking this to the bank. But the prediction is that Derek Carr's market could be a little underwhelming that he won't get the big deal like Kirk Cousins got from Minnesota on the market.

Remember when he hit the market, he was, everyone knew Kirk Cousins was kind of a mid-level quarterback, you know, probably more of a win wither than a win because of guy. but a good starter. And he immediately went to the top of the pile or got the fully guaranteed deal, a new structure. And so there was some evidence that, hey, if just one of these guys ever hits the market, they're going to get paid like they're better than they are.

Is there the potential here you think for Derek Carr's contract to be a little bit underwhelming maybe, and there could actually be a little bit of a reset downward that even could affect where Cousins is at in a year if he were to hit it two, Do you think it just keeps going onward and upward with Derek Carr? Well, with Derek Carr, I don't think, and I've said this, that he'll be traded. I think he can control that dialogue because he does have the no trade clause.

I don't think also that he'll have to take a pay cut. So I think a downward trend isn't realistic. And I think he probably will get a raise. Now, will he get $45 million a year? Probably not. But he's going to get a nice deal to go somewhere. So I think he holds the cards to that. he's not going to allow the Raiders to take advantage of him.

So therefore, I don't see why he would agree to a trade, knowing that they have some guarantees and some other money due that they're not going to pay. So eventually they're going to have to cut him because that makes no sense for them to pay that money and then move him at a later date. So I think teams like Tennessee who could free up money with Tanny Hills deal, maybe in Atlanta, if they haven't solved their issues long term, I think Derek Carr would be a good play in those markets. Who knows, it might even be a Carolina.

they could find a place to actually pay Derek Carr some money. I don't think it'll be the Jets. It seems like the Jets I'll come up in all these quarterbacks scenario, but it's usually from the media or fans, and I don't think a quarterback's going to the Jets. I just don't think that that's going to be an attractive spot for a lot of reasons, mainly because they haven't got it right yet, and the quarterback they drafted with the second pick is still looming in that decision.

So I think Carr will find a place. I think he'll get, you know, I don't know about trend-setting money, but he's not going to have to take a pay cut in my mind. So I think he was at about $40 million a year, so you think he can still get that car can. I think he'll get that. Yes, I do. And it'll be structured to where it'll be team-friendly,

but he's going to get his money. There's too many teams still looking for quarterbacks. Why wouldn't the Raiders want him? They just had them. They could have him for that. I think they've deemed him to have fatal flaws. I'll be honest with you. That deal was done.

And for whatever reason, Josh McDaniels thinks they can't move on with him. So when they pulled a plug on that, they pulled the plug on him for good. So that tells me they have deemed him to be fatally flawed. I'm saying others will not. Others will definitely want a bite of that apple before they, you know, before they're willing to adopt the same philosophy that the decision makers did with the Raiders. Would you pay him $40 million if you were the Saints or one of these teams? I would.

I think he's worthy of that. I think he's an upper third quarterback. I don't think he's below that. I think for whatever reason, I don't think the Gruden ears were kind to him. And you can say that John Gruden's offense was this or that. I think it was a little bit dated, and I think it didn't give him quite enough answers and options. I think the Josh McDaniels offense is a very structured offense as well. And there's nothing wrong with that.

But I just think for whatever reason, he hasn't been in an ideal spot. Not that the Saints are, but if I'm the Saints, I'm going to take a step forward, and I think he's definitely better than where they're coming from, whether it's Andy Dalton or Hill, the pseudo-quarterback. I think he's clearly an upgrade over that. But that's what I mean, Mike. You're going to have, say there's three teams. They're going to drive the price up to, you know, he'll be the top guy on the market.

You're going to pay him before any of these other guys, I think. Yeah, I mean, my question is, is he at $40 million. And if those other guys, you know, what's Jimmy Garapolo at or what are some of these other guys? guys that are at 25 or 30 or whatever, is car that much better? Well, I think he's better than Jimmy Gropolo. I think he's better than some of these other guys who are going to be hit in the market. Would you rather have him or Gino? You know, Gino's not going anywhere.

Gino Smith, who's a Seattle and who says negotiations are going good too. So I don't know. I just think the fact that he's going to be available. I'd better have Gino Smith the guy. Maybe so. Maybe so. Again, I think that there's a little bit of a difference in that it seems like the more a guy plays, the more flaws we find in him.

