The Athletic Hockey Show - Connor McDavid hits 100 points, coaching carousel spinning, Toronto Maple Leafs with James Mirtle, Multiple Choice Madness, and more

Episode Date: May 10, 2021

First, Ian and Hailey discuss Connor McDavid’s milestone weekend, hitting the hundred-point plateau against the Canucks, the coaching carousel beginning to spin over the weekend, potential John Tortorella landing spots, Stanley Cup Final Four predictions, fallen ice cubes, and more.Then, The Athletic’s James Mirtle joins the show to talk about the North Division champion Toronto Maple Leafs, who will be in goal when the playoffs begin next week, if Auston Matthews is already on the Leafs’ Mt. Rushmore or not, what the roster could look like next season, and much more.Plus, to close things out, Ian and Hailey run through a series of Multiple Choice Madness questions.And, don’t forget, you can sign up for an annual subscription to The Athletic for just $3.99 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hey, everybody. Welcome back. It's another edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. Ian Mendez, Haley Salvean with you. On this edition of the podcast, we're going to discuss Connemick David's 100-point season. And if there should be an asterisk or not, next to the century mark for number 97. The coaching carousel was set into motion over the weekend. We'll talk about the new openings in Arizona and Columbus and discuss maybe where John Tororella will end up next. And we'll make our bold or not so bold predictions. We're going to pick our final four teams left standing in the NHL with the playoffs just around the corner. Speaking of the final four, I think that's the expectation around the Toronto Maple Leafs.

And as such, James Myrtle will drop by for a visit looking at the North Division champs heading into the postseason. We'll do some multiple choice madness as well, asking if Mike Sullivan deserves some Jack Adams love and if Wayne Gretzky will actually be a good studio analyst for NHL broadcast. But as we kick off the show Haley, I almost feel like the last couple of shows,

it's almost like we should have, and I feel like there's a pun to be had there with like, what's ailing Haley or Ails with Hales or something like that. So you have been taken down by a broken toe, a potential concussion, a smoke detector that wouldn't stop. What's Ail?

You know, again, it's the old what's ails with hails or something like that? What's going on with you today? Is it all good? Well, I feel like it's something that we should have done, like, sponsored content. This is, like, the perfect opportunity. With a pain reliever. Yeah.

Yeah. Tylenol, Aleve, you know, Tiger Bomb, some kind of insert sponsor here, injury report. But it's just specifically my injury report. Because you've been fine. I'm the one that comes in. broken on Monday mornings. But I'm fine this week. I mean, I don't want to jinx anything,

but we are all good. Health-wise, like I have no injuries to report, which is a new thing for me on a Monday morning. Okay, well, this is good. You did a great job kind of powering through, not 100% of the last couple of weeks. So we're raising the bar for you this week.

And if your smoke detector does go off this week, it's because you've got some scorching hot takes, and that's the reason why the alarm's going off. Okay. So this kind of balances it out. How corny am I saying fire and ice? But I do have a serious adulting question for you before we start. Yes.

Because I asked our producer before we started recording. And we both kind of agreed on what your answer would probably be. Oh, here we go. Because I was filling up my big water with some ice and I dropped a couple of ice cubes on the floor. do you a multiple choice madness to start the show today and listeners tell us on Twitter as well because you know this is one of the things that is big on if you're an adult or you're still a child when you drop an ice cube out of the freezer because you're getting ice do you pick up the ice cube or do you just kick it somewhere and forget about it kick it somewhere so you pick it up

so you pick it up and put it in the sink like a reasonable adult I do, and I think partially it's because we have kids. We have a couple of teenagers, right? So I feel like it's setting a bad example if I'm just kicking ice cubes all over the place, right? I kick it under the fridge. What, you do? Is there going to be like moldy under there? Maybe.

I don't know. Maybe. I do. Like, if I spill some water, I will just like, I'll use my sock to clean up the water. If it's water, but if it's like something sticky. But it's an ice cube, it's going to be. water. Yeah, if it's an ice cube, yeah, I'll pick it up and, and put it in the sink. If it's multiple ice cubes, like I just dropped like half a tray, I will pick them up.

But if it's like one piece of an ice cube that falls, I just kick it somewhere and then I step in it later. If it's not under the fridge, it's near my desk and I'm like, oh, my foot's wet. And then, you know, it's a problem for an hour or so later, Haley, to deal with. Okay. Well, you know, we're going to have a whole I would read that you would be the one to pick up an ice cube that you dropped on the floor. Oh, for sure. But at least you live, like you usually are by yourself. Yeah, thank you for reminding me. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

I just wanted to subtly just twist that knife. Yeah, I'm calling you a spinster. I'm a child. I live by myself, et cetera. I'm always hurt, yeah. At least you don't, like, I have people I can blame for when I open the freezer and the ice cube tray is empty. And it hasn't been refilled. That drives me bananas.

That's a big dad angry thing. Yeah. That and where's the remote? Where's the remote? Yeah. The ice cube tray. My dad always gets mad about that. But he also doesn't really like when my mom makes the ice because he thinks she's bad at it.

It's like, like you can't win, right? Because it's like, oh, the ice is empty. But like, Kim, you made the ice bad again. Like, I don't know how you make bad ice. Is it just not feeling the tray, like the tray to the top? I don't know. It's just an extreme dad thing. the thermostat, the ice cube tray.

And remote controls. Where's the remote control? Because there's a spot. There's like a dad spot for the remotes. And it's usually right beside their seat on the couch or their recliner, whatever it is. Yeah. No, exactly. Hey, on the couch and the recliner, I think that's where a lot of us were, Haley, Saturday night,

settling in for the Connor McDavid show. And it's funny because he went into that game four point shy of 100. and I think a lot of us thought, you know, he could get it tonight. And he sure did. And it felt like a lot of the hockey world was sitting down watching that game, which really didn't mean a ton in the standings, but there was a sense of history. I know it was easier for you.

You're in that time zone to kind of watch that unfold. But what was your excitement level when you saw Connor McDavid setting up Leon Drysidal? They get McDavid to 100 points on Saturday. Yeah, I thought, I mean, obviously being on. mountain time is great because it's not staying up late for me for these kind of games. And as someone who just lives alone and sits at home and watches hockey all the time, it's pretty perfect time zone. But, you know, I thought it was, I thought it was great. I thought, you know, just the fact that, and I know I'm taking it back a little bit, not just on the game, but I think it was, it's kind of

crazy how we went from, can he do it? And thinking, like, is, you. Is this actually possible? And then at some point this season, we all just switched to, yeah, he's going to do it. It's just a matter of when. Like, when did we all just know that he was going to hit 100 points this season? The fact that he did it in 53 games, you know, I don't know if I would say I'm excited because I do live in Calgary. And I think I even tweeted, like, for legal reasons, this is a joke. I'm not actually happy about this.

Please don't unsubscribe. But no, I think it's incredible. I think it's to do that in and of itself, let alone in this kind of era of hockey where, you know, scoring has been, or point generation has been somewhat down. You know, to do that this season, I just thought it was so impressive.

