The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Mailbag: Mac Jones' trajectory, Bears concerns, Colts questions, Bills burdens & more with Stephen Holder

Episode Date: September 21, 2021

National NFL Writer for The Athletic, Stephen Holder, joins Robert Mays for this weeks listener mailbag with topics such as Mac Jones' trajectory in New England, Chicago Bears concerns with Justin Fields, the Buffalo Bills' start and much more as we close the book on week 2.DISCOUNT @ theathletic.com/footballshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Football Show. The Athletic Football Show. Today is Tuesday, September 21st. I'm Robert Mays. Joining me today, it is our new national NFL writer at The Athletic. Also covering the Colstall a little bit and the co-host of the 1% Better podcast, Stephen, how you doing, man? I'm doing great.

I'm doing great. I am doing better than Carson Wentz because I only have one sprained ankle, not two. So I won't tell you how I did it Because it's just going to indicate that I'm getting old But yeah, man I've had a swollen ankle for like a week So I'm not available to play quarterback for the Colts I just want to put that out there

I guarantee you the way that I sprained my ankle On my training camp trip was more embarrassing Than however you sprained your ankle Does walking down the steps of the deck count It was worse than this By the way, we're going to do a melt bag today As we're doing every single Tuesday appreciate your guys as questions.

They were excellent again. We'll get to the questions in the voicemails. I'm feeling a little punchy because it's Monday and I'm tired, so I'm going to tell this story. So when I got done at Dolphins Camp, I'm driving to Jacksonville. As a veteran of South Florida and Florida overall, you know that is a shitty drive.

It's not a fun drive. It is a long drive, okay? And we're like a weekend to the training camp tour. I have not had a day off because I went to Tampa on the only day off. They were the only team practicing on the, the first and I was like, I'm using this day. Do not have the stamina I had when I was 24, but this is a whole other story. So I pull off to the side of the road, I'm starving. Those training camp days, you just forget to eat for like 12 hours. I'm so hungry.

So it's just a world of strip malls, like probably an hour outside of Miami, as most of Florida in that stretch tends to be. I see a Wendy's, and I'm going to go to the Wendy's, I'm going to at dinner. I ate like shit on this trip. So I park in the wrong parking lot and the Wendy's is one over and I can't get there. So I have to walk through like some bushes to get into the Wendy's parking lot. As I'm walking through these bushes, my shirt catches on the bush and I twist as I'm walking off the curb and I just snap my ankle. And I'm like, you got to be kidding. You got to be kidding me. It's like you have to be kidding me. I'm sitting here. I'm on the road. I have a five hour drive ahead of me. It's my right ankle.

Add insult to injury. The Wendy's isn't even open. The lobby is not even open. So I can't get me food. In the same strip mall parking lot, there's a Walgreens. I go into the Walgreens. I buy like an old-timey ice bag. Like the type of ice bags that screw open that you'd see in like a cartoon.

Right. I buy a huge bag of ice. I fill the ice bag in the Walgreens parking lot. I get some athletic tape. and it's my right foot. I have a five-hour drive, and I tape the ice bag to my foot as I make this five-hour drive from Miami to Jacksonville. It was just a horrible, embarrassing series of events, but this is a safe space. No one listens to this podcast, so I don't mind sharing this with you. Good, good. And you know, this is what you should tell people. It's kind of what I do, too.

Like when people think, oh, what a glamorous job. You could tell them the story of, about getting your shirt snagged on a on a weed or a bush in Florida trying to get to a windies now that's glamorous stuff it was horrible I wore an ankle brace the next day at jack's practice it was fine I mean a couple days I was okay but it was really swollen and it was just one of those moments was like I and then I'm like looking up urgent cares in jacksonville's like did I break my ankle like might have to go get this x-rayed at some urgent care in jacksonville Florida. Well-reviewed urgent cares in Jacksonville, Florida. Just the heads-out for anyone that ever has a medical issue down there. Anyway, speaking of medical issues, we're going to get to

the Colts on a lot of other things today and the week two mailbag. Let's start with Jason Sanders. Jason Sanders sent us an email, said, hey guys, love the show, been able to follow Stephen's stuff as well. Pretty simple question. Which two and O teams are you not sold on and which oh and two teams are you still buying? I want to save the O and two teams for a little bit later, because we've got a few questions like this. But let's start with the 2-0 teams, which I think is a good reset after two games typically. Stephen, which of the 2-0 teams in the NFL right now

are you still a little bit hesitant about? Which ones are you not quite buying yet? Right, right. So, you know, as I look through the AFC here, right? Like, well, first of all, the Broncos, all kinds of questions come to mind, right? Yes. Like, I think I need to see a little bit more. I think it's wonderful for them, by the way, right?

Like, I think they have some talent. They think they're building something, but like, I don't know that. I don't know that they're there yet. So I'll start with the Broncos. And clearly, you know, we have to see more of like, if they're a quarterback situation going to be viable long term, all of that, right? There also is, you know, one team that I think has been,

that I think it's really talented and really fun but never consistent is the Cardinals. Yeah. I like that team. I want to love that team,

but I don't love them. Now, I can grow to love them. I can't because I love a lot about them already. So, but let's just see if they can sustain it. That's really, that's all I'm saying. I think they have lots of talent. It's a matter of consistency,

in my view. And the Panthers, so you were in town here in Indy, right? The Panthers came in for practices against the Colts. I was kind of underwhelmed, right? I just don't know. I want to see more on them, too. I just, I don't know. Those are the, that's probably most of the two and O teams, honestly.

Yeah, there aren't that many. The bucks are convincing, you know, but most of the team is, most of the league is one and one. I think the bucks are convincing we all knew that coming in. I have questions about the Niners. I don't know what sort of long-term viability the Niners have even at 2-0. It's not like they beat the brakes off the Eagles yesterday. Their offense looks strange. You know what I mean, there's so many screens and just getting the ball out of Jimmy's hands.

What they're doing with their skill position players, like the fact that Brandon I, you has this really diminished role at their defense, I think, is already hurt. So, I mean, they're 2-0, but they beat two teams before the season. I think a lot of people thought we'd be picking in the top five next year. I think the Eagles are going to be better than we thought coming into the year that a lot of people thought. But I still don't think these are overly convincing or overly impressive wins that the Niners have had. Carolina, we talked a lot about them on today's show with Nate. I think that their offense is playing better than I thought it would.

