The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Free Agency Week Roundup: Justin Fields to the Steelers, Keenan Allen to the Bears, Aaron Donald retires, Vikings pick up another first-round pick, and more

Episode Date: March 18, 2024

We finally caught our breath on Friday of free agency week, only to be bombarded by news during a roughly 30-hour window. Aaron Donald, arguably the greatest defensive player of all time, retired. The Bears traded for Keenan Allen, then traded away Justin Fields. The Vikings picked up another first-round pick in this year's draft. And, somehow, that wasn't everything. Robert Mays and Dianna Russini wrap up free agency week on this episode of The Athletic Football Show.Follow Robert on Twitter: @robertmaysFollow Dianna on Twitter: @DMRussiniSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTube Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Football Show. Welcome to the Athletic Football Show. I'm Robert Mays. Joining me tonight, the senior NFL insider at the Athletic. Diane, how are you? I'm good. I broke every single screen time record I've ever had in my career. So I am pumped after seven days of just being all up in my phone.

And I look forward to just sitting in a dark room. I'm going to do what Aaron Rogers did last year and just go to this dark place for a few days to kind of reset and recharge once all this gets set. down. Our jobs are very different. And even I feel like I'm so glued to my phone during last week, even like I have trouble sleeping because it'll be on my nightstand and I'll just know that something could potentially be happening. So I should continuously wake up like every hour and check my phone. And I can't even imagine the fact that you actually have to live like that for those five days. So it's very very different, but even I feel the blowback. Your mind is racing because you're putting together takes and thoughts and probably, you know, kind of racking your brain

going to some of the historical moves that we've seen because you're so great at that and probably already thinking about contracts and all the great stuff that you've perfected. For me, it's obviously just trying to collect the information, share information, and of course, break the stories. So this last few days, and thank goodness I have great training in this space of, it was almost like having a newborn again where you wake up in windows. for feedings. So when you have a little baby,

and you bring the baby home from the hospital, that first few weeks, so it's like three to four weeks, you're getting up every two, three hours. So I've been doing that for the last three years. So two years, excuse me. So I was like, I got a little baby again.

So I was doing these little windows. One story, actually, I was in a deep sleep. And my husband got up to go to the bathroom. And he just like, oh, my gosh. I'm so tired right now. I forgot which story. story it was. And I jumped out of bed. It was during one of my like earlier windows. But either way,

you figure it out. And there was so much action at night this time. It was. So, you know, depending on where you lived and, you know, where you were finding out the news. I know for the East Coasters, it felt really late that a lot of this breaking news stuff happened. But yeah, it was an awesome free agency. I had so much fun this past week. It's one of my favorite weeks of the entire year. Obviously, we do a show pretty much every single day. We didn't end up doing one on Friday into Saturday because Mike and Randy were doing football GM. It's like, it wouldn't really make sense. They're going to record a few hours later anyway.

We'll let them handle it. And then I sit there on Friday. The Aaron Donald news happens. Friday night, the Keenan Allen trade happens. So all of this stuff rolls. And I'm like, oh, man, I really want to talk about all of this. And I had to wait two days to do it. But thankfully, we have a little bit of time and a little bit of space to hit all the things

we couldn't over the last couple days of which there is plenty to dig into here. Yes. And that's the good news about this is, yes, the big gigantic tsunami is over, but there's still going to be a lot of blips between now and the draft. In fact, I expect a lot more action to happen as we get closer to the draft to see what these teams are going to be doing,

such of those teams that are in the quarterback market, we're going to see some more trades to move up. So I'm sure we're going to get to all that in a second here. And the Vikings trade, I didn't get a chance to talk about. So all of this stuff we're going to hit today, but let's start with something that Mike and Randy couldn't even hit because of when it came down,

something very important to me. Justin Fields officially traded to the Pittsburgh Steelers. Before we get into that move, the value of it, I just wanted to take a brief second to talk about the last couple years and what the Justin Fields experience was like. Because obviously, there was so much talk on the Bears' Internet over the last three, four months about what they would do, whether they should keep Justin Fields. I think I'm on the record as saying that this is a unique opportunity. It's the way they've talked about it every single time. that Ryan Poles has been in front of a microphone. They have the number one pick.

They're in a spot where I think it would be irresponsible to not use that pick on a quarterback. And that always felt like the most likely path to me. That doesn't mean that Justin Fields didn't give Bears fans in the city of Chicago more excitement at that position than I think I've probably experienced in my lifetime. I mean, obviously the J-Colored trade was incredible, but that era always left you a little bit cold, always wanting more. having a guy that was a homegrown pick have those moments of excitement. Ironically, that Monday night game against the Steelers comes to mind. Some of the things he did as a runner in that second season, that doesn't mean this is not the right move for the Bears. Because excitement doesn't mean sustainability at the most important position in sports.

And their ability to kind of pivot to this to draft Caleb Williams and get everything they've gotten in trades over the last couple years. This is always the most likely outcome. So when you saw the initial news of the trade, what was your first reaction? I was surprised they got it done, actually, because I knew the market just was not good for him. And I was talking to so many different GMs around the league, just trying to get an idea, A, if they were in on it, but also if they knew of other GMs that were in on it and what they were hearing from just, there's so many conversations that are happening during this week that I don't even think fans can comprehend. And it's not always specific to what that team's need is.

Everyone is just sharing information and collecting and trying to see of how they can get, I guess really ahead by using that intel. But that being said, so many different types of people I was talking to around the league just kept telling me the same thing, so much so that I felt like I kept going back to my text messages to see if I was making a mistake, meaning, wait, didn't I just ask this yesterday? I did, but I have to ask it again because I just believed that his market would get better somehow because I do have a lot of that Chicago fan base in my ear, I think, and also on Twitter, that made me believe, well, maybe his market should be better. And I'm being lied to

by ever all these guys. Maybe that's what it is. Everyone's lying to me. His market's actually great. And that just wasn't the case. So, look, I understand in the city of Chicago, this was a really difficult few months, I think, just for the fan base, because of those things that you speak of, of those blips, those, those moments where you saw him on the field and you thought, this is it. This is the guy. They got the right guy. But I knew from my conversations with sources in that Chicago building that they've moved on. And there wasn't a similar conflict mentally or emotionally. It was a lot clearer in the building by the decision makers than it was by the fan base. So I think when I saw it, I actually felt relief.

That's exactly how I felt. That was the number one emotion. Correct. It was like, thank goodness, especially because I went on our colleagues' podcast on their local Chicago one. And I just was talking to them about the situation. And they asked me a very simple question, which was, you know, do think that Justin Fields is going to stay on this roster or are they going to trade him? And I was completely confused by the, I almost told them to stop recording because I said, you don't mean to ask that, right?

Like to me, it was just from an outside perspective from covering this team at a national level. It was just very clear that they were moving on from Justin Fields and also obviously having conversations, my job to collect it and know it. So the relief I felt for fans as soon as I saw, unfortunately came at such a horrible time when so many Bears fans were out partying for St. Patrick's Day. But hopefully on Saturday night, the parties were even better taken to another level, knowing that, look, it's going to be tough to break up and move on. But here's what I know.

Just like in any relationship, the best way to get over the person that you just broke up with is get a new one and get a better one. So maybe for this Bears fan base, the hope that Caleb Williams is the answer. Hopefully they're sleeping better. I think a lot of Bears fans look at what happened over the last couple years and see a franchise. that failed Justin Fields in a bunch of ways. And I think multiple things can be true at the same time. They did. They did not put enough around him in those first couple years to give him a chance to succeed.

