The Athletic Hockey Show - Connor McDavid Hart Trophy credentials, New York Islanders with Arthur Staple, Carolina Hurricanes with Sara Civian, Multiple Choice Madness, a brand new Hailbag, and more

Episode Date: March 22, 2021

First, Ian and Hailey discuss which teams, other than the Buffalo Sabres, have been the most disappointing so far this season, whether Connor McDavid should be the landslide Hart Trophy favorite or not, and more.Then, The Athletic’s own Arthur Staple joins the show to discuss the routinely underrated New York Islanders, how Anders Lee’s injury could impact GM Lou Lamoriello’s trade deadline targets, Mathew Barzal’s overall game, and much more.Next, The Athletic’s Carolina Hurricanes writer Sara Civian calls in for a quick conversation about the state of the Canes, Rod Brind'Amour’s case for being Coach of the Year, goaltending options as the trade deadline approaches, and more.Plus, to close things out, Ian and Hailey run through a series of Multiple Choice Madness questions and Hailey answers listener questions in another installment of the Hailbag, including one about the future of Team Canada’s goaltending.And, right now, you can sign up for an annual subscription to The Athletic for just $1 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow or 1 CAD a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshowcanada Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome back, everybody, to another edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. Once again, I'm Ian Metis, alongside Haley Sialvi. And I head on this episode of the podcast. We'll give some much-needed love to a couple of teams at the top of the standings in the Islanders and the Hurricanes. Both Arthur Staples and Sarah Sivion will drop by for a couple of visits. All of the attention has been on the Buffalo Sabres so far this season. But what other teams have been major disappointments thus far? We'll hit on some multiple choice badness,

asking which bubble team from the Central Division will make the playoffs this year, Columbus, Chicago, or Dallas will wrap up with a couple of listener questions, including who would be your goalie for Team Canada if we had a best on best game tonight? All of that coming up on the show with a, I'm assuming, heavily caffeinated Haley Salveon, maybe? I don't know.

She's short on sleep, but high on energy. Yeah, I got the, this new mug from Home Sense. It's, uh, this is a podcast so no one can see it. I don't know why I'm holding it up. I'm doing it to show you. It's baby Yoda. It's very on brand. It's very cute. It holds a large amount of coffee, which is excellent and very important. Um, I underestimated a story that I was working on yesterday about the Calgary Flames. And I was up until 3.30 writing it because I thought, oh, this will be a simple one. And then seven hours, three thousand words later.

And here we are. And here we are. But you got your coffee going, you know, Haley, fun fact about me, I have had one cup of hot coffee in my life. One. What? That's it. Yeah, it's kind of weird.

When? Where was it from? And why was it the only one? And it was last, it was the summer of 2019. I waited until 2019. I was 41 years old, I think. 41, 42. when I had my first cup of hot coffee and I had it at the original Starbucks very first location

in Seattle. Because I said, you know what? Incredible. Yeah, I was like, if I'm going to have one, my first cup of coffee, I got to go to the OG Starbucks right in Pike Place there in Seattle because that's where my parents live. So I went there. I had my cup of coffee and I have not had another cup of hot coffee since, although I've slowly moved into iced coffee now.

So I can do that, but I can't do hot coffee. But I also used to drink, when I used to host radio shows in Ottawa, I used to have energy drinks from time to time. But then I thought, you know what? I'm not a big energy drink person. No. And you get to my age, Haley. There's certain things you shouldn't be doing. Like when you hit 40, you shouldn't be having energy drinks.

Like, like we should come up with a, and you could help me out because you would be at the perfect vantage point for this. Let's come up with a list of things that guys in their 40 shouldn't do. I'm going to say energy drink. Okay? Snapchat accounts and ripped jeans and ripped jeans. Don't do it, man. Like, you're clinging to something that's not there. Let it go.

Let the energy drinks go. Let the rip jeans go. And for the love of God, don't have a Snapchat account if you're 40. No. Snapchat. And even TikTok is pushing it too. It's so funny. It is.

The funny part about you saying that you went to the first Starbucks. I had a Ryan Clark, our new Seattle writer, he's awesome, like good, good friend of mine, great colleague. We were talking about once the pandemic's over, you know, you should come down and visit, my wife and I will show you around Seattle. And he read me like the basic 26 year old girl that I am. And he's like, you probably want to go to the Starbucks, don't know. I was like, I was like, I.

Ouch. Yes, I do. But like, oh, that was so rude. And he's like, whatever, we'll go to Starbucks. What I want to know is post-pandemic in Seattle is the gum wall still a thing. You know what the gum wall is in Seattle, Haley? People just go and stick their gum on a wall. And it's right by the original store. It's right by the Pike Marketplace there. And it's an entire little tunnel. And it's just people have stuck their gum there. I feel like in the COVID world, that's not happening. But that's just me. All right. Hey, listen, let's get into a. jam-pack show because for the first time, I think since we've launched this podcast, Haley, we have multiple gas, as I mentioned. So we're going to get to Arthur Staple, Sarah Sivian, in a few minutes. But let's talk about some storylines going around the league.

And, you know, one of the things we've done a lot of in the first six or seven weeks of the season, or I guess are now over two months, we've kind of ripped on the Buffalo Sabres. And I think everybody would agree if you had to pick your one team that's been the biggest disappointment is the Buffalo Sabers. But if we remove the sabres from the equation, Haley, who should be the most disappointing team in the league? Like, is it Philly?

Is it Nashville? Is it the defending Western Conference champion Dallas Stars? Like, let's remove the sabers because I think we've beaten a dead horse there. Yeah. Who would it be for you? Yeah, I think it's an interesting question. And for me, I mean, I think, Nashville is a big one, although I don't know what kind of expectations there were on this team

heading into the season. Like they have a ton of big contracts. They have players. Nashville is a team for me that always seems to be worse than they should be based on the players they have on their roster. You just, you look at on paper, the Nashville predators, you're like, oh, good team. And then they're 24th in the National Hockey League right now, you know, under five, hundred say a state percentage jesus i'm tired under 500 record so that's always been a big question mark to me i mean the flyers i don't think i would put them in like crazy disappointing territory um i know that they were a big dark horse heading into the playoffs last year um they had a ton of momentum they're not terrible they're they're 15 11 and 3 like it's could be a lot worse for the philadelphia

flyers. This is a really good question because I do struggle with it. I wrote down a couple. Dallas is a big one to me. They were so close to winning the Stanley Cup. And now they're 25th, like bottom 10 in the National Hockey League. They have a ton of games in hand because they had a delayed start to the season. So there is time to make up some ground.

