The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Prospects to Pros: Top rookies at the halfway mark of the NFL season, and this weekend's biggest college games

Episode Date: November 8, 2023

Nate Tice and Dane Brugler shift their attention—mostly—to the NFL side of the equation on this episode of The Athletic Football Show's Prospects to Pros. The guys highlight the play of the top rookies at each position this season. They couldn't leave the Prospects side of the equation untouched, though. After wrapping up their rookie discussion, they discuss the biggest college games of the weekend from an NFL Draft perspective.Follow Nate on Twitter: @Nate_TiceFollow Dane on Twitter: @dpbruglerSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTubeThis episode is brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/MAYSand get on your way to being your best self. Find your bright spot this season, with BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp dot com slash MAYS today to get 10% off your first month. That’s better HELP dot com slash MAYS.Sign up for a one-dollar-per-month trial period at SHOPIFY DOT COM SLASH mays. Go to SHOPIFY DOT COM SLASH mays now to grow your business–no matter what stage you’re in. SHOPIFY DOT COM SLASH mays.You’ll be amazed at what you can do with Grammarly. Go to grammarly.com/ATHLETICFOOTBALL to download for FREE today. That’s G-R-A-M-M-A-R-L-Y DOT COM SLASH ATHLETICFOOTBALL.New to Etsy? Use the code HOLIDAY10 for ten percent off your first purchase. That’s code HOLIDAY10. Maximum discount value of fifty dollars. Expires December 31st, 2023. See terms at Etsy dot com slash terms. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic football show's Prospects to Prospects to Pros. Hello and welcome to Prospects to Pros presented by Invesco QQ, the official ETF of the NCAA. I'm your host, Nate Tice. We have a really fun one today. It's the midway point of the season, so why not talk about some rookies? To help me do that is the one and only Mr. Bigboard himself, Dane Brugler. How you doing today, Dane? I'm good.

How are you? I'm doing very well. Doing very well. Nice. I like the midway point because it's nice doing the award. stuff. That was an easy article idea for me last week. So I'm all about it right now. And even with, it's like kind of the midpoint with NFL, but even like in college, you look at it and there's like three weeks left. And it's like, oh, wow, this season is winding down quickly. There's only so many games. But November is such a fun month in college football. We had LSU, Alabama, this past weekend. I mean, that USC Washington game was bonkers. But it seems like every week now the next through Thanksgiving, we're going to have. some really big games.

We'll touch on those a little bit later. That's fun. That's what's always loved the conference play. We try to hint at that when we're watching, talk about some of these guys early, some of the prospects. We'll be focused more on pros for most of the show until the end of the show. But it's talking about prospects.

It's like, wait until they get to conference play. And then we got some more games to check out and some better matchups to check out. And yeah, when you're in the thick of it, you kind of forget. Like last Saturday it was like I felt like every time time slot had a great game and other games ended up being entertaining. So that's a great shout out that. November is a good call football season. Oh, yeah, for sure.

Yeah, so today we're going to be going over the rookies who's standing out. We just want to give a shout out to you about the midway point of the season. We did this about a quarter of the way, about a month ago. So just want to continue that trend. We're going to be starting on offense. We'll go with quarterbacks first, the golden boy position. Dane, who's going to start off for you? I think there might be one guy, but anybody else you want to give a shout out to at the quarterback position.

I mean, this is the easiest pick of this exercise, right? I mean, there's one guy at the top, obviously, someone coming off a career performance on Sunday, setting the rookie record for passing yards, game winning drive, and more so than just the numbers was how he did it, watching him just go to work. It was so much fun. And it takes you back to watching him last year at Ohio State. And, you know, he did it throughout the season, but really against Georgia and in the college football playoffs. how he performed in that game was like, okay, yeah, I'm perfectly fine, putting all my chips in the middle on this guy. And, you know, we talked about it before. Again, the goal shouldn't be try to find the next Patrick Mahomes.

That's not the goal. The goal should be find a top 8 to 12 quarterback in the draft. And watching that CJ stride against Georgia, you thought, all right, yeah, this guy can be that type of player. So far hasn't let us down. I mean, he has been as advertised and then some. And, you know, the tape has been great. but and then just look at the the raw numbers, uh,

14 touchdown passes. That's more than Dak Prescott. That's more than Joe Burrow, more than Trevor Lawrence. Uh, it's more than Kenny Pickett and Matthew Stafford put together combined. So he's putting up the numbers, um,

and, and not just the, the touchdowns, but he's not, the takeaways aren't there either. Uh, or the giveaways, I should say.

Right. One interception on 279 pass attempts. The only quarterback, close to that efficiency is Lamar Jackson. He's got three interceptions on far fewer attempts, 253. So what CJ Stroud is doing right now, you see the poise, you see the rhythm, see the accuracy, just how in tune he is with his entire body and his decision making. It is very, very impressive. And, you know, again, I think we can point back to that Ohio State tape and, you know, showing how he could do this at the college level and you wondered, okay, some of the

aspects of the NFL. But I think this is also a reminder of so much of quarterback play as rookies. And, you know, we can project all these guys as much as we want. But where they land, the coaching, the development they receive, that matters so much. And give a lot, we need to give a lot of credit to that Texans coaching staff, especially O.C. Sloick. I mean, what they're doing with Stroud, yes, it's mostly the quarterback. But the coaching staff and the waiter, developing him and, you know, it helps to have a cornerstone left tackle. It helps that the receivers are stepping up. So this is, it's all about C.J. Stroud, but again, the situation that he went into, that plays a major part as well. Absolutely. And I'm glad he gave him a shout

out. But that was looking at this Texan team, any quarterback that I felt that they would take, that they were likely to take. I felt it was still a solid situation to drop them in. I thought the offense aligned. They traded for Shaq Mason. I know he's at injuries. The whole, offensive line has. But then, but also just like this receiving room, I was like, okay, Robert Woods, okay, Nico Collins, okay, all right, you know, Noah Brown, okay, all right. Oh, John Macchi, all right, okay, these guys are all fine. I like these guys. They all have nice, they have potential to be a nice role player and stuff. Donald Schultz, okay, it's just solid, solid, solid. But he is making them better. And that's what you want. And that's, I'm so, it's like, it's nice that he's

solid. So I felt good about how ever that this situation would be dropped in, you know, and then you contrast it with maybe the Panthers. And you're like, and but you watch him and his timing the, I went off on this on Sunday. It's just, it's clinic tape. It's what you teach. It's how just the dropback stuff. How quickly he gets rid of the ball. His eyes is like, I mean, even just how he moves in the pocket. Like, his sacrate's pretty low for a rookie that's always promising. And then, I mean, he's just putting up numbers. So it's nice that people are kind of noticing. this, but it's like, this has been consistent throughout the whole rookie year. So it's really cool to see a guy drop in and kind of, like you refer to the Georgia tape. But like even the Northwestern game last year when he was truly like, I mean, he only finished with like 78 yards that game. But several drops. It was a really windy day. That was the game that really put him over the top for me because he was line driving throws through this like really windy day. He was being used as a runner. And he's creating more than he ever had to do and call.

college, and it's been other than that Georgia game that you refer to, but it's just been really good stuff. I'm all aboard. He is so accurate. He makes all the right decisions time and time again. That does have something to do with the coaching and running a good scheme, but also the quarterback has to do it. So seeing him do it time after time, it's, yeah, it's Houston, Texas fans should be extremely

happy right now. Oh, there's no doubt. And, you know, so like when I do my scouting reports, the last line. the overall, that is where I kind of want to hit home. Like this is the most important thing. I want you to have from this. And with Stroud's report, I included, so he's an outstanding rhythm passer with touch, pacing and ball speed control.

I think that has been the biggest difference when you watch him compared to some of these other young quarterbacks, the ball speed control to, it's so much about his timing. and you know, you're playing ahead of, you're ahead of schedule with your eyes, but then you understand what type of touch and timing it needs so the ball arrives before the defender can react so the receiver can make a play. I mean, and that final touchdown is a great example.