And this is the cost of misalignment as an organization. They trade for Justin Fields in the final year of the Ryan Pace era. Those two guys get fired. Ryan Pohl's comes in with Justin Fields in his second year with a roster that is an absolute need of a teardown. It was one of the worst rosters in the entire NFL. Well, his biggest incentive and his obligation was not to make sure Justin Fields succeeded. It was to set up the bears for the best possible future they could step into over the next couple years. And even if you look back at the free agent class of 2022 and some of the players they potentially could assign to put around him,

they weren't missing out on much. At receiver, at left tackle, you know, Tehran Armstead has been hurt consistently for the last couple years. Christian Kirk got $18 million a year. There weren't a lot of options to make sure you could put the right pieces around Justin Fields. And I think the way that Ryan Pulse handled this and the timeline he handled this on, making sure I want to position this team as good as possible for 2024, 2025, and beyond. That's exactly what he did. The Bears would not be in a position to have DJ Moore, Caleb Williams,

one of the best situations you're going to drop a top 10 quarterback into in a very long time if he had leveraged himself to build the right team around Justin Fields in the moment. That was never his charge coming in after another regime drafted him. So it's possible that they did not do enough to help him succeed, and this can still be the right move. Both of those things can be true at the same time. And I think people have struggled to come to terms with that. And you mentioned Ryan Poles a lot here because he's obviously the general manager, and he's making significant decisions.

But let's not forget that Kevin Warren has a very loud, strong voice in the decision-making at all things Chicago. Bears, not just stadium conversations, not just what was happening in free agency, but obviously this movement that they made in terms of trading him eventually to the Pittsburgh Steelers. So I just think that you have new voices, people that are learning each other. They took the year to evaluate and figure out what was best for them. And in their mind, it was obviously to move on from Justin Fields. And I can't wait to really dig into some of the other side of this because, you know, I do want to

talk about just the overall thought about Justin Fields over the last few weeks. I think the fact that the rest of the league just knew that Chicago was wanting to move on from him. So that's my question here. The market that did not materialize, do you think that's more rooted in the way the league sees him as a backup? Because I think that obviously has played a role here, but also teams knew that the Bears were in a terrible position. They had zero leverage in this. So the final price of a sixth round pick, conditional one, going to Pittsburgh, is that more about the way the league views Justin Fields or how everyone saw Chicago in this negotiation. Robert, the second Ryan Poles picks up the phone to call teams about Justin Fields,

they immediately lose their leverage. Everybody and Indy knew that they were trying to move this guy, everyone. So because of that, you're going to have to know that you're not going to probably get what you were hoping for. There's a price that comes with that when everyone has that information and that knowledge and they hear, they hear how you're handling it, right? Now, at the time, it sounded very kind, actually, of Ryan Poles saying, you know, we want to do what's right for Justin, right?

We want to do the right thing that could help him. So other GMs around the league heard that and they said, all right, well, they want to get this kid out of the building now. They want to move so he doesn't have to be around all of this. And so they can start doing their work on Caleb Williams and have. all these meetings and all this hype towards the draft and he doesn't have to be a bear anymore. And all of that was used against the bears in the end here, which is why we saw what very little value really they got for Justin Field.

Now, second part of that is that the reality of how Justin Fields is seen. I don't believe so. Now, do I think that all the quarterbacks that we saw get traded during this last week or so are better at the quarterback position? No, I don't believe Sam. Howell is better than Justin Fields. I think that's a difficult pitch. But at this moment, the Bears business side took a hit because everyone knew their, everyone knew their cards. I also think that the fact that no team was willing to stake him as their starter, that's undeniably

going to affect the market. The moment that the Raiders were deciding, okay, we'd rather pay Gardner-Minshoe, the moment that the Vikings said, we'd rather pay Sam Darnold. Those seats got filled, it's inevitably going to drive the price down. And then you consider what the fact that Sam Hall is two years left on his rookie deal, the fact that Kenny Pickett does in a backup market, those are two cheap years where Justin Fields only has one. So I think it's all a combination here. And Courtney Corona from ESPAN reported that there was a better offer on the table for

Justin Fields to a team with an established starter. The Bears preferred to send him to Pittsburgh. Again, Ryan Paul said he wanted to do right by him. I don't, I'm not going to say, I said this yesterday. I'm not going to sit here and lose sleep over a sixth round pick compared to a fourth round pick if that's what they could have gotten. Getting him out of the building, not making him kind of flail in the wind here for a few more months, I completely understand it. So from Pittsburgh's perspective, what do you think this means for them after signing Russ to that minimum deal with the situation that he has going in Denver right now? Well, before we get to Russ, I actually want to stick with what you're talking about, how Courtney was reporting about other teams having interest and better offers on the table.

I wasn't able to get that information. And that this, by the way, Courtney has the information. Somebody told her that. I just think there's a lot of spin going on right now. That's just my opinion. Sure. I think right now everyone's just trying to make the bears look like they handled this in the classiest manner. I think Justin Fields, who I think has completely handled this situation in the highest way he can.

Even just his goodbye to fans, I thought was tremendous. So look, I don't think Bears fans should be frustrated that there was a business decision made because of their feelings for Justin or feeling like they needed to do the right thing for the player. Essentially to kind of what you're saying, I don't think it was anything significant at all. What I do have an issue with, though, and this is something that's been discussed with other teams, as everyone's been watching this, and this came up last week, was just, you know, the tiny, of all this, right? Why not go to Justin and say, look, we're drafting Caleb Williams. You're going to be the backup. And you essentially have him in the building here.

And you wait for another quarterback to perhaps go down during training camp. We see it every single year. We saw all of last year how many times a quarterback was needed. Think about the kind of value Chicago could have received then. What was the urgency? What do you think that value really is, though. Because that's my question here. If we look at the, how much do you think a team really would have traded for Justin Fields in the middle of the year when so many of these teams were willing to, Josh Dobbs went for nothing when he got traded. Joe Flacco was signed off the street.

A lot of these teams weren't willing to leverage actual draft or use actual draft capital to seek out a position when their guys got hurt. So I wonder what it actually would have been. Like let's say they keep on the roster till training camp or during the season. Like what is the best pick you get back if a starter goes down? But think about the quarterbacks you just named, right? Josh Dobbs, Joe Flacco, of course you're not going to give up a lot for them. Joe Flacco is my age. Josh Dobbs, you know, up and down. We've seen little spurts.

I think Justin Fields would be considered, you know, a significant upgrade from the traditional backup quarterback that would be available if this situation that we're talking about, this fake scenario of a starter going down in August, or something like when we saw the Jets last year with Aaron Rogers, would they have been willing to make a move like that? And I don't know what the price would be, what a team would be willing to go. But you just, I just got to believe based on how I knew the league saw Justin Fields. Do I, did I ever have this thought that he was a first round pick? No, no, but there was a time. And this is the truth. There was a time. The conversations around the league were he was going to go for a second or third rounder, right? So at some point here,

Before everyone sensed that Chicago was desperate to move him, his value was higher because of the player. So I think when you throw that situation in with the team that would be desperate for a quarterback, I believe the Bears could have gotten more. I think that's probably fair. My question is it would have been worth, because I wouldn't have wanted to make him wait that long. I can understand trying to do right by him and saying, we're not going to make you sit through training camp. We're going to let you start over again, have a clean slate, have an offseason somewhere else. I get that part of it.

