The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - NFL Mock Draft Scenarios: Picks 5 to 1

Episode Date: April 16, 2024

On the last installment of The Athletic Football Show’s Mock Draft Scenarios, Robert Mays and Nate Tice discuss the top five picks of the 2024 NFL Draft. They examine the team needs for the Chargers, Cardinals, Patriots, Commanders and Bears. Plus, a bonus look at the Panthers to wrap up the episode.Read the 2024 Edition of The Beast, By Dane BruglerFollow Robert on Twitter: @robertmaysFollow Nate on Twitter: @Nate_TiceSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTube Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic football show. Welcome to the athletic football show. I'm Robert Mays. Joining me today. It's my good friend, Nate Tyson. How you doing, buddy? I'm doing well. Tax day.

It is tax day, yes. I was good. I was good. away from the draft. Oh, yes, tied it in together. We are so, so close, right? I think it's nine days from the time you listen to this. You'll be listening to this on Tuesday. Draft kicks off on Thursday. Quick reminder. Oh, yes. Quick reminder. Draft Day. Thursday, April 24th, we will be coming to you live. Every single pick of round one, me, Nate, Dane, reacting to all of them from a nice little studio in Detroit.

very much like the draft show we did last year. One of my favorite things that we do each year. So please have that on your radar. Please have that on your calendar. We'll be doing all of the first round on Thursday, all of rounds two and three on Friday live. So just carve out the time. Come join us.

You can watch the broadcast at the same time. But highly encourage you guys to give that a try because we have a great time doing it. It is a real chance for Dane to shine throughout those entire two days. So just put in your calendars right now. leave yourself a little reminder to come join the athletic football show on the first two nights of the draft live on YouTube. I was going to say, come watch Dane Flex.

That's what it is. Day two is a lot of fun because just the pacing gets up and down and just interesting things happen. A lot of our guys get drafted. A lot of our guys fall, which is more of my case than Dane's. But it's a lot of fun. I'm very, very excited. Very excited we go to Detroit as well. It's going to be a fun few days.

was there for the Little Caesar's Bowl last. That was the last time I was there. My last game as a Pitt Panther as a GA. James Connor played as designated pass rusher and ran for over 100 yards, maybe over 200. And a good old Aaron Donald and Tyler Boyd showed off as well. So that was my last memory is in Detroit. I was there for training camp last year. I ate very well.

We have a couple of good dinner reservations for when we're there. So it is going to be a fun weekend. If we were up to day and we would also do rounds four through seven live. but we're not doing that. So we will have a show coming to you guys recapping rounds four through seven, but we are not going to be doing that live. So hopefully Thursday and Friday nights

will suffice for all of you. Today, as Nate alluded to, we are wrapping up our little mock draft team need. However you want to describe this exercise that we've been doing over the last month or so, we've been going throughout the entire first round talking about pretty much every single team and what their needs are

and what sort of scenarios they might be looking at when they are on the clock in round one. And we have arrived at the top five. So we're going to be doing the top five today, plus a little bit on the Carolina Panthers. The Browns also done a first round pick, but the Browns aren't picking until round three. So, yeah, kind of doesn't.

Yeah, they've done this to themselves. They made choices and choices have consequences. And one of those is we're not going to talk about them on these shows. But the Panthers have two picks in the 30s. So it was worth giving them a little bit of a nod. But let's dig into the top five here. And let's start with a Los Angeles Chargers team very much in transition. When you were looking at the needs for the Los Angeles Chargers heading into this draft,

where did you start? That's where did I end. More than where I start. It's all over. It's so funny that you say that. It's just kept going and going. Yeah, they need this. They need depth and needle movers.

They are a weird team that has pieces, including a franchise quarterback, but feels like they're rebuilding. and a coach that we have generally only seen you be in a win now kind of mode. So it's a weird disconnect. New GM. I mean, there's just so many question marks. If you were picking a position that wasn't a position of immediate need for the Los Angeles Chargers, where would you start?

I think that might be easier. Quarterback is a good one. Man, like, oh, now I'm looking. I guess, you know, left tackle. They're okay.

Sure. One tackle. One tackle. One tackle. One tackle. kind of sort of guard and then you're really just that's it.

After that it's like I don't care where you drop in I would no matter where they go in this draft I would probably go yeah. I think that's right. That makes sense. Because even if there isn't an immediate need

and I think Edge may be another one of those positions, Bost is there, Max there, Tully was good last year. But if you fast forward to 2025, everything is on the table because most of the guys that are on the roster right now

are not locked up beyond next year or have contracts you can get out of. So I looked at this because I listed all four or five positions, but as I was doing the exercise, my last thought was they have needs everywhere. If they move on from Joey Bosa and Trey Pipkins after this season, which is feasible on both of those contracts, the only veterans on the roster in 2025

that would be making more than $5 million are Justin Herbert, Derwin James, and Rayshon Slater on his fifth-year option. More than $5 million. if they moved on from Bosa and Pipkins. This is a rebuild. It is a restart. Even though they kept the edge rushers, every conversation we had

about the state of the chargers, which is they need to be nuked and they need to just turn the page and start over, that is where they are right now, even if they kept two of the four expensive veterans that they had to worry about coming into this off seas.

And those guys, that's why it's, there's a disconnect between those guys staying and what they actually are. That's more just like, well, we got to because what else are we going to do this, use this for? Because of just the resources we have. They cut costs with the Keenanow deal, so they didn't have to cut costs with the other guys.

And so it's just, all right, at least we have some feasible bodies on this side. But that, that's what it is. But it's a disconnect between it's not like, oh, no, we're going to still keep building around these guys. Think of these longtime vets that they've had, these former stars and still that play really, really well. Think of them more as mercenaries. Like, this is their last year with the charges. That's what they feel like. So that's not guys you build around.

So then you start right back at the front. which is, I mean, again, it's just every position they could go here in the draft, which is like, to me it seems pretty obvious the two areas that they should go, line and receiver based on the players at their spot. So it's going to ask you, even if everything is on the table, what are the feasible pads? I was going to say at number five, let's say what are the feasible pads out of the first round if you're the chargers? Because they don't have to stick at five.

They're one of those teams that if the draft falls a certain way, I think they're a very good candidate to trade back because of all of the needs that we're talking about right now. So as you're going through the scenarios in your head of what the Chargers could do in the first 15 picks, what's on your mind? Oh, trade back and taking an offense alignment in the early teens. That to me is the ju- I was not going to say the juiciest because Chargers fans are going, what? Oh, that's definitely not the juiciest.

That's how you'd have right now. I meant to say, not the juiciest one. Juiciest to me and maybe like Brandon Thorne and then, you know, a couple other people. But to me, that is ideal. Just trading back into that where we think some teams might trade up from. The early teen slots, Vikings at 11, would be one, but starting there, getting more draft capital, getting more middle round picks or something next year when you know what you absolutely need. Or even this year where it gets some guys that you truly like. If you want to bring some of your Michigan compadres over, you know, the like quorum of the world, the junior Colson's, I do like Junior Colson.

But bringing those guys on day two, okay, we. we got some more picks on day two that we can use those guys. Just bringing out scenarios there. But to me, that would be ideal if you're thinking just long term, midterm, and short term, because you're also thinking about Justin Herbert's health. That's also why I keep reminding Chargers fans. It's how did Herbert's season end last year? Let's keep them healthy.

