The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Mailbag: QB’s percent of salary cap, Stefon Diggs’ contract, Lamar Jackson extension talks, the Steelers long-term plan & more

Episode Date: March 30, 2022

What percentage of cap space should be devoted to the quarterback? Is Stefon Diggs due for a payday? Where are the Steelers headed over the next several years? Robert Mays and Nate Tice answer your mailbag questions. They also discuss Lamar Jackson’s contract, cold-weather stadiums, the value of the center position and much more. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic football show. Welcome to the athletic football show. Today's Wednesday, March 30th. I'm Robert Mays. Joining me today. It's my good friend Nate Tyson. How you doing, buddy? Doing very well.

I was listening to your show with Dane. I listened to it today, but you recorded it yesterday, which this will come out tomorrow. But he said, just to confuse everybody even more. But just he was saying it's the home stretch. And we're like, we're almost there to the draft. And that's kind of how I feel, free agency. You guys, kind of how you guys summed it up. It's like free agency, we've taken the deep breath after that first week of free agency,

first two weeks. All right, now we're into this official draft season, even though I think everyone's already worn themselves out already. I'm just getting started. See, I've got fresh draft legs right now. I'm feeling pretty good. I know I need it. Typically on this feed, you guys would get Dane and Lance on the draft on Wednesdays,

as Nate alluded to. Dane and I were on Tuesday this week. So if you want to go listen to some draft chatter, I talk with Dane, kind of an intro, an idiot's guide with me being the idiot to the 2022 class. If you guys want to go check that out, I highly recommend it. I think it's a good primer. I needed one. So if you also need one, please go listen.

We will be back. They will be back next Wednesday. So in their spot today, we decided to do an offseason mailbag. So much stuff has happened in the last month, two months since we did one of these. Wanted to solicit some questions from you guys. As always, sincerely appreciate everyone. taking the time to do this. We got way more questions than we could possibly answer. I tried to answer some of them. I'm going to try to answer some more of them over email. I'm not going to be able

to get to all of them. I would love to be able to get to all of them, but you guys sent too many in. Your engagement and thoughtfulness as part of this process is the reason that we do this. So sincerely, thank you to everyone who set one in. We're going to get started with the voicemail. Marissa, cue it up. Hey, guys. So I've been wondering what is too much to pay a top quarterback, having a conversation with friends talking about how, what is too much, 95% of the cap too much. Peyton Manning, when he was with the Broncos, seems like the only top paid quarterback that we can think of over the last 20 years who's won a Super Bowl.

So what is too much percent of the cap to pay a quarterback if you want to win a title? Thanks, guys. So this is an interesting question. And I think that when I've talked about this in the past, it's been skewed a little bit by the idea of winning a Super Bowl. because a lot of teams winning a Super Bowl, I'm not going to say it's random, but the team that ultimately wins is in a similar position to the team that I would say gets to the final four. The teams that play on championship weekend, that's where you can learn a lot of lessons. So if you look back at some of these teams that have gotten to the final four in the last,

let's say five, six years with the modern financial structure of the NFL in place, you land around a similar number. So some of the bigger ones in recent years, Aaron Rogers, years last year, 14.54% of the salary cap is what he was paid. He was also at 14%. He'll also be at 14% in 2023, and he's been around 13% in other years. That's pretty much where we're sitting with the bigger quarterback contracts that have gotten to that stage of the playoffs. But there are a lot of other things to consider here. We can get to some of them. What was your first thought when you heard this question. My first was to look up what a supermax gets in the NBA. Seriously,

it was just like, that was my first thought. It's a great call. So when I looked at this numbers and looking at what, I wanted to look at what Stafford got last year and look at that percentage. And it comes around right in that kind of mid-teens number. That kind of seems to be the sweet spot if you want to pay a guy and really take advantage of it. It kind of seems to be in that mid-percentage, mid-teen percentage number. But top quarterbacks, their worth is always going to be undervalued. I know we're paying. Now, we're starting to pay these guys half or a quarter of a billion dollars and having like ridiculous hits every single year. But finding that kind of cap hit magic and making that work with these guys where it's like really, yes, it's 25% of the cap is tied to them, but we're only paying them.

Basically, the cap hit is only 14%. And I think that's going to be the sweet number, is that mid-teen number. So I don't know if that's like, that's the right answer. What I think a guy can get paid, I think the max max that you can pay these guys isn't that low 20% of the cap hit total. And I don't even know if we'll ever get there. I don't think so either. So here are a couple examples that I'm looking at right now. And this is why this question gets complicated. Because even if you look back at previous years, if you look back at like, let's say the

spot track percentage of the cap numbers on the 2021 cap or 2020 cap, a lot of the stuff is going to be skewed because these deals are restructured. Yes. So let's look at Mahomes this year. All right. Mahomes right now is it 17% of the salary cap. He has that $27 million roster bonus that they can restructure any time. and they might if they trade for someone

or they try to go make another splashy move. The bank of Mahomes. Yes. And with a lot of these guys, when you're restructuring some of these deals, the question and the downside to doing it is that you're committing to these guys even further. You're pushing money under further caps. With the quarterback, it doesn't matter.

This guy's going to be on the roster, so you're willing to borrow from it. And that's kind of why the tier of player here is super important. So if you're paying Patrick, if you're going to borrow from the bank of Patrick Mahomes or Josh Allen, who's at 18% of the cap next year with a 20-something million-dollar-based salary, that number's going to go down because they're just going to keep pushing it and pushing it and pushing it. So if you have an elite player, the calculus changes, the same way the calculus changes with how much you're willing to pay that guy in a vacuum.

So my problem is when you get to some of these bigger numbers with non-elite quarterbacks. So teams that made the playoffs recently, a big one, Kirk Cousins was 15% of the cap in 2019. That's probably too much. That is. That's probably the cap for what you can pay a non-elite quarterback because you don't want to borrow further from his contract because he's not the guy you want to tie yourself to you for the next five years. Jimmy was at 13.49% last year. That feels like we're hitting right at that cap. That's about as high as you can go, which is why the idea of paying him $25 million for him to sit on the bench this year is truly inconceivable to me.

I mean, we'll get into that later on. But that whole conversation, I think, is wild. When you're bumping up against it, two really good examples recently of how you can make it work, Brady is always the best example, right? So in 2020, he was at 12.25%, 2018, he was at 12.2%. Almost the exact same.

Breeze was also at 13.5% 2018, when they easily could have won the Super Bowl. That was the NFC championship game debacle. So I think that 12 to 15% is right where we're seeing a lot of these deals. and when it creeps over that number, Mahomes this year, Josh Allen next year, are we going to see teams lower it and kind of artificially affect this conversation? Yeah, it's like the danger zone is once you hit 15%. Then it's like, okay, we need a down shift somehow.

Like I think that's really. And that's what teams have done. That's exactly what teams have done. So that to me is right where that number is. I love this question, though, because I got to look at this through a totally different lens. And it's like, it's fun. Now these numbers stick in my mind for future reference.

