The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - In The Pocket: Justin Fields' return, Dak Prescott at his best, the full picture of 2023 Patrick Mahomes, and playing on Thanksgiving

Episode Date: November 22, 2023

On this Thanksgiving week edition of The Athletic Football Show's In The Pocket, Robert Mays and Chase Daniel discuss Justin Fields' excellent play in his return, Dak Prescott having potentially his best season, and the overall state of play in Kansas City for Patrick Mahomes. Then, Chase shares memories on what it's like to play in one of the Thanksgiving Day games.Follow Robert on Twitter: @robertmaysFollow Chase on Twitter: @ChaseDanielSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTube Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic football show. It's the athletic football show. I'm Robert Mays. Joining me today with this edition of In the Pocket is long time. NFL quarterback Chase. Daniel Chase, how you doing? Good. You can tell by our setups that we aren't in our normal home.

So we're on the road right now. Thanksgiving and we were just talking. I'm like, I'm making 10 people get out of the house right now. So I'm going to have 45 minutes to record this. I know you're traveling. It's hectic, but we're getting it done. We are getting it done here. Yeah.

I'm used to recording these sets of shows on a little bit earlier timeline down here in Miami where I come for Thanksgiving every single year. So I'm a little sweaty. I'm a little uncomfortable. It's a little bit too humid as it always is. But excited for Thanksgiving, excited for the holidays. And Thanksgiving is always a great time in the NFL calendar, not only because we get to enjoy some football with some family, a little quiet time. But things feel real. You know, I remember talking to a GM a couple of years ago and just asking when he thought his team,

really became the team that they expected, right? Like, we have crystallized into the roster we want to be. We understand ourselves. And he said, Thanksgiving. And I was like, what? That's like two thirds of the way into the season. And, but it does feel like when we get to this mark in the calendar, things have really fallen into place.

And with that in mind, I want to talk about a game that we all watched last night. We have not talked about on this show that is supposed to be dedicated to quarterback play. We have not talked about the best quarterback in the last. league through the first 11 weeks. And I think part of that is because as so many other quarterbacks in the NFL rise and fall, as their situations change, as we try to figure out, how good are they? You know, is it the players around them? Is it the system? What needs to change? Patrick Mahomes, for the most part, has been a known quantity. He sits in his own tier. He's the best player in the NFL. Ask the anonymous player survey we did in the athletic today. And so there aren't as many

factors with him that seem like they're vacillating. They're actually in motion. But right now, this particular moment for the Kansas City Chiefs may be a little bit different, maybe a little bit different of a consideration. So when you watch that game last night and you're watching the Chief's passing game right now, what do you think are the issues that are limiting them right now? Is it just the lack of receiving talent or do you think it goes beyond that? No, it's 100% the lack of receiving talent.

And it's not even the lack of talent. It's just the lack of plays being made. They have 26 drop passes. They lead the league in drop passes. And no bigger than NBSs that would have put them ahead. And quite honestly, maybe would have won them a game against the two heavyweights of the Eagles and the Chiefs. And you look at even the Justin Watson on fourth and 25. The fact that you have a chance on fourth in 25 to get a completion.

I mean, first of all, that was an absolute laser beam. Okay. Unbelievable throw. Unreal. It was unreal. And they've had four, they've had two separate fourth and twenty-fives this year that have been dropped. And that says it all.

That says it all right there. And look, Mahomes can't do it all. He can't catch it. He can't run the routes. And I just start by going back to like this preseason, right? And when they were hyping up Skymore, and I say they,

the chiefs were hyping up. up Skymore, Kidarius Tony, all their in-house production, the franchise that they had going on. It was like interviews of all these guys saying, hey, hey, we're going to be good. This is going to be good. And then it's just been a complete disaster. And quite honestly, if this continues, like, it's going to cost them a chance at another Lombardi because at the end of the day, you need all 11 people on the field making plays, right? Like, I think their run game is pretty dang good. At one point, I tweeted last night, I'm like, look down on my phone and like five minutes into the third quarter, they had 153 yards rushing.

And I was like, wait, what? Like, where did that come from against a good front in Philadelphia? And then you go and, I mean, it just comes down to the drop. Sometimes when you look at problems on an offense, it can be as easy as it's my receiver group that is literally not making plays. We could be X amount of points better per game if we didn't have those drops. Now, look, you're going to go back last night and you're going to look at the two red zone turnovers, right?

the fumbled by Kelsey, the interception by Mahomes was probably as bad as an interception I've seen because the guy is wide open. It was a cool little slant and up, and he should have kept it a little bit more over to the left away from that free safety and Byard. And it's just like, to me, it's just at the end of the day, like you could tell, you could tell the press conference that Patrick Mahomes had and how upset and just ticked off he was, but yet has still. never to this day thrown anyone of his receivers under the bus, which just says a lot about who my homes is as a person.

But then last night, he's saying, hey, I could have, I could have underthrown MvS. Come on, bro. Like, no, no. Like, at the end of the day,

there has to be accountability. Right now there is none on that receiver room. The set of bets that they made last year, it worked out better than they ever could have hoped. You trade Tyree Kill, you use those resources to restock your defense. And listen, even if the results,

have been bad from the receiver group, that bet that they made, that has worked. They won a Super Bowl and their defense is a top five unit. It's playing at a ridiculous clip. So I still feel like the overall plan has worked out the way that they wanted to. But even last year when they had a guy like Juju Smith-Schuster to lean on, they don't even have that sort of presence within the offense. After moving on from Tyree Kill, this was the most efficient offense in football. Patrick Mahomes was the clear-cut MVP.

