The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Week 3: Injury impact, stellar slate and can Dan Quinn respond?

Episode Date: September 24, 2020

The injuries across the NFL continue to make headlines. The Athletic’s Robert Mays and Lindsay Jones discuss why this might be happening and how teams are adjusting. They also break down the Tyrod Taylor situation in Los Angeles.Later in the show, they talk about this week’s great slate of games, including Chiefs-Ravens and Saints-Packers.Plus, Lindsay explains why she thinks this is an important week for Dan Quinn and Robert isn’t quite ready to say the Raiders are for real.  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Visa, official partner of the NFL. This is the Athletic Football Show. Welcome to the Athletic Football Show. I'm Robert Mase. Joining me today, the Athletic Zone, Lindsay, how are you? I'm good, Robert. How are you? I am doing wonderful.

We have a jammed slate of week three games this week. There is a ton of stuff that we have to get to. we're going to get to all the big matchups. There's a lot of marquee ones, a lot of cool quarterback clashes this week. Tons of stuff to get into. But before we do that, Lizzie, let's talk about injuries, which is the most fun thing to talk about, and something I'm always excited to get into. But there's really no way around it.

You know, we open Wednesday show talking to Joe Thomas about just some of the injuries, why we think they're happening. And as more and more news has come out beyond the Tyrod Taylor stuff, which we'll get to, it's kind of just a wave, just getting serious. slam with this stuff every 10 minutes it feels like there's a bit more injury news somebody else is out for the year somebody else is on i are you know you've made some calls about this you know over the course of the week since sunday when everything came down what of your general what's the general feedback been from people as you talk about why this might be happening and just how they're

trying to process it yeah and i've been thinking about this a lot really since sunday morning denver time i mean this rarely happens when you pull back the curtain a little bit where you know what you're going to write about on a Sunday this early. I mean, it was, the games were probably at the end of the first quarter. And I slacked our editors. And I said, I'm right, this is it. This is the big story of the day. I'm writing the injuries. And then from there, it just kept getting worse and worse and worse. And wave is the perfect word to describe it. Because that's really what it felt like. And that's kind of what it feels like it's going to be like this season. And yeah, I've been, I've been making a lot of calls this week, talking to people who work for teams. And then a lot of kind of just like independent doctors and people who,

you know, sports medicine doctors and those sorts of folks. And somebody that I talked to this morning, a doctor said, everybody saw this coming, everybody. And that's right. I mean, this was a very big concern about what was potentially going to happen this year, given the abbreviated, canceled, you know, whatever words you want to use about what this offseason was like. There was no offseason program.

Guys were, guys couldn't even work out at their home gyms for most of the offseason. So, you know, April, May, June, the time where guys normally would have been at the facilities focusing on strength and conditioning, you know, really, really focusing on those things. None of that happened. Some guys were working out in their basements, in their garages. You know, some guys were fortunate enough to have, you know, very complex, fancy home gem setups. If you were an undrafted rookie last year, maybe you were lucky enough to have a set of barbells at your parents' house where you were like to be a 24-hour fitness membership. Yeah. Well, and a lot of those gyms were even closed until this time. Yeah, there was no, there were no options for people. I mean, it's.

Yeah, I mean, the closest thing that we could compare it to was the 2011 lockout season where there wasn't an offseason program. But at least during the lockout, guys could organize their own workouts. They could work out together. Every single gym in America was open. They had access to these sorts of things and their private trainers and everything that they did not have this year. And there was a full training camp that year. There was. Yeah.

You actually had a training camp. I think that's kind of the biggest different. And a full preseason. Yeah. It's even if we take out the OTAs and kind of getting to July in a different sort of shape or in the same sort of shape they would have in the 2011 lockout, the ramp up was completely different. I know hindsight is 2020. But if, let's say we can transport ourselves back to July 15th, is there a way around this?

Would there have been a way to push the season back a month, let's say, to make sure that the ramp up time was adequate because it feels like we people, even if they knew this was coming, didn't take the proper precautions to change the approach here to make it safer guys. Yeah. And this was all of the stuff that went into the NFL and NFL PA negotiations. So if you remember back to it was probably late June when this card, when we started, when we started really talking about this stuff, when the, where the negotiations got really serious. The NFL side actually wanted players to report early.

They wanted them to come in, you know, July 15th, if not earlier than that. NFL PA said absolutely not. We're not coming in earlier to extend our season out so that we can have more of this ramp-up time. What the PA wanted was this extended acclamation period in August and the cancellation of preseason games. So the players were very concerned about soft tissue issues. They wanted a longer ramp-up period but did not want to come back to work earlier. the coaches side wanted as much on-field time as possible, as much hitting and stuff as possible.

So I think they were kind of both right. You know, I think maybe they're in hindsight, like you asked, it would have been nice if they could have adjusted the schedule a little bit. But the NFL was so focused on week one, getting to September 10th as that kickoff day. The NFLPA was adamant that they weren't going to come back early. And I don't necessarily fault them for not wanting to come back early. especially when they're not getting their salaries adjusted for those sorts of things.

There was also that middle of the summer was there was a lot of COVID concerns. Yes, absolutely. Dominating the conversation in a way that it's not now. So it's almost as if there was a boogeyman out there that people were so afraid of. And now this other threat that really wasn't, even if it was being talked about between the league and the PA, I think in the public consciousness, this was not nearly as big of an issue as whatever was going out with the virus in that moment. And it probably should have been. Yeah, absolutely.

I mean, teams spend a lot of times preparing thinking, okay, we're going to have to reshuffle our rosters. We're going to have to do, make all these changes to the IR rules and to practice squad because of COVID. But what we're seeing is that they're using all of these new four 2020 only rules because of this wave of injuries. I mean, how many guys are we seeing go on IR for, you know, three weeks or so? You know, last week it was with Richard Sherman.

This week, it was Christian McCaffrey, got put on that. It's kind of like a short term IR. And I'm going to be very curious if that's something that it's not in the current CBA. It's not in the new CBA that they agree to in March. But I wonder if it's something that they might want to renegotiate and keep going forward. Because football is the only professional sport that doesn't have that sort of, you know, disabled list. And why is that? I don't.

It's a competitive balance issue. It has to do with salaries and all this stuff. But it doesn't make sense. It's not good for players and it's not good for teams. So, you know, maybe one of the good things that will come out. of this messed up 2020 is that the league will rethink some of these antiquated policies. They've already done it with some of the scouting stuff in the draft. And this might be something that they could do moving forward in terms of more flexibility

with their practice squads and with injured reserve. So I know that in 2011 there was that rash of Achilles injuries that guys were blowing on left and right. It was definitely an outlier when it comes to the numbers. Has there been a statistical kind of jump here in a way? or is it a lot of big name guys getting hurt? And is that why there's a little bit more attention being paid? What are the actual numbers bear out that you've seen?

Yeah. And that's what we're trying to figure out exactly right now is because, you know, I was texting with some league officials on Sunday as this was all going on. And, you know, they were cautioning not drawing too many conclusions in one week because it does seem worse, right? When it's Nick Bosa and Sequin Barkley and Jimmy Garapolo and Drew Locke, you know, starting quarterbacks and, you know, very high draft picks and all this sort of thing. But what we are seeing is that there appears to be a pretty significant increase in the rate of ACL tears.