They played a really banged up Saints team yesterday who was missing several guys on their defense. But I think that the way that Sam Darm was operating is impressive. We'll see what it looks like long term. I think they're doing some interesting things on defense. They have a really young, explosive core of defensive players. And I think that their front can get after people. They're aggressive up front. Just the different pressures they're bringing, I think, are,

it's the right way to deploy those guys. So I'll be keeping tabs on them as this goes, but I think that they may not look as impressive over the next four weeks as they did over the first two, considering their competition level. And I think the Broncos are another really good example. You know, they played a Giants team that, who knows, I think their offense played well against Washington.

We're going to dig into Washington's defense a little bit later in the week. I assume I'll talk about that with Nate on Friday. They're playing the bills this week. But I have a hard time getting a feel for them. But the Broncos' offenses look better than we thought. So I just, with all this stuff, wait in C mode. I know that's not interesting, but there are so many things that happen over the first two to three weeks of an NFL season that when you look back on it three, four, six months later, like, I cannot believe that happened.

So every single year, I typically try to just. just slow us down at this time of year. Just slow down. I know that does not make for interesting material for the first month of the year or so, but I've learned way too many lessons and gotten burned way too many time. So let's check back in three weeks about every single team that's two and no, and we can have a deeper and more nuanced discussion. It will be a different discussion too because they won't be on the same trajectory.

They won't all be on the same trajectory. Absolutely. All right. Let's get to our first voicemail of the week. Hey everyone, this is Charlie from Chicago. I'm just calling as a Bears fan who is at the game today and very sunburned. I think there's a lot of reason to be excited about field well beyond any sort of positives that happen today. My question is, is best case scenario for the Bears, does it look like the Chargers season last year where they're in a lot of games, but they end up losing in a lot of a variety of weeks?

weird ways and people who are a lot smarter than me seem to not speak super highly of this coaching staff and especially of this front office is something similar to what the charters went through where their quarterback is offers nothing but opportunity. Thanks for you, Shannon. So I really appreciate the call from Charlie. It was like 85 degrees in Chicago yesterday. So we're not used to that. 85 degrees in sunny, but it might have been a little cooler yesterday.

but on Saturday it was very hot. It was a warm couple of days. He was at the game. He's very sunburned. I think his question is legitimate. And I think it's a question that we've asked on this show a few different times. I'm curious about your take. When it boils down to it, do we feel like last year's chargers are the best case scenario

or just a reasonable point of comparison for what the bears might be going through during Justin Fields' rookie year over the next few months here? Well, let me start by saying, okay, on the sunburn. issue. First of all, all right, I'm the black guy talking about sunburns, right? You don't have to respond to that. But look, I am just, I am still not like back from my training camp sunburn. Like, I still have ankle marks. And it's been like three weeks, you know, at least three weeks. I still got the ring around my bicep from the shirt sleeves. And I still got, you know, the ankle sock, you know, tan going there. And it's like, like extremely noticeable, like extremely

So, yeah, anyway, that's what I'm dealing with. I go back to pale instantly. All I do is get a ton of freckles every time I'm in the sun and then just instantly pale again. So it's a really, really nice combination. I'll get my usual tone back by the time the leaves are all turned, I'm sure. So it'll be time to freeze my tail off. Anyway, so here's the thing on the beers. You know, I think I have to start by saying,

I think there's a big difference between the bears and the chargers, and I think it's the front office. Okay? I got to say, I want to say this. That is a point that he made, the Charlie made. He said in this case,

Pace probably gets fired. So that's one of the differences. He did make that point in his call. We cut it off about halfway. Fair enough. For context. Fair enough, right. But I think that's an important point because the composition of the team,

like they both have done some good job. They both have done a good job with some acquisitions. There's no question. The bears have some pieces. But I think that with the chargers, like, it feels like there have been fewer misses with some of the swings they've taken. They're just, I mean, be seized by injuries, right? Last year, just utterly besieged by injuries.

And obviously some, like, comically just embarrassing mistakes at the end of games, couldn't close out games that should have been wins in many cases. cases. In the Bears case, I don't know, I just think, I think yes, I do think that is, that is probably the best case scenario because do we see this being a great team this year? No. I think you have a rookie quarterback. If he ends up playing, you're going to have mistakes. I think that he is probably going to have a little bit different trajectory than, than the Chargers had with their rookie quarterback last year. He just seems, he's a different type of passer with, With the Chargers, they were dealing, I think, with a little more polished of a quarterback, right?

And I don't say that in a negative way about Justin Fields. I just think they're different. And their learning curves are going to be different, I think. And so I just think it's going to be a little rockier. I felt like with the Chargers, I mean, they had a quarterback who was, I thought, playing well in spite of much of what was happening around him. So I think with the Bears, it's going to be, you know, can he, be a guy to lift some of the play around him? I don't know that yet. We'll see. We'll have to see.

Are other guys going to have to help Justin Fields? I don't think with the Chargers, that was necessarily as much of a question. So I don't know. I don't think they're exactly the same, but I do think if the bears come out of this knowing for sure that Justin Fields is a guy, that is a huge win, no question about it. I think for teams that are searching for a quarterback, and I'm a guy who's an indie, so I can relate to this. For teams that are searching for a quarterback, if you can come out of a season, regardless of whatever the hell your record is, if you can come out of that season feeling like,

all right, we got our guy, that is a win. So I see it. I totally agree with that. And I think that that is, in that vein, it is the best case scenario. If that is where we're at on January 1st, Justin Fields is a guy. Justin Fields is a guy that we can build around. I think that comparison stands.

I don't know what else you can get from this season if you're Chicago. I think their defense played pretty well yesterday. It was encouraging, but I still think that the secondary is enough of a question mark that the defense is going to struggle to carry them. And I still think they have so many issues up front on offense, just questions that we had coming into the year, questions we had about the structure of the offense, the talent that they have along the offensive line.

Those don't disappear just because Justin Fields is the quarterback. Those are the same problems that plague the charge. personnel-wise last year. But I think your point is totally well-taken. I think Tom Telosco has done a decent job of assembling talent on those Chargers teams. They have found players on those Chargers teams. There was a core of talent there. In Chicago, I think there are fewer guys that would make up whatever the next stage of this is.