It wasn't even a conversation. Right now, he is seventh in EPA perjury. I know that seems fine. It is fine. But for him, that's really immortal. This is just a different version of this offense than we're used to seeing. So I'm curious, just as somebody who's been in that offense, who understands it who understands Andy Reed, how is the wide receiver position and the asks on it may be a little bit different within that system than it might be in some other offenses? Because there really have never been many examples of young rookie receiver specifically catching on there.

And they've got a lot of youth in that group and in that room. How do you feel like that maybe affects this team and this offense maybe in a way that it does in other systems? Yeah, it definitely affects with this offense. And you look at MVVS, he's the guy that is the one who's the veteran, right? Everyone else is pretty young. And within this offense, there are normal asks of receivers like, hey, you've got to know, the formations. We shift and we motion quite a bit. But at the end of the day, they're running the

same concepts for the most part, like that they've run in training camp. So they have a set in that offense of 20 to 30 concepts, whether it be drop back. So you do drop back, right? Three step, five, step, seven step. And then they go movement game, which are your shot plays. And then you have naked play action games and then you have RPO's. Of course, there's what Andy Reed likes to call green dots or added plays to the game plan to take advantage of like what Philly was playing or how they were playing a certain coverage and their new plays. You have to learn those. But he has a system where, hey, you can only have 15 green dots for the entire new game plan. So there's only 15 new plays per instance per game plan. And people think that's crazy.

But it promotes the type of stuff that is not happening right now with the chiefs receivers. they should be knowing exactly what they're doing. And I don't think it's actually going down to the matter of the fact where they don't know what they're doing. It's just that they're not, it looks to me that they're not playing really fast. And it's not the type of confidence that Patrick Mahomes and Travis Kelsey have, the connection that they have. And so that to me is the deeper issue, is them not playing fast.

Look, they trust each other. But at the end of the day, when Patrick Mahomes and the game is on the line and you're double team and Kelsey and you're going to Justin Watson, like nothing against Justin Watson. But like, come on. Like to me, it's a higher bit of organizational. I wouldn't say failure because they've won a lot of like, you know, championships, obviously. And they've been in five straight AFC championship games will probably be a six.

But the fact that you can't get one or two veteran guys for $10 million or less to come in and really solidify that room, they were, they were okay with going. With this room going forward, and that to me is the bigger part of what I think of an organizational, like, hey, hey, mishap here, you really miss it on this receiver room. The bets that they made on defense have worked out in every single instance, right, going and getting a trade McDuffie as part of that trade with Tyree Kill. He looks like a superstar. George Carloffes has really come on this year. Everything on defense has fallen into place as part of this overall plan. Everything on offense hasn't.

If you look at the bets and the swings that they've made at the receiver position, a second round pick on Skymore last year, trading a third round pick for Cadarius Tony, drafting Rishi Rice this year, Rice may come on, but he hasn't come on fast enough to offset the lack of production you've gotten from the guys that you acquired last year. And that just leaves them without any consistent, reliable options in that room right now. Yeah. I mean, that's the biggest thing.

And I tweeted out last night, though, that I do think Rishie Rice has a chance to be special. All the talent in the world. And the thing is, it's not even about him not going out there and doing it. He just didn't get a lot of chances last night. And that's the thing with these rookie receivers, especially if you draft them and hope to groom them to be in this offense for a long time, with Mahomes for a long time.

You've got to get out there and give him opportunities. So he wasn't on the field a lot last night, which was a little bit surprising. It looked like they went up with Watson over Rishi Rice on a couple different things. and Sky Moore has been just sort of obsolete. And same with Cadarious Tony. They used them in a different ways in the back bill. He had some good punt returns.

But it doesn't seem like they have that one true weapon. If you actually take away Travis Kelsey, which is actually hard to do. And he's been hurt. And so it makes it a lot easier. But if you do that, then I just don't know who Mahomes finds as a viable number two option. Because MVS was rolling last night on that. should have been go ahead touchdown and great route great play design great throw okay three of the things that you need no catch like you got to finish it you have all three things working in your

favor concept design throw and then drop like you can't design it any better than that and these opportunities for these type of plays don't come around very often and it seems more often than not when the big time plays are needed to be made even the fourth and 25 they're not making them You know Andy Reid. You've been in that building. If we see flashes of talent with Rishi Rice, but the opportunities aren't there, how do you explain that disconnect? Is there something that's happening in practice that maybe we can't understand because we're

not seeing it? No, that's a great question. And honestly, something that they got to look at themselves in the eyes and in the mirror and just figure out like what the heck is going on. Because it can't continue this way. And there has to be, like, I guarantee you, Mahomes, I know for a fact that Mahomes stays after with these guys and throws after practice, right? It's not that it's just, and it seems like they're running the right routes. It's just like at the end of the day, it's as easy as you should have to catch the football.

Like, like, I think a lot of people are just literally looking too far into this. And not us because we like to dive deep, but some other people, there's something like, go get on the jugs and catch 100 balls. like when you look at the drops like 26 drops or just drops I don't think it's a lack of concentration I don't think it's a lack of not knowing what to do it's a lack of your skill set not being there in dropping ball I mean bottom line and I saw you know Tyree kill came to MBS's defense like hey those bright lights under the stadium it's not as easy as it looks like cool but like that's a game on the line number one seed on the line which the chiefs are no longer, the Baltimore Ravens are.

Like stuff like this matters in big time situations. You're the chiefs. You're going to be in these big games more often than not. So I don't like to look at it from that point of view. Like I just think at the end of the day, it's just skill. Like go get on the jugs a hundred times. It gets 100 balls. In terms of problem solving, if things are not going right,

if you're hitting snags as an offense. And you've been in some weird Andy Reid offenses, right? It wasn't 2018 chiefs when you were there. The offense was very efficient. But it had to be creative in the ways that they found solutions. Very famously, they did not throw a touchdown pass to a wide receiver for the entire season. This was a team that was good. This was a good football team that was dealing with this.