Keep them upright. So trading back line first would be the way to go or consolation prize, a receiver, because again, this is a cool receiver draft, and it might get wonky. If you trade back there and one of these guys falls, just depending. out of the draft. One of these guys meaning the top three of Harrison,

the Dunsayer neighbors. I don't think they would, but just, you know, ideal scenarios. So if you're looking at possible scenarios and possible ways that this could play out,

let's say they go down from a, because you need a partner to do this. So which team would be motivated to come up to five and for what player?

So let's just hypothetically. Let's say the Vikings go up to four and trade with the Cardinals, which we've seen, you know, but mocked a million different places.

And let's say the Cardinals, like they did last year, wanted to come back up to five to get one of the receivers. The price that Arizona paid to do that last year from 12 to 6 was they traded 12, 34, and a fifth round pick for six and a third round pick. So if you're the Chargers, you could go back to 11, get an extra second as part of this process,

and then a little bit of change later on. So now you're working with 11 and then something at 34, 35, 36, that extra Cardinals pick. So you can pick an offensive lineman at 11, and you can go get whatever into your offensive line, into your defensive line, which is a massive need on this team. It's not the headline one. It's not the one everyone's going to be talking about. But again, it's just all these areas where they just need bodies. So if the Cardinals are that candidates to potentially come back up because they still want one of the receivers, even after a trade down, I think that would be a plausible scenario for a team that would be motivated to come up to five.

So that's what the Chargers, in my opinion, that's where their mindset should be, is how can we get back and start adding picks here, even if the receivers are very juicy? Yep. And you guys just think, and it feels like they're dripping it into the media and dripping into their fan base about... Oh, I don't even know if it's been dripping. I feel like they've been overt about it. A steady stream that, hey, we have an inside out mentality. We have a trench first mentality. We have an offense-aligned first mentality.

no matter what coach everybody they have the same mottoed and just looking at harbos history again these are the guys he's going to go after if they stay put they have their pick of the litter i think of the offense aligned which is a really interesting proposition because of the guys that could be available but the thing is one of those three guys i'm thinking of in my mind uh joe alt olifshano or jacy laytham one of those three could be available at 11 like uh you know maybe not all but the other two easily and that's the argument for trading back if you're any of these teams that needs an offensive of linemen. Tennessee, if you wanted to move back a little bit, Chargers if you wanted to move back a little bit, is that in theory, you could still get one a tiny bit later in the first round. Receivers dice here, because I think the teardrop is bigger, and those guys,

the Brian Thomas's, the Adnanai Mitchells, are they going to be going a little bit later, and you don't want to miss out on the first crop? But for tackles, if you think it's a little bit tighter, is it worth taking the chance and picking up a sprinkling of a second or a third round pick as part of that process. The O-line run and everybody that's listening to these pods

and just heard me talk about the same five guys over and over is that's going to happen in the teens. Like that it's going to go. That's where they're just going to start picking up. That's where do they want to start it? Like, do you want, that's the needle that you try to thread? Do we get to that part of the draft that we start the O-line run as opposed to, oh, shoot, now we're on the third guy

because we traded back too far, yada, yada. Also, what if the Jets are kind of really like, yeah, screw it. The Jets are another really good team. Yeah. The Jets are another team to think about. They don't have a second. So what you would get back as part of that process if you want to get a future.

It's the future. Yeah. So I think that's another team that's worth throwing out there. I will say this. Even if I'm on board with this plan that you have of moving back, getting an offensive linemen accruing more picks, it would be hard to pass on the receivers. Even if it's not the soundest team building choice, you have a star quarterback. When are you going to be in this position again to potentially add a.

Harrison or a neighbor's if the draft falls a certain way. So I understand the argument, even if I don't think it is the smartest plan forward for them. The same, no, I've thought about this a lot with the Chargers because I, it's the same discussion we had when we talked about the Bears at nine was, okay, offensive line receiver, this gets into the players over with the offense line. I like a, and Doonzee and neighbors better than I like all Shanoo and Latham, even if I love them all.

But that now it gets into, and I'm not saying. know to this, by the way. I'm saying taking Dune's A, who I think they would probably prefer, but take him at five and then get the offensive lineman that might be more of a home run swing in the second round. Like, just flop it. Just flop the thinking. That's not bad

I think decision making because you're getting to two spots. Do you have workable offensive linemen right now. Like if they went into next season with the current state of the offensive line, even if it's not ideal and you want to upgrade that other tackle spot, probably somewhere along the way. And this draft

gives you an outlet to do it, they could go into next year with a five offense line they currently have on the roster. That's, and that's part of the thinking here. They can, the Chargers. I'm not saying in general, and this is why you have to go team by team with all this, which is what we're doing. But no, that's why. It's because this offensive line, when healthy, is fine. It's pretty good. It's just that they haven't been always healthy. And that's where the issues. And again, if you replenish it and get a, I'm just throwing out a name here, a Patrick Paul from Houston, a Jordan Morgan, he might be there, you know, who could play right tackle or guard. Like those types of guys in the second round, I think those are good players like a Patrick Paul has upside too. So, you know,

that's not a bad plan either. A, what's his name? Jackson Powers Johnson from Oregon, who could play all the three spots, who seems to be falling a little bit because of some medical stuff. So that could be the range too. You get him. Okay. Now you got another guy that could be all three spots. What spot do we get him at? But he could be a needle mover on the inside in the long term. So just other things, the other avenues that they can replenish these spots. Thinking about the offensive line, they signed Bradley Bowman this offseason. They signed both Bradley Boseman and Hayden Hurst, which to me is very funny because it's just an overt bet against the 2023 Panthers. Just saying we'll get more out of them.

Both of those guys signed multi-year extensions in Carolina last spring, spring of 23, and now they're available for a million bucks each. I think one of them at offsets, so that's maybe part of the reason. But it still is very funny that they took two guys from that offense because they're like, yeah, if there's one team, one unit, I'm going to bet again. and the results from those players weren't real. It's the 2023 Panthers. There are worse approaches. No, that's buying low and just going like, yeah, we'll get more out of them. Even though every coach thinks that, no, this actually might not be a bad philosophy to go down.

They have an extra fourth from the Bears as we're looking to set their draft capital from the Keenan Allen trade. And again, just alluding to their cap situation, right now, even if they kept Bosa on the roster next year, which he's going to be like 35 million bucks. he's 30 he's hurt for pretty often again wouldn't be surprised they move on if they did they would have like a hundred and thirty million dollars in cap space heading into next season this is a full scale start over with justin herbert and like two other guys we knew that but when you actually look at the nuts and bolts of it it's pretty striking it is it's like the opposite of the vikings it's like and it's like the cardinals last year right the cardinals had kailer and nothing

And that's kind of where the Chargers are. And guess what the Cardinals did last year? They moved back in the first round because they had a quarterback and nothing. And the Chargers have the left tackle, which is very nice. But for the most part, the roster is pretty barren. And I think their thought process on how they approach this should probably reflect the current level of talent across the entire thing. And I'm going to say this term, this word about probably every single of these teams.

The Chargers are fascinating. they're just fascinated to, they are, when you talk about experiments and all these types, Vikings are another team. We've talked about like it's kind of an experiment

team building. This is Justin Herbert and Harbaugh with a open slate, basically. Okay, what happens? I can't, I can't wait to watch.

There are two teams in this year's top five that as soon as I started spending more than 10 seconds thinking about it, my conclusion was, I cannot wait to see what they do. The Chargers were one, the Patriots were another.