I thought the excitement of his teammates was great. You know, you could just tell how genuinely happy, Connor was, how happy his teammates were for him. You could tell that it was just a meaningful milestone. Players are never going to say in an interview, like, yeah, I'm really hoping to get this. Or, you know, people ask Austin Matthews all the time. Do you want to hit 50 goals? Or do you want to win the Rocket Richard? And he's never going to say, yeah, that's a priority of mine. But it's those moments when it actually happens and they reach that milestone that you can see how genuinely excited they are. And, you know, I thought it was, I thought it was great for the game, you know,

Twitter was all about it. Everyone was talking about it. Even the people who were saying, like, this is the Mickey Mouse division or people saying put an asterisk next to it. But, like, people were talking about it. And there was a lot of genuine excitement for Connor McDavid among the fan base. And I think regardless of what team you cheer for, you've got to just be able to watch that team and enjoy it sometimes.

Well, it's interesting you bring up the asterisk idea because I think they're, like, yeah, But hockey fan came out this weekend, right? Yeah, but. Yeah, but he played against the North Division. Yeah, but he had, you know, nine games against Ottawa. Yeah, but, yeah, but fan came out big time. Okay. And here's what I want to bring up to you, Haley, is if you're going to yeah, but

Connor McDavid, I think you should be yeah-butting Wayne Gretzky. Okay? So I went back and I looked at Wayne Gretzky's magical, memorable, 1985, 86 season in which Gretzky set the record for points in his season. Okay. So Wayne had 215 points in a single season. Haley, surprise trivia question for you, okay? In that season, Wayne Gretzky played 32 games within his own division.

Okay. So eight times he played Vancouver, eight times he played Winnipeg, eight times Los Angeles, eight times Calgary. Okay. So four teams in the smite, eight times each, 32 games. How many points do Wayne Gretzky get within his own division in his record-breaking season. Like what's your, what's your guess for Gradsky? 32 games. Uh, 90 points?

Yeah, so you're, you're not far off at all. Ninety eight points. Oh my God. 98 points in 32 games against his own division. He played Calgary eight times, Vancouver eight times, Winnipeg eight times, L.A. A. time. So to the yeah-butt fan who's yeah-butting Connor McDavid. Okay, you want a yeah, but go ahead. But then go ahead and yeah but Wayne Gradsky. Your butt actuallying.

Yeah, actual. Oh, yeah. Well, well actually also works very well as well. So I think it's really important that, like I think we don't do a very good job in hockey of celebrating our stars. I think we do too much to like, yeah, but them. Wow. If he played in this era, well, I don't care. It's hard to compare McDavid to Gordy Howe, to Gretzky, to Lafleur.

They all played in different eras. The only thing you can do, I think, Haley, is judge each player within their era. And when you look at Connor McDavid and you see that he got to 100 points and he has lapped the field, that's the only way we can measure McDavid. And the fact that the discrepancy between McDavid and it, Anybody who doesn't play on his line is, like 30 points, that's what, that's, that's what dominance is. So I just want people to understand, look, I understand. Like, if you want to say that he, he torched the North, okay, fine.

But Gretzky torched his own division back in the day. And I don't know, any, and goalies were playing with tiny equipment. And, you know, so let's, let's just do a better job of being like, wow, this is really cool. And let's, let's celebrate our stars, which is something I don't think we do. And it's not ingrained in hockey culture. Yeah, no, it's super weird. And I think, like, the stats aside, too, like, you just need to watch Connor McDavid. Like, this is the best player in the game right now. Like, watch what he does on the ice. It's incredible. Like, I just, the stats are impressive. You watch him, it's impressive. Like,

you don't, we don't need to nitpick and argue. Like, and I mean, to your point, too, Ian, about the North Division and stuff, you know, look at some of the, like this, it annoys me. And I said this to somebody on Twitter because they said, you know, my first thought about this is the division he's playing against. And I said to him, like, it's not like Connor McDavid wasn't doing this against other teams. Like, this is not his first 100-point season. You know, it's a 100-point season in only 53 games, which makes it even more impressive. But it's not like Connor McDavid was this, like,

nobody who was struggling through the Pacific, who just all of a sudden started playing well because he's in the North Division. Like, this is the game's best player. And if we look at the teams who would typically be in the Pacific Division, I know you're not playing all of your games within your division in a typical season, but Connor McDavid normally would be playing several games against Vancouver, who's currently 29th in the league. We've got the Kings, they're 25th in the league.

These teams are somewhat near the bottom of the league standings right now, below the Ottawa Senators. So we can talk about how McDavid is beating up on the Sends, but the Sends are above about three teams who are typically in the Pacific Division and the NHL standings. So he would have been beating up on them too. And outside of your division, he would be playing against the Buffalo Sabres, the New Jersey Devils, the Columbus Blue Jackets.

Pretty sure he would have been able to beat up on those teams too. So, yeah, I just think it's, let's just be excited that something cool happened in our game instead of arguing about it. Because I'm sure there's maybe people who aren't big hockey fans who are going on Twitter and seeing like, oh, what's trending today? and then you look at the infighting and you're like, eh, never mind. You know what I wish? Like, and it's,

uh, it's like before my time, like I'd love to go back. And if we have older hockey fans, I'd love to hear from me on this one. Were there people who were like crapping on Bobby Orr back in the day that, that were people like saying like, you know,

that's not the way to play defense or so? Like, you know, is that just ingrained in hockey culture that we just, we don't love, just, we don't celebrate the raw athleticism. and dynamic players and offensive stars,

like the way that we should. Like, I'd love to know. Like, were people rating on Bobby Orr's parade back in the day? Or did they just say, you know what? Not on social media. We're witnessing something really cool. And this is great. I'd love to know.

So if you're old enough to remember Bobby Orr, you know, hit us up, you know, via email, the athletic hockey show at gmail.com. Send us a tweet. Some feedback there. I'd love to hear about that. So on the weekend, Haley, McDavid gets to 100 points, but the coaching carousel has started to spin as teams

start to wrap up their season. And let's start in Columbus, John Tonorella and the Columbus Blue Jackets are going their separate ways. Do you believe in the idea, Haley, of mutual termination? Like, and I guess this goes for like, you know, you hear when people break up and they're like, ah, it was a mutual decision. Is it really ever truly a mutual decision? Can you mutually, what's your conscious uncoupling?

Is that the term that was used? Yeah, Guineath-Paul-Tro. Yeah. So, like, is that possible? Is there, is conscious uncoupling a thing that can happen in the NHL? I mean, I think so, honestly. I know that's probably not the, you know, I'm sure a lot of people probably think that it was Columbus who initiated this and Tortorella maybe agreed.

