The Athletic Hockey Show - Bruins or Canucks: which team is the bigger Round 2 underdog?

Episode Date: May 6, 2024

On a brand new Monday edition of The Athletic Hockey Show, Ian and Laz discuss Laz’s disappointing decision to shave his mustache, Ian’s experience watching Bruins-Maple Leafs Game 7 with noted Leafs enthusiast Sean McIndoe, the allure of being the head coach of the Maple Leafs despite the intense pressure, whether the Bruins or Canucks are the bigger Round 2 underdog, updated Stanley Cup odds, potential NHL Draft lottery outcomes, and the forthcoming retirement of Jets head coach Rick Bowness, as reported by TSN’s Darren Dreger. Plus, The Athletic’s NHL insider Pierre LeBrun joins the show to talk about covering the upcoming Avs-Stars series, how things could play out in Toronto this week, why there was so much chatter surrounding Rod Brind’Amour last week, and more.Subscribe to The Athletic: http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. We are back, everybody. Welcome to a Monday edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. It's round two of the Stanley Cup playoffs, and we are ready to roll to kick off your weekend hockey. It's Ian Mendez, Mark Lazarus, with you. And I got to tell you, Lanz, I'm real, I'm a little bit disappointed because last week,

you went on X, you posted that you were toying with the idea of a mustache. I'm not going to lie to you. When the stream came up today, I was hoping to see a moustachioed Mark Lazarus staring back at me. Instead, I'm seeing the clean-shaven completely, not even any facial hair. Yeah, I shaved yesterday the other day. You know, like, I'm in New York for the Rangers Hurricane series. And like the mustache was fun.

I had it for like three or four days. It was funny to go places with it and like look ridiculous. But I didn't want to have to explain it to like 150 colleagues everywhere I go at every arena I'm at for the next two weeks. So that was the ultimate determination was not worth the hassle. And like, would you feel awkward or weird? Like, like, let's go back to Madison Square Garden on Sunday. And you're talking to Freddie Anderson, let's say, it's grow.

How could anybody take me seriously? That's what I'm saying. I did tweet a picture out. Me and Scott Powers at our end of season lunch at Mandy's Deli in Chicago. And so there's proof that it existed. And let me tell you. I know. It was kind of magnificent.

It was a legit, sweet-ass mustache, man. But no, I'm not a mustache, man. I can't pull that off. I told you last week, I said, a mustache isn't facial hair so much as a state of mind. If you believe you could pull it off, you could pull it off. You actually, in that picture that I saw of you, you actually look like you could pull it off.

I just didn't want to have to explain it to everybody. If you just show up somewhere with a mustache for the first time, people ask questions. And it's not no one. right? Did you lose a bad? Did you finish last in your fantasy league? Like, what's going on here?

Why? I didn't want to have to keep explaining. I thought it would make my kids laugh and yada, yada, yada, yada. So I was just gone. Such as life. Yeah. I feel like I looked like 30 years younger, though. That's the only good thing.

That beard was all white, man. There was way too much white in that beard. There was a lot of wisdom. Yeah, it conveyed a lot of wisdom. Yes, that's the word. Yeah, wisdom. Yeah, that's, um, okay. So I want to let you and the listeners in on a little,

a little background story. here. Toronto, Boston Saturday night. Okay? It's a game seven. And yeah, you've heard of it. And so everyone knows Sean McAdoo, Down Goes Brown. He's the Wednesday co-host here with Sean Gentilly, fantastic columnist

with the athletic, diehard, well-known Toronto Maple Leafs fan. So about three or four weeks ago, Laz, and Sean and I went to university together, went to journalism school together. About three weeks ago, a buddy of ours who is in Toronto, also

a huge Leafs fan, sends me a text and says, I'm coming up to Ottawa, Saturday, May 4th, let's all get together. And I said, no problem. I'll host a barbecue, whatever. Schedule comes out and I see, ah, game seven, it's one of the, Leafs are down 3-1, it'll never happen. Well, guess what? Game 7 happens. So I text Mac and do. I text, down goes brown on Friday. I said, listen,

I'm just making sure this still works for you to come to my house. Because if you want to just stay at home, watch the game curled up in a fetal position or whatever it is you do. You do you. He says, no, no, I'll be there. Last, I watched a game seven. Toronto Maple Leafs Game 7 in my living room was down goes brown. This reminds me of the time when I was in college, we had a little screening room in our basement of our dorm.

And we had a friend who had never seen Empire Strikes Back. so we're like oh my god so he and he didn't even he did not know that darth vader was luke Skywalker's dad how do you not know that and live in this world so we ran downstairs to show in the movie and as it gets to that final scene none of us is looking at the screen we're all looking at dave to see what his reaction would be that would be me watching a game seven of toronto i would not watch the game at all i'd be staring at mackandu going what's what's you gonna do how's you going to handle this what's going to happen that's all i would do would be staring at the guy I even told him after like as the game I was like man I should have written a column off this

you should have I know no but I I didn't want to put the pressure on it but here's the funny thing Toronto goes up one nothing does he cheer on the score is it or is it just like that no kind of like noicism he's got I yeah the fist pump but there was no feeling of we got this okay and sure enough the Bruin score a minute and 21 seconds later and he like he just deadpans he says something along the lines of well that was a fun 90 seconds like and then and then we get to over and the game goes to overtime and i and i'm telling you this i am not trying to be that you know taunting him and it's a game seven this is his team i'm respectful i'm respectful of that so i'm not trying to talk but that's just me i have known him for 30 years i i i don't

want to bust him for that. And so we get to always have the only thing he says, and our other buddy Chris is there. Again, Chris is also a dire lease fan. And the only thing Sean says is, please God, just don't be something stupid. Like, just don't be something stupid. And then the Pots or not gold goes in. Those two guys don't even say anything. They don't even let out at, oh shit, or they don't throw nothing. It was almost like they knew it was coming last. Yeah. Isn't there a weird thing when you watch a game with like a diehard fan when you're not a fan? I remember doing that before I even had this job. Like I remember like the 2011 Blackhawks Canucks series.

Remember the Hawks came back from 3-0 down, forced the game seven. And then Chris Campoli turnover. And then it was. Yeah. And then the Chris Campoli turnover. And it was Alex Burroughs slaying the dragon. Like I was with a buddy of mine who was, you know, decked out. And he's Jonathan Taves jersey.

And he's like super fan and coming off at the greatest year of his life because they won the cup. and he just, I have video of it. I was actually taking video of him during overtime. That's how my little I cared about the game. And he just, when the puck went, he just, his head just fell slowly into his hands. And he just sat there silent for like a minute. It's so awkward. It's like, do I want to like add him on the back, give him a hug, laugh at him?

