The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Prospects to Pros: 2023 NFL Draft superlatives + way-too-early 2024 mock draft

Episode Date: May 3, 2023

Which teams had the best draft? What was the biggest surprise? Who was drafted higher and lower than expected? Which player and team is the best fit? Andy Staples and Dane Brugler answer all of the 2023 NFL Draft superlatives. Then, it’s never too early to look ahead to 2024. Dane reveals the top prospects he’s watching in next year’s draft. Follow Andy on Twitter: @Andy_StaplesFollow Dane on Twitter: @dpbruglerSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTube1:15 Teams that had the best draft9:04 The biggest surprise16:17 Player that was drafted higher than expected23:25 Player that fell lower than expected26:45 Team with the most efficient draft29:17 Best player/team fit37:29 Way-too-early 2024 NFL mock draftThis episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/mays and get on your way to being your best self. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic football show. Welcome to Prospects to Pros, the show where we examine the guys who just got drafted to the NFL, the ones who are about to be drafted in the NFL. But right now we're talking about the ones who just got drafted in the NFL because Dane Bruegler is here. He's back from Kansas City. The draft was last weekend, Dane. You are due for some much-needed R&R, but we got to have one more download

before we let you go on vacation and forget about 2020. draft prospects, even though I've just been in your ear about Carson back at Georgia that he may find his way into the first round. But no. Planting your flag early. Exactly. Exactly. So, but no, we need to talk about this draft that just happened. And we're going to do some superlatives because you guys broke it down so thoroughly on the set in Kansas City. If you guys didn't watch, it was fantastic with Dane and Robert Mays. But this is a chance to look back and to decided, okay, what are we really like? What were our favorite thing? So, Dane, we should probably start with best draft. What team do you think had the best

draft? It's hard not to go with the Eagles. I mean, you get, now obviously, this depends on Jalen Carter panning out playing the way we think he can. But getting Jalen Carter, getting Nolan Smith in the first round, I know the whole Georgia former Bulldog aspect. of this is a fun storyline, but then they come back and get Keeley O'Ringo in the fourth round. I mean, it's not part of the draft hall, but then trading for D'Andre Swift.

Like, it's just, they added good players. And on day two, even, you add a Sydney Brown. They needed help at safety. Sydney Brown's going to help them special teams and safety from day one. They needed help on the offensive line, depth, Tyler Steen. He's going to come in and compete for their starting right guard job,

and then maybe he is the long-term right tackle. So for me, the Eagle, Star Power, depth. I mean, I think they kind of hit all the high notes for me. So if I had to pick one, the Eagles are at the top. But, you know, the Colts, I really like what they did. I mean, it starts with Anthony Richardson, obviously. But then, you know, hitting all these athletes.

I mean, this is a Chris Ballard draft, if I've ever seen one. Getting some key athletes, getting Josh Downs at pick 79. Exactly. Just a steal. It was kind of like Ballard is getting all these high-end athletes. and then he told Shane Steichen head coach like, all right, you can have one. Who do you want? Josh Downs?

Okay, done. Here. You drop him to that offense. That's a lot of fun. I had another college football writer texting me during the draft and Josh hadn't been taken yet. And the text just said, do these people, did these people never watch Josh Downs play football? Because he's one of those, like, production-wise, it's hard to deny. And really, we talk about Drake May a lot as a 2024 prospect.

but that was pretty much all Drake May had. And Downs was very productive and just. He's just small. That's it. He's small and he's a 4-48 athlete. He's not a burner quicker than fast. But you want a guy that gets open? You want a guy that catches the ball?

That's what he does. That's it. That's it. So I had one that I realized this might be a little bit controversial because I know there's some people that think, okay, you didn't have to just swole. bought picks with the Eagles. You could have gotten Jalen Carter here. But the whole Bears draft, I like, in terms of filling needs.

So you've got Darnel Wright in the first round. They need people to block for Justin Fields. I realize you may have wanted Jalen Carter or something different. They got a block for Justin Fields. They needed right tackle specifically. And they got the best right tackle in the draft. Exactly. And then in the second round, they get Jervon,

Dexter from Florida and Zach Pickens from South Carolina, two guys who will be, I think, first line interior defensive linemen in the NFL. They are starting NFL defensive tackles. Dexter, I've always thought, will be better in the NFL than he was at Florida. He didn't have a ton around him. He's getting double teamed a lot. He was probably playing more snaps than he should have. He's a 6-6-310-pound guy who could move. And then Pickens, I think, is a great value there. And Rocheon Johnson, I'm just telling you right now. This dude is going to be a productive back in the NFL. He was, and he was that guy at Texas.