Last year in all of 2019, so that includes preseason and then the entire regular season, postseason, there were 47 players who tore in ACL. We're into the mid teens already. That's crazy. Including training camps. So, you know, last year, that was a rate of what, like 2.3 a week? Right now we're at 6 or 7. I mean, we're about at double the rate right now. And the big question that I have, and you know, you kind of address this already, too, but it's like, we're here.

You know, we can talk about all the things that maybe we wished would have happened and that maybe should have happened to get to this point. But we're here. The conditioning was what it was. The acclimation period was what it was. So how are teams going to adjust to make sure that this injury wave doesn't continue week after week after week? What are they going to, how are they going to change their practice habits? Will coaches shorten them? Will they focus more on conditioning?

it be different types of strength training? Will it be focusing more on sleep and nutrition? I mean, I don't know exactly what that answer is, but I think- Have you got any feedback on that? Have you, anything that's been kind of a constant theme? Yeah, I mean, the constant theme is, is risk mitigation. And what are we doing that's increasing the risk of some of these players? So you look at, a doctor that I was talking to this morning was talking about ACL specifically and guys who have really strong quads are more prone to ACL injuries. So, and, and, you know, and, you know, that can say Juan Barclay. Sequin Parkley, obviously.

Offensive lineman, I'm assuming Nick Bosa probably has ridiculously jacked quads. But if you are already prone to having, if your risk might be higher for ACL entries because of the way your quads are built, maybe let's not do as much squatting in season, things that could, you know, bulk those up even further. So I think there are some things that they can do. But I think there's also, there's all just other like life. style changes. Do you do more work, more nutrition, more sleep.

They're studying a lot of different aspects of health and bio data and biometrics that they haven't really ever gotten into before because of this weird offseason. So I think this is a theme through a lot of different areas of football. The smart teams are going to figure it out. And there's going to be some really not smart teams that are probably going to set themselves back even further because they're not equipped to handle it. there's that element of it and then just the depth element of it. There are some teams that really set themselves up again because,

oh, what if we lose a whole positional unit because of COVID? And I think that that was probably a consideration for how teams built, you know, later into the summer as you kind of add more bodies. But now it seems like depth is going to be such an important factor because of all the injuries that we're seeing. So you have a team like New Orleans, for example, who I think had the deepest roster in the NFL coming into the season. And they had all these contingency plans because I think in their minds,

they thought we have to make sure no matter what goes wrong, we are still able to win a championship this year. So they've set themselves up well. So it just feels like depth, overall talent, and your ability to kind of withstand all of these blows that have happened over the first couple of weeks and are sure to continue to happen, maybe the most important factor in kind of remaining a contender this year. Yeah.

And then the one other interesting kind of thing and that's related to COVID is that this is a really difficult year to just bring a guy in. If you need some depth. I mean, we saw the Giants just signed Devante Freeman to help bolster their running back room. The Broncos are signing Blake Bortles. But because of the COVID procedures, you can't just sign a guy on a Monday or Tuesday and have them on practice on the practice field on Wednesday.

I mean, the earliest that they can be in the building is three days after getting their COVID tests. So, and with practice squads being bigger than ever without training camp tape, without, you know, full, a full set of offseason. visits and tryouts. The pool of guys that are just readily available to help fill your rosters, teams can protect guys off of their practice squads from poaching from other teams. It's going to be really tough. If you're not deep already, there's not just a lot of great options of guys sitting out there, you know, in their basements waiting for a call that

are going to be ready to step in and play. The one really big piece of injury news that came out today was obviously what happened with Tyrae Taylor. From everything that I've heard, from what Adam Schefter reported this morning, it seems like his lung was punctured when he was getting a pain-killing injection before the game. It was punctured by the team doctor. Is this? I mean, I know that there's a lot of womp-womp-ch-wom-chargers injuries, kind of punchlines when it comes to this sort of thing. But this is serious, first of all. Second of all, is there anything that you've heard about how normal this is? Is it really a huge mistake? What's going to happen? I know that a grievance has been, or an investigation has been started by the PA, is my understanding. What is the latest that you've heard just about this entire

situation, which is even for the Chargers and their injury woes, very bizarre. Yeah. I mean, this is like the ultimate. I mean, we've, the ultimate Chargers, wamp, wamp, sad trombone injury issue. But it's very serious. I mean, how scary must that have been for Tyra Taylor. I mean, I mean, those images that we saw of him sitting on the sideline, you know, right after the coin toss, it just takes on this whole different like meaning now that we know

that his lung had just been punctured. But yeah, I've been texting with some people and talking to people. around the league and texted with a friend who's a doctor, an emergency room doctor who has, you know, performed these sorts of things before. And so it's a known risk when you give any sort of injection into the chest area. And that's what Tyra Taylor was having because apparently he has cracked ribs that he suffered week one against Cincinnati. So he's already needing these pain-killing injections into his rib area. And that's a known, it's a known issue. I mean, it's not that the way the body is built. And so what happened likely is that,

the doctor just went too deep and went too deep and punctured the lung. But it is rare. It's a very rare occurrence and also a really big mistake. I mean, this is something that, you know, obviously the NFLPA is going to investigate. I imagine that Tyra Taylor could file a grievance if he ends up losing significant wages because of it or future wages because of it. If, you know, he never gets a starting job back, those sorts of things. this doctor could potentially get fired because of it. I mean, these are all really, you know, significant things.

You know, I've been talking to our reporters around the league of, have you ever heard about this before? And, you know, you hear about medical mishaps or misdiagnoses from time to time, infections that happen after surgery. This sort of thing, we could remember one specific instance that Matt Barrow's, our San Francisco 49ers beatwriter, found of a player, kind of like an old tie of 30 years ago who had this happen to him and then ended up playing through it.

Medical science changes. I assume that 30 years ago it was probably just more apt to happen than it would right now. And it just seems really crazy that this happened in 2020 with a pretty standard thing that I'm sure a lot of players get. Yeah. And so this will be something that's going to have some pretty wide ranging implications in terms of the grievance, the investigation. And then really what's going to happen with the Chargers now?

And, you know, what shitty luck for Tyrod Taylor, right? I mean, he lost. I mean, you can just insert Chargers player X in there for the last like 10 years. Well, and even, I mean, even for Tyrod. So, you know, he goes, he finally gets the starting job in Cleveland. They go and draft Baker Mayfield. And, but no, Tyra's our guy. Tyra's our guy.

He gets a concussion, which you can't, you know, you can't fault a guy. I mean, that's a freak thing that happens, right? He gets a concussion. Baker takes that job back. He never plays another snap for, for the Browns. you know, he comes in, gets this signs with the Chargers thinking, okay, this will be a good spot for me long term. Back with Anthony Lynn, starts one game.

And now that could be it, right? I mean, I don't know exactly what it means for them. They're a long-term future at quarterback. Justin Herbert played really well. I mean, I think he exceeded everybody's expectations when he just got thrown in into that lineup. But he's going to start this week against Carolina. And if he plays well again, I don't, I don't really know how you go back to Taylor, but this is just The Carolina secondary is definitely the group you want to be playing against if you're trying to hang on to that.

Yeah, I'm glad I have Keenan Allen. Yeah, good week for Keenan Allen and fantasy, I'm guessing, right? All right. So let's get to the actual football with the players that are on the field now that we've depressed everyone. Now that we're seriously depressed. All right. It actually is a great week for football. I mean, some of these games are the perfect games you'd kind of build if you were making a slate.

