The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Prospects to Pros: Jayden Daniels rises, and a check-in on the 2024 WR, TE and RB classes

Episode Date: November 15, 2023

Jayden Daniels is putting together an incredible season for LSU, and it just might have his draft stock on the rise. Nate Tice and Dane Brugler dig into Daniels' play on this episode of The Athletic Football Show's Prospects to Pros. They also dive deep on the 2024 receiver, tight end and running back classes.Follow Nate on Twitter: @Nate_TiceFollow Dane on Twitter: @dpbruglerSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTubeThis episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Find your bright spot this season, with BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp dot com slash MAYS today to get 10% off your first month.Right now, you can try LinkedIn Sales Navigator and get a sixty-day free trial at LinkedIn dot com slash MAYS23. That is LinkedIn dot com slash MAYS23 for a 60-day free trial. Let LinkedIn Sales Navigator help you sell like a superstar today! Just go to LinkedIn dot com slash MAYS23 and get started. New to Etsy? Use the code HOLIDAY10 for ten percent off your first purchase. That’s code HOLIDAY10. Maximum discount value of fifty dollars. Expires December 31st, 2023. See terms at Etsy dot com slash terms. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic football show's Prospects to Prospects to Pros. Hello, welcome to Prospects to Pros presented by Invesco QQ, the official ETF of the NCAA. I am your host, Nate Tice. Today, going to be going over an LSU, like blockbuster performance against Florida, and a couple of players involved with that. Also breaking down some of the offensive skill positions, outside quarterback, outside the offense of line. Don't have Brandon Thorne here for the offense of line talk. But to do help me do that, to go over the receivers,

running backs and tight ends. Give you a little bit of an update. As always, is Mr. Big Board himself. Dane Bruegler. How are you doing today, Dane? I'm doing well. We're getting close to a holiday season here with Thanksgiving. Yes.

The air is a little colder. It's kind of great. I love this time of year. I get to middle November. So I imagine the air is not as cold there for you in Vegas. But here in Northeast Ohio, it certainly is. We got these, we get the cold, night time. Okay.

So as soon as that sun goes down, it's like turning off the oven. But the sun is deceptively hot, not deceptively. We live in the desert. We know that. But the sun still can get hot. So you'll be like, oh, it's 48 degrees in the morning. All right. I'm going to go do something in the middle of day.

I'll have a sweatshirt, sweatpants on. And it's like, oh, it's only 63, but the sun just pops you. So you actually get a little bit more sweat than you think. But yeah, we got a little crisp winters. or here you might get a little snow. It's snow the first time I moved here or first year I lived here, so, which I was just kind of like, really, I'm going to move to Vegas and it snows. I can't escape this.

So it's kind of nice, though. All the weather is pretty nice here. The sun is deceptively hot, like Tyree kills deceptively fast pretty much. Yeah. It was like when I moved here and it was like, oh, there's mountains around. Oh, Las Vegas Valley. Valley. That's right.

Yes, yes. I know. Well, I said, speaking of Tyree Kill, I was walking. into the living room yesterday and my son was watching Dolphins Broncos. I'm like, wait, they didn't play yesterday. What is going? He's watching Red Zone from week three. And I was like, what are you doing? Like, he's like, oh, I had a birthday party this day, so I didn't get to watch these games. So I'm just going through him. I was like, you're eight. What are you doing? Like, this is, this is two months

ago. I was like, oh my gosh, what have I done to my son? I've passed on my just diabolical genes. And I don't know if that's a good thing. So just the status. obsession, highlight obsession. Oh, yeah. I know. Oh, that's, it's a good and scary thing. I know that type as someone that was reading draft reports in fifth grade and watching the draft and doing all that stuff. So, speaking to which, actually, let's talk to some college prospects. We had, so today, today, this weekend, LSU went up for how many yards and how many explosive plays against Florida, and they feature several NFL prospects at their offensive skill position. So I don't know if you want to start with the receivers or the quarterback, the trigger man for that LSU offense, Dane, because they are all playing pretty well right now.

Yeah, I mean, let's start with Jaden Daniels because he deserves to be talked about more. I mean, he did things in that game Saturday night that no one's ever done before. That's pretty crazy. So 350 yards over 350 years passing, over 200 yards rushing. He is a playmaker. And look, it's not an apples to apples comparison to Lamar Jackson, but that's a name that came up a few times talking to scouts because of the way defenses have to game plan for you when you can be such a threat with your legs but can also win from the pocket. He has gotten better and better as a passer. Being in the same scheme, the same system two years in a row now is a big part of that.

at Arizona State, he had that really nice freshman year and then COVID happened and then they changed schemes his third year. It was the same coaching staff, but still what they were doing, the scheme was different. What they asked him to do was different. Had his worst year, that third year. Then he transfers to LSU did really well last year. Had showed some nice improvements. And then this year, just taking another jump in what he did. And I mean, he was, he made my top 50 a couple weeks ago, my updated top 50.

And it just, his draft. projection feels a lot like Deshawn Watson's was coming out of Clemson, where it's like, okay, because remember, we weren't talking about him as, Deshawn Watson is a slam dunk first round pick. No. Like we were talking about him, and I say we, I mean, a collective we. Yeah, NFL teams. Yeah, exactly.