He was a leader, kind of the guy everybody rallied around. Even though Bejohn is a great player, you know, the perfect back prospect and a really good teammate and all that. But the Texas people will tell you that Rochon Johnson was the guy everybody listened to on that team. So I'm very excited about that. And I still believe in Noah Sewell, even though he had a bad year last year. I still think there's something there.

I'm very curious to see what they get out of him at pick 148. Yeah. And my guy, Tyler Scott, who I had a grade as a top 50 player. And they get him much later than I think he should have gone. You look at the Bears moving forward. Darnell Mooney's in a contract year. Maybe Tyler Scott takes over for him next season. I agree with everything you said about it.

I don't do draft grades. What I do is I power rank 1 through 32, my favorite draft class. Eagles are one, Colts were two, the Texans were three. I mean, I didn't factor in what they gave up. I'm just factoring on, I'm just focusing on the players. Right. And obviously you get C.J. Stroud, Will Anderson,

right there, you're going to rank high. Seattle is four, and then Chicago is five for me. So I'm with you, Chicago at a heck of a draft. Seattle at four, man, I don't think we once talked about Devin Witherspoon going five to Seattle. You think about Pete Carroll and John Schneider, this is their 14th draft. They've been head coach and GM together in Seattle. They have never drafted a corner in the first round until this year. And when you look at their track record on day three, why would they?

Especially coming off a year where they found two starters on day three at corner in last year's draft, why would you use a top five pick on a corner this year? I think that just tells you how much. they love Devin Witherspoon. You know, a guy that's under six foot, 185 pounds, you better be pretty good to draft you top five. Obviously, Seattle thought so. But then they come back with JSN at 20,

one of my favorite fits in the draft. Derek Hall, a great edge rusher. You had him to the rotation on his second round. Zach Charbonnet is really interesting. When you have Kenny Walker. I can't wait to see what that looks like. You know, it's kind of like Kenny Walker's your, your home run hitter where

Charbonnet is your doubles guy and you know going to be more you know Walker's got more speed more big play potential Charbonnet is more of your you know in terms of you're running back specific traits your vision your patience

that's where he is superior to Walker but it's going to be interesting the the workload and what they is it strictly using Charbonnet and passing downs or I don't know it's going to be fun to walk Well, you can pound on the defense a little bit with Charbonnet, who's a big guy. Yeah.

And then take some load off of Walker so that when you do give Walker the ball, there's a better chance that those explosive traits come out and he breaks one. So I mean, that's because you have a really good running back on a rookie contract in Kenneth Walker. Why not stretch that out as much as you can? Get as much mileage out of that as you can. and I think Charbonnet is good value there and will he can he can give you the kind of production that Walker would give you on most carries and it keeps Walker fresher

so that every once in a while, kaboom that's the thing that I would I would do with them and the Derek Hall pick I love too as he he looks like a Pete Carroll type edge rusher so I'm very excited to see that the biggest surprise oh go ahead I just a common theme with that Seattle draft, I think you, you look at all these guys, they're like football passion

guys, like Witherspoon, Smith and Jigba, Derek Hall, Charbonnet, I mean, all the way through, they're all, like, there's a common thread throughout this draft class that these are passionate about football, high football character players. So kind of a big turn from them possibly taking Jalen Carter, which, you know, there's questions there at five. Yeah. They went to different direction with the entirety of their draft class. So the biggest surprise, I mean, for me, it was right after the Texas Stakes, C.J. Stroud, which didn't seem that surprising. I realize there was a lot of smoke that they might not, but they needed a quarterback. But then to turn around and trade up to three to take Will Anderson, I was shocked. Shocked that they gave up so much or shocked that they.

Just the aggressiveness of it. Yeah. Because you think you have another pick, you know, high in the first round. you could get a lot of value just picking there. But to say, you know what, this is the guy we want. We feel like we can really build our team. And those are going to be, obviously, Stroud's the quarterback. He's the most important player on the offense. Will Anderson's going to be the face of your team.

Oh, yeah. He just is. That's who he is. And he will be the face of your defense. He will be the leader of your defense once, maybe not immediately, but eventually. and I just think it's great that, you know, with the new coaching staff coming in, they said, you know what? We are going to tell everybody what this team's going to be right here and get what we want.