Chiefs Ravens Monday night. huge win for athletic football guest, Lewis Riddick in one of his first games on the Monday Night Football crew. I mean, this is as good as it gets. Beyond just Mahomes, Lamar,

you know, two of the better teams in the AFC, probably the two best teams in the AFC. What are you looking for in this one? Oh my God. I'm just like everything. All right. I'm just,

I'm so excited. Okay. Let's start. All right. I will do a better job of hosting. Okay. When the chiefs have the ball, what are you interested in watching this week?

Yeah. Well, I mean, look, we've seen out of the chiefs in week one and week two is not like fireworks, you know, 40 points a game like the chiefs that maybe we were expecting given the coaching staff, the offensive talent and then every all the ridiculous stuff that Patrick Mahomes does. But what that makes me think is what else is there?

I mean, it was really cool to watch them in week one be kind of boring, right? And just run the ball a lot. Just a different version of themselves. Yeah. And, you know, and then last week where you kind of just knew that if Patrick Mahom Holmes gets the ball back and it's close late in the fourth quarter. And then in overtime, what are you doing, Chargers, giving him the ball back in overtime? By the way, you just knew what was going to happen.

So, you know, but I just think this is a really tough matchup. For the Chiefs, I think on both sides of the ball. But I want to see how that Raven secondary is going to match up their hurt right now. They lost cornerback Tavon Young, excuse me, for the year. We talked about it last week, a couple weeks ago, that we thought that they're depth, the Raven secondary depth is really the strength of that team. That's going to be tested now because, you know, I think the chiefs have the weapons, right? Tyree Kill, Travis Kelsey, DeMarcus Robinson has played pretty well lately.

We haven't really heard much from Nicole Hardman yet. I would doubt Sammy Watkins is going to play. He had that pretty bad concussion last week. But, you know, I think they have the horses there, but I don't know. I don't, what do you think? What are you going to watch for? So I went back and I watched just some of the clips from last year when these two teams played because Mahomes had a big day, you know, threw through 375 yards.

I was like, oh, man, how do they attack them for that? Because I know Tyra Killed didn't play in that game. So you watch that game and you think, oh, those are some gaudy numbers. And were they really attacking them, you know, outside and really taking advantage of that secondary? And they weren't. So you look at it, there's a lot of checkdowns to backs. I think Darry Williams had five catches in that game. Kelsey was really good over the middle of the field.

He had McCle Hardman right up the seam on a long touchdown. and then DeMarcus Robinson had Robinson or so many Watkins, I can't remember. But again, it was just attacking the safety to that side. So they were doing a lot of work between the hashes and a lot of work underneath because that's how you want to attack the Ravens. That's where they're weakest. And I'll be curious to see what the game plan looks like this year now that the Ravens have swapped out liebackers.

Now you have those two younger guys, Malik Harrison's been nice in coverage. So is it the same sort of game plan when you have a different kind of personnel group out there for Baltimore that has different strengths and weaknesses? And it's interesting to me because, like you talked about, you know, the Chiefs last week for those entire four quarters against the Chargers, they're not marching the ball up and down the field. They didn't look like that high-flying Chiefs offense that we've seen in the past. But the Chargers play, stylistically,

the Chargers are about as far away from the Ravens as you can be on defense. The Chargers don't blitz. They play a ton of zone. And historically, they've played Mahomes really well. The Ravens blitz more than anybody in the NFL. They play about man coverage about half the time. So they're really far apart. So I'm really curious to see if the Ravens just stick with what we typically see from them

or if they say, oh, maybe pick up a couple little hints from what we've seen because when you Blitz Mahomes, it typically doesn't go very well. So I think there's a lot of different directions this could go. And I'll be curious to see which one the Ravens land. And I would say the one new wrinkle that we've seen through two weeks of this Chief's offense, while we haven't seen a ton of new stuff and they haven't been lighting at the scoreboard, is that Patrick Mahomes is using his legs a lot more. just in like an in case of emergency situation.

You know, it's, it's almost like, he's not doing design runs. Nobody's ever going to look at him and go, like, confuse him for Lamar Jackson. He's not that sort of running sort of athlete. But it's just this new dynamic. And he runs like a cartoon. It's like, he really, really funny. I love the, the Patrick by home shuffle that he does, like when he goes back to the huddle and back and forth to the sidelines is one of my favorite things in football.

Somebody described it as he looks like he's running and trying to. not to spill a beer, which is exactly right. That's exactly how he runs. And that description is just in my head every single time he takes off. That needs to be photoshopped like the smoking J. Cutler. Can somebody who's good at computers do that? So, yeah, he has been doing that. I don't know if it's a good thing.

That's kind of my question here is, do we want him moving around? And Jeff Schwartz tweeted this. He's very in tune with Patrick Mahomes making life harder on the offensive line, considering his brother is the right tackle. But there have been some moments where you see Mahomes. drifting a little bit further back in the pocket than you want him to. And the interior of that line in Kansas City is definitely one of their weaknesses. So someone has given them something physically in the run game that they didn't have.

But in pass protection, that's definitely the weakness of this team. It has been for a while. And now you're going against a team with Brandon Williams, Clayas Campbell, guys that can push the pocket. Do we see that kind of drift from Mahomes and do those guys on the outside get to him because he's not playing in the pocket the way he used to or the way that would be advantageous for his offensive line? So just a lot of stuff to watch for me.

This Ravens team is they can dictate games to you defensively in a way that few teams do. But for the most part, Mahomes has been really good against the Blitz. So just a lot of stuff to take into consideration. On the other side of the ball, you know, I know that we mentioned in our AFC preview that the Chiefs run defense has not been good. And it still is not good. And now they're going against the Ravens team that can really run the ball down your throat. So do you feel like the Ravens are just going to kind of, you know, lean on Lamar's legs

more than his arm in this game and just physically take it to the chiefs from the start? Well, I think a little bit is going to depend on kind of that other matchup because, right, isn't the blueprint for beating the Ravens is to jump up on them, it's to get ahead of them early? And so their game plan is going to depend, I think, on if, if they're able to run the ball early, if they're able to go up 7, nothing, 14 nothing, something like that, if the Chief's offense is slowed if the Ravens defense does their job. But, you know, I think that's what they do best is they run it through Lamar Jackson, they they let him use his legs.

They let him take those big chunk, those big chunk shots. I went back the other day and watched like all of his chunk passing plays. And I felt like I needed a cold shower after. It was ridiculous just to watch him take these. I mean, just the way they easily can just rip off, you know, 15, 20, 25 yard pass plays and just when they want to. And, you know, so I just think that they have so many different ways that they can

attack this chief's defense. and especially if the Chiefs D-Line is a little bit banged up. I think Frank Clark is going to be questionable going into this game. I still have some questions about their overall pass rush, especially if he's not part of it. You know, Chris Jones can be a game wrecker there. They've got some young corners. So I just think this is a really, really, really bad matchup for the Chief's defense. So their linebackers have been a problem for what seems like a decade.

For every single year, it just seems, I look at it. I know they drafted William Gay in the second. around this year. He's not playing a full-time role yet. So, yeah, Damien Wilson there, Anthony Hitchens, you know, the same guys that have been there for a little while, and it's still a problem. And if you watch the Ravens, I went back and watched the Texan's game today. What they're doing before the snap is almost like comical. The amount of motion and movement, it is just incredible how much is going on. I mean, it looks like a Pink Floyd concert. It's ridiculous, just all of the distractions that are happening. And when you, you're just, you're going to be. And, you're just,

have a linebacking court. And that is exactly what that's trying to accomplish, is taking advantage of linebackers in the middle of the field. That's where the chiefs are weakest. I would not be surprised at all if we had a clip that this week of just two chiefs linebackers running into each other and cocking heads as Lamar Jackson ran for a 60-yard touchdown. That's certainly in the cards.