So how would you characterize the way that Andy Reed seeks out solutions to unconventional problems compared to some of the other coaches that you've been around? I think the best thing, I know the best thing that I like about Andy Reid is he never he never over analyzes situations. And sometimes you can see this around the league when coaches, when things aren't going right. It's not like they're broken as an offense

because they're top 10 in almost every major category. It's just those drops. The biggest thing about Andy is he's just like, hey, hey, just get back to work. Just get back to work. Like he's always saying that. Just get back to work. Like just go to work.

Just work on your craft. Be you, show your personality. And then eventually, if Andy thinks that he has a certain receiver that's going to make a play over a certain guy, then he's going to call a play for that guy, right? But I've never really seen Andy ever do something so out of the blue and extraordinary that a lot of times coaches can think, hey, something's not working. We need drastic changes.

Well, there's one little part of your offense. No, it's a big part that isn't working. And it's the receiver's dropping. Okay, first of all, you have to instill confidence in them. That's the biggest thing for me is like, hey, if a receiver dropped the ball, especially, and I remember this one story, we were going. It was practice. It was 2013, Andy Reed's first year there. And I was throwing to some receivers. And I'll always remember this because it sort of molded who I am as a player. We went up and we were like an OTAs or maybe it was like early, early training camp. And this receiver, I don't even know his name. He didn't make the squad.

Like I don't even remember because it was so long ago. I remember throwing a ball to him like a hitch route or a slant route. And the ball just dropped. Like he just dropped the ball. Like it was a perfect throw, dropped the ball. And I just went on to my. next thing and just kept going and it was routes on air and Andy comes up to me quietly after practice and was like hey you know that that ball that you know that guy dropped like why don't you get with him after practice like why don't you like get into his ear like tell him you're going to get it and if you if you do it again and he drops it get that rep again right away and I'm like wow okay because like when he speaks it's it's like it's like that old grandpa that you really respect and that trust but you don't want to that's why when he went after Travis Kelsey yesterday on the sideline that look he gave him.

I was like, oh man, he is clearly not happy. It's not only the look he gave him, but he said, Kelsey. Yeah. Kelsey. And then he said, Travis. When he called him by his first name, I'm like, it is like your dad yelling at you. Like, that's exactly the feeling that it was on the sideline yesterday. Yes.

It was wild. And that's a thing, too. It's like, it's just he's got that like dad that you respect, but fear, but in a good way. Like, you don't want to let down. And I think that's the best thing about Andy Reid as a head coach. He doesn't, oh, he doesn't, he doesn't overcomplicate things. He, he oversimplifies things, which is great. It's what you want and allows guys to play fast.

And eventually he's like, through 11 games, he's like, okay, we're eventually going to like break out of this like slump of dropping passes, but it has not happened yet at all. Well, something to monitor, because obviously it's holding them back right now in terms of the offense. They can be in the heights that we've seen them reach in the past. But they've spent a lot of resources. you know, not crazy resources.

We're not talking about first round picks or top 10 picks, but they've taken plenty of swings at receiver, and we'll see if any of those can materialize a little more than they have throughout the rest of this season. Let's get to a game near and dear to my heart, Justin Fields, his first game back in the lineup for the Bears. I think some kind of big picture questions have creeped up over the last couple of days, and we knew they were going to about Justin Fields, about his future.

you and I were talking about them yesterday, which is part of the reason we wanted to discuss this. But before we get to some of those bigger picture discussions, I just wanted to ask you, what stood out from you, what stood out to you about the game that you saw Justin Fields play on Sunday? Well, second play of the game, design quarterback run. Like right away, you're not holding them back. You're not worried about his thumb. You call an aggressive play against 12 yards. Multiple designed zone option reads.

Okay, that's what Justin likes to do. He's said it before and every. He likes to get hit. He likes to get the feel of the game. And then he gets into rhythm as a passer. And then as far as throwing the football, it is interesting. We both talked about this in the production meeting. But what I saw from Justin was probably the most impressive game I've seen from him as a bear

against that type of defense of Detroit Lions, which is top 10, top 12 defense on the road against a team that quite honestly has a inside shot at the number one seed other than Philly. the Detroit lines. And so for him to go on a road to play like that. And as a passer, I felt like he got through progressions at a clip a lot faster than what I've used to, what I'm used to seeing him. And I have a breakdown coming out on it because I went through almost every play. And this is a six-yard completion that I broke down. And people are going to be like, why on the world are you breaking down this six-yard completion? It was Colquette.

You knew exactly which play I was talking about. There was a hitch to the field of DJ then he came it. So that's his number one read. And then there was a stick route to the field. That's his two. And then there was a spacing route to Colquimette as number three and then the corner route. So you literally just read it, sweep the board, across the board, hitch, stick, spacing. And he already saw that when he dropped back, his shoulders are set to the hitch. And as soon as he knew it was covered, it was like almost in one motion. So it was only two hitches. He swept the board. And before he got his eyes, to the spacing on cold command his shoulders were already turned like that is really good quarterbacking that is really good um mechanics and that's maybe something that had been lacking from Justin it was the processing speed that maybe was lacking a little bit from Justin and when I saw that play I'm like okay this guy's got it and there's also a few other plays within the game that you look at and like the the second and 21 touchdown throw like probably one of of the better throws of his career. It's man coverage. They have a through route, which is like a

a streak to get the safety's attention. And they have a big time post to DJ Moore. Okay, that's his second read. He easily steps up in the pocket, gets a little bit of a dirty pocket. And then there is a huge bit of green grass in front of him to run. And he can easily run. And I've seen him more times than not just be like, oh, I'll take it. No, he was a thrower first, stepped up, set his feet, launches a dime. Like in stride, touchdown, and I'm just like, did I just see that? Like, I watched it live on 2nd and 21. They're throwing beyond the sticks and they're taking shots.