Not waiting until the draft, I think, is the question that I would raise. Is there a team that doesn't come away from the first couple rounds with a quarterback that's in need of one? But really, the only team that came to mind for me that hasn't done anything at quarterback and potentially could have needed one was the Broncos. So if the Broncos didn't find one in the first two rounds, would they have been willing to give up a little bit more for Justin Fields to allow him to compete for the starting job? What do you think about that? I don't believe that Justin Fields' style of play fits in what Sean Payton is trying to do. Go back to everything Sean has done over the years and what he prefers. Now, do I think if Justin Fields is on the roster and he has to make it work like we saw him do in New Orleans,

all those different quarterbacks when Drew Brees went down? Yes, he would figure out a game plan to fit into the strengths of Justin. But I think for him, now that he's completely fully in the driver's seat there in Denver, now that Russell Wilson has moved out, he wants a high processing type of quarterback there that resembles what he has done and had success with in New Orleans. And I don't believe that that would be Justin Field. So where does that leave Denver right now, right? Jared Stidham is on the roster.

We know how they feel about him right now. They think he's good. I don't believe that they think he's great. I don't think they think he's the future. He's workable if they need him to be. Correct. It's a solid quarterback to have right now at this point. But here we are now, okay?

Sam Howells traded to the Seahawks. Can you pick it to the Eagles? Can you pick it to the Eagles? Sam Darnold, from what I can gather, was one of their top targets that they, who they were going to go after once they moved on from Russell Wilson. He goes to Minnesota on a one year $10 million deal. Denver's not paying Sam Donald $10 million to go play there. No way. That would have been a bigger surprise to me.

than anything else probably if they did do that. But just knowing how they see things, I don't believe that would have happened. All right. So who's available, right? So then Joe Flacco winds up with Indy. Joe's obviously been in Denver before. I thought actually there was a moment where that would have made sense,

but obviously they did not make that move. So every single time I saw a backup quarterback go last week, all I kept thinking is what are they doing in Denver? What is their plan here? you have Zach Wilson still sitting on the roster in New York. Okay. So is that something he'd be willing to do? But then in my mind, if you're going to get Zach Wilson, why wouldn't you get Justin Fields?

Justin Fields is better than Zach Wilson. Okay. Then you have Ryan Tannahill who's still available. That's an interesting one. Yeah, that one makes the most sense. To me as well. My understanding, what I had heard about this is that Ryan Tannhill's made a lot of money playing football. I don't know if he's necessarily going to be thrilled about taking a backup quarterback salary to go to Denver or play somewhere on the cheap.

But at this point, it might be the only thing he's left with if he wants a role in 2024. That was my sense of the situation. I don't know what you had heard about it. Or he pulled a Jay Cutler to Miami thing where he just waits and waits and gets a big fat deal and gets to step in and be the starter again. You know, obviously we saw he lost his job in Tennessee to Will Levis. And, you know, he was pretty bummed out about it. And I never had any inclination from the times I've spent around Ryan that he was trying to hang it up or he was done playing football, not at all. Like he still wants to play.

So I am very interested to see if Denver's going to make that move this week, if they're going to be willing to get in and maybe trade for one, which again, you know, I think the Zach Wilson has some upside. I do think it would be very comical, obviously, because of the backstory there. Yeah. I'm trying to take another former Denver quarterback here to try to improve him. Denver, excuse me, Nathaniel Hackett, you know, the connection I'm trying to make there and try to make that work. But I think he would have his work cut out for him, in my opinion, if Zach were to go there. But we'll see who they wind up on because, you know, is there a player in the draft

that they're looking at right now that they believe in that they'll be willing to give up picks for. So I think Denver's obviously certainly a place that we're going to be watching. Putting a bow on this, everything about that response and the fact that Denver would not be interested in him, that leads me to the conclusion I'm reaching here about Justin Fields. There aren't that many seats out there. There aren't that many teams that even if when the draft ended would potentially be willing to give up more for him than you were going to get now.

So if there's not a team post-draft where he's only sitting there for another month, do you have the stomach to have him sit there on the roster in the locker room? with Caleb Williams all the way through training camp and waiting for something to happen, I can understand not wanting to live that life if you're Ryan Poles and not wanting Justin Fields to live that life. That relief that we felt when that move happened,

I guarantee you they felt a similar sense of relief. So not having to deal with that. But they built it up themselves, though, Robert. They did it. The reason why we feel for the fans so much is because we've been watching how they've been operating. If Ryan Poles came out at the combine during his media availability and said,

we haven't made a decision at the quarterback position. We're standing pat. We still believe in Justin. Justin is a top-notch quarter, blah, blah, blah, whatever PR thing or narrative they need to push out there. So teams go, hmm, maybe they do like him. Okay, maybe he is better than we thought. But the fact that they just had their trash out on their front lawn and going,

hey, come take it. You know, it made it very difficult. So either way, like you said, I'm relieved for Justin. I'm relieved for the fans. Relieved for this front office from that side of it. But I am always going to wonder, could they have maybe been a little bit more patient and played poker a little bit better here to get a better deal? Ultimately, he goes for a conditional sixth. It will go to a fourth if he pays more than 50% of the snaps. The barrier to that is that the Steelers have let everyone in America know over the last 24 hours, apparently, that Russell Wilson is still the starter in Pittsburgh. What do you make of this very strong messaging that seems to be coming out of Pittsburgh that even after trading for Justin Fields, Russell Wilson is going to be their guy in 2024?

I can get very snotty during this time of year because I'm stressed and I'm tired. And I received information from a source that essentially said the same thing. And it felt very volunteered. It felt very put this out, which that's a whole other conversation to have of weeding through why people. people want you to put information like that out. Right? So here's what I think. By the way, I did not put it out.

And I think everyone got the point. No one needed me to tweet it. There's a lot happening here. I saw a little nugget. I think it was earlier today about how they're going to work toward an extension after by the time the season ends. It's like, why? Like you have him for nothing this year.

I just don't understand it. Do you remember what Philadelphia did with Carson Wentz, Robert? Do you remember all the tire pumping? Do you remember all the narratives that were around him to make him, feel good. You're our guy. We love, like everything to feed into the ego and the confidence, the mental side of this, the psychology.

I, it is March. Talk to me in October. I just think this is what they need to do, what they have to do. This is obviously a conversation they must have had with Russell before he signed. So they're just sticking with the word and they're just going to live in this space through camp so they don't have to answer questions. about a quarterback competition. They got out early and let's just see how it goes.

Now, I believe Russell is a better player than Justin Fields right now. I do. And just and Russell will most likely be the starter week one. I believe that to be true. Do I think that this will, Russell Wilson will last the whole season? I don't. I can predict. I almost feel like I should make a bet.

We will see Justin Fields play for the Pittsburgh Steelers as a starter. It will happen. And he, come on, the edge this kid must have, the chip on his shoulder. I bet you he has the best off season in terms of just the work he puts into it. And then, you know, you have the other factor in this. Okay. So you've got Arthur Smith, the offensive coordinator. And gosh, don't you just think it's so interesting, right?

You have you have Arthur Smith who, you know, we got to know him more when he was with the Tennessee Titans, right? You have Marcus Mariotta there. You're Ryan Tana Hill. And then he goes to Atlanta. And we, we seen him attempt to make that work. Doesn't have the most success, but we saw snippets of it.

But I never got the sense covering Arthur Smith that a Russell Wilson type was the kind of quarterback you'd be into or a Justin Field. I don't think either of these guys are the type of quarterback that he would be into. You're going from that to now these guys are going to a coordinator that I'm not even sure he's the best marriage. So all of this to me is just. it's so bizarre. And here's what also makes it crazy is the last time I spoke to you,

and we discussed the Pittsburgh situation at quarterback, I said to you, they're not interested in Russell Wilson and they're not interested in Justin Fields. I said it because I knew it because I was told it by Pittsburgh. They obviously changed their vision. This is a value play. They got both of them for free. That's exactly what this was.