And Gino's played one year out of the last seven or eight, maybe it's 10, you know, so we don't have any flaws, no flaws on him. That's right. Yep, you're right. That's how the draft works. Prediction, Tom Brady means it when he says he is retiring.

But he'll come back if the right opportunity presents itself. And I thought it was funny that, oh, by the way, I'll start the fox thing in a year. Yeah. I don't think he's coming back to play, Mike, and I'm happy about it. I think we've talked about it here on the pod. I think his best years obviously are behind him. I don't want to see a band-aided up, taped up, Tom Brady struggling. So I think he does mean it. We saw the toll that took on him this year. I mean, he was a shell of himself by season's end,

actually by halfway through the season. Obviously, the personal issues and all the other things kind of heaped on his shoulders. He looked like a downtrod and beaten down man at the end of the season. And I think he even realized, hey, this is enough. I don't need to do this anymore. Before we get into our Sean Payton item with the Broncos, our final prediction, nothing changes in officiating unless someone like Andy Reid gets railroaded in the Super Bowl and then pushes stuff through. And I'm alluding to, of course, the game that the Saints had with Sean Peyton there against the Rams with the past interference that wasn't.

And then all of a sudden there's committees and rules changes and one-off. Do you agree that it's going to be status quo in officiore? unless something like that happens, the right person is aggrieved, because really right now there's not one of those people that is standing on the table. Yeah, I think it's the inconsistency by how our game is officiated week to week drives me crazy. But there are so many old school owners and people in decision-making positions that don't want to change that we may be stuck with what we have. I do think it's bad for the game to continue to not try to improve and improve the product and make it better. we talked about it last week. I'm all for the Sky Judge,

kind of a easy button at the end of the day where if you screw it all up, punch this button, then they'll get it right. I am for that. I don't think that'll ever happen probably just because we're too old school thinking. They don't want to open a Pandora's box either

of having to solve and have a bunch of unintended consequences, and I think that scares the league at times because they're hesitant to do that. I just wish the product was better. and when I say product, the officiating as a whole, you know,

I mean, we could do a whole podcast on why I think the fishinating has gone down and I don't know if I'm publicly willing to air out any of that laundry, but they have issues.

It's inconsistently officiated week in and week out, all the way from the crazy rough in the quarterback stuff to, you know, the easiest calls of holding that can in some places be made,

others they don't get made. It's just consistently inconsistent and that's never good in my opinion. All right, we're finally going to get into a good topic or two because these will be the ones Randy put down. I wrote down some of those other ones out of my column, but you got down here. Those are great topics, Mike.

I'm happy with those. Sean Payton, what's next inside the Broncos building? Where do we start? I think this is interesting because it's obviously been in the news, but you bring a little different perspective because you know what happens when it's day one, right? When you're in the building. So what's interesting there to you, just in general,

and then as it applies to this team, Denver. Well, yeah, as a GM, when you have a new coach, you've got to kind of ride the fine line in that you want to download him with all the information you can to get him up to speed on what's going on internally. But I would also, as if I'm George Payton, want an independent assessment of our own team, so I don't really want to talk to him about all of our players. I want him to come up with his own opinion,

and you've got to help sometimes block the door so he can actually watch tape and develop this opinion. So I think that's important as well. I don't think George can taint the decision-making and the evaluations that are going to go on. So I don't know if that makes sense, but it's kind of a fine line. You've got to bring him up to speed on, for example, all the medical information. You'll sit down with the trainers on maybe the second day in our doctors and go through any medical issues because those have long-term effects. We've got to make decisions on certain players that are affected.

by all the medical stuff, off-season surgeries. You might have a player that has bone-on bone on a knee that you have to make a contract decision on. So all of the information you need to download to him, those are pretty much factual information, and you've got to give the coach all that so he can weigh in with his opinion once we get to the point of having to make a decision.

You've got to have a salary cap review of every contract in play. So he gets an understanding of where you're at cap-wise, where you're at contract-wise. Now, there are some franchises that won't even allow the coach to be in that same cap room. I think you've got to have a consensus built and that you should give them as much information as they're willing to take in. You're not going to sit on, you're not going to ask, yeah, you're not going to ask the coach to decide all these things.