That's what that's, I'm complimenting the question because it's a really kind of cool question to look at because I don't really think of these things. I'm saying even for my football mind for it is I don't think of these things of percentages like this. And so it's kind of cool comparing it to another sport where he's pay a start 35%. It's like, ah, here, but try and get it under 18, 17%. Well, looking at Rogers and that 14.5% from last year, they could have won the Super Bowl. They were 13 and 3. So the fact that they didn't, I don't want that ending to overly influence this conversation when we talk about how much can you pay a quarterback and win a Super Bowl. That's a Super Bowl worthy team. It's a really good roster. They just didn't get all the way there.

So I think that's right where the limit is in that 14, 15% range. All right, Marissa, let's do the next one here. Hey, Robert, Nate, a big fan of the podcast. I'm a Bill fan, and we've been talking a lot about the stadium. I was hoping you could weigh in on a debate my friends and I are having. The question is on the topic of stadium diversity. Isn't it kind of crazy? that the NFL has teams play in radically different environments between playing in a dome or playing outside in the elements? Like, what other sports does that really happen in? Baseball plays outdoors, but it's the summer, so, and it cancel games if the weather gets bad. Soccer is a decent comparison, but they also, at least in North America, play during the summer, so you get, like,

one-off crazy games, but generally the weather is less of an impact. The question is, should the NFL have a mandate that every team plays in the dome or is the fact that teams need to accommodate for if they have to play outdoors or not, is that a good part of the game? Thanks. Looking forward to hearing your responses and keep doing great work. Thanks. What do you think about this? It's a great question. I grew up in the kingdom and the metro dome. So indoor football was very normal to me. I love that Minneapolis, that's the barrier. It's too cold to play outside of in Minnesota. That's where we cut it off in the United States. So my,

I know, right? And that's why we play on the, on the Green Bay is fine. Chicago, fine. But Minnesota, no dice. Bridge too far. Now, Cleveland. Yeah. No, we're too. We're cool. They're Buffalo. Yeah. No, Minnesota. Let's dome it up. What's, what's, uh, it's, it's, it's, it's funny for me was going to domes, going to domes. Even in Minnesota, the college team, the gophers played at the Metro Dome at the time. I was in high school is when my dad went to Jacksonville, I went to a game in early September in Jacksonville. And that was my first realization of why the home team wears white jerseys in the

south. I was like, I didn't know football could be played in that hot of weather. Like, that was new to me. It was the flip side. I was like, people play 98 degrees. Like, this is camp weather. This is not week one, week two weather. I did not know that. So I like the domes for other reasons, not just affecting or taken away from the cold, but taken away from the heat as well. So you don't have to worry about having heat stroke as you're watching a game. I thought this is interesting, though. I think that's what's cool about football is that you have to adjust to the weather and how game plans can change because of the weather. This is how we get three passes from Mac Jones in an NFL regular season game. But I think his question is valid. Is that a good thing? I like it because they're the best

teams have to handle it. You know, whatever that gets thrown at them. I think that's what's cool about football is you can play it in any weather. You know, I don't know. That's me. I would prefer if they all play in domes, though. Don't give you wrong. That's kind of where I'm leading. I, a younger, more testosterone-driven version of me would have been like, oh, no, you got to play outside where it's cold. I mean, you've got to deal with the elements. Now, I want to see Mahomes, Josh Allen in a dome in January. I want to see it to be like a 50 to 48 sort of game. Like, that's fine with me. Seeing the best players and the best conditions, I think makes for the best sorts of games. And I think that's kind of where I'd lean with this, is that if it were up to me, it would be a level playing

field, but I'm not overly bothered by the fact that it's not. It's no. I'm with you because you want to see the best of the best right you want the best best track best best everything so you don't want anything to be affected it's always ironic we we've talked about this how like mahomes and rogers playing kansas city and green bay it's like imagine if they played in the super dome and freaking like you know playing these like awesome like bent like fort field and Detroit and all that uh the other thing other thing that i thought of when i saw this question or before before the show was when i was in the a af because it was a spring league that was that really messed with my brain because camp the weather was cold and then it got warmer throughout the season.

So that was because that one was weird. Like it was really like going out to practice. I'm like, oh, I'm shedding clothes. I'm not adding clothes as practices go on. So just had to throw that little anecdote out. That one really screwed my brain for a few years. The A.A.F. All right.

Let's do the next one, Marissa. Hey, Robert, Nate. Appreciate you guys and love the show. So this question actually comes from a couple of weeks ago. you guys recorded podcasts as we're talking about the chargers and how they have the right people at the most important positions, the tackle, quarterback, now with the Cleo Mac trade, they have some past rushers, Derwin, James, the back end. But then after the podcast has ended, I saw an interaction on Twitter between Robert and another writer about how the Colts are almost the inverse, and this was before the Matt Ryan trade, of they have great positions or great players. at positions that aren't as important, like great running back, all pro left guard, some great linebacker.

And it made me think of like, if you just combine the chargers and the Colts, wouldn't that be arguably like the greatest team in the league? So I just thought it was a fun thought process. Do you guys, can you think of if you combine two teams together, they would be the most interesting or most dominating? And like if you combine the Chargers or Colts, you let Wright call the offense and you let Staley call the defense and how interesting that would be putting together. Love the show.

Looking forward to hear from you guys. Bye. I had fun thinking about this one. Where did you land with this? Well, the Colts Chargers one was a fun one. That's a really good one. That's a really good one.

I know. I called this the Stiegel's question because like during World War II, they combined the Steelers and the Eagles, so they became the Stegals. And what that just popped to my brain was Packers and 49ers. I thought that would be interesting because now you don't have to worry about the quarterback question. playing left tackle though that's that's actually the one note i had i'd move i think i'd move trent to right tackle and bactiari at left tackle that active disrespect from you i know right

and i don't know just because of the wrong stuff i don't know that's that's a curious question but i just want to say like like fred warner all those dbs that they would have like okay four nineers who are they playing that corner guess what jire alexander you know they they're like that would kind of mesh together that actually is a good one so i actually had the niners in the rams with the corner thing in mind because you can just throw a no boom at right tackle and now you have Trent left tackle.

Now you have Debo Cooper Cup George Kittle. I mean there's some real I mean that works and then Jalen Ramsey in one of those corner spots and the other one that I threw out

simply because I think the corner is still their number one need and you throw in slot receiver now too the bills and the Rams I was trying to find a fun one with the bills and I could that's a fun one though because corners like they're one biggest they're still the lingering need they have on defense.

So you have Jalen there. Into your defensive line, they have a bunch of guys, but no stars. So you throw Aaron Donald into that mix. And then Cooper Cup is their slot receiver to go with Stefan Diggs and Gabe Davis. And then you mix the lines. You find five good starters there. Josh Allen, your quarterback on that team. I'm sorry to Matthew Stafford.