They got both of them for free. And they said, we're going to take the guys for free. free. And I understand building it this way, right? Russell Wilson is not one of the five worst starters in the league. Like, if you look at what he was in Denver, even if there was a lot to be desired, you can have workable NFL offense with Russell Wilson. You're paying him the league minimum. I get that. And Justin Fields is a free dice roll. You give up a conditional six-round pick. You get to drop him into your offense. I honestly, I think that you have a better chance of fielding a league average passing offense with Russell Wilson. I want to see Justin Fields, though. I want to see Justin Fields,

though. I want to see Justin Fields in that Arthur Smith rushing offense with that offensive line the way that that group played last year. I just think the dynamic element that potentially gives you is more entertaining to me. But neither of those is a great plan. Again, these are marriages of convenience and value. That's what it feels like the Steelers have done here. You don't win games because you've got a good deal on two quarterbacks. But that's exactly what they've done. That's why I still think that Kirk Cousins was the best move for them. Because I think that's the only needle moving thing they could have done at quarterback this offseason, but that's not what they do.

That's not how they operate. This is how they operate. And look, let's see how it comes together. They may, we may be talking about this in November going, holy cow, what a smart move this was. But until then, and if this doesn't work out, they're in a tough position. And then on top of it, they aren't dealing with the quarterback who just ended a, his time in Denver, and it wasn't good, right?

He had a head coach who was essentially pushing him out the door by September 20th, if not earlier, right? So I wonder about his psychology right now, where he's at mentally in all of this. He's had to lose some of that confidence. How do you not? That was a really rough go for Russell Wilson. And Justin Fields, right? So, you're fragile, they're not fragile, but they've been through a lot.

It has been a taxing year in terms of how they probably think about themselves, how they think about their futures. And again, if you're Omar Khan here and you're making these deals, you are going to get value out of these guys. If Russell Wilson plays 17 games, he is going to give you more than a million dollars worth of quarterback play. But does that matter? Like, if you get marginal value out of this, does that move the needle for you as a franchise? And I think that's the biggest question about the Steelers. I think that the plan initially, as I understand it, is that Justin is going to be, used in situational packages, right?

Like you'd be silly not to use his rushing ability and the athleticism that he brings. But other than that, it feels like Russ is going to be the starter until proven otherwise until they run into some sort of wall there. So we'll see how that ultimately goes. It just goes to show you how quickly things can change. Fans get so mad when reporters are putting on information and like, oh, you're wrong, you're wrong. No, no, no.

The reporters aren't wrong. The vision changed. And that's what we saw here. And now we'll see if the two. cheap quarterbacks that I believe have potential to be home runs if it works and if they can figure out a way to tap into it. But until then, this just has a big question mark around it. Let's stick with Chicago here, talk about another move that we haven't gotten to hit because of when it happened. And that is the bear's trading for Keenan Allen. I want to talk about, again,

my emotional connection to this before I see it with any sort of sober mind. Keenan Allen is one of my favorite players the last decade. I remember when Keenan Allen came into the league, it's right when I started covering the NFL. He was an early favorite for me when I started watching the league the way that I did back then. It is incredibly cool that Keenan Allen now plays for the Chicago Bears. That being said, I want to take a more sober look at this in the way that this might make sense for Chicago. It's $23 million against the cap this year for a 32-year-old receiver who has missed 11 games combined over the last couple years. Like even if he had one of his best seasons last year. There is some risk that comes with this. And I also think that there is some

opportunity cost. $23 million instead of chasing an edge rusher and free agency, you have to make concessions there. Does this make it harder for them to land one of the top receivers at nine because now there's a need for the chargers at five, all that kind of stuff. So I think that there's a lot to consider here. Ultimately, though, the way that I land on this is you just gave Caleb Williams one of the most quarterback friendly receivers in the entire NFL. And even if you had to pay a little bit of a premium and Keenan Allen may only have one, two, two and a half quality years left, you only gave up a fourth round pick and you are setting that guy up for success, even if there is a tax that comes with it and some risk that comes with it. How do you feel about this for Chicago?

Well, I have written on my piece of paper, quarterback friendly, right? That was the, that's just like the best way to describe him and his consistency, right? that's just what he's going to be able to bring a young rookie player. You know, it made sense to me when the story was coming together and knowing the other teams that were involved as well, why the Chicago Bears were willing to do what they did and give up to get him, or at least to pay him what they're paying him.

What I think put Chicago in a really good position in the draft too, because I do think it allows them to truly draft the best player of them. elbow now, right? Now they have almost a checkmark of a weapon that's already in the can. So I think this helps them in terms of what they can go after now that they've been able to establish this in free agency. I still think they need another receiver just because he's best in the slot. So if you need another outside receiver and outside receiver's skill set, that's still not on the roster. They're still very thin at that position outside of these two guys. So somewhere down the line,

I think that they would benefit from adding another body, whether that's a lot. Whether that's at nine or a little bit later, that becomes the question. I think the most likely outcome now, if all the receivers are off the board, is a trade doubt. You have no picks. So is there a team that wants to come up and get one of those tackles because you're walking into this draft now with four draft picks? That's a tough position for any team, and especially a guy like Ryan Poles, who is actually

stockpotted a lot of picks over the last couple years despite some of the pick for player trades that he has made. So maybe I'm wrong about that, but just reading the tea leaves. about how they've operated in the past, I would think that trading down and trying to accrue some of that capital back is more likely now after making this move. Yeah. Isn't it so nice that we're not talking about what they're going to do at the quarterback

position, like the fact that we can actually discuss that pick? I haven't even like really spent a lot of time diving into, oh, where's Chicago going to go there? Really because it's like, well, we got to work on this Justin Fields thing. But that being said, look, nothing surprises me anymore. but because we do know that this is such a talented wide receiver class. And if they have an availability there, I can see them doing it.

But like you said, they still have all other holes to fill. But yes, no, I look forward to seeing what decision they make. Trading out, though, to get some more back, not a bad business decision at all. Yeah, I just think that that, again, it becomes more likely now because you have so few picks. And that glaring, glaring need of we need another receiver has potentially gone away. way. But if they want to draft a guy who can play on the outside, you still have three receivers in the NFL. 11 personnel still 65% of your snaps, and Keenan Allen is 32 years old. I don't think it would be a bad team-building decision to do that if one of those guys ended up falling to

nine. But I also think this gives you some, there's less urgency as it relates to that move. You're still in an edge rusher. That's my biggest question. Where does that other edge presence come from? They still have not addressed that in free agency. Do you feel like you can get that a little but further back in the middle of the first round. We don't need to get super granular on the bears here. But I think those are some of the questions that now arise after you make this trade. Yeah. And then you look around the league to the night that Keenan was traded.

Excuse me when Keenan went to Chicago, you know, there were a lot of conversations the chargers were having with different teams. And it's so funny that the player is the one who revealed it. So a lot of the insiders knew that the chart. He doesn't give a fuck, man. They asked him to take a pay cut. He does not care anymore. I love that about Keenan Allen because he's always been like that. So as soon as I saw on the press conference that he was like, oh, yeah, the two of the teams that were interested in me were Houston and York.

I just started laughing and I hit up all my sources of like, hey, can I now talk about this? Because they didn't want, you know, teams don't want that stuff out. Teams are so sensitive about trade discussions. It's crazy. I experienced it a lot this last week, actually. and then people just don't want you sharing their information because it shows their it shows their hand they don't want you to see what they're doing what they're willing to give up who they're willing to trade um so the Texans were in on it they made an offer um the new york jets

did not from from the conversations i had the jets did talk to the chargers about it but they never really put anything on the table um and from what i gather the Texans had a a a really good shot of landing him. And I think they believed in their building that Keenan was going up going there. And then in the end, obviously, Chicago was the team that was able to give the chargers what they were looking for, which was a pick this year. But that being said, I mean, I started to, when I had heard that the Texans were in on it, I started to think about what that would have looked like with CJ Stroud. But obviously, that was not meant for them. but interesting to see that Houston was going to get aggressive in there in the wide receiver market and bringing a guy like him.

