The Athletic Hockey Show - Did the Hockey Hall of Fame screw it up again?

Episode Date: June 26, 2024

Gentille, McIndoe and Frankie Corrado look back on the Stanley Cup Final, the voting for the Conn Smythe Trophy, Leon Draisaitl's future with the Oilers and the upcoming free agency period which commences on July 1st. Before that, Sean and Sean wonder if the Hockey Hall of Fame got in wrong with yesterday's voting of Pavel Datsyuk, Shea Weber, Jeremy Roenick, David Poile, Colin Campbell, Natalie Darwitz and Krissy Wendell-Pohl into the Hall for 2024. Plus, the boys take a look ahead to a chaotic week for the NHL with trades and extensions, buyouts, the award show, the draft and free agency dominating the calendar, and we send off former Arizona Coyotes owner Alex Meruelo, as only Gentille and DGB can. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. Welcome, welcome, welcome. This is the Athletic Hockey Show, Wednesday edition, Sean McIndoo, Sean Frankie Corrado, Sean Jantilly here. It is a show about the Stanley Cup in the elbow room in player movement in the draft. What else? Trades. Buyouts.

We got a lot of. stuff to deal with over the next eight days, my friend. We've got an entire offseason condensed into a week is basically what's happening. I was told that this wasn't going to happen. You were lied to, my friend. I was told, I was told that the schedule is going to normalize after COVID, and we were going to stop passing this stuff out at the, this is, here's what I'll say. Maybe we'll jump right into what I've learned, because God knows you have Hall of Fame takes,

and we're going to roll right into those. What have we learned, Sean? What I've learned is that I am capable of being angered by the NHL's offseason schedule, which I did not know was possible until the last couple days because that was always something that was in one ear and out the other with me. I wrote it off as media carping. You know, everybody wants cottage season to start as early as possible. I want to, you know, figure out, hammer out some vacation in August. I'm like very, very concerned about taking media whining and elevating it. past the level that it should be because fans don't care they shouldn't care it's our problem it's not theirs generally we should keep this stuff to ourselves the way things are going right now i'm finally on board with like this is ridiculous and they need to do something about it because the amount of work that nchl teams and perhaps lowly podcast hosters slash posters slash bloggers slash journalists have to do over the next seven days is repulsive i can't handle it

Yep, I'm with you, preach. The NFL every three weeks has a new, like, offseason milestone that becomes front page news for a three-day news cycle. Apparently, they haven't figured out you can just condense it all. Yeah, what if we had the draft and the schedule release and all these things that the NFL gets full news cycles? Do the Hall of Fame. Let's do the awards to all the trades because this is the only time of the year you can trade, as we're told all season long.

And free agency on a national holiday up here. This week, I'm going to be thinking about all the Panthers folks who have to schlep out to Vegas. And the Edmonton people who are still dealing with just a brutal, brutal, Vegas to sober up. Like they're going to get to Vegas and be like, all right.

Time to bring it down and odd. I'm going to get three hours of sleep. We're going to have a nice dinner and then get a full night of sleep. And then we need to figure out who, like, if we can swing any trades on the draft floor. Because we've been otherwise occupied for the last two months. That was a rough weekend. All right. It's Monday.

It's lunchtime. Let me just check my phone. Oh, Sam Reinhart's a free agent. Oh, no. Nobody told me. Oh, let's get on. Go drag him out of a hot tub somewhere and figure out what he wants. It's a mess.

It's very, very bad. But it is tremendous content. Tremendous content. And that brings us into what you've learned, which is something we all learned yesterday when the Hockey Hall of Fame class was released. Oh, boy. I learned that they got it wrong because that's the feedback I've heard from everyone. They got it wrong because it's too.

easy to get in the hall of fame. Guys are getting in who shouldn't get in. But also, here's my list of very mediocre players who absolutely should be in. And it's a complete joke. It's a debacle. Travel Dad soup, but not Patrick Eliash. What are we doing here? And more Patrick.

Patrick Eliasch taking shrapnel. It wouldn't be a Hall of Fame discussion with Sean McIntoo without some Eliage. All I know is that all I know is that the Hall of Fame is very, very, very easy. and they keep screwing it up because it's so obvious to everybody. What did you say? Well, okay, first of all, they put two women in. Great.

I'm not being dismissive of the women's game when I say like, I don't even really care who got in. Just the fact that they put two in and stopped the stubborn, arrogant, like you can't tell us what to do stuff. That was great. But on the topic of stubborn arrogant,

you can't tell us what to do. The Alexander McGilney Watch is uh continues continues for one out for scott wheeler who's going to have to make his case for induction next year in our fake in our fake hall of fame induction for the fifth consecutive season he's going to be yeah this is like the alexander mcgillney hall of fame dynasty of four or five years in a row or whatever is going to be ridiculous but we keep voting them in and the thing you could always have looked at it and i know a lot of people said well it's It's the Russian thing.

Somebody on that committee doesn't like rush some, but, but that's who gets in. Now, that's who I think a lot of people would, would argue has a stronger case. Sure, but. I mean, okay, so they put Dadsook in, but not McGilney. And then they also hit us with Shea Weber,

which I'm surprised how many people are, find that controversial. And then Jeremy Roanick, which is another one of those that, he's been eligible for years and years. He's got kind of the numbers for it, but I don't hate the Roanick pick, even though he didn't have my vote most years. Right, me neither.