The tank Dell. So, yeah, I think that he has so much of what, and I think this is why we felt really good about C.J. Stroud in terms of his floor. You know, we could debate, you know, What is the ultimate ceiling for him? Could he be a top five quarterback in the NFL? Is he a Pro Bowl quarterback?

The ceiling, I think, was a little bit debatable. But I think we both felt really comfortable with his floor as an NFL starter because of those strengths that he had as a passer. I just kept calling him clean, clean, clean. And I'm glad he brought up the touch stuff. And that's where a guy, maybe even like a Josh Allen, but either any quarterback really, where accuracy usually comes from, it's not an overhaul of like throwing mechanics as far as your arm. it's usually footwork and just becoming more intelligent and be able to anticipate. And it's easier to anticipate when you throw soft.

It's hard to anticipate when you line drive something in there. That's just physics unless you're just a freak. Some of the guys can do that. But it's most people, most mortals. So like a guy like Stroud for being a rookie and that first touchdown to Tank Dell, the double move. And I brought it up on the Sunday show with Robert. But he throws that, del's up like the 12, 13 yard line. Right.

And the ball ends up in the back corner. of the end zone. And it's not like a, you know, a balloon ball that he just throw. It's like a nice, like, looping liner that you see to the right center field and a baseball game. It's just a perfect throw. So fraction of a second off. That's a fraction of a second to earlier, too late.

I mean, it changes everything. And so that timing and the ball speed control, the tempo that he plays with, you're right. I mean, it ties the feet, tie with the eyes, tie with the arm. He has such a great feel for his body. and what he needs to do to get the ball out and where it needs to be. It's really impressive to watch, especially for a guy that's, you know, had eight career starts under his belt.

It's really something to behold. It's cool. No, it's really, really cool. Will Levis has had a couple starts recently. That's the other new quarterback maybe to talk about. Not much to talk about with Clayton Tune in that performance on Sunday.

That was a little rough one. But yeah, Tommy DeVito, I believe, is another quarterback in here. It's a throw around. Right, yeah. Aiden O'Connell. Ayn O'Connell. He actually looked okay on Sunday. He was clean.

He was clean. I mean, the Giants' defense maybe helped him out a little bit with that. A little bit. It's nice when you know you got man coverage every time. It's nice. There you go. No, I think, I mean, with the Stroud conversation, it is interesting to contrast that with what Bryce Young is dealing with in Carolina.

Now, obviously, it's Bryce Young shoulders, plenty of the blame here. But the situation is just, it's a real. and it's hard to have these conversations especially stemming off of what Stroud did on Sunday. Right. Because I think everyone focuses on

just the raw stats and wins and losses and with Brice, the situation that he's in is just a stark difference. It really is. And it's not an excuse. That is just reality. And so it'll be interesting

the rest of the way what Carolina does to try to rectify some of that. And then what they do in the off season? Because you have to get him more help. I mean, it's outside of Adam Thielen, you're just not getting any consistent receiver play. I was a big Ikea Kuanu fan coming out. He has not developed the way I thought a lot of people thought he would. His second half last year, he did. And then he just took a huge step back. It's so strange. So the offensive line hasn't been what we thought it would be. So there's so many parts of this Carolina offense and they just have so much to do this offseason to fix it and get their

quarterback back on track. I think Bryce Young has made enough quality impact throws that I feel really good about him moving forward. It's just the situation, it's rough and I'm not sure what the answer is. The situation is just so bad that it's shocking to me because I thought the Panthers old line was going to be one of the better, one of the better offensive lines in the league. I think I kind of had them around like the 10th best when I kind of looked at them in the preseason. And they've been one of the most disappointing units in the entire league, like any team, any position group.

And so that's tough for any rookie quarterback. I still think that is the first thing you want to build when you have a young quarterback is the old line because you can't operate if you have no time or no pocket to work with. And then you can't even judge your receivers or the concepts you're running if they can't even get off the ground. of course my my family background will have some influence on that line of thinking but still it's part of my football dogma but I really it's just tough to watch because I do think just like in college he's he's so smart and I know he knows where to go with the ball and I just think

he's trying to make it work and it's just it's tough he's not he's not getting a lot of easy buttons from his teammates or the scheme is fine but it's just yeah he needs help he needs a lot help. And I think these things are, you know, they go in cycles. You know, I remember, what, a couple years ago was a 2020 draft class. That was when Joe Burrow went number one, but after that first rookie year, everyone went, oh, Justin Herbert should have been the number one overall pick. You know, he said to the new touchdown rookie record. And then fast forward another year. And it's, Oh, Joe Burrow, obviously, was the number one pick. And then a month ago, I had people arguing in my mentions how Tua was really the guy that should have been the first quarterback.

So, I mean, these things will come and go in cycles. But, yeah, bottom line, if you're a Texans fan, you feel great about where you are with your quarterback situation. And all right, it's only uphill from here, you know, because we got our guy. Looks like our coaching staff. Hopefully it stays intact. And then now it's just about how we build on this. How do we get better? And so, yeah, it's a good time to be Houston Texans fans.

Yeah, I see my replies are always funny just seeing them with different photoshops of Keel Williams and Drake May. Maybe Marvin Harrison Jr. Right. That I always see. The team changes every week. Vikings fans were in there and now they're celebrating everything right now with Josh Dobbs.

So it's got it's pretty funny which teams drop in there. So, yeah. The most volatile has been the Bears fans. I mean, it's just you got a faction of field believers. Others are, you know, ready to move on. And then between those, it's Caleb, it's Drake May. It's, you know. And then it's fire everybody.

And then it's like, no, give them another chance. They're so, they're so scarred by the quarterback position that get rid of fields. And with the two picks, you draft receiver and a tackle. Don't draft a quarterback. You know, just go get dobs. Go get, you know, whatever. But we don't have any trust in a quarterback here. So, yeah, it's a, it is a roller coaster for sure.

I just watched their defense, actually. Yeah, I guess the Saints. they're doing some things. They're picking up. They're picking it up. Montess sweat looked good, but the rest of the defense, they're doing some nice things. Oh my God, right, right, I know.

Jack Sanborn, shout out Wisconsin. Actually, you know, they paid those linebackers and he actually played pretty well. But let's move on to receivers, the guys that were throwing to. Actually, I think the Texans rookie receiver might be the one to lead this conversation, but anyone else in the receiver group that has stood out at the halfway point, maybe outside of even Pooka Nakua, but I will want to talk about Pooka in one second. We got to start with Puka Because I think he's

Right now he ranks top five among all players Not just rookies In targets Catches receiving yards So you know Even though maybe he's cooled off a little bit He's still in terms of production Well over what most receivers are

Only two touchdown catches But he is right now tied With Tyree Kill For second in the NFL Catches 20 plus yards with 16 obviously these two guys look very different with those 20 plus yard catches but it's just impressive to watch Puka Nukuha

go out there and do this week in week out and so we'll see with the Rams quarterback situation how that changes a little bit they just signed Carson Wentz today and Stafford will see how long he's out but yeah Nakua still right with where we are at the midway point I think has been the top receiver

and then after that I you know well here I know you wanted to talk by Niccoa. Would you want to mention it? Oh, no. Just, yeah, it's one of those where it's like, man, it felt like he cooled off. And then you look at his stats and you're like, holy crap. 91 targets? Oh, okay. It's so many first downs. Like, he's just efficient. I did my article last week for the awards and I gave him my rookie to year and it was the easiest section. And it would much easier to write last week before Strah did what he did on Sunday because then

everyone would have been killing me for it. But it was at that time a week ago, it was easy. It was an easier call. But you mentioned top. five and all the counting stats, but just even one of the stats I always like to look at, which is success rate, uh, successful target per route run. He's fifth in that. So top five as well. And the only other, the other names are above 15%. He's at 16.9.