So I can't remember. I apologize for this. I can't remember who said this. But I think that one of the reactions to this was that the Texans are not necessarily hell bent on adding another receiver. They felt the skill set that Keenan Allen would bring combined with the guys they already had had a nice synergy to it. I think a lot of people have responded to this and said, well, this means the Texans need another receiver. They're motivated to get another receiver. It seemed like Keenan Allen was a specific enough addition in what he brings, that that was the appeal more than we need more receiving help no matter what it looks like.

What a gift, huh? What a gift to have a vision. You've got the quarterback on a rookie deal and you're just going, I want you, just you, to come here. Not we're so desperate for this position. We will take anyone and overpay and make ridiculous decisions because we're panicked. It's like we're going to be really unemotional here and be particular and picky because we can be because we're going to be one of the hottest teams in the AFC again. It's why I love Keenan Allen though, because he does fit with guys who are more traditional kind of big name outside receivers.

Like you can, the way he works with DJ Moore is really interesting to me. And I think that's why he's so appealing for a team that maybe has answers at some of those more traditional receiver spots. So I can completely understand why the Texans felt that way. and I can completely understand why the bears felt that way. The last question I have here is, why would the Chargers do this? They already saved some money with the Cleoomack and Joey Bosa restructures, and they apparently went to Keenan Allen and asked him to take a pay cut.

He said to go to hell, and he ends up on the Bears. They saved $23 million against the cap, but they already were cap compliant and had saved a bunch of money this off season. So ultimately, why do you think this is the place where the Chargers and Keenan Allen landed in this process? So going back about two weeks ago, and I was told that Keenan Allen was on the trade block. I actually thought I made a mistake in the conversation. I said, no, no, did you mean Mike Williams?

And the person like, no, no, Keenan Allen. I'm like, hmm, that doesn't seem like a type of receiver that the chargers would want to move on from. And at the time, this was before all the restructured deals were going on. So, you know, at the time it felt like just everything that had to do with the cap. But I truly believe these guys want to run the ball a lot. I'm not saying that they don't need receivers. I just think that vision of what they have for the offense just is going to look very different than what we've seen in years past.

And I do think the age factor and his price was obviously certainly a part of it. if they're asking him for a pay cut. So look, we've seen this before, right? When a new head coach comes in and they have a whole idea of what they want, the type of players they want there, and maybe for them, you know, Kenan Allen and Mike Williams just weren't in the plan.

Yeah, I wonder what the vision is because Cleo Mac is getting a little bit older. Joey Bose has been hurt. I wonder if it was just as simple as who's willing to take the pay cut and who's not. And we'll just stick with the guys who are willing to take the pay cut. And part of me thinks, if you look at how aggressive they were over, the last couple years.

And they were much more aggressive than the Chargers typically are in the way that they move money around and the cash that they spent. Daniel Popper wrote about this when he was discussing maybe the motivation behind the move for the athletic. He said, this could just be a situation where they're trying to not spend a lot of money this year. So by not paying Keenan Allen, by trading him, they saved $23 million in cash that they were going to have to pay out for him.

They are 28th right now in the NFL in cash spending. That's with $52 million going to Justin Herbert. it's possible that one of the missives here from ownership as this year got started was, hey, you guys can do what you need to to reset this a little bit, but we're not going to go crazy. And maybe the Keenan Allen move was part of that thinking. Yeah. And you're right. I think the unknowns are something that isn't just sitting on our brains today, but it's something that I know people on the league are discussing of, all right, what is Jim doing?

What is Jim want? What is he, what are they building there? because even just during free agency, listening in, not listening in, but being told, the listening in sounds so creepy like I'm a spot. Like I'm sitting in the corner of some GM's office and they don't see me. You know, but sharing information with different agents and just talking to sources around the league about who the charges are in, the type of players they were interested in. It just wasn't as clear as you see other teams that you just know what they're doing.

It's like, okay, this makes sense. This is a Ravens thing. This is what Baltimore is doing. We don't really know anything about them yet. And I think that that's really interesting in the sense that, and the same is true that Keenan Allen doesn't know them. So them coming in and be like, hey, you want to take a pay cut and be like, who are you?

No, I've been here for 10 years. I'm not going to do this. It's why I thought they were one of the most interesting teams in the league heading into the spring because there were so many different directions that they could go. And I still think we're learning about them. I think we'll be learning about them until this first draft is over. Yeah, well, I hope he likes the cold. Listen, it's not that bad, all right?

He'll be fine. He did North Carolina for a while, California for a while. I think he'll be okay. All right. Let's stick where it's pretty cold. Stick in the NFC North. The Bears were not the only teams making moves this week. The Vikings make a huge, splashy trade that is ultimately going to go a long way in shaping how the 2024 draft unfolds.

They trade number 42 and a 2025 second for the 23rd. overall pick in this year's draft, giving them 11 and 23. You tweeted not long after that move happened that the Vikings have a plan. Let's sort this out. What are the Vikings planning and how does this move fit into that vision? So I think for the last few weeks, obviously knowing the Kirk Cousin situation, you know, they had the price that they were willing to go. They had the contract that they were willing to offer Kirk.

and they knew that there was going to be a team out there that was going to be able to probably give them more money in terms of the structure of the deal. That's what it came down to. Whenever you talk, Kirk Cousins, leaving Minnesota, it has everything to do with him being with an organization for more than one or two years. That was what Kirk was looking for it. That's not what Minnesota was looking to truly give him in the end, past two years. Do you have a sense of how far those guarantees went? Was it like a year and a half guarantee? That was always my hunch that that's what they would be willing to do.

Yeah, yeah. It was just about that. It was obviously the first year fully guaranteed. The second, not fully, but it was close. And that puts you in a position where if you were to be aggressive in drafting a quarterback this year, you could move on from Kirk after this year and you'd still pay the collective quarterback room, not an amount that would be hamstringing your ability to build the rest of the roster. That's always, I think, what they were going to try to do.

I never thought they'd be able to do it because Kirk could get more. were. Yeah. And they were in a really hard position, I think. And you know, you sit in Kevin O'Connell's seat and you go, you're putting yourself in his shoes and you understand why he would want, why he was banging the dramas out as he really was through the media of I want Kirk here, right? I mean, that was a parent. Because he knows what he's getting with Kirk, right? You know, you're taking a really big risk if they wind up doing, which was your original question. What's the plan here? Well, we sell them gather some ammunition. And, And it appears that they are moving up in the draft in pieces, right? And we've seen teams do this in the past where they don't just do it all in one shot and go all the way up and try to move up to three or four. They're going to do this gradually as we get closer to the draft as they're hoping the quarterback they want is going to be there. And again, that's another risk you take because you don't know if that can even happen

because we have to assume Chicago's sticking at one. They've got their eye on Caleb, and Washington isn't going to be going anywhere but quarterback. The other teams we've seen do this, the two teams come to mind to me are the Eagles in 2016 with Carson Wentz. And the other example would be the bills with Josh Allen, right? Like they made multiple trades to move up. But both of those teams, part of their move up,

they traded players to move up. So that allowed them to do this. Remember, the bills switch first round picks with the Bengals for Cordy Glenn, and then the Eagles moved up with the dolphins by trading Kiko Alonzo and Byron Maxwell. By not doing that here if you're in Minnesota, you're going to pay a tax twice, according to the draft charts. You were going to pay a huge, huge premium to ultimately do this. And I wonder what the thinking is here. Is the team that you're trying to trade with is the appeal of the 23 better than two seconds that you trade it to Houston? like why is 23 more valuable as part of the eventual deal you're going to try to make than those two second round picks were if every single draft trade calculator is going to tell you those two second round picks are more valuable.