And they do have some major injuries to Tyler Sagan and Ben Bishop, which obviously play a role. but there still is a major question mark around like, what is this Dallas Stars team less than a year removed from the Stanley Cup finals? New Jersey, I don't know when they're going to turn it around. That's one for me where you're kind of looking and being like, are they going to, when are they going to get out of the basement of the league? And the Rangers, I think, have been a little bit disappointing. I think if you rolled a tape back from one of our first episodes, Ian, you and I, I think we had the Rangers as a playoff team.

We thought that they had all the pieces. And Alexei Lafranier was going to be, you know, a great player. He still is going to be a great player in the future. But those are my big ones. I know I kind of rambled a lot and I didn't answer with like one straight team. But I think the Rangers, Dallas and maybe Nashville are up there for me in terms of disappointment. Yeah. No, I appreciate your rambling because you listed half the teams of the league. So that was good. It was good to narrow it down. I cast a very wide net. So no one can really tell me I'm wrong.

Yeah. You know what though? I think as I think about it, like my initial, my gut feeling was Dallas only because they went to the cup final. But they do have the games in hand. And we got to be, you know, mindful of that that the point like points. Like we got to do a better job I can think of looking at points percentage rather than points. And but there's still a playoff bubble team. certainly not locked in. I think I agree with you. I think it's the Rangers. I think the Rangers were the team. Panarin, Zabanajad, you know,

were supposed to be dominant. Then you were going to parachute in Lafranier. Capo-Caco was supposed to come in and kind of now with his season under his belt. Like their top six, I think talent-wise, we all thought could be as good as almost anybody's top six, just in terms of talent. And they've been underwhelming.

You take that one period, out for Zabanajad against Philadelphia, he's got, I think, four goals. Other than that, right? So he's been underwhelming. I almost think like he is symptomatic or he is the best illustration of the Rangers this year. You want to paint the Rangers with one stroke of a brush?

Just look at Mika Zabanajad. And you were like, yeah, it's a little bit underwhelming. So I think I would agree with you there. It would be the Rangers based on what we thought about the preseason. Now, I also want to ask you here, because you're seeing a lot of people, as we hit this point in the season, Haley saying just go ahead,

engraved the name Connor McDavid into the Hart trophy right now. Like, stop it. Stop the fight. Stop the race. It ain't even close. Are you in that camp? Do you believe that Connor McDavid is going to be the landslide winner of the Hart trophy this year?

Yeah, and you're going to get me in trouble because I obviously cover the Calgary Flames. But this is a national podcast, and so we cannot be biased here. So nobody yell at me. I'm just trying to do the job. Yes. Connor McDavid, you know what?

Engrave it, you know, let's just put the caveat that if someone goes on a crazy heater and gets their team into the playoffs, like they're going to be in the conversation. We know that. But Connor McDavid, what he's done through 34 games is ridiculous. He has 60 points in 34 games. That's 21 goals, 39 assists, 60 points in 34 games. The next closest, I believe, is Leon Dreisdiel with 50. His scoring pace for an 82 game season is 144 points, the way that he's going at this

clip right now. If he were to play 82 games, he would score on pace to score 144 points. In the last 10 years, the only player that's come close to that. is Nikita Kutrov, who had 128 points. That's an insane scoring pace. And the one thing I noticed, too, is that his shooting percentage is actually down this year from last season in the year before that as well. So Connor McDavid is having this ridiculous year where his shooting percentage is at about

15.4% compared to 16 and 17 in the previous two seasons. So he's on this crazy pace. His shot percentage is a little bit lower. It's just, it's insane. You know, at this pace, you know, there's eight, I guess, how many more games are left to the season for him? He's played 34. He's played 34.

He's got 22 left, right? 22 more games. That's like a one point. That's, I mean, he could get 95. Like, he could almost touch 100. I don't think he'll get to 100, but, you know, if he could score 90 points in 58 games or 56 games, that's just insane. And yeah, you have, you just, you have to give him the heart trophy if he does that. That's just ridiculous.

Let me throw the one counter argument to this, and you tell me, if you agree or disagree. 16 points for McDavid in seven games against Ottawa. And I know he's also gone gangbusters against Calgary. 14 points in six games. Is there something to be said for, like, I guess my question would be, is, is it fair to compare what McDavid's doing this season versus what Kucherov did in the season you mentioned or anybody who's done anything in the 21st century? Because it's such a unique year.

Like, McDavid's point totals are amplified because he's played Ottawa seven times. Like, there's no denying that. I wonder, should that be built in? And as I looked up the numbers, now, if you. you take McDavid's games against Ottawa out of the equation, he would be on a point pace for 133 points over the course of the season. So that's still really amazing, right? Like that is all world stuff. But I just wonder, do we need to just, I guess, do we, do we pump the brakes a little bit on this is the greatest offensive season of the 21st century? Because you're

just playing the same six teams? I don't know. Yeah. I mean, I I'm not going to come out and say that if he, like, that's the best offensive. Like, the pace is, would statistically be the best. But I'm not going to go out and say that Connor McDavid just had like the hands down best season in the last, you know, two decades. Because obviously this is a different year. But at the end of the day, like, you take away the games against Ottawa and you're still playing against some of the remaining bottom teams in the national hockey league. like you still play the Ottawa senators in a regular year. And you also play, if you look at the bottom of the standings,

you also play Detroit. You also play the San Jose sharks, Buffalo, the New Jersey Devils. So it's different, but he's still playing against, you know, those teams that you could maybe rack up the points against. But I think it's the way that he's doing it too. Like these aren't just like little greasy tapins. Like some of his goals have just been, sorry, that was like one of the more, like,

like hockey broie things I've ever said. No, I'm just, I'm just trying to picture a, I'm just trying to picture a greasy McDavid Tappin where he doesn't do anything and he just stands there. I can't even picture it. Just sometimes you just got to get a greasy one. Yeah.

I hated that. But no, like again, I think that, you know, if you look at a player like Patrick Kane or, you know, even a bark of, like if they, they're not going to put up the same amount of points. But I think that,

that those are players, in my opinion, who should be in the conversation if they can still produce at an elite level and get their teams that everyone wrote off into the playoff conversation. It was the similar thing, you know, last year, I think everyone was right up on the Leon Drysidal for Hart hype train. And for me, I was like, Artemi Panera and got the Rangers like into a really good position. Like I was big on Panera and I was big on Pasternac, big on McKinnon. Drysidal was on my ballot, but for me, it was like, yeah, like he had a really great season, but so to McDavid and the Oilers had a pretty good year and look at what the Oilers did, but like look at what Paneran did to get his bottom feeder team into a good position and

look at what Pastor Nack did this year. So I think there's always going to be other people who deserve to be in the conversation, but knowing the way that this voting goes, like we all know that McDavid's going to win. Like, dryside won by a landslide last year, and I think there was a fair argument for other players. So, you know, regardless of what we think about this division, I just, I think it's no question that he's going to win if he puts up those points. And I still think that every division should have their own MVP, just for this one unique

season. I don't like change. That's supposed to be the 40-year-old day. demographic. I don't like change. Yeah. I'm the 26-year-old who wants to, like, really wants to go to Starbucks. Yeah. But I also hate change. Yeah. I have a bad day and I go and walk to get an ice coffee to feel alive.

