The Athletic Hockey Show - Barry Trotz recharged and ready for next coaching job, Bo Horvat trade options

Episode Date: January 24, 2023

Stanley Cup champion Barry Trotz joins Craig and Sean to discuss how he has fared during his self imposed year off from hockey, how he reached out to Bruce Boudreau after he was fired from Vancouver, and what fellow Stanley Cup champion head coaches have taught him over the years.Craig and Sean take a look at trade options for the NHL's most sought after rental player, Bo Horvat, plus what do the Carolina Hurricanes have in store now that the team has lost Max Pacioretty after his second right achilles tendon tear in a year and how messed up are the Vancouver Canucks?Subscribe to The Athletic Hockey Show on YouTube: http://youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowGet a 1-year subscription to The Athletic for $2 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshowGo to https://www.chime.com/nhlshow to sign up for a Chime Credit Builder Visa Credit Card today! Thanks to Chime for supporting the show.Sign up today at stitchfix.com/hockey to get $20 off your first purchase! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. Hey, everybody. Welcome to the American edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. And boy, do we have a great show for you today, not just because it's Sean Gentile's birthday. Hey, Sean, happy birthday. What did I tell you about that? Do not talk about my birthday. He said, right before we hit record, he goes, hey, one last request, Craig.

We've known each other a long time. If you could just not bring on my birthday. If I've ever asked you for anything, please shout out my birthday in the first 30 seconds of the episode here, please. I'm sorry. I'm your host, Craig Custin's joined by Sean Gentile. Most importantly today, we are joined in segment two by Barry Trots, Stanley Cup winning coach, coach and waiting of team, I guess, fill in the blank. Not the Vancouver Canucks. team not the Vancouver Canucks.

And he was really, I think, revealing on some of that. He's so good. We're not even going to talk that much. Sean and I are going to try to show some restraint here in segment one so we can get to that because he touches on the Bruce Boudreux situation, the Toronto Maple Leafs, Alex Ovechkin, the moment he knew the capitals were going to win the Stanley Cup, and it was way earlier than I think the rest of us knew. What else, Sean?

There was like, it just, it was amazing. I feel like I know a lot more about, I feel like I'm ready to go coach a hockey team now. Yeah, how to win us, like, the Barry Trots, the Barry Trots coaching clinic. That's right. He also did this,

it's worth saying, or gave most of these answers without any kind of prompting. Like, he just sort of, yeah, yeah, we did nothing. Like, even lazier stuff from us than usual here, honestly.

He just rolled right into, I was, check stuff off my little outline list, like without even having the hazard bringing it up. Yeah, it was almost like he's like, and I'm sure next you'll ask me about Alex. All right. And now you're going to ask me about Alex Hoveatchkin. And you're definitely going to ask me about Bruce. So I'll just bring that up on my own.

He was just trying to spare us the uncomfortable question. So he's like, well, let me just take this on. At four different points, I try to wrap it up because I get, I have, um, he said, no, no, no suit for you, my boy. I was like, hey, one last thing, you know, and then we can let you go. And it was like 40 minutes later. There's 13 more minutes of gold. I'm always just so paranoid about like overstaying my welcome anywhere or extending something beyond somebody's, I have that.

I have some sort of like anxiety. Some people are completely immune to that. They have no problems being the last one at a party. Me, I'm out. Definitely not. Usually because I'm pulling the Irish goodbye at a party. specifically classic um i don't know though i'm not surprised to see that's how that's how it went went with perry he's got he's good for it he's got the rep for it and he just i think kind of seemed

like he wanted to talk honestly like after a certain amount of time you just knew like all right he's he's not he's up for a chat he's got you know it's got time got time and those are the best kind of interviews so definitely listen to that the one thing i want to talk real quick before that sean is Max Petruetti goes down for the Carolina Hurricanes. Like, rough one. Like, you hated to see it. Don Weddell talked to Pierre LeBron and said it was as down as he'd seen his team after a win as he'd ever remembered. It's like every bit surrounding that circumstance was maximized to be as depressing as possible, right?

Like, you have the hurricanes at this guy who seems like he's the one, like, you're he's the dude, right? Like, he's like the piece that they add in a spot that they needed it, which is, you know, clutch goal scoring, proven ability in that area. And then he gets hurt. And then he comes back and he's good. Productive. Right.

For all four or five games that he's in the lineup. Three goals in five games. Right. And then for it to happen that late in a game, which is brutal, 18 seconds left or whatever it is. Are you trying to make Carolina fans? No, I'm just saying Like, I was surprised at how like I felt bad.

I felt worse for Max Patcheretti than I normally do for when you see guys get hurt. I don't care. They're not, they're not, they're not people to me. So more than zero? He, there's something about Achilles injuries, man. There's just something about about watching those on video where they just resonate with people, right?

Because you see, we've seen it in hoops so much over the last couple years, whether it's Kevin Duran or whoever else, where guys just jump up like they got bit. And to see that happen in no patch ready's history and just all these different things that wrapped up to. And yeah, I felt, I felt, I mean, all kidding aside, you always feel bad for guys when they have serious injuries like that. But that one even more so, it's just like, oh, for God's sakes. Right. Yeah. So Carolina, as Don pointed out to Pierre, they generally don't, you know, they like to do some of their moves in the offseason. They're kind of one of those teams that if they're making moves or adding people with term, they're not huge rental team.

I mean, there was some of the stuff like the troche. I remember that Panthers Carolina deal a couple years ago that was interesting. But, you know, here they are sitting in first place. in the division and I don't know, we're waiting for the big postseason breakthrough, not to like put pressure on them, but when you look at the potential offensive players available, you know, the Ryan O'Reilly's, Teresankos, Bo Horvatt, I mean, now you're like, boy, I think that would, maybe this is the time to ramp it up if you're Carolina. Yeah, and I think it's worth saying too that we've seen a deviation from the standard

Hurricanes model over the last six months. Like, do the Carolina Hurricanes of 2019 go out and trade for Max Patcher Ready? Even though it was cost effective and it was a cap dump for Vegas and whatever, like, do they go out and get a guy at that phase of his career, you know, in the last year of his deal? I don't know. Do they go out and get Brent Burns? I don't know. Those guys are, those guys, even though, again, cost effective, you know, T's.

entertainment salary, all that stuff. They don't quite fit the on-ice profile of what Carolina typically goes out and gets. And they were in on other people, too. There were other things percolating around the Carolina hurricanes during the off-season in a way that we typically don't see from them, right? So they start the season as a cap team. Rod Brindamore told me and Haley Salveen, when we talked to him ahead of the season, you know, they were all psyched for Max Patcheretti to be there,

Trade deadline edition because they knew it not just because he's a good player and because he was coming back late, but also because they knew that they didn't have any other space. Like they knew that they, that because of what they'd done in the off season, that, you know, this was going to be their big ticket item,

that there wasn't going to be, you know, just because of cap concerns, there wasn't going to be someone who came in on March 1st or whatever. And that's certainly different now. So they absolutely become one of the leading candidates. Whenever you're talking about, about, you know, win now teams that have available space that need offensive reinforcements.

Absolutely. They are at the top of the list. They need to, every conversation, especially in Eastern Conference, in terms of who is going to go out and get somebody needs to start with a Carolina hurricanes because clearly the desire is there and the space is there. I think the most interesting, and this is maybe not tied to Carolina directly, but the Bohorebat stuff is really interesting to me. You know, Jeff Merrick, I think, mentioned some, I think he was kind of carving out what it's going to take to get him from Vancouver. And it's like, they want players who can play now.