Like all the small details are what I noticed that he did a lot better. And we've talked about this before. We've talked about a starter going to the bench, whether it's a bench or whether it's an injury. You can get a perspective on the bench. all you've been doing is playing and starting, that you can't get anywhere else because you're used to being the guy on the field and as soon as you get off of the field

and you see it from a different view, a different mindset, there might be a few things and be like, oh, okay, like I see it this way now. I need to get through my progressions faster. And it can only happen once you get off the field and actually see it. And I think those three or four weeks on the sideline

really helped Justin. The last game we saw him was against Minnesota. He gets hurt. Two games before that are the Washington game and the Denver game From a production standpoint, two of the most productive games he had is a Chicago Bear. Go back and really watch the Washington game, though. He's throwing a couple hitches to DJ Moore that he takes to the house on yak opportunities. The long throw to DJ Moore on the first drive is pretty defined double move.

He's not really reading anything as part of that play. I believe this. The game he played against the Lions last week, I think, is the most impressed I have ever been with him in a Chicago Bears uniform. And it's for a couple different reasons. Like you said, everything that you said, you saw all of that. I don't think that there was a single play where his decision making, I was like, that guy's open, you need to throw it. And that was something that was consistently coming up with him over the last two years.

Go back to the Tampa game that we talked about. So many plays are like, just rip it, rip it. And going back and watching that Lions game, there was none of that. Honestly, I think he got to his checkdown a little quick on some of those plays. That is a problem I will welcome based on the way that he had been playing for long stretch of his career up to this point. So the processing, I thought, was very good, the pocket presence, the movement in the pocket, a couple times where he's taken off maybe a little earlier than he needs to, but still not nearly as drastic as it's been at other times in his career. But what I was

so encouraged by, my main issue with him was the timing mechanism and the feel in crowded spaces. That was my main issue. That's improving. The other thing that I was concerned about with him is that this is a guy who has so much physical ability. But the other part is that I, I'm a I was worried about his creativity as a thrower. And when I say that, the guy obviously has a canon. I mean, you saw that on the throw to DJ Moore. And we saw that at Ohio State, the ball placement, the ability to push the ball down the field. But off platform, he wasn't as twitchy as some of these guys who were high-level players in the league.

And he made two or three plays outside of the pocket in this game where he's changing arm angles, he's doing it on the run. And those are the plays where I'm like, all right, now we're cooking. If this is going to start happening and his pocket field is going to be there and he's running at opportune times, again, I don't think I've ever been more impressed with him in the totality of the game that he played than I was with him on Sunday. And that leads me to a potentially interesting conversation here. Like in my mind, and I think in a lot of Bears fans' minds, they were going to get one of the top two picks in this draft. They were going to draft a quarterback and they were going to move on from Justin Fields. that's absolutely still on the table. But now the discussion, I think, becomes a little bit more interesting if he keeps showing the stuff that he showed in those two games before he got hurt and what he showed on Sunday against the Lions.

Well, and I had this tweet that went a little bit viral because it seems that anything I tweet about Justin Fields's future in Chicago goes viral. And I just said, I said, look, if you don't think that the Chicago Bears brass is using. this performance to prove to everyone that he belongs here and that he can be the future of the bears. And you're crazy. Like, of course they are. Because in their minds, they're seeing it exactly how you and I are seeing it. Like, hey, like this is, this is progress. And not only like the stat, you look at the stats. They weren't like throwing, you know, 180 something yards, but a hundred rushing yards. So an overall amazing performance. When we went into the season, I was expecting. I don't know what you were expecting, but I was expecting a jump in Justin Fields third season similar, not quite exactly,

to what Jalen Hertz did in his season. And it wasn't quite there because he was, first of all, the offense didn't fit him. And then you look at the last really three games before he was hurt and it was good. Then you look at this game, I'm like, he's trending in the right direction. And maybe he just needs a little bit more time. Maybe he needs a little bit better roster around him. Maybe he needs a little bit more interesting play caller behind him because they got to see that it's there. It's just as a quarterback sometimes it's hard to figure that out when you are not surrounded by stars, if that makes sense. If you're not surrounded by people that can make you better. Now, Colquimette's it.

I think Donald Mooney has a shot. I think DJ Moore is a legit number one receiver and how they use them. I do. That offensive line's got to get better. if they continue to, you know, shore up that offensive line, which surely they'll end up doing with a number one or five pick, whatever they have, depending on the quarterback situation. But now with this game and the previous few before he was hurt, you've got to be thinking if you're a Bears fan, like, man, look at that draft capital that I have. Probably a top, like two picks in the top five is what it's looking like, top six. Like, how much better can we get our team other than the quarterback?

Because in my opinion right now, I don't know if Justin Fields, sorry, if Caleb Williams or Drake May is a better option right now than Justin Fields. I think this is a very good set of games to judge him on because the offensive line is the best that it's ever been since he's been there right now in this moment. Tevin Jenkins is playing really, really good football now at left guard after Nate Davis got back. Donald Wright's a little bit banged up. He has his moments in pass protection, but I think he's a really nice piece.

Nate Davis had some issues with Aline McNeil. A lot of players have had issues with Aline McNeil so far this year, but I think he is a solid option at right guard. They got Braxton Jones back. We'll see how that goes. I think he's in an evaluation mode for the rest of the year, the same way Justin Fields is. But that group as a whole is way better than it's ever been since he got there. The receiving group is obviously better than it's ever been. And I don't know about you.