So like you said, I just think that the chief's defense is a bad matchup for this Ravens offense. The question is, can Mahomes put up enough points to kind of keep pace? Yeah. What do you do if you're the, if you're the chief's defense with Jackson? Do you try to spy somebody on him? What do you think is the best way they should handle that? I loved, I thought I was very impressed with the Texans game plan last week.

And it's not about a spy. You can't have one spy. You have to, I think, just really, and we don't talk about this stuff enough week to week. You know, I think Jim Schwartz came out this week and really talked about emphasis and what you emphasize going into a week. What are those tiny little things that you're going to drill into your guy's minds? And when I was watching the Texans game last week, it seemed like their staff, told them before that game, nothing else matters, but number eight.

Nothing else matters. Do not get distracted by all of the stuff going on around you because that's why they're doing it. I don't care about the guy coming in jet motion. I don't care about him handing off to Mark Engerman having him gain seven yards on a read option play. I want you keying on the quarterback at all times. And I think they did a really good job with that, whether it was him as a runner,

whether it was him getting outside the pocket. It was Zach Cunningham had a couple really nice plays that I noticed where you can tell he's just zeroed in. And I think that's what you have to do. I think you have to make other guys beat you. Get the ball out of his hands or if he has the ball. Just make sure that that's your number one focus. Because I would absolutely be thrilled to have Mark Ingram run for six and a half yards

of carry if Lamar Jackson didn't beat me. And I think that's the way you have to go about this. It's not a great answer, but I definitely think it's the lesser of two evils in this situation. Yeah, because the dangerous thing here, right, is that you can still have a great game plan against the Ravens and still lose by double digit points. Oh, absolutely. And I think that he always, and that's the problem, I think you go back and you look at

the Browns game and they got pressure on. They were actually frustrating him in the pocket and he's just so casually moving around, getting out of it, drifting away, completing balls on the run. That's the problem is that no matter what you try to do, I'm not a defense coordinator of the NFL for a reason. I don't know what the best answer is, but it seems like no matter what you try to put forward, they're probably going to have a way to come back and say, you're going to do this, we're going to do that,

and we're going to feel just fine. And that's why this game is so fun because on the opposite side is you can have a tremendous game plan for Patrick Mahomes and the Chiefs. And if that game is close in the fourth quarter, Patrick Mahomes is just going to make silly shit happen. And I am so excited for this game. And I'm going to put my daughter to bed early so I can watch every single snap of it. This is, I mean, it really speaks to the overall movement of the quarterback position within the league.

Because I wrote about this at the ringers before the draft this year just about how almost all of the best quarterbacks in football now and all the best quarterback prospects have some level of functional mobility. You can make things happen. You can make a guy missing space. And that's exactly what it does. It provides you answers to everything a defense can throw at you. And Peyton Manning had answers with his brain. That's what Tom Brady does too. These guys, it goes beyond that.

They could beat you that way. Mahomes certainly can. But now even if you have answers with how to strong. structurally stop them. If they're going to make a guy miss in space that you can't account for, there just becomes no way to actually slow them down. And I think both of those guys fit into this category. And that's why it's just so hard to defend them week in and week out.

So let's go from the new guard of great quarterbacks to the old guard of great quarterbacks here. Packers Saints, Rogers Bree, Sunday night football. Again, these are about as good as you get. So you watch these first two games from these two guys. Rogers looks reborn. It looks absolutely incredible. Breeze looks old.

Which of those do you feel like is more likely to continue for the rest of the year? Breeze kind of continuing this downward trajectory or Rogers doing what he's done so far? I think Rogers is more likely to continue. I mean, when I'm watching Drew Breeze, I'm just looking at a guy who can't, he just can't do what he's used to doing. And he's going to have to find a way to adjust to what his body is capable of. And that's going to be a huge, huge test now for Sean Payton and for the rest of that offense. I am the other side of that.

I am jacked up about pissed off Aaron Rogers and whatever this offense is. And they might not have Devante Adams this week. That's going to be a significant setback given the rest. Is he right now the most valuable receiver in the league because of what else they have in the receiving core? Is losing him more of a loss for the Packers than losing any other receiver would be for any other team? Maybe Arizona with Hopkins be my other one that I would throw out there. Yeah, I mean, I would probably also throw Mike Thomas and the Saints in there after a lot.

Oh, yeah, that's a good one. That's probably a good point. But the argument for that about the Packers is that their top receiving option without Devante Adams is Aaron Jones. And they're moving them all over. They're not just like doing them these little, giving him these little passes out of the backfield. They're, you know, sending him at all the receiver spots and letting him run receiver routes.

But so, yeah, I mean, this is this is a really interesting, you know, there's a lot of parallels there, right, with the way that these teams are built and that, you know, without Mike Thomas, they're really having to rely on Alvin Kamara with the Saints. But yeah, I mean, I'm this version of Aaron Rogers, I'm really excited. I wouldn't put him quite in that same like MVP conversation, what we're talking about with some of these other young guys right now. But I just love whatever the soft season did to him. He seems happy.

He seems angry at the same time. He seems to be having fun for the first time. and I have no idea how long it's been since Aaron Rogers really was having fun. So I'm just, I'm really excited about this matchup. And I just think these are two quarterbacks. The difference between what is Aaron Rogers? Is he like 37? 36, 36, 37 and 41, 42.

That's a big, that's a really big gap. And, you know, we're still seeing Aaron Rogers at like the height of his physical powers. And we're seeing kind of a shell of Drew Brees. And now I want to see him try to take over games with his brain and try to just adjust to doing things differently because I just don't think that downfield passing is there anymore for him. So this is my Rogers theory that I think I've said in private, but I'm not sure if I've ever said it publicly or not. I probably have. I think that at times over the last few years, Aaron Rogers was bored. I think that's fair. I think he was bored with football and bored with

offensive structure with taking what was there. And you see that. He just tries some of the crazy shit with some of the balls he tries to fit in. And his interception, you know, rate is low, but he really, pushing the ball down the field, he didn't really take a lot of easy throws. And I would, I've been so impressed with, one, the amount of just layups they've given him. They're the first play against the Lions last week. They lined up in trips. And they came out, it was just a little underneath route to Marquez Vall de Scantling. He dumps it off to him, a little 10-yard game. And I wasn't sure how those easy completions were going to come for this team because of the way that their overall receiving core was structured. They had a lot of long

striders, vertical guys, not guys that are good after the catch in space players. They've made that happen with the guys that they have. But it's also the deep shots haven't gone away. He's throwing deep on 23% of his passes according to pro football focus, the second highest rate in the league. But his release time is the seventh quickest in the league. So you have him still playing this aggressive way, but he's playing within the rhythm of the offense and the structure of the offense.

So there are easy throws and the deep throws. It's just the right mix. And he looks comfortable. And when he's playing within the rhythm of the offense, within the structure, playing the way that, essentially taking what plays are designed to give him, he is still more than capable of dominating games. And that's what we've seen so far. I mean, it is just a version of him that I cannot remember.