All right, Haley. You know, we have to give some love on this podcast, I think, to a couple of teams that are at the top of the standings that maybe nationally speaking don't get that type of love. And I'm talking about the Carolina Hurricanes and the New York Islanders. And let's start by chatting some Islanders. Let's bring in our good friend. He covers the Islanders for the athletic. It is Arthur's staple with us to kick off this week. Arthur, first of all, thanks for joining us.

Can you tell our listeners, what's the vibe, what's the mood, what's the feeling in that market around a pretty good Highlanders team right now? Well, it's usually a little bit of anxiety just because it's the Islanders and they're always waiting for the other shoe to drop, at least for the last, oh, I don't know, 40 years or so. But they are a nervous fan base. They always think that there's some bad things lurking around the corner. And frankly, the Anders Lee injury is probably the thing that's gotten the most attention

just because it's such a huge blow. And they've been okay since then. But really, I think if you look at the big picture, which is hard to do, I know, for a lot of fans, the last three years since Lou La Marello and Barry Trots came in, might be the best three-year stretch they've had since the glory days of Bossie and Trachier and Al Arbor and Bill Tori. It's been an incredible transformation around the team. Garth Snow was a pretty good GM, I think, if you look back on his days, but he ran a unique operation under Charles Wong.

It was a very lean machine. There wasn't a lot of people around. I think the fans sort of felt that underdog vibe all the time. And it's hard for them to shed it. You know, this is a good team. They've established themselves as a good team. The run in the playoffs last year, even if they don't get the national or North American love from everybody, this is a good team.

And everybody around the team knows it. And the way that they carry themselves, I think they understand that they're a successful team. And they've become a real contender year in and year out. I think one of the things that we always see, at least from the outside, and maybe Ian can speak to this a little bit too. but, you know, I do think that the New York Islanders are typically underrated by, you know, the North American media. I mean, covering the senators last year, you know, I think there wasn't too much about the New York Islanders, but they ended up making that playoff run, as you mentioned,

Arthur. Why do you think that is? Is it a location thing? Is it a personnel thing? why do you think they've been, I guess, undercovered compared to some other American teams in North America? You know, I think not to go full history, but even 50 years ago when they were born, they basically owed a territorial rights debt to the Rangers from their birth that ballooned out of control and kind of almost sunk their ship before they even got started in the 1970s. And it was really a situation where they had the right GM and Bill Torrey from the start. They had the right coach in their second year from Al Arbor. But it was still a matter of they were the little brothers to the Rangers, big brothers. And even though the Rangers hadn't been successful for so long, even in the 70s all the way up to when they finally won in the 90s,

it was a lot of playing second fiddle and trying to prove to whether it's the media in the New York market or the fans on Long Island and in the area that this was a real legitimate team that was going to be around long term. obviously didn't take them very long to be successful back then to be champions within a decade and then do it four times in a row, probably something that'll not be done again. But I think soon after that, when the ownership problem started, you know, they just have a lot of issues that the Rangers haven't had that more established American hockey teams haven't had. And I think that kind of drove them back underground in the 90s and then kind of the Mike Milbury era of revolving door owners and promising a new arena and all this stuff that's, you know, kicked a lot of. of their fans in the butt for many years, the ones that are still left, you know, through the 2010s were the really hardcore group. You know, I think it's just hard for, if your own fans don't appreciate the good times like they have now with a new building coming next year and a lot of stability, it makes it harder, I think, for fans of other teams and in other markets to say,

oh, we've got to take this team seriously when you hear a lot of nervousness and wondering about what the future is going to hold from just within their own fans. and you bring up an interesting point too because they've kind of had this nomadic feel about them right in the last couple of years of where they're going to play and are they going to play in brooklyn or they're going to play on uh at the coliseum as they've kind of slowly opened some things up if i'm not mistaken arthur now we've seen some fans come back into uh the coliseum to watch them play like what's the what's the uh the mood been like with a handful of fans at games in uh in new york I mean, they're enthusiastic.

You don't want to make fun of any fan base, but the fans that have endured all of the, all of the nuttiness of the last 20 years up until maybe a few years ago are super dedicated. And I've, you know, I've been doing this long enough to have interacted with hundreds of them. And as negative as they can be sometimes, they love this team and they love being able to go to the Coliseum. They love being able to go to a place on Long Island. They did not love going to Brooklyn. and I don't think any of the players love going to Brooklyn either, but that's a separate story now that that's over with. But the Coliseum is their place. It's a very territorial feel when you're on Long Island. There's lots of people. I have family on Long Island. Lots of people don't love to leave Long Island. It's kind of its own little area separate from the city and they don't want to necessarily be associated with the city, especially when you're an Islander fan. You don't want to be lumped in with the Rangers or whoever else. So they love having their team on Long Island. I think being able to go to

the games even for just a thousand or 1,500 people, whatever it is now, it's huge for a lot of people. It really, you know, I think it's the only pro team that's in the area if you're on Long Island. And I think being able to go after a full year away is, it's a big relief to a lot of people. And especially because last spring when Long Island was among the places in the tri-state area, that was really hard hit by the first wave of COVID in the United States, you know, it just, I think it feels like another step to kind of put the pandemic, start to put the pandemic in the rearview mirror. So maybe switching a little bit towards the upcoming trade deadline.

And you mentioned the Anders Lee injury. It was announced just a few days ago that he'd be having surgery to repair a torn ACL. I guess that happened last week. And we don't usually get, you know, clear pictures of things from Lou Lamarillo. but I did see in one of your recent pieces that he did come out and say that the Andersley injury certainly changes their focus heading into the trade deadline. What do you think the Islanders need to do or are planning to do to fill that void that Andersly leaves?

Well, if we say it, then it usually doesn't happen when it regards to Lou Lamarillo. So I'm sure. Okay, so should we just cut this part out then? Maybe we'll just say player X instead. I think everything's on the table for them. Being able to use least $7 million cap hit and LTIR opens up pretty much the door to just about anybody. I think with a little bit of maneuvering, they could make Taylor Hall fit under their cap situation right now. So you'd sort of think him and Kyle Pomeriery are the top free agent, unrestricted free agent, pure rental type wingers.