I actually thought that the game plan on Sunday and the way that they built the offense, play action, boots, movements, getting him on the run, all of the. those things combined with some of the deeper shots they're trying to take, I like the way that the offense has been constructed right now, and especially the way it was on Sunday. So I think right now, all of those factors, play calling, offensive line, pass catchers, this is all set up for us to get a very honest assessment about what type of player he is moving forward. I don't know what the answer is. I don't know where it lands, but I am open to the journey in a way that I don't think I was six weeks ago. I love how you said open to the journey.

Yeah. And honestly, like, that's another point. Like, the bears aren't going to make the playoffs, obviously. So you've got six or seven games. And these six and seven games are truly, for teams that aren't going to make the playoffs, truly for evaluation. It is everything they do on that field right now is for evaluating what they have in that building. And no bigger than the offensive line, Justin Fields, and those past catchers.

So as a player, you know that. You know that, hey, I'm getting extra evaluated, if that makes sense right now and how I finish off the season. So I do think that this offensive line that Justin, that these receivers are going to have a little bit extra juice, man. You're playing for your future, okay? Every time you go out there and put it on tape, you are playing for your future.

That's what a lot of people don't understand is, hey, look, playoffs, if it's lost and whatever, if you're going to pack it in and just give bad effort, like I promise you the way they're going in the organization, Ryan Poles will get your ass out of it. Like that'll be the first thing he does is like get the bad apples out of there. So you better put it on film. No better time than now when the playoffs are really out of reach

and you just can go out there and play. You don't got to worry about anything. Who cares if you lose another game? Just put it on film and be the best version of yourself in that offense that you can be. Darno Mooney's a free agent, okay? If they have two of those top picks in the top four, Marvin Harrison Jr. is sitting out there. The left tackle from Penn State is sitting out there.

Joe Alt from Rotter Dame is sitting out there. So if you're Brexton Jones, that's something you've got to be thinking about. So I absolutely think that there's a level of urgency happening with all those people in the building. And I'm excited to see how it plays out. As you're evaluating Justin Fields down the stretch, in your mind, how well does he need to play for them to not use one of the top two picks on a quarterback? if he plays the way he did on Sunday for the rest of the season, is that enough for you? Yeah. Yes, absolutely. And that's the question in Chicago.

Is it one of those things where you have 30, 40 some odd starts? Like, you should know by now. Well, you know, sometimes it comes down to right to the end and what you show in a what have you done for me lately league and that you've shown that you can withstand the rigors of an NFL season and come out stronger on the other side. And I think this is the perfect example for it. but I do think if he plays,

and I don't even think he has to play like that. I think he has to play within the coaches scheme, within the offensive scheme, and they got to grade him out well. And they got to, he's got to prove that, hey, if they get behind in some of these games,

they were playing ahead, actually for most of this game. So it's easy to play ahead. When you can dictate based on down and distance and you can use play action all the time, and you can get him on the move, it certainly helps things. What he's going to look like on third down

and in defined passing situations, I think is really the biggest question. Because it's also, I mean, this is just a little bit more inside baseball, but a lot of the stuff they were trying to do is play action, take shots down the field. There weren't a lot of underneath options. So when they took things away over the top, he essentially just had to run. He didn't have to read a lot of stuff out in those exact moments.

So I think there are a couple more things I want to see from him just in terms of the process of playing the position. But damn, was I encouraged by so many of the things that he showed on Sunday. And listen, there's also emotional sides to this, right? If you're just taking a step back, and I'm looking at this in a detached way, fine. You take Drake May, you trade Justin Fields, like, let's get rolling. This is a guy as a blue chip quarterback prospect. Let's go. But there's part of me that has seen the flashes from him, have seen how much it matters to him,

and is rooting for him to be the guy that figures it out because how fucking awesome would that be? Like, how awesome would it be if he came out on the other side and he ended up becoming a star, especially when you consider how much of a leap that he had to take. I still think that there's a ways to go and we're definitely not there yet, but I think it would be pretty awesome if that was the end result of all of this. Well, it's such an intriguing storyline, and that's what you want. That's what you want, especially if you're a Bears fan, or especially if you're just a Fields fan in general,

is like he's such a good guy. Like, you want to see him figure it out. And I think he's on his way to figuring it out. him dancing after that third and 15 scramble. I love it. I love it because there's so many moments over the last couple years where he just looked broken. He looked broken and beaten down. And for him to look like that in some of those moments against a really good team on the road,

again, I have no clue how it's going to turn out. I have no clue what the next month and a half is going to look like. But I am excited to watch it play out. And I have a lot more hope in how much I'm going to enjoy it here. over the last couple months of the season. All right, let's get to another guy who is absolutely balling right now. And that is Dak Prescott. You did a video on him on your YouTube channel last week.

I mean, it's hard to overstate how good this guy has been after that Niners game. Since week six, okay, Dak has the best EPA per dropback in the NFL. Over that five-game stretch, he has 14 touchdowns. He has 16 big-time throws per PFF, which is the most in the NFL. he is arguably playing the best football of his entire career here in what is I believe year eight for Dak Prescott. So when you go back and you watch what they're doing right now, what you're seeing from him right now, what do you think is driving the success that we're seeing from Dak? Well, it's twofold. In my opinion, the skill group is playing up to its level.

And that is what is making Dak Prescott confident and look. like he's playing the best ball of his career because he is playing the best football of his career. You look at the acquisition of Brandon Cooks. To me, that is low key, an amazing acquisition. Because you have C.D. Lamb, who has come on before the Panthers game, it was three straight games, 10 plus catches, 150 yards, never been done before. He's history, okay? So he's coming on as a true number one. They're tied in down there, Ferguson, I think, is balling. Yeah, you like him. dude, I like him a lot. And obviously Tony Pollard,

so you take that position group and you take an offensive line that was battered early in the year, starting to get back to form, and you put it all under the umbrella of the second part of the equation, which is Mike McCarthy and what they're doing,

shoddy down there, like it's impressive. A lot of people gave Mike McCarthy crap, rightfully so. I was one of them when he fired, it was a firing. Let's just be sure of that. It was a firing of Kellynne,

it wasn't a mutual parting of wins. Kellan Moore had a job eight hours later. When Kellyn Moore had a top five offense in the league, or top six offense in the league every year he had been a coordinator in Dallas. And so people are like, what? And Mike's like, well, we want to run the damn ball. Well, they haven't really been running the ball. They're throwing it just as much.