They want fraud. They want it all. And in this case, like, whatever it is, 27-year-old centers like Boorovat, like that, you can have a high price. Maybe because I'm in Detroit, so I always, you know, my ears perk up when I see the Red Wings mentioned in something like this. they came out, you know, that came out this week as a potential destination. And the more I thought about it, I'm like, wow, that really makes a ton of sense for me.

Because now here's, here's where the Red Wings rebuild has, I don't want to say been slow, but it, I mean, it has been. But they, you know, they never got high enough into the, to the draft to get that stud center. It was always like, hey, we really like this defenseman. It was Dylan and then everybody else. It was Dylan Larkin, who you've always been like, he still, you want that other center to go with Dylan. You know, it's not, and they just haven't been able to get that as part of this, but they have gotten so many other pieces, either prospect or players that are already on the roster that you can, you can start to build a trade that doesn't, you know, that you're like, this isn't going to kill them, but it's exactly what Vancouver would want to do. and now all of a sudden you've got two kind of at the same age centers that could win now. It's, and you've got the space.

I don't know, Sean. It seems to make a lot of sense to me. It's one of those things, if you really want to take the dots or the dot connecting, like one step further, I wish I would have thought of this myself, but I didn't because I'm stupid. Oh, okay. In one of Max Boltman's, you know, pre-trade deadline analysis pieces, which are running from everybody on the site, by the way. And if you have any specific interest on a team or a specific player on a team, like those are starting to roll out, roll out.

Max mentioned Philipronic as like, you know, someone to watch, a name to watch on the Red Wings roster. And I saw that and I was like, huh, it's interesting. signed through 24. $4.4 million for the next two years. He's got one more RFA, you know, deal to sign it looks like before he hits UFA, right? Mm-hmm. Is it? That's right.

And I looked at that and I was like, oh, that's interesting. Like, Heronics having an unbelievable year is, you know, seems like he's finally leveled up in a way that people there, I think, were anticipating from him. I was like, huh, I wonder who they trade Philip Aaronic for. It didn't even, didn't even register with me that he is. is the exact kind of player that the Vancouver Canucks are looking for for better or worse, by the way, probably worse, because again, Roanick's good and all that. But adding 25, 26, 27-year-olds just seems like they're kicking the can down the road on a roster that just seems tough to salvage in its current form. But whatever, that's another discussion for another time. Roanick for

Horvatt seems to make a lot of sense. it's just interesting to me the idea of adding because it's like you kind of double up on the issue that they have with Larkin, right? And these are good players, so ultimately that's whatever, who cares? You're better with Bo Horvad playing center than otherwise.

But they're both kind of like one B's. But you put them together. But when you put them together, what does that mean? if you have a 1B playing second line minutes, does that cancel out not having a true 1A? Right? And maybe it does. They got to find these guys somehow because they are.

They're at a funky point in the timeline when you start to think about these guys' age and Larkin's contract status. He's a UFA doesn't have a deal done, all that stuff. So the idea of team lists you guys together is very interesting to me. I don't think this is a reason to do the deal, but let's say you're Steve Eisenman, who, as we know, is going to look for any edge at any point in any, let's say, negotiation he might be getting into.

And you have Dylan Larkin sitting there unsigned. And you make a huge deal. And you're probably only training for Bo Horvat. If you've talked to Pat Morris in Newport and you have a pretty good idea, you can get them done. And boom, you sign Bo Horvat. And then you go to Dylan and say, look, we love you, Dylan. All of a sudden, you got a little more leverage than you did yesterday, don't you, Sean? You also probably set the market for the market.

Yeah. You say, like, we'll give you X, certainly no more than the X millions of dollars it would take to retain Bo Horvatt, I would imagine. Because you create that artificial organizational cap that we've seen from plenty of successful franchises over the last however many years. Yeah, including the Detroit Red Wings. Yeah, exactly. The Nicklitzram cap. Way back yonder when the Red Wings were playing relevant hockey back when, you know, Frankfurter's only cost a nickel.

With a that logo. It was now dozens of years ago. And if you lose, I don't think they're going to lose Dylan Arkin, but I mean, if you do, now you're like, you have a story for the fan base where it's like, hey, our goal was to have them both. We just couldn't get it done. But we still, you know. Dylan wouldn't take $8.5 million here.

Like, or whatever. Right. Yep. We love it. Let's just make this happen. Do we just decide on this? I think we just traded Boer Horvette to the Detroit Red Wings. All right.

Good work. I'm actually on my way down to the rank after this as soon as we wrap here. So I can, I'll, if I see anybody, I'll plant the seat. Push it. Hey, guys, I have an idea. Have you thought of this? Hey, I was just doing a podcast. Eight and a half for Larkin.

I'm sure Dylan would love all of this. All right. Let's get to Barry Trots. So that's, it's interesting. We're, here's real quick. I mean, this trade deadline stuff is always fun. Barry got me pumped for the playoffs in a way that, like, I hadn't even, like, he's just like, they're going to be so good this year. The whole thing's great.

So let's just let Barry do the talking instead of us just recapping things constantly. Good. We'll be right back. We are now thrilled to be joined by Barry Trots from a hotel room in Manitoba. Barry. How are you? Good to see you. I'm good.

I'm good. I'm enjoying the, uh, beautiful. snow that we have going here today. Yeah. Yeah. We got, wait, you're, are you saying that it's, it's snowing, it's snowing in Manitoba in January? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Brings me right back to my, my youth.

So, so, um, we wanted to jump in. There's, I mean, there's so much to kind of go over with you, Barry. But I, I, I'm really interested in, you know, you've kind of said repeatedly, like, this is an important time for you to, to take, to kind of take a step back and pause. and I don't know, I think you've used, you know, assess is the word you've used. And I just wanted to talk through that process. Like, is it just like taking downtime or like, what is it, what does this moment been like for you, this moment in time?

Well, I think, and I've been pretty transparent. I think to most people in terms of, you know, I've had, you know, I'm 60. My parents are not 60. They're a lot older. And, you know, same with my wife's parents. and the kids are growing up and what have you. I've got kids that are 30 years old now. And, you know, when the opportunity was presented for lots of jobs, I guess,

I was interviewed for lots of jobs. I think I could have had a few if I desired, I guess. But at the same time, I really, when you're coaching and I've done it for, you know, I go back to when I first start. it would be almost close to, you know, 40 years, 38 years. And almost 25 in the NHL was really not much of a break. Went from one job to the next pretty, you know, start out the 16, 17 years in Nashville and then, you know, move over to Washington and then over to the island.

And really haven't had a lot of breaks. And then what happens in this business, you tend to put your family, you know, you miss birthdays, you miss a number of things. And I felt really important, especially this summer with our family anyways, on both sides, my family and my wife said I needed to help them out. I couldn't put it on, you know, you need a great hockey wife and I have one. And I just didn't feel that I could put all this on my wife and my family and my sister and whatever. So I just felt that it was time to get back to the family a little bit,

well and and also take some time for myself and I had a really hard summer. I mean, I did not take any time off. Usually you get about a month or five weeks, a place up in British Columbia. I was there for like six days this year. And, you know, so I was, I was working through the whole time pretty well seven days a week. And you need a lot energy if you're going to coach in this game because emotionally, physically with travel, emotionally with expectations, the stress, all the stuff that comes with being a head coach in the national hockey league, you know, people think that you stand behind the bench for three hours a day and that's what you do. It's, that's what you do in minor hockey. It's

something you do professionally and you live it. So, you know, a game day is, you know, you're up at, you know, 6.6.30, you're in the office at 7.30 and you're already at work. And then after the game, you've got two hours of work after the game. So it becomes an 18, 19 hour day. So you end up putting a lot of things on the back burner, things that you say, oh, I'll get to it later, get to it later. This summer, I decided it was time to get to it. So I got to it a little bit. So, but, you know, it's a blessing in disguise sometimes when you, when you are like go from teams that you're able to take that time and use it the way I have. So I've taken that time to, A, get a lot of things that needed to be done family-wise

and be, you know, get yourself mentally refreshed if you want to get back into the business. As you were having those discussions with teams in the summer, was there any moment? when you're like, all right, this is not, this is not, not the route I want to take for next season. Like, what, what tipped you over into deciding that, you know, that it wasn't going to be a year off? Yeah, I had, right of the gates, I had, I had four teams in particular that, you know, basically within 48 hours of the news, I had teams, you know, wanting to meet. And I, what I did is I said, I needed a little bit of time to assess, really. if I could pull this off, all the things I had to get done.