And we'll get there in about 12 minutes here. picking at number four, the Arizona Cardinals, we already talked about the Cardinals on one of our earlier shows because they owned two first round picks, but we really didn't dig that deep into it, and we really didn't talk about what the scenarios might look like in the top five. So I don't think we really need to rehash a lot of the needs the Cardinals have.

It's most things. The only thing they really did in Free Agency is they spent on interior defensive linemen, Ball, Nichols, Justin Jones. They signed Sean Murphy Bunting, but they still need another corner. the Mac Wilson contract, which I didn't realize they had signed him to a starting level deal, you could probably make an argument that off-ball linebacker is not a huge pressing need for the Cardinals with Mack Wilson and Kaiser White. But that's all we got.

We got off-ball linebacker, interior defensive line, and maybe running back because James Connor still has a lot of juice left in the tank. And offensive tackle after Jonah Williams. So those four-ish positions, I think, are the spots that you could write off. Other than that, pretty much everything else is currently in need for the Arizona Cardinals. I said, are they going to try the old Switcharoo shell game they did last year and move back, move back up? You know, and like I could see them doing that. Like, I could see them drafting any position standing pat drafting Marvin Harrison Jr.

I'd be like, yep, totally makes sense. If he's gone, say the Patriots or somebody gets funky at 3, don't think it'll happen, but you never know is I could see them going with another receiver. Like, you know, if they went, they just said, nah, we'll take them Dunes Day or neighbors. I'll still go, yeah, I get it. Like, just go for it. Why not? Get the best player. So, yeah, Cardinals, anything could really happen.

They could be in a great position to move back as well because it could go, QB, QB, QB, and somebody might love McCarthy or somebody might like Daniels or May or one of these guys. And they just go, okay, who wants to move up? Like, they could just have so many spots or so many options here at number four and just stand pat, take a great player. We've talked about this as a potential. timeline, but I think it's worth bringing up every time you discuss the Cardinals. I'm not putting too much on the movement that they had last year, going back and the going down

and then coming back up. It's not just that that makes me think it's on the table for them. It's the current scenario in the draft. If quarterbacks go 1 through 3 and the Vikings want J.G. McCarthy and they move up to 4 and the Cardinals end up getting 11 and 23 and something else is part of that trade, the move back from 11 to 5 is not going to come. with the same tax that the Vikings are going to have to pay. So even if you only in the end move down one spot through that series of trades,

you are not going to pay nearly the same price. You are going to come out so far in the black with that draft capital that that's why I think it's worth considering. And what's the worst thing that could happen? You go down to 11 and you can't come back up. You have so many needs. You might as well keep taking swings. Yeah.

Oh, my God. And there's also the quarterback trade-up tax. That's what I mean. It's a quarterback and it's the desperation where the Vikings are going to pay so much that you're going to, we just went through the price. It was a second and then like some change after that. So if you're getting two firsts and change for the Vikings trade and you're only paying a second to move back up, you do that every single time. So I think it's absolutely worth exploring if you're the Cardinals and if you think that there's an appetite from the chargers to move back down. and again it's the who loves these guys too like that that's a thing too is like the patriots could be

interesting like because that would be hilarious if they move out of their spot okay someone comes up to three and then it's the cardinal spot like and then it's like okay well they just paid this for three and then it's like a new kind of math that has to be played too right on the spot which i think is going to be interesting as well i'm this is these next two spots are really really actually these three spots four spots if you're including the giants are just be such pivot points in this draft that's just going to be crazy the type of movement because all the all the availability is the premium positions i'm sorry i'm just raining here quarterbacks offensive line receivers these are spots that people move up for we haven't really talked about this

like all the different timelines that are on the table here in the top 10 anything anything trade ups movebacks stand like all these teams can not move like there can be no trades i'd be like yeah i can understand why because of the guys that could be available there. I mean, what is Dane said about neighbors? Teams can feel about that, but with Malik neighbors. Dan said the top three players in this track has to include Malik neighbors. Teams could feel the same way. The chargers could feel the same way. The Patriots could feel the same way. The Cardinals can feel the same way and go, I'm going to just take that guy rather and just get funky with it. So it's just going to be so, so, so interesting. Yeah. I mean, if that's the scenario that plays out, if the Vikings come up at four

and the Cardinals can get back, then they can make those trades and still get Marvin Harrison Jr. And I know that seems fantastical, but it really does feel like that's a possibility with how this all might play out. If I gave you two options,

if you were Arizona, you could trade back to 11 and you do not get one of the receivers, but you get all that other capital, or you could stick it forward and pick Marvin Harrison, Jr., which one would you do? I would actually take it,

Marvin Harrison Jr. I know you would. That's why I would. ask you the question. And that's hard. That's a hard one for me because, yeah, deep down, that's a hard versus head one. Like my head's truly saying, uh, trade back and just go, yep, get the capital, it all work out. But Marvin Harrison Jr. is that type of player that you, you take. You just take and whatever. He's worth it. He's that type of needle mover. At a certain point, you need players. And if they hadn't done all of this collecting of draft capital

last year, then I would probably be beaten the drum a little bit harder to say, you need to just accrue picks here. The roster is so barren. You need to keep getting these shots and keep getting these dice rolls. But right now, they have seven picks in the top 104. They have four. They have 27. They have 71 from the Will Levis trade last year with the Titans.

They have 90 from Houston. So even if they stick and pick at four and just say, this guy, we cannot risk losing somebody like this. At a certain point, you need foundational pieces. So even if we have a long way to go, it's still worth just knowing we're coming away from the top five this year's draft with a true number one receiver. We've got enough picks to fill the rest of the holes that we have on the roster. If that was their mindset heading into this and that's where they landed, I wouldn't have any sort of issue with that strategy and approach whatsoever.

And you just with the word you said, they're shots at it. We always talk about the quantity of shots, which I get. We always say these guys are coin flips, yada y'all. It's all about the denominator and even out in the end. but also it's kind of more bets. It's more like I think Marvin Harrison Jr. has a high likelihood of being a good player that we can build around. These are the shots that you move up and do all these things to take.

So when you have it, at this point in time, it passes that threshold of more capital to take more shots because this type of shot is worth taking. I don't know, it's a higher value type of shot that you have to take when you have it. So usually that we're talking about with quarterbacks for that type of thing. But Harrison Jr., I think to me and a lot of other people, people. He is that type of non-quarterback that could do that. That's worth this type of thing. You can leave the first round of this year's draft with Marvin Harrison Jr. and a defensive player

at a premium position at 27. There's going to be a corner there. There's probably going to be a pass rusher there. Whatever flavor you're going to want to go with. And you can do that without making a single trade. So the amount of draft capital they have and just the amount of ammo that they have, I think that's actually a good argument for just saying, we need the players this time. And if that's where they land, totally fine by me. all right let's go to our next team here which as i alluded to previously i think they might be the most fascinating team in this entire process and that is the new england patriots picking third overall i was talking to somebody about this recently who is a big fan of the worst sticking a

three we're picking one of the quarterbacks plan and i understood all of his arguments and you know as i thought more about it i was like yeah i get it you don't know when you're going to be back in this position if you think all three of those guys are worth those sorts of picks that's fine. And I'm willing to admit that, as I've thought about this, because I don't love Daniels as much, that's coloring the way that I think about it. I think part of the reason that I'm team trade down is that I see if there's a world where Caleb and Drake may go one, two, and you're left with Daniels at three. I'm like, eh, I don't know about that. If May is there at three, then I think I would be a little bit more enthusiastic about them staying and picking the quarterback. But even

removing myself and removing the evaluations of those guys from the thought process here, it's still so hard for me to justify dropping a rookie quarterback into this current infrastructure when you look at the state of the offensive personnel on this team. Everything you just said is about the Daniels made thing. I was prepped myself for this discussion is that it's how you view these guys. That's the thing. I know people love Daniels. I think me, you deign a little bit too.