And I think what helps them in terms of this market and maybe why he hasn't jumped at the first opportunity to do something, kind of the way he did with, even though it was on the deadline with Jean-Gabriel Pazzo last year, where that was the guy that they knew that they needed. They didn't have a lot of holes they felt in their forward group, but that was the guy they wanted at the time, long-term, certainly has worked out well for them, even though they paid a high cost for it. I think now you're seeing whether it's a pending UFA, maybe some guys with term, you know, pending RFAs who, you know, pending RFAs who, might not think about, there's a lot of wingers that are available. And that's obviously their area of need since Andrew Lee was their top scoring winger and captain and real leader of the team. So I think if you look, Paul Palmieri, maybe they can, if they can wrangle a guy like Nick Falino out of Columbus, those are three rentals that you might look at. But then I think you look further down and maybe some younger guys with a little bit of term or RFA, Sam Reinhart

maybe in Buffalo's guy who fits what they do. Connor Garland in Arizona, if he's available, he's a guy who fits what they do. There's a lot of options. And I think Lou is his mantra is if you have time, you use it. They've bought themselves a lot of time by having such a good start to the season. So I don't know if they feel the real urgency to maybe surrender a first round pick, a decent prospect right away. He's seeing the market.

There doesn't seem to be a ton of buyers right now for a lot of reasons. So I think there's a lot of options on the table for them, starting with Hall and working your way down. Arthur, maybe you could fill us in on how the Islanders have filled the gap, the departure of Devin Taves in the offseason. I think a lot of people looked at that and thought, wow, you're losing a top four defensemen just basically because of a cap crunch and a tough situation, had to trade him to Denver for draft picks. And yet, I look at the Islanders. They're in the running to maybe win the President's trophy, maybe win their division. How have they been able to withstand that loss of a guy that was eating about 20 minutes a night for them last? last season. Yeah, it's, it definitely loomed as a big problem. And I think the biggest problem of all, one that you're kind of seeing playing out right now with Noah Dobson in the second week on the COVID

protocol list, they really ran with six guys pretty much for the first 29 games or so, which, which, you know, I think you've seen teams use 12 or 13 defensemen at this point. So they got pretty lucky in that regard, because Taves really did allow them to bring Dobson along slowly last year. It allowed them to kind of, you know, drop nether. Nick Letty down, drop his minutes down a little bit because Taves is such a good power play quarterback. It really slotted guys in properly last season. And I think this year, the worry was, could Nick Lettie step back up at age 30 and retake kind of the minutes that you're used to seeing him get over the years? And the answer is yes. The guy's got 20 assists so far. He leads the team. He's been really good. So his pairing, I think, at five on five in that second pair with Scott Mayfield hasn't always been perfect.

but the way that they've played defensively, it really isn't always about in the Barry Trot system exactly how those six defensemen play. They need their forwards to be supportive. They kind of clear the front of the net. They don't force their goalies to make multiple saves

on each chance. So I think it's kind of a full team effort to keep these guys on the back end healthy and upright and productive. And really, you know, it's been Letty. Andy Green at age 38 has looked pretty durable and he hasn't missed a game.

Dobson, before he went on the COVID protocol, this was really emerging as a good young player. And I think that top pair of Adam Palick and Ryan Pollock, when you talk about underrated with the Islanders, I think they're kind of the poster boys for underrating players on this team. They are a legit top pair. I think if you look at their underlying data, they're over 60% expected goals for when they're on the ice at five on five.

And they're playing against some really good top lines in this division night after night. So it's been an impressive run for those two guys. And then I think even if you go beyond that with Dobson out, Thomas Hickey, who's a really good story, you know, kind of an emotional night for him getting this first game in two years. Injuries kind of derailed him a couple seasons ago and most of last season, lost his brother to cancer around this time last year when the world shut down. It's been quite a ride for a guy who's been an Ilander for a long time. And he stepped in and had two assists in his first game in two years.

So they really, they're just a plug-in. play operation, it seems, maybe not so much to fill Anders-Lee's void, but defensively, they've really managed to avoid any dip in their play with Dave's out. I guess my final question for you, Arthur, we saw this ridiculous goal from Matt Barzell, I guess two weeks ago now. I mean, it was probably one of the, it was the best goal I've seen this season in a couple years for sure. But you did a really fun story after the fact with Rangelo,

ranking his goals in order of ridiculousness. Where did that goal, I don't even know how to describe it, quite frankly. I'm sure we know the one that I'm talking about. Where does that one rank for you in terms of the things that you've seen Matt Barzell pull off? And if someone knows how to describe what he did, please, I'm all, I'm all ears because I don't know how to put into words what that goal was. I mean, it was the whole play, right? It was not just. just the between the legs, cutting across the ice, it was getting onto a puck inside of Rasmus Ristolin who has about 30 pounds on him and shrugging him off like he was, you know, he was just like throwing, you know, flicking a bug off his shoulder pretty much, and then cutting across the crease

and then, you know, stopping and putting it between the legs back behind them. It was, yeah, it was, it was insane. You know, like I wrote on that piece, there's been a lot more important goals scored in Islanders history, but there hasn't been one that was like that ever. And I think for him this year has been a real step forward. He's had a couple of great ones. He started off the season in Madison Square Garden, undressing Tony DiAngelo and, you know, kind of inside out and then beating the goalie from distance. And that was kind of the beginning of the end of Tony Gangelo's year, you know, with the Rangers and in the NHL.

And he said a couple other ones, nothing as good as that one, but a couple other ones where he's really showed his incredible skill. and I think his desire to get to the net and put shots on that is maybe the thing that's changed the most about him from last year to this year. Got nine goals. He's been stuck there for a little while, and I think Lee being out is a real blow to him because those guys were linemates for a long time. But I think the Matthew Barzell you're seeing on that goal is a guy who knows that you need to put on a show, but also do the things you need to do to keep getting ice time and Barry Trotz's system. And he's had a couple of hiccups. You know, he took a bad penalty the other night and got set out for a little bit.

And like I said, he certainly hasn't been producing at the same level with Lee gone. But yeah, it was a hell of a goal. And it's one, I think, maybe even surprised himself a little bit the way that he reacted to it. I know I said that was my last one. Sorry. But is Matt Barzell underrated? No, I think he's pretty properly rated. I don't think, and I think it's, I don't even think he would say that he's in that Matthews,

Marner, McDavid tier yet. But is he as good as Jack Eichel? I mean, sure, you know, he's not, maybe not as individually gifted as Jack Eichel, but he's part of a really good team. And I think in the playoffs in the summer, Barzal finally was able to realize, you know, that the creativity and the hard work can mix together. He had a real good goal to put the Islanders up three nothing on Washington in that first round series last summer in overtime. And I think that was kind of the breaking point for him, breakthrough point.

