The Athletic Hockey Show - Building Canada and USA Olympic depth charts

Episode Date: December 5, 2025

On today’s Prospect Series episode, the guys work together to create full Olympic depth charts for both Canada and the US, debating the locks, the final spots, and much more.Hosts: Max Bultman, Corey Pronman, and Scott WheelerWith: FloHockey’s Chris PetersExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Chris FlanneryGot a question? Ask it here: t.co/fYieuQEg14Watch full episodes on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowJoin our Discord Server: https://discord.gg/VTm9VjkFSubscribe to The Athletic: https://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Hey, everybody, Max Boltman here, alongside the athletics, Corey Prominent, Scott Wheeler, and Flohockey's, Chris Peters, for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Today is our Olympic Depth Chart debate episode, guys. So similar to what we did on the World Juniors two weeks ago, we're going to talk about, we each came prepared with a 15 forward eight defense, three-golly list of how we would rank Team USA, Team Canada. and we're going to kind of simulate a roster debate here from a management team. So starting right off the top with Canada, there's obviously a lot of consensus. And it helps that we had the Four Nations tournament. We had a starting place.

So no surprise to anyone that Nathan McKinnon, Connor McDavid, Sidney Crosby, Sam Reinhardt, Mitch Marner, Braden Point are in everyone's top nine. Another guy, though, who is in everyone's top nine is Macklin Celebrini. And I wonder, Corey, are we at the place now where we can call Celebrini a lock, which is not something I thought we'd be saying with our chests out on December 3rd a month ago. Yes. I think unquestionably, yes, he's a lock. He's one of the league's offensive leaders.

He has a well-rounded game. He's a top-end skater, top-end competitor. I think he's going to be one of their most important players. Yeah. It felt like coming into the year that that was going to be a debate. It's can you get Macklin Celebrini onto this roster? The number of us that had Celebrini on the first or second line here, And I know it's not necessarily true lines, although I did mine that way a little bit.

I wanted to kind of match out. But, you know, Scott, I mean, it just seems like everyone feels so confident in the complete game of Celebrini that you can play him big minutes at a tournament like this. Yeah. And I think to add to Corey's case, the world championships, I think, helped him too. The fact that he performed at the world championships for hockey Canada, that they felt that they had built some chemistry with Sidney Crosby or whoever else. I think that matters. He's been involved with them. he's not coming in fresh in the way that a Connor Bedard would be coming in a little bit more fresh to to a sort of return to hockey Canada after the world juniors.

So it's, I guess he was sparsely used out of men's world championships. But no, it's, it feels to me like an inevitability at this point. And I think that speaks to everything Corey said, but also just to what he's accomplished at an early age here. Like, it just, it's beyond reproach at this point. Like, it's, it's walked in. Not quite as high on everyone's list, but two more guys that were unanimous, that were not on the Four Nations team for all of us, Mark Schifley and Nick Suzuki.

And, Chris, I think Schifley in particular is a guy who, the first half of this year has really, it's a hard case to argue against, I think what Mark Schaefley has put on tape over the last three months. Yeah, I think that's accurate. You know, I mean, I think there's a lot of things that he brings to the table. that certainly Team Canada is going to be able to use. You know, I think that he's got, you know,

improved two-way capabilities on top of, you know, the offensive attack that he's able to provide. I think, like, if you're looking at building, you know, a third line kind of situation, a player like that goes a long way for you. And so, you know, I think that there's, there's a lot to like about what Shifley can potentially bring to the, to the table.

And, you know, I just think, yeah, he's put himself in a position, a much better position at this point, to be part of this team based on what we've seen over the last little while. Yeah. And Suzuki, I think, was maybe the most impressive player down the stretch last year among the cuts. He picked up right where he left off, too. And so he's put himself in a very good spot. He's everybody's 4C, Scott.

Suzuki deserves it, frankly. I think Suzuki, I think there was a little bit of politics at play in sort of the way that things went down at Four Nations, all of the talk about him not going to men's worlds and not being a regular participant in Hockey Canada's programming. But I think he just deserves to be on the team. You start to look at some of the players that could be subtracted from last year's team, whether it's Travis Keneckney or you go down the list. He's just a better, more impactful player. He plays a premium position. He can play center. He can check. I think him and Seth Jarvis both check at among the highest levels of those who are capable of sort of being a part of the

bottom six for this team Canada. He can play with anybody. I don't think there's much of a reason at this stage, barring politics to keep Suzuki off. And to add on Shifley, the one thing I thought about a lot with Shifley, and I included him on my roster as well, is that this team Canada upfront isn't all that big. And Shifley isn't the hardest player. but Badard, Marner, Suzuki, Sorrelli, Jarvis. Like, there's a lot of 5-11, 6-foot types on this team. And I think it matters that Shifley is 6.3 and 215, 220 pounds. Like, I do think that's an element that Canada actually needs a little bit more of,

especially when you match them side by side what Team USA is going to look like up front. All right. So those are our consensus up front. There's plenty of debate still to be had, even if, It's not so much for, you know, who's on or awful, though we do have a couple of those bubble things that we're going to get into shortly. But also how you use guys. And when you have an all-star team like this, Corey, there's always going to be who do you want to use as a center when, you know, realistically, a bunch of these guys can play center for you. I think that really starts at the three-seat debate. And, you know, Chris has Sidney Crosby there.

I have Anthony Sorrelli. Corey and Scott have Braden Point. So, Corey, why don't you kick us off here? Like, how did you approach this? Why do you have Braden Point as a 3C? And you could use them so many different ways. Yeah, I think first you go through the players, you determine who fits in this group on talent, and then to take it from there, then you have to figure out who's the best fit at center.

I think a point with his two-way play, his skating, his competitiveness, and to go with his skill, I thought of the players that I put on this top 15, I thought he was the one most deserving of the 3C slot. That being said, I think right after I made this roster, I think Sorelli went on. an absolute terror and maybe I'm a little harsh leaving him off the roster. I'm guessing he won't be left off when it's all said and done, given just how well he's played lately. But that was the argument for me there. Like, I think McDavid C's are the top two Cs.

I'd have a hard time getting either of them out of the top two center spots. The only thing I don't like about how this ends up is with Crosby, Point, Suzuki, I guess less with Crosby because he's just so hardworking with. I don't love the idea of Point, Suzuki being both like 5, 10, 511 centers in your bottom six, but I think that's just the roster, and you still got to take the best players, and they have the capabilities of playing hard minutes, defensive minutes, killing penalties, playing competitive style hockey. And that was my lean. I took it as point on that third line, but I put Sorrelli in the middle, and I left all three Tampa guys together. So I've got Hagel, Sorrelli, in point on a line that I think John Cooper, if you put him in a tense situation, that's a line he's going to feel really good about. They have natural chemistry. I think that really matters at a tournament like this. is, you know, whether they have familiarity with the coach or not, they have familiarity with each other, Scott. I do wonder if we might get a little bit carried away by that, like the Taves, Devin Taves, Kail McCar pairing and the Tampa guys, like you, these are the best players in the world.