I don't want to speak all the way for him, but we see him as a tier different. And I see him as not a guy I would take a three. And this is why is what you're saying here with the Patriots, because the offensive line is average at best, maybe after this draft. I think, I think that's even. That's what I'm just putting. That's being nice. I'm being nice here.

So this is why I want to paint this picture, a receiving core that I can't even say average at best, a below average one led by my guys. I was trying to figure out a way to describe them because I was typing out all the receivers when I was going through the needs. And I said, receiver, okay, Kendrick Bourne, KJ Osborne, J. Osborne, J.I., Shuster. And then I have a little bullet after it. And I was like, it's a room full of it. And I was trying to figure out the descriptions.

And I was going to go with second slash third options. I deleted the second. It's third options. It's a room full of third options. I think that's a realistic way to look at it. I thought you were going to say a room full of Nate's favorites, like, which is... which are they're synonyms of each other. That's what I thought you were going with.

That's not the way that I was framing it. Are you kidding? That is power slot. It's so true. You don't want to build the whole room about power slots. Even KJ. Osborne, you've had some nice moments with.

Yeah. He's like a, he's like, I appreciate parts of his game. But yeah, yeah, it's not what you want. Even Hunter Henry is part of that,

part of that discussion. Oh, it's so true. It's so true. And that, here's my problem with this. I, the way that I've come to think about May and Daniels.

And I'm honestly, even hesitant to keep putting these sound bites out into the world because of how they might sound three years from now. But the way that I've come to think about May and Daniels is that on the rookie quarterback contract, I can absolutely see Jane Daniels being successful. Look at what he did in college last year. If you put him in a really good situation with really good players, I think he has a high enough floor where you can be a success with him when you can spend those excess resources on players in that four-year window. But when you get out of that, that worries me a little bit.

And part of the reason I think that applies to New England is they have so far to go before they can surround him with that sort of supporting cast that you're burning 25% of what makes Jaden Daniels valuable. So that's why I just don't like the quarterback first part of the sequence here for New England specifically. It's for me, even with May being the guy, I think, I would still probably go, yeah, I'd end up taking him because just this, you, he's, he's, the type of guy I wouldn't pass over it. This is just me. But for a general guy, a general

consensus of May, then it's more of the, let's move back, the ones I think he needs time, yada, yada, yada. That's also why you have Jacoby, uh, Berset on the roster too. So that's a whole other discussion as well. But I, I, this whole time, I've just maybe just have picture of the Patriots moving back because I think they're so far away offensively. And I feel like they know that. And that's why they brought back kind of their whole Nate's favorite cast. And not because it's just like, it's more just, well, these are the type of guys, everyone else fills out their roster with. Well, let's start here and then start cherry bombing with the really good players at the other spots. That's how I feel they're doing their team

building. That takes time because that's several draft picks you have to hit. Not you don't acquire those guys just some free agency. So that's two years minimum. How long did the Packers take to replenish their past group two years and nailing every single one? So usually it's like three years, really, to just replenish that to really get like kind of needle movers. So that's why to me, it's like they feel like they should, the prudent move would be to move back. Even, you know, even if you do like Daniels and stuff, I just think it's a shaky situation. Even if you're getting into the contract stuff, I would even say just because it's his play

style sometimes, just might not be, he's kind of, you know, can be aggressive with his body. I would say that's the generous way I'll put it. And maybe not the best situation for him to be dropped into, even if there are some safeness to him as far as accuracy and understanding the football and where to go with the football and everything. But I don't know, like you said, it's like if you don't think of him as that, high-end guy that can really move it by a time that it's worth it, are you in the spot to take advantage of that anyways?

To me, I looked at it as like this, O-line, receiver, tradeback, quarterback. That's kind of, and I said, maybe my order, but those are the four options I look at right there. Yeah, you could put them in any order you want to. I think it's the receiving core needs a high-end guy. The offense, they need a left tackle right now. I mean, they need it right now. You want to counter McDermott out there? The only way you're going to get there and have enough.

picks to get guys to fill all these spots even over the next two years is if you add picks somewhere along the way. This isn't a situation like Arizona where they have all these picks. This isn't even like Washington. Washington has a bunch of picks already. The Patriots have their picks plus an extra sixth. That's what they have. And with the state of the offensive roster, I think it has so far to go that you need to

be adding draft picks somewhere independent of the quarterback situation. And I just, I get, oh, we're picking three. there's a bunch of quarterbacks available. What if we are never in this position again? But I've seen so many quarterbacks that just have no shot. They have no shot because of what they're surrounded with. And as I look at the supporting cast on this team, I just think that this is one of those situations.

I think it's one of those places that you're setting that guy up to fail if you draft him right now. And we're talking about all of this and kind of a team-building vacuum, where if you were just operating independent of any sort of conditions or circumstances, Robert Kraft's view of this is going to be very, very important. If he wants to leave this draft with a quarterback and he wants the next era of this team to start

and they can peddle some hope as part of this, then they're going to draft a quarterback. And I think that part of it probably looms pretty large. But if you listen to what Gerard Mayo has said and just the moves they've made this offseason, it just wouldn't surprise me if they landed on trading back and kicking the can down the road being the best possible option for where they are right now. And that's how I've read it too. But even just getting into possible answers, we've gone through the glut of free agency. We've seen what they're kind of going for because they missed out on Calvin Ridley, which would have kind of changed some math of this. But if they go quarterback at three, okay, then they go, hey, round two, we'll get an offense alignment or a receiver.

Say they go receiver. We add some juice to add with Pop Douglas, you know, to go to the receiver spots. Now we still need an office alignment. like and okay this is just this year but then we're getting into next year we still have this need if the receiver works out the round two receiver where there's a glut where there's a lot of talent there but you might be wrong but now we're getting into this next year without the resources to maybe have some of these misses and then the defense might be moving on some of the spots might not be working out even if i do really like a lot of the defensive members that they have but you just more question marks about happen

and this is if the quarterback is working out so i don't know it just feels to me me that the math is off for them. And I think what you just said, laying out what the Cardinals have, that's why it's a little different from, even if these two teams feel kind of similar in their building, Cardinals do have Kyler, but it just kind of just seems like the math is just different for him, like, greatly so, actually, I would think. Maybe you can make an argument that you can try to chase a Donovan Smith or somebody like that that can just be a stopgap starter for you just to survive the year. But there are not that many of those guys left in free agency. And I also think that, you know, I'm sure Patriots fans, some of them would say, well, we're going

have so much cap space next year. Like, we can fill some of the needs that way. A starting left tackle or a number one receiver, you're not going to find those on the open market. You missed out on paying Calvin Ridley $23 million a year. You look at what happened with the Texans, and I know it's a very different situation. I know that. They can do whatever they wanted on whatever timeline they wanted because no one in America was

paying attention. That's never going to be the situation with New England. There's always going to be more urgency and more pressure to get it figured out right away. But Houston's willingness to do that thing slowly, to have patience, they had the left tackle in place, they had some low-cost swings at receiver, and dropping a quarterback into what had become an underrated situation, I don't think we should ignore that stuff. And I don't think we should ignore how important what you're giving a quarterback is to whether or not that guy succeeds or fails.

and that has to be on their minds. And if it's not, they're doing the quarterback that they pick and the franchise a disservice. Right. And you're just doing the Mac Jones thing all over again, just with a higher draft capital. But you already alluded to it, but what Mayo said and his quotes kind of, it seemed like they have kind of good heads on their shoulders as far as vision. As far as this is, again, we'll never know. This is April 15th right now. Who knows in two weeks, I might just be like, what are you doing?

