The Athletic Football Show: A show about the NFL - Week 9 recap: The best of the best—and the worst of the worst—are separating from the pack

Episode Date: November 4, 2024

We're halfway through the NFL season, and the best of the best are starting to separate. Two cases in point in Week 9...the Lions and Ravens. Robert Mays and Derrik Klassen dig into those results on this episode of The Athletic Football Show. The guys also discuss the Chargers latest win, concerns for the Bears, highlight reel plays from the Eagles, the Rams win over the Seahawks, and a whole lot more.RundownRavens dominate BroncosLions handle PackersLos Angeles Chargers...You Have My Attention!Joe Burrow...You Have My Attention!Chicago Bears...WTF?!?Seattle Seahawks...WTF?!?Saquon Barkley and Devonta Smith carry the EaglesDrake Maye did something cool againTerry McLaurin is out of QB hellChris Olave's healthIt's So Over...the Miami DolphinsIt's So Over...the Dallas CowboysWhat Did We Learn Today?Host: Robert MaysCo-Host: Derrik KlassenExecutive Producer: Michael BellerProducer: Michael BellerSubscribe to The Athletic Football Show...AppleSpotifyYouTubeFollow Robert on X: @robertmaysFollow Derrik on X: @QBKlassTheme song: HauntedWritten by Dylan Slocum, Trevor Dietrich, Ruben Duarte, Kyle McAulay, and Meredith VanWoert / Performed by Spanish Love SongsCourtesy of Pure Noise / By arrangement with Bank Robber Music, LLC Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to the Athletic Football Show. I'm Robert Mays. Week 9 is in the books. Kind of a strange week in the NFL. Had some bizarre games, especially in the second half and the second slate of games in the afternoon. We're going to talk about all of that with Derek Classen. Also, Ed, I feel like the best teams in the NFL starting to separate themselves a little bit. Big day from the Ravens, big day from the Lions, another nice game from the Bills. We talked about how the teams and the classes in the NFL are starting to become a little bit more distinct. nine weeks into the year. Also talked about some good quarterback performances. Justin Herbert and the Chargers grabbing our attention. Joe Burrow having a big day in what has been an uneven Bengal season. Again, chatted about the Bears and the Seahawks having some unfortunate performances in the second slate of games.

And then a few other nice moments that we liked from week nine with me and Derek Classen. Let's get to it. Welcome to the Athletic Football Show. I'm Robert Mays. You're joining me tonight. It's my good friend Derek Classen. Derek, how you doing, buddy?

I'm doing good. It feels like a, it's a weird week in the NFL. I mean, the time change is different for everybody. Like, it was kind of a weird come-down week after last week was completely insane. So, like, I feel like in a trance is the best way I could describe this week. I was a mess today. I'm on mountain time right now. So I'm on mountain time.

It was daylight savings time. The last game and the late slate went like 45 minutes later than it was supposed to. I have no idea what time it is. And I have no idea what's going. on. And I think that was pretty fitting for some of the unsettling football that we got to watch today. Yeah, I forgot that you were on like the double time duty, which is a tough way to live, especially on an NFL Sunday. Yeah, I mean, I did this to myself. I don't need any sympathy from anybody else, but I'll be back hopefully in my normal zone over the course of the next week. But it was definitely a little bit disorienting and a day full of stuff that was a little bit disorienting. Sometimes we kick off the show with a performance, you know, something that really stood out.

or a game that we thought carried particular weight from that week. We're not going to do that today because I don't think any one game really stood out that way. When I was watching today's slate unfold and I watched a couple of the performances, one of the things that really started to hit me was I think we're figuring out who the really good teams are in the NFL. One of those teams, just a mindless winning machine, is going to play tomorrow night against the bucks. And that team just continues to eat up everything in its path. And there's a reason the chiefs are the chiefs.

We know about them. But today we did see some teams that I feel like, all right, they're really settling in. They feel like they're putting some distance between them and everybody else in their respective conferences. And there are two performances that really stood out to me in that regard. And then there's a third team that we can talk about. I think the Ravens and the Lions feel like those sorts of teams right now. And that Baltimore performance on offense today, I think we can talk about why it puts them in a slightly different place. And I think now with the bills being seven and two and essentially walking away with

the AFC East, you can probably throw them on that pile too. But that was pretty much my biggest takeaway from today. I don't know how you felt watching those teams. That is exactly how I felt. You know, I kind of came into this week believing that there were, to me, five very good teams, which is obviously the Chiefs who will probably win on Monday night. The Ravens, even though we still had some questions about their defense, the Lions, the Bills, and then the Packers, the Lions beat the hell out of one of those other teams that I just said. Obviously, the Packers kind of had some of their own issues with Jordan Love not being fully healthy and the defense missing a couple of guys, but the lines went out and handled business. And then the Ravens, this Denver defense legitimately

was, you could make a case that they were the best defense in the league to this point. And the Ravens went out and smacked them for four quarters. Run game, past game, didn't matter, got every single thing that they want. For them to do that, it just felt like, okay, the Ravens have had these good games. They're putting up all these numbers. For them to go and do it against what has maybe been the best defense to this point in the season, I'm so bought in a on the way this team is going. It was absolutely crazy for Lamar to have that sort of game against a team that was number one in the league in EPA per dropback coming into this game.

They were number one in the NFL on defense the Broncos were. And I believe Lamar averaged 0.91 per EPA per EPA per dropback in this game. That's absolutely insane. The number that really jumped out to me, the Broncos didn't play a lot of man coverage in this game. Typically, they'll lean into some man coverage. And I understand why teams are a little bit hesitant to play it against the Ravens because they're worried about what Lamar can do with his legs.

Lamar wasn't very good against man today. I mean, it was pretty average. Against Zone looks in this game, Lamar Jackson finishes 13 for 15 for 260 yards. If you're doing the math at home, that is a cool 17.3 yards per attempt. They were getting some chunks. And like, the Broncos weren't even necessarily,

they didn't even in some instances have like the wrong answers for what you should be doing in Zone. Like one of the big plays that Zay Flowers hits, where I think it's the touchdown right before the house. half. They're running like cover two to his side over the top of him. So you should think, oh, we're safe. But they're running switch verticals and like a corner route runs the deep safety off. Zay just gets up right through the seam and is able to do whatever he wants. And so like, even when the Broncos thought they were safe and thought they had the right answer to like,

ah, we're not going to give the most explosive passing offense an explosive pass. They still give it up. And Todd Munkin still finds away and Lamar Jackson still makes it throw. Like the way this offense is operating, it is truly like one of, in terms of the passing offense, what they're doing on a down-to-down basis. It's legitimately one of the best passing offenses we've seen in a decade to this point. Yeah. And just in terms of efficiency, the numbers are crazy. We talked about it coming into the week. They're averaging, I think, 7.1 yards per play, which is one of the best marks that we've seen in the last 20 years. It's up there with some of the best offenses ever. They were at 7.3 yards per

today against the defense that has been objectively good most of the season. Right on that's what you're talking about, Tizé. He, the layer, Lamar layers that ball over the linebacker. was trying to get his hand up to get it. And that's the problem with this team. That huge touchdown to Zay, and then there was another big chunk to Zay earlier, even on that driver on the previous drive, both of those are just out of super heavy personnel play action. And that's what this team is doing to you.

They can really do whatever they want. They can run the ball out of any personnel grouping. And when they line up with those heavy personnel sets on early downs and they try to take some of these chunk shots out of play action, what are you going to do? Because you're so worried about having to stop the run. and then they're just gashing you behind the linebackers on these 25, 30-yard chunk plays. They are such a problem right now, and I think a huge reason for that is just the way that Lamar is playing. We've alluded to this, the fact that this is probably the best version of him we've ever seen.

But right now, he's playing the best quarterback in the NFL down to down. And even as he's won MVP's, I don't think that is, I don't think that was the case. You know, like, I don't think he was playing better quarterback down to down than Josh Allen was last year or than some other guys have in the past. but right now he is. I mean, there was a play. I can't remember which throw it was. I think it was at one point in the game where he, he like, John Franklin Myers was coming unblocked at him.

It was actually the chunk to Zay off of play action, and it was right before they hit the wheel route to Justice Hill. Franklin Myers is coming at him on a stunt, and he has to like just sidestep him a tiny bit and throw the ball around him for that chunk of play to Zay Flowers. And it's like, Jesus, man. Like the fact that he's doing all of this little subtle stuff in combination with the spectacular things we see from that offense, it just makes them such a dangerous beast right now. And doesn't it feel like right now when he moves in the pocket, he'll make him, he'll make one guy miss and then it feels like the game immediately slows back down for him.

Like he isn't going into like, do I need to run? Do I need like, where's my checkdown? It feels like he makes the guy miss and immediately like time slows back down. And he's like fully back into like, all right, what's the next thing? And I think that's a big reason why he's been able to play the way that he's, he's, he's, he's. playing so far. I went and looked up his EPA per dropback numbers through nine weeks since 2011. Lamar Jackson has the fifth best EPA per dropback at 0.35. The guy's ahead of him. 2016 Tom Brady, who granted only played four games, but he was in the MVP conversation and

then beat the actual MVP in the Super Bowl. You have 2011 Rogers, one of the best seasons we've seen in my lifetime, 2018 Mahomes, which was obviously like an incredible thing, and then 2013 teen Peyton Manning. Those are the only guys ahead of him over the last, since 2011. That is the level that he's playing at. Like, this isn't us doing the thing of like, oh, Lamar Jackson's playing really well, and it's October and he's doing it all again. No, he is legitimately one of the most productive passes we've seen in over a decade.

And you combine that with what Zay Flowers is turning into, the fact that they have Derek Henry and this team is a wagon in a way that they just have not been offensively in any year that we've talked about Lamar, the Lamar-led Ravens. even in 2019, where they were the most efficient offense in the league, they were less flexible than this. They were fewer ways that they could beat you. And I think that's what makes them so scary. And I think that conversation extends in a way to what the lions are.