And two, if you have the, you know, if you could get it done, is it the right situation? And the, and will you have the energy to get it done with the new organization? And the one thing that I stayed true to, I said to all four teams that I had talked to, that I was going to talk to all four teams. I just said I needed some time. And a couple of teams came back and he said, you know, hey, we need to know where we're going to move on. And I said, no, move on.

I think so. So that's sort of the process I went. And I, when I got towards the, you know, I talked to all four teams, I had to make a decision and be fair to the teams that I was talking to, that I was not going to start the year coaching anyways. is there a possibility and I've had conversations even just coming out of COVID where people when you're in the grind and you're in the moment you just you do it because it's all you know and then when you stop you're like oh hey this isn't so bad either like I've had people

that are like I've had like you know in our profession writers and stuff and people in hockey that are like boy just getting back at it has been a real challenge is there any scenario where you're like hey that that's really hard coaching I like I kind of like this yeah Well, yeah, I think everybody, no one realized how hard coaching is, professional ranks. I mean, it's easy. You know, I'm sitting back this year and I'm going, this is easy. You know, and I'm saying from my seat, you know, you get a bigger, bigger picture, but you don't feel the, you know, the second by second pressure or the have to read the Twitter and all that.

I just watch, you know, Bruce go through health. And, you know, I reached out to Bruce. I said, I don't have any interest in, you know, your job or anything. This was, you know, probably about six weeks ago. And I said, listen, I watch what's going on. And I said, I just sometimes you need to talk to someone outside the game just to have enough voice to vent on. And I said, you know, here's my number.

And, you know, and he really appreciated it. I just thought it was it was unfair to him. The way he was done, it's unfortunate, and it's, you know, you don't know, I don't know the dynamics in that organization and how it was, came about, but in a ways, it was, it was tough to watch, and I think everybody recognized that. So I just wanted to reach out and, and to them. And it's, you know, when you're sitting on this side of the fence, it's easy to coach. It's easy to criticize.

It's easy to do all that. And, you know, when you're in the, when you know, there's some things that I know in the business. And I'm watching, you know, analysts and people in the, in the media just tearing it to someone. And I'm going, they don't even know. They have no idea. And as coaches, you want to be as transparent as you can. but sometimes you just got to take it and eat it, you know, and protect your players. So it's, that's part of the business.

So it's been, it's sort of refreshing to sit back and watch. I've never been on this side for, and it's been my choice, which has been great. I mean, it wasn't my choice. I might be saying it a little differently, but to this point it has been my choice. So I'm taking the time. And I've been, you know, really I didn't get my, I'll just say my summer started. Most times you get your summer started, you know, you get June, July and, you know, part of August. And then you're about August 10th, you're like, okay, I got to get pulling here and getting things.

And I was, I really wasn't to that point until almost Christmas time this year, just because I had watch on the plate. So I was able to get away at Christmas time. and I've got one more trip next week and going over to Europe and I can go from there. Beautiful. So you mentioned reaching out to Bruce. How much of that was just was you feeling compelled to do it just because of, you know, the connection that people drew with you and the Canucks over the summer? Like, were you, how much of that was, you know, okay, just so you know, like, I'm not.

Over your campaign. I'm not, I'm not involved here because it was. Because that was, even at that point, there were people who were connecting dots that maybe weren't there. Oh, yeah. Every time that there's something in British Columbia, like I have a home there and everybody sort of assumes that. But I just, no, there was nothing to, I just felt as a coach, as an older coach in the league, you see other people in your business. And I know Bruce a little bit. We have the same representative. But I don't know Bruce. as well as, you know, a lot of people. But I do know Bruce through the business a little bit. And I just felt that it was the right thing to reach out because, you know, when you get fired, no one wants to reach out to you a whole lot other than reporters and, you know, what went wrong.

And what do you, you know, do you have any, you know, ill will, if you will? Hey, we're here for you to dump on the team that just fired. Yeah, that's a very valuable role. And so I just felt that, you know, it was the right thing just because you're in this business. And as a, I'll say an older voice, just like, you know, like I'm a good friend with, you know, Ken Hitchcock. And, you know, over the, we always do, he lives out in British Columbia in the summer. And we always meet and do these hockey one-on-one type things, you know, what's the new trends? And he's always a good voice to reach out to and talk to because he's, you know, he doesn't have skin in the game, if you will.

And when Bruce was going through that, I just felt that it was something that Hitch would reach out when I was stressed out over the years and say, hey, you know, you just need someone to talk to them here. They give him a call. And I felt it was something that, you know, I needed to do just as a human. You know, without knowing what's going, what happened there in Vancouver, there was obviously, I don't think, there's a disconnect between, you know, the manager and the coach and whatever that looks like. how did you, that happens, right? Like that happens sometimes where maybe it's not their guy or or things just, there's a different difference in philosophy through the years as a coach. How did you like part of it is managing your manager, right?

Like how did, what was your approach in doing that to make sure the communications, even if you weren't seeing eye to eye was still there? Yeah, well, I think, you know, and everybody can speculate what happened in with, with Bruce and Vancouver, all that. We don't know the dynamics. I'm not going to judge it. It was optically, as everybody has said, so I don't think there's, I'm speaking out of turn. Do you try to manage that?

I think I was very fortunate. I had David Boyle, you know, when it first started in the National Hockey League, and, you know, we started out on an expansion team. So we were, there was a lot of communication. I had a year before we started. But I always felt that having, letting your manager know what you're thinking, any conversations that you had with players to be, to have the communication not only go horizontally to your coaches,

the other coaches, but also to your management. You know, critically, you have to let your manager know, you had a conversation with a player. Maybe he's not playing well and you talk to him and you're trying to push him to the level that you feel he can get to. and you better communicate that to your, to your manager because the last thing you want your manager to get a call from the agent and say, hey, you're a coach and my player and not seeing eye to eye and, you know, we want out.

You don't want that. I think it's communication is the key to anything. And it's as simple as reaching out every day, you know, even at the start of the day or at the end of the day and having a coffee or at least a phone call. with your manager just so just so he knows how you're a how your day went what you're thinking and be if there was anything that popped up and then at same time you know it is the you know a lot of times you say you know you give the the coach the team but it really is the manager's team you're you know you can put your stamp on in terms of style but management puts the players

in place and you want to have the same vision. You know, if the manager is trying to create an offensive juggernaut, if you well, or a wide open style of a type of a team and he's drafting and they're filling a roster with that. And then you put in a, you know, a real strong defensive coach who, you know, doesn't want any, you know, put it in deep every time. I mean, you need to balance, you know. There's teams out there that are really good strong offensively,

but you just need a balance. So you try to find that balance. And as a coach, I've always tried to coach the roster rather than, you know, I'm probably known as a defensive coach because I've fixed a lot of those problems. Yeah. My last couple of teams that I've had.

