The Athletic Hockey Show - Connor Bedard joins the show, NHL preseason prospects update, USHL and USNTDP notes, and more

Episode Date: October 7, 2022

First, Corey sits down in the Regina Pats media room with potential No. 1 pick in the 2023 NHL Draft Connor Bedard to discuss being a hockey nerd, other top prospects like Adam Fantilli and Matvei Michkov, his Vancouver Canucks fandom, and more.Plus, Max, Corey, and FloHockey’s Chris Peters discuss the NHL preseason play of guys like Shane Wright, Juraj Slafkovsky, Peyton Krebs, Owen Power, Brandt Clarke, Dylan Holloway, Marco Rossi and more, as well as a check-in on the USHL and the USNTDP to close things out.Get a 6 month subscription to The Athletic for just $1 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshowSubscribe to The Athletic Hockey Show on YouTube: https://bit.ly/3BKz27u Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Hey, everybody. Max Boltman here alongside Corey Pranman and Chris Peters of Flohockey, back with another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show's prospect series. We got a super exciting show today, standouts from the NHL preseason to discuss. But first, Corey's spending some time in Regina Saskatchewan with presumptive top 2023 pick, Connor Bedard. We're going to start right there. Corey and Connor Bedard. I actually wanted to start with a quote from your long-time coach John Calvano. He refers to you as a hockey nerd.

Why do you think he calls you a hockey nerd? And would you agree with him? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I love kind of studying the game almost. And, you know, for me, it's all I want to do is play hockey. And, you know, when I'm home, you know, get to stop watching, watch the NHL and, you know, even at school, you're searching up guys highlights.

and stuff. So there's stuff I enjoy to do, like, when you're not playing. When you're watching NHL games, are you still a Canucks diehard? Or are you broadening your scope a little bit more right now? I'm a big Canucks fans still, but, I mean, I watch a lot just to, you know, see guys and see what they do. But for Canucks games on, that's definitely the one I'll be tuned to. Who were your Canucks, whether even now or the past, who were like, you know,

your favorite players, your idols, the guys you just, you know, those were your guys growing up. That was, you were your big fan of it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was obviously Sidene era. My favorite player was always Tana, Chris Tanna. Interesting. Why? He just, if you like watch those guys, I think, you know, I mean, you block every shot, you know, ever and, you know, I just see the sacrifice and stuff. And then obviously, my was my next one, favorite one. But I think just, obviously, like I said, a city era and you know i mean it was a you know they had those just a couple uh few years when i was pretty young and uh you know what said in a lot does you ever watch junior hockey when you were a kid

you watched the world juniors you watched w hl hockey uh always world juniors every christmas and i went to a couple of giants games and a few uh like blazers and rocket scans i think was down there, but not too much junior, but a lot of world juniors. I think it was John who mentioned that you would, like, pull up all Austin Matthews goals to watch them to kind of learn from them. Is that something that you would just like, are you just like Google NHL.com or like, do they have like a sport logic account for your agency or your team that you would kind of use to like, like how into the weeds are you getting with this kind of stuff?

I mean, just YouTube, you can find out stuff pretty easily. I mean, Matthews, like he said, the guy, I watch a lot just, just on the shot. you know, I think, you know, I watch them all the time. So just learn it stuff from all those guys. It's huge. Is that the kind of guy you model your game after? Or is there another player? Is it a combination?

I don't know if I model my game after anyone. It's just kind of trying to learn things from everyone and, you know, be my own player. But you can take things from so many guys in the NHL. And that's just something, you know, his shot is something I try to take. And, you know, when we talk about your game, your shock comes up a lot. Do you consider yourself a goal score or a playmaker? It's interesting.

Whenever I talk to anybody, any like NHL scouts or who've only watched you, like, say, with Team Canada, they describe me as a goal score. When I talk to NHL scouts who've only washed you in Regina, they describe you as a playmaker. So how would you define your game? Yeah, I don't think I see myself as one or the other. I think, you know, whatever plays there,

I'm going to try to make that play. And if that's shoot, it's shoot and pass to pass. and, you know, I don't, like I said, I just don't really see my self. It's kind of one thing. I think I can try to be bold. Your shot, though, was pretty high in. Like, what are some things you've done to develop it to that point, where whether things you've had to practice on,

elements you've taken from wherever you're watching an HL players? How do you think it's gone to this point? Yeah, I think just kind of, you know, as a kid, you're always shooting pucks in your front yard, backyard. It's something I still do, you know. Did you do the Cindy Crosby thing where he banged up a, few garage doors or pieces of furniture downstairs? I broke a couple windows in the front yard, but then I moved to the back.

And, you know, I still have that. I have a really good setup in my house in Vancouver. You know, this summer I'm out there a lot of. I just shouldn't. What do you do to get away from when you're not, you know, I want to get back in hockey you said, I know you watch a lot of hockey, not with the pants. But when you're not wearing a retired of patch jersey, what are you doing every day? I mean like summer wise any what when you're here I don't know what is your hobby

what are you doing your off time uh yeah I think just like spending time with family and friend I like to you know play their sports whether it's golf or you know racquet sports or something like that I think just spend the time with family friends if you're a golfer you'll fit well into into the hockey world yeah I'm not a great golfer but yeah I like to do it I mean you're you'll you know it comes with time right uh is that your other Is that the sport you're really passionate about, or is there other sports that you're passionate about that you're watching your free time?

I watch, I don't know, I watch a bit of football, but basketball, but nothing too much. I mean, every Sunday, it's kind of, you know, I think everyone watches football, but, you know, you know, like a favorite team, I think that you fall passionate. Not really. I'm kind of a stat watcher for other sports,

you know, I don't watch too much. Like, Stad Watcher does mean, like you're a fantasy player or just like a casual fan? I was just a casual fan. and kind of look at players in the NBA and so. Gotcha. I wanted to kind of talk about your support sitting your family for a second. I believe that when you went over to Sweden,

your sister, Kay went with you, right? First, I kind of want to talk about how, you know, for people who are listening, so you went when the COVID happened and WHL wasn't starting, you went over to go play with NHV 71 for a brief amount of time, but he went. First of all, how did that come about?

That's such a unique, you know, almost heart in the back, like when Austin Matthews went to Switzerland, essentially during his draft chair, This was two years before your draft to remind you, but how did that come about? Was that Asian driven? Was that family driven? How did you make that connection with HV 71?