I just want him to be informed so that he and I can have basic discussions about some of these things and have the same basis behind it. So you've got to do that. You've got to also get your staff hired. I mean, he's got to hire a defensive staff. He's got to hire the rest of his offensive staff because the number one, really the number one task of any front office in pro football in the offseason is the acquisition of talent. So you can't even start to acquire any talent until you set your philosophy and your vision of what you're going to do on offense and what you're going to do on

defense and then set a criteria by position, which we've talked about on the show many times when we get close to the draft, but you've got to set that criteria now. That's going to take several days to go through and really detailed exactly what Sean is going to ask his left tackle to do, what he's going to ask his right guard to do, what he's going to ask his receivers to do, how are we going to line these guys up? And you'll have maybe a list, Mike, of 10 different points of contention. For example, a receiver might have. We've got to prioritize those.

What's the number one thing that Sean views as important in finding the right receiver for our scheme? So all of these nuances got to be discussed at nauseam. And we haven't even got to free agency yet, which is looming, you know, a month and a half away, not to mention the draft shortly thereafter. So you've got to cover a lot of stuff. I love the process. I love that part of the job. And I think George will too.

I'm familiar with George and his non-ego way of doing things. So I think he's probably the perfect guy to match with Sean in that Sean will have a more out front role and be the face of your franchise. And George will be very comfortable working behind the scenes. Yes. I do think that Sean Peyton is so strong in his opinions that he's really going to be running this team, don't you think? That all the moves they make are going to be his moves. Do you believe that?

Well, I think a lot of them are going to be his. Hopefully, Sean knows that he's got good people there that he can trust. And I think if he doesn't, he'll have to find a guy or two. I think the biggest thing is they've got a kind of re, I don't know, re-equal. their process of evaluating players because they've made a couple blunders the last year, year and a half. And so they can't go down that same road of how they evaluated in the past. So they've got to figure out a way to hone in on that and just do a better job of

evaluating and valuing players. And I think Sean will go a long ways toward helping him tighten that up. How long does it take, or do you think he can, just reframe the whole Russell Wilson thing, right? Because everything was about Russell Wilson this last year. Is this just instantly solved now and Russell fits into what they're doing and says, yes, sir, yes, coach, this is what we're going to do? Or do you think there's more to this? I think it's going to take some time.

I think that Sean and you and I talked about this, I think Sean is the best coach for that situation. I think he walks in the door, being in charge, being the big show, having to really not say anything and just carry a big stick without using it. And I think everybody will do that. Now, we read this week where Russell Wilson had reached out to him during the interview process, and that kind of action made me, you know, bristle a little bit. That's really not what we want. We don't need Russell's opinion.

I'll be honest with you. We already went down the Russell Wilson show last year, and it was a colossal failure. So I think it's nice of him that maybe he wanted to reach out, but he's no better than the left tackle. He's no better than the right end. He's got to be a team guy, and if that doesn't change, they're going nowhere with Russell Wilson. But I think Sean will do that. I think you already saw some of his answers to his questions in the media day about the extra offices, extra parking spots, all the other circus and pomp and circumstance that comes with Russell.

I think we've seen the end of all that. How Russell adapts to the ways of Sean and allows Sean to be the guy who runs this ship, that's yet to be determined. And hey, we all have to set our egos aside when there's a new sheriff in town. We'll see how long it takes Russell to do that. All right, let's transition away from Denver, which has hired a head coach to a couple of teams, the two teams that have not yet hired a head coach, the Indianapolis Colts, coming off the illustrious Jeff Saturday era, which could continue.

We don't know. There was a very funny social media thing that everybody should watch Jim Mersey retweeted it with a skit between Ballard and the GM and the owner about the hiring process. I thought that was very funny. The Colts and the Arizona Cardinals who are still looking. So the Colts are interesting as we connect the dots here, Randy, in that they're apparently blocking their defensive coordinator, Gus Bradley, from interviewing for jobs elsewhere,

which makes you wonder, okay, are they just going to plug in an offensive-minded head coach maybe after the Super Bowl? Yeah, very well could be. I'm struggling to make heads or tails of what the Colts are doing. When I read that they're going to do a third round of interviews, I almost think they're stalling for time. And the fact that neither franchise has hired anybody, first thing comes to my mind is, well,

maybe they're going to hire a coach that's in the Super Bowl now. And so that's why they're waiting. I don't know if that's true or not. You mentioned really what's going on with the Colts and Jeff Saturday. I mean, if they wanted to hire Jeff Saturday, they could have done it a long time ago. So I don't think it will be him at this point. I know there is some opinions out there that,