Other ones above 15%. Tyra kills him first. Then it goes, Iyuk, Amon Ross St. Brown, Travis Kelsey, then Nakua. Then it goes, Jamar Chase, AJ Brown, C.D. Lamb, Keenan Allen, Jalen Waddle, and Devante Adams. And then I think Justin Jefferson's after that, just below that. And Stefan Diggs right after that. So it's like the dudes.

Yeah. It sounds like in a fantasy draft, like the first 12 picks. That's it. Yeah. It's crazy. It's the guys. And so I thought that's the thing. It's not just these empty stats.

He's being efficient. He's going down the field. And I long, he's going to be just, he's just flat good and they use him perfectly. So really, really, really fun player to watch. Yeah. No doubt. Who else? Who else?

Yeah. It's kind of a grab bag for this group. So, yeah, where do you want to go next? If you're just going based off of receiving yards, the next three guys are, or Zay Flowers, Jordan Addison, Josh Downs. They're the only other rookie receivers that have at least 40 catches and like 460 receiving yards. But I think with Addison, you know, he is actually tied with Stefan Diggs for the second

most touchdown receptions in the league, just behind Tyree Kill. And it's like one behind Tyra Kill. And then I think it's interesting, there are four NFL receivers with at least 40 catches and zero drops. Two of them are rookies. Addison and Downs. So, I mean, these guys are putting up catches, but they're also not putting the ball on the ground, which is great to see. So, you know, I think Josh Downs, I understand why he fell.

He's not a big guy. I was still surprised he fell as far as he did into the 70s. I mean, if you didn't take him in the first round, I get it, totally. Yeah. I graded him as more as an early two. But to see him fall into the early three, early to mid three, that was a little bit of a surprise. And so just interesting because, I mean, Jordan Addison, I mean, he was 174 pounds. I mean, he's not a big guy either.

So, you know, it's kind of pick and choose. A flower is not a big guy. We've got to pick and choose how we, you know, weigh these different measurements and how early we take them. And it's just interesting. But good to see him balling out with Gardner, Minshu and Indy. Yeah. Addison was a true, true. And I think we talked about this before the draft.

for me at least true just trust the tape kind of guy because all the other stuff was such red alerts for me and you know I'm not I don't like undersized receivers and especially ones that don't run well but I was like man he moves well and he runs good routes and he catches everything so I don't know that was one I just I never wavered on um as far as keeping them as like a kind of a where he ended up getting drafted was kind of where I graded him so it kind of worked out but this year Ladd McConkey gonna be that guy because he's just he 185 pounds that he is not a guy. He had a digger post this weekend.

He's just a good football player. Yeah. I mean, he's just, his play speed and the competitiveness. I mean, it's good luck covering him. So, I mean, I think... I'm so glad you kept him in your big board. That was awesome. Yeah, I mean, McCongy's going to be one of those guys. Yeah, I wish you were a little bit bigger.

Don't really like these smaller guys, but I get it. I totally understand. So yeah, he's going to be in that conversation. Especially when you have an ace, like Addison's with Jefferson. True. And they have Parkinson. They're like, that's going to be just so dangerous. I'm glad you mentioned Day Flowers. I mean, the Ravens' offense is death by a million slant runners. It's so funny. I mean, him and Bateman and OBJ, it's pretty fun. Even Aguars having kind of a decent season.

But I actually wanted to ask you about is Demario Davis, oh, Douglas, I'm sorry, Demerio Douglas, the Patriot's six-rounder. He's kind of picked it up a little bit the last couple of weeks. Nothing crazy, just like 50-yard games, 30-yard games, like something like that. But he was a six-rounder. I just wanted to ask you about him because he was, he was. Yeah, he's doing some nice things with the ball in his hands. Well, and another small guy. I mean, he's 5-8, I think he's 179 pounds at the combine. So not a big guy.

And he was a slot guy, you know, in college or a lot of underneath routes, you know, not a lot of downfield targets. But you see the burst that he plays with. You know, you see the agility and the acceleration, the footwork at the top of his routes. You can create that separation, give his quarterback a, clean window to throw to. And then after the catch, you know, he's just, he's a, kind of a pesky player to keep up with. Um, and then you add in the return skills.

You add in, um, you know, the fact that he's, uh, the interview process went really well for him in terms of the competitive nature, in terms of the way he sees the game, the way that he understands concepts. So I think all those things combined, you're like, yeah, he's small, but, um, I like what, And that'll limit his overall role. You know, what he will be. But the explosive nature of his game, the way he, the competitive nature of his game, you bet on those. And yeah, I think he's done a nice job as a rookie for New England.

I've seen the 81 get the ball in his hands. I'm kind of like, okay. And it's just like he had some pop to him. And I remember him at Liberty, but it was just, yeah, it was been nice to see you. And they're finding ways to use them a little bit more. I mean, they need juice on their offense. but yeah, he's been a pleasant surprise when I watched. Bill Belichick, don't let him draft a receiver in the first two rounds.

But he could find some of these guys later on. That's it. There's something to it sometimes when they're just like one guy, that just that one really good trait. And it's just like, okay, whatever, day three, whatever. That's the dark throw. Just go for that. With the Patriots and I'm sorry, I just, we're going to go off on a tangent here.

No, that's good. Like, okay, receivers they've drafted in the first two, right, All right, Tyquine Thornton, which has not worked out. No. That was overdrafted and it's begin with. Third round, the earliest for him. He took him top 50. Nikiel Harry drafted him in the final pick in the first round that year.

Obviously, that did not work out, which. And also another one that wasn't a huge surprise, especially when they drafted him ahead of, you know, E.J. Brown and, you know, those guys. D.K. Metcalf. Before that. Who else do they draft early? Aaron Dobson was a second round pick in 2013. Wow.

I'm thinking of those. Yeah. But I mean, so you look through these guys in the first two rounds and it's, you know, a bunch of misses. And then you look in the fifth, sixth, seventh round. You see Julian Edelman. You see Matthew Slater. You know, you see guys that have been able to, you know, not all of them been hits, obviously, but they've at least been able to find a role and, you know, be a little bit productive.

And, you know, we'll see with this group because they drafted two with Boutet and Mario Douglas. So, you know, you're right. That offense needs some juice, needs some type of explosive element. And, you know, they'll take what they can get. And Douglas has been able to provide a little bit of that so far. Yeah, the, uh, another undersized receiver too is, Stroud's throwing partners, Tank Dell. Tank is, yeah, he's, when he's healthy, he's very effective. and he's perfect for Stroud and this is I think Josh Allen's the one guy that I never understand they give him all these kind of smaller receivers

or they always try to before they're like hey let's just give him Kincaid give him like a favorite target but like with Stroud Tankdell makes a lot of sense because all he does is throw BBs so it's like oh yeah it doesn't matter but he's a great route runner they're using them perfectly any thoughts on Tank Dell because I have some stats with a he's been very very effective when he's been out there oh no give him to me I want to hear him Because Tanktown is a good player.

It's just another guy that's small. I mean, he is under 170 pounds. He's a smaller target. But again, good luck covering him if he's able to get free. So, yeah, I think he's been a nice bright spot for that offense. Yeah. Yeah, they have some nice synergy going on right now. He's 17th overall in yards per route run, 2.27 yards, which is third among all rookies.

And 17th in explosive receptions per route, which I think is very important. I think sometimes these smaller guys that we look at our heads, work. Oh, yeah, he's going to be explosive just naturally. And then they actually aren't, aren't. They get tackled right away or they're not good route runners and they can't catch the ball. So it's nice to see a small guy really taking it to defenses. And then the last one I want to bring up was with Rishie Rice. Because he's, if you didn't, I was going to. So I'm glad. Okay, good. Okay, slowly coming along. But yeah, any thoughts on Rice? Because I see the chiefs and Mahalm starting to trust him a little bit more. It's been pretty cool to watch. You can make the argument he's the most consistent receiver the chiefs have right now. I think he is. You know, obviously, pass catcher, it's Kelsey, but, you know, just pure receiver. I think, yeah, with what he's, and they use him in different ways. They'll put him in a slot. You know, they'll line him up outside.

