The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Football GM: What’s next for Colts & Jeff Saturday, Packers’ problems continue, Cardinals begin in-season Hard Knocks & more

Episode Date: November 10, 2022

As Jeff Saturday and the Colts prepare to take on the Raiders, Mike Sando and former GM Randy Mueller try and make sense of what happened this week in Indianapolis. Then, they talk about the Packers�� fifth straight loss before looking ahead to Mike McCarthy’s return to Green Bay. They also dive into about Tom Brady’s comments on the Bucs “effort,” the Cardinals debut on in-season Hard Knocks and much more.Follow Mike on Twitter: @SandoNFLFollow Randy on Twitter: @RandyMueller_Subscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTube2:30 Jeff Saturday named interim head coach of Colts23:08 Packers tone on field amid losing streak33:47 Mike McCarthy returns to Green Bay37:58 Tom Brady calls out Bucs “effort”41:35 Cardinals begin in-season Hard Knocks48:02 GM Notebook59:52 Week 10 Picks Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Football Show. Welcome, everybody, the Football GM podcast here on the Athletic Football Show feed. I am Mike Sando, senior writer for the Athletic, along with Randy Mueller, three-time former GM and current GM. Randy, how you doing? I understand you've been pulling a little double duty here. You've been down in Dallas with your XFL job, flew back today. How's that going? We got a lot to talk about today.

We're going to the colds. Well, I'm sure people are waiting with bated breath over the XFL stories. No, we are. No, it was great. It was the first time, you know, those that don't know, I'm involved with the Sea Dragons here in Seattle. It was the first time we were able to gather and get together and do some things. So we've got a big draft coming up here next week. So it's a, it was nice to get back in draft mode and kind of building a board and things that you do your whole life that, you know, you kind of miss.

So it was great. I like the process of exactly everything that goes on getting ready for a draft. And so this was part of that. So it's fun. You know, one thing I'll say about Randy is, you know, I talk to so many people in the league and guys who've kind of go out of the league. And usually when people stop being with an NFL team, they're really good for a year. And then the year after that, they're a little further away. And by about three or four years, I realize, geez, I'm not talking to them as much anymore.

And the thing I love about Randy is, like, you have that itch. and you always want to do this, and you're always watching the film, and you're picking up stuff on things that are going out, just like you would have been if you were still with the Chargers five years ago. And, of course, you prove it now by getting this XFL job. So it's in your blood, isn't it? I mean, you just like to do this all the time. I figure it's a spring league, right?

And fishing stinks in Idaho in the spring, so I can't fish or hunt in the spring, so what the heck, you know? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Well, let's fish and hunt for some topics here, which we don't have a hard time finding. We're definitely getting into the Colts with the Jim Mersey stuff, hiring Jeff Saturday. There's always, seems like there's always Packer stuff.

Cardinals and Rams are little interesting to us this week. The Bucks are too. The GM notebook is here, of course. Randy's got a few things there. We'll get to our picks. But without further delay, the new coach of the Colts has not been coaching even since Saturday. How about that? Jeff Saturday has not been a coach since Saturday.

and he is the coach of the Colts. I loved what our Bob Kravitz wrote here. I sketched this in looking at that post conference. On the left, he had generally... It made me laugh. This is great visual. On the left, you had the general manager for now. Chris Ballard, his arms crossed, wearing a stern visage,

looking like he'd rather be anywhere but there. Next to his rambling team owner, as he tried to make the case for why any of this makes sense. In the middle, you had the owner referencing sausage making, nuclear science, rockets to Mars, the CIA, comparing Ballard to Michael Jordan, and Jeff Saturday to Don Shula, Tony Dungey and Bruce Ariens. And on the right, there was poor Jeff Saturday, who must have been thinking, what in the hell have I gotten myself into it? I know, Randy, it's part of the job. You've sat up there for some awkward press conferences, I'm sure, too, but maybe nothing like this. I've never seen anything like this. And I liked you, Mersey, too.

And it still made me laugh like crazy. And I wasn't really laughing with them. I was kind of laughing at the whole atmosphere that they approached, you know. And then it was awkward, not only that part of it, but then Jeff kind of laughs. They all laugh like it's a great deal, you know, like, well, how could anybody ever question this? I've thought through this a little bit, Mike, and I don't even know where to start. And I like Jeff as well. I'll say this.

I've known Jeff Saturday a long time. I was probably one of the few guys that was at his pro day at North Carolina, his senior year when he came out. And all I remember was walking around there. They had it on a Saturday morning, I believe, walking around all the drills. And an old time scout for the Cardinals, a guy named Jerry Hardaway, who is just a slightly bit less grumpy than Fred Sanford, but kind of the same look, you know. You kids out there, Google Fred Sanford, man. Oh, yeah. And Jerry was awesome.

And he walked around that, and Jerry was kind of in charge of the pro day. So he's calling out the times. And he kept saying, weekend, 5.48, you know, weekend three shuttle, 4.20, you know. And I'm thinking, who the hell is weekend? What's he talking about? It took me about 10 minutes to figure out he's calling Saturday weekend because it was the weekend. And that was his name. So he was calling Jeff Saturday weekend during his pro day the whole time.

Maybe my Idaho education came in. but I couldn't figure it out for a while. And then I laughed like, hell, when I figured out what he was talking about. So I go way back with Jeff. And I'll be honest, I watch Jeff every day. I think he is great on TV. I think his takes are usually right on. He understands the game, and I get it.

Yeah, yeah. So I have no problem with him or him, you know, I guess figuring he's qualified for this job. Where I struggled with the whole thing was seeing it from the coach's angle. I would not want to be a coach to. that hallway that the owner walked by and hired a guy off the street who had no experience and brought him in over the top of all these guys who have done this their whole lives. And I felt like it was an opportunity for Jim Ursay to do something different. This wasn't, you know, what I would have done by any stretch of the imagination.

And it was almost, I thought, a disrespectful move for the rest of not only the coaches there, but coaches around the league. And you mentioned I've been with coaches the last few days and I've had a chance to talk to a few more on the phone. To a T, everyone kind of has the same response. So that may not even be fair to Jeff putting him in a position like this. But there's a narrative out there that this is kind of disrespectful to the league, disrespectful to the job, disrespectful to Shield and everything. And I understand he's a former player.

And we give those guys a lot of operations. opportunities, but I think there was a lot of ways that Jim Mersey could have gone with this, not even to get into the minority part of it, which I think is a whole other topic that I wished he would have done. But it's, it's, it's opened some source for a lot of people in some conversations that I've had around the league for sure. And one of the biggest frustrations that coaches have with other people in the building, frankly, sometimes it's some, some, especially with an owner, is they know the owner doesn't really know what it takes. I don't really, the owner doesn't really know football.

I don't care if Jim Mersey's been around football for 50 years. He doesn't really know the way the coaches know. And so that aspect of it is always frustrating because you're, you're trying to explain to them. And at a certain point, look, it only matters if you play good on Sunday at a certain point. And if you win or lose, that's all going to come in over time. But this just seemed to show, with no disrespect to Jeff Saturday. No, I get it. Yeah.

