The Athletic Hockey Show - CHL Top Prospects Game: Bedard, Benson, and more, Corey’s Michigan-Minnesota series notebook, Max’s Rögle BK trip, a supersized mailbag, and more

Episode Date: January 27, 2023

On a brand new episode of The Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series, Max, Corey, and FloHockey’s Chris Peters discuss the Michigan-Minnesota series from this past weekend, including an impressive showing from Adam Fantilli and whether Matthew Knies and/or Luke Hughes could jump right into the NHL following their respective college seasons, Max’s trip to Ängelholm, Sweden to take in a few of Rögle BK games, the CHL Top Prospects Game featuring Connor Bedard, Zach Benson, and others, plus a supersized mailbag to close things out.Subscribe to The Athletic Hockey Show on YouTube: http://youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowGet a 1 year subscription to The Athletic for $2 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshowGo to https://www.chime.com/nhlshow to sign up for a Chime Credit Builder Visa Credit Card today! Thanks to Chime for supporting the show.Sign up today at http://stitchfix.com/hockey to get $20 off your first purchase! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Hey, everybody, Max Boltman here alongside Corey Pronman and Flohockey's Chris Peters back for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. All three of us are blissfully back at our homes after some travels in the last couple weeks here. And I want to start the show today, kind of recap on them a little bit. I know Chris and Corey, you guys both were at the CHL Top Prospects. game. We're going to definitely get to that in a minute. But Corey, you were also at the Michigan Minnesota series. And I want to start there, because obviously that's a hugely rich prospect series that we're talking about, both in terms of guys who have already been drafted and obviously

some intrigue at the very top of 2023. Yeah, and it was a great series. Both games went to overtime. Both games featured a late goal by Minnesota to tie it up against Michigan. It was a packed building both nights and just a ton of NHL talent on the ice. It almost felt like a world junior game in both of those games, both in terms of the amount of talent and the kind of the pace and the intensity of the game between Minnesota and Michigan and just a great overall series. One thing that I thought was really notable was to play the two draft eligibles on Michigan, Gavin Brunlein and Fantilli.

I thought both were very good. and Brinley was quite good for Team USA at the World Juniors and while I thought Fantilli was solid for Canada I mean he didn't play a ton for them and probably didn't have the tournament you hope for him and while I thought he was pretty good on the Saturday game against Minnesota the game on Friday he was just outstanding

like he looked like an impact player or like the kind of draft eligible at the college level that you remember like Jack Eichol making on a game at the college level he was just you know between his skill, his physicality, his pace. He looked really, really impressive and looked like a guy who, I know, like, I've seen some criticism, some corners of him after the World Junior's. Like, oh, is this guy really all that?

And he is all that. He is a special pro prospect, and he showed that against Minnesota. Well, that's one of the interesting things to me when, especially when college guys go to the World Juniors, is like, I think it's fair, especially when you're talking about guys who are playing in the CHL, you know, the World Juniors is like decidedly. up a level. And I think there's a certain level where that's true to in college, but you're playing against older players, like more mature competition in college than you are even at the world juniors. And so, like, in that standpoint, if a guy struggles at the world juniors and goes back to the Western

league or the Q or whatever and is back to what he is, you're like, okay, well, he should be. But if he goes back and he does this against the Minnesota Golden Gophers, who are one of the top, you know, most talented teams in college hockey, I think we can, we can read a lot into that, actually. Yeah, no, he likes it. He's a stud. He's one of the best draft eligible I've ever seen at the college level. And it's funny, you mentioned that world junior aspect. Chris, you might recall whether I'm off on this, but I think Zach Rowansky's world junior didn't really go that well when he was also at Michigan, but he was just incredible for a 17-year-old when he was back in college. He didn't play as an underageer at the world juniors. Did he? No, he played in his draft season.

His draft season. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. When he accelerated and went to Michigan as a 17-year-old. Right, right, right, right, right. Yeah, no, yeah, he was, he was underwhelming that year, came back the following year, and he was the captain of the team and had a great world juniors. But yeah, I think his first one was disappointing. You mentioned Gavin Brindley, too, Corey.

And he's a guy who I think maybe starting to generate a little bit of steam here recently. I don't know how much of that is playing a little bit with Fantilli. I think he's been on the wing a little bit, which is interesting, especially when you talk about kind of the size profile there. But what stood out to you about him? I think everything with Gavin is his skating at his compete level. I think this is a guy who just has a ton of energy in his game. He brings it every night.

You saw it the world juniors. You see it in college. And so you love those aspects about him, especially given he's an undersized guy. He was contributing in the offense. I think with Gavin, I don't think he's going to be a first round pick. You know, I don't think it's dynamic enough at whatever. he is, 5-8, 5-9 to go in that range.

But when I think of him, if he's a center in the NHL, I almost think of him as like Blake Lazotte, you know, who also was a very good college player and kind of has that same mold of high-speed, high-compete with secondary offense. And that's what I kind of like from Gavin. Also from that series, you know, the obvious guys were good. Like that Logan Cooley, Matt Nye's Jimmy Snugglerud,

line was outstanding. I think Nye scored the overtime winner on the first night. And in general, those three played really well up until snuggler got kicked out towards the end of the second game. And from Michigan, Luke Hughes was, I think, good, not great in the first game. And then the second game, he was excellent. And like Nyes, helped contribute to the overtime winner. I mean, we're talking here about a month out from the NHL trade deadline here. And I think that's when a lot of fans of other teams start to get.

very curious about Matthew Nyes, because I think there could be some hope there that if the Toronto Maple Leafs are going to make a big push, could you lure Matthew Nyes away? And Chris, I want to go to you with this one because, you know, I think the obvious hope that people have with college hockey prospects is their season's going to end. They're going to jump to the NHL and they're going to make a big impact right away for you in the playoffs. Usually I think you kind of dismiss that. But with a guy, especially who's built the way that Matthew Nise is and his neck is like a tree trunk already and all this stuff. Like, is this a guy who you think could make an impact on the Toronto Maple Leafs playoff run?

Is this a guy that you could see the Toronto Leafs, Maple Leafs trading to make an impact on their playoff run? Yeah, you know, it's hard for me to see him coming into that particular lineup and making a significant impact right away. But at the same time, he continues to elevate every single year, every single game, you know, just seeing what he's been able to do at Minnesota. He's been solid. But, you know, I think that there would be a pace of.

adjustment for him. I think they're just, you know, the general physicality. Right now, he's bigger than everybody. He can push people around. It's not real hard for him to get to the middle of the ice. That had changed. You know, and it's not like, you know, when I think back to like when Chris Kreider came into the Rangers, you know, like, what did he have? Well, he has this elite speed and he, you know, he has all this other stuff that he, you know, he had the size and stuff like that. I don't think that that's necessarily what you're going to get out of nyes. But he's a guy that is an option for you. If, you know, you start running, you're losing some of your depth, either to injury or you're just not as effective.

He's a guy that kind of gives you a chance to give your team a different look. And certainly I think long term, he's kind of the type of player that I think the Maple Leafs have been looking for for a long time where, you know, he's got that power forward element to him. You know, he's not easy to push around and he can score. You know, I mean, they have a big guy that's not easy to push around and can score in Austin Matthews too. But, you know, I think that Nize is a little bit, you know, you add more. that. So the thing about the trade deadline, like it'll be interesting to see kind of what the Maple Leafs ultimately want to do. And I think it would be very difficult to trade a guy like Nyes, but I think

at the same time, you can't be too precious with your own prospects sometimes when the pressure is on. And certainly the pressure has to be on for them to get outside of the first round and certainly to do even better than that. So, you know, I think everything has to be on the table for them. but, you know, I think it would have to be a pretty substantial deal. I don't think a rental, he's not the kind of player you're going to give up in a rental deal. Yeah, I would, only I would disagree with what Chris said is I think he plays for them right away. I think he helps them right away. There's a pretty glaring hole in that third line left wing with due respect to Bobby McMahon.