differ from that. I do think that they will continue to talk to people and that they may indeed wait for a coach after the Super Bowl. You mentioned Shane Steichen, the Eagles offensive coordinator. The downside to him is that he's a Frank Reich disciple. He's going to have heard all about the Colts from Frank Wright. The other thing is that makes sense with what you said about them blocking the Gus Bradley movement is that they were both together at the Chargers. I was there with them. So I know Gus Bradley well. I know Shane Steichen well. I can. could understand them wanting to work together, and Gus might indeed be a Shane Stike in first choice. So there's some different, you know, sides of the coin to look at what they may or may not

do. You tell me, I don't know. I just, I'm having trouble connecting the dots other than to just say, hey, they're going to wait to last the Super Bowl and hire one of these guys who was participating in the game. Here's the question that came up there. You've been in these searches. So how many rounds of interviews are there? Like, how does this go?

You know, sometimes we've seen hires get done in two days. and you're like, that was determined, you know, a month ago. That was a bad process. If you just have your best process, I mean, how many dates do you have to go on before you get married? Well, I've never really gone on three, and I've spent a lot of time with guys. And we hired a coach in, well, I've hired a coach in Seattle, hired one in New Orleans, hired one in Miami, or was involved in all three of those searches. I can't think of any that went to a third and prolonged decision.

Now, some people say, well, they should have, you know, but I don't know. I think once you gather, once you gather the information and can qualify the personalities and extract the information that you need to make sure you're aligned as a franchise, that's number one, and that you have checked the boxes of the criteria that you have set yourself, I don't know why you can't pull the trigger. So, you know, I don't know. I think the Colts are going to wait. I don't know what the Cardinals are doing. I'll be honest with you.

That one is even further down the tracks for me. where I don't understand that at all. Well, but to me, Vance Joseph's going to be involved in one way or another, either as the head coach or the defensive coordinator for a Mike Kafka or someone who's still playing in this thing, because we've seen a lot of movement in the defensive coordinator market, and we've seen Igero Ivor, you know, was asked out of Denver, right, and got out. So if Vance Joseph wanted out or needed to get out to get in on one of these opportunities,

that would have happened. So I think we can see he's in there playing one way or another. or we talked about that even before, or maybe around the time Cliff King's Rue was hired, we were speculating that possibly he could even be the head coach there. So maybe that's not going to happen because it already would have. They must be waiting. But I think when I saw like Brian Flores go to Minnesota, some of these guys who might have been in the mix, I just think kind of like what you were saying with the Jets, you know,

and it's maybe not the most attractive situation for one of these top quarterbacks. as a head coach, Arizona, was last on our list, at least on my list of most attractive ones because of Kyler Murray. Yeah, it's probably the case. That was the elephant in the room there. And again, we said that he's not going to work for every offense. And that's probably been a discussion with all of these candidates. Is there any jumping off platform in the Kyler Murray contract?

And I don't know the answer to that. I think that will come up at some point because you're going to want to run a certain offense. and in more cases than not, it's not going to be a Cliff Kingsbury-style attack, which is what Kyler has been, you know, performing under the last two or three years. So I don't know. I think it's a hard one because I do know Monty, Awesomefort, the GM that got the Arizona job, and he is a great guy, a very good team player, going to communicate well with most of the building. I wish that he could hire the guy he wants, and I don't know that he's not,

but it has taken a while to get to this point. And maybe it's been put on, I won't say put on hold, but maybe the brakes have been pumped just because it's Super Bowl week, Mike. You know how the league is. They don't really want too many of these things to come out and overshadow what's going on in the Super Bowl city. And so maybe they kind of have in their back pocket what they want to do and they're just going to wait until after the game to announce something next week.

Yeah, I think it's got also probably involved, at least one of those cases, someone who's in the game. So we'll see that. On these coordinator moves, you know, one of the interesting things that the league did in 2020 was incentivized teams to promote minority coaches by giving them third round picks, you know, when they leave. And we've seen this offseason the 49ers have gotten three third round picks for Rand Carthon leaving to be as a general manager candidate for Damiko Ryan's leaving. And so it was just kind of interesting in looking at some of these coordinator hires that have happened. Other than Vic Fangio of the Dolphins, you have Steve Wilkes to the 49ers,

replaces Demico Ryans, Brian Flores goes to the Vikings as a defensive coordinator replacing Ed Donatel, Giroiro, as we mentioned, went to the Panthers, replacing Phil Snow. Joe Woods lands with the Saints, reunited with Dennis Allen. They were together with the Raiders in 2014. We're seeing Eric Bienmi could meet with the Ravens for an offensive coordinator job after the Super Bowl. Desai has been requested by the Broncos as a defensive coordinator candidate. So that's kind of interesting that there's a, you know, a push to add and maintain diversity in the ranks with the incentivized third round draft picks. And, you know, it seems to be working.