All of us on the outside, everyone in the league. Collectively, we were talking about him as, you know, a top 50 guy, but maybe an early two, maybe he gets in the first round. I weren't really sure exactly where Deshawn Watson was going to go, even though he had this tremendous resume. And then lo and behold, he ends up going 12 overall. And so that feels kind of the same way with Jane Daniels where he's really good and he's going to go somewhere in the top 50.

It's just, I'm not sure where right now, this early in the process, could maybe slip to the second round, could very easily sneak into the top 20. Nothing should surprise us, especially at this point. We're not even Thanksgiving yet. Nothing should surprise us this early about how early he could go, especially coming off a game like he had against Florida. And then I tweeted this and it went viral yesterday. The number of explosive plays is ridiculous.

And most of it's with his arm. As good as he is with his legs, he has 76 plays this year of over 20 yards or more. That's 19 more than number two in the list, which is Michael Pennix. but of the 76, only 16, so it's, what, 61 passing, 16 with his legs. So it's not like he's just, you know, doing everything with his legs. Most of what he's doing is with his arm. And so really impressive to watch. Obviously, the offense, the receivers play a big part of that.

We'll talk more about those guys soon. But, I mean, yeah, basically that's but the long way of saying Jane Daniels deserves we talked about more. and the more you watch him, the more you appreciate him, the more appreciate what he's doing, the offense as a whole, he understands what they're trying to do. He understands what the play call is trying to execute,

and he is able to make it happen. And so there are still times where he maybe moves on from a read too quickly or the accuracy is good, maybe not great, but it's good. So there's still room for plenty of improvement here. but what he has shown up to this point hard not to be impressed. Yeah. And it's a great reminder. This position's so hard.

Just to play and to evaluate. And what you said about having continuity with the play caller. And it's huge. You know, Kelly's Kelly and people can joke about it. It's like he runs some good offense and stuff. That's what he is known for. And now he has a trigger man that's willing to push the ball when it's needed. He can be selectively aggressive.

And again, that's always going to be the number one thing. I kind of like when I watch a guy. He's faster. I swear, he's faster than he used to be. Like, he might not have gotten bigger, but he definitely has gotten stronger or at least more athletic or more explosive, something. There's been some training happening because he's always been a fine mover, but it's like, now he just gets to the edge.

He outraces angles when he's running up the middle. And that's kind of right through. Those runs that he had against Florida are legit. Florida's a defense full of athletes, okay? He didn't do this against Army or, you know, rambling, a couple of, other teams they had in the LSU scheduled this year. He's doing this against SEC defenses. And it's funny.

His, so his dad is a former college football player played corner. So looking at him, it kind of makes sense, right? That slender build, but also with the way he moves, the quick feet and some of the speed, that acceleration that he has, really impressive. And, you know, I think his dad wanted him to be a corner, but he always gravitated towards quarterback growing up. And, you know, the rest is kind of history. But yeah, it's, I agree with you.

Some type of training has helped to become a more explosive athlete. Yeah. No, but he's, I think you nailed it on the head is that I, when you had him to top 50, I was like, okay, now I've gone to watch them a little bit more. And it's great. Again, better competition that you want to watch. He's just, he doesn't make a lot of mistakes, even if he is chaotic. That makes us, we, I've compared him a giant Knoxville or he, like, one of those types of

quarterbacks. But as a, like, progressing from the pocket. very sound like good eyes great timing like he throws those i mean they run so many slot fades but like just all the time that ball comes out of it too so good dropping the bucket i mean it's yes those are layered throws and that's a very real throw mar you just compare to lamar lamar mar's thrown to like six of those in the last two weeks right like just those are real NFL throws you have to make or at least get 50 50 shot at those um yes he has some talented receivers but i think he's just an excellent trigger man and the traits outside of size

he does he has enough traits that it's like this is fine to kind of keep him up here it's not just a production thing it's like actually like he's a good athlete so that overcomes some of the size stuff you know weight wise um i think his arm strength would be above average to good but i have no qualms with it because he makes every throw and he operates on time so it's not a hindrance uh maybe some other guys it and again like he's athletic he creates but he operates in on time and in structure he can do both already so he looks like a fit like he looks how a fifth year player should look. You know, like he looks like a senior operating an offense that he's been in. It's like, that's kind of refreshing to see sometimes in these college offenses. Like, you don't get that a lot.

So, yeah, I'm all, I'm all on board. I really like him. I kind of like where you have him slotted. And I kind of agree with that kind of look at him. Yeah. And it's, you know, we've talked about quarterback three a lot, right? Yeah. J.J. McCarthy. And, you know, we should probably touch on JJ McCarthy coming off the Penn State game. We talked about it so much, how important it was. And then, you know, the game plan was... The brush aside. Yeah, okay, let's do 30 rushes in a row here. Of course.

That's how it always goes, man. Me and Robert, how many times you've broken down games? It's just the complete opposite. It's like, all right, well, it wasn't expecting that game plan. They're coming out of bye. Sorry. Right, right. With Daniels, I mean, I agree with everything you said.