I think Nyes will make a bigger impact right away. Yeah, Cori, I know you're a big believer in the flags fly forever thing when it comes to managing. And for that reason, I tend to agree with you. And for that reason, I think usually I'm in favor of a contending team trading their futures for this stuff. But I don't think Matthew Nyes is that far in the future. I think even if it's not a major playoff contributor this year, he is a near-term contributor for that team. And I think you got to, when you look at the cap situation, the value of that exceeds the value of, you know, whatever your first-arm pick, whatever it's going to be. Yeah, I think he's an I think he's upgraded on their roster.

second he signs. He looks like a pro, plays like a pro. Only thing it's going to be issue is skating right away, but I think, you know, his compete and his size will help him be an NHL player right away. In terms of the flags fly forever, aspect of it, you know, that's usually my mantra, but when you look at Toronto, you look at the division, you know, is this their year to go all in? And I know there's these various pressures and the playoff history, et cetera, but, you know, it's, you could make the argument that that third best team in the division, you know, so it's... Would you?

No, you could have arguments about it. I don't... I think it's really close between them and Tampa. Yeah. And I think Florida's better than they are right now. And so, but it's close. So I think you have to buy if you're them, but I'm not sure if this is the year to push all your chips into the middle.

I guess it would depend on the return and what kind of player you would be getting for nice in an exchange. I wouldn't have a problem with that. them having a trade deadline similar to what the Florida Panthers did last year and giving up like their next three first round picks. But that's because those guys are years and years out. Like I think your window is right now. It's this year.

It's next year. It's probably the year after that. And you're going to have Matthew Nyes on an ELC for all of those. And I think that that's more valuable than the picks personally. I'm not saying three at once. But you know what I mean? Like Florida traded a ton of futures last year, right? And they didn't get anything out of it.

But I don't think that they should regret it necessarily either. Maybe they've been Charatio. Well, okay. That's fair. That one, and that one could be a top 12 pick now. Yeah. Yeah. I guess I think Florida will get better. I don't think it'll be top 12.

But yeah, I thought Florida was, you know, one of the elite teams in the league last year. I understand why they did what they did. I thought it was reasonable. Maybe a little over the top. But not unreasonable. I, if you, I don't pretend to have the, you know, watched as much NHL the last month or so as I would do in the first few months of the year, would you call Toronto one of the top five teams in the league right now?

I know, I'm sure. I would say they're on the bubble, I would think, for me in that regard. Yeah, I mean, for me, I think the division does kind of skew it because I think you might have three of the top five or six in that division, to be honest. Like, I don't know who you're taken between like Toronto, Carolina, Toronto, Tampa, you know, Dallas, I think is in the mix, like, you know, Vegas is in that. I don't think any of those teams are clearly better than Toronto. Right.

I think they're on the bubble for me in that regard. But they're in that mix. I know the goal to have even better than we expected, but it is a minor question for me going to playoffs. Fair enough. I guess the other guy we can talk about from the same series and what they might or might not add to a playoff run is Luke Hughes. And you mentioned his play there, Corey. And I saw a quote, I'm sorry, I forget who tweeted it, but I think Brandon Nerato was saying he thinks that Luke Hughes could step into New Jersey's lineup tomorrow and help them.

Do you agree with that? Could he, yes. Will they bring in a teenage defenseman and plug him into a very tough situation where you're trying to win a playoff game? I don't know. When I saw that, I thought of what Detroit did actually with Dylan Larkin when he was coming out. And they just pretty much put him in the American League and said,

year is your year because I believe they were in a playoff push at that time as well. And I think it will really depend how Luke looks in the second half of the year and where the devils are. I thought ruling it out, but it would be a it would be a coin flip call, I think for me. What do you think, Chris? I think he's in. I think he plays. And I think that they're going to, I have a feeling that they're going to make some moves here at the trade deadline that are, that's going to make their blue line a little different. And so I think that that he, you know, is he, is he, he wouldn't be, I don't think he's going to be a top four guy. You know, I don't think, you know, you kind of, you'd have to, you know, shelter him a bit,

especially towards the, the, the playoff run and things like that. But I do think that, you know, New Jersey is, is probably going to get a little bit more aggressive here. And, you know, I'm interested to see kind of what happens is, is, is Damon Severson, you know, long-term guy for them? Is he a guy that they move? Is there something like that that happens that, that then suddenly creates an opening and creates an opportunity to add D? and Luke can play on either side. And so I think that that's helpful as well.

And yeah, I mean, the thing is, is like, you know, Corey and I have been talking about it a lot this year and watching him and there have been absolutely games where he has been unbelievable and there have been a lot of games where he's been, you know, average. And, you know, we want to see, you got to have that level of consistency. You can't really have an average night as a young defenseman in a playoff race.

So to Corey's point, I get the hedge there for sure. sure. But I just think that the way things are going, you know, I do think that Luke Hughes, with his skating ability, with his ability to move pucks up the ice, the fact that, you know, he has good size already. You know, I think that that's, those are all things that are going to help him, you know, be a contributor. If not, you know, I don't think he'd be an impact level player, but a contributor. Yeah, can I see him getting games like in April? Sure, but I can't sit here and say I for sure see him in the lineup in game one of a playoff series just quite yet. I'm not ruling yet he could, but I would need to see how he does in the second half.

And if he played in April, how he doesn't get NHL first. And while Chris and I were in British Columbia for the CHL Top Prophics game, which we'll get to shortly, Max was touring Sweden. mainly tough life max it is a long flight max it is a long flight max was an angle home covering rogla who have two very good red wings prospects in marco casper and william valender and max will be able to tell us what he saw from them but you also saw some good player a good player on sano a jose philobista which we've talked about a couple of times throughout the season yeah so the first game when I was there was Linchaping, which is where B-Step plays, and they house

rogu. They beat him six to two. It was a good game for the first period, and then Lynch-Caping pretty much was just a better team. And for that reason, like, B-Step was the most impressive of the three that I saw that night. I think, I don't know if he had a, I think he had an assist, but either way, he helped set up a goal. Size was obviously very noticeable in the impact that he was able to make with that. And he was really good. I mean, kind of picked up where you saw him leave off in the world juniors. I left there very impressed with him that night. Honestly, both the Red Wings prospects that night probably had tougher nights. And when I talked to one of the coaches there, he kind of was like, it's not really characteristic to how their seasons have been, which is true.

If you look at their seasons. And then the next night out, like you really saw that. I mean, Marco Casper was probably their best player in their game against Malma, which is their big rivalry game. He scored the opening goal like two minutes in. They played him like 20 plus minutes while under played like 25 minutes. And that, I think, was a much more kind of representative game of their seasons. While Indar, I think you saw a little more of the maturity. He's always been this, you know, big fluid skater with some good hands. But I think you saw a couple mature plays where, you know, gets it over the red line and gets it deep

or cuts it back to, you know, hold possession and reset his team. The kind of things that I think he'll need to do to really be a big minute defenseman in the NHL at some point to kind of manage that game. and Casper drove a ton for them. That's good. Carried the puck and had possession. I think he probably held onto it too much in the first game, and that was where some of the issues stemmed from. But I thought it was a really efficient,

effective game from him the second time I saw. Last year, you did a similar trip to Frulanda when Simon Evanson was there. So now you've covered two different SSL organizations in two years between Frulunda and Rogla. what similarities or differences that you see between maybe how those two teams approach things? I've thought about this a lot since I was there because I think when I went over last year and saw the Red Wings prospects that were at Fulanda, I spent some time around that organization.

I left really impressed with kind of their model for developing these really elite prospects. And I think what I may be underrated at that time was the role of kind of the city that Feralanda is based in. It's like a big population center. They got a lot of guys who grew up in Gothenburg that, you know, feed into them from the surrounding areas. Hosting Xer's World Junior. Yeah, they're hosting next year's World Junior, right. They're a little bit kind of like the Yankees, I guess.

Like the more removed I get from it, like they're just this powerhouse. And as much as they develop these elite NHL players, which I stand by what I wrote last year is truly impressive how they do this. They're going to have another two potential first, but I would think at least top two round picks next year in Otto Stenberg. and Noah Dower Nilsson. What I think is interesting about Rogla is, this is a town of like 40,000.