This, we've heard a lot of different things coming out of Houston the last few days since the first round. This just feels like Will Anderson was our guy from the start. Highest graded player on the board. This is the defensive cornerstone that Demiko Ryan's targeted. and that he wanted. But at the end of the day, then you know the quarterback. And so they had to figure it out. And even though they drafted C.J. Strive first,

I think Will Anderson is the guy they wanted all along. And so, but you take the quarterback first. And then you, you know, Nick Casario ownership, you tell Domeco, listen, we got to take the quarterback. But then we're going to go up and get your guy. We'll find a way. We'll figure it out. And they do that. And the cost a lot.

It was expensive trade. And, you know, I did my. you referenced it earlier, my 2024 mock draft. And for the draft order, I just did the inverse of the Super Bowl odds. And right now, it's Arizona picking one and Houston picking two. So if that came to fruition, Arizona would have the first two picks in next year's draft, which obviously in hindsight would not be a great look. But obviously, you know, we'll see how it plays out.

But it'd be awesome for Arizona. I mean, Caleb Williams and Marvin Harrison, come on that. I mean, that'd be a heck of a haul. Because it's not, I mean, Cardinals still were able to trade back up for Paris Johnson and get their left tackle of the future. So the Cardinals coming away from this draft with two first next year, with three thirds. I mean, just all the draft capital for next year, they're going to control next year's draft. And that's exactly what they needed with a new regime in place, a broken roster,

uncertainty at quarterback. I mean, it's I thought the Cardinals just absolutely, in terms of process and plan, they killed it. Well, here's the thing, though. If you're the Texans, I don't know if they would actually say this,

but what you say to that is, oh, you might have just given away the second pick in the draft next year. We're not intending to suck. That's what you say. And that's, it's a possibility, you know, with what they've done

and if C.J. Stroud comes in, and I would assume, I'm assuming C.J. Stroud's your day one starter. You know, maybe not. Maybe you go with Davis Mills or Case Keenum at first, but I'm assuming he's coming in to start. And, you know, if he plays the way he did the last game we saw him play, they might be pretty good. No doubt. No doubt. I can't wait for that. They have a chance to, you know, make some noise in that division, no doubt. You just never know with rookie quarterbacks. And the offensive line's okay. I thought that was a really interesting part of this.

Usually when quarterbacks are drafted early, the offensive line's terrible. And those guys are in trouble. But you look at Carolina with Bryce Young at one, that pretty decent offensive line. Like he's actually going to a good. Now receivers are a little more of a question mark, but his offensive line is pretty good. Houston, one of the best left tackles in the game. And then the other parts of the offensive line are fine. we'll see about center

but I think for the most part Houston's offensive line it's not it's not in the bottom five of the league it's probably it's closer to the middle of the pack and having Laramie Tunsell is a big part of that but I mean for these two quarterbacks at the top now Anthony Richardson

the Colts offensive line is still an issue but for the first two picks with the Panthers and the Texans it's interesting that their offensive line not as big of an issue as we usually expect from teams picking that early in the draft yeah and And it's funny with the Texans because you just always think of David Carr going there with an expansion team and just getting sacked every single play.

But you're absolutely right. Even while Deshaun Watson, we first got there. I mean, that's why they traded the farm for Laramie Dunsell. And that, you know, obviously there's a lot to give up for him. But they had to, they were desperate. They had to do something because Watson could not, did not have any time to make any plays. So, yeah, it's definitely been on the minds of, I think, the Texans ownership to make sure they invest in the line.

You just reminded me one of my favorite picks when you talked about trading for Laramie Tunsell. So they traded to the Dolphins for Laramie Tonsul, and the Dolphins got a ton of draft capital out of that, obviously. The Dolphins made one of my favorite picks in this draft. Oh, yeah. Devon A-chain. I feel like I mocked it into existence.

I did it in my seven-round mock. I did it in my after round one. did a mock for a round for day two rounds two and three i mocked a chain to the offense and both because i selfishly i wanted to see it happen and mike macdanio gave it to us uh it just it's fireworks man i mean this is uh you think about what how they used their running backs in their offense you think about a chain and the strengths of his game the speed man that that is a chance to be a lot of fun and so i i can't wait to see it that is the most functional football speed on the field of any skill position group in the NFL.

And it will be very difficult for defenses to deal with. I can't wait. I hope to a tongue of my low is okay. And I hope he's healthy and can play for a long time. Because if he can, holy crap, that's going to be fun to watch. Oh, yeah, no question. I mean, just ignore that I had mocked Michael Pennock to them in my 2024 mock. But, you know, hopefully.