And then two are the things that really stood out to me just when studying his game. First is the release. It is so quick and it gets out so... Consistent. It is. is and there's a rhythm of what he's doing. But then two, his internal clock is a lot better. It's not like it's one read, okay, drop my eyes and then I'm going to scramble and make something happen. He works the pocket and his feel for that internal clock about when the walls

are closing in, he will stay tough in the pocket until the last possible moment. And so this is not a guy that wants to be a scrambler and necessarily and use his legs when he doesn't have to, but he can. And so it's nice that he wants to be a pass first player. That's how his mind works. And so he is processing very quickly and making these split second decisions and making the right decisions. So very slithery in the pocket. And when there's a window, he will go make something happen and did that over and over and over again on that Florida tape. Yeah, I know. Let's talk about, I mean, God, man, he makes some real throws. He's just a joy to watch. He's just like, there's a lot of fun quarterbacks right now. We've talked about all year,

but it's like he's just a really fun, just because he has some of that chaos to him, but again, it's organized chaos, which I like. Really, really quick. Let's just touch on quarterback three because, again, we've talked about this since the summer with, you know, Drake and Caleb. I wanted that anointe just got bench, Tyler Van Dyke, and he's coming back because of an injury. He was banged up. He had a bat. Do you see all the injuries listed for him? It was like finger, back, hip, and one other thing, shoulder.

Oh, that's it? Oh, okay. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. Rope some dirt on it. Look, he's, yeah, the quarterback three remains wide open. And the guy that we thought had a chance to maybe put a really strong foot forward, J.G. McCarthy going up against Penn State at Penn State.

I mean, he was seven of eight to start the game, and then he didn't attempt a single, he'd say attempted one pass in the second quarter, and it was a PI, so officially didn't happen. But, and I fought a lot of wars on Twitter on Saturday about, hearing from people how they don't trust him, obviously, you know, if they trusted him, if he was really a first-round quarterback, they would have let him throw.

What are we doing? Like, Penn State really couldn't stop what Michigan was doing on the ground. No. What's Penn State strength or pass rush? What do you do to negate it? Just hand the ball off to your two NFL running backs. And if Penn State's offense could get a first down and really threaten you at all, then we would have seen Michigan do something, but they didn't have to.

Why would you possibly move away from your game plan and just running the ball? Right. And they couldn't stop. And yeah, I mean, it's not like Michigan, they had a pun a few times, sure. But when you have an offense on the other side like Penn States that can't do anything, you're not scared about that. And anybody that's watched Michigan football over the last, I don't know, 60 years understands this is how they operate. Jim Harbaugh, when he became head coach, there's a run first team.

So this is a total game plan thing. I mean, J.G. McCarthy is averaging 25 pass attempts a game. He was considered a Heisman favorite going into that game. You're telling me they all of a sudden they just don't trust them. I mean, he's having a great year. So, yeah, it's a lot of bad takes with the, uh, They obviously don't trust them to throw the football. It's one of those where beforehand, Rick, oh, I can't wait to evaluate this game.

All right, we'll just put a pen in it. We'll just go to the next one because there's going to be, you know, other opportunities to see them checking the rock. That's why it's the whole season. And it is frustrating as an evaluator. Oh, yeah. Look, the Michigan coaches, their job is not to, there you go. The job of the Michigan coaches is not to showcase their top NFL prospects, you know, for us. Like, that's not their job.

their job is to win games and that's exactly what they did. But it does put a lot more on that Ohio State matchup coming up here in a week and a half. And it shouldn't necessarily, you know, like we know a lot about JJ McCarthy already. But if he plays really well or say he doesn't play really well, you know, it's a lot will be made off of that performance. And then what happened if they do win, obviously the Big Ten championship game and the playoffs. So, yeah, JJ McCarthy, it still feels like a work in progress.

We're still learning about him. Quinn Ewers came back in that Texas offense. He's obviously still someone worth talking about, but another guy that his evaluation feels incomplete. Who else? Those guys all feel like they just, the needle sideways for me. And it felt like Daniels was the one that's like the needle moved up,

as opposed to those guys. Like, oh, I'm flopping all of them. It's like, no, those guys, just, you know, just like we got, we got to wait. We got to wait. And I would throw Carson back in there too, Georgia. Yeah. Oh my God. Just keeps getting better. Yeah. I'm glad to include him in my top 50 because he is actually deserved it. And he has played like a future NFL starter. So, you know, we'll see if he ultimately decides to go back to school. Wouldn't be surprised. He's, he's young for a red shirt junior. You see the pedigree with him like that,

like you're really seeing it now. He throws a, he throws some real deal like seeing. and vendors and stuff. He's another guy that plays on time. You know, he just, the game, as the game speeds up, he doesn't, his eyes don't speed up. He still plays under control. And that's so key.

And obviously they've got to, you know, they beat Ole Miss with, you know, what they did on the ground. As good to see Brock Bowers back. I'm sure we'll talk about him more here with this conversation. But, um, okay, just wanted to talk about quarterback three real quick. Just a kind of a quick update as we continue to,

I mean, I don't want to say Jane Daniels is now the favorite to be quarterback three, but it's a much more possible outcome. He's making the best case right now. Yeah, it's a much more possible outcome than I think we gave credit earlier in the year. That's for sure. I thought I was done with my evaluation with him. I'm not going to like, not really.