It's just Mike McCarthy's concepts. And so, tusha, I guess. Like, at the end of the day, it's working. And I would say before the San Fran, game. What I saw in that offense was very, oh, how do I put it? Was very static. That's the word I always use in reference to the Michael McCarthy offense and that offense in general static is the word I always come back to. And that is something that I was just like, man, you got so many good players. And then sort of the San Fran game after that game, they did something. I don't know what it did,

but I would love to hear the story on that offense and how they change it. And now they're giving DAC more responsibility at the line. They're giving them man's own reads. They're shifting. They're motioning. They're using more two tight-in sets. They're not just an 11-personnel offense.

And all these things has really led to DAC playing the best ball of his career. It's the under center play action game. It's more so pure progression plays than Mike McCarthy's probably done in his career. That means just, hey, sweep the board, Dak, if one's open, throw it,

if two's open, throw it, if not check it down to three or go. And I'm a big fan if you've listened to these podcasts and these shows of pure progression plays for a quarterback because it takes all the stuff out of the quarterback's head, hey, just work this side.

Okay, cool. And I think that's what they're getting to among other things. And it's just, it's fun to see because, I mean, Dallas is, what are they, seven and three right now? And so they are very much in there with the best of the best in the NFC. And everyone knew at the beginning of the year this defense was special.

They didn't know how this offense would go. But the way they're playing the last four or five games, like to me, their top five team in the National Football League right now. And DAC is easily a top three playing like a top three quarterback in the NFL too. What do you think is different from the version of DAC specifically that we've watched over the past month and versions of DAC that maybe have come up a little bit short at times in his career. I've always thought that he was a very good quarterback. I've always thought that his process, some of the stuff he could do with the line of scrimmage,

the decision-making. I always really liked the way that he played the position. But this is just different than we've seen him. Maybe not different than we've seen him play. The production is better than we've ever seen, right? Like, what is coming out at the end? The results is so good right. They are so good right now, even if the process has always been above.

of average. What do you think about his play specifically is slightly different than what you've seen from him before? Well, I think he's healthy. That's, that's a huge deal to me. Like, he's fully healthy and he's fully practicing every day and he's fully involved in the game planning. So that, that obviously helped. But I also think that he's just really, um, enjoying the process. I watched an interview the other day and he's just like, man, I'm just trying to get better every single day. Like he's year eight and he's already, you're already trying to to just like put it in trusting the process every single day and then when results come it's a funny business when results come you get a really big confidence level boost right you get a confidence level

boost and that confidence level boost can really propel you throughout the year knowing hey um you know i can make this role i can do this because confidence is a tricky thing in quarterbacks i'm not saying dac ever lost confidence when he wasn't playing and quite honestly at the end of the day what it comes down to for me is like, Dallas has got to prove they can do it in the playoffs, right? He's done it before in the regular season. So all this talk is great. Can he continue it into the playoffs? But the confidence level of a quarterback is really important for a lot of reasons.

Not only do you have to believe you can do it as the actual quarterback, but the confidence level in you from your teammates has to be there. And they're empowering him. This coaching staff is empowering him to really go out there and show who he really is, instead of overthinking things at the line, which I've seen them do before, instead of maybe handling all these mic ID points on past game stuff, or hey, you have an, you're an empty,

and you have this play design of five different plays you get to. They're not putting a lot on DAC and allowing DAC to free up and play, and it's showing with the results right now. If you look at the first five weeks of the season, the Cowboys were 26th in average area arts per attempt. And anecdotally, that tracks. I remember watching them.

It was just death by a million paper cuts, right? He was a quick game machine in the way that we've seen him be at times this year. But I think that that can make the offense feel compressed, and it can make it feel a little bit static in the ways that we've seen from them in the past. Over the past five weeks, he is fifth. It went from 6.7 air yards per attempt to 8.8. And that's only one stat, but you can feel the difference when you're watching the offense. I think that he's been more aggressive.

I think he's used his legs more than he has. over the last couple years, which has been really nice. You pointed that out. And I've just been really impressed with the structure of the offense. They had a buy in week seven. When they came out of the buy, two things have stood out to me. One, C.D. Lamb is a true number one receiver. We're going to use them as an X.

We're going to use them in the slot. We're going to create the passing game around our best player. And that has boated well for them. The other part of it is they're just stealing shit from people. Like, if you watch some of the motions that they're doing, If you watch some of the concepts that they're doing, they're just copping stuff from the dolphins. It all just feels so much more alive and dynamic than it did over the first five weeks of the season. And that's a credit to the coaching staff.