But I've coached, you know, you know, pretty offensive teams and in, in Nashville and in Washington, In Nashville, when we, you know, we had guys like Korea and, you know, Arnaut and Sullivan, and, you know, if you think about Nashville, I was there a long time. The one thing that's very, very common in Nashville is active defense. You know, I always felt, you know, I tried to do with the roster.

We did the same thing in Washington. I had a total different problem in the island. They were bad defensively, so we had to reel it in quite a bit. and that we knocked off 100 goals the first year, which they weren't, they weren't bad defensively for all that long when she got there for the end. Yeah, you know, it seemed good pretty quick. Yeah, you, you've tried to coach the roster.

And also, you know, people tend to say, well, you know, as coaches, the bottom line is the NHL is in a winning business, you know, you're judged on wins and losses. You can talk about development all you want, but, you know, there's certain players maybe on your team that are younger players, high drop choices that you want to develop, but you're judged on wins and losses, and that's pretty well it. Yeah. No matter what organizations say, hey, we're not developing or whatever, development's really in the minor leagues and winnings in the National League.

And it's hard to make the playoffs. I will say this. It is hard. People don't realize that how hard it is, just to get in. And once you get in, you know, how hard it is to win the whole thing. I was very fortunate to win it and have been there. But, you know, it takes a lot out of you. I'd say the, I know you had mentioned the bubble. It was, it was interesting because I, when I went to the island, we had, we went to the conference finals twice and both in the

restrictive, you know, number one in the bubble and the second year was when we had the new division alignment. We just played the, you know, basically the eight teams that you bring in the conference. So it, it,

it mentally, I know the bubble year and the next year, that was hard. That was hard mentally because you were restricted in so many, so many levels. but that it, you know, when you did get some freedom, you're like, I remember coming out the bubble, true story. We lost out in Edmonton and my family was in British Columbia.

And it was really strange. You know, we lost out and they got you out of the hotel within 24 hours. They were risking people out of there, yeah. Yeah, they're taking you out. Helicopter lives outside. Oh, yeah, guys are like, okay, and we lost. And then the guys are like, we got to leave. leave at seven in the morning now, you know, they're kicking us out. And I know why they were talking

to me about a flight and I felt sort of squirmish about a flight going into, I really did. So I said, just rent me a car. I'll drive to British Columbia. So it was actually, it was actually a great drive. Beautiful, I bet. I was going through, you know. In the spring, like you're, you're fine. Yeah. Yeah. And so anyways. It was refreshing because I got to see that the world was a little bigger than just a hotel. And it was, that part was refreshing. And it allowed me slowly to get into regular society, if you will. It's funny, Barry, you talk about how hard it is to, A, make the playoffs, B, win.

And the example I always use is that Capitals team. Like, I was in Columbus when it went into overtime. I'm somebody hit a post. I think Panarin or somebody hit a post. We're talking an inch and it's a completely different story. And it's like then from there it's history. That all we remember is, you know, the Capitals won and Ovi got his and whatever. We're drinking out of T-shirts.

But like one inch we're talking. It's crazy. It is. I got a great story for you. When we lost twice and overtime to Columbus and we went to game three and we won, I think in double over time. Double overtime. And we won that game.

I walked into our coaches room and I said, you know what, guys, we're going to win Stanley Cup. Get out of here. Is that true? And it is a true story. And I can tell you, like coaches looked at me like I was an alien. And I said, settled down, settle down before, you know, we won one game. I go back to, you know, a couple of years previous. So during the All-Star break, I ended up to take my family out to,

the Bahamas and I think it was Atlantis and I right by the way great place yeah and uh I ran into Jacques Lamar so I had won we had with Washington they had a good team and we were trying to get through that the mental um if you will to to you know we had lost to um Pittsburgh two years in a row us and Pittsburgh were sort of you know vying for the president's trophy and then vying for the you know, they go on and they beat us twice and went on to win two cups. And that was hard. It was hard mentally because you felt you're right there and we just couldn't get by.

I'm looking for the key. And so I'm talking to, during the World Cup, on the staff, you know, I was asking, ask Mike Babcock and, you know,

Claude Julian and Joel Quinville was on staff. You know, we'd sit there after, having a glass of wine and and, you know, talking after between games. And I said, you know, what was how did you guys, what was the key to, you know, winning a cup? Because, you know, and it was story after story of, you know, what, we should have lost in the first round. We hit the post and, you know, we came back, we won the game and then we rolled from there. You know, you think about, I think L.A. had.

Chicago on the ropes of one year. It was story after story about, you know, you should have lost. I talked to Terry Crispus with the, he's become a good friend, obviously, with the predators over years. And he says, we should have lost to Vancouver in the first round the year they won the cup. You know, I think he says, Rick Lance hit the post, I think it was, and they would have lost. And we'd never have that story. So I get to the Bahamas, and I run into Jacques Lamar of all places.

And I said, Jacques, you know, if you're here, I wouldn't mind sit down with you for our coffee. So, you know, we arranged to have coffee. We sit down and talking to Jacques. He said, you know, I've got a good team. I think we can win the cup. But it just is there, you know, I'm looking for that edge, you know. And I said, you want some cups. You know, what was the one thing that, that, you know, if you could think about all the cups you want,

and, you know, as a coach, do you, is there something that, you know, really allowed you to win? And he looked at me and he thought for a second, and he says, we didn't have to play the Islanders. We could never beat the Islanders. And I was like, I was waiting for this nugget, you know. And, but what he was telling me when you,

once you win it, is that you need a little bit of Lotton. And, you know, every story was, we were this close to being out and we were able to turn that that into something positive and then we just build off of it. He said, you know, we didn't, we had the route where the islanders were in their head. They didn't have to play the islanders. So they always felt like they could always win. And he was saying, you've got it. There's going to be, you know, adversity and things. It's how you respond and you've got to stay in the moment. And that was the one thing everybody says, you have to stay on the moment. No matter what happens.

happens, you just got to get up. And one of the things I talked about the year we won the cup is, you know, I had a friend who climbed Everest. He had two attempts at climbing Everest. And the thing that he said to, I brought him in and he said it to our group and we used it as a little bit of theme. He was asked by reporters, do you have what it takes to climb Everest? and says that's why I'm going back. And we use that, that theme that year is that's why we were going to find out if we had it. Yeah. And we did.

And when we hit the post and we wanted, they hit the post and we won in double overtime, I knew. That was it. I absolutely knew we were going to win the cup because it was, it was one of those things that, that you just know, you know, inside and I felt it. And there was a real calm end to the rest of the playoffs were, I mean, it really was. I knew it were going to win the whole time. Even in the Tampa series, you know, we knocked off almost every block that was the Washington ever, you know, you lose two games at home. You never win a series.

You know, it was one thing. Another, we go into Tampa and we win both game one and game two. they would come back and win three straight. Then we have to win game six and seven. And I was calm through the whole thing. It was, I just knew. I knew. And we had a great group.

Oh, yeah. How do you frame that concept for the players? The idea of luck playing such a, such a role. You're like, all right, boys, like, this is, like, we got our, we got our break. Everything's gravy from here and out. How do you communicate that with them? I think when you believe in something so strongly, people can see it. Yeah, I bet you they felt it.