And you voted for Weber, right, like in our little exercise. Ultimately, yeah. So without going into the nuts and bolts of the mock hall of fame induction, all that far, I thought there were more than, for deserving men's candidates this year. We are limited to voting for four on our first ballot. Shea Weber was not on my first ballot, but he made it to the second ballot runoff

because of tiebreakers and stuff, and I voted for him there. Yeah. So don't have a problem with that. Ronick didn't get my vote. It's hard to imagine that happening, honestly, for me. But the big asterisk with him,

And this is something we've seen in a few different places. I know Greg Wyshinsky said it yesterday. So as has been the case so often, I'm just repeating something he said. But I'm okay with airing towards the side of fame when it comes the Hockey Hall of Fame. Like Jeremy Ronek is, you know, there was, there's a, there's a cultural element there with him, at least in the 90s, where I think that might, that makes, that makes me more okay with him getting in for, for the, for the, the space he occupied, at least in the United States, for a little bit there. Does that take him from a non-Holof-Famer to Hall of Fame or no, but I can understand the logic enough for I'm just like, okay.

There is a strange thing that happens where you're right. I mean, Jeremy Roanick, I guess the first thing I'll say is in the early 90s, if you were a hockey fan, you looked at Jeremy Roanick and you're like, that's a Hall of Famer. Yeah, right there. And I will defend him a little bit because I've seen people point out like the guy was never an all-star, like postseason all-star, the real Oscar. The guy played in the Gretzky Lemieuxer, and he was a

sin. Okay? And I know, like, you know, well, but this guy, you know, McGilney was that, yeah, McGilney was a winger, totally different. I mean, at some point, you know, it's a little bit like saying, well, Shea Weber never won a Norris. Well, yeah, he was, you know, Nicholas Litteram, beat him by three votes when he was 40, and

whoever else, like, yeah, shit happens. Yeah. But, but when you start talking about, well, you know, the fame argument, like that it's me that's just a fancy way saying like Jeremy Aronick was American and there certainly were guys like Joey Molling got in the Hall of Fame because he was American because he was the first

American to score for five million tools what's that you hate Joey Mullen too I forgot about that yeah I do yep and but there have been guys where it's like hey this guy's one of the great American all the time like Brian Litch had the resume to get in no matter what

but that was something that came up and it's sort of like okay are we still doing this like he was at Ronick was a key part of that 96 team, the only American team that's ever won a best on best in the World Cup. I don't know. Like at some point, has America not enough to Canada that we can stop giving bonus points? Certainly now.

And I think it's a vestigial kind of thing where Ronix from that class of guy where maybe it would have been a little bit more of a consideration, he just hasn't. He just hasn't gotten in yet. I think if he, well, I was about to say, I think if he gets in, he did. He is in. We can completely mothball that. And I'm not sure it's even an argument that it's not a super effective one on me. And I know that, you know, it's only half, it's only half stick where I'm always standing up for the concerns of American hockey fans here.

I think we can, I think we can put that one away now. It's my news for Keith Kachuk, because he was the next guy to. I was so disappointed he didn't get in just because I wanted to see the footage of Lanny McDonald calling Keith Kachuk on two. afternoon. A sleep-depri-eyed Keith Kachuk and be like, they're in the Hall of Fame. All right. Whether, whether Big Walt was awake or whether what was asleep. It would have been a very, very, very fun conversation. Keith's face and let him know that he's in the Hall of Fame. But yeah, they induct three men players. So they have four spots. So that means, you know, some years, they put four guys. They

put four guys in. You go, what about this guy? And it's like, well, I mean, they only had four spots. So maybe they, not this year. So that means this year, everybody who didn't get in, the committee thinks your guy's garbage is what we're saying. There's no, like, sorry Rod Brindamor fans. Sorry, Henrik Zetterberg. Like, you, you're, you're out. You, you, you, you embarrassed me so thoroughly last year for trying to stomp for Zetterberg, but I didn't even bother this year. Good. Good. That's progress. I like it. Chrissy Wendell and Natalie Darwitz were the women who were in Dr. Yesterday both fun week for Natalie Darwitz, eh?

Interesting few weeks for Natalie Darwitz. Sure, she wins a she wins a championship in the PWHL, the Walter Cup, and then gets essentially fired from that interesting, interesting stretch for her. Now she's in the Hockey Hall of Fame. Her and Chrissy Wendell, two men, two, two, two of the best American players of their generation, certainly. I don't know that they would have been my, well, I know for a fact that they weren't my choices on, and the, on the women's, on the women's ballot, I would have, I voted for Megan Duggan and, and Jennifer Baudrill,

but any woman in the Hall of Fame is a good one because of, uh, because of this insane backlog situation we have. It's good that they inducted to. We've seen one get in way too many times over, over the last couple years. And we got to taste that, by the way, Sean, you, like, we experienced this in the, in the, in the whole voting exercise that we did, it's, it's a little too easy to split votes. Everybody needs to be on the same page where you say, like,

you know, we're putting in player A or player B. Because as Eric Duhatchik has said many times, 13 votes isn't 14. And you got to make sure that, that people meet the threshold. And I think there was some, um, I think there's been a lot of vote splitting going on there over the last couple years, and it was good to see them get their act together because the backlog is crazy, and it's only going to get worse.

And again, not to beat what is probably a dead horse by now, but the process is no good because you're right. Like how many years in a row until this year are we all furious every time they put one woman in? And there's clearly a back. I mean, Chrissy Wendell, uh, poll worthy candidate hasn't played since what 2006 2007 so i mean darwitz as a player hasn't has been he retired early she retired 14 years ago like it's been a long time you know clearly we're acknowledging like there's a backlog here let's get some of the uh you know the older candidates in

but imagine if the committee could come out and say guys we're voting for the women it's just the way you know this is how the vote played out we don't we you know i'm not saying people would accept it, but maybe people go, okay, so you guys aren't just being, you know, a bunch of cavemen. Speaking of cavemen, Colin Campbell, people are mad. That seems to be the one that is the lightning rut, Colin Campbell getting in. I've seen a few people complain about David Poyle, but that's dumb to me. David Poyle is the winningest GM of all time.