There's no Joey Bosa in Chicago. Kaleo Mack is 31 years old. the players they've spent on a lot on defense haven't necessarily been key pieces over the last year in a couple games. I think that for the most part, the vision of this team has been a little bit more muddled. I will say that they have resources to fix this next offseason in the same way that the Chargers did. The most important thing for the Chargers is they walked into this offseason with like $40 million in cap space and they fixed their offensive line, at least in terms a pass protection. If you look at what that

team is, they didn't fix the whole roster in a single year, but what they've put around Justin Herber in a single year is very impressive. The Bears have a chance to remake their roster next year. They have a decent amount of cap space. Alan Robinson's a free agent, all those considerations. But this isn't a team that's locked

into whatever this version of the roster is. Kalilak's set to make $30 million. He has a $12 million-dollar base salary. If they wanted to trade Kalil-Mak and it just hit the reset button hard around Justin Fields, they can do that. They do not have a first round pick. I think that's one of the bigger differences,

where the Chargers had this cap space and they had a first round pick. They remade their offensive line by spending and apparently so far hitting on Richon Slater and remaking that group in a single year. The Bears don't have that. They don't have two ready-made receivers on the roster for 2022 in the same way that the Chargers did with Keenan Allen and Mike Williams and a chance, I think, to remake their offensive line in a single year. But I do believe that if we're sitting at the here at the

end of the season and they say, this is a guy that we have a chance to build around. This is a guy who can be just a upper tier quarterback in the NFL. I do think that's the best case scenario for the Bears. What happens with the coaching staff and the front office and all of that, I think remains to be seen. Yeah. And I will add this. I mean, the context is important because we're talking about the Bears and a quarterback. Like if the Bears find a quarterback, right? Exactly. Yes. That is next level win. Okay. The context here matters. Yeah. I totally. agree. And if we're sitting there, and we talked about this coming into the season, it was almost an inverse of what you'd come to expect from this team, where you're searching

for a quarterback, searching for a quarterback. The opposite could be true, where they have a quarterback by the end of the year, and everything else remains a question mark. And I could see that happening. And I do think that that is an outcome that most Bears fans would probably accept. All right. Our next one here comes from Brady Vernon. He said, big fan of the show, this is probably an overreaction from yesterday. But is it fair to start putting some criticism on Brian Flores and Chris Greer. The Dolphins' first round picks since Flores took over haven't exactly been studs. Austin Jackson's sad face.

And as good as the defense has been, Flores has had a revolving door of offensive coordinator and offensive line coaches, a position in which they've invested a lot of draft capital with not so great results. Just wanted to hear your thoughts. Like Brady says here, I do think it's important not to react, but this is an important year for the Dolphins' overall trajectory. It's the second year for Tua. year two for that 2020 draft class

that had three first round picks. It doesn't all have to happen this year. But I do think that we're monitoring what sort of progress this group is making in what is a pretty crucial year. So a couple games into this season, where do you sit with the dolphins and what is a very pivotal season for that?

So first, I think it's important to point out. I think one of the problems with Miami is that they're a little bit of a victim of their own success. Because as you talked about, you know, their progression here in this tour era, look, last year, well, two years ago, right, they have that late surge. They look like they're going to go 0 and 16. Then they have the late surge. And they look like they actually have a clue. And that carries over in a major way to 2020. They go 10 and 6. And that was never supposed to happen. Right. So I think the ideal situation if you're, you know, Not a fan, but if you're, you know, someone who is looking for this to be linear and maybe, you know, someone who, if you're sitting in that front office, you're thinking, okay, maybe we don't want too much pressure. The way to, the way for this to have gone was for them to go like seven and nine last year, you know, and say, oh, okay, we might have something in the quarterback and, you know, we have some defensive players we like and can build around. You know, I've got to tinker with the offensive line. So does everybody, right? seven and nine coming out last year and then this year all right let's ratchet that up a little bit right that's that's kind of where you want to be but no they go 10 and six so now here they are and we're getting questions like this which are totally appropriate so i don't know i i think that part of the

problem you have they still are a very young team in many ways right and and when the young team has success like that they they had that success despite you know going through the growing pains or all of their growing pains that are going to happen with a young team. They were not finished with those growing pains last year, even though their record might have suggested maybe they were, but like, come on, they're not. And so they're going to be more growing pains. And when they encounter them, are those going to be setbacks? Are they going to be able to overcome them? Are they going to be able to establish an identity, et cetera? In all of those questions, they're still kind of unanswered, you know? And I just think with a young team, sustaining that is really,

really hard. So yeah, it's fine to ask questions. I think it is. And I just think you have to prepare yourself for it to not go as maybe you hoped because there's still a young team. And I think, I just don't think that consistency is something I expect from a young team. I think that's totally fair. And to me, the question would be, all right, you look at when we were, let's build the case for why people were optimistic about Miami a couple years ago. When you have, this rebuild and you have this team that's playing hard. Even when they were tanking, they were playing hard. It's like that's what you want to see.

And then you have this 2020 draft where they have all of these picks. They have these three first round picks. You get your quarterback while not totally tanking the year before. It all seemed to work out in the way that they would have hoped. You have these two other first round picks. You go out last year, you have a really nice season. It's like, all right, year two for these guys. You know, we have another draft where we have a lot of picks.

They end up trading up, all that stuff. the progress from the draft picks has been frightening. No egg binogamy is not played. He's been inactive the last two weeks. He's a first round pick last year. That's tough the stomach. Austin Jackson has not been good. The rest of their offensive line,

it's still a problem. They put a ton of resources into that spot. And the fact that Jesse Davis is still starting at right tackle for them, and I know Lee and Ikeberg went in there yesterday, but they have not figured that spot out. They moved on from their offensive line coach last year. They hired someone else. They've cycled through offensive coordinators.

Now we're in year three, and we have two co-offensive coordinators. There's not been much stability on that side of the ball. And it's tough to say because Tua got hurt yesterday. So we're two games into the season, and he's played a game and a half, and this is such a huge season for him. So I don't want to, again, not overreact too much. But I think it's fair to bring some scrutiny to this situation. Because even if they're a young team, you still want to see tangible progress,

even if you don't expect them to be a finished product yet, and it's important to be patient when you have one of the younger teams in the entire league, I still think it's okay as a Dolphins fan or as someone watching this team closely to expect to see tangible gains from last year to this year and then even as this year goes along. And so far, I watched that game this morning, their offensive line is still a huge problem, no matter who's playing quarterback. So if that's going to continue to be an issue after all that they've spent on it, I think it's totally fair to start levying some criticism toward the front office, toward the coaching staff, because this is the year where they have real expectations.