Now, the lions didn't play the cleanest game today. They didn't run all over the Packers. It wasn't a hugely efficient day. The weather was bad, et cetera. But this is just to me like a perfect encapsulation of who the lions are. They have a fourth and six with 15 minutes left in the second quarter, the beginning of the second quarter. They have like, it's a third and six. They run the ball on third down and then they get to that fourth and six.

They come out on that fourth and six and they just do all this bells and whistles bullshit to try to get the Packers to jump. The Packers jump on fourth and six. And even as the play clock was ticking down, I know they weren't going to take a time out there because I'm sure they were comfortable taking the delay because it would have been a chip shot field goal the same way it would have been if you hadn't taken the delay. So they go because they know they have nothing to lose by doing this. They go try to get the Packers to jump.

They get the Packers to jump. And on the next play, they hit the fourth and one touchdown to Amman Ross, St. Brown. And it's like, okay, this is what this team is. Like, they are just going to do all these little things better than you do, and you extend to the talent that they have, the explosiveness they have on offense. So now it's 7 to nothing. Then you have the Kirby Joseph interception return for a touchdown.

So now you're down 14 to whatever. They come out at the half. First play, they run this beautiful little screen Tom on Ross St. Brown on the first play of the half. They get 11 yards. Same drive. 18 yard chunk to Jemir Gibbs. Just gorgeous zone blocking.

Like the cutoff block by Decker is gorgeous. Ragnow displaces the nose. The Glasgow gets up on the linebacker. Same drive, fourth and one, 15 yards. Sewell crushes the right side of the offensive line. Gibbs scores a touchdown. Now it's 24 to 3 and the game is over. You felt like you had a chance.

You felt like the game was close. but because they convert a bullshit fourth and one, and then another one two drives later, you're now down by three touchdowns at the start of the third quarter and there's nothing else you can do. They just suffocate these teams. Even on days where they're not necessarily clicking on all cylinders, you wake up and they're up by two or three scorers

by the time we're halfway through the third quarter and the game is already over. Yes, that is the perfect encapsulation of this team. They're always stronger than you. Like, they can bully you when they want to. They're usually cleaner. Like they don't make as many mistakes outside of, you know, the corners maybe being a little grabby.

They don't have that many penalties. And then all the little things that you mentioned, like, you know, that fourth and six where they, you know, they get them to jump and stuff like that. That to me was also the biggest difference between a team like the Lions and a team like the Packers. I think the Packers are a very good football team, but they just made more mistakes today. You have the Jordan Love throwing the weird pick six. You have on the fourth and one you mentioned, like they clearly mess up that fit.

I think McKinney overruns his fit and is supposed to fall back and he doesn't. And Gibbs is able to spring for a touchdown. You have Green Bay dropping a number of passes. And I know the weather plays a factor in that, but like the Lions weren't really dropping passes. And so the weather is the same for both teams. Exactly. Right. And so this to me was just a game where it's like, all right, you see what it looks like when one team is clearly just a little bit more mature than the other one.

And that's what it really felt like with this Lions team. Another thing I want to add to that too is like I think two years ago there are two factors where if they happen to the Lions, they would have absolutely lost this game. First of all, it's a wet game outside for Jared Goff. Two years ago, instant loss. Like, they lose that game and I have no doubt about it. And then the other thing, Brian Branch gets ejected in the first half of this game. I think if you told me two years ago, the Lions second best defender, and currently their best defender with Aidan Hutchinson off the field,

gets ejected in the first half. I would be like, oh, they lose that game. But both of those things happened and they didn't lose that game. In fact, they won it pretty handily. Like, this to me so clearly feels like a very different Lions team than I've ever really been used to. Yeah, I think they have so many paths to victory. They have so many ways to hurt you. And I think that today was a really good example of that.

Beller dropped this stat into our rundown doc, and I still don't believe that it's true. Over the last six games, the Lions have scored more touchdowns than they have thrown incomplete passes. They have 26 touchdowns and 24 incompletions. That's an offense that I think is in a good spot. It's doing pretty well. You know what? I actually do believe that. I think I saw on the broadcast.

this is golf's fourth game this season that he started with at least 10 straight completions. Yeah, it was 11 for 11, I think. It's crazy. How does he keep doing this? They are just, again, it's an offense that I think understands exactly what it's trying to accomplish all the time. I think that's why they're so fun to watch. And again, you want to throw the bills in there. It's another team that I think he's playing really well offensively.

We'll talk about that game a little bit later. So I think you have a solidified group of teams at the top. And I think today was another expression of that. On the flip side, and we don't have to spend a ton of time on this, but I think it's an interesting counterpoint to the good teams that we're starting to see develop and stand out. There are an unusual amount of very bad teams this year. If you look at the standings, there are nine teams that are two in six or two and seven. Some of them we expect, you know, the Panthers are in there, the Giants are in there, the Giators are in there, the Titans are in there. But then we have some of these other teams that just have seasons from hell that have joined them.

The dolphins are in there. The Jags are in there. The Saints are in there. So we have this huge collection of teams. I mean, a third of the league essentially by, we're pretty much at Halloween. Everyone was celebrating Halloween all weekend. So I'm just going to say we're still at Halloween as we're making determinations about the NFL season. We're at Halloween and you can ignore a third of the NFL.

That's wild. I just don't remember it being quite that distinct, but that's the way that it feels right now. Yeah, I mean, the only team that I think was supposed to. to be trash and hasn't been trash is Washington, right? Like they've been like the one, okay, they have somehow jumped themselves out of that category, which I think has been super impressive. But otherwise, all the teams that were kind of supposed to be bad have been bad. And then a number of teams like you mentioned that are, were mediocre or at least had a shot at the playoffs, have just completely like their season is over. And like with the dolphins, some of that's not

your fault. Like, too, it gets hurt for a few weeks and like your offense just craggers for a little bit. That's maybe a different discussion for a different day. We'll have that. We'll have that discussion in 20 minutes. Yeah, for a different, yes, a segment is how I should probably phrase that. The Saints is probably the most confusing because I know there wasn't a lot of reason for optimism, but for it to fall apart quite as drastically as it has, I think it's pretty insane to me. But for there to only be like one surprise good team and then a lot of surprise really bad teams, it just feels like there's no middle class in the end.

the way that I think there have been in other seasons. There kind of is a middle class in the NFL, but even the middle class in the NFL is weird. We're going to talk about the Chargers in a bit. The Chargers are in the middle class of the NFL. The Cardinals are like, I think the Cardinals are a team that we expected to be this sort of team, right? I think the Cardinals are five or four through nine weeks. Like, all right, I think we expected the Cardinals to be this sort of team.

Everyone else in the middle class, like the Rams are this weird team lingering around the middle. The Bengals are this weird team lingering around the middle. So a lot of what's happened with the distribution of teams in the standings right now, I think, has snuck up on us in sort of a weird way. Speaking of the Saints, just throwing this out there right now, there are a couple games we're not going to talk about today. Because it was not in my field of vision watching games in Denver today, and because I care about myself, I did not watch Panther Saints and we are not going to talk about that game. And we're also not going to hit on the Sunday night game doing all the prep during that game. I think a lot to dig into with the Sam Darnour performance of what we saw from the Joe Flacko,

Colts offense, which was just as bad as the Colts offense has been at any point this year. But just so you guys know, we're not going to hit those, but we are going to hit most of the other ones. And that's going to start in earnest here with you at my attention. Gentlemen, you had my curiosity. Now you have my attention. We've been dancing around this a little bit. You know, we talked about the defense on the preview show.

You've been poking me about Justin Herbert, which I'm open to Justin Herbert love, by the way. People have made this weird. It's very strange. I don't understand. of the comments we've gotten. But this was the first game, I think, that we can really lean into this because of what they played like on both sides of the ball and what this looked like against the Browns team that actually showed some life last week against the Ravens.

The Chargers are now 5 and 3 with their 27 to 10 win over the Browns, doing some stuff worth paying attention to on both sides of the ball. So the Los Angeles Chargers, the firmly in the wild card race, Los Angeles Chargers, you guys have my attention. They really do. And they have my attention in the exact way that, like, If I painted the picture for how they would have my attention coming into the season, it's exactly this, right, where like the defense kind of comes together the way that we think

they would. Justin Herbert is playing out of his mind. The run game looks a little bit better. And overall, it just feels like a well-coached mature team. Like, they still have some individual screw-ups, right? Like, Quentin Johnson not getting his head around on a back-shoulder ball that he probably should catch. Just little stuff like that where, like, drops here and there.

The best throw that Justin Herbert made today, by the way, was that back-shoulder whole shot to Quentin Johnson that should have been. caught. A day where he had many plays we're talking about, I still think that was the best throw that Justin Herbert had today. It was, and it's a shame that that one actually gets dropped. So, like, they still have some of these individual errors, right? And like the interior of the line's not great. But in terms of getting the most out of all of their players, they really are on both sides of the ball. And I think that's obviously true with some of the past catchers that that Justin Herbert is getting decent production out of. But then some of the names that you see make

plays on the defense this week, I thought was insane. Like, Deon Henley, I think on the first or second drive, sinks under a bender, almost intercepts a pass, Tarib Steele, or Tarib Stil, who is a rookie fifth round pick, tipped up an interception for one of his other, I think for a safety in the end zone. And then later in the game, Elijah Molden, I think, was the one who ended up picking it off. Yeah. Yeah, for Elijah Molden. And then later in the game, he's playing outside leverage on a dig route. And immediately, as soon as the receiver goes in, he just drives under it and and picks it off. And it's like, two months ago, we didn't know who any of these guys were if they would be

anything for this team. And now they're making huge plays in games. And it's just like the fact that they are getting that from their defense. And then you still have guys like Mac playing at a high level. It's coming together in a way. I just didn't expect that this quickly. The Tar Heap still tip for the interception was a fantastic play. And I just love that these guys are never covering grass ever.