I mean, it's sort of my agent kind of bringing up the idea of going over there, and they had a good relationship with HV 71. So then, you know, family kind of talked about it. You know, I think I just wanted to play games, and, you know, I think going over there was kind of the best opportunity to do that. So it was a really good decision. The training was really good. and I got to play a few games before, you know, they got shut down unfortunately, but,

I mean, it was a good decision. You know, like you said, my sister coming and it was just cool for us to, you know, be over there. What, yeah, like, how did that discussion go about, like, that she, was that like your parents wanted you guys to be together, that she was, was it her initiative? How did that happen? Well, I mean, she was, it was COVID year, obviously, and she was supposed to be in university, but she couldn't go. So she wanted to come and, you know, have that experience.

and, you know, I want to have this while, just spend time with that and stuff. How long were you guys there for, like, in total? Two, three months or so around there. So, yeah, we're there for a bit. You know, that's interesting. And obviously, that year was strange for everybody. Yeah.

But that's a unique experience, you know, staying on your family. Like, obviously, you've been in the limelight for years. I remember Milwaukee News did a feature on you four or five years ago or something like that. How do you, like, who's been your, support system throughout all of this. Who do you, who do you lean on?

Who helps you kind of stay dialed in and focused on being the best player and best person you can be? Yeah, I think it's, you know, my family, you know, it's kind of very grounded with that stuff. And, you know, for us, for me and for me and that was kind of, you know, outside noise. And, you know, I think they've helped me with just focusing on where you are and what you need to do. So, I mean, they've been, they've been great with that and they've, they've paneled really

well. I think taught me a lot of it. You know, is it been, you know, when did you get your first agent and how, how involved have they been in your process? You know, in your day-to-day process for the last few years. Yeah, it was 14 years old. I didn't huge. I mean, just with decisions and advice and everything, they're really good. I mean, I think, you know, I'm super happy with that I picked with Newport.

You know, I mean, it's been awesome just to have their support and just, just, connections they have. We want to turn to hockey just for a few more minutes here. I think when I talk to some NHL scouts about your game, they will always talk about all the very positive things. You've had a lot of success so far in your junior career.

I think the one question that comes up is, for a guy, you're about 5 foot 10, you're still going into your body. Are you an NHL center, I think, is the one question that comes up, because there aren't a whole lot of 510 NHL center men. What would be your response to that question? I mean, there's a few of them.

I think Crozies probably 510, 511. Right. Great. Praid of points, 58, 5.9. You know, I mean, obviously, you know, I do get to that level. You'll see what position you end up playing. But, you know, I obviously played Saturday my whole life. And, you know, I'm most comfortable.

But, you know, I think you would have to see, you know, what your coach thinks and kind of what the organization thinks. And, you know, I do end up getting there, like I said, on what position. when you look at those guys, whether it's Crosby, whether it's Spray and Point, whether it's Jack Hughes. Is there any one of those guys you think your game is the closest to stylistic-wise? I'm not too sure. I think, you know, there's all areas of all of them.

I think, you know, but I don't know too sure if I can, I don't want to compare myself to Crosby or anything. Oh, no, of course not. But we're looking for like, you know, just smaller things ago. Not trying to say you're compared to Crosby or something like that. No, I'm not too sure, really. obviously again, as a player, you've had quite a bit of the junior success so far,

how do you, whether it's in your day-to-day, your week-to-week or year-to-year, like how do you set your goals for the season or for yourself? Like what are your goals right now and how do you set them? Yeah, I think you always got to, you know, start with team goals.

And I think I've always been told kind of with team success comes, you know, individual success. So that always comes first. And then for me, it's just kind of improved as an overall player. I think, you know, two or a different game and proven all areas. Well, what were some goals that you've had recently that you met and some that you

have for yourself that you didn't meet? I think last year not making the playoffs was one that, you know, didn't meet. You know, but I feel like as a player, you know, I improved my game and a small thing like base off. So I got in the second half jumped up to like, you know, over 50% and something like that. So, you know, I think that was a. The draft is coming up, and I didn't want to make this question about the draft. But there's two other players other than you being discussed in the top of the draft.

You played with Anthony until he played with the Canadian Under 18 team in Germany last year. You played against Bobbatham-Mitchcock at the prior U-A teams in Russia. If you could only take one player with you to the NHL, which one of those two would you take with you? I'm not going to answer that question. They're both very good players. and like you said, I've played with and against them. And, you know, they're special. And, you know, I'm excited to see, you know, what they do this year.

Let me phrase that a different way. You know, how would you describe both of those players? Yeah, I think for Mitch God, he's a, you know, the goal score, I think. He's so good at, you know, fine in quite space. And, I mean, his shot's unreal. I mean, if you look at their stats, it seems like he's scoring at the same pace every time. So I think he's, but when we played him, you could, you know, I watched him, you know, pretty closely.

And he'd make a lot of good, good pass and stuff, too. So, not one-dimensional, he's special in Ventilla. I mean, he's six, six, three, six-four at center. And he's really fast. I was shocked at, you know, how fast he was in Germany. And, I mean, he's smart. He scores, scores a lot of goals. And, I mean, he's a special player.

So they're both very exciting to watch. You said you watched Michkov really closely. Was there just because you just knew how hyped he was, or was there particular reason why you were watching him closely when you were, when you were there in Dallas? I mean, I never seen him play. You know, our names were kind of like there for about a year there. And, you know, I think just to get to watch him and see what he's like

and kind of see the way he played. It was exciting. I think that was it for me. Okay. Awesome. Yeah, I appreciate your time. I know you probably get asked the same questions over and over again by a million people. So hopefully today I didn't bore you too much.

Yeah, it was good. Thank you for, you know, coming all the way out here and doing this. Yeah, no, my pleasure. I mean, this is me a great year for the Western Conference in general, not just you, but I mean, Nate Danielson, Brandon's a great player, Yeager. Danielson's a little four, but you probably played with Yeager and Benson quite a bit, right? I'm good buddies with Danielson, just from camp stuff. I played against Yeager a lot.

I played with Benson growing up a lot. What camps were you at with Danielson? Just Asian one last year. You're both Newport? Yeah. Gotcha. Yeah. So we were there at like same hotel room for a week and stuff.