But it's this is right now, it does seem like the answers at least have a lot of things. thought and a lot of some, you know, some vision to it, some feel for at least what they want to do, which should be encouraging. And even if you move beyond the offense or beyond receiver and tackle, there's still a bunch of needs that this team has. They need edge rushers. Judon and Uche are free agents after this season. Jibiro Puppers is a free agent after the year is over, even if they brought back Kyle Dugger.

Like, there are spots throughout this route that need to be addressed. The offensive line beyond the left tackle, you know, Citi Sao is currently their starting right guard. If you want to try them out there again, more power to you. Dave Andrews is 33 years old and he's going to be a free agent after this season. So they just have so far to go at so many different spots that they're a team to me that just screams, we need more picks, we need more picks, even if quarterback might be the biggest need they have on the entire roster. Yes. You know Jacobi's okay. Yeah, he's fine. But again, a long-term answer record. You're not building around. You're not building around. I'm just on. And he's on a one-year deal, right?

He's on a one-year deal anyway. Stop it. It was just to do it. Yes. I think too often teams are afraid of the unknown. They're afraid of, oh, if we go into a season with Davis Mills is our starting quarterback, how could we possibly do that? No one gives a shit that Davis Mills was the Texan starting quarterback for a while anymore.

No one cares. And I know the Patriots have some talent on defense, but if they kick the can down the road at that spot, I would not be at all surprised if they were bad next year and potentially, in a spot where they could chase a quarterback at the top of the draft. I know right now the quarterback class is bad, but Jane Daniels didn't even exist in this conversation at this time last year. A lot can change between now and next year's draft, and I think that teams should be less afraid of the unknown that comes with that thinking and that sort of process.

The variables change every day, every hour. So it's just like, that's why anyone that tries to predict it, everyone says about next year's class, you just never know. We thought at one point, I thought six quarterbacks might go in round one. I mean, some people are still saying that. But to me, I only have really two and a half guys graded as first rounders, like true grades, three. What's called three?

But that's three. That's not six. You know, that's a big difference from what we were talking about four, five, six months ago. We're trying to predict a year out. It's impossible. Yeah, I say McDaniels. But what about next year is JJ McCarthy? When we get to a place where it's just like, yeah, I can win with that guy.

If I took that guy in the top ten, I could win with that guy. And there's plenty of those guys. we're not talking about the number one pick here. We're talking about you coming away with quarterback three. And I think that is an important way to think about this because there is a difference. And there is a difference between just picking a quarterback because you're in a position two and picking a quarterback because it is the best thing for your franchise at that time. Let's continue that sort of conversation as we get to Washington and two.

This to me feels like way less of a debate. We know what we can talk about the needs for Washington outside of quarterback. but Washington's going to pick a quarterback with the second overall pick. It's just a matter of which quarterback they're going to end up selecting. As they should, do not overthink it.

You do things in the draft and trading and doing everything team building wise to get just a swing at a guy like what I think. Either was Caleb or Drake May. It seems like it's way more open than that with Jane Daniels throwing there. But if they have Jane Daniels look,

they view them that way, that's the bet that they're making. That's the swing that they think is worth it. That's what you try to do. That's what you're angling for in the draft is to get a chance at one of the guys that you think is a franchise guy. I'm with you. And I think that they should take a quarterback at two. And then it becomes a question of what else do they need to try to maneuver for in this draft?

They've spent like a team that knows they're dropping a quarterback into this equation. They signed Nick Aligretti and Tyler Biottoch to starting level deals. They have receiving options on this team. That's what they spent their first round picks on multiple, not first. run picks. That's what they spent high-level assets on multiple times over the last three to four years. McCorn extension, drafting Dehan Johnson, Jahan Dotson in the first round. So this team, I think, for the most part, is well positioned from a player-supporting cast perspective to set up a young quarterback for success. The one exception to that is what's happening at left tackle. But I've

said this before, and I continue to believe this, they are in a position in my mind to be aggressive in finding that left tackle, potentially at the back half of the first round, because of how many picks they have. So right now, they have six picks in the top 100, including their pick in the second round, which is 33, and 40 from the Bears in the Montess Sweat trade. They have 78 for Seattle as part of the Sam Howell deal. They have 100 from the Niners and the Chase Young deal. So if you look at previous trades in this range, one of the ones I was thinking about was what

the Jags did with Devin Lloyd two years ago, right? So they had the 33rd pick, and to go from 33 to 27, all it took was 33, 106, and 180. So if you're Washington, you're at 36, let's say you think you need to go up to 26. You want to get ahead of the Chiefs, the Ravens, the Niners, some of these teams that need tackles. You could probably do that for like 152 if you look at historic traits. And to me, that feels worth it. If I'm Washington and I can come away from this draft with a starting quarterback and at least a shot at a starting left tackle and use some of that ammunition that I have, that would be my mindset if I were Adam Peters. You're like a one man trade machine.

And look at, but look at Adam Peters. This is what I spend my time thinking about. But look at Adam Peters and who the regime is. Adam Peters and Bob Myers. Bob Myers is a basketball guy. They throw around picks like, you know, a pezzis, you know, like mintz. They don't care about that And then Adam Peters coming from the 40-nighters

They will be aggressive with their selections And using them wieldings, moving those around Again, guys they want So I mean, to me, obviously They're taking quarterback at two Even the move on from Sam Howell Was like, hey, we're taking a quarterback Because it was like, hey, we had no friction here

It doesn't matter which guy Like even just a very diet version of the Justin Fields trade Yeah, it was Even though they got more for him. Less Harold had won like, okay, yeah, we're just hey, yeah, we're just shuffling him aside Less publicized or less talked about move, but again, they got as much for Sam Howells the Bears got for Justin Fields. It happened.

It's one of those things that happened this offseason. I know, we're going to look back at those trades. It's going to be fascinating. But I can say fascinating ever again. We look at how they're setting up the team, quarterback. If they get even what I would say a tackle because of this class, a tackle that legit, like you said, can be a franchise guy. Not just a guy that's like, hey, we got a guy that can fill the spot, maybe something. It's like a legit chance at someone that could be a needle mover.

That's what this type of draft. That's why I think this draft is so cool because of the depth at the premium positions. Maybe not edge. Corner is interesting, but offensively, the three premium positions, quarterback receiver, offensive line, offense tackle, however you want to look at it. Yeah. I mean, there's some real, real guys that, like, teams are getting fancy.