It was whether it happened this year or next, like Poyle was getting in because he was a GM for a gazillion years, as respected as any GM ever had. It has been, at least since, you know, this, in the last 50 years, let's say, it was, it was inevitable. You knew he was getting in the last year at the draft when we couldn't get one damn pick in without somebody getting up and given a soliloquy about the retiring David Poll. Here's the one thing, though, about that. Because I've got no issue with him getting voted in. No. But do you know what he's up to these days, among other things?

he's on the committee for the hockey hall of fame. David Poyle is one of those 18 guys voting on this. That's a little weird, right? Did he vote for himself? Well, I don't think he can't. Apparently, they, you know, he would have to, like, recuse himself. And I don't know if that means he needs, like, does someone vote in his place?

Do the percentages change? Like, that's, well, how funny would it have been if they're like, Dave, you have to leave the room. We're having the conversation, you know, I nominate Dave, he's got to leave. He goes out to get. coffee comes back in. Everyone's like, don't worry about it.

You're good. Come on back in. It turned out. Didn't take us very long. And then the announcement comes out and you're not on it. And you're just like, oh, okay.

But yeah, Colin Campbell is the one that people are mad about. Because, I mean, for a certain type of fan, his reputation never recovered from the whole 2011, Gregory Campbell, Mark Savard,

little faker scandal. And rightly, so Colin Campbell was always getting in. Colin, like, did you see the statement from Gary Bettman, like, listing off all the things Colin Campbell has done in the hockey, like, he's a hockey lifer high level in the NHL to this day. I feel bad a little bit. If you're really mad about Colin Campbell, I should have prepared you for this because he's, of course he was getting in. There's no word. I was surprised that he wasn't in.

I was surprised that he wasn't in already. You could have told me 48 hours ago that Colin Campbell got elected in 2006. There's a wrong in the said. Yeah. You never know. Like everyone who gets like I'll break the news to you guys now. Bill Dale,

he's getting in. I don't. Yeah, but he had that, remember in the 2012 lockout? He said that yeah, he's not like the league didn't fire Colin Campbell in 2011. They're not going to turn around now.

They don't care. They don't care about that. The, the people who are making these decisions are not, are not going to let that, let that keep one of their guys out. It ain't happening. So all in all,

I didn't, you know, I think it's a B plus class. Like I didn't think they, there was no Giacarbono level selections. You know, Ronek wouldn't have had my vote, but it's fine. I'm just glad we didn't get some kind of brutal cup deciding review in game seven and then have, and then have Colin Campbell announced as a, as a Hall of Famer the next day. That would have been fun. It's maybe next year.

there's always next year who is the next colon campbell there's an there's an endless line i mean daly's got to get in i don't know who else is is at the at the top is brisdalen is his berk in yet that's a great question he'll be in he's on the committee too i think or at least he was for years but apparently that doesn't stop me i don't think i believe he is not anymore but i'm i'm not 100% sure that uh mike murphy you'll uh We'll get in at some point. Another. They should have inducted Colin Campbell and Stephen Waltham in simultaneously.

That would have been, that would have been fitting. That would have been great. Let's go to Frankie. And here we have one of the stars of the post-game cup presentation, according to everybody who watched in Canada. I had to settle for watching Frankie wander into shots on the ESPN broadcast. Did I really? Was I in any shots in the background?

You walked right in front. You popped Paul Maurice as he was getting the cup. It was really awkward. No way. What an interesting experience that was. First of all, it was really cool to be down there. To be in the building for one of the most historic game sevens in the history of the NHL, correct me if I'm wrong, DGB?

Is that a fair assessment of what that was? It's right up there. It's for sure. So to be there in the building, With that, really cool. And then after the game, they kind of take, if you're not a rights holder, which we're not at TSN, they take you into like this holding cell area and they cage you up. And they say, we can't go on the ice until the first commercial break, which is after the picture with the cup. And then, because, you know, we're not doing interviews.

We're doing like our panel. I guess we are doing interviews, but we're doing our panel. And we have, you know, we need like 10 minutes to get set up. Me, Duffy, Drager, noodles. we're not in a rush to get out there, but other people are. And it can get, yeah, it was, it was hectic getting onto the ice. I also felt, not going to lie, felt a little bit like a pigeon. Like a lot like a pigeon because it's like, you know, it's their Stanley Cup moment, right?

And it just feels like we're out there. I don't want to pest their people. I want to get in the way. But, you know, we got to be out there as part of our job. But it was, it was really cool, really cool weekend. And now we get the collaboration. that I think a lot of people were waiting for at some point. And it's the Stanley Cup featuring the elbow room.

And it's a good time down in South Florida. I think the first one I did was Kings Rangers, which would have been 2014. And I straight up almost had like, Frankie, man, like you felt that way. Imagine like me as a total, total poser media dude, you know, never played the game and whatever. I'm like, I'm like, I should not.

I've never felt that way before. That was before or since. I was like, I should not be here. Like, I was my first one as well. And the best, the two moments I remember is number one, uh, Justin Williams was there like his family and his young kids and he got the cons spice, so everyone's crowding around him. And there was some like in his wife had a conversation and she went off and did something.