So we got pretty close. And then the other guys I know, I mean, you know, I mean, even in the other other division, you know, Crystal and height, all of the guys. Is Chris, which one of those were from Vancouver again? Crystal. Yeah, we're really, really good. Right. And he's obviously out still in these.

Yeah. Yeah. Did you watch his whole link out of curiosity? Yeah. Yeah. I watched as many games like, we couldn't. I was at World Junior Camp for last few. game so we couldn't get it on the TV there for some reason.

That's strange. Yeah, it was, but we got the finals a bit. You know, I'd watch as much as I can of it. Yeah, no, I mean,

you said, and obviously, yeah, and he's really good. Obviously, Yeager and Benson are obviously guys. Oh, really high.

You got, probably got, you said you play with them coming up, too? Yeah. Yeah, I played with Benson on my spring team for five years. So, Crystal,

for eight or nine. So, yeah, you just played against him. Yeah, how would you kind of describe, you know, Crystal,

I know, You said you're really close. How would you describe Vanger? How would you describe Benson? Yeah, I think Benson, you know, I mean, he's a really complete player. He's, you know, good in all zones. And skating is, you know, really good. It's shifting.

And, I mean, he's just so good at making plays and find an open areas to score roles. And, I mean, Yeager's like, no, he Eager reminds him a lot of McKinnon with his, you know, skating and his shot. I mean, he's self-touched with him just with how powerful he is. And, I mean, he can shoot the puck very hard too. He's both exciting players. Yeah, and answer to Mitch Cove, the fantili questions. I guess he wanted to answer this. Why it's like, who's the biggest pain of like,

of like those three Danielson, Yeager and Benson? Yeah, I don't know. I mean, yeah, that's a tough question. They're all tough players. And particularly Moose Jaw and Winnipeg. Those are going to be really tough teams for all season. Yeah, they're very good teams. Yeah, they're loaded.

I mean, yeah. And so we'll see what happens. But I say it should be a really great year for the West. in general. Yeah. You know, he's exciting that age group. He said,

you have those guys. And I mentioned, you forgot to say Riley Hyatt to two off. So it was you, but then I went, Yeager went second? Uh,

Hyatt went second. The Hager went third. And then Benson went, I think, like, he went a little bit later. He went, 14.

Yeah, he went in a spot that doesn't look good in hindsight. Yeah, no, he was a good pick for one in a picture.

Yeah, I remember, like, talking to somebody who said, uh, at the time, He said Ben didn't even realize how good he was until he got to the jump.

I think you could always see it. He was MVP of that Bannam League. You think it was just like a size thing probably? No, I mean he was always really good. No, I just mean like why he's like maybe he like went a little later. Oh, maybe. I'm not too sure. I'm not really got to ask for that.

Right. You were running the draft. I'm just trying to like, I know like, yeah. I mean, just talking to people in the league like that is that obviously he's still not the biggest guy, but he was, you know, not always the biggest guy. and hey, like, not like, dynamic, like speedsters, all of that. Those are the kind of things I heard from why he slid to whatever,

whatever it was in the draft. But obviously, yeah, I mean, he led the WHL playoffs and scoring. Yeah, I like so. So, I mean, not have had facts for that for sure. Oh, no, no, he's a hell of a player. Yeah, I think that's it for me. Thank you. Okay, sounds good.

Thank you. Thank you for your time, Connor. Thanks, see you. Same to you. And good luck this season. Thank you. Awesome. Great stuff from Connor Bedard, Corey.

curious as you were going through that conversation, what stood out to you and anything that really made an impression on you or that you think will make an impression on NHL teams? I thought when the topic of Mofé Michkov and Adam Fantilli came up, both of those players considered among the top other top prospects in the 2003 NHL draft, he seemed to kind of dial in really on the specifics of those players and talked about how when he was playing in against Mitchcove at the U-18s, like, you know, he was very curious. and focusing in on the guy's game just because obviously he's, you know, heard him mention a lot, mentioned in the same breadth of him as he said. So I thought that was interesting.

That's a guy who, you know, probably will tell people he doesn't want to focus too much on the draft, wants to focus on team success. But, you know, he clearly obviously had an eye on someone like Mitch Cove, who he will be competing with for that number one spot. And it's going to be a super fun competition to watch wire to wire. Let's jump in right now, though, with the guys who are in this most recent draft class, are now starting to take, in many cases, their first strides in the NHL in the exhibition season. Urizzlovsky, Shane Wright, two of the top prospects from this last draft class playing in the preseason for Montreal and Seattle.

It sounds like, Corey, Shane Wright, is going to get every opportunity, even as this regular season starts here, to keep with the Cracken. Yeah, that seems to be an indication that their general manager, Ron Francis, told our Pierre LeBron, is that they will probably. probably keep right up during the season. We obviously will see how it plays out, right? You know, there's different stages. There's the nine game stage and there's the 40 game stage for them to kind of reevaluate

where he is at the NHL level. I've watched a couple of his preseason games. I think he's been solid, good. I think he looks like he belongs at the NHL level. I would not say he's, I would say, particularly stood out, not a ton of points. He's got, he gets some of his shots, gets his scoring chances, makes see some plays, but I wouldn't say from what I've seen of him in the preseason that I would classify as a guy who no doubt looks like he belongs in the NHL and is ready to help the Seattle Crack and

win games right now. So here's my question for you, Chris, then. We've seen in recent years, and I'm going to kind of pick on the New York Rangers a little bit here. Sorry to our producer, Chris. We've seen Capocaco and Alexei Lafranier kind of make this immediate jump to the NHL at a time when it was at least debatable, whether they were like 100% no doubt ready to be big difference makers in the NHL. Do you get any kind of fear here going this route with Shane Wright? Would you have gone a different way? Yeah, I do have some fear because I think that there was less questions for me about LaFranier and Kako going into their draft season or their their draft plus one in the NHL than there is with Wright. I mean, you know, I think that there's, you know, there's a