They can play with each other. They can figure it out. There's something to be said for chemistry in a short period. But I don't know that that has to be the starting point or the knee jerk. Maybe it's something you go to in a pinch. Maybe it's something if the line isn't working that you go to in a pinch. But I think you have to start by building lines that just work. Now, maybe that is that Hegel and Sorelli and Point are together.

But I think that doesn't necessarily, if I'm sitting in that room, that wouldn't be my starting point necessarily. And I think it's tough that in order to get those three Tampa guys together, if you look at Max's Def Chart, you have to take one of Mark Stone or Connor Bedard or Shifley out of the top nine. And I would probably wager. I would wager I'd want one of those guys on pure talent ahead of one of those three players. Which is fair. And you know, you talk about Stone. Like there's a handful of Team Canada guys here that were on the Four Nations roster,

a gold medal winning roster that are very much on the bubble. Sam Bennett, guys, is not on any of these roster. rosters. Mark Stone and Brad Marchand, like it's kind of hit or miss how people have them, how high up they have them. I was the only guy that had Travis Kineckney on my roster among this group. So there is a real bubble here. And for me, and Chris, you could probably speak to this. Like, where I tried to break the ties is, I think this is a tournament that's going to come down to a lot of pace. This was fast hockey. This was tight hockey. Like, I look at Brad Marchon, who's having an amazing year. And if he doesn't have the pace, then I at least need something else.

And for me, that was Mark Stone with the size with the defensive stick. But you can hem and haw that a lot of different ways with this group of guys that are on the bubble. Someone has to come out. If we're all, if we're all putting Celebrini, if we're all putting Suzuki, if we're all putting Shifley and if we're all putting Connor Bedard in, two, three, four of these guys are coming off. Yeah, you know, and if the arena is as short as it's going to be, I don't know necessarily.

Like, is pace going to matter in a smaller surface as much as heaviness? I mean, that's going to be the real question I think they're talking about right now is, you know, there's no room to move already. So how do you combat that? And I think, you know, there's going to be mixed opinions on that. I think USA is pretty clearly going with heavy. And Canada can counter that however they want to, either heavy on heavy or with speed. You know, and that's why a reason that I have, you know, a Brad Marchand on my roster and on my depth chart, just because I think that he's, he is going to give you some of those little extra things while still being able to contribute offensively and having a recent Stanley Cup performance in his back pocket. You know, I think that you need somebody that's going to needle the opposition a little bit.

And he can do that where you still are, you're not giving away a ton on skill. But, you know, to when we were talking about Shifley, the size factor is really intriguing here as we look at can. You know, my depth chart, anybody's. depth chart is that you are kind of struggling to find that size. And obviously, Brad Marchand doesn't help you in that department either. So, you know, there's a lot of different things that kind of are going to be decided. But if this is a smaller ice surface, I do think that there is going to be an emphasis on some of that heavy hockey. And that does open the door, I feel like, more widely for a Mark Stone who wasn't on my list. But, you know, the more you think about it, the more maybe he

makes sense there. Yeah, he makes sense a lot for me in that third line role. I just think he offers too much to that group. And I think what he's been healthy, the big issue for them has been health. But if he's healthy, I think the skill, compete combination there will be really exciting. What I don't get at this team can debate is all the Tom Wilson stuff I've heard discussed. Chris probably could talk to this more than I have. He's covered more a double H of turdance than me.

If there's so many guys in the mix, and I understand that that USA Canada game is going to be really physical and really intense. But I don't think Tom Wilson is the kind of guy who double IHF refs are going to look favorably on. And I think he's a guy that could easily get candid into penalty trouble in a metal round game. Aren't they using NHL refs? They are.

They are. But I would say that the standard, like the penalties are different. So like the contact to the head is automatic. Like if you have that, you could lose a player. for the game. We've seen it happen plenty of times over the years. So there's, there, their, their, their NHL refs, we'll probably call it more NHL style,

but the, the level of penalty is different and the standard is different in the double IHF. The reason I, I think with Tom Wilson, it comes back to this, this heaviness that I think is going to be there. The other thing is Tom Wilson's actually also a, I think a really good skater and a guy that is going to play the game at the pace that this is a great player. I just mean, the rationale for why people think he needs to be on this team. I mean, yeah. Yeah, it's heavy hockey. I mean, I think the thing is is that he, it's not just about hard body checks.

I think it's how hard he is to take off the puck, how hard he is to stop going to the middle. Those are going to be the things like the game is still going to be one between the dots and guys like him are going to help you get to the interior more, I think. You know, just with with kind of sheer aggression. Now I have him on the very tail end of my depth chart. I think he's on the bubble. But at the same time, I think as you're kind of making that calculus, like the other thing is too, like look at the goals this year. I mean, he's scoring a ton this season. You know, like there's, he's playing really well.

He's a great player. Yeah. So I mean, I do think that the risk, the penalty risk is huge in international play, power plays and everything are going to make a huge difference. I think if, you know, Tom Wilson, I think people sometimes think maybe he can't help himself. when it comes to some of the physical stuff. If they can kind of get him an understanding of the mentality it's going to take to play at this level and the focus it's going to take to play at this level,

then I think that he does still make sense. I just feel like this happens a lot in these tournaments. And I know even the team in Canada coaching staff is going to be in the middle, when the medal realm comes around the world juniors in a couple of weeks, I think they're going to be closing their eyes every time KShod Atchison's out there on the ice and hoping he doesn't do anything stupid in this.

finals. Or Brady Martin, if that makes the team. Yeah. Scott, why don't you make the case for Brad Marchand? Because he is having such a great year here, and yet he's not on all of our rosters. Yeah, my final roster debate was Brad Marchand versus Tom Wilson. So it doves tails nicely out of the conversation we just had. I just felt like push comes to shove hockey Canada loves Brad Marchand. And it's easy to see why they love him. He's having a year that I think qualifies him. to be on the team in terms of his play. I think he's been, given all of the injuries, I think he's been excellent, debatably,

for it as best forward this season. They were playing the Leafs last night. I tuned into the game and he was their best forward in that game. Like, he's just, he's so consistently good and has been so consistently good for, for Team Canada, that even with players that we all agree should be on the team of head of him, like Seth Jarvis, who we talked about before. Like, I'm not sure the Canadian brass are going to make that same decision.