What do I do here? I don't know what to do there. So then I said, before that game ended though, I said the Macadoo, I was like, what happens if the Leafs win? I said, do I suddenly become your good luck, charm? What happens if the whole thing was predicated on you coming to my house and watching game seven? So here's, this was my master plan. Las. This is that I will reveal my evil plan. So I was okay. Come over, watch game seven. They win. Next round, let's say they play Florida. Let's say they go to

game seven. I was going to invite them over. Come watch the game. They win again. They get to the conference final. Maybe they bounce the Rangers or the Carolina in a game five or six. Come over to my house. Okay. Then Stanley Cup game seven, last I was going to invite him to my house. I was going to lock the door. I wasn't going to let him in. And then, and that, that was my plan. Cold, cold blood. Yeah. That was the plan. Fandom's a weird thing, man. Like, I, like, I'm still like, I still have that with the Mets. Like, I've lost my fandom in hockey. Like, I don't have any feeling for the Islanders anymore. I covered some from, I would did some NFL so like the Giants not really there anymore. The NICs. I'm

excited about the Knicks. that's a big deal to me. But like the Mets are the only thing I have that. But I can't, it's not like it used to be. Like I will yell and scream at the TV. And then the second they lose, I've moved on. Like, I don't know if that comes with age, if that comes with the job. I remember the 2015 World Series.

I had my newborn baby. She was less than a month old, sleeping on my chest when the Mets blew their third save. Jay Reese Familia, Blue his third save of the World Series against Kansas City. And I didn't even wake up the kid. That's when I knew that. I had gained control of my fandom, right? Like, that's when I knew, like, I'm above this, and it kind of made me sad. Because I was like, oh, man, like, in the old days, I would have been tearing this place apart.

Yeah, the rage factor. It goes down considerably with age. I think if you're a Leafs fan, if you're not like a Steve Dangal type, if you're, you know, Sean McIndoo is already a stoic guy to begin with. I feel like you just, it is similar to being a Mets fan or Knicks fan. You're just braced for the worst at all times. so when it does happen, you just kind of love you. Yep, knew that was coming.

And you just got a new year. Yeah. It's resignation more than, but the worst thing is, there's always that little party. It's the hope that kills you, right? Oh, yeah. And there's always that little part, but it was just so, it was almost like very businesslike, gay men,

these two guys were like, no. He stood up, you shook your hand and he just left. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for hosting. I showed him great respect in the handshake. That's nice. That's nice.

That's nice. You got to give them the props. That's the whole key. I'm curious. Florida Boston. And we'll bring Pierre LeBron in here momentarily. We'll talk a little bit about the Leaf stuff and the fall out, all that. Florida Boston is interesting to me last because I thought Florida in February and early March,

they were my pick. They look like the best team in the east. They had a bit of a speed wobble down the stretch. They look real good against Tampa. Boston did not impress me against Toronto at all. If I had the guess right now, I'm thinking Florida in five, Florida, in six maybe. People aren't given Boston any chance at all.

This is a team that set a regular season record last year and was really good again this year. And people are like, oh, they're going to lose in two. Like they have absolutely no prayer of beating mighty Florida. What a world we live in where Florida is the powerhouse and Boston's this huge underdog. So I'm, okay, so you're reading this exactly the same way I am, which is, it is. Boston is a massive underdog here. But my question is, what's the scenario? Is it swaying just going nuts?

Like, what's the scenario here that you would actually see the Boston Bruins as are currently constructed, beating the Florida Panthers four times in seven games? It's hockey. I can see almost, it could, of course it could happen. Boston's a good team. This is not the Washington Capitals. This isn't the team with like a minus 80 goal differential. The Bruins are a good team. They're not as good as the Panthers, but that doesn't mean they can't be better than them four times in seven games. Look, I would pick the Panthers. I expect the Panthers to win.

But I'm kind of surprised at how quickly people are just like completely writing off the Boston Bruins, who are a good team. And have that, Jeremy Swainman's been the best goalie in the playoffs, maybe. Him in Ottinger, maybe? I don't know. Like, unless they're dumb enough to put Olmark back in there and do the rotation thing, instead of riding the hot hand, which could happen. Boston's got a, of course, they have more than a prayer.

They've got a shot. Who's the bigger underdog? As we kick off the second round of the playoffs here, and we look at the four series, I think a lot of people would tell you, Carolina and the Rangers is a little bit of a coin flip. Maybe a little bit favorite to the Rangers, but essentially a coin flip.

Dallas, Colorado feels like a coin flip. But Boston and Vancouver, Laz, are, I think, perception-wise, are going into their series as the definitive underdogs. Who's the bigger underdog in your mind? Boston or Vancouver. I think it's Vancouver just because of their goaltending situation. I don't think if that Shredemko doesn't play in the series,

that's not the same Vancouver team that was so good all year long. So I think that's the X factor there. I mean, otherwise it probably would have been Boston because people are so high on Florida and for good reason. Yeah. But it's hard. It's hard to win seven or eight playoff series in two years. Like, you know, Florida has been through a lot in the last calendar year.

And that does take its toll. But yeah, I mean, it feels like we're all like up. Can't wait for Dallas, Edmonton and New York, Florida or Carolina, Florida. Although the Carolina of New York, and that's the series I'm covering here in New York. And it's funny, listen, you know, Dom's got the hurricanes at like a 70% favorites to win this thing. And everyone I talk to thinks the Rangers are heavy favorites. It's the dichotomy between the analytics and the eye tests on these two teams, massive. It's crazy.

right. The New York Rangers won the President's trophy have won the first five games of the playoffs and yet there's a little bit of a They're the betting underdogs. Like the Carolina has the it's not just the analytics. The bettors are favoring Carolina. Yeah. Anyway, so for me, I'm fascinated by the series you're covering on the ground there, Carolina and the Rangers, because Carolina is this like, it feels like

I know we talked about Toronto's at a breaking pole. point. Maybe Boston, maybe, depending on how things go, maybe they're at a little bit of a fork in the road. Carolina feels like they might be in a little bit of a fork in the road if they don't win this series. They got a ton of UFAs. I mean, Gensel's obviously UFA, Martinuk, half the defense is a UFA, their coach is a UFA. And this is their fourth year as, you know, a top, top, top tier team, and they have nothing to show for it. They went to one conference final and got sweat. So, you know, if this were the exact same situation happening in Toronto, it'd be, you know, a five alarm fire right now. It's just because it's in Carolina that people aren't freaking out about.

