The Athletic Hockey Show - Colorado Avalanche win the Stanley Cup, Hockey Hall of Fame voting needs more transparency, Multiple Choice Madness, and more

Episode Date: June 27, 2022

First, Ian and Hailey discuss the Colorado Avalanche winning their first Stanley Cup since 2001, defeating the two-time defending champion Tampa Bay Lightning in 6 games, Nazem Kadri’s redemption story, and what his next contract will look like, if this is the end for the Lightning’s run of greatness, and much more.Plus, thoughts on ESPN’s Avalanche-Red Wings rivalry documentary, the need for more transparency in the Hockey Hall of Fame’s voting process as the 2022 class is set to be announced, and a couple of Multiple Choice Madness questions to close things out.And, right now, you can get a 6 month subscription to The Athletic for just $1 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

It is your Monday edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. It's Ian Medis Hilley Salvean back together again and back to recap the Stanley Cup final after Colorado secures. A Stanley Cup championship Sunday night. We'll talk about all the storylines coming out of that one. Nazim Cadry, Kail McCarr, is just the end of the road for Tampa. It's a big day in hockey too on this Monday. Hockey Hall of Fame announcement is going to be coming down later. We'll chat a little bit about that.

You know, we got a lot to get into. on the show. But Haley, I got to say out of transparency, because I did write about this, so I feel like, okay, now I can share. And I won't overshare. Don't worry.

I won't overshare. But the reason why I wasn't with you last week in the Monday time slot, I was sidelined with kidney stones. And I got to tell you, this is the most painful thing. I think I can never go. Like, I can't even describe the pain to you.

I don't know what the most painful thing that you've ever had happened to you. Like, What did you break your foot at one point? My baby toe? Yeah. It sucked. Yeah. Is that the worst pain you've, is that the most pain you've ever had?

I had some knee injuries when I, like I ran cross country and track when I was in university and I had some knee problems, but I don't, I didn't ever, I didn't actually ever tear anything fully. So I never had that full injury experience, just the, you know. Terrible knee pain every time you run. Just a nice dull ache that never goes away. Oh, I would gladly take a nice dull ache that never goes away. Because this thing is like, it's almost like if somebody takes an ice pick and stabs you in the back. That's the only way I can describe this feeling.

It's awful. And I don't know that I'm out of the woods yet. But I would love to, if any of our listeners have dealt with this before, my goodness gracious, please reach out to me with whatever tips you had to either pass the stones, manage the pain. I'm open. Like I'm into anything at this stage of the game. Like I'm into that. Please help.

If it's weird, holistic, I don't care what it is. I'm in. I'm in. Get some sage, burn it in your house. Yeah. You need to cleanse whoever you pissed off who did this to you. Yeah. It's like, you think there's a voodoo doll of me out there that she's being.

Someone's actually just stabbing you in the back. in a doodoo doll actually is what's happening. Well, because this is coming right off the heels of, I was playing softball this year. I was like, you know what, I need to get back into, you know, playing some sport. So I play softball, my first game, Haley, torn hamstring.

This is not, this has been a terrible reminder that I'm in my 40s now. Yeah, I was going to say, like, was it like a pre-base, like were you stretching? Or were you running the bases? No, I was rounding third. rounding third headed for home. Were you just running and then went, oh, oh.

Yep. Totally. I didn't make that noise. I ran too hard. Yeah, I did. I planted, anyway. So this has not been a great stretch for me. That's tough.

Physically speaking. Physically speaking. I will gut it out to do. You know what? And it's a perfect place to lead off because when you listen to, and Peter Baas's coverage and Joe Smith's coverage has just been dynamite throughout the Stanley Kapplaas. But watching them.

their coverage and reading about, you know, Nazim Cadry, let's start there. Had an injury, Haley, that he said after winning on Sunday, should have been a six-week recovery. He was back in under two weeks to play. Yeah, it broke a-established out in multiple places. Like, it wasn't just like a, it was like a multiple kind of issue up and around there for him. You know, everybody kind of reveals their injuries. It's remarkable. But, I mean, let's start there because I think the Nazim-Cadry vindication story,

might be as interesting of a storyline as anything that came out of the Stanley Cup for the Colorado Avalanche. That postgame interview where he makes the guy, he's straighted up, addresses the fact that people think he's been a problem. Kiss my ass. For people who think I've been. Can we say that on here? Yeah.

I think so. Well, he, Nazim Cadry said it on TV. How can we not say it? We're fine. We're fine. Kiss my. It was awesome. It was great.

I think I saw a PJ Stock post about it. He was my co-host when we did the Olympic show. Obviously, PJ played. He played for the Bruins. And PJ posted something like every player at some point in their career has felt this at some point. Like, to the people who doubted me, the people who hate me, like, you can kiss my butt. It almost sounds weird when you say, but. And he was like, but you don't really get that many opportunities to actually say that.

And he's like, winning the Stanley Cup is the time to let that out and finally air that out there into the world. Like winning the Stanley Cup is the platform that you take to tell everyone who's doubted you to kiss my ass. It's really remarkable though because, you know, what he went through in that St. Louis series with the kind of the racial taunts that were directed at him, he responds with a hat trick. he gets that injury in the in the Edmonton series hit from behind by Evander Cain. We think, well, that's it for him. Comes back, scores the overtime winner. And I get it.

I understand that that overtime winner was cloaked in a little bit of controversy with the too many men, whatever, whatever. Okay, whatever. Just over two weeks after having surgery on his thumb. Yeah. Like 16 days or something. Like, it was wild. Yeah, it's one of the great stories.

Yeah, and after what happened in Toronto, too, I know there's some Leafs fans who are always going to root for Nazim Kodry, and there's some Leafs fans who are never going to forgive him for the suspensions and for the things that happened with the Leafs. But, you know, Peter did a really great story, and I know he traveled to London and spent some time with Nazim's family, you know, met the parents and talked to his wife and everyone for this story. Like, that trade hit him very, very hard because he was somebody who grew up wanting to play in the league and, you know, wanting to play for the Maple Leafs. And then everything went down the way it did. And I think being traded from that team, like,

really hurt him. And I think it took him some time to just recover from that fact. Like, that's the thing. Like, these are people, right? And I think we forget that so often. Like, this was a person being uprooted from everything that he knew. And then even more so, this is a person who's being racially taunted in one of the biggest moments of his life. I mean, that doesn't even matter. Just the racial taunting in any environment is horrible. And like, Nazim Kodry has been through a lot. And I think you saw that in his celebration.

Like, you saw how much he'd been through and the relief when he's lifting the cup over his shoulders and how happy this person looks to finally get through all that shit. that has been thrown at him and finally reach the peak. I thought that was a really special moment. And then seeing him, I think there was a picture of him with his dad out there. Like he was someone for sure that it was like, yeah, this is awesome. Like that's always my favorite moment for the Stanley Cup finals is when you see everyone getting the cup and everyone has their moment.