Like, I'm not sure they've, they view Brad Marchand as a bubble guy. A year ago, wasn't he won it for the Four Nations, wasn't he one of their original six players that was named? Or am I misremembering that? I don't remember, but your point stands. Like he's a legacy guy who I think like he's built up a lot of goodwill. He was coming out of the conversation is if he took a step back this year

and he started to show his age. And if some of those things happened, then you start to have more of a conversation about Martian. I think if he played well enough to be on the team, that they were going to find a way to be on the team. for him to be on the team. So that's kind of where I, where I landed with Brad. And I think he belongs just like the rest of the sort of bubble guys do. All right. So just looking at my notes here, we are agreed that Nathan McKinnon, Connor McDavid, Sidney, Mitch Marner, Sam Reinhardt,

Macklin-Cellarine-Clein-Point, Mark Schifley, Mark Stone, Nick Suzuki, Anthony Sorrelli, Connor Bedard, and Seth Jarvis are on the team. I think, Corey, that leaves our debate, really down to, based on what we've all just talked about. It sounds like we're at Marshaun versus Tom Wilson. Yeah, and I think they both bring a lot of things to the table that you like. They both bring skill and speed. They bring some nasty in their game. The big difference is that you, you know, one, Marchand was obviously on this team at the Four Nations Stanley Cup champion.

And there's a size differential there. There's a physicality differential there between him and Wilson. My guess is just based on how he's played this year, how he played in the playoffs last. spring and just as experience with hockey Canada, my guess is the lean here would be towards Marchand. But my guess the one reason why I think they might go the other way is that if they're bringing Suzuki, if they're bringing, especially Seth Jarvis, are you bringing too many small players there?

I think like Jarvis, and if we had this kind of issue with Jarvis and Kine and Marchand at the tournament of the Four Nations, I kind of feel like they all kind of cancel each other roll out a little bit, whereas Wilson would bring something a little bit more unique. Yeah. Chris, I know you're the Wilson guy. Do you want to make a, what final case? Yeah. I mean, like, I think there's a couple of things here.

And Corey mentioned some of them. I think the size thing is huge. I've mentioned the heavy hockey on. And then on top of it, you've got Tom Wilson playing the best hockey of his career. I mean, he's on a 49 goal pace right now in, in what he's in this season. He does bring a different element. And, you know, I think it, to me, I have a hard time arguing against Marchand as well.

He was ahead of Seth Jarvis on my depth chart. And that's going to be interesting to kind of see how this debate all ends up playing out in real life. But I think that the combination of things with how physical Wilson is, the way that he's playing this season, the pace that he plays at, the imposing nature of his game, especially on a smaller ice surface. I think that that goes a long way. And it's not just about, you know, you're building a team to beat Team USA. Like, that's what we all kind of feel like. But I think he's going to help you really intimidate other opponents. He's going to make sure that you have, you know, anybody that's kind of coming near him is going to have to have their head up.

And yes, you do have to be careful about the penalty situation. He's going to have to play not restrained, but, you know, smart and, and do that. So to me, because of the nature of the difference that he brings to your lineup, that's why I would. would have Tom Wilson and I would have them in my regular lineup too. He wouldn't be on the bench for me. He would be in the everyday lineup. Well, let me ask this. Is there anyone that would be willing to take Jarvis off and take both Marchand and Tom Wilson? Doesn't sound like that. No. I mean, aside from me. So you would do that. We already knew me. We already knew me. I could be talked into it. I mean, I think these are both legacy kind of players that, you know,

Wilson less so, but I can see the argument about like there's redundancies in Marchand and Seth Jarvis. I didn't think Jarvis didn't play his way out of the lineup, though. Like, he's been good in the NHL. He's been a playoff performer. I thought he was, you know, of all those kind of guys I mentioned who were similarly rolled at the four nations, I thought he was arguably the best of the three. So I don't know if he's played his way off this roster. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't think so either. I mean, I think that's the, that's the hard part when we get to these discussions. I think right now it's all about roster structure and. balance and whatever else. But I would agree. I think Jarvis has every reason to believe that he

should be on this team. Yeah. All right. Well, then let's vote. Everyone who wants Brad Marchand on this team, raise your hand too. I'm going to vote with Chris on Tom Wilson and we're going to have a tie. Anyone, we could bring back the old super vote from last, I don't know if it was this summer or what. Anyone feel really strongly and they want to pound the table and hammer this? No, but I can, like I said, I could be persuaded on Wilson. Like, I'd be on the fence, so I'll come onto your side with Wilson so we can move on here. That's good radio right there. I quit.

I forfeit. I think it'll be, I think there's a chance both of them will be on, but I do think Brad's going to be on the team in the end, but I'm okay with Wilson for our team. All right. So then the last thing we should talk about with these forwards here before we get to the D is Connor Bedard and the role. see him. Scott, I think you have him in the top six. All the rest of us have him more fourth line, 13th forward. That's different than how we're talking about Celebrini. And I think there are the people listening that want to know like, why is that, so why are we talking about Macklin Celebrini as like a, hey, top six guy and Connor Bedard is a 13th forward, Corey.

Some mild differences, you know, at the end of the day, this is still a roster of the very, very best players in the NHL. And I think people will reasonably look at Badard and say, well, he's top five in the NHL and scoring right now. He's a, does that mean? I mean he's a top five player in the NHL. I probably wouldn't go that far yet. He's probably a top 5, 10 player in the NHL right now in terms of his pure offensive abilities. His skill is offensive sense, his goal scoring ability. Like I think he probably fits a, you probably want to find a way to get him onto a power play unit if your team Canada.

I do worry a little bit about the frame. I think his skating is pretty good. I don't think it's elite for his size. I don't think his physicality is elite for his size. and when you start, you start asking about the guys he has to knock off. Like, are you knocking off Sam Reinhard, who's been a playoff performer for the last two springs? Are you knocking off Mitch Marner, who's also a prolific player, much more developed body, much more of a two-way game? You can keep going down in terms of, you know, the guys that he needs to beat out to be in the top nine.

At least with celebrating, you could say, yes, he does play that fast. He is that strong. He is that competitive. He can win that many battles against these grown men on top. USA who are big and strong and are very physical. That's the question for me. I think that's going to be the obvious question for Team Canada and putting the roster together.

But if you put him in the top six, top nine and the argument, it's just that you feel like he's so above the other candidates offensively that you just have to. And I think there's a reasonable debate that he is based on what he's shown so far in the first half of the season. All right, let's go now to the team Canada defense and goalies. And again, a lot of agreement here. Everybody's got Caleb McAves,

Josh Morrissey, Thomas Harley, one of the breakout stars of the Four Nations. There are a few players, though, who are whether they're returners or whether they're kind of legacy players who someone had an issue with. So, Corey, you didn't have Drew Dowdy on your list. Why was that? I think Drew Dowdy is great. And when we did this conversation in the couple months ago, I had him in there. But for me, the difference is, one, you're going to have a healthy Shia Thadol this time around.

And two, I think Jacob Chikrin has been that good. in the first half of the season. And I think he brings everything you want in a team Canada offense. He's got great feet. He's big. He works hard. He has significant offense. He can move a puck.

He's got the big point shot. I think he offers a lot to this team. And I know he wasn't even on the initial camp roster. But for me, I think it's not about less about Dowdy and more just about how good Chickren has been in the first half of the season. I think he deserves to be in this conversation. Yeah. Scott, you didn't have on the flip side of that, Colton Pareko.