I mean, can you imagine any situation where Rod Brindamore is not the coach of the Carolina Hurricanes, like, forever? How is that even a possibility that he's going somewhere? I don't know. I feel like Ron Francis is sitting in Seattle, like, with the evil, you know, Dr. Evil type of thing. Yes. Oh, man. All right, Laz. why don't we bring in our weekly insider.

It is our pal Pierre Lebrun joining us in between the first and second round. Pierre is off to, and we were talking about this just before we jumped on the air. Pierre, you got the best, we think we have the best assignment here. Dallas, Colorado, this is going to be some terrific theater coming up in the next two weeks. I mean, honestly, I'm not saying this because I want to pay lip service to the NHL. I really like all four second round series. But yes, when I was asked if I had interest in covering Colorado, Dallas. I jumped all over it.

I mean, the avalanche looked like the 22 avalanche right now, cup worthy, and Dallas just beat the cup champions. And I think this is a toss-up of a series to really deep teams. I'm pretty darn excited to be part of it. And I was thinking about this today, guys, if you go back to the Chris Tannaf trade, the four Western Conference teams that are still live in the playoffs were all finalists for Chris Tannav.

Hamilton, Vancouver, Colorado, and of course, Dallas, who actually got him. The one Eastern team that was part of the final group that we confirmed was Toronto. But the four teams in the second round all took a swing at TANF, and it was Jim Nilda got him. Not that Chris McFarlane, his GM counterpart in this series didn't do his work. After not getting TANF, you eventually, as you know, would get Sean Walker as part of this whole makeover by also trading Byron for Middlestads. So two front offices that aren't too scared to fill holes, and that's where they are where they are. You know, man, a lot of us have Dallas as the best team.

We've had them all year as the best team. But if they win the Cup, they're going to have to go through Vegas, Colorado, potentially Edmonton, and then, you know, like Florida or Carolina or the Rangers. I mean, this is an insane gauntlet they have to run through. I totally agree, Lodge. And it's rare in the cap era that, you know, You also get to the second round and you're like, oh, right, all the good teams are there. Like, we haven't had the kind of anarchy that we're used to having in the first round or at least in, you know, in some cases.

And listen, had Winnipeg beat Colorado or Toronto beat in Boston, it would have been shocking. And those were close series. And, of course, Vegas and Dallas. But at the end of the day, I think we can all agree on this call that I think the eight teams that truly, I think, were favored end up in the second round. Really. And then that's not really the solar cap at HL. So, so yeah, the cream has risen to the top here for once. Well, Pierre, let's chat about the Toronto Maple Leaf because inevitably there's going to be a ton of attention on them

after another game seven loss against Boston on the weekend. So how do you see this week playing out in Toronto where obviously the temperature is going to be turned up again on the core four on Sheldon Keith and on others? Yeah, well, I think Sheldon Keep is a low-hanging fruit. And I don't want to, listen, diminish when the human being may or may not lose a job. And it always sucks. And you never cheer for that.

But I think it's a low-hanging fruit in the sense that Bradtree Living inherited Sheldon-Kee gave him a two-year extension, which in MLSC land is just like, let's get the noise away for a year. You know, money's not an object at MLSC. I think that if Sheldon-Keefe is fired, then that's the most obvious. move, who knows, it may not happen. He's meeting the media today. So we'll see how this plays out. But it's noteworthy that the management media availability is not until Thursday

and players and coaches today. And I mentioned that because a year ago, after the Leash lost in the second round to Florida, Caldubus did have his GM availability the same day as the players availability. And we know

in retrospect that that was actually a bona contention. that Brendan Chanahan had asked Dubus not to do his media availability that day to let things simmer down. In hindsight, it kind of tells you how the rest of that week played out in terms of that divorce between Dubus and Chanahan. But in this particular case, Brad Tree Living is going to wait a few days. And, you know, the bigger thing here, guys, is there's a new boss, a new sheriff in town with MLSC. Keith Pelley is now the big boss of the organization. Raptors, Leaves, Toronto FC, everything is a big, big company.

And everyone's just wondering, what does Keith Pelly think of Brendan Chanahan, who has now had 10 years at the helm as president. Chanahan has one more year left on his deal. He's paid handsomely. I don't know where Keith Pelley's going to go with this. He's not sharing that with anyone. But I don't know why you, if I was Keith Pelley, I don't know why you wouldn't use that year.

to continue to figure out what you're going to do there. That's my prediction. In other words, I think Shanahan may survive this. But for no other reason, then you got another year if you're in charge of this organization. And this should be said that on the hockey side, it's been an absolute failure that the lease have never gone deep in these 10 years, given the nucleus of talent that they have.

But it has to be noted. And maybe this is less obvious to people who don't come to Toronto a lot, don't really care about the Leafs that much. The business side, the way the Leafs operate, has been an absolute upgrade to Shanan took over. I mean, Ian would know this, you know, from his point of view from Ottawa, but, you know, the Leafs were a train wreck at times before all this.

And so just the way they operate and the way things happen certainly has been better under Shannon. But at the end of the day, that being said, 10 years is a long time and they've never gone deep. So, you know, it's, it's, I think it's fair that people are asking these questions here. I feel like every situation where there's a president of hockey ops and a GM is a little different. How would you characterize Shanahan's actual role?

Like how hands-on is he with the roster construction with his GMs? Well, first of all, his title is not president of hockey ops. And I'm not trying to be cute here. But what's interesting, last year, to your point is that most of his counterparts around the league actually have president of hockey ops titles. As you just said, he is the president of the Toronto Maple Leafs. And the reason I point that out is that within that title is bake the idea that he oversees much more than just hockey, that he's president of everything, business, hockey. I guess it'd be similar to Domodale and Carolina, who's president of the team, which involves business and hockey, and he's GM.

But what I would say, though, your question is still pertinent is that he has been very involved. And I think, you know, he feels that he should be in terms of hockey decisions. and philosophical viewpoints of the way the leaves have been built and so on. I mean, I think he absolutely was in there with Dubus and he has been with tree living, but that's also been pretty transparent, I think. I don't think that's underhanded or meant to be secretive. I think he's pretty upfront about that. You know, Pierre, you mentioned we're very mindful of these are human beings and these are their jobs.

And so potentially a guy like Sheldon Keefe could be looking for, employment within the week. But how could that maybe have a domino effect? I mean, maybe there's a team out there that thinks, okay, Sheldon Keefe would be a good fit for us. The Toronto Maple Leafs might be in the market for a brand new head coach. So how do you see the dominoes maybe playing out here involving the Leafs in the coaching carousel the next week or two?