reason he slipped to fourth. And there's also what is what is the rush? Why? Is it the best thing for his development? That's the thing that I don't really know. I can say definitively. And really, we won't know until we see him in the regular season. I think there's no reason to, you know, not give him that look with the NHL team. You've got the time to do it. But if suddenly you're looking and you're saying this, this isn't working. This isn't good for his development. He's not playing enough. He's not having success, you know, we're worried about his confidence. I mean, I think it's taking Capocaco and Alexi LaFranier more time to get up to NHL speed because the NHL isn't really geared towards development. It's not a place where you can, you can and should get better. All players

should move forward. There should be progress and things like that, but that's not the sole purpose. So my question for the cracking is at this stage in your organization, when you did not have a good first year when you have such an important piece of your future, why do it now? Why, why rush it? Because quite frankly, Shane Wright did not dominate the OHL last season. He played well. He played really well. He just, but it wasn't a dominant season. And you wonder, could he afford to have more time there and get better at some of the other things? So, so my, my biggest thing is, is there's, there's, a ton of evidence to me so far based on what we've seen the preseason coming out of his last season. I don't see an NHL player right now. I see a guy that's certainly on that track,

but I don't see an everyday NHL or in a guy that's going to contribute. But again, I could be wrong. He could get in there and once the games are live and all the players are going, things could get better. You never really know how a player is going to react. But, you know, those two examples that you gave Max with LaFranier and Kako, I mean, they've kind of stumbled out of the gates here. And I feel like it's been detrimental. to their overall long-term development, not that it can't be recovered. There was an interesting, you know, I've obviously covered plenty of prospects coming in with the Red Wings in recent years.

And I know Jeff Blaschell, when he was the coach, would kind of make this distinction of guys who were ready to survive in the NHL versus ready to thrive in the NHL. And I don't think anyone of us has doubts of whether Shane Wright is going to be able to handle the NHL. So he can be able to night to night be able to play, not be a huge liability for the crack him. But I do think it goes to this point of like, is it the best thing for him? Is he going to develop into the player that he can if he's kind of in this mode of surviving a little bit? And I think that's the argument. The counter might be he has an exceptional status kid. He's already

spent a lot of time in the OHL and maybe there's a he needs mentally to move on or it's just that time in his life. I do get that too. He's in a tough spot with the CHL-NHL agreement. But I think it's a fascinating one. And I just wonder, for, for Ron Francis coming out and, you know, he didn't, he didn't write it in stone. Actually, I think he, in fact, said he doesn't want to draw a line in the sand. But I think it is a process that I, you know, I'm very curious to see it play out. And I wonder if they'll maybe change their mind at some point. Yeah.

My line would be for what I saw of him, both in the preseason and last season, would be to send him back to the OHL, just because like what Chris said, to let him dominate, really, you know, be the MVP of that league, go to the world juniors, play a big role at that world juniors. at that level. And that being said, kind of what Max just said, too. It's not for sure yet that he's up all year. I do think, you know, there are reasonable hockey people in Seattle. And if it's actually not working out,

I got to imagine they'll send him back. I just haven't seen that yet personally, but we'll see. With Lefrenier, I think the distinction I would make between maybe right in this case is I thought there was no real reason to send Lafranier back to Junior. I know it took some time in the NHL for him to get up to speed. And, you know, obviously, they're very good team in New York, not an easy lineup to get the major minutes on. And his skating wasn't the best. But, I mean, that guy torched the QMJHL in his draft year and the year before that.

What was he going to do? Go back and score four points a game. Was that really helpful for his development? So that was a tricky one. Where I think in Wright's case, he hasn't done what left for any year done, has done in the CHL yet. So there's still that developmental opportunity there if it doesn't go well in the NHL. for him. How about Yerislovsky? What would you do there? I mean, he's still kind of going through this process with Montreal. Maybe, I think it's fair to say he hasn't blown the doors off in the

preseason either. What would you do there? I have actually, I've liked some of his preseason games. Some of them haven't been as, you know, impressive. That game versus Toronto, for example, he was very good versus NHL players. Other games, he hasn't been as impressive. But they have options of them. You can stay in the NHL, you can go down to LaValle, American League. He can come up and down between the American League and the NHL, depending on how his year goes, and he can go back to Finland. So it'll be really interesting to see what they do with him. I think hockey-wise, I'd like to start him in LaValle.

I think there are some parts of his game that are look at HL ready. I think he, like right, he could survive and help an NHL team. But I would like, this is not a guy yet who's actually had a really good club season yet. a truly great club season. And I think there's something to be said about trying to develop that consistency and having that really great club season. He was pretty good at the junior level as a 16-year-old in Finland, but it wasn't simply an outstanding year.

So I think there is some value going down to LaValle and showing that you can light up the American League before going to the National Hockey League. However, there is the issue, and I think this is why you got to keep Finland as a realistic possibility, that just because of Montreal being what it is, I feel like if he's in LaValle, every single shift of his down there is going to get dissected.

That's a good point. And also, LaValle's ticket sales are going to go way up next year. So if they do that. But no, what I would say to Corey, and I think that that is, you know, getting them away from the spotlight would make some sense. But at the same time, I do think that the HL is the,

style of hockey that he's going to have to get used to. I think some of the things that we've seen from him in NHL games and in the rookie tournaments were, you know, plays that you can get away with when you get a little more time and space when you're, you know, the HL is a very tightly checked league. It is a place where the time and space closes very quickly on you. And I feel like he can actually benefit from that more than, more than anything else, just making quick decisions, making the different, you know, just making different reads. and plays against professionals here. And the thing is, is, you know, if you can surround him with the right people,

that's the other thing in the HLs, you have to have the right apparatus for a player that's as skilled and as good as Slavkovsky is to be able to maximize that talent, to be able to, you know, if he's going to make a play in an NHL-level read, he needs a player that's going to be able to convert on those opportunities and a player that's going to be able to get him the puck where he needs it. And that doesn't always happen in the HL. It does happen a lot. I mean, a lot of teams have stacked their rosters with more veteran players that are better equipped to do those kinds of things.

But for me, you know, I think that the appropriate decision with Slavkovsky has to be completely guided by development and obviously not by the pressure that both he and I guess the team to a certain extent would be under with him being the number one overall pick. I think Owen Power going back to college last season as a number one overall was a signal to any future number. one picks, that it is okay to go back to where you were or to start at a level that's not the NHL. And I think with the advantage of having the HL, and I totally agree, Corey, I think it's going to be scrutiny city. It's going to be a lot of pressure. But I also think that he's going to have to start getting used to it sooner or later. And now with LaValle, you know, that's maybe like the appetizer for the massive spotlight that would come to his way at the Bell Center. And my lean is sent to the American League.