But, you know, I think a lot of us could probably see this coming, you know, a conscious uncoupling or a breakup between these two sides. It's been six years that he's been in Columbus. This year there's been, and I mean, not even this year, there's been a lot of players who've left. Even this season, there's been, you know, quite a bit of drama, you know, at least on the outside, probably on the inside too, you know, Pierre-Luc de Bois, you know, fans, people watching, asking about the benching, then the trade request, then, you know, you get line A and then he starts getting benched and the team's not very good. They're, you know, the bottom of the standings. I think they're 27th in the league. So they're bottom five in the NHL after, you know, making a

decent little run in the playoffs last year. So I don't know. I think this was probably a disappointing year. I think that this probably just got to a point where both teams just, I mean, both parties just needed something different. Like, I'm sure that John Tortorella was seeing the discourse around him in Columbus and in the league and was like, I don't want to do this anymore. Like, I'm sure after six years of being told that you're the bad guy or whatever it may be, like, I'm sure he's someone who probably just needed a fresh room. Like, I think he's probably a coach that burns some players out. But I'm sure there's also a side of it to him where it's like, I lost the room. And I think he's probably intelligent enough to know that. And it seems from,

you know, Aaron Portsyne's reporting. you know, it's a different one because I don't know if it was John Tortorella who went to them and said like this should be it or if it was the, if it was, you know, the general manager who said this should be it. So I guess it's a roundabout way of saying, I don't know if that's possible. But I, you know, is it, can we say that it's a mutual decision if one party initiated the conversation and the other one said yes? But that's how, like, like in a couple that breaks up.

there's always that text that we need to talk. Yeah. Right? So is that person the one who initiated? Or is it truly, you know what? Both people know. It's just at some point somebody's got to have the conversation. And I mean, look, in the case of Totorella, his contract was up.

So the conversation was coming at some point. So this one does feel like, you know what, there might have been a mutual feeling of, look, your contract's done. It's just it's best that we move on. But Haley, you start to look around the league, and there's some other interesting openings. Obviously, Rick Tocke is out in Arizona. So as we sit here recording this podcast today on the 10th of May, there's an opening in Arizona. There's an opening in Columbus.

There's an opening in Seattle. We sometimes forget about that. So the Cracken, there's three jobs. Then start to look around the league. Travis Green's contract is up in Vancouver. What's going to happen there? Jeff Blaschell is up in Detroit. There's a lot of Red Wings fans who listen to us who would say,

they're ready for a change. Dominic Dusharme is on an interim deal in Montreal. Doni Granato's on an interim deal in Buffalo. So I would think in the next week or so, we're going to start to maybe see a couple of other seats open up. And, you know, we've had people write into us. We got a tweet here from Steve who said, guys, where do you think Tororella is going to end up next year?

And I think this is a really interesting question, Haley. I think five years ago, or six years ago, when John Tonorella went to Columbus, I think a lot of us were surprised. We thought that that guy was done. Remember his tenure in Vancouver ended so poorly. We thought John Tortorella couldn't connect with young people anymore. It's done.

But he went to Columbus and he proved that tough love can work. So when you see a team like the New York Rangers put out a statement like they had last week, Haley talking about we need to basically be a little like, you know, tougher because they got rid of the general manager, the president of hockey operations in John Davidson, do you think there's any chance we get a, sequel on Broadway of John Tortorella. Would that fit for you? After you listed all the other coaches that are available, I don't know.

I think it's a fair question to ask. I think it'll be good fodder for the fan bases, for radio podcast, you know, for writers to look into and speculate on. I think, as you said, he showed that he could connect with the younger player. and I think the New York Rangers, they've had this kind of internal debate or discussion about lack of toughness. But, you know, just because you have a tough love coach, does that automatically mean that your team is going to start being tougher, at least in a physical way, in a way that they're

going to, you know, step up and defend their teammates in the way that, you know, people talk about in the typical hockey terms? So I don't know. I do think that, you know, there might be better options that fit the New York Rangers better because I think, you know, there's still Bruce Boudreau who's at home. You still have Gerard Gallant at home, but you also have Seattle who's looking to hire a coach. Like, I don't know if, you know, he is the, John Tortorella is the number one option for the New York Rangers, because as you said, there could be a really huge coaching carousel this summer.

And as we know, you know, a lot of these teams, they hire similar people. You know, we call it the carousel for a reason. These guys aren't retiring. These guys aren't quitting to just never be heard from again. They're probably going to get an NHL coaching job because such is the way, I say with my baby Yoda mug. I don't know if you've even seen the Mandalorian that just went right over your head, didn't it? It did, but at least you acknowledge that my laugh was like a fake.

Yeah, that was the fakes laugh I've ever seen on Zoom. Thank you. Good one. But yeah, no, to answer your question, I really don't know. I'm curious what, like, do you think he's a fit in New York? Or do you think that there's something better? No, you know, I think he is. I really do.

I think he's a fit. Like you go back to when Toritz was coaching that team 10 years ago and, you know, he had guys like Dan Girardi going all. in on blocking shots and everything. Like that's the kind of hockey that can work, although that Rangers, the makeup of that team is totally different, right? They're a pretty skilled team when you look at Panarin,

Zabanajad, Lafranier, like that's a pretty skilled team. I just wonder about that. But I think from a personality standpoint and a demanding accountability standpoint, like if that's what the Rangers, if that's what James Dolan feels like is lacking within that organization right now,

that's the guy that can bring it in. But this is going to be really interesting, Haley, because there's three openings now. Let's conservatively say there'll be another two to three. So that's about five or six jobs that could be open here in the National Hockey League. And then here we go with the coaching carousel. So it becomes really interesting to me. And not to mention there could be some coaches that maybe they lose their job if they get a quick bounce from the playoffs too, right?

Like who knows how this all plays out. but to me, John Torrell is interesting. And, Rick, Arizona is a weird one for me, too, because there was a stretch where they were playing well. Remember they were kind of in a playoff spot and they were at St. Louis? I don't know. Like, Rick Tocke's a weird one, too. Like, he's had a couple of stints, Tampa, now Arizona.

And I see everyone saying, oh, Rick Tocke's going to have options. But I don't know. Like, I guess he's a good coach. But I guess to me, I look at Rick Tockett's numbers and his career record. I don't see a successful coach, but I feel like he might be one of those guys that's a better assistant than he is a head coach. Yeah, I don't know, because I think you hear from players often about, you know, how much they like Rick Tockeet.

You obviously hear from other media people who, who are, you know, friendly or they know him well and they speak really highly of Rick Tockeet. So, you know, obviously the coach has a major role in the systems, but, you know, he hasn't exactly been handed the best hand. in Arizona. So I can't imagine that's an easy place to rack up a good coaching record. So I don't know, I think Rick Tocket might be one of the ones where, you know, he'll get a head coaching job because of his reputation and because he's well liked by a lot of people. At least that's what it seems like to me. I haven't really seen many people come out and say anything negative about Rick Tockett.

I've heard, you know, a lot of good things about him. So I think that's probably one of those situations where he's got a good reputation. He's well-liked and he'll probably get a shot, even though, you know, his numbers maybe don't necessarily stack up against some of the other options who are out there. But, you know, there's only going to be so many spots. We know that. It's not like every team is going to be hiring a new coach. So, you know, maybe if you stack him up next to a John Torturella or, you know,

a, you know, Bruce Boudreau, Gerard Gallant. You know, again, there's a ton of guys sitting at home right now or who could potentially be sitting at home, who could be losing their job soon. So, you know, maybe the reputation doesn't quite stack up against some of these other guys. So I think we'll have to wait and see on that one for sure. All right, Haley, as we're just talking about here,

like the coaching carousel, it's going to be spinning kind of as the regular season comes to a halt for different teams at different times. And it also means that the playoffs are around the corner. And in fact, we're led to believe that the Stanley Cup playoffs are going to start for the American teams as early as Saturday or Sunday of this week. So, Haley, knowing that the next time we get together for this podcast next week, that the playoffs are actually already going to be underway, I thought, well, we can't wait another week and start doing our playoff predictions. We've got to lean into them now. So we're not going to do our full bracket here because obviously we don't know exactly all of the matchups and how it's going to all shake down.