Like you obviously keep watching these guys, but I was like, okay, how much can he like keep improving or how much? And it's like a lot, it turns out he was already had a nice base on it. It turns out he can keep getting better. So yeah, good on him. But the receivers that he has. I was just going to say, let's talk about his receiver. Because another guy you gave a very high grade on on your last big board, not only Malik neighbors, who has had some pub even going into the season. That's kind of the battle after Marvin Harrison Jr.

But Brian Thomas, the other LSU receiver, which, yeah, I'm seeing what you see, Dane. And I went back and watched a few of his games. And he is right. Oh, he is so up my alley. So, yeah, but I want to hear you kind of rattle off these LSU receivers because they were both very fun. Well, yeah, with Brian Thomas, I got a lot of questions after he was 24 in the top 50 a couple weeks ago. And, you know, oh, does he really, he's a top 25 guy. Like, yeah.

It's pretty simple. He's big. He's strong. He's long. And he can run. Like, it's not overthink it with Brian Thomas. Okay. This guy, he moves a lot quicker and faster than you would expect a guy that size to move.

Watching him against Florida consistently win vertically. There are a couple of throws. that were actually a little bit behind him that if they were out in front, he scores the touchdown. My favorite play, he had a career high, 150 receiving yards in that game against Florida.

My favorite play was not one of those catches. It was the 85-yard touchdown run. And I have an LSU film room on the athletic right now that you can go see this play that I'm talking about. There was an 85-yard touchdown run that Jay and Daniels had. It was his own read. And, you know, so with Brian Thomas,

he's at the bottom of the screen. He doesn't know what's going on behind him. he just, he's reading the corner. His job is to block the corner. All of a sudden, the corner starts taking off. And he outraces him down the field, shows off that speed, finishes that block to really, you know, to find the finishing touch on that long touchdown run for Jane Daniels.

But it's just a great example of not only the speed that he's just simply outrunning this corner, but the want to, the competitiveness. And so it was a great, he had a pop-pass touchdown that kind of put the game away for LSU. I mean, it was a great performance from Brian Thompson. Thomas. As a route runner, he's still a work in progress. There's still nuance to his game that he needs to develop. And one thing that I think really important for him is just to learn to be more available as a receiver, getting his head turned around quicker, adjusting to, okay, I turn this way, but it's to put my other shoulder. Okay, I need to adjust. Just being more available as a receiver or something. Tied to that route running kind of with the tag of his hand in hand, yeah.

Right. And so it's, and he's a young receiver. So it's, he's a young receiver. so it's all things that he's going to develop over time. But again, when you're 6-4 and you're consistently getting behind the defense because of your vertical speed, but you also have the competitiveness. I mean, it shows as a blocker, it shows in his routes.

So big fan of Brian Thomas, and I think, you know, we talk about quarterback three. We talk about wide receiver two. Wide receiver two is, there's a lot of names in that tier of who's going to be the second receiver drafted. And Brian Thomas brings something different than,

you know, Malik neighbors brings that amooka Buka brings to the, you know, so it just depends on what type of receiver you're looking for. But if both these receivers, Malik neighbors, Brian Thomas end up being top 25 picks and two of the first five receivers drafted, that should not surprise anybody. At all. No, I'm 100% with you. Thomas is, I love both. I actually really like both of these receivers because one, what is so neater right now with

receivers right now is explosive place. How do you create them? Can you either beat defenses over the top or can you create a little bit after the catch? And both of these guys can. Neighbors being more of that Z, traditional almost Z vertical guy. I don't know how this is kind of describe it. Like, yeah, but he can catch some of those bubbles and turn up the field. But Thomas has more bend to him than I anticipated for such a big framed guy.

And usually when you think six four vertical, okay, got it. Mike Williams. Got it. Yeah. That's what you picture in your head. He has more, yeah, bend when he has the ball in his hands. he can get the corner when he's like working outside, you know, when he's trying to work to the sideline with the ball in his hands or on routes. So even though the route running, I'm with you, I think he's a, yeah, I'll put him around averageish route runner at this point underneath on underneath.

Work in progress. Yeah. Yeah. It's just that he has the traits in the ability and like you said, competitiveness, competitiveness. You're kind of reading between the lines with it. That's like, oh, but that can improve. It's not like where it's like, oh, he's not, you know, Alec Pierce where I'm like, oh, he's never going to be able to run. comeback routes, like, because he just can't turn. Like, he can turn. So I, I'm all bored this one. Yeah, great shout out by you. Well, he's kind of like a less flashy key on Coleman, you know? Like he's, Coleman's got these ridiculous highlight plays. But, you know, Thomas, he's probably a little bit faster too. Um, it doesn't have some of the highlights, but he's still making big plays. That's for sure. Yeah, I 100% with, you know, the explosive plays. Nobody has more explosive plays as a receiver than Malik neighbors this year. And he had a few more against Florida.

He really showed off his yak. 70% of his yards, he had like 135 receiving yards. 70% of those came after the catch, showing that ability to make a guy miss, to show that toughness and power through. So he is just such a glider. He's not a big guy. He's going to be right around six foot, right around 200 pounds. But he's so controlled with his feet, he can win early.

early. He can win late. And he's reliable down the field, the way he tracks the football. So he's got, I think every single game, he's got at least one catch of 20 plus yards. And of all of his receptions, 80% are going for touchdowns or first downs. Anything over 70% is really, really good. He's going over 80%. So this is a guy that led to SEC in catches last year might do it again this year. So Malik Neighbors, and obviously he's.