You know, he got it, he took a, I think he took a stick in the eye in the Philly series, the next one. And, you know, Barry Trots was saying it like, you know, after that, after that playoff run was over, he had, you know, blue, you know, black and blue over his eye and a big cut running down. And so he looked like he looked like he'd been through the war. And I think maybe you need a little bit of that to start getting to that next level. And I think he wants to be a guy like Patrick Kane or Sidney Crosby. And the way that you get to that level is not necessarily just scoring those great goals or making those great plays. It's hoisting a Stanley Cup or two like those guys have done. So I think he understands that that's the next step.

And maybe he's not rated as high as some of the great individual guys. But I'm sure he'd take a conference final trip or a Stanley Cup final trip over 120 points. any season. So, you know, I think that realization is probably as important as some of the other stuff he's done. Well, Arthur, listen, we appreciate the visit because it is great to hear about the islanders. Again, I don't think we give them enough love, certainly nationally. So appreciate it. And let's give you a little plug here for your, I love the name of your podcast, by the way. No Sleep Till Belmont. I love it. I mean, that might be the best podcast name under the athletic umbrella. That thing is amazing for a name. So just give our listeners a sense if they don't know

when they can listen to your Islanders podcast. When can they tune into that? We record on Tuesdays. Usually comes out Tuesday afternoon. It's myself and AJ Miletco, who is as good talking about Islanders and the NHL as anybody out there. We've been real lucky to have her come on board this season. And yeah, every week on Tuesday and trying to get some good guests on to talk Islanders. And we do have a great loyal following of Islander fans, but if anybody else wants to know about the Islanders, it's a good listen to. So hopefully everyone can tune in. Yeah, absolutely. Listen, Arthur, thanks for dropping by and we look forward to your coverage on the athletic and the kind of

weeks leading up to the trade deadline. I'm sure the Islanders are going to be busy. All right. Thanks to you both. Appreciate it. Thanks, Arthur. All right, Haley. Like I said, this is the theme of giving some love to some franchises that I don't think get enough of it on a national level. So great to have Arthur's staple drop by. now to talk about another team that probably falls in that same boat and same category. Sarah Sivian joins us because the Carolina Hurricanes are back at the top of the standings and maybe not getting the love that they should be getting across the league. So first of all, Sarah, thank you so much for joining us on the Athletic Hockey Show podcast.

Sounds like you've had a bit of a day to start. Yeah, yeah, first of all, the islanders, the teams, everybody's favorite team. But yeah, last month, girl, forgot about everything else in my life, but life must go on, the show must go on, and the games must be respected. So here we are. So what's what, I mean, listen,

I ask this question to Arthur, I'll ask it to you. Okay, nationally, maybe the teams like Carolina and New York aren't getting the love. But in Raleigh, in your market, how much hype is there around a very good Carolina Hurricanes team? A lot and you can tell actually it's like ironic how it works like when everyone's being critical of the team. That's when you know that they're good. You know what I mean?

Because you don't expect them to lose whereas for the past decade before the last 2.5 years, they expect the most mediocre product out of the cane so they weren't even mad. But now people all see them tweeting like how mad they were at like some loss that wasn't about that. And then they're like, wow, like we've come a long way. And that's how I describe it. It's different expectations on the team now, I guess, right? That's exactly what it is. And obviously that starts with Rod Brindamore coming in,

and that makes the immediate impact. It's a level of excellence, it demands for everybody else. Why do you think that the Carolina hurricanes don't get talked about enough on a national level? Why are they so, I guess, underrated? Well, there's like three reporters here. One of them is me and my broken laptop. And then it's, obviously, it's a small market. And then that paired with the decade of Will Day, they won't say,

with the cane, where they'd always come, like, two games short of making the playoffs. People get sick of that, right? Like, in a relationship, like, at a certain point, you don't want to wait around and hope that somebody changes. You're just, like, over it. You finally break up with them. But then, of course, then they get the new...

I don't know I'm going with this girlfriend, Rod Brindamore, who comes in, changes everything. And you're like, oh, I guess... They were good after all. So, hey, listen, speaking of Rod Brindamore, give us your best pitch for why Rod Brindamore should win coach of the year, this year. He does so much with so little and never complains.

And just his impact on the team, it's hard to describe, I guess, but the way that he coaches is the way that he played, kind of just, and he, I think people expect him to be kind of a scary person maybe if they don't really know him, but like he's not. He's so good with millennials, which is weird, but he has millennial children that are athletes too. And he knows exactly how to coach that isn't yelling or isn't scaring anybody, but is making them want to be better versions of themselves. And that's a true leader. Sounds like he's really good at making this Carolina

Hurricanes team more accountable. Exactly. And you know what? Like you see that after, like they're They won eight games in a row, and then they just dropped three, and you know what he did at practice. He made it the most fun practice of the year, and he just, he doesn't want, like, the bad vibes in the locker room. Like, I don't think he is kind of more revolutionary, where he knows that that doesn't actually work, but guys loving each other and wanting to succeed for each other and themselves actually does work, and there's nothing wrong with a little bit of fun. Like, you don't want to come into the rink and hate it. As we wrap up with you here, Sarah, just two questions.

here real quick. Speaking of the fun stuff, fans are back in the building. What's the atmosphere like? And because look, the hurricanes were such a fun bunch of jerks, all that stuff last year, look like a fun place to be in 2019 and early 2020. What's the feeling like inside a hurricane's home game in 2021? I got out of the honest, I was really anxious at first just because it's like I haven't been around that many people in a year. And I was like, oh God, but everything, they're being so safe and taking all the precautions that double masks, and I'm seeing everybody wearing two masks. I respect that. And we're at the stage here where it's like most people are at least in the US and where I am getting ready to at least get vaccinated. So it's kind of like a different world.

But it's awesome. And the way they're doing a storm surge now that kind of honors a front line worker every single game. So I love that little touch from them. Like they didn't, they weren't necessarily going to bring the storm surge back, but they did it for the frontline workers. And the final question for you, we're about three weeks out from the deadline, Sarah. Do the Carolina Hurricanes try to upgrade the goaltending position, or are they satisfied with what they've got? Well, it's interesting. We might have a little Jordan Bittington situation on our hands with Alex Medell-Chivik.

Oh, my Alex Nadelkovitt, it's the most impossible thing to say. I practice it in front of the mirror and I can't do it. But he is their up-and-coming goalie who, he's like 24, so I think people kind of Hannah, we're starting to consider him a bus, but now he's been forced to play, and he's been one of the best goals in the NHL. So that's another thing that people need to talk about more, I'll say, about the game. He's playing tonight, so we'll get to see, for real. That sounded like Ian Mendez trying to pronounce Dom Luce Chishin.

Everybody trying to pronounce that. Except for me. There we go, except for you. Haley, you got it. Hey, Sarah, I hope the rest of your day goes better than the start, because you had a little bit of a misadventure there. Listen, thanks for dropping by on the podcast, and we look forward to all your coverage of the hurricanes with the athletic here leading up to the deadline. Of course. You guys really turn my day around. Thank you. Thanks, Sarah.