I think people, people can feel it. I mean, it's, it's, you know, we've all been there, you know, in sport or in life that you know when someone's saying something. They're in. Yeah. And they believe it. They know it. And it's a lot easier. when there's that conviction

conviction there and then our players bought in we had fun with it I told them you know there was a lot of things you know guy like OV you know and Backstrom who have had they had a lot of

disappointment great players and I think when I came to the realization and was able to convey to them the realization that no one's going to be defined or you shouldn't be defined by, especially great players like Ovi and Backey,

by a piece of steel. It's silver. You shouldn't. Because life is, you know, I said, you know, everybody wants to be Alex Ovechkin. You grow up, how many kids, you know, tie their, you've got the yellow lace around, you know, and they tuck their jersey in and they, you know,

they use them his stick and his mannerisms. And I says the impact you've had, you're not going to be defined in your career. You're going to be defined as a Hall of Fame player, one of the greatest goalsquers of all time. And someone who saved hockey, him and Sid saved hockey. So conveying to them that it was about the journey, not necessarily the medal. It was the journey in getting them to understand that the journey is going to be really hard, but also when it's all set and done, yeah, you have a ring and you've got, you know, pictures and all that. But I can guarantee you everybody who can tell you about all the funny things and all the hard things on that journey.

And the end is the prize. You've got to say that to the world that, hey, we've done it. But inside anybody who's ever won, it's the journey. and the tight-knit group that you had. And that is what's, that's what upsets you. You know, you uplifts your spirit a little bit. You know, like I have a Stanley Cup ring.

It's been on my finger once, no twice. Twice once when the, the caps gave it to me. And twice when I showed it to my family. And that's, you know, That's that's it. And I would say a lot of players, you know, same thing. They have it on for, uh, I always, I always, uh, I always laugh. The people who have really wanted, been in the fight, you know, day in and day, day out,

the 20 players and trainers, coaches, all that. You never see them wearing a ring. But you see all the, all the other people on the outside. Yeah, you see the guy that barely got one's got it. I would, I'll be honest. If I ever got one, it wouldn't leave my hand. Yeah. And that's how that's, I always, I always,

I always talk about that. It's the people that have really earned it and have done all the heavy lifting. They never wear the ring because the ring is really the journey. It's that, you know, it's here. And the other people who are a little more on the outside, but we're a part of it, they always wear. That's great. And they're proud. Yeah, yeah.

But it's, you know, that's what you see. a lot of times great. That's awesome. Well, last thing from me, Barry, I just, you mentioned Ovi. How different is it watching him now maybe as a fan or as an observer versus being in the battle with them, right? Where you're trying to get him to do things or whatever it is. Do you, is it, do you have a different appreciation when you're just like, hey, I'm just going to watch him fire up goals or what is it like watching him now from your perspective? I just think, I just think I'm very fortunate to have been a part of greatness. Yeah. I took a lot of flack when I said he was the, you know, greatest goal score of all the time when I first said that when I got there.

I think you've been proven. Yeah, yeah. And I took a lot of flack from, you know, north of the border. I also said, I think he's been the, he's probably the most physical superstar that I've seen in a long time, you know, since, you know, even more physical than I think I said like Mark Messier and, and took a lot of flack for that, you know. But he is, he's exceptional. I don't know if you'll see a guy like him again because of the durability factor. You know, he's, you know, he's been someone who's had impact on the game. I mean, the game threw the lockout him and Sid really carried the game for a long time.

It was, you know, he was always the evil empire, if you will. He was the bad guy and Sid was a good guy. Now there, I think when you look at it, it's come full circle. and OVie is, you know, it's like, you know, Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. I mean, they're both, you know, they're there and they've been. Jump off the cliff together. Yeah. And I think you see that he's really, he's a special player that we're getting to see now,

both of him and said. I mean, you called him one of the great goals scores of all time when you coach him, but like there's a difference between that. And now we're seeing him, you know, he's at the top of a lot. He's moving towards the top of a lot of lists, as we all know, right? He's hitting big round numbers. Like, what was your thought? And you're like, when you were coaching him, were you ever like, I think there's a chance

that this guy could finish first or second all time in goals, aside from just being like, you know, as skilled as he was and as productive as he was, to be at the top of the list. Yeah, you know, when I was there and this is, you know, we're talking, you know, five, six years ago now. And that seemed like it was a long way away, but it wasn't impossible because it was vulnerability. He would be knocking on the door right now if it wasn't for lockouts. Knockouts.

No, I don't think Gretz ever had a lockout season when he played. You'd have to look. I don't know if the one in 95, but that was only those 30 games. It wasn't. Yeah, it wasn't a real long one. You know, always missed two sort of full seasons. And then he got shortened by, you know, the 58. game schedule or whatever in the 48 one year.

So, you know, he'd be knocking on the door right now, you know. But he'll play durability-wise, the release is there. And one thing I know about Ovi, when he gets focused on something, he's pretty hard to stop. You know, he really is. And that's what the great ones are. When they get something in their mind that they're going to get accomplished, they usually do. So I'm betting on Ovi. Yeah. Yeah. Not a bad bet. Yeah, not a bad bad. Yeah, real dangerous. I mean, smart, smart money is still money. I guess it's fine. That's true. O'Berry.

Yeah. Go ahead, Sean. Wait, hold on. I'm trying to ramp it up. We got out. We got out. No, we got, we got, we got, we got to one more. Are you, are you feeling, are you feeling charged up? Do you feel like you're, where you need to be after the break to maybe get back at it next year if the situation's right? Yeah, absolutely. I've talked to a few teams, a couple teams even, you know, during the winter year, have reached out to me and sure. And I said, no, I'm not going back. You know, so I'm going to go back.

You know, I'm refreshed. And I got, as I said, I'm going over to Europe with my wife and some friends. And when I get back, you know, I'll be charged up. I just felt like a middle of the middle of December. and we're almost looking at the, you know, getting close to February here. So I feel like I've got accomplished what I needed to accomplish. And I've been staying on top of the league and staying refreshed. So either at the, you know, in the spring or next year, we'll get back at it.

Hopefully, if they still want me. I think they can be right there. You don't have to worry about that. Well, Barry, thanks for doing this. Good to see you. Enjoy Europe. Where are you going? Any, any, uh, Israel.

Oh, wow. Wow. Well, enjoy that. That's an incredible trip. And I'm sure we'll see you back at the rink before too long. Yeah, hopefully, hopefully, guys. Never know. They never know in this business.

You kind of know. It's a great man. I watch Bruce, and I can say this with all due respect to everybody, what Bruce was going through, it's such a great game. The people in the game are great. They really are. And the fans are. You saw how the fans

You saw how the fans You sent them off, I guess. You know, he's right. It's the, this game is the best game and the worst game in the world. Yeah. At times, you know, it's business. And it's, the season has been fantastic. There's some great teams.

And it's been enjoyable to watch. And I think the playoffs are going to be spectacular this year. I really do. Because, I mean, people, don't realize the best team and the worst team in a national hockey league, no matter who that is, it's going to win one out of three games. And they usually beat a good team, which every guy's fan base is crazy, but you have to be on because there's, you know, winning a president's trophy and finishing eighth in the conference is winning one more game a month. That's about it. Is that it?

I've never thought of it in those terms. Jeez. I've never done that math. I think it checks out. But the trophy is usually, you know, 112, 116. This Boston may blow that out of the water. You know, and the team making the playoffs is usually 95. So it's about one game a month. That's about it. You know, and it's crazy because you get off to a great start. You know, you could have the president's trophy,

but you could have a team that's finishing eighth who's got off to a slow start. They're not, they're coming. So there's not much difference between that. And think about Colorado if they finish eighth. Yeah, you want that team in the first round? Thanks. I just watched the other day. They're going to be just fine.