And Montreal did talk about when they picked Levkoski that whether they feel like the player they were going to pick number one could handle that spotlight was a variable. So obviously they believe he can do that whether it's in Montreal or LaValle. To your point with the talent, but I think he will have some players to play with down there. I mean, Philip Messhard will probably be down there. Maybe Jesse Yelone and Matisse Norlinder, not another high high end prospects, but they're good players, talented players, guys who have skill and he can create offense with. And I think he started in the American League.

and I think you just see how it goes, right? Maybe he needs a few months down there. Maybe it's a mid-season call-up. Or maybe you send him down there, and it's kind of like a Joel Farabey situation in his rookie pro season where you send him down in two weeks in, you're like, oh, shit, never mind. Up you go.

So I have no problem with that approach. Chris, you mentioned Owen Power, and I want to use that to just take us into really a collection of Buffalo Sabres here because I think we've known for a while now there was a youth movement coming to Buffalo, and really I guess you could say there has been for some time. But already, it looks like we're seeing top nine looks right now in training camp for

J.J. Patyrka, Peyton Krebs, Jack Quinn, you have not only power, but Mattia Samuelson near the top of that Sabres lineup. Are we just going to get this all at once here in Buffalo? I mean, why not? You know, what else has worked? You know, and I think that it's time, too, because I think with the guys, particularly Krebs, Petirka and Quinn and Samuelson, just getting really strong performances at the AHL level, they've proven it at that level now. So they're, you know, it's time to push them to potentially

make that step. Now, will all of them end the season with the Sabres? I don't know. We'll have to see. But I love the idea of putting it in their hands now and saying, because I think that the Sabres aren't disillusioned to believe that they are ready to compete immediately.

You know, they know that now this is about taking the next step as an organization, getting your core together and giving them more time. I think, you know, a lot of teams in various stages of rebuilds, you kind of start to see this transition of when they hand it over to the kids. We see it in all sports as well when they're just starting. And I feel like that the Buffalo is now in that range where it's time to give them this team and to make them, you know, essentially lead this team and give them the opportunities to learn together. The only trouble with that is is that if you do start

losing a lot. And you don't want to keep that continuous cycle that Buffalo has kind of gone through where it's just a lot of losing. But I do think that if you have the young players in the lineup, and if you give them some taste of success, and I think Ottawa has done this to a certain extent, certainly not as many at once. But, you know, they're looking, they're at a step ahead of Buffalo in terms of their kind of maturation as an organization. I think Buffalo is trending in that direction. I love it. I personally love it. I also think that Don Granato is the right kind of coach for a young team.

I think that he's the kind of guy that can give you a lot of positivity. I mean, I've been around Don a little bit in my career and just knowing how he operates and the way that he thinks the game. He's going to do his best to put these guys in a position to succeed. So I think for Sabres fans, get excited about seeing the future, but don't anticipate the futures here now. You know, like, it's not, this isn't going to be a team that's going to be amazing and blow the doors off anybody. But this is going to be another learning year, but it's with the guys that you expect to be part of your future core.

Yeah, you know, we mentioned those young guys, but I've also liked Dylan Cousins in the preseason, too. And, you know, and I think there's, you know, it'll be interesting, interesting season to see what Casey Middlestadt does, right? I mean, I know there's other young guys that are probably, you know, Cepard fans are more excited about now. Middlestats kind of stagnated a little bit, but it looks like he's going to have a prominent role to start the year. So, you know, if he's healthy, it'll be interesting to see what he does. I think in general that Dalene, Matthias Samuelson pair will be really interesting to follow all season. And yes, I don't think the Sabres are going to win this year, but, you know, I think, I don't think it's unrealistic to expect them to take meaningful steps forward as an organization.

That doesn't mean make the playoffs. That doesn't mean even, you'll come with a couple of points making the playoffs. But I think this is an organization that is trending in an upwards direction. One of the names, Corey, that I saw on, on your list. for prospects who have stood out so far is Brant Clark. And obviously top 10 pick, a prospect who's got a lot of potential. I don't know that I expected to see him on this kind of list this quickly. And I wonder, Chris, did that surprise you at all to see the kind of performance that Clark has turned in throughout this preseason so far?

You know, I think coming into this entire offseason, I would have been. But having gone to the rookie tournament in San Jose and seen how he played there, you know, I saw a player that had taken a step, a guy that had definitely made some strides in his game that was more confident against pros with a puck on a stick. And I think that we're seeing that now that he actually is excelling when playing alongside and against high-end players. Now, he still has a lot of his game to clean up. There's going to be things that have to, you know, get fixed over time with him. But at the same time, some of the plays that he's making, the reads that he's making, you know, they're very strong. And so now it's like looking to the point where,

hey, he's done enough to earn an extended look, I would say. Do I think that the long term best in his best interest is to be with the Kings? That's where I get a little bit hung up just because I think there's more for him, there's more, there's more for him to do at the junior level. But at the same time, it's hard to argue with how he's played. And, you know, he's a guy that I've had a lot of questions about over the years, I still think that he's got exceptional upside and the skill level that he has and his hand skills are really, really impressive. And now we're just kind of seeing how it looks against NHL players. And so far, you know, it's looked pretty solid. So, you know, if you would have asked me this before I went to that rookie tournament, I would have

said, yeah, absolutely, I'm shocked. But I think that, you know, this is a continuation of how he started his, you know, basically his summer here. So pretty good on him. And it's not just about whether it's best for him to stay or not. I kind of agree with Chris, even though he's been very impressive. I would say in terms of whether he's ready to be an 82 game player, I'm on the periphery of that. I see the argument. I see it against it. The issue with the Kings is, it's not like this is a bad team.