Well, listen, one lefty for another. There you go. Something happens, you know, you just, well, I'm not trying to be cynical here. an oft-injured lefty for another oft-injured lefty. Yeah, you're not wrong. No, we will get into your 2024 mock draft at some point. You said you're not reading the comments. I've already started reading the comments. It's my favorite part. I'm sure there's some good ones. But let's let's talk a little more about this draft. There's a, they took him where pick, like the person who went much higher than you expected? I mean, you got to start with the lions,

what they did in the first round, right? With both Jemir Gibbs and Jack Campbell, when Jemir Gibbs was drafted at 12, that was the first, like, whoa, moment for me in the draft. Because that's one where I just never even entered my mind. Like, it wasn't even a thought that that could be a possibility. Now, obviously, in hindsight, knowing they were ready to move on from D'Andre Swift,

like, you know, it becomes more of a practical pick, but still in the moment it was like, whoa, wow. It's one of the, my initial reaction is funny. There's a clip from our live show. My initial reaction was, can you imagine Lions fans if you mocked that pick ahead of time? I mean, they would have gone nuts. And I mean, it's, I don't know. I love Jumeir Gibbs.

I cannot wait to see him. This is one of those, trust your offensive coordinator. If you're the Lions and maybe you know, don't love the value of where they drafted him, just trust your offensive coordinator. Ben Johnson will know how to use a talent like this where his suddenness with his feet, his ability in the passing game, he has, you almost don't even look at him as a running back. You look at him as a weapon, you know, he's going to help you in the passing game. Line him up in the seat.

Last year, he was 25% of his snaps came in a slot. He led Alabama and receiving it. So, you know, this is a guy that, and it's funny, I, it, Jamir Gibbs is going top 20. The Jets were looking at him at 15, and there were other teams looking at him. He was not getting out of the top 20 picks. So I don't think it was as big of a reach as many pointed out.

And I tweeted this Friday morning. It's funny how many Lions fans accused, oh, Lions PR at it again. Or, you know, oh, the GM trying to save face, Brad Holmes. I was like, I'm right now, I'm, flattered that you think Brad Holmes called me and said, hey, you mind putting this out there? Like, I'm flattered. You think he would do that?

But no, I mean, there were other, several other teams that I know we're looking at Jamir Gibbs in the top 20. And so it's not as big of a reach as maybe something it is. Well, and Jack Campbell, who they also took in the first round. Right. Was potentially going to get picked up later in the first round, too. So in both cases, they had players they really liked, who might not have been available. So I think that's that's really all you can do, especially if you, if you feel like

those are your guys. And, you know, Jack Campbell is one of those. It's definitely a culture pick. You put him with Malcolm Rodriguez, who you got for his steal last year. And that lineback of core could be pretty good. You've got a obviously very good defensive line in front of them. So, yeah, the Gibbs thing, I was surprised when it happened too. But then the more I thought about it, I was like, well, it is, this is a person who fits my criteria for a first round running back. And I didn't have a problem with where Bejohn went or where Gibbs went. If that's what you want, if that's the kind of weapon you're looking for, then fine. And you're right.

They would not have been able to get him with their next pick. That's it. And, you know, Campbell, it's tough. The only linebacker drafted and then what, the top 50? top 60 this year. Now, could they have traded back maybe and got him? Probably. Like, I don't think, I don't, I don't, I don't, we'll never know for sure,

but I don't think another team in the first round was going to draft Jack Campbell. I know Buffalo was out there as a maybe, but, you know, they, obviously, they, they, they wanted Dalton Kincaid. And as soon as Dalton Kincaid fell past the Chargers, Brandon Bean was on the phone. Okay, we got to go make a, make a move to go up and get. Dalton Kincaid. And it's funny because they, they jumped the Cowboys thinking the Cowboys wanted them.

Cowboys, Kincaid wasn't even the top tight end on their board. Sam Leporta was. They were considering San Loporta at 26, Dallas was. And actually the Cowboys pick came down to Matthew Bergeron or Mazi Smith. Either a guy they're going to put a guard or the nose tackle and they want the nose tackle. So it's just fascinating, you know, what teams think other teams are going to do and how that affects their decision-making.

But, yeah, the Lions, and then in round two even, like, Sam Leporta over Michael Mayer is interesting. That's one where, you know, you can look at it and say, I really, I like Sam Leporta quite a bit. Just surprised they took them over Michael Mayer. But, you know what? The Lions weren't the only team that had Leporta above Michael Mayer, which is really interesting. And then their favorite, my favorite pick of their draft. It's probably Brian Branch later in the second. Absolutely.

