The Athletic Hockey Show - Elefantenrennen in the Eastern Conference

Episode Date: April 1, 2024

It’s Monday, so Ian and Laz are back on a brand new episode of The Athletic Hockey Show to discuss hockey pranks, bubble playoff teams flailing, the Sabres missing the playoffs for the thirteenth straight season, and whether Jeff Skinner will ever play a playoff game in his career, Ian’s feature on Josh Ho-Sang, and more.Then, Sean “Gents” Gentille joins the show to talk about first round matchups if the playoffs started today, whether you’d rather face the Preds or Lightning, Jack Adams frontrunners, and the successful return of the stolen Jagr bobbleheads. Plus, to close things out, Jesse Granger stops by to discuss USA Hockey’s ambitious “51 in 30” goaltending initiative and whether the US or Canada has better odds to win the Stanley Cup this season.Subscribe to The Athletic: http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. All right, everybody. Welcome back. It is your Monday edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. As always, the Amendous Mark Lazarus with you. And it's April last. We can finally say, we got playoffs this month. 20 days.

Like less than three weeks, we were going to be watching the Stanley Cup playoffs after this endless slog of a season finally comes to a conclusion. Wait, hold on. And I think I saw this. So the energy. playoffs, they start on 420. Oh, boy. Is that right? Oh, boy. I'm sure that there won't be any

terrible jokes made on Twitter about that. No. Hey, speaking of terrible jokes, did you fall for any April Fool's things? Not yet, but my kids are still sleeping, so it's only a matter of time. Oh, so like, now, are you set to, like, are, because your kids are how old are they, like 11? 12 and 8.

12 and 8. That's prime, pranking territory. Yeah, I'm in trouble. I'm definitely in trouble. The best The best one I ever got on them was I set up the kitchen sink. I put like a little rubber band around the sprayer so that when you turned on the sink that just spray them right in the face. Just simple, elegant, you know, just annoy the heck out of them. Like that was just a nice, quick little, that's like a perfect April Fool's Day broke, Frank in my mind. Yeah, like the rated PG got to.

And now, a very important question that I need to ask in this year, were you or your wife in the background with a camera of videoing this or just letting it go. No, we just, this was a few years ago. I wasn't, I wasn't, you know, I, I feel like we, we, that's a more recent thing to have a camera on at all times for all aspects of your life. Like I just got back from a vacation. We were in Florida all last week. And I feel like I had my camera out more than I was actually looking at my kids.

I was looking at them through the camera more than I was looking at them, you know, in real life. it's kind of sad actually. Oh, yeah, exactly. So I haven't been pranked yet. I, uh, I made sure what I was on social media this morning, doing it with a, a very critical eye, not falling for it. It's harder now.

With the blue checkmark fiasco under Elon, it's so much harder because you have to actually click on everyone's name and look at their follower account where it used to be a blue check mark meant something. Now it's just someone giving the richest man in the world $8 a month for some reason. And you have no idea. So you have to click on the followers. You got to look at the interactions. You got to make sure.

You've got to be really careful out there these days. Yeah, no, it's totally different. Now you're right with the blue checkmark world. You know, I was trying to think, too, of like the best kind of hockey-related pranks that I've witnessed or heard about. And by the way, we would love to hear from our listeners. Hit us up, The Athletic Hockey Show,

gmail.com, let us know if you've pranked the teammate, you've been prank, anything like that. Like, have you, like, you ever witnessed a great prank or been a part of a great hockey-related prank, Les? I don't know if I've witnessed. I've heard Taylor. Patrick Sharp and Adam Burrish just tormented Patrick Kane and Jonathan Taves back in the day. They would steal their hotel key almost every single road game,

their first couple of years in the league. And while Taves and Kane were out for dinner, they would trash their hotel room so that they'd have to pay all the incidentals. Or they'd order every single thing on the menu for $500 on room service and have it delivered at 6.01 a.m. on a game day to, you know, force them to get up and annoy them. And one time, Kane and Taves got them back,

they stole the Sharp and Burrish's hotel room. And they set up, like, kind of like almost like a romantic dinner on top of the beds. They pushed the beds together. And they set up a dining room table and shares and like $400 worth of food, balancing delicately on top of the beds, forcing them to get all that down. I think,

I think those are kind of like your standard, you know, I don't think it qualifies as hazing because it's not, physical or anything or emotional. It's just annoying. Like those are those are kind of your, your NHL kind of pranks. But why are our third and fourth liners? Why are they getting their star players up at 6 a.m. on a game day. Wouldn't you want? They were, they were pretty young too.