I don't think they're going to finish eighth. But could you imagine that? There's your prize for finishing. It feels like they're coming for sure. Yeah, I watched them the other day. They're just starting to pick their feet up now. They're going. They're gonna, is there any team other than the Bruins that you've watched this year and just been like, yeah, I would be curious. Like who's been most impressive from you?

Who's, who's been really impressive to me? And I, uh, I like, I like the crack and, you know, you think about the crack. And, uh, they, they drafted a lot of people with, uh, good character. They could skate. Their defense was really strong. I know if Philip Brubauer had an off year, there's a different pressure when you, you sign that big contract and, you know, all that. Um, and they just didn't have enough offense. So, you know, you know, But all of a sudden you get veneers and you add Berkoski and Bergstrom and missing some guys. And they've added those guys. You've added like five. Oh, they didn't have TAN of last year. They've added basically two lines to their team, you know, offensive guys. And their, you know, hack has got them playing, you know, solid on both sides of the puck and they can hurt you. There's not one guy that hurts you.

They all hurt you, you know. they started chip away at you. So they've been very impressive. You know, I think Toronto's, no one gives Toronto any credit for how good defensively they've been. You know, I think we're starting to recognize it, but I saw it last year. They were really pretty good defensively. You know, in the playoffs, what you see is teams that are going to get in that have to go on, you know, they're playing at that, that 100% level, if you will, or close to it all year to get in.

When playoffs come, they don't have that extra level. You know, and then there's teams that, you know, they'll have that extra level that that's sort of been really quiet about their year and they're going to have a good playoffs. You know what they feel like to me, Barry, like exactly what you were talking about with your washing. I feel like they need that first round. The puck goes in off someone's like leg and they get a lucky win or whatever.

takes, right? And then something snaps and then the leaves just go on this huge run. Like I feel like that's, we're in that moment of time with Toronto. Yeah. I think with Toronto, what the thing what I saw with them last year, that I know that they're, they're trending to having success and getting through the, the first round is you saw the commitment level in the playoffs. And there was, their stars were blocking shots. They're, you know, they, they had to, they, you know, they got their noses dirty a little more often. They made the simple play when they had to.

They didn't try to force things. And, you know, if you look back to the year, we're in the bubble. And if you remember, I think Tampa Bay lost out the year before in an early round. Yep. And you can see when players make the adjustments. I think Pucheroff had the, and this is how a player grows. and that's where I'm trying to go with this, is Cooch wouldn't dump the puck in ever.

I mean, he would try to make that play. The next year, when we played them in the bubble, when they won the cup, a guy like Cooch led the whole sort of the playoffs in getting puck's teeth, if you will, either through entry with possession or by putting it in, which is the adjustment in his game.

And that tells you. tells me when teams are learning to win is they are learning to adjust. They're learning what's valuable. They're not just going, oh, I've done this all my life. I'm going to continue to do it. They go, you know, this is a different animal, so I've got to treat it differently. And the good players do that. And they seem to, we're winning Trump's stats, if you will, or their game.

They put the team first. and a guy like Kuch, I saw that, and I was like, when we were playing them, I'm like, oh, this is going to be a tough out. They were a tough out anyways. They were a tough out anyway. I was like, he's getting it. There's a difference.

There's a difference in his game. And you see that. I thought I saw that last year with some of the beliefs. I mean, you see, I like Marner's game. And Marner's playing the 200-foot game. I mean, he's first on the forecheck, first on the back, I mean, your stars are doing it. You're going to have a chance to have success.

Yeah. That's great. There's a lot of good players in this league right now. The skill is stupid. The Leafs fan base is going to be thrilled to see this. Barry Trots is signing off on Toronto's defensive forward work. Let's go. Well, you know, I'm signing off is that they're learning to win.

They're not signing off on the Leafs because there's a team lost in there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's pretty good. So still. But I'm saying. great competition, great teams like Tampa who have learned to win.

And Boston, who's had the winning tradition, Toronto's learning from that. I know if you're a Toronto fan, it's deaf by a thousand cuts sometimes over the years. But you'll break through. It'll break through. It'll happen. I don't know what will happen this year, but it'll happen. You know, it as well because players are proud and they learn to adjust good players. The great players do.

And I know they have some really good players and you got good leadership. And, you know, that's why I say the playoffs will be fantastic this year. It's going to be fun. Yeah. Yep, they will. All right, Barry. Well, thanks for doing this again. Good to see you.

All right. And we'll catch up later when you get back, hopefully. Hopefully. Like I said, I think we're, I think, I think, like you can't say it for we can. You'll be, you'll be back. All right. You guys. Thanks.

Thanks for the time. Yeah. Anytime. All right. Thanks, Rats. Thanks a lot. All right. All right.

All right. All right. Very good. Perry Trots always and forever a great conversation. Do you think he's being humble when he says, maybe I won't be, you know, maybe people won't be interested. Or is there any like part of him that's like, if you're out of the game for a year, maybe it's not going to look the same this

summer as it did last summer. I wonder, like, I always wonder that. I realize that after the fact when he was like, yeah, maybe, maybe I'll talk to you guys like, whatever. and we both immediately were like, well, yeah, of course somebody's going to hire you. He's like, I don't know. Maybe. I don't know.

He sounded pretty, he sounded pretty satisfied with his year off. Maybe May rolls around and he was like, I think I kind of want to do it. I changed my mind. I kind of want to do this again. I kind of want to hang out for another season. That was my, he never really answered it, but that was my question. Like, is there a scenario here where you're like, hey, this is pretty great? I mean, he's, I don't know when he gets paid through, but like, it's.

I mean, in all serious. Coaching's hard. Why I tacked on that one at the end like a jerk, but I wanted him to say like, oh yeah, I want to come back next season. Yeah, I thought that was good. He came as, that's as close. That's as close as we were going to get as in the saying, I'll be back for sure because he's a smart man.

And he's been doing this for, like he said, he's been a coach for 40 years. And in the NHL for almost two and a half decades. So he's not going to get hemmed in anywhere. He's been around the block of time or two. All right. Coming up next, the best segment in sports media. That's what it is.

We'll be right back. This is the only good segment on the show. Dive into the comments. Address your concerns. Share your abuse? Online bullying of Greg and I? A little bit. The height stuff.

Come on. people. This is your fault. This is your fault. You got people thinking both of us are little boys. Not really true. We'll get to that. Jimmy L. asks, and here's the level of research and focus that goes into the segment.

Jimmy L.'s question, if the Blackhawks get the first overall pick, would it be the first time one city has multiple first overall picks in the same? like in the same draft year because it's going to happen for the bears and it's possibly going to happen for the Blackhawks. He says, I know this is a hockey pod, but I feel like it's a first in American sports. I did a scan, just a quick scan and it definitely hasn't happened in a long time. That's for sure. The other issue at the moment is that the Chicago Blackhawks no longer have the best odds. I don't know if people are paying attention to this, but they're no longer the leader in the Bedard Tank Fest. They're in fact, third. They're behind Anaheim and Columbus,

who both have 31 points in a 660 points percentage. Chicago is a whole point ahead of them, but also has a couple games in hand. They're 6-4-0 in their last 10, which, boy, It's worth remembering, I think, just how drastically enormous the odds are for the number one pick to, or for the worst regular season team to get the number one pick. Yeah, it's gotten really, people forget. It's wild. It's wild to look at this. And 25.5% chances for the Anaheim to win the lottery and end up draft in what's face. which is crazy. 13 and a half for Columbus at the moment,

11.5 for Chicago. That's crazy. So we need to like, this is, and it's fun trivia and it would be fun to see the bears and the, the bears and the Blackhawks maybe both take swings

around the same time. But gosh almighty. 25.5%. Aren't the bears straightened down anyways if they get the, they're going to They already have a quarterback.

