The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - NFL Week 8 recap: Never underestimate an NFL Sunday

Episode Date: October 28, 2024

Alright, we'll admit it. We hand waved this week's slate back on our Week 8 preview episode. And then the league delivered one of the craziest days of the season. From the Browns upset of the Ravens, to Washington's walk-off Hail Mary against the Bears, Week 8 came through for us in a big way. Robert Mays and Derrik Klassen recap the week on this episode of The Athletic Football Show.RundownBears-Commanders sillinessThe Philadelphia Eagles...You Have My AttentionTime for a Bengals post-mortem?The Buffalo Bills...You Have My AttentionThe Atlanta Falcons...You Have My AttentionThe first place Cardinals...You Have My AttentionAre the Dolphins done?The New York Jets...WTF?!?The Baltimore Ravens...WTF?!?Anthony Richardson...WTF?!?Did You See That?!?What Did We Learn Today?Host: Robert MaysCo-Host: Derrik KlassenExecutive Producer: Michael BellerProducer: Michael BellerSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTubeFollow Robert on X: @robertmaysFollow Derrik on X: @QBKlassTheme song: HauntedWritten by Dylan Slocum, Trevor Dietrich, Ruben Duarte, Kyle McAulay, and Meredith VanWoert / Performed by Spanish Love SongsCourtesy of Pure Noise / By arrangement with Bank Robber Music, LLC Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to the Athletic Football Show, brought to you by Thursday Night Football only on Prime Video. I'm Robert Mays. What a week in the NFL. I feel really bad about me not believing in this slate of games heading into the weekend because it was probably the most fun NFL Sunday that we've had all year. We kicked off this week, me and Derek Classen talking about a wild game in Washington, a heartbreaking loss for the Bears. But a game they probably didn't deserve to win anyway. Talked about the Eagles, big win over the Bengals. the Eagles grabbing our attention, the passing offense looking as good as it's looked all season. The first place Cardinals in the NFC West chatted about their big win over the Miami Dolphins. Discussed the Bills shalacking the Seattle Seahawks in a big win for Buffalo. Chated about a weird game for the Jets and what that means for their season.

Discussed a bizarre Ravens loss to a Browns team that I think most people had left for dead for a good chunk of this year. And a few more things from a wonderful. week eight in the NFL. Let's get to all of that with Derek. Derek, that was one heck of a week eight slate. How are you doing, man? As good as ever. I mean, what a slate. I feel like from start to finish. What a day. What a day. Literally from like 10 a.m. kickoff until, I mean, you know, the Sunday night game wasn't great, but really up until that, it was about as action pack as it could get. My goodness, the end of that noon slate. It's noon for me. It's 10 a.m. For you. Every single game seemed like it was close. I mean, the game that was, you could argue,

It was the best game in that early slate was Eagles, Bengles, and that was one of the only blowouts that we got on the entire day. Everything else came down to the wire. We got last second field goals. We've got interesting storylines all over the place. So I would like to apologize to the tone that we took to this slate of games because this is one of those I wasn't familiar with your game sort of moments for week eight in the NFL, despite all the bad games, quote, unquote, we thought we were getting. And yeah, it's funny.

Like you just mentioned, one of the games we thought was going to be. really good was going to be Eagles Bengals, and it was one of the only duds. And almost every other game on the slate was just an absolute, just insanity. Even the Lions blowout, like, it's not an interesting or good game, but the way that everything unfolded was insane and worth like looking at. We'll dig into that a little bit. Just, I want to get out in front of this because I just assume that everyone who listens to the show is listened to the show before, but I know that's not always true. So the way that we handle these Sunday night shows, we're not going to talk about every game and we are not going to talk about every game for the same amount of time. For example, for example,

example, we are not going to really talk about the Sunday night game. Unless the Sunday night game is the game of the week, typically we save that for a little bit later in the week. So if you're looking for Cowboys-Niners conversations, that'll be coming later in the week on this podcast. But we are going to hit a majority of the games today because, like we mentioned, something interesting happened in almost every single one of the games on the slate. Let's start the only place we really can't start. And that is with the ending of that game and the silliness of that game with the Bears and Washington. I'm fine. Like I assume some people think I'm going to have to pick myself off of the floor to do this game.

I think in my heart I knew the Bears probably didn't deserve to win that game anyway. So that ending was a little bit more fitting than it typically would be to have your heart ripped out on a Hail Mary. But there was still like 10 weird ass plays in the second half of this game that we'll get to. But as an impartial observer, somebody who does not have an emotionally vested interest in the outcome of that game, where would you start with kind of your big picture takeaways? I mean, I almost kind of think you just have to like reverse engineer. Like, I feel like doing start to finish for this game doesn't really make a whole lot of sense because the early, like, you know, the first three quarters weren't all that interesting. But you go to the very end where the bears completely botch their Hail Mary situation. First of all, you have Tyreek Stevenson who is like yelling at fans in the stand before the Hail Mary.

Like halfway through the play, he realizes the ball has finally been snapped. So he finally gets over there and does his thing. And then the ball lands, like Jane Daniel slows the ball, probably two or three yards short of the goal line, right? But every bear's defender runs up to get to it and it gets tipped over, and Noah Brown gets to it. So you have that as the ending. And then before that, you have Caleb Williams going crazy in the fourth quarter after being useless for three quarters. So you got like the whole span of Bears quarterback to them in the sense of like the first three quarters. It felt like Rex Grossman was playing quarterback.

And then at the end, you get, oh, this is the promised man. And then you get it taken away by the dumbest Hail Mary possible. Yeah, the way they played the Hail Mary and just everything that led up to that moment obviously is a disaster. And losing that way with a tipped ball where you're supposed to have somebody back there in case there is a tipped ball, they played it poorly. And you can make an argument that they played the previous play poorly. By giving up that kind of 10 to 15 yard completion on the left sideline, they put Washington in a position to even throw that Hell Mary. So lack of game execution, certainly wanting for the Bears. But most of their performance in this game was wanting.

It just happened to be on the offensive side of the ball for 95%. of it where the defense actually held up its end of the bargain. And then the most important moment of the game, the deciding moment of the game, that's the moment where the defense decides to let everybody down after keeping them in this thing for, again, 95% of regulation. It was absolutely ridiculous. And they played the Washington commander's offense the exact way you have to. They did a really good job stopping the run. Like the Washington did not run the ball that well outside of, again, again, Jane Daniels is going to get two or three a game where he just does something crazy. he had a third and eight conversion that was just like, I don't know if anyone but Lamar probably

capitalizes on that situation. So he can just do that. But other than that, like, his ability to know when to take off when he's being pressured in the pocket and when to pull the rip cord, that's a real skill. And it is infuriating when your team is playing against him because it seems like he has a sense for that every single time. And the thing I'll add to that, he always, I think from day one in the NFL has had a good sense of when to just pull the ripcord and go. I feel like you kind of saw in this game, too. He continues to get better at knowing how to keep his eyes up. And there are still situations where you got to go run. But he made a number of place in this game outside the pocket where he was able to keep his eyes up and make it throw.

And just his development in that sense has been really good. And it was really one of the only reasons they were able to stay in the game. That and then a couple of, you know, Terry McLaren beats Tyrick Stevenson on a double move. But on a down-to-down basis, the Bears did a really, really good job defensively. I totally agree with that. And the last thing about Jaden Daniels' game that stuck out to me today that I don't think we've really talked about in much detail. I think he does such a great job of finding throwing windows when there's a lot of traffic. It's not anything crazy, but his ability to throw the ball between two people, like offensive linemen standing in front of him, or just lowering his arm ankle just a little bit to throw it

around someone. It's nothing flashy, but I think it allows him to operate in condensed spaces. And that was something that coming into the league, it's like, what's going to happen when things are a little bit dirty around him. And I still don't think he does a lot of like sliding up in the pocket and making throws after resetting. But there are skills he's bringing to the table, whether it's knowing when to scramble and being devastating as a scrambler or being able to change that arm slot just enough

as things get crowded where he's able to survive even when things aren't super clean. So just another game, even if they weren't able to finish off touchdowns over the course of this game, that I leave still being very impressed with where this guy is. Yeah, and I think that's a really good point about like he doesn't always do some of the, you know, sliding around and finding little crevices in the pocket the way that, you know, actually I think despite all the numbers, Caleb did a really good job of that today. But it feels like when Daniels knows where the ball needs to go, he actually does do a really good job of like as soon as he knows where it needs to go. Just somehow finds a weird little crevice to get the ball out. It's pretty impressive. Somehow, we talked for like six minutes without mentioning the fact that the Bears had a chance to take the lead in this game after not being able to move the ball offensively.

for the entire game, and they decided to hand the ball to a backup offensive lineman on the one-yard line. It's insane. Like, it's just, it's absolutely insane. The thought to arrive at that moment, if you are Shane Waldron, with the game on the line, to say, I'm going to hand the ball to a backup offensive lineman with a game in the balance right now from the one-yard line is unhinged from reality. I just cannot imagine landing in that place when a run to your running back or a quarterback sneak probably gets you into the end zone.

I think Tony Romo immediately upon that handoff happening says, oh yeah, remember refrigerator Perry got the ball in the Super Bowl? The score was 36 to 3 when they handed him the ball. All the times that Ben Johnson has tried to have his offensive linemen score touchdowns, almost exclusively, the game is completely out of hand when he's doing that shit. To hand the ball to an offensive lineman with a chance to take the lead in the fourth quarter, again, is completely detached from reality. I cannot believe that it happened. And to me, it's like if you want to do something weird on the goal line like that, there might be an element of, oh, we don't trust our offensive line.

