The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Teams at a crossroads in the 2023 NFL Draft

Episode Date: April 11, 2023

Left or right? This way or that? A number of teams find themselves at a crossroads on the doorstep of the 2023 NFL Draft. Robert Mays and Nate Tice discuss the paths those teams can take on this episode of The Athletic Football Show.Follow Robert on Twitter: @robertmaysFollow Nate on Twitter: @Nate_TiceSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTube3:36 Ravens sign Odell Beckham11:23 Green Bay Packers16:30 Los Angeles Rams27:17 Minnesota Vikings39:29 New York Giants47:18 Pittsburgh Steelers54:28 Washington Commanders59:42 Tennessee Titans68:21 Tampa Bay Buccaneers75:11 New England Patriots Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Football Show. Welcome to the Athletic Football Show. I'm Robert Mays. Join me today. It's my good friend Nate Tyson. How you doing, buddy? Doing very well. This is, I feel rejuvaded.

You know, another week closer to the draft, got a video up on YouTube. You know, just checking a lot of boxes. Tax is done. Oh, wow. I got to do that. Yeah. Everything's going very, very well. Got updated some claims for my flex spending account.

I am an adult. I'm an adult fully my 30s right now, but I am doing very, very well. We are rambling toward the draft here. Rumbling toward the draft here. I'm rambling. We are rumbling. We are rumbling collectively. A couple weeks until the draft.

We're going to do another kind of pullback to look at NFL teams today. Not specific prospects or not what we expect from this class of players entering the draft, but where some of these teams sit on the eve of the draft. We've already done the teams that we feel like have the most at stake in this year's draft. Naturally, it was a lot of teams at the top of the draft and a lot of teams with a ton of picks. I will venture a guess and say that at some point before the draft, we'll talk about some of the contenders and maybe what they need to do to finish off some of these championship caliber rosters, potentially, in a way that the Chiefs did last year. That might be a show that we will do here over the next couple weeks. But today we're going to spend some time talking about, I don't know how to frame this.

And that's a problem. Maybe we'll get to that by the end of the show. The team's in the middle. The teams that maybe we just can't really figure out, they're either at a crossroads in their team building plan. They're kind of stuck in no man's land. They've got some needs, but not a ton. Some teams that we really just can't quite get a handle on. And we're going to land on about eight to ten of those teams and just try to untangle where they're at at this stage of their process today.

Yeah, each one, two. And that's what it's hard to title this, because, Each one, I like when we presented to, or presented to each other on our Slack chat was vibes. What are the vibes of each team? And just checking in on that, you know, just a little oil check. You know, some are going to beat the crap with 180,000 miles on that. A team based in Los Angeles might be like that.

And some teams are just fresh, you know, like new tires. And they're also just trying to, you know, spruce up the rest of their interior of their car. So I'm, I'm interested to see where we go with each of these teams discussions because it's fun. I think all of them, I kind of have one central question that I'll use to kind of get us kicked off and then we'll just explore things from there. Before we dig into this list of teams, though, one piece of news that we wanted to hit coming out of the weekend. Odell Beckham signs a one year up to $18 million deal with the Baltimore Ravens. I believe he and Rappaport was the first person to report it and since a lot of other people have chatted about it obviously since that news came down on Sunday. at first glance, I assumed that that up to 18 million language was going to be doing a lot of heavy lifting.

And what that contract for a 30-something O'Dow Beckham, who hasn't played in over a year, might be getting on the open market. It turns out it's not doing much lifting at all. Odo Beckham gets $15 million from the Baltimore Ravens. The majority of that in a signing bonus, I have to assume they're going to have the maximum amount of void years or several void years tacked on to this thing. to keep his cap hit in the $2, $3 million range for 2022. But he gets $15 million in cash, no matter how this goes. And that number is a little bit higher than I expected it to be. But I think that we can kind of read into what that number looks like,

what it means for the Ravens, and why they felt so compelled to do this and get to that point. Yeah, they paid a pretty penny. Someone asked me, it was that a premium for having to be a wide receiver with the Ravens. And in my head, I said before probably yes, but you know, Greg Roman's no longer there. So Todd Munkin is a lot more receiver friendly. So that is not as much of a premium. They compared it to a pitcher at Corse Field playing for the Rockies.

They have to always like pay a premium for their pitchers. So I kind of actually thought that was pretty funny. Whoever replied with that, that was pretty pretty funny. But it's not the same situation. This is interesting. I like the talent level of OBJ. It's probably, I mean, as big of a fan of I am. of Rashad Bateman.

This is the best receiver that Lamar potentially might ever play with. I do think there is a little redundancy with Rashad Bateman and OBJ. Guys are best on underneath stuff and yak and route running and kind of I want to see a big pass catcher. I'm assuming all this that Lamar is coming back, but even if he is not, but same just building out that pass catcher room. But also just with OBJ, like you said, he hasn't played in over a year. And it came off a knee in the Super Bowl, who where he was playing very, very well,

was playing very well throughout that playoffs for the Rams. But this is the, OBJ's name has done a lot of lifting for him over the past few seasons. And I tweeted this and it seemed to mean, but I really, this is a fact. Adam Thielen, Doug Baldwin, Larry Fitzgerald, T.Y. Hilton have all made Pro Bowls

more recently than OBJ has in 2016. And so that is something you have to keep in mind that there is talent, but he hasn't reached the peaks, peaks of what we know, the one-handed grab and all that from his giant's days. Brown seems fine. it wasn't a great mismatch, a great synergy with Baker and that offense. He still has talent like we saw with the Rams, but just have to be realistic about what he is in this time and age.

Yeah, I mean, the actual risk associated with the contract, if they move on after this year, which I assume they might, if it's a one-year deal, you know, you make him a post-June first cut or do whatever kind of cap magic you have to do to spread out the cap hits with all of those void years. $15 million in the headline is a lot of money, but I think that there are ways around to kind of mitigate whatever they actually. actual impact is going to be on the opportunity costs and what it prevents them from doing all of that stuff. The most interesting parts of this to me go way beyond Odo Beckham getting $15 million, what his on-field impact is going to look like, all that stuff. The receiving core as a whole, I actually think that O'Dow Beckham, Rashad Bateman, and Nelson Aguilar for a million dollars instead of the $11 million that the Patriots were paying him is not the worst group of pass catchers with Mark Andrews to work with Amar Jackson and in this Todd Monk in offense. But

still, to me, the most interesting takeaway from all of this, most interesting tidbit of all of this, is what does this mean about Lamar Jackson coming back to Baltimore? The fact that he seemed pretty involved in the process, according to Tom Pelliser, the fact that O'Dell Beckham was even willing to do this and willing to go to a team, presumably, that doesn't know who their starting quarterback is going to be based on the Lamar Jackson drama. It kind of seems like it's giving us some clarity about where Lamar Jackson is going to be playing this season and how much of him we're going to see playing for the Ravens, which is what I always thought was going to happen. Yeah, and already posted pictures of them FaceTiming.

So it seems like an indicator of the quarterback of the team is kind of going like, yeah, I'm happy you're coming here. It's not like that. It doesn't sound like that he's moving on. And I do want to say this too. Like you brought up the receiving room with Mark Andrews as well is that this is, OBJ is better than a lot of the receivers in this class could ever potentially be. Yeah, even this version of him and where the Ravens are at as a team.

we're talking about appeasing quarterbacks and trying to sweeten, hey, we got a guy for you. It's not theory. We're not fake promising. We're going to draft a guy and we don't draft a guy. Same thing that the Cardinals did last year, trading for Hollywood Brown. So it's kind of funny to see what these teams are doing to kind of appease their quarterbacks. And I don't mean that in a bad way, but just trying to go like, hey, we're trying to put a good situation around you. We got a different offense coordinator.

It's better than the passing attack for you. That's going to be creative. And now we got another bonafide guy that even though I brought up some negatives with him, OBJ still has a lot of weight in the league, you know, has a lot of sway. And I'm sure that's going to do a lot for how Lamar's feeling about the whole organization and what they're actually doing for him for the future. It's a great point. I mean, it's selling OBJ on coming.