Like, teams are going to love. Like, there's a lot of, like, my guys for each team. Like, there's a lot of those types. Like, a lot of, like, ooh, that guy fits for us. So that's why I think draft night's going to be so crazy once we get outside not only just a top five, but the top 10, top 15. This can get kind of, I think, pretty crazy on draft day. If you're Washington, I think the quarterback and left tackle to me are the two most pressing needs. The reason that I would put left tackle there independent of the fact that it's a wide open spot on their depth chart,

I'm going to do in everything I can to make sure every box is checked for the quarterback to start. They have plenty of needs defensively. If you look at it just to get in a vacuum, they have needs at edge, they have needs a corner, they have needs at safety. This team, trading away picks to move up for a left tackle, may not be the most prudent thing if you're just looking at it on a spreadsheet. But I think that you pay a premium

to make sure that your quarterback is in the right spot. So that's why I would be willing to give up a chip here or a chip there to make sure I can get a tackle early in the draft. Relatively early. There's a million paths to building a team. And there's an idealized version, of course. But it's like, this is, with Washington,

it's like, this is the step we're taking, okay, this is how we're doing it. This is our path right now. This is our formula that we have to figure out. We are going heavy offense first. Okay, and then we'll figure out the defense later. It might be if the Patriots went quarterback could be the opposite kind of math for them as far as a team building thing. And again, I don't love that math.

And I don't. I don't either. I always think you just go heavy, heavy, heavy offense first and then figure out the defense whenever. You colts it, you know, with Peyton. That's how I look at it. It's like you just, I mean, even teams I grew up with, but it's like you heavy offense around the quarterback. and then we try and microwave or we've splashed a first round pick here on defense

and figure that out later. That's just kind of how I view these things. Especially early in the quarterback's time. And that's what we've seen. And this is the natural progression of things when you pick a quarterback early in the draft. Throw a ton of resources at supporting that quarterback when he's cheap and when he needs development.

And when you can pull him out of the oven as a fully formed product, then you can diverge some of those assets onto defense. It's exactly what the chiefs just did over the last five years. And the bills are now in that position, too. Where it's like, all right, we need to move on from Stefan Diggs. We need to, we need the

quarterback now that he is a star and paid like a star to elevate the players around him rather than being propped up. But when you're at the beginning of that sequence of events, it should be the opposite thought process, where you're trying to do everything you can to prop up the quarterback until he's a fully formed product that no longer needs it.

I also want to see the guy in some shootouts. they put the team on your back a little bit, you know, and make some mistakes, make some good plays, make some hero ball plays, like kind of, I don't know, just even some mindset stuff I like about it. We forget what the 2018 chiefs felt like.

It's so long ago now and we live in the Spags era that we forget what those teams used to be like. Very quickly. Very quickly we forget. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. No, it's,

I think those are the better versions of it. The bills kind of went like, hey, we're spreading this out with vets. Spread out all of it. So everything is at least. the average across. Yeah, they made the dig splash, but other than that, for the most part, they did it a little bit more all over.

Yeah. Yeah, but it's fun. That's why I'm curious who they go. Again, it seems like it's going to be Daniels, always the smoke right now, even though they did seem pretty smitten what Drake made at his pro day. Who knows? I don't know. I hate silly season.

I'm so over it. But if they go Daniels, that's what I want to see what these next steps are. Like you said, do they get aggressive? What else they do with this draft capital they have? Because they can make it pretty cool because they have players. Terry. The run-in-back group is pretty interesting. Jahan Dotson, I did like when he was coming out. I still think he has a use, even if I'm kind of a little lower on him than when he was coming

out now, I kind of seeing how he's going to use. That's plenty. You have a center with starting experience, Tyre Biotish. You have more than enough. This is the difference between Washington and New England for me. To me, it's just a bar you have to clear. Do you have enough to put the quarterback in a situation where you are not hampering his long-term development if you were going to play him early? Washington right now, I think, is close to that. If they get a tackle in this draft as well, they check all the boxes I need them to

for me to feel good. The term I always come back to, I remember having a conversation with Greg Olson, who is the longtime NFL assistant, not the commentator, the longtime offensive assistant in the NFL. He's been a offense coordinator a bunch of different plays, squarback coach,

is everywhere. So he's at 20 different stops in the NFL. I remember talking to him in 2017, the year that Sean McVeigh got to Los Angeles, Angeles. He was the offensive coordinator or the quarterbacks coaches, I think he was the quarterbacks coach on that first Rams team with McVey. And we were talking about Jared Goff and Jared Goff's experience as a starter in his rookie year. And what Golson told me, he said, he didn't play enough games to develop that scar tissue that you get worried

about. That's what you don't want. You don't want to drop a quarterback into a situation so bad and have him take enough reps in that bad situation for that scar tissue to start to develop. And I think that Washington is much closer to that scar tissue free lifestyle than some of the other teams that are typically picking in the top five looking for quarterbacks. Even just like, I kind of just like a simple, quick and dirty, like, how many starting quality players do they have? Like guys that you like don't have to, you can win with these types of guys. Like half of their offense, more than half of their offense is starting quality. Six of their guys just off the top of my head. You look at the Patriots, I would say four of their guys.

Just right there. You think it's four? I think it's like two. Well, that's because, you know, I'm a little nice with Boren and Hunter Henry. But so let's say three. But that's, I mean, and we're not even talking. Yeah. And we're not even talking about the offensive line.

And you can drop in there. So that's seven for Washington. Like so just that right there, just a quick and dirty math way of looking at it, much better situation to drop a guy in. Then you look at the Vikings and you're like, wow, this is a great situation to drop a young quarterback in. Just looking at the guys that are quality starters, not even just stars, but that's, that's a good way to look at it.

Well, if you're Minnesota, you better have enough quality starters because you're not going to have a draft pick for the next three years as you try to build around your quarterback. Speaking of Jared Goff, like, yeah. Then the Rams did a good job. They picked the right pieces in free agency. They had building blocks on defense that they could build around. And so

it has worked out in the past, but it's a needle that you're threading. The last thing to mention with Washington, just as I was doing this exercise, a lot of snaps to replace on defense. Like, way more than you would think at first glance. Kendall Fuller played a thousand snaps last year. Cam Curl played a thousand snaps last year. They have other guys in their secondary who are going to be hitting free agency

in 2025. Benjamin St. Joseph is a free agent in 2025. Derek Forrest is a free agent after this year. So a lot of guys that are penciled in right now to give them a lot of snaps, these are 2024 propositions. So they have a lot of looming needs on defense, but I think the urgency to build around the quarterback on offense is correctly influencing saying the way that they're using some of these resources. They got Frankie Louvre. Hey. But I don't, Frankie Louvo, Dorrance Armstrong, like, they've got some guys on defense that I find

interesting, but there are still a lot of holes on this team. There's a reason they're picking second overall, even after spending a lot on for a and freeze to see. And then you look at here at their startup, Mike Liebacker. And then you're like, oh, that's right. That's right. All right. Let's get to the Bears at one.

We don't have to spend a lot of time on. this because we just did the Bears at 9 on the last show. The only thing that we really haven't discussed at all on any of these shows, because even when we talked about the quarterbacks, it was really just an evaluation of Caleb Williams. Like, the Bears are picking Caleb Williams with the first overall pick. That's happening. Like, the Bears are about to pick this guy who is a high, high level prospect with the number one pick in the draft.

Like, that is going to happen. And I don't think I've actually wrestled with that idea. on this podcast yet. I don't because he talked about him like, yeah, it was a step removed as we were going through the evaluation on the quarterback show. And it's not just,

that's what's cool too. It's not like where it's just like one person going like, you know, it's not just me going like, hey, I really like a man. Everyone else is going like, I don't know.

It's like, people are having to like slow themselves down. How I would say like Caleb Williams, sometimes me, he's awesome. We talk of needle movers, whatever. He's that type of player. and he's dropped in a situation where we talk about situations they could succeed.