I had my doubts about what it would look like. I had my skepticism about what it would look like. But I think some of the ideas and concepts and kind of bedrock foundational aspects of the offense recently have been so much better than they were early in the season. And I think it's led to some of the results that we've been seeing. well and we said this before but it is it's a copycat league man and and i've been around coaches i'm not going to name names but some of the better offenses we've been around that in this funny you said about thanksgiving like how teams hit their strides i tend to agree because not only you know who you are but honestly there's a lot of burnout right now you've been going for you know

11 weeks plus six of 13 weeks already the the season's turning into the fourth quarter of the season here soon and you've got a long way to go if you're in the playoffs and sometimes there's just a little bit of burnout where I've had coaches and and even us quarterbacks we turn on the big play reel throughout the NFL the week prior while we're game planning or going over what we're going to go and be like hey scroll scroll oh this play is sweet let's put it in let's personnel a different let's motion to there instead of lineup static and it will hit it and it's a huge play in a game like it does every every every single NFL offensive coordinator does it they still ball plays and it's just like how can you make it your own? And I've been around a lot of them where you might not run it the first

week because you've never run it, but it's one of those that stays on the call sheet and you're like, when is coach going to call this play? We've been practicing it for six weeks. And then he calls it and it hits at the perfect time, at the perfect place. And it goes for a touchdown. And it's no different. It's just, it is a copycat lead because you want to stay on the forefront of how different offenses around the league are attacking defensive. and you can get that on a lot of different film throughout the league, especially the Miami Dolph. I feel like everyone is doing that little short motion out on the move.

Dagger, short motion out, hitch. And it puts a lot of different pieces in movement for the defense to look at. And that's one of the many plays that I'm seeing that is sort of the trend, would you say, of the National Football League this year. And I love seeing them incorporate some of that stuff. There's nothing wrong with it. And we're talking about dynamic offenses. who's more dynamic than what the dolphins are doing.

So if you feel like that can give you a little bit of a jolt, that can create some matchups for you, I think teams should steal it. So I give a lot of credit to the Cowboys coaching staff for what the offense looks like right now. There's going to be a conversation here over the next two months if things keep trending in this direction. Not only about whether DAC is playing well or not,

about what his standing in the league is, there should be a real discussion if this keeps going about where he fits in the MVP race. He has 19 touchdowns right now. Let's say over the next seven games, he throws 16 more, which isn't crazy at all. He's thrown 14 over the last five. That's 35 touchdowns.

He's on pace to throw for about 4,500 yards. If the Cowboys have the second best record in the NFC, one of the best records in the league, in this year where Mahomes is down, Josh Allen's thrown a bunch of interceptions, the perception of him is a little bit wonky. Some of the other guys who have a ton of production. I think people just kind of dismiss the role they have within their offenses to a Brock Purdy, etc.

Dak is going to have a real case if things keep trending in this direction to really change the narrative about the way that people talk about him and the way that people see him because he is playing at an MVP level right now. There's no doubt. And quite honestly, it's America's team. So in my opinion, the quarterback, whoever is definitely not. I honestly think that hurts him, though. Should be at the forefront. I feel like because there's so much stink on him because of how, because they're so visible and because the Cowboys discourse never quiets, his failings, I think are very prominent in a lot

of people's minds because of that. So I think that creates even a bigger hump for him to get over than it might for some other players. Maybe I'm giving too much to that, but that's kind of how it feels to me, just in terms of the narrative around him yeah i mean look they're on prime time almost every every game and if if networks had their had their way they would put the dallas cowboys 17 games on prime time because they draw numbers and that's all the networks draw about and i do get what you're saying but at the beginning of season though like you have to put like like tony romo even like and that is that is an interesting

thing though like the MVP race right it's the most valuable player so in a year that like you you said Mahomes is down, that Burroughs not here, that Josh Allen is not going to win it. It's looking like a quarterback and it's looking like a DAC or like, why isn't Brock Purdy getting any love for what he's doing over there in San Fran? Lamar Jackson, the number one seed in the AFC. So it's going to come down, in my opinion, there's no clear frontrunner. So it's going to come down to the last four or five weeks. But you've got to imagine that 4,500 yards, 35 touchdowns, the second or third best record in the NFL. Like if you just ghosted out and blacked out this drawing of Dak Prescott and put him up on the board with his numbers at the end of the year and telling me that they're the second seed or the first seed in the UFC,

like he absolutely deserves to be in the conversation, if not win it. Yeah, I tend to agree. And if you look at the underlying numbers too, he's right there at the top of the league with some of those guys in those Death Star offenses like Purdy and Tua. So it's going to be a really interesting discussion here as we get down the back half of the year. We are a couple days removed from Thanksgiving. It is Thanksgiving week. You are in an interesting spot here to talk about what Thanksgiving week looks like for NFL players and particularly quarterbacks because one of your starts as an NFL

quarterback came on Thanksgiving, a game I remember very well. I don't think we've ever talked about this. This was 2018, right? Yep. So it was 2018. I had just started dating my now. We had been dating for a while, but it's one of the first Thanksgivings I went to with my now wife and her family. And she lives in my in-laws live in Miami, but the family lives in various other places around Florida.

So we had to drive there. But I couldn't have missed the beginning of the Bears game. And the family gathering started like two hours later. So I went to a sports bar in a strip mall in like suburban, like Fort Lauderdale or wherever we were. And what a scene, this sports bar on Thanksgiving, by the way. So people are just like smoking inside. And I'm watching you like tear up the Detroit Lions. Eddie Jackson had a pick six.

So that Thanksgiving win and that Thanksgiving start that you had is a very memorable day for me in a lot of weird ways. Yeah. I mean, that I've never heard that. But that is amazing. Nothing like a smoky bar on Thanksgiving. It was it was depressing. It was so depressing. It was so depressing.

Do you remember who I threw the touchdown passes too? So one was to. Roy Cohen, right? Yep. And then the other one was a backup running back whose name I can't remember. It's like, his name was Smoke.

Tyquamenzel or, his nickname was Smoke. Yeah, Taekwemoiselle, there you go. Take oneazel. And that's who I did. And honestly, that was a play. So a lot of people don't understand and playing on Thanksgiving.