Well, there are certainly a few teams I know that I've heard of here in the last couple of days that are still hoping to see when the dust clears here after the first round if there are other candidates that emerge before they move on in their process. I don't want to say which teams those are, but that's been the communication I've had from them. And that's just, to be honest, that's just good business practice, right? I mean, if you have a coaching vacancy and you've waited this long as a non-playoff team to figure out what you do and your models will make sure you know every single option before you move on.

So that's all that is, I think. And so that is happening right now. I mean, and some teams have a more urgent timeline than other. in terms of when you'll hear a higher, but pretty much every team I've heard from hopes to have a coach in place by the drop in Vegas. So, you know, there should be some headlines here over the next few weeks.

Probably the juiciest piece of news that came out of the weekend. I think it was from our good friend Kevin Weeks who kind of talked about Mike Sullivan and what's going on there in Pittsburgh, and I know our own Rob Rossi's done some reporting there. and I made a few calls as well here over the last couple of days. All I can say is from a penguin's perspective that they're not letting anyone talk to Mike Sullivan.

They're not given anyone permission. So I'm not exactly sure why this continues to percolate. And I want to clear up something too because I think there was speculation. Well, you know, Mike Sullivan has a big extension. That actually kicks in next season, I think we've talked about this year, that maybe there could be some trade, that if you get Mike Sullivan and that's not allowed in the NHL. And this goes back to about 12 or 13 years ago. I remember writing about this, but Gary Bettman stopped the practice of teams receiving compensation

or being involved in trades, involving coaches or front office people. And so if you let someone go, you cannot get anything back in return, who's under contract. The only thing that's at play sometimes as teams can agree on making up the coach's salary. So I think Mike Sullivan's extension is around five and a half million a year

starting next year among the top fake coaches in the NHL. If he were to leave, the penguins could pay like, let's say a million a year and the new team picks up whatever. I mean, that is allowed. But the idea that the penguins would somehow get compensation for him, that's actually against

the rules. Can't do that. So anyway, the bottom line is, as of today, the word out of Pittsburgh is that, you know, they're not letting anyone talk to Mike Sullivan. This might be a dumb question. I ask a lot of those. But is Toronto an attractive job right now? I mean, it's an original six, huge city, going to get paid a lot. But the pressure there is unrelenting.

The team is kind of stagnant. Wouldn't like New Jersey be a more attractive job right now, a lower pressure team on the rise, lots of young talent. I mean, maybe that's a cowardly way of looking at it, but wouldn't, aren't there jobs out there that are better than Toronto right now? I think it's an awesome question. And I guess my experience from being here 30 years in this market is that people kind help themselves, because if you're ever the person that could lead the Leafs to a Stanley Cup

for the first time since 1967, you're gone. You are, your legacy is cemented for eternity. So that allure, that carrot has been, has been too much for so many people to turn down over the years. And that's why you've seen some big names come here and coach. You know, the late Pat Burns leaves Montreal for Toronto. The late Pac-Quinn, even though his, you know, Pat Quinn was already a Hall of Famer by the time he got to Toronto in the late 90s. He couldn't, he had to try. And he had some good teams, by the way.

He did a good job. You know, Paul Maurice, Randy Carlyle, Ron Wilson. You know, Team USA Ron Wilson's like, I'm going to do it. And so I love that because to answer your question, no matter what state the Least team is in. Of course, by Babcock probably being the best example of all because of where he stood in the coaching hierarchy at the time in 2015 when he came here. But the answer is I've never heard a coach who didn't want to come here. And that doesn't change the fact that the underlying factors that you outline are not true. They are true.

I mean, I don't see the way the Leafs are currently constructed. I start the year always with seven or eight teams I have ahead of them. That doesn't mean they can't win one because that's the NHL and there's randomness in the playoffs. But the way they're currently constructed, they're too top heavy. John Tavares is no longer worth 11 million and that's a problem, at least for one more year. So yeah, there's a few things going on. Pierre, why do you think there was so much noise around Rod Brindamore last week? I mean, it feels like he should be a hurricane for life or be able to write his own ticket.

They've been a perennial cup contender. They just, they won the first round series. And yet there was a lot of chatter around him last week. Why was that? Well, first of all, it's reminiscent. It's not a perfect example, but it's a recent. recent one. Barry Trotz when he delivered the cup to Alex Ovechkin and, or I guess Alex Ovechkin, you know what I mean. Very Tross was a coach in 2018 for the capitals.

You may remember he was on an expiring deal and we were at the Stanley Cup final asking Barry Trots about his future. It was a very strange circumstance and in fact, very trots left after he won the cup in Washington. It was very weird. And so, so that's what we're, this, this Brindamore situation kind of reminds me of. that given the potential for Carolina to win a cup, although they're down when nothing to the rangers right now. All I can tell you is Don Waddell has been absolutely consistent with his belief that this will get done, which he said publicly, he said to our own Mike Russo last week. I think what's happened, though, is that this eventually became a negotiation that involved

the owner and the coach and no one else. And so read into that what you will. I don't think it's a money issue, by the way. Like the money's there. So, well, let's see where it goes. I do think it'll get done, is my gut feeling. But it's not ideal that it wasn't done for the playoffs started. In a perfect world, if everyone involved was on here with us and had truth serum, they would agree that this should have got done before the playoff started for all the obvious reasons,

i.e. the very trot story that we just talked about. But it hasn't. What do you think happens to Carolina should they lose this series of the Rangers? This is the fourth year in a row, they've been like legit Stanley Cup contenders. They've yet to win a game in the Eastern Conference final. They got a ton of UFAs coming up. The coach is a UFA. Is it possible we see a total rethinking of things in Carolina,

or they like their system so much that they're just going to try to keep rebuilding it this way? Yeah. Hard to say, Lazz. and I'm not trying to cop out from the answer here, but I truly feel that if there's a difference between losing in this round and how you lose. So I would need to see how this series played out before I could truly answer that.

Like, are you flaming out or are you going seven and going toe to toe with the president's trophy winners? So, you know, it's hard to the vacuum. Toronto, if Toronto scores an overtime and they go to the second round and then get waxed by Florida, is anything different, though? No. And in fact, I think that even had the Leafs scored an overtime Saturday,

but then gone out in four or five games against Florida, I think Sheldon Keefe would be in trouble. Yeah. My guess is winning that game Saturday night probably meant more for Jim Montgomery than Sheldon Keev in that aspect, by the way. So, no, it's, I mean, it's absolutely an important question when it comes to the hurricanes. They're also only one game in.

So let's circle back. I'm just speculating wildly here. That's what we do on this. Yeah. No question. Yeah. Let's circle back on that one. Well, listen, Pierre, it's always great to get you on Monday.