Last year, out of like 38 qualified quarterbacks, he was 34th in average time to throw. This year he's seventh. I think that even if it's early, that says a ton just about how willing he is to kind of play within this offense. and I think you're seeing the results. Yeah, it's been really fun. And I'm excited to see this matchup, too, because I think of the teams that they've played so far this year, right,

Vikings, lions, not the best defenses, not the best secondary is that he's going to be going up against. But if the Saints are going to win this game, it's going to be because Marcus Ladimore has a massive game. It's going to be because Cam Jordan, they're able to put a lot of pressure on them. They're going to be able to do things defensively. The Saints are against the Packers and against Aaron Rogers.

they might be without their center this week. Corey Lindsay, he's going to be questionable. He's got a hand issue. They're going to be able to do things that the Vikings were not able to do week one. And I think that the Lions weren't able to do last week as well. Yeah, you saw that Aaron Jones. They really tried to take advantage of the linebackers that the Lions had. I mean, he'd cooked Jamie Collins in space a couple times.

That's not going to happen against Mario Davis. You saw what happened last week when the Raiders try to do that. He's just the guy that really holds up in coverage. So when you look at what the Saints did against the Raiders, Darren Waller had that monster game. Malcolm Jenkins did not have a good night. The Packers aren't necessarily set up personnel-wise to take advantage of that. Robert Tanya is not Darren Waller.

And if you can't go to Jones, if Adams either isn't playing or is taken away by Latimore, can you attack the weak points of the Saints team? I'm not sure that they can't. On the flip side, I think that the Packers problem, similar to the Chiefs, their lineback and core in the middle of their defense has been an issue for a while. And I just think even if Michael Thomas doesn't play, this is a massive Kamara game. Because I think they're going to attack those linebackers in both the running game and with him as a receiver. Packers are 30th and Rush Defense DVOA.

They've been up big. So that's part of the reason there. Brum defense has been a problem for this team in the past, though. You think about where they usually struggle. And it's when teams can hurt them with misdirection and hurt them on the ground and just kind of physically push them around. And I'll be curious to see if the Saints go that route. Yeah, I think so. Who do you like?

Who do you like in that game? I just think Rogers is playing well enough right now that it's hard to pick against him. I typically in a game like this, we have two good teams. I think the quarterback that's playing better is the direction I often go. So I'm going to pick Green Bay, but I absolutely can see the Saints giving them a problem again in the same way that teams like San Francisco have in the past. Yeah, I think I'm on the Packers too. I just want to see if the Saints can make some offensive adjustments this week,

figure out ways to account for a quarterback who's just not himself anymore. Yeah, a couple guys that I'm, Just one more guy I wanted to mention. Jaira Alexander is playing out of his mind. Like out of his mind good. And that Packers defense overall has some issues. But I do have faith if he's going to be playing at that level for them to kind of figure it out. Rishon Gary had some moments last week, which I was watching the game.

I was like, man, who's number 52? He's really, really explosive. And I was like, oh, yeah, he was the 12th overall pick in the draft last year. He better be pretty explosive. All right. Before we get to our next segment, let's take a quick break. Talking about erectile dysfunction isn't easy. Usually, men just brush it off or blame themselves saying things like, I lost my mojo, or they avoid it all together with excuses like, I had a long day at work, or sorry, honey, I'm just not feeling it.

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That's why we keep it vague. Right? Well, Russell Wilson versus Doc Prescott Sunday afternoon, Seahawks Cowboys. It's a playoff rematch. It's two of the hottest quarterbacks right now who are putting up just ridiculous passing stats and rushing stats. Doc Prescott rushed for three touchdowns. touchdowns last week, which was just bonkers, not something I was certainly expecting out of his stat line. But, you know, I thought they were going to use him in the red zone more because a smart

coach would. They're so dominant when he's a runner because he changes the numbers. I wish they had done that more on her Jason Garrett. Yeah. Are you saying Mike McCarthy is a smarter coach than Jason Garrett? Is that what is going? I'm saying that Kellyn Moore is a smarter coach than Jason Garrett. Fair. Fair. I'm with you. This is a pro Kellyn Moore show right now. But yeah, I mean, obviously the Cowboys offense did not play well in week one. And I think a lot of that was a credit to the Rams defense. We talked about that a lot last week. But he was kind of unconscious last week.

And obviously they fell behind the Falcons a lot. They maybe took some more chances in the second half, opened things up a little bit more than they would have if they'd been leading by 25 points instead of trailing by that much. But look, he was averaging 13.2 yards per attempt. That's the best in the league on play action passes this year. They're really set up to run that game to perfection given, given the running back that they have and kind of the strength of that team. And, you know, I'm just really excited to see that match up against a Seahawks defense that has some issues. You know, look, they just lost Bruce Irvin.

He's one of the guys who tore his ACL. They lost safety Marquis-Blair. He tore his ACL also on Sunday night. They don't have much of a pass rush. I mean, that was the big liability, right, of this Cowboys offense is that they've had a lot of offensive line questions. But DAC has been getting rid of the ball really fast. Seahawks don't really have great pass rushers outside of safety, Jamal Adams. Yeah, he's the best one.

And that's the problem here is that the one area right now where you can take advantage at the Cowboys offense, the Seahawks aren't set up to do that. And I think the play action numbers are especially irrelevant because when you look at some of the big plays that the Patriots hit last week against Seattle, Jamal Adams is playing down in the box. He's got his eyes in the backfield. They need him to be kind of in that range of the field. That's where he's best.

And you can hit them over the top behind it. I think that's exactly what I expect the Cowboys to do is really try to exploit the middle of the field behind those linebackers and try to use those play action throws that have been awesome for them. And I really, I mean, it's so funny that you say the playoff rematch because just think about where these two offenses were two years ago. They were so boring. They were so just counterproductive, just slamming their heads against the wall, running the ball into loaded boxes, running the ball too much. And now I think that we've seen what can. happen when you allow both of these guys to play like two of the best quarterbacks in football when you put the ball in their hands and you say this is what we're going to look like we're going to

use the crazy weapons we have which both teams do and we're going to let you go play and let you win the game for us both of them are capable of it i wouldn't be surprised at all we talked about this on the sunday night show if that cowboys win kind of redirected their season and the level that dac is playing at and the level that russell wilson is playing at i think both of these guys are going to be MVP candidates moving forward throughout the rest of this season. And I think this game could go a long way in figuring out kind of who has the inside track there, even if it's early. Yeah, especially because, look, MVP voters don't typically want to vote for the same guy

year in and year out. And if, if Russell is able to continue on this sort of pace, he's absolutely going to get that, you know, it got kind of tired hearing Chris Collinsworth talk about it over and over and over again on the Sunday night broadcast about how he's never had to vote and how he had, Collins Earth would have been the guy who voted for him. But it is true that there, that he hasn't gotten that. And at some point, there might get that momentum as like, this is a guy who deserves it. He, he's deserved it throughout the last few years of his career.

I'm curious about DAC, though, if he could really get into that conversation. I know he was your preseason kind of dark course. He has 700 passing yards. Yeah, no. He's completely 70% of his passes pretty much. I mean, I know that it's kind of cheap when you consider what the game looked like. But in week 10, no one's going to remember why did he throw for 450 yards against the Falcons? That's kind of what I'm saying.

If they can really get hot, he has done nothing, even if they've looked on inspiring, he has done nothing to put himself behind the eight ball there when it comes to that kind of stuff. He's played well. So if they can catch fire, he's done nothing to put himself in a bad spot to this point in the season. Yeah, and I'm just not sure what else is left to say, though, about Russell Wilson at this point, because he has just been playing. He's the best player in football right now. Yeah, I agree.