Oh, man. Can you imagine Josh Allen, a Cooper Cup? That would be a... Yes. No, that's my favorite one. I think that was my favorite combination. I like that. Chiefs would have been in this conversation in previous years, but they've lost enough star power.

It's like, that's actually one. I was trying to think of a team with an awesome defense with the Chiefs, and I was like, oh, wait, you know, Tyreek's not there. So that kind of, that kind of ruined a little bit of the fun. All right. Next one here. Andrew Saldano asks, my question is both about Lamar Jackson specifically and more generally about how an elite quarterback in today's game can reach the open market. Lamar has previously expressed his goals of being a billionaire and being a champion. He's not represented by an agent and has yet to enter an new extension with the Ravens. Is it possible that he intends to exhaust the franchise tag route to the point where the Ravens allow him to reach the open market?

Third tag runs at 144% of second tag salary or at 120% average of the top five guys of the position. Running the franchise tag up to the point where a team can no longer afford the bill seems to be the only way an elite quarterback can reach the open market. Curious to hear your thoughts. This is particularly pressing because they asked Bashati about this today and it seems like Lamar has no urgency to get this deal though. So he's going to go into this season on the final year of his. contract, which we very rarely see with quarterbacks. And to me, it opens up kind of a fascinating conversation about how you can weaponize this. What's your initial response to this?

Yeah, that's the, that's the Kirk Cousins plan. That's exactly the name that I think about first, obviously. Or Brandon Shurf now, but I know we're talking quarterbacks, but it's just funny in that regard. The quotes were so interesting for the Ravens, too. He was like, we're playing Lamar's game now. And it was like, okay, what does that mean? Like, what is that insinuating?

But that's the thing with the NFL. There's no like bird rights or anything like the NBA has, like the incentives for the hometown team. They can pay you 120%. There's nothing like that. It's truly, once you get the market, you hit the market. You're trying to say that, yes, we're building around you. So I think it's interesting that if Lamar is doing that. And I don't know.

This is my other thing on the flip side from the Ravens perspective. If Lamar wants or if they end up to tag, tag, tag and just doing that year after year, with Lamar's play style in his injury history. Like it might not be the worst thing for them to go on a year by year deal. Yes, you want your players to have long-term security and all that. But if he wants to play that game, that might be the game they have to play. If it's coming from his side, he's the one that wants to do it this way, then the idea that you're alienating your quarterback and at the risk of alienating

your locker room, I think kind of falls away a little bit. I think so too. But if you look at the recent examples of this, it turns out really well for the quarterbacks. Kirk Cousins, the way that Kirk Cousins and his agent have handled this, is the best example of weaponizing your leverage outside of the Deshaun Watson situation was an entirely different conversation that we have seen from a quarterback in recent memory. Kirk Cousins has made $40 million in cash twice in the past three years.

Twice in 2020 and this year, 40 million in cash. Both of those were top five figures in the NFL during that stretch. Dak Prescott is another quarterback who has been, franchise recently. Deck Prescott made $75 million in cash last year. If you're a quarterback, you should not be afraid of this. This is the best way to make the most money because you're going to be in demand no matter what. The argument against this was always injury, right? Well, what if you get hurt? Deck broke his leg and then they gave him $75 million in cash the following spring. There's always the chance that you can have a catastrophic injury that would ultimately

derail your career. But at this position, if you are an above average player, even at Kirk Cousins's level, this is definitely the route to get paid the most amount of money. The argument, not even the argument against this, but the reason most players don't do this is they have no interest in weaponizing their leverage to the greatest extent possible. You get to a point with some of these discussions where enough is enough. If you're going to give me $125 million guaranteed, if you're going to give me the Josh Allen contract, or if you're of homes and you're going to make half a billion dollars over a 10-year stretch, it becomes enough. You don't have to squeeze every single drop out of it. But now I think when you combine

how you can use the franchise tag, plus the understanding that there is now a fully guaranteed contract out there. However you think about the way that went down, that is going to shape the way the discussions happen moving forward for quarterbacks. So now the landscape to me has shifted. And this is a real way for a guy to maximize his earning potential if he's willing to see this through. But it takes some real fortitude to see this through because it's hard to turn down $100 million. Yes. It's ultimate game of chicken. I mean, it is. And now that like you said, the fully guaranteed deals are that that box can't close now. That box has been opened. That is a new, whole new structure of contracts that we're thrown out there now. If you're Justin Herbert,

okay? And you get to a point after this season when you're eligible for, an extension. There is absolutely a world where you can go to the charges and say, I want a four year, $200 million contract, and I want it to be fully guaranteed. With the other things out there, you are justified in doing that. But if the chargers come to you and say, we'll pay you an average of $50 million a year, we're going to guarantee the first two-thirds of the deal like most contracts are. You'll make whatever, $125 million at signing. It's hard to say no to that. So this is all a question of how much guys want to use the leverage that they have. And for the most part, in the modern NFL, since rookie contracts have comments play,

the current financial structure of the league, most players have not been willing to do that. A player that has is Kirk Cousins, and we've seen how it's worked out for him. It's so interesting to me, Lamar, you know, Lamar is always, Lamar goes how he wants to go. Like, Lamar has his own speed for stuff, but literally and figuratively. But it's it's so interesting because Kirk Cousins with Washington, it makes sense why he wanted to get out and get an open market deal. It's, you know, it's Washington. It's like what that franchise has been going through. And it just seems like the Ravens are the opposite of that as far as how they handle things and how they treat their players and how they just accumulate picks, how they just do everything as that as that team does.

They always seem to have a plan. So it's just it's just, that's the circumstances. It's more like Lamar, it's like, no, I'm trying to maximize them every dollar I can get when Kirk's trying to do that as well, but also the kind of subbenefit. of like I don't have to play for Washington anymore. So it's kind of, it's kind of curious as far as like just personalities involved as well. And Kirk was getting a $20 million offer from Washington or whatever it was when they were trying to extend him. Lamar has an MVP award.

It's the circumstances of the conversation are very different. All right. Marissa, you want to cue the next one up? Hey, Robert, Nate, long time listener. First time I've called in. Thanks so much for everything you do. This is Steve from Colorado Springs. I wanted to ask about the Steelers draft outlook with the additions they've made

this offseason, adding some interior offensive linemen, sort of loading up the D in a new corner from Buffalo, adding Miles Jack. It's tough for me to tell where number 20. I'm curious, does it make sense on their time? Any thoughts you have would be awesome. Thanks so much. So Douglas Glossie asked a similar question to this, and they're at a point that I think is worth examining in the way that they're approaching this because it's a new territory for

them. We've tied this conversation a couple different times. You know, the idea that Steelers, one, have had the financial flexibility to go out in free agency and, two, have needed to go out in free agency because of the state of their roster, this is new for them. We're not used to this when it comes to Pittsburgh. And now they're having to navigate this awkward transition phase that a lot of teams have to navigate. So what do you think? Like, if you were the Steelers, how would you approach the quarterback position and, let's say, the next 18 months of their team building process?