Okay, but like handing the ball to another offensive lineman behind that offensive line doesn't solve the problem. Like, it just doesn't make any logical sense. The fact that the Bears were even in this game is an absolute miracle, because the offense looked. not functional for most of this game. And I'll, you say that Caleb, I understand where you're coming from. When you're saying that Caleb did a decent job of sliding around in the pocket. And I do think that some of the plays he made outside of structure in the second half were really impressive.

Him progressing all the way back to commit for that completion is a really nice play. Him sliding in the pocket and finding a Dune's A on that third and 10. That's a really nice play. The ball he completes to DJ Moore on that corner out on the left sideline. That's a really nice play. The play way out of structure. or we have to throw back across his body to Keenan Allen. This is all very good stuff.

But I don't think that you can just wash away how completely frantic and erratic he looked in the pocket for a huge majority of this game. Part of that is losing your left tackle at some point and the offensive coordinator for whatever reason doing absolutely nothing to account for that for most of this game. But part of it is just that I think that there were a lot of stretches in this game where it felt like the moment was a little bit too big for this offense

and that he was very, very unsettled. And I think we're still in the part of his career where that's going to happen, right? We're like, what? We're eight weeks in, and all the damage that they did over the last three weeks, the last three games that we saw them play was against the worst defenses in the league. But there were still some moments from today that really, I think, remind you of how far him and this offense still has to go when they're playing against a defense that has a pulse. I don't think I necessarily disagree with that.

there are definitely moments, and it feels like it'll go on for like an entire drive where he just is a little bit rattled and like a little bit just his decision making his little off. He's like spinning around in the pocket. Yes, but the moment where he slides a yard short of the first out marker because he has no idea where he is, that feels indicative of what this game was for the bear's offense for like three quarters. There's definitely some of that. I think I still came away relatively impressed by it because he was pressured, according to true media, on 61.3% of his dropbacks. He only took two sacks and didn't have any turnovers, which like, again, he failed to capitalize on a lot of those plays, and he had three or four miss balls. And then there was a

miscommunication to a dunzee where he's supposed to run a slot fade, but he takes it inside, and that's a miss. He tried to hit Keenan Allen on like kind of a stop back shoulder on like a third and seven inside his own red zone. Alan kind of stops a little bit too late. That's a really tough throw. I don't understand why you're asking him to make that throw on that play and there's not a better answer. Right. I think it's that play in particular, that throw to Keenan Allen, it's off fast motion showing it immediately. That to me feels like a product of being pressured all day and thinking you needed a quick answer.

And on that place specifically, he actually had time and probably could have gotten to something else. But when you're sped up all day, those are the types of decisions and the types of forcing it that begins to happen. Right. And so I don't disagree that he left some yards on the field because of that. I just still kind of came away relatively impressed that he didn't end up getting sacked seven times and have two turnovers.

This could have been a total blowout game where he just completely nuked the offense and didn't let them play football. He at least let the defense keep them in the game and then kind of came alive in the fourth quarter. Yeah, I think my takeaways from this are, again, Washington's offense, they moved the ball fairly efficiently today against a very good defense. They just couldn't finish it off with touchdowns. I think this offense is going to continue to be a problem for most of this season. And again, I just think that the bears still have a decent way to go. They had a lot of problems with simulated pressures today. Washington was doing a lot where they would bring four and they would drop somebody out.

He was actually pressured more when Washington brought four than he wasn't Washington blitzed in this game because of all the funky simulated stuff that they were doing. So this offensive line even went healthy and that group isn't healthy. Tvin Jenkins was out for a chunk of the game. They lose Braxton Jones in the middle of the game. This is still a group that is going to struggle against teams that have a really good pressure plan and have players up front that can make it hard on you. And that's exactly what Washington is. So I think the Bears will still probably be one of those teams that hangs around in the NFC. But I think this was a day that even if they technically lose it on a hell Mary, they got drastically outplayed.

I think that we saw the gap between them and teams that are kind of the class teams in the NFC right now. Yeah, they were the worst team today. And I don't think this is like I feel worse about them making the playoffs. It's just like I might feel like 10% worse about like what happens if they get there. And obviously they have a tough road. I also think it's going to be tougher to make the playoffs. Yeah, it's a tough road. This team that we saw today, I think that they have a long road to the postseason.

It absolutely could happen. But I think that their climb is a little bit tougher than some of the other teams that we're going to talk about and some of the other teams that they're going to be competing against in the NFC. I think that's fair. All right. Let's get to the things that grabbed our attention today. It's time for you by attention. General, you had my curiosity. Now you have my attention.

Each week, especially daily today. It seems like there's 100,000 things going on. We like to pick out a couple games. a couple performances that really grabbed us by the shirt collar over the course of an NFL Sunday. And let's start with the Philadelphia Eagles absolutely dropping the boom on the Cincinnati Bengals. 3717. An Eagles passing game that I think both of us had some reservations about coming into this game. The last couple of performances, even in wins against the Giants, it just seems like they really hadn't found their footing in how they wanted to throw the ball.

A much better day from Jalen Hertz, a much better day from this passing game overall. So Philadelphia Eagles now sitting at 5 and 2, firmly in the playoff mix in the NFC. You guys comfortably have my attention. You do. And like the Bengals right now, I know their record is weird, but they still feel like a team like, you got a beat to kind of prove that you are legitimate. And I think we'll talk about that. I kind of believe that.

We'll talk about that. And to me, it was like the fact that the Eagles could come out and have a three score win against them. I was like, okay. And to me, you know, you mentioned Jalen Hurts in the passing offense. Jalen Hertz was straight up good today. This was the best game that he's played all season. Like no qualifiers, I'm usually a guy who has some degree of criticism for Hertz.

I think he was just straight up good today. He was playing really fast. As a runner, I thought he looked really good. He had more pep in his step than I think I've been used to. I'm so glad that you say that because the first time, the play where it really stuck out to me is they run a quarterback draw in the red zone. I think I'm one of their first couple possessions. And the acceleration on that play, I mean, this feels like 20,

21 like Jalen Hertz carrying the ball. And obviously he scores a rushing touchdown later in the game. But I thought he had a lot more bursts and a lot more explosiveness pretty much every single time the ball ended up in his hands. And that's a good sign for this offense moving forward because that hasn't always been the case over the last couple years. No, it really hasn't. We've seen even this year, like a lot of their zone read stuff has just been dead in

the water because he tries to get to the perimeter and he just can't get all the way there. And I thought in this game, both as a scramble and as a design runner, he did a bunch of better job in that. And then as a passer, I thought he did really well. He actually had a couple of really nice throws over the middle of the field. That post he threw to Devontas Smith in the back of the end zone. Jesus, man, like that is such a beautiful ball.

And Devonta Smith, it's a great ball. It's the only location for that ball to beat. It's still a very hard ball for Devonta Smith to track over his shoulder and go up and attack that ball. It's unbelievable. And I'm always baffled that a guy who is like probably generously like 170 pounds just consistently goes up and makes those catches. He blows my mind. He's like a one-of-one in terms of body type and what his actual skill set is. It's incredible. I'm not trying to take away anything that the Eagles did from this game, but I just want to try to put what we saw from J-1 Hertz in proper context. And I think that

when you compare this game to like last time we saw them against the Giants, one of the things we talked about on the preview show is when they don't have good pass protection, he looks like a different player because he's making really fast decisions. It's a lot of go balls. It's a lot of throws outside of the numbers because he doesn't have time to progress in the way that he progresses. He's not always moving as fast as some of these other quarterbacks. So when you're speeding him up in the pocket, things are short-circuiting because there's even less of a chance that he's going to get from two to three on certain plays. That was not a problem today because the Cincinnati Bengals have an absolutely disgusting

pass rush. It is so bad that I can't even come to terms with it. And there's one guy that really makes a difference for them. and that was Trey Hendrickson. And I thought that Fred Johnson, the Eagles backup left tackle who's in there for Jordan Milata, had a really nice day against Trey Hendrickson. When he was even in one-on-one situations, I thought he stonewalled him consistently. And so if you're going to win that matchup with a backup left tackle against Hendrickson,

you're going to win all the other ones against the rest of this Bengals offensive line. And that's what happened today. Hertz was pressured on like 17% of his dropbacks. And they went to town because this Bengals defense is actively bad. but that's what you want to see from this Eagles team. I want to see this passing game in this offense pick on bad defenses if this team is going to be relevant in the back half of the season and into the playoffs. And this was a good entry on their way to that.

That is such perfect framing because, yes, the Spangles defense, they'll give you some freebies and they're not going to get a lot of pressure on you. But I still didn't have. They're awful. I didn't have much faith that the Eagles passing offense specifically could beat up on an awful defense. And this at least checks that box, which again, I don't know what that really. means for like December football, January football, but for now and to getting to that point,

that does matter. And it was a nice little sign for them. There's two throws to AJ Brown I want to talk about. The first one was on the first drive where he progresses all the way back to it and it's a huge chunk coming back from right to left over the middle of the field. And then there was another one. It was a deep curl on third and 16 that he gets all the way back to and he fires it in in space. Those are the sorts of plays that you want to see consistently from him. Because those guys are going to be able to make the 50-50 ball. That touchdown from Devante Smith, that's going to be there over the course of the season. But can we see him making more plays on schedule within the rhythm of the offense at every area of the field?