But I'm going to go through. We're going to just pick our final four teams. Okay. And we're going to see which one of us at the end of all of this in about, you know, six weeks from now or so, who is more accurate in selecting their final four? Okay. On top of our bracket that we're going to do. Correct? On top of the bracket.

Is the final four that we pick now? Do we have to make it the final four of our bracket? Like what if I change my mind? How would you change your mind within 48 hours? You don't know that. The flames are still in it. Listen. Big changes coming in.

Pick your final four. And okay, we're going to start in arguably the toughest division to solve, which is the East Division, right? And that's got the Pittsburgh Penguins, the Washington Capitals, Bruins and the New York Islanders. So Haley Selvian, who's coming out of that division when it's all said and done? And the first two rounds of the playoffs are done.

I'm going to kind of be lame and I'm going to say Pittsburgh. Is that controversial? I don't know. They clinched first in that division. They won three straight. I don't know. Jeff Carter's looked pretty good. Yeah, I'm going to say Pittsburgh.

What about you? I'm going to go a little bit off the board here. Okay. New York Islanders. Do you think they're going to upset in the first round? Barry Trots, like if you're asking me, I got to choose between Barry Trots and then, like, he just has a way.

I know the Islanders have had some ups and downs in the back half of the season. Like, I get that. There's something about Barry Trots in the Stanley Cup playoffs that he just, it gets it done. I got to take the Islanders. I don't. I don't disagree. I think Pittsburgh is obviously having a great back half of the season.

But give me the Islanders. It never ends up just always being the top seed, right? In every division, there's upset. So I'm going big on the upset here, Haley. Give me the Islanders to come out of the, what's it called the Mass Mutual East? Yeah, the Mass. Chaos.

Mass Chaos East Division. Give me the Islanders. I mean, okay. I mean, it's interesting because both teams have very, closely identical home records. So I think it's going to like both teams have only lost four games and regulation at home all season. So it's going to be interesting to see how that plays out.

Like it's going to be all about someone stealing one on the road, I think. Yeah. But we've got a, we've got an immediate matchup right off the top. So this is going to make it very interesting. There we go. Winning.

So. Okay. Don't let me down. Okay. Here we go. Crosby. Well, that was your team as a kid too, right? Like when you were growing up,

Don't out me. But you've said it before. Yeah, I know. That was, no, I completely copped out. Yeah, that was my like, my childhood team, don't let me down.

Yeah. Everyone's going to make fun of me. Thanks, Ian. Yeah, not for the ice cubes, but for that. Okay. Next, next division that we're going to go to, the hotly contested central division.

So that's the one, the Carolina Hurricane, still jockeying for the president's trophy. We do know that we've got an all-flora matchup locked in, the Panthers and the Lightning, and then the Nashville Predators are going to be in there as well, facing off against Carolina. So Haley-Salve, and again, I will defer to you.

I'm going to give you home ice. You get to pick first. I already have my team written down on a piece of paper. Who's coming out of this central division? Honestly, I'm bad at you go first. Oh, she is, she's, Wait, but if you pick my team, then it's going to seem like I'm copying you. Okay, but it's like you're a team that has won the toss in the pregame, in the football.

You have deferred to me. I will receive the ball first. Haley, the Florida Panthers are coming out. No, that's what I was going to say. The Panthers are coming out. You know why? Because nobody's picking them. Because everyone is all in that Tampa is the defending Southern Cup champion.

And did you know that Rod Brindamor is, this and that. Okay, I get it. Yeah. Give me Florida. I think, I think Alex Barcoff. They're playing really well. I think Alex Barkoff might be the best player in that division. And when he's going, Hubertow's dynamic two.

I don't know if you've known this, but Sam Bennett's actually played well. I'm probably breaking news team. Who is that guy? Who had he come from? Give me the Panthers. And you know why? It's the cue factor. Joel Quenville.

So give me, give me Florida to surprise everybody. They're going to come out of there, even though they're probably, well, they could be the two seat, but they could be the three seat. Are we allowed to have the same team? Sure. Legitimately was going to save Florida,

but I didn't, I just didn't know if that was a hot take. But it shouldn't be. They are currently second in the central. They are, you know, only three. I mean, it's over now, but they finished, you know, three points back of Carolina for first in that division.

They finished with five straight wins, eight and two in their last 10. I mean, they've got two really solid. solid lines. And I mean, they look great that I watched. So as many know, Sam Bennett did come from the Calgary Flames. And I watched every, I watched a bunch of his shifts. I watched a bunch of those games. And I went back and I clipped every single shift that Sam Bennett had a point on. And Jonathan Huberto is seriously impressive. And I knew this before, you know, but obviously this

season, it's difficult to just watch a bunch of Florida Panthers games. But, you know, Huberto with Duke Claire and Bennett, that's a great line. And, you know, that's their second line. They've got the Q factor. So, you know, I know it's the Cains. I know it's Rod Brindamore. I know it's the defending cup champions. I also think that Nashville could be a sleeper up.

Like, I don't know. Is that crazy to say that I think that Nashville Carolina series could actually be pretty competitive. It's going to be a good series. Yeah. I mean, it's either to be good or it's going to be really bad. Like there's no in between. Yeah.

Ucissaros has been so good. He could be the great equalizer, right? Yeah. And I think it's not spoken about, like, I know Ryan Johansson had a really bad, like, bad season for his standards, but he had a really good play in. Like, he was pretty good in the return to play in the bubble. So maybe we could see these guys who've been underperforming in the regular season up the ante in the playoffs.

So we'll see. But I think we both agree that we would, I think it's more that I am trying to project the Panthers getting to the final four, you know? Like, I don't know if it's going to happen, but I'm saying, please. Will it? Will it be into existence? Okay. Yeah, we're manifesting.

To the West Division we go, Haley. And this one, Minnesota has been a great surprise team this year. They've been really fun. Colorado is in there. You've got the St. Louis Blues in there. And, of course, the Vegas Golden Knights. So we'll let you go first this time. Unless you're going to defer the coin toss again.

No. I think I've made at this point in previous. episodes, but I'm going with Colorado. I think that's a team. You know, it's a, it's a really strong team. You don't really have to say much about Nathan McKinnon and Kail McCar. I think, you know, last year, the goalie controversy, it's not even a really goalie controversy, excuse me, but, you know, they had several injuries to their goaltenders and they ended up in game seven with Mike Hutchinson and Nett, and they lost to, you know, the Dallas Stars who went on to the Stanley Cup final. I think this is a team who is looking to make a comeback.