A fundamental misunderstanding, though. or disrespect for or disregard for what all goes into this job. It's hard to, how could anybody? I don't care if Jeff said it's brilliant. I'm sure he is. To just walk in in the middle of the week and say, let's go play the Raiders. Yeah, let's go. I just think it was a disrespect for the amount of knowledge that you build over time to get that seat.

And not that Jeff wouldn't get it, but I got news for you. The NFL is not the place to go with on-the-job training. Trust me. I've seen GM struggle with this. Guys that have been two or three seats removed from being a GM, made the gym, they struggle. It's, I'm telling you, it is, you know, the old adage, Mike, when the guy with money meets the guy with experience, the guy with experience usually ends up with all the money. And that's the way these things go. So experience is expensive.

And that's, you know, I don't, I'm not saying he can't. Let me ask you this. Would you feel different if it was, say, Peyton Manning? as opposed to Jeff Saturday, and would we have a different spin on it? Just curious. You would still be criticized. I think it would be, yeah, it would still be criticized. It may be criticized less.

I don't know. I feel like. Because he's a quarterback or because of Peyton Manning. Here's what I feel about with Peyton Manning. Here's what I feel about with Peyton Manning, just from my knowledge of people that have played with them and have been on those staffs. Unlike anybody else that I can think of, includes Tom Brady. Aaron Rogers, he kind of coached the team and ran practice.

Now, I don't know if you think maybe I'm overstating that, but they did things on his schedule, his way with his attention to the details. And so he might be the only one. And that's been done before, Norm Van Brockland, Hall of Fame quarterback. Yeah, he went straight from playing to coaching the Vikings. Okay. And so it had that has been done. And so I think if it had been Peyton Manning, I would have been a little bit more intrigued from the, wow, you know, because Peyton Manning will actually call the plays.

Do you think Peyton Manning could go in and call the plays? If they were running his offense. Or do you think that I'm overestimating what Peyton Manning could do? I don't think anyone can really walk in for outside the building in the middle of week 10. I think that's a hard thing for anybody. That would be, shoot, that'd be challenging enough for John Fox, who's right down the hallway and knows everything they've been doing all week. Yeah, I mean, how about that? That's a whole other angle.

John Fox and Gus Bradley, how'd you like to be those? Yeah, the Manning thing, Peyton is interesting. I mean... I've thought this, and I can share this, I think. It doesn't really matter at this point. I've thought in all my time in the NFL, I would have never recommended a player to go take over a team without any experience. He's the one guy that I've thought about for years might be the guy to do it, Peyton.

Now, this hasn't had to do with Jeff or that situation. For a lot of the things you just said, I don't think he has any desire to coach, so I'm not even there. But maybe that's the next move for Jeff Saturday to help, or say, hire Peyton, you know, at some point. Yeah, I think whatever Peyton's doing, he has to run the whole thing. Yeah. And I think that would be a two-edged sword with a lot of maybe bad in it, too. You know, it's hard to do. The Larry Bird syndrome of he wasn't the coach because he ran the whole thing too, and it just didn't come across right.

Yeah, and how can you do it to Peyton standards? I mean, there's one Peyton Manning ever, you know. Yeah, that's right. But so the interesting thing about that is the fact that I even gave it potential credence of, oh, that might be interesting. Like, who would be, who would be closer intellectually to Peyton than Jeff Saturday? He's probably the next closest thing. I'm just saying.

Peyton Manning that he ran the whole, a lot of stuff goes through the center. Right. Not every center. He's the communicator. He is the, besides the quarterback, he's the communicator. Didn't these two get in a scrap one time over calling a front? And it was on national TV and they were yelling at each other. It was great. Now, I watched that again today. You should check it out. You did. Jeff Saturday, rant. It was awesome. But see, here's the deal. Peyton knew he was miced up that day. Oh, he did. So later they had him on the sideline saying, yeah, we were miced up. Now, Jeff Saturday, I watched. Jeff Saturday was on the Pat McAfee show like a year ago. And I watched that. That was a lot. So a year ago, Jeff Saturday doesn't know he's going to be the coach of the coach. They asked him about that.

And he goes, yeah, of course they made the quarterback look good. But they didn't know was that on the next series, after we ran the ball and scored, like I said we should, Peyton gave me a hug and said, yeah, you know, you were kind of right. Which he could have been embellishing. He's probably just making that up to get at that. But that is an interesting component of this. See, here's what I thought was happening was. I think by far the biggest surprise to the Colts and the biggest disappointment of the for them this year, right or wrong, maybe they mis-evaluated their own, but just the

offensive line. Okay. They have three guys in that line making $12 to $20 million a year. And even though they didn't rectify the left tackle position, they've got a guard, a center, a right tackle making money. And I think that was the one thing that they were pinning everything else on was, hey, Matt Ryan may be declining. he may not have a fast blow anymore,

but if he can step up in the pocket and deliver, he can still do that. And I believe that he could. Because I went to their training camp, and when they weren't hitting them, it looked a lot better. But you know what I mean? Unfortunately, yeah.

Unfortunately, though, they've had a bad offensive line. Not just, it's been a really, really bad. So my thought was that Ursa, no one just didn't have to be dangerous, probably always wanted to have Jeff Saturday coached the line. Or, you know, he's an extension of how, Howard Mudd, who I know and you know 10 times better than I know, or new, rest in peace, Howard Mudd. But that he probably wanted Saturday to coach the offensive line.

He probably feels like the line needs to be coached better. I think that was mentioned at some point in that press conference around it, that they had tried to hire Jeff a couple times. But Jeff Saturday is not going to come off of the set of TV to coach the offensive line. Yeah. But for eight games, maybe does he think that he can fix the offensive line now? And can he, Randy? Could Jeff Saturday come in and help the offensive line? Or is that a pipe dream?

I think he can help the communication of it because he will understand that. Here's the one positive that I came up with. So I agree with you on that. The other positive I came up with for them making this move was it, nobody else on the coaching staff or in the building has to adjust at all. Obviously, the offensive play caller who they've hired, who I've never heard of. But the rest of the guys, Gus Bradley,

Everybody's doing their same job. They're not adjusting at all now that Frank Reich is gone. So nobody comes out and takes on a different role or a different job at all. So it's status quo. So they don't have to. You know, normally if they put it. Yeah. They put an injured guy up and they move up.

Yeah. And the collar on offense is Frank's right-hand man, by the way. People haven't heard of him, Parks Frazier. But he is a, Parks Frazier was a player. up until about 10 years ago. And then he went to, I believe, Samford as a coach and got to be buddies, got one of his old high school or college teammates to coach with him. Then he left.

And then that, I believe that team recruited Doug Peterson's son as a quarterback, Drew Peterson. And so Drew, Drew, that other assistant who was good buddies with Parks Frazier ended up going to win in a Super Bowl with, uh, with, uh, with, with the Eagles and Doug Peterson. And then when Frank Reich left and go to Indy, he asked this guy, hey, who should I get? And he said, Parks Frazier. That's my guy.

So Parks Frazier from day one, I believe in Indy, has been right-hand man, started out as kind of the assistant to the coach, but was doing the game plans and putting together the wristbands for Peyton. And then he was on the headset with Nick Siriani and those guys. And he was, you know, calling out the coverages and that type of stuff. and he's been like the number one guy that Frank Reich has gone to. So he's not an experienced caller.