Just like these receivers are helping out the quarterback. Having a quarterback like Jaden Daniels helps out these receivers. Yes. But, I mean, let's make no mistake about it. These guys are NFL guys and neighbors. Keon-Colman was wide receiver two in my top 50. Malik Neighbors is right there. I mean, no one should bat an eye if Malik Neighbors ends up being that second receiver drafted.

He has that type of skill set both with his ability to get open, with his ability to create after the catch. He is just dynamic. dynamic. Accelerate, decelerate on command. I mentioned with Thomas how he needs to become

more available. That's where I think neighbors really kind of, that's a difference between these two guys. Neighbors is a little further along. Yeah. And he's, he seems like he's just more available,

uh, getting open and then with the catch point skills. So I agree. He is a playmaking Z at the next level. Um, a little bit different than maybe some other Zs because I think he's just, there's more to him. But,

um, yeah, be a true playmaker, no doubt about it. Yeah, like, most Zs you picture are just kind of those underneath zone beaters. Like, you know, those five to 10 yards, that's where they work, which are also very useful. But just, when you take a guy high, you kind of want, you know, some juice. See what some of these guys to take to the house?

Devonte Smith, kind of like that, you know, where he's a Z, but a little bit more than that, you know, not just the, yeah. Could be an X in some world. It's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I told you. Yeah. I pictured, to me, the Z is Nate Burleson, like, just because where I grew up. So, you know, but that six foot, 190 pound to 200 pound guy, that's a pretty good route runner, good against zone.

But you had it in your updated big board. I believe you had six guys in your top 31, including Troy Franklin. I believe, or is that seven, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, seven, including Troy Franklin. I believe in your top 31. And yeah, I'm right there with you. I think all these guys are legitimate first round types and some fun flavors. And like we've talked about a few times is, you know, Marvin Harrison Jr. neighbors, Thomas Adunze from Washington.

Keon Coleman, obviously from Florida State. But Troy Franklin from Oregon is like some size. These are Xs. These are vertical Zs. These are guys that actually can win one-on-ones and zone and take it to the house. So it's a really, really fun group. Are there any other guys that have maybe impressed you lately that maybe you haven't given a shout-up before on the show other than our guy, Lad, McConkey?

Can I talk about lad again? You sure can. I love talking about lad. He's another pleasure to watch. Oh my gosh. He's so much fun. He's, again, Sy's not going to impress you at all. I just talked about all these guys with size.

And it's like, well, but here's the one that's like, I understand why to like this guy. Right. Well, I was finishing my Brock Bowers report, Sky Report, last night. And so I was watching the Auburn tape. And McConkey had this one route where his ability. to gear down. I mean, he is pushing this route vertical and then just on a dime, controls himself and just breaks off a 90-degree route to the outside, to the sideline.

And it's just like, the corner fell over. He was on the ground. His, that short area burst. He also has the long speed. Yeah, Ladmanconki is the real deal. And he's got a real feel for how to run routes, how to, you know, just the spatial relationships between him and the coverage. you know, not to break too early, not too late.

And when you have a quarterback that's on the same page, man, it is fun to watch. And so that's where McConkey and Beck are right now. I get it with McConkey. He's not, the size is going to bother a lot of teams, but he can give you a lot. So yeah, definitely one. This class because he's the different flavor. You know, it's like last year, like a Cedric Tillman is going to get a little bit of a boost because it's like, what are our axes are we in draft?

So it's like, you know, on this class, it's like, okay, he's, all right, We got kind of maybe the shifty underneath guy. Like, it actually has a little bit more juice. So, all right. I can see a team really loving them if they have some size, you know. So Xavier Worthy had a nice game. You know, he's, the size with him is going to be an issue as well because he's, he's taller. You know, he's probably be right around six foot.

But he's 165 pounds. I mean, he is really, really small. But again, we've seen these guys, whether it's two to out well or Tank Dell. guys that, you know, the weight does not look impressive. We've seen these guys be playmakers at times in the NFL. So, were these going to be really interesting? A couple of these seniors, we've talked about Malachi Corley from Western Kentucky. The Debo comparisons are going to be all over with him.

Really like Roman Wilson from Michigan, obviously didn't get a chance to see him do much against Penn State because they didn't throw the football. Xavier Leggett from South Carolina, another one who, you know, he's big. fans. Yeah, he's 6-1, 220 pounds, and, you know, he's got speed. So this is a really good receiver class. And we'll see what other underclassmen come out. We just talked about, you know, the 10 that were in my top 50. But then you've got a few interesting guys, you know, our guy in North Carolina State, Walker, who just missed my top 50. I mean, he's probably going to come out. Him and Drake May had some nice connections in that win over Duke on Saturday night, which was a lot of. a fun to watch. That game was boggars. It really was. Muhammad, Moose Muhammad from Texas A&M.