And as Gothenburg like is a big city, Anglholm is a small hockey town. Like they've, the town loves their team, but they're not drawing from like these major suburb areas. They kind of have to bring guys in. And they actually rely more on the SHL level on these young guys that have come through their academy.

I think they have seven or eight like junior age players, or at least under 21 players. I guess Willinder wouldn't technically be, or Valinder wouldn't technically be a junior age anymore. But, you know, there got this guy Felix Nilsson, who's working into their lineup, who might be a, you know, a draft pick this year. I think there were some scouts there on Hamble. I was there to see him.

They had a guy who, Corey, you broke the story while I was there, scooping me while I'm on the ground that Tom Willander, who we expect will be a semi-early pick in this next draft, committed to be you. I wonder if that maybe is why I did not see him play these SHO games while I was there. but like they have built this thing up from a much different place. Roglo was up and down in the SHL, relegated and and then finding promotion, but never really challenging.

These two Canadian twin brothers, Cam and Chris Abbott, have really redefined what this program is. They're now one of the clearly top programs in the SHL and they've done it without this kind of immense payroll, immense kind of machine like Furlenda has. Both super impressive, but also kind of. kind of really different in how they've gone about it. And so I've been thinking about that question a lot since I got back of like what, you know, they've kind of both become these powerhouses in really different ways.

So Max, you know, having a chance to see these guys and being there and getting up close, you know, I think a lot of people are really excited about Marco Casper. Do you think that he is based on what you saw and based on kind of what you've heard? Do you think he's got a chance to play in the NHL next season? I think he has a chance. I came back last year pretty confident that, Simon Edvinson was going to play in the NHL right away last year. So I guess I kind of got to check the impulse a little bit here. But I do think like there's elements to his game that are

very kind of polished, right? Like he, I don't think he's going to have a problem with the physicality or the pace of the NHL level, for example. But you just never know how someone's going to adjust. And so he's a really mature kid. It would not shock me if he, you know, takes even more steps between now and next September. But every player is kind of different. I didn't think Lucas Raymond was going to be ready. I did think Edvenson was going to be ready. I've been wrong on both of those so far.

So I think that tells you like how much mystery there still is, even with pretty advanced prospects. I do think it's interesting. I don't think I would have guessed going into this that Casper's production in the SHL would be pretty much identical to what Lucas Raymond's was in that year. They do it very different ways. But I think you might even be able to,

argue that Casper's more kind of direct style of play might appeal more to like the average NHL coach when you're talking about a young player. Yeah, I agree. The only issue I think is that you have one, Casper in your own line. If you probably want him as the top nine, right? Yeah. So you look at the Red Wings lineup, you know,

particularly with a guy like with Jonathan Berger and kind of emerging and it's like, okay, well, where does he fit? Is he take Joe Valeno's third line center spot? You know, what happens with Tyler Pertuzzi going forward? I think those are kind of the questions that would need to be answered. over the off season before we start penciling Casper in. Exactly. And the Red Wings have been really intentional about if they're going to have a young guy in their line,

if they want him in the top nine, they haven't really want. Even Valeno, like, they weren't really sure they wanted him to be in a fourth line role. And he played well enough to get the minutes that made it, you know, kind of indistinguishable, whether it's the third or the fourth line on some nights. But he's playing 12, 13 minutes. Like, that's enough. If Casper isn't going to be getting that kind of role and probably some power play,

I think you're right that they tend to. to slow play those guys. Okay, guys, let's get into the CHL Top Prospects game now. I know you're both on hand for this one. And let's start with the one that we got to start with. Connor Bedard and Zach Benson on his line. Anything new that we learned, anything that we even could have learned new about Connor Bedard in this one, Chris.

No, I mean, there wasn't going to be any surprises. You know, I think the thing, you don't, there aren't many games where, you know, you see Connor Bedard go through, adversity. I mean, there is it, there is, I should say that in Regina, obviously, there's, he's got to do a lot himself. And so there's a level of adversity there. So this was kind of reminiscent of that. There was a lot of things where he had to do a little bit more. I think early in the game, he was a little deferential, which was surprising to me. He would

pass a lot more when he had, not, didn't always necessarily have the angle, but he's a guy that can score from anywhere. So you just kind of expect him to shoot. But he was looking for Benson a little bit more there. They had to kind of rotate the wings around. He and Benson stayed together, but they tried a couple of different looks of different players that didn't, you know, the way the teams were constructed, it really didn't leave. It was kind of like they were like, hey, this is like how it is in Regina. You can have the, you know, there were eight top 20 central scouting rated players on the other side, skaters, and there were two on his team. So, you know, like, and then he did get the, they did give him the number one goalie at least. So like, just to give you

an example of the imbalance. But the other things, like, they did that last year, too. Yeah. Yeah. They put Shane right. They put Shane right on the worst team and it really didn't go well for them. At least this one felt a little bit more balanced because Benson and it did. Yeah. It did. Yeah. It did until late in the game. And actually, Badard's team significantly outshot team white. You know, so like there is, you know, the Scott Ratslap was really one of the guys that they kind of stole the show. But, but, you know, I think the other thing, too, with Connor is that you got to see his temper a little bit too. You know, he did take a penalty late in the game,

which was not a great thing for him to do. Oliver Blanc really got under his skin in the game. Petal leveled him at one point. Yeah, Petal. Lucas Dragasevic also buried him in the boards for an early penalty for boarding. So it was clear that there was, the guys in the other team were not going to go easy on Connor Bedard, so they didn't make it easy on him. But he still had six shots on goal.

He was dominant at the faceoff dot. He had, he, you know, he got Dragasevic back a little bit by dangling him to his knees, essentially, where he just, he fell over because he inside out of him. And, you know, and that's just what, what Conrad can do. But, you know, obviously the single game, you look at the body of work, you know, relative to what that game was for Cona Badard. And, you know, there's, there's not a lot that we learned, but it was at least nice to see, you know, he was competing. Everybody was competing against him. Nobody was taking it easy. So it made for a good game. But I think two of his three pointless games this season have been the CHL top prospects game and the gold medal game for the world juniors. Bust, complete bust. Not a big game player. And the first game of the season in the CHL, I think those were his three pointless games. I actually think Zach Benson was just as good as Bedard, maybe even better in that game. I thought he made a ton of plays on that line.

He was always active, always keeping his feet moving. I thought, again, that line, even though it had a rotating wing, I thought they, They were the best line at that game. They drove bus, and they got a lot of scoring chances. They just couldn't finish during the course of that game. Right. I was having a conversation with someone about Benson this morning. I'm curious, like, how do you compare him to, like, a William Eklund in his draft year?

Not as good as skater, I don't think. Actually, I'm not sure we were talking to the same person. Someone asked me about that today, too. I don't think so. I think I would say not as good as skater. I think I think Ecclint skating is like dimensional. And I think that's Benson's major issue for his size. And I would say Benson would have more natural offense.

You know, I don't think Ecclain's ever been like a pure scorer. I mean, he can score, but I don't think that's really, you know, he's leading the barracuda and points right now. But I don't think that's ever been like his big thing has been, you know, a big points guy, a big goal scorer. and I but so I think those would be the two distinct differences there for me where we would fall on those differences in terms of making a list you know you could defer but I think that would be the argument there for me I still feel like Benson's off puck value is higher than Eklund's I agree but I think Eklund does compete well too like he's got around that idea but no yeah no Benson competes like another level higher like he's probably you can argue him he's the most

competitive player in the draft to be quite honest yeah I think he has one of the best sticks of anybody He is so good at taking guys off sticks. And Connor Redard actually said in our media availability, how Benson is just so relentless on the forecheck, he just gives everybody problems. And it doesn't matter how big you are. It doesn't matter. He just finds a way to get the puck off you.

No, I mean, he has one of the best sticks in the draft. He's one of the smartest players in the draft. He's one of the most competitive players in the draft. He's just a 5-9 guy without speed. And that's the debate on him. And where he ultimately fall on that, we'll see. but I think he has some very several elite attributes. Yes.