I think there's probably Lamar Jackson element to it. Selling Lamar Jackson on coming back, there's probably an Odo Beckham component to it. So I think it works both ways here. And yeah, I mean, it's one of those things where the money seems like a lot. I think that yesterday I tweeted out the cousin Greg meme. I was just like, oh, wow, strong. Wow, strong for a man. Yeah, that's, I was surprised about how much it was,

but he's about to get on a plane and go to the Jets when you have multiple parties and you have a team that's motivated to do it because they want to keep you from getting on that plane and going to New York and negotiating with the Jets. I mean, I think that's how you get to a number like this. And it's a lot. It's an overpay. I think any way you slice it, but I understand how they arrived at this point. And now I kind of just want to see Lamar Jackson in a Todd Munkin, Odo Beckham,

Rashad Bateman offense, and it feels like we're inching closer to that reality. That is a really fun. Again, OBJ is better than a lot of these receivers in this class. So a lot of those didn't really get me excited. You know, I was like, oh, you know, maybe Cedric Tillman in the second round. You know, that would be interesting. Well, they traded their pick. Oh, so they might not be able to get a guy that I like.

OBJ is a lot more fun. Hopefully Rashad Bateman has a healthy year, you know, pairing with them with Mark Andrews and, like you said, Nelson Aguard. that is some fun synergy. Andrews is the size guy. They all can kind of work over the middle where Lamar loves the throw, you know, especially in the intermediate balls. So I'm excited for it. I wasn't expecting it, to be honest, I thought this Jets thing was going to happen. So I'm excited to see OBJ playing potential with Lamar and Todd Munkin. And that's the other bit of connection here is that OBJ already played for Todd Munkin in Cleveland when he was the offensive coordinator

during that very strange Freddie Kitchen season where Mocken was coming off of a fantastic run as the play caller for the Bucks, went to Cleveland where he wasn't the play caller but was the offensive coordinator for that team that completely crash and burned, which is a fun little bit of a trip down memory lane remembering that 2018, 2019 Brownstein?

I can even tell you. It was 2019. 2019. It was Baker's second year. Yeah, that will fever dream year. Let's get to some of these teams. in the middle, some of these teams we cannot quite figure out from this year's draft. Let's start with the Green Bay Packers.

It was one of the first teams that you and I were kicking around, and we haven't really talked about them that much in the context of what comes next. And that's kind of my big question to kick this off. What do the Packers look like and how do the Packers operate in a post-Rogers world? Because it's not something we really got to see that often because they haven't really done much in free agencies so far. So what is this draft going to tell us? about who this version of the Packers is when Rogers has moved on.

And not only haven't done much like for agency wants, haven't done much about coaching staff wise. Like Joe Barry is still there. Yeah. Same OC, same special teams coach. Like everybody kind of comes back. There's a lot of returning players. I really do think that this team desperately needs,

and this kind of feels hilarious. So we're saying this again about this team, needs pass catchers. And that's the number one thing, tight end or receiver and receiver, whichever word you want to use there. I think that that's the most whoever's playing quarterback. I know it's not going to be Aaron Rogers,

but it's like whoever is playing quarterback there needs pass catchers. Michael Mayer from Notre Dame has been kind of a popular mocked pick for them. Actually, I would love that for their first round pick. You know, in Ohio State's JSN, Jackson Smith and Jigba, meets their 195 pound threshold, which is very important when we're talking pass catchers for the Packers, is that they have sized thresholds for the receiver position, which is 195 pounds.

So I don't know what to say about as far as like what this indicates for their path because they return so much. So it's kind of more just like adding and dropping in guys. And that's kind of how I've looked at this Packers team and how they can help out Jordan Love potentially. So what we've seen with Rogers is that they haven't felt compelled to go and get these guys early in the draft. We famously did not draft the pass catcher in the first round during Aaron Rogers's tenure there. And that includes tight ends. Do you know the last Packers' tight end who was taken in the first two rounds? I wasn't Bubba Franks.

When was Finley drafted? You actually did have it. It was Bubba Franks? It was Bubba Franks? They drafted Bubba Franks in the first round of the 2000 draft. And that is, so the time concerns I put it on it were since Ron Wolf was there. Because with the Packers, some of these things like, oh, the so-and-so franchise hasn't done this in 40 years. Well, they've had 10 different GMs over that time.

Who really gives a shit? Brian Buchan's has worked in Green Bay since 19. 98 when Ron Wolf was still the general manager there. So there is a lot of similar DNA with all of these different regimes. And they have not done it since 2000 when they drafted Bubba Franks. And they haven't done in the first two rounds. So drafting a tight end that high or a receiver that high would be a departure. But they've been working for the most part during that stretch with Hall of Fame quarterbacks.

And what we've seen with the chiefs that are another good example, if you have that guy that you feel like is the guy, you can skimp on your pass catcher sometimes because you're, you're, you're you're trusting that quarterback to elevate whoever you put around him. Even if they're optimistic about Jordan Love, you can't make that same bet again. I think that you have to be willing to build a team around Jordan Love that can lift him up on occasion until he ultimately, in their hopes, gets to that place. So if they spend a little earlier on these guys, maybe it wouldn't be that surprising, even if we haven't seen them do it before. Yeah, it's like the sliding scale of investment for this.

It's where we now we got a younger quarterback that needs a little bit of help. Well, let's get him some guys that will help them as opposed to the other way around. When you're comfortable trading Devante Adams or not taking these guys because you say, hey, they'll make our B players A minus players. Our C players, B minus players. That's how good our quarterback play is. And it's just funny. It's the biggest kind of news with this team, I guess, is like it's not even the draft. It's all the lead up for the draft.

You know, who blinks between them and the Jets? Or if another team gets involved, 49ers. Keep an eye on that. But it is something that is just that's really more of the news with this team. And then once the draft happens, it's kind of going to be like, oh, yeah, that makes sense. I would say the other hole that they have, I just want to throw us in there is safety. Wow. Isn't it they desperately.

Goodness gracious. Oh, my goodness. It's especially with Darnel Savage is more of a slot now. And like he kind of got unlocked there. So they need safety very, very badly, especially for a team that thrives on their safety play. Adrian Amos did a lot for this defense the last couple of years. He's setting free agency. And they brought back Rudy Ford.

on a modest deal. That was like the big free agent splash they made was bringing back Rudy Ford. So they have a lot of work to do there as well. And I think the big question for them in the draft is, where will they be drafting? How many picks will they have? They can have an extra second round pick. They can have two extra second round picks. The Jets are picking at 42 and 43 after the Elijah Moore trade.

The Brown's got their third round pick. The Jets got the Brown second round pick. So a lot of questions in terms of how much draft capital they've had, they will have, and where they want to use it. Absolutely. A team that doesn't have quite as much draft capital. The next one we're going to talk about here is the Los Angeles Rams. What do you want to start with that? So they were the team that kind of kicked off this idea. Okay. Okay. These teams coming into the draft that are kind of total wild cards. It seemed to be at a crossroads of sorts. And the Rams embody that. I mean, what are the Rams going to try to do? Like what kind of team do the Rams think they can be, I think is the prevailing most important question with this? Because, it's hard to even tightly round up the needs that the Rams have. And I think that's mostly on defense.

You can talk yourself into a more healthy Rams team being better on offense in 23 and then being competent on that side of the ball. And that includes the offensive line even, which was a disaster last year. On defense, there is no rosy optimistic way to spin this. I want to read you the guys at the top. of the depth chart for the Los Angeles Rams at cornerback, edge rusher, and safety. Okay? Let's do it.

At cornerback, it's Darian, Kendrick, Kobe Durant, and Robert Rochelle. At edge rusher, it's Michael Hoek, Kair, Thomas, and Daniel Hardy. Thomas and Hardy played 112 snaps combined last season. At safety, Jordan Fuller is still there. we have Quentin Lake, Rust Yeast, Randy Rye, and Frank Flower. Russ yeast. Man, that's a, it's a rough name. I made up the final two names.

Those are made up names. Rust yeast is real. But the other two are bread terms and I wanted to see if you actually thought those were real people. I knew Russ East is a real. Rust yeast is a real guy. Because I came across it and I was like, Russ yeast is the guy's name. Did not hear the last two, though.

That's my brain went. that's fake. It's like when your eyes, you know, like with CGI. Those are both fake. Those are the uncanny valley of Rams fake defensive players. Rust yeast is real, though. Those are the guys at the top of the depth chart at all of those positions. It's rough. It's every time I check in and they don't have a single specialist on their roster, no kicker, punter, or long snapper on their entire roster, which is hilarious. It's not like, yeah, you can fill those spots, but it's just funny to see a team in April not have a kicker punter or long snapper on their entire roster.

My breakdown for this, like when I was prepping for this show, basically unfolded exactly what you just did other than the made-up bread names, was that I just listed like, who are, it's a who's who's that on defense. Like it's crazy. Yeah, I had Aaron Donald D-Line, I had linebacker at Ernest Jones and the DB, Jordan forward. I like Kobe Durant. He had a couple moments last year.