They'll give him a bubble. They'll push him outside. They'll, you know, have him run downfield routes as well. So I think it's interesting the way they use him. And, you know, I liked him a lot out of SMU. Like, going back to last summer, he was my number one senior receiver in the draft. I was all in on Rashid Rice. And then watching him at the senior bowl liked him but didn't love him just because he didn't have a ton of juice.

You know, you could tell like this, he moves like a four or five guy. And, you know, that at time could be exposed against high level corner play. And then some of the off field stuff, which I can't even talk about because it's, you know, it is what it is. You know, that made me sour on him a little bit. The chiefs took him earlier than I thought he'd go. And I think so far he has kind of, you know, he's out or he is lived. lived up to where they took him in terms of being just a reliable part of that offense and getting better, you know, and growing into a more serious role. So, yeah, I'm glad you brought him up.

Who else to me? JSN settling in with Seattle. Yes. Solio but surely coming off the injury. He's had some busts a little bit. And that's kind of, but that's been a Seahawks receiver issue for a couple years. So that might not just be all on him. But should we mention a different Seahawks receiver too, a rookie receiver?

Mr. Bobo? Mr. Bobo, yes. I mean, he's got more receiving touchdowns than some of these guys. So we got to talk about him. No, he's legit like a good player right now. Like he's not just like a joke. Like he's, they use them like they use them all over the place. I, yeah, big fan of Jake Bovo because he is, they're giving them like design touches like like jet sweep touchdowns and designer shot plays in the red zone. Not to use too much jargon, but it's like, yeah, no, they trust them.

They really trust them. Same with rice. And that's why, like you're saying, they're using rice all over the place, is that I know what they, they like, they like what they're seeing with him. So they're like, okay, let's give him the bubble. What's given this play at near the goal line. Like, so that's good. But yeah, what are your thoughts on Jake Bovo? Because it's, he's been a lot of fun to watch this here. I mean, for a fourth or fifth receiver, like that's, uh, like, yeah, exactly.

And again, this comes down, like, you watch his UCLA tape and you see a guy that's consistently moving the chains, just a reliable player. and then you just couldn't draft him based off his 40-yard dash. That's what it all came down to. You know, you can't draft a guy that's only 206 pounds, but ran in the four-nines. And he ran multiple 40s. This wasn't like it was just he stumbled or something. He's a 4-9 guy when you have a stopwatch out,

but on the football field plays a little bit faster than that. I think it's fair to say. But, you know, he does have a size advantage. You know, he is a legit 6-4. he he there's not a ton of clean catch windows but he operates well in traffic you know bodies around them don't really throw off his focus um and you know he's just very efficient putting the ball away and then just kidding as many yards as he can sometimes it's just two yards but uh he can put the ball away and then get get vertical so yeah he is a a fun player who i had a draftable grade on until that

40 yard dash because i oh yeah what do you what do you do with it you know it's it's it's a complete liar that I have personally never seen before. Yeah. And it's not the, when most guys, it's like a receiver, I run slow. Okay, this 218 pound receiver that ran like, oh, we have to move him tight end. They ran like a 472, not a 498s or even a 4-7, like a 4-6 something, not this. So that it was. I thought there was weather or he was hurt or something.

And nothing like really ever came out about that. But yeah, he does not play like a 4-9-8. It's still like a 4-7-something, but it's... There was a... Sorry, I went back and looked at the sheet, and the scout on record did report a little bit of weather, but it wasn't like a torrential downpour. Okay, okay.

You know, he's running through puddles. It wasn't anything like that. It was, you know, but still, it was... The fact that he didn't have another pro day to say, or, you know, like, oh, I could be better than that. Like, that tells you who's probably testing in the 47-48 range anyways. and there's really no point to put out another 40-yard dash at that point. I'm glad we got to talk about Bobo. That's fantastic.

Moving on to run. He is. Moving on to runoffacks. Some guys are really picked it up. It's been kind of a fun group. Who do you want to start off with for the roadback position, Dane? Well, I mean, I think Bejon still leads all rookies and rushing yard. Still great.

Yeah, as much as, you know, we can be bewildered with, you know, usage and yeah what what exactly the plan is for a a player of this caliber um in terms of talent it is frustrating it's confounding um but at the same time i think he's you know he's still when he's when he gets his touches he does maximize him he does play well so you know he's averaging over five yards of carry um still only just that one touchdown uh carry which is a little bit of surprise what do you make of i mean i know this Atlanta conversation is Oh, man. We almost don't even have the right,

we don't have time to do the whole thing right now, but in terms of Bejan and, yeah, because I think you even, I heard you guys talk about in your preview show, you expected a big game from Bejohn this past weekend. And, you know,

going forward with Tyler Heinekea quarterback, with what do you think their plan might be, no mustache with Arthur Smith, what do we think about Bejohn Robinson over the second half of the, the NFL season. I really, I actually thought their bi-week was this week. I had to flip to my head. It's next week. But they play the Cardinals this week with Kyler coming back. So I thought Joshua Dobbs was tough. Now you got Kyler. But I think some of it's been some galaxy braining.

And I think some of it too has been from Arthur Smith, maybe some of the staff and how they rotate guys, which I do think in some ways I get that they're trying to kind of, you know, what's the one thing that happens with rookie runoffbacks or highly drafted runoffbacks? their short lifespan or short span in the career, career span, I should say, in the league. And I would say, I don't want to say that short lifespan. Hold on three, two, one. One thing with highly drafted run backs is their short career span. So I think some of it is to save some of those touches for the second half of the season.

But there's times where it's like, hey, the game's tight. Let's roll with them. Like, let's let them go to work. Running backs do, I do feel get better with more touches. They get a feel for it. They get a feel for how things are breaking down. the offensive line gets a better feel, better push on the stuff. Like Tyler Arjir is a nice, effective runner, and it's like nothing he's doing wrong.

No one was higher on Alger than you and I. I mean, we were both like, you know, take him in a third round, feel good about what he's going to give you versus rookie contract. I mean, yeah, we were really optimistic for what he could be. Yes, he's exactly what I thought he would be. He's exactly. He's the two and a two-man rotation. Like, yeah, I love him.

But I also think there are some things where his head was starting to swim a little bit. They're asking him do more in protections. And I think that kind of it kind of slowed him down a little bit. There's times where his head's not getting back around. So I think they were trying to be good and be like, hey, it's not overwhelming. It's not like, oh my God, this guy's great. But it's not overwhelm him. But they're like this last game.

Oh, so frustrating. They give him the ball. He has an explosive run. And then he fumbles. And I think some of it was like, hey, man, we got to go with the guy that's not fumbling right now. It's not that type of game. But I hope after the buy, they start rolling with him and get him, like say, hey, this is the midway point or past the midway point.

We get going. But it's been a frustrating to watch. They, uh, the turnover has been very frustrating as a whole team. I still think they should go back to Ritter. Uh, just give him a chance. Heineke's, Heinke's, Heinke's, Heinke's, I know what he is. But I think the Bejohn stuff is there's got to be a better, even if you are trying to make him better and trying to save him a little bit, there's times where you kind of just

have to lean into your best players and just let him go to work. And I think that they could lean into that a little bit more in the second half of the year. It's a man, but he's so good. He is so smooth and so explosive. It's, I know. I want to see him just get like one of those drives where he gets seven touches in a row. Just let him go to work, just like a Texas. Well, and I think there's something to be said for running backs.