You know, I don't think they liked the way that they went out. I think they thought that they could have won the cup or made it to the finals last year. So I think, you know, I know that Vegas is a great team, but I'm going with Colorado. Yeah. And this to me, it's a complete flip of the coin. I think Vegas and Colorado might be, I mean, you can make an argument. They might be the two best teams in hockey. And they happen to be in the same division.

And this is kind of like we've seen Tampa and Boston in the same division in years past. This is just two super heavy. weights in the same division. So I'm going to take Vegas. I like the fact that they've got two potential goalies that can get them over the hump, whether it's flower, whether it's Lennar. I think Patcheretti's had a really good season there for Vegas. I just, I like the makeup of that team. And I think that

Shea Theodore, too, is this kind of underrated, at least outside of that market. I don't know that people quite realize how good Shea Theodore is. And obviously got Mark Stone leading the way. I think that's a team that felt like they've underachieved, believe it or not, in the last couple of post seasons. I like Vegas, so give me Vegas to come out of that. And just before we bring James Myrtle into the show, why not finish off by talking about the North Division, Haley?

So we've got to pretty much the four-team set. I mean, there is a tiny chance, sliver of a chance. Notice how high my voice is going when I'm saying it, but the Calgary Flames could sneak in, the Montreal Canadians could miss, but it's probably going to be Montreal, Winnipeg, Edmonton, Toronto. Let's go, Haley.

Give us your North Division winner after two rounds. Yeah, I don't think it should be a controversial take or anything crazy, but I think what we've seen from the Leafs this season, you know, obviously they haven't won a playoff round, so it is hard to say they're going to be in the final four are their contender, but I just think that if they can continue to play the way that they have throughout the season, I don't think, you know, the Leaf, I don't think there's a question that

the Leafs team we've seen this year as a Final Four team. It's, but it's going to be about putting that into the playoffs and actually executing in the postseason, which we haven't seen them do before. Like I am saying this very clearly, so people don't get all cranky and yell about it. But I, I'm saying Toronto. I haven't seen anything from them in this regular season. season that would indicate to me that this is not a final four team. Oh boy. So if I, the problem is, if I pick Toronto, then half of our picks are the same. So I'm going to go a little bit differently here, Haley.

I give me the Winnipeg Jets. I think the Winnipeg Jets are going to be the team that comes out. Like, I'll be honest with you. I probably would lean Toronto. But I think Edmonton, they're so top heavy. And I talked about this with Sean McAddo on our podcast a couple of weeks ago. The most impressive individual regular seasons in NHL, history have always ended in huge heartbreak.

Like, no player that's ever had a statistically amazing season, like their best season, Wayne Gretzky's 92 goal year, they get bounced in the first round. Gretzky's 215 point season, Steve Smith scores in his own net. Mario Lemieux's amazing season coming back from cancer, David Volick beats him in overtime. Bobby Orr sets a record for points by a defenseman. They get shocked by Ken Dryden. So I'm just saying, I'm going to use that and think, I just don't know. I don't know that Edmonton's going to get out of there.

But give me Winnipeg, Haley, Winnipeg's going to come out of the north. All right, Haley, for this week's guest, I guess, do we have to be at our best behavior? Because, I mean, technically, he is the, what, senior managing editor of the NHL group in the NHL division with the athletic. So Haley, this is our boss that we're bringing in. We have to laugh at all of his jokes. Yeah, all of the dad jokes. But you know that I'm all in on.

on James Myrtle's dad jokes. Again, senior managing editor with the athletic columnist, writes about the Toronto Maple Leafs, host of The Leaf Report podcast. But maybe most importantly, Haley, a fellow dad, like I said, fellow dad. So let's ask James My question. My question?

Yeah. Okay, you ask it. I want you to ask Merle the question the way you ask me. People listening to the show are probably going to think, like, this girl needs to stop. This isn't good content. But I am very curious because before the show started, I was filling up my water. I dropped a few ice cubes on the floor.

If you are getting ice and you drop them on the floor in your kitchen, do you pick up the ice cubes or do you just kick them somewhere and deal with it later? No, I'm way too anal. I pick them up. They go in the sink immediately, immediately, yeah. If it's like one ice cube, you don't just kick it under the fridge or kick it somewhere. No, no, no. So you're voted out, Haley, two to one.

Two to one for, but it could be maybe it's just a dad thing. Maybe this is what we do. I'm going to have to start a poll on Twitter or something. You do as a dad, you get very used to just like picking up random things all the time. And like, I don't know. You can see why you're, I don't know, you can, you just start turning into your parents. So you never thought you would. And it just, it just becomes part of your identity at some point.

I did have that moment. I was at Home Sense and I wanted to buy this little patio set. It was a decent price, but the chair was a little wobbly. And I was like, excuse me, this chair's damaged. Is there a markdown? And I was like, oh, my God, I turned into my mother. I don't know when this happened, but I am that embarrassing mom. Like, every mom does that and the kid just gets mortified.

Mom's asking for a discount again. Everyone does that, right? Did you get the discount more important? I did. Yeah. Because the chair is very wobbly in my defense. Like I wasn't being that out of line. It was very damaged. But yeah, I turned into my mom very fast.

Okay. Well, this is good. I'm glad we can turn this into a podcast slash therapy session as we move along. But listen, we didn't bring James Myrtle in to chat about our personal lives. We want to know about the North Division champion Toronto Maple Leafs heading into the postseason. I think, you know, James, I think for me, the biggest question I have about the Leafs is, I'd like you to fast forward like two weeks in advance, three weeks in advance. Who's in the blue paint for the Toronto Maple Leafs? Who do you see being the goaltender

for these team when the playoffs are often running here in the North Division? Well, the goalie controversy is dead. I mean, it's actually become really, really easy for the Leafs to decide who's going to play a net because Jack Campbell's been, other than a blip there of three or four games, he's been fantastic. His record speaks for itself. His numbers speak for themselves. He's at a 924, say, percentage. He's been really, really solid.

So I don't, there's no debate. I mean, the only other option is Frederick Anderson, who has only played a game and a half with the Marley's in the last two months and hasn't played very well and has been hurt a lot of the year. So Jack Campbell's going to get the crease. And, you know, it's, I think it's going to take him having more than one poor performance for him to lose a hold. on the crease.

And I'm interested to see what the schedule looks like, guys, because if there are a lot of back-to-back games in the playoffs, then potentially you might get in a situation where you're going to need to play two goaltenders. Because other than that, I think Jack Campbell's going to get the bulk of the starts with the leaves. Where does Freddie Anderson stand? We saw him play one American League game with the Marley's shootout loss.

I think he led in round four goals. Where's the confidence and, you know, I guess, or the level of concern. with Freddie Anderson with the leaves. I would say confidence is fairly low. He wasn't having a good season. He was playing through that knee injury before he shut it down in March.

He didn't have a great year last year. This is not kind of, this isn't a short-term injury-related issue with Frederick Anderson at this point. I mean, he's struggled now for a year and a half. And Jack Campbell's just flat-out out played him ever since they acquired them last year. So, you know, there's just not really a debate right now at this point.