Safe travels down. Like we said, this should be a real fun series, Dallas and Colorado. And make sure you grab me a CD Lamb jersey. Okay? When you're down there in Dallas. Now, wait a minute. You don't want to wait for the extension? Like you want it now because you know he's not going anywhere

no matter what? Okay. Yeah. Pierre being in Dallas for the Cowboys, I'm in New York for the Knicks in the playoffs here. Like, we're just getting sent to our favorite places here. I love it. Yes. The Knicks know how to make things interesting, though, don't they?

The Knicks are a lot like, it's the same as the Toronto job, too. Everybody keeps coming to New York thinking they're going to be the ones that do it, and nobody's ever the one that does it. There's a lot of Cowboys, Knicks, Maple Leafs. There's a lot of, yeah, we can go on forever. It's the perfect vent. diagram. All right. Well, listen, safe travels, Pierre, and we'll hopefully hit you up again next Monday. Right on, right on. Sounds good. All right. All right stuff with our pal,

Pierre LeBron. And, you know, you did ask you, you bring up a great point, or you brought up a great point with Lebron on, you know, the job of the Toronto Maple Leafs head coach. And is there a hotter, like, bounce around pro sports in North America. What would come with a hotter seat right now than the head coach of the Toronto Maple Leafs with their 57-year, whatever, drought of winning? I don't know. Like, I'm not sure there's any. I'm not sure there's an equivalent to what Toronto feels in hockey.

Like, the Dallas Cowboys, sure, but like Jerry Jones stuck with, what was his name, Jason Garrett for like 120 years when he probably should have been fired. Like, there's some loyalty there. And I don't think the pressure is quite the same as Toronto is. with its hockey team. Like you can talk about being manager of the Yankees or being, you know, maybe with the Dodgers right now,

given all the money they've spent. But I don't think there's really an equivalent to the singular pressure that being in charge of the Toronto Maple Leaf Springs. No, I think it's a great point. And like, I think it's no different than being a player. Like, I think if you have your choice in free agency as a player, you would absolutely weigh in the,

the pressure factor, the scrutiny factor. And there's a lot of players you would say, you know what, I'll just go play in Florida or Nashville or Carolina than to go into Toronto. But the flip side is, and we've talked about this so many times, whoever delivers that cup to Toronto, I don't even care if you're the assistant trainer. You're not buying a drink for the rest of your life.

Yeah. That's just it. I mean, some guys are wired differently, right? There are players that crave anonymity, and there's players that want to be superstars. And so that plays into a lot of these decisions just as much as state income tax does and things like that. But the thing about Toronto, like if Toronto, when Sheldon Keefe took over that job, that was a sweet gig, man. You had all these young superstar players at your disposal. Things were on the up and up.

But now, like, it's not just the pressure. It's all that pressure on a team that is just in dire straits right now, cap-wise. fan-wise, it doesn't feel like good things are on the horizon. It feels like things are going to get worse. It's Chief Wiggum going through the hot dog ringer here, man. Oh, boy, it's just going to get worse before it gets better. And I just feel like I'm not sure that's an attractive job, no matter how much it pays, no matter how, you know,

hockey coaches are so competitive. They want that pressure. They want that job. But you are not going to win in Toronto in the next few years. It's going to take some time to kind of re-chigger this thing. And I'm not sure that's the best gig out there. Okay. Well, New Jersey would be very

palatable, I think, because you got arguably one of the best six or seven players in the game when he's healthy, I think, and Jack Hughes. Or he could be one of the best for sure. Six or seven players in the game. You've got a good collection of young, talented players, good defensemen. Okay, sure, you need a goalie, but

the recipe's all there. I would have said Buffalo until they got Lindy Roth. I think Buffalo would have been an intriguing job. I agree. In some ways. But yeah, I think if you're, okay, let's put ourselves in Craig Baroube's shoes. Let's for a moment say that Craig Baroube is the most sought after coaching candidate on the current market.

He's got a Stanley Cup. He's got a great reputation. All of that stuff. If you're Craig Baroube and later this week that Toronto, you see the phone call coming in, the call display, MLSC, it's the Maple Leafs, they're calling. and then devils have also phoned you and said, we want you. And Ottawa phoned you and said we want you.

And Seattle says, hey, what about us? And maybe L.A. There's a bunch of places that he, you're Craig Baroube, though. Would you not be intrigued by the idea of, hey, listen, I already got a cup. So why don't I just take a swing in Toronto? Yeah, no, I mean, it's,

there has to be an appeal there. Like for anyone who is competitive and anyone who is steeped in hockey, like almost anyone who was going for these jobs would be, there's certainly an allure to being head coach of the Toronto Maple Leafs and maybe being that guy. I'm just saying, I don't think that's the best job on the market, objectively speaking.

Like, you have to factor in all those extras, both good and bad. And I feel like right now the bad outweighs the good for Toronto. It's a great city with a great fan base and, you know, great history and all that. But that team's just stuck right now. The window's open, though. Do you agree that windows open to be a contender? It's not shut, but it's like, what's the path forward here?

How does this team become a contender in the next two or three years? Like a true Stanley Cup contender? What do they have to do? We're talking about blowing things up. They can't really blow things up. You can kind of do some movies on the deadline. I mean, if you do trade Mitch Martyr, if you can convince him the wave is no movement clause, and you trade Mitch Martyr, you're not going to get full value for him.

It's going to be a Claude-Jaroo Patrick Kane situation. where he's basically dictating where he goes. You're not going to get full value for a player of his caliber. And what are you going to do with that money that you get from him? Are you going to completely fix the blue line? Are you going to get yourself a real goalie? There's too many holes. There's too many holes and there's not enough money to fix them.

Boy, yeah, it's going to be a fascinating story to see. And as LeBron pointed out, though, it has been a job that a lot of the big names have gone for, the Babcock's and the Burns and the Quinn's and the, right? Like, it's an attractive job. That's the thing is everybody can name all the Toronto Maple Leafs coach. Can your average hockey fan tell you who are the devil's coaches when they won the Stanley Cup? You do it in Toronto.

You're not anonymous. You are an icon forever. There is absolute validity to that. It is different if you do it in Toronto, if you do it in Montreal, if you do it in Chicago, New York, Boston. It's different. It is. But do you want to win or do you want to have a slim,

chance of being an icon. That's an interesting choice. I'm not saying it's an easy call. But Craig Baroube probably will have his pick. He seems to be the top guy. And I'll be fascinated. Maybe the fact that he won a cup recently does open the door for that. But it's a fascinating thing to think about. It sounds so stupid to suggest that Toronto is not a great gig. But I'm not so sure it's a great gig. You just reminded me, man, the devil's won their three Stanley Cups with three different head coaches. Yeah. They were always firing guys at the last second. Before the playoffs. Jacques Lumer in 95,

Larry Robinson, right, who took over for Fetoric at the end in 2000, and then Pat Burns. Yeah. In 03. And I wonder how, honestly, I wonder how many average hockey fans

could have named those three guys. Yeah. But everybody knows every Leafs coach ever becomes world famous. Well, I remember even in, I think it was 2007. Week before the regular season ended, Claude Julian had the Devils in first place,

and Lulu Amarillo fired him. and took over himself. Yeah. As the head coach. It's a weird business man. Like, being a head coach in the NHL, the rug can come out from you at any moment. Any moment.