All right, Haley, the rare two-guest episode of the athletic hockey show. So great to have Arthur Staple, Syria, Sivian, with us. And now, as we always do, Haley, time for a little multiple-choice madness on a Monday. In fact, this first question kind of dovetails nicely off of what we were just talking to Sarah about because it's about goal tending and issues for contenders. So here's the first question for us to ponder on a Monday, Haley. Which top 10 team in the overall standings right now has the biggest question mark around their goaltending right now? So these are teams that probably have aspirations of going deep in the playoffs, but maybe their goaltending is a little iffy. Is it A, the Toronto Maple Leafs, B, the Carolina Hurricanes,

C, the Pittsburgh Penguins, or D, the Edmonton Oilers? You know what, I'm going to probably, I know we just talked to Sarah about it, and it does seem like they, I'm not sold that Carolina has, you know, a true, you know, elite top tier starter. But it does seem like they at least have, you know, a third goalie who can step in and help out in the event of injury. Yeah, she said he's, you know, I'm not even going to try to pronounce it because it's not even in front of me. Oh, it's a lusitian.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, the back that they have, you know, a third debt piece who can step in when, you know, he's quote unquote forced to play due to injury or whatever it may be, I think that kind of helps. You know, they have a decent amount of, I guess, quantity. But for me, like, I've got to say the Toronto Maple Leafs. I mean, they just played against a Calgary flames. The flames in the first period on Friday against the Toronto Maple Leafs generated 0.27 expected goals for like a quick little explanation on what that means. The shot quality and shot volume in that first period was enough for them to score.

0.25 goals, essentially. The flame scored three. Now, that is a pretty big indictment on the goaltender, which was Freddie Anderson, who has been their starter for several years. There's been a ton of questions about can Freddie Anderson still be the starter. And I think the Leafs kind of have this goaltending controversy on their hands because Jack Campbell came in the very next game, got a shutout, back-to-back shutouts for Jack Campbell.

obviously there was a lengthy, you know, stretch of time that he missed due to injury in between there. But, you know, I think Jack Campbell might take the starter spot away from Freddie Anderson because he just hasn't been very good. And I think that's a problem for a team like Toronto. And it goes back to the conversation we were having last week of do you want an elite team with decent goal tending or do you want really good goaltending with, you know, a pretty good team? and I think the Leafs are kind of, they were struggling with that. And then, of course, once you go down the list, like we saw, Jack Campbell was out with an injury. Who's your backup?

It's Michael Hutchinson. That's just not a good situation for a hockey team who wants to win the Stanley Cup in a shortened season. So I'm going to say Toronto. You know, I'm looking at this too. Look, Pittsburgh's gotten better goal heading lately from Tristan Jerry and Casey DeSmith in particular, I think has been a lot better. But I still look at them. And while I agree with you, like I think, Toronto's big issue is Freddie Anderson's game is just not where it should be

for a legit cup contender, sub-900 save percentage. But I'll say Pittsburgh only because I just don't know if they have the experience there. Like in Edmonton, Mike Smith has been in the playoffs before Toronto, Freddie Anderson's been there. Even in Carolina, James Reimer has played playoff games. Tristan Jerry and Casey the Smith really don't have experience. And that scares me. That always scares me. And I know we've had the Bennington stories and some of these magic carpet ride stories that kind of come out of nowhere.

But I'd prefer to have a goalie who's kind of been there and done that at least in the Stanley Cup playoff. So I think it's Pittsburgh, but I will say I think that their goaltending has improved in the last couple of weeks with Jerry and in Casey DeSmith. Okay, on to question number two, Haley, in Multiple Choice Madness. And we're going to talk a little bit about the central division here where you look at that division and it feels like the top three spots are locked in, right? The aforementioned Carolina Hurricanes, the two teams from the state of Florida, the Lightning and the Panthers, they're in. The question is, who's going to be the fourth team that makes the playoffs out of that division? Is it A, Columbus, B, Chicago, or C, the Dallas Stars?

And I'll go first on this one, Haley. And we got to preface this with, the Dallas Stars have some games in hand here. And they got to figure out how to come back. And, you know, if they win their games in hand, they're probably in a playoff spot. but something's not right in Dallas. Like this is a team that went to the cup final last year and they just looked like a shell of themselves. And we talked about this earlier in the show

about disappointing teams in the league. Dallas is right up there for me. I don't like where they're trending, quite frankly. I can't believe I'm going to say this because I feel like they've been a soap opera all year, but I'm going to say Columbus. I think Columbus will figure out a way. John Tonorella will get those guys to figure out a way

to make the playoffs. I think Chicago has been a really fun story and a great story. I just have a feeling at the end of the day, John Torrell is going to get his team to buy in, down the stretch, and Columbus will sneak into the four spot. What about you? I mean, I'm going to go with Chicago.

I think they've been a great story. They haven't, you know, you look at their goal differential and it's not great. It's minus 11, but it's better than Columbus, who's minus 17. You know, Chicago's gotten some pretty solid. goal tending, you know, that's been a really great story with Lankanen coming in. I know he's been somebody that our friend Dom has really liked. And I think Dom's probably won a lot of money

betting when he's starting. So I think Chicago's been a good story. And, you know, of course, they have players like Patrick Kane who have been producing at an elite level once again. They have some young players who are, you know, having a pretty good season, you know, obviously losing a player like Kirby Doc at the start of the year wasn't what they wanted. But I'm going to go with Chicago. You know, we had that whole discourse when it came out that they were going to be rebuilding. And, you know, Patrick Kane and Jonathan Taves were not happy about that. They were like, we don't want to rebuild and look at the way that they're playing.

Like they're saying, no, this isn't a rebuild. Nope. We're going to go in. So I'm going to say Chicago. Okay. We asked this guy, I kind of asked Sarah Sivian in this podcast to give. give us her kind of pitch for the Jack Adams and Rod Brindamore. Here's my next question.

Right now, Haley, you get a chance to cast your vote for the Jack Adams Award here in late March for coach of the year. Who gets your vote? Is it A, Dean Evanson in Minnesota, B, Barry Trots with the Islanders? C, Rod Brindamore and Carolina, D. Joel Quenville in Florida or E. I'll allow you to go off the board, Haley. You can pick anybody else in the league. Who gets your vote? It seems like I liked what Sarah had to.

to say about Ron Brindamore. I think Rod Brindamore is a great coach. You know, I've chatted with with players in Carolina about that. They really respect him. They love what he brings to the rank every single day. But I mean, and it feels like such a throwaway, but like it's got to be Barry Trots, doesn't it? Like he's just such a great coach and, you know, talking to Arthur and hearing about, you know,

what Barry, you know, Barry Trots plays that defensively sound style. and hearing about, you know, a player like Matt Barzell, balancing, you know, being a more complete player with that elite skill set, you know, you want to have those flashy goals, but it's more than that. And I think that's something that a coach like Barry Trots instills in his players. That's why Jean-Gabriel Pajot, we knew that he was going to be a great player in that system because he is a smart player with a 200-foot game. And some people might watch the Islanders and say, oh, this is boring. the same way that they're watching the flames under Daryl Sutter and saying,

oh, this is boring because they're so defensively sound. But, you know, that's a complete, you know, game. That's a good 200-foot game that he instills. And they're tied with Washington right now, 44 points for the top of the division. They could win the president's trophy. And, you know, I think that's, it's a credit to the players, but I think it's also a credit to Barry Trots. Yeah, you know what?