It's going to take Jack Campbell being really, really bad for Anderson to get into the net. Or, like I said, for there to be a back-to-back situation, and the Leafs deciding that they do want to play Anderson there. And the Leafs have two regular season games left, and I think Anderson's probably going to play one of those games. Maybe he can change a conversation a little bit, but I doubt it. So as you look at this, I think most people feel like, James, it's this is the year for Toronto to get to the final four, right?

You think about the Tampa and the Boston hurdles the last few years. This year, I'm not going to say they're the overwhelming or definitive or prohibitive favorite, but it does feel like their odds are as good as they've ever been. And so I ask you this in the context of what's the easiest path for them? Out of this, like, or is there one team that you look at, James, out of these? And we'll include Calgary in the mix because technically, you know, they've got a faint pulse of a of a playoff life. still beaten there.

But as you look at Montreal, Edmonton, and Winnipeg, is there one team out of there? You're like, you know, it'd be ideal if Toronto never saw them in the first two rounds. Honestly, no. There's not, no.

I think that the Leafs feel pretty confident against all three of those teams. You know, and Edmonton's the best of the group, but Toronto's record against Edmonton this year is spectacular. They're six, one, and two. They've outscored them 20 to six in the last five meetings. The Leafs have owned the Oilers. this season. And even going back to last year, they played Edmonton really, really well. And for whatever

reason, the Leafs Blue Line has had a lot of success shutting down Connor McDavid. They're, you know, they're one of the only teams in the Canada Division that can say that this year. And, you know, so I think if the Leaf's path is Montreal, then Edmonton or Winnipeg than Edmonton, they're totally fine with that. And, you know, I'm fine calling them the favorite and saying they should make it to the final four because they should. You know, the season that they've had, you know, some people are trying to cut it down because of the division that they're in. But, you know, this is the best Leafs team we've seen since the Pat Quinn era, you know, going back 20 years. There's a reason why they won the division. And, you know, the only pressure on them is going to be

to deliver on what they should deliver on and deliver on their talent level to win these first two series. So, Myrtle, one of the things that Ian and I were talking about before you came on was if Connor McDavid's season was watered down because of the North Division, are you seeing some Similar arguments about Austin Matthews goal scoring pace because he's only shooting against North Division goalies or the North Division's the worst division. Where do you stand on that? Yeah. I mean, it's on Twitter these days, if you tweet anything positive about the Leafs or Sheldon Keefe or Mitch Marner or Austin Matthews or Carlton Mabere, anything. The response back is always, well, they're in that division.

And the funny thing is a lot of times it's fans from other Canadian teams. It's like, well, your team's in that division too. So, you know, you're saying your team is really bad because you want to make the Leafs not look as good as their record currently does. It's, you know, I like the piece that Dom did earlier in the year that looked at division strength. And, you know, he said, you know, the North Division's not that bad. I don't think the North Division is fantastic.

It lacks a lot of really high-end teams other than the Leafs. But I don't think, you know, you look at the West Division, and you look at the teams in California and how weak they are. You look at the division, you know, there's division. You got Detroit, you got Buffalo. There's bad teams in every division. And that's the case every year. And I saw someone on social media made the good point the other day that, you know,

we don't go back and look at the seasons that players had against, you know, the expansion Ottawa senators or the expansion Washington Capitals. And some of the, you know, remember the Washington Capitals, you know, their first year, they, what did they allow, 400 and some goals? You know, no one's going back and looking at, you know, Esposito season then and saying, oh, you know, those goals and those points don't count. I kind of feel the same way about what Connor McDavid and Austin Matthews are doing. All they can do is play the games against the teams that are in front of them.

And, you know, some people have made the point, too, that these guys are playing against the same teams over and over and over again. Shouldn't the goalies and shouldn't the defensemen and shouldn't the coaches be able to scout them and shut them down if they're playing them over and over again? If you're a goaltender, can't you just watch McDavid and Matthews and find a way? feels like that would be easier than if they're just one of 30 opponents that you're playing throughout the year. Yeah, and Haley and I brought this up on the show. I said, look, look at Gretzky's record-breaking season in 85-86. He had 98 points, James, 98 points in his own division. Eight games against Vancouver, eight against the Kings, eight against the flames, eight against the Jets.

So he's playing the same team eight times back in the day. 98 points in 32 games. Do you, like, I mean, my whole point is if you're going to yeah but McDavid's hundred points and yeah, but Matthews 40 goals, then go back and make sure you're doing the same thing on Gretzky in 85 and 6. And who were those goalies? I grew up in BC. I'm well aware of the 80s history of the Canucks and it is not good.

It is, you know, they were the Patsy to the Oilers and the flames those years. So I'm sure they were beating up. on bottom feeder. He was beating up on bottom feeders throughout some of those years. You know, I want to ask you too about because, again, McDavid's had a great year. Matthews has had a wonderful year with 40 plus goals. And I've seen people start to talk about already, even at his young age, Austin Matthews kind of place in Leafs lore and where he, where he ranks. So I'm going to ask you the question this way, okay? If we gave you some sort of empty space in the GTA, which I know doesn't exist, but if there

was a spot and we could James Myrtle could create his Toronto Maple Leafs Mount Rushmore. Is Austin Matthews on it already? Yeah, I think so. You know, I think the two things that are going to cement his legacy are going to be playoff success and whether or not he resigns and spends the majority of his career in Toronto or not. Those are going to be the two big things. I mean, I think that he's on the trajectory now where he could. can become the all-time leading goal score for the Maple Leafs franchise by the time he's 27 years old. He can pass Matt Sundin for a lot of the franchise records for the Leaves

before he's 30 years old. So if he resigns when his contract's up in a few years and if the Leifes have any kind of playoff success, not even necessarily win a Stanley Cup, you know, if they're a team that has some deep playoff runs, absolutely he's going to be on that, on that Mount Rushmore. Who's on your Rushmore right now? Wendell is probably on there, right? Well, the tough thing with the Leafs is you've got 103 years of history you're looking back on, right? So if I put Wendell on there, am I leaving off Teter Kennedy? Am I leaving off, you know, Dave Kionn, Johnny Bauer? Like, there's, that's why.

Ian's just trying to sewer you. That's why they've got, like, if you look at statistically, no, Wendell's not on the list. Like, you know, we've done lists before historical lists with the Leaves, and you rank the top, you know, 10, top 12, top 15 former Leafs. And Wendell's not there statistically. He's someone that people remember really fondly as being the best player on some really bad Leafs teams and the player who would fight anybody and who was kind of, you know, wore his heart on his sleeve and all those things.

But it's really difficult, actually. It would be hard to, that's why the Leafs have the Legends role with, the 11 or 12 different statues, because it would be really difficult to narrow that group down to only three or four leaves. I know we're kind of looking ahead to the playoffs, but, you know, the offseason is going to come up pretty quick here. Regardless of what happens in the playoffs, are we going to see, you know, a significantly different Leafs team next season?

Because they've got about eight or nine UFAs. A few RFAs on this roster. Cap space is always a big thing, especially with the flat cap. Do you see some big changes? I don't think Frederick Anderson will be back, so there'll be a change in goal. I could see Jack Campbell being the nominal starter next season. But, you know what, no, I think the roster, a lot of the roster is signed. You know, the big ones are going to be Anderson and Zach Hyman that are UFA.