Yes. They're always aware of situationally of where they have to be. when you watch the depth that all these guys get in coverage, even if it's like a cover two corner. If it's third and 10, I don't give a shit if you're sitting there two yards off the ball in the flat. I'm going to get some depth and make this a little bit harder for these quarterbacks who are having to try to hit a whole shot in third and 10. They're consistently constricting those lanes when they're defending the pass. And that Deion Henley play that you pointed out is a perfect example. Like he gets so much depth there and just gets one hand.

That's not a bad ball by James. It's actually a good ball by James. It's a fantastic play by Henley. That was like at the 530 mark of the first quarter. And I believe it was on a third down and that short circuit's a drive. And you're just having all of these contributions. Morgan Fox had some moments as a past rusher today. He had a sack on an inside move in the first quarter.

Clomack had a disgusting sack on an inside move at one point. The defense overall just played really well and cohesively in the way that we've seen from them. Coming into Sunday night football, James had the second worst EPA per dropback of any quarterback this week after what he did against the Ravens last week. So we want to see, and the Browns aren't the best offense in the league. We know this. But we want to see the Chargers to kind of stack up these performances against not bottom three offenses.

So to see them do this against the team that really did show some life last week against the Ravens, that's really nice. And then you combine that with a quarterback that, listen, the offense isn't good. Okay? They had a 30% success rate today. He was pressured on 53% of his dropbacks. He was running for his life the entire game. but he's still going to be able to make three, four, five throws over the course of the game

that make this team intriguing at the least dangerous at the most. And that's why I think that even if they're incomplete and even if there's a lot to be desired with where this team is and its build, which we knew going into the season, there's still a lot to like about what they look like right now. Oh, yeah. I'm not going to call this a good offense, but the quarterback is making it as good. It's a bad offense, but the quarterback is saving them. He's making it as good as it possibly can be.

And honestly, the formula that they have, I think is probably good enough to get them into the wild card where if your defense can continue to play at a top five level and they're really not giving up that many explosives, where on the other side, like you said, three or four throws a game from Herbert where he just does something absolutely nuclear and instantly puts you into at least field goal range and you can get some points out of the drive. That is not like the best and most comfortable way to win games, but it is probably going to you again, especially in an AFC that really outside of like two or three teams, how many do you really feel that good about?

I'm just looking at the numbers from today. I didn't see this. We started talking about it. They had 13 first ounce. The Chargers did it. 13 first ounce. I mean, now that I think about it. It helps when you're scoring touchdowns on third and 21, you know, where the Denzel

Ward just leaves Josh Palmer on that play, but the Herbert still has to make the throw. And then the 66-yard touchdown to Quentin Johnson, I believe it's third down. He has to reset in the pocket. Herbert does after getting a little bit of pressure, slides to his right, puts his foot in the ground, and throws a 40, I looked at the air yards. It was 48 yards in the air. It's a missile whole shot to Quinn Johnson for a touchdown. In this game, a couple of those, a couple of those coin flip plays with your quarterback's a superhero, that ended up being enough. Whether it's going to matter when they play real teams in the playoffs that they get there, that's an entirely different conversation.

but I'm at least interested in what the Chargers look like right now. Yeah, I think among the scrappy potential wild card teams, I at least want this. When you have very good defense, cool quarterback, that's enough for a wild card, but I'll watch that on Wild Card weekend. All right. So we're looking at the AFC standings right now.

The Chargers are 5 and 3. The Broncos are 5 and 4. Yeah, man, it's hard not to feel pretty good about them, right? Like, no, there's going to be no wildcard team from the AFC East. Okay? In the AFC North, we're going to get at least one. Right. The Steelers or the Ravens are going to get one of the Wildcard.

card. So that's one. In the AFC South, not feeling super good about the Colts. And so it really does feel like the Chargers have the inside track to one of these. Is there any team in that middle class, that non-existent middle class that we were just talking about in the AFC that you definitively feel better about right now than the Denver Broncos, or excuse me, than the Los Angeles Chargers? No, because what I was going to say, too, is that of all the non-division leaders in the aFC, if you were to just look at like, you know, each side at the ball, like offense and defense, like which of which each individual unit do you feel best about? To me, it's probably the Chargers defense, like outside of all the division leading teams, it's probably

Chargers defense. And then again, like you said, they probably to me have the best quarterback of all the teams that aren't leading their division. So yeah, like, yeah, they're in a pretty good spot. Let's get to our next one here. I want to be very clear about this, this entry into you have my attention. It's Joe Burrow, and it is only Joe Burrow. It is none of the other Bengals, because I'm not doing this. I am not going to get excited about the Bengals as a team, and I'm not going to do the, oh, they're four and five, look at the AFC wildcard picture.

That's fine. If we want to do that three or four weeks from now, we can do that three or four weeks from now. I'm not going to let myself go back down that road after beating a team that did two notable things today, the Las Vegas Raiders. One, they yanked Gardner Minshu to play Desmond Ritter. Not injury related. This is a performance thing. A quarterback that they just signed, that that's the decision that they made.

And then after this game, they fired Luke Getsey. You signed? That just happened, according to Tom Pella. I was about to say, I did not even realize that before we started recording. Luke Gatsy is out as the offensive coordinator for the Raiders. You came into the season. You've made these choices. So the state of the Raiders right now, I'm not going to get overly excited about a team-specific performance against this version of the Raiders.

I will, however, get excited about a performance like this from Joe Burrow because, in my opinion, this is a continuation in a couple specific areas of things that he's been doing this year that I find particularly exciting. And the thing that I think really jumped out today is his ability to continue making plays off schedule and trying to create a little bit, whether it's buying a little bit more time in the pocket, whether it's making plays outside of the pocket. That, to me, has been one of the biggest strengths of his all year in what has been. a very nice season for Joe Burrow, even if the Bengals as a team have been struggling a little bit. It to me has been the only thing that's kept this offensive float is those two or three plays outside of the pocket that Joe Burrow makes a game. I mean, you can go back and watch any of their games, whether it's their wins or some of their close losses, the three plays that Burrow gets out of the pocket and maybe he throws a deep ball to chase or it's some weird third

down conversion. Like those are the only plays that are keeping this thing alive. Because like the run game hit or miss, depending on the week, they were actually good today. But again, Raiders team is not that good. But it's mostly Joe Burrow having these big time explosive plays. And for him to be doing it without T. Higgins in some of these spots, it's incredibly impressive. Like I think today, especially, my only thought watching this game was this is full on LSU Joe Burrow. Like they are, it is fully the LSU offense where it's like, all right, it's going to be a

bunch of quick games. We're going to have well-timed RPO's and then Joe Burrow is going to make five insane throws outside of the pocket. Many of them in the red zone and many of them were in the red zone today. And so that's, again, I still don't know if that's the most consistent formula for success. But if he specifically is going to play at this high of a level, maybe it is. Maybe it is enough. Most every single one of his touchdowns today, he's making a play outside of the pocket and having to extend.

First one to Chase Brown, rolls to his right, finds Chase. Great play by Chase Brown, by the way. Really good awareness to get to the back corner knowing that he's rolling out. It helps when you're running back runs like a four or three and he can get over there. But that was a really nice play by both of those guys. the fourth and three that he had to Tanner Hudson, where he has to slide to the left and up in the pocket to make that little sidearm throw. That's a beautiful play.

The touchdown to Yoshivas, he's having to slide to his right, goes back across his body. That was beautiful. I mean, just he's doing that stuff consistently. And watching him can, you know, make some of those plays, you know, what Chase is going to be, you know, when Higgins gets back, there's still enough with this offense that makes them exciting. But I think this version of Burrow is really, like you said,

it's what kept them, is what has kept them afloat a little bit, and it's just something that feels a little bit different than what we've seen from him in the past. And I think as, I don't know if elevate is the right word. We've seen Joe Burrow play really good football, but it just feels a little different. And it just feels like it's given them a little something that this offense may have lacked at other times when we've seen them really thriving. Right. I think there were maybe at previous points when Joe Burrow was the most explosive passer in the league, there was a little bit more of it where it was just like, wow, Jamar Chase and T. Higgins.

are really good. Yes. And there were still some elements of like, okay, Joe Burrow would still go make a play outside of the pocket. It would maybe be like once or twice a game and he'd be like,

okay, that's nice. And then a lot of it would just be chucking deep balls. Right now, it truly feels like he makes five or six plays a game where everything is on him to go make something happen. And he does. And you add that on top of the fact that I do think he's actually just playing really well

within the system when he's allowed to right now. Like there was a scene ball that he threw in this game where he just goes, one, two, three, boom, ball is out and like layers it right. over the linebacker and fits it in right before the safety can get over. And so for him to be playing as efficiently as he is within the offense, I mean, he started 15 of 15 in this game and didn't have an incompletion until Max Crosby got his hands on an RPO pass. Like that was his first

incompletion. And then the throw right after that was a drop. Like that is the level that he's playing at within structure and then you add the out of structure stuff. So if he can continue to do that, get T. Higgins fully, but like if he could be back in the fold, this offense does have something. Was the seam ball that went to Eric All? Yes. Early in the second half, I love that play. They were an empty, and it was like a little slant flat seam. And so just like the stress you're putting on the defense on that side,

and Burrow gets to it so quickly, it was like a 20-yard chunk. And they were just hitting a lot of those today. So Joe Burrow, only Joe Burrow, because I want to be clear about this, you have my attention after that performance today. We're going to talk about a couple performances from the late slate of games. today that left a lot to be desired. But before we get into those, let's take a quick break. What the f***?

The late slate of games today, what for me was the two to 225 slate of games. We could put any of them in here. We're going to talk about some of the Nick Siriani decisions a little bit later. So the Eagles, because they have some real superstar players, did not rise to the level to warrant mention in this segment. Two teams from the other games absolutely did. And let's start with the Chicago Bears. Bears lose 29 to 9 to the Cardinals, and they have a schedule in the back half of the season that's absolutely brutal.