I mean, when you're young, yeah, you're pretty stupid at that age. Oh, my God. Dave Bowling used to tell me, he's like, he's telling me, it was like, well, we used to put scotch tape on, on their skate blades before they went out there. That wasn't good because they would just fall in, hurt themselves every time. So we stopped doing that. Like, oh, you think? You think? That's always the worst prank because you could never tell with the Scotch tape because

if you look at the skate looks totally normal and you go to take and I've seen guys just wipe out. That's terrible. Like, yeah, you're right. You can't, you can't do that. You ever talk to older players last, like guys that played in that 70s or 80s when there were commercial, like teams actually took commercial airline flights. And like, if you talk to guys that played in that era. What are, and this sounds like, it sounds like such a dumb prank is that they would be waiting in the terminal like with, you know, and you just be around regular people. And for fun, NHL players in like the 70s and 80s used to put like $20 on like a fishing

line and they put it down in the middle of the terminal and then, you know, just random strangers would go to pick it up and, you know, the guy would just like pull back, you know, on the fishing line and yank it away. And they just gets so much amusement out of this. It's like Mortimer and Randolph Duke level stuff. What is that all? Just like torturing people like that. That's cold.

Yeah. With players being so rich and really all the pranks come down to is making them spend money really. That's kind of what this comes down to now. And if you have players, this still happens because especially because these guys fly chartered, they don't have to go through TSA screening. They will,

people will like take the coffee maker or the, iron or the hairdryer out of their room, stuff it in one of the guys's bags so that they get hit with the incidentals because the players still pay the incidentals. Like the team buys you the hotel room, but the players still have to put a credit card down and they pay the incident. If you hit the mini bar, you're paying for that. You know, they have a per diem. So if they get like a $120 room service stake at the Beverly Wilshire, you know, the

team's paying for that. But if you steal the coffee maker, you're paying for that coffee maker. And, you know, these guys are like, slipping their luggage up the thing, why is it so heavy? and they open it up on the plane, and there's a freaking coffee maker in their bag. So that's the kind of pranks they do now. You know, the biggest prank that backfired on anybody in NHL history, in my opinion.

And I was actually surprised that this didn't make the documentary. By the way, did you watch, Lads, on Amazon Prime, the Alexander Degg documentary? No, it's on my list, though. Okay, it's really good. Highly encourage all the listeners to watch it. Really good. But there was a glaring omission.

and it's a fascinating. Do you know the Alexander Dague prank story? No, share. Okay, so this is perfect. So I'll tell you kind of the quick version of it. So, and again, this was a commercial flight in the 90s. And I think it was, they were flying on U.S. Air. Remember the old U.S. Airways?

Sure, yeah. I don't think they have it anymore, right? No, they've merged with American, yeah. Yeah. So it's a U.S. air flight from Pittsburgh, and I think they're flying back to Ottawa. And Alex Dague is a, you know, he's a young star with Ottawa, and he's on the plane. And the team's video coach was next to him with a laptop.

And Alex says very loudly with the stewardess, the flight attendant right there, hey, make sure you put that bomb away before the plane takes off. Oh, no. But here's the kicker. Not only do we all know not to say bomb on a plane. At the exact same time that this, the plane was on the tarmac, um, Air Force one with Bill Clinton was on the tarmac as well. Oh, and Lee.

So they got to call it in. And Alex Dague, first overall pick has to be escorted off the plane because he thought it would be funny. What a prank to be like, hey man, you better put that bomb away. Look at up, if you, if you Google Alex Deg bomb threat, it is so like, Well, here's the, here's the thing about pranks. Like, everybody loves a prank in theory, but they're huge pains in the ass. It's like a, it's such a, like, like, if, like, Mark Andre Fleury is obviously famous.

He's like the greatest prankster in NHL history, right? He's tying your shoelaces together. He's putting whatever where he's, he is, if it was, if anyone other than the single nicest human, that's ever lived did the stuff that Mark Andre Fleury does, they'd be out of the league because no team would pick them, no team would sign them, no teammate would play with them, play for them.

Like, you have to be Mark Andre Fleur to get away with the annoying crap that he pulls all the time. Yeah, it's so true. If you went up to your car and you opened it and it was just full of popcorn, you'd be so mad. They'd want to kill somebody. And it's Flurry, like, ah! Oh, that guy.