They have options on defense. You know, you know, sending, keeping Clark means sending Tobias Bjornfoot to Ontario. Keeping him up means sending maybe Jordan Spence down or having to keep a player like Sean Dursey maybe on the periphery of the roster, who was very good in the NHL last season. So, you know, he's forcing some very tough roster decisions. And I have to imagine when you have good veteran players, maybe not Spence and Ders and not veterans, but guys with pro experience who have excelled at the pro level already, my head, my lean would be to send Clark back, maybe give him a couple of games to reward him for such a good camp. Yeah. But that's kind of,

you know, this is a team that's trying to make the playoffs this year. And I don't know that you just, like I know Spence and Björdenfoot, haven't exactly blown the. the doors down the NHL, but they're good players too. One guy who I do think is, looks like going to make the team for their club, is Dylan Holloway, who as of this week has been skating next to Leon Drysidal and Zach Hyman. It looks like, Corey, he's ready to break through. Right. And the message from the oil that's coming into the camp was Holloway really needs to blow us

away to make this team. Otherwise, he's going in the American League. And he heard that message and said, okay, I guess I can do that. He scored a hat trick in one of the preseason games. I think in just front of his rookie camp, through the preseason games, he looked very impressive, a powerful, competitive forward with good speed and skill and scoring ability. And I do think this is a guy who has shown, you know, he missed a lot of last year due to injury. But also, he was very good as a sophomore out Wisconsin, very good junior player.

And I think this is just a guy who continues to show that he's a good hockey player. think he's going to help the Oilers this season. Yeah, I agree completely. You know, and Holloway having, you know, been injured for a portion of last season, you know, he kind of had a late blooming season, you know, and then he got the opportunity to get into the playoffs. I'm just, I'm fascinated with where he's going to fit for them, you know, and where, you know, if he's going to be able to maintain what he's done so far in the

preseason, I'm a, I've been a big believer in Dylan Holloway for a long time. And, and I think that, you know, ultimately, this is. is kind of what we envisioned him to be, was this guy that could make these kind of plays and do these kind of things. He's doing it in the preseason, so we have to wait and see if he's going to be able to do it in the regular season. But I agree with Corey. I think he's ready to help this team and his game has really matured in ways that are probably a bit quicker than they expected. And he's forcing them into that decision to say, hey, I'm here to stay. And one last guy who looks like he's trending toward the right side of that roster bubble would be in Minnesota. That would be

Marco Rossi. Chris, any, you think he's trying to avoid your home state here? Does he want to go to Iowa? What's the story? Yeah, I'm sure he does. I guess he was living in West Des Moines last year, so that's a pretty nice little suburb over there. So I don't know why you want to avoid that. But, you know, the thing about Marco Rossi is, is, you know, when you're a top prospect and having gone through the things that he's gone through in his life, aside from just hockey, You know, you're always wondering how you're going to get back. And I think you have to credit him for the incredible amount of work that he's put in on his body, on his physical well-being, on his physical fitness, and on his game, getting it back to where it needed to be. And I think, you know, there were points at last season in the HL where he say he's in the right spot because he's not there yet.

He's not ready yet. I think over the course of this preseason, we've seen a guy that's making NHL-level reads. We've seen a guy that's been able to handle the pace of the NHL. and the physicality of the NHL and he's getting back there. I mean, when he was in junior, he was a dominant player, even though he wasn't big, you know, his lower body and his ability to just, you know, protect, Pucks, win battles, all these different things. You know, he's getting back to that again.

And it took him a while to do that against pros, as it would for anybody. But he was dealing with, you know, a full year away from hockey, a lot of health concerns and other things like that. And I think you just have to give him all the credit in the world for the work that he put in. And also the credit to the Iowa Wild that have been a real. really strong developer for Minnesota over the last few years with Tim Armi at the helm there. And it's not just the plug for where I live now, but it's just, you know, the fact that it's really important to have a very good AHL team and system and development path. And I think that

Minnesota has found that in Des Moines. Here's my question on Rossi is, I think he's looked good in the camp in the preseason. I think based on what he's shown over his career, he's probably, you know, really skilled competitive player. He probably is one of the 12, the 13 best fours right now on the Wild. So, you know, he's, and the Wilde are trying to win right now. So you want the best players on your team. It looks like he's going to start off on the fourth line in between Connor Dewar and Brandon DeHame. Is that the best place for Marco Rossi?

It would be the one question I have. Even though if I was in their position, I would probably want him on my team. team if I'm trying to win games. Yeah, I think that's a really fair point, Corey, too, because it is, I think that's a question a lot of teams ask themselves is we, this guy's ready, we think he's ready for the NHL, but we just don't have the right spot for him. And so, yeah, I would say, yeah, if it comes down to it, I think it's worth seeing how he, you know, how he fills that role.

And if, if you're able to provide some secondary scoring from that position, but then if, if not, yeah, I mean, then you want him getting more reps as a top six, you know, forward that's driving play and making things happen because as good as he was in the AHL last season and it isn't like he was just the outright dominant player. So there's always room that, you know, there's always room to improve for any player. But I think that for him, yeah, for the while, they have to make that right decision based on role and availability. But, you know, he's in a much better position this year than he was last year to find a way to make an impact for an NHL team. All right. Let's get into now.

kind of an overview of some of the top names in the USHL this year. We're just coming out of the USHL Fall Classic here. Obviously, there are some guys in the 2023 class we're going to want to talk about. But we should probably start with the potential, the presumptive one year out, the annual tradition, the next year's guy, Macklin Celebrini. Chris, you want to start us off on Celebrini? Yeah, Max, you know what? It's always been exciting these last few years where we've had these high-level elite

you know, elite level prospects coming to the USHL a year before their draft. We saw with Owen Power, Adam Fantilli, you know, Andres Fetchnikov before them. And, you know, I think Celebrini's in that mix. He's the presumptive, you know, at this point, it's very early. Lots can change.