Getting him in the mid-second, whether he plays slot, whether he plays nickel, you know, more of a more of a safety position, more of a corner position. I don't know. It's going to be interesting to see how they use all these defensive backs across the secondary. All I know is they got better because Brian Branch is a heck of a player. Yeah, he's one you just plug in and you know that you're going to get production from him and that he's going to be smart and understand your defense and do what you need him to do. I love that.

It is interesting because I believe our Iowa beat writer, Scott Docterman, said that the Lions had some fear of the bills later in the first round. But like you said, when the bills knew they could get Dalton Kincaid, they were going. You know, it's interesting because the bill's got Osiris Torrance in the second round, which I think is a pretty good pick up there. And then Nick Broker from Ole Miss, I think can wind up playing for them too. So, Dorian Williams in a third too. They needed a linebacker, and I thought they got a really good one in Tulane's Doreen Williams, who's long, young, he can run. Yeah, the bills, they were into my top 10 of my favorite drafts because I thought they,

you know, you, the Dalton Kincaid to Buffalo, that's one of my favorite fits in the entire draft. I mean, he's going to be their slot receiver, basically. Whether he's lined up, you know, more as a tight end or a receiver, it doesn't matter. He will be that receiving option they've been missing, and it's just going to help that offense. So, no, I love that fit. That's going to be something that pays immediate dividends for that offense. And then, yeah, add Osiris Torrance to the mix to compete for a starting job.

And, yeah, and broker, that's a good call on day three. As a guy, you can work into the offensive line rotations, give you maybe some position flex up front. He gives you solid depth. So Buffalo, definitely an easy call. for top 10 of my favorite drafts this year. So how about he fell how far with the question mark? Everybody's going to say Levis because we saw so much of him in the green room.

But that does make sense once the Colts took Richardson. That's it. There was not a huge need of quarterback. The Titans could or could not take one. They've got Tannihil. They didn't have to take one. So it makes sense that if they're going to, take one. They're not going to take one in the first round. He'd take him in the second.

So I get that one. Was Michael Mayer the more surprising one for you? Yes. I mean, I thought for sure he'd go in the first round. Real quick on the Levis thing, I think you're exactly right. Let's just say Levis went four to the Colts. Anthony Richardson's the guy that falls then. It's not like Anthony Richardson gets to the five and Seattle's like, oh, we're taking Anthony Richardson there. No, I mean, Anthony Richardson falls and it's anyone's guess how far he does fall. And multiple teams tell me they got calls from Tennessee trying to trade back up into the first round to get Levis, the Eagles, the Chiefs, a few other teams. So the Titans were trying. It's just they couldn't find a deal to get it done.

And they were able to trade up into the second to, of course, get him. So even though it was a longer wait than he wanted and just, you know, an unfortunate way to spend that first day of the draft being there. in Kansas City and not working out, that's tough. But I thought he landed in a good spot where this is not the GM that drafted Malik Willis, Ryan Tannhill. This is, you know, he's close. Ran Carthon, new GM. He's close to the end with Tana Hill.

So, you know, he's got a real chance there to be the guy. And so I thought it's a good landing spot for him. The Michael Mayor one is interesting. I think he's something that, yeah, Nate Tyson and I, every time we talk about Mayor, we kind of say this, but you just don't overthink him. Plain and simple. Michael Mayer might not be an elite athlete, might not be an elite blocker. He's just a darn good player, all around good player. It doesn't matter what you want.

And so he goes to the Raiders in a second. Great fit for him. He's going to make that offense better from day one. A couple, we mentioned Josh. surprised he fell out of the top 75. Both Tennessee receivers talking about both Cedric Tillman and then Jalen Hyatt, both those guys falling as far as they did out of top 70 picks. That was a little surprising.

And then DeWan Jones. Not surprised DeWan Jones fell. I expected him to fall. I mean, people are surprised. He was my 60-something rated player in the draft. And I heard from people say, He might go in the first round. And I'm thinking, this guy's not going to the first round.

There's too many question marks, too many concerns, you know, football character concerns, weight concerns. But I am surprised he fell all the way out of day two into day three and right into the lapse of the Cleveland Browns who, you know, have one of the best offensive line coaches in the NFL and Bill Callahan. So that's an interesting fit for him. But still surprised he fell as far as he did. So interesting you bring up Cedric Tillman and DeWan Jones. because my next question to you was,

what is the most efficient draft? And so you mentioned the Brown. Cedric Tillman was the first player of the Brown selected. Their first pick in this draft was number 74. Then they get Apuica from Baylor, who's one of my favorites, giant nose tackle, who, when you're in an odd front,

that's the guy you have two gap in or just trying to blow up the middle. DeWan Jones, Luke Whippler, the Ohio State Center. Way down on day three. Dorian Thompson Robinson from UCLA. I don't know that DTR is a starting NFL quarterback, but he could be a valuable backup, I think, at some point.