But other than that, it's like, I don't know who these guys are, not even like, a glimmer where I'm like, oh, yeah, that guy did this as a senior in college. I remember that. Or this guy did something in his first year. Don't remember any of these guys. It's an insane, insane, insane roster that they're putting together and that they're going to trot out this year. And they don't have their first round pick.

They do have a couple day two picks, though. So my question is they're picking a 36. They have their second round pick. It's up near the top of the second round. Do we just see them try to accumulate as many picks as possible? Is that the strategy here? They have an extra third round pick that they got in the J.1 Ramsey trade, which is actually the pick that the Patriots traded to the dolphins for Devante Parker,

which is going to be like a fun little bit of trivia if that player ever turns into anything. But they don't have the first round pick. So do they try to turn 36 into two more mid-round dice rolls? And do we just see them start to do everything they can to build up every level of the defense with as many mid-round players as they possibly can? because I think if you looked at the offense, you could talk yourself into them not having a ton of immediate needs. Joe Mnoboom did not play for most of last year. They've committed to him at right left tackle.

Rob Havenstein is somebody who's been there forever. He played over a thousand snaps last year. Brian Allen is somebody they signed to a multi-year contract detention last year, even though he was hurt, so he's presumably going to be their starting center. Logan Brust, they drafted in the third round last season. He was hurt all of last year. Alaric Jackson gave them some decent.

snaps. Coleman Shelton is still on this roster. So can you piece together what that left guard spot looks like with guys that you already have and just the interior in general? You combine that with healthy Matthew Stafford, Cooper Cup coming back, Alan Robinson, even if disappointing, and a slightly healthier version of Ann Jefferson, that can be a solid, workable NFL offense. The question is, do you just spend all of the draft capital on the defense and how do you balance this? We can be solid on this side of the ball right away, but we're totally rebuild on the other side of the ball. And are you really rebuilding if Aaron Donald was making $30 million?

There are a lot of contradictions happening with his team all at once. And his dead cap is potentially like 29 million, not even 29 million. Yeah, the day, yeah, I think that's what it is. Dead cap down the road, it's like 29 million. So I know like an absurd amount. And that's the thing is they've kind of, I don't say claim, but really I've taken pride in finding these middle round, late round guys. That's kind of like the Rams kind of whole thing.

Hey, you know, F them picks, but we're going to niv. the middle round and late round guys. So like you said, like maybe trade back and fine. I mean, you look at their rust. They got so many third rounders and fourth rounders playing these spots, even a guy like Jordan Fuller, who was a six round pick. I think a fine player. But it's just that they're trying to, you know, thread the needle with this and find

more bodies that they can actually just throw out there. Maybe a couple of them stick. Yeah, I don't know. I just feel so weird about this team. I know for sure I do. I agree with you about the offense and just being healthier. And offensive line is going to help so much. but we're definitely not going to nominate this team as a top 10 offense on that podcast that we do this summer.

They will not be making that list where I squeaked him at the end of the list last year. As far as offensively, they might need another receiver again. I think they absolutely do. But I don't know how it stacks up to the other needs that they have. I could have told him, like, when you signed out on Robinson, man, you could spend that money better elsewhere. It's like you could have done it. You had a path there to actually really help yourself and they just took another step back. It's kind of, you know, Robin Peter to pay Paul.

That's what it feels like with a lot of these moves. So it's a funny team. Yes, they won the ring a couple years ago, but it's just a funny team to see now that they pay everything off, have to pay off that credit card, what it amounts to right now. The guys that you, when you're saying that they've gotten a lot out of their mid to late round picks, they have, but even a lot of those guys have now moved on. Yes. Taylor Rap is a second round pick, but he had free agency this year.

Greg Gaines is a fourth round pick. They got a lot out of him. He's in Tampa Bay now. Nick Scott was a seventh round pick. Nick Scott played a lot of snaps for this team. He's now with the Bengals. Sebastian Joseph Day signed with a Chargers in free agency last year. A lot of these guys that they've hit on, quote unquote, that have given them production,

they're either no longer on the roster or they have been re-signed and are no longer cheap players. So even the hits that they've had no longer form kind of a cheap second and third level of their depth chart in the way that it did in years past. They even need running back. like his came acres is like you know he's whatever he's replacement level and it's it's it's actually funny you just start piecing together and you're like oh i know that name uh they're they're they're in a very strange spot and i just think again my question is what do what does their draft tell us about how they feel about their current situation and if they trade back a bunch and they're just trying to accumulate a bunch of picks and trying to build for the future is that going to tell us

something if they're a little bit more aggressive does that tell us something because they're just in this weird, weird middle ground, man, where McVeigh is back, but they're kind of rebuilding, but like how much are they really going to be rebuilding? And there are just so many more questions about them than answers. And I think that because they really haven't done anything in free agency, because they can't, this is going to be the first time kind of like the Packers, where we learn a little bit about their mindset and where they currently sit. Yeah.

Is it a revamp or a rebuild? Like, or if they, is it a revamp that they're, or is it a rebuild that they're telling themselves that is a revamp that they're like, oh, no, we're. we're still, we're still going to be. That's kind of where I'm sitting. That's where I think they're at. Like that they're like saying, oh, no, we're we've, we got a couple pieces that we can draft and get some starters there and we'll be fine. Right. So it's wide open in the NFC, but really that's like, this roster isn't really one that's going to that looks like, that screams a playoff roster. It is funny. Going over their offseason moves. They traded for Hunter Long, the Ramsey deal. And then they resigned Coleman and the Marquis Copeland. And then it was like, that's it. That's, that's the list. It was three bullet points when you had to look at the review of what they did this off season. Just a funny, funny, funny. team in Los Angeles right now. I really have no idea what to expect from the draft or beyond. We're going to learn a lot about them.

Next one here. The Minnesota Vikings. My big question about the Vikings is where are they at kind of on that competitive rebuild cycle that they tried to sell us last year? And they've made some moves this off season that I think try to thread that needle in the way that they did a year ago, right? They bring in Byron Murphy. They bring in Marcus Davenport.

Both of them kind of as their big, free agent additions, right? Combined those guys are going to make less than $9 million against the cap this year. Right. So they've tried to bring in these reinforcements, but maintain flexibility later on. You know, they have some of the young pieces they drafted last year in Andrew Booth and Lewis seen that should step into bigger roles now that they've moved on from some of their older, more expensive pieces. So what does the draft look like for them? Are they still going to kind of be looking to 2024? Do they make a move for a quarterback? Like, where are they at in this competitive rebuild mindset that they started a year ago?

And what do we learn about their draft class that can tell us more about that? Yeah, they kind of a lot of whispers happening with them and quarterbacks and potential move up, which I think is, which would be very interesting. We've talked about teams getting aggressive if they like a guy. So that is something, you know, there's a lot of smoke with it, specifically with Henan Hooker, you know, as the, you know, kind of the fifth quarterback of this class and potentially a guy that can sneak into the half the first round, which I would be, I would not endorse, but it is something that teams might do. And the fact that there has been linking of that, it's like, okay, there's smoke there.

You know, even if you have to rethrough a lot, especially in this type of the year, it's the silly season. But still, there is something notable there. Stuff like, do they trade Dalvin Cook still or even release them? Like, that's something I thought would happen by now. Same was Darias Smith. They've got several guys that's like, oh, man, are they going to hang out of this guy? Like, they can save a bunch of money if they don't. That's kind of, like, interesting.

like, okay, that's kind of like signaling. All right. So you guys looking at this is a very competitive deer. Even saying that with the Davenport and Byer Murphy signings, I actually kind of like that for where they're at because it's like it's a high upside move. Yes, those guys have injury history and you can't count on guys with injury history, but it's like that 5% chance both of these guys play most of the games. It's like, okay, they can surprise some people because those are plus players that they got kind of at a discount. But they still need cornerback desperately. I liked Andrew Booth, but he's had a long history of injuries.

They have the new defensive coordinator, Brian Flores, and you have to keep that in account, too, is they need corners. They need guys that can cover because he's going to play a lot of man coverage and blitz a lot. And that does, do we see more three safety looks with Bynum, Harrison Smith, who's probably on the outset for this year and Lewis Seen, their first round pick last year. So it's an interesting team because it is that competitive rebuild, like you put it, and it's a team that's trying to straddle both at the same time. And doing the whole Kirk thing again, it's like they want to assess everything else. They might need another receiver. You know, I know they like KJ Osborne. I like him as a nice role player, but they might need another guy.