Oh. Yeah. Oh, man. Anybody else, you have a full-blown brawl in the locker room the next day. Yes, exactly. Oh, man. Oh, boy. Anyway, we'd love to hear from our listeners.

Hockey-related pranks. Hit us up the athletic hockey show at gmail.com. Or you can tweet at Laz or myself. We'd love to get your tweet. So we're kicking off April, as I mentioned. It's the month where we're going to get the playoffs. And this playoff race, lads, if you had to, I guess, make a comparison, or paint an analogy of the Eastern Conference

Playoff Race for the last wild card spot slash third place in the Metro. What's a good analogy? Well, I think last week I used that German term Elephant Henrennan where the two trucks on the highway are trying to get past each other. It's not even that. They're backing up.

They're going in reverse. This is like the Keystone cops just stumbling all over each other. You know, this is a three students routine. This is every single team. Every single team that's in that quote unquote race is coming off of a loss right now. It's unbelievable. Nobody can gain any ground at all because they're all terrible. Can I ask this is a totally random sidetrack question that I feel like you would know the answer to?

Because you just dropped the Three Stooges reference. Okay. So the Three Stooges were Larry Curly and Curly. Then who is Shep? Didn't he replace one of them? One of them, like, there's like a contract dispute or something. I don't know what else. Dude, I'm 44 years old.

I'm not 94 years old. I don't know. I'm only a couple years older than you. I just, you dropped the three stooges reference at that be. And I don't know we could easily look this up. I just, I'm guessing, this is Hollywood, man. I'm guessing there was a contract dispute. One of the stooges, one of more mother than the other stooges.

And he got replaced by some dude named Shemp. I don't know. Anyway, that's, okay, classic sidetrack. But are you interested at all? We got Islanders flyers on Monday. And like I look at this and I see your argument of the, what was that German term? The Elephanton Renan.

Yeah, Elephant Ten Renan or the cards back it up or the Keystone Cop. Okay, I get that. But is there any interest in, man, this thing is so weird and bad that I'm kind of interested to see Islanders flyers. Like the islanders have one shot left last, one shot, and it's tonight. It's Monday, right? They got a win in regulation time. Yeah.

And they've got two games in hand on the flyers and they're down, what, five points. So they are still very much in this quote unquote race. Is it not four back with two in hand? It is five back with two in hand. Five back with two in hand. But if you win, like, I think the thing I hate about this, and I think the same thing, Washington and Detroit play each other next week. Washington's in third place now.

They're not even... The flyers of won three of ten. But what I think is hilarious is I almost feel like you can go ahead and mark it down Islanders Flyers on Monday. Washington, Detroit next week will end up being three point games.

Yeah, it certainly feels that way, right? And then that's the whole problem with the loser point is it's so difficult to gain ground. You know, we always talk about that if there was a 3-2-1 system, where you got three points for a regulation win, not only would those third periods be more exciting because teams wouldn't be playing for overtime,

but you'd have a little bit more separation. Then a two or three game win streak can leapfrog a team up. With the current system, the current system is designed for faux parity, right? All this parity we talk about, it's kind of fabricated, it's artificial. And the loser point is what does that. I know Down Goes Brown is not going to be with us today,

but he would be ranting about this for the next 20 minutes if he could. So that's the problem is, and especially a Tortorella team, John Tortorella has spent 20 years building a career on just getting to overtime and just getting in as a seventh or an eighth seat. That's like the Tortorella method, and it works. He makes uncompetitive teams competitive, but it's kind of bad hockey because it feels like half the time

they're not playing for the win. They're playing for overtime. And this race is so stagnant that it's hard to imagine a team winning three games in a row in regulation and actually getting some separation. So I know on the weekend You tweeted out about the idea that this race is so bad And a lot of people will talk about an expanded playoff field

Or a play in You know, where the last two teams play each other So is what's happening in the Eastern Conference talking you out of that idea? I've always been kind of out on it I mean the play in tournament in the NBA I don't love it Like the Chicago Bulls like here in Chicago, they have no business being in a quote-unquote playoff game. They're terrible.

They're not a good team. And sometimes it's okay to just not make the playoffs and not let everybody in. I get all the arguments. Look, there were 16 teams in the Stanley Cup playoffs when there were 21 teams in the league. And there's still 16 teams with 32 teams in the league. Half the teams miss the playoffs. It's bad for revenue. It's bad for fans.