Yeah, I didn't have Pereco, Sanheim. There were a couple of guys from last year's roster that I just felt weren't really in the mix. And McKenzie Weeger, who we talked about as someone that could be a sort of number eight a couple of months ago when we did this, I think, has played his way out of the mix. So the group of players that I was strongly considering kind of shrunk over the course of this season. and the only name that sort of usurped someone that jumped into this group outside of the eight that I had previously was swapping Matthew Schaefer in. I've got the same seven defensemen otherwise. And I think Schaefer, much like Jacob Chikrin has played his way into the mix, I think Matthew Schaefer has played his way into the mix. And I think if you were playing Matthew Schaefer at some point in the tournament 15, 16 minutes a night, I think he's more than capable of handling his own. And he has shown that with his skating and the way that he thinks the game that he's, I think, ready for this.

maybe not for starring in this, but I think he, there's a, there's, there are minutes that he could play in this event. So, uh, I felt that Schaefer was sort of the last guy on for me. I had Matthew Schaefer as my last guy on too. And, and for me, it came at the expense of Shea Theodore, which I didn't feel great about. But I just look at the rest of the Canada depth chart and I see Thomas Harley, Josh Morrissey. Like, I see Devon Taves even. Like, I see guys who are similar toolkits to what Shea Theodore brings, who I like more. And so at that point, it was.

Let me reach for the dynamic element of Matthew Schaefer. I know he's very young. And Corey, maybe that's why you and Chris probably didn't have him on. But that, to me, was my argument with Schaefer. He at least brings that special quality. He's extremely talented. But, man, he's 18 years old. And I know how good he's been to start the NHL season.

And we'll get to team USA. But I really like what USA's manager, Bill Guerin, said. He was asked about this. It's like this is not a pee-wee trial. It's not about who had two good months. It's a thorough player evaluation. You've got to look at the body of work. You've got to look where the toolkits are right now.

And, you know, Matt Schaefer has an 18-year-old's body. And, you know, I think you'd be fine against Slovakia and Switzerland and teams like that. But I don't know how he's going to do when the Kachuk brothers are bringing down his neck in a metal round game. Like, that would concern me a little bit. And I think if you asked me to go two, three, four more names, he would be there. but I just had eight other names I'd prefer to bring at this stage. And but I think if we're talking about, you know, this is 2026. If this was a 2028 tournament, I absolutely could see him be in the conversation.

Are we that much more confident that Colton Pereko or Travis Sandheim with some of those players breathing down their neck are aren't? I'd rather have I'd rather have Pereko killing penalties than Schaefer. They've got put, they're going to have plenty of guys who can kill penalties. like Colton Pereco hasn't scored a goal this season. They don't have anyone else like Colton Pereco anywhere on this roster. Like they don't have anyone with his level of physicality on this defense score. Or maybe Drew Doughty. Or it's close to the size too.

Like, yeah. And his skating, like he's a pretty unique. Like he's going to be a tough one for them to leave off. Even if he's just like a seven, like, I know he's like his offense is very limited. And if you ask him to make a pass more than 10 feet at this level, you're asking him probably too much. But I think you got to have someone like that on your team. that to me is more valuable than making a pass at this level

and executing at this level is more valuable than adding toughness on the back end to this. Like Devin Taves can penalty kill. Kale McCar can penalty kill. These are the best players in the world. I don't think they're going to be short. I don't know that you want McCar penalty

killing in a gold medal game. He can do it in the NHL. Perico is like eight inches taller, man. I'd rather kill McCar with the chips on the table in any situation than Colton Pereco. Like it's... I think that's completely insane.

Inserting size and... That's not how penalty kills work. It's not about like skill. Like you got to have big guys who go block shots and win... He penalty kills on the best team in the league. Yeah, he's awesome. Penalty kills on the very best team in the NHL right now. Where does Colorado's penalty kill rank relative to St. Louis's penalty kill?

Like, what do you mean? These are the world's best players. He's not going to be on a penalty kill there. Like, I mean, he's just not. I mean, that's the thing is like you do have to still build roles. He's not going to play 30 minutes a game. And for nor would Matthew Schaefer would be. We're not bringing Matthew Schaefer to penalty kill either.

And nor would be Evan Bouchard, right? So it's not like everyone's going to PK, but I don't think you're bringing Colton Prego for a totally different job than you're talking about from some of these other guys. I just think that Josh Morrissey and Drew Doughty and all of these guys can do that job. Yeah. And there's enough got like obviously Evan Bouchard is a different. conversation, but the rest of these guys can penalty kill and do

penalty kill with all of their NHL teams. I have some concerns on Theodore being a penalty killer on this team. I'd have like some, even like I said, like I don't know, like he's yet, even like Morrissey and McCar, like I said, it's, it's like, can they do it? Yes.

Can they do it at the highest possible level in hockey when you really need to want to be a stopper? Like, that's where I think the debate comes in and why you prefer at least somebody who's a hard defenseman on this team, even though, like, you are giving back a lot in terms of the puck play. Like, I get, like, it's less about the penalty kill and more about the even strength impact.

Like, would you rather have Schaefer playing 10 even straight minutes or rather have Pareco playing 10 even straight minutes? It's more of the debate there for me. But in terms of the PK ability, like, I think that's clearly a role that's lacking on this team with the group right now. There are going to be one, if not two, kichucks on the ice when Team USA is on the power play. And I need a defenseman bigger than six foot one. back there, at least one of them on the ice

for when there's down low battles and retrievals. Like, I just can't have it all beyond Josh Morrissey, Devon Taves. Great players, like Norris candidate players, but if one or two of the Kachucks are out there, I need someone with size. Yeah, Harley's big, but he's not hard either. And when Colton Pereko coughs a puck up in the slot

to Kyle Connor or Austin Matthews or any of the number of shooters, like there's give and take with every hockey player. You take the players who are going to drive play and win their minutes. And I don't think Colton Perrako's up to that task. But nobody's driving play on the penalty kill. No one is.

Like the whole point is getting icing and get off the ice. Yes. And the best players in the game find ways out of trouble in the defensive zone and make plays on the penalty kill. Like it's, I don't know. I think we're grossly overstating the value of a player like Colton Pereko at this kind of an event. Like Drew Dought. Drew Doughty has played how many hundreds of penalty kill minutes has Drew Doughty played in his career successfully?

Like it's... And he'd be a good candidate. He'd be candid for that. Also, I would just guess as well, given who the manager of team Canada is, that Piraeco probably could have been there. Just a hunch. But this is our list. Like, this is not predicted. This is our formulation.

Let's go to Evan Bouchard. This is a related conversation with Evan Bouchard, frankly. So let's just go there now. He's on both Scott and Corey's list. He's not on either of Chris and mine. Scott, like you're already kind of making the case, I think, as you are. But go ahead and make Bouchard's case. Yeah, I just think the case for Bouchard's the same one as it was previously.