A cheap backup. That's exactly what they need him to be. So I love with the Bronston. I mean, they, yeah, like you said, they didn't pick until 74, but they still got five of my top 100 players. And Luke Whippler was close. I mean, he wasn't a top 100 player for me, but, I mean, he was still an early fourth-round guy,

I thought, and they got him in the 6th, and he fits exactly what they do in that offense. So a guy that you add to the mix for competition, maybe, not this year, but maybe down the road, he's fighting for a starting job. I, you know, like Isaiah McGuire, they get him with their fourth pick, which was 126. I thought they might have drafted him with their first third round pick, because he fits exactly what they want to do. Cedric Tillman, I don't think the Browns entered day three thinking, okay, we need to get a receiver, but just how the board fell.

And that's what above all, what I think the Browns did really well. They let the board fall into them. And it worked out really well where they just drafted good players. And I thought, you know, Cedric Tillman, one of the few true X receivers in this draft. And you look at it, Marry Cooper, maybe only a year, another year in Cleveland after this. We'll see the cap number. No more extra money due. There's a lot of things to work through there.

Donovan People Jones will be a free agent. You know, Elijah Moore, you figure is there for the long haul, but even, you know, he's not an established NFL player just yet. I mean, there's a lot of bodies on that Brown's off wide receiver depth chart, but not anyone that's truly a proven commodity outside of Amari Cooper. And we just don't know how long Amari Cooper will be there. So love the pick to go get Cedric Tillman and excited for what he could be with that organization. We've talked about a lot of good fits. is there one that you think, one player in this draft that you think, okay, he landed in the perfect spot. Maybe it's Devon A chain.

Maybe we already said. Yeah. But any other guys that stick out to you that from a scheme perspective or you just wanted to see this player matched up with this head coach or this position coach or coordinator? We've mentioned a few of them. A chain's a good one. I think Dalton Kincaid and what he's going to mean for that Buffalo Bill's offense is definitely one. But the one that it stands out to me as the fit, I just think it's going to be such a big impact immediately is Jackson Smith and Jigba going to Seattle. I mean, you just, I would have loved to had a camera on Gino Smith when that pick was made.

Like, I just fist pumping. Like, I mean, he's already got paid, so he's got to be feeling good. But now it's all about winning championships. and D.K. Metcalfe and Tyler Lockhart on the outside, you plug in a guy like that. Seattle's been missing that number three receiver. They have not been able to, you know, D.S. Gridge, they drafted highly a couple years ago. He has not been able to really live up to that. Smith and Jigba, you plug him in there.

And, man, I wasn't sure if JSED was going to last until 20. We thought he'd go in that 11 to 20 range. Well, he lasted at 20, first receiver off the ball. board. I just, I love the fit. I think it's something that from day one, he's going to be able to be productive. And then you also factor in Zach Charbonnet in that backfield like we talked about. This offense, man, it's, they've got their tackles, the interior of their offensive lines, got a few question marks. But this offense, if Gino plays at the level that he did last year, maybe even a little bit better, this offense is going to be fun to watch.

Yeah, yeah, I can't wait. I mean, when Jackson Smith and Jigwe got picked and you're thinking, D.K. Metcalf, Tyler Lockett, that is, the Gino Smith reaction is perfect. I mean, I can't even imagine how he's feeling. Because that's, and that's the thing with these quarterbacks is, we always joke about the Aaron Rogers thing, that the Packers would never draft him a weapon. But like the Lamar stuff, the contract stuff with Lamar, that came out on Thursday, the first day of the draft.

Well, and then they picked Zay Flowers for him. Yeah. It's like, here, we picked you some flowers. hours. Talk about a narrative shift. I mean, a week ago, the narrative around the Ravens offense was, I mean, we just don't know, Lamar Jackson, who knows, they had to franchise them back to back. And, you know, but now they lock up Lamar Jackson long term.

You add O'Dell Beckham. You add Nelson Agilor. Rashad Bateman's coming back off injury. And you add in a Zay Flowers. And all of a sudden, the narrative around that Baltimore Ravens offense is completely. completely flipped and it's not if you're you know the browns the bengals or steelers you're you don't love that you don't love to see what the ravens you're able to do last Thursday no but i i think it'll be right this is as we said the browns had a good draft the Steelers did all right as well

yeah they were the other team that had uh i think it was the Steelers and the Bears both had six players from my top 100 um I they they They smartly traded up in front of the Jets to get the tackle Broderick Jones. When that tackle run started, Paris Johnson, then Darnell Wright, Skoronsky, and then to get Broderick Jones. And then, you know, I mean, you're getting Darnell Washington in the late third. Yeah. I mean, you're getting a lot of value with the picks that the Steelers made. The other team, too, that I want to mention is the Packers.