It's so funny, too, is they're not used. used to looking up either. Like the other teams in their division are all, they're fighting. Like those are all, like, you know, they're fighting for like, their tenders. Now, on a football level, they are now in the worst position of any of the teams in their division. They absolutely have the worst quarterback situation.

But, I mean, even then you look at the rest of the rosters, I mean, Bengals are in very good shape. Yeah. I mean, especially considering where they were two years ago, the Browns have a very good roster. The Ravens are going to be much better than they were last year. just by virtue of being healthier. I mean,

top to bottom, even with a quarterback out of consideration, those teams are better than Pittsburgh is right now. Yeah. And that's why I think it's okay if they want to go. If they have a guy, they're in the perfect spot in this draft because the quarterback class is so crazy.

Just it's there's no top, it's not top heavy and there's no real depth to it either. It's a week, week quarterback class. You're going to hear it a million times. But if they like a guy, I don't think Willis will be there, but if he's there or a Ritter,

if they like the guy, they're in the exact situation to take them. Because if they, If they really like them, if they are sold on Desmond Ritter, they're like, hey, this is our guy, pick 20, yada, yada, yada. But if they like one of those guys, then they can go on to the future. They have Chibisky as well. So it's kind of like they're giving themselves that little buffer.

If they don't like a guy, say Ritter gets picked before, but really they don't like Ritter, then it's like, okay, we'll go with Tribisky. Maybe we take a guy in the second or third round. I just think that way that they have to revamp. They have some interesting pieces. They have T.J. Watt, make a Fitzpatrick. Teams would kill to have T.J. Watt make a Fitzpatrick. That is a good place to start with the.

Make a Fitzpatrick who's in the final year of his deal, by the way. Yes, I know. That's what I actually going into this like process, I looked it up and I actually thought they already resigned them and they didn't. So that was, that was news to me. But that's a good place to start with the defense. Offense has so many holes. And then this is, it's kind of like asking questions about the roster kind of gets you

to the answer. If they like a guy at quarterback, cool. All right, that sets you straight. We talk about sometimes being on that path as a franchise helps you make all the other decisions. If they have a situation where it's like, okay, our guy that we like, liked this. The people got crazy and there's three quarterbacks taken before we even pick.

We don't want to trade up because we need all the picks we can get. Then you kind of, I wouldn't say punt on the season, but revamp the whole roster and build it up and then try and just really find a guy for next year. Hopefully you have a top 10 pick. I think that's really what they're going down. It's one of those two things. If they like a guy at 20, take them. And then now we can build up the offense for next year, the year after, I should say, 20,

23. And then we have a defense and all the defensive pieces to go with that. But again, it's so scary because even right now, talking about next year's draft class, yes, the quarterback, just by default, the quarterback class has to be better. You just never know how it's going to break out. We've talked about tank for Tua, lose for Gino Smith. Like all these guys that we anoint as a number one guy the year before or top five guy the year before fall off.

So that's what's always so scary going. Oh, we'll get our guy next year. If you like a guy, just take them. I think that's what the Steelers have to do at where they're at. And it would make sense to me about where they are as a franchise. I think they might be too good to get a top 10 pick next year. Even if we think they're the worst team in their division, Mike Tomlin's never had a losing season.

They're going to be fine, Steve. And their defense still has a lot of pieces. I don't think they're going to be a good team next year, but I think they're going to be a competitive team next year. And if they end up somewhere around 500 and they're picking 14th, they're in kind of an awkward spot. So if they do like one of these guys and they can sit him behind Trubisky, they can bring him along as slowly as you want to,

I understand that as a plan. The other side of this is that right now, they have $25 million in dead cap this year. They're still dealing with the Rothersberger fallout to an extent. What they did with Juju's contract last year, tacking an extra void year onto it, they're paying him $5.6 million to not be on the roster this year. So they're still sorting through some of that stuff. Next year, they have $75 million in cap space as it currently sits. Kim Hayward is going to be 34 years old next year.

we could be looking at a bigger rebuild here than it might seem. You know, they've given, they gave a decent amount of money to Miles Jack for next year, but not a lot of that is guaranteed. I mean, I'm wondering what this looks like over the next 12 months or so. And if they're actually further away from finishing off and completing this roster, then we think just because they're the Steelers. And they need help up front, which is, I think that's, you get some of these teams because they're always so consistent in all these other areas.

say you're like, oh, they have an offensive line. It's like, no, they need help up there. They have a patchwork team right now, but with a couple cool players to work around. So yeah. No, I think to me, if they liked a guy this year, I would, yes, go for it. If you're all in, you're sold, it just sets your path. And if they're rebuilding with all that cap space like you just brought up as well, it's like, okay, now you're getting into a path that can work.

You know, it's like, okay, now we have some answers of what we want to do in the future. You're going to have a new GM as well. That's the other thing you got to keep in the pocket is, old GM going to, you know, is Colbert going to take a quarterback and go later? Like, that's a whole other, you know, get the human element also involved in that as well. What they're trying to do is a very tough balancing act. It's really hard to navigate these moments of transition when you're a decent team. It doesn't often go well.

It's hard. It's really difficult to get where you want to go because it's hard to find your quarterback as part of this process. So I understand the hesitation and the concern. the part of Steelers fans. What are we actually trying to do? You're going to be relevant this year. You're not going to be embarrassing every Sunday because there's no way they would ever do that as an organization.

But the fact that they're not willing to do that, is that a bad thing? Is the competency they're going to build this year ultimately going to hurt them? I understand that. I would be worried about that if I were a Steelers fan, even if I get it from their perspective. Yeah. It's like, yeah, no, please be bad.

It's almost like the Steelers fans are true. It gets them a little bit. I know. Pride is a hell of a thing. Listen, hopefully Mitch can get them there, get them to a 5-12 season, and everything will work out okay. All right, Marissa, can we get the next one here? Hi, Robert and Nate. This is Paul from Albuquerque, New Mexico.

Seeing all these trades, this off-season, got me curious about the value of draft picks in the NFL. It seems like, especially later on draft picks in the NFL, are worth more capital. in terms of the league more than like a draft pick outside the lottery in the NBA or a later pick in the MLB draft. Do you think that

this is true? And I'm curious as to why you might think that be. Appreciate the work, you guys. Thanks so much. What do you think about this? Yeah, I mean, just because there's 22 starters on a football team. And you find players later in the draft.

Yes. There's seven rounds for a reason. Yeah, that's just. Based on conversations, I've had with teams, my sense is that the top 100 is the sweet spot. If you can stockpile as many picks as you can, the top 100, which is pretty much the first three rounds. If you get those compics at the end of the third round, like that range is where you want to be. So if you're a team like the Chiefs, who got a first and a second round pick for Tyree Kill, same with Devante Adams and the Raiders.

If you look at Timo Risk from PFF did, it was, did an interesting kind of look at this this week about the surplus value created with certain positions at certain points in the draft. So if you look at high leverage positions and you look at, so with wide receiver, edge rusher, those sorts of spots, if you look at the first and second round, there's almost, it's almost equal. The surplus value created on rookie contracts if that guy hits in the first and second round at those positions. So the first 65 picks, think about some of the guys drafted in that range, D.K.