I think he's the perfect sort of number seven, number eight guy for this group because he gives you an option on the power play. If a Cail McCar gets injured or a Josh Morrissey gets injured, he immediately becomes an upgrade over Shai Theodore, who runs the power play in Vegas. And some of those guys, there's just a level gap there on the power play for me. more of one with Evan Bouchard on the power play than with Colton Pereco on the penalty kill for me. And I think he's proven it over the last two players. He got off to a, like, let's be honest, he got off to a really rough start to this year.

I think he's been much better recently. But I think he's shown enough over the last two playoff runs, especially the playoff run two years ago, that he can be a guy for you. Is he going to be playing 20 minutes a night on the back end for Team Canada at this event? No, I don't think the coaching staff will trust him to play that kind of a role. But I think him as an option as a backup as a number seven, number eight makes a lot of sense. Yeah, there is an argument to be made that if Kail McCar is for any reason unable to be in a game, if he's hurt or whatever else, like Evan Bouchard is the guy who would elevate the team the most because he could be an elite power play quarterback.

There might not be another elite power play quarterback in this bunch, Chris. No, probably not. I mean, and I just think that there's the one-dimensional nature, you know, I think is really the separating factor. and why I didn't have Bouchard on there. I think you can have specialists in this. Like, you know, I mean, if we're going to spend a lot of time talking about Colton Percos penalty killing abilities, you have to talk a lot about Evan Bouchard's value on the power play. I mean, Cal McCar once went to a world junior as basically only a power play guy.

You know, so I think that there are opportunities to utilize that player. You know, in the end, I just think, you know, I look at various options of what they have. and I feel like you're getting a bit more versatility from some of the other guys. You know, it's, I did debate having Bouchard over Doughty on my final list. You know, he's, I basically added two extra defensemen below on my death chart just because, you know, to kind of really make sure that I, you know, as I saw all, you know, all of them there, all 10 of them there, what it looked like and, you know, ultimately decided that that versatility was going to win out. But I think that to Scott's point, you know, you lose. McCar for any amount of time, you really are starting to feel like, hey, we could have had somebody better on the power play. And that's where that debate comes in. All right. So I think we've got

seven solved based on everybody's lists. Devon Taves, Kail McCar, Josh Morrissey, Drew Dowdy, Thomas Harley, Colton Perrako, and Shea Theodore are on. We have one spot to give between Jacob Chikrin, Evan Bouchard, Matthew Schaefer, and Travis Sandheim. So we're going to have to vote there. So I guess all in favor of Chikrin hand up. Just Corey.

All in favor of Evan Bouchard hand up. All in, okay, Scott is in favor of Bouchard. Matthew Schaefer hand up. One to one to one to one. And I guess we know where that's going for. Oh, wait. Who's that a hand for?

Well, for the only player left. Travis Sanheim. Travis Hanheim. Yeah. Okay. All right. So we're one to one to one to one. I would be pretty inclined to flip to Sanheim if I was going to flip mine.

But does anyone want to flip theirs first? All right. So I'll vote with Chris. Travis Sandheim is our eighth player. And that's our defense court. Devon Taves, Kail McCar, Josh Morrissey, Drew Doughty, Thomas Harley, Colton Pereko, Travis Sanheim, Shea, Theodore. Scott's given a grimace, man.

you're not thrilled. I don't. Travis Sanheim would have been fourth. Like I would have gone Bouchard, Schaefer, chik, any of those three over over Sanheim, but that's all right. All right. We are debating the guy that,

the guys that are probably going to have the least amount of ice time on this team. So, yeah. The only thing we have left on Team Canada is the goalie. And it's a short debate because almost all of us have the same grouping, Logan Thompson, Jordan, Bennington, and Darcy Kemper. But Corey, you have Aidan Hill. So I wanted to at least give you, you've already been outvoted, frankly,

but I wanted to at least give you the chance to make the case for Aden Hill here over Darcy Kemper. Just like the athleticism there, but if you really all felt confident that Kemper could be the three again, I'm talking about the three here. I think for me, the more interesting debate is who we think is the starter. Because I think Thompson deserves to be the starter. It's just going to be so hard for Team Canada to go away from the guy who delivered them the gold medal a year ago. And I get it. He's been horrible this year.

He's been one of the worst goalies in the league. to start it out. And maybe that will sway them. Maybe they'll get to camp and be like, Thompson's just way better. But don't you think no matter what Bennington's getting game one? Oh, yeah.

I mean, and as, as, you know, as an American, I think that's a great call. I'm right there with Corey. I think it should be, I think it should be Thompson. On merit, yes. The one calculus sort of mistake that they made in this entire process

was just bringing three goalies to their summer summit. whatever you want to call it. That backed them into a corner. And now two of those goalies, I would argue, have played their way completely out. Like Sam Montaumbotambo isn't even – talk about the worst goalie in the league. Sam Montaumbotambo isn't even in the conversation. So they should have just brought five – they brought a ton of defensemen and a ton of forwards.

They should have brought five or six goalies in the summer. I think that was silly in hindsight. All right. So that's Team Canada. We're going to take a quick break. We'll come back with Team USA. All right. we are back and the draw for next summer's World Cup is on Friday at 12 p.m. Eastern.

You can watch the Athletic FC podcast live stream reacting to all the major fallout immediately after the draw has wrapped on their YouTube channel. Make sure you check that out. It should be exciting. Now let's hit Team USA. And once again, a ton of consensus high in the lineup. I think the top nine is pretty much consensus for everyone. The Cuchuk brothers, Jack Eichel, Austin Matthews, Jack Hughes, Dylan Larkin, Matt Bowley, Kyle Connor, all unanimous in everyone's top nine, Jake Gensel and almost everyone's and really not that far down anywhere else. Everyone has Tage Thompson somewhere on this team. I think that's notable.

But really, again, what we're talking about here is the guys who are at the four nations and who are now kind of on the bubble. And so J.T. Miller is the most obvious case of that. I think most of us kept him on. But Scott, you've got him off your roster. Yeah, there were a few of those guys, whether it was Nelson, Miller, Trocheck, who I just think have been outplayed over the course of this season. Like, I think Jason Robertson's been better. I like Shane Pinto as sort of a fifth center.

I think Alex DeBrinkechette has played his way into the conversation. Cole Coughfield has played his way into the conversation. And despite the fact that a Coffield's a little bit smaller and a Dubrinkechitz a little bit smaller, I don't think this team is wanting for size. Like, they don't have to search for it maybe quite like Team Canada did. And I don't think that necessitates bringing a player like a J.T. Miller. They've got the Cichuk brothers, Austin Madd. Matthews.

Like, they've, they've, if Tage Thompson's on all of our rosters, I know he's not the hardest player, but he brings, certainly brings size. Um, so for, for me, that was the calculus was just, A, I don't think J.T. Miller has played particularly well this season. And B, I don't think you're desperately wanting for what he brings to the roster. He's got plenty of skill, though. Like, he's, like, this is like a, you know, a guy who has a pretty prolific scoring. Yeah.