He's a former college quarterback, but he's as close as probably almost anyone there to Frank Reich. To your point of we're not having a bunch of other guys move around. Right. No, I agree with you. I think everybody is in place. And so I guess that was the only positive I came up with in that if Jeff takes over Frank's chair, nothing else changes.

Nobody else's chair changes. Nobody else's responsibility change. So if you want to keep the status quo, this might be a closer move to that than anything else they could have done. I can't wait to see him play. I mean, this is just so weird that I just see. I'm the other way. I don't really care. I think that's, who cares?

Really? You know, I wish I could. Pardon me? What if it's a disaster? What if they beat the Raiders? I mean, I don't want to watch a train wreck. I mean, they're bad. They already fired the coordinator two weeks ago who incidentally doesn't call the place.

So I'm not sure what they're planned. is to be honest with you. But what if they beat the Raiders? What does that say? Because we're going to talk about this whole week. There'll be one of seven. There'll be one of seven this year that beat the Raiders. But all week we're going to hear, oh, this is a disrespect to the profession.

And I get it. What if they win the game? I don't think it matters. I'm not a week-to-week guy. So I understand there are people that are. I am not a week-to-week guy and going to react to week-to-week. Let's get back to me after Thanksgiving sometime. We'll see how it's going.

One of the things after this happened, you know, the Apple does. and far from the tree fall far from the tree. I tweeted this out. I looked it up because people were saying this is, this has got to be the wildest coaching thing ever. There's never been anything like this. I said, you know what? I bet you ain't the wildest one in the history of the Colts. Because Jim

Ursay had a dad by the name of Bob Ursay, who you think Jim Arseille is off the charts here. This guy was even more off the charts and there was a story back in 1974, okay? Howard Schnellenberger was

coaching the Colts. And the owner of the team, Jim Mersey's dad, during a game, went down to the sideline and tried to tell Howard Schnellenberger to change quarterbacks. Howard, you might imagine, Howard Schenenberger told him where to go. So it... I wonder if he took his cigarette or cigar or whatever out when he told him that or just carried on with it in his house. Told him where to go. I'm sure it was very choice language, told him to F off basically, right? So, okay, the owner goes back to the box, but he gets the last words. So the owner, the game ends, the owner goes down to the locker room and announces to the team that Howard Schnellenberger is fired. He fires him. Fires Schnellenberg. They get into it in an office there. And not only that, he names Joe Thomas,

who's the GM, he names him the head coach. Did Joe know? Joe, I think, had been trying to reach him before this happened to talk him out of it, because Joe had never coached college or So he'd been a high school coach 25 years earlier, okay? So Joe Thomas, the GM, was named the Colts head coach and had a two and seven record, I think, the rest of the way. So something like that. So there's always something weirder almost that has always happened in this league. Isn't it, Randy? You're around long enough.

You think you've seen it all, or you think something's never happened before? There's probably something even crazier. Oh, no, no doubt. It's a wild and woolly business. and there's always something that I just, you can't make it up. I couldn't have made this up in a million years either. So let's try to look forward now just a little bit on them. What do you think the future means for, you know, Saturday,

you think it's just an eight gamer and get us through? What do you think for Ballard, Chris Ballard, the GM future? Is it, you know, obviously I would think this was a Jim, or say, move to hire Saturday. I wouldn't think that would have been Chris Ballard's first choice. I mean, maybe I'm wrong. But has Ballard already sort of been by? bypassed and, you know, cut off a little bit here, or is it a wait and see till the end of the year?

What do you think? I think they're trying to, and again, I don't know, but I think they're trying to float the boat for these eight or nine weeks, and then they can recalculate. You know, it's mayhem has got the wheel and taken over, not just Saturday, but just mayhem in general. And we're going to run this thing its course for eight or nine weeks and then reset the button. With regard to Chris, I don't know. I've known Chris a long time.

I like him. They've got off kilter on their evaluations. There's no doubt about that. So some way, somehow, Chris has got to prove that he can evaluate and that he can team build. Because that part of it, doing it on paper is one thing, but it's got to be in conjunction with what the coach wants and the schemes he's going to run. Frank is, for everything Frank is, he's also a loyal to a fault friends and family guy. You told the story of the assistant coach that came with him through some loyalty program.

Frank is always like that. And he's been that way with his quarterbacks. But guess what? Those are the moves that you lose credibility with. You know, when you swing and miss at quarterbacks three, four times. And you're stuck with, you know, what they have now. I mean, that doesn't build credibility. What part in that did Chris play?

I don't know. Maybe Chris wanted no part of it. I don't know. I don't think we know because we're not inside the building. But I do know this. when you have chaos hit you like this, and I've been a part of it, you've got to recalculate and recheck your own ego, and you've got to recheck your own structure of your people around you, and you've got to get it right somehow, some way, if, if Ursae allows that.

I did think Rick was likely to get fired after that game, but aren't there fireball games? I mean, when you see a game, you go, sometimes you go, how can Frank Wright come back and coach him the next week? I felt that. Right. Well, when they fired a coordinator two weeks ago, why would you allow that if he'd even thought about firing Frank? You wouldn't, you know, so I thought Frank would be good set for the rest of the year, but maybe, like you say, it's maybe he had no choice because it was that bad. It was a, yeah.

Yeah, he must have saw it the same way. Well, and I think he had a choice, but I just think of an Ursa type. You know, there's just, that type of guy is going to just, that's it, you know, and that's the way it was. That doesn't take away from the comedic value of that press conference, though, because I laid there and watched it a couple times. It's good theater. People should check it out. It's funny. And Bob Kravitz, he hit it on the head.

I was thinking of, I was actually thinking of, you know, I would say of the three people up there, you know, Ballard and Saturday would be the most sort of logic-driven, you know, regular type of process-oriented, you know. you know, take some pride in how they do things, you know, in their professional and personal lives, right, attention to certain details. And they're sitting there with Ursa. I was just thinking, what are the, I would love to have the thought bubble of what those guys were thinking while Ursa was talking. And that's just the nature of this. If we still had newspapers, we'd have a cartoonist at work on that. That's for sure. Yeah.

No doubt. Well, hey, we got more cartoons going on around the league. Let's talk about the Packers a little bit. We've done that a lot this year, but for them, five losses in a row. You know, shoot last year if they lost two or three in a row. For most of the last 15 years, they lose two or three in a row. That would be a panic situation. But they've lost five in a row.

Certainly the Aaron Rogers stuff, we think we'd all agree to not have a good game against Detroit. And there's a lot of stuff, obviously, that contributes to that. But it feels like it's getting a little bit worse. Detroit, obviously, a bad defense. They've got a $58 million. Not bad, Mike. The worst. The absolute worst, statistically, right?

Yeah. Yes, absolutely. So Rogers for next year has a $58 million fully guaranteed option bonus. The team has to decide also this coming off season in May whether to buy a fifth year in 2024 of Jordan Love, who hasn't really played. That would cost $19 million. If they pulled the Nersay there, Randy, and said, all, you know, everyone's out of there, Mueller come in, you've got to plan our next, the next two years of this team.