I honestly like didn't even have a chance to think that there'd be 28 or 29 million people watching me because we had just finished the game against, was it the Vikings before that or who Mitch Trubesky got hurt yeah I think it was the Vikings it was a night game and we were the fastest turnaround in NFL history because it was a 1230 start instead of a one and so I think we had 76 or 78 hours from the time Sunday night football ended until the first

game on Thanksgiving I didn't even find out until Tuesday morning that I was playing so I mean like for for sure and then so first of all Thursday games, especially Thanksgiving games, it's just walk through. So I was like super amped up. I'm going like full speed and walk through there. And it was just, it was just like, chill out, like, chill out. And I remember the gameplay and I was like, we're going to let you, we're going to let you fire it out. And it was cool because obviously Chicago's very close to Detroit. My wife was able to get on a little plane, fly up, watch me play on national television. And because it was such an early game, she ended up flying back.

some of our good friends Nick and Amy Williams who was who's still playing. He's a detackle for the for the Chargers. They were not on a team that year, I don't think. No, no. I think Amy was, I think Nick was maybe on the Bears. But anyway, Amy watched our kids.

We had two at the time. No, we had one at the time. Just pressing. Gosh, this is so long ago. I'm messing up all these details. But we had one.

My wife flies up, gets right off the game, gets in it playing, flies right back, has things, we have Thanksgiving, giving dinner on the table after that game while we're watching the nightcap because it's such a quick flight. It was the best thing ever. And so obviously like winning, but I'm just like, man,

it was such a really cool experience. And even my son is like, dad, you know, when Thanksgiving comes on, you played on Thanksgiving. Didn't you? You played on things. I'm like, yeah, yeah. It was. Did you like it? Did you like, do guys, did you like playing on Thanksgiving or is it pain in the ass? No, I actually love it because like, you know, obviously you miss the family aspect of it, except unless you're playing the early game at home. But it's so cool because you're the standalone game. And what does everybody in America do Thanksgiving? Like, they watch NFL football.

So it's like every eye is on you. And so it was cool. I'm glad we got out with a win. I'll remember this touchdown that I wish I would have thrown a hitch earlier. I got actually sacked and fumbled but fell on it. They brought, they brought a boundary pressure. And we have a guy. streaking wide open and I watched the film next day. I'm like, oh my God, just throw it a hitch

earlier, but I didn't get it out late. But yeah, it was a fun. It was a fun win, man, something that I'll always cherish, especially on Thanksgiving and just the amount of people. And then, and then you think like Thanksgiving, you think Detroit Lions, right? Like you think Detroit Lions on it. And so it's, it's a man, that's a fun brings back some memories for sure. The third and 12 that you hit to Alan Robinson that you let go down the right sidelines, It was a big time throw. Big, big time throwing,

a big time moment during the game. Yep, I checked to that one. And then Tyquamizel's touchdown, we put it in in the ballroom, Wednesday night at the Detroit Marriott. And I said, Nags,

let's do this. It was my idea. I'm just going to go ahead and take full credit on it. I'm like, look, and it was a stolen play. You know what the play was from?

It was the Minnesota Vikings, 2017 versus the Saints. The Saints, we scored to Alvin Kamara, against Eric Kendricks in the 2017 playoff game, the Minnesota Miracle game, down the right sideline. And I pulled this up because they were playing very similar.

I'm like, next, here's it. And he's like, done, teach it up. So we taught it up in the, in the ballroom.

And we end up hitting it. And he's like, yeah, and it wasn't even man coverage. It's supposed to be like a little pick route, little swing route by number three. Wasn't even man coverage. I'm like,

I'm throwing that. And he was like, he came off the sideline. He's like, it wasn't man. But I know you were throwing that in. And I'm like, yep and it scored. So that's the whole

genesis and story behind that. So it was a pretty cool little thing. I love it. I love it. That again, a memorable game. Eddie Jackson had the pick six at the end. It was a special year. I mean, it was one of more enjoyable years I've had as a Bears fan. That defense was incredible to watch. And, you know, I'm very used to those teams where the defense feels like it could score at any moment. They're making huge plays left and right. And that was

one of those teams. But you made more than enough throws that day. So a very cool, very fun memory, I think, for both of us, but in very different ways. any any favorite thanksgiving traditions foods like what's the highlight of thanksgiving for you um i hate turkey hot take turkey is not my favorite i'm a ham guy um but i just enjoy now that i have kids i enjoy um because for 14 years and really my whole time i've been playing football we you can't really travel so everyone's got to come to you everyone and and it gets it's fine but now i'm like especially with kids we have our kids i'm sitting at my in-laws

place right now doing this and the kids are down there playing with their cousins and with their aunt uncles and with grandma and granddad so all this and they have great grandma and great granddad here so that probably is my favorite part about Thanksgiving now that I'm a little bit older that I have kids and I'm able to travel a little bit um so yeah just the family aspect of things I really enjoy that it's been nice to my I spend Thanksgiving with my wife's family it's very big for them I come down here every year it's become a really nice tradition but I still love the food I just love the food like we had We had like our friends giving last weekend. I made most of the food.

And I just, I love Thanksgiving food. Like, it's not the best food, but you make good versions of it. It's pretty damn good. I smoke the turkey, and it's still my favorite way to make a turkey. It's much, much more moist than it is if you just, like, throw it in the oven. The amount of butter I slattered on that thing before I threw it on the smoker was crazy. And I just, I love stuffing. Like, making stuffing is fun for me.

Stuffing is delicious. Like, I just, I made a little brio stuffing with, like, a ton of sate. and sausage and just everything last weekend. The best. The best. Awesome. I'm having two Thanksgiving meals in about a seven-day span here, which is I'm sure good for my cholesterol. But at this point, it's all right.

You got to get after it. Yeah. Listen, the Peloton is calling to me. Yeah. Guys, that is all we got for this holiday week. Sincerely appreciate all of you swinging by. Please enjoy your Thanksgiving with your family. I know that we will.

Thank you so much for spending the time with us today and all season. Looking forward to talking to you next week. This was The Athletic Football Show.