Do you get what I'm getting at here? Like they're going to make minus EV moves twice here in order to get where they want to go. And I wonder why they thought this was the best path forward. And I believe this is why Kevin O'Connell seemed so stuck on Kirk. Because he understood the type of haul and the price this was going to take in order to go up and try to get the quarterback again with the question mark if he's even there. So the business side of this and from everything I gather from the conversations I've had around the league and even just in the building in Minnesota, you know, their general manager, this is what he does. This is his expertise in terms of smart planning.

That's why this is particularly interesting because he literally. built the draft trade charts at other places that he was at. So him being the one orchestrating this gives it like an intrigue that even other teams wouldn't have with me. Yeah. And in the end, though, does it mean it's right though, right? Is this going to actually benefit the Vikings in the end? So look, it's a great point to make.

But who even says that's off the table? Maybe there's still going to be more moves here that actually go against the grain of them moving up the way we traditionally will see teams piece together. So I'm not sure of where that goes. I don't know if it's the right business decision. So we'll see how it plays out. If you look at the other trades the teams have made from this range up into the top three and what it took to come to mind for me, the Rams trading for Jared Gough in 2016 and then what the Niners gave up to go get Tray Lance in 2021. And adding on to these two first round picks, you would need like a second and then another piece.

But they already traded their 20, 25 second and their 24 second to get this pick. So ultimately, if you're going to get the Patriots off of this or Washington off of this, where you can go get one of the top two or three guys, what you're going to have to give up here seems exorbitant. Like I wouldn't be surprised if it was 11, 23, a 2025 first, and then maybe even a little bit more. whether that be a 2025 third or do you have to like dig into a 2026 first or second round pick? Because it feels like to ultimately do this and not pick the fourth quarterback, they're going to have to give up a crazy amount. And if they don't give up a crazy amount, it's going to be the fourth quarterback.

I think that has been the understanding there that if they lose that on Kirk and they go in the and they go in the draft for a quarterback, this is going to be a huge haul. So I, while to us, maybe we're going, oh my gosh, that just seems ridiculous and it seems just a little much. This may be something they're comfortable with, especially if we're not willing to do that structure with Kirk. If you think about if you're the owners, if you're the owners, right? If that felt too much, you probably would have given Kirk that 30-year guaranteed deal. If you're like, you know what? Maybe this is the way we go about it.

That way we don't have to give up draft picks in the future. blah, blah, blah, blah. But obviously for them, they are willing to make this big hole if they think they can get the guy they want. It's a fascinating team building experiment because they have clearly made a choice organizationally that the financial flexibility that comes with a rookie quarterback contract, even if you have to give up draft capital to acquire that contract, is more beneficial to your championship aspirations than Kirk Cousins at Price. They have clearly made that decision. And now we're going to see it play out because now they're going to have to operate without a first round pick, a second round pick next year, potentially two more first round picks. So you're them willing to give up that sort of capital to get on the rookie quarterback financial timeline and have that help them build the rest of the roster. They've clearly shown that is the most important thing to them. Whether that works out is an entirely different question.

You know, Kevin O'Connell is considered to be a really good offensive-minded head coach. we saw the success he had with Kirk. We saw the success he had with Josh Dobbs. And sometimes I wonder when coaches have success with backups like this, if that actually works against them, right? Because then if your ownership, you're going, well, we got this great smart head coach. You can take a guy like Josh Jobs and win games for us.

Let's go get a rookie quarterback that he can coach up and make great. Versus that idea of staying with Kirk Cousins, which I'm sure is way more comforting for a coach who knows all the flaws and the strengths and already have experience together. And I thought of that during all of this, when I thought that maybe the Vikings had a shot because there was a little bit of a window there where I know Minnesota felt really good that that Kirk was going to stay because of the relationship he has with the team,

the players, and obviously his love for living there with his family. But in the end, we saw what happened. And so I thought of that a lot about how sometimes I think the thing that has helped build that team or help give that team so much great attention could possibly hurt them and put a lot of pressure on Kevin O'Connell. If you look at other teams that have had offensive-minded head coaches that have had these rookie quarterback contract windows, a lot of them have gotten tons out of them. The Rams with Jared Gough, the Eagles with Carson Wentz, even like what Mike McDaniels done with Tua when they could trade for Tyree Kill because of that contract. what Shane Steichen was able to do with J.1 Hertz in year one. There are a lot of examples of teams being either Super Bowl contenders, getting on the doorstep of a championship,

or being consistent playoff teams because they've paired the right offensive-minded head coach with the right cheap rookie contract quarterback. And that seems to be what Minnesota is doing. It would have been really difficult to afford Kirk Cousins at $45 million a year, Justin Jefferson at $35 million a year, T.J. Hawkinson on a veteran extension, Christian Darris on a veteran extension, Brian O'Neill on a veteran extension,

and have money left over to build up your defense in the way that they've been able to in this free agency period. You couldn't do it. So now you have the flexibility to add pieces on both sides of the ball, and even if it's a dice roll, you have a theoretical upside with some of these quarterbacks that Kirk Cousins just does not give you right now. The floor is so much higher with Kirk,

but the ceiling theoretically is higher with one of those guys that you can go trade for. There's just so much in play. here. I absolutely love it. I think that's what made it hard, though. Like, the way you just laid that out is exactly what was being said in meetings in Minnesota about what to do, right? Can't you see both sides to this? Yes. I understand Kevin O'Connell's view on this very well. And the stress that came with it, you know, a lot of people knew about it that this was not easy for anyone in Minnesota. That is making decisions and as part of that organization.

So look, I think they should be optimistic, though, because you know, you laid it out perfectly of, hey, if they get this right, this may be the move that changed their direction completely. And maybe something we look back on. Teams that trade up for quarterbacks, we've had some, no one gives a shit in Buffalo that they traded up for Josh Allen had to give up what they did. No one cares that the chief said to give a future first round pick. But this is going to be more than that. this price that they're ultimately going to have to pay is going to be more than that.

But if they can manage to use some of the savings to build up the rest of the team, I think that becomes the biggest argument. The other side of this trade is the Houston Texans moving back out of the first round and getting two second round picks. I wanted to talk about this because I just wanted to discuss the Texans plan overall. But some people, when this happened, were like, well, look at what the Texans did in free agency. Aren't the Texans all in? Aren't the Texans trying to win?

Why would they trade out of the first round? everything you do doesn't have to be tied to one sort of mindset. I think being a little bit more aggressive in some of the free agent moves that they did, and then counterbalancing that with giving yourself more shots at cheap players in the draft is actually a very good way to think about maximizing your present while also building for the future. So I think the way that Texans have approached this by doing two things at once is actually a very smart way to think about Windows, resources, everything. So this to me is another entry in what I think has been a very impressive offseason from Houston.