McCaff, A.J. Brown, you can find superstar players at high, leverage spots within the first 60 picks. So that's why a second round pick is extremely valuable. Like the Bears trading Khalil Mack for a second round pick. That seems like, oh, man, only a second round pick for Kalil Mack. You could really find a superstar with the 50th pick in the draft. That doesn't happen in the NBA. It doesn't happen nearly as often.

And the NBA, when you get out of the top seven, the drop off is precipitous. So I think that's the important thing to consider when you're looking at some of this stuff. Creed Humphrey like, you know, like Trace, you know, Smith at the sixth round. Like you get all these types of guys. Yeah. I mean, we, years and years, we talk about Manuja Noboli being such an outlier because he was the last pick of the draft and, you know, all this. And like he's a great player in the late second round. Isaiah Thomas, you know, Ben, you know, Ben Wallace is an undrafted guy. How many times we hear, we have James Harrison wearing defensive players on drafted guy. Okay, we talk about Kay Juan Williams. He's a

starting nickel. He's on drafted guy. All these guys at us Nekler, like they, they, there's just so many players in the NFL or in football that can have an impact that that's why you can find them in all these rounds. Yeah, it's just finding a tangible window that makes sense. I think that's such a good point of finding the receivers in the second round because that's exactly it. It's like you can find these guys that instantly impact the game. All right, Brendan Burke asks, I've been pretty intrigued by the trade market for franchise tag eligible players and how it fluctuates. For example, a few years ago, we saw premium draft capital traded for guys like Frank Clark and D. Ford right as they needed a new contract.

But then guys at other premium positions like J.C. Jackson and Toronto Armstead just walked for nothing this year. What do you think dictates which positions justify these draft asset, big contract trades on a year to year basis? So I feel like the answer about J.C. Jackson and Toronto Armstead, their markets weren't as voracious as we thought they were going to be. Toronto Arnardtick got $15 million a year. He's 31 years old and has an injury history. The J.C. Jackson thing might be an example of the market not valuing J.C. Jackson, this is. same way the football internet might value J.C. Jackson. And obviously, the Patriots didn't. You look at Frank Clark, past rushers are different. The market for corners has stagnated. So if you look at the top cornerback contracts in the league, J.1 Ramsey's number one,

we expected a guy like J.C. Jackson hitting the market to potentially surpass or equal a deal like the one that Ramsey got. That hasn't happened. We'll see what happens with Jaira Alexander, but corners have plateaued a little bit. And past rushers have not. Past rushers are in the $25 million range, $27 million. So that position, I think, is different than something like the J.C. Jackson situation, and especially something like Tehran Armstead, who is, again, in his 30s when he hit free agency. That's the difference to me.

Yeah. And team situation as well. Patriots live in their own world and Saints are maxing out the credit card every year. So they're, you know, they're like, we can't do this. And yeah, I think I think that's a great point. And I think age corners, teams are scared to pay a corner in the late 20s and once they hit 30. So that's a whole other thing to throw in there as well as positional aging, I think is a good way, a good way to put it. Yeah.

So that's that's another thing that teams are going to look at. Maybe a pass rush or they're like, okay, we know what we're going to get out of these years. These guys don't fall off. Corners are volatile. That's what the position is. You never know what you're going to get. Like year to year can go way up, way down. So I think teams maybe are just well hesitant with that.

Yeah, if you have a pass rusher that's worth franchising, I think somebody's always going to be willing to give up something to go get him. There's a reason that most big time pass rushers don't end up hitting the market. And J.C. Jackson just did. I think those positions are a little bit different in the ways that they're valued and paid, at least by NFL teams. All right. Marissa, can we get the next one here?

Hey, Robert. This is Brad from Buffalo. And I'm a little concerned. about the nebulous tweets of Stefan Diggs recently, the contracts of the wide receiver market, what do you make of Diggs potentially forcing his way out of Buffalo like he did in Minnesota? Thanks. So I wanted to use this as a way to talk about the Stefan Diggs trade and how it's different than some of the other wide receiver trades that we've seen recently.

the bills gave up a first round pick for Stefan Diggs. Obviously, the dolphins traded more for Tyree Kiel. The Raiders traded more for Devante Adams, but it's in the same ballpark, you know, a first round pick worthy wide receiver in a trade. Stefan Diggs came over on what was a team-friendly deal at the time two years ago and has not been altered at all. That's very different than paying a top of the market deal

on top of trading a first-pick, first-round pick, and more in the way that the cheetah, the way the Raiders and the Dolphins just did. So that deal is incredibly valuable for the bills. I also think it's a really good example of, we just assumed when that deal happened that they would tweak the contract in some way, that they would rework it in some way, and they just didn't. They just never did. And now it's been a bargain for them over the last couple of years.

I'm surprised it took this long for this stuff to start creeping up with digs and with Buffalo and the market because he's been underpaid relative to the position and his peers of the position for like two years now. Yeah. He became underpaid about four weeks into the season of Buffalo. It was like, hey, I'm an all pro now. Like I should be getting paid by like an all pro. But also, yeah, and also just like the Vikings at that time, why they made that trade is where they were at as a team. team and cap situation as well, but also like they knew what that draft class was going to be.

I know that's easy to say where they got Justin Jefferson. Oh, yeah, this is easy. Just trade one all pro. But that's informing a lot of this stuff now. Yes. It's knowing what's available that you can recoup in either the free agency or the draft. It's knowing what's available, knowing what's the whole market is, not just what your market is. It's what 32 teams are and what the college draft is available as well. So I think and why Diggs is starting to whisper. He's getting closer to 30 sooner rather than later. So he's gone, hey, okay. Okay, let's...

And I think the whispers are deserved it. I think he has a point. Oh, yeah. He was an all pro. Like, he was an all pro, and he's not at least 28. You know, I think, yeah, I totally get it. I wouldn't be worried about him forcing his way out. No.

I think that a dialogue is probably worth starting between his people and the team. The same way it is with Cooper Cup. Yep. It's not about forcing your way out, but the Rams have done this pretty consistently. I think they're going to do this with Aaron Donald now. When your deal is outdated and you are no. longer paid in accordance with the other players at your position, you should probably, let's have a chat. Let's have a chat about how this should go.

And I think that's probably what will happen in Buffalo in the same way that it'll happen with Cooper Cup in L.A. I wouldn't be concerned about a divorce, but I think that we need to sit down and have a nice little family meal and discuss some stuff here. It's like when how people used to have their raises tied to inflation. It's like that's what they are doing. That's what they're trying to do with these positions. Hey, the market went up 8%. Here's your problem. Like I think, I think that's what the dialogue they're trying to start. And again, they've gotten a lot of value out of that trade. And I think it is the right thing to do to start a conversation and say,

all right, you know what? It's probably time that we adjusted this a little bit. You're underpaid. And he definitely is. All right. Our next one here is from James Stark. He said, his question is about the center position. I know that you and eight have spoken a lot about how getting a good center

is one of the best things you can do for a young quarterback, Corey Lindley, for example. And I guess I'm wondering how important that position is in general. Do you think that a center should be considered a more premium position in line with edge rusher, left tackle, cornerback. Also, do you think Lucas Patrick is enough of an upgrade of the position to help Justin Fields develop? So I want to be clear about this.