And I like the idea of Trots. the only thing is for some reason this award gets treated like, okay, once you've won it, like move along. Like it's almost like we treat it like it's the rookie of the year. Like I think Jacques de Mare is the only guy to win it back to back years. Now, granted Trots did win it two years ago and he won it with Washington a few years ago. But I think there's something in our mind where we're like, well, it's not necessarily coach of the year.

It's almost like, hey, which team did like surpass their preseason expectations? Yeah. Who surprised us? And let's say that it was the coach that did it. So that could be Minnesota. I guess that's probably where you're going. Minnesota, Florida is probably where you're going with it. Yeah, I think so. And I think, you know, I think you can make a case for Dean Evanison in Minnesota. I think the wild were a team that a lot of people didn't know, like, what were they going to be? And they've done a pretty good job and keeping the puck out of their net. I think they're averaging right at three goals a game. They've been a little bit more entertaining than, you know, you're used to see in the wild.

I think Dean Everson's done a nice job. Now, somehow they've been successful with like one of the worst power play in the league, which is mind-blowing because when you got a power play play clicking at like 9% and you're in a playoff spot, that's remarkable. So I think that's been a pretty good job from Dean Everson on a team that a lot of people didn't know if they would be good, if they would be successful. And here they are as one of the better teams in that West Division. So I'll say Dean Everson.

All right, Haley, on to question number four. And that is, which former Hart Trophy winner would you want on your team for the playoffs this season? So you can pick your team and you're like, you know what? I could parachute this one former Hart Trophy winner to be on my team. Who am I picking? Is it A, Taylor Hall, B, C. C. Joe Thornton or D. Corey Perry. They've all won the Hart Trophy as League MVP. who would you want on your team?

So my gut tells me it's Taylor Hall because, look, he's the youngest. He's in the arc of his career. But I don't know. Like he, I'm really torn on Taylor Hall. I still think he's going to help you. But I don't know. Like with the cap hit and the same with Carrie Price. I'm going to go kind of a little bit different here.

Keep me Joe Thornton. And the reason why, Haley, is I would want. the win it for Joe. Let's do it for Joe feeling in my locker room. Like, Corey Perry's won a cup already. So whatever. If he wins it, great. Kerry Price and Taylor Hall,

the cap hit scares the heck out of me trying to fit them in. But if you told me, and again, this is a theoretical thing because the Leafs aren't going to trade Joe Thornton, but you're telling me I could parachute the old guy without a cup and like, hey, let's win it for Joe. That's what I would do. So I would go Joe Thornton.

What about you? Yeah, I'm kind of inclined to agree. You know, I think playoff carry price, you know, he was excellent in that play and round against Pittsburgh last, last playoffs for Montreal. Playoff carry price makes it intriguing. But again, that cap hit is really high. And, you know, he has had some struggles this season. We've seen that.

I agree on Joe Thornton. I was listening to an interview with Austin Matthews last week or, or two weeks ago. And they asked him about Joe Thornton. And he was talking, you know, just about what Joe Thornton's like in that locker room and the way that he brings guys together. He's really loud. He loves to tell stories so that, you know, you could be in the stick room or in the gym or somewhere. And you can hear Joe Thornton in the locker room telling a story.

And he's really loud. He has this really loud laugh, this really loud voice. And guys just start migrating in because they want to go and see what, you know, Jumbo Joe is talking about. And he just has this effect of bringing the team together. And so I think that adds another element to it of, you know, guys love him in the room. They like playing with him. And then you add the like, let's win it for Joe Thornton.

He's never won a cup. Like, come on, let's do it for this guy. We love him. I think that could add, you know, a really great element to it. And I mean, yeah, it's hard. to say no to Joe Thornton. So I'm going to agree with you. All right. Last question for you, Haley. We've seen, you know, NCAA March Madness is back. The Frozen Four is, you know,

got the seedings for that tournament. It's around the corner. Here's my question for you, Haley. When things get back to quote unquote normal, which hockey tournament would you rather attend? A, the NCAA Frozen Four, or B, the double IHF World Junior Championship? That's a really good question. And I think looking at this, I've struggled with it because I think there are years where I would say the Frozen Four. Like I think this year when you look at, you know, say some of the teams who are at the top in the NCAA, you look at University of North Dakota, you've got, and this is notable to you,

you've got Jake Sanderson, Shane Pinto, Jacob Bernard Docker, players like Reese Gabor, Tyler Cleven and other Sends Prospect. you basically have the Sends Farm System at University of North Dakota. There's so much talent in the NCAA that are not eligible to play in the World Junior Championships. So if you just look at that North Dakota example, only Clevin and Sanderson were on a world junior championship roster this season out of that group that I mentioned. But Shane Pinto is still an elite player. Jacob Bernard Docker, elite player.

They played a year ago, didn't play this year. So I'm inclined, although the world juniors is best on best competition, part of me wants to say the Frozen Four because you have elite players who are just a couple months or a year older and can't play in the World Juniors and you can typically see them in the Frozen Four. But I don't know. Maybe that's like a bad, maybe I'm like going to upset some Canadians because that's like our tournament, the World Juniors, but I don't know. Yeah, I think I think I tend to agree with you.

I think the Frozen Four is a really cool thing. And I think it would be great if in the years ahead, it'll never get to where the NCAA March Madness is on the basketball front. But we got to do a better job in the hockey community of really highlighting that. Because I think obviously we do a great job with the World Juniors, at least in Canada. I don't know that that Frozen Four gets enough love. And I think people would love it. So I would love to go when things,

are back to normal. Get in there. There's nothing like a college atmosphere attending a sporting event. I love it. I think it's a great atmosphere. Count me in. I would be in for an NCAA Frozen Ford trip. And I will add to the women's Frozen Four is just as exciting. I don't know if you saw Ian, but Darrell Watts scored like a Wayne Gretzky type goal in overtime to win the national championship for Wisconsin. She was basically behind the net and chipped it in off of the defender and into the net to win in sudden death overtime in the national championship. Wisconsin is a powerhouse.