And like people started asking him questions and he answered. And then like he suddenly got this panic look in his eye and he's like, where's my kid? he was like I'm supposed to have my like I guess he had been told like hey keep an eye on the two year old and he just like I guess was distracted but and so like everyone stopped asking questions and started looking around and then someone like held up a kid and was like is it this one and he was like yes that's it the other thing I remember yeah and I didn't see this lie but you you guys may this 10 years ago now but if you were on Twitter you you may have a bit of a memory of this I get stressed out on the ice because all the the the the the the white and girlfriends and everyone are walking around in these high heels and you're on ice. And I'm just like, oh, someone's going to end. There was a, there was a girl that year. She went down. She went down hard, hard.

Face first on, like she was behind some reporter doing a hit. And so it immediately went viral and all this. And I remember I was in the elevator with Lozo and this girl gets on and with some of her friends. and it was I very rarely get starstruck like I don't care you know Scotty Bowman can get on the elevator or whatever but I was like that's the girl and she was explaining to her friends what had happened she was like oh yeah I'm like I'm on I'm all over Twitter and they're like why and she this wasn't her direct quote but she was like yeah I ate poop on live TV nice I got to say all things considered she was very chill about it she wasn't doing what I

did would have done which is like just walk off and have like yeah have a test Like, you never see me again. Totally never, ever. Changing industries. You're going back to writing websites, something else. Yeah. 100%. I'm cracking up HTML for dummies again, and I'm getting right.

Like, that's it. You will never see me again. Frankie, when did you get back? Did you guys stay the night? Did you see any of the elbow room in action? So we, yeah, we flew back yesterday. We got back pretty late. Like, we got back after the game around 1.30, once things wrapped

up and our hotel, funny enough, was the closest in proximity to the elbow room out of all the hotels on the A1A there. So we have a great, great view of it. Yeah, what a coincidence. So, no, it was like it was poured over, basically, into the sidewalks. You couldn't really get in there, but as I was walking back from breakfast yesterday, this would have been around 9 o'clock. The elbow room was open and there was people there. And I look up and sure enough, there's the cup. and Matthew Kachuk and some of the boys were there getting things started or maybe continuing things probably. That's more likely. But hey, man, listen, you win the cup.

You bring it wherever you want. You bring it to the elbow room. The only thing that will not happen is when you try and cross the road from elbow room to the beach on the A18, people will not stop for you on a green light if you have the Stanley Cup. They will continue to drive through and make you wait for your signal before you take that. into the ocean for a swim. That's, that's the rules. I didn't make them, but clearly those are the rules that are in effect right now.

That would be the most Florida man thing. Florida man run over while carrying Stanley Co. Did you guys see that? They're trying to cross the road. They have the cup and no one's stopping. Cars are just going through. Like, yeah, whatever. Like, we're, we got to go here.

Like, if that's somewhere, that's somewhere in Canada, that's like a full on, like, street closure. And everyone's getting involved. but hey, it's all good. It's all good. It was cool. That's set back. It's set like someone,

like so many times in the years on radio hits or whatever, I feel like I end up defending fans in non-traditional markets because they deserve it. In 99, 99% of the 99% of the, of these instances, they're taking an undue amount of shit, right? And then that happens and it's like, I can't. Yeah. You've just undone all the work we've spent the last,

however many years, however many years trying to pull off. It's, you know what? It was that game, the best way to describe it, the Florida Panthers were more like the Florida Panthers than the Edmonton Oilers were the Oilers.

And ultimately that's kind of what it came down to. Like Florida, you know, I think going into that game, a lot of people would have thought, like, Edmonton has cracked the code on the Panthers, and they have no answer for it

because if they did have an answer for it, they wouldn't have just lost three in a row, and now they're in deep, deep trouble. And McDavid was held off the score sheet in game six, and boy, is he going to go off in game seven. And you have to give the Panthers a ton of credit for sticking to what makes them a good team and what made them successful,

because I was talking to one of our producers before the game. I said, I'm so curious about how the Panthers approach this game early on. Because their D, the whole series, right or wrong were very aggressive. And, you know, when they, when that team faltered, it was because they didn't have like the forward support helping them out. So a lot of the D like looked bad and got exposed, you know, over the, over games four, five, and six, one of Foresling or Eckblad or both were on for 10

goals against, which is, which is crazy because that's your shutdown pair. And you know what? They said, we're going to go down doing it our way. And they played really aggressive early on in that game. And they were strong defensively. Bob was good. Bob didn't have to be spectacular because they did a great job in front of him. And it just felt like the Oilers had really run out of steam.

They just McDavid could never break free. A few other guys had quiet nights. And there's your ball game. But I think like the Panthers deserve a ton of credit for, you know, finding the focus and the concentration in game seven to play your game and ultimately win. The McDavid thing is a huge part of the story. The fact that he did not do anything, those last two games. And it's weird to talk about because as soon as you start referencing it,

like everybody is waiting for you to break out the dumb hot tape that you're right. Like, oh, maybe when it's the Stanley Cups on the line, Connor McDavid isn't so good. And it's not that. But it's also kind of like, we've got to mention this. Like they actually did either figure out a way to shut him down or he ran out of gas or whatever it is. But between that and dry sidle not doing anything in the final, that's the twist ending I never saw coming. Was those two guys disappearing when they were needed the most.

Yeah. And I'm so curious when Edmonton, you know, they get back and they do their media, you know, the official word on what the injuries are going to be on guys. because like just rumblings that you hear around the stadium talking to people, I think the dry sidal stuff is quite significant. And I wouldn't be surprised if McDavid is more significant than maybe we would have thought too. But I don't know, like, how did you guys feel about the Con Smyth? Because I was of the impression it was McDavid's pretty much no matter how game seven went.