I suspect they're going to find a way to bring Zach Hyman back on a contract. And then a lot of the other UFAs are guys that are making really low salaries. Like, you know, Jason Spetz is going to be back on elite minimum contract. Joe Thornton, it's going to be up to him whether he wants to come back. I suspect he probably will. Same with Zach Bogosian, Wayne Simmons. You know, they got a lot of these guys that were kind of brought in on the cheap one-year contracts. As long as they want to come back, they've all had pretty good years.

I think the roster's going to look pretty similar. I mean, they're going to lose someone in the expansion draft, probably be Alex Kerfoot, or Travis Dermott. They're going to mix some young guys in next year. Rasmus Sandine and Nick Robertson will be in the lineup on a more regular basis. I think the team's going to look pretty similar, though, and why not with the year that they've had? With those older guys, Simmons, but maybe more in particular,

Spets and Thornton, is the feeling, though, around them, if they somehow get this done, that they'll do the Lanny McDonald, kind of see you later, we win the cup and we're out of here? Or do you think that there's a chance that they could come back and play regardless of what happens in the next two months of the playoffs? Well, you know, Toronto, no one's talking about if they win kind of thing. I mean, they haven't won around in 17 years. 2004, right? Yeah, yeah. There's like, I mean, no one's going to talk about that.

I mean, people that know Joe Thornton really well and that know Jason Spetser really well, frankly, they say that those guys are going to play as long as they can. You know, it seems like Spets is on the track where he's going to sign a lot. league minimum deal, one-year deal again and again and again, as long as the team wants him here. He wants to be here. His family wants to be here. And it sounds like he's going to move into a management role when he's done. He's had a fantastic season.

He's been really, really effective for the Leafs. So I don't see any way that they don't offer him that contract again. I don't see any way that he turns it down. He's not looking for a bigger payday somewhere else. So I would be shocked if Jason Spetz is not back. Thornton, you know, there were a lot of teams interested in him last summer. it seems like he's having the time of his life here. So, you know, it's really going to be up to him.

Maybe he takes some time to think about it. But I think that he's probably going to be back too. All right. Final question for you here before we let you go. And this is on behalf of some Ottawa fans. I just want to know, James Myrtle. Would Toronto fans be legitimately nervous if the Ottawa senators who have been blistering hot the last few weeks,

if there was a way, if they could have snuck into that fourth spot and it was a Toronto-O-O-O-W-W-Matchup in round one. Would Toronto fans have legitimately been nervous, or they still have just acted like the Ottawa senators are the little sibling, and it never would have bothered them? You know, Ottawa's had a much better year than I think anyone anticipated. Like, they've played really hard, and it's certainly against the Leafs.

They've given the Leafs a lot of trouble. And you know what it is? Ian, I think it's a stylistic thing. And when the Leafs play teams that play that kind of style through the neutral zone, where they really bottle things up, the Leaps have a hard time against those teams. And, you know, it comes up whenever they face Carolina or Boston or, you know, it's just something that Toronto struggles with.

And we've seen it this year against Ottawa. And I think that there would be, I mean, some fans are nervous about the playoffs no matter what. Some fans are nervous about Montreal because they've, you know, the Leaves have had some tough games against Montreal. Now the Canadians are really banged up. They've got a lot of injuries right now. You know, the Leaves have been kind of beating up on them in their recent games. But yeah, no, I think that there would be some nerves in the fan base if Ottawa

snuck in. And I mean, realistically, you look at the standings, Ottawa's not that far behind Winnipeg and Montreal right now. They're really not that far out of it. So, you know, I don't think there's that much separating the senators from those teams right now, certainly not with the way the Jets have played of late. Excellent. Listen, James, this was great to have you here. Look, we're looking forward to your coverage of the Toronto Maple Leafs here in the weeks ahead. and I'm sure your Leaf Report podcast is just going to be straight fire as the Stanley Cup playoffs as the Stanley Cup playoffs roll on here. So listen, thanks for dropping by.

And we'll talk to again real soon. Awesome. Thanks for having me on. All right, Haley, going to wrap up the show with a couple of multiple choice madness questions for you. So here we go, ready to go rolling up the sleeves. And here's question number one. Lots of talk around Connor McDavid's 100-point season. Haley, I'm going to ask you this.

we're going to answer this question. What's the most impressive individual season by an NHL player in the 21st century, meaning since the year 2000 to now? What's the most impressive individual season this century? Is it A, Connor McDavid's 100 points in a shortened season? Is it B, Alex Ovechkin, the only player this century to hit the 65 goal plateau, Ovechkin doing that in 2007, 2008, or as you'd see, Mario Lemieux, coming out of retirement to get 76 points in 43 games back in 2000, 2001, Haley.

What's the most impressive individual season by a player this century? It's a really good one because you have to kind of like take yourself back to those moments, right? And I think obviously what Connor McDavid did is great. 100 points in a shortened season's incredible as we talked about. I think Ovechkin is really impressive too. But I've got to, I don't know if there was a, I think I've got to go with Mario Lemieux. You know, the context around his return when he came back into the league, you know, he had cancer, he retired, he comes back with, you know, I just think it's, that's incredible. And it was Mother's Day.

So I'm once again deferring to old fandom. My mom's a huge Mario Lemieux fan. Huge. She's French-Canadian. She loves Mario Lemieux. So I think I've got to go with that. I think I'm going to say Mario because if you take yourself back to when that happened, obviously I don't think, you know, Twitter or social media was huge.

But, you know, I've got it. That was probably, I don't think there was many people, you know, but actually what Mario Lemieux did that year. Are you sure not on a. MySpace account. People weren't doing that while they were downloading music on Napster, maybe. You know what? I would agree with you.

You know, Mario LeBue, think about this. This guy, like, gets up off his damn couch at the age of 35, hasn't played in three years, comes back. And I know that there was a business element to it, right? Like, he got the penguins out of bankruptcy. Like, I get that. But there was also an element of, like, his kids were a little bit older and they're like, oh, daddy, were you really that good?

He's like, you know what? I'm going to show you how good I was. He comes back to get 70 some odd points in 40 games. You hadn't played in three years. You just, you get up off the couch and you're that good. And then a few months later, or about a year later, he helps lead Canada to a gold medal, like at the Olympics. To me, and I love what McDavid did.

I love what Ovechkin did. But like you said, when you contextualize it and give it a little bit of context, I think Mario Lemieux's comeback season is the best one. Okay, speaking of the penguins, Haley. Here's our next question. should Penguins head coach Mike Sullivan end up as a finalist for the Jack Adams trophy for a coach of the year?

The options are very simply A yes, B, no. Look, I'll go first on this one, or our colleague Pierre LeBron ended up polling 28 general managers in the National Hockey League and got ballots for them. And guess what?