Obviously he's got NFL bloodlines, you know, with the coaching staff and everything going on there. He may end up declaring a big fan of Sturt event at UCLA. That passing game. Yeah, I was wondering what you said. What did you think about, which is like an updated look? Because I know you kind of were like, hey, he's interesting. He's very interesting in the preseason.

So I'm curious. Yeah. Played my flag on him in the summer for sure. And he, because he transferred over from Cal to UCLA. and I know the UCLA coaches love him. But, you know, the passing game at UCLA has not really been able to feature him as much as I think he deserves to be. So we haven't seen that, but still, the talent is there. He can be a day two pick.

So it's, it was good to see Johnny Wilson back for Florida State too. You know, when Keon Coleman and Johnny Wilson are both out there. It's just obviously a different FSU offense in that Miami game. Yeah. God, you just keep going on and on. about a, I just had a, because I looked up his stats last week, because I feel like he's just always just putting something up or at least, oh, no, he didn't actually recently. But yeah, Tori Holton from, from Colorado State.

But he, I managed to watch him against UNLV, and I was like, oh, there he goes again. There's another, I think, I believe you had more like a third, fourth round type. So I just had a kind of check him out again. Now, going on to the other past catchers, we, you mentioned that you just kind of wrote up Brock Bowers or, you know, taking a look at him. Any other tight ends have stood out to you outside of Brock Bowers? But I mean, we should just start with him. Obviously, I mean, just he's good.

Yeah, it's pretty good. We can move on? It was good to see him back on the field. It was. It's like that's hell, man. Yeah, those tight rope ankle injuries or four to six week injuries. He missed two games. Okay.

It is funny, after the game, Kirby Smart, they asked them, you know, like, did you talk to Brock about maybe sitting out and, you know, shutting it down. And Brock said he got calls from agents and other people saying, hey, you know, maybe take it easy. And Kirby said it pissed him off. Like he was like, oh, well, I'm coming back earlier now. Like, he just, he just wants to play. And so obviously it's like catnip for NFL team to hear stuff like that.

Yeah, they love that. And Bowers had a touchdown and, you know, didn't have his normal explosive game that you But, I mean, first game back still looked good, still looks fast. I mean, his ability to win with speed and physicality is just, it's awesome. The ball skills are great. After the catch, he's fantastic. He's just so unique and versatile. And I get the, again, we talked about before, the, you don't draft tight ends in the top 10 and blah, blah, blah, I get it.

I totally get it. But if you have an offensive play caller who is dedicated to featuring. this type of versatile talent, I would not hesitate to draft him in the top 10. But again, your offensive play caller has to be on board. He has to have a plan. He has to understand like, okay, we can use him in a slot. We can use it as a wing. We can use them in line. But this is how we're going to use him. And it's funny watching that, again, I was watching that Auburn tape specifically. The entire offense at Georgia goes through Brock Bowers. If he's not, if he's not the preferred read, he's a decoy route. And you can tell when he's the decoy route, because he doesn't

turn his head. He's just running these routes down the field and you see three defenders go towards him and he doesn't even turn his head. He doesn't even look because he knows I'm clearing something out for loud. I'm clearing something out for these other guys. And so he is a true, true difference maker. Yeah, top 10 pick. I'll be shocked if he's not a top 10 pick, put it that way. I would be too. Yeah, I think he's just so dynamic. He's a classic draft player in opposition type of guy. And you're drafting him. Because also how teams are switching around, they use tight ends blocking has really changed how I'm looking at F-only tight ends. And kind of more of those hybrid guys, of course, Kincaid, we've talked about with the

bills, but Leporto with the Lions, even Evan Ingram with the Jaguars, just how teams are getting a little more creative and they're figuring out different ways to mitigate it or make it easier. And so it's maybe, it's really eased my one huge concern. Obviously, it's like, oh, yeah, he's not a Y tight end, which is what you want to value more, but it's like, he's such a dynamic receiving threat that I'm like, yeah, yeah. Top 10. Like, I'm fine with this because like you said, he can run off routes because he's fast enough. So you can truly use him as a pass catcher, not just a tight end. So yeah, I'm all born on the Brock Bowers height. He's, he's fantastic.

Yeah. Yeah. And we'll see what other underclassmen come out. We, uh, Ben Sinit, Kansas State. He, uh, accepted his invitation to the senior bowl. So we'll get a chance to see him there. He's, I mean, a fun player, former, former walk on who is useful. Six sport player in high school Did a little bit of everything And he's still just You know Kind of underrated with the way he can impact the game Yeah very useful We'll see some of these other guys who comes out

It's not a great tight end class Outside of Bowers You know Jatio and Santers in Texas We'll see but you know he's a guy that didn't make my top 50 I'm still like Cade Stover a lot from Ohio State I mean he's a guy both of both of us really like Yeah he missed a few games banged up And he still doesn't look 100% out there

but did a nice job against Michigan State Saturday night. I think he's still in that third, fourth round range. Not a guy really considered for the top 50. Again, if you're going to take a tight end in the top 50, he better be a Brock Bowers type or a really good all-around player. And Kate Stover is more of your Trey McBride, you know, just that type of tight end who's a good player,

but I don't think teams are going to value him as early as the top 50. So, and that's nothing against him. It's just, that's the position value of, you know, the way he plays, the position and, you know, his talent. So he's still going to be a guy that can be an NFL starter. Both Penn State tight ends I like, Theo Johnson, Tyler Warren, Bryson-Nesbitt for North Carolina, had a nice game. He had a really nice catch in late in the fourth quarter from Drake, a touchdown. So good to see him make some plays.