And I think the answer today was very much yes. If he could make three throws like that a game. That's it. That's all it has to be. And there have been games this year where he didn't make any of them. And you could see how much of a strain that put on the offense. But again, like you just mentioned, two or three of those throws a game, I think it goes such a long way. The other thing I want to add really quickly about the Eagles, it is so damn cool seeing Seekwon Barkley on like a legitimate good winning football team. It truly fills my heart with joy. It's the same feeling I get with Derek Henry being on the Ravens. It's a joy. I want to talk about the defenses for a quick second. Cooper DeGine made two really nice plays in this game. He had a second and seven PBU on Yosha Vos that was just really well done from the slot. And then there was a fourth and one where they tried to they tried to play with him in man cover.

So they had Jamar Chase going on like a little bit of a yo-yo motion on fourth and one. And Dijin was on him in man coverage. They sent Chase back into this flat on the right side. They tried to pitch him the ball in space. And Dijin makes the play on fourth and one for a TFL that short circuits that drive. And that was the second half in this game for the Bengals. That fourth and one was a three-play drive or four plays. They turned the ball over.

And then the next drive, I believe it was either on the first or second player or the drive, Burrow tries to take a go ball shot down the right sideline, which you should do when you get single high coverage and you have Jamar Chase on your team. Isaiah Rogers makes a beautiful play to tip the ball and C.J. Gardner Johnson's standing right there for an interception. So we got like six plays from the Bengals in what seemed like 45 minutes of real time. And that's where the Eagles just ran away with this thing. I'm so glad you bring up Cooper DeGine. He's kind of like the embodiment of it feels a little bit like the Eagles defense is starting. to like gel and understand what it's supposed to be. Obviously, you bring in Dijin, he can kind of,

you know, play all over the place, run and pass. He's a really good player. Mitchell has been good all year on the outside as a corner. The front, I think, is playing a little bit better. Like, Nicobi Dean is playing a little bit faster, more comfortable. Zach Bond has been really good all season. Like, it just feels like, I still am not 100% sure what I think the ceiling for this defense is. But I felt like over the first three weeks, I was like, man, I just don't know if they're going to be good enough. But now they're getting some of their players back. Some of their younger guys are really getting more comfortable. There's a little bit of, of something here. I mean, Vic Vancio knows what he's doing.

It all feels like it's coming together in a way. And there was a play, I was in the first half, and it was right after the Dijin PbU. And they brought a pressure off the left side and Burrow lets it rip really quickly on a third and seven. And Blankenship is just coming downhill so hard to make the hit for the PbU because he knows the ball has to come out because they're sending a pressure to that side. And watching that convergence between Russian Cubs. coverage, that's when you feel a defense really starting to find itself. And so you'd hope that now they have the players they want out there, they have a little bit more time in the system.

There's a requisite amount of talent on that side for this to be a decent unit. And when you combine that with what they have on offense, it's a compelling team. If they can kind of find their footing, there's enough here to be intriguing in the back half in an NFC that does feel pretty wide open when you consider what the Niners look like and pretty much what every team on that second tier looks like outside of Detroit. Yeah, I think that's a really good point. All right, let's get to our next one here. The Buffalo Bills absolutely throttle.

Actually, you know what? Sorry, I'm not ready to move on yet. Oh. Is this time for like Bengals post-mortem? The Bengals are two and five. Yeah, they are not good. I mean, like you meant, the defense is like... Three and five, excuse me.

The Bengals are three and five. This defense is comfortably bottom. five. And I think this was another game where the Bengals offense, like, it just, it doesn't feel very real. There was, there's too much on Joe Burrow specifically as like a pure gun pastor. And you know, he made a handful of really good plays in this game, especially in the first half, he was bawling. It's just at a certain point when all you have is Joe Burrow, can you throw to your two best guys and can we just push it down the field and do that stuff? It's hard to live that way. They had an 11.8% rushing success rate today. They still can't get under center very much. And they still don't really

generate explosives outside of like maybe one time Chase Brown will get to the perimeter, or maybe one time Jamar Chase will do something absolutely bonkers. Like it's just, it's hard to live this way. The Bengals are three and five. There are six teams right now in the AFC that are at least two games ahead of the Bengals. Some of those teams are like the Broncos, you know, I mean, the Broncos, the Broncos win again today. They pick on a Panthers team.

Full disclosure, we're not going to talk about the Broncos Panthers game. so if you're looking for discussion about that, hopefully we're talking rookie quarterbacks later in the week. We will have a bow next conversation. So the teams ahead of them aren't world beaters by any stretch. I mean, there is a path where you could say, you know, they're still two games back. They're so talented offensively.

Like maybe they could still claw their way back into this thing. I'm done with that. I'm done with that sort of rationalization about what this team is capable of considering the state of the defense. And if this really is over, if we're in a spot where this team might not even make the playoffs, let alone be the sort of contender that people expected them to be coming into the season if they were going to be healthy, where is this team? T. Higgins is a free agent after the season.

We saw what the offense looked like when he doesn't play. There's a chance that they just move into a post-T. Higgins world in perpetuity after the year. And the defense is an absolute mess. The defense needs a complete overhaul. and you're not necessarily going to be in a position to spend a ton of money to bring in players to do that because now everyone that used to be cheap when you could do that the first time is extremely expensive. So I just don't know what the next year or two for this team looks like, and I think it's them clawing back to more like legitimacy and relevance than it is to contender status.

And that's just a really brutal place to be if you were a Bengals fan, considering the hopes that you had dating back two or three years ago when you thought that the line on the graph was just going to go up for the next 10 years. They probably need a look in the mirror type of offseason and 2025. You know, I probably came into the year team Patee Higgins and I'm probably still there, but it's very contingent on like, I thought this team would be able to put up 35 points a game and they would be five and three at this point instead of three and five. And it would be like, okay, you can still convince me that this is a worthwhile way to build a team. even if everything you've done on defense where all the vets that you paid like four years ago

and like built the defense that way, they're all old now or gone. And then all the rookies that you drafted to be part of this team are really haven't actualized into good players. So they're in a weird spot on that side of the ball. That's the biggest problem. Haven't actualized it to good players is kind. Aren't contributors in almost any way, shape, or form on defense is closer to the truth. Yeah, I mean, I can't really think of a serious contributor who is like a rookie contract

player right now for them. Can't celebrate it. It's like a starting corner for that. And even he's gotten benched at times this year. Exactly. And like even he has not been a very consistent player for them. He's a corner and his probably one of his best traits is that he will hit and tackle you, which is like it's an admirable trait and I love it.

But there's some more things you would like to check off the boxes first for a cornerback. Yeah, the Bengals are just firmly off the benefit of the doubt list until further notice. Like that's where I sit with this team because they haven't earned it and they haven't even, I don't think, begun to earn it. Now we can move on. Okay. The Buffalo Bills throttle. the Seattle Seahawks today, 31 to 10.

This was an ass kicking in a game that, again, we framed as the game of the week because nothing else really seemed to rise to that level. The other one you probably could have made a case for, obviously Bears Washington was a whole different thing because we didn't know if Jane Daniels was playing. The other one you could have made a case for was Bengals Eagles, and that was also a blowout. But the bills really take care of business in this game. So going on the road and doing that to, at the very least, a solid Seattle

Seahawks team. The Bills, you guys have my attention firmly. I'm glad you said that this was a the Bills bullied them. To me, I felt like, and I'm just doing propaganda for a player I like, Keon Coleman, like embodied what the Bills did to the Seahawks today. First of all, he has, I think the first touchdown of the game where they throw two fade balls to him. First, he doesn't, he's not able to get it on woolen. And then the second one, he like, almost does the David Tyree, like on his helmet, like one-handed catch. Yeah, it was incredible. And so he, he kind of, he dunks on woolen that way. And then later in the game, Coleman has a block where he instantly shoves the cornerback to the ground and then mid play just like stands over him and points at him and laughs.

And like, that's what the whole game felt like is the bill's just shoving a guy to the ground and pointing at them and laughing and saying, yep, we're better. We're the class of our conference and you're not. They were physically dominant for a good chunk of this game. And we'll get into why the score looks like it looks. It was a very weird game on some levels. But I think that the Bill's ability in this game to completely assert themselves and how they wanted to play was evident from pretty much the first snap. They had a 61% rushing success rate on running back runs in this game, and Alan was pressured on 19% of his dropbacks.

We talked about in the previous show how this Bill's offensive line hadn't really been the sort of group that we'd seen for stretches of last season and when they've been at their best. They were on that level today. They played absolutely excellent. There were probably, there was a double team from every collection of Bill's offensive linemen that leapt off the screen in this game. Like there was one on the first touchdown drive, I want to say, where it was Torrance and

Spencer Brown just moving Byron Murphy like four or five yards off the ball. Mitch, I was saying Mitch Morse. He's been a stable. The center and David Edwards, the McGovern and David Edwards, they had one where they just like moved a defense tackle five yards off the ball. Dionne Dawkins and Edwards had one where they just moved the guy five yards off the ball. They were dominating in this game. And one thing that I actually, we don't really, this is more nitty-gritty than we probably need to get into,

but I thought the bill's game plan and some of the levers they knew they could pull was really impressive in this game. They were consistently in some of these two high early down looks. They would send a fast motion to the opposite direction of where they wanted to run the ball because they would pull out the safety to that side. And so then they had six hats for six hats. and they were just dominating every single time they did that. So clearly, and Joe Brady, I thought, did a really good job overall in this game. They clearly saw something where if they were going to do that and yank the safety out,

they knew they were going to be getting these juicy run looks over and over and over again. And man, did they take advantage of them? And we're talking just like 8, 11, 12, 8, 9. That's just how it felt the entire game when they wanted to run the ball. And to me, I mean, obviously, like we both said, this offensive line did step up and felt like they were playing like they were at the end, especially at certain points last year. To me, I also came really, really impressed with James Cook. I felt like every single run got more yards than it should have. If it was blocked for four, he found six. If it was blocked for nine,

he popped it for 15. If it was like a gritty third and one, he somehow got four out of it. Like it's just, he runs, he's not really the biggest back, but he runs incredibly hard. And it's such a, it's such a beautiful marriage behind an offensive line that at their best is going to bully you and put you five yards, you know, beyond the line of scrimmage. And then the guy's spelling. him is Ray Davis who's built like a bowling ball. Like this is just a mean. I love Ray Davis. I'm almost sad that Ray Davis isn't getting more work, but it's because James Cook is so good right now. It's almost like the, it's not to the level of the Falcons, but it's like where they have two legitimately just really good backs. Like James Cook is obviously fantastic and more explosive.