And then you see their families and the post-gate. Kyle Boccas did an amazing job on the broadcast post-game interviews. He had me tearing up a bunch of times. but I thought Codry's celebration specifically in his interview were real, real highlights of the post-game celebration for sure. You know what? You mentioned Peter did a fantastic story on Nazim

and kind of his journey. And it was Peter's story if I'm not, correct me if I'm wrong on this. I always thought this was weird. Tell me if this was weird. That when the day that Nazim Cadrika traded from Toronto, Kyle Dubas phones him and says you've been traded. Cadry's at home with his family

and he doesn't tell his family what happens. He walks into the bedroom, closes the door and posts on Instagram that he's been traded, then comes out and tells his wife, right? Yeah, I think that was probably. But isn't that weird? The way I see is he probably needed to deal with that in the immediate aftermath by himself. And then his like first priority because he grew up, you know, London, you know, that's not quite, it's not GTA, but.

Yeah. Yeah, like growing up. outside of Toronto, dreaming of playing there, going through, finally making it, everything that happened. Like, he probably felt a sense of like, I need to say something to the fans now. But before your wife? Like, I just feel like it was, like,

if I got something like that seismic happened to my career and I got a phone call and I told my wife, just hang on a second. I'll be right back. And then I went and posted on social media, then told her, I feel like it might be a little awkward. But that's just me. You think she didn't know what the, call was about, though?

I don't know. Like Kyle Dubus calls and then he like walks into the room and he needs to be alone. Like that was probably the thing. Like he probably went to be alone. I don't know the exact timeline. But for me, it's like, you know, he probably needed to process that by himself and decided I'm going to say something. Like, I don't know.

Maybe he did tell her. I don't know. I don't think we got the precise timeline of events there. But you can kind of wrap your head around it because of how much playing for the meant to him and how much the fan base and the organization meant him. Like, you can kind of understand in his head saying, like, I have to do this and say something to them as soon as possible. And I'm sure that was hard.

That was probably something when he was dealing with the fact that he was traded. Like, those were probably the things that came to mind is I've loved being a make belief. I've loved playing for you. I've loved all this. I don't know. Yeah. No, it's, you know what? And I hope that this obliterates the narrative of you can't win with that guy.

Like, you know, like for years, it's like, well, you can't win with Nazim Kadri. Or for years it was you can't win with Ovechkin or you can't win with whatever. Like, and I hope, and I know there's people out there, and I'm just going to pick another random guy here, like Jack Eichol. You're going to hear people say, you can't win with Jack Eichol. Yeah, you can. You can win with anybody if you surround them with a really good team. Like that has to be the takeaway here is that that I hope people understand you can win. win with Nazim Kadri.

You can win with these types of guys. And if you're at Toronto, don't you look at this and think to yourself, Cadry Hyman, Zach, and Connor Brown, Zach Hyman, Connor Brown, Nazim Kadry. Under our umbrella at one point, and those are exactly,

like that's exactly the type of player we're probably missing at this stage of the game, right? Like that was their window, I think was to win when they had all of those guys under reasonable contracts, no? I don't agree because Austin Matthews and Mitch Marner and William Nielander were younger at that point. They weren't the, like that's not Rocket Richard Hart Trophy Austin Matthews. Awesome Matthews was still great, but that's not 100 point Mitch Marner 60 goal, Austin Matthews at that point in the Leafs timeline.

Like when they were losing, it was like almost still sucked for Leafs fans. But like, you know, think of that Boston Bruins series. It was 4-1. Like, I don't think you can look back on that and say, like, oh, you biffed it because you had cadre and Connor Brown. Like, no, the Bruins were the better team. The Leafs, they were like 23, 22. My God, not even.

Like, how old is Awesome Matthews now? Like, these guys are still young, right? So, like, we're talking about a core of 19, 20-year-olds. Like, that wasn't going to happen. You can look back and still say it's annoying, especially within the context of everything happened over the last five, six years. But I don't think you can look back and say, like, you ruined your window of contention because you didn't win with Nazim Kodry. I think both things can be true. I think you can say that Kodry, that you can win with Nassam Kodry will

also acknowledging that the Leafs probably needed to do what they needed to do. Like, I think there was a trust loss there. And I don't think that's something that you can easily get back, right? And that was the one thing with Kodry and Jared Bedner, and he goes into the avalanche and he gets suspended that one year. And, you know, they kind of, they gave him that other shot. And they showed the trust in him. And they just, you know, always made him feel comfortable and not like he was this issue that they needed to contain. And I don't know if he would have been able to achieve that at that point after everything that would have, that had happened in Toronto. So you can win with cadre, but I also think we can acknowledge that the Leafs probably needed to do that when

they did because of the trust factor. And there was the Mitch Martin, Mike Babcock thing that happened too. Cadre was like, right? Like, what, what did that do with the trust factor there? You know, we know that Codry was one of the ones who was on that piece of paper that was used in that whatever mind game trick that Mike Babcock was trying to play too. So I just think it was probably hard for him to see at the time, but obviously the change of scenery was excellent for his career, both individually because of the season he had. He's going to get paid this summer and also from a team perspective because he just won a Stanley Cup. Well, he's going to get paid. I think he's really enhanced his value, right? Because not only did he have a magnificent offensive season

where he averaged more than a point of game, he then, for the most part, was essentially, I know Jordan Bittington and St. Louis fans might disagree. But he was very disciplined for the most part in the Stanley Cup playoffs didn't cross the line and certainly played a big factor even though he was banged up and his team winning. I just wonder like, you know, what does his deal look like? Do you pay him like he's a 75 or 85, 95 point guy? Do you think he's more, that was just a just happened to be on a powerhouse team? He's probably more like a 60 point guy. And I just don't, I'm really fascinated about what he's,

deal might look like because like, I guess let me phrase it this way. After seeing him do what he did this year in Denver, do you think he could be somebody's legitimate number one centerman? Or is he just better served as you're perfectly slaughtered in the two spots? I think that if Nazim Kodry is your second line center, you're going to be a very, very good hockey team. You know, like that's the ideal to see behind your like elite, superstar level first line center, I think. Like, I, I, I don't know. I mean, he's still pretty, he's not even that old.

He's 31. So we're not talking about like a 34-year-old about to hit UFA status. I mean, he's, he's older than someone like Johnny Godreau, but he's younger than of Guinea-Malkin. Like, like, maybe that's a different way to look at it. Like, if you are a team who needs a centerman right now for the next four years, who are you giving more money to? Caudry or Malkin right now?