And so the fact that they've dropped these last two, their outlook for the year has definitely shifted. But I said this after the game today, and I truly believe it, no matter what sort of losing streaks they went on previously with Mattieber Fluss. They have the number one pick in the draft. It doesn't matter when you have no expectations. You can lose all the games you want when you have no expectations. to come out and play this way after the way that last week ended and all of this consternation about culture and how the locker room feels and where they're going to go after that moment to lay an egg like this against this Cardinals team and especially against this Cardinals defense

what the fuck what was that today that was there are so many different angles and we'll get to the I'll get to the culture you know we're the team that's all put together stuff in a minute I want to start with something that Ben Solac tweeted via next-gen stats. 16 different Cardinals defenders registered a pressure today. 16 individual players, which is the most in a game since 2018. And Caleb was pressured on 46% of his dropbacks overall. There were definitely a handful of them that were just his fault. He's holding the ball a little bit too long.

But when you are pressured on basically half of your dropbacks and more than the allotted 11 starters are getting pressures on you, it's crazy. Like, this is obviously a Cardinal's defense that we know to be not very good. And they are still beating all of your protection rules. Your backs aren't getting where they need to be in past protection. And you just don't have that many good checkdown options. And then you add that on top of Caleb missing a few throws. That's how you end up basically laying an egg against one of the worst defenses in the league right now.

My issue here, so he was blitzed on 26% of his dropbacks today. It was four of 11 on those plays. It wasn't very good. The issue is they didn't have the blitz to be doing that. If you look at who got those pressures, it's two for Mac Wilson. It's two for Kaiser White. It's two for every single second or third level defender that blitzed. They're sending all of these simulated pressures where they're only bringing four and they're dropping guys out.

And the bears have absolutely no idea how to handle any of that shit. The safety, that's exactly what happens on the safety. Oh, gosh. They leave the back on essentially an unblocked second level defender, even though they're only bringing four. And then I think the play before that, the drive before that, where it ended on a sack, it was another simulated pressure that they couldn't pick up. Their pressure plan in general is absolutely garbage. I know that they're missing the starting left tackle in this game.

I know that darn all right eventually did get hurt in this game. That's not what this is about. This is about a team that is completely ill-prepared for how to handle some of these funky looks. And this goes back a while. Washington did this to them in the Jags game, the Jags, even though the Bears were rolling, had some success on these simulated pressures. It is inexcusable to have this little of a plan. and have so little of this buttoned up when it's been such a problem for you over the last few weeks.

That's the offense. And you mentioned Caleb doing this to himself. He did not play well again today. The play that I just cannot get out of my head, the sack he takes on first and 10 from the plus 38 at the end of, I think, the first quarter is disgusting. Yeah. Like there's just absolutely, you can't do it. Like, it's totally indefensible. The checkdown is sitting right there for him to throw the ball to.

he just doesn't do it. And the funniest part about it, they almost overcame it on that set of downs. And then Keenan Allen drops a third and eight that should have gone for a first down. So everything about the offense was just gross today. That's the thing that I want to stress about this. Caleb did not play well today and he missed a number of throws that he just shouldn't be missing, like flatly. But then you add that on top of the fact that like there is no margin for error in this offense for him. And it feels like some weeks it's like totally zero.

There like, you know, there was that few weeks stretch there. week four to six or whatever they were playing okay but when they're bad and it looks like this there's literally zero room for him to mess up and he's a rookie he's like a 21 22 year old rookie he's going to mess up and he's going to have games that look like this and so like when you add both of those factors together again that's how you get a game where you score nine points against one of the worst defenses in the league we wouldn't be having this discussion if that was the only problem with the bear's performance today because this is what it's looked like at times this season where the offense who's really struggled. But the defense, Matt Eberfluse's defense, right? That's why Matt Eberflus is here.

Because what the defense did in the second half of last year. I can hear you becoming the Joker in the like, Matt, that's why Matt Eberflus is here because the defense, right? The defense played really well in the second half last year. The defense was really good for the first half of this season. What the Cardinals did to them on the ground today. Kyler did nothing today. Right. That's the craziest part. Kyle had one of the worst games of any quarterback in the league when you look at the stats today. And it didn't matter. It didn't matter. Over the first three quarters in this game, the Cardinals average 0.48 EPA per rush.

For context, that's outrageous. That is double an average Josh Allen dropback from this season. That's what the Cardinals were doing on the ground. It was unbelievable. We're talking about 10, 12, 11, 8, 15, 8 over and over again. And the Cardinals run game is a beast to deal with. I mean, they're throwing tons of shit at you. And I actually liked one thing specifically in terms of schematically today, design-wise,

they were running these looks where it would be 12 personnel and they would have both receivers split out to the left and they'd be in these like Y-Wing sets. And you had Jack Sandborn walked out over Marvin Harrison in those looks. And so you had a linebacker walked out of the box and they were just getting gashed in those looks. But it didn't matter. It didn't matter if it was gap scheme runs. It didn't matter if it was zone runs. It did not matter.

the Cardinals did whatever they wanted today. The nadir of this is a third down run at the end of the first half where they give up a 60-yard touchdown. I just could not believe it in real time. I said it was a draw when I saw it happen because I thought it was just a give up draw. It was just a run play. They were running the ball to end the half and they give up a touchdown to essentially put the game out of reach. It was unbelievable. It was that center or playside guard pull that they run like,

a million times a game. And what happened was the bears fire the nickel. And so they fire him and he like ends up hitting outside of where the two pullers are. DeMacardo, who is the running back, sees that and goes, oh, all right, I'll just hit it up the hash right behind my two polars. And he's just gone because the bears are in a too high look. So there's a ton of space once that that slot corner misses and he's not in the picture anymore. And DiMicardo just, he's gone. And it's like to give up that play, by the way, a reason that this afternoon slate felt so weird, I'm pretty sure all of these games had like a weird, bizarre touchdown right before the half. The Eagles also got like a third and 17 draw touchdown, which was ridiculous.

Gino, I think, threw a touchdown right before the half, like all of these games. Yeah, he did. But this was certainly the most egregious of them all. The reason I take this tone with the defense is, again, this is what you were supposed to be able to hang your hat on if you're Matt Eberflos. If the offense is going to look like garbage because of the higher that you made in the offseason, If you're going to be putting your number one overall pick quarterback into shitty situations over and over again, the offense is going to look bad. That's one thing.

If the defense is going to start to fall apart. And I know Kyle Gordon didn't play today. I know Mattes Sweat didn't play today. I know Jekylln Biscler didn't play today. Everyone's got injuries, man. Guys are missing all over the place. Missing one defensive end, one nickel corner, and a safety is not the reason that you got run over and over and over and over again. It was a terrible day for the linebackers.

I don't want to make like sweeping proclamations about firings and staff. changes and everything else. The last thing I'll say about this, we're heading in a bad direction. The Bears as an organization, the Bears as currently constructed, what they're supposed to accomplish with this staff, it is trending in a very bad way. And we can revisit that as that slide happens. But after this discussion, I think I'm good on Bears talk for a while. This is just one of those moments where because it was the low moment, I do think, of what this staff and this regime has looked like, it deserves to be mentioned. It deserves to be talked about because this was a gross game. It does. And the last thing I want to mention, I brought up, you know, the

discipline, culture, all that stuff, we're a buttoned up team at the top of this. The thing that irritated me the most about this was right early in the, or late in the second half, third and six, third and goal for the Cardinals, they sack Kyler Murray and they get them into fourth down, and they get them into field goal, and Jervon Dexter commits a penalty where he jumps over the snapper. And so the Cardinals get the ball again and they finish and score a touchdown. Like those are the mistakes that if you're going to, you know, preach yourself as the buttoned up team and we have all this discipline, you cannot make that particular error. No.

And it was a game full of errors. Speaking of games full of errors. Another team we wanted to talk about in this segment is the Seattle Seahawks. We can hit this from a variety of different ways, entry points, anything you want to do. I think I'll start with this one. The Seahawks average 10.2 yards to go on third down today. 10.2 on third down. that's bad. Actually, the Patriots were worse, which is somehow hard to imagine that a team could be worse than that.

But that's the problem with the Seahawks team. If you look at a lot of stats, quick pressures, you know, some like play actions or excuse me, past protection stats, they're right there with the Patriots and all of this shit. The Patriots are barely watchable. The Patriots are only a team that you want to pay slight attention to because of Drake May. The Seahawks aren't that far away in terms of what they're having to overcome on a down-to-down basis. I can't remember the exact slate of down. and distances that they faced in this game. I tweeted about it, so let me pull it up. At one point on their first five possessions, the Seahawks faced a third and 13, a second and 31, a second and 18, and a third and 33. Those were all on different sets of downs.

So it's not like they gained, you know, it's not, whatever. It's not like they had a second and 31. They gained 18 yards and it was 1313. These are different sets of downs. That's what this team is constantly dealing with. I know the weather was bad again, but to have two flub snaps and to do all of the other weird shit they did in this game. And I know they almost won because Gino and JSN did ridiculous shit for a good chunk of this game. But man, this is truly one of the most maddening teams in the NFL when you see what they're capable of and then what they constantly do to themselves.

Yes, and you mentioned the 10.2, what was it, 10.2 yards to go on third down? First of all, if you spiked the ball twice on first and second down, you would be in a better position than that, which not a great way to run your offense. That's a great way to put it. I didn't think about that. That's literally true. Yes. And then second of all, you're doing this with you have maybe like one of the worst, like we said, one of the worst past protection offensive lines in football. Like your interior and your right side of the line is really, really, really bad.

So 80% of the line. Right, 80%. Basically everybody outside of Charles Cross, and then especially if Zach Charbonnet isn't in the game to do pass protection for them, it's just really bad. You know, their offensive light isn't that bad. It's just the left guard, the right guard, the right tackle, and the back. Other than that, everything's both fine. And like the tight ends aren't very good at it.