Yeah, and I would add this, when you talk about some of that instability, especially with young players who need to be developed, that is an absolute recipe for disaster. It's not a recipe for success. So I think that just gives more credence to exactly what you're saying with these young players not progressing like you might hope. All right, let's get to our next voicemail. Let's stick in the AFC East here for a minute. Hey, guys. Every pass fan is hoping we drafted Drew Brees and already redrafted Andy Dalton. Sorry, Robert.

When evaluating young quarterbacks who can't win with their legs, how do you tell which path a quarterback is going down? I seriously can't catch a break. Just stray voicemails are getting me now. It's unbelievable. People are getting their shots in, man. you know, hey. It's all right.

It's all right. I'm glad that people feel comfortable doing that. I think this is a really interesting question. You know, we came in. I remember having this conversation. I've had it a lot over the last couple years. And it's been something that's kept coming up just because of how quarterbacks are changing, right? A lot of the young quarterbacks that we've seen come into the league over the last three or four seasons, almost all of them have what I will determine as playmaking ability.

Even if you're not a runner. You have a lot of guys who can make stuff happen out of structure with their legs. Take it back to the 2018 draft class. Sam Donald is even like that. Baker Mayfield, to a certain extent, even if it's not to that degree. Josh Allen absolutely is. Lamar Jackson, absolutely is. So a lot of the young court go back, Holmes, Watson.

A lot of these guys can't have that aspect to their game. And now we come into this draft class, and Mack Jones doesn't. And I think the argument for needing a guy like that in the modern game, is that you needed somebody who could bide his time as he was developing the mental side of things. Because if you look at guys like Breeze or Brady, Peyton Manning, guys that won with their brains, Philip Rivers, that happens later in their careers. And the way the game has changed, there isn't a chance to have that develop mental time anymore because passing is so important. So I think it becomes difficult. So this is a unique situation that Mack Jones is in because he's so unlike most of the young quarterbacks that we've seen come into the NFL.

And what we're watching with his development is going to be so dissimilar to those examples. So when you're watching a young quarterback who doesn't have that legs as checkdown, legs as playmaking ability aspect to his game, what do you need to see from that quarterback to think, all right, he's progressing in the way that we want him to? Well, I'll start by saying there's another variable here that it's not just about those players needing to make plays off schedule because they're not there mentally yet. It's also who they're facing on defense. Okay. Because look at, excuse me, look at some of the athletes that are rushing the pastor today, right? And that has consistently changed over time.

Just even, look, I'm not that old, but I mean, I can tell you, in my 16. years, yeah, 16 years ago, my God, covering the NFL, like, yeah, it's steadily changed. You know, I remember covering Simeon Rice years ago. I was like, man, this guy's a freak. Oh, my God. And everybody has one of those. You know, it's like, every pass rusher is Simeon Rice now. Exactly.

Like, I'm not actually exaggerating, I don't feel like, you know? So, so anyway, I think, so now you have these guys that are getting chased all over the field. They've got to put some stress on those incredible athletes. athletes playing defense. And the kind of guys who do that are the quarterbacks that you talked about, those athletic dual threat quarterbacks. So with Mack Jones and guys like him, look, he is a little bit of a dinosaur nowadays. Let's just be honest. I don't think that means he can't win. But look, he is an outlier. There's no question about it. You've already outlined one thing that has to happen. He has to be ahead of the game mentally because he's going to have to,

if he's going to play from the pocket, he's going to have to make quicker decisions, right? He's not a guy who's going to extend plays a lot. He's going to have to make quicker decisions. So mentally, you've got to process stuff. There's no question about that. And you've got to process it faster than a lot of your young counterparts come into the league able to do. So that's the first thing.

The other thing, and if you talk to people who really understand quarterbacks, they will beat this drum obsessively. Accuracy, accuracy, accuracy. And the reason for that is, I think the guys who extend plays, Okay, take Patrick Mahomes. Is he accurate? Of course. But there are times when he can wait for a guy to get open.

Okay, he can give Tyreek Hill a split second longer because he'll buy time. And on those throws, frankly, you don't necessarily have to be incredibly accurate. But you've got to keep the play alive. You've got to see things, you know, all of that. But the accuracy is a little less important in situations like that because you're just giving a guy a chance to go get the ball. and generally he has worked his way away from the coverage by then. So you have less of those types of situations with a player,

I mean, theoretically, with a player like Mack Jones. So he's going to have to throw into some tighter windows at times. And I think that gets tougher. I mean, these guys have great anticipation on the back end. You're going to be making, if you're making tougher throws, that's going to have all kinds of impacts on your success, completion percentage, what have you, right? Turnovers, all of that.

So I do think it makes it tougher. There's no question about it. If I'm running a team, it's not my preferred style of quarterback today, right? That doesn't mean, again, he was available to him. They did what they could. They got the guy that they believe in. But let's be honest about it. I think that these questions are very, very relevant and very, very fair.

If you're looking at it, I think it's about how you deal with pressure is the most important thing. Yeah. Because that's what those guys that win upstairs were able to do. They can mitigate pressure and make you pay for blitzing in all of these ways that are so apparent, just how quickly they operate. I think it's that. And then the other side of it, you bring up Mahomes. I think that's another really good example for how this happens. Justin Herbert isn't the fleetest of foot.

But when you watch them play last year, think about how many times Justin Herbert can drift in the pocket and make throws because he has just this upper, upper echelon arm. that's another way you can protect yourself as a young quarterback. So Mac Jones doesn't have mobility and he doesn't have the arm. Makes it harder. The needle you need to thread is much more difficult. And I think that one of the benefits that a lot of these guys had earlier in their careers, go back and look at the numbers.