Malkin's 36. He's coming off of a knee injury. Audrey, isn't it? Don't you think for more money and more term? Like, if Gennie Malkin is going to go down as the better player. Like, that's a Hall of Fame career of Gany Malkin and his cons mites and his trophies, his Stanley Cups. He's a thousand point player at this point.

over his career, is he? Is that just Crosby and Ovechkin right now? Malkin's a little bit behind. Yeah, Malkins missed some games. I'll look at that up. But I think he's not, I feel like he's at 1,000, no? I would think we looked at this before. But I think if you're a team who says, like, we need a center right now,

you might be giving more money to cadre right now. Malkins 35. And yeah, he's an 1100 point guy. to at this point in his career. He's going to go down as the better player. Hands down. That's not the conversation we're having. 31 year old, Nazim Kadri, who's healthy coming off of an excellent season or 35-year-old. He's turning 36 this summer. So 36-year-old of Gennie Malkin, who's coming off of, you know, only playing a partial season due to big knee surgery.

But the thing on Malkin, what's weird, like he was still. Still better than a point. I know he only played half the games this year. I know that's the thing. We're like, mm-hmm. He's 42 points. Yeah,

he was great. You know what? I think, here's what I think happens. I think Malkin gets a higher cap hit. I think Cadre gets the longer term. Mm-hmm. Right?

I also just wonder if Malkin stays in Pittsburgh. I kind of hope he does. I want him to go somewhere weird like Nashville. Like just make it weird. Like just be like, or Anaheim. You're like, what, I guess.

And just Columbus. Like just some random place where you're like, what is that I've got? It's like when Sergey Federov went and played in those, like Sergey Federov was in Columbus at one point. You're like this guy, what is going on here? I feel like a lot of the conversation was like Malkin to Dallas because they have so many Russian players, but they don't have any money. Dallas is going to be very interesting this off season.

But you know what? I think, yeah, we're talking about Malkin. Like, well, 35 year old Malkin's still 20 goals, 42 points and 40 games this season. And like, ho-hum. But that's the level that we've always, like, that's just relative to what we've seen from him as a player over his career. Like, he's an incredible, incredible center. But, like, that's almost kind of a thing.

Like, againi Malkin can be your one C. Absolutely. I think Nassim Kodry could be your one C. But if you have Codry behind McKinnon and Malkin behind Crosby, that's like an elite one-two punch. in your top six. And I think that's probably what your ideal situation is with someone like Codry.

I don't think he's going to be out of his depth as a first line center, though we haven't exactly, I think it's tough because we haven't seen him in that space in a while, right? Like we're talking about a guy who we've seen in Denver. He wasn't the first line center in front of Austin Matthews. You know, Matthews was the guy. So it's kind of hard to say, like, absolutely he can do this. But to draw on Calgary, like nobody who thought,

Elias Linholm was going to be there one seat, right? So I don't know. But I think it's going to be interesting. I think this summer is really interesting in terms of the kind of players that we can talk about Malkin and Cadrean. Johnny Goddrow, like there's so many interesting UFA forwards this summer. And they all kind of are a little bit different. But we were talking about the cup final. But yeah, I don't know what he's going to make.

I really don't know what Codry's going to make on the open market. Yeah. I think it depends on the team specifically, because there's not a lot of teams with a ton of cap space this summer that might also attract, that might be attractive to him. Like, that's always the thing, right?

You have to have that perfect package of cap space, you know, the plan to show that you're going to be good slash already good. And that's not always easy. And we should never discount the fact that he finds a way to stay in Denver, right? Like maybe he loves it there so much and he won a cup there and he's willing to take less or they're willing to be creative. Like we should always assume that staying put is a possibility. It just it feels like he could really cash in this summer and someone's going to pay him a boatload of money and it's certainly well deserved.

We were really hyped up about this series and I think a lot of us were hoping, especially when Stephen Stamcoast opened the score. on Sunday night. I think we were all dreaming about a possibility of a seventh game back in Denver on Tuesday night. That, of course, didn't happen. And largely because I think Colorado, like, Haley, I know you were live blogging the game on Sunday. Like, that was downright clinical what they did in the third period.

It wasn't like, oh, man, Colorado's hanging on by the fingertips and Darcy Kemper. Like, Darcy Kemper made one save that I thought was pretty good. And that was on Nikita Kuturov on kind of a cross-ice quasi-one, one-timer, but Kutrov didn't even get all of it on the shot. Like, to me, that was just downright, like, methodical and clinical. And it's what every team should be doing when you've got a one-goal lead in a game is do what the avalanche did in the third period last night, which is put the gas to the floor and go.

And they completely locked it down defensively, too. Yeah. I think one of the best things about the game last night and the series in general was how unpredictable everything was. I don't think, like, I don't bet anyways, but I don't think I would have confidently put money on really anything at any point. Sure, I can say, like, you know what, I think the apps are going to take this one and win in six. But I wouldn't actually put my money where my mouth is because everything about the series was unpredictable. Who saw that seven nothing game or seven two and, you know, that OT game?

Like, who saw a lot of this stuff coming? Like it was, there was so many twists and turns. And I really do think it lived up to the hype. I thought this was a great series. I thought this was the best cut final we've had in a long time. And that might be recent C-Bias talking. But I think I saw someone on Twitter say, like, that was probably the most fun I've had in a cup final since the back-to-back penguins, red wings years in, like, 08 and 09. Because those ones were awesome.

Like, those two cut finals were incredible. But I think what the abs did so well is the first period was quite even, even though they didn't start great. Tampa had a better start, obviously. Drawing the penalty, you can say draw the penalty or anyways, they end up on the power play less than 30 seconds in. They open the scoring at home and you think, okay, here we go. Tampa's going to be able to maybe start locking it down and maybe get one more and then completely shut it down. And the abs kind of weathered that first period came back, and it was very easy. And even in terms of ozone time, shot attempts, shots on goal, high danger chance. Like, that was a very even period, that even strength after that power play ended. And then I think the second period is when you started to see the abs really start to take over. It was like midway through the second. You could see the abs starting to take it up a notch and starting to have the puck more.

and starting to just cook in the ozone more. And that's when obviously McKininin scored early in that period. But then they get what would become the game winner. And then the third period was just a defensive clinic. Like really, really impressive. Tampa didn't have a shot on goal until 1013 in the third period. Like that is not how you're going to come back in a season ending, defining game. Right?

But that's exactly how you're going to put a team way, like Tampa, because you can't let Kutrov have too many chances to tie it up. You can't let Stamco's have too many chances to tie it up. And that's exactly what they did. It was like a clinical defensive game. And that's one of the things they do so well is they play D, but they also do it. They're a very good puck possession team as well. That's your best defense, right, is keeping the puck in their zone. So by the time their guys get the puck back,

they're so gasped that they have to just dump it in and get a change. And that's what the abs were doing to them for that third period. It was very impressive. You know, one thing I noticed with Tampa on Sunday night is for the first time, and you didn't see it against Toronto or the Rangers when their backs were against the wall, but you saw frustration, right? Like you saw Ryan McDonough hitting, who did he hit from behind now? I'm more on my blanket.