Yeah. He's not like a grinder. No, but he hasn't produced nearly in line with any of those, like any of those players this year or last year. Sure. Yeah, and his role, his role on Team USA would be a grinder. Like,

yeah, that would be his role. If he's, I don't know if Cole Cofield's a grinder. He's not, but like that's the thing is like J.T. Miller, if you're looking for that,

that's, that may be that, that, as I built this team, I was like, oh boy, like the reason J.T. Miller ended up,

up on my depth chart is largely because I was like, well, if nothing else, he might not, he at least plays a hard nose brand of hockey typically, not all the time. You know, this year is definitely not been his best showing. But I mean, I do think, you know, I look at kind of my roster. Like, wow, there's a lot of, there's an awful lot of skill there. You know, how many guys are going to, you know, really be able to do it at both ends against a Canadian team that's going to be quick. and if they do have some size, you know, like a guy like a Tom Wilson, you know, I would not want to be in the same corner as Tom Wilson and Cole Cawfield at that point. But either way, you know, I think it's going to be really interesting to see, you know, Bill Garron has tipped his hand that heaviness is is going to loom large in the decision process here.

I took him on mine, partly because, you know, he was on the team last year. I think Mike Sullivan, who is now his head coach with the Rangers. And that may be a good or a bad thing based on how J.T. Miller has. played this season. But I think obviously that that's going to help the familiarity. And I think he's just a guy who you can put in a bunch of different situations. If you needed him to play center, and we've talked about you really don't have to force that on these superstar teams because a lot of guys can play center. But it's less true of Team USA than it is Team Canada. There's more places to put J.T. Miller in a pinch than there are for me like a Jason Robertson. And that's a guy who was popular. I did not have on mine. And I know he's been super productive, but there's just only, I'm not going to put him on a fourth line that I'm expecting to check.

It's really it would only be if something came up in the top six. And that was the thing I grappled with with Jason Robertson, Corey. Yeah, and I probably wouldn't have him in my top 12. I think he's one of my reserves. But his skating is so bad that I think unless he's in your top nine, you think he's going to play regular even strength and power play for you. It's going to be tough to fit him into the lineup. I put nyes on my fourth line because I like the heaviness there.

but as I've thought about it since then, and obviously with Toronto struggles this season, I wonder if they would go a different direction there. But I feel like with fourth line guys that fit that role, like I said, Kayla doesn't really fit that. Tage Thompson doesn't really fit that. Cofield doesn't really fit that.

So if Garon wants to build a heavy team, I don't know if the bubble can, it's if there's a lot of guys who really fit that description. Yeah. And if we stick talking about returners, like Vincent Trocheck is another guy, of course, that I don't think you had on yours.

And I have him on mine. Chris has him on his. I don't think Scott had him. But Scott, why don't you start that on this one? Why know Vincent Trocheck? I just, another one,

him, tuck, like, I just think some of those guys have been outplayed. Like, I just think you start to look at the options, and I think they've been outplayed.

And I think there is room for a Caulfield or a Debrinket in place of a guy, like a tuck or a, or a trocheck or a Miller in that you do. start to look at, okay, PP1, you kind of know the names, but PP2, there isn't really that sort of, Tage Thompson maybe if he's sort of on PP2 on the flank. There isn't really a dynamic flank player, I think, left for PP2. So that's kind of where I factored in a Cole Cawfield a little bit more than a trocheque or a tuck or one of the, Matthew Nyes.

I don't think Matthew Nyes has played well this season, but I don't think he's quite there in terms of level yet. Um, but it had one name I wish I would have put on there was Nelson. Like now that I'm thinking about it, I probably, instead of Nyes, it probably should have had Nelson in there just based on the different elements, probably better skater than Nyes too. I just thought Nelson had such a tough time last year. Like I, he, I, maybe, maybe that was just me writing him off a year ago,

but I, I kind of took him off my roster last year and hadn't really thought about him, thought about him since. Yeah, he's, it's so interesting. He's, he's, he's an interesting one because I thought about him for a really long time. before leaving him off as well. The other factor is this is the hidden factor. This definitely doesn't matter is, you know, the whole Rozo element. If USA hasn't won a gold medal without a player from Rozo on the team.

Or not Roseau, sorry. War-O-R-R-R-O-D. Oh, my gosh, that was a terrible mistake. War-Od from the team. So, wow, please, Minnesota, don't come for me. War-Od, I understand. You know, but on top of that, like, yeah, I actually thought the Four Nations to me was a bit underwhelming for Brock.

And I have tremendous amount of respect for a player that, you know, it took me a long time to warm up to. And boy, he's had just a tremendous career. I think he has that versatility that USA may want in its depth. And he very well could be there. But, you know, I agree with,

you know, there's just some elements that just didn't fit for me. I probably think the most competitive player, if you're looking, maybe not the heaviest player, because I think Nelson would, provide that combination of heaviness and size, probably the most competitive player is probably Cooley.

Like, I think the way he plays, the way he can get inside, the way he can win battles. Like, I think when you see how he's played this year, I think I'd be surprised if he's not on this team in some capacity. Like he's just,

even as a young player, I think more than Keller, more than Calfield. Like, I think he's the one that should, has played his weight into this conversation. Well, basically where we're at here is we've just mentioned,

mentioned a bunch of different names. And we have two winger spots on the fourth line. And then we have our fifth line, quote unquote. And that we have so many names to choose from here. So it's kind of hard to get a handle on all of it. But let's try to vote here and get some consensus. Based on the list everyone submitted, we're going to put J.T. Miller and Cole Coughfield in. And then the guys we have to decide between are Logan Cooley, Brock Nelson, Matthew Nyes, Vincent Trocheck, and Clayton Keller. And we had Shane Pinto, Alex Tuck got mentions, but not nearly enough, I think, to even put them in this vote.

I think, Corey, your Cooley idea has some merit. And it sounds like Chris is on board with that. Is everyone cool if we go with Logan Cooley on this roster? Cool, I'm good with it. And Corey, you know, the point about him being a center sticks here. Because right now I think we have Tage Thompson as a center here. There may be a world where Team USA wants. We'd rather have Logan Cooley centering a fourth.

flight than Tage Thompson. I think there's a word with Buffalo Sabres or rather have Tage Thompson on the wing than at center right now. So I think there's, I have a hard time imagining Tage Thompson being the fourth line center on TV USA. I just can't see it happening. Sabers fans will tell you that Tage Thompson's best hockey has been played at center and not at the wing, but yeah, I tend to agree. I know we're not like unanimous on Vincent Trocheck, but he's a guy that I think could, you know,

help team USA's brass sleep easier if he's on this team too. Do we have opposition to Vincent Trocheck on this team? A lot of shaking. I'm okay with Procheck. All right. So I think to me, when we have Cole Coughfield, when we have Kyle Connor, I only want to take one of Clayton Keller or Jason Robertson. So let's have that debate here. Anyone want to make the case for Jason Robertson?