Yeah, I would agree. I think it's definitely working. And if that was the idea to start with, I think it would have to be a success because it's happening. that way. If it allows you to consider a more diverse group before you pull the trigger on any of these decision-making positions, I'm all for it. And I think most of these guys are very well-deserving of it. So hopefully that continues. And you're right, a team like the 49ers have gleaned multiple third-round picks for people that have left their franchise in decision-making roles over the last two or three years. So I think they've done well. We've seen the Saints do it on GM fronts.

So I think it's actually been a good direction and some good guidelines that the league put forward that we were all a little skeptical on when it happened. But I think you'd have to say it's working at this point. Well, and certainly Steve Wilkes, as you said, probably should have got the Carolina job. Certainly it was deserving of it in that case. So he's somebody now in the mix in a really good situation with the 49ers where you can have some success. Maybe he can actually, maybe this is a springboard he needs to get a head coaching job that he deserved off of how he coached this last year. Brian Flores with the way that it ended in Miami. He's a prime candidate.

Maybe it's the dust settling on some of the legal stuff that's going on, but you've got to think he's going to get a second chance at some point. And then, Jero Evro, to me, was, you know, shoot, it was supposed to be tougher on defense in Denver when Fangio left. I thought he did an excellent job. So maybe he's an up-and-coming one, and they have talent in Carolina, Randy. I mean, he could be, he really could be in a position to get a head coaching job if it goes well there.

Yeah, no, I agree. I think that Steve Wilkes may have fell into the catbert seat, to be honest with you. If he wasn't going to get the head job in Carolina, who would not want to sign up to coach the 49ers defense, who may have some of the best players in the league all on one side of the ball and have Kyle Shanahan run on the other side. So that's a great scenario and great point by you in that these guys are operating now in a position of leadership, but it's the next move. And that's what we all want to see is some of the minority candidates get consideration and actually get some of these head jobs. And they've positioned themselves currently for that,

and they'll be able to do it again in the future. I'm convinced. And there's been one hired in this cycle. And if you look at the history of hiring, basically to grow the numbers in the head coach ranks, you need two hired in a cycle to make progress. Yes. It's been about 15, maybe 20% of all the hires

since the Rooney Rule came. So if you have an average of six openings in a year, and one gets it, you're just sort of treading water. if it's two, which seems like a reasonable expectation, two of six. I mean, you're growing then, and you're raising those numbers, like we said, with some candidates here who are promising, and in promising situations, at least Minnesota and Carolina, I mean, at least San Francisco and Carolina, the Minnesota one's a little interesting to me for Brian Flores, isn't it to you?

Because I don't know that it's, is it the player scheme fit? Maybe it's just a total rebuild or restart on that side of the ball where they have so many veterans who have been playing one way, or does he come in and reinvent what he does? I just think that's an interesting one, an interesting place for him to go. Is that, or was he established enough as a head coach that he doesn't need to have a top 10 defense to get a look? Is that what it is? He just gets a coordinator job and he's fine.

Well, I think at some point they all have to have success, but I do think you increase your odds of getting a head job when you just read off five, minority candidates got coordinator jobs. Well, that's a good thing because probably one or two of those guys are going to end up moving on, which is the same rationale that any of us would use, no matter any condition was set. So that's pretty normal. I don't know about the specifics of Brian Flores, tying him to Minnesota. I thought Minnesota, and we talked about it, they've been, they've had the rabbit's foot in their pocket for the last year, in my opinion, and now they've got to prove that they're actually good enough to carry on.

And I think Brian Flores does do that for him. I think he'll bring a determination of grit, probably a little bit more of aggressive style than they've had. And so they need some change there to get over the hump because, let's face it, regardless of their record, I don't think they were good enough. And I do think Brian will bring a little different demeanor and mindset than they've had. Okay, before we get to the picks and wrap up,

let's dive into the highlight of the show. It has to be the GM notebook. What do you got in there? I don't want to put pressure on you. Well, we hit on a bunch of them. We talked about Aaron Rogers. Yeah, we've got an angle on, yeah, I see in here maybe you've got another angle to it. What do you got?