Anyway, he buries the avalanche player. Yeah. Pat Maroon is slashing guys. Stamco shoots the puck at the official. He's lucky he didn't get an extra two there. And then at the end of the game, what I thought, did you see this? The Kutrov thing? Yeah, with 25 seconds left, for the people who didn't see this, this was really weird.

25 seconds left in the game, the avalanche dumped the puck down the ice. Victor Hedman goes to get it, and he kind of lays up because he's thinking it's going to be icing. and the ref, the lineman waves off the icing and everyone's shocked. As this is happening, Nikita Kuturoff is at the Tampa bench. His stick is broken. He's trying to get a new stick. For whatever reason, the training staff, nobody had a stick for him. And Kuturoff is like, he threw a glove at him, right?

Like he threw a glove. He like threw his gloves off and went on the bench. Right. And it's like you got 20 seconds left in your season and you're, most talented offensive player is throwing his equipment off. Like, it was just, I had never seen Tampa get unglued. I know, but you can also look at it like, and not to glory, like, not to say like, absolutely have a temper tantrum.

Like, do this. Yeah, it's your star player with 25 seconds left in the season and he's throwing his gloves off, but it's also their best player standing on the ice without a stick. Asking for one, asking for one, asking for one. Which is like, I can get it like where. Where is his stick? Like, did everyone on the bench just say, like, it's done? You know, like, okay, well, I guess I'm just not going to have this ready.

Like, I've talked to equipment staff before. Like, that is, I mean, I remember talking to one of the Sends equipment guys. Like, that's their art form. It's literally just getting the stick out really quickly. We've seen equipment guys all the time get the assist, right? Sydney Crosby loses sticky, streaking down the board. and the equipment guy just puts a stick over and he grabs and he goes and scores. We've seen that happen before with like Marner and, and we see that.

This was the complete opposite where it's like, where's a stick, where's a stick, where's a stick. Right. I get he just was probably the heat of the moment in the game and was like, this is unbelievable. Like, where's my stuff? Not that throwing your stuff at a member of the training staff is ever okay. That's not what I mean. But it was just weird. It was like he's freaking out.

Where's his equipment? and like weird, weird things happening. Yeah, again, I think it was just a great illustration of how the seemingly unflappable Tampa Bay Lightning were suddenly just discombobulated in Game 6. And that's full credit to the Aves because the Aves kind of drove them to it. So now then becomes the, look, I think we know, even if they bring Cadry back or not, it feels like the Avalanche should be a force to be reckoned with here in the next couple of years. The question, though, is, is this the end of the road for Tampa? And I know Stephen Stamco's was very pointed last on Sunday night after speaking to reporters Peter Bond. Or sorry, Joe Smith in his column basically wrote, hey, Stephen's like, why is everyone writing us off?

But, you know, they've got some free agents here, Andre Palat, who's been a huge part of their team. He's a UFA. Nick Paul, who is just a wonderful fit in there. He's a UFA. And Yan Ruda, who's played some big minutes for them, he's a UFA. but I mean listen Kutcheroff points Stamcoce Sirelli

Headman Surgachev they're all coming back Fazilev they're all coming back What are your expectations for Tampa now Like do you keep them at the top of the heap Saying yeah you know what They've been to three straight Stanley Cup finals Until somebody dethrones them from the east

They're still the class of the east Or do we see enough holes in them Along the way where Toronto had them on the ropes The Rangers had them on the ropes And then finally Colorado finished them off I can see some holes now that they're a little bit more vulnerable than they were in the past. I don't know. I think you still have the best goalie in the game in Andre Vasselowski.

So that's always going to be what makes me think that they're going to be fine. I think Stamco has had, you know, the best postseason season that we've seen him have in a long time. Like these Kutrov's still Kutrov. He's not old. Like we're not watching him go off a cliff here. I think Sorrelli and Point are still young players who are continuing to get better within that system. You still have John Cooper as your coach. I think it kind of depends on what they can do with the very limited space that they have to replace the players that they're potentially going to lose, right?

Yeah. But this isn't them losing Blake Coleman and Barclay Goodrow and the whole third line this summer, right? Like this is actually not that bad. Yeah, you're losing Victor Hedman's D partner. But, you know, he's essentially taken cheap deals every single year with the Tampa Bay Lightning. So I don't put it past maybe he returns on another discount deal. Maybe he finally cashes it on the fact that he's been to three straight Stanley Cups and he's been Victor Hedman's D partner. There are teams who are going to pay for a player like that.

I wrote about, and we're talking about Ruda here. I put him as an option for the Calgary Flames because they need someone beside Oliver Shillington when Chris Tannock's potentially out. I think I saw him on the Vancouver Canucks. Like maybe he could play with Quinn Hughes. Like there's going to be teams who were interested in his services. Same with Nick Paul. Same with Andre Plott.

But that's not losing that entire third line. That was arguably the best line in hockey when they won that. Was it their second cup? The first cup? When did we all just fall in love with that? that Coleman Goudreau, Gourd line. The first cup.

The first cup. The first one? Yeah, and then came the expansion. They lost. No, no, they had them for both those, right? And then... Yeah. I think they were very, very, very good, the second Stanley Cup.

I mean, they were great in both. Anyways, I don't think it's as a direct hit. I think the lightning, all I'm trying to say is I think the lightning are... They're not going anywhere. Like, this is... Their core is still there. They've got the goalie. got the coach, they got the core pieces.

I think if you just look at the east too, like, and think of it too, like, Braden Point, he got hurt in the Toronto game. Yeah. Game seven against the Leafs, right? Game seven, yeah. They got through the Rangers without Braden Point. And if we believe he's like the future big one. They swept the president's trophy winners without Braden Point.

Think about that, right? They swept Florida without Braden Point. That's the thing, right? So, yeah, maybe we can say, are they going to have a whole? holes from what they did this year, but they look what they did this year without Braden Point. And with the injuries on that roster, John Cooper said that if it was the regular season, they would have had half of their American League roster up right now last night. So I don't think they're going anywhere because they're going to have point back and they're

going to be healthy and et cetera, et cetera. And what team in the East is actually going to get that much better this summer? Everyone's capped out. who's going to be making, like, big, big steps to challenge the Tampa Bay Lightning. Toronto is already there. The Lightning, you know, we had Joe Smith on and he said that was the hardest series they'd played. The Rangers are going to be there.