Sullivan came in fourth haley. So he just misses out on the ballot. It was Rod Brindamore, who's the winner. And then I think it was Joel Quenville and Dean Everson. were the ones who got votes ahead. Boy, this is a tough one because you know what? I think teams like Pittsburgh, Washington, you know,

we're so used to them. We're almost desensitized to their greatness. We expect great things out of them. And here's my pitch. I almost wonder, do you think that we should have, not a separate Jack Adams Award? But it's almost like the Jack Adams Award always goes to the team who surpassed preseason expectations.

the most and not what team actually maybe kind of had the best season. Was coached really well. Yeah, was really well coached. It's almost like the, and I don't want to say Scotty Bowman Award, but there's teams that are so good every year. You're just like, oh, anyone could coach them. But Mike Sullivan didn't have Evgeny Malkin for a good chunk of this season. Crosby had his struggles early in the season.

Tristan Jerry and Casey DeSmith were giving them like 880 save percentage in January, February. And yet the Penguins could win their division, like end up winning their division. And I, boy, I've been really impressed with Mike Sullivan. And there was some turmoil there. The general manager left the equation. Like, there's a lot going on. Like, so he would probably end up on my ballot. He'd probably be like the third guy. Like I like Brindamore. I think I like Dean Avison. And I think Quenville's great. But I think Sullivan would end up on my ballot. I think he really would. What about you? I think he should. And I hate that we agree so much today. But I can't go against that. I think you laid it out perfectly, Ian. I think that, you know, obviously we could, I'm sure we could go through the list. I'm sure people will also do that. You can go through the list and I'm sure you can find several coaches this season who faced similar things, you know, lots of controversy, things going wrong. But again, at the end of the day, you know, Evgeny Malkin was hurt. Sydney Crosby, you know, when we had Dommon, we were talking about a Sydney Crosby, you know,

know, starting to regress. And, and, you know, he was having, you know, a rough patch. There was no Malkin. The goal tending was bad. Like, it was got to a point where people were like, should they have let Matt Murray go? Like, the penguins need Matt Murray. We were talking about that at one point too. And then, you know, the general manager. So I agree with you completely. And I think that, you know, I don't know if it's just because the penguins have been good for a long time. And because you think you have Crosby and Malkin, you have Chris LaTang, you've got these excellent players that coaching is, you know, not that important. Maybe it's just, you know, they're a good team. They've always been a good team. You could put whoever behind the bench and they'll be fine.

I don't think that's the case. I think Mike Sullivan's done a really good job this season. And again, you know, I have them as the fourth of my final four and they won their division. And that was one of, I think, probably the most difficult. I mean, I don't know if it's the, we called it the division of death, like, and they won it. So, you know, you don't just do that with a mediocre coach. And I think he deserves to be a finalist for the Jack Adams. All right. Last question here in multiple choice madness, Haley.

Lots of talk of the weekend that TNT was willing to back up the Brinks truck for the great one, that they would be willing to maybe pay $5 million a year to make Wayne Gradsky their studio analysts for the new T&T NHL broadcast. Here's my final question. Haley, do you think Wayne Gratzky will make a good studio analyst if he's hired by TNT? A, yes, he's the biggest name in hockey history or B, no, his personality, it's just too reserved. He's too, you know, almost shy and he's just not opinionated enough to make it work. What do you think, Haley? Well, I don't know if it's, I saw some of the takes on social media of people saying, you know, he's, he's kind of boring. He's not, he doesn't have that engaging personality, but how are we supposed to know that? Because, you know,

that personality is not always going to come through in media interviews, but when he's the media person on the desk, like, I'm sure that's going to be different. I think he, I think he could be. I think it's name recognition. I think it's a huge draw. And when you, and, you know, maybe he's not that engaging and maybe he's not that great right off the bat, but, you know, it's Wayne Gretzky. And I think that there's value in that. I think that. I think you look at what the NBA is done and you look at the name recognition and the stars who have transitioned to doing the panels, doing the shows. And that becomes must watch stuff. People like watching these players. And mind you, I think it is different because there is more

personality. There is more fun on NBA broadcasts to begin with over the NHL. I think they just naturally have more fun. You know, they're not as rigid. It's not. not the same kind of culture with the two sports. So I think it is a little bit apples to oranges. But I think you see a really good blueprint to what the NBA is done. What the WNBA is doing too, they get their former players on too. And it's really fun. You know, Sue Bird was doing a lot of stuff.

So I think you can look at that as a model. And you just look at the way that the NBA has grown their business and grown the game of basketball. And I think, you know, I think there's an opportunity there. to do something similar with Wayne Gretzky. Have we seen that personality like Charles Barkley or Shaq? No. But I don't know.

Maybe it's something that we could get there. And I think the name recognition could be a really big thing. I'm sure there is a lot of people, whether he's boring or not, who would tune in to hear what Wayne Gretzky has to say about something on a national broadcast. Yeah, I think so. I think that's been one of hockey's biggest problems. How come we've never been able to get our biggest stuff?

to stay in the game on the media side of things, right? Like, obviously, like Steve Eisenman and Joe Sackick and some of these guys are in the management. But you look around, like, look at, you mentioned the NBA. It's like Shaq is arguably one of the greatest players of all time. Charles Barclay was a perennial All-Star Hall of Famer. They're prominent. You look at the NFL, Randy Moss.

In my opinion, Randy Moss, the greatest wide receiver who ever played, at least that I ever saw. He's a broadcaster. Terry Bradshaw's got four rings. Troy Aikman's got three rings. Like, they're all prominent, right? Right? You've major league baseball. Say what you want about... Tony Romo. Well, don't go down that back. But still, like, look, say what you want about Alex Rodriguez.

Statistically, he's one of the greatest players of all time. And he's been a, he's become a broadcaster. Hockey's, we don't have that. You look at the list of the best players in hockey history. And it reads like a, where are they now? Where are they now? Yeah. Like, where is Marcel Dion? But anyway, but for real, like, I think I agree with you that I think it would be good. It would be good for the sport. even though we may have agreed on all of the multiple choice questions, we disagreed on the most important thing on the show today, which is what do you do if an ice cube falls on the floor? I'm going to do a poll,

and you are going to learn that you're weird and wrong. Okay, so what's the percent? As you fire this poll up and be careful, we got to, well, we'll talk about it off-line, but we've got to agree to the terms of how you word the question. You can't lead people in a certain direction. So look, we'll look for that on... Your back is broken.

You drop an ice cube. What do you do? You can't bend over. No, I think 65% of people would agree with me and James Myrtle, and they would pick up the ice cube instead of leaving it there to melt. But we'll find out the answer when you put it out there. Listen, that is all the time we have. This was a lot of fun.

I'm glad that you're back to 100%. I think we can definitely hear it in your voice. You're ready to go. Listen, enjoy the week. I know it's going to be an interesting one for the Calgary Flames. And we'll do it again. Playoff styles next week. I always forget to respond.

You can just leave that in there. Feel the chemistry. Feel the connection. All right. Thanks, everybody for listening to us this latest edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. Please subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. Leave us a rating and review. We would certainly appreciate that.

Annual subscription to the Athletic. They're available to you for just $3.99 a month when you visit theathletic.com slash hockey show. Scott Burnside, Pierre LeBrund. They're back. Two-man Advantage edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. That's coming your way on Wednesday. I'll be back with Down Goes Brown, Sean McIndoolead.

On Thursday.