What are you thinking right now, given where they're at and kind of a little bit locked into Rogers, who kind of is the problem but isn't the problem, right? He's probably still their best player, but it doesn't look real good. Yeah, I know. I agree with you. I think it's, if that were the case, and I'd never thought about it until you just mentioned that, it probably would be good if they did had a fresh set of eyes on everybody. You know what I mean? mean on everybody to see if we can change some things and do things differently because there are the one franchise that stuck in their ways and always have been we talked about them not making a deal last week we've talked about the way they've gone after not gone into free agency you know

ted thompson did it for years um which kind of surprised me because ron wolf wasn't afraid i mean he signed uh players and had players to come and got got it turned around a little bit but they went back away from that um i would say this if in charge everything would be on the table you've got to put everything including the quarterback on the table because right now there's no accountability you can tell that he can talk to talk but you've got to walk the walk if you're going to talk to talk like he's been putting out for the last couple years so he can say he got the best grade from the coach what's the quarterback coach's name Tom what Tom what Tom everyone's first name basis yeah I don't know yeah he got the best grade from Tom well I got news for

you he didn't get the best grade from Tom last week I can tell you that so We all need to wake up. A couple of those throws were not Rodgy. We need to wake up and smell the coffee a little bit here and wake up to what we're really facing day after day. I sat down, Mike, to watch this tape a couple days ago. Actually, it was Tuesday morning, so I've lost track of the days. But three plays into it, I shut it down.

Really? On play two, Alan Lizard runs a little crossing route and he doesn't make the catch. And he gets up and starts to yell at somebody else. Lazzard did? Yes. He starts to. react and go kind of and then the film cuts off but he was clearly frustrated at something play two of the game yeah yeah the third play rogers throws a little uh curl pattern where one of the lions

defenders reaches in and knocks it down and actually makes a really good play on it he gets mad and slams his fist down that's the third play of the game wow so we are already frustrated and sending negative body language if if i'm the lions they go off to the bench and they say hey this isn't what we normally see against the Packers. Now, they're already frustrated. Three plays in. Three plays in. So the negativity had already started.

I don't know who it's toward. I don't know where it's going. But it's negativity is exhausting. It drains your whole team of everything you have. They started it on play two and three with screw ups by somebody to frustrate a couple of their playmakers. So I felt Aaron Rogers, 100%.

And I've been a big supporter of Rogers because I think he's great. I think that he's been a victim here, too, with their terrible receiving core. I'm not excusing that. But I think in light of all of that, he could do a much better job of how he carries himself, how he leads, how he projects. And he's always had this part in him, but he's played so well and they've been so good that I don't think it's mattered, really, frankly. But this has gotten to a point now where he's contributing to the negativity. It needs to be leading these young guys with the bottom. body language.

And because if he's doing it, then they're doing it. And I think, you know, ideally you would have, you'd have a stronger head coach who could take charge of it. That's a hard situation for somebody like Matt Lefleur. It's not his fault that he didn't have a bunch of experience or skins on the wall when he got the job, right? I mean, he's in Aaron's shadow. Right.

And it has been. He doesn't carry the swag that Aaron does. Yes. Yeah. So I think that that is. a completely fair criticism of Rogers now, and he needs to pull them out of that. Yeah, I agree.

You only watched the first three plays inside. I watched the whole thing, and it got worse and worse throughout the game and pouty, you know. I just don't know how you could think that that would be an effective form of leadership. We all get frustrated. Hey, I was in charge of a dolphin team that lost, I think, 11 straight. one year to start the season. I've been there. I know what losing does.

We've all been part of other losing streaks. It happens. But stop being a baby. Let's grow up. Come on. Be a professional. And I remember one time we were getting waxed in a game by somebody that season. And the coach, I happened to be in the locker room at halftime.

Well, somebody had gotten hurt. And he said, what do you think I should tell him? I said, just tell him to be pros. We're all getting paid to do a job. Stop with the drama and all the braddy brat stuff. And let's just play and be pros. I don't think there's enough of that in this day and age because everybody's afraid of everybody, especially these guys that make all the money. I think they got to stop with it.

That leadership doesn't work. It's not going to get them over the hump, being frustrated and letting the other team see you sweat and be affected by everything you do. Come on. We're adults. Let's go, you know. That would bother me as a GM. I'd love to see Octieri or somebody like that. Just say that, you know, someone who has the standing.

Somebody. to say, what are we doing? We're pouting around like a bunch of babies. Play the game. A bunch of sisters. Come on. What is this? Go high?

We all get our asses, kid. Let's go. We're getting paid to do a job, though. Play better. Let's do something about it. That's right. It's not anybody's fault. It's our fault.

And maybe they have that conversation. Maybe somebody has said that, but it's sure not reflective on Sundays because there's still all this negativity that they put out as certain players. Okay. So let's now go to 10,000 feet. Would you be inclined one way or another? I think what I would do, my thinking would be, look, we're sort of locked into Rogers for another year, and I think he can still do it. But we've got to have a little bit of a come-to meeting, and then we really need to upgrade it, get some receivers.

And I would try to make a run next year. Would you say that we're too far down the road, and you would want it be more inclined to start the rebuild now? Well, I don't think you have to rebuild to get better. So I don't think anybody's tearing anything down if, like you say, they're tied to him probably for another. of the year. I'm not saying I want to get rid of Aaron Rogers, but I think they should have been all in this year. I think the mis-evaluation of what they had going this year, especially on offense, is multi-faulted, you know, multifaceted faults all the way across the board, from the team building to the evaluating, to the execution and scheming on offense. It all takes

a blame. But yes, I'm all in. You got to go all in. At some point, you have to mortgage to keep up with the Joneses. You don't have to do what Dallas or what New Orleans is done where stretch their cap for 10 years, they'll never be the same. You don't have to do that. But it sure wouldn't hurt that if we're offering a second round pick for Claypool and another team is too, so what if we give them a fourth on top of it? Do whatever you got to do to get the guy. If that's the guy you want.

So, yeah, maybe we feel like they don't have the ability to do what they need to do to take the steps they have to take regardless. The ability, the mindset, the guts, the what? The direction? I don't know. What is it? What do they need? They don't have an owner, so they don't really have to answer to too many people. So the money's not an issue.

I don't know. Yeah. Whatever they're doing, I think they've got to make an exception. And yet to do, like you said, we've got the two-time MVP. And some of it's his fault, like we've said, but why not try to make a run with this guy? If not, we're going to decide to pay Jordan Love $20 million and Aaron Rogers is $58 million. So I don't know. I can't do that.

I can't do that. We're almost at 80 million now. Yeah, one of the things I wondered is, you know, obviously Aaron Rogers has played at a much higher level in the last couple years than Russell Wilson. But when you look at a team like Seattle that got rid of, you know, what's been perceived to be a little bit of a diva-ish issue and now the teams just rallied and come together, right? You wonder if a team like the Packers would see that they've always sort of been inclined to, I don't know, maybe they haven't always been inclined. but, you know, would you look and see it the effect of a on a team like that and consider it? Or is it a fantasy land situation because Jordan loves is not going to be very good? I don't know, but if I'm a certain Bay Area team, my ears have perked up the last week or two just to kind of see what's going on.