You know, a lot was made with, okay, would they get that receiver or that type of? tight end in the first round. They don't. They make the quintessential Packers pick with Lucas Van Ness. Like, that's fine. Van Ness is a good player. It makes sense. No problem with it.

But then they come back on day two. And they draft two stud tight ends and a receiver with Luke Musgrave, Tucker Craft, and then Jane Reed at Michigan State. And I love those three players in that, with that offense, that scheme specifically. It's just a perfect fit. Yeah. It's so exciting. And everybody, I talked about this on my show, the Andy Staples show,

because this is the part of the year when NFL fans who typically tend to be more cynical than college football fans, this is where they act like college football fans with recruiting because in college, all of the new recruits you have coming in are the best players ever. You know, they're great. And I always explain to people, it's because the people, people who cover recruiting and then those of us who cover college football, we're not going to say mean things about 16 year olds. We're just not.

But it's a little bit different in the NFL. But, man, everybody talking themselves into every single pick. Oh, it's easy. Yeah. It was unbelievable this weekend. And so I realize once mini camps start, everybody start poking holes and everybody else. But I do enjoy this one period of bliss right here where every pick's going to work. Everybody's got a whole, you know,

giant sky full of possibility ahead of them. So I can't wait. So we love the draft. You know, right? It's why we love the draft so much is it represents hope. It represents, you know, a lot of teams got better. I mean, all 32 teams got better, right? They added players.

And so it's now it's a matter of just seeing how it all, how comes to, how it all plays out with training camp. But then once a season gets going, who gets the opportunities, you know, it's going. It's a really fun thing to reflect on. and even going back, you know, a year ago. And how were we feeling about the players in last year's draft? And with the full season, were we right about those guys? What about three years ago?

You know, it's always interesting to do that self-reflective look and just to understand why things worked, why they didn't, and then use that for future scouting to make sure you get these guys right. Well, and I've been interested to hear what some of the GMs have said about their plans for, because, you know, sometimes they are a little cagey about it early on, But like Chris Ballard basically said, they're taking it slow with Anthony Richardson. They don't intend to just dump him into the deep end of the pool and Gardner Minshue is there. And that's probably how they should handle it.

Although I'm sure when they get Anthony Richardson in their building, they're going to be really excited about the things he can do. I mean, this is why you have training camp. I mean, why predetermine when a rookie is going to start? There's no point. This is why you have training camp. Let it play out. if he earns it, great.

Get him on the field and let's see what we have. If he's not quite ready, that's fine. You don't have to rush it if you don't need to. So, you know, I never understand why we get these different proclamations from coaches or even owners who come out and say, oh, he's going to start. I think it's owners more than anything else. More so, yes, definitely. But, you know, I remember when Doug Peterson did this with Carson Wendant,

and, you know, when they drafted him. And it's just like, like, let's let training camp figure this out. You know, we don't need to put any expectations on these guys more so than they already have about when they're going to get on the field. Let's see how they do with, once they get the playbook. Let's see how they do once they get into training camp and have a chance to, you know, get better or get coaching. And so we'll see how that works out with with this crop quarterbacks. Although it will be pretty surprising if Bryce Young, C.J. Stroud, those two guys aren't the stars. starters from day one. I think both are equipped to do so.

You know, with Carolina, Andy Dalton is there where if they, they don't have to put price out there right away, but I just find it very hard to believe he's not the week one quarterback for the Panthers. Yeah, I think you may be right. Meanwhile, you've already turned the page. Before you go on vacation, you drop a little bomb on us, the, the, the, the, 2004 way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way, way too early mock draft. And it's interesting because obviously everyone expects Caleb Williams to be the number one pick in the 2024 draft. I would be shocked if he's not.

This feels like a very Trevor Lawrence type situation where there's just, I mean, Marvin Harrison Jr. is amazing. But Caleb Williams is one of those quarterbacks that it's hard to find any fault with other than, you know, maybe don't paint the cusswords on your nails. And the Cardinals have the first two picks, so they can get the top two guys if they want. Yeah, and that's the thing with Caleb. He, a lot of the reasons we love Bryce Young on the field,

Caleb can do those things, plus he's bigger, quicker, and has a bigger arm. So it's like, okay. Now, obviously, the intangible factor is a big part of this. I mean, Bryce was just off the charts when it comes to intelligence, on the field, is processing, all that stuff. Caleb, it feels like he's up there in terms of his ability to process. Yeah, they're going to like him.