And then Ray Davis is just a bowling ball and a really good passing player. Like they, it's a really, again, they don't have like a true superstar player, but now that they've added to Marie Cooper and these two backs are playing the way that they are. There's just a lot of options here, especially the offensive line, it's going to play at that level. I really loved the game that Kean Coleman had because I think it was an indication of what Kean Coleman is capable of when you use him in a bunch of different ways. And so I just think that asking him to get separation outside of the numbers and be like a boundary X contested catch guy is probably a losing battle. Like it's just really hard to live that way in the NFL, but there's more to him than not. And I think we saw that a little bit today.

They threw a screen to him today. And he gets, you know, 10, 12 yards of yak on that play. He, on an extension, on a play extension thing where Josh Allen escapes outside of the pocket on a scramble drill, he finds Coleman for a huge jump game, which he's done on those. And he's done multiple times this year. And so being able to find explosives that way, because he's still a big downfield target, but that actually creates separation inherently because of how the play unfolds. And then there was another one where this is how I would use him more often.

in the big chunk play he had within structure in this game, he's lined up in the slot. And the scene ball and they line him up in the slot. So it's encouraging to see him contributing in all of these ways. I just think that a faster route to getting the best version of him involves him doing more things than just lining up as an ex-receiver and running a lot of vertical routes outside of the numbers. So to see a few more layers added to that today, I thought was really nice. I totally agree with that. add some more layers, move him around a little bit, give them some yak opportunities. Because like you mentioned, he's not like the best top speed guy, but he's very explosive

within those first two, three steps. And he obviously can bounce people off because he's a big guy. We can save the X jump ball stuff for the red zone, which he's still good at that there. Yeah, if you want to do that and you want to have him pin the ball against his head for a touchdown, that's absolutely fine. But I would do a little bit less of that in other areas of the field. The last note I wanted to talk about with a Bill's offense, and again, just clearly something they thought that they could take advantage of. They came out on the first play of the game, six offensive linemen, heavy set. They throw a chunk that Dawson knocks for a huge game.

So on the season, the bills have 18 dropbacks with six offensive linemen on the field. That is the most in the NFL by far. They have 198 passing yards on those plays. No one else in the league has more than 75 passing yards with six offensive linemen out there. Alan is 11 of 16 for 198 on those plays. 0.61 EPA per dropback, which essentially is three times the best quarterback in the league. Today, four of six for 64 yards.

So they clearly, again, saw if we put those, if we get you and heavy personnel, we know we're going to be able to sling the rock around. They do that more than anybody, but they really, really leaned in that today. And I think they had two or three of those plays taken off the board today with penalties. And so like they were even doing it even more than that. And so, yeah, when you can, when that is to do the six offensive line stuff, you have to have the legitimate threat of a power run game. And so with the way that they were running the ball today,

on top of that, it's just this is the way the bill's offense should look. It's how it's supposed to look. On the other side in this game, what the hell happened to the Seahawks? They just unraveled in such weird ways in this game. And I know it looks like a total blowout. But the three moments that stick out to me. One, you're inside the five or near the goal line. You snap the ball over Gino's head.

That happens once. you get down there again and it's fourth it's fourth and goal from the one yard line gino gets stepped on and you don't get that one so twice you'd come away with three points and two inside the five trips because you cannot get the quarterback the ball from under center and the second one is worse because i think this was off the back of the josh allen interception which it's i think his first interception of the season that he only throws because of marie cooper slips in the pouring rain. So you get this like God's send of a turnover, like down from the heavens.

And then you step on your quarterback on fourth and one. It's like that's just the type of game that the Seahawks played today. Here's the real type of game the Seahawks played today. On top of those, the one other time that the bills almost turn the ball over, Josh Allen gets sacked on a third down and fumbles and kicks the ball forward and the bills recover it for a first down. that was the type of day that the Seahawks had today. And then on top of that, you have a tipped ball interception to a defensive lineman,

which happened in this game. You have several Seahawks defensive players trying to fight each other on the sideline. Did you see that? Yes, I did. Yes, I did. I do remember that. So that happened at some point in this game. And then Gino, with the game like not totally out of reach,

scrambles for 10 yards on like a second and 20, sets them up for what should be like a reasonable thing. third down, and then he throws the ball at a defensive player and gets a taunting penalty. So I thought that they were outmatched in a lot of ways in this game just from the start, and I thought the Bill's offense was phenomenal. But the Seahawks did themselves in no favors over the course of this game with all of the weird bullshit that they did. Yeah, they were outmatched in like a normal sense.

And then, yes, like you said, they continued to do just the weirdest bullshit for the entire game. And Gino Smith, I understand why he was so frustrated, right? Like, you don't have your best receiver. Your offensive line is getting beat to hell. the way that it always does. You have the two weird goal line sequences, but the game is still very, very winnable in that moment when he does that.

And I think he was like wanting a personal foul call because he was hit like maybe a little bit laid out of bounds. And I think he was wanting that. There was some jawing and then he throws it like. But it's just... There's a better way to communicate that. There's a better way. Throwing the ball in a defensive player.

Especially when the game is winnable. Like if you're down 30, I get why you're that pissed off. But in a game that is very much winnable, even if it's very uphill sledding, it's tough. I would say no D.K. Maccalf in this game, which makes things harder, but injuries happen. Teams play without good receivers all the time.

There was a version of the Seahawks offense when they were down 7-0. I think it was their second drive where there were multiple play action completions. Gino's checking the ball down for a chunk to Kenneth Walker. They throw a screen. That was the one that got torpedoed by the bad snap at the goal line. But I still think that there's a version of the Seahawks offense out there where they're manufacturing yardage a little bit more than they typically asked their quarterback to do. I still feel like the degree of difficulty with how often they're dropping back, with how little play action they're using, just makes it really, really hard on the quarterback and the offensive line. And living in the gun the way they do, it's the conversation we've had about the Bengals over the years, is that it's harder to find complimentary ways to lean into play action and find easy completions within the offense when you're sitting in the gun all the time.

But I just feel like we need to see a little bit more tinkering to not make this thing so hard all the time. Gino contributes to that. There are moments where he's taken the hardest throw on the field where he probably doesn't need to. But I think trying to take away that instinct from him as often as possible by design to just take plays off him and the offensive line, that needs to happen more with this team. It definitely does. And I'm going to sound like the old 60-year-old ball coach, but like they just have to find a way to run the ball better. They are running the ball worse than they did last year when they didn't run the ball very well. And like Kenneth Walker will do something incredibly weird.

and he had a play in this game where he is like five yards behind the line of scrimmage to the left side and then sprints all the way to the right side and still gains yard it like he just he will do something weird to either bail you out or get you an explosive but on a down to down basis this is still a really bad offensive line and run game they had a 14.3% offensive offensive rushing success rate today which is obviously like you you just can't play football that way and so I think that contributes to why they've struggled to kind of have a more cohesive offense and like have more of a run pass balance, have more of a gun and under center balance. I think a lot of it still for me stems back to that. I just love watching the way the

bill's defense plays, no matter who's out there. I mean, it can be Baylon Spector, it can be whatever backups we want to talk about. And the play that sticks out to me is even to get to that fourth and one where Gino gets his footstep down, go back and watch that play. Go back and watch the effort that you get from pretty much everybody on that side of the ball. Spector does like a full Superman dive over the line on that play. Rousseau just dumps whoever the tight end was on to that side, which isn't surprising, but it's still fun to watch him do it. And Roussel Douglas had a great tackle, I think, for like no gain in space in this game.

When they put him one-on-one on the perimeter, it's just such a unit where you feel, this is what culture is, right? Like, when I watch the Bills defense, like, that's what people talk about when they're, this, like, these buds words about what we want our team to feel like and what we want our team to play like, it doesn't seem to matter who's out there. And the talent deficiencies have led to some struggles at times this year. But I still feel like no matter what, they're always going to play hard enough to give themselves a chance. And we just need more units like that. And they're always one of them in my mind. I love that. I love that you mentioned the Rassul

Douglas tackle and then saying that this is what culture feels like. Because to me, defensive culture is corners tackling. And like, Taryn Johnson had a number of plays in the backfield as well in this game. Rasul Douglas had a couple. Christian Benford will come up and tackle when he needs to. Like they just, when your guys on the perimeter don't give you any of the easy stuff. And then you're so good at communicating everything else and like taking away the middle of the field. That's how you get to suffocating defense. And the bills, when they're at their best, absolutely play that way.