Sounds like an easy debate. All right. So we're Keller then. Chris, you had him pretty high on your list. Why Keller? Yeah, you know, I just think that he is a facilitator. I think he can really make guys around him better. I think he's a he he's a heady player.

I don't think that he shies away from the physical games. Yes, he doesn't have size, but I do think that he, you know, is, is a competitor. He's going to make plays. You know, he was pretty disappointed to not make the Four Nations team last year. And I think he was one of the later cuts of that of that team. You know, he had a 90-point season last year, not quite at that same pace this year. and now he's, you know, dealing with the unfortunate and untimely passing of his father as well. But to me, Clayton Keller answered the call last year was part of that gold medal team at the

World Championship. I don't think that you use Olympic spots as rewards for that necessarily. But I think that that was a moment that was significant for Team USA, for him as well, to go there. And then also just kind of having had that success, I do think matters. So there's a number of things there. but for me, I think that Clayton Keller is the kind of guy that's going to make other players better. He's going to help Team USA score goals by the way he can drive play. So I just felt like he is in this mix of players.

He belongs in this mix of players. You know, I could certainly be swayed, but I just think you look at kind of the some of the guys that are in the mix. And you think about Caulfield and Connor and others, and I was like, you know, I think having a Clayton Keller or somebody or along the lines that can, you know, and you'd have to have a bigger center, but, you know, have somebody that, you know, can get those guys the puck and I think he could. Yep.

On a tangent there, Chris, like, I know we have them on the roster and we, I love Cole Cofield. I've been a huge Cole Cofield fan for a long time. You know Bill Garron. Is there any way he's bringing Cole Cofield into the 3rd and 12 of this team?

Yeah, that's, that's the thing. I, I am very skeptical of that. You know, and I think he's, he's been pretty open about, the way he wants to build this team.

I don't necessarily agree. You know, like, because I think that with goal scoring at a premium, it'd be hard to leave one of your best goal scorers off. I think Scott said as a text that when he, that they're kind of opening the door for another just an applicator situation here. Oh, man.

But none of these guys are just an abdlocator. Like these are, these are all NHL all star players that we're talking. This is a different player pool than Team USA's had in. Well, don't, don't, hey, hang on a second there, Max. don't don't be shocked if somebody

comes out of left field that we aren't even talking about like a Brian Ruffling like a Brian Russ or something like that Well yeah and actually Brian Russ still wouldn't be He's like doubled Ablocator's career high and yeah Yeah it's just

No offense to just an applicator Who's a very nice person He's a great guy Former Cedar Rapids Rough Rider You know yeah Michigan State's bringing Chris Crider back or something Like who you know Yeah I mean that like again

I think there's there is a world where that is a possibility. And maybe that's where Brock Nelson kind of fits into this debate as well in terms of, you know, maybe, maybe you're sliding him in and that's, I'm not saying that he's at that level. I think he's, you know, he's having a great season. So, you know, he makes sense if he's, he's in the options. But I do think like when you, like to the outside world, Cole Cawfield seems like an obvious guy to the way that they're building this team. He very much is on the bubble. He is on ours, though. And so the, the, the one last decision. we have to make here is Brock Nelson or Matthew Nyes for one of these two spots. Nelson does have

the center thing, but with Cooley and Trochec already in place, my lien would be for the physicality with Nyes. He's also having a better year. He's younger. I know Scott what you said about not being ready to be kind of at this Olympic level. I would take him here. For the role, especially with all the small scorers you have, I would pound the table for Matthew Nyes. I'd lean Nyes over now. I'm not, I'm not excited about either of those. players being on the Olympic roster, but I would lean Nyes over Nelson based off what we saw. At least in Nyes, you know exactly what you're getting, which is a heavy below the goal line for checking, dig in the dirty areas and get guys the puck player.

I don't think you're starting him in your top 12, but if you have to insert him under your fourth line, I think you have a better idea of what you're going to get, even maybe more than the more veteran in Nelson, who you just don't quite know if he's at this level. either. Scott Corey, any objections to Nyes? All right, Matthew Nyes, welcome to our team USA. Yeah, I do wonder when it comes down to it if they start looking at the certain qualities, and you mentioned the world championships. I wonder about Nazar because of the year he's having, because of the energy level he plays at, I wonder if he leaps some of these skill guys, these more traditional skill guys. I do think the last month for Nazar has probably

ended that conversation. Like I, I was hurt. Last time we did, even before that, he, he was not playing, like he cooled off considerably

and was not playing well and they were cutting his minutes. And I think that, I thought coming into the year, we mentioned it the last time we had this chat. I thought he was kind of a dark horse, but I don't know whether he still is.

He basically, he's kind of like the Seth Jarvis type of player that Canada has. So that would be the argument. All right, let's go to the D now and honestly, even more so than the forwards. There's a lot of consensus here. We all got Quinn Hughes, Charlie McAvoy, Jacob Slavin, Jake Sanderson, Zach Werenski, Brock Favor. The debates are pretty simple.

There's an obvious one that's Adam Fox. We'll get to that in a second. But Noah Hannafin did not make it on to a whole lot of these projections guy. Chris, you're the only guy that had Noah Hannafin on these rosters. Corey, why not Noah Hannafin? I just think there have been other players this season. that have leaped what he can bring. I think Hughes skates just as well,

if not better than him. Brings just as much, if not more offense than him. Happened maybe a little bit harder, a defender. But I think Hughes brings more elements. I think that Jones brings some of the same, if not better elements than Hanifin brings.

If they're healthy, which they weren't lasting because they didn't have Quinn, I think there's just better candidates. I know that we talked about on the, this with the lightning forwards in the Canada segment, but I also really like the idea of reuniting him and Zach Wrenski on a third pair for that being Seth Jones. So, you know, Seth Jones's playoff run was outstanding.