You know what I'm saying? Just to kind of see what's going on. I don't really care about three years from now what Tray Lance is. I really don't. If I had a chance, I might be able to find a way to make a deal if they're willing to deal. Now, I don't know if it makes any sense financially. You got to go through that. You don't want a handicapped return to death.

Yeah. But I see that the Colts did it. The Eagles did it. The Rams did it. They got rid of guys that they just gave $100 million to. Now, this is more money than that. But I just think all things, like I said when we started it, all things have to be on the table. You got to discuss them all.

We can go three and six with Jordan Love. I can promise you. And I'm not saying he's the guy, but I'm just saying that what we're doing now is not working. So we got to put everything on the table. That's a great point. What's the record is going to be worse? So there's got to be something out. In the middle of all this, by the way, too, Randy, Mike McCarthy returns to Green Bay.

I mean, the timing of some of these things are amazing. I know. You can't make it up. The Colts are going through all this and then Josh McDaniels come in. Well, that's who they tried to hire. You know, that would be an interesting week, interesting elevator ride as it is at the stadium. I thought for a while on Twitter today that they might be able to hire Josh McDaniel if they wanted to.

I don't know. Did you catch that? The fake Adam Schaefter Twitter that came out? Yeah. I thought maybe Josh McDaniel could have gone back to the phone. With a new, yeah, with the new Twitter verification thing. It had a blue checkmark on there too. But it said Adam Schaefter not.

So I saw some people in media actually retweeted that. But in the middle of all this, Mike McCarthy returns to Green Bay. and for the longest time the last couple years, we thought, man, that poor guys had to watch, you know, the Green Bay Prosper Bowl, Dallas Flounders. Well, now it's the other way around. It's a pretty good time to come back for him. What do you think about that?

Well, I think what do they say? Life is timing, right? It's all about timing. So he hit this one. Mike's had his share of adversity his first year or so, a year and a half in Dallas. So I'm glad to see that he can walk in with his head held high. He did win a Super Bowl for the Packer people.

So I would hope they would treat him good. regardless of how their beloved Packers are doing. So I think it's kind of cool. I have known Mike, and we've talked about it for years. I root for Mike. I'm for anybody getting ahead if they can do it. And he's earned a chance to do what he's done with the Cowboys, and hopefully they can keep it going.

But you're right, it is kind of a twist of fates with him going back to Green Bay now. Does he drive to the stadium on Mike McCarthy way? I would. I'd have the team come in. You just go turn it and go back and forth. I'd have the team come in on it for sure. The team has to come in on McCarthy way, right? Yeah, I mean, makes sense to me.

Yeah. Go in and anybody wants to take pictures. We'll slow down here at the stop sign to see the stop sign, see the street signs, but just remind them that, yeah, I got a street named after me. So is this an easy win for Dallas or no? I don't think there are easy wins. I really don't, and I don't think this one is going to be easy. I think we're going to find out what Matt Lafleur is made of because he has not faced any adversity.

13 and 3 is fun in games. But where they say it's all fun in games, so you got to wear an eye patch? Well, you've got a freaking eye patch on now. They've lost five in a row. So here it is. It's time to find out what kind of coach you are, what kind of leader you are, and what kind of motivating factor you can be to make a difference on Monday through Saturday. And that's what's going to determine if you have a chance on Sunday, not just showing up on Sunday.

So we'll see. I don't think it's an easy game. I think Green Bay is backed up against a wall now to where they are the most desperate team in the league. And here's the crazy thing about it. If Green Bay finds a way to win a game or two, they're right back in it. I think Minnesota is a little bit on – they got the stars that have aligned, right? I think I saw where this – this week they're going to play their third backup quarterback of the season so far. The stars are going to bring them back, I think, at some point.

So if the Packers can just win two or three games and the old adage is 500 at Thanksgiving, guess what they'll be? Pretty close to 500 at Thanksgiving. So I think the Packers can save the thing. They just have so many issues that I don't know if they can solve enough of them to beat the Dallas Cowboys. But Dallas has been known, as you know, to not handle prosperity well. And they are prospering now. People are all in the bandwagon.

The owner's talking about, you know, OBJ and the deals he should have made that he was hoping to make. So there's a constant beating of the chest, it seems like, out of Dallas. So we'll see. Yep. You're right, though, about Minnesota. So Minnesota, I believe, is 6 and 0 in one score games, you know. So they just, you're not going to do that all the time. So, you know, you think some of that evens out, but they do have a nice lead, obviously, where they're at.

It's a good spot to be in. we talked about Rogers and some of his behaviors. Tom Brady's had his share this year. I thought it was interesting. I think it might have been on his podcast. He called the Buck's effort, the most embarrassing aspect of the team this season. We picked up a little bit on this earlier in the year

when he criticized the team. And I think we talked about it. It was like, geez, he was almost talking like a coach. And we went back and forth on that. Is there a method to this? What do you think of it? Do you agree? Have you watched Tampa?

His comment was correcting our mistakes. improving our effort, which that's probably the most embarrassing part of our team is our effort level on game day. That's something we better fix. That's like questioning your heart. That's like questioning your character. That's something that runs deep. And in a way, it's almost more scathing than what Aaron Rogers has said about not making plays and some of his receivers. This is questioning the crux of why we show up for work every day.

And so, yeah, I think it was definitely calculated. Tom Brady's not going to say this unless he had a. had thought it through and had a reason to do it. And I think he is putting people on notice. Maybe again, like we said about Rogers a few weeks ago, maybe he feels like it's not getting questioned enough by his own coaches and leaders in that locker. Yeah. These quarterbacks aren't stupid now.

They understand where the team is and what kind of needs to be said. And if they feel like it's not being said, they just might say something that they think is sufficing as if, hey, you're not getting this in our own building, I'm going to come out and say it. I don't know. I think some of Rogers to me felt a little more self-serving. Like, hey, I had the best grades. And I feel like Tom Brady's is more like.

He could care less. Yeah. Yeah, Tom Brady is interesting to me. And I'm interested in their matchup this week because, you know, look, they've won a championship. They're a veteran team. And I could see them being like, ah, shoot, we got to go over to freaking Germany. I mean, this is all we need.

What a disruption, you know, all that. And here comes Seattle. Little Seattle. Pete Carroll. Pete Carroll is like, unbelievable. We get to play Tom Brady in Germany. This is a championship opportunity. And, you know, some of those, if it was still Richard Sherman there, so those veterans might be, you know, oh, geez, we've heard.

Maybe roll their eyes. But they're not. They're not. This is, this is USC 2.0. This is a team with energy. I think they're excited to go in there. That makes this matchup interesting to me. It just makes it interesting to me.

Like, who has the energy? It's going to be one of those off-hours ones. We're going to be tuning in at 6.30 in the morning here on the West Coast, 7 a.m., something like that. So if it's about energy and vibe, like you say, I have a hard time not betting on Pete Carroll running that battle because that is his deal. And he's done a really good job.

Plus, they're playing with, I mean, obviously great momentum now. I'm not so sure that Gino isn't playing as good as anybody in the league right now. If they can continue that, I think Tampa's got their hands full. I think it's only like a two or three point game. Tampa's favored. Yeah, we'll get to that in the picks. But I just, just the Tampa vibe to me in watching their game against the Rams, it was a freaking struggle.