But, you know, it's like whatever. But so like, let's say in some fantasy land, Josh Allen and the Bills had a game where they have 10.2 yards to go on third down. It's like, okay, well, there's still a decent pass protection unit. and you have Josh Allen who can just run around and make plays. Gino, for the most part, is a pocket quarterback, and now you're sticking him behind the worst pass blocking unit in football. Like, it's just the fact that they got anything out of this game is a miracle.

I don't know. This team is just incredibly frustrating. And then they actually moved the ball okay. And then every time they got to the red zone, some type of calamity happened. And one of the – Gino, obviously, through two interceptions. The pick six, that is fully his fault. It's an awful throw in a –

awful decision. It is a fully egregious error where he gets pressured. He's rolling out to his left. Cam Kinchins is like playing the flat and he's so tight to the boundary that I think he realizes I don't really need to play like right on the running back who's out in the flat. He realizes, all right, I'll fall off of this a little bit. As soon as Gino goes to trigger, he just slides back into the to the back line picks that off somehow runs it back, which is a truly incredible play. The other interception he throws, they're trying to do like a little gun rollout and they're trying to get A.J. Barner just stringing across into the flat across the formation, he kind of gets hemmed up, like as soon as he passes like the right tackle mark. Gino Smith throws it as if he's going to be

able to keep moving anyway, throws a rice past him to a defender. Should Gino dirt that? Maybe. Like if you see your guy getting hemmed up, you probably should just dirt it and kill it. But I understand like why with a guy in his face, he just thinks, ah, he'll get there and he'll figure it out. And it's just like kind of an unlucky just bang, bang play. So it just felt like every single thing that could go wrong for Seattle did go wrong. They had a second and 31. I'm 100% with you on all of those. Even if he gets hit on the Kinchins pick six,

even if he didn't get hit on that play, that's still going to be a pick. Oh, yes. Kinchins reads that the whole way. It's first and goal. You cannot throw that ball. That's the biggest error. Is that it's first thing.

First and goal. Like, you cannot have to do this. If it's third and fourth in goal, I get doing something stupid. But first and goal, like, just throw it away. Don't out of bounce. Doesn't have to happen. The partner,

one, it's just an unlucky play. I mean, that's just brutal. The first interception he threw, this to me is it just sums up everything. Second and 31 after another fumbled snap. Second and 31, they get a 22-yard chunk to JSN. And on the next play, the ball hits JSN and gets tipped up for an interception. That's it. That, to me, is just this team in a nutshell.

The other parts that are just emblematic of where they are, Gino pressured on 59% of his dropbacks in this game. 59% he was 9 of 19 on those plays. When not pressured in this game, 12 of 15 for 208. Pretty good when he's not getting killed every single play. And really, 9 for 19 is not that bad when you're getting pressured that much. The touchdown they scored at the end of the half, it reminded me a little bit of that touchdown they scored against the Falcons, where there's like six seconds left and he just throws an absolute missile shot to get them six points.

And Gino, I think, Bellar put it in here. I believe Gino had six completions, or seven. Gino had seven completions of 20 plus yards in this game. Seven. I mean, and they had two called back for holding. He had like a 38-yarder and a 40-yarder to JSN that were called back from holding. So the fact that they made all these splash plays and the quarterback was able to do, again, four or five crazy things. I know they threw three interceptions part of the reason they won.

But to even be in this game and to eventually lose it because you don't get a fourth and one in overtime after the game is essentially being handed back to you because you can't block anybody, man, they are just so frustrating. And dude, in overtime on the other side of the ball, when the Rams get the ball, they, it was either the first or second play that they have, but they're trying to throw a big crosser to the right side to, I think, Ty Johnson. Tarik Wollin is like standing in the spot where the ball is going to be and he's like waiting for the interception. He's sitting there like a centerfielder waiting for the ball to come to him. If he drives to, two yards and runs up to cut off the crosser.

It's an interception. Seahawks are instantly in field goal range. Game over. But he's just standing there and he lets Ty Johnson cut in front of his face and make the catch. And then like shortly after that, Stafford makes an ungodly throw to. DeMarcus Robinson. Again, DeMarcus Robinson, I'm telling you, somehow always makes the play. And the Robinson makes an incredible one-handed catch.

So it's just like you fail that fourth and one when the game has kind of been gifted to you. And then you have to Rika-Won and just like not drive on a very easy interception. It's just like the game is winnable and you're just not winning it. And the fact that they didn't win it now is huge in the NFC West race. Because now the Rams, who felt like they were dead in the water a few weeks ago, are sitting there at four and four and a half game back of the Cardinals. But it's not like the Rams were great today. The Rams' offense struggled throughout most of this game.

We talked about how much Gino struggled against pressure. Stafford was only pressured on 34% of his dropbacks today, according to next gen. Three of 15 on those plays. They had some trouble in past protection today in ways they didn't against the Vikings. So I don't really know what to make of this Rams performance overall. Puga gets ejected, which I can't believe we had two star players ejected in the early parts of these games today. But conversation for another time. Puga gets ejected.

You know, that's one more thing that they have to worry about. Now we're back to a slightly diminished version of the offense. But it still wasn't the sort of performance you'd want to see from this Rams team after what they did to the Vikings on Thursday night. And so I don't really know exactly what to make of this moving forward. I just know that this game was very winnable for the Seahawks. And they continue to shoot themselves in the foot, unlike almost any other team in the NFL. And it's especially, you know what, if the Seahawks didn't look as promising as they did for the first five weeks, I probably wouldn't care. If they lost one or two more of those games and it didn't seem like they could jump in front of the division, probably wouldn't care.

But the fact that they gave me hope and then now it's starting to crumble again, it's like, why, man? Why'd you do this to me? It's twofold. The ways they're losing these games are why it's notable. You're snapping the ball over people's heads multiple times a game. You're getting stepped on inside the five. You're throwing multiple red zone interceptions. That's one of the reasons that we're talking about.

The other reason that's worth talking about is you see what they're capable of. You see the plays that this offense can make when the situation is even halfway decent. The problem is it's very rarely halfway decent. So the major takeaway here is that we got some truly grotesque football in that afternoon. slate and that was always going to take up a majority of this segment. I don't totally think the Seahawks should get a, excuse me, I don't totally think the Eagles should get a pass. So we're going to get into some of that with, did you see that right now? Did you see that? Did you see that? Let's start with the good. Let's. The Eagles made two of the most insane plays I've ever seen today.

Would you like to go through what you saw from the Sequan-Barkley play and just how it moved you emotionally? I, it's, it's not often you legitimately get to see a thing that I cannot ever recall where Sequin Barclay, first of all, the thing is, it starts as like a normal good play, right? Where he catches the ball out to the left, he spins out of one defender. And you start right there, there's not that many backs who can just spin out of tackle. That's cool. He immediately transitions that into like putting his back to a defender and then realizing, oh, the only way I can get around this guy is to just jump over him with my back turn to him.

And he does it. Backward hurdle. Yes, it is a backwards hurdle. Like, I truly never seen it before. And you have to be one of the best athletes to ever touch a football to make that kind of play. And it was literally, it was legitimately like a video game glitch or like it as something you dreamed of. Like if you wrote this in a movie script or like a show, everyone would be like, that's the

dumbest thing I've ever seen. And then he did it. We've talked about this a little bit and alluded to this a little bit. I think there are a few players you can talk about this with. We'll talk about one in a second. It's been so cool to see, I'm going to say cool twice. It's been so cool to see objectively cool football players be able to do this shit in better circumstances. Like, I'm sitting there watching that game today with the Ravens, and it is amazing to me that we have two of the coolest players of my lifetime in Derek Henry and Lamar Jackson.

They showed Derek Henry stats and just like where they are and his generation and what he's been. I'm like, Derek Henry is a legend. Like, he's like Paul Bunyan. Yes. When you think about what he has been as a football player for the last two decades. And the fact that we now get to see him as part of this Eagles or this Ravens offense is so great. And I think you can probably say a lot of the same stuff about Sequin Barclay, where he had to wallow away with this Giants team for his entire career.

And the Giants had some of the most unwatchable offenses, some of the most unwatchable offensive infrastructure for the last six years that he was there that we've seen in the NFL. Like at the bottom of the league, pretty much every single year. And now you put him on this Eagles team. And it feels like once a week, he does something where it was like, holy shit, did you see what Seekwon did in this game? That is awesome. Like, I'm very glad that we get to see that version of Sequin Barkley.

And he's necessary. With how up and down the Eagles can be and how stop and starty, they could be, he's necessary. Other guys that are necessary and how the talent lifts this team is somebody like DeVante Smith, who also made the sort of play today that you see once every two. three weeks. If Garrett Wilson hadn't made that play last Thursday, we would be talking about the Devante Smith touchdown today as maybe the best catch we've seen so far this season. Especially he, I thought last week's catch, right, was incredible where he catches that post. He goes up for it in traffic, puts it on the on the back line. That's an amazing play that not

many receivers can make. For him to do what he did today, where he catches a go ball down the right side at the back of the end zone, he catches it like, he's leaning over. So he's like almost parallel to the ground one-handed and just like dragged both of his toes in on the back line. I just, his ball skills are truly one of the best I've ever seen. And because he's not, Go Go Go gadget arms. Yeah. Yes, legitimately. And because I think almost all the time when we think of ball skills, we think of the Drake London, George Pickens, Mike Evans, these guys who are big, big, exactly. But DeVantza Smith, just in terms of like find ball, bring ball into my frame and make sure I hold on to it, there's just not many guys who find a way to bring the ball in like him.