That's a great team. They had a good series against Tampa. I don't think Ottawa is going to be challenging. Florida is going to probably be better. Florida would be the team for me that if they make a couple of tweaks, although they made a massive coaching change that. I don't, we'll see how that plays out. Yeah.

So I don't know. It's always so hard to do that, do this right now. I just, the Tampa. I tweeted that stupid quote from, did you ever see holes? The movie holes. Did your kids ever watch that with Shilabuff

where they're digging holes? No. They're like in, it's like juvie kid. All they do is dig holes in the heat. Okay, never mind you wouldn't get it then. No, go ahead for the, for the benefit. of our listeners. No, no, for the benefit of our listeners who have seen holes, you can't leave them hanging.

I'm not going to do the, like, the, I'm not going to, like, say the quote if you don't get it. And, okay, I tweeted this stupid clip from Holes where it's a flashback to the little girl. She's like, I'm tired of this, grandpa. He's like, well, that's two damn bad. Like, that's how I feel about the Tampa Bay Lightning being good every year. He's like, I'm tired of this, grandpa. And you're the Tampa Lightning being like, well, that's two day in bed. See there.

I got the reference. And now the listeners who've watched holes are like, yes, you nailed it. Yeah, just did the really bad kind of southern accent. I think that's how they talk. Anyways, it was a very funny tweet. I thought it was funny. Yeah, I'll take, listen, I'll take your word for it. Take your word for it.

Okay, so listen, that was a really fun, like you said, it was a fun series. There was certainly some moments where the tensions started to boil over. And I think that that was great because for the benefit of our American audience, Haley, on Sunday, the table was set for that by a lot of people tuning in to watch ESPN's documentary on the Colorado Avalanche and Detroit Red Wings, great rivalry of the 90s and early 2000s. And first of all, you and I, we live in Canada. We did not have access to this. So we need help from our listeners here. Like, give us a preview, like in the comment section and tweet at us. let us know what your favorite part of that documentary was because Twitter was a buzz on Sunday afternoon.

People were like, wow, that was amazing. Best sports documentary I've ever seen. Great job capturing it. Like, I'm super excited to see this, but I was really frustrated that like. I don't know what you guys are talking about. Yeah, I don't know when they're going to. I'm sure TSN will show it in Canada at some point. But, man, that was frustrating to watch everybody talking about something that you just have no access to.

Yeah, I mean, it was weird. I know Sarah Sivian and I did the live blog last night, and she hopped in a live blog, and she's like, I am ready for a goalie fight. I just finished watching the SPN doc, and, you know, I'm ready for goalie fights. I'm ready for some drama. And I was like, I don't get the reference. So she was all amped up after watching it. She was a lot more excited for the game than I was, because I had no idea what she was talking

about. there's a lot of people who are kind of in their late 20s, early 30s, that will credit the Detroit, Colorado rivalry for really getting them into the sport. Really, they fell in love with hockey at the same time that those two teams were meeting. And I don't, like for you, I know you, like the penguins, the Crosby penguins were kind of your real first love of hockey, right? Or not? Yeah, yeah, I would say, I think I, like, that's one of my, like, that's one of my, like, memories in terms of really getting into the sport was the draft, like the 05 draft. Yeah.

I was sitting in an East Side Marios. You were at East Side Marios? With my dad. We watched the draft. My mom and dad, my all you can eat breadsticks. Did you have, like, one of the things when you go to East, and East Side Marios, by the way, for our American audience is a Italian, what would be the equivalent? It's like discount olive garden.

Yeah, there you go, olive garden. Exactly. I was like, what can we compare to it? It is the Olive Garden. But did you, were you one of those kids when you went to East Side Marios that you would order like, I want the Jolly Rancher drink with the cotton candy and like the crazy straw? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no allowed to have that. Shirley Temple.

Surely Temple. Just give me the Sherley Temple. Just give me my Shirley Temple with extra cherries, please. Oh, God, you have to have the marriage. And the cherries taste better when they're on those little plastic swords too, right? Would you agree? It enhances the whole experience. The whole thing.

Anyway, so you were at East Side Marios. Yes, I was at an East Side Marios. Wait, wait, when you go, like, when you watch a draft at a restaurant, the volume's not on at, like, East Side Marios, Olive Garden. I don't remember. This was in 2005. I don't remember if the volume was on. We were in the Bar Side.

Yeah. So the volume was probably on because it was the bar side and it was the draft and Sydney Crosby. So I remember that, but I also remember just going to games and stuff. And I talk about this all the time. I grew up in a small town and there was nothing to do in Fergus, Ontario. Like when we got a Walmart and a Target, it was a big deal for Fergus because there was finally like that target. We only had targets in Canada for like six months.

I know, but it was very awesome. But that's what I mean. Like there was nothing. Like we had the Zellers that turned in the Target and then we got a Walmart and that was the huge deal when the Walmart opened in like the south end of town. But anyways, because there was not much to do. My dad and I spent a lot of time just going to Rangers games at the odd or going to Guelph Storms games. If we were in London, we'd go to London Knights games. And it was this like prime time for like Canadian junior hockey, right?

Because Landis Scog was playing for the Rangers and Drew Dowdy was playing. for the Guelph Storm. John Tavares was playing for the Oshua Generals. London had some good teams there, right? Yeah. Yeah, like the London night. Cadre wasn't on all those teams, but you know, there was, I think Patrick Kane was on the Knights at one point.

You had Cadry on the Knights. You had Corey Perry, like Rob Shrempe, like the 05 London Knights were a big deal. And they obviously went to the Memorial Cup final against the Ramoskios. which was Sydney Crosby's team in the queue. So those were like the core memories, like watching Gabe Landisog and the Rangers at the odd. My dad and I, and that's what's so great is being in the sport at this level now. And I'm at home at my parents' place in Ontario right now and watching these games

with my dad, there's all these like, you know, you'll watch the game and dad goes, do you remember watching like Gabe Landiscag when you were a kid? And there's all these like just like really nice full circle moments when you actually get to this point. working in the NHL and you get to share that with your dad almost. And it's just like, you know, he, you know, he took me to go and watch him when he was in junior and all that good stuff. So those were, that's kind of what it was for me was Canadian junior hockey. And then, yeah, then watching Crosby and then he gets drafted first overall and it's like, hey, that's the guy who lost his line.

That's not what I said. That's the guy who lost to Cory Berry. That's not what I said. But that's kind of where it was for me when I was like, really, really hooked on the sport. I'm aging myself maybe, but... No, you're aging me. By the way, two things.

One, again, we want to hear from our listeners about that Aves Red Wings documentary because we didn't get a chance to see it. Tell us what you loved about it. And if you know when it's airing in Canada too or if there's maybe a sneaky way we can watch it, we'd love to hear that. The other thing is you mentioned that you were at your parents

house doing this podcast. You didn't need to tell us that, Haley, because you know when we knew You know at what point in this podcast we knew that you were at your parents' house? We heard a home phone ringing in the background. I thought you're going to say when my mom came in and brought me a coffee. No, no, no, no. I didn't have this when we started recording.