But yeah, this is a tight end class that outside of Bowers, it's hard to get really excited about. It's going to be a tight end class where it's like, can't wait to see the testing. Okay, which guy should have maybe peek out a little bit more. And wait. How big is he really, you know? Length. Yeah, right, right. Yeah, which makes sense for tight ends.

It's just, I think Bowers is the one that's like the easiest you can see his role. Stover, special teams coaches are going to love them. because he'll just run run fast and hit somebody. Yeah, he can go do that. But yeah, I'm with you. The Titan class, I'm waiting for kind of maybe another kind of why to step up to like really kind of latch on to. But like watching even like a stover and then seeing the difference between him like Rucker from a few years ago.

It's like, okay, Rucker I could project a little bit easier almost because that was a why. Like that was a guy in line. I could see the flashes of blocking you if he wasn't always great. So that was an easier projection at least. I want to move on to the other somewhat disappointing offensive skill position to the running backs. Yeah. Because that is, that's another position that kind of seems like maybe a guy to wait out, but it seems more of a super role player heavy class. But right now in November, what are your feelings about the runback class, Dane?

Well, none of these running backs made my top 50. And it's, I think I mentioned it on that show, but it's only happened once ever. where we had a running back not going to top 50 picks. So history says somebody's going to sneak in there, but especially now with this Jonathan Brooks injury, he's sidelined with the ACL. With that, I think Brooks was trending towards being running back one or running back two in this draft.

He was going to go high among these running backs. Now with him sideline with that injury, that, you know, it's another running back that's not going to go that early. So, Trey Benson and, to me, two guys, Trey Benson from Florida State and then Treyvion Henderson in Ohio State. These two guys are really, really talented with Treyvon Henderson. I mean, he was a five-star guy, was the guy on campus as a freshman. But he's been so banged up.

And it's really interesting with, I mean, how you factor in these injuries because he was banged up last year. And you could tell he missed several games earlier this year. you could tell. But when he's in that, he's on the field. That Ohio State offense looks completely different. It makes a huge difference. So he's a big play way going to happen.

And Trey Benson is kind of the same thing. He had a nice touchdown against Miami where at the line of scrimmage, lateral cuts, contact balance, and then speed does the rest. He has a lot of traits that say, okay, yeah, that'll work at the next level. And then even catching the football. Both these guys, Henderson and Benson, they are very, very good, especially on like swing screens and wheels where they don't have to stop their momentum and they can just catch in stride and keep going and not slow down. They could be real weapons.

So right now, I think Trey Benson and Trayvon Henderson are kind of the top two guys at the running back position. But it's, I think that we're going to have a lot of split opinions. You know, some guys are going to like the Michigan players, Donovan Edwards and Blake Corum. Braylin Allen is still a part of this conversation even though he's been banged up and hasn't had the season many thought he would but the thing with Braylin Allen too is

he's 19 years old he's so young and he won't be he'll be 20 in January so his entire rookie year in the NFL he'll be 20 years old that's crazy so there are running backs to like in this class there

but it's hard to find running backs that you truly love and say oh yeah I would take this guy in the top 50, not think twice about it. But it is a decent group of talent based on these underclassmen coming out. A lot of twos. That's what kind of feels like. But useful.

Yeah. Committee guys and, you know, guys that can be valuable. Sure, yeah. Do you have a favorite of this group? I mean, Benson's kind of working his way up just like, because he's at least explosive and he has size, even if sometimes the vision can come and go. I always think he has ways to mitigate that. So, like, you know, I, okay, there's a, it's a sliding scale for me for vision.

If you, like, you can bounce out. Like, James Cook is maybe a decent example. Sometimes he'll bounce stuff. Like a lot of fast guys do. But I think Benson also has size, which I usually like. And you mentioned a past sketching. So it's like his role, it's like, you can't kind of screw that up. I think no matter what, a team's going to find use for that.

So he's kind of going that way. But like you said, these guys are all like late. third fourth rounders to me, like as opposed to like a guy that you're saying even top 50. It's like, oh man, even top 70, like top 80s kind of getting a little dicey for some of these. Benson I could see up there. Alan has size, which I'm always going to be fine with. And I think enough speed to be kind of a nice efficient runner. You know, maybe I think he's a little better than this, but maybe that AJ Dylan type role, you know, where he's just size.

And again, he's the, he's the hammerhead. But he's got some finesse and nice feet to him a little, a little bit. But yeah, the rest I'm just like, you know, Bucky Irving. Okay, yeah, he's fond from Oregon, but it's how small he is. Right. So it's like, okay, just another guy. That's another role guy. Yeah, it's a complimentary piece.