Drew Breeze in 2004, in the first year he went to the Pro Bowl, he threw 26 passes a game for a team that was pretty good. That's not going to happen for the most part in this. day and age. It's hard to be that efficient when you're running the ball. The Patriots are going to try, but that's what you need to do. The Tom Brady Patriots in 2001 were extremely run heavy. Think about what Ben Rathesberger's teams were like in 2005 when he was a rookie, extremely run heavy. Russell Wilson's Seahawks teams when he was a rookie, extremely run heavy. That's what you need to do. You need to protect and insulate these guys in the early stages of their careers

when they're a different version of the quarterback you hope they are three or four years from now. That's the most important aspect of this. I think it's really difficult to live in the way that the Bengals did last year, where we're not going to be able to run the ball really well, and we're kind of letting our quarterback play point guard. That's a really hard life for any quarterback, and he ended up getting hurt. I don't think it's because of that,

but I think that's a really difficult bar to clear, and I think the degree of difficulty in that is extremely high. So when I look at Mac Jones, he's not able to mitigate pressure just by virtue of his brain at this point in his career. He was one of four for negative one yard yesterday when butst. I mean, that's just not going to happen. And that's okay. So I think it's really difficult to know what the path is like and whether these guys are heading in the right direction just because it's really hard to win like that when you're a young quarterback and you don't have those other tools. So he could be fine.

But again, I do think it's a really high degree of difficulty. And I think we were saying this. We were saying this coming in. And just because he played well in the preseason doesn't mean this stuff suddenly goes away and suddenly vanishes. It's going to be difficult for him as a rookie at times. But I think that's okay. You just need to kind of work through that stretch in the same way a lot of those other guys did.

Brady's sack percentage as a rookie was 9%. He was sacked on 9% of his dropbacks as a rookie. His career sack percentage now is like 3.5. It's a huge difference. And that's okay. Like, it's okay if he doesn't look good as a rookie. Like, especially when you consider how different he is that some of these other guys that have come in and had just microwave success. All right.

Let's move on to our next one here from James Sandberg. This is our first of a couple sad Colts fans questions. He says, frustrated Colts fan here. I figure we had to ask you a couple. Sure. He said, we should have beat the Rams yesterday. Most of the team did enough to win. Julian Davenport excluded.

But it was the Rams, so whatever. common consensus seems to be that Frank Reich is a pretty good play caller. I've spent the last two seasons questioning this and wondering when national media will join the throng of dubious Colts fans. We've had two drives that went inside the five and got zero points. The plays didn't work. I don't know how else to cut that. Please understand why I should trust Frank Reich.

Stephen, I felt like you could give some pretty good perspective on this one as someone who has covered Frank Reich day in and day out over the last few years. I can. So I am one of those people who think that Frank Wright, is actually a strong play caller. Same. Right. And I think most people who really look at this unemotionally, I think they see it that way, right?

People who I respect who know football, they often agree. Okay. So I'll start by saying that. That doesn't mean you have to agree as a fan. You can feel however you want. I'm just passing on information, man. So anyway, here's what I think is happening. And it's something that I actually dived into a little bit today.

because this tends to happen, these conversations tend to happen after their, and this is true of all fan bases, right? They tend to happen after there's sort of a, you know, a really big pivotal call on a game that doesn't go right, right? I mean, that's when all coaches become bad play callers. That's how it works. That's the rule.

And so yesterday you had two huge situations, right? You can't get to the one-yard line and not punch it in against a team like the Rams. They can't do that. And that happened, right? then they have another goal to go situation. They run a shovel pass. Aaron Donald goes Godzilla and completely destroys the play.

It gets intercepted. I mean, just like everything that could have went wrong in that play did. But that can happen against Aaron Donald, right? So really, I'm not saying those are the only examples. I'm saying those are two really big examples of people really being outraged and saying, you know, sort of as a result of that, you know, look, maybe this guy's a bad play caller. Okay, what they never talk about, and this is all, this is going to be applied in a lot of places.

But what people never talk about is here's this team with right now, you know, some pretty average group of receivers, very, very average. They're missing Tyre Hilton. They're missing Paris Campbell yesterday. And yet, they're able to scheme Michael Pittman wide open multiple occasions, right? That doesn't just happen because the Rams suck. They clearly don't, okay? Have you heard of Jalen Ramsey, right? No, that's scheme. That's play calling. That's route combinations. They're doing things to make that happen. That is a result of play calling and scheming throughout the week. And I can tell you, that plays out on a regular basis. There were multiple occasions yesterday. They got guys wide open through scheme. I mean, Jack Doyle, God bless him, one of the hardest working guys I've ever covered, but Jack Doyle runs like a 4-9. Okay? This guy's getting

he's a great route runner by the way okay i love jack i hope he doesn't hear this but even if he did he wouldn't even be mad at me because he's a great guy but jack doyle's getting wide open against the ram secondary how do you think that happens you know what i mean it now granted he does a great job of selling and and his route techniques are incredible so he does his part but at the end of the day scheme is a big part of that and scheme and play calling i think go hand in hand right so yeah Now, what Frank Reich definitely has to do better at is, look, he is very aggressive. There's no question about it. And I have run his red zone numbers over the course of his four years in Indy, going on four years now.

And they are, I believe, dead last and the number of times they've been stopped on fourth down in the red zone. It's not a ton because this is not a very frequent scenario. Yeah. But they've been stopped more times in the red zone on downs than any other team over the number. those four years. I think it's like 12 times. And so what happens is I can think of like three or four of them off the top of my head that were huge stories on talk radio for a week. So that's what happens. You know, you have these big, much, or well-documented scenarios and they linger in your mind. And so it sort of leads you to this, you know, a little bit of a biased conclusion. Yeah, you know what?

You know what? Now that I think about it. He does suck as a play caller. Because remember that time, then this happened, then that happened. And so anyway, I sound like I'm defending the guy, and I don't want to do that. But I'm just telling you- Oh, I'll do it in a second. Don't worry. No, no, no, no. I just think that's what's happening here.

There's some really specific situations that really had a huge bearing on the outcome of games, and people are latching on to those, and so therefore you're a bad play caller. They don't, again, they don't complain all the times when very average receivers are getting wide open. So that's what I'd say. Frank Gregg took over as the Colts head coach in 2018.

He was hired on February 11th, which is about a month later than most head coaches are typically hired. We all know what the situation was with the Colts in 2018 and their head coaching job. He comes in to that team. Huge questions about whether Andrew Luck is going to be ready to play. Remember, just that whole saga about that entire offseason. Did Andrew practice at all during training camp that year? Basically no. No.

Okay. So he has a quarterback that doesn't practice through all of training. Sorry, let me rephrase that. He didn't do anything through the offseason. We came into the training camp not knowing if he would even do anything. And so they started working him in at the beginning of training camp. So he did have some. But up until the day they reported to camp, his status was still a question.