The viewers could not see that, but they could certainly hear the sound of a home phone ringing. And they're like, who is where there is a home phone? The answer is Haley at her parents' house. I'm not even joking. It does not matter what time of day or what I'm doing. And this is like a running joke with Aaron. he, every time I'm on the phone with Aaron, one of our bosses, the home phone rings.

And he's like, I don't get it. It's the home phone again. As a matter who I'm on the phone with. It's just, I'll be on my cell phone. I'll be on a Zoom call. And the home phone starts ringing every single time, at least once. Yeah.

So yeah. We still have a landline. I think what's going to be really interesting, and we want to point out that by the time a lot of you are listening to this podcast, there's a very good chance. The Hockey Hall of Fame has already announced its inductees for 2022. So we're not going to spend a lot of time, you know, it's going to be hard for us because, you know,

somebody might get in and, you know, we're debating that. I just, first of all, and I'd love to see the Siddians are worthy of being in the Hall of Fame. I think Roberto Lovango is worthy of being in. Heck, and look, people know where I stand on Daniel Alpherson. I think he should be in there. Alex McGilney, Keith Kachuk. Like, the list goes on and on. What I would like to highlight, though, Haley,

What I really want to see from the Hockey Hall of Fame is I would love to see a little bit of transparency in this process. And I say that because I think like the year that Guy Carbono got in a couple of years ago, like I had no idea that this guy was even on the radar. And it would have been really helpful to know that you know what, the year before like Guy Carbino just missed out. Like he had 71% of the vote. You need 75. That would have been helpful information. And I think that's what I'm really lacking here is some tangible information on how close is Rod Brindamore?

How close is Daniel Alpherson? How close is Mike Vernon and Tom Brassel? These are all people that I think are deserving of being in the Hall of Fame. But I have no idea. And I wish that there was an element of transparency. So I don't want to get into this thing where, you know, I think oftentimes what happens is when people get into the Hall of Fame, we start to nitpick them and we're like,

well, this guy, like Rod Brindamore would, be a great example. People say he should have been, he should be in. I think he should be in. And I think Alex McGilney should be in. And Keith Kachuk and Alfie and all all these guys, Sadiens. But I just wish there was transparency here. Yeah. That's all. Is that too much to ask for? No, I don't think so. I think, and the reason guys like that aren't in, though, is because you get these first ballot guys coming up. And I remember doing this exercise when I was still on the Sends Beaks. We did the Mock Hall of Fame Committee. And I, nominated Daniel

Alfredson. And I tried to get him into our fake Hall of Fame. And everyone was like, it's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Very Good. And people were like, no, no, no, no, no. I got zero traction on it. So then I didn't end up voting for Daniel Alfordson, who was my own nominee. So I was like, you only get four votes or you get five votes, four votes on your ballot. And I'm not going to

waste it on someone who everyone just openly pushed back on. And I think it was a very eye-opening part of the process is it's just like that was just our little work committee. But I think, you know, it's not hard to imagine that that's what Alfredson's been facing in the real Hall of Fame. Why he hasn't been into this point is that there's been people in the committee saying, no, no, no, no, no, like he's not good enough. And then, you know, if you lose the guy that you're really fighting for, you have to, you have to pivot to get someone into the Hall of Fame, right? That's how it works. everyone if you don't get a certain amount of votes in the first round you just get cut so that's always

difficult but it would be interesting to see that in a really transparent way like who who's voting for who um i think more specifically when it comes to women i think that's very important i think it'd be very interesting to see if it's just cassie campbell pascal nominating women every year and vouching for them every year um because just for the record to Two women can get in every year. And two women don't always get in. Usually it's just one. Because it's not somebody who's really vouching for them, like who is really, right?

And I think that's been the frustrating part is there's been way more women with Hall of Fame credentials who have not gotten into the Hall of Fame yet. If Jen bought, like, so to me, Carolyn Nulet is a should be a first ballot Hall of Famer. Amazing, amazing career. This is her first year, right? Yeah. And she's probably going to get in this year. if Jen Botterall or Natalie Darwitz or someone else does not get in with her, I think that's a really, it's a shame because there's women who've been waiting to get in who deserve it,

but Carolyn Ulet should be in, like right away. Carolyn Ulet, like you said, first year nominee. So is Megan Dugan, right? Is first year eligible? I believe so. Yeah, I think this is her first one. And, you know, she captained that American team to a gold medal. Like, like, you're right, though.

Like, there's the thing. And that's why it turns into this argument. Totally. Is an amazing hockey player and her reach in the sport is going to be greater than just her playing career. She's already gotten a promotion and in the role she's currently in. She's going to, you know, she's someone who wants to be involved in the NHL at a high level.

And I think she's going to do it because she's an incredible player. She knows the game. She's very smart. But like Jen Botterall was, she won her first gold medal or she went to her first Olympics before she even started college. Right. She is not recognized as the all-time leading score in the NCAA because they didn't start taking the record books for women's hockey until Jen's third year.

But unofficially, she is the highest scoring collegiate hockey player in history. She's not officially because they didn't start counting her stats until, like, 2001. But if you actually look at how much she did when she was playing in college, I mean, she's one of the best players to play. And then she had this career arc of being, you know, the young kid who made the team who nobody really knew. She's 18 years old and she has success there. And then she's an integral part of the team. She's a very important piece of the team in that middle section. And then in 2010, she's on her way out.

She's on the fourth line. And guess who's next to her is Mary Philippe Poulin. Yeah. And they went in 2010. And she makes, and she literally passed the puck to Poulin for the game winning goal in 2010. So to me, I just think Jen Baudrill deserves to be in the hockey hall fame. But this is the problem. It's not just Jen.

It's Carolyn Nulet. It's Megan Duggan. It's European players who've been retired for years that nobody talks about because they lose to team Canada in the quarterfinals. Like there are so many fantastic like women's hockey players with Hall of Fame credentials that people don't talk about because they only get. two and usually only one goes in and it's just a shame. But anyways, I do think Alfie deserves to go to Hall of Fame. I agree. Alfi deserves it.

It's a long list. And that's the point I want to make too is that if he doesn't get in today or if Keith Kachuk doesn't get in today or if, you know, you want to say it's Patrick Eliosh, like whoever it is that you're championing and they don't get in today, the door will remain open. It's not an open and shut thing where within, you know, a year or two, they don't have a chance. They have a chance. And there are some really strong first year candidates this year, the Sadeens.