It's a pretty good one. It's a pretty good situation, especially on offense and a defense that can keep up. I think it's going to be really fun. Yeah, every other time this has happened with the Bears and a quarterback, we didn't know what it was going to be. I mean, even when they had the second overall pick in 2017 or the third overall pick in 2017, we had no idea who they were going to pick even if they were leaning quarterback. The Tribisky thing was a total shock to everyone who was watching the draft and to the Bears head coach at the time, which may have been a wrench in the process.

Insane. Insane to me. That's absolutely insane to me. It's still at this day. Even looking at, like, they traded for Cutler. Like, they just trade away all these early picks. And then it was just kind of like, what do we have here? Because it wasn't like you grew with Cutler.

It's just drop them into what we have right now. I know, it's just, this is completely different. This is not the Justin Fields thing where you're getting QB4. And, yeah, and moving up for it. And trading away. a future first to have to do it. This is you have the number one pick in the draft that doesn't even belong to you or didn't even belong to you and you get to take a high level quarterback prospect. Everything I said about Caleb Williams is not going to change just because the bears are

taking him with the first pick. Every reservation I have about why he might fail or why he might never become an elite quarterback in the NFL remains, even if he's on the bears. But the same is true for all the reasons I'm very excited about him. So I feel like your fandom would make you more jaded about it absolutely. It absolutely. I figured it would. And he's he's a guy you get excited for. I try to always be realistic, even if I'm more of an optimist. I always, that line of thinking of what a guy can do if anyone's ever. It's like he's too positive about guys. I try to focus on that. But with Williams, it's one of those where it's like you, it's more like, what can he do? That's what I'm trying to, because it's every, it's just one after another, all these

positive is a true guy that puts a team on. his back. And when you watch, it's one thing to watch a guy on Saturday just doing it, but once you get to the study process, you watch them one after another. And now I've had some years doing this media-wise and in the background-wise with teams and just seeing a guy like Caleb and a guy like May in my personal estimation is, it's like refreshing. It's just like, holy crap. You can't wait to see him in the NFL because it's almost like a, like a wait till you guys see this shit. Like wait till you see what he's going to be. There's going to be bumps. It's not going to be perfect. That's the thing. But there's going to be so much.

fun with him that I'm excited to watch Bears fans kind of enjoy him, like, enjoy watching him play. That's kind of what I was referring to at the beginning, is that like, this is now going to be part of the process. This is going to be every week. We're going to get to watch Caleb Williams on this offense. And where I'm at with it now is, I was with my mom yesterday. And so my mom's asking me, she's like, she's like, is he good? You know, that's where I'm at with like a lot of other Bears fans is just talking about what he is now that I've studied him. And it's just a fun place to be. It's a fun spot to be in where you feel good about the rest of the team. You feel good about the direction and you get to drop a guy like this in.

It's a rare opportunity. And that's what Ryan Poles said. He's used that exact phrase a dozen times in talking about where they are right now. It is a rare opportunity to have a solid. I think we've overrated it a little bit in the process, the supporting cast and what they're dropping him into. But to have a solid infrastructure that you can drop this sort of prospect into, this just doesn't happen. For the most part, if you're drafting a quarterback number one overall, you are terrible, or you have to give up a ton to go do it. So either way, on two fronts, you have a depleted support system for the guy you're about to draft.

The bears are not in that situation. It's not depleted in any way. And that's why it feels like an outwire, and that's why it feels exciting. That is. And they have a chance to reinforce it in the top 10 and, like, do other things. That's, it's a really cool situation. Like even teams that have gotten lucky where it's like they have a high pick, it might, they don't have an anonymous guy like this, you know?

Yeah. Or that's the thing is like, oh, they might have one, two, you know, pick two. And it's like, all right, well, and we have five guys we have to choose from. Or when the Browns, you know, when the kind of we're doing their kind of tanking thing, they took Baker because there's five guys that a lot of people like, but we don't know where we're going to stack them. Like, I don't know, at least with Caleb, it's like, yeah, I feel like, even if we make the wrong choice, making the right, wrong choice, but I think it's a very right choice to make because, again, with the upside of all this, not a lot of the teams get into this. It's really exciting.

There's not really, as a neutral fan, it's kind of cool to see a team kind of stick the landing so far of this rebuilding to get launched into, hey, we're a real team now. Not a lot of teams actually do it and actually might pull it off. There are thorough moments of it that give me pause, even independent of his evaluation. I think that going into this season, not with that sort of lame duck head coach. He probably has. more job security than it might seem because of the way the last couple seasons have gone with Mattieber flus. But it still is a, it's underwhelming, right?

Like the situation with the coaching staff and the offensive ecosystem is like a little bit underwhelming. It's a defensive minded head coach. It's an offensive coordinator that I think is solid but not great. Like that's part of this. I think mean you've reached the same grade with. Yeah. Yeah.

With Walter. It's like, I was intrigued by a lot of the stuff he did last year. I think he was a very good problem solver when some stuff was getting thrown at them with offensive line injuries. There's a lot of unique ideas within that offense. But part of the reason I like watching the offense so much is because I like watching Gino a lot. So if you try to pull it apart with the Waldron aspect of this and everything else that was

going on on Seattle, it's like, okay, he's okay. I think he is a solid choice to be your offensive coordinator, but I do think the ceiling with him as a play caller and what the design of the offense might look like is fairly limited. So there's, like, there are elements of this where it's hard to get super, super excited, but I think the floor

with pretty much all of this, the past catchers, the offensive line, the play calling, it checks enough boxes where you feel like the quarterback is being not set up to fail, even if he's not necessarily being set up to succeed in the way that some people have been painting in this process. I think the,

I had a coach one time, say that everyone's bar for good enough is different. Like this one, I've maybe after saying like last year's Panther squad was kind of good enough to drop Bryce Young in. Now I'm like, my bar has changed. I feel the exact same way.

So now, I'm glad you said that because I feel like that we, I went through the same process. Big lesson. Big lesson learned. And that that's, yeah, with the bear is it feels good enough. Is it good?

Uh, but it feels good enough because maybe my bar has raised a little bit. Maybe, you know, I know what you're saying with the Eber Flus and everything. I do like him as a coach. I'm not in these meetings. I don't know any of this stuff.

But from our outsider's perspective and all that, but this is the other kind of maybe pro of this, say, in a post-Ebrofoosh world, probably a lot of offensive coaches that would really like Chicago and really keep in certain. I don't want to do that. That's the thing that worries me

is that if you are in that position again, now we got two offensive play callers in two years, and now you're starting the same sort of bullshit cycles that you've done forever. And even if I don't think that's going to happen, I still, it's still hard to totally block it out of your mind when you look at the results over the last two years and then deciding to bring him back. So overall, if you look at every single aspect of this and you paint the full picture, there is so much reason for optimism. But I've tried to pump the brakes a little bit and not be quite as far, quite as full steam ahead as some people have been.

I just need to keep with the energy up the entire, I know you will, but the entire draft show, because that's a high peak to start with. and then you'll peek back again at nine or higher or lower. And then just got to keep that up there. Well, it depends on how it's going to go at nine. Because there's a chance I'm just completely deflated from like picks nine through 16 and then I got to work myself back up. No, I'm a professional. I'll be okay.

No matter what happens, I'll be okay. All right, let's finish this up here with the Carolina Panthers who are picking 33, who we have not talked much about at all because they obviously are not picking in the first round. When you were looking at the Panthers' needs heading into this draft, where did you start? This was not as clear cut for me as I might have expected it to be when I was starting the process. Well, this also, by the way, completes our Memento mock draft thing that we did, Mock Situation thing, because we're starting back at 33. So if you listen to the first episode or if you just do this in reverse order, it makes sense.