And when you talk about like the skating, right? Like it's speed, yes, but like the change in direction is not bad. That wouldn't scare you off. Right. Yeah, no, I don't think it's that. I think he's got, you know, small area quickness. He can, he could make guys miss. I just don't think like in the NHL he's going to be pulling away from guys, you know.

But I don't think, I don't think he's a below average NHL skater. I just don't think it's for that size. It's a major asset. Kind of Lucas Raymond dish, or do you like it a little better than that? Yeah, kind of similar to that. Kind of close to like where Zuccarello, maybe skating, is the question is whether his offense is going to be that level. I thought Lucas Raven is one of the most purely skilled players I've seen of the last 10 years coming into the draft. So, I mean, that's where the debate lies a little bit.

But if you're a believer, that's what you're hoping the trajectory is. All right. Let's call on the other side of that game now. And I think we can just go to the top line there as well as we talk about Colby Barlow, Braden Yeager, and Cohen Zimmer. What did you think of that group, which includes a couple of guys who could go in the first half of the first round? Right. And that would probably be Yeager and Barlow.

And they figured in, I believe it was on the first white goal where Yeager got a shot to the net. And then Zimmer, I think, not Zimmer, sorry, Barlow. put the rebound in. But after that, I didn't think that line really had the impact I thought they would, given the amount of scoring that all three of them have shown this year and the amount of talent on that line. I thought, you know, they were fine, solid. Just he didn't really notice them on a consistent basis throughout the game.

Honestly, there were other players on White who I thought were really impressive. I thought Luca Pinelli on the second line had a good game. I thought Carson Rakeoff, the Kitchener 4 had a good game. I thought Kalyn Lind from Red Deer had a very good game in itself noticeable in a lot of ways between both his skating, occasionally contributed to the offense, and he was a pain in the ass to deal with for everybody on Team Red. But I think those guys probably, I know it's a more on consistent basis than the top line with the high profile names on Team White.

Yeah, I agree with that too. because you know, you could see the flashes of the various things. Like, I mean, like, Zemer has a really good skill level. Like, he used his hands well in the game. Not an amazing skater, you know, so that does limit him a bit. You know, Colby Barlow is so much more physically advanced than a lot of the guys. And you just, even if you looked at him, if anybody watched the game, you saw the kid with the full beard. That's Colby Barlow.

He was sitting next to Brent Seabrook in the team photo. And I was like, which of these guys played, like, who's ready to retire here? Like, it was like, that's the way it looked to me. because like, because he's such a, such a, like a physically developed kind of player. And so you always kind of look at that and you wonder, okay, well, what's the upside and things like that? But what I will say about Barlow is that, you know, he does have a lot, he makes a lot of pro-level decisions. He does, you know, he knows when to get Pucks deep. He knows when he can take it a little bit more. He has a good, a good feel for getting to the net. He can lower

the shoulder a little bit and be a little bit harder to defend. So, you know, he uses all that, that well. Yeager, to me, was the least noticeable of the three of them. He had a couple of moments here and there, but didn't necessarily, I think he was put in a position to succeed, and I just don't think he kind of rose to the level of that game. He kind of faded a little bit.

You didn't necessarily notice him a lot. So that was kind of interesting for me to see, because, I mean, obviously he's had a very strong season. He's a productive player, you know, had a great Holink of Gretzky, who's kind of been one of the top guys in his age group, and, you know, didn't necessarily elevate, but, yeah, and to course,

he's point two, I just want to mention on Rakoff, you know, he's a guy that kind of, he has a lot of the tools. He's six foot two. He's highly skilled, really good shot. You know, consistency has been a real issue with him. You never really know exactly what you're going to get in a game in a game out situation. That's made him a little bit tougher to get a red on. It's made him a guy that I think has frustrated some scouts this season. But to have a good performance there, just a reminder to show, you know, the shot that he had was a major league shot. I mean, shot in stride. He shot against the grain. It was a really, it was a, it was going to be tough for the goaltender to stop. So really good stuff. Yeah, a nice one-on-one play to create the space there.

Exactly. And, you know, his hands have, have been outstanding. You know, he does a lot of really good things. It's just, you know, he needs to kind of put it a little bit more together to make sure that, you know, the toolbox is matching the tools as well, because he's, he definitely has a lot of skills. So it was good. And he was one of the players of the game. I thought he thought he had a really, nice effort and it was a good time for him to have that. Yeah, and on a line with Cal and Richie, I wouldn't be able to pick out which guy was supposed to be the first round, pure tools guy and which one was the other guy. I still would have Richie ahead of recoff, but I thought that was interesting compared

to trash both two guys from the same league on the same line on that evening. And you mentioned Yeager before. Yeah, I only noticed him in a couple of instances with his skating and that he would get a couple of shots towards the goal by using by using its feet to create some space but i didn't really see him make many plays or or really get as many scoring chances as you would have hoped one other got one other forward we kind of skimmed over is i thought the uh the combination of matt kattiford and grace and sotchen together did well initially i think they broke him up at some point in the second half of the game and particularly grace and sotcha and i thought had a very nice game

and i thought his compete level was very high he was playing with pace he was making skis he was making plays. I don't know. He's not putting up huge numbers, a little bit about a point for game, but his team he plays on in Seattle is a loaded team, so you can't always get great opportunities. So I thought in this context, away from Seattle, it was a great opportunity for him to showcase his skill, and he looked like a solid B-range prospect, I thought in this game. What did you think of the line of Denver Barkie, Conor-Levis Riley height, the second line on Team Red? I didn't, like, I know Hight tried the lacrosse move at some point in the game, but I really didn't notice those three ever in a consistent manner. Yeah, I was a little confused as to how Riley Hight ended up getting the player of the game honors for Team Red.

You know, he did have that lacrosse move. He did have an assist on the initial goal, but it was more off a broken face off play. And so, yeah, so I, you know, I thought that they were fine. Like, Barkey, you know, he was a late ad to the game. He's got some quickness. He's a small guy, but he's got some quickness. he you can see his jump every once in a while. But yeah, I mean, you know, I thought that, I thought that line was a little bit quiet.

It was a little hard for me to see, you know, height had, there were a couple times where height was able to show off as shy. He's got a pretty heavy shot on him, you know, and that, but, you know, it didn't really amount to much. Also, the Michigan move. That was maybe the slowest developing Michigan I've ever seen. And Scott Ratslap actually had enough time to get his shoulder up to make the save. It was actually one of the best saves on a Michigan goal I've seen as well. because I and I thought that Scott Ratslap to me Scott Ratslap was actually the best player in the game.

But yeah, but that was, yeah, but that was that was pretty funny. But, but you know, the other thing too, Corey, and I wanted to ask you this, we don't, we haven't talked a lot about the defenseman. And obviously, I was about to get to that actually. Yeah. Yeah. I wanted to ask you two things because the first was, you know, I thought Oliver Bunk had an interesting game because he, he definitely got under Conrad's skin. as the game were on. But also, I thought Cam Allen on Team Red had a very nice game.

He didn't necessarily have the points, but he was moving pucks well. I thought he skated really well. He's wearing a letter for the team as well. I think he was on the ice for only one of the goals against and was also on the ice for one of the goals for. So I thought that that was getting him away from Guelph, kind of the same way where he's in a different environment, getting a decent chance to handle the puck some more. I thought he had a nice game. I don't think that's going to change his draft stock dramatically, but I do think that it was a nice reminder of kind of what his ability is. I wonder what you thought of him. I wasn't as blown away

by him in that game. I thought he was steady, solid, but I think the question with Cam is like, what does he bring to an NHL team? He is an average-sized defenseman. He's a good, not great skater. He's not really showing much offense this year. I like to compete. I think he's a nice defender, especially at the junior level. I think he'll be able to defend fine at the NHL level. And I think there is secondary puck moving. I don't think he lacks offense. I don't think his numbers this year are reflective of what he is as a puck mover.

But I don't think that's what he's going to be as a pro. I don't see a big offensive guy. So like I said, I think, yeah, he was solid, fine. But I watch him and I wonder, okay, well, what does this mean for the NHL? What is he in the NHL? Is he a top four defenseman in the NHL? Who does he remind you of that looks and plays like that? that kind of track record coming into the league.