You need that. You need, I mean, I don't necessarily think Bejohn's a guy that needs to, you know, find that rhythm. But it sure helps when, you know, you're not coming off the field. And, you know, you have a chance. to really settle in. And I mean, Bejohn's talented enough where on any given play,

he can break one. Speaking of that, Devon A-Chane, you know, he's still been out, but even though he's played half the games that some of these other running backs

have played, he's still high up there in terms of the highest rushing yards for rookies, yeah. He leads all rushing, or all rookies and rushing touchdowns with five.

He should be coming off to IR here pretty soon. Yeah. Yeah, good to have. have him back in that offense. And you can tell they need him. I mean, Rahim Oster's a good player and he's done a nice job. But having another explosive element to that offense, that something they sure miss.

Neither of them should be taking really more than 10 to 12 touches. But that's fine. When you have both of them, it's great. When you only have one of them, kind of get a little dicey with extended games. Only other guy I wanted to mention was Jemar Gibbs. Absolutely. I think he's been good as a receiver, as a runner. Maybe not what fantasy owners want him to be, but I think he's been a quality running back at this point so far.

They've quieted down the last two weeks because he actually is getting all the touches. With Montgomery out, right. Yeah, yeah, but Montgomery's coming back. He is. So that goes. But yeah, he's explosive. He's also that successful target per route run. He's second in the entire league in a position.

Oh, I'm sorry. Second among all rookies in that receiver, tight end or runoffback. So he's still been that effective receiver that we thought it could be, which is good to see. They love running choice routes to him. There's a lot of Saints influence in that offense. The last guy I wanted to shout out was, Zach Charbonnet for the Seahawks. Also just a guy after my own heart because he's good past protection. So just, yeah, he's been nice to give him some more touches.

I think that he's shown he's being reliable. But another UCLA rookie for the Seahawks just, you know, coming along for him and doing some nice things. Yeah, and when he's targeted, he'll catch the football. I mean, I don't think he has a rushing touchdown yet, but he's averaging over five yards of carry. I mean, he's just a quality player. Maybe not exceptional in any one area, but good across the board. No matter the situation, certain running backs, you know when they're on the field, okay, yeah, he's going to, they're not going to leave him home to pass protect or, you know, they're going to use him in this way or they're going to motion them, whatever. With Sharper days on the field, anything's on the table.

You can go to whatever play call you want. whatever formation you want and Charbonnet can adapt and be that type of player. So, you know, I think he is, doesn't have the home run ability of Kenneth Walker, but he's just someone that's going to help your offense. And I think we're seeing that more and more as we get deeper into Seattle season. Moving on to tight ends, the loaded tight end class, which has some guys kind of really coming along now. Do you want to start with Donald Kincaid, the first tight end drafted, who the bills are starting to finally start, like they're figuring it out.

Why did it take an injury to Dawson Knox for this to happen? I mean, we thought this from like day one. Like, you know, as soon as they drafted him in the first round, you, me and Robert, we were just like, oh, okay, this is your new slot receiver. This is, you know, the way, and we got so excited for what it could be. And then it just, it took time. And then once Dawson Knox went out, it's like, okay, we have no choice. He's going to see more action.

And he's responded really well and played at a high. level. So when Dawson Knox does come back, what does this look like? You know, what, how do they, because you can't, he needs to still play the same number of snaps. How, how do you, it would be interesting to see how, I would think they recognize that,

but how do they make all these pieces work in an offense that you know, it feels confused right now. You know, I don't know. It's, you've got Josh Allen, who's one of the most insanely talented quarterbacks on the planet.

who, you know, doesn't always play within himself, but still you're going to ride or die every snap with Josh Allen. How are you going to help him with a talent like this? So I don't know, what is your takeaways been in the last, especially specifically the last two weeks with King David? No, I love the whole lineup that they're using, especially with James Cook or Latavius Murray. Tavius actually has been a very nice ad for them because it's just the dirty work guy.

And Cook's come along. But then. Leonard, Fournette, too. Yeah, Leonard and Halenny. But yes, Lenny and Latavius actually have. It's funny how they kind of actually ended up being kind of similar role players, I guess, in a way. But that lineup with Khalil Shakir, Gabe Davis, Don Kakeh and Stefan Diggs, of course. Now that's, I think by having to do it, they had so many choices before in all these personnel groupings that they're leaning to to give themselves what we've been calling guardrails or give themselves kind of like, okay, this isn't working.

We can pivot to this, which I do think is going to be good. It has been good, actually, I do think. I think just because of that Thursday night came, they realized, oh, we can't do any of that. Quentin Morris, our blocking tight ends out too. And then now Knox is out. And now we have to use these guys. And I think that actually is when the light bulb went on because they couldn't get to anything else that finally was just like, rather than using those types of plays, that personnel grouping 12 times, they had to use it 40 plus times. And I think that's all it was.

It was just because they had to. But I think sometimes you're a little scared where you're like, okay, Kink can't do this. you can't do this, but I think that it led to what can he do? And he is a hell of a slot outrunner. Catch the football and run. He is good at that. And you can see, I own getting trust with these guys. And when you have the same five out there, at least the same four outside the running back,

and you know what every guy is, okay, you are the X, you are the F, you are the Z, you are the tight end every single time. When we start mixing things up, I know who's running what. I don't have this like, okay, are you, oh, you're outside on this play. Yes, quarterback should know that. but it's, you know, bullets start flying and it could be a little dicey. So I think it's just some of that injury necessity and just also, yeah, they leaned into it. And I think they're realizing like, this is good because it's a lot of heat coming at,

coming at defenses and Alan's really picking his spots with it. Yeah. Well, and it draws the attention of defenses. So, okay, all of a sudden, Stefan Diggs is getting more one-on-one opportunities. Or, you know, I mean, I think that this offense has so much potential, lean into Dalton yeah Dalton Kincaid and what he can offer

as a receiver because that's what you like that's why you drafted him it wasn't first blocking it was for he's going to give you targets he's not going to put the ball on the ground and then he's going to quickly become a runner and give you yards after the catch I mean this is this is what he does

and even though he did have that slow start to the year he already has 40 catches this year which surprised me I know he's been good these last few weeks but surprised he was already up to 40 already because it seemed like such a slog out of the gate. But yeah, I think, you know, we have to talk about two guys, Sam Leporta and Kincaid. They're both over 40 catches now, clearly one and two, just looking at the stats of these rookie tight ends.

Leporta, you know, cooled off a little bit. And it's funny looking at the target disparage between these two guys. Kincade is at 44 targets. Leportez is at 59, but there's only three receptions separating these two guys. So, you know, when Kincaid's targeted, he catches. catches the ball and does something with it. And yeah, hopefully we see more and more of that going forward. I think we will.

It's sometimes like I just talked about personnel and sometimes just the scheme is where the ball is going to go. And that's what when Cole Beasley dropped off and they went away from that. They've been trying to fill that slot. That guy can work inside and out with Stefan Dix, that they can work their two-man game. And that's what Concade is. So like when it's just watching them against the bangles, they just kind of peppered the same route over and over. and that's exactly how Utah used Kincaid.

Just those quick little out routes. So six yard out routes from the slot, usually going into the boundary. He is just a master of those because he has such loose hips and everything. But yeah, the Porter, too, just as a receiver, runner after catch these two guys. They've been, even for me, because I think Titans will hit the ground slow. I think everyone should assume that. It's been nice to see them in the first, both of these guys in the first after year be effective players and not seem like they're over.

overwhelmed and not really affecting the game yet. And tight ends one of those positions where it is tough and it takes time. So Laporta, he's got 25 pass blocking snaps. If you had a guess, how many pass blocking snaps do you think Dalton Kincaid has had so far this year? Pass blocking zero. One. So you're close. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. If he, if there's a drop back. They're coaches testes them as blockers and they kind of went, ah. Never mind. Oh, yeah. That's right. That's right.