And I have no issue with him not going out to take the picture. And I think Ray Ferraro brought up a great point on overdraft. yesterday. He goes, think about the logistics of, of this. So, games over, you shake hands, and McDavid waited for every one of his players to go off the ice and gave them a little something before he went off. He was crushed. He was devastated, like the rest of his team. But now the Panthers are doing their thing. They're celebrating. And he's going to go into that room. Is he supposed to sit around and like, wait for some PR guy to be like, hey, Connor, we're going to come grab you then? And then we're just waiting on this. You know what I would tell him? Like, beat it.

get out of my face. I'm happy. It's an honor, all that stuff. So yeah, I don't have an issue with him going out to, or not going out to grab the trope. I couldn't,

I couldn't care less about it. You know, he waited, he waited an extra long time for those guys that come off the ice, because Corey Perry took some time to savor it. You know, we can probably read between the lines there. That was,

that was a long wait that he had there at the, at the door. I couldn't care less. People say, J.S.G. Ger went out for it. Yeah. And have you seen the photos?

like J.S. Gare looks like he was at a funeral. Like that truly. And look, as hockey fans, we can't do this thing every conference final where we get all excited. Oh, they didn't touch the trophy. They didn't touch. That's not the one they won. It's all about the cup.

Oh, we love that. And then be mad that somebody who just lost Stanley Cup final isn't coming out to like. I think the only people mad about this are all the people who had their like participation trophy takes ready to go. And now they can't use them. They're ticked off. Yeah. That's a good point.

And now I think we need to find some way to, not to cut you off, Frankie, we got to find some way to be able to cast those votes after the actual games over. I think that's, I think that's a big part of why the result ended up the way that it did. Because it did you the TSN guys have a vote probably not. You didn't get to lobby. I don't know. We didn't, I don't think any of us had a vote. And I saw the list. I saw there was one gentleman who voted for three Oilers.

Yes. So that was, that was another interesting one. But, you know, I think now with the oil. Oilers, you know, a lot of the talk is going to shift to where do they go from here and what happens long term with dry sidle and how hard is it to get back to that point? And no doubt, it is, it's extremely hard to get back to the Stanley Cup final. But there's a lot of evidence in the last, you know, 15 to, I don't know, 15 to 17 years, let's call it, that teams can do it. Like Pittsburgh and Crosby, they lose and they get back the next year and they win.

And, you know, I wonder since, you know, McDavid, Crosby, face of the NHL, I wonder if that's a possibility that the Oilers would be able to do it. The other thing, Tampa gets to three in a row. You know, L.A. gets to two in, is it two in four years, two and three years? Chicago wins three cups in six years. Florida just goes back to back Stanley Cup finals. So, I mean, it is very difficult, but when your team is in that win now mode, it is possible. I think the biggest obstacle that they're going to face is not contracts because guys have another year left.

Like, you're going to have guys coming back next year. The biggest obstacle is going to be today is June 26th. other players around the league started training basically 26 to 35 days ago. Now you just finished and you're banged up and you have to get yourself back to healthy. And then from there have to start like training and getting ready for the rigors of another season. So where does that take you? Like does that take you halfway through July? Maybe a little more.

Like it's a, it's a quick turnaround for those guys. And that's going to be the biggest issue. but like I just said, there's evidence in the last 15 years that it can be done. Yeah, the two really interesting pieces on the athletic this week. Daniel Nugent Bowman had a piece where he basically looked at it. Like, what are the odds that the Oilers can bring this back? And certainly you can't rule it out. But he did make some what I thought very good points about how this did feel like

the year where it all came together for the Oilers, where just, you know, everybody who needed to elevate the game, elevated the game. Everybody needs to stay healthy for the most part, stayed healthy. Stuart Skinner got hot at the right time and it still ended up one goal short, which could be tough. The other one was CJ's piece about Le Undersighton and saying like, where does this go now? And that was fascinating to me partly for the reaction. There were a lot of, I'm presuming, Euler fans very unhappy that that piece even got written, that were even talking about this.

You know, they're basically saying he's going to stay. They're going to give him whatever money they want, blah, blah, blah. Don't worry about it. It's not a story. And CJ, I mean, I thought CJ wrote it very responsibly. CJ wasn't like, here's why he's going to the Leafs, here's why he's going to be on the Bruins. Here's why this or that. He was just saying, like, he needs an extension.

He has not really committed to doing it yet. And let's see where it goes. But that is fascinating. Because even if, look, at 90% chance, at least, I would imagine that the two big guys resign extensions. That's just the way it goes in the NHL. I would agree with that. But they're not resigning for 21 million combined.

No. You're not getting that. And I know the cap's going up, but it's not going up enough that, I mean, if Leon Dressaitle wants to say, like, guys, I've been the most underpaid player in the league for the last three, four years. Right.

We're fixing that now, kind of like Nathan McKinnon did. Does he get more than Matthews as it become the new highest paid player in the league? He should, right? Yes, he should. Even with him, even with him at 8.5 for one more year,

they have about 10 million in space and they have a whole bottom six to rebuild. And, you know, you can try to improve in other spots too, right? So I mean, he should get more than Matthews, depending on how many years he wants and that sort of thing. And then with McDavid, a year from now, it's, I mean, that's a blank check. That is like literally the Wayne Gretzky, Bruce McNaul. like here you fill in the number that it takes. Now, I think they're all great points and they're all very real. I think from like a feel type thing, you know, if the Oilers won, I don't know how you guys feel about this.