I did like the Josh Oliver signing to maybe signal more of a move to 12 personnel with him and Hawkinson. But yeah, just a lot of, still a lot of question marks with this team. Obviously, that's why we're bringing them up on this show. The receiver thing is something I also thought about whether they think they need another one. and even if they're going to play more 12 personnel or even if they do like Osborne, like down the road, you know, starting next year, do you feel like for the future again? Like how much are they looking to right now? How much are they looking to build one, two, three years down the road?

And I just don't know the answer to that. The quarterback question will be the biggest consideration with that and where they ultimately find that guy. Hypothetically, let's say the Vikings really liked Will Levis. I don't know if they do. And I would be honestly to be surprised if they did. but let's say they do and he's on the board at 10

aren't they the most reasonable team to like make that sort of move up for a quarterback considering the rest of their roster like if you went through the other options I think it's them and in terms of timeline

probably Tampa would be the teams where it's like okay if you dropped a quarterback into this making them play for that guy and giving up something to go get him would make the most sense based on what you have on the rest of your roster. Yeah, those two would make a ton of sense.

And I know Titans have been linked up to a move up, but I still wouldn't be allowed. We'll get to that. Yeah, yeah, but for Titans, I'm like, yeah, you guys need about 20 other things before you look at a quarterback in the future. Yeah, they would, especially at 10, in that hypothetical, I would understand that move up. I'd be like, yeah, that's, that's a interesting plan that kind of resets your,

obviously you're drafting a quarterback, kind of resets a lot. Your timeline makes so much more sense now, more tolerable. Now you have the rookie quarterback deal that can really replenish your whole team because now you have more resources to fight with, even if you're giving up draft capital. That would be interesting, though. Especially in that scenario, if one of these top four guys does fall to that, the bear's range or anything after that, then it becomes super, super interesting.

They don't have a ton of picks. They traded their second round pick in the Hawkinson trade. And then they traded their own fourth round pick last year to go get Caleb Evans in the fourth round. So they don't have a ton of picks. They have two picks in the top 100, 23 and 87, I believe. And they have a need of corner. I would say they still have a need at interior defensive line. I know they signed Dean Lowry and Free Agency and Harrison Phillips is still there. But they're both under contract next season. But I think adding another piece there is probably helpful. I mean, they're one of those teams that when you look at the starting 11 on both sides, it's like, okay. They're a reasonable team. Like they can be a competitive team. But I still think that, their one, two, three, four moves away from being like a real championship caliber roster. And how they see that timeline to me is the most interesting question about that. Yeah. Caleb Evans, that like that name's going to stick out to me because I, like he started to stand out to me a little bit with his play, you know, middle of the season.

I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm going to mention this guy in the podcast. And literally, I think the day I mentioned him or I was about to mention him, he got hurt when on IR. I, I, I, seeking jinks. I don't want me praising you guys. Like that I've just realized that. I'm going to refer to these guys and not say anything too glowing because otherwise they get hurt right away. It seems like.

But that's the thing. They have Kirk Cousin still. So this is a weird team. The fact that it's like, no, this is not like a total Baker Mayfield with the Bucks move, you know, but we're going to talk about. But it's like just a team that kind of is trying to straddle both. And it's kind of a choose your adventure. We'll see how the draft shakes out. And I think that's going to dictate a lot too.

I wonder what the thought process is with the guy like Hendon Hooker, where it's, okay, we can get him and drop him in. It's a natural kind of handing off of the baton, right? It makes sense. It's a smooth transition into the rookie quarterback contract phase of our team building plan. Or are you feeling like that's kind of like a consolation prize? You're doing it out of convenience or when you rather go into next year's draft saying, we have to go find our guy. I think that question, we talked about a little bit on the mailbag where it's like not everyone can just say, well, we'll get our guy next year. Like that's not going to be available for everyone. So do you feel a sense of urgency if he's there and you kind of like him? Because it's like, all right, we can build around this guy with that contract being

able to give us some more resources to kind of wield on both sides of the ball. Yeah. And the thing, hooker, if we did a hooker hypothetical is that, you know, he's come off an ACL. And by the time his rookie contract ends, he'll be 30. Yeah. And that's, and again, rookie contract, yes. And that's, it's valuable to have a guy that could be a tolerable starter. But again, it's a sunk cost. if it's not a guy that you can actually work with. So that's another thing. It's like, like you said, is that Constellation Prize or a guy that you truly like, they're like, this is our guy.

We moved up and we're anointing him right there. Or is it just kind of a, you know, half measure where you're like, oh, yeah, I guess. Yeah, we did have, right? See, see, new timeline, uh, huh? But, yeah, that's kind of hard to justify, I think, if it is Hooker, if you're trying to move up for that, as opposed to what I think is a real needle mover potentially next year. I know, it's all theory, one hand to in the Bush, but you never know.

Well, when is that worked out? When is the team just kind of picking off a quarterback outside of the top 15 because he was there? When does that end up working out to the benefit of the team in question? Lamar? Lamar is, they had to trade up for Lamar, but yes, it's sort of an answer. Teddy. But that was like, which is the Vikings as well. I think Lamar is Lamar.

Jaywin Hertz. Jaywin Hertz is the best possible example in how that's worked out. Yep, that was the second round. And then I think the other kind of guys that you could throw in that same conversation would be what happened with Andy Dalton and the Bengals, right? So they had the top four pick that year. They drafted AJ Green. They waited until the second round to get Eddie Dalton. They were able to build a really competitive team around Andy Dalton and what he was capable of on that cheap deal.

So we have some examples of it working where it's like, all right, this isn't a needle mover at the position. But because he's functional, we can put so much else around him. Right. And with this team, you have a lot of. lot of these contracts that are there, quote, unquote, expensive contracts that are probably going to be coming off the books as early as next year. Okay. Yeah.

So they can move on from Zadaria Smith, Dalvin Cook. The Kirk Cousins thing, if they make him a post-June first cut, let's say, theoretically, they can save about $18 million. Okay. And then Harrison Smith is probably gone after this year. So the Vikings with those four moves, with those like aging veterans, we're moving. we're moving into a different direction phase of their of their team building process.

They can have $120 million in cap space. And if you drop a rookie quarterback contract into that, that's the sort of flexibility that you're chasing. And you already have your entire starting offensive line in that equation, I believe. You already have Justin Jefferson. And T.J. Hawkinson is going to be hitting free agency, so you're going to have to give out some extensions here.

But you'll have the money. But you'll have the money. So is that the argument for, all right, if we think that Hennon Hooker is a workable player. The flexibility it's going to give us is worth it even if we don't think he's a true needle mover at the position. Or do you wait and say, are we going to be in a position in 24 where if we need to go get a guy, we're willing to move heaven and earth with draft capital, move up and make a play for somebody that we think is that top tier guy at the position. I think those are the two things you have to weigh. And that could be interesting if they,

you know, inject some more juice on the defense. They add another corner. You know, they're in a perfect spot to take one of these corners. And they, they add a little more juice on their defense this year. And then next year, that's that it can be easier to make that move because you say, like you said, the offensive line, Jefferson, the Hawkinson, that's a fun kind of little group on offense to drop whatever rookie you want to in there. And then if you have enough talent that you maybe hit on the defense, okay, that's a nice path. I'd actually, I think that's more tolerable to me, you know, injecting the defense now and then hopefully building for the future or building for the future in the sense that you take that guy in the next year or the year after. There is nothing they

done this off season that is going to preclude them from doing anything next off season, my opinion, right? Like the Mark Staventport contract, the tech all the void years onto it. Byron Murphy has a $10.2 million cap at next year, but there's only $5 million in dead money after this season is over. So I think they can be competitive right now because of the state of the NFC and because Kirk Cousins is a pretty good quarterback when you look at the state of the NFC and they still have really good pieces on offense.

But again, it's going to give them flexibility into next year. and I think that's exactly what they're after. All right. Next one here, a team that I think is in a pretty similar situation in a lot of ways. They played the Vikings in the playoffs last year is the New York Giants. So what does the first phase of the we have committed to Daniel Jones version of the New York Giants look like? I think that is the big question here heading into the draft.