Roberto Luongo, Hank Zetterberg. So it's going to be interesting. All I'm saying is, let's just get a little bit of transparency here. I think it would certainly help the process. And allow us just an insight to know, how close is this guy or girl to making the Hall of Fame? Or are we just barking up the wrong tree, so to speak,

when we're writing these passionate columns on, this is why Daniel Alpergen should be in. And then he's getting like 8% of the vote. Well, you know, maybe we're wasting our time. So we'll see how this all plays out on Monday. And I'm sure it will cause a lot of debate amongst hockey fans. All right. Let us wrap up the show, Haley, like we always do on a Monday with a little multiple choice madness,

where we just kind of sink our teeth into some fun questions. So let's start with this. We have a fictitious NHL team that we're starting. Okay? And I'm giving you a chance, Haley, to start your team. You only get to choose one of these guys, and this is how you start your franchise. you're starting today, you get your choice of these three guys, who you take it? A, Connor McDavid, B, Kale McCar, C, Andre Vazolevsky.

Who you're taking? You're starting your team today. From scratch, you only get one of them, and the rest of them will probably be filled out with some expansion type of thing. Who are you taking? McDavid McCar, Vazolevsky. I'm not good at this. I feel like you go McDavid. But like, recency biased would, oh, this sucks. I don't like this question.

That's why I like the question. Because McDavid is the best player in the world. Best player in the world. But that has not been enough because their defense isn't good and their goaltending's not good. But guess who the other two options are? One of the best goals in the world and the best offense from the world. So now I'm very, like, it would be because who was it that it was Gabe Landis They asked how to team, this is a copycat league, how do people do what you guys did?

And he goes to draft Cal McCar. So now I'm like, mm, mm, Camarar. But then Andre Vasilevsky has always been the piece that makes you think that the Tampa Bay Lightning are going to be okay. But just good goaltending can't get you that far. You've got to get runs support. Because Ilya Sorokin is like probably the best goal in the league that nobody talked about this year. He was awesome, but the Islanders weren't good. would you like to go first?

Like my gut says Connor McDavid, but a part of me wants to say Keel McCar because of what we just watched last night. Like, Connor McDavid is the best player in the league, but Kail McCar is the best defenseman in the league, and he just won the Norris, the Kahn Smythe, and the Stanley Cup. Two of those trophies.

Well, three of those McDavid doesn't have, but one of them he can't because he's not defensive. I don't know, Ian. I don't. What do you think? So this shows you it's a good question because if you're debating amongst McDavid-McCarr-Vazilowski, look, and again, I don't think there's a wrong answer. I do not think there's a wrong answer.

I would go Vasilevsky myself because... Like, I'm my GM of this team so, like, I can get myself a good goalie and not Mike Smith. You are the GM. You can do whatever you want, but you only get to choose one of these guys. is the backbone of your team. See, I'm going Vasilevsky because I'm a believer in you start from the net out.

So if I was starting a team, I want to be competitive and I want to have an idea of winning a cup, I think you've got to have a goalie. Vaselowski's young enough where I feel like he's still got seven or eight really good years left in him.

He is still for my money, even though he didn't win the Stanley Cup this year. I think he's the best clutch go goaltender in the last, you know, X number of years. I would go with him. But I don't think there's a wrong answer. If you want to go McCarr,

go McDavid, go McDavid. But I would I, I would probably lean towards the guy that's going to be on the ice the most amount of time. And even though he plays 60 games, he's on the ice. I would go Andre Vazelowski. But what if no one else can score? Right. Not going to win zero zero.

But just like, what if you have McDavid, but you don't have goaltending? Or what if you have McCart? That's what I said. That's why I'm like afraid to pick David because we've seen what happens when we have Conn McDavid, but you don't have goaltending. I think I'm just not. going to answer this one. She's taking a knee. She's taking a knee, folks.

Look, my gut says it's McDavid because he's the best way in the world. That's your answer, McDavid. There's no wrong answer. Yeah, but I'm not going to be happy about it. Okay, well, then you're not going to like this last question in multiple choice matters because this comes off the heels of the Avalanche Red Wings rivalry documentary that aired on the weekend, which we still haven't seen, but we know that Eisenman and Sackick are central figures in that.

Now, Joe Sackick, general manager of the Colorado Avalanche, who just won in Stanley Cup, Steve Eiserman, architect of a couple of gold medal winning teams for Canada, put together the lightning team is in charge of Detroit. Here's the question, Haley. Who's the better general manager? Joe Sackett or Steve Eisenman? I told you. You hear me scratching my head on Mike?

Yeah. ASMR. Disgusting. I apologize. Who's the better general manager? Joe Sackett or Steve Iserman? I can't answer that without seeing how the Red Wings turn out, you know? Because I think if he not only created the roster that ended up winning,

obviously Julian Breeze-Bois did some excellent work at these trade deadlines. Like he's the GM who's taken over the finish line, but we know that Eiserman is the architect of a lot of what happened in Tampa, right? We can agree on that? Yeah, I think so. The foundation was certainly laid by there. By him, obviously, you mentioned national teams, but I feel like I need to know what happens with the Red Wings first.

I think it's, I think Eiserman probably has the, the pedigree for most people to say it's Steve Iserman, even though he isn't complete with the Red Wings, right? Like, because it's, you know it every day, every time it's the deadline of the drafts, like, Steve Iserman's going to do something. Like, Steve Iserman's always going to do something that works out. And I think we see that process in Detroit right now. And there's a lot of promising things happening there. But I would like to see how the next couple years go before I can say.

Because if that works out and we see two teams that he's crafted, have success, then it's without doubt there's no debate. It's Steve Asman. But I think Joe Sackick's done a nice job here too. That's probably Steve. I'm probably going to go with Steve Eisenman. honestly. Okay. Okay, here's a side question.

If you're a general manager... These are stupid. Would you rather... This is now turned into what would you rather. Would you rather win it? Would you rather be the general manager who put together a Stanley Cup championship or a gold medal at the Olympics? Like you were the architect.

Which is the one that you would prefer to like be the master of putting together? An Olympic gold medal team or a Stanley Cup team? I feel like hockey's so different. It depends on your country and stuff, too, right? Like, I know it's really hard because I know, say, in soccer, football, you win the World Cup. You're the champions of the world. If you win Champions League, that's great, too. Like, that's probably the same thing.

But, you know, a lot of these players, they win a World Cup. And that's the ultimate. That's the ultimate. Like, the World Cup is the thing. Obviously, winning the Champions League is great. but those are sometimes you're against super teams, et cetera, et cetera. But I know when France won the World Cup a couple years ago, the last World Cup, like that was the team I was cheering for.

And that was a huge deal. Like they're, oh, that's the dog. That's also how you know that I'm at my mom and dads is there's this little fluffy, yappy dog named Penny. Wait, where's Bono right now? He's sleeping like a good boy. He's having a nap. But no, I don't know.