Darrell Watts is a player to watch for hockey Canada for the women for the future. She won the Patty Casmeyer trophy as a rookie, the only player to ever win it as a freshman. And she scored, I think it was 36 goal, 36 points. in like 18 games or something ridiculous. So she is just an incredible talent. And she's been someone that I've had on my to watch list for, you know, the 2022 Olympics, even the world championships coming up in Halifax and Truro. So she got the game winner.

If anyone hasn't seen it, I recommend checking it out because it's, you know, it was pretty like vintage, vintage goal to see that. So the women's Frozen Four is just as exciting as the men's. and I think that's really important. Yeah. Hey, listen, well said, and I'll have to check out that highlight to see the Gretzky-esque goal. I love that.

All right. So to wrap up the show, as we always do, Haley, we're going to take some listener questions, some feedback as we get some questions thrown to us via Twitter. So this one comes in from Stat the Obvious, which is, I guess, a play from State the Obvious, but Stat the Obvious says, look, Kerry Price and Carter Hart are struggling right now.

If you guys are the general manager of Team Canada and the Olympic Games are starting tomorrow, who is your goalie for Team Canada to open up the Olympic Games? So that's a great question from Stat the obvious. Now, I'm going to throw something at you here, Haley. Okay, so after I saw this question, I did a little bit of number crunching. Okay. So using, because only this season is a pretty short, you know, sample size, so to speak. So using last season and this season, okay, which Canadian-born goalie do you think has the best save percentage in the last two seasons?

Okay. If you had to guess, who would it be? If you take a wild stab, any guesses? Mark Andre Fleury. Okay. And that's a great guess. Okay. Mark Andre Fleury, 913 save percentage.

And Mark Andre has played 70 games. So that's pretty good. Number one, and now, there's a couple of caveats here. Number one, technically, is Chris Driger, but he's only played 25 games, okay? But if you're talking about a goalie who's played, like a lot of games, like north of 40 games, it's Darcy Kemper at 923.

If you're talking about a goalie that's played north of 50 games, it's Tristan Jari. Like, I'm, I actually think there's a great, listener question because I don't know what I would do. I'm inclined to say Mark Andre Flurry at this stage like at the here and the now I'm inclined to say Mark Andre Flurry. And it's remarkable. But like the goaltending position that used to be the strength of Canada, all of a sudden feels like it might be the weakest link if a best on best tournament started tomorrow, right? Well, especially when you're looking across to the U.S. and they have someone like

Connor Hellebuck who's probably going to be their starting. goaltender. I mean, he's just incredible. And, you know, Sweden has some good net minders. Jacob Markstrom comes to mind. But I wouldn't say that it, I think that if you go in best on best, like, I'm sure that those players, like that's, I don't know, I could see Flurry being the starter still. I, like, Darcy Kemper is playing really well and I think he should be in that conversation. But I don't know if I would say that Tristan Jari is the starting goaltender. I think that we've seen what happens when you doubt Mark Andre Fleury or say someone that can assert him and he just ends up coming back even better. Look what he did after he got taken in expansion

and look what he did. He's doing this season after everyone said Robin Leonard was the starter in Vegas. So maybe it's a little bit of a bias because I grew up watching a player like Mark Andre Fleury. But, you know, I would still, if it started today, I would still stay Flurry. And I think, but I do think Kemper should be in the conversation. You know what they should do? Then if we're smart, we would name Kemper the starter, tell Flurry he's the backup. He'd have a chip on his shoulder,

and then he just takes the job. That seems like maybe what we need to do. Okay, one other mail-by question here, Haley, this one comes in via Twitter from B-Lahl. B-Lall has written to us, says, guys, I got a spicy one for you. Okay? Forget the team around them. Who would you rather build your team around?

Elias Pedersen and Quinn Hughes or Jack Eichel and Ross Mastalien. Wow. Okay. So, Alias Pedersen and Quinn Hughes, so that's your kind of forward defense combo, or Jack Eichael, Rosmastaline, as your forward defense combo.

Who you got, Haley? I think I'm going with Elias Pedersen and Quinn Hughes. And I don't know. you're kind of just staring at me. Well, I'm scared. You don't, you don't sound very, like, convinced. You're like,

well, no, because that's a really good question. Yeah, it's a great question. It's a great question. It's a great question. You can't go wrong with either of them.

No. No, you can't. But Buffalo's like, actually, we kind of did go wrong somehow. Yeah, like I think,

obviously in this exercise, we have the benefit of hindsight. Like, when you just look at, you know, obviously no one's won anything. I mean, no one's won anything in terms of their team.

in terms of their team. But when you look at Elias Pedersen and Quinn Hughes, like I think I like their future upside. I think I like what they've been able to put together in Vancouver very early on in their careers. And I could just see that duo having more success in Vancouver in the long run than Jack Eichel and Rasmus Dahlene have had in Buffalo. So obviously, like, obviously.

But, you know, Again, like we have the benefit of hindsight in this exercise. I don't know if it was blank slate and you're on the draft table and you're saying, do we want Elias Pedersen or Jack Eichl? I don't know what that decision would be because, you know, there's obviously way more recency bias in context to it. But if you're asking me right now, I'm going Elias Pedersen and Quinn Hughes. Man, I think I would go Quinn Hughes and Jack Eichel.

Can I do that? No, you can't do that. But it's, it is a great point. Like we've seen Eichel and Dahlin now for 3 plus C. Like, you know, Rosmus Dahlin has, you know, played this is his third season. And we've seen them in the league. And it's like the Sabres, it's so weird. They can't get any traction.

And they've got the prototypical number one center, the prototypical number one D. And they still can't get it moving. So, and again, it's not like Vancouver is a world beater either. But I would say, I think I would take Eichel in Dahlene, just because I think out of that group of four, I think Eichel's the best player. That's what I think. So I would tend to go with that. I feel like Eichl's the best player.

Quinn Hughes is the next after that, then Aaliyos Pedersen and then Rosmustalin. But I guess I would go with the best player available. So you'd go with one in four over two and three? I know. That doesn't make sense. Now that I say it out loud, but hey, this is what. Bilal said this would be a spicy question.

That was too spicy. It was too. Too spicy for my Monday morning. It's 11 a.m. It's fine. All right. Listen, we'll leave it there, Haley. I hope you have a fantastic week filled with more than four hours sleep on most nights.

Listen, thanks for this. Have a great week. And we'll get you again next Monday. Thank you. I will try to sleep. Maybe I'll take a little nap. There we go. And thanks to everybody for listening to the Athletic Hockey Show.

Please subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. Leave us a rating and review. We would certainly appreciate that. Coming up on Wednesday, Scott Burnside. Pierre LeBrun, they've got the two-man advantage edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. I'll be back in this chair with Down Goes Brown, Sean McIndoo on Thursday.