Yeah. I think it is. They have to add another pass catcher. I really do because they're building the whole plane off slot receivers. now. I think that they, so Dan Duggan did a mailbag about this. And he asked, one of the first questions that he addressed in that mailbag was, do they need to draft the past catcher, a wide receiver in the first round? And I think what they have done in free agency and what they have done this off season is made the answer to that question, no. They have enough guys where

they can live this year without like an immediate difference maker at their past catching spots. It's not going to be a great offense if that's the case. But I think they have enough guys bringing Slate back, trading for Waller, the dice rolls with Paris Campbell and Sterling Shepard and having Wondell where it's like, we can roll the ball out, find four dudes, even if we need more juice at these positions. So what we got with Isaiah Hodgins. Yeah, Hodgins too. Yep.

I can't believe I forgot Isaiah Hodgins as the, as one of America's preeminent Isaiah Hodgins lovers. That's what's hilarious last year is that now they have all these slot guys, because Robinson went down last year, is they have all these slot guys now. They were having Hodgins work from the slot. like choice routes because it's like we got nobody else. Like we got dial up plays for this guy. He did great. But that's that's what that's kind of priority for me right now is giving him one more

guy maybe with some size. And I think day two. And I like that brought the point of it doesn't have to be in the first round. Like I've seen I've seen some guys slotted there, Jordan Addinson, Jackson Smith and Jigba. And I'm like, uh, uh, neither of those guys. Not with the giants. Get them some size. Get them some giants.

I mean, that's what they have to do. But they also can maybe, yeah, I even read a day two receiver, another pass rusher potentially, interior offensive lineman, maybe another guy in that kind of range. You know, keep, hey, hey, what's build up this offense? We invested in Daniel Jones. He looked pretty good in those clean pockets last year. So let's keep that going. I really think they're in a spot where, you know, they can continue to add talent.

And I know on defense, though, they need some DBs. They need corners. They need safeties. The Julian love kind of letting him go kind of, I'm still curious about that. That still is like, man, he played well for you guys. Why were you guys so just letting go? It was not like the price tag was huge. They probably could afford it if they wanted it.

It's a really interesting question. Especially how versatile he is. Yeah, that one's weird to me. But anyways, and yeah, they need corners. Remember, it's Wink Martindale. So I think that's, they're in a good spot again. Any of these teams that are in the middle of rounds, there's going to be a couple of them brought up, Vikings being one.

Middle of the first round, I should say with their picks, is they're in a good spot to find a corner. Because that's where a lot of these guys might be going. So that's where I think they might go in the first, and then maybe find some pass catchers on day two or offense alignment on day two. So you mentioned several positions where they need help. And I think that speaks to where this team is. You know, obviously they made the playoffs last year.

They were so much better than we anticipated. But so what does this version of it look like now that they're paying Daniel Jones? And this year, they're in such a strange place just because, again, these kind of last remnants of the Dave Gettleman era. So you're looking at their cap this season. They have $2 million in cap spaces as it currently stands. Leonard Williams,

Dory Jackson, and Daniel Jones are making up $73 million of their, of their 20-23 cap, which is about a third of the cap. And this is the cheap year for Daniel Jones. That's because Leonard Williams is making 32 against the cap and Dory Jackson is making 20. So they'll have flexibility.

And there are other things that they could potentially do. Dexter Lawrence, if they extend him, they can get that number down. Now that the Jeffrey Simmons domino has fallen, you'd assume the Dexter Lawrence extension will be coming eventually. If they sign Sequin to an extension, they can get that number down. But next year is when they have all the flexibility. Even after giving out extensions to Sequin, Dexter Lawrence, whoever they ended up paying,

they're going to have a lot of financial wiggle room next year. I mean, it's like $120 million in cap space. So next year is when they can really kind of realize whatever this is going to look like. But that's what my question is, positionally, where you're trying to build now, is it cornerback depth? Is it safety depth? Do you add more into your offensive line? I think this offseason, even if we have high expectations for them based on what they were last year, I think it's more about making sure the connective tissue of the roster is in the right place before you can make some big splashes next off season. Yeah, it would be like a advice for like a poker player. It's like, don't chase.

Yeah. I think that would be that my advice for them, not that they need it, but I'm just saying it's like, don't chase. Just keep at it. Keep doing what you're doing. Remember where you're at a year. ago, even if you guys made the playoffs, just keep adding talent. I think they're in a decent spot to do best player available and I would understand that, which I think is not a bad place to be. Even like, we just talked about all the receivers they have. In 2024, only two of them are under contract. Yeah. So it's not, they can easily reconfigure this no matter what they want to do, which I, yeah, they're not a bad spot, but they're not in like a great talent spot, but they're not a bad spot. They can just do a lot and choose the path they want to go down. And yeah, interior

offensive line is another good thing to bring up. Ben Bredison's a free. agent after this year. Galinsky, I think, has a million and a half in dead money after this season. Yeah, they could add some bodies and try to figure out the interior with the tackles already being set. You know, safety, they signed Bobby McCain, but, you know, Bobby McCain's been in the league for forever at this point. Adori Jackson's gone after this year. So I just think that, all right, making sure that we're still just building up those areas where you need a ton of pieces, a ton of depth. They've done a lot of work at receiver this year. And if they need to do a little more. These other spots, I think

there's still a lot of work to be done. So I'm just curious, like, what, what this regime looks like in this process, because we've seen them at the top of the draft. And we've seen them with all of those picks that they had last year. What does it look like when they have to try to figure out how to exist in the middle class where they are at this point? Yep. Just keep tone the line. Just make yourself competent and make yourself refreshing and can make Daniel Jones feel good about himself. You know what I mean?

I'm not saying it that bad way, but just the quarterback can continue to progress because they want him to progress. Obviously, they paid him. like he's on the ascension. He's going upward. So I think that's what they have to do is just make sure there's no drop off around him so we can continue to get better on offense and really have something there. I think they're doing a fine job. They already had a schedule from last year.

I mean, just making a playoff. So I think that's what it is. And that's why I want to say that line again is don't chase. Just keep at it. Keep doing what you're doing. Keep racking up singles and doubles. And I'm curious where they go in the draft. And they, I mean, they've gotten by with bodies at positions.

They did last year. They were so hurt at corner last season. Oh, my God. I mean, Aaron Robbins has been heard for a lot of his career, but he only played like two games. You know, they got a ton of snaps from like Cordell Flot and guys that were rookies. I mean, I'm so curious which guys they think are building blocks and which guys they think need to be replaced. Because they had so many guys play out of necessity last year, I feel like the directions they go in the draft are going to teach us things about that. And that's why the draft is always informative because the picks can't lie.

You know, the picks are very, they're truthful in the decisions that they've made. They can no longer kind of misguide you about what they think about their team. And I think I've always appreciated that. It's funny. It's like you don't do a first round pick to like as a smokescreen. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. We're taking this guy in the first round as a body. Yeah. Just for you. No, no. That guy is a guy that they're expecting to play early and often. Next one here. The Pittsburgh Steelers.

My main question about the Pittsburgh Steelers is what are the Pittsburgh Steelers? What are you? I don't know. They are. They are such a confounding. team. I just, I think that they, so here's my overarching thing about the Steelers, okay? They have 1732, 42, 49, and 80. They have 32 as a result of a trade that they made with a professional football franchise in Chicago, Illinois. And they have, so they have four picks in the top 100.

They have three picks in the top 50. I think that the biggest needs the Steelers have, and you can correct me if you think I'm wrong. Offensive tackle is still a big one. I think they need another tackle. I think corner is a need even after going out and getting Patrick Peterson. And I think interior defensive line depth and edge depth is necessary. And I don't think it's crazy to think about them adding another receiver. This is a team that has lived in 11 personnel. Calvin Austin is now the number three receiver on the depth chart. Even they spent something on him, he's a specific kind of player. If they went out and got somebody to play in the slot for them, I think it would align with the skill sets that they already have at that position with

Deonti Johnson and George Pickens. Yep. Yeah. They got rid of Chase Claypool. They got the pick, but I'm saying that was a guy playing a lot of snaps for them and starting for them and being productive for them. Calvin Austin couldn't be any more opposite from Chase Claypool. Like they, Calvin Austin plays like you hope Chase Claypool would play, but he's like 150 pounds, like 155 pounds. But he has, I hate this line because it's gotten so overdone.

He does have that dog in him. but it's like he actually does and Chase Guy Poo is a little more Fidesse. But these, those needs, that's how I have. I corner with a star. I think so too.

Yeah. Okay. So let's throw those needs out there. Let's look at the picks that they have. Right. Is it crazy to think, all right, we get a starting left tackle at 17 that can replace Danmore.