They have Justin Fields. It's a matter of whether, of how much people like, you know, Bryce Young or C.J. Stroud, I would imagine they could trade that to some other, or anybody, really. But you would think, like, some quarterback desperate team, Carolina Panthers or somebody gives them the godfather offer, like we've seen it in the past. Who do you think goes second in the NFL draft, Sean? Probably a, probably that defensive.

You want to run through the first round real quick here? Yeah, there's a, there's that defensive linemen from, from Georgia, because they're always, There always is one. They've always got one. I'm trying to remember. Probably a wide receiver from Alabama. I know Dane had Dane Bruegler, our NFL draft expert. I know he had Bryce Young as a number one pick before.

And the other QB that I know people like is a kid from Kentucky, which is just wild to me. And then there is an edge rusher from Alabama. I am now looking at, I'm now looking at the list. Jalen Carter is a different. Jalen Carter. Jalen Carter. Jalen, I was trying to, I was only trying to find the Georgia defense. wine and then I brought up.

It's Jalen Carter. Jalen Carter. For whatever it's worth, I tank athons just one time to see what happened in the Black Hawks one with their 11.5%. It's really funny. After me sitting there and droning on for 45 seconds about how bad this is for Chicago to finish third instead of first. Ooh, San Jose, who I'm about to go see.

I just hit with them. It'd be fun. Can you see Corey? I'm going to go see Corey. go of a chat William S it's a longer message It's the first comment

So you all can go read it But he has an issue With the Mount Rushmore of hockey I don't know Did we reference this or is just in general I think it's come up a lot Where everyone says you got We're guilty of that

And then You know what's funny is we complain about the We complain about the Rushmore thing And then fall back on it Way too often We haven't done We joke about it with the Apple Pod but I don't think we've ever,

I can't remember the last time we did a Mount Rush more of anything. It's pretty American though, I guess. But William S has a proposal that, I mean, at least we give us some more flexibility. He proposes the last supper of hockey. Three times as many spots we can fill. I don't know how many people are in the last supper painting.

Why are they all facing the camera? That's what I'd like to know about the last supper. They didn't sit around the table. Was it a photo? It's like in that 70s show whenever they're eating in their kitchen and there's always a spot. Like nobody sits on one side of the round kitchen table. Nobody wanted to be across from Jesus directly? Judas probably did.

You know what would be funny about the... A Judas joke. I didn't see that covered. Take them out. Take them out. Funny thing is if, I will say, if we do shift to the last supper of Hawkins, I look forward to all of us just assuming that Wayne Graskey takes over the Jesus role and not having to vote on who actually on on who else may be a candidate.

Isn't there somebody whose nickname is McJesus that's in the conversation? I hate that by the way. I hate that. I hate that nickname. Is it your Catholic upbringing? It's my 12 years of Catholic schooling. Bleeding out. Yeah, it's sacrilege.

Do you think Connor likes it? I just don't get it. Who knows? Have we asked him that? Does he like or dislike anything? I'm sure he has certain things. Yeah, he does. He likes and dislikes certain things.

Yeah, we do know that. Bruce G. points out the cigarette capital of North Carolina is in Salem. That was from our, I think, Kingston talk. We were talking about the cigarette capitals. Wow, shit. Did I say Raleigh Durham or something? I think I used the wrong. Yeah.

Come on, Sean. Know your tobacco. God knows I do There was a I really should have known that Because there was like all sorts of Winston-Salem stuff Or all sorts of cigarette-related stuff in Winston-Salem Like there was definitely Roadside attractions

And I feel like maybe In Virginia and in North Carolina There's for sure like The world's largest pack of cigarettes or something on the side of the road That's a big part of the culture down there I do regret making the mistake. Not about, Kingston, though, who gives a shit about them.

I don't agree with that. Christopher B. Oh, go ahead. Oh, sorry. No, go ahead. You just took too long, so I was going to jump in. Yeah, I know. It's from Marvolo.

Sean used the word slagging three times in the first five minutes of the pod. What? This word needs to be added to the band words list. Oh, the band words list is back. We need to, we need to refresh that one. Michael K says just ban on Western PA words, which the implication is that slagging is western Pennsylvania slang.

I don't believe that is true, but it certainly is a word that I use too much. Slagging. You did use it. I don't even know. I heard that. It goes in one, I don't really listen to me. Do you just have those days like where you can, like, I can feel it happening when I'm just using the same word like over and over and over again where, and it's happening more and more to me now that I'm doing more podcast, but I'm like, wow. I said, I said slagging too much this week in my six hours of podcast content that I've,

that I've produced. And the commentsers will call you out on it. 100%. It's like they slam me for the, for the pronunciation of during a couple, a couple weeks ago. Doring. Doring. Former Pittsburgh Steelers, wide receiver, Chris Doring. Doring.

There's an E and an H in there as well. If you'd like to leave a comment, this is just a reminder as Sean picks out. the next one. Go to the athletic app. Click on the listen tab. Find the athletic hockey show. Figure out which was our last episode. In this case, it will be the Barry Trots episode. Click on details. Then go into the comment section and leave a comment. And we may or may not read it. Super easy. Always remember, you can use emojis in your comments. So if there's you know, send the middle finger, go for it. Don't do that. Hoop emoji. No. No. Sure.

We've got enough emojis elsewhere. black. Mac Z says, are you telling me Craig isn't six foot two? He's got the voice of a tall king. We all know Sean's deal. This is what my deal is that I, that I am in fact taller than Velvet Pipes Custin's over there. Don't let the, don't let the voice fool you. Yeah, I do get a lot of, hey, you're shorter. You're shorter than I would have thought. And I'm like, these people don't have experience. That's what's the first thing you're going to say to me. I said, hey, Max, it's Mac. It's Mac. Macsie. Sorry, Macsie. Maxy.

Is it like Cormick? Because we call Cormick Max sometimes. Yeah, that's cool. Maybe it's Cormick. Maybe he's weighing in. Cool than you. Cormick Zebediah Custins. That's where the Z-E comes from.

People clearly haven't seen, they have minimal time with play-by-play guys who I feel like are so often tiny. Right? There's a lot of short play-by-play guys out there that still have the classic broadcaster voice. Or like actors, I think they're all like super tiny. Like Tom Cruise, you can put in your pocket. Actors are all short with gigantic heads. Yeah.

Tom Cruise has a head like a Rottweiler, but he's five foot three, so whatever. I'm 5'8, Michael Kay, just to be clear. I'm 5.9. I'm 5.5. He is taller than me, I'll admit. Measured by a medical professional at one point in my life to be 5.10, I'm holding on to it until I die. Was that the same person that does like the prospects

before the draft, before the NFL Combine. It was the equivalent of Johnny Goodrell tape and Pucks to his waist so he can tack on if a couple extra LBs during the, during the, during the, during the combine. No, I just, I think I shifted organs and broke bones in my back to stand on that straight. So I'm, I'm holding on to it. Honestly, didn't even realize you could see friends on Goodreads until last week, says Thomas. I have a much more modest goal, but I'm already, I'm already falling behind. See, Thomas, you're being honest about your good.