Even like you said, when they have their third or fourth string lineback on the field. We got a couple more teams that grabbed our attention today. But first, we're going to take a quick break. Let's get to our next one here at the Atlanta Falcons. take sole possession of the NFC South with a 3126 win over the bucks. It wasn't the prettiest thing in the world. You know, they needed a couple turnovers in the second half. I still think Atlanta is not necessarily a complete team and has some defensive deficiencies

that will probably show up in the back half of the season or in the playoffs if they eventually get there. But as it currently stands, the Atlanta Falcons are atop the NFC South. And for that reason, you guys almost by default have my attention. They do. And I think kind of earnestly, the offense actually does have my attention. I really like the offense. They are a straight up good unit. It is, it has become a beautiful combination of, I actually think the coaching is really good. And I've been really impressed by some of the stuff that they do. Their motion usage is kind of unique. Like, they do a lot of stuff where almost all of what they're trying to do with motion is hide whoever the slot player is. So they'll have their guy, like they'll move somebody into the number three and then they'll push them out to the number one really fast. And it's not to get that guy who's in motion. in, it's to hide Drake London being your new slot player or to hide Kyle Pitts being your new slot player. And they do such a cool and interesting job of that. And then you add that on top of the fact

that Kirk is just, he's become one of the best and smartest, just like pure dropback pastors just in terms of knowing where the ball needs to be, hanging in there and making tough throws. And I think that combination has just been incredible. And then you get, I think the piece there is a stance in this game, Kyle Pitts. He was like the one part of this that I was like, I don't know if we're going to get all the way there with him. He was awesome in this game. He broke off on a fourth and three corner route where he gets wide open for Kirk on a touchdown. And then he had another one where a motion again, they're in a two by two pistol look. And Mooney, I think, is the slot player to the left side. They motion him across to the right side at the snap. So it kind of holds the hook

defender to that right side. Kirk just guns a dig route right behind that player to Kyle Pitts. And he's just off to the races for a touchdown. Like the fact that Pitts now is in this, mix, it's a cool offense. I love the point about the motion. That's Rams shit. They do that all the time where they'll just change the number count right before the snap. And it's not the craziest thing in the world, but it consistently gives them advantages when it comes to number counts like, all right, who's one, who's two, who's three. You're screwing with defensive assignments. And it's just creating little

bits of leverage before the snap. They do a really, really good job of that. And that's something that the Rams consistently were doing when Zach Robinson was there last year. I have a weird question for you. Because as I think about this offense, I'm intrigued by the offense. I think that there is a real ceiling to this group. I really like a lot of the things that they're doing, and I think that there is a decent amount of talent if Pitts is going to play this way.

If you had to pick a wide receiver skill set that fits into this group, what would it be? Because I still feel like there is a gear to this that exists when Ray Ray MacLeod is not playing a majority of the snaps. I mean, think about what the best, the absolute best Kyle Shanahan offenses have looked like.

Think about what the best one looked like. literally in Atlanta. You had a vertical X receiver. And look, I love Drake London. He's a fantastic player for so many reasons. Not the fastest guy in the world. He's not really going to take the top off and give that to you. He's more of a you want to throw 10 drift routes to him and hit him over the middle type of player. Whereas I think if you had a true dominant number one outside of the numbers guy, even like to the Brandon Ayuk level, I think that could kind of change. Okay, no. I'm talking about realistically. No, I know. I'm not saying like something they could do over the next two weeks. Oh, then I don't have a good answer for you. I'm

I think in the highest realm, it would be something like getting that type of player. I don't know what else it is because, like, they have speed. Ray Ray MacLeod can move. Donald Mooney is having a career year. And obviously they're not fantastic players. I just don't know like what they would do to upgrade over those two players in those roles. Yeah, it's something I want to think about a little bit more. I wish I had not put you on the spot and myself on the spot by asking this question and had done some prep on it.

But I think it's one of those Oceans thing. What's like, do you think we need one more? I think they need one more. and I'm just curious about what that might look like because another receiving option that's not Rayleigh in the Cloud, I'm interested in that. What they did in this game, just in terms of the guys they picked on,

it was pretty brutal. So the play that you're talking about, the Kyle Pitts fourth and three touchdown, I think Kavon Meriwether is the guy who was in man coverage on him on that play, only snap that Kavon Maryweather played in this game in coverage, was on that fourth and three touchdown of Kyle Pitts. And then they're just,

I can't remember. remember his name. It's like Thunderdirk or something like that. Thunderberg, I believe. Thunderberg. That might be it. Number 24 on the bucks. He's playing. He's a backup corner. And they're just picking on him over and over and over again. On the Mooney play, you see Antoine Woodfield after that as Mooney's crossing into the goal into the end zone, he's just like, what are you doing? Yeah. What is that? And so you, that, Merriweather, and they're just picking on KJ. Brett over the middle of the field over and over and over again. There's nothing wrong with that. If you feel like there are things that you can consistently

go to, that's what a good offense does. And so I really liked them just taking advantage of the weaknesses in that Bucks defense that we know exist. On the flip side, I actually really thought the Bucks offense played well in this game. Without Godwin and Evans, I thought that some of the stuff that they were manufacturing, the ways that they were creating separation for Cade out and throughout this game, some of the screen shit that they were doing. I actually had a lot of respect for their ability to hang in this one for most of it. And then they just got a little too cute as we got into the second half. They tried the, I think if I'm trying to sequence it correctly, pick on a flea flicker that doesn't need to happen.

That was a first in 10. So Baker throws that because, you know, it's one of those. We're calling it. We want the shot. That gets intercepted. They try a fake punt inside their own 40 on a third, on a fourth. and three, that they don't get. And then Baker tries to get a little ambitious on a throw down the left sideline that AJ Terrell picks off. So I think in the aggregate, people are going to look at

Baker's final stat line, see the interceptions and be like, ah, he didn't really play very well. The offense didn't really play very well. I actually left this game more impressed by Liam Cohen and the people in charge of that group than I was coming into the game because of what they were facing heading into this without their top two receivers. I agree. And like the flea flicker, maybe a weird decision to call it. On the other hand, Baker is probably used to that guy being Chris Godwin and being or Mike Evans and being like, yeah, they'll find it. And then obviously when it's, I think it was Scotty Miller, it's like, oh, they're not going to go find it the same way that those guys will. And instead another like all pro player Jesse Bates picks you off. And so that type of stuff happens.

The other one I think is just purely on Baker where he's, AJ Terrell just comes off of like the 10 yard in in front of him. They're trying to run a wheel behind it. He comes off and picks it off. That one I think is on Baker. But like you said, otherwise, I did think the offense, did it really well today. Like Baker was firing in a lot of other throws. Kate Otten had an incredible game. He's got more bounce to him than I thought he did. I'm going to be honest. He's a nice player. We don't really see him get fed because of the other guys they have on this team. But I thought that them featuring him today was not necessarily surprising because

he's probably now your best receiver or your best receiving option with those two guys out. And before we move on, I think it is worth mentioning. If we're talking about the formula for this Falcons team, the offense I think is going to be good. The offense, I think, is probably going to be firmly a top 10 unit over the course of this year. Defense is going to be a work in progress, but you have guys on the back end. You have your AJ Terrells. You have your Jesse Bates's. So this formula of we're going to move the ball really, really well, especially against incomplete defenses.

That's how we'll refer to the bucks. We're going to move the ball really well against defenses that we can pick on. And we've got guys on the back end that can give us one, two turnovers every once in a while and swing this thing back our way. that's not a bad formula. It's exactly who the 2024 falcons should be. Yes, if you can force the shootout and then make them throw at your best players, it's not the best way to win, but it's a way to win. And that might be enough in the NFC South. Yes. Yeah, and that is their way to win right now. Speaking of teams that are in first place in their division, the Arizona Cardinals go to four and four with a 28, 27 win over the

dolphins. This is the team I wanted to see coming into the year. We'll, we'll, talk about the specifics of it, but this version of the Cardinals offense and some of the things that they were trotting out and what this overall looked like against the Miami defense that had actually been playing pretty well. If you look at some of the advanced metrics, like this is a group that had been given some teams problems. And the Cardinals come out and have, I think, pretty definitively, their most impressive performance of the year. Use it to move to 4 and 4.4 is the leader of the NFC. West, but we're giving it to the Cardinals. So the division leading Arizona Cardinals, after your best game of the season.

You guys have my attention. They firmly do. And I think this is a weird team because they're still figuring some stuff out, right? They're very young on offense. It's like it's still a relatively new system given that Kyler Murray didn't really get to play in the offense that much last year. Like he's still only not even a full season into it. So I think they were still trying to figure some things out on that side of the ball.

And to that point, they had a couple of weird games where it was like, oh, maybe this is just going to be a volatile team, roller coaster. They're going to have really good weeks, bad weeks. I think sometimes you forget what the really good weeks can look like. And it looks like this where Marvin Harrison Jr. is completely unlocked. Trey McBride is going for over 100 yards. The run game is not that explosive, but they're getting yards when they needed it. Like, I think they only had three and a half yards of carry, but they were actually relatively efficient because it would be like it's a third and, or it's a second and four and they get three. So they're

still like chugging along and doing what they need to do. And then you get three of those like, holy shit, Kyler Murray plays. And he had, you might have had more than three in this game. He was, he was really, really good today. Trying to look it up right now. So, eh, the run game was not very successful today. James Conner had a 30% rushing success rate on his 20 carries. But it didn't really end up mattering because of how they threw the ball in this game.

And the element offensively that really stuck out to me, and we'll talk about the Kyler plays because they don't win this game without them. But in terms of what we want. want to be and how we want to go after people, I thought that this was a good blueprint in one specific way. This is a team that wants to play in heavy personnel, right? They want to be in 12 personnel. They want to be in 13 personnel. Their 13 personnel is much more dynamic than most teams can trot out because McBride is an actual vertical presence. He can create explosives for you. And even in 12 personnel, you know, he is, if he's your third receiving option, you're in

pretty good shape. This team, Kyler, today, finished 9 of 10 for 119 yards when the dolphins were in base defense. And that's what this team has to be. If they're getting heavy personnel on the field, if you're going to come out there with 4 DBs, this group needs to sling it around the yard. And to this point, that is what they have been as an offense. The Cardinals are number one in the NFL in success rate against base defense this year. And only the bills had a better EPA per dropback. Kyler was nine of 10 for 119 yards on those plays in this game. And you saw that. When they can get that group out there, this offense really does have a lot of explosive potential. And I thought that this is probably the purest expression of that that we've seen this season.