You know, actually, real quick, Lou Lamarillo, side note, tangent here. Yes. By chance, did you, last, did you watch or see any highlights of the Tom Brady celebrity roast on Netflix? I have not yet. I just saw it was lighting up my Twitter timeline

when I was watching Dallas, Vegas. Okay. So it got me thinking yesterday. I'm like, man, if we had an NHL equivalent of like, who's the person you want to see roasted in the NHL world, I came down. I think it was Lou Lamarillo for me. I want to see, I want to see like Claude Julian who got fired by Rob Fittorick,

who got fired like all these, like think of all the, I want to see people show up with facial hair and different, like, Don't you feel like you would be in for that? I would love to see it, but I feel like everyone lives in constant fear of Lou La Marello, and I'm not sure anybody would have the guts to say anything about them. That's why the celebrity roast, it provides you immunity. You can't say whatever you want about anybody in a roast setting, can you? Do we think like Jeff Ross has ever heard of Lou La Marello?

No, no. But I'd love to ask you, I'd love to ask the listeners on this. And you can hit us up, The Athletic Hockey Show at gmail.com. Leave us a comment in the comment section as well. You can tweet at us. If you, you can pick one person in the hockey world that's sitting there and then they have people come up and it's a celebrity roast. I mean, for me, it's Lamarillo because I think it would be so weird. It would be funny.

I mean, would a Betman one be funny or not really? I mean, here's the problem is nobody is, no athlete are better trash talkers than hockey players. They're all Shoresy out there. The problem is they don't do it when we can hear them. They only do it in kind of quote unquote, the privacy of the rink there. And I just, I can't imagine hockey players saying the things they want to say if this thing was going to be broadcast on Netflix. It's inconceivable to me.

But to hear an actual roast of Gary Bettman would be absolutely, it would be the most incredible thing that's ever happened in sports. To hear what these players actually think of Gary Batman and have them saying it to his face. I would pay good money for that. Never going to happen in hockey. And look, we got the list of speakers that Alan Walsh is up first.

The celebrity rose to Gary Bettman. Alan Walsh. Oh, Chris Chelyos is, remember Chris Chelyos in the 94-95 lockout made the comment where basically he low-key threatened Gary Bettman's personal safety. Right? The thing about Chelios is he's reached a point in his life

where he does not give a single damn what anyone thinks about what he says. He has reached the point where he just says what he wants to say now. And it's a glorious thing. And yes, that would be amazing. I'd love that. Because I feel like a celebrity, if you pick the most iconic, like Tom Brady is clearly the most iconic football player of this century. There's no question.

If you had to pick the most iconic hockey player of this century, maybe it's Sid. maybe it's McDavid, whatever. It would be so horrible. It would have to be like, you would have to be like, you'd be roasting like Ryan Reeves or Kevin B.XA. It would be, it would have to be somebody who is both a pain in the ass and has a sense of humor, right? Like, that's the only way to make this work.

Like, Tom Brady's a different, is a different beast. Yeah. In hockey, the only way it would work, it would have to be someone like that, like a shitter type player that, you know, I'm at Redmay right now. It's something like that. It would have to be someone who's both funny and has a good personality, but it's also a huge pain in the ass. You know, Brad Marchand would be a great one to be roasted.

You know, a great player. Everybody loves and hates him at the same time. Like, that's what Brady is. Like, nobody likes Tom Brady outside of New England, but everybody kind of begrudgingly respects Tom Brady. It's got to be that kind of player. So maybe Brad Marchand's the guy. Yeah, or maybe like a Colorado Avalanche reunion

where they roast, or not Colorado, Detroit, where they roast Clod Lemieux. They get Claude Lemieux back and members of the 95, 96 Red Wings. I'm not sure that would draw the same number of eyeballs as a Tom Brady one though. No, yeah. So anyway, I was curious.

I hit us up. The Athletic Hockey Show at gmail.com. Let us know. That was going on on Sunday night. The Brady Celebrity roast. I was not watching that. I was watching Dallas Vegas, like a lot. of people. And I wonder now, where do we see Vegas? Like, I don't think their windows closed at all.

In fact, you could argue they went to a game seven against arguably the best team in the league and pushed them to a goal and they were up to nothing in the series. They're there. They'll just break the goddamn window if it's in their way. This is Vegas. We're thought they will do anything they can to, you know, stay alive. Yeah. So I think you probably, based on you saying that, probably follow the same side of the argument with me, which is my perception and view of Vegas hasn't changed for next season, which is they'll be one of the eight playoff teams in the West, and they'll do everything they can to push themselves into being a Stanley Cup contender again. Like to me, losing in the first round, no biggie.

Yeah, they'll spend this summer getting back under the cap somehow or another. They'll just, they'll figure it out, and then they'll spend next year figuring out how to get back over the cap legally. This is what they do. it works and more teams frankly should be doing what they're doing which is going for broke every single year and stop worrying about these five and six year plans go get your cup and then do whatever you can to stay on top i like i can't even fathom them going through a three year rebuild and you know he was not sitting through a three year rebuild hell no hell no no i don't think so uh

speaking of a Vegas usually we bring in our pal jessie granger uh on money days for a little segment called Granger Things, sponsored by BetMGM, the exclusive betting partner with the athletic. However, we have allowed Jesse Granger some grieving time. This guy doesn't know what losing is. You know, he doesn't know.

He's flying home, but he's all confused right now. Yeah, he's like, what? I didn't know that there was return tickets after game seven, but so Jesse, we're giving him the day off, but we are going to dive into, as I said, this segment is brought to you by BetMGM. And there's eight teams left in the

Stanley Cup playoffs. And what I love about this last is there's a couple of teams here with long-ish droughts for winning a title. Vancouver's never won a cup. Yeah, Edmonton hasn't won a cup since 1990. The Rangers haven't won a cup since 94. Like, the Panthers have never won. Like, there's a potential outside of the avalanche, I guess the Bruins they won in 2011,

but someone's going to break a lengthy drought here. Yep. As we start to look at the odds of the final eight, though, there's a little. little bit of a separation, though. Isn't there like, there is a feeling like Vancouver, they're up against it, right? Yeah, it's a good time to reassess the odds with the start of the second round. And Vancouver is by far the longest shot.