Yep. I mean, and they were able to get it. Yeah, they were able to get it in the end. And we'll talk about the Rams a little bit. But it wasn't like you watched that game and said, okay, Tampa, look out. You know, you kind of went, oh, someone had to win that game. And the Rams kind of lost it. No, I agree.

Yeah, that'll be an interesting matchup. I'm with you on that. Yeah, I think that's a fun one. Okay, so the Rams this week are actually playing Arizona. The Cardinals start in-season hard knocks while free falling. Absolutely love it. I'm going to, I'll be on. I absolutely love it.

Like I said, I'm not a negative person. Okay, I'm going to watch this. Trust me. this is going to be awesome i want to see kiler i want to see what he's you you saw the meltdown last week with him and the receiver and then the coach kind of comes in and i just want to see where this is going that's all i watched the trailer today uh now this is you know you uh yeah we were i was saying i can't wait to watch the colts and you were like come on why this is different for uh the cardinals because it's all that behind the scene stuff you know and i don't think

this was really what they were doing but um no remember when they signed kiler murray you know and that clause came out where we, you know, hey, he's got to do his homework, no video games, you know, and then it was removed. Then we found out, or at least it seemed like it was around then, they were going to be on in-season hard knocks. And part of me thought, you know, I think they just want to put the spotlight on Kyler here

and keep the pressure on them if they're going to pay them all this money. And now you can have in-season hard knocks to do it. But given where they're at right now. And the fact that their second half of the seasons have been so fruit. Well, yeah. Now, the difference this year is they're adding DeAndre Hopkins, but still, they lost by 10 points at home to Seattle. And Seattle gave them a pick six. So it wasn't even really close. Yeah, it wasn't even close. Yeah, this was a 20 point win, it felt like loss. So a couple questions for you. One, we can just talk about Arizona where you think they're at. But I'm curious to you, like, when the league comes to a team and says, do you want to do in season hard knocks? why would you want to do it and who wants to do it? Well, for one thing, I think you've got to be really confident that you're going to be in a positive state of mind. And so when they asked them this probably last summer or whenever it was or last spring,

even it, usually this stuff starts about league meeting time, right, March or April as who's going to be on there. My guess is the Cardinals thought they were going to be really good. Hey, we're signing the quarterback to a long term. We're signing the GM to a long term. the coach to a long term. So they didn't think there was any risk it at all. Now they got a mess on their hands. So I don't know.

I mean, it's changed because when I was in it, you could say no. I don't know who can say no and who can't now because I think the long arm of Park Avenue leans on everybody to do what they want them to do. You know, I don't know. You know who was in season Hard Knocks last year was the Colts? Could you imagine if they were this year if it was in season? They're going to have the same thing on their hands. I got news for you.

The Cardinals go three and six in this side of the – I mean, they're going to be six and 11, you know. That's not going to go well. How do you justify that if they're six and 11? Did you see today that – I just saw it come out today that the owner of the team watches film with the head coach and the decoordinator week. What do you think of that? I think this, if it's done in a normal course of prep and business like they would normally be watching film, great. But if the coach and the D.C. have to take time away to go watch the tape with Michael Bidwell for two or three hours, I think that's crazy. Even myself as a GM, I would never ask a coaching staff to do that.

And I understood what we're doing from week to week. I felt like I'll go watch with them when they sit down as a staff to watch it. And maybe that's what Michael does. So I don't know the mechanics of it. But if you're as an administrator, whether you're the GM or the owner, if you are forcing them out of their realm just because you're a higher ranking officer, that to me is counterproductive to us winning games. So I'm jumping in with them and watching you getting what I get out of what they're already doing.

So it's not taking anybody else's time. Sometimes as a coach, you know, you're a little bit worried about who is telling the owner what, right? And sometimes it could be they could have a right-hand person who's the salary cap administrator or it could be the GM or it could be somebody else. So I think from a coaching standpoint, if it's not taking time out of your day, it could be kind of nice to have a direct line of the owner. Hey, look, we can explain what's going on for better or worse. Now, in the end, you've got to win. That's true for everybody. but I'd rather be the coach telling the owner why it happened than have someone else saying it in their language and with their, you know, with their agenda.

It was, yeah, that makes total sense. And I agree with you. I was always one as a GM that didn't do as good as I probably could have managing up. Yeah. But nowadays, these coaches make so much money that they're going to save their own livelihood any way they can. And that might make sense to them. That's first and foremost. I would never take away from the team or the production, what we're doing day to day.

So setting aside that time would bother me. But maybe it's most important if this is the case and if this is the dynamics to Cliff that he does go spend his two or three hours with the owner. I don't know. We're surmising here. We don't really know. Yeah. I knew I was talking to another coach once and he said, yeah, like the Mike Brown at the Bengals would do that, the staff. And even when Katie Blackburn, who runs a team now, his daughter, when she was young,

you know, she would be in there asking questions with the coaches. So it's kind of, you know, these teams are set up differently. Some of them are more family operations, whatever. It's just from afar, it's a little unsettling sometimes, I think, when the owners chew involved. But at the same time, I guess if the owner can really get a feel for what's going on better, you know, maybe that's. Yeah, I like the fact that they're involved. I don't have an issue with that. I just don't want to, I want to use.

our time. There's only so many hours in a day. I want to use it to be as process-oriented and productive as we can. And if you have to do this as a one-off each Monday, go spend three hours somewhere else, that would make me nervous being kind of old school and wanting to get going. But I understand the owner, it's his ball. I get it. Her ball. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What's in the GM Notebook this week? Well, we got a couple things. One, one we talked about already was the body language of the Packers, the demeanor, the leadership skills. I just think in this, in any NFL season, you have three or four weeks like this. And remember how I always say, we're all three weeks from a mutiny?

Well, sometimes the mutiny takes four or five weeks, but you get tested when you're down. I think anybody can be a peacetime president. That's just, how can you not? but when it's wartime or when there's bad stuff going on, that's when you find out. I always like to, even in the toughest times and in the best times, be the same.

I wanted that even keel group of people around me, and at least for myself, I wasn't one to react up to a big win or down to a bad loss. I was kind of the same the whole time. Probably not surprisingly why Tom Landry was my favorite coach of all time, because you seldom ever saw a sniff out of him. What you couldn't tell if they're winning or losing. But I like that because I think you get the most out of your people around you because they feed off of you.

And I think a lot of times these, some of the leaders nowadays, there's a lot of up and down. There's a lot of, you know, Aaron Rogers type body language that I just don't like. And I remember Mike Holmgren saying this a lot in our time together in Seattle. And he used to say, do not let the other teams see you sweat. Do not let them see you're hurting. Do not let him see the frustration. and he thought that that really helped the other team motivate him. It helped to bring the best out of them.

It's like a boxing match. When the other guy's hurt, you're coming hard. But if you show you're hurt, you know, that's even worse. And that's what Mike always used to strive for. And I totally believe in that. He used to beat our guys up with it in a good way. But just the way I see it. So I think the negative body language around the league and even the over-the-top celebrations,

I just think it's exhausting for us. Let's save some energy here. Yep. I would like to have a culture where that type of stuff gets called out the body language, where kind of like the coaches would, you've got three loaves, you know, or whatever, where you're loafing on the film or whatever. That type of stuff can't be allowed to creep in. It used to get called out.