Yeah. Go running around. Just show it on tape. Just show it on tape. We put it on tape. If there's a drop back, right. Yeah. If there's a drop back, Dalton Kincaid's going to be out there trying to get open.

So, yeah. Absolutely. My, it seems like the Raiders, remember, they drafted Michael Mayer. About time. And he has been. The same thing with Musgrave and Green Bay. Musgrave got a touchdown. That's first.

For the Packers. Yep. And he kept his feet, which was good. You know, usually he's a stumbler with the ball in his hands. I think his shoes are too big. I really do. But, no, Michael Mayer. it's nice because he has been an effective blocker already, which we thought he would be.

But it's nice to see a rookie tight end already doing that. And then this most recent game, he had a couple of ball with the ball in his hands and like getting upfield. And again, it's one of those things that we talked about before the draft was he's underrated as an athlete. He's underrated as a receiver. He can move a little bit. And so it's nice to see him kind of the Raiders remembering that, oh yeah, we draft this guy to sick around. He's pretty good. So I did have one guy I wanted to ask you about the dolphins have been using an undrafted tight end named Julian Hill.

from Campbell. Do you have any notes on Julian Hill? This is, maybe you should have been for off air, but I really want to, want to ask you about Julian Hill. No, he was a good athlete.

Yeah. I mean, he, he stood out quite a bit because he, I mean, he's not a big guy. I mean, he's under 6'4. He's under 250 pounds.

Um, but four six athlete, um, you know, I think that I wasn't surprised that he went undrafted. I thought that's what he was projected to be. Um, but I,

at the same time, wasn't not surprised that he is on a roster. and contributing because, you know, you could, you saw this on tape with him. So good to see that he, it's all about situation, right? You know, where these guys land and getting a path to get on the field. Good to see that he's been able to do that. I don't think that he impressed enough during the pre-draft process to get drafted, but I thought there was enough on tape that made you, there's something here.

There's something that, you know, with the movements, you know, his ability to work down the field, down the seam. there's something here and so glad to see he's getting a chance. Yeah, give him some snaps. It was interesting. I was like, I was like, who the hell is this guy? Yeah, got a fighting camel out there. So now we go. So it's moved to the offensive line.

And I love how our offense discussion. It's like it was cushing about Stroud probably kind of took up first half of the show. But moving to the offensive line to the big boys, any guys is standing out. Has there been one offensive lineman to you that has been like, you know, because obviously we got, you know, C.J. Stroud. And, you know, it seems like every position there's, one or two guys that we absolutely need to talk about.

With the offensive line, I don't think there's been one or two that it's like, oh, yeah, this guy, these few guys have stood out above the rest. I think it's more been a lot of up and down with this group, which is to be expected with rookie offensive linemen. Yeah, Paris Johnson has probably had the strongest tape so far, but then he's also had, like you said, some rookie moments. I think maybe as the season's gone along. But yeah, darn out right, another one.

Yeah, he's had some really good flashes just like, and then he's had some, some sloppy moments, but more positive than good. I think Anton Harrison for the Jags has been really coming along. Yeah, he's coming along. Way earlier than I was expecting him to do. And I think they are kind of giving them some baptism by fire. They're not giving him chip help sometimes. They're just trying it.

Like, hey, we drafted in the first round. Hopefully you could do this long term. So it was good. Like he went against T.J. Watt last week and did okay. Like held his own. So I was pretty fired up to see that from Harrison. And so, yeah, I'm kind of with you where it's like they all look like rookies. That's my best.

That's about there's no worse in this group where I'm like, oh, wow. Or even a Slater in his rookie year where he was like, oh, wow. But I do think they're quality players, which is good to see where I'm not really too, not too many alarm bells going off. Yeah, I think Bears fans are maybe not thrilled with darnall right. But I think he's been, especially in the run game. I mean, he has been, you know, moving people. people creating that movement that you want to see, which is great. I think you can at least feel optimistic moving forward that he's,

he's going to be the right tackle. DeWan Jones with the Browns, especially considering as a fourth round pick and there were questions and of this and that, but he has stepped up in a big way. Browns are just lots of the left tackle now. So they're playing with backups at both tackle spots. And it'll be interesting to see, you know,

what they're able to do. I wish they play with a quarterback with great pocket presence. So that's good. It's going to really help them out. Bill Callahan's going to make that money. You will. They'll prove why he is one of the best offensive line coaches in the league. Yeah, I know, sure.

I mean, maybe Osiris Torrance, we can mention. Steve Avila for the Rams. Yeah, Jared Patterson, I thought, has done a nice job for Houston. I think he's been better than expected. Skrotsky's been good since coming back from his injury. Not great, but good. been solid. So, but yeah, I think most of these guys have been really up and down, but that should be

expected at this point. Yeah. Tyler Steen had his first start. He did. He did. He did. Yeah, get in the run game. I want to see how the past reps went.

But I liked him in the preseason. So I want to, yeah, I was, I was curious to see how that first start went. That's a pretty tough one to start off with going against the Cowboys' defense line. Had a huge fumble recovery. He did. Right place, right time. Yep. So good start.

He originally went to Vanderbilt. He was around the ball, but it's a bit of Bammer, right? Yeah. So flipping over to defense, we'll stay on the line, some line play. Any defense alignment? We'll go edge, actually. Any edge players in particular standing out, I feel like there's the top one. It's been pretty damn good.

Well, I think it's the same two or three we talked about when we did this exercise at the quartermark, right? Will Anderson, uh, uh, Byron Young with the Rams. And then, uh, Tully. with the chargers. I think those three guys consistently have been, it hasn't been great every week, but they are, you know, getting pressures.

They are making an impact. Maybe Anderson was expected, but Byron Young and Tully being day two picks, I think they have exceeded expectations up to this point, which has been great to see. But, you know, outside of those two guys, I mean, Tyree Wilson, I think slowly, but surely, we see more out of him each week.

But to this point, He has been a disappointment. I think it's fair to say. But yeah, I think it centers around those three guys, especially Will Anderson. Yeah, not real to add. It's that I totally agree those. I mean, we saw Tully on Monday night against the Jets having some real nice moments and doing the Joey Bosa celebration, but he's been doing that all year.

And yeah, Will Anderson, like you said, even it's fun watching him with his ear, has been backed and getting to do that in the NFL scheme because he's good at it. Who knew? But yeah, but also, yeah, Byron Young, those are the same three guys I had. And then it was funny, my fourth kind of thing I just had in my notes was just like, I think this is the same three. So nothing real to add to contribute here. I want to give credit to Byron Young because I, I mean, he tested off the charts. He, you see the explosiveness.

You see the acceleration. You know, he was a guy that could get home on tape. But one of the big worries was, okay, can he be an every down player? Can he make plays against the run? And to this point, he has done that. And that has been a nice surprise out of him that it's kind of like, okay, I need to go back and figure, did I miss this? What about, because he was very inconsistent at Tennessee against the run. Offenses knew they could run to his side of the field.

So what changed, but based off what he's doing as a rookie compared to the college tape that kind of bridge that gap, that's something that I haven't had time to this point, but I need to go back and figure that out because that has been one of the obvious, like, like blinking red lights. Hey, this is, he's a lot better in this area than you thought coming in. Well, I thought, I watched him in the preseason and I thought he had a nice preseason.

So I was like, all right, I keep an eye on him. He'll be a DPR. You know, that's what I thought. He'll just, that's exactly,

what you're saying is exactly what I thought his role is going to be. He's playing 87% of their stats. He is on the, all, he's on, yeah, and he actually, he's had some,

the Packers game is his best game against the run. Again, this, and I'm with it. He's almost, he's 25 and a half. He's going to be 26 soon, like in a couple months. He had a crazy backstory.

Crazy. Yeah, he basically tried out for football because he saw a flyer and went to Juko and then worked his way up. And, I mean, yeah, he was behind the eight ball. And it's just amazing. He's got to this point. But yeah, he's making the most of it, that's for sure. Yes. Yeah.