They're plus 1,600 right now to win the Stanley Cup. Everyone else is kind of bunched together. Your favorites are Edmonton and Florida, both plus 450. And then next you got the hurricanes, the stars, and the Rangers are all plus 550. Avalanche right behind them at plus 600. Bruins at plus 900. So the Bruins and the Canucks, like we were talking about,

are clearly the underdogs here, the most glaring underdogs, but really only Vancouver, probably because of the goaltending situation, is the only one that's not really being given a realistic chance of winning the Cup. It is great, because Vancouver won their division. They, you know, they beat Nashville in a series

that a lot of people figured would go seven, but they were able to close up. They've got superstar talent. You got Quinn Hughes. You got Pedersen. You got legitimate, you know, great players. J.T. Miller has been great, like, best. Like, all of these guys have been good. and you're playing with your third string goalie,

and you're right, that's part of it. But if you're in Vancouver, like, I look at them if I'm Rick Tocke, like that's the card I play. Isn't it in game one in the locker room, just before we hit the ice, don't you play the everybody outside of this room, these 20 guys,

nobody believes we can do this. In, literally every team and every sport plays that card every single game. But often it's fake, right? It's always manufactured. I don't know. This one really feels like. Didn't Travis Kelsey said that after the Chiefs won their 17th Super Bowl in like five years?

Yeah. Nobody believed in us. Nobody believed in us. You're talking about. But I feel like this is one where Tuckett can actually give the speech and it would actually be somewhat truthful, right? I mean, sure. I mean, you've got to look for any advantage you can, any motivation you can as a coach. But also, I think we, you know, I was Duncan Keith once told me this.

is like, this isn't how you think it is. There's nobody standing in the middle of the room giving a Disney speech before a game. Like, we are professional athletes. We do not need artificial motivators. I think this is back in 2015 before the cup run that he told me that. It's like, we don't need to be told

that we should try hard. You know, we got here for a reason. Everybody understands the stakes. We don't need a rah-rah speech to get us fired up before a game. I think we like, we romanticize it because it's always such a great scene in a movie. But I don't, I don't know how much you really need to play that up.

The Canucks know exactly what everyone's saying. They know exactly how good they are and can be. They know they're on their third string goalie. And, you know, there's an internal motivation that these professional athletes have that most of us can never truly comprehend. And I feel like that's not really a coach's job anymore. A coach's job is the X's and O's. The motivation comes from within. Yeah, it's a great point.

Like Vancouver might be, I'm trying to think, and somebody can correct me if I'm wrong. You can or somebody else can. I don't know how many teams have gotten to the second round of the playoffs have home ice advantage. And I'm saying if I'm Vancouver, I just want to split the first two games. Yeah. You know what I mean?

You need to get an early win early win to prove that you can hang with this team. Think about that. They got a whole ice advantage and I think they just need to split. Is that not fair? Like, I think that's perfectly reasonable. The way evidence is going, the way that power play goes.

And again, you're on your third string goalie. in the playoffs against one of the greatest offensive teams that we've seen in the modern era. Yeah, they're underdogs. They know it. And if they get a win in one of those first two games, they're going to feel pretty good about themselves going to Edmonton. We're going to wrap up the pod here, Laz. We're going to stick with the theme of odds for a second,

and that is the draft lottery odds. Ah, yes, the Chicago and Ottawa beatwriters have to finish off the pod by talking about the draft lottery, which goes Tuesday night. And the prize this year is Maclin Celebrini, who is not going to be the Bedard or McDavid generational type of guy, but he's going to be a real good player. It might be more well-rounded, really, coming into the league than, like Nico Heeshire, but with more offense, really.

A little bit like, yeah, or at the, you know, a lot, I see a lot of comparisons to Jonathan Taves, like that kind of number one centerman that can do a lot of things, 200-foot game, all of that. 11 teams last 11 teams have the opportunity to end up with Macklin Celebrini. San Jose has the best odds at 25.5%. Remember, his dad kind of from the Bay Area, worked with the Golden State Warriors. Celebrity is a guy that played in the Sharks' kids system.

All of that was a Shark's fan or whatever going up. So that's a great angle. And you can make a great argument for a lot of teams. You know the team that I'm going to say I'm going to go ahead and pull for here? I'm going to say I'd like to see them win the lottery on Tuesday. I'm going to guess. Columbus, yeah. Columbus and Anaheim are the two teams where I'd like to see him go.

I think those are two markets that could use some star power and that kind of deserve it. I don't like the word deserve. Like Chicago didn't deserve. deserve Badaard last year the way they tanked. San Jose doesn't deserve Celebrini the way they played. I feel like Columbus is at least trying, right? And I would like to see them rewarded for it. I'm with you there.

And I'll tell you why it's, and it's, I'd like to think that if there are although I don't know if there are hockey gods. I don't, I, sometimes I think I believe in hockey gods and then other times I'm like, this is, there's no hockey gods. But what Columbus is that.

When the goal was scored, there is no hockey gods. That's right. Oh, man. I think about what Columbus Blue Jackets, PR staffer Lindy Noel did for our Aaron Portsline. And Lindy, she donated a kidney

to our colleague, our friend Aaron Portsline, not two weeks ago. And I got to think, come on, let's put a little good karma in the universe, right? How are you not cheering for the jackets? Can't argue. Cannot argue with that at all. You always hear fans say,

I'd give my left arm for a Stanley Cup. well, Lindy actually gave something up for 40. And yes, no, that would be, that would be excellent karma. But we all know that ping pong balls are frozen and going to Chicago, let's be honest. Yeah. You know, you know what would be a weird one? Like, and they have a chance to win. Utah would be weird, right?

Okay. Obviously, if Chicago somehow wins this and they have the third best odds of doing it, right? So it's, oh, sorry, second best. Second best. there's a path to that. And you'll hear conspiracy chatter if that happens. I get it.

The only other team that I would argue you're going to hear conspiracy chatter would be Utah. Oh, yeah. Don't you think? Oh, yeah. And Coyote fans would lose their minds because every year they were up for it

and they never wanted. They never got, they didn't get Matthews, they never got their guy. It would just be the cruelest kicking the gut after just kicking the gut and kicking the gut and kicking the gut. It would just be the finishing blow.