And I think even that big, that first big play, the deep over it's Marvin Harrison Jr. is, I think they catch me in baseball personnel. And he just hits, I think it's like right over the top of Jordan Brooks on a deep over route. And that's where you started to see like, all right, they're maybe going to start to get comfortable in this game. And then I thought over the course of the game, they did a really good job of just adjusting and finding certain ways to get specifically Marvin Harrison Jr. open, but then also Trey McBride. And then I thought Kyler Murray, you know, one of the criticisms I actually had a Kyler Murray coming in. And even at the earlier parts of the season is his quick game can be a little up and down. Some of his blitz replacement stuff can be up and down. He's a little bit more willing to hold the ball and do some crazy stuff. And he had a number of plays in this game where he held the ball and did some crazy stuff. But I actually thought his operation in the quick game was pretty good in this game. And it kind of made up for the run game, like not being that great for them. And so you get the floor there and then you get the ceiling of just him and Marvin Harrison, just making four plays in this game. That's why you draft a guy like that in the top five.

Yeah. And watching him do some damage on runaways in this game was really nice to see. Because, again, somebody that had been mostly outside the numbers, vertical X receiver and hadn't really been productive in some of those looks. I mean, the way that they were using him is the way that you would use like, this is a Matt Harmon term like that sacrificial X that you would throw outside of the numbers and just keep setting him on vertical routes over and over and over again. So seeing him do some damage on some big crossers in this game, that was really nice to see. And then Kyler Murray making those two,

three, four plays that very few guys in the league can make. The first one that Michael Wilson touchdown, where Jalen Ramsey comes completely unblocked, he manages to make him miss in the pocket, creates, extends the play, finds Wilson late for a touchdown. But then in the fourth quarter, There was a stretch in the fourth quarter. Jordan Brooks comes completely unblocked on a creeper, and Murray lets it loose for Marvin Harrison on a third and four from a stack for a huge completion. On the same drive, Brooks comes again on a blitz. Murray makes him miss, escapes to his right, finds Marvin Harrison for a 22-yard gain,

and then to kind of finish off the drive, they had McBride as the isolated receiver and like the trips look to the left or to the right, and he is a little in-breaker. Kyler hits him. They're inside the five touchdown. So you have a chunk by design to your tight end, who is a more explosive receiving option than almost any in the league. You have your true number one receiver making contested plays on third and four.

And you have your turbocharged mini man of a quarterback, making guys miss and making plays outside of structure in ways that almost no one in the NFL can. This is it. This is the vision for how this can go well. It was cool to see that stuff click today. And you know what's funny about the fadeaway ball to Marvin Harrison Jr. To the left side, he made that same throw, I think, against the Niners, like at the very end of the game where he, where they need it. Like, that's just, it seems like they, when they get into crunch time, they're like, all right, Marvin Harrison, 15 yards and out.

Kyler's going to get you that ball one way or another. You just need to get to the sideline. So that play was awesome. And then at the very end, Kyler Murray, ice is this game with his legs. It's third and four. There's about a minute 30 left. and if they don't get to the sticks, they're going to have to kick the field goal

and then the dolphins will get time with the ball. Instead, Kyler, they do a designed run to the right side. Whoever is playing off the edge just fires into the backfield. And so it ends up, Kyler Marie kind of has to bend around him, ends up like six, seven yards behind the line of scrimmage, and then just accelerates to get the first down. And like, that's where you see his special, special athletic ability.

What do we make of the dolphins in this game? Two, it comes back. Dolphins still lose. And now I think it's a sort of similar conversation to the one that we were having about the Bengals. Where does this leave the dolphins this year and beyond this year, considering some of the

aggressive moves they have made from a team-building perspective to try to wedge this window open? So I was pretty concerned with the way that the defense played, but offensively, I'm going to talk about, I'm going to talk out of both sides of my mouth here. First of all, I hate the way that the Cardinals play defense.

I don't like the three safety stuff. We got to get more guys in the box. We got to play heavier you up front. I just don't like the way it works. And it kind of works sometimes because Buda Baker is exceptional and will find ways to clean up the mess. But as a philosophy, I don't love the way that it works. However, what it did accomplish in this game is that it consistently kind of made to await a beat on some more stuff because you're just getting into rotations in ways that you just don't typically see from like normal coverage shells. And then it also kind of put a roof on a lot of stuff.

And it didn't really give the dolphins those just random explosives where they get 70 yards out of thin air. And they're able to just, you know, kind of have a scoring drive out of almost nothing. They really made the dolphins work in these like six to eight to 10 yard chunks. And eventually they're going to mess up and not be able to convert on drives. And again, they still score like 20 some odd points in this game. So it's not like they shut them out. But they didn't give them that many of the freebies that this dolphin's offense can get. And I think that with the way they're off.

played, that was just enough in this game. It would be interesting to see how the rest of the season unfolds. I mean, they have five losses now. This is an aging team. This is a team where you're going to have to make some financial concessions next year. Right now, as it currently stands, they have $4 million in cap space. And they have some levers that they can pull. They have guys that they can restructure.

But you want to restructure somebody like Tyree Kill, he's 31 years old. Jalen Ramsey's going to be 31 years old next year. Toronto Armside is going to be 34 years old next year. So it's a core that whatever we thought the dolphins were going to be over the last couple years, that idea, the idea of that team is slowly fading away. So you could make, you could rationalize potentially, okay, you know, if Tua can stay healthy next year and we bring back most of this core, can we make one more run at this thing with this team as currently constructed and this core players is currently constructed. I get that maybe, but I think that that window and that path, is becoming narrower by the day. I probably was already closer to that side of where the dolphins were at with their team

building and their roster coming into the season. But yeah, now you get to here. And I know they've lost some games specifically because Tua was not healthy. But even before he was, you know, was missing games early in the season, offense didn't look all that great. And then against the Cardinals defense that you should have been able to put up 40 on, weren't quite able to do it. So I have the same concerns about where they're at.

All right. Let's stick in the AFC East and get to some of the stuff that was a little bit disappointing today. It's time for what the fuck. What the fuck? Jeff lost to the Patriots today. And if you had told me that earlier in the day, after, let's say even the first Patriots touchdown drive, where Drake May just looks like 2019 Lamar Jackson and is the greatest scrambler we've ever seen. I could understand how May's presence in the game would lend to a certain level of volatility where you could lose to this team.

Drake May didn't play for three of the final four quarters in this game, and the Jets still lost to the Patriots. The Jets, what the fuck? I don't even have, my takes on this Jets team are well documented, and I've already said how bad I feel about this team. Even this was not on the table for me, like especially once Drake May was out,

I thought with Drake May they weren't winning this game. And then without Drake May, somehow the Patriots offense looks like better this week with Jacoby. percent than it ever did before with Jacoby percent. Like, it just, this Jets team, I'm just continually frustrated by the things that they do. Like, they just, to lose this game the way that they did, baffling. The Jets are not two and six. They're a team that we can comfortably ignore, right?

Yeah, fully. And I was already to comfortably ignore them. And I had something that I wanted to talk about on the preview show that we didn't get to because of time. But I'm going to trot it out now. And it almost feels like it has less teeth after the, game, but just know I believed this before they just lost to the Patriots. We pay attention to the Jets because Aaron Rogers is saying crazy shit and because they're the Jets.

And they get all this media coverage because this is a huge market team. The Jets this season are just the big market saints. That's all they are. The Jets as a team are not compelling. They have an older quarterback who they signed as they went out and acquired in almost an act of desperation to try to squeeze what they could out of this version of the roster. They have a defense that was once an elite unit that has been diminished that is no longer the type of group that we think of at their best.

And they deserve the same amount of attention and they deserve the same amount of brain space as the Saints did coming into this season. And I'm glad that now we're finally in a place where we can pay that level of attention to this team because they don't deserve it. I'm honestly mad I didn't come to that same conclusion with the Jets being the Saints. It's so good. And you know what? There's so many like if you think about it even deeper, there's so many more connections. It felt like for a large part of Derek Carr's career, he kind of felt like the Walmart version of the way that Aaron Rogers plays where you're like,

a lot of throwaways, he's accurate, you wish he would push the ball a little bit more than he actually does. You have that connection between those two. They're also the only two quarterbacks in the league who are Devante Adams's best friend, which is like another part of this. And then you have two offensive lines that have like, completely just kind of crumbled in front of their quarterbacks and made them play almost to the worst parts of their abilities. Like, it's just, I love this take. It's too good. Watching Aaron Rogers right now is a bewildering experience. Like, in this game, he was five of 11 against man coverage. And essentially, every single time they got man coverage, he was trying to

throw a slot fade to somebody. Like, they just have no interest in playing real offense. It's so weird And I guess it shouldn't necessarily be surprising because this is how he was playing the last time we saw him when he was in Green Bay. It was all go balls and throwaways. And that's what this offense feels like. They had two chunk completions against man coverage in this game. Both of them were slot fades to Garrett Wilson. It's just, it's such a bizarre offense to watch. The running game was really bad.