And again, he's doing this. He's like 180 pounds generously. It just the ways that he does it are crazy. I think when we talk about Sequin, just how unique of a talent he is and the fact that he was the second overall pick in the draft. And you can argue about whether or not that should have happened, considering the quarterbacks available in that draft. But I don't think anyone was like, oh, yeah, Sequin Barkley is not a top five talent. This was about all of the other things that go along with drafting a running back that high. Sequin was so good as a prospect and is so physically gifted that you could talk yourself into why he is worthy of the second overall pick.

That's unicorn shit in 2018. Devante Smith, at his size, at his physical package, was one of the most productive college football receivers we have ever seen. The man was the best player in college football. And I guess I forget this in these terms. The fact that we have these historical outliers in certain ways on the same offense in Philadelphia. And seemingly every single week, these dudes that are just in another zip code in terms of how they're built and what they're capable of are doing this stuff consistently. And even, I know he's not playing right now, but Jordan Milata, for him to be like seventh round pick who wasn't even playing football. And now he's one of the best left tackles in the league.

Like, they just find these unique talents. And I think How he says this I mean it's unusual is what they He says about late round picks But that's unusual players Can we find unusual players And the fact that

A.J. Brown Who's like one of the most physically Dominant and most physically Imposing receivers of his generation Feels like the third or more Third or fourth Most outlandish physical specimen His own offense

I think tells you a lot about What this Eagles team is from a talent perspective Right, that's the other thing. Like, the other players are just, it's hard to find an analogous player, whereas you look at AJ Brown and you're like, all right, he's incredible, top five receiver, but also like Des Bryant was kind of something like this. Julio Jones has been something like this in certain ways. But like the other guys, I don't know if I've seen another Devontas Smith in terms of

the way that he does it. He's one of one. He's truly is one of one. The fact that some of this and all of this might not have mattered because of the decision making from the Eagles in this game is what is particularly from. I don't know what to do with some of the situational choices being made by the Eagles. A lot of people losing their minds about taking points today. I'm never going to be in that discussion.

I don't think taking points is not always the best answer. When there is incongruity in your decision making and when you choose to do things and when you do not, that is what is frustrating to me. To have a fourth and inches, not fourth and one, fourth and inches from the 25-yard line, when you have the most efficient short yardage play we have ever seen in the NFL. You're the fourth and inches team. You roll out Jalen Hertz on that play and he throws a desperation heave and you turn the ball over on downs. Okay, cool.

And then on a fourth and three at the 22, you pass up a field goal and there's a turnover on downs. And I believe they missed a field goal later in the game when we think they might have gone for it. It's just everything about the choices they're making and when they're making them is sort of perplexing, right now. And I think that it doesn't matter because of the talent that they have and the fact that they can overcome so much of this. But these frustrations with how they're going about this, even if they're not coming up against teams like the Jags, it may come up against the better teams in the NFC when we get a little bit deeper into this season and the games really, really start to matter. I think that's pretty much why I'm at with it. Whereas I will say, I think coming into

the season, I thought maybe some of that stuff and maybe some of the inconsistencies on what I thought the offensive scheme would be, would be a problem. It turns out when you have a number of the most unique talents at their positions and some of the best players at their positions, and Jaylen Hertz actually playing a little bit better than I thought he was going to, turns out none of the other stuff really matters. Again, I think when we get to, if you have to see Detroit, you know, potentially in the playoffs, yeah, this stuff is going to matter. But as far as getting there and getting into the dance, maybe the talent is just too much. Next one here.

Did you see the play that Drake made to force overtime and then the scramble that eventually led to that play? I've seen this play 10 different times from him at North Carolina. It's the thing. It's a miracle that he does this. His ability to extend plays in the red zone where he's just running around evading three or four different plays, which he did on this play. He made three or four different guys missed behind the line of scrimmage.

I think NextGen stats actually tweeted this. he held the ball for 11.82 seconds on that play. It's the second longest touchdown throw since 2016. And the only one that was longer was the Jaden Daniels Hail Mary from last week, which is like it's a three-man rush on a Hail Mary. That doesn't count as much as literally the game is on the line inside of the five-yard line. Like it was just only Drake Man makes his play. It only he is insane enough to do something like this.

This feels like a potentially good situation for the Patriot. If you're a team in this spot, the idea of losing almost every single game, it's not good for the coaching staff. It's not good for people who eventually want to keep their jobs. And I know it's hard to maintain morale and all that stuff. I'm not going to deny that. But if you're just going to put yourself in position to have a top two pick in this draft, to have the pick of whatever you want, whichever position you want to go with, and the quarterback

looks good consistently and continuously shows promise in arguably the, the first one, worst circumstances in the NFL, that feels like not a terrible place to be if you're the Patriots, right? The fact that he's doing this and having these moments pretty much every single week, it's not perfect. It's not great. You threw for 200 yards today on 41 attempts. It's not great. But we have these glimpses and these flashes where it's just like, man, if you can surround him with some real pieces, there's a lot to be excited about here. Even if the wins and losses are gruesome right now, I still feel like there's something to hang your hat on with that collection of shit if you are a Patriots fan.

Absolutely. I mean, losing games and getting to the top three pick, if they can kind of like you said, somehow keep the morale good in the building. And honestly, I think if Drake just continues to play this way and these guys feel like he is the guy, like I think Devon Godshaw, who's obviously one of their defensive linemen, he said today, this is young Josh Allen 2.0, which if he were to turn into that, that obviously is like a 100% outcome for him. But it seems like they're pretty bought in on him.

And they should be like everything Drake May did on really the two minute drive in general was insane. Obviously, the final play is crazy. But at one point, they're in, it's second and ten. He's an empty. He slides up around a pressure, fires a bullet to Kashan booty into tight coverage. The next play, he has to like squirm around in the pocket to make a jumping checkdown to Ramandre Stevenson. And then right after that, he scrambles and gets a first down. And then he gets a fourth and two to Hunter Henry that puts them like inside the five where he

and then go do whatever it is he did on that last play to tie it. Like this, that's the moment where like you said, you're like, okay, maybe we've got one. The fact that I'm going to be consciously turning into Patriots games in the second half of this season, given what their record looks like is a testament to how interesting Drake May is right now. Let's get the next one here. Did you see Tara McGorne's touchdown on that sluggo today? I, everything about that play, everything about that play was gorgeous. The route was gorgeous. The ball was gorgeous. And this is, again, kind of an offshoot of what we're talking about with Sequin.

I was watching games today at a bar in Denver with my buddy from high school who lives here, who's in my fantasy league. And he has Terry McCorn. And I've had McCorn like every single year that we've done this league. And this year, I was like, I can't anymore. Like, I just, I have to move on from this. He wasn't worth keeping at the price that he was at. And the fact that I don't have to watch him do this as someone who has believed deep in his soul that Terry McCorn was a great NFL player. every single year, no matter what the production looked like, I'm torn because there's a personal

pain that comes with it, but I'm also just really happy for Terry McCorren. These guys who get to get out of quarterback jail at some point in their career and we finally get a sense of what sort of players they really are, that's a beautiful moment. And we are in that Renaissance right now with Terry McCorren. It is. We need every cool player needs to have this moment. Like there's inevitably going to be some really good players just locked on to Taylor. terrible teams, right? Like, that's just the way that it goes in the NFL. It's the way that the NFL draft works. That's naturally just going to happen. For Terry McLaurin to finally have a quarterback who can, one, get him the ball, but two, Jane Daniels is very willing to throw those,

like, all right, those double moves, go balls, whatever. He's like, I know Terry's going to be open. Why wouldn't I go throw that? And so for those two to already have the connection that they have, obviously we saw it against Cincinnati a few weeks ago, but it's only gotten better since then. Like these two, just in terms of the pure deep ball connection, I feel like this is not could be the last time Terry McLaren will be on here for did you see that? I've really enjoyed watching those two play that two-man game throughout the season. And it is really cool that Terry McLaurin gets these moments after what his quarterback plays look like for most of his career.

Last one here, I'm not going to get a do a jokey way into this because it's serious. And we usually reserve this segment for some of the fun stuff we saw on Sunday. But this is something that absolutely warrants discussion and we need to hit. Chris Olave, another potential head injury over the middle of the field, carted off, goes to the hospital. this would be his second concussion of the season, documented concussion. He was checked for a concussion last week, I believe, and I think he's had multiple concussions at other points in his career. So obviously, there's been a lot of discussion about Tua and his history and his future based

on some of the head injuries that he's had to endure. Chris Olavis seems like he's in as bad or worse of a place when you look at his history. And I mean, this is something that feels like it's happening every single week. And there's not really much to say other than it's sad. I mean, it's just truly sad for him and his future, and that's really all that matters. But also, like, he looked like, and still is, like, one of the more dynamic young receivers in the game. And this just felt like the week where we were going to see, you know, all right, here we go, like wheels up for Chris Olive. And then immediately this happens. And it's deflating in the moment.

It's scary. And it just is really unfortunate that we've reached this point this early in Chris Oliva's career. but it feels like we're probably at a stage where some tough conversations are going to have to happen. Yeah, sad is really all there is to it. I mean, two years ago, him and Drake London kind of came into the league burst onto the scene at the same time. And it was like, man, these two same division, rival teams, they're both going to, you know, jump onto the stage and be these top 10 receivers. And for a lot of it's purely just been the injuries that, you know, the concussion specifically that have kept them out of it. But when he's been healthy, he's one of the cleanest route runners you'll ever see, especially for a guy who's his size.

like he's over six foot and it's just incredibly graceful. His speed is outstanding. So for him to have some of these issues and not be able to healthily play a full 17 games, it's just frustrating, especially again for a player who is so incredibly promising when he is out there. Yeah, that game, again, I didn't watch a ton of that game. It was on behind me. My brother texted me and he just something about Olave and I was like, what happened? Again, something happened.

And then I saw the replay and everything and I was like, man, I cannot believe that. When you consider everything that has happened to that guy this year and just some of the moments he's had to endure, for it to happen again that early in the game, it was almost unbelievable. It was just something that was hard to wrap your head around. And unfortunately, that's kind of the place that we've landed.