But to me, it almost would have felt like we did it. We delivered. Everyone in the market's happy. Check please. I'll, you know, we're, I'll always be a legend and there's no hard feelings. and, you know, business decision, whatever, you're going to move on. Now that it didn't happen, I wonder if he'd be more inclined to say, we do have some unfinished business here.

And I'd like to partner up with Connor and try and get this thing done. Like, I don't know. Something about, something about those two and the way they operate would make me feel like it's more inclined to say, like, we got to try and get this thing done together. But I don't know, it's, there's, there is going to be, like, you're right. There are going to be more hurdles than maybe you would think on the surface. And that's, you know, there's also, like, Dregs was tweeting about Ken Holland's future in the organization, right? Like he was talking about, he could have a position there, just not sure what exactly that's going to look like.

So, yeah, there's, there's a lot that needs to happen in a very short period of time because it was, you know, June 24th when the Stanley Cup gets awarded. That's a very weird situation, right? Like, did, did Dregor not tweet or make? Maybe it was someone else saying that, like, Ken Holland isn't expected to be at the draft at this point. Yeah, that was so what a weird situation. Like, you're playing game seven on Monday night. Now the draft is in a couple days. And it's like, who's in charge? Who's running?

Like, I mean, Jeff Jackson obviously is the guy, but it's like you don't have a GM or you do, but he's not there. Like, it's, it is so bizarre how much is going to happen in the next few days. Like when we are you next, it's making me anxious. It's making me anxious from a, from a, from. a work standpoint. And I'm just writing about recording the salary app and reporting in a recording podcast and stuff. Well, who the hell knows what's going to happen? Like, you know what made me anxious? I get a text from my buddy yesterday who's a huge Red Wings fan. And he goes, I hope Stevie knows what he's doing. And I said, what is this in reference to? And I see the trade come out. And it's Jake Walman

and a second salary dump over to San Jose. And I'm thinking a second to get rid of Jake Walman, who's a, he's a good player. And San Jose is in no position to be turning their nose up at good players that are, you know, wanting, wanting to play there. And listen, I'm sure,

like, I'm sure there's a whole, there's, they know what they're doing. Obviously, there's this planning that goes into this, but I'm like, I'm intrigued now.

What does Detroit got up their sleeve that they're moving Jake Walman to get rid of that salary? Buffalo apparently buying out Jeff Skinner. Mm-hmm. Buffalo. found out about that. Offload just bought out Jeff Skinner. And I mean,

can, are we going to be able to sober up Sam Reinhart in time to figure out if the biggest free agent name on the market is going to actually get the market? This is agent. How much, I'm not sure offhand who his agent is.

Someone's doing some hard work. Guys, hold on a second. In, on the 24th, he scores the Stanley Cup winning goal. And you're telling me on the first, so six days later,

this guy could be flying for a different team or signing with a different team. I don't know. I'm just, it could very well happen, like, because who knows what kind of number someone's going to throw at him.

But I think, like, after being down in South Florida and seeing all that and what this team just went through, I could see him taking a little discount to stay there. You can also... The ocean on July 1st and be like,

hey, we got an offer from Columbus here. What do you think? Oh, yeah, well, it's fine, okay. They have a,

I will say about Florida's Capp situation because I had to look at it for something yesterday. It's probably not, not quite as brutal as you'd think. They have, they have, they're not going to be able to sign Reinhard and Montor. That's not happening.

But they can do, they can do, they can do Ryanhart, you know, but 10, 11, it'll be very, very comfortable.

It won't, it won't be an issue. The Ryanhart deal is going to come in lower than everyone thinks and everyone's going to be furious. And there's going to be so many takes about taxes and all this stuff. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

I, I think it comes in like nine something. That's my thing. Right. I think nine and a half. I don't think it touches 10. If it touches 10 for the Panthers, like they really went out of their way to give him more.

Like, like, no, because I don't know, like if you're a different team, this guy drives a golf cart to the rink and he just won a Stanley Cup and he's had more success there than,

you know, elsewhere in his career. I don't know, like you would have to throw a serious bag at him to make him consider leaving that, especially if the, the Panthers are going to be, you know, in the ballpark, let's say.

Barkov makes 10. That feels to me like a cap. Sort of informal cap. But yeah. Get the put him at 10, get the Billy Zito. Thank you bonus or whatever. Like salute. The other thing that helps Florida's cap situation is Gustav Forsling is going to be on the best

value contract in the NHL for quite some time now, especially when the cap goes up. Right. Like that guy, that guy really wanted to be there. he would have left, you know, significant money on the table. But that's, I guess that's the advantage of Florida and the lifestyle and the tax situation and everything that goes on there. So I can't play. And being on a winning organization.

Like everybody is for the last few years, I mean, let's fit. The history of this franchise was kind of a mess. And the last few years, ownership has kind of figured it out. And, you know, you hear Paul Maurice talk about how, you know, when they, when the, Florida Panthers called and we started talking. I was like, oh, these guys actually know what they're doing now.

And that's part of it. And like a lot of it is we always talk about winning culture. 90% of a winning culture is just winning. Like that's, there's no teams that don't win that have a winning culture. Nobody's like, oh yeah, you know,

you always got a winning culture is the Buffalo Sabres. Now it hasn't translated yet, but they really like, no, it's all their, they have a winning culture. They do have a winning culture. It's just with the players that used to play there.