They had a 40% rushing success rate on their running back runs in this game against the Patriots defense that their coach was calling soft open. in the media a week ago. It's just so bizarre. And then afterwards, Jeff Obrick makes a comment about this being like a moment of darkness. And Aaron Rogers immediately, here's the word darkness and thinks,

oh yeah, I can make this about me right now. That's one of my buzzwords and goes to, I've been to the darkness. Who does he think he is? I'm done. I'm done. I'm just so done. And it feels like I'm really glad this game

gives us a free pass to not have to pretend that this team is compelling. Yes, I'm just done with it. The most frustrating part about the offense, one, like you mentioned, we've seen Aaron Rogers do this before. This is what the end of Green Bay was. But it's also to play this way is purely playing ISO ball. It's just saying my guys are better than your guys. Okay, but their offensive line can't block anybody.

The quarterback is not who he was. And the receivers aren't playing to the level of their talent. Like, you can't play ISO ball like that. Yeah. We don't need to spend any more time on it. Like that is currently the state of the New York Jets. They are two and six right now. Their season is probably over.

And it is going to be a long, long off season as we figure out what the next path forward looks like. I'm glad that they really needed some urgency by firing Robert Sala. They really needed a jumpstart here. If they had kept Robert Sallow, who knows how many points they would have lost to the Patriots by. Let's get to our next one here. I'm going to let you take this one actually, because you're the one who's actually

frustrated about this. So why don't you take us in to the next entry we have here? Yeah, so the Baltimore Ravens coming off of a five-game win streak, by the way, looked like one of the best teams in football, went and played the one and six Browns, and they lost the Ravens. They do this twice a year, it feels like. How do you go and lose to a one-and-six team? Baltimore Ravens, what the fuck?

I understand your frustration here, right? I get it, because the Browns look completely hapless for the first seven weeks of the season, and they look like a team cruising toward the number one pick. and to lose to a team in that state is fairly depressing. And quickly, the way that they lose this game, where Kyle Hamilton drops the freest interception ever, and then immediately you lose to a deep ball where the one problem this team has had all year

is you can't defend the deep ball. Like, it just, come on. This is all fair. And I will concede that part of the reason for this is that Marlon Humphrey didn't play in this game, Nate Wiggins didn't play in this game, the Ravens defense was banged up. But the Browns actually looked like a real NFL football team today that could do some things.

I believe Deshaun Watson did not throw for 200 yards in a game at any point this season. James threw for 3.34 in this game today. It's always so funny when you have terrible quarterback play and it's just impossible to evaluate anybody else on the roster. Did we know that Cedric Tillman could do this? Listen, I liked Cedric Tillman as a prospect like two years ago. He didn't catch any passes until like two weeks ago. And now he's just all of a sudden a guy who can go for a hundred yards a game. There was a play also.

I think it was in the second half where Jerry Judy like stacks Brandon Stevens and then puts his foot in the ground and separates at the top of the route. And James hits him for like a huge chunk gain. I want to say that might have been on the same drive as in Joku's like dunk touchdown was on. And so now I'm sitting there and I'm like, okay, like the fact that the Browns were completely unwatchable and now even granting that the Ravens defense was banged up, they're capable of an offensive performance like this. What would you think if you were in that locker room and you now have to come to the realization that you wasted half of your season by playing that guy when this version of the team and the

energy that you could potentially get on defense because you know you actually have a shot was there somewhere and the people in charge elected not to do it. I think that's the most frustrating part. You see the way that James played today. And I'll actually concede that they did look like a real football team. And I'll start it with the first throw of the game. James Winston rips in overrout to David Njoku covered by Kyle Hamilton. And it is as close to coverage you can get. And he puts it right through a keyhole to him. I was like, okay, they might be playing real football today. But because it plays like that, this Brown's team could probably be, what, four and four?

Like, at least, like, this could be at least a 500 team if James Winston had been playing quarterback for them. And I mean, James Winston is like quarterback 24. Like, he's not a great quarterback at this point. But when you're going from literally unplayable to a guy who knows what's going on and will give a decent skill group chances, that is enough, especially against like a banged up secondary and a secondary that's been struggling anyway. the Ravens secondary is banged up.

The Brown's secondary has gotten healthier. And I think that's also important to point out. The Brown's defense was really disappointing for the first chunk of the season, but they'd been missing guys. And now, you know, Juan Thornhill's back. It just feels like this group is complete on the back end. The front can still do some damage over the course of the game. And I really do believe that this is a defense for one of the first times all year that

understood if we play well enough, there is a chance that we can win this game. And so I think that this group overall was in a position to give Lamar Jackson and this offense more trouble than it would have been at any point in this season. And they did. They consistently did. He was under pressure for a good chunk of this game. I believe he was pressured on 42% of his dropbacks and was 513 for 76 yards on those plays. And you could feel it. Like he was getting pitched off his spot consistently in this game.

So this version of the Brown's defense, I didn't really realize that this was still a possibility. but I think in part because of having reasonable quarterback play, we got to see this group play at least almost up to its potential again. I agree. And really, the defense, it's still very simple. It's still a lot of we're just going to play tight man coverage. We're going to rush with our four. And they'll throw some funky stuff here and there.

But they mostly just like their guys just won. And this is, I think it was a good test for the Ravens offensive line in the sense that like, all right, what do you look like against the team that can keep it close and can just rush for and have a really good four man rush against your. offensive line where you have to pass to stay in this game. And it didn't look so great. They lost that battle pretty decisively. And Lamar made a number of like special plays to keep them in it. But it was still very hard sliding for him pretty much all day. Save Ravens defense panic for when the corners get back. I think that's fair. I don't know when or what I want to do

with this Ravens defense. We can definitely save it until they come back. But even when they're back, they haven't been. I don't know. Well, I'll, I'll, we'll do this discussion after Thanksgiving. When it, when When the games the Ravens are going to play are really going to start to matter. Yeah, I think the fact that the Ravens are 5 and 3 now, that looks not great. But that's more a product of, I cannot believe, you lost that game against the Raiders earlier this year. That's more, that's my main issue I take with this, not you lost the game against a team that finally had life because their quarterback could actually play football. To me, it's both. These are the two games they always find a way to lose.

next one here I hate to do this but I think we've arrived at this moment where it's time for an Anthony Richardson discussion finishes 10 of 32 in this game today while getting sacked five times

the Anthony Richardson experience eight weeks into year two I'm gonna say this in like a dour way what the fuck I'm this game was a little bit worrisome and you know what I went back and watched it for the first about quarter or so, I was like, all right, this isn't as bad as it looks. Like, Pierce drops an overrout to start the game.

A.D. Mitchell doesn't get his feet in for a touchdown. There's another drop, I think, by, or not a drop, but like a catchable pass from Will Disley that doesn't get caught, like, or not Will Disley. It's one of their other. Will Mallory. Yeah, it's Mallory. I knew it was like Will. Yes. I know exactly the player talking about.

Yeah. And so that could have been caught by like maybe a better player. And so some of those, I was like, okay, the inconsistency, I kind of get it early on. on as the game went on, he was just missing bizarre passes to me. Like he had Josh Downs, they were doing like that split back, split backfield out of shotgun where Downs is to the right side of the quarterback. He just runs a little angle route out of the backfield. Richardson like double clutches it when he's open and just rifles it past him. Like those are the misses that are like, yo, what?

How does that happen? Like you cannot, those are unacceptable misses for an NFL quarterback. Yeah. It's, I think you could explain a lot of. it away because of the pressure in this game. Like the fact that he was pressured on such a, I mean, he's pressured on 60% of his dropbacks. And the Texans were living in the back field. He was five of 17 on the place where he was pressured, but he was five of 15 on the

place where he wasn't. And I just feel like this has crept in not only just to the accuracy, but to the decision making. Like how he's playing the position and where he's going with the ball, that was not as much of a problem last year in his first force. starts as an NFL player as it is right now. So it just feels like some of the struggles have started to creep in just to the way that he's playing quarterback down to down.

And I don't know what you do about that because it almost feels like he could be well served with some time sitting. But now are you too far down the road? Like is the catch us out of the bag? If you do that, what does it do to his confidence? What does it do to like the development plan? is it too late to go to that as a potential solution? I honestly don't know the answer, but I think that continuing at this rate, I know they're

not going to play the Texans Pass Rush every week, but it doesn't really matter who they seem to be playing. The erratic way that he's playing the position seems to creep in. So I'm just not really sure what the best path forward looks like, but I don't know if you can just continue chugging away like this. I really don't know what the best answer is. It just depends on the guy, like how he's wired. but like I don't know if sitting him now and like taking that that much of an ego hit where you get benched, you know, halfway through your second season. Like does that do more damage or does him continuing to kind of snowball down this path where he just, it's kind of like you said, I think, you know, maybe on the last show we were talking about Anthony Richardson. It just feels like because he had some of the inaccuracy issues and that leads to some inconsistency, he's kind of like just not believing in the way that he plays football. And you're seeing him just force these weird passes that he, again, didn't.

make as a rookie. Like he knew what he was doing as a rookie for the most part. And now it just doesn't so much feel that that's the way that he's playing. It's frustrating. There was a play. It was a third and 13 at one point in the game. It was a play where he actually had a decent amount of time. And he has Mitchell on the left side running like a deep comeback.