And we'll revisit that when we know more. And I'm sure that there will be a lot more discussion about it. But I felt we had to hit that at some point on the show. Next up here, we're going to talk about a couple teams whose seasons are on the brink. But before we do that, let's take a quick break. It's over. So over. We did this early in the season, almost as a joke, right?

After it was like week one or week two, we could jokingly look at a team, I think it was the Panthers after week one, be like, it's so over. Now that we're at the midway point, we can bring back it's so over and have it actually means something because for these teams, their season is probably over. The Dolphins fall to two and six today, which are heartbreaking loss to the bills, a walk off 61-yard field goal by Tyler Bass. Two and six, several games back in the division, a few games back in the AFC wildcard,

even talking about the underwhelming middle class. Dolphins probably have too big a hill to climb here. I'm pretty comfortable saying it's over for the 2025 dolphin, or 2024 dolphins. And I don't really know what that means about the 2025 and on dolphins. I think they are the most frustrating. it's so over type of team because they're really not that bad. Like the offense actually played pretty well today, like 27 points, Tua had a number of

really good throws, Tyree Kill, especially in the second half really exploded. Devon A. Chanis, for however many touches you can give him a game because he's a smaller guy, but like when you can get him the ball, he is truly unbelievable, like just his speed, his vision. It's truly incredible. And the defense is like a functional unit. But when you're at 2 and 6, at this point, you're just too far behind the 8 ball. Like you have to basically go eight and one from this stretch. And like there's a chance they go, you know, five and four or six and two or six and three or whatever.

And they're a functional team, but that's still not going to be enough to get you out of this hole that you've dug yourself. And I know some of that is like Tua goes out with some of the injuries and the offense just completely craters. Maybe you should have a better backup than Skyler Thompson and Tim Boyle, which is probably the biggest issue there. You can't necessarily predict that Tua's going to get hurt. But for the season to have fallen apart the way that it has for them, while still being a kind of functional and scrappy team, I think that's why it feels particularly frustrating for them. They're two and six right now. Let's say, for argument's sake, they finish six and a level. So that means they would go four and five the rest of the way, which I don't think is crazy.

If two is healthy, I think that they are that kind of team. They almost beat the bills today. I think that there is a chance that they're like a five. 500-ish team, maybe even a little bit better. So let's say 6 and 11 or 7 and 10. If they finish 6 and 11 or 7 and 10, if you are Stephen Ross, does Mike McDaniel come back next year? I mean, I honestly think that he might not.

And I think there's a couple of factors that kind of compound themselves. First of all, obviously you go 6 and 11. Your job is probably always going to be on the table. But the other thing is this roster is pretty expensive and pretty old. So it feels like this version of things. is just run out. And if you feel like, like obviously Ramsey is expensive than old, Tyree Kill is expensive and old to run Armstead. Um, like a number, there's a number of guys that I'm probably forgetting, but a lot of your guys, like I said, are, and you just paid your quarterback. So like,

this roster is already kind of maxed out for what it could be. And so I would understand why if they think, okay, if six and 11 is all we're getting out of this year, maybe we don't want to give the head coach like the chance to fully rebuild it because maybe that's just like too, it's going to be too weird of a timeline. So I still think McDaniel is actually a good coach, but I understand why just like the timeline of things and how everything is falling apart, that there's a chance that it's six a lot of in he might not be there next year. If this were almost any other situation, I would understand people being like, I don't know, this is what we should do moving forward. Here's why I think it actually would make sense to bring him back. There is no offensive system that you

could run that would make your quarterback, the quarterback that you just paid $53 million a year, more valuable than the offense that Mike McDaniel is going to run. So if you decide because you didn't reach the goals that you wanted to, that it's time to start over with the coach, I know the roster is aging a little bit, but if you hit the reset button, you still have the $53 million quarterback in this next iteration of the roster. And if you're not maximizing that player, you're probably going to fall short of your goals anyway. So I think trying to see what you can get out of this group for at least one more shot because they can bring back most of this roster next year. It is expensive, but they've done a lot of maneuvering.

They've done a lot of restructuring. They can probably do it one more time and get away with it and say this is the best chance to get the most out of Tua and this collection of players because Tua's skill set is best utilized within this sort of of offense, I understand that argument, and I actually think I buy into that argument. I don't know if the dolphins are in better shape or better positioned next year, no matter who you bring in as your head coach and your coaching staff, than the one they have right now because of the way they've built and oriented this entire thing. Unless they totally bottom out from here on out, which, again, I actually think they're like a scrappy functional team, so I don't think that's going to happen.

I pretty much agree with you because I think you're either going to end up in the spot where you end up running an offense that is not as good for Tua, this is assuming you replace Mike McDaniel, or you get four weeks into the season and realize, hmm, I think we have to just run some facsimile of what the old Mike McDaniel offense was. And at that point, it's like, well, we should have just kept the guy and we should just kept him in the building and pray that he could put it together again. So I think there is a chance that they could just run it back, assuming again, it doesn't completely bottom out. And I don't think it will. So I think they should still bring him back, but you can never know where an owner is thinking if you go

six and 11 or whatever it is. And I know people are going to say that he just signed a contract extension in 2024. You think Stephen Ross is worried about that? It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Yeah. I think that Stephen Ross probably has enough money to pay Mike McDaniel and one other coach.

If this goes really bad, I wouldn't be surprised if we start having that discussion. I don't think that we should jump to that conversation, though, because of the circumstances and kind of the considerations that we talked about. Their inability to run an NFL offense with anyone other than TWA is a problem. and I do think it's something that they should get in front of in the future, but I don't think it's necessarily an indictment of what this team looks like with its quarterback. There are real reasons why I think they can't do anything when he's not in there. And I think it's a couple different things.

One, what he does as a ball handler and just some of the, like the machinations of how the offense works, having somebody that is skilled in that regard, but is also used to doing that is really important for the Dolphins offense to be what it is. you've seen that each over each of the last two weeks. And the other thing that I always come back to, I talked to Frank Smith before the season about something. And I've alluded to this in this conversation a couple times. But we were talking about why two is able to kind of rip those throws over the middle

of the field. And it's this ingrained trust in the fact that it's going to be there. And that trust is gained over dozens and dozens and dozens of reps throughout training camp. You're throwing balls before guys are open. And the only reason you're willing to do that is because you've had extended time on task with this coaching staff and you've built inherent belief in what they're asking you to do. So you're going to make decisions that are living on the edge in a way a quarterback that just dropped into this situation is never going to be willing to make. So I do think there are actual tangible reasons for why the offense falls off a cliff when they're starting quarterback isn't playing.

Whether or not you should build an offense that that fragile is an entirely different discussion. but I understand how you arrive at that point. Right. I think it's both. Like this is probably not the best way to build an offense, but they've gotten the most out of the guys that they have, which I think is pretty impressive. And then you make the good point that like Tua, again, whether it's the best way to play the position,

he is always going to fire throws, especially over the middle of the field and that offense. He's going to trust that they're going to be there. You could see what the other quarterbacks. And again, they're not very good quarterbacks to begin with. But those guys, they just didn't have the full confidence in where and when those throws were supposed to hit. And that's why it felt,

not as consistent, not as good. Yeah, again, I think that the answer is probably to bring this group back and see what happens because it does give you the highest ceiling. But to be two and six, and for this to be a lost season, it's a tough place to be halfway through the year. Next one here, I guess I'm going to pose this to you. And I think I know what your answer is, but the Cowboys now are three and five after losing to the Falcons today.

Is it over? Is it so over with the Cowboys? It's over, especially, Dak Prescott left about halfway through this game. especially if he's not going to be fully healthy for the rest of the year, potentially. It is extremely over because he, what have I said on almost every other time that we've brought up the Cowboys? It's like the only thing holding this team together is a DAC throwing quick game and CD getting two explosive plays for you a game. That's the only thing holding this thing together. Okay, well, if you pull out the quarterback from the equation, all you have is CD's explosive plays.

And if the quarterback plays and it's good, we might not even get those. So like, I think it is, it is pretty over for this team. And we felt this coming even when they were in a 500 team, right? Like we felt when they were three and three, this team is not very, it is not very legit. They're a little bit fraudulent. And now two weeks, two weeks later, it feels very much that that's where we're at. Yeah, I mean, the gap between them and what this Falcons team feels like. We talked about a little bit on the Thursday preview show, on the Friday preview show,

just where the Falcons are and what the Cowboys would need to do to get to be that level of offense. And you could just feel the chasm between those two teams. today and just even some of like the design stuff. The Falcons offense wasn't great down to down. They didn't run over this Cowboys defense like other teams have, but there were so many easy completions available in high leverage moments. Like the Darnell Mooney touchdown is a perfect example, but there is a gap between where this Cowboys team is and where even, let's call them good NFL offenses are, what

feels like a good NFL offense. You feel the gap between those two groups right now. And for the Cowboys to be there with their quarterback. with C.D. Lamb and with what we've seen in stretches from this offense over the last couple years, man, that is a tough pill to swallow. Yeah, like, I think the Darnell Mooney touched on. I think it was a fourth in three in the middle of the second quarter. They're running bunch to the right side. And this to me is like how you know they're just this this, this Cowboys team does not have it together right now. Trayvon Diggs is playing as like the high player over the bunch. And Darnell Mooney

like runs that wheelwright out to the right side. I know as the high player over the bunch, he's had to work through the traffic and get out to that wheel right before. I know he's done it. He's a good player. He's a Pro Bowl level player. But he just takes his angle so low and runs himself right into the traffic of the other two players. And Darnell Mooney is just walking into the end zone. It's like if these are the kind of simpler mistakes that we're making eight weeks into eight, nine weeks into the season, how could this be a serious unit?