It's bad for a lot of reasons. And a play in tournament would mean more in revenue. It would mean, you know, a higher salary. I understand all the arguments. I just don't want it because I, I want the regular season to mean something. It's already too long as it is. Now we want to add another round, even if it's only two or three days.

They're giving out the Stanley Cup at the end of June. It's literally summer when they give out the Stanley Cup. And I'm with our guy Pierre LeBron. The Stanley Cup should be awarded by May 31st every single year. Get out of the way. That's when it should be. If you want to play in tournament, fine, but shorten the regular season. Do something.

And then it all nullifies itself. These teams do not, they haven't, like there are seasons when there are a, When there's a ninth seed, that's a pretty good team. But more often than not, it's like this. Or like last year, it wasn't last year. It was like the difference between the eighth and the ninth team. It was massive. There was no race at all.

I don't feel like it's like the college football playoff. All right, well, we go to 12 teams. Well, the 13th team's going to be upset. I don't care about the 13th team. That's, we've gone far enough. So I just feel like 16 teams is the right number. It's the best playoffs in sport. Let's leave one thing good and well enough alone and not chase the dollar.

Boy, but yeah, you know what, and those are good arguments. It really is. Like I feel like I vacillate between give me the play in, because I've liked what it's done in Major League Baseball. I've liked the wild card thing. It would be fun. Like, it'd be exciting. And it would be, I understand all the arguments.

I'm just from a strictly competitive standpoint, these teams don't belong in. But wouldn't it incentivize, you know, locking down one of those three divisional spots, for example? Like, okay, you better finish in one of the, those top three spots because if you don't, you might have to play in. And wouldn't, okay, the Vegas Golden Knights, for example, they're sitting in a wild card spot.

You're telling me you wouldn't want to see a one game Vegas, St. Louis, and you wouldn't be cheering for St. Louis? Of course you would be. You'd be all in. It would be good drama. Like, you mentioned the wild card system in baseball. Like the one game wild card play-ins are incredible drama. incredible.

It's also the stupidest thing I've ever seen. Like I remember in 2016, the Mets, I'm a Mets fan, and the Mets were in that wildcard game. You play 162 games. And then it comes down to do you have one pitcher that's better than the other guy's picture? One game. I don't want any one game series.

I don't want any two-game aggregate score series. And then you start getting into too long of a series where the good teams are waiting too long and rest becomes rust. And it just extends. And then you're giving out the Stanley Cup in July. Nobody wants that. Oh, man.

I don't know. I always think about the 2010 playoffs, that Game 82, Rangers Flyers, and it was for, you know, winner goes, and it was great drama, great theater. And I think it would make for great TV,

but I do see your point that in a year in which all of these teams in the East, like I said, Philly's won three of 10, Detroit has won three of 10. Washington is a negative you know, 30 gold differential. And then, okay, I guess let me ask you this question.

Because I think if you're an Eastern, a fan base of a team in the East, you're going to have a lot of anger that you're in a year in which the playoff, the cutoff line might be like 89 or 90 points. Like, this is very achievable. And it looks like the devils are going to miss, the sabres are going to miss, the penguins are going to miss. And I think all three of those fan bases went into this season with legitimate playoff aspirations and hopes.

Of those three, as you watch this Turtle Derby unfold. And I guess you could throw the Islanders in there, too. But what fan base should be the most upset thinking, my God, we couldn't make the playoffs in this mess? Well, I feel like the devil's entered the season as like legitimate Stanley Cup contenders. So their whole season is a bigger disappointment. But it's got to be Buffalo, right? Like Buffalo, like finally, it's been 15 years.

Like they finally had a chance to make a playoff appearance. And they can't even do it with this playoff field. You got to be the most upset about the squandered opportunity if you're in Buffalo right now. Because you are already so frustrated. Like the devils, you know, they wanted more, but they beat the Rangers in the playoff series last year. They're, they've had a little joy in their lives. When was the last time Buffalo had anything good to think about hockey-wise? It's got to be Buffalo, right?

Well, their playoff drought is going to run to 13 years, 13 this year, longest in the history of the NHL. And if you think about it, you know, last year they ended up, I think it was with 91 points and they missed by a hair. If they had 91 points this year, they'd probably make the playoffs. I think that's the vexing thing for Buffalo fans. You're like, if you can't make the playoffs in a year in which the cutoff is 89, 90, when are you going to make it?