Maybe not immediately, but like we have a left tackle of the future. Where the draft falls and what kind of guys could be available there, they could find a left tackle at that. spot. At 32, could they find one of these slot types of receiver that we've talked about? And maybe it's corner at 32 and a slot type of receiver at 49.

I don't think it's crazy that all of these needs that we just talked about can be filled with the picks that they have in this year's draft. So you combine that with the pieces that they already have at receiver, you know, a quarterback that played fine as a rookie, the pieces they already have on defense, even though I don't know what to make of the Pittsburgh Steelers and like what the plan is and what type of team they're going to be, I think if things fall a certain way, they can actually be like a fairly formidable team this season.

I think the ceiling is certainly capped, but I think that they can be really competitive if they add the right pieces in this draft. The always competent Mike Tomlin will make sure. Doesn't matter. These guys could be two tiers below like they were last year and they still have them fight for 500. But that's the thing.

This roster going through it, I'm like, It's pretty solid. Yes. That's in like we, and I'm going to do a study on it. I'm going to, I might do a picket video, by the way. I haven't talked to you about this,

but might do a picket video. Sounds great. Let's do it. Yeah, because I want to study, I want to study their offense in the second half of the year and just see what they actually got. But yeah, those advanced metrics are very flattering, by the way.

Yes. And then defense, I mean, they got freaking, Mika Fitzpatrick and T.J. Watt, hopefully is healthy and Hayward and Highsmith. Like, I don't know. It's this roster overall. It's like, yeah, they're going to be feisty at the very least. And I, I, what you're saying about where it's slotted, that's what's interesting about this draft class in every position is there's such a drop.

There's only there's a lower amount of blue chips as like true first round talents in this draft. And again, we've talked about this on several shows that kind of meeting in the middle, I guess, where there's not much tier difference from like picks 12 to like 60, like 55. So that's, it doesn't, none of those guys can be a reach. Like, you know what I mean? Like if they went in, that pick 32, Anton Harrison from Oklahoma or DeWan Jones from Ohio State, yeah, that makes total sense where those guys would go. Harrison might go a little earlier, but if they got them a 32, that'd be great.

They're in a great spot to find a corner in the first round. Like, or like you said, a flip flop, there's corners that might be there at 32. Yeah, they're in a decent spot to be very, very feisty this year, especially if they nail this draft, even if they get two starters from this draft. Yeah, it's just another quiet off season. Like the moves that they made in free agency this off season where Isaac Salamalo, Nate Herbig,

Cole Holcomb, and Alandon Roberts. Yeah. But they're gonna have, they're starters. They didn't spend a lot of money. They have bodies on the offensive line and at offball linebacker. They go get Patrick Peterson.

They've added bodies. And I think when you combine that with the star power that they have, I think that they can be interesting at the very least. A lot of this hinges on what Kenny Pickett is, right? And where he can go in year two with, you know, of coordinator.

They still has some weapons. That's going to be ultimately what dictates how far they can go and what their ceiling is. But I think the floor is very high. And I think that they can get even more interesting if things fall a certain way here over the next month. Those are why moves. I liked him because it's the classic line.

It's like what the Bengals did last year where it's, you know, it's going from bad to average is not a bad thing. Like, you know, yes, it's not like the craziest moves. Star-laden signings. But it's like getting competency there and good, good warm bodies there. to play for you. That's not a bad place to be. Like if one of those guards gets hurt, like I don't even know.

Are we talking to ourselves? The Steelers are yanked off the no-fly list. They are back on the fly list. Let's talk about it. I just don't know what to make of them. I really struggle to figure out exactly what they are and what to make of them, but that doesn't mean that I'm down on them or I am pessimistic about them. I just find them confounding.

That's it. Yeah. Yeah. It's a, it's an uptick question mark. I am Ron Burgundy? Like that, it's a good kind of question mark. Speaking of the teams that I just can't figure out, let's talk about the Washington football team, okay?

Okay. I don't even know what the central question about the Washington football team is. Okay. I think that there are some similarities with Washington and where Pittsburgh is, but there's no answer to the quarterback question with Washington. Washington brought in two kind of starting caliber offensive linemen in free agency and Nick Gates and Andrew Wiley. Those are like the two big moves that they made. You piece together their starting line with Gates, Wiley, Leno, Sam Cosme. Chase Reyes is going to cost $12 million against the cap this year.

He's played 421 snaps over the last two years. They have questions along the offensive line, but I think they've added enough bodies to find five. The past catchers, there is really no question about that at receiver. They have players at receiver. they have some pieces on defense. So I guess the question is, is Sam Howl and Jacoby Percette really going to be what the plan is at quarterback this year? I guess that's the biggest question I have about them. Is that wrong?

Is there anything else that's like more pressing to you? No, my question for myself was, is this a surprisingly good roster? Question mark? But I think the quarterback, I think that is their answer this year is Jacobi Percette and Sam Howell. I really do think that is their answer for this year because I do think the rest of the roster is fairly solid, especially the, you know, defensive front. They, Doron Payne bringing him back on the big deal. You know, it's like, it seems like they're, no, this is what we're going with. And we're just going to play out the draft for however we want to play out the draft.

Obviously, I don't think they need another defense alignment. They might get a healthy Chase Young this year. Like, that's interesting. I actually like the, you know, the Cody Barton linebacker signing. I like him better than a lot of Seahawks fans seem to seem to like him. You know, maybe they go corner, another team that just pull the string. That's the, what, four-team I imagine? Corner would potentially make sense.

You know, they have four, they still have St. Juice, but they brought back Danny Johnson, like a two or five million dollar deal. I don't know how much of that is guaranteed. So they did, like, make a small move there to bring him back, but it still feels like they could add some bodies at corner. Yeah, but it's not a bad spot where it's not like, oh, that's a glaring need. Like where I'm like, oh, God, they have nobody playing there. You know, like when I look at the Steelers, I'm like, man, really, Patrick Pearson's their answer.

It's, you know, they actually have competent guys. I'm pretty high on St. Juice, even if he's up and down. I mean, safety, Derek Forrest, another guy we liked last year. Like, they just have a, it's like, man, this roster's not bad. And I like Jacobi Berset. I think he is a fine starter. You know, he's the jockey. That's what my nickname for now for at the quarterback position.

And you can see what you have in Howl. He's a fifth round pick, you know, so that they are talking it up like he was a first rounder. But I don't know. I think that is their answer because I do think the rest of the roster is decent, even as an outsider. That's how I look at it. So next year, Charles Leno will be 33 years old.

And he has pretty much no guaranteed money left on his deal after this season. I'm wondering, like, how realistic it would be to have them draft an offensive tackle in the first round this year. As a long-term play. Yeah. So I think that's a question. But I'm tempted just looking at where they sit and what the next year could look like. Do they trade down? And do they just try to accumulate a couple picks?

say, all right, we need some depth at tackle. We need some depth at corner. We could get another safety somewhere along the way here. Just try to add a couple pieces. Make sure that when we go into next season, they're ready to roll. Like their roster top to bottom doesn't have a lot of glaring holes on it, ideally, where it puts you in a position to say, if we want to take the swing on the quarterback next year, we can do that.

And then again, you accumulate maybe even more draft capital if you move back out of the first round to put yourself in a position to go make that swing next year. Because if it is Sam Howland-Jicobi percent, if that is the plan for this season, what does the next 18 months of quarterback play look like for Washington? I would guess my assumption is that you would get to the end of this season and think we need to go get a quarterback. And after the team gets sold,

are you more willing to do that? After some of the uncertainty kind of clears up, are they in a position next year where they'd be willing to go make a move? like that. Yeah, because there's no Alabama defense alignment for them to draft where they're at right now. Well, Anderson won't fall that far. But I think that's what they kind of did at that spot. They're like, let's just kick the can until next year. Let's just get through this year, patchwork it together, see if we have anything with Sam Howell, if the year's not going how we wanted to, or he has a fantastic offseason. We've talked about many of times. Shikobi Bressat's a great teammate, but also it's a

competent starter. So that's what it feels like to me is that they kick the can at that, position to next year. And I think they're maybe just going to see what they got this year and see how it goes and ride it out. You know, this team is so as an organization, of course, with the ownership stuff, that's what's just so hard with them. They just feel like I could see them doing anything and it makes sense to me, whether they want to buy more time for the future or just kind of do a half push into this

season. It's a very, very curious team. The one position we have not mentioned that I think could be interesting with them in the first round even if they stayed put would be tight end. tight end. Right? You drop that in. Logan Thomas, they give him an extension, but I think that he doesn't, after this season,

he has $1.8 million of guarantee left on his deal. I mean, he's 33 years old. He's going to be 33 years old in 2024. God, he's 33. Yeah. We're old as shit, man. That made me feel so old as shit. That was rough.