They're going to like meeting him and getting to know him. But that's a little bit of an unknown at this point as we learn, scouts learn more about Caleb Williams, but it feels like that's going to be something that shouldn't get in the way. And same thing with Drake May. It seems like he's on the path of being a top five pick. It seems to other quarterbacks, we'll have to wait and figure out. Quinn Ewers from Texas, who has a...

his special arm can the does a mental part catch up but we even remember he's a redshirt sophomore and he skipped a senior year of high school so technically he's like a wretched freshman right i mean a true sophomore basically yeah i mean he i think he did the quarterback redshirt and that caught him back up with his class but he's uh that that's that's an interesting situation because you were should be good he's got a ton of talent around him i'm going to give you a name that I'm sure some of your college football, the college football listeners will know, but the NFL folks may not have heard.

Malik Murphy. So he is the backup quarterback at Texas. And everybody's like, aren't in Archmanning the backup? No, Archmanning is not ready to be the backup yet. Malik Murphy. He's big, right? Big and huge.

Yeah. Very Joe Milton. Not quite Anthony Richards. Anthony Richardson set on a different level in terms of athleticism. But Malik is very similar. physically maybe is bigger, I think, even than Joe Milton, who's the quarterback at Tennessee. California kid? Yep, yep.

And so if Quinn gets hurt or for some reason is not performing well, Malik's the guy you're going to see there at Texas. And now he's not draft eligible next year. But it's a very interesting situation there because Ewers is, you know, we saw him Alabama. He looks so good. He gets hurt in that game. He comes back.

His footworks just all off. So that's, but he's one, if he fixed everything in the off season, he could blow up this year with the guys he's throws, Xavier Worthy, their tight end is fantastic. He was in the mock. Yeah. So, I mean, it's a really interesting situation at Texas. And then you've got J.J. McCarthy from Michigan at 15, which I like J.J. McCarthy a lot.

he was never really relied upon to win a game through the air until the Ohio State game. And then he did a really good job. He showed he has that capability. But I did want to ask you about because if the Cardinals wind up with the number one pick. Yeah. You can't not take Caleb Williams. You have to. But that's, you hate Kyler Murray.

I mean, how does one franchise bungle quarterback so much? Like you draft Josh Rosen in the top 10. The next year you're like, oh, we messed that up. We're taking Kyler-Marie. And now you've paid Kyler Murray, and you may stink, and you really can't turn this guy down if you're the number one pick. If Caleb Williams was in this draft, the Bears don't trade out. They take them.

They take Caleb. Yeah. I mean, if you have a chance to get better, a quarterback, clearly better, you do it. You don't have a choice. And if the Cardinals are picking number one, then obviously, I mean, Kyler's obviously with the injury, that's, he's going to miss a little bit of time. But even, you know, if they're picking that high where they could have a chance of Caleb Williams and something was off with the quarterback position to begin with. So there's financial repercussions here if they did that.

But to get to reset the quarterback clock and get a guy, a talent like Caleb Williams, they don't have a choice in my opinion if they are drafting that high. So that will be really interesting domino in all of this. Just how that plays itself out. Well, they let the Caleb Williams, Drake May sweepstakes begin. Yeah. Dane, incredible draft cycle for you. Thank you. I just want to say thank you to you, Andy, for coming on, you know,

kind of steering the ship this year for prospects to pros and, you know, all season. Your wealth of knowledge has been. been awesome for the show. And so thank you very much for everything you brought to it, having Lance. And then just it's been, it's been a really good season of the podcast. And so I'm, I'm excited to run it back next season. And it is a lot of fun. So thank you. Oh, my pleasure. This has been the most fun part of my week. And I love breaking all this stuff down. And it's great to, because I, you know, cover these guys from one angle to see how people view them from a a different angle.

And it's, I mean, helps me in my day job, too. So this has been awesome. And also shout out Marissa. Yeah. That's right. Our producer. All the, all the background stuff behind the scenes that you don't think to see, but she's been invaluable as well.

So thank you. Yeah. So, Dane, you are going on vacation. Hopefully there's an ample supply of Mountain Dew where you're going. And we did undisclosed. We'll keep it off the radar. And have fun. Get ready. Beast, Beast 2024 is due in about, about 10 months.

Ready or not? It's coming. Got to start. Thanks, guys. We will talk to you again very soon. This was The Athletic Football Show.