But, you know, he's been projected as one of the top 2006-born players in the world, potential to be the number one pick in the 2024 draft. Playing with the Chicago Steel just like Adam Fantilli and Owen Power did in their, you know, before their draft. And so, uh, he's a, he's a fascinating player. I know Corey has seen him, saw him live last year. I obviously and saw him this year at the fall classic. Unfortunately, he got hurt at the fall class. He's going to be out for a few more weeks, but, um, it doesn't sound like anything too serious. And before he got hurt, he had three points. But you go back to last season. He played at the Shattuck St. Mary's. He was a 15-year-old on their

prep team. So a U-16. And, and you think about all the people that have gone to Shattuck St. Mary's. And there are only two guys that had a better, better point production in a points per game basis than Macklin Celebrini at Shattuck at the same age. And it's Sidney Crosby and Jonathan Taves. Um, so I mean, I've, I've heard of those guys. I've heard of them. I know those names. Um, yeah. So, so like the thing is, is is, is Max Celebrini. He's an elite player. No question about it. I think he thinks the game at a high level. Um, you know, I'll let Corey kind of describe the way he sees his game because, you know, I've, I've been around the kid a little bit this year doing some stuff for flow hockey and I'm just blown away by his maturity,

his understanding of how he needs to play and his ability to kind of compartmentalize the expectations that are on him and what he's trying to do. And I think he's going to be a very special player. Yeah, I think with Salarini, he's a very well-rounded player. You're a very skilled, highly, highly intelligent player. He makes a lot of skill plays with pace. He competes well. He can score goals. For a guy who, as Chris mentioned, is in the one overall discussion, I wouldn't say, like, for me, he rises, at least from what I've seen early on, to, like, that truly high-end tier, whether it's Rasmus, Dahlene, Jack Hugh, like, one of those, like, you're number one.

you're going to be such a foundational part of our franchise type of prospect. Like he looks more like a nicheo, Nikohesia type of number one, maybe a little bit better than that. But we'll see how his next two years go. I'll be really curious to see. I think with 2024 draft, there hasn't been a lot of guys who have clearly distinguished themselves. Like, I'm going to be a top five pick unless something goes really wrong.

So I think that draft class has a lot of room to develop over the next two years. usually that tells me there's going to be some CHL kid that's going to come bursting out like a bull in a china shop. That seems to be anecdotally how this goes. If it's not someone we know about two years out, so a couple OHL or WHOL centers are going to break through and they're going to be the guys. That's my theory. Yeah, we'll have to see about that. But, you know, it's really the thing about Max with him as well is, you know, he's got size. He's got, you know, he's going to continue to build strength.

And I just, I think, you know, I think he's based on what I've seen so far and it's just, you know, limited to what I saw last year and early on this season. You know, there's just, he's got so much, such a great foundation to build up on. And I think he's only just going to get better and better as things go as we go forward here. Moving into this current class, I think one of the most interesting players in the USHL this season might not have played in the USHL this season. If not for an amazing Halenka tournament, this is the goaltender. Michael Ribal, who gets traded from Dubuque to Omaha following really tremendous Holinka

and has now stacked on top of it a really good U.S.HL. Fall Classic, Corey. Yeah, and the Heslinca was very good for Czechia. They didn't win the tournament by any means, but they won a couple of games they shouldn't have it, and mostly due to the play of Haramble. Then he goes to the USHL Fall Classic, and the first game against the USAU18 team, helps bring a significantly outgunned Omaha team to overtime. I forgot the shot told it must have been something like 45 to 20 or something like that, and they still lose it overtime.

And then he shut out the Lincoln Stars the next day. I mean, he was really impressive, big goalie, moves well for the size, really intelligent. I was talking to one scout at the tournament, and he said, that's some of the best goaltending I've seen since Spencer Knight. I'm not saying this guy is going to be a super high, first rounder. We got a long way to go to see how his season plays out. But it's fair to say there is significant intrigue in this player right now as a pro prospect. And I would say he is the runaway best goalie in the draft class right now. Yeah, I would agree. I mean, he's six foot six. He can

move. He's got really nice technique to him. You know, I think the thing that really impressed me, especially in that game against the U.S., was just how contained he was. I mean, he was under duress. and just being as big as he is and as aggressive as he played without just swimming in the net. You know, I mean, it was impressive to see that kind of goaltending. I mean, and in the USHL, the USHL has not had many goalies like him. I mean, you think about there haven't been a ton of non-NTP goalies to come out of the league and just really, you know, be stars. this is a guy that absolutely has that potential.

And I mean, I knew about him coming in, but to actually see him play live to see a guy that big that moves that well, that is so sharp, it's pretty impressive to watch. So he makes the Omaha Lancers. He gives them a chance in every single game now because he's that kind of goalie. And that is a really tough league to find that level of goaltending in. So very impressed by him. How about the defenseman in Sioux Falls, Maxim Sturbach, Chris?

Is this guy who could go in the first round? I think 6-2, right shot D off to a pretty good start. Is this a potential first rounder? You know, he certainly is going to have a bit of a learning curve. I saw that in the first couple of games, but there's smoothness to his game. He sees it really well. He scored on his first shot in the USHL. I don't think he was trying to score.

I think he was trying to get a puck on net, but it went in. And, you know, he's big. He's ranging. He's mobile. and he's had a lot of high level experience. He played at the World Juniors this year for Czechia and was, or Slovakia, sorry. And, you know, he was able to, you know, play big minutes for them and play, you know, play a really strong role. And I think with Sue Falls this year, they've got a veteran decor.

They've got some guys that have been there before that'll help him kind of move along. And I'm really impressed by just his poise in this league. You know, it's his first time in the league, first year draft eligible. He's committed to Vermont, which is interesting. You know, like they've actually been going very hard after European players as part of their recruiting process. So, you know, it's been rare for the cat amounts to get a guy that that is that, you know, high end in terms of what we expect for the draft. But, you know, with the smoothness, the poise, the fact that he's had some high level experience at such a young age and thrived in those situations makes me believe. that he absolutely can be in the hunt for the first round this year.

Percentage chance he actually plays one game in Vermont. Who knows? I don't know. I mean, that's the thing is like so many times you'll see a guy I'll commit, but then, you know, I think a lot of people thought Kail McCarer would never go to UMass, and then he did. I didn't say he wasn't go. I didn't say zero percent.