So that's the other one that I would say. And then honestly, somebody else who is, this is the last year of his deal is Curtis Samuel. Yeah. So Curtis Samuel was not under contract. for them next year. So a really interesting time. You get the third receiving option with the other two guys. Yeah, no, that's not.

Yeah, that's, but that's the thing is this team has actually got options, which is so weird, like maybe a month ago. I wasn't really thinking of Washington kind of sitting in an okay spot, I guess, if you just ignore the quarterback position. They brought in Cam Dantzler and Free Agency. It's one other thing to mention at the corner spot. I still think they absolutely could draft another corner. Probably need to.

Yeah, but all right. Agreed. Next team here. The Tennessee. Titans. My question for them, do they chase a quarterback this year, which a lot of people have been saying they might, and their quarterback's been mocked to them for a while here? Or do they just embrace the tank?

Because of all the teams in the NFL that are potentially going to be bad and need a quarterback, not necessarily this year, but over the next five years, they seem the most likely candidate and the most reasonable candidate to just be bad, take your medicine this year, and hopefully you're drafting in the top five, and you can try to go get one of these guys. Is that crazy? No, it's not. I think that's, I mean, we did a show a couple months ago on them, kind of like, what's going on with the Titans?

And I still stick with that as like, kind of embrace the competitive tank. You know, Mike Vrable will hate that word, so repackage it and just say that you're trying and play with one hand time behind your, tied behind your back mic. That's what we're doing. We're trying to see how good of a coach you are this year. You know, that's challenge them in some way, make them competitive because there's teams.

There's, I know I see them getting mocked. They're getting mocked a receiver at times. They're getting mocked a quarterback and a move up for a quarterback. And both of those decisions to me, I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Get a line.

Get offense a line. Rebuild. Find some just any best player that you can because I think dropping a quarterback behind whatever offense line they have this year is like not conducive to future success. And also if you have to give up future draft capital to do it. Like that just doesn't make sense to me. So I think it is embrace the competitive tank and hopefully you get that top five pick next year. And then we go from there.

I think you can make an argument that they have the worst wide receiving court and the worst offensive line in the NFL. Yeah. I'm trying to rack my brain right now. O line, almost for sure. That line's so rough, man. It's every time I look at it. I'm like, really?

That's what you guys are doing this year. So looking at it from left to right, according to the R-LAD, step chart right now. Andre Dillard at left tackle, Daniel Brunskill at left guard, Aaron Brewer at center, Dylan Raiden's at right guard, and Nicholas Petit Ferreira right tackle. Their past catchers are Trelon Burks, Nick Westbrookina, Kyle Phillips. That's about it. He's a good returner. I think you got put in the doghouse last year too. That's it. Their defense, I think, has a chance to be very solid. Yeah. They went out and got Arden Key. key. They signed Aziz Al-Shayr and free agency.

You know, if they can be healthier in the secondary, Sean Murphy Bunting came over, so they have some bodies. You know, Elijah Moulton's obviously still there. He was banged up for most of last season. I think they can be a solid to good defense next year. But if they're the eighth best defense in the league and they're the 32nd offense or 31st ranked offense, that could still be a top five pick. The problem is, the problem, is Ryan Tannanhill two. too good to allow you to completely bottom out offensively.

And you're playing in the AFC South. So you might get some gimmies from the Colts and Texans, even if they're trying to kind of revamp themselves as well. And that's the thing. It's like last year, like Roger McCreer, their second round corner. Good player. Like out of nowhere. Like this guy, okay, they got a good starter from the second round at corner position.

And that's the thing with their defense is that surprisingly competent defense might carry them to some wins when they don't want them. So that's what it is. it's like you have to kind of figure out a way to maneuver that the offense isn't good enough. Hey, let's see how Malik Willis plays this year. And just hopefully it's a race of 17 points for every game. They have $127 million in cap space for next year as it currently stands. That's without the Jeffrey Simmons extension.

So whatever his cap it's going to be. For argument's sake, let's call it $15 million next year. It's pressed down and it'll go up. It still has $110 million in cap space next year to work with. And if you don't draft a quarterback in this year's draft, you can use the 11th pick on draft Jackson, Smith, and Jigbo, whatever you want to do. That's a piece for your quarterback next year when you draft him. I think that drafting a quarterback this season, sticking him on the bench behind Ryan Tannenhill, wasting one of those cheap years. And then trotting him out next year when you've had less draft capital to build a guy to build around, when you know you're probably going to be picking high.

With some of these other teams, it's like, okay, take the shot. you're probably not going to be in this position again, I just think that it's likely they're going to be back in this position again. Over under, they're picking 11th this year. Over under and where they're going to be picking next year, I'm taking the under. I think it's higher than 11. So if that's going to be the case, and this is another draft, there's going to be a bunch of quarterbacks, I just don't really understand the thought process for reaching for

one this year when the rest of your roster isn't in the right place to properly absorb a rookie quarterback and set him up to succeed. Their Vegas over under right now is seven and a half wins. That's higher than I would admit than I would have imagined. I would put it at six and a half. By the way, Mike Frabble deserves the benefit of the doubt at this point. Yes, he does. This team has done a fantastic job winning all these games and maybe that's part of the

problem is that they're never going to be bad enough to put themselves in this position, but I think that they've kind of painted themselves into a corner here. They have even less talent than they did a year ago. I know. Oh, my God, right? And, well, you know, having a new GM can maybe help that sell and just, like, he can kind of reconfigure and go like, hey, this is how I view it and everything, even though I think Brable has a lot of say. And it goes on to the day to day and the roster construction and all that. So it is one of those where it would behoove them to be bad.

But it's a cell, which is not like, I know it's NFL. Everyone wants to be competitive. But it would be a sell, I think, to try and go, hey, tone down that defense a little bit. Let's try some of the young guys. But you don't sign Jeffrey Simmons to be bad on defense. You know, re-sign them to a big deal to be bad on defense. And you don't sign Aziz Al-Share to be bad on defense. And Arden Key, those guys are like actually competent, good players.

So it is kind of a roster that on defense is close to competing. And an offense, it's like nuke it. And so I think that's what you have to sell is that if one side of our ball can barely scrape together 21 points, why should we push this year? So let's try and sell on losing games. All right. Our next team here, Tampa Bay Buccaneers. My question with them is, what is this year supposed to be?

Right? Like, are they, what is the Baker-Mayfield-led year supposed to be? Is this just a stepping stone to next season? Are you going to try to find a quarterback? How are you going to try to find a quarterback? They brought back Jamel Dean. Like, they still have enough pieces, I think, to be relatively competitive with solid or better quarterback play.

Like, are they a team that potentially, if a quarterback falls, they could trade up and make a move for somebody because I think they're more realistic than pretty much everybody that's not Minnesota in terms of being a reasonable team that could go make a play up the draft to drop a quarterback into their current situation because the timeline makes sense. So they're just, they're one that I just can't really stop thinking about what that's going like in terms of their quarterback solution and whether or not this is the year they should try to go find one. Yeah.

My initial note is that I think they're going through the season with a brave face and going like, Yeah, this is it. This is what we got. I mean, they brought back Levante David. Yeah. Like, you know, and how they signed the corners, like, you know, bring back Jamal Dean and all that. It's one of those that, okay, so what are you? Well, you have Baker there.

You lose it, but then you release Donovan Smith. And so now you have a whole up tackle. That's the problem is they, they're not a quarterback away. They've had to lose too many guys to be that. The offensive line is like that. They have way less depth on defense, way through a problem. pieces on defense. They need an edge player until Michelle Barrett's getting older.

Yes. Like, yeah. So it's, I know, that's the thing. It's not with Washington, it's like, okay, there's a little bit more, especially on the offense where it's like, okay, this makes sense. You know, again, it's that we've talked about. They have some, so many interesting players and good players that are under contract, but it's, they're going to be another year older.

So it's just they, yeah, they're trying to bridge some few things. And like you said, if the domino's fall in a certain way, it wouldn't shock me if they did decide if Levis is there at 10 and Levis is there at 9. I wouldn't shock me if they made a move because it seems like they're trying to straddle it just in case the draft does unfold that way. Like I think that's what they feel like they're doing. And then if not, all right, Baker, go run around. We go go go be tough and try and scramble around and make some plays for us, I guess. And I think that's what they're going to go through.