Right. That's the frustrating thing. Jeff Skinner's about to play his thousandth game and he's never been in the playoffs. To ever. Thousandth game. Is that the most mind-blown? So I was looking at it up. Do you know who prior to Skinner? Do you know who held the record for the longest, I guess, start of a career without making the playoffs?

Who? It was Ron Hainesie. Okay. And it was 917. games. Then he finally made the plus. then Hainesie won a cop right in Pittsburgh in 2017, I think. So anyway, I guess all's well. That ends well for him. Prior to Hainzzi, it was only yoken it at 700, I think it was 799 games.

Like, but I'm now certain to play this out last. Jeff Skinner has three more years on his contract. Given the, the dollar amount there, it's a what, $9 million. cap hit, I almost would put him in the category of untradable, meaning he's likely going to be in Buffalo, right? Like, yeah, feels that way. He's a great goal scorer. He's not, not an extremely well-rounded player, I feel like. So he's not a highly coveted kind of trade deadline asset, especially at that cap hit. I mean, the cap's going up significantly. There will be more opportunity to trade guys, to trade four guys like that, right? But again, if we're going to, you know, that's another

reason, another argument against a play in tournament, if everyone feels they're in the playoffs, nobody's going to make any trades in early March. If everyone feels they have a chance at the play in tournament, by the way. But I guess my point is, the guys get three more years on this contract in Buffalo. Do you see a scenario in which Jeff Skinner, and I don't want this for him because I do think I'd like to see him play in the playoffs at some point, but you got to feel like there's a path for him to never make the playoffs. And that's really upsetting, isn't it? It's bizarre.

I talk to Connor Murphy about this every training camp because he's been in the league for a decade now and he's never made the playoffs. He has technically played in the playoffs because of the bubble in Edmonton when they expanded the playoff field. And then the Hawks beat the Oilers, so they got to play against the Golden Knights. But even he does not count that as the playoffs. He has never played in an actual playoff environment, right? and he's played 650 some games. He's been in the league since 1314. It's a long time.

Man, it's in his 30s, and he's never been in the playoffs. Skinner's got 350 more games and still hasn't done it. He doesn't even have the bubble because Buffalo didn't even make the expanded field in 2020. It's got to be just agonizing for these. I remember I used to talk to Marion Hosa about this. Every year at beginning season, it's like, oh, my God, I can't believe I have to play another 82 game season just to get to where I care about, which is the playoffs. Like, that doesn't mean he didn't care about the regular season.

But once you've been in the Stanley Cup final, once you've won Stanley Cups, it can be really hard to get up for a mid-November game in, you know, Raleigh or whatever. So I can't imagine for Jeff Skinner. That's all he knows. He's never had that opportunity. And he's in the league surrounded by guys who have done that, who have been there, who tell stories about it.

It's got to be absolutely excruciating. It's got to be all he thinks about, all the time. Man, how quickly Marion Hosa forgets his time as an Atlanta thrasher? The man, I can't believe. The man went to the Stanley Cup final,

what, three years in a row, four times in like five, six years. Like, I'm sure he's forgotten everything about the city of Atlanta at this point. And he's the only guy ever, right, to go to the Stanley Cup final three straight years with three different teams, right? Isn't he?

Yeah, you went, He went with the penguins and lost to the Red Wings, and he went to the Penguins and beat the, or lost to the Red Wings and lost to the penguins, like vice versa. And then he finally won it in 2010 with the Blackhawks. Yeah. No, it's, uh, it's, it's just something that when Skinner gets to his thousandth game on Tuesday,

I can't help but think, I can't believe that this guy is playing a thousand, like the statistical improbability of this happening is mind blowing. He's going to be a, he's going to be like a 400, something, he might threaten 500 goals in his career by the time he's done. He's that productive. Like, if you score 450, 500 goals, you're a

borderline Hall of Famer. Yeah. Just by definition. The guy's never played in the playoff game. It's one thing for like a Dan Marino to never win a Super Bowl, but to never even make the playoffs in the league where half the teams, and for most of his career, more than half the teams make the playoffs,

I mean, he left Carolina just as Carolina got good. And he got to Buffalo, and it's just nothing, nothing. And I do feel like Buffalo is going to get there. Like, I feel like Buffalo in Detroit and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, there's going to happen in the next couple of years. There's always, there, there's always, this is cyclical. It's got to be cyclical.