And the thing I thought that this unit would have, even with some of the player struggles, some of the personnel issues. I was like, man, the Mike Zimmer defense, so at least be well coached. even that doesn't feel very true right now. And so for them to like, it just doesn't seem almost any of the good outcomes that we could have got for this roster have happened. Like it's been almost all of the worst outcomes everywhere. We're going to have a long time to have these discussions. I don't think this is similar to the Mike McDaniel thing. The Mike in Dallas is over.

Oh, yeah. They're going to move on at the end of this year and they're going to figure out what the next regime looks like. We don't have to spend 15 minutes fixing the Cowboys right now. We're going to have a lot of time between now and New Year's to have that discussion. So we will revisit that at the proper moment. We are going to talk a little bit more about Darno Mooney before we get out of here. It's time for what we learned today. You know, I think I've learned something today.

We'd like to wrap up all these Sunday night shows with just a little lesson. A little lesson you took away from the weekend. I'm going to let you kick this off because it's an extension of the discussion we're just having about the Falcons. Yeah, it is. And I think this is like almost a grander discussion about how well the Falcons are coaching their offense. But to me, Darno Mooney is kind of a reminder of how important the pecking order and like your role within an offense matters specifically for skill players. I remember maybe two, three years ago when Darnal Mooney was in Chicago and he was their best

pass catcher. I was like, man, this is not a way to run an NFL offense. Like he's just too inconsistent with his hands. This is not a guy that you can feed that many targets to. His route running can be a little all over the place. Now you get him into Atlanta where to me he is your fourth most valuable past catcher. You have Drake London who's incredible. Kyle Pitts, I think, is a weapon even though the production can be up and down sometimes. And then Bajon Robinson out of the backfield is like insane whenever they get him out of the ball. So now Muni has jumped from or jumped down from being the most important guy in the offense. Now you're the fourth most important threat. So it's easier to scheme up plays for him that make more sense with other guys taking some of the

bigger roles and like you can kind of limit when his targets are supposed to happen and you can really hone in on the routes he's good at rather than, hey, you're our best player. We need you to run all the important routes. And so I just think all of that has kind of made sense why he's had truly a career year in Atlanta. And he's playing really, really well right now. And I think this is just kind of a testament to all that stuff. I would make it, I'd argue that Darnal Mooney is a more important better pass catcher right now than probably Kyle Pitts is for this offense. He might be, actually. I mean, I, again, the idea of Kyle Pitts is intriguing and you had those moments against Tampa. But watching what Darnal Mooney is doing, I mean, the production is obviously impressive. But

what he's doing on like a down. a down basis. It was early in the game, it was in the first or second drive. And he just cooks on another one of those. I think it was like a post-corner stop. And his ability to really,

really hurt people on those vertical stem outside the numbers routes, whether it's like a blaze out or a comeback, the vertical speed that he has combined with his ability to throttle down, that's a real weapon within that offense. And then you combine that, like you said,

with what Drake wanted it is. I know London got banged up today, but when you know Drake London is, what Bison Robinson is, the entire collection of pass catchers and the complementary skill sets that they have, it's what makes this offense so fun to watch. And I think a staff that has a decent idea of how to deploy all of these guys, that's what you feel when you watch this Falcons team play. And I think the Darno Mooney aspect of it has quietly been one of the reasons that the Falcons have been such a compelling group the entire year. They really have been. I mean, he's their guy who gives them some stretch in the offense, right? like the running back can only give you so much stretch out at the backfield.

But then Kyle Pitts is like, he can run, but like he hasn't been as much of a vertical presence as we thought. And then Drake London is usually, again, working under the 15 yards area. So like Mooney has been their guy that gives them that vertical presence. And he's done it about as well as you could hope. Yeah, I guess Donald Mooney applies to the Terry McLaurin conversation about getting saved from a terrible situation. Maybe. Like a completely different player. They got that hurts my soul.

mine today, the lesson that I learned watching the slate of games it's something that we've touched on a little bit but I think it really was apparent when you watch the Ravens offense and the Lions offense. Continuity is so important when you get to the NFL

when you think about the trajectory of some of these teams. The irony is that I was having this discussion with Kirk Cousins before the season and we're talking about how pocket quarterbacks really develop into the best versions

of themselves a little bit later in their careers, right? Like they age very well. And he was talking me about how he kind of lamented the fact that he was never able to work with the same play caller for a huge chunk of his career. You know, it was a couple years here. It was a couple years there. Somebody gets fired. He leaves Washington. Sean McVeigh gets hired to be the head coach of the Rams. Kevin's DeFansky, it's hired to be the head coach of the Browns. So every

couple years, he's cycling between offensive play callers. And every year he seeks out conversations with like Hall of Fame quarterbacks. And I think that if you look at those guys, it lays bare how different Kirk Cousins' his career is compared to somebody like Tom Brady, who worked with like two offense coordinator's entire career, Sean Peyton, who worked with Sean Peyton, or Drew Brees has worked with Sean Peyton his entire career. And you look at teams like the Ravens and the Lions,

and they don't have 10 years together, but you feel how much the continuity with the quarterback and the play caller matters for these offenses. With the Ravens, it's only year one to year two, but the comfort level with who Lamar is with Todd Muckin heading into his second season. It matters so, so much. You feel just how different his handle of everything is and how much control he has within the system.

And then you go to Detroit, and we've talked about this, how in almost any other scenario, Ben Johnson would be a head coach somewhere. Because he isn't, the Lions are interested in such a different position than so many teams at this point in their timeline. They've been able to build and build and build and build. And I just think that Jared Goff, and again, I talked with him about this during training camp, just the conversation and the dialogue that he's having with Ben Johnson consistently and what that relationship is like, there's just such an understanding all the time of we're doing this because this is what we're trying to accomplish. We're doing this is because this is what we're trying to accomplish. The entire offense understands what the plays are designed to do and what they're trying to get out of them. And you feel that so consistently.

They understand situationally what they want out of everything they're trying to do. And that only happens because you're able to build that over time. So if you can hang on to the right offensive play caller and you can pair that with the right quarterback, you see results down the line. And I think that there are examples on the other side, right? Washington's been really good in year one. Cousins has been good with Zach Robinson. But when you have these pairings and these relationships and these partnerships,

and that's what they are. They're partnerships. when they're really allowed to grow, that's when you see the special stuff start to emerge. And I think that that's what we're seeing in Baltimore, even in year two. And I absolutely think that's what we're seeing in Detroit now that these guys have had a long time to work together. Absolutely. I think you can be a good offense, right? Or when you just like kind of jump into it year one and you're just putting stuff together.

I mean, the Ravens last year, they were, Lamar won the MVP. But they weren't like a great offense overall. It was really only when we jumped into year two like this where it's like, okay, Lamar now can take over. more of the pre-snap stuff. We have more answers for the blitz. Lamar Jackson is more comfortable in a pass-heavy spread-heavy offense where he's throwing the ball more and having to read out the field a little bit more than he ever really did with Greg Roman.

Just getting more comfortable with that stuff goes such a long way where you feel like you know where the answers are. And I think that's really the value that you get out of being able to be in the same system for two, three, four years is that you just know when things break, you know exactly where you got to fix it. And you know how to like pre-fix things before they even be able to be able to be in the same become a problem. That's why, you know, we mentioned earlier, Jared Goff has started four games where he's completed at least 10 passes. It's because they know where all the little tricks and all the answers are

for everything that a defense is going to try to throw at them. And they've perfected their ability to get ahead in games. And you can only really do that when you've played together for for three years now, the way that the Lions have. I mean, you go look at Andy Reed and Patrick Holmes. Obviously, they're a perfect example. They're two of the best to ever do it. And part of the reason is that now it's been, you know, five years or whatever it is, even without not, like, they just don't have very good past catching talent right now. It doesn't matter because Andy Reid is giving him enough answers and Patrick Mahomes is consistently finding him in a way that it's kind of hard to do if you haven't, you know, been in the system and lived and breathe it for five, six years. And so I think we're just

what you're seeing kind of like you've said, at the very tippy, tippy, tip of the sport, you see a lot of teams and a lot of offenses that have been together and worked together for a long time. Even the staffs. I mean, the fact that that staff has mostly been intact, they've been able to work with the same guys. That staff out offensively hasn't been picked over. They have a lot of the same voices and a lot of the same collaboration. The play that I go back to that touched or the, the wheel route to the league play to Tucker Kraft last week, where the Packers are literally drawing that up on the sideline because it wasn't in the game plan because all of these guys have worked together for so long. You know, Jason Vrable and Mike Stennett or Adam Stenevich,

their offensive coordinator, who was their offensive line coach, when you can have that. And it's knowing where the bodies are buried. These guys know where the bodies are buried because they've worked together for so long. And that is such a huge advantage. And I do think, again, we've seen examples on the other side in the regular season so far. I think when you get into the playoffs, that's where this shit really, really matters. Because you know where your weaknesses are. You know where you're going to be vulnerable.

You know where teams are going to try to attack you and how to potentially account for it because you've had the time on task and you had to do it already. So I think that even if this is fun and we're seeing the Ravens offense crush and we're seeing the lion's offense do this, there's a chance we may not have even seen where this is going to end up mattering the most. That's what I'm really ready for. When in the playoffs you've got to catch bags on a bi-week, that's when this all really starts to matter.

All right. That is all we've got for today. Sincerely appreciate you guys listening. we will be back with our midweek show. We're going to be releasing the midweek show just a little bit later this week, just so you guys know. Typically, we do it on Tuesday evenings because we record early on Tuesday afternoon. Tuesday is the trade deadline, which I've been doing this for 10, 12 years, you know, full time.

I forget about the trade deadline every single year. So the fact that Michael Beller exists is a very nice moment for me here is we have to figure out how to program the show around the trade deadline. So we're going to push that show back a little bit. It's going to be coming out overnight into Wednesday so we can react to whatever happens at the trade deadline. God, I hope we see some fun stuff. I really, really hope we see some fun stuff. If not, I'm going to be super bumped.

All right, that is all we got. Sincerely appreciate you guys listening. We'll be back later this week. Talk to you soon.