There you go. Okay. Slow start. Remember 2018? It was a very slow start. They did not play well at the beginning of the season. by the end of the year, fifth and weighted offensive DVOA. Fifth, okay?

2019, the quarterback retires on the eve of the season. Jacoby Percette comes in. They finish 19th in offensive DVOA. It's not great, but it's ridiculous circumstances. You had a top five quarterback retire a week before the season started, okay? Again, we've said this a million different times. Eventually, these excuses are going to diminish, but over time, I think he has given a, he deserves the benefit of the doubt.

Last year, Philip Rivers comes in, a bit of a bit of a bit of a few, of a slow start again, they finished 10th and waited offensive DVOA. So two years, three to three years with three different quarterbacks, they've had two top 10 finishes. What do you think about waiting the end of the season more than the beginning of the season? He comes in this year, and the first game wasn't great. But yesterday, what's his 10 of his first 12 for 1229 yards? They get stopped twice inside the five.

They come away with zero points inside the five. Consistently, they were able to make stuff. happened in the passing game yesterday against the Rams. I think they're going to be just fine with Frank Reich as their offensive play caller. I thought they looked okay on offense yesterday. The one thing that was a consistent problem yesterday was protection. And I think you can question the overall approach with the way they handled the offensive line yesterday. I don't love sprinkling in a left tackle when he's not fully ready to play.

I just think in terms of overall process, that's flawed, because you're putting guys in positions to fail. Like, Julian Davenport isn't a great NFL player, even in the best circumstances, but flip-flopping him between sides of the line and asking him to play multiple positions. I mean, we've seen guys where you can have an entire week to prepare playing right tackle versus left, and it isn't easy. And now he's over there single-blocked on Aaron Donald multiple times in this game. The Rams were hunting him in past protection. I mean, they knew where he was at all times.

You need to help him. I just think that was to me the issue with the way the Colts approached that game yesterday. It was the way they handled the line and the way they provided help to some of those guys individually over the course of that game. Outside of that, lines on paper, scheming guys open, what you're asking your quarterback to do, I think all of that is fine. I think all of that will be fine. And you would assume and hope that when the line gets healthy and Brayden Smith is there. And Eric, what's Brayden Smith's status, by the way?

we'll see he's got a foot injury uh we'll just have to see if he practices this week so okay so hopefully he'll be back sooner rather than later no no you work so yes so you work him he gets back in you work fisher back into a full-time role hopefully this stuff gets figured out but i think that to me we're watching that game yesterday that's the only thing where it's like you got it you got to help your guys out like that's just you cannot let them sink or swim in those moments but other than that i did not come away from that game yesterday being like man the Colts offense is a disaster of what's happening now. Yeah, and I will just say on a related note, I think that I really felt like Frank Reich,

if Carson Wentz was ever going to get right and get back on track, and I know he's got the ankles injured right now, injured ankles, plural, guy. But if Carson Wence was ever going to get back on track, it was going to be here with Frank Wright. I really believe that. If he can't do it here, then maybe people are right about him. I actually think that the guy is salvageable, and I think yesterday was incredible evidence to back that up. I thought that he did exactly what you thought he was going to do, which is make good throws. He's playing very efficiently, frankly, which is not something he did last year, playing efficiently,

and also being just a really incredible athlete when he needs to be, and protecting himself as well. So he didn't get hurt scrambling. He got hurt playing in the pocket. You know, so that's not on, that's not on wins. We just addressed the past protection, so we know how that happened. So I just think that important little adjustments are necessary, and that's what really good offensive coaches do. And if you look at the numbers from last year, the Colts led the league in past attempts with

five-man protections. They love getting everyone out in routes. And when you have Phillip Rivers and one of the best offensive lines in the NFL, that's a solid way to play. Like if Neheme Heinz is my running back, I want him out there. I want five eligible guys and I want Philip to play point card. When you have Carson Wentz, who has clearly

struggled with pass protection issues in the past and you don't love the guys you have blocking for him, throwing the ball 30 times yesterday with five guys in pass protection might not be the best approach. They averaged, he had his 9.1 sack percentage

yesterday when they had five man pass protection. It's like little things like that. It's like I think overall their approach works offensively. I think that they do a very good job with it. But it's just little things where it's like, can we just give Julian Davenport like a tiny bit more help? If we're going to use two tight ends and we're going to have Moe Alley Cox and Jack DeWale on the field at the same time,

let's just sneak one of those guys in there. Let's just nestle one of those guys into pass protection and help my guy out just a little tiny bit. That was the one quibble that I had with the way they approached that game offensively yesterday. The Red Zone play calling, all of that. I think that'll all sort. out as it typically does.

All right. One more sad Colts question here before we move on. Josh Lane asks, question about the Indianapolis Colts defense from a long time Colts fan. All we've heard in the off season is that this defense was primed to be elite this year, and they've been far from it. Seems like offenses this year and last have had their way with us when they really need to make a play. Are we having problems because, one, we have very little pass rush. Two, the elite players, Kenny Moore, Darius Leonard, and others are simply insignificant

underperforming, or is it a defense that's past its time and not structured to stop today's high-powered offenses? Thanks and love the podcast. We love you, Josh. What do you think? So I think there are, there is some truth to a lot of what he says or what he lays out there. I think, first of all, the pass rush, there isn't any.

Then that is a problem. That is a problem for sure. Now, I get why they approached the pass rush the way they did. You know, a lot of Colts fans wanted the Colts to go out and sign a, a big-name pass rusher and free agency, you know, you know, how that tends to work out. Generally, it can be a mixed bag, right? Now, they had a lot of young pass rushers already on their roster, guys who have played varying amounts, but not enough. And so what did they do?

They parted with two veteran pass-rushers, Justin Houston, De Nico Atre, and they said, you know what, guys, you're going to have to prove yourselves, and we want to see what you can do. So that's where they're at right now. They got these young guys playing and they're not getting the production they want. And so I think if you're a Colts fan, like you're right to be frustrated about that. But you should also want to know, you should also want to know, all right, here are some guys in year three and four. Like, we need to know if they can play. Right. And so I think that's part of the front office's approach here is like, we don't know what we have.