It's a four year million. It's a four million dollar contract for Baker. Yeah. Like there's nothing preventing them from going to make a move if they want to. And so if they can drop an actual like highly drafted quarterback into this equation and kind of say, all right, let's see if we can split the difference. Let's try to thread the needle here with the previous way that we did this and then the next phase of it, I think that would make sense. And their offensive line is way more questions than it used to. Again, the defensive depth isn't

where it used to be, but trying to bridge this in the best way possible, I think is going to be the challenge that they face. But even like I just brought up that, there's some questions that all line losing Dominic Smith. They still have Ryan Jensen and so have Tristan Wurfs. Yeah. It's like, that's not a bad old line to start with. And if you do drop in a rookie quarterback, having a vet center that handles everything is fantastic. And that can really help bridge whatever new guy they want to drop in there. So it's like one of those words, as I talk this out and look at their roster, it would make sense if they did make a move, you know,

especially what other options they might have. Because I think they're too competent to fail. Like as opposed to the Titans, I was like, oh, I can easily see the bottom falling out. The Bucks, I'm like, they just have too many good players that you can see even a 500 season, even if things don't break well, so they can't get that top pick. They're 2024 cap. They have like a decent amount of cap space because they're not paying a quarterback. But Shaq Barrett's making $24 million.

Chris Godwin set to make $27.5 million. Carlton Davis is making $20 million. Vitavaya is making $21 million. Ryan Jensen's making $17 million. I mean, they just have so many expensive pieces. And I think the best way to kind of smoothly transition with that sort of core is onto a rookie quarterback contract. Yeah. Because then you can.

afford all of these guys. So again, I just think that they make so much sense because they have the most incentive to get onto that financial timeline while also having a guy that can make them competitive. You could pay Baker Mayfield $4 million. It doesn't make you relevant. So trying to find that guy who's cheap but can also make them relevant, I think they have as much or more motivation to do that than almost any other team in the league right now. Yeah, because it's easily that they could talk themselves into going like, man,

we hit on this guy, look at the rest of our roster. We're back at it. Yes. We're back at it. Like, especially in this NFC where everybody's revamping, it seems like that. I can understand when, if they were in those in those meetings, they talked themselves into it. Like, I can see why that would be an argument for somebody. And if they, if this is the hypothetical argument that somebody had in their personnel room.

All right. Last one. New England Patriots. I didn't have a central question for this one. Where do you want to start the Patriots conversation? I have what linemen are they going to take in the first round. That would be my first question. But really with them, they feel like they're in a prime spot.

Again, this draft, there seems to be a lot more guys that have second round grades on them than true first round grades. It feels like a Belichick tradeback. It feels like, you know, that feels prime to do that from the team spots, even if there are some interesting offensive alignment there where they pick in the first round. But really this team, I really like the defense and they brought a lot of guys back. So I don't see them needing to add too much juice there. I know corner, maybe a corner with size might be an interesting spot. But it's not like where Belichick where I'm like, oh, yeah, they'll take one in the first round. They'll take one in any round.

So I can't just say that that's where they'll prioritize. But it feels to me it's like they need to add offense a line. And so I really, that's where they're at. I want to see this offense with Bill O'Brien and Mac Jones. Even though there's like all these whispers that they're like trying to trade Mac Jones. So is that real or is that just kind of a motivation kind of thing where they're angry at them? It's a lot of questions, a lot of statements, a lot of exclamation points there. We got an email from a reader before we did the mailbag.

And I think the question paraphrasing it was essentially, what do the Patriots need to do to be relevant this season? Right. And relevant is all dependent on how you do. That depends on how you define relevant. But like a team that's competitive that pushes to make the playoffs, based on what they've done, far. Obviously, they go, when got juju, you know, they signed Mike Kosicki to that, that short-term deal. They got a couple past catchers. But based on the moves that they've made, it seems like Bill O'Brien is the biggest free agent that the Patriots signed this offseason. Yeah. Like,

they are banking on going from one of the worst situations in the league in terms of who was in charged with their offense to competency, to an adult who has done this before. It's the bad to average argument. It's just, just for play callers, though. And if we can do that and get ton more out of our quarterback. And we've added enough pieces and we can go get an offensive lineman, which kind of feels like they need to. I mean, right now, their right tackle options are like Riley Reef and Connor McDermott and Yadne Kajus, like going to get an actual starting right tackle in the first round

of the draft, which is never a position you want to be in. It feels like that's kind of where they are. If they can do that, it does feel like, again, the top line of the depth chart is such that this team can be competitive. but I just don't I don't see the ceiling. Like I just don't, I don't know where it's going to be with this group. And I think that's always been our concern with them is based on the way that they're constructed

and the lack of a true difference makers they have at some of these really important positions. Even if they're competitive and even if they're relevant, I just don't know what the end game is with this team. Yeah. The defense, I think, is going to be very good. But the offense doesn't scare me whatsoever. Yeah. And I think that's really is.

Even if you get an uptick from Taekwan Thornton. from Baylor, their second round pick last year because he was banged up. Weird, he's 170-something pounds. Built like a twig. Weird that he got hurt. But he is a talented player. He's tough.

He can bring a vertical element to that offense. This team, though, even with Mack Jones, and there's always these discussions with Mac Jones in the ceiling, and he was a positive player as a rookie. They really fucked him last year. Yeah. And I felt really, like, watching him was frustrating for me and what they did to that guy.

And how much they put on his plate without no help. whatsoever. And you can see him trying to make it right a lot of times. So the fact that there's all this narrative, all we're down on him. I'm like, really? You're going to throw him under the bus? Of course, I'm not in the rooms. I don't know Mack at all. But just still, it's like, man, you guys, you guys didn't do much to help them. So I can't believe you're actually mad at them. So I think that's what it is, is that even with the offense, even if they get a rookie tackle, anybody that anybody lists the names, top five guys, whatever offense line they get, that still doesn't feel like it's like, oh yeah, this offense is solved.

They're still just like, okay, is that your receiving room? I like some of the guys, but is, you know, where's the, where's the needle mover there? Where's your needle moving pass catcher? You have a lot of fine players. You have a room I love, like Juju and Kendrick Boren. I love all these guys, but that's not always a good thing. Yeah, Nate Tice likes all your receivers. That's not always a good thing because it's usually some gritty guy.

So I think that's what it is. They just, even if they add a couple guys, it's like, all right, is it going to be enough to make them even a good offense? or anything more than average or competent like you just said. So I agree with you in some ways that it's just, it's hard for me to justify where this offense could be, what I know Bill Bryan is, and what the upside of this offense could be. Let's say they're the 12 best offense in the week, like optimistically.

Yeah. And they're a top three or four defense. There you go. Kind of feels like the best case scenario. Yep. What is that in the AFC? Especially with the dolphins all in, the bills, still the bills. That's just their division.

The Jets, if they get Rogers. Like, that's just their division. before you even get into the west side or the bangles or anybody else, the Jaguars, whatever they do. It's tough. You know, succeed.

Maybe you get a wild card. Yeah. And you win double digit games. And that kind of seems like that's where they're at. Yeah. And maybe that's enough. Like Belichick's cruising toward that all time win record. He's in his 70s.

Like they're never going to bottom out. They were never going to bottom out. And that's just kind of the team that they are. And so that that's what it feels like. And this draft feels like another entry into. that where it's like how can we piece together that version of the roster with a starting tackle here maybe another pass catcher there all that kind of stuff but that's kind of where I sit with this team and it's where I've sat with them for a little while now yeah they're they're like in a position

to add winning players but not needle movers and I know that sounds like I'm talking about both sides my mouth but it's like that's just where they feel like and just feel like that in general um as much as I like their defense and a lot of the guys on there. It's just, yeah, it's just like, like you said, the ceiling is, I don't know where the ceiling is. But I just know that's not as high as I would like it to be. That is all we got for today. We are going to be back. I am going to be back on Friday with some offensive line content.

That is going to be coming your guys's way. In the meantime, we got prospects to pros this week. We got another episode of the football GM with Mike Sandow and Randy Muir coming your way on Thursday. If you have not, please go check out the Beast. Dane Bruegler's draft guide is now live on The Athletic. It is a colossal towering achievement that he puts together every year. He is hurting, I think. I mean, Dan is not feeling super great.

So please go check that out if you have not. The only way you can is with a subscription to The Athletic. Theathletic.com slash football show is where you can get one of those. We are going to keep rolling on with our draft content for the rest of the week. In the meantime, appreciate you guys listen. We'll talk to you soon. This was the Athletic Football Show.