Blake Corum, another complimentary guy. I like it. Like, I can see his role in the NFL, like, but that to me is not an ace. That's not a guy you give 20 touches to. So it's, it's very hard to annoy any of these guys, but I'm with you where I think it's Benson if I had to pick one. And then probably Allen for me too. And that's not just because I'm Wisconsin guy.

but I can see his role in that having where he can get that's 15 plus touches that's justifiable if you take him like in the third. Yeah. And I think with Alan, he's a guy that, I mean, teams were recruiting him as a linebacker. Yeah. I mean, he was a safety in high school that thought, okay, he's going to grow into a linebacker role in college. He was a mod star in high school. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

And, you know, it kind of just did running back. And I think as the more and more as he is committed to the position at Wisconsin, we really saw it last year with the way he produced. And then this year again, he's been banged up and some fumbling issues too. But man, when he's right, it does look good. So, yeah, he's, I think that and throw Adrick Estimate in there too from Notre Dame. I think they were all in a similar tier where, you know, between picks 70 and 120, you know, like these are running backs that you can understand,

okay, we drop him in with the guys we already have on our depth chart and all of a sudden we feel better about this group. And so, yeah, it's a good group. It's just I don't think any of these guys you necessarily pounded on the table for and saying, okay, yeah, we need to get this guy early. You know, which, again, we usually have one or two of these guys, whether it's Bejohn and Jimiuk Gibbs last year or, you know, the year before, even with Kenneth Walker and Breece Hall, both those guys,

neither went first round, but they went pretty early in the second round. So, you know, it just doesn't feel like that type of year where we're going to have somebody go super early. And you can understand why with this group, even though it's still a good group. Yeah, right. Useful. I'm just going to keep using the word. Any thoughts on Devin Neal from Kansas? I'm just curious about him.

What would you think? I think he's another fourth round type to me, fourth-fifth round type. But it's just like, I don't know. I like him. I just think he has some three down potential because I think he has hands and they use him the Kansas offense. It's a lot of fun to watch. But also just like, I don't know.

He does a lot of things well. He checks a lot of boxes for me. Has size, pretty decent balance, decent vision, good enough vision where I could see him in his own scheme and actually be okay in it and enough athleticism. So I don't know. He's one I kind of like I like, but again, like you said, like but don't love. And I just curious if you have any thoughts on him. Well, I'm not, we'll see if he comes, if you'll be in this draft or not. Right.

But that's the thing. Yeah. Because I don't know. When you're talking about running backs, obviously underclassmen, it's always different because most these guys are going to come out, whether it's Will Shipley at Clemson or, you know. And when they don't, you're like, why don't you come out? Right. Right.

So he's one that I didn't expect to come out. But, yeah, if he did, I mean, I get it because I think he could be, he's a draftful player. But he's one of those names that, you know, it's good to talk about because you add him to the mix. And it's like, okay, another one we got to slot in here, figure out, okay. Because it's not a great senior group of running backs either. Like Blake Horm's a top senior, obviously. And then my second senior is South Dakota State, Isaiah Davis, who I think he's a good player. He's 230 pounds.

He is a no-nonsense type of runner, but he's a good athlete too. My favorite day three running back this year, I've got two of them. they're both in the SEC. Ray Davis from Kentucky, one of the best stories in college football. And then Josh Williams from LSU, another LSU skill player, had some big blocks in that game against Florida.

One was the Jane Daniels long touchdown. He got down the field, took out a corner. And then the other one was that pop-pass touchdown to Brian Thomas. He had a huge block that really sprung that. So, yeah, this is a senior class of running backs that's not great, but there's a few of them

that really stand out as, like Josh Williams, former walk-on, you know, you don't see that at LSU very often, but he's a good player. There's nothing game-breaking about him, but you add him to the mix

and you feel good about what he brings your running back room, what he brings value-wise, any situation. So, yeah, these are guys that, there might not be a single pro bowler

in this group, but some valuable players. Yeah, someone that's going to save your fantasy. season in a year or two. And they were just like, oh, God, I got that guy for a dollar or someone. I actually, I'm glad he gave South Dakota State a shout out because I really love their offense.

Oh, yeah. Zach Lujan, his offense coordinator, same is a young guy. But last year when I watched them, uh, Tucker Kraft, Tucker Kraft. Yeah. Really, I really like the offense. And the quarterback was actually pretty fun. So it's one I'm always like keeping an eye out on the jack rabbits. Uh, from time to time.

But no, that was great. Dane. Uh, you want anything you're, you're watching this weekend that we just wrap up with or just a typical slate of every prospect possible. Yeah, I mean, look, put it this way. Let's savor college football because we've got two weeks left of the regular season, you know, and so let's, uh, let's, uh, let's see the championship games already clinched.

It's like, come on. I hated that. It's like, oh. Well, and we've got a bit with Ohio State, Michigan, that's going to be huge, obviously. Yeah. If, it's important not to overlook this week, you know, and that kind of thing with Ohio States, uh, or Michigan's got Maryland. Ohio State's got Minnesota.

So it's like, okay, let's take care of business. Then we can really focus on that next opponent. But with the game in Ann Arbor, I think obviously Michigan will be favored. It's just a matter of how much. And so that's going to be really interesting to watch. But yeah, I'm sure we'll be talking quite a bit about that game next week. I think so too. But again, you guys can hear prospects of pros or watch it on YouTube if you're into that as well.

Every Wednesday on the Athletic Football Show feed, thank you guys so much for joining us. Thank you to Dane. As always, I'll see you guys next time. This was the Athletic Football Show's prospects to pro.