He was one of the Panthers three best players, I thought, on that cup run. So he's on my team as well, leaping over Noah Hanofin. It's, I don't, Noah Hanifant didn't do anything at the last tournament to play himself off the roster. And that's where I feel bad. And Chris, you can kind of speak to that. But I just felt like Seth Jones leaped him. Yeah, I mean, that's, that's, that's,

certainly fair. I mean, I think that there's, there's a lot of, I think these last couple of D spots are really up for grabs and that there's going to be a lot of debate points. You know, I didn't, I would say that Hanofin, among the players that I put on my depth chart was probably one of the ones I felt the least strong about. And then I also watched him against the Blackhawks last night. And that definitely did, there were, there were good and bad for that. So, you know, you kind of just see various things. I'm going to be really fascinated. I know like Corey has Luke Hughes and, you know,

there are other guys like. Scott's got Lane Hudson. Yeah, Scott's got Lane Hudson. You know, like that's, I think Hanofin is the type that I think they would bring relative to some of those other guys that have maybe more offensive prowess. I think that that's ultimately why I had

him over some of the other guys that were on there. Because I, you know, if it was my team making it, you know, I think Lane Hudson, I'd find a spot for him maybe as my seventh D. And a, but at the same time, you know, I just, I'm also trying to think about how, how things would go. And I think players like Hanofin would be more in line. And why, frankly, Seth Jones ended up on my list, too. And if you're going to bring like Hudson or Fox, they probably need to play on a second

power play because you figure we're Wenski or Quinn or. on the second power play. You could put 2D there, but then it's a question of which of these tremendous forwards are you leaving off to bring another defenseman onto your power play? It's fun. I will say, it's funny you mentioned

that you were watching Noah Hanofen play against Chicago last night, and he didn't play well because Seth Jones was also terrible against the Leafs last night. Bad timing, guys. All right, so, Corey, you left Adam Fox off of your lineup here. You're the only one that left him off. And you left him off, I thought interestingly in favor of Luke Hughes.

I know there's more size. I know there's more skating. But is there really, especially after the case you made against Matthew Schaefer, like is there really, I know Hughes is a little older, but is there really that much more impact you're getting out of Luke Hughes than Adam Fox there? It'd be close. Like it is, it's close. But I think you're trying to think about what you're getting from there, your seventh,

eight D. I think that's a variable for sure. It's why I would take a parakeo over a Schaefer. If I'm putting together a depth chart, putting together a raw. Luster, like, there's no way you're maximizing Adam Fox on this team. Like, I just don't see how that happens unless you have several significant injuries. Same thing with Hudson. Whereas I think with Hughes, like, he's still probably more of a power play tilted guy,

but I think with his skating, you can live a little bit more with him at even strength against a team Canada, against the team Sweden. His rivals, his transition game will be good enough at this level, even if he's a little bit of a questionable defender, decision maker at times. That's my lean there. Like I said, I think in order to, in order to, in order to be a transition game, bring Fox, he has to be on your power play. And for me, he's just not on my power play. So that'd be my lean. I would, I would argue that in order to bring Luke Hughes, he has to be on your power.

Like, I don't think Luke Hughes defends nearly well enough to be, be an even strength guy for them. I agree. You'd have an easier time selling me on Noah Hannafin over Adam Fox than you would on Luke Hughes over Adam Fox for me. Same. I think it would be cool if all three Hughes brothers were on the team. That'd be cool. But I mean, yeah, like, that's a thing. Like, I kind of agree. And I think that there's, there's, there's a lot of different things that, that they're going to weigh here.

And I think, particularly on the blue line, I do think, like, the reason that guys like Seth Jones are going to be there. And, and, and I do think Adam Fox will ultimately make the final roster. But I do think his, his status is very precarious. It's, it's all about having guys. that you can depend on and rely on. And as much as I love Luke Hughes and as much as I love Lane Hudson and even like a Jackson Lacombe, I don't know if there's enough track record there for me to take them over

the more senior players. And that, I think, is what will make the difference here in some of these decisions. All right. So I'll propose this then to end the debate. Adam Fox is on the majority of these ballots. But, Corey, can you live with that if Scott and Chris agree to put Seth Jones on this roster here as well? Sure. All right. Very simple. Scott, Chris, are you, are you comfortable with that compromise? Yeah. I had Seth Jones on my roster. The grimace from Scott here is amazing.

He really doesn't want Seth Jones. I would have, I would have rather Noah Hanofin than Seth Jones, but, uh, but that's the compromise, right? Like, because I think for me, I mean, Peters, Peters had, Peters had Hanifin on his roster. Did you have Hanifin higher or lower than Seth Jones on your on your I had him. I had him lower.

Yeah. No, you don't have Seth Jones on yours. Wait, I don't. No. Oh.

Dang it. Yeah, he's, he's listed fifth on my, on my on your left side chart. Yeah.

Yeah. But that's kind of my thought with the compromise is that like if, if it's Jones or Hanifin, I think Corey and I

are good with Fox. Did you not have Fox, Max? I have Fox. So Fox is on, but I'm saying like just to like kind of. I'm just angling not to have to make like, we're all going to have guys off of our roster. If Fox was going to end up on it either way, I don't know whether we have to compromise with Corey here.

Like if there's a guy that three of us. Well, then the debate's just going to become Jones or Hanifin is what's going to happen. So we can do that. So Fox is on. And then the debate is Jones versus Hanifin. And to me, it's a fairly simple debate because one organically plays the right side and has huge familiarity with the guy that I want to play him with, which is Zach Werenski. So that's my argument for Seth Jones. Okay.

Well, maybe it's as simple as I've lost the debate on Seth Jones for now then. All right. So we'll take Seth Jones. And then the only thing we have left to decide today is the third goalie for Team USA. Connor Hallibuck, Jake Ottinger. Everybody has those. But it was a two-two split on how the rest of us wanted to proceed. I have Jeremy Swayman.

I believe Chris also had Jeremy Swain. Swayman. And then Corey, I know you had Spencer Knight, and I think Scott did as well. So that's the debate we have to have to have here. And it's not an easy one. These guys have both been off to really good starts to this season. Swayman obviously was on the Four Nations roster. So to me, that gives him a lean and a tie break.

But I also can buy, Corey, if the argument is, hey, Spencer Knight might just be your goalie at the 2030 Olympics. Like, that's not a bad case to make for your third goalie. And I would just argue he's been, you don't want to overreact to it. couple of good months. But to me, it hasn't been a couple of good butts. It's been a couple of outstanding months. Like, the level he's played at to me has been one of the very best goalies in the league. And you look at the toolkit, you look at his track record. There's a lot of reasons to be optimistic about this player, to think that he could handle this level if he's

given the call. And I think he's just deserved it, quite frankly. All right. So I guess what we need is somebody to volunteer to flip here. So Chris, I don't know how married you are to Jeremy Swayman over Spencer Knight. Do you have an inclination to go night? I think the way that Spencer has played this year has been outstanding. I mean, the other thing that I'm going to come back to is it's going to be Jeremy Swayman. You know, he was the goalie for the gold medal game at the World Championship. I had a shut out in that game. You know, I feel like that decision was made a long time ago, and I don't think that it's going to change.

Scott, Corey, either of you want to come over to the Swayman side? We could put Swamen on there. It's fine. I just disagree, but it's fine. Yeah, I mean, I think Spencer's playing better. I actually had both Knight and Swamen on my team and didn't have Ottinger. Oh, you left Ottinger off? Yeah, I'm okay either way.

I think you ride the hot hand in this kind of a format. But I did have Swamen as my number two. at night is my number three. So I'm definitely good with Swamen being the number three. All right. Well, that does settle that. And there's our team. There's our team USA. And that is going to do it for us. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect series. You can of course catch more of Chris over at Flow Hockey and on his podcast called up. We'll talk to you soon.