I think the Bonk Drago-Sevich pair was fine. I don't think a lot of the defensively stood out. Like I thought Boakki fought it a little bit. He was the guy that actually got danced on the Carson-Raikov goal. Caden Price, I didn't think, really had a great game overall either. The one, actually, I did like the pair of, I'm going to butcher these names, Tanner Mollandik and Hunter Perchevich. I actually thought that deep pair had had a good night.

Yeah, those guys can really skate. And I thought, I thought Mullen Dyke was the guy that really, you know, was kind of try. He was playing like it was a top prospects game, right? He was trying to show the full complement of what he's able to do. He was being aggressive with the puck. He made some really nice passes in stride and, like, on the rush. And so that was good to see. And then Bruce Stevich is one of those, like having those two guys together, two really good skaters.

I think Bruce Stevich is very agile. He was one of the top players in the on-ice test. as well, just, which wasn't a surprise because he's just a very agile skater. It's not that he necessarily has like this straight ahead speed. It's just that his footwork is outstanding. He's really good on his edges. He can create space and did that at times in the game. So yeah, I'm glad you brought those guys up because I thought that they, they definitely were of the defensemen in a year where we're just trying to figure out who the good defensemen are. You know, they definitely said, hey, you know, don't forget about us. We got some, we got some tools here. We got some things that we can do.

and yeah, they were pretty solid. All right, fellas, let's go to the mailbag here. We actually have a super deep mailbag today to get through. And it's going to start off with one from Christian, Chris. Thoughts on the Merckley Cout swap? You know, I think at the end of the day, this is kind of the, both of those guys were high-risk picks at the time. Cout, for reasons not a different, you know,

he had a heart situation at the Combine. And Merckley, everybody knew that, you know, there were there were off-ice issues. There was character concerns. There was everything. And San Jose said, we're going to take that. We're going to bring him into our organization. We're going to hope that our guys can mentor him and get there. And they gave him opportunities at the NHL level.

It just turns out that on top of, you know, some of the character concerns and things like that, he's just not an NHL defenseman. He's got high level skill, moves puck's incredibly well. But his decision making continues to be suspect. He's compete level can wane. He's got inconsistency. I think this is just a situation where two teams were like, this didn't work. We're going to give you a change of scenery. Good luck.

And I think that that's fine. And Berkeley didn't really do like that well in the American League. He didn't. He didn't. Not like put a lot of offense and couldn't defend in the NHL or something like that. The offense actually didn't really translate in a. significant way to the pro level. I also think with Cout, there was some stuff there with where I think he wanted to

change his scenery to the organization probably wanted to move on. Pro Scouts I've talked to, whether it's because of the heart issue or other issues, we'll just note that the cow seemed out of shape at times kind of thing. And I think maybe just we'll see whether the environment change helps either of those players. But right now they both look like they're not trending to become NHL regulars. And I thought Cout would be, I thought there was, more recently anyways, because I thought there was pro tools there.

You can skate. He's got size some offense. I still think, I think, yeah, like how, I think that he has a better chance than Merkley of becoming an NHL player longer term. But, yeah, but at the same time, like, I, it's, it's getting, it's getting hard to, to get behind either as a more opportunity to sound as A2. Right. Right. Right. And in the, in the end, too, I think, like for Colorado, they get Matt Nieto in that trade as well, which is a guy that they're familiar with that can play down their lineup that is a good fit stylistically for how they play.

So that also, you know, they get some help at the NHL level and then they also move on from, you know, a prospect that wasn't going to really do anything. And I don't see any way that Ryan Merkley fits into their long-term plans. You mean there are power play spots open on the Colorado Blue Line right now? I don't think so, Corey. I've heard they've got some good defensemen over there. Yeah. No, I tend to agree. All right.

Here's one from Mac Blackwood's left heel is Jack Hughes in the Hart conversation. It's kind of funny to me that there even is a hard conversation. Is there a hard conversation at this point? You look, it's kind of settled. Yeah, no. I mean, Jack, he might be the conversation of like when you're filling out a ballot, should he get a top five vote? I think that is absolutely a conversation and a very reasonable conversation to have him

on your ballot just as long as you don't put the one next to his name. Yeah, yeah, I agree. I think that Jack Hughes has had like right now the discussion is really about who's going to get the number two and number three who are going to get those last two finalists spots. This is and these are the years where becoming a finalist being a top five vote getter in the heart trophy when you've got a Connor McDavid doing just otherworldly things as he will continue to do. That's almost like we should maybe just start giving out the like a little tiny heart trophy just like a little honor McDavid. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean that's kind of what happened last year, right? I mean, Matthews had an incredible season and absolutely worthy of being named the Hart Trophy winner, but almost felt like the voters wanted to give it to somebody else. I voted for Shusirkin. I voted for Matthews. So, yeah, but that was, and the other thing, too,

like with Jack, and let's get just specifically. But you could have very reasonably argued McDavid was the best player in the league. Absolutely. No question. No question. No question. But I think, yeah, and that's going to happen

a couple of years. But I think with just to get it back to Jack Hughes quickly, whether or not he's a heart trophy contender, this is, this is the Jack Hughes season. This is the, this is the, this is the, this is the, this is the superstar. Here I am. I am one of the best players. And Corey and I were actually talking about this like, you know, a couple of years ago,

we were talking about, you know, ranking first round draft pick or first overall draft picks. And there was at, during Alexei LaFrennier's draft season, there were a lot of people that were saying, hey, I would have taken, I'd take Leffronier over Jack Hughes. And that, you know, and I think that we didn't necessarily know, like there was so many question is, is Jack Hughes going to get it together? You know, he entered the league at such a young age. Is he going to be able to, at his size, is he going to be able to handle the grind of the

NHL? And, I mean, the overtime pass he had the other day, where he gets, or whatever, the pass where he gets buried into the boards and still sends a backhand pass onto the tape. Like, he's just making so many high-level plays on a game by game basis. I mean, so, you know, he's absolutely like, I don't know if I get a vote this year. it changes some years. We kind of rotate around a little bit. But if I do, you know, he's absolutely on my ballot.

He's probably a top three choice for me. I agree with you. And I think the way that New Jersey is elevated, like that's narrative-wise. That tends to be a really appealing thing for people. I think he's on my ballot right now, too. He's on pace for like 100 points. I think the only knock you could even have on his game anymore is the face-offs. I think that's about it.

Right. I mean, especially because the goal scoring has become a really significant asset for him, too. It was interesting. I don't know if one of those questions made into the mailbag, but I noticed somebody asked me whether we hedge too much based on high draft position and when I'm making my drafted prospect lists and stuff like that. I guess people thought that there were too many high first round picks that happened performed too well on the recent U23 list, for example.

And it reminded me of the fact that there was a lot of criticism. And I get plenty of things wrong, but there was a lot of criticism at times when we were doing the U23, list and we had Jack Hughes and Rasmus Dahlin very high up there despite the fact they had not performed yet at a high level and I think sometimes for these guys it just takes some time

and you don't want to overreact to one or two bad seasons. It's why I'm not ready to give up on Alexei Le Frenier or give up on quitting by field who mind the latter of which has been playing really well why I wasn't ready to you know you don't say Capo Caco's a bust who also is playing really well right now you want to be a little bit more patient with some of these guys.

And obviously, you know, Dahlene's in the Norse conversation. And Hughes is in the heart conversation. And hence the age thing, right? That's why it's 23. That's why it's not 21, right? Yeah. Right. We have even Nico Heeshire.

How many years were we here and like, oh, that's a shitty first overall pick? And yes, if you compare him to Kill McCar, Amiro Heiskenen, you might come to that conclusion. But like, I don't know, he sure looks like an incredible player this year. He's got a Selkie case. I was going to say, maybe not McCar, but like, could you argue he's close to Hayskinen right now as a player? Sure. Yeah, like, yeah. So, I mean, I guess you can, you know, number two was a whole other issue there.