I was asking you, what's the percentage chance he plays? I know. I couldn't even put a percentage on it because I don't know the kid that. well, but he seems like, you know, he seems like a mature young man. So I'm sure he had a very well thought out decision when he, when he decided to go to Vermont. I say less than 50% shit. One more guy, Chris, I know that you're excited about in the USHL, non-NTDP division. And we will get there. Andrew Strathman, the North Dakota commit smaller left-handed D, but a guy who I know you like. Yeah, you know, I just, I think that based on what I've seen and the fact that, you know,

he's played in the USHL, he's got a year of experience already and played really well. on a on a on a on a tri-city team last year that was among the best in the league um you know he's got some he's got some jam to him despite the fact that he's a little bit on the smaller side uh he he skates very well he's got good mobility i think he sees it really well played for the u.s at the hollink of gretsky cup and was was they're you know one of their most impressive players i thought um i was in their live like cori was i was watching on video but i really liked the way that he performed there and and youngstown actually is going to be a very interesting team to follow. They have a number of NHL draft picks on their team, and then they also have a number

of draft eligible guys like Strathman, William Whitelaw, Jacob Fowler, their goalie is also, you know, a guy that could be drafted. So, you know, I think that that's going to be a fascinating team to follow. And Strathman in particular, you know, he had a really good first weekend at the Fall Classic three points right off the hop. He's really, he's going to be on their top power play. So, you know, and then being committed to North Dakota, that's been a haven for top, top level defensemen. You know, a lot of guys get better there. Jake Sanderson, of course, spent the last two seasons there.

So I think they're going to be really happy to get him in Grand Forks as well because I think there's some upside there for sure. All right. Let's go now to the program. And I think that the guy at the top, I mean, there's always so much talent at the program. But this year, kind of the guy, I would say for me, a little ahead of the pack, is Will Smith. Good season last year with the 17 team. But he also played pretty close to half of that year with the 18s.

Usually that's a really good sign, partly obviously. obviously gets driven by injuries, but he held his own when he got called up there, Corey. And I wonder, what do you see Smith's potential as as we go into this year? Right. And actually, Ryan Leonard, I think, played more and played bigger role with the 18 team. I think just because of the way he plays a hard, you know, competitive player that he filled a role on one of those wings. But I think, I agree with you. I think Smith is the guy.

I think this is a guy with a lot of skill. He's a creative centerman. He skates well. He makes highly skilled plays with pace. He can shoot the puck really well. I think he competes well enough. I've seen him kill penalty. Just like a very well-rounded player with him with some flashes,

a dynamic ability in there too. You know, he's not the biggest guy, 6-0-ish type of, you know, but again, the feet are good. So you kind of like, and the style he plays that will translate to the pros. You know, I'm not, you know, usually when you talk about the top guy in the program, you're saying he's a top 10 guy all day long. I'm not there yet with Smith. I think he has a chance to be a top 10 guy.

I'd say probably more top 20, top 15. right now as it stands, but he has a chance to be top 10 with a really good season, given how talented he is. Although there is a top 10 guy in this year's draft, but that's the late 04 Charlie Stravel. Yeah. Yeah. And so far, Smith has averaged two points a game, you know, with the under 18s, and they've played, you know, he's scored in every game they've had.

He's, you know, just kind of scoring big goals to the speed factor that he brings and the ability to make plays at pace. it really stands out and it's made him very difficult to defend. And even though, you know, in a lot of years on an NTP team, you're looking at, you've got so many different guys you've got to worry about. And even if you key on Smith, he just has the brain to be able to kind of, you know, get his way around that and find ways to score and make the guys around him better. So I've been really impressed by the way that he's played this year.

I think that, you know, as he continues to build strength, he's got, you know, a good enough frame to tack on more muscle and be a little bit tougher to move off pucks and things, and that'll help him a lot. But I think that the base of his game right now and what he's shown in the early season is that, you know, this is a guy that's going to make some real noise in this, in this draft class. And I agree with Corey. I think he's on the fringe of the top 10 now, but, you know, he's trending up. He's certainly trending up for me. I wonder behind Smith, like, how do you kind of parse the next group of NTDP guys, Corey? Because you've got some different flavors. You mentioned Leonard, who I think can kind of play a little more of that gritty, jammy role

if you want him to. You've also got Oliver Moore. who's kind of that slick, smaller centerman, Gabe Perrault, another guy who probably belongs in that conversation. How do you parse kind of that next tier? How long is it? It's probably those three players, maybe Danny Nelson, depending on who you talk to. I think those guys are all close enough that it'll depend how their seasons go to see what order they go in. Leonard does have a little bit more jam in his game. He skates well, but he also has had a four-goal game during one of the games in the seasons.

So I think there is offense in his game. Oliver Moore, I think it's the clear best skater on that team while also having a four. offense to go with that. Gabe Perot, you know, not the biggest guy or the fastest, but it's got a ton of offensive creativity. He could score. He works hard. You know, he's a big part of their power play.

And Danny Nelson is one of the most fascinating prospects in this draft class. Played defense in Minnesota high school last year. He's a second line center on the program this season. You know, big guy has skill. I think, you know, there's a lot of development ahead for this player. You know, it may not be 100% ready to make an impact yet at this level, but there's a lot of tools there. And I know a lot of NHL scouts I talk to who are very intrigued by this player. I think there's a chance he could be the second best player on the team by the time it's all said and done.

Yeah, I would agree with Corey on that. The Nelson is just, it's all about that raw ability and seeing where he can take it. And I've seen a lot of guys come into the NTP in that second year. And sometimes it's a tough adjustment. And some guys absolutely thrive in that environment. and I think he's going to be one of those guys. I can't wait to see it. And the one thing I'd say about Ryan Leonard, too, just real quick,

because he is, I think that there are so many teams that want, they have to find players that play the way that he does in order to win. And I think that he plays, that versatility that he brings, the physicality, the fact that he's not a huge guy, but he's just always in there. Kind of like, you know, Rucker McGority was similar in that way. And if he continues to develop that scoring tool, And he really does have some really good scoring ability.

He had a great under 18 world championship too. I think he had five goals and five games, including a hat trick in one game. So, you know, he's got the ability to make some noise. So I think he's the kind of guy that he doesn't necessarily look like your typical first rounder, but he's going to be a first rounder. I just think that there are going to be enough teams that just love the way that he plays, and that'll be enough for him to push him over the top.

Awesome. Well, a lot of time to follow all those guys, and we'll certainly be on top of all of it. But that's going to do it for us today. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Athletic Hockey Show's prospect series. You can subscribe to the Athletic Audio Plus on Apple Podcasts to get all the bonus content from our entire network. It starts with a 30-day free trial, and then it's just 99 cents a month after that. You can catch more of Chris over at Flow Hockey and his podcast, Talking Hockey Sense. And, of course, you can subscribe to The Athletic right now for a dollar a month for six months when you visit theathletic.com slash hockey show.

We'll talk to you soon.