And he's open. And he's looking at him. And he just doesn't throw it and then double clutches and then tries to throw it late as he's getting hit. And this is the stuff where it's just like, this is bad. If he's not going to be able to throw those balls to guys who are open within the rhythm of the play, and that's going to lead to some of this stuff, that's when you know that these issues go beyond accuracy. These issues now creep into decision-making, timing, just the mechanics

of how he's playing the position. And that is something that I think is much more difficult to fix. Yeah, that's the problem. I think I came into this season being like, okay, he triggers on stuff maybe a quarter of a second late, but he'll do it. Now he's a quarter of a second late and then double clutches that and then finally decides to throw. And it's like, well, by now, any defensive back in the league can catch up to this. And now you're already inaccurate and the windows are tighter now. It's just, and you probably have a pass rush or close to you. It's a really hard way to play the position. Yeah, I'm sure we'll talk more about it as we move through the season. But the last weekend this week, I think it's hard not to be really concerned about the way that he's looked.

and it's put this team in an unavailable position. This is a really difficult thing to navigate because it'd be really hard to sit him after the decisions you've made and the timeline you've tried to put him on, but I'm not sure what the best answer is here. We're going to talk about a couple smaller moments that we noticed over the course of the day,

but before we do that, let's take a quick break. Did you see that? We only have a few of these today because we pretty much hit every single other game in depth over the course of this show. The slate earned it. You wanted to kick this off, And I'll admit, I did not watch much of this game.

So this is why you're here. But you thought that Justin Herbert had another one of those days where he made four or five throws that made you stand up straight. I don't even know why I watched this game. I guess just during the afternoon slate, I thought everything outside of Bears Commanders was not that interesting. Like Bill Seahawks ended up being a blowout. So I don't know why I had this on one of my screens. Regardless, Justin Herbert. I had it on.

I was just a little bit distracted by my team playing in its most consequential regular season, October game in four years. See, that's the thing. I could be a little bit more not quite so attached to that game. And then once the bill started to pull away, I was like, all right, I can go watch this game a little bit and keep an eye on Justin Herbert. But he made, he had one on the second drive of the game, I think, to actually Will Disley this time. This is the correct player. A seam ball to him that was just absolutely insane pins it on him. He's not able to bring it in. That was frustrating. But then he has another deep throw down the right side line to Ladd-McConkie. He's got to kind of like put it like the cornerback. has like inside leverage on him, so he's got to put it a little bit to the outside. Ladd makes like a spinning catch, is able to go off to the races after he catches it. It's a touchdown. That play was truly incredible. He has another deep ball to Josh Palmer later in the game where he cannot step up in the pocket. Like he's stuck where he is feet in the ground like a toy soldier and he just rips it 40 yards and puts it right on Palmer and just he and then the other one, I think it was maybe his last touchdown. He ends up getting pushed out of the pocket to his left

in the red zone. I almost can't explain the core strength and elasticity he has to get this ball to Ladd-McConkie when he's like rolling to his left. Rolling to your left is hard as a right-handed quarterback. To get your body to do what it wants to do, not easy. But for Herbert, a guy who is built like a cyborg, it somehow looks easy. And like those are the plays where you just, I'm never going to quit this guy. I don't care if this team is one in six.

They're not this year, but like in theory, I don't care if they're bad. I don't care if they're scoring only 20 points a game. That guy is completely different than almost any other player on the field. So they play the Browns next week. Then they get the Titans, Bengals. They already played the Broncos once and they won that game, which I somehow have erased that from my mind. But I'm just trying to think about the Chargers path to the wild card here.

It is very real. It absolutely could happen. And now that game against the Cardinals that they managed to squander on Monday, it looks even more frustrating. But this formula, of our defense can actually play, and we have a quarterback who can make those four or five throws a game.

You could do worse. You can do worse. You could do worse as an overall plan as an NFL team. Many AFC teams are doing much worse. Yeah, we'll do some extended kind of considered Chargers talk at some point over the next couple weeks. I really do want to take a longer look at that defense

because we just really haven't gotten a chance to because some other stuff has gotten in the way. But they deserve a little bit more time and attention than we've given them. So that will happen at some point down the road here. Next one, did you see that Jordan Love was just limping around throughout the entire first half of this game and into the second half? This is this entire game period. Jordan Love was limping around. Jordan Love looked very hurt. He eventually gets pulled in the second half of this game.

I'm worried about this. I'm worried that we're just going to be in a place where he's hampered for a majority of this season and it's ultimately going to dictate what the Packers ceiling looks like as a team. They had him on the week one Kurt Cousin's plan where everything is in pistol. He's not moving out of the pocket at all. Like, he's just kind of stuck there stationary. And listen, Matt Lafleur can cook it up well enough. And they have good enough skill talent that it kind of works enough that they were able to put up some points in the first half.

But to your point, he very clearly did not look like the player, did not look like the creator that I think that we've seen him be, especially at his peak, like, especially down the back end of last year. So I think it is frustrating. It's frustrating not only because this is a player, I think we were both obviously very excited for like what is the next step for him. So it sucks that we're not able to see it from him specifically. this is also like kind of a really good Packers team.

Like this team should be able to like, if he's not at full capacity, it's going to be hard for them to contest the lines at the top of the vision or even contest like the top wild card seeds. It's really unfortunate. Yeah, I don't know what the answer is. I don't know if you give him some time to recover. If you think the offense can survive with Malik Willis for another couple weeks, but if Jordan loves going to be playing at 70% for the rest of this season,

I think that we really have to think about what that means for the Packer. and what that means for their chances, because they need him to reach their ceiling. And with the way that he looks physically right now, I think that there's a chance, his health and his inability to be the player we thought he was can prevent them from getting there. Last one here.

You see the lion scored 52 points with Jared Goff throwing for 85 yards? This, I, the way that this team continues to find ways to win where they can have the Jared Goff his perfect game and then also have the Jared Gough does nothing game, and they just smoke both of those teams. They're insane. Six different players scored touchdowns. David Montgomery threw a touchdown pass to Samaporta.

I experienced this game solely via highlights. I had to make some choices in the early slate, so I got this via Red Zone and via fantasy updates more than anything else, but an impressive showing from the offense nonetheless. It was. Did you see the David Montgomery touchdown throw, by the way? I did. I did see that because I,

very invested in David Montgomery. Mean spiral on that. I have credit to him. Now it's impressive. Yeah, they're having running back to touchdowns. They're having offensive linemen catch touchdowns. That's exactly where this Detroit team is right now. And you know what? You deserve it. When you're that good, why not? You deserve this moment if you're the Detroit Lions. All right, let's round this out with what we learned today. I think I've learned something today. So we like to end all these Sunday shows just, you know, with a little lesson, with a little life lesson, something to take away from the week. What do you got for me? Never underestimate an NFL.

late, man. We both came into the week just looking at the schedule. There's only like three matchups between winning teams. It just looked like there was going to be a lot of slop this week. It just looked like it was not going to be a week that had a lot of juice. And then I think wire to wire, this is one of the most exciting weeks that we've had, maybe the most exciting weeks that we had. And so even if some of these games didn't necessarily have the biggest stakes in the way that they, like Jets Patriots doesn't really have a whole lot to it in terms of stakes. But just the fact that those games were on the table this week when we didn't think we were going to get a whole lot from it. I just love this league. It just, it's incredible. Yeah. This is,

it definitely snuck up on me. This week being what it was, I don't think you ever could have predicted this. And I agree. I think this was probably the most fun NFL Sunday that we've had so far this year. Mine, I don't have really have a good one today, but I was sitting there thinking about the way the Browns looked without Deshawn Watson and then just some of the weirdness we saw from the Bears, whether it was Caleb Williams really just feeling, it seemed like he was nervous early in the game, right? Like the moment. was so big because this is the biggest game he's ever played in. It's the big end, the biggest regular season game,

the Bears have played it in years. I think we forget sometimes these are human beings. Like, these are human beings that are playing these games, understanding the stakes, and the way that they're feeling going into the game can be extremely powerful. Like, Tyreek Stevenson yelling at the crowd and forgetting to play the hell Mary,

this is a guy in his second year. Like, these are learning experiences, and you, have to learn how to play on that stage. And on the Brown side of this, like, I truly do believe that this is a team that believed it could win a game and believed it could actually play well for one of the first times all year. Like, when you watch the energy that defense played with and you watch what the offense looked like, you can't pretend like that doesn't have a real impact. Like, it felt like a different sort of team. I think the crowd in Cleveland fed off of that.

It was just an entirely different feeling. And so how, how? guys how much belief they have and what their like mental state is heading into some of this stuff I think we forget how much that plays in to what the final results look like like the games aren't played on paper like their actual human beings playing the game and I think today was a good reminder of that it really is that's why yeah confidence matters for some of these players and even just being able to like let the moment kind of like being able to look past the moment it's kind of like why Joe Flacco is able to just step in for the Colts and be like, yeah, I'm incredible because like he's playing with House Money at this point in his career.

Whereas for Anthony Richardson, this is a very high leverage, like high stakes situation for him to be in his life. That's another great example. Yeah. And so like that type of stuff I think is important. It's also why it's so important that like, you know, we talk so much about having coaches who can set the culture and quarterbacks who are worth like being leaders in the locker room.

Like that stuff really does matter, especially when the chips are down and like you're in a lot of these tough games. And when you get to the end of the road, they're all tough games. And so you need these guys who can like kind of keep you in line and keep the team in line. Yeah. And again, I don't think that this is an indictment. I'm like what the Bears could eventually do. But I do think that today was a learning experience.

And when you are on these stages for the first times, sometimes it affects people more than others. So a very good day overall. Really, really, really enjoyed it. Hope you guys did as well. We will be back for our midweek show on Tuesday, a little bit later in the week. And then obviously we'll be back with our week nine preview heading into Friday for now. that is all we got. If I just could ask you guys a favor,

I never do this because I'm bad at my job, a couple different things. If you're watching this on YouTube, like and subscribe, like the video, subscribe to the YouTube channel. I would very much appreciate this. If you're listening on the audio side of things

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It really does go a long way. So thank you very much in advance for that. For now, that's all we got. Appreciate you guys listening. We'll talk to you very soon.