But it takes, it takes some time, sometimes. I mean, and there are times where you're Austin Matthews and you walk into the league and you're a star right away. You know, McKinnon was very good right away. Barkoff is very good right away. Sometimes that happens, but it doesn't always happen that way. yeah absolutely with that said logan r's question i'm curious where would you rank slovakoski lafrenier and jack hughes in this upcoming nchl draft i know you're going to do a whole story on this in like four months but um great question you know i think if they were in this draft

what he said so is jack hughes lefrenier lefrooski you said yeah and we're using their drafts let's use their draft seasons maybe we should put that as the qualifier right well it's Is that the question? Is that the question? The question doesn't specify. That's what I'm saying it is. Well, I was about to say based on what we know now, I said, based on what we know now, I think you would have to have a very hard conversation about whether you would take Hughes ahead of Baderg right now.

I think just, and it doesn't mean I don't think that Baderd can't be better than Hughes, but, you know. Hughes is that. It's a burden of a name. I was going to say, you're probably taking Baderd hoping he becomes the player that Jack Hughes. already is. And could he be better? He could. I could see a work where he's better. Right. And this, but Jack is, but Jack is that right now. And he's, and he's a center in the NHL. And it's, yeah, I would. And he's on pace for 50, 50 plus goals. And so have Jack adding more of the goal scoring element this year, uh, changes kind of the, he was always, he could always

score. Like it wasn't a doubt that he could score, but it wasn't his primary tool. And it, it still isn't, but it is at a level. He's scoring at an elite NHL level. And so that, because this is the thing that, this is an interesting question because of how it relates to Baderd specifically and how we talk about Connor Bidard and how, you know,

we're saying, you know, best prospects since McDavid. And that very well may be true. Um, but I think that people, is he better than Matthews at the same age? I,

I, it's difficult, they're different. You know, like, I mean, they are, they are different,

but, But Matthews was before Eichel, wasn't he? Matthews. No, you're right. 15. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. So, yeah. So, yeah. So I mean, you know, you've got, you know, but that's, but that's the conversation, right? That's been the conversation. There are some guys. It's a conversation, but I think it's a question worth asking whether he actually is better than Matt's at the same age. Right.

Right. Exactly. And I mean, I think because, because of Austin's size and the, the two-way capabilities that he's shown this year and his obvious elite goal scoring tool. Yeah, I mean, I think that I would say I wouldn't have put him ahead of Matthews either. But to go ahead and go ahead to rank these guys, I mean, I think that Corey's exactly right. The decision between Bedard and Hughes is pretty dramatic because there are, there's not a huge, I don't think there's a huge gap there. But I'm going to say, I'm going to like, you guys know how much I think Jack Hughes is just an absolute superstar.

I think I would put Baderd one, Jack Hughes second, and then I would put, we're saying, Slavkovsky and Lafranier. Yes. Okay. A mountain between them. And then I'd say Lafranier, Slavkovsky. But it's not just with Bader, right? He's asking, like, in this class, right? So I think you're talking Fantilli, Carlson, Mitch Cobb, and then.

Oh, okay. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So for me, I would be very close, but I'd be very close. probably would lean hues over badard right now and then i would have that group of four the other out of the other bulls and then i would probably put slofkowski five and then left for an ear six and the reason i agree with that corey is we also know that jack is an nchl center even given

what i just said about the face-offs but like i think these are these are two guys who we're talking about uh with the size profile and whatnot i mean obviously i think jack's skating is the elite of the elite. Yeah. You're just that confident that he's a center that I think puts him for me a little bit ahead as well. Yeah. There's a certainty versus upside thing there a little bit.

And I say that. These are banana land like trade scenarios, but you had to put, if it's trade Jack for Badar, what would you do kind of thing? I think a decent amount of managers would take the certainty of the number of the start and more center. Yeah, that's totally fair. Like I think it's razor thin between those two guys, you know, just like, you know, because I mean, we also have to keep in mind.

and Conradar is having, you know, an otherworldly season on so many levels. And you look at all the different. Yeah, I mean, just so. We were talking about this at the CHL game, like thinking about Bedard's draft year, thinking about other draft years we've seen. I mean, I don't know. Jack uses draft season was pretty otherworldly too. Not in the,

not at the world juniors level, but in so many other different contexts. Right, yeah. Yeah. And Jack was playing through, I think he was playing through like a shoulder injury throughout that draft eligible world juniors too. And then also like, yeah, yeah, it's just, it's, it's, it's crazy. But Jack Hughes had the best season in the history of the national team development program where all those guys, Matthews, Kane, all of them played there.

And he's the only player in the history to average two points a game in one season. And the only NTP guy to go from the NTP to the NHL. Exactly. So, I mean, we're talking about guys that are, you know, we throw around generational a lot, but we're saying these guys are special relative to the rest of the, you know, the prospects that have kind of come before them or are around them right now. Corey, do you remember that game? I think you were there too, where we showed up to Plymouth and Hughes and Coughfield were both like five or six points off of the respective program records. The Green Bay Gamblers game.

Yeah, I remember that one. Caulfield had like seven goals on nine shots and Hughes, I think, assisted on all of them. Yeah, they had to split the puck in half because Caulfield set the goals record and Hughes set the points record. On the same play. The same play. And they did. They saw it in half.

I mean, to see that, think about it, that was a team with Jack Hughes, Cole Cawfield, Trevor Zegris, Matt Boldy, Spencer Knight. I mean, just keep going and going and going and I mean. Was the Nears there by that time? He might have been on that. He might have been on them by then.

Yeah, he was on the team by then. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, Turcotte was there. Kirkland. Yeah. Yeah. It was, I mean, we may never see, well, who knows.

We always say that and then somebody I still think it holds up I think that one's going to hold up to be honest I think so too one of the crazier games I've been to yeah to Chris's point I think when people saw the team with Matthews and Matthew Kachuk

and Charlie McVoy and Noah Hannafin and Zach Lewinsky they're like oh that team's never going to get and you could still argue they might be better than that other team like that was that was a shit ton of talent that decor was was unbelievable yeah So unreal.

Tom Horner notes that Quentin Byfield is playing left wing with Copatar and Kempe. Corey, is that progress? Where is his future? Is it down the middle or on the wing? I think it is progress. I've only watched a little bit of him up with the Kings since he's been called for American League, but he's looked good, I think. I mean, yeah, he's going to be a good player.

You aren't that big, that fast with skills. He competes well enough. Like, it's going to work. Just to our previous conversation, sometimes these things do take time. and he may not be like this, he may not be an NHL senator. Maybe they don't believe the hockey sends is high end enough or they're a good team, the Kings.

They have good centers on the team. It just doesn't fit maybe short term. He's a winger or long term. He finds his way back to the middle. Maybe he doesn't. But Quentin's a good hockey player. He's still pretty young. I get, if you want to compare him

or Lefrenier to Tim Stutzla, it's a pretty one-sided conversation right now. But if you compare him to the rest of the draft class, I don't think he's that far. off, you can still have a conversation about him as one of the top five best players from that draft class, even top three to four. Like, he's a very good pro prospect. And it wouldn't surprise me, you know, we'll see how the rest of his year goes.

But I think by this time next year, he's going to be a good NHL player. And he is going to be an important part of that team for a very long time. Yeah. And I, just to answer to get to that question, too, about him being on the wing relative to center, I think the more reps he gets against the NHL, no matter what, playing alongside Andre Cope, playing, you know, meaningful minutes. That is progress. That is a good thing.

There are a lot of players that are going to be centers in their career that spend more time on the wing earlier. It allows him to kind of find his way offensively. And then eventually, you know, there's, you know, the duck started Trevor's Egress on the wing. They moved to back to center. You know, I think there's plenty of an opportunity to move Quentin back to center as time goes on. But it's, there's, it's, it is him being in the NHL. being a productive player and being a guy that can contribute on a top line, that is progress. All right.

Next one's from Papa Mucci. Who is the most physical forward that may fall into the middle of the first round? Have we already talked about him? I guess depending on where, like, I think we could probably all say Charlie Stramel is a guy who should be available in that range. And he might be the most physical forward in the class. Yeah, he's up there. I think Kaelin Lynn's pretty physical. I'm not sure if he's a day one guy.