Just because I think having a good center is valuable, it doesn't mean it's on the same level as other positions, right? So if you look at what Corey Winsley was paid in free agency, I think his deal was $13.5 million or $12.5 million a year. Look at how that compares with an edge rusher. It's $25 million. It's literally half the price. So finding the right guy is valuable, but you.

you don't have to spend a lot of money to get the right guy. And I think that's why Lucas Patrick is a good example. The Bears didn't pay, the pairs paid him barely anything. But he's somebody who's been in this offense, understands this offense, is clearly a very smart guy, can be an interpreter of some of the offensive details and some of the rules and everything else for a young quarterback. That's not worth paying top of the market money for. So I think having the right guy at that spot matters,

but you don't want to overpay at that position. And I think that's why a lot of free agent deals at that position end up working out because it just doesn't make a lot of money. Yeah. It's all a bunch of $8 million deals and $7 million and $9 million. Yes. When Mitch Morse got his was $11 million was the top of the market. Yes. And that's, and I'm a firm believer.

I do think center after left tackles is the most important position on the offense line. So second most important. But that's exactly. I'm with you. I wouldn't call it a premium position. It's an important position, but it's not premium. It's almost like where I'm at with safeties maybe. you know, kind of like, you know, like where it's that second tier position.

I don't know. I'm workshopping this kind of thought. I also think that you don't, like Corey Lindsay was a fifth round pick. That's what I mean. You can find these guys wherever. And because it's not based on outlandish physical traits. You don't have to. There are guys available at every level of the draft that can give you what you need at center in the same way that you can at safety.

So because it's not about finding the biggest, fastest guy to play this position. What makes safety is good in a lot of ways is route recognition of mental stuff. It's how quickly you can process things. And that's something you can find at all levels of the draft because it's not the biggest, fastest guys that you need to find in the first round. Well, that's, it's funny when you look at like top 10 picks at serve positions, corner, tackle, edge rusher. You know, it's not only just the good football players.

It's the freaks of freaks. Yes. It's very hard to find a Jalen Ramsey at 6-1, 2-10, willing tackler can move like that. That's why he goes top five, top seven. Like that's why those guys go so high because there's only X amount of them on the planet earth. You know, a guy like a Rodney Hudson, I've talked about a million times of his pot.

Look at Rodney Hudson. If you're listening to this pot right now, look at his testing numbers. He is a godawful athlete. He is a terrible athlete. I mean, terrible, terrible athlete. And so that, like, that's why you can find these guys later in rounds. You don't have to be a, I'm just, I'm agreeing with you, typical. that you're not finding these guys that are the freaks of freaks.

Yes, that helps. But yes, it's an intelligence game. And that's why I like comparing it to safety and I wouldn't even say receiver, but finding these guys, it's more of like they're not that elite premium position, but they are valuable because I do think centers, upgrading a center, it's like an RPG video game or it's like everybody gets a little 10% boost around them. That's what a center can do.

Maybe they are only an 80 overall, but they bump everybody else up just a little bit. Like that's what a good center can do. but you can wait to find these guys in the second or third or fourth round. Rodney Hudson, a 12 percentile broad jump at the combine. Yeah. Eighth percentile, 20-yard short shuttle. He's like 6-2, right? Like two.

6-2-99. Yep. Yeah. About the same size hands as Joe Burrow while blocking their off defensive linemen in the NFL. A perfect example of the fact that you don't need to be one of one athletes to be an all-pro-level player at that position, which means you don't. need to spend a lot on those guys. So I think that's a really, really good example on Corey Winsley's another one. All right, Marisigini, can we have our next voice from here.

Hey, Robert. This is Spencer, Colin from New York. I've got a question about the Patriots. If you were thinking about a quarterback like Mac Jones and others who have had success with the sort of high accuracy, not a huge arm kind of strategy, what kind of skill position players do you think work best in an offense like that to sort of maximize his potential and make that offense as good as it can be? Thanks. Love the show. I like this one. What do you think? Yeah.

Looking what the 40 and I was done the last couple years. That's exactly what I would say. It's an easy answer. It's like find yak monsters. Yeah. But build your offense around those sorts of players and have an offense that is built to create yak opportunities. Those are the two things I would say.

This is my cut and dry way of looking at it is the bigger arm, the QB, the bigger the targets, if that makes sense. The bigger the receiver. And then as a quarterback gets more smaller arm. or more accurate as opposed to arm strength, then the guys can be smaller as well. And then you create the yak. So you kind of like tie it in with the arm.

That's why I like want the big receivers for fields. Like I want the big targets for him. But that's, I think what we've seen the 49ers do, just get all these guys that run inbreakers, run slants, glances, crosses, everything moving, moving offense. You don't want anything static

because a static offense with stop routes like with the Cowboys or anything like that is that those quarterbacks have to be a big arm because they have to pin it on a guy. Yep. Pin it right on their chest to beat the defense. So, yeah, look at what the 4-9ers have done. I think that's the epitome of a modern yak-oriented offense.

I also think that Jamar Chase is a good example of that. We think about him as a deep threat, but he was a yak monster last year. And that was huge. I mean, if you can get the ball out quickly and you can allow those eight-yard completions to turn into 70-yard touchdowns, that's a huge bit of value for a quarterback that's built like that. It's why the Nelson-Aggler thing never made sense. I mean, I understand that they signed him before they drafted Mack Jones.

but that's the worst pairing I can imagine is between those two guys. Should be the biggest arm guy possible for him. Like you want guys launching it to him. Kendrick Boran can play it anywhere, so that one worked out. All right. Next one from Evan Gore. He said, why do most teams focus on patiently building a good roster and then finding their quarterback?

It's because coaches and GMs have short contracts. Most of the best teams since 2000 built a strong roster and then plugged a good quarterback into their system. Tom Brady with the Patriots, Big Ben with the Steelers, Russell Wilson with the 2012 Seahawks, Mahomes with the Chiefs, many of the worst teams repeatedly drafts super talented quarterbacks and then ruin them with terrible rosters, or waste tremendous draft capital pursuing quarterbacks who can't fix their roster problems. As a Stewart fan, I'm baffled by the media and fan-based talk by having no quarterback plan when the entire offense is in transition.

I want my team to build a roster that will create a successful quarterback rather than hoping we can luck into the next marino behind the turnstile offensive line. There are a couple different ways to think about this. I think some of the recent examples are misleading. Right. What's happened with Brady, what's happened with Matthew Stafford, even what's happened a little bit with Russell Wilson and the Broncos. That's not typically how it's gone.