Some of these guys have been hurt. Some of these guys have been playing behind veterans, whatever the case might be. they need to play because we may or may not have to pay them pretty soon. So that's really just a function of team building that people don't consider, but it's a real thing. It's a real thing. Now, the fact is, they're not getting the job done right now, and that is what it is.

I'm not going to make any defense for that. Now, the other point about some of the big playmakers not doing or playing at the level expected, very real, it's a very real thing. No question about it. You have Darius Lennon. who admits to having an ankle injury that's not going to heal anytime soon, I think we're seeing the effects of that. There's no question.

Yeah. We're not hearing his name. He's not making his signature plays. He had the forced fumble in week one. But really, I mean, for Darius Leonard to have four and five tackles in a game, like, that just never happens. And I'm not saying tackles are like the end-all be-all. They're not.

But this is a sideline-to-sidline player. That's not who he is right now. So, I mean, I can't tell you that's going to change. I mean, if anything, it might go the other way. He may have to sit, may have to go get surgery. I don't know. I'm just saying, you know, those are the worst case scenarios. But that's something they can't do anything about.

I don't think it's going to get better, honestly. I really, really don't. So I don't have any good news there. And then the other thing on scheme in terms of the system, one of the things that I'm seeing is, this was really true in week one, too. The Colts are actually adding more to their defensive menu than they have in the past. And ironically, the results are getting worse.

I go back to 2018. I said this on our podcast with Zach Kiefer. I go back to 2018. Here they come. Maddie Rufluis, he's playing basically Monty Kiffin's defense from back in the day. And people, and India are like,

oh, we've seen this before. You know, Tony Dungee, been here, done that. And you know what? Getting Gary Bracket flashes just taking me back a few years. And to be honest, I thought that was their,

most consistent season defensively. And so I'm starting to wonder, I don't know the answer to this, but part of me is wondering do they need to just go back to basics and just say, deeper than the deepest, wider than the widest, Lovie Smith style, and just say, you're not going to beat us over the top because right now they're beating them over the top. The problem is to play like that, you need linebackers who can cover a lot of ground. And if Darius Leonard's hurt, that again, becomes a question. And I think that if you're going to play the way they want to play,

and it goes back to the free agent pass rushers conversation. Melvin Ingram looks like a stud for the Steelers right now. He's a different player in this defense. He can be a spinner with the Steelers. They can do a lot of funky fronts in Pittsburgh because of the way that they play. The Colts don't play like that. Colts have an even front. It's a four-man rush for the most part.

They're going to bring a scatter pressure here and there, but we know how they're going to play. I think this is a bad matchup for a young Colts pass rush. You know, Quitty Pay had zero pressures yesterday. He's playing against Andrew Whitworth. it's going to happen. If you're a rookie pass rusher playing against the guy who, in my opinion, is a Hall of Fame resume and is still playing at a decently high level, you're going to run into this every once in a while. I also think schematically, it's a shitty team to play against.

I mean, they did a lot of stuff yesterday that makes it hard on you. The Cooper Cup touchdown, where he's lined up in the backfield and he's got a two-way go on Kari-Will's coming out of the backfield. That's just stuff where you're out of luck before the play even starts in that situation. And I think there were a few of those yesterday. A couple of areas where I think that it's unacceptable in the way that they played. Tackling its base on screens. Too many just easy chunk gains for a team that... I remember I was having a conversation with the GM before the season.

We were talking about what lessons did you learn watching defenses last year? And he brought up the Colts as one of the teams that he learned by watching the Colts defense just because of how fast they played to the ball. You watched that defense last year and they just played like their hair collectively was on fire. And I just think you haven't seen that on underneath stuff over the first couple games. And when you play the way they do stylistically, you have to play like that. Or it's going to be a problem.

And I think some of those just easy chunk gains on those screens yesterday, that that's just not something that can go down when you're playing this type of defense. I think other than that, it's not as if the Rams were marching the ball up and down the field yesterday. I mean, they had some key third downs. Every time the Colts played man on third down, they ran into issues. The three plays that I can think of, the two plays specifically, where we're talking about one, just playing a type of defense you don't normally play, which is man coverage late on third down.

And two, your star is not showing up. Tyler Higbee was lined up one-on-one with Darius Leonard, wide to the right and hit a slant on third and four. That's typically a matchup where the Colts aren't in a disadvantage. With Darius Leonard right now feeling the way that he is, that's a disadvantage. And then I think you go, there's another play. It was third and nine,

and they had Cooper Cup manned up on Kenny Moore coming all the way across the field. Stafford hits him, first down. They were three for three for 22 yards. and three first downs against man coverage on third down. They were 0 for four when the Colts played zone on third down. So when the Colts are playing the way they want to play, and they still have a sound defense with pretty good players over there.

So I wouldn't be too worried after the first couple weeks. I think that that Rams team is going to be really good on offense, and I think that they've done a really good job with Stafford there of putting their guys in positions to succeed. but if that pass rush is not going to get home over the entire year when they're playing lesser offensive lines and as those guys get more experience, that's going to end up being a problem.

But I wouldn't be smashing that panic button quite yet because I think that the Rams offense has a chance to be very, very good this season. All right, let's get to our next one here, our next voicemail from Steve from Buffalo. Hey, this is Steve from Buffalo. I love the podcast. I just want to comment on the Buffalo defense, actually, The story of the first game was our sputtering offense and the pass rush that the Steelers got,

but I would say the bills played pretty good that game. And then come this game, they're pitching a shutout. Ed Oliver, his name is actually being called for stopping the run. You've got Matt Milano all over the field. Both secondaries played great. You're starting to hear Ebenez's name, and then Rousseau did a little bit. So do you think this defense is for real or just a product of the matchups? And how good does it have to be if our offense keeps spluttered?

Kind of looking for a trained eye. Thank you very much. Goodbye. This is one of my favorite versions of fan emails or questions. It's not a question. It's just Steve trying to talk himself into how good the Buffalo defense can be and using me as a way to do it, which I sincerely appreciate. not a knock on Steve. I appreciate you using the outlets available to you. So I want to talk about

this because we haven't really talked about the Buffalo defense like he mentioned. The Steelers with the story in week one, the offense struggled yesterday. Tua gets hurt. We're talking more about those two things. So two games into the year here, how are you feeling about the way the Buffalo has played defense with this retooled unit, especially up front that they brought into this season? Well, first off, I mean, I think they know they were right to retool, I think, because It just didn't seem like a dynamic defense to me. And I saw this team against the Colts and the playoffs. And that was one of my takeaways from that game was, man, you know, they have so much talent.