No, not necessarily. I do think Aaron's going to end up somewhere. And I had mentioned the Raiders as a likely spot. I also think Tennessee. I think that's a likely spot. Would he love to come west, of course? But I just don't know that there's going to be anything further west of Vegas for him to come. And it's obviously going to be an AFC team.

I can't see Green Bay ever moving him to an NFC team. that doesn't make a lot of sense. So that was on my list. We talked about Daniel Jones and his market value. The other thing that we had in the same note was we touched on it a little bit was Gino Smith. Gino Smith's not going to have a demand. And he's not going to get to free agency to where he's going to break the bank. He's going to end up being a role model, a nice fit for Seattle. I think where you've got to be careful if you're Seattle is that you can't overpay for slightly over mediocrity, you know, and I like Gino. He's been great. I just don't think it's, there's a big enough body of work that you would go pay crazy amounts of money to keep him,

because I know what the options are out there. And could they find somebody like that? Maybe and not have to pay crazy money to, but I don't think there's going to be a big demand for Gino. I really don't. He's, he is what he is. And the drawback for anybody else paying Gino besides Seattle is that he's worked in the dark for eight years or however long it's been. There is nobody that's going to, outside of Seattle, value him at $30 million a year. They're just not going to do that. They're going to, they will see the downside of why did we give Gino Smith 30 million? Seattle, he's more valuable to Seattle than anything else is what I'm saying.

And so I think he'll get a nice deal to stay and both sides will be happy. Yeah, I was going to say on that one, he's, he's made $17 million in his career. It shouldn't be hard to give him more than that on a deal that commits them for two years, you know, and isn't anything over the top, keeps that number healthy for their team and lets them add pieces, but also just gives him a level of wealth he hasn't had. Yeah. They're not going to have to bid against somebody other than themselves, so they should get a fair deal. And I think he will be happy to get a fair deal.

Like I said, he will double his career money the day he signs the new deal in Seattle. The other one that I had in the GM notebook was, and I was on Chicago radio station earlier this week, and, you know, they're all stirred up because they have the first pick there. what do the bears do with that first pick, whether they trade it, how do you feel about Justin Fields, and all of those type questions. And it just made me think through, and we hit on it a little bit earlier in that these quarterbacks that have been deemed first-round picks by media types and other people outside NFL offices is one thing. But the NFL will probably not necessarily agree with that at the end of the day. And so you can't really make a decision what you would do with that first pick. If I was Chicago, I would keep

all options open. In all likelihood, I couldn't draft a quarterback there. I don't see really one that would make me excited about it, but you can sure talk about them and maybe someone else will decide that they're worth going up to get. I don't know that at the end of the day, Chicago is going to be able to come out of that spot. I think the fairy tale is that they can move out of that spot and get a whole bunch of stuff by moving down six or eight picks. I don't think this is the year that that's going to happen. So I think the other thing they've got to be careful with is they've got to, don't want to trade out of the players. You don't want to go below the elite guys.

So they may end up being stuck right there, not stuck. I mean, they earned it. They'll be right there and really get a really good player for them. And I don't think that should be a disappointment for bear fans just because they haven't found a way to one, get a great quarterback or two, turn that pick into a whole bunch of other things. It may be a year where they just have to sit tight, grin and bear it, no pun intended, and pick a really good player, whether it's a Will Andrews,

or the defensive alignment from Georgia or something that will be determined to be top of the heap. And I don't think that's a bad thing. Yeah, you know, that was going to be in my topics for the predictions in my Monday column. And I just, I wanted to say that they would end up holding on the pick. But then I just thought it just takes one team, you know, to make a different evaluation, right, and decide that they're going to do it. you know, they're going to go up there. I wonder what you think about this.

Do you think Bryce Young's stock goes down at all through the offseason process as he has seen next to these other prospects who are bigger physically? Yes. Yes, I think it will go down again. It can only go down if you had him rated up there to start with. So down compared to where the outside evaluation, waiters have him. Yeah. I don't think the NFL guys have ever had them up there, and I think that's the misnomer. Nobody's looking for that. But I do think that could carry over into what happens with

Chicago, because I bet you Starbucks right now that they end up sitting where they are, making a pick, and it's not a quarterback. That's just the way I think this draft's going to be. And we're sitting here, what, February 10th or whatever it is. So we're a long ways from there, but that's just a hunch on my part. Yeah, absolutely. Okay. Randy, we've delayed it as long as we can. I mean, making an incorrect pick on the Super Bowl, I think you and I just ought to have a deal where one of us picks one and one on the other, and then the football GM got it right. We can claim that we got it right.