It drives me crazy at all levels of football. Those are the things culturally that I would care about more than, what scheme we're running. Like that type of stuff, just how do we do things? How do we treat each other? How do we talk about the team? Yep. How do, that's the most sacred thing you have as your, as your organization.

And to be allowing that type of stuff is you're just coaching it. You might as well be encouraging it. I was never around it to twice to the extent you're talking about. Our good friend that you mentioned earlier, Howard Mudd. Yeah. Howard Mudd had a list of stuff in his office every week. of just that. He would hold guys accountable.

He would, hey, honesty, if you can't handle the honesty, you probably not the right spot for you. So I was around it with him for, I don't know, 10 years or so. Yeah. Two stints in Seattle. But then the king of it was Nick Saban, my time with him in Miami. Talk about holding everybody accountable. I mean, on the film.

Everything every day. I mean, Phil Savage wrote a book from when he was at Alabama is every day's every day's fourth and goal, nothing could be more true. And I always equated it because my guys would say, how is it? I said, well, you've got to tape your ankles every day now. There's no Friday practice, I'm telling you. But having said that, it made me so much better, Mike. I was 25 years in the league, had built three playoff teams out of the four years before I got to him,

had won the executive of the year. He made me so much better because he held me accountable every day I had to be ready. and that doesn't happen anymore. And that's not for everybody. I didn't think it was for me. But guess what? It made me, now I lost 30 pounds, which I guess is good and bad during my time with him.

But he made me so much better and it invigorated me to where if I ever did go on to be a GM somewhere else, I would use a lot of the same stuff that you can't do when you're younger. You just can't be an asshole when you're younger all the time and grind people down. Nick didn't really care.

And he had had the skins on the wall. He didn't care if he was talking. talking to a GA at Holy Cross or in the NFL executive of the year. They got the same treatment. I think of like there's nothing more valuable than honest feedback. And think what you would have to pay a consulting company to come in and be honest with you and evaluate your operation, right? Why would we resist it when it's somebody we know telling us, right? So someone says, hey, Sando, this could have been 50% better.

I'm like, you should be like, thanks. What are you talking about? That's BS. Mind your own business. Well, no, no, no. You can get better. We can all get better on this stuff. That has to be the mindset. And so much of it is defensive and not don't want to hear it. Don't want to be embarrassed. We both spend a lot of time at the mothership, right? I think we can say it. ESPN. I spent three years there. And my most negative thought after those three years, because I loved it. And if I wasn't 40 when I was doing it, I'd probably still be doing it. But I just, I craved the feedback. the accountability, and I got none when I was there. Absolutely none. No one ever told me good, bad, and that bothered me. And this had grown up in football, right, where we were accountable every day. I was with Chuck Knox. I was with these guys who would hold you accountable in every way.

Hey, Randy, those shorts are awful. What do you wear a nose today for? You know, everything. Some of it was personal. But in that mode, and maybe that's the media, I don't know, you've been in it. I just wish they would have been more coaching and would have helped me get better at whatever it is. I have a theory, though, in a lot of, this isn't just the media business, in a lot of businesses, to quote, my favorite quote from Coach Jim Moore, people don't know whether it's good or bad. They only know if it's good or bad if it got good or if it got clicks or if it got this. They don't really know a lot of times if it's good. But in football, the coaches really know. The coaches really know if it's good or bad.

So they can give that type of feedback. But I think that feedback is rare in a lot of industries. I think it's, yeah, I think the mechanics of what we do for a living on the football side make it easier to hold people accountable. I don't think it gets the traction that it once did, though, just because society has changed and we're afraid of the pushback now from that for sure. Because I think I've had these conversations with players as well. And when you watch the tape, you know.

and they'll have the conversation with you because they know you watched it. They know you know. So why would that not make us all better if both sides know the other side knows? Yeah. If that makes any sense. Yeah. Well, there's a lot of dynamics, I'm sure, that go into that, that it's easy for me to talk about. But that's definitely I'm with you and see that.

What's your second item in the notebook? Well, the other thing I got a kick out of last week is all the narratives that came out after the trade deadline about, well, so-and-so offered this and we were pressing hard to make this deal. and I thought we had that deal. I guess, and I'm trying to figure out, why does all this stuff come out now? Is this just like 2022 stuff?

I mean, people have been doing this for years. If I were documented every phone call, I thought I had a deal done, I could have written a series of books longer than the Hardy Boys, okay? I mean, of all the deals we almost made, you know? Yeah. So I know there's more, more platforms looking for information, so everything gets written.

You tell me, why is all these, where are all these things a story? Are we, do we need to get out? out there that we're working? Clearly, yeah, clearly people want, people want it out there, right? Always, when anything comes out that's a report, you know, I always think, okay, who does this benefit, right? Right.

It's really easy when you've been in the business a long time on your side or on my side. I can tell almost, I think I could tell it 90% certainty where everything came from. Yeah, for the most part, that type of stuff. And just figure out the agenda of the source, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. It doesn't mean, yeah. Yeah, it doesn't necessarily mean it's true. true or false, it's just the way that it is. So I think there's a lot of people competing,

you know, competing for information and then a lot of people trying to get their spin out there. So it is what it is, but it is comical. I see your last item in the GM notebook has to do with a certain quarterback who's maybe a little banged up now. He's a little banged up. I like the kid. I think he's a great player. And we're talking about Josh Allen from the bills. I just have saw a little bit of a last couple weeks of the MVP Josh reverting to

drunk Carney Josh when it comes to taking care of the ball. You know what I'm saying? I did the green big game too. Yeah, a couple years ago I say I can't get that out of my vision out of my mind of him in Houston in that first playoff game

where he's spinning around and throwing the ball backwards and I'm thinking, oh man, this is a this is a carnival ride. Well, he did some of that the last couple weeks, throwing the interceptions in the red zone at the worst time. So I'm just saying, I'm not saying he's regressing, but I would say this. I'll bet you this has come up at Orchard Park this week about taking care of the ball.

Josh, I understand you're confident. I understand we can come back from anything. But here's what we can't do. Give away points. And we gave away seven points last week or we'd have probably won the game. So this is just something that it's reared. It said a couple times here these last couple weeks. with Josh Allen, and we're all, again, we're holding everybody accountable, right?

This is the football GM. We're holding everybody accountable. Well, I hope they're holding Josh Allen accountable, too. I think a month ago, we would have said 100% they win that division. If he's banged up, and just from what you've seen with, you know, Miami, Miami's been able to put up points on a lot of people. They haven't been able to always stop. And obviously, if you could combine the Dolphins offense with the Jets defense,

you'd probably win the Super Bowl, the way that's going. But each one of those teams is imbalanced and weak on one side and strong on another. What do you think for, is there a challenger to the bills in that division? Well, I still think they're the best by far, but I think two things. One, Josh Allen's got to take care of the ball. I don't care of who you are. And two, he has to be more aware of the punishment he's putting on himself. You say he's hurt now a little bit.

This guy, nobody takes more hits than he does. Nobody's more fullback oriented than him. I mean, it makes me nervous. And I know he's invincible right now. He's 25 years old or whatever. He's never going to get hurt. Well, just, that would be a hard one for me. You don't want to take the stinger away.