Good point. That's a really good point. Yeah. You know what? So like now I think like everyone kind of feels like they're gearing up for the draft to be mayhem. And then going into July 1st, I don't know. Like it's the demarket for me going into that day. Like I feel like we're going to have, you know, if you can't get and I think I've said this to you guys before, if you're in need of a defenseman this year and you can't get one, like just hand in your resignation because there's a lot of good defensemen and different price points and right-handed shots and power play guys and like, you know, bigger guys. Like, whatever you need on the blue line, it's available to you this year. So it's just up to you to identify what's going to fit your your team and fit your cap structure. Is there, is there anybody from that T-group that you're maybe like a, I mean to put you on the spot, but some kind of outside of the super obvious ones at the top, someone here like, okay, this is a guy who we could make a splash somewhere? So you know what?

I thought like Jalen Chatfield is a good player in Carolina and he took $3 million. Like I thought that was a little bit of a discount. He could have got more elsewhere. JD's telling us Matt Roy. Like Matt Roy, I think with L.A. moving that money

on Dubois, I would imagine they make, you know, a good push to re-sign him. I'm curious how much much teams are going to give Nikita Zedorov. Like, AFP Analytics has his projection at five years, $5.3 million. Like, I think five years is, is a lot for him. I think 5.3 is probably, I don't know, on the higher side of what I would want to give him. But I wouldn't be surprised if a team looked at what he did in the playoffs and said,

okay, we'll come closer to your ask of six, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be running to to go sign that one if I was a team. Like I would still have a little bit of a caution sign up on that much term and that much AAB. Evolving hockey has him. They're, they're pretty solid in the contract projection game. They've got him three years,

a little bit over four, which seems a little bit more in line. But it's also really hard to imagine. It's frankly hard to imagine him getting that little. Like I feel like, I feel like with the playoffs, he, for better or worse,

the door of just. amped up, amped up. I'm always fascinated. A year and a million dollars. So how can he get that much? Sorry, how can he get that much? And Chris Tenev is like a four, you know, just under five. Meanwhile, Chris Tannave, you put him on your first pair. Your first pair doesn't get scored on anymore. Like, what do we, like, you know what I mean? Like, I get big, tough, tall, all that stuff. What we're looking for as a defenseman is don't get scored on and help your team win. First and foremost, Chris Tanev doesn't get scored on, but he's going to be under 5 million. I get the age thing. That's, you know, that's a very real injury history,

for sure. But like as far as impact goes, one guy, you know, Jekyll and Hyde, one guy, you know, solid, you know, Dallas should just, Dallas should just give him what he wants. He fits there so perfectly. And I think they do. He's exactly what they need. They, they're, their, their D's set, except for, we'll say, second pair on the right side. Just write the check. Cut the check. chase cups for the next few years whenever he's you know if four years from now whenever his shoulder gives out or whatever

happens like so what like that's like make it make it count in the meantime it's it's it's a silly thought to imagine imagine someone someone not worried about Chris Tanna up down the line because he's fantastic still I want to see the order these guys go in that's the fascinating thing

is like who want who wants to go first who wants to set the market who wants to wait and sort of see like, oh, no. I mean, if TANF gets this, then I'll get that. But also, if TANF gets this, that takes one of your potential landing spots, maybe off the list.

And what you don't want to do is be, you know, Chris Russell a few years ago. Remember where he was going to get a ton and then seem the market dried up. Or Klainberg was the big one, right? Like, I mean, he was waiting for the monster contract. Yeah. Going back a little further.

The music stops and there's no chairs. Remember Cody Franzen as a UFA? Like, he thought he was going to get that big, ticket. He had to go to Buffalo on like a one year deal, right? Like, it does happen. I think we do get a little bit of like a market set with Dylan DeMello's contract yesterday. I thought that was interesting too. Right? That comes in at 4.9 and I saw the AFP projection was 5.3, which I thought to be a little bit rich. But I guess with him, he does really well with that, you know, number one kind of puck moving guy. He was really good in Ottawa with Shabbat, and Shabbat played really well with him,

and he's been really good with Morrissey. And Morrissey has had basically two of the best years of his career. So it may not look, I don't know, it doesn't look sexy. You know, if you watch DeMello, like there's nothing flashy about it. But for some reason, when he plays with that type of player, both those guys seem to get good results. So I guess there you are at 4.9. So where does that put everyone else? Because that's a big number. I know he was a, he was. He was. was a pending UFA and Philip Heronick was an RFA, but I look at those deals as

sort of of a type where they were in Vancouver, they've figured it out. Like Heronick was great with Hughes. You say like, okay, like we're not going to mess with this. We're going to lock

this in for a while. Like, you know, Hughes, just like any, any player of his skill set, isn't always the toughest guy, isn't always is the toughest guy to find a partner for. So you're like, Bob, we got this dude in the fold now. So if that means we give him another year and maybe go outside our comforts on that, we're fine doing that.

And I look at DeMello with the way he's played at times with Morrissey. And it's just like, yeah, okay, fine. Like, we can set this and forget it and, you know, move on to the next. Yeah. Yeah, it'll be interesting. Like, Pesci, like, there's going to be a team that really wants him. there going to be a team that really wants Brady Shea? Like those are, those are going to be bigger numbers.

I thought Shane Gostis-Spere was outstanding this year in Detroit on a one-year deal at like 4.1. Does he get a little more term? Is there, you know, is there a little more AAV attached to that? I don't know. There's so. And then if you're looking for a right-handed shot and you don't want to go spend the Pesci, Roy, Tanev, do you take, do you call Tyler Myers and say we got three million for you? and we just need you for a couple years.

You know, so those, like, that's the thing. Like, there's just so many different ways you can go with the blue line. It'll be very interesting to see how it shakes out. I think we're going to talk about a July 3rd, a little free agency recap here. And I have a feeling it's going to be from what everyone's saying. And they say this every year. So I don't know why we believe it. But let's, let's believe them this time.