I mean, that's probably, I would probably let you go first on that, just to make sure that in the interest of the podcast, we don't go over. I'm going to pick the Chiefs, Mike, and here's why, and I know they're a slight underdog. I don't think the Eagles played great last week. I don't think they, yeah, I don't think they are at the top of their game right now. I don't think Jalen Hertz has played at the top of his game since the shoulder injury. And not that Pat Mahomes is 100% healthy.

I just like their options better. These two teams didn't play this year. They played a year ago and Kansas City dominated them. I just think that I'm more apt to take the Chiefs in this case and roll with Pat Mahomes at 80% just because I like the style. I like their approach. And they've proved to be fairly successful against a similar Eagle team a year ago. Yes. Now, since then, the Eagles added a top receiver in A.J. Brown, and then we subtracted Tyree Kill.

But I was kind of hoping you would do the Eagles so that I could then go on the Chiefs. But we're just going to roll the dice. You know, I was in Vegas the other night, you know, Randy, for the Pro Bowl and Shrine stuff. And you saw some people there. And I was staying at the Bellagio Hotel. Okay. So you have to go through about a million tables and shoot by nighttime. the limits are $100 a hand.

You're not going to find Sando down there. Unless, you know, I mean, I'm not looking to get divorced anytime soon. So, but I decided on the last night when I was all packed up, I would go down there and play a little blackjack. And I'd made a donation. I made a donation to the belage. They don't look like they need donations. I mean, that place is glittering.

I'm sure they took your money, but they don't need it. They took it. The lady's, the dealer smiled. You know, she was very friendly. But I was out of there quick. I got to bed early because I was not sitting there with piles of the money. But I think I would do too. And by the way, the Eagles, I think right now are favored by one.

I'll go with Cincinnati, too. And, you know, I said, you know what? I was thinking of Cincinnati because I picked Cincinnati last week. I picked Cincinnati last week. And then I got schooled by the one thing I was afraid of was that it was Mahomes was sandbagging. That we were all worried about his injury. that guy is really as special, isn't he, Randy? He's nails. He's unbelievable, and he showed that.

How many people have we seen over the last five years, 10 years, say, an high ankle sprain, they're going to miss a month. Some of them miss six weeks. This guy didn't miss anything. You didn't miss a game, okay? I didn't miss a throw. So I have to actually say it out loud because right now I could say I didn't pick the chief because I accidentally said Cincinnati. So I will pick the chiefs and I'll take the point, take my chances with Mahomes.

I like your reasoning on it. They've been able to prove everyone wrong, every step of the way. And I just feel like Mahomes' legacy almost commands a win right now. You know what I mean? He and Tom Brady are the only guys to go to three Super Bowls in the first six years of a career. And the amazing thing is, you know, Tom Brady had some really great defense. It's not taking anything away from Brady. But they were playing a different style and a different era with really good defensive players.

and they have some good defensive players in Kansas City, but they haven't had a top half-ranked defense, and he's doing this. And that is what really stands out to me, and that's why I think he really is on top. I think there's a gap between him and anyone else in the league. Do you agree? Yeah, I totally agree. I think he's been the best.

I think there's been people that have made runs at him. I think the consistency by which he performed this year set him apart. And he has had some misses in prior years where he'd take a two-a-three-week hiatus, He didn't have that this year. So I think he's the best. And for that reason, I'm all in on him for this game, too. Well, that means everybody should go bet on the Eagles. There's no doubt about it.

We have jinxed the heck out of the Chiefs. Apologies, Chiefs fans. Better grease those light poles in Philly because it's going to be a big celebration there after the Eagles win the Super Bowl. So thanks everybody for coming along. Mike Sandow here. You can find me on the Athletic on Twitter at Sandow NFL.

And you can find Randy Mueller at Mueller Football. and on Twitter at Randy Mueller underscore. Anything else? No, I'm ready to roll. I'm ready to see a good game this weekend. Looking forward to it. Okay, thanks. Talk to everybody next time. This was The Athletic Football Show.