No. In history, for the most part, you have to be bad to get a quarterback near the top of the draft and ultimately build that way. Or you have to have a rookie quarterback. I mean, Russell Wilson was on a rookie deal and helped build those Seahawks teams. So I think that having a good team and just dropping the quarterback into there is sounds great. in theory, but that's not often how it works. Yeah. You still look at the divisional breakdowns of who's starting where, and it used to be

every quarterback, number one pick, number one pick, number five pick, number, like, AFC South when I was with there, it was Matt Ryan, who's number two or three, whatever. Breeze would have been a first rounder. He's an exception. Then James Winston was the number one pick. Cam Newton was the number one pick. I mean, you looked at the AFC North last year. Burrow, number one pick.

Lamar, first round pick. Baker, number one pick. Like that's how it used to be. You had to find these guys like really, really early. It's a whole new world. But I think it's because the quarterback's going to make or break you. Like that's what it is. So I think nowadays or we're saying like, why on the team they build up the team?

There's never a right time to get married. There's never a right time to have a child. Like you, you know, sometimes you just have to do it. You have to plate your foot and go, all right, this is our time. This is when we're going to do it. I think that's really how the metaphor I'll use for picking a quarterback is like sometimes it feels better than others. Let's go for it. All right.

We're all in. The Chiefs had to move up big time to get Mahones. That was, if that doesn't work out, that franchise is nuked. Like they are, I mean, we're going to be laughing about to this day. Wow, they moved up. They ran out Alex Smith. Oh, my God, look at them. But so you have to be right.

You're playing a real tough game of poker there. So I think really that's what it is. It's just there's never a right time for it, but sometimes you just have to play at foot and go. And sometimes you think the guy is your guy, like the Jaguar's taking Bordals and thinking that's their guy. That's the guy that's going to lead us to the Bears, with Trubisky.

They think that's a good guy, but you just don't know. This shit is so random, especially at the quarterback position. I mean, yeah, a lot of these are such strange circumstances, right? Like Rogers, when he was drafted, it was like a different version of the NFL. Yeah. There was a different, entirely different world. Yeah. And so, I mean, the best example we've talked about recently with rebuilding is Josh Allen.

Yeah. And they had to trade up to go get him. I mean, that's difficult. You know, it's a tough thing to do. And they rebuilt that team around him. You know, having a really good playoff caliber team and then trading up in the first round for a generational quarterback like Patrick Mahomes, that's not a plan. No.

That's not how this stuff is often going to work. Another really good example is the Bengals were really, really bad, and they got Joe Burrow. The Chargers had a top 10 pick, and they got Justin Herbert. For the most part, that's where these guys are going to come from. Even Lamar Jackson is an outwire. Lamar Jackson at 32, that's not how this usually goes. Lamar Jackson fell that far for reasons that are still totally unclear. And that's the only reason a stable franchise like the Ravens could pick him and kind of maintain their relevance all the way through.

How about the Seahawks, one of the examples brought up. Okay. The Seahawks, the year they drafted Russell Wilson in the third round, they signed Matt Flynn to a huge deal. Do you think they were banking on relying on Russell Wilson, like becoming Russell Wilson? Like, no. They have no idea. Sometimes you just, you know, get the right circumstances. You're trying to create chances to make yourself lucky.

That's what you're doing. And you hope one of these guys hits. And when they do, everything smells great for years and years. And maybe there's a chance now that things are changing a little bit. If quarterbacks are going to force their way out, if teams are going to be willing to deal some of these guys in a way they wouldn't have before, like what the Seahawks just did with Russell Wilson. We'll see what happens with Lamar.

We'll see what happens with Kyler Murray. Maybe we're going into a different time where we're going to have one quarterback who's available every single offseason for multiple first round picks, and you want to give yourself that flexibility. We've talked about that in relation to Miami and what their plan might look right now. If they're sitting there next year and they have two first round picks and the Ravens franchise Lamar, they're going to make that phone call. So maybe there's a chance this is shifting a little bit.

But for the most part, I think that what we've seen the last two years where the Super Bowl winner has been this ready-made roster that they've dropped a veteran quarterback onto, that doesn't feel like a replicable model moving forward. I don't think that's sustainable. No, a new path has opened up, but the main path is always going to be the main path. That's how that's that's the traditional way, even if there's newer ways that are starting to be formed. Those are kind of allies, in my opinion.

I think that the easiest way to do this, not the easiest way, the best way to do this, look at what the chargers and the Bengals have been able to do. this spring. They have top, let's say seven quarterbacks, okay? I think Justin Herbert

is better than that. But they have top seven-ish quarterbacks. Elite adjacent quarterbacks. Yes. They've been able to do whatever they want. They can get any players they want.

There's nothing holding them back from how they want to build that team because of the value created from those contracts. So if you can find a guy in the top 10 and that guy hits within that first deal, within that first deal, that is still the easiest way to build the best team. Because even if you're concerned about the supporting cast around that player,

if you're picking in the top 10, that supporting cast can change in a big, big hurry if you have unlimited free agent dollars in the first two years of that guy's deal. So I think ultimately finding that guy and providing him enough support to not totally tank his career, that is still the best model, in my opinion. Oh, yeah. It becomes a choose-your adventure once you have that guy. It's like, let's go have some fun with it. No, but that's always going to be the traditional method. Everyone knows quarterbacks matter. People in the league do too. All right. Let's get to our next voice, Mila, Marissa.

Hi, Robert Nade, Danny, big-time fan, just calling the sea. If you think the Jets have any chance of trading for the wide receivers that are, you know, on the last year of the rookie contracts, AJ Brown, P.O. Samuel, or D.K. Metcalfe, I don't feel likely about Devo Samuel just because they already have Tray Lance and they're looking to keep him for the continued growth of that team. But with A.J. Brown coming available and Ryan Tannahill not really being super clear as a long-term solution in Tennessee, do you think the Jets can potentially trade further than him or do you think they're probably going to go through the draft going for one of those picks in either four or ten? Thanks. I do a great job on the show.

Have a good day. So Brian Connor asked a similar question. And it's amazing how fast this has changed, right? We see the Devante Adams trade and the Tyree Kill trade. And now it's what star receiver in our team trades for? And so here's why I think that the situations with those guys is different than the situations with Tyree Kill and with Tevanti Adams. This is all about money. It's all about money.

So not only are those guys creeping up toward 30, which is something to consider. here, those teams, the chiefs and the Packers, are paying their quarterbacks $40 million a year. That's not happening with these other teams. To me, the reason that the Niners wouldn't trade Debo Samuel isn't because they're worried about Trey Lance's development. It's that Trey Lance is on a rookie contract. They can afford to pay a Debo Samuel. The Seahawks are going to be, have a quarterback on a rookie contract, most likely for the next couple of years. You can pay D.K. Metcalfe and help that quarterback at the same time because he's on a rookie deal. The Titans, they may be on a rookie quarterback contract quicker than we might assume.