No, really fun watch. If you guys haven't watched the Rams, he's been a huge bright spot for them. And he's only getting better. Another guy, even though he's older, it's just every week. week he gets better even from the preseason it's really cool so that's the thing that's why like you're saying you're like oh i got to study back and it's like some guys it just clicks some guys it's just like they just need reps just watch watch the alabama tape watch the georgia tape that he was not good against the run against uh in the preseason he wasn't good against the rod it's yeah i mean it's it's

something that is clicked for him and you know i think it's just he's embracing his athleticism instead of just i'm gonna take on this tackle and i'm you know it's not just about he's using his length really well i would That's the best thing he does. He knows how to stack guys, which is really helping them. And he can get free. And, you know, it's really relying on that athleticism. And so that's his calling card. Is that first step quickness and the acceleration?

And, you know, yeah, tap into that when you can. And he's doing it. It's been great to see. Kicking inside a defensive tackle, Jalen Carter. And any other defensive tackles outside the top one that have stood out to you so far at first half the season. I mean, Brazis is doing some good stuff with the same. which has been awesome. Our guy,

Cano Benton with the Steelers, has been a really quality player for them. Claudeau. He's starting to, it's more flash than consistency with him, but some of those flashes are really big impact plays. And so he's got closer ability, like the third down, fourth quarter,

like crank up. Oh, yeah, there's our first round pick. Yeah. Okay. That's exactly. Yeah. And, you know, that's obviously, you want maybe a little more consistent.

and see out of your first round pick, a top 20 pick. But yeah, it's good to see him pop up and make these impact plays here and there. Yep, can't see. He was another good one to add. I like that. I was also going to shout out Carl Brooks for the Packers. Six-rounder. He's doing some nice things.

Double hand swipe machine. He's got a really good move. Might use it a little too much, but it's nice. But yeah, some defense tackles are really picking it up. So those were some good shouts. Linebacker, kind of a, you know, pace, of course, with the Vikings. but anyone else that maybe that has stood up to you at the linebacker position? I mean, it's kind of like what we thought about these linebackers before the draft.

It's kind of like, yeah, like hard to get super excited about these guys. Yeah. But my guy Henry Toto, he's got 53 tackles. He's the only rookie linebacker with at least 35 tackles at the miss season point, which says a lot about this rookie class of linebackers. but he it's tough because he misses so many tackles too um i mean just watching that defense and he is a lot of times right place right time but he's just you just a little bit longer wish he was just a little bit stronger to make

finish finish that play um you know i i but i i think with uh totoe because they're they're relying on him quite a bit um i don't have his snap numbers in front of me let me try and oh he's out there all the time yeah because he is uh they they are expecting a lot out of him. And he's responded well. I mean, like I said, the missed tackles are frustrating. But even in coverage,

I think he's doing better than, um, I expected. Not great, but better than I expected. So, um, yeah,

he, he leads all linebackers with 400 defensive, uh, snaps. I mean, it's more than a hundred than the next, uh, most by a linebacker with pace who's got 280.

So yeah, I mean, he is out there. They are relying on him quite a bit. Yeah. I think, I think worst case with him is that he is a at least a two down backer. You know what I mean?

Like, yeah, which is totally fine. I think he, uh, I think Damico Rines likes him. And I think he wants him on the field, even if he does have some of the blemishes like you're bringing it up.

He tries to like make it work inside in the middle. But it's like, because he wants them out there. He wants that mind out on the field. But the other guy I was going to bring up, uh, but it was not, he didn't end up like kind of sticking out.

It was Dore Williams for the bills from Tulane. And that was more just off one game I watched him. I was like, for when Matt Milato went down. They were figuring it all out, figuring it all out, Bill's defenses. Just, I feel so bad for them. Because it's just so many guys just not only just like, oh, I got hurt. It's like, nope, out for the year.

But so feel pretty tough for them. Any other linebackers, really? I couldn't really. Pace Williams and Toa Toto were really the ones I had Campbell's out there a little bit. Jack Campbell, yeah, I think he's, we're going to see more and more out of him. I think so, too. The second half. But yeah, it's a lean group.

It is. Let's kick it back in the spine. The safety position, I mean, I just want some badass nickels in this class. But any other defensive backstart in the safeties or the nickels or a slot position, I should say, that stood out to you, Dane. I mean, Brian Branch, you know, he's still the guy. I don't think there's any other safeties that's, you know, really come close to that. And then, Izzyn. Is he in?

Is he? Yeah, yeah, yeah. He is played well. Yeah. You know, he's a small guy. I mean, he is not even 5-9, I don't think. He's under 200 pounds. But, yeah, he has showed up and played well, which has been really great to see.

He's like, he's pad in the box score. He just shows up. He's just one of those guys that makes plays. I'm loving, like, this is kind of people finding this role, like, especially at the slot position and just like these versatile players kind of really going to shine. Ryan Branch is a great one. I'll just include corners here because Devin Witherspoon for the Ciox has just been a dynamo. I compared him to the pistol from Halo 1 in my article. Like, just this is what he does?

Just three headshots and he wipes out your team. But any other DBs, any corners that maybe stood out for you today outside of Witherspoon or including Witherspoon, if you want to, any thoughts on him. Yeah, I mean, Witherspoon, I think his debut, which was a week two, I think that was a little up and down. But since then, he has not allowed to touchdown. he has not allowed a reception over 25 yards. I think he's been one of the best, not even rookies, one of the best cornerbacks in terms of run support.

I mean, he is so good coming downhill. And that was kind of his MO, right? That competitiveness is also a worry. It's like, okay, this guy's 180 pounds. Can he really play like this and hold up? But he's second among all rookies and pass breakups of six. So, yeah. and then that competitive nature,

one of the best run-defending corners, not just rookies, but corners in the entire league. So, yeah, Witherspoon's been a lot of fun. Joey Porter, since he, his role has grown. I mean, he's really locked down. I think he's, like, he sees targets, but he doesn't give up a lot of reception. I mean, his reception rate is really low.

Obviously, Christian Gonzalez hasn't been playing, so it's not, you know, I think he still deserves me talked about is one of the best corner or rookie corners. But yeah, he's on the on the shelf for the rest of the year. And then I do want to shout out Emmanuel Forbes because he talked about some high highs and low lows. Oh, yeah. But he was back in the high highs this past weekend against Patriots to get finished with three past breakups.

So he had a big hand in getting that win for the commander. So Forbes, a little bit of a roller coaster, but coming off a game where he was at his best. and the reason why they drafted him where they did. Yeah, he's an aggressive and an emotional player. He is a swinging for the fences corner. And I think he got introduced to the NFL by AJ Brown and a few others. And I think that kind of got to him a little bit. And he was always trying to make a play, which is why you like him, all those returns in college and all that, his nose for the ball.

But in the NFL that got on tape and he wasn't rectifying it. And so they benched him, I believe, against the foul. And I think that actually is what helped. It kind of made him take a breath. Okay. There's times to be aggressive in the NFL. And I think that's what he's leaning into it. So great shout out with Forbes.