Maybe with his offense, he could be, like maybe some. when he buys the Ridley-Greg type of profile, I would guess not as much offense probably goes, you know, somewhere in the second round for me. I guess it really depends on, you know, the size part of it too. Like, because I think like there are some like smaller guys like Ryan Leonard or Ethan Goethe who play hard, but they're both around like 5 foot 11. I also don't think Ethan Gauthier should be going in that range, even though I see him on a bunch of lists at that spot, but like Leonard could be like a mid-first as a guy who

was, you know, a really hard to play against type of guy. Although I wouldn't call him like, I don't think he's like a crusher. He's not like a physical player, but he's like a highs. He's taking some guys off their feet for sure. Yeah, but. Do you think he can be that guy in the NHL though at 511? He is, he is one of the thickest players in this draft. I mean, he is a strong kid.

Yeah, I mean, I think, I don't think he's going to be a crusher at the NHL level, like, but I do think he's going to be a physical player. We're seeing, you know, there are some guys that can absolutely throw it around a little bit. He's, he's so, he's a very physically advanced young man. What do you think? What do you think of a comp of him for like Jason Zucker? Hmm. Yeah, that maybe.

I think he's a little, I think he's a little more engaged physically than, than Zucker is. Yeah. I thought, yeah, because I always thought Zucker's like compete was like a big asset kind of thing. Yeah, it was. Yeah, he played, played, played, yeah, yeah, I think so. Yeah, that's fair. I thought you might say Kobe Barlow, Corey. You thought I was going to compare Ryan Leonard to Kobe Barlow?

No, no, I thought, like, in terms of the guy in the middle of the round, like, physical forward, I thought he might be at it that we were talking about. Yeah, he, I don't know if he's like a killer, but like he, I think he does compete hard. He's can kill penalties. Like, I'm trying to think of guys who, like, lay people out kind of thing. I think Stramel is the obvious answer. And I think because of his lack of offense, he's probably not going to be a high priority guy type of thing. He's probably more of a middle, middle first, late first. So I think that is the answer to the question.

All right. Jesse James Larch says, who are the prospects with the most potential to shoot upboards as the process goes on? Hmm. I mean. I think we go to the U18s then for that. I go who some guys. I think we can either from the U18 worlds or from the CHL playoffs possibly

that could have big performances from the U18s. I'll be, it depends on the context of like shooting up. Like from what point A to point B exactly what we're talking about. I'll be really curious to see what like Alley More looks like when he has better talent around him once they make some calls on in February. I think, you know, you look at some of the other international teams. You know, it'll be interesting to see if there's any, you know, down the radar suites or fins that have big U-18. You know, you mentioned like Noah Dowell-Nielsen who's having a monster year in the J-20s, but hasn't looked at the, looks so good with the 18 team with Sweden.

Does he have a big April? Does that change how we talk about him at all? Depends who comes up for Canada. I could see some of the better names, whether it's like Lucas Dragasevic or Andrew Kristol or Caden Price, go to a tournament like that and do they play well? Do they not play well? How does that change their draft stock?

Those are some guys that come to mind. Anybody for you, Chris? Yeah, I mean, it's tough to say it's kind of a, at this stage in the game, the guys are moving and up and down already. You know, I mean, and to shoot up throughout the rest of the season,

I mean, I'm still going to be very interested to see how the goalie, the goalie situation works out in the first round, you know, with the level. There's a number of good goaltenders. And I think that the fact is, you know, there are going to be teams. They're going to want to make sure that they come away with, like,

you know, one of those top guys. And that might force them to go a little bit higher than they, you know maybe in the first round maybe you know early second kind of things like that you know i'm still interested to see where where where a michael harabla goes where carson biannison goes you know guys that that we that they're those those to me are the three guys all three of which have been up and down this year like exactly we've had very good moments and not as good moments and who has that consistency in the second half or right anybody does actually yeah i mean you know and and i think

like there could be like a run on goalies at some point in the in the draft and you know but this is a this is a good year to be looking for a goalie I think that those guys even though they have had their ups and downs like I really like the upside of a rabble I really like what guy on has shown um even beyond the world juniors and what he's done at the junior level this year yeah armistence is athletic I think rats I think rats laugh in augustine are nice nice smaller goalies not as athletic maybe but they're but they're good smart goaltenders yeah so and yeah and I mean like Like, you know, does Ratslaff take the net from Millick in the playoffs? And if he does, you know, that could really change his trajectory as well.

So what about what about Daniel Boot? I mean, he's, I mean, he's not a guy who we're going to be able to see have a big U-18s because of the Russia thing. But, you know, when Bob McKenzie's list came out last week, this was a guy who's in the mid-20s. I know, Corey, you already have him much higher than that. But in terms of overall consensus, I feel like he's a guy who has that potential to jump into that range. Yeah, but I see the tools. I mean, he's 6'5. He can skate well for his size.

He has offense. His playing time has kind of been inconsistent. They kind of have like yo-yo, those guys around there in Russia. But I think when locomotive gets into their playoff run in the MHL, I think he'll be consistently playing with that one team, as opposed to being up with the KHL team. And I think that could be, I think that playoff run in that league will be very interesting to monitor for those top guys.

Here's another guy. potentially. And our next question, Peter G. Could Nate Danielson play in the NHL next season? Late birthday, strong board work, NHL-style game, make me think it's a possibility. I pick 10 to 25. We'll probably go to a team with at least some help and could possibly contribute in bottom six minutes.

What do you think, Chris? I don't think that's a good move. Not for, I mean, could he physically do it? Like, he's a really smart player. He's a really smart player. He does a lot of things well. I really liked this game, actually, at the top prospects game. It was kind of unassuming.

He ended up assisting on the Luca Panelli goal on a really nice feed, you know, coming off the boards. And yeah, I agree. Like, he does work well off the boards. He's got a high compete level. He does a lot of different things well. I just don't think, like, those guys that are in that next tier, like, you know, I look at like Cole Cillinger right now with Columbus. And, like, was he was capable of playing in the NHL?

But was that ultimately the right move for his long-term development? I guess we're going to find out. But I think that, you know, the desire to rush these players to get into the NHL at 18 really has to be tapered once you get past a certain point. I think Nate Danielson has the potential to be an impact prospect for the team that he goes to. And, you know, I think I just, I just, I always err on the side of patience. And with a guy like him, I think you want him to continue to play in the top six role. at the junior level. You want him to continue to develop his offensive game.

You want to continue to have time and space to make different kinds of decisions and learn what he is able to do. I just don't think that playing at the NHL level is necessarily the best thing for his long-term development. But again, you go into camp and you show yourself, well, anything can happen. So, I mean, physically, maybe, but I just, I don't, that's not something that I would anticipate. Yeah, I would only know, too.

I think he checks a lot of the things you look for with guys who could, translate. I think he's a really good skater. I think he competes well. He's got good size. He is intelligent. Probably, that's probably a year or two, too aggressive, maybe one year out from his draft, two years out from his draft. He's in the NHL. Probably not next year. I think you want him dominating junior. He'll be on Canada's World Junior team, I think, that next season, that's a better path. I think we'll be interesting with this draft with the NHL readiness is, I think we all reasonably presume Connor Bedard's in the NHL next year, but is Anne Fantilli for sure full-timer next year?

Is Leo Carlson for sure a full-timer next year? I could see arguments on both ends of that, but I think that's probably the more fascinating question as we get into the second half and see how those two progress. Yeah, and on the fantilly front, I think there's a good chance that he'd stick around for another year at Michigan. Right. I think it depends on how he does and the organization that drafts up, I think.

Right, absolutely. And yeah, and I mean, you know, you look at the guys that have gone to Michigan, like, you know, Owen Power first overall, went back for the next year. Luke Hughes went back for another year, you know, so there's. I think the biggest difference between him and maybe Owen Power, many been years, Kent Johnson, is the level of impact he had as a freshman compared to them. I would say he's well, no question. He's well ahead of those guys in terms of the impact he's already had at the college level. And I think if you think he's going back, like he has to be like the Hope and Baker favorite by like. a massive margin, I would say, going back as a sophomore.