And that's crazy because you know how I feel about Patrick Mahomes. But he really, he really is. I mean, he's just playing on this completely other planet. And it was so encouraging to see that the let Russ Cook thing was not just like a one week, you know, week one game planning type thing. It seems to be something that they will be committed to. I don't know if, you know, he finally just got the Schottenheimer and Pete Carroll got just bullied or they finally started reading their Twitter mentions. I'm not sure.

But it was, it was encouraging to see that even after there was a pitch. six. What was that even Russell Wilson's first pass of the game on Sunday night that they still decided they were going to pass on early downs. They didn't shy away from those big chunk plays. And it's almost like they just finally realized that, yeah, Russell Wilson is the best deep ball thrower in the NFL. And we should do that more. And D.K. Mattcalf, unreal. I know you and Nate talked about that throw and that catch the other night. But I'm just so impressed of the type of receiver he's growing in to be. And it just gives the Seahawks element or the Seahawks element, or the Seahawks offense,

just this really, really, really terrifying element. And I think the Cowboys' defense, the Cowboys secondary is pretty beat up. I don't think they were great to begin with. They have some of their, I think, Ousier is questionable.

And they've got some trouble. Yeah, I mean, they've got some trouble on that back end. So could be some real favorable matchups there for D.K. MacCap. I hope they score 100 points between them on Sunday. All I want is just rocket ship offenses

from these two groups. I want it all season, but I would love. to watch it on Sunday. I mean, that is just, give me that 3 p.m. game after a full slate of noon games and just give me all the points in the world. Just lay it on me. I am ready for it. One of the most fun games I ever covered was that Peyton Manning Tony Romo shootout in Dallas in 2013, where I think it was like 55 to 52 or something. And give me that, but give me that like on steroids. I'm totally ready. And not quite as exciting matchup, but one I am still looking forward

to. I'm really excited to watch the Rams offense against the bills of. defense. And it's for this reason. You know, so you look at the Rams and the way they're built and all of the numbers kind of lend to this. So they were using motion at the snap at the second highest rate in the league over the first two weeks. My buddy, Seth Walder from ESPN, gaming those numbers. And they have used play action on a ridiculous 48% of Jared Gough's dropback so far this year. I mean, that's nuts. So when you're thinking about the Rams' offense and what it's designed to do, it's about discipline. With all the motion, with all the play action, not dissimilar to what the Ravens are trying to do,

like we talked about in that game. They want to have all this window dressing to make life harder on you. And it's tough to be that discipline, play in and play out. You know, a lot of other teams, they try to add layers of complexity to their offense with things like personnel or formation. So if you go to a team like the Saints, right, they only use 11 personnel on like 50% of their snaps. So they're trying to confuse you just with who's on the field,

things like that. The Rams don't do that. You know, they are using 11 at 11. lower rate than they used to, but it's still like 73% of the time. The way they try to confuse it is with where the ball is going with play action and where guys are going with motion. And the Eagles really struggled with that last week. I mean, we talked about this with Bo and Zach on yesterday's show.

They put Nate Gary in a blender yesterday, or last week, Sean McVeigh did. The bills are so well coached and so disciplined. And it looks like Bultray admins and Matt Malano are going to play in this game. So their linebackers are going to be at full strength. can this be the type of defense that can sit there and watch all of the bells and whistles and all the stuff that's moving for that Rams offense and say, cool, we're not paying attention to any of that. We know exactly what you are and we know exactly how we want to stop you.

I think it's a fascinating matchup between two very interesting sides of the ball. And the times that we've seen, I mean, we have to go back to 2018, really, when the, when the Rams were firing and were just so good. The times that they struggled were when they played those really disciplined defenses and the best smartest defensive coordinators. It was when they played Vig Fangio's Bears and obviously what Belichick did to them in the Super Bowl. So that's the blueprint. That's what they need to be going back to defensively to figure out a way to kind of slow down.

What has just been this reinvigorated, really fun offense. And you can just tell that Sean McBay is like feeling it again. Oh, yeah. He's like re-refound. Jared Gough had a keeper in the red zone. You know that that's when Jared Gough is running the ball on purpose. You know that Sean McVeigh is feeling real good about himself. But man, I mean, this time last year, if you would have said, like, in a year from now,

we're going to be talking about like Rams Bills is the game of the week. I would have thought you were crazy. But I'm really excited. I mean, this is such a good slate of games. It was really hard for us to pick just two, you know, two games of the week and a couple matchups because this week looks really, really fun. Yeah, I'm excited to watch that. I just think that, you know, I'll be curious to see what the bills end up doing.

You know, the Rams have been so good. It got using Tower Higbee just as a movable piece within their passing game. Curious to see if they try to get him. him on some vertical routes on the outside to take advantage of some of the quarters that the bills play. There's just a ton of little cat and mouse games within that matchup that's really fun. All right, before we move on, let's take a break to talk about Draft Kings. Last week is in the books. Now it's time to review the tape and prepare for this week. There's no better place to get in all the action than with Draft Kings, the leader in one-day fantasy sports. To add to this

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Minimum $5 deposit required. Eligibility restrictions apply. See Draftkings.com for details. Lindsay, let's get to who has the most at stake this week. There are a couple different options here. with so many O and two teams kind of staring down the barrel. Who would you say this week has the most at stake of anybody in the lake? All right.

So I'm going to go with Dan Quinn, the head coach of the Atlanta Falcons. This has been a really rough, really rough week for Dan Quinn. Obviously, the Falcons fell to O and 2 after that onsidekick debacle in Dallas last week, where, you know, in the days after Arthur Blank, who's doing this media tour because he just wrote a book, you know, maybe their owner shouldn't be out doing all these interviews right now. but he really called out Dan Quinn and his staff by questioning if the Falcons players actually knew the rules. I mean, that's that's really rough. And I'm very curious how Quinn comes back from not just that, you know, that fourth quarter meltdown and that onside kick debacle.

But, you know, we have to remember they started one in seven last year. And it felt like Dan Quinn wasn't going to make it through the entire season. They ended up finishing six and two. They had a couple really big wins late in the season. And they remember they beat the Niners in San Francisco late in the year that was, you know, that was like a really kind of crucial win there for the, for the Falcons and for Dan Quinn's job status. But I don't know how many times you can kind of keep doing that and, and have confidence if

your ownership in the direction of this team and the way that it's being coached. I mean, he has already done a lot of the things that desperate coaches do when you're trying to save your job. You, you fire coordinators, you cycle through offensive coordinator. You take back control of calling the defense. And then you give it back again. And then you give it back again because it still wasn't working. So, you know, he's already, he's been cycling through offensive coordinators since

Kyle Shanahan left. I mean, the strength of that team when they went to the Super Bowl in 2016 was how brilliant that offense was and whatever it was that Kyle Shanahan unlocked within Matt Ryan. And it was just this perfect storm of, of play calling and Matt Ryan playing out of his mind week week after week and Julio Jones at his peak. And they haven't been able to recreate any of that. It wasn't Steve Sarkesian.

Dirt Cutter doesn't seem to be necessarily the offensive coordinator answer, you know, to fix it and to make it make them good week after week offensively. You know, Julio Jones continues to have injury issues. So this is just a huge week, you know, a huge week for Dan Quinn. And I want to know, you know, I want to see the players rally around him. I want to see good tackling. I want to see them know what they're doing. on special teams. So, you know, it's tough because Dan Quinn, everybody loves him, right?