You don't want to take away what's made him the best. I just think it's a matter of time before this kid gets started getting nicked up and gets hurt. And then I don't know what we got. I know this. We got no chance to win the Super Bowl if he gets hurt. So let's don't be too sad. And he's got an elbow now. It's day to day.

I mean, I'm a little, you know. Now it's amazing. Do you see that last throw he made against the jets? It's crazy. I'm telling you, it's John Elway. He's got a lot of the same characteristics as John Elway. I said it in his bioman report at the time. No way is he John Elway, but he reminds me of John Elway.

That thing went 70 yards and hit the guy between the numbers. I know. It's great. It went right through the breadbasket. And I think before that or maybe it was hard out. I mean, his elbow was obviously bothering him already. Yeah. Unbelievable. Well, let's get into our picks this week. We were, we were, we were Jeff Fisher last week. We were 500, which by the way, Jeff Fisher did have a lot of winning seasons.

He did? Yeah, I think he did. He's 13 and 3s in there, which was a Super Bowl. But yeah, they did have a run of some 500s in there too. I was one, one in one. I pushed with Atlanta against the charges. Come on, man. Matt Mariotta's got the guy wide open for a touchdown with five minutes left. but that's why he's where he is. I won with Seattle, where I said the wrong team was favored, got a point in a half against Arizona, really lost with Buffalo. I gave 13 with the Jets. That's my mistake, I think. I think the Jets defense is really good.

So maybe they're not going to lose. I just thought, man, Zach Wilson, I just thought he turned the ball over. But when he doesn't, they're going to be in every game, right? He's a good player. The people in New York need to stop saying every week, What do we have in Josh or Zach Wilson? He's going to be your quarterback for the next couple of years.

So just ride it out. Let's let's play the long game on Zach Wilson. Yep, yep. And you went one-on-one, Randy. You won with Jacksonville against Las Vegas, lost with Carolina. Did I? That was a weird one, yeah. I wasn't anticipating it to go sideways like that either.

But that's... That one went nowhere fast. Yeah. Who do you got this week? Well, a couple games for me. My first pick is the giant. because the Giants lost a tough one, as we both know, to Seattle a week ago. They're by-rested now.

They're at home after this tough loss. I just think they're going to be refocused. They play the Texans who aren't very good. At home, I'm surprised they're only a five-point favorite, the Giants. I thought this was a seven or eight-point game minimum. So I think the Giants win and cover handily. So I'm on the Giants. I think here's why.

Their wins have been by 8, 6, 5, 4, 3, and 1. point. And they only, they never really risk the ball throwing it. So I think they sort of play to get to the fourth quarter. So that will be interesting in this case. Do they sort of get that extra touchdown? You know, because Sequin Barclay going against that defense that Derek Henry had 200 yards on and everybody can run on. Maybe this is the week that they get a win by more than a score than one score. That's kind of, that's basically what you're betting on. Are the Texans blacked out in Vegas? They have not seen any games in Vegas of the Texas? Are they adjusting to some blackout that I don't know about? Yeah. Come on.

Well, sometimes I wonder if they see the teams. Yeah, okay. And then who's your other pick? I got you. My other pick is I'm going to take the Titans given two and a half against the Broncos. I think Tanny Hill's going to play. They'll actually maybe attempt to throw a forward pass. Oh, my goodness.

I don't think we bring up Malik Willis how that is gone. But can we truly say a year away from a year away, maybe a year away? You know, I mean, it's unbelievable. Why would you do this? I don't understand that one as to why are we forcing this? They have Logan Woodside sitting there, right, another quarterback who they've had as their backup. I know we want to get this kid some time, but I want to win some games, man. Yeah, maybe there's an internal poll there and prioritizing.

I'd like to know what's going on behind the scenes there. Yeah. But, yeah. And I think they'll beat the Broncos. Yeah, to go to basically take the chiefs to overtime in Arrowhead while completing five passes, This is pretty special. I mean, that's the first of the year right there. Yeah, incredible.

No doubt. Yeah. And they're two and a half point favorites against the Broncos. So any way you look at it, it's probably the same line of thinking that you just gave me on the Giants. Nobody thinks they're going to score. So it's going to be a 1917 game, you know. Yeah. So I'm going to do Tennessee also.

So you had giving two and a half. I think I saw giving three. I'll take the two and a half thing. I do agree. I think the Titans are just a tough team. Yep. I agree. They're just good.

They'll find a way. I agree. They'll find a way. And then I'm going to stay away from the Colts and Raiders one. I was initially a little bit interested in it. But I'm going to go back to Seattle this week. I think people are not watching them. Yeah.

Because if you take their first four games or whatever when the defense was terrible and you average it into the stats from afar, you think, well, the Brady will get it going against these guys. Have you watched the last few games? Yeah. I mean, I don't know. We'll see. Turnover ratio is incredible. Defense playing way better.

Tampa definitely going to have a game now. The running back? I mean, is, so Tampa Bay can't really run the ball, right? Mm-hmm. And their quarterback, if you look at the rushing that Seattle's given up, it's Kyler Murray running. They're not giving up the back lately. So is Tom Brady going to run?

Yeah, I don't think so. I think this is just going to be interesting. Now, I just think it looks so hard. for Tampa Bay for so long. Yeah. That we'll see. You think the wrong team's favored? I think the wrong team's favorite.

I think it's more of a tossing game. Pick him game, yeah. But I just don't feel very good about Tampa. Yeah, I agree with you. Now, I also, you know, we'll say on the Seattle side, Gino Smith had two or three balls that really could have been picked last week. And he did, one of them got picked six. So he has to protect the ball a little better in some of these throws that he had.

Yeah, their margin for error is less against. Tampa than it was against Arizona for sure. Yes. And so he has done some really good things in some of the other games, but I felt like for a 10-point win, they also had some guys wide open down the field, and I think his Reed just took him to shorter stuff, and maybe he even did the right thing.

But that did prop up on me, you know, come to my mind a little bit this last week that there was some balls being batted around that he shouldn't have thrown in the red zone. So this is a test for him, too, against the better defense. I just think the energy is with this Seattle team right now. And just watching Mike Evans

get sandwiched and struggle to get up and Brady calling out the effort. Pete Carroll's not calling out the effort with those guys. Those guys are playing fast. They're hungry. They are fast. And it just looks like, yeah. So we'll see.

Those are my two. I got you. I don't disagree with either one of those. Of course, I have one of them. I have the same pick on one of them. You have one of them. Yeah, yeah. Maybe they're the same pick

that I'm picking. against Russell Wilson in Denver, and I'm picking for the team that moved on from Russell Wilson. Maybe we're still on that. I don't know. Maybe I should be wearing a wristband during this. That's a whole other topic. That's a whole other podcast.

Petero can't help himself, it seems like, little comments. But anyway, hey, thanks everybody for listening this week. You can find Randy Mueller's work at mueller.com. You can find him on Twitter at Randy Mueller underscore. You can find me on the Athletic Mike Sando and on Twitter at Sando NFL. You got anything else, Randy?

No, I'm good to go. Ready to put it in the books and watch some more football starting Thursday night. Yeah, it should be fun. We'll talk to everybody next time. This was the Athletic Football Show.