It would be just, oh, it would be so, hard to watch. Yeah, that would be like in terms of conspiracy theories, Chicago would be one. I think Utah is one A. Because people would say, that was part of the deal. You gave them the team. I think Utah would be one and Chicago would be one. Really? I think if he, if Celebrini goes to Utah, that feels like, we all know it's not. But it feels so orchestrated. I mean, especially with Utah having like what, the six or seven best odds, too, because Arizona wasn't that bad this year. So, like, that would feel really hinky that, you know, Gary Batman under the table told Ryan Smith, we'll get you this guy, you know. Oh, no, sorry, six. Sixth best odds for Utah.

You're right. Six best odds to get them. And then the other team that I wonder, would there be, would there be conspiracy chatter if Montreal ended up with Macklin Sillabrini? Just because they just had the first overall pick two years ago. Would there be conspiracy chatter? This is the world we live in. There's always going to be conspiracy. no matter who gets it, there's going to be conspiracy chatter.

But it's going to be right. Yeah, those are the, those are certainly the teams that would, Utah, Chicago, and to a lesser degree, Montreal, I feel. Because I don't think the NHL wants its players, star players north of the border. No offense to our Canadian brethren. You guys are watching no matter what. In the states, you need stars. So having Bidar go to Chicago was massive for the league.

Having Matthews in Toronto and McDavid and Edmonton, it's not good for the NHL. It's just objectively not because there's more money to be had in America. And you guys are in the bag no matter what you're watching. And in the States, it's not that way. If Matthews was in New York, he'd be the biggest star in the country. In Toronto, he's just a hockey guy. People have heard of it.

So I don't think Montreal gets that kind of conspiracy talk the way that Chicago would, the way that Utah would. Yeah, I agree with you there. last team that I want to bring up, which would be really interesting if they somehow won the lottery would be Calgary. And I say that last because the Flames franchise has been in the NHL since the early 70s. They started in Atlanta and they moved to Calgary in the early 80s. They have never had the first overall pick. Ever in the history of their franchise.

And then I looked this up left. So Calgary, since they've had their team in 1980, have never even so much as pick. in the top three overall in the track. I mean, in some ways, that's the mark of consistent, you know, consistently solid teams, right? Like, you're never that bad. But also, it's like almost mathematically impossible if that's never happened. Sam Bennett is the highest pick they've ever had in Calgary, fourth overall.

Wow. That's kind of crazy, isn't it? That's really, that's like, again, that's mathematically very improbable. Yeah. How about Buffalo? They have the lowest odds that can actually. he jumps number one. Wouldn't you like to see Buffalo just pull that one out after all these years

are just getting so close? Okay. So yes and no. Yes from the, okay, this organization has gone through so much that, I'm sorry, that fan base has gone through so much.

I want to see that fan base enjoy success as much as anything else out there. Okay. But let's stop, think about this for a second. They already picked first overall with Owen Power. They already picked first overall with Raspas Dahlia. They blatantly tanked for McDavid and ended up with Eichel. So they got Reinhardt second overall.

So it's not like they haven't been given the top picks. That's all. But from a fan perspective, my God, they deserve it. Yeah. So I think Columbus and Anaheim are like the feel good versions of this. Like, oh, those franchises could use this the most and deserve it the most. I feel like those would be the good ones. All right.

Tell you what, as we wrap up a little breaking news on your Monday for you, courtesy of TSN's Darren Dregor. And we talked about this with Pierre LeBron, about the coaching carousel, Domino's falling. Well, a playoff team looks like they're going to be looking for a new head coach next year, Las. A Canadian-based playoff team that got bounced in round one is looking for a coach.

That's right, the Winnipeg Jets. Not Toronto, which, and maybe that'll come later this week. but Darren Trigger reporting that Rick Bonas is going to hang him up and step away from coaching. And I really respect that decision. He went through a lot this year with his wife with health concerns. I think it takes an emotional toll to be a coach in a place like Winnipeg. I think you saw it last year when he carved the team.

He tried to get the best out of him. It's emotionally taxing. I think he's probably at the end. But there's an interesting job that just has opened up here with the Winnipeg Jets. Wow. Rick, bonus, man. He has been coaching since I was two years old, and I'm an old man.

He has been in the NHL in some capacity since the mid-70s. It's incredible that he still was a head coach this year and doing a really good job of it. Yeah. That's just a phenomenal career. I don't know, did he never win a cup? Was he an assistant in Tampa in either of those two years or no?

I know he was an assistant in Tampa at one point, but I, He was assistant for 2015 when they were the runner-up and not for the championship years. He never won a cup. No, yeah, I'm looking through his whole list here. He never won a Stanley Cup, which is a damn shame. But what a career he's had. But yeah, that's a sweet job.

He was an assistant in Vancouver in 2011, was he not? He was. He was, indeed. He was the associate head coach. And was he not the head coach in Dallas when they lost in the cup to Tampa? He was. He was, the bubble ears. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He's come close in the last 10 years or so, but no, never won. But that's a primo gig right now because, you know, that core is locked up now. Hellebuck is locked up. It doesn't have the glamour of Toronto, but it's got some of the psychosis and the fan base. I mean that in a loving and best possible way. That's an interesting job. Obviously, you know, there was some uncertainty about the future of the team. Ownership was talking to Chris Johnston earlier this year.

here about, hey, if we don't fill this place up, it's going to be a problem. So that's a factor, but that's a good team. And good teams usually don't have head coach openings. Yeah. And it's a great group of guys that could be on the verge of, you know, taking that next step and being a legitimate Stanley Cup contender. So yeah, this is going to be a fascinating week. So I'm sure by the time the Wednesday edition of the podcast drops in a couple of days

with the two Shans, Gentile and McIndoo, and Frank Corrado's going to join them. I'm sure there's going to be a lot of news that comes out there. By the way, on Wednesday, on the pot on Wednesday, Las,

Corey Prondman's going to drop by with McAdo and Gentilly, chat about the draft lottery results. We'll do a mock draft, all of that, and Corey Promen, I'll jump on with them. Hopefully by Wednesday,

McIndoo will have recovered. Maybe he'll give his side of this story of watching Game 7 at my house. Maybe it'll be a totally different retelling of game seven. Maybe he just hates you forever because he'll just blame you forever. It'd be. I did tell him. End of a 30 year friendship.

That's right. I did tell him as a make good offer, I would come to his house and watch a Dallas Cowboys playoff game at some point. I would be much less respectful of watching a Dallas Cowboys fan than you were. Awesome. Well listen,

Les, safe travels is you bounce between Carolina and New York. We look forward to that coverage because that should be fun series that goes six or seven games. So safe travels between those two cities and hopefully when we talk to you next week, we'll get some more coaching news. We'll get some more news on your series, all of that. Have a great week, man, and we'll hit you up on Monday. Thanks, buddy.