Read School. You're not just pretending that you're going to read 75 books this year or whatever. Listen, A, the reason we're talking about it is I want you all to hold me accountable. If I don't get to 75, fine, call me out on it. Don't call me out in January, Sean. I'm three in. I just haven't updated. Also, hey, this podcast has been an absolute boon for my, for my good reads friends. Is that true? Oh, my gosh. I'd like to welcome Brea and Simon and Jeff and Brett and Tom. and Kendall and Jen. We already welcome Jen. All right, all right.

These are all new Goodread's friends. If anybody wants to follow me on letterboxed, go for it. I'm going to start, I'm going to start logging movies again, I swear. Of all like the social media things to focus on increasing or whatever Goodreads is. Letterbox is the only good social networking site. The only good social networking sites are Letterboxed in Venmo. Venmo is funny because you can just see what funny jokes people make about about payments they're sending.

Isn't the letterbox where you get like movie rentals at like CVS? No. Letterbox is just a site where people log movies that they watch and review them and create lists and all sorts of stuff. Okay. We're going to finish with your Denna, official copy editor of the comment section. She's back. She's saying she's back.

Sorry for my prolonged absence. I was out doing things. Oh. Good. Good for you. It's one of us is. Can't remember what things, but I had no energy left to battle the troll. The troll can be intimidating.

Craig, don't feel bad about the artichoke mishap. The first time someone put a whole artichoke in front of me, I was like, WTF. Am I supposed to do with this? Next meetup at tipsy mixed agger should feature an artichoke appetizer, which I like artichoke dip. Oh, okay. Just cheese and stuff, basically. Yeah, that's just a cup of cheese. I would, listen, I don't want to guess anything on tipsy McStaggers menu,

but I don't believe they're going to have the italy artichoke option that we're referencing here. I still, yeah, I'm still chewing on some of that. Thank you for understanding here, Denna, who also says, if there's karaoke involved, she would, she would fly up for the tipsy McStaggers meet up that we're going to do someday. Karaokey, that would be unreal. I can't say tipsy mixed aggers today. I keep saying Tixie. Hmm.

I love karaoke. You do? Like legitimately? We've talked about this. Yeah. I don't love it. I'll do it. I'm not like a,

I'm not a Joe Smith level. I was just going to say, you know who loves karaoke? fucking freakazoid, but I, I'll do it. I'll do it when the mood strikes. There's a group of people who are doing it at the draft in Montreal that I,

like a situational independent. Didn't do it. You didn't do it? It was because it was colleagues and you were embarrassed? No, I was just otherwise occupied. It was busy getting COVID from Drance. You and everybody else. Oh, my gosh.

Make sure you listen this week to the roundtable because Pizzo, Rousseau, and Granger have Mike Murphy in the NHL. Also, you said Rousseau is going to talk about the Bruce Buzrobe. If you didn't see it, Mike Russo got Bruce Boudreau on the phone, short, that was probably 10 seconds after Vancouver finally, finally moved on. It's crazy. You know what's crazy that Rousseau just seemed like he knew that he knew that Boudreau was going to get fired by the Canucks. How could that have happened?

He's so prescient. You know what I liked about that was Bruce, there was something along the lines of, he was flying home to see his wife and he had bought the plane tickets last week. the tickets that he used to fly so he had already booked the flight it was him and crystal his wife flying back from Vancouver to the house in Hershey and they were using tickets that had been allotted to him in his contract so that was part of his deal that they got like 10 sets of round trip tickets out of Vancouver so he used one of those to leave Vancouver for good unreal bizarre here's normal here's one organization look I have a

like there was so many things went wrong and I don't we don't want to belabor this we didn't even barely talked about it I didn't like that they came up and and said something along the lines of at the introduction the Rick Tocket press conference this was something we decided this morning it just lies they're liars that's like now like if you do a bunch of stuff behind the scenes and you plant stories in the media or whatever you want to do that like that's I'm not saying it's good or it's not great but it's at least part of how the game is played occasionally don't don't then get up on stage and say, this just all came down this morning or whatever the thing was. Well, then Rick Tocott says something like, yeah, I talked to the Cedines on Saturday.

Like, you got to fill in everybody. Talk, it's not going to lie. Why is Tuckett's not part of his. Like, whatever's going on with you. Whatever you guys want to. Like, then I never, like. They're dishonest people. They're dishonest people and it's a dishonest organization.

Anything else? Yeah. I just, that, that really bothered me. Yeah, it's bullshit. Like it's, but it's, it's the latest. It was like just like one last gob of spit in the face, but before it all, before it all ended. When I always tell people, I'm like, look, I know there's times you can't tell me things. Like, don't take the call or don't, just don't lie.

Like, don't flat out lie or else then I can never trust anything you're saying. When I'm talking to sources, whatever, I don't care if you ignore me. I don't care if you dance around the truth. I don't even care if you, like, Gary Bettman split hairs. and say, I said at this time, I said at this time. You know what you mean? Like, they'll add like little disclaimers to their comments. Like, we're not looking to leave Atlanta at this time.

And then this time tomorrow, maybe we are. That's lawyer. That's lawyer bullshit. I can be lawyered up, but don't say. It's not naked, naked dishonesty. I don't know. That really bothered me. Come on.

Yeah. No, they made the decision on Sunday morning. Like, it's, it's foul. It's foul. Foul shit. That's like the, and again, like, just, let him go, like they made him come in on Sunday morning. Like, it's, whatever.

We said we weren't going to talk about this that much and here we are. But let him just leave on Saturday night. Fire him after the game. Come in and do this bullshit where he gets fired in person on at 930 on a Sunday morning. How out of here? I know. Losers. Yeah.

Well, you know, this is a terrible segue, but I did want to like mention news kind of emerged as we were recording this. Bob Jones was diagnosed. with ALS, Senator's assistant coach. So, I mean, just terrible news. And we,

nothing to say other than we're thinking about you. And that's, it's, like, it's terrible. Yeah.

It's a terrible. It's a terrible, but it takes bravery to come public and share it. And I always admire people to do that. So,

you know. Well said. Yeah. I agree. Any other way to get out of it, get out of this at this point, John?

leave a review specifically about Sean if you would subscribe to the athletic I will read bad five star reviews five star reviews you make fun

I mean that's fine but if you want to make fun I mean talk about you know things you don't like I was reading I was trying to I was reading reviews

on something yesterday and it was a five star review that crushed the place like how does it like it was so misleading it was five stars I'm like oh good and then they're like

terrible never use this like why did you get a five stars then? Is there some strategy there I'm missing? You know the internet. I think it's just, I don't know if it may be, there's less of a chance that the review gets hidden possibly.

Yeah, but also like, showed up. It was like the first thing and I'm like, hmm. The only, one of the only, I'm not even to say the place that this was.

I had a really, really horrible experience at a, at a restaurant once. And I left like, I left like a good review and was based, this is years ago, but I left a really good review. And I left a really good review.

I'm not even getting into how bad the deal was there because it was bad enough for me to leave the only review of a restaurant that I've ever left in my life. And I was just like, yeah, five-star review, but like don't, don't just don't come here. Oh, maybe that was you that I was reading. Strategy. You can also follow the athletic hockey show on YouTube, YouTube.com forward slash at sign the athletic hockey show. Anybody would do such a thing. We're back next week. Sean and I, we're setting some sort of record.

Consecutive shows with the two of us. I'm going to jinx it for sure. You're setting a record. I'm always here. Leave me out of this. We have some sort of record. And I just want to genuinely wish everybody a happy new year. It's January 24th.

When is this bit going to, I hope it can't end now. Just keep doing it. Happy New Year, everybody. Happy Lunar New Year. that at least was someone close to this Hey I didn't specify which one

Happy Valentine's Day Bye