Oh, yeah. So, oh, yeah. So, I mean, his production is at least, it's ahead of, I think, where Benares was. Even draft plus one, right? Yeah. Yes. By, by a bit. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, he's like, he's, yeah, he's one of the top, I think on a point per game basis, he's a top 10 player in college. It's right around there, I think. Oh, and points per game. He's, he's, he's, he's, uh, I think he's second. Yeah. So, yeah.

So, yeah. So, I think it's a very interesting. debate to have on whether he should play that second college year. Does he play some American League time? Does he go into the NHL right away? I think that'll be really interesting to see what the NHL organization ultimately decides to do. Yeah, actually, he's first in points per game in NCAA right now, 1.65 points per game. So, yeah, I mean, and you're right, Corey.

I think that is a fair point. I just, yeah, I think it's really interesting to see kind of the dynamic of the decision process. I mean, Luke Hughes also had, you know, an unprecedented freshman season at Michigan. you know and you know those guys have have a lot in common so just you know the guys that we've all talked about so yeah but I think it's it is interesting and and also to Leo Carlson do you think he has the pace to play at the NHL right now yeah no I don't I don't know like guys I think about when I think of Leo are guys like Thomas Hurdle guys like Miko Ranton in terms of play styles and both those guys took one extra year before they went to the NHL so I

I could see an argument for him to play one more year, whether it's in Sweden or in the American League. All right. Next one is from Jack Powers. This will be one I'm curious to hear from both of you. When you're going to scout a junior college game, assuming you have the complete freedom of seat selection, where in the arena do you like to sit for the best scouting vantage point? Chris, we'll go first. That's, you know, I've sat in a lot of different places.

at various ranks. And, you know, like, when I go to a USHL game, I kind of have my pick of wherever, you know, I can kind of go. But I've often found I prefer, I prefer watching from the middle. I do prefer seeing the entire ice, you know, from closer to center ice, elevated, you know, having a chance to see. And you don't always watch the puck carrier. You don't always, you know, but you still have a really good view.

And we're lucky in the media, we get kind of. often get unblocked vantage points from a press box, which allows us to see a good chunk. I don't want to be like in the NHL press boxes, you're often sometimes too high. You know, at junior and college level, you're able to be kind of, you know, closer to the ice and have a really good feel. I have also seen a lot of value in watching from an end. If I'm watching a defenseman, if I'm watching, you know, somebody that, you know, I'm really trying to zero in on.

I might watch from the end and see. But again, when you get to the opposite end, it gets a little bit harder. That's why I prefer to sit in the middle. And I think that that typically has been advantageous for me. I feel like I get the best information out of that vantage point. Whereas at the top prospects game, we were in a corner. And I was also, there was a table blocking my, like almost half the ice. So sometimes you've got to, like, get creative and stand up or stand on a chair or, you know,

basically throw somebody out of their seat. first time in angel history, Mike Morreale, he blocks somebody's view. Yeah. We love Mike. We love Mike. We do love Mike. He would laugh at that joke if he was here. For me, the answer is, wherever there's somewhere to plug in my phone.

But I also agree with Chris that I do prefer the middle. Typically, center-rise, lower, you know, first-level center-rise, typically is the best view for me. the only time that would change is if you go into the game knowing one side of the ice is loaded with talent and the other side isn't and you know this is going to be a 70% possession game and then I sit on the end where I know the puck's going to be every single time yeah yeah I always like the end I don't know why I like sitting pretty much not quite directly behind the net but slightly off center to the net my only thing I don't want I do not want to be anywhere that I have like an obstructed view of like the boards or the corners which is can be really brutal especially when you sit down low and yeah, I hate that. So elevated is my number one priority. Not really a, not really a insightful observation. But when you sit there at the end, I find you learn as much about a goalie as possible too.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. All right, last one is from Jason G. And this one's kind of almost like a state of the sport question, which is I think it makes it good to end on. He says, I watched the top prospects game and marveled at the site of a bunch of five, seven, which is a little bit of an exaggeration. players running around wondering if this is the future of the game will they lose a lot of fans the

intensity and toughness of hockey players is what drew many to the game i'm curious to hear what both of you guys think about this one right i actually wanted that question to be included because i thought it was interesting not because i necessarily agree with what they're asserting but because i actually heard that from several NHL people after the game was over including one director who said the game that was you know there was various assertions of that was one of the smallest showcase games I've ever seen or like, wow, there was a ton of small players in this game. I think you go through like the blue line. I think half of the defensemen were 6-0 or smaller.

So I thought that was an interesting observation where I would dispute what the person was asking because I actually thought the game itself was really competitive. I thought it was physical. I thought guys were going at each other. I thought it was intense. Like, you know, there was a fight in that game. People were, you know, or they were going after each other. other after the whistles and stuff like that. I thought it was very competitive. But it's fair to say

it was a, you know, the Canadian crop this year is on the smaller side. You know, now Quentin Mussie wasn't in the game. He is the most physical player. That being said, also Andrew Costal wasn't in the game. He is on the smaller side. So I don't know if the game is going to be losing that kind of intensity. I mean, it's not going to be, you know, the old Red Wings Colorado rivalry, I think, again, for the perceivable future where people are literally going after each other's throats. But I think the game

is plenty physical. I mean, Connor Bedard sure felt that way after that game. But there are definitely stylistic changes happening to the game over a long period of time

that is making it more possible for smaller players to become premium players at the higher levels. Yeah, I think, you know, the question is, is, is, you know, in terms of the intense, I don't think the intensity is, is ever going anywhere. You know, even the small, some of the, some of the small guys are some of the most competitive people that, that are in the game.

And they might not be able to do as much about it, you know, with, with the physicality. But I think that the NHL as a whole has gotten faster. And often the fastest players are. smaller to average size players. You get some players that have the speed and the size. I think that's why Adam Fantilli is getting such attention, because he is a bigger player that can really skate and has some physicality to him and different things like that.

So, you know, that's why, you know, he's so highly regarded in this class because there's a premium. But, you know, you look at it and look at how many of these young defensemen are coming through. You know, we're looking at Axel Sandin Pelica could be one of the top defensemen taking it will be one of the top defensemen taken in this draft. And he's, you know, 511 or 510. You know, so those, though, there are, there is more of that.

But I also think that the speed of the game, the entertainment value of the game is, is changing as well. I think that the league is continuing to see more stars, the younger players that are coming in with this higher end skill level. They're allowed to do the skilled things. They're allowed to try things. They're allowed to be creative without getting their heads punched in. And they can do a lot of different things. things and that is appealing to a broad audience as well. The other thing that you have to remember is a lot of these guys are coming up in the age of social media where the highlight clips, they're exposed to

more and more things in the game. And it's not the fight videos that are getting the most views anymore. I mean, they still do. They still do. They're still popular. It's not the big hits that are getting the big views. It's Trevor's eagerist doing a Michigan. It's, you know, Jack Hughes with his little backhand pass that's, you know, that's like insane. Those are the things that that are driving a lot of interest and eyeballs to the game because they're doing things that, you know, not everybody can do that. Almost everybody can be physical. Almost everybody can throw a body check.

Very few people can do the things that Jack Hughes does with the puck, that Connor McDavid does with the puck that Kyle McCarr can do, that that's what I think will continue to drive more interest in the game. And I don't think, but I don't think we're ever going to lose that intensity. They're still going to be body checking. They're still going to be fighting. There's still going to be other things like that. It just might be smaller people doing it.

All right. I think that's going to do it for us today. Thanks everybody for listening to this episode of The Athletic Hockey Show's prospect series. You can follow us on YouTube at YouTube.com slash at The Athletic Hockey Show. You can also catch more of Chris over at Flow Hockey on his podcast talking Hockey Sense. And right now you can get a one-year subscription to The Athletic for $2 a month. And you visit Theathletic.com slash hockey show. Talk you soon.