Yeah, I don't think it's the sexiest answer, but from my perspective and watching all this, it just seemed like they were in a position to improve the team and be flexible. Yeah. Like, not simple. Like, find what works for us. Don't be pressed about it. Don't force it. If it works, it works.

if it doesn't, we pivot, right? And it just seems that that's how they're operating now. And I, I, I still have these moments sometimes when I'm talking about Yustin. I can't believe we're talking about you seen in this light now. How much has changed by just getting C.J. Stroud, how look at the depth of conversations that we're having about the Texans now compared to what we were doing two years ago. And that brings me back to Minnesota. If you can get one of those guys, think about how transformative of it is. And that's why teams are willing to fall all over themselves to try to find one because of how much it changes everything about your organization, the way that you can operate, all of it. And that's exactly where Houston is. So I completely get this. And I saw some people be like,

oh, well, you go from 23 to 42. You're just getting a different sort of player. We overrate how much we know about which guys are going to be good in the draft all of the time. There is a reason that teams do this. And there's a reason that getting more swings, traditionally is good for you as a team building process. And I think that, again, counterbalancing that long-term value-based move with let's be aggressive and go get a Daniel Hunter, I like doing both of those at the same time. I don't think one is contradictory to the other. I also think it's as simple as they saw where they were in the draft and probably didn't

love where they were going to be at and who was going to be available. I mean, I know fans probably think it's deeper than that. It's not. Let's get a second round pick next year because we don't care about the difference between 23 and 42. That's exactly what, that's exactly the mindset. And when we're seeing teams do this, they tell you exactly how they feel about the draft when they make these notes. Let's chat about a smaller move that is not related to player movement, but still something that generated a lot of interest on Friday. The Browns have hired Mike Vrable as a coaching and personnel consultant.

And there was a lot of questions after this move happened about what that means. what his role would be. I guarantee there are plenty of people in Cleveland in a conspiratorial way, thinking, oh, what does this mean for Kevin Stefanski? Are they trying to bring in another head coach in case this goes poorly? I want you to try to give some texture to this move, why the Browns would do this and what this actually means in practice. Yeah, I think you have all different perspectives.

You have the side of the Browns who I think just look at it as, let's just keep adding smart people to our organization. They don't look at it as an intimidating factor, another head coach that's had success that's going to come in and change how we do things or perhaps try to put themselves in a position with ownership to try to get the job. I've covered teams in the past where I would be in a conversation with decision makers about their staff as they were putting them together. And I had a head coach a few years ago say to me after I suggested a,

a coach that was available, he didn't want to hire this coach because he was too smart. And I said, what, why? Why would that bother you? Don't you want someone? No, no, no, no. Sometimes when these coaches come in here and they're that smart, you immediately, they immediately become a problem because they're putting themselves in positions to take your job. So I don't need that. I need, and I'm like, I'm sorry. I remember the conversation vividly thinking that is the dumbest thought. It's self-preservation and it's, it's actually sad. that you don't want to add just firepower to make your team better because you're frightened,

intimidated, scared, and secure, whatever your reasons and issues are. So I look at this from just Kevin's to Fancy's perspective, first of all, just such a win by him and Andrew Barry going, we can be better. And maybe we can do it in a different way. Let's be open to a different style, a different way of connecting. Vrabel's coaches, his assistance over the years are very loyal to him. And it's very difficult to even find them, you know, have conversations with them without them bringing up how crucial Vrabil has been in their development.

So the fact that the Browns are bringing him to both develop the coaching staff and the personnel side, the players, I think is tremendous. And I think, you know, I think the Vrabel side to this is even more interesting because I was going to ask you about that because I have a sense of the brown side of it, but not why Mike Vrable would want to take this job. I don't know specifically why he's doing this versus just playing golf. I do know he loves football, right? And he's probably needing to just be around it.

You don't go this many years of your life at his age and just be okay with being away from it. Because he does truly love it. But I think for him, when I saw the news break, my thought was, huh, that's really interesting. I would never put Kevin Stafansky, Andrew Berry and Mike Vribal, like at a table in a restaurant together, right? Just knowing all three of them very well. But what I love about it from Varybill's side, especially, is I think it's good for him to expose himself to that type of coaching and that type of mindset. way Andrew Barry and Kevin Cefansky work. And I think any openness to something different than what you've done and how you've done it your whole life is always going to be a positive.

So I love the move. Some people were weird about it. I think it's great. I can't wait to see what it actually is going to look like, what it's going to be. And I'm sure not, you know, we'll see if we'll be talking about Rabel back in the head coaching hiring cycle by, you know, November next year for those teams in need that. I don't think we'll be the Cleveland Browns. Yeah, I don't think it'll be the Browns. And I think that was the response from people is that is this a move that's being forced

on this staff? Because if they want a potential future at head coach, I think Kevin Stefansky is excited about this. And I think Kevin Stefansky had a role in making this happen. I don't think this is something that was forced on him. If I had to make a bet right now, Kevin Stefansky is closer to a contract extension than he is being fired as the head coach of the Cleveland Browns. So this 100%.

This to me says a lot about how secure he is in that role. and being willing to do this in a way. Because remember we talked to the Super Bowl, joked about the figure that Mike Frable cuts and people willing, not being willing to bring him in the building. The fact that Kevin Stefansky is willing to bring him in as part of his staff, I think says a lot about his ego

and the way that he approaches this. And the way that you said it about developing the coaching staff, there are only so many people in America, if you're an NFL head coach, where you can have an honest conversation about what the demands of that job look like. So bringing in someone where you can have that sounding board, I think has value.

And this coaching staff specifically has had a ton of turnover. They have a new offensive coordinator. They have a new offensive line coach. They have a bunch of young coaches on this staff. They brought in Tommy Reese from Alabama. They have so many different moving parts having just a resource to coach the coaches. And by the way, that is a mandate in the Browns organization, period. They do a very intentional job of trying to develop the coaches into their next roles.

It's just a growth mindset overall organizationally that I think comes from Andrew Barry and Kevin Sifansky. And all this says to me is this is another entry into that. Let's try to make sure that we're growing the people in the building the best that we possibly can and using Mike Vrable as a resource to do that. Yeah, he has nothing else to do. He had no other offers, it appears. So this just makes sense. I like this for him over media too. I think it's better for for I don't know maybe maybe because I'm in the media I just don't think it's I don't know we still Sean

Peyton do it you know because because you have to figure he definitely wants to be a head coach again what makes the most sense for him to get back in it and I just think staying sharp and being in it and a team like Cleveland that can really lean into him I mean just look at Jim Schwartz that's exactly what I was about to say he saw it first up close watching what Jim Schwartz did in Tennessee and then look how good of a job, Jim Schwartz day when he was giving an opportunity. So I guarantee you that that has to be part of the thought process from Brable's side. I don't know that for a fact, but I would have to assume. Yeah, I just want one person not to tweet me over the next few days as I've been getting bombarded with, well, I guess he's not, I guess he's not too big for Andrew Barry.

Well, Andrew Barry is also a very big man in very good shape. So it's going to be hard to intimidate Andrew Barry, anybody. Andrew Barry is not, doesn't seem like a very intimidating, easily intimidated a human being anyway. So yeah, that I think, but you know what's something to I just thought of. It's an obvious thing, but Braves was in Houston as an assistant coach chair, a defensive coordinator. So he knows Deshaun Watson, right? That was why DeAndre Hopkins went to Tennessee because their relationship in Houston. So I don't think it ever hurts to have a quarterback comfortable with the people around him. Let's talk about a couple of moves that haven't happened yet, but are still looming here. What is the latest on the wageria's needs situation?

with Kansas City. And how do you ultimately see this playing out? Well, I had my tweet up ready to go because I really thought it was going to get done last week. The Tennessee Titans and the Indianapolis Colts were really close on getting deals done. This was before the Calvin Ridley move was made by Tennessee. I don't think all trade talks are dead involving Sneed now for Kansas City. Do I believe that it's going to be Tennessee?

I think chances are obviously smaller now. Being able to pay Sneed on a new contract because he does want a new deal, obviously. And that appears to be the holdup of trying to iron that out. So the conversations are going to continue. And I do think if there's going to be more movement, we're going to see it a little bit closer to the draft. Do you think Tennessee, excuse me,

do you think Indianapolis is still the most likely landing spot if he is going to get traded? I do. I know the New England Patriots, the Minnesota of Vikings were also involved in conversations, or at least we're having conversations. I don't think the Vikings are in a position to give away any draft picks right now. So there you go. They are no longer in those conversations, New England either.