I mean, he's a good guy. He, you know, everybody really likes him. He seems really smart. But at this point, you just have to wonder, what are they doing and where are they going? They're running out of runway here. I mean, that's just the, that's as simple as it gets. And I totally agree with you. And he's somebody that, you know, I've enjoyed the conversations I've had with Dan

Quinn in my life. He is. He's a thoughtful guy. I think that he, guys like him. They want to play for him. But at a certain point, when you're a defensive-minded head coach, you need results on that side of the ball. And this is a team sitting 28th in defense at DVOA again. I know they faced Russell Wilson and Dak Prescott.

We'd have spent the last 15 minutes talking about how those are two of the best quarterbacks in the league. But they can't stop anybody again. You know, that little eight-game stretch they had with Rahim Morris-Callon plays last year seems to be somewhat of a mirage. And if it's going to be the same old story where the offense is good but not dominant, which has been the post Kyle Shanahan story and the defense is searching for answers, which they seem to be in perpetuity, then this team is nowhere. It's not in a different place than it's been for the last three seasons. And if it's not and no progress is being made, then I think you have to step back and ask

what we're doing here. And if they can't slow down Mitchell Chubisky and the Bears offense who have looked okay better than I thought they would in stretches so far this year, but still aren't a consistent unit. If the bears come out slinging around this on Sunday and they have no trouble moving the ball, I think we have to start asking some very serious questions about what the Falcons are going to be this year. And here I thought we'd get through this whole podcast without you talking about Mitchell Trebisky. Listen, it's irrelevant points.

It's not as if I pulled it out of nowhere. It definitely matters. All right. My answer here, let's stick in the NFC North for a moment. The Vikings and Kirk Cousins, I was blown away at some of the numbers here. So my friend Eric Eager, who is pro football focus, as far to say, they should trade for James to Winston right now because of how badly Kirk Cousins is playing. I'm not willing to go quite that far yet.

But the Vikings right now are dead last in EPA per play through the first three quarters of games. And they cannot throw the ball. And I think it's a lot of different reasons, right? Cousins is not playing well. He's throwing some bad picks. He did not play it well against the Colts last week. A couple just inexcusable interceptions, a couple of ball placement issues. Up front, they have concerns.

Drew Samia was not ready to play against the Colts last week. Forrest Buckner absolutely tossed him around for four quarters. And Tyquan Lewis also had a really nice sack. I mean, they just pushed them around at front and controlled the game. But I also think that we have to kind of consider how much that Vikings' offense is keeping people off balance. because when I watched the Colts last week, they were flying around. That's a defense that knew what its game plan was and knew exactly how they wanted to attack a team. Everybody was playing fast.

Everybody seemed to know exactly where receivers were going before they were going there. Xavier Rhodes looked good in man coverage against Adam Thielen. That is not a sentence I expected to say at any point this year. So when you consider that, it's like, all right, they are not keeping teams off balance. And, you know, I had a lot of faith in what Gary Kubiak was going to do as a play call are coming into this season. But it just seems like if teams take away Adam Thielen and teams can push you around up front, that's when we find out that Kirk Cousins, and this is, I'm not trying to nag on Kirk Cousins

here. He is a product of his circumstances in a way that a lot of quarterbacks are. If you put Kurt Cousins in a good spot, Kirk Cousins can be good for you. If you put him in a bad spot, he's going to be bad. And that's exactly where we are right now because the spot he's in Minnesota is not good. And this hurts me a little bit to talk about. and maybe you too because I think you and I both really like Gary Kubiak. I really do.

And, and, you know, I grew up in Colorado. I covered the Broncos for a long time. I covered the Broncos, you know, through their Super Bowl run and Super Bowl 50. I do have this question, though. When was the last time that Gary Kubiak was a really good play caller in terms of, like, when was his offense? The last time that an offense that he called was really good. Like the 20th.

I think you could argue that the 2050. quarterback situation was so bad. Yeah, but that wasn't about scheme. Even getting anything out of it. Even getting anything out of that team, you could probably say he did a good job. But I think that that's probably a stretch. I'm probably reaching. Oh, I mean, Gary Kubiak deserved to win coach the year in 2015 because of the way that he

managed that in everything that happened with the 2015 Broncos, the quarterback situation. I mean, they tried to force Peyton Manning into an offense that didn't fit him earlier in the year. They switched course. He got hurt. that defense was a, I mean, was a monster, but was full of the most ridiculous personalities. And Gary handled it. It was a crew.

Perfectly. So I have tremendous faith in Kubiak as a manager and as like the adult in the room who is going to get the Vikings through this in terms of, you know, if guys start finger pointing and what's going wrong. But I do have a question about what are they doing schematically and play calling wise. And when was the last time that he called a really dynamic? and exciting offense. And that does, like I said, it hurts me. It hurts me to say. But I mean, was it the 2014 Ravens when he was calling plays for Joe Flacco?

Do we have to go back further to the Texans and the Andre Johnson years? I'm not really sure. But I'm just not seeing the like the Kubiak influence and them doing anything interesting and exciting or even stuff that like you said that's helping Kirk Cousins. You know, where are those naked bootlegs? Where are the play action? And where are those staples that should be helping cousins and it's just not there? Well, they've played a majority of this season down multiple scores.

Yeah. And I think this is the type of offense that really needs to be in positive or at least neutral game scripts in order to use that play action. Their play action percentage is really low. I want to say it's like 16% of cousins dropbacks because play action has much less credence when you're playing from two touchdowns down for most of the game. So I think that's part of it is they've been scrambling. But this is something where I probably put too much faith in Krupiak and Zimmer coming into the season because this was probably predictable, right? I mean, you look at the personnel the Vikings have on offense.

Why would they have a good offense? The offensive line is still a big concern with some of the questions on the interior, even though I think that Brian O'Neill is playing well and, you know, Riley Reef is not good but serviceable. The interior, especially with some of the injuries to Elfline and everything else, it's become a big question. and they clearly just have no dynamic receiving talent outside of Adam Theowen. I mean, Justin Jefferson hasn't given them anything so far, and the other guys in that team are all just guys.

And if you take away Thielen, there just aren't many answers, it doesn't matter how much you scheme stuff up. If you don't have the talent to go toe to toe with NFL defenses, you're not going to be able to kind of put a point, especially when you're playing from behind not playing the style that you want to. So this probably, you know, again, and I think on the other side of the ball, we probably should have known that the second. there it could be a disaster. I think I am on record saying it can't be worse than it was last year.

It is definitely worse than it was last year. Jeff Gladney had a really rough game last week. I mean, it's been the same kind of story for most of their corners, Holden Hill, at a really terrible game. So they are searching for answers right now on both sides of the ball, and I just don't know where those answers are going to come from. All right, Lindsay, last segment here. Let's ask our one big question for the weekend. What do you want to know by the time this weekends, games are over. All right. Well, I'm going to wrap this, like, circle this back around to the beginning of the podcast

when we were talking about a bit. Okay, great. I'm sorry, I'm going to bring us down here at the end a little bit. Appreciate it. I want to know who's going to be able to survive this injury wave. And I think there are two teams that are most dramatically hit by this right now. And it's the 49ers and the Denver Broncos. And I want to see if these teams who had like legitimate, I mean, obviously the 49ers

believed they were a Super Bowl team again heading into this year before they've lost basically half of their roster, the Broncos. thought they were going to be one of the best young teams in football, could make a run for a wild card in the AFC West. And I want to see if these teams can survive it. When you look at the Broncos, especially, you know, I'm here in Denver. I've been paying attention to them really closely. And, you know, losing Drew Locke, they're not putting him an IR, which gives them the chance

that he could come back in two to three weeks as opposed to being more like a month, a longer timeline for that shoulder injury. But, you know, they're going to start Jeff Driscoll, who played fine. I mean, I think he exceeded expectations when he got thrust in her playing against the Steelers. Yeah, he played okay. But, you know, Brandon Allen played okay when he came in for Joe Flacco last year. And then when he got to his first start, it was a freaking disaster. And, you know, now we're going to see Jeff Druskel start.