I think that's probably, to go back to your original question, would you rather? I feel like it's different in hockey. Like, the Olympics aren't the only thing they have, you know? But I think you saw how disappointed it was for the players to not go and how important it is for the players to go. It makes you wonder the way that they value the Olympics. I don't know if they would say that I would rather do one or the other, though. I honestly don't know how to answer that one.

This is a great way to end this. I think that's something that you'd have to ask like a GM. No, how, like, seriously. You punted on each of them. I've never heard anybody like put that up against the other. Like I don't think they would even answer that question. I go, I'm going to win both. Like, what do you think?

You haven't answered. I think I want to, I would want to create an Olympic gold medal team because it would be best on best. And then I would have the ability to manipulate a best on best roster, right? But you're not, I think a GM winning a Stanley Cup is more impressive than the GM winning an Olympic gold medal. Because if you're Canada, oh, oh, you pick Crosby. Oh, great. Thanks, Steve.

No, I'm, but, you know, it's not the same. It's not the same as making big moves and having to utilize your cap space and manipulate a championship roster against other teams with all the best players in the world. you're the GM of Team Canada and you're laughing. So there we go. I smoked you out. Let me just, yeah, there we go.

I smoked you out and there's your answer. It's the Stanley Cup. I was, you confused me. No, I wasn't sure. I was just thinking of it in terms of like, if you're Steve Eisenman,

are you proud of your gold medal that you've GMed? Are you proud of what you did in Tampa? But it's like, it's more impressive to me for a GM to win a Stanley Cup. there we go see finally got an answer for you and i want to say one more thing about these multiple choice questions they weren't nice i'm going to tweet that one actually the vasselski mccar macdavid one put put it out as a poll put it out as a poll and give the three options i think it's going to be you know what i suspect just based on recency bias kale mccar's

going to win this poll and i want to go with him like i want to go with mccar but it's also like There's no wrong answer. I don't think there's a wrong answer to that. But yeah, put that out in a poll. And I think it's going to be roughly almost 50% McCar and then split between McDavid and Vaseliske and the other two. Yeah, we'll see. But that's the thing. It's like it's the recency bias.

We just watched Count McCar in the last five days win three major, major trophies. We look forward to Toronto fans. Where's Austin Matthews in the, or no, even better. Where's Michael Bunting? Oh my God. Ian, I got so many Oilers fans being like, why is Dreisdel not on your All-Star team? It's like, I don't know. Why don't you ask the 300 other people who didn't vote him for the All-Star team?

Because he didn't make the All-Star team. It was hard. Like, this, honestly, this year's voting, and I've only voted a couple times. It was really hard because I feel like there was like six or seven legitimate candidates for the major awards. This was a good year for the Hart Trophy. This was a good year for hockey. It really was. I had Johnny Goddrow second on my heart ballot, and I was open about that.

And because I was like, I think Matthews is going to win, then I wanted Gadro and just Sturkin to round out my top three, I ended up going with Gadro because I think I get stuck with the goalie heart thing. Like inherently a goalie is always going to be your most valuable player because if your goalie sucks, you're screwed. And if your goalie's good, you're golden, right? So, like, I was like, ah, two. might be a little high because if she's

stricken's at high, you should probably just be one anyways. Like I was galaxy braining the order a little bit. And then I had McDavid for and people were legitimately upset with me. I was like Johnny Groh had the most five on five points in the national hockey league this season. You're acting like I just picked some scrub off the flames and I'm a homer. I was like, I really like, I really like Michael Stone.

Is that the same voice you use for the what was the movie that You quoted earlier? I don't know. It's the same, no accent, but the same pitch, the same pitch and tone was used.

And this is the thing, though, we are transparent about the voting process for NHL awards and it opens you up to some crap sometimes because obviously people are going to wonder why, and it's not crap,

I shouldn't even say that, it opens you up to questions, criticism if people don't believe that you'd have the right picks or whatever, but I would rather it be like that than say like, how the heck did this happen? Okay, well, I can go and look and see how it happened, you know? Like, I would rather that. And I think that would be nice for the hockey Hall of Fame as well to say like how the hell did X player. How the hell did Jen Baderl not get put in the Hall of Fame? Okay, here's why. I can go and look. Transparent. Yeah. Like, like I said, You were, you were, you, we all took criticism for our ballots, but you're able to defend your

selections. And that's all I'm asking for with the hockey hell of fame. Like, I took so much time on that freaking ballot this year. The Norris. I voted Yossi for Norris. I debated Norris. And it took me forever because, and this is why. I know we're running out of time. No, no. But I put Roman Yosey on my heart ballot. And I was like, I can't have him above McCar. for MVP, but Macar above him for Norris, even though they're different awards, but in my mind, I was like, because it was, it was razor thin for me. And I thought that the fact that Yossi was by far the MVP for the team, Douchain had a great season, Forsberg had a great season, but like Yosey was the MVP for the National Predators. He did something that nobody had done as a

defenseman in a long time. And I thought that he was carrying around a lesser, relatively speaking, D partner compared to Devon Taves. He's a very good hockey player, Devon Taves. So that was for me, it was like, Yossi doesn't have as much beside him. And he's on my heart. I'm going to go with Yossi. It took me hours.

Totally. Frank Saravali texted me like five times to be like, why isn't your ballot? and I was like, I'm fresh again. I have five more minutes. Give me my four minutes. Like, I have it in. It will be in time. I am agonizing over this.

Just it'll be there, I swear. Oh, I wanted to see on Frank Sarvelli's trade bait board. Number nine, Haley Salvian's award ballot for next year. It's up in the air. Yeah, she's done. She's stressed as all it. We're done. Yeah.

Oh, man. Hey, speaking to being done, we should probably wrap this up. This was fun. The week flew by now. should point out that you and I actually get, I think we get the week off next week, Haley, because fireworks emoji here. It's July 4th.

So, you know. That was one of the more weird, chaotic things I think that have happened when it's just you and I on the podcast. When Dom and Sean are here, it's just like, I don't know what's happening. I was talking about dirty toilet water and you missed it. It was very terrible. Anyways, I was doing the beatbox

and you said fireworks emoji. And I think that was really nice of us. It was great. We wrapped it up. But this was a lot of fun. And we want to remind everybody to follow us on your favorite podcast platform. Leave us a rating of review. We appreciate that.

Hey, and leave us your reviews of that Red Wings-Aves rivalry, too. We're just looking for any information we can glean from that. We'd love to have it. Subscribe to the Athletic Audio Plus on Apple Podcast. We'll get all of our bonus content from our entire network. You'll start with a 30-day free trial. And then it's 99 cents a month after that. Right now we got a great.

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