It's just like a Memento. So I mean, I feel like I was with everyone else here and thinking to receiver would be the obvious one, and especially where they're slotted. They can be, there's some interesting guys. that they could take. But actually leads to a conundrum. I'll explain more in a sec about that. But, I mean, to me, they're a team that's, they shouldn't stop them from adding anywhere.

If they, if they like a guy, just take them, especially at defense, I mean, any spot. I really, I mean, they just moved off from Brian Burns. Who else are you building around on defense? So, you know, to me, it's just wherever they need a spot, wherever they think they need a spot, or need a guy, I should say, yeah, just take them because they're in a BPA spot, even if they are leaning maybe to receiver.

I know they're not leaning to guard. I know they do what I'd be taking. That's the one spot they probably don't need anybody. Yeah, guard is taken off the list. I will take off that position. And tackle probably two. You know, they drafted Ikea Kuanu in the top 10 two years ago. They paid Taylor Moten.

So, I mean, that's probably a spot where they feel decent. And then on defense, even if they've done a decent job of filling a lot of needs in free agency, just guys that can play right now, I think they're very much in a position where you haven't signed anyone at any spot that should preclude you from trying to upgrade. You know, they signed Dane Jackson do a two-year deal of a corner. It's like, oh, well, if there's a corner that you feel good about building through for the future, you can pick a corner. Even if you signed Jadvian Clowney and DJ Wanam and Free Agency, if you want to go

get an edge, you can still go get an edge. The spots, I would say, are maybe most glaring. Tight end. You know, with Tommy Trembled, they moved on from Hayden Hearst after last year. So tight end, I think, is in there. And Trebles is like a move guy, like a jester guy. Tommy Trimble, but he's not like an in-line tight end. He's not a Y. Somewhere along the way, it's probably worth chasing one of those guys. I think that

receiver, even after the Deontay Johnson thing, is still worth bringing up. You know, Adam Thielen is old at this point. They probably need the juice there. The pause before the old just killed me there. I was trying to figure out the right descriptor. And I think old is correct. Like, he's going to be 34, I think, this season. Yeah. Sorry, that's just really funny. Oh, I should say on defense, Derek Brown is a very, very, very good player. So they do have somebody there are building around there. They just paid him and they paid Aishon Robinson in free agency. So right now, if they were going into the season right now and they're starting four in subpackaged situations on the defensive line was,

Chedebion, Gawain, J. Wannam, Aishon Robinson, and Derek Brown, you can live with that. And that's kind of how I feel with a lot of areas of their roster. It's like if they had to go into the season with the guys they currently have right now, they could survive, even if they would be an underwhelming team, but they need upgrades at a lot of these spots. They need difference makers

at a lot of these spots. The problem is when you're picking 33 and 39, it's not the easiest spot to find a difference maker. No, and they got to nail them. I mean, I mean,

they really do. They cannot waste these. Like, even Jonathan Mingo last year was a project-y type receiver. Like, he was basically a tight end off, you know, F-back, uh,

at H-back in college. So, like, they need guys that can not only grow with but contribute because you know we got to get going here we're in your two bryce young hey we got get guys he can grow with too so that's where i like if they take a receiver that's why i like me and 500 million other people have said lad macaque for them early in the second round i would love that if they did go receiver if they need a guy that's reliable but also has juice and hopefully size but again we're picking at 33 those the guys i just described are all going top 10 uh so that again

you're getting into that situation. What do they exactly need? They need some speed, though. I will say that. If they don't have speed, they need size. Maybe someone that Bryce Young can really trust on a third down. Hey,

I'm going to pin it on this guy. I really think Bryce Young needs that type of body that he can really pin it on a guy. Who's that at 33? That, that I don't know. I really don't know as far as, as that Troy Franklin. That's way too rich,

I think, for him. And he's 175. So again, this A.D. Mitchell falls to them. Fantastic. So just talking about talking it out, where I'm now kind of getting struggle and maybe guys that fit the ideal role that they need.

You think we're thinking about trading up with those two second round picks? Or you think they're lacking draft capital too much to think about that? It depends what guy's there. Like say A.D. Mitchell's there. You know, in like the mid-20s or something like that, I would think he's worth it.

But if he's not there, there's not really a guy to move up for. Just in my head, who's a consensus top four, top five guys. And I think you're, I'm with you on that. I think I also really like A.D. Mitchell after watching him. So I could totally understand that. But this is, again, they only have that extra second because they traded away Brian Burns. It's nice to have the extra second, but it's also nice to have superstar pass rushers. It's like, you have a Robin Peter to pay Paul there a little bit. Yeah. Yeah, we train him away for a mystery box. Hopefully that mystery box turns into Brian Burns.

And I understand why they did that. But again, the only reason you have the 39th pick is because you just traded away a guy who was worth the 39th pick. The other spot that I would throw out there, just because both of the starters right now are going to be free agents after this season, safety. Do they sign Jordan Fuller to one year deal? Xavier Woods is going to be 30. So there's still a decent amount of needs lining this roster,

even if they've done a good job of plugging some holes in free agency. Yeah, they did. Yeah, they kind of, the guard, every time I look at their guards, I crack out because they are just truly like, never again. Like, that's what they went into this off season. I know what they spent a premium on some of these guys. But they're still like, going to get the guards.

Like, all right, even if you paid the sticker price to get those guys, having a 5-10 quarterback, spending on guards make total sense, right? Like you see the vision, even if it's an expensive vision. Signing the Ash Diamond to be your swing tackle in a pinch. If we are not going to let the offensive line be a problem, even if we have to overcompensate, we are not going to let the offensive line be a problem. The Deontze Johnson trade. Even if Deonti Johnson has elements of.

his game that leave you wanting a little bit more. He is a separator. And that is the one thing that the guys on this offense could not do last year. So everything they did, it makes sense on the offensive side of the ball. On the defensive side of the ball, everything they did was sign guys that have played for a Giro Everardot before. Oh, I know. That was very funny. But it was. I do like the fuller signing. But like you're saying, they got, they found some answers of free agency that aren't expensive. But they found guys that are decent players. I like Yash, Josh Diamond, a lot. I think he should be starting in this league at left tackle. But the Jordan Fuller one is a great example.

He's one of those that's like, like you just said, has experience in this defense, which I usually hate, but I like Jordan Fuller. So it's one of those where it's like, yeah, perfect. They also signed Nick Scott, which I thought was funny, and they signed Josie Jewel, who played for Joe Everro in Denver. So we've got a lot of former Everett players that are now joining him in Carolina. But we'll see what happens.

It's nice to have that extra second round pick, even if it did, you know, cost them Brian Burns to end up getting it. All right. That's all we got. That is our Memento-esque run-through from the NFL mock draft scenarios here from picks 32 through 1 and then back to 33. So you can go back and listen to any of these. These are going to hold here for the next week or so. So if you missed any of the other shows about the picks in the first round, encourage you go check them out here in the 10 days we've got between now and the kickoff of the NFL draft. Quick reminder, the draft next Thursday and Friday. We will be coming to you live from Detroit. Every single pick we will be reacting to on Thursday and Friday night live on YouTube. Me, mate, Dane, some guests, some fun bells and whistles. So please be on the lookout for that. For now, that is all we've got.

We'll be back with Dane on Thursday. Until then, I appreciate you guys listening. We'll talk to you soon. This was the Athletic Football Show.