And when Jeff Druskel has been a starter in this league, it hasn't gone well. They're bringing him Blake Bortles. It's just this, like, terrible case of deja vu for what the Broncos and their fans have been dealing with for year after year after year with this quarterback carousel. If Blake Bordel's a world I know very well, Lindsay. Don't worry. Searching for a quarterback is my baseline state. Driscoll is going to be the ninth starting quarterback since Peyton Manning retired for the Broncos. That was not that long ago.

Blake Bortles could become number 10 since the beginning of the 2016 season. I mean, that's really bad. I would have put some money on that happening. I think Blake Porthos probably will become number 10 here at some point. Yeah. I mean, if he was able to be in the building before like Thursday afternoon, he could have been starting this week. But because of the COVID testing procedures, he could.

just couldn't actually participate in anything on the field. He couldn't actually go through practices until the variance. This is one of my favorite things. Why did teams go into a season with a backup quarterback that they don't feel comfortable about playing if he has to play? Well, so that, I mean,

that's the big philosophical question about the Broncos right now, right? Of that it was, we're going all in on Drew Locke. We're not going to sign a more experience backup because we want everybody to know that Jewlock is our starter and we believe in him. And we're not going to try to sign Cam Newton. I mean, I listen to you on Sunday night and I was like right along his side.

because they should be asking that question. I mean, if Broncos had traditional ownership, they should be asking that question. They do not. John Elway has complete discretion to sign whatever quarterbacks he wants. But yeah, I mean, they didn't even pursue. They didn't look into Andy Dalton. I mean, wouldn't you be a little bit more comfortable having Andy Dalton right now if you're the Broncos?

I mean, absolutely Cam Newton. But, you know, they wanted to have this message to Jew Locke. You're our guy. You're our guy. So it was just this massive gamble that they, took by not signing anybody else to be, you know, or anybody more experienced to be Drew Locke's backup. He doesn't have this great injury history. And here we are heading into week three. And they're already finding out that it was a really bad gamble.

Probably should have been. You were good. You were like the RA in the dorm for all of us people partying about the Broncos. You were like, guys, calm down. You should take it easy, which I really appreciate. It's a mom energy that really was necessary in that moment. So, My question here is, are the Raiders for real? Because we talked about this yesterday. You sent me a message. You're like, are we, is it time for us to apologize about Derek Carr? And the answer is no.

It's not time yet. Because I went back and watched that game yesterday, the Saints game. And it's still the same stuff. It's still the same Derek Carr. There are moments where it's like, oh, man, this looks great. I think Gruden is in a groove right now. I mean, some of the play calling stuff and the play design stuff that they have is really fun. they had a play at one point during that game where, you know, Aguilar came down in motion from the right side.

They kind of created a little bit of a trips with two tight ends on that side. And they ran a little man beating concept with the two tight ends as like a trips formation. It's like, oh, that is cool. Like that's just understanding how to get into stuff in a different way. And I think you're seeing a lot of that from Gruden. I mean, there are a lot of elements. They're running unbalanced lines and getting Waller and RPO situations with Jacobs. I mean, they know exactly how to get the most.

out of this personnel. But Derek Carr is still Derek Carr. I mean, he's sixth in total passing EPA. The efficiency is undeniable. But the air yards are like six yards per throw. He's still now near the bottom of the league. Watching some of these plays develop. And he's flipping the ball to guys three yards away.

And it's fine. But it's like, oh, man, he doesn't make very many negative plays. He still takes too many sacks for somebody who doesn't withdraws the ball very quickly. He takes some bad sacks. But for the most part, he doesn't make. make negative plays, but I'm not sure how many great, great positive plays are still out there and if he's the guy to make them. They're running more play action than they used to, which I think is interesting. You know, last year they were down near the bottom of the league. I think this year

it's something like 36% of his dropbacks. It's almost like there's scheming aggressiveness into him by having those deeper developing play action shots. He hit Brian Edwards on like a really nice overrout that looked like it was straight from the Rams playbook, which it shouldn't be a surprise because John Gruden is kind of taught Sean McVey offense. But it's that kind of stuff. It's like, all right, I want to see a little bit more of that. I want to see a 14-yard throw instead of just him getting the ball out of his hands so fast. He processes well.

He's a good, smart quarterback when it comes to that. But I'm just looking at it. I'm like, there just seems to be more on the bone here. So I want to see what they can do against the Patriots defense because I'm encouraged, but I'm still not sold. That's what I'm going to say. Yeah, I'm guessing this isn't the week that all of a sudden he's going to find like these deep.

chunk plays against Stefan Gilmore. I don't think so. I don't think so. It's probably not the best. And I do have questions about their offensive line. I mean, they've all of a sudden, you know, tackle issues. Trent Brown hasn't been playing. Richie Incognito was just placed on IR today. That's a great point.

Short term, it should be like three or four weeks. But, you know, that was the strength, right? I mean, they had such consistency on their offensive line and they're not going to have that right now. But three weeks ago, I would not have said Raiders Patriots must see game in week three. But I think it's going to be really, really. fun and I have the exact same questions. It was the first, the first name that I wrote down when we were talking about what are big questions this week. I wrote down Derek Carr. So,

yeah, no pressure. The fact that I've been asking it, I think, says a lot. I wasn't expecting to ask this question this early in the season. So I'm willing to eat crow on Derek Carr if we can get there. If they truly turn into this dynamic down the field dominant offense that can create explosive plays. And maybe they're never going to be that. It's okay to not be that. We saw how well this style can work out when they were just lighting up the Saints for all those little, you know, eight, ten, twelve yard completions. But I still want to see a little bit more. I don't think that we have really come to realize the best version of this offense.

There's still something else out there. And I'm just curious as to whether they can get there. All right, Lindsay, before we get out of here, is there anything that you want people to be looking for on the athletic this week? Yeah. So on Friday, I want to make sure everybody checks out. Mike Sando and I have been working for a couple months. we've been shipping away reporting at a project about NFL coaching staff diversity.

It's a very data-driven project. And it's going to be running on Friday in the athletics A-1. So that should be in all of your feeds. Make sure you check it out. You know, it's not just about head coaching. It's about top to bottom. What does it actually look like in the NFL in terms of coaching staff diversity? And what are some of the things that the league and people outside of the league are doing to try to change that.

So I hope everybody gives that a read. That'll be published Friday morning on The Athletic. It'll be all over your apps and over the athletics homepage. please check that out. It's an extremely important issue. And I feel like we talk too much about why aren't people getting head coaching jobs and not enough about why the pipeline is just truly broken. So I'm excited to read that.

I'm glad you guys did it. All right, guys, that's all we got for a week three preview. I'll be back on Sunday night with Nate. Until then, please subscribe and rate us on your favorite podcast platform. We'll be back after the week three games, which are fantastic. If I do say so myself. Until then, appreciate you listening. We'll talk to you later.

This was the Athletic Football Show.