It should be pretty crazy between now. We got a very ominous line from Elliott Friedman on 32 thoughts yesterday. where he said that I think this is going to be a banana's week. I think there's going to be things that happen here that we absolutely do not see coming. It's going to be a long, going to be a long eight days or however many it is between now and July 3rd. You guys are in Vegas? You guys are going? Supposedly. We are. You guys stay out of trouble out there. Keep JD out of trouble too. I was going to say, we're not, we're not the problems here. Take it easy, brother. We'll talk to you on July 3rd. See you guys.

All right. We're back. Sean, we have breaking news here in the athletic hockey show studio, courtesy of a PR release by the National Hockey League. Gary Bettman today released the following statement regarding the retirement of Glenn Sather. The National Hockey League congratulates Glenn Sather on his retirement and salutes him for his legendary career. This means one thing primarily for you and I is that we have our pre-pick preamble for every team at the draft in a couple days in Vegas. Get ready because Glenn Sater, is about to get thanked 32 more times. The breaking news here is that Glenn Sather was still working.

I was so hard. I didn't know that he's already in the Hall of Fame. I'm pretty sure. He's got to be. Won a lot of Stanley Cups. It could happen 30 years ago. Yeah. Has there ever been, and I'm not knocking Glenn Sater.

He's at a phenomenal career. But has there ever been a more unfortunate call your shot moment than Glenn Sather, when he was with the oiler, saying, if I had Rangers money, I'd never lose. And then going to the Rangers and didn't work out so well. The monkeys, the monkeys paw curls. Yep. Salute to Glenn Sater. The other bit of news that happened, we alluded to this with Frankie, Jeff Skinner buyout.

He was making $9 million a year. We knew this was a possibility. Kevin Adams had talked about it last week. seem like it was It does not seem to be completely official but Interesting. Unless I've,

or I have not seen, but I'm seeing everyone reference it as if it's a done deal. So, you know what? Now it's going to be who does he move on to and who does he can, in theory,

when you get bought out, remember you get two thirds of your money. So it usually works out at least financially for the player. because he can, in theory, now go and take a cheaper deal somewhere if he wants to fit in and, you know, either rack up numbers or go chase a cup. I'm looking in Matt. Yes, there you go. I'm looking in Matt Duchan's direction.

I feel like he's the summer 2024 version of Matt Duchyne gets bought out by the Preds, signs a very, very, very team-friendly deal with the Dallas Stars. And then has himself a year. Like Matthew Sheen's set to get another decent contract after getting bought out by Nashville there. Jeff Skinner's made a ton of money. He was signed for $9 million a year for a few more years. Still a pretty good player. He's dropped off from, you know, that huge renaissance that he had a couple years back, but he's still strong second-line winger power play element.

He's going to be in demand, especially whenever that first layer of guys' signs, like when people miss out on Jake Gensel's, on the Jake. Gensels of the world. I think you're going to see a lot of folks turn to Jeff Skinner. He's an interesting name to have in the mix here on June the 26th. Yep. So that's that's an interesting one as I refresh Twitter just to see if there's anything else, any other breaking news, but there probably won't be. They're going to wait until we finish. And then that'll be when the Mitch Marner trade drops. Something big's going to happen. We have another we have another goodbye to send. to our old friend Alex Marullo. Oh, former owner of the Arizona Coyotes. Seems like he's finally out of the racket now after collecting his billion dollar check

or whatever that was for the sale of his team to the league. They're in Utah, obviously. Arena land auction falls through. Alex Marillo says peace. Our old buddy Craig Morgan had that news first and has a bunch of coverage on his Twitter feed. If you're interested in that. To Alex Marulo, I say, beat it.

Goodbye. Beat it, dufus. Beat a chump. You know, from a NHL perspective, he died doing what he loved. Being a huge prick that nobody wanted around. Making a largely unsuccessful grab at the brass ring. I'm disappointed that he gets the golden parachute here. Like, it's frustrating that he made a billion dollars on that sale.

but the league will be a better place without him. And I think when you're talking about people who own professional sports franchises, it is a class generally of repulsive people in a lot of ways. They didn't, or consortiums or whatever. They didn't get there by being decent in most instances. They got there by stepping on people's necks. So to stand apart, as Alex Marulo has, over the last few years in terms of just being, you know, publicly brutal and clearly privately

difficult to work with, to make as many enemies as he has throughout, you know, Arizona in general. And to do those fans, as dirty as he did, to stand apart in the class of pro sports owners is truly a feat. So to him, we say happy trails. Congratulations on your 2012. of Fame induction. And a little word to the wise. Whoever gets hired to pack up his office, you don't want to get paid in advance. Get 50% off front.

Check the drawers. You might find some interesting invoices. You might. Yeah. I think that does it for us. Sure. Thank you. Thank you folks for listening to The Athletic Hockey Show.

Thursday, Max Pullman, Corey Prom, Scott Wheeler, C.P., Chris Peters from Flohockey, have your draft preview. Thursday night, I think we're locked in here, brother. McIndoo and I return late night pod from Vegas. I think late night is in air quotes there. Looking back on the awards. I mean, among the two of us, I can, we know who this is going to be a bigger problem for. We're looking ahead of the draft.

There's going to be rumors. There's going to be trades. It's going to be a wild few days, as we've said, many, many times so far in this pod. and then the three of us will return next Wednesday. It's July 3rd, free agency will be open. Frankie will be back. We hope to talk to you then. Enjoy the insanity of the next week.

It'll be something to remember.