Who knows how long Ryan Tannenhill is going to be there? So I think that there's still the consideration of, is it worth bypassing the $20 million a year contract and drafting a guy? That's always going to be part of the conversation now with some of these teams. But I do think with the A.J. Browns and the DK Metcalfs and the Debo's, their teams are in a different situation than what the Packers and the Chiefs were staring down. Yeah. They're coming off their first deal.

And those guys are coming off their second deals, you know, or getting tagged and all that. So, yeah, I also just on the, because I think you just nailed out the head, everything I would say on that perspective. I also, also they're in a contract here. You think their agents are kind of going, hey, you know, if you're not going to pay me, don't trade me to someone that will. Like, I mean, that's also a part of it, too, all about money. Also, by the way, I just don't think the Jets need to trade for a guy. Like, the Tyreek Hill trade made sense because just of what they were giving up. But I think there's, they have plenty of draft capital and the guy in the second round.

They have two tangibly good guys at Corey Davis and Elijah Moore. I don't know what the Jets fans are going so psycho about. We need another guy. It's like, you guys are doing okay. You don't have to like break the bank. Let's figure out the quarterback's worth playing before we figure out whether you need another receiver for them. I think they can draft the best player available in the second, third of rounds and go for it from there. If they do want to take a guy in the top 10, Drake Lending at 10 would be fucking awesome for them.

So maybe if they did want to go that, I would like that. But I just don't think they have. You just love the idea of hiring tiny Elijah Moore with big-ass Drake London. That's what you're looking at right now. Basketball room, baby. I got my point guard. I got my slashing guard. I got my small forward.

And now I got my center. It's perfect. It would be great. But yeah, I really, I don't think. Corey Davis really is the Paul Millsap of wide receivers. He is. Block and rebounder. Like, yeah.

Yeah, that's exactly what he is. That is. Good player, but not a star. But he's useful. That's always my backhand compliment. They're useful. But no, I just don't think the Jets have a real speed to get to that. I think you nailed out the point about it's all about money with these guys.

So they're just going to try to find the biggest bidder. But I think that's when you're looking at who might be available. That's what you have to look at. Yeah. I mean, it's which teams aren't going to be able to pay some of these guys. Yeah. And those three teams, I think, will be on that rookie quarterback timeline faster than it might seem with the Titans. And the other two already are unless the Niners stick with Jimmy.

What's going on there? Let's talk about this for 30 seconds. Okay? So at the owner's meetings, but before we get out of here, this is our last question. There is no way, my opinion, you can justify paying a breaking case of emergency quarterback $25 million. You'd have to adjust the contract in some way. But even if you're going to adjust the contract in some way and still ultimately pay him the $25 million, whether it's over the next two years, you're sabotaging. the benefit of having a quarterback on a rookie contract.

Yep. Because one of the upsides to going and getting a guy like Trey Lance is that you're paying him $7 million. If you're combined paying your quarterback room $30 million with Jimmy's sitting there on the bench, then one of the advantages you've created is completely gone. So that would be the concern to me. And let's say they keep Jimmy another year. It's like, oh, you know, we're not going to get anything for him. So we'll just keep him.

We were a game away from the Super Bowl last year. Now you've lit two years of that. rookie quarterback contract on fire. Yep. So it just trying to do two things at once. It's, oh, I know. Do you see Calh-Shanehan, too, when he's answered questions? He looked so tired.

I'm kind of like, yeah, we might have both of them, I guess. Like, this is where we're at. It seemed like the galaxy brained it. And they were trying to, they were trying to get that perfect deal for it. And they just couldn't like, they're holding on, holding on, holding on, holding on, waiting to get that perfect deal. And they never got it. And then now they got left empty-handed or full-handed.

I guess this is a better way to put it. They got left with the bill. I mean, that's exactly what happened. And now, who knows what's going to happen? I know. I just can't, I don't think you can justify it. I mean, you can move the money around and maybe they can get that price a little bit lower. But even if it's $10 million for this year, even if you have to think that they weren't budgeting for this, that they were budgeting to have more money to be able to surround their rookie quarterback with more pieces.

I mean, look at the Traverius Ward contract. I don't think that's something you hand out if you're planning on paying Jimmy Garoppel at $20. million dollars. This does not feel like the timeline. So I feel like this has to be posturing from them to not tank his value. It's hard for me to imagine a world where they hang on to him. I know I said this same thing last year after they made the trade. I know. But I think this is an entirely different thing. Again, burning two years of that rookie contract after you traded so much to go get him, that'd be really hard for me to stomach. It's weird. And they're a final four team.

It's just such a weird. But that might be the argument against it. It's, oh, we were a final four team. We, we, look at how good we were a Jimmy. We might as well try this again. No, bad. I'm going to spray him with a squirt bottle. Stop that.

Just take your lumps. You trade it up for this guy. Just like, get him some reps. Just get them out there. Just eat it. Like, I, I agree. Because it's just the whole point of getting a rookie quarterback or a young quarterback is getting them on the rookie deal.

Like, that's the whole point of doing it. And just all the advantages we've already laid out. Yeah. And they're a team. that by all their other moves is a team that's like, no, we're competing. So it's, I don't know. It's so weird. It's like all their other position rooms, they treat one way and then the quarterback

room, they treat a different way. And they're trying to, I think they're just trying to sort it out. It worked out great. You kept him for a year. Yeah. You were a competitive. You were a Super Bowl contender. You maintain the standard and the competitiveness and the culture that you want as an

organization. Now you have the same exact thing that the chiefs did in Mahomes's rookie year. You got to sit him because you were competitive. It's like, all right, this is who we are. We're a winning franchise. You got to maintain that feel while letting that guy learn for a year. Guys got good reps. They got playoff reps.

And now you transition. This is the time. There's no reason to hang on to whatever that was. It works out perfect. We trade our first rounder. It was pick 29. Okay, perfect. Like, that's exactly what you wanted.

Great. Yeah. You know, like, I know. It's, it's weird. That's why again, it's just hard for me to imagine. There's no way they pay him that money. I just cannot believe that they. they would pay him that money to be on the roster.

All right. I agree. That is all we got, guys. Again, sincerely, thank you so much for the questions. There were so many good ones. I wish we could have gotten to all of them. Nate and I will be back tomorrow. We're talking about the quarterbacks.

We're talking about the quarterbacks. And this year's draft, it has begun. It is draft time in earnest. We're going to dig into those top five guys that are in first round consideration. I may let Nate talk about some guys further. A little deeper in the draft that he likes. We'll see. We'll see how much rope I give you there.

E.J. Perry, Brown. So please come back and check that out. I cannot wait to dig into that conversation. In the meantime, please rate and review the podcast on your podcast platform of choice. Sincerely appreciate that. Please subscribe to The Athletic. We have a deal going on right now. It's a dollar a month.

So please take advantage of that. Theathletic.com slash your football show is where you can find that. We'll be back tomorrow. Appreciate you guys listening. We'll talk to you soon. This was The Athletic Football Show.