I still like him. Great shout out with Joey Porter Jr. He is really a little more fluid movement than I was expecting out of him. Like he actually doesn't look as, I mean, he's still a big body. Right. Doesn't have as much stiffness so far as what I'm seeing. So it's really cool watching him in coverage. I knew he'd have some handsiness and some physicalness.

really take it to guys. But in that division that he's in, that's really nice to have against the receivers he's going to have to go against. So last guy, I did like, I think he's been banged up a little bit, but Juju Brands for the Colts, second rounder, still want to study him, still want to write about him. I've mentioned this for about a month now, but he's an interesting watch. The Colts defense is really interesting and interesting as a team as a whole. A couple guys I wanted to mention to, Mikey Blackman for the Vikings, I thought, has been a

really good player. I've been really impressed with him. I think he has lived up to being, I think the drafts him won't the third round. So, I mean, he has lived up to being a day two player up to this point. And then two players who have,

you know, you show their highlight tape and you're like, oh, wow, this rookie of the year, right? But then you show the rest of the tape and you're like, oh, okay, Tyreek Stevenson for the Bears

and Deonté Banks for the Giants. Yes. Both those guys, you see the talent. That's exactly. But it is, it is very up and down. And Stevenson,

he has given up seven touchdowns. Not a good number. But he also has gotten his hands on a lot of footballs. I think he's got six pass breakups now. So, I mean, he is, and then even as a tackler,

he's been, I think, pretty good. But it's just too much feaster famine and coverage. It's too much. Eyes in the wrong place. You know, just not reacting the way he should in terms of reading the route, reading the receiver, and then making sure he's in position

to contest the throw. He needs to get better there. And same thing with banks. You see the talent. I mean, I don't think the Giants regret drafting him where they did because you see the talent. You think it's going to get better and better. It's just some of these low points needs to eliminate before, you know, we're going to talk about him as living up to being a first round pick when it's all said and done. And he was more toolsy anyways.

He was. Yeah. That's fair. That's always what you expect to go. And I thought that was a perfect player scheme fit going to what they run again, man coverage a lot with the job. But yeah, I agree. He's had some real nice moments, but there's been, he's got a, he's got a, it's a tough world out there playing corner in the NFL.

It's hard. It's really hard. But, yeah, so I think that wraps it up. Any punters, there's been some shout, some, yeah, we got to have some specialists out there. Bryce Barringer, uh, conversation or talk by Jake Moody. Um, or the, the Saints kicker. Yeah. Groupie or whatever his name is.

Groupie, yeah. They have got in his last name, which is always scary. There's quite a bit, I mean, we're like eight or nine or ten kickers and punters that are, you know, starting right now. So it's an interesting group. But, yeah, I think that, and I think even the Cowboys, Aubrey, I mean, he's, I mean, fascinating story. Yeah. Kicking at Notre Dame, soccer player, decided to try it out. And, I mean, he had a rough start and he's been pretty great ever since.

So, yeah, it's. It's an interesting group of specialists and even returners. This is where we could throw Marvin Mims in there and a couple of the other guys. So, yeah, the specialist, I want to make sure we give them a shout out as well. Absolutely. I know. I'm looking into punter stats for TBD reasons. It might not become anything.

But I did notice that a lot of the rookie punters were really having at it. I knew this offseason looking at way too many depth charts throughout this entire offseason. I noticed which teams did not have punters, Rams, or a kicker, Rams, or a long snapper ramps. So I was very, very curious which team that they would end up, or which players they would end up going with. So, I mean, even their, their guy looks like he's booming the ball. So, yeah, it's fun, fun watching some of these new guys in here. So a lot of Australians coming in. But yeah, what's, kick it on over back to the prospect section of this show, going to preview, try to wrap up a lot of these shows with this. But what is Dane watching this weekend? What are some of the

games that you are highlighting that are going to be on your screen or where are some of the prospects that you're keeping an eye on? Well, yeah, and let's go in chronological order. Start at noon, Eastern, Saturday, and Michigan at Penn State, this is going to be a big one. You know, there's so much noise

with this Michigan program right now, obviously. I'm not going to get into that right now, but what's, you know, Penn State's coming off a good win. I think they've regrouped since the Ohio State loss.

It's a tough place to go and play and win a football game. So this is going to be a big test for Michigan to see what, what they're made of, their resiliency with all the noise about them, and, you know, how do they regroup?

answer this type of challenge. So J.J. McCarthy, a lot of riding on him. You know, the running backs with Blake Quorum and Donovan Edwards have not been the guys we expected coming into the year, but they're still really talented players. So what do they look like? This Penn State's defense is, even though Ohio State did find some success against them, they're still a really good unit. And I don't know if we're going to see Chop Robinson out there.

He's been banged up since that Ohio State game. It sounds like they're going to get them back at some point this year. Not sure if it's going to be for this Michigan game. But obviously he's a big one to watch, Kaelin King as well, going up against Roman Wilson, Michigan receiver, who one of the better senior whiteouts this year. So that's definitely one to watch at noon. In the 330 window, Utah at Washington.

It's another big test for Michael Pennix. He was good against USC, but, you know, hard to. really expect anything else against that defense. Related. USC fired their defense coordinator. In related news. Right, exactly. So Utah is a much more well-coached defense. And so this will be a best coach teams. Exactly. So Utah is going to have trouble scoring points probably. But, you know, Washington's defense did not look very impressive either against Caleb in that group. So Utah and Washington definitely won the watch. Later on the evening, we've got

Ole Miss at Georgia, should be a fun one. Georgia with Carson Beck and Ladd McConkey and obviously Brock Bowers is still out, but that offense can still do some things. Texas at TCU, do we see Quinn Ewers? Sounds like he's day to day, so we won't

know until game time, if we're going to see that quarterback or not. And then USC at Oregon. USC coming off that deflating loss. I mean, the picture of Caleb Williams in his mom's arms, you know, just so emotional. And I don't understand what people are killing him for it. I mean, the fact that his give a shit meter is so high that he's just, it's so emotional

after the, like, I love that. Like, you're going to tell me like he's, it's going to hurt him. Yeah. It's being competitive. I know. You put so much into it that, you know, it's, I don't know. I'd be even more worried if he was just. kind of shrugged it off and it's like,

eh, that's all right. Just a loss. Like, you know, right. A couple days later, that's fine.

Oh, I'm gonna be a pro in three months anyways, who cares? Like that would be like, all right. Right. So.

Lauren Bell's going off. But now, okay, what, you know, USC, it feels like their season's over, right? You know,

they're, I don't even think they're ranked anymore. Um, yeah, they're obviously out of the playoff picture, um, out of the PAC 12 picture.

But you know what? They've got an Oregon team coming up here that they can play spoiler. And so what does this team look like? You know, what does Caleb look? What, what, would they be able to regroup this week and, and, and, and do something. So this is, it's kind of a big gut check, uh, moment for Caleb and just, uh, you know, to see what that offense looks like with, with him running the show. So yeah, looking forward to that one. That's in the 10.30, uh, window for us on the East Coast over here. Yeah, that's, uh, yeah, 730 are a time, but our first game that, that's great. Well, unless you're a big 10 fan, like, it's early, but.

10 grad, but 9 a half football, which actually. You're up, you're up, right? I'm on way up. I'm way up. Daylight savings has been great. It's been so fun with a one-year-old. It's been something. Yeah, it was great on Sunday when my kids were all up at 6 a.m.

And screaming, it's like, why you? Oh, that's right. That's right. I know. Well, that was, yeah, ours is getting up at 5 a.m. Instead of 6 a.m. And then my wife's like, why is he getting up at 5? I'm like, the hour.

Oh, no. It's like, all right, we got to train them off of this. They don't warn parents for that. No, no, yeah, didn't think about this one. Did not. I'm pretty good about the time zone stuff and everything. No, did not think about this one at all. Didn't think it would be.

I was like, they'll just adjust like we do. Yeah, right, right, right. Oh, they get to sleep in? Great. Yeah, no. No, no, not at all. But, you know, with my kids, if I, well, you didn't get enough sleep last night. Here, we'll go to bed early.

Yeah, or, you know, or maybe I'll keep them up late at night. That way they'll sleep in more the next morning. No, that's not how it works. Nope, that's why you're going to be consistent. Yeah, exactly. I know. You do. I'm trying to be consistent with it.

But I am consistently watching these games. How about that? There we go. That's how we're going to spin that. That's how we're going to send us off. But it's always, this was a lot of fun. I love talking prospects and pros with you, Dane. We'll be here every single Wednesday.

Make sure to check it out. We'll see you guys next time. This was the athletic football show's prospects to pros podcast.