But unless they're going to be better on defense, like, I don't see how they can win at all. You know, that was one of my big questions. So far, so good. Now, I lean towards saying, I want to see a little more. Now, I can't denigrate anything they did. against Miami. I mean, shutouts are so rare, exceedingly rare today. To pitch a shutout is so difficult that, look, I have nothing negative to say. I have to give them their due. And I'm not even being negative in general about them. I just think that we will get a better read on them in

the coming weeks. I look at their schedule. Week five, obviously, if you're a Buffalo fan, you've got that circle. Kansas City, you know what, you know what that means. I think a week later, they go, I believe, to Tennessee on the road, two at Tennessee, against that lineup of skill players that they have. I just think we're going to get more information about this team. They've got Tampa Bay later. We're going to get a lot more of a read. I know you want an answer now, and I'm not doing a good job of that. But I want to see a little more. I want to see just a little more. And we'll get that answer here pretty soon, I believe. I thought they played well yesterday.

I think the final score is a little bit misleading. The dolphins went forward on fourth and one inside the five. They did not get it. They had a fumble inside the five, or excuse me, a interception or turnover of some kind inside the five. And that was after a dropped pass by Albert Wilson that would have given them a first down. They had the ball in the 31-yard line and got no points.

So, I mean, this is a team that really sputtered when they got into Bill's territory yesterday. That being said, I do think that this group, and especially with the talent that they've added up front, can be a problem for teams. And if you look at it, this team brings a ton of heat. I mean, you forget it. I went back and I watched the game today.

They had 11 defensive back blitzes on about 53 dropbacks for the Dolphins, which was right in line with their percentage last year. They brought the second highest rate of defensive back blitzes in the league last season. So when you watch them do that, it's like, all right. And then you have to marry that on the back end. There was a beautiful play. I want to say they brought, I think it might have been Hyde coming off the left side. And Brissette got rid of the ball quickly because of the pressure.

And Levi Wallace just played downhill on it perfectly. It was the play where you got the taunting penalty, actually, which is a whole other story. Oh, that's a whole other podcast. Oh, listen, I went on a rant on yesterday's show, which I don't typically do. And I'm kind of embarrassed about it now. Anyway, so you watch that happen. It's like, all right, this, all of that. is combining in a really cool way.

I think they're getting a little bit too cute sometimes. I think I don't need to see Greg Rousseau in coverage that much. Like it happened. He had six coverage snaps yesterday. Like, it's interesting to watch a 6-6 guy do that, and he actually had a nice snap where he was in coverage and added late, you know, sack on it. But for the most part,

I am intrigued with the way that the pieces are fitting together. And I think that over the course of the season, especially if Levi Wallace is going to play well, and that second corner spot gets locked down. I think this team has a chance to be very good on defense because of all the looks and all of the bodies that they can bring at you. I want to see how Leslie Frazier settles into how aggressive he wants to be over the course of the year. Because I think with last year's team, they felt compelled to bring a lot of heat.

Are they going to need to do that consistently this year because of all the pass rushers they've added? Epiness looked really good yesterday. Granted, it was against the right tackles. for the dolphins, but he looked really good yesterday. I think Rousseau is going to be able to give them something. I think that at Oliver looks like he's kind of turned it up a year. And are you going to need to bring all that extra heat if you can rely on those guys? But that's what the season is for.

You settle into yourself, I think especially on defense, as the season goes along, and you get a feel for what you need to do and how aggressive you need to be in those situations. So I think that it wasn't as impressive as it needed to be, as it may have looked yesterday given the final score. but I do like some of the stuff that they're doing. I do like how those guys look right now, and I would be encouraged if I were a Bills fan. The question is, how we finished, do they need to be this good?

If the offense is going to keep playing like this, the offense was not good yesterday. For the second straight game, they were not good. But that's the hope is that when you have a Super Bowl caliber roster, like I think the Bills do, I pick them to go to the Super Bowl, which I'm kind of regretting now. Because early in the season,

I should have listened to that voice in my head that was like, I don't know if their offense is going to be as good again, but that's a whole different thing. But you'd hope that they can find their footing and the defense gives them time to find that footing. And I think this is another big week for them against Washington. But I do think the defense is playing well enough right now to carry them through whatever this little ravine is that their offenses facing. All right. That's all we got today. Steven, thank you so much for doing that.

We're going to be just having athletic friends on for the mailbag every single week. We're going to bring in somebody different every single week. I hope you guys are enjoying that. Appreciate the time. Appreciate you guys sending on all your questions. The reason that we're doing this is because of the thoughtful questions that we get every single time we do a mailbag. For the last two weeks, you have not disappointed. We've gotten some really good ones.

We've had some ones that we couldn't even get to that I hope we'll be able to do down the road. So please continue sending those in. I will be checking it every single day. So don't think that you're just sending them into the ether. I am reading and seeing these. We will be back tomorrow. with Mitchell Schwartz and Lewis Riddick, which I am very excited about for our Wednesday show. Until then, please rate and review the podcast on your podcast platform of choice.

Please subscribe to the athletic. Stephen, is there anything you're working on that you want people to know about? Yeah. So I've actually, you know, Lindsay Jones, obviously a frank guest to the show. She and I have a story coming out about this is going to be very interesting, I think, about what life is like for an unvaccinated NFL player right now. Like, not like, all right, you got to get tested every day, but like just like the utter inconveniences you got to deal with every single day. Yeah.

Like, there's a lot more than people realize. So we just kind of wanted to put that in the context. And I'm also going to dive into Mr. Red Zone, Frank Reich and some of his history in the Red Zone for the Colts fans out there who are interested. So I'll get into that here next day or something. I really appreciate you just leaning into Colts fans' anxieties with the work that you're doing. It's great. You guys should abs. It keeps me going because they give me story ideas.

Because I'm like, all right, so this is what they're worried about this week. I guess I'll write about that. So I love it. All right, guys, please go check that out. Theathletic.com slash football show is where you can subscribe. If you don't have a subscription, I don't know what you're doing. It is necessary to follow the league at this point. So I highly encourage you to go grab one.

So please do. We'll be back tomorrow. Appreciate you guys listening. We'll talk to you soon. This was the Athletic Football. Ball Show.