So I do think when it comes down to it, I think the Colts are probably the front runner on it. But I know the Tennessee Titans were really close to getting that trade done. For the Colts, it would very much be in line with the way they've operated. in the past. If you think about the biggest splash this team has made outside of the Carson West trade, which we don't really need to talk about. The biggest splash this team has made in veteran player acquisition was DeForest Buckner, who they traded a pick for. Chris Bauer has been adamant, adamant during his time as the Colts general manager, I am not going to pay a money for B players in free agency. So trading for a guy who wouldn't be available on the free agent

market, that has been his path to try to get difference making players from outside of the building. so this would absolutely fall in line with how he has operated in the past. And they have money to make it work. Yeah. And I do know Kansas City is fine with keeping state too. Of course they're fine with it. They can. Yeah, they can afford it.

They've shared that. You know, where it's like, yeah, we're good. We're good. We're not pressed at all here. So we'll see how this plays out. I do see it changing though. Yeah. I mean, I think that we'll see what happens with the contract.

I assume that's part of the sticking point is that if he's not going to be taken $20 million dollars a year or if that's what he wants, which I assume it is. If you're a franchise tag and you played at the level he did last year, there are no corners available in free agency this year. If I were his people, I would absolutely be looking to reset the quarterback, the cornerback market as part of this deal. And I can imagine that's a tough gap to close no matter who's trying to trade for him. Exactly.

Any other moves as we enter week two here, free agency and the second wave is about to begin that you have on your mind or you're keeping an eye on. Well, we've got Michael Gallup and Michael Williams, go to go full names here, visiting with the Panthers, right? So I'm interested to see how that's going to play out in terms of those receivers that are going to be available. If there's going to be other visits from other teams, who's also in on this because it's usually how this works,

this next wave. Odell Beckham Jr.'s name has been getting floated around a lot around the New York Jets. If you recall, the Jets were interested in him last year. In fact, that deal was almost done. I almost broke that story that O'Dell Beckham was going to the Jets before the Ravens swept in. Thank God. Not thank God he didn't go to the Jets. They got it and tweeted because things changed so fast that night.

So I was told that they're keeping an eye on him as well. They're definitely in the market for a receiver. They've been trying to figure that out. I'm very interested in what the Jets do from here because I understand everything they've done over the last week or so. The Tyron Smith deal, having that be most of the incentive-based, they have three new starters along the offensive line. Listen, the issues they had last year with older injury riddle players have not changed. Tyron Smith has played 13 games at once over the past five years. There's still plenty of concern there.

But I understand why they would make that move. They now have starters at all five of those spots. but now do they feel like they have to come away with the tackle at 10? I think you could argue it's still probably in their best interest too, if the right receiver is there, if Brock Bowers is there. So what this ultimately means for the path they take in the draft, that's definitely one that I'm keeping an eye on.

I'm curious about that. Yeah, their off-season moves, I knew that they weren't going to be spending tons, which is why that first wave, as the tampering period opened up, they just did nothing. like it was quiet. And I just kept getting told they don't want to spend tons.

They know what they need to address, which is offensive line and receiver, but don't expect them to break the bank or go crazy here on like a Calvin Ridley type receiver. If they weren't going to do any of that. So now they're just going to fill this in here as long as I guess Aaron is in campaigning and running for her vice president, which I guess it's been reported now that that's not going to be the case. But at some point here last week, it was a very serious conversation being had around New York, but it doesn't appear to be something he's doing. It would just be, all the Aaron Rogers stuff aside, them going out and having their two biggest moves this off season be Tyron Smith and Mike Williams.

And every Jets fan being like, oh, man, look at this. We got Garrett Wilson, Mike Williams, Tyron Smith, and then having those guys play a combined like 10 games this year and having them not have answers at either of those positions, it almost feels too predictable. at this point. I'm not even trying to wish that on Jets fans, but it's not like that's a far-off possibility here, a remote thing. Both of those guys who struggled to stay healthy. They've been through enough, right? And so I have so much sympathy because this has to work this year. But I don't know if this roadmap is really good to get them to the place they want to get to. Last thing here, this news came down since the last time we recorded a show and I definitely

wanted to talk about at least a little bit. Aaron Donald retired. Aaron Donald was the best defensive player I've probably ever seen. I think that the stretches that JJ Watt had from like 2012 through 2014 should not be forgotten here. But what Aaron Donald did for a straight decade, again, I started covering the league in like 2013, 2014. I vividly remember that pre-draft conversation about Aaron Donald. It was insane to me that he fell to the 13th pick or whatever pick it was. He was unbelievable at Pitt and he was that guy from day one in the NFL. He's one of the best defensive players of all time, just full stop, watching him was truly a pleasure. Do you have any erendatald memories or thoughts here before we get out?

Yeah. First of all, remember two years ago, he was toying with this. He told, I think, some pregame show right before the Super Bowl that he was going to retire. And so I remember right after they won the Super Bowl, obviously because of him, as we saw him all over Joe, Joe Barrow. he was the first player I write up to at the Super Bowl. And I don't think I even asked him how it felt to win. I think I was like, are you retiring? I just like went right to it because it was such a big story at that point because

no one was expecting it because he was still playing at such a high level and he still is. But, you know, and I remember actually doing a piece on the Super Bowl. And at the time I was at ESPN and what they like you to do is do a piece on essentially what you think is the key part of the game or the moment. And you almost always do the quarterback, right? Because that's usually how it comes down to. And nope, it was all about Aaron Donald.

He's the reason why they were obviously able to win that game. So to me, just the fact that he gets the double coverage and he still beats it all the time. Like he's just so used to it. He's, you know, undersized yet has dominated the position for as long as he has. my favorite part was also just seeing all the people from the other teams be like, good, get out of here. Bye. Leave me alone. The presence.

I think that's just the ultimate compliment. The way that he hung over every single game, if you had to be game planning for him, I think was unlike any player of the last decade. And the fact that he was still playing at this level when he decided to walk away. I mean, truly, I think in the conversation to be as the best football player I've ever seen. And it was sincerely a pleasure to watch him do what he did for the last day. years. And such little drama with how he said goodbye too, right? He just like post it. I love it. I'm like, wait, we're not doing like a parade. You're not doing some sit down interview. You're not posting some like over the top hype video. Like just I just thought it was beautiful.

It was perfect. I love the graphic that the Rams put up. Just said quarterbacks rejoice. It was the only thing that they said. Like it is truly a badass way to go out. We'll have a lot of time to talk about what this means for the Rams. I think there's a discussion to be had there. but we have got a lot of shows coming your way this week, and we will touch on plenty of that. For now, that is all we got. Dan, I sincerely appreciate you spending the time with us on a Sunday night after the week that you had.

So thank you very, very much for doing this. That's awesome. Thanks so much for having me. All right, guys, that's all we got. Quick heads up, just programming note. Nate and I are going to be coming your way on Tuesday with a chunk of a mock draft. We're going to do a mock draft or a part of a first-odd mock draft

every single Tuesday in the runoff. to the kickoff of the NFL draft. So we're going to do, I think, the first seven or eight picks for Tuesday. So be on the lookout for that. That is part of our new pre-draft schedule that we're going to be following. We're going to be coming your way on Tuesday. Me, Dane, and Nate, I'm joining Prospects to Prospects to Pros, very excited about it, are going to be coming your way every Thursday.

And then we'll also have a show coming your way on Friday with Football GM on Saturday. So from here on out after this show, we are Tuesday, Thursday, Friday, and Football GM on Saturday all the way through the draft. So just a heads up, that's when you should be looking out for shows. For now, though, that is all we've got. Sincerely appreciate all you guys listening. We'll talk to you soon. This was the Athletic Football Show.