It's got to be cyclical for Buffalo and Ottawa, right? So, I feel he'll get there. The question is, when he gets there, will he just score, like, 30 goals in, in, like, and, like, or is he going to completely soil himself because it's finally here. Like, that's what is the. What's the pressure on him going to be like when he finally gets that opportunity? Yeah. No, it's really, it's really, it's really big, to be a big storyline,

Thousandth game for Jeff Skinner, great accomplishment for him, but you can't help but feel like, ooh, I, I don't know. Yeah, you should, you should feel for the guy. You know what, before we bring, Sean Gentilly, by the way, is going to pop in the Monday pot. It's like a crossover episode of a sitcom. and Gentile, who does the Wednesday show, is going to pop by here. And before we get to him, I just want to, and this is not me trying to be selfish and say,

look at the story that I wrote. But I think it's actually, look at the story you wrote. Yeah, look at the story I wrote. No, because I think it's actually, it was one of the best, Lazte was one of the best conversations I've had with a hockey player in a long time. And that was with Josh Jose. And so I reached out to him for two weeks ago, after he signed in Florida in the East Coast League.

So we'd be up for a chat. I'd like to connect. Just kind of see where you're at. And I figured, and I said, let's do a FaceTime so we can kind of do this face-to-face. And I thought, this will be, you know, 15 minutes, you know, your standard, maybe 20 minutes, whatever. Last, it was over an hour on FaceTime with Josh Husseng. And I probably could have chatted with him for another hour. What a fascinating individual.

And just so the readers, the listeners understand, if you haven't read the piece, is Josh Hossang has signed with the Florida Everblades. One of the great names in hockey, by the way. Maybe, maybe the best name. It's so good. The only other East Coast team name that's better is the making whoopee. I always love the Wheeling nailers too. Yeah. Wheeling nailers, making whoopee.

And I connect with Hoseang, and there's a couple of things. thinks he's got cooking right now in addition to his hockey career. Again, he's rubber less. He's 28 years old. And if you go back and you look at his draft year, for example, like he was taken with, you know, dry sidel and, you know, these are guys that are in the,

the same Ryanhart peak of their career. And he, he's got an app that he's launched, you know, to try to get people to get active and play pickup sports together. And he's also dropped. a rap album, 18 tracks. You can get it, you know, Spotify, Apple Music, all that. And he walked me through the lyrics of a song called It's Time to Grown Up, which is all about him breaking into the NHL finally

and just feeling like devoid of happiness, no euphoria, just felt sad, felt homesick, felt like all these things. and he walked me through the lyrics of the song. Anyway, it was a really fascinating conversation with one of the most fascinating personalities. I don't know if there's any player in recent memory that I was more disappointed, didn't make it big. Because when you saw what he could do,

he was so creative and he had such flare. He's exactly the kind of player you desperately want to succeed in this league. And it just never happened for him. That's like the one guy I go back. Like in the last 10 years, if I could, you know, make one guy make it, it would have been Joshua was saying, because the league needs more guys like him who can think the game the way he does. He just, he would attempt things that nobody else could attempt.

And it's such a bummer that it really never panned out for him. But it's, it's cool to see that he's, you know, found a, he's found some avenues for all that. And, you know, he's still in the game and he's still, he's branching out. And, you know, a lot of guys don't make it. A lot of guys come in with hype and they just don't make it. And then they just don't know what to do with themselves. All right, last, I'll tell you what, as I mentioned, this is like a crossover episode. Bringing in one of the Shons for the Wednesday show.

In fact, see, I'm a loyal listener to the Wednesday show with the two Shons. And I know that Sean Gentilly, he's been dying. And last week he said, yeah, I just want somebody to call me Gents. That's his nickname. He wants Jen. So let's bring in Jets. There we go. There we go.

Hey, fellas. To anybody who thought they were getting CJ or Pierre today, I say to you, happy. April Fool's Day. I'm going to go with Tilly. I feel like your hockey nickname with Tilly. Tilsie. We can start a bracket. There's like probably eight possible ones.

It's going to take the world by storm. Everyone's going to try to figure out how to shorten my name and what to call me. Yeah. Oh, but hey, listen, thanks for popping by because it's actually perfect timing because you had on Monday a look ahead at what, again, a lot of stuff's up in the air. matchups could change. But there's a, you know, it's fun here. We're in April, as last night we were talking about,

let's start thinking about playoff matchups. And let's start with this one, guys. Because I, like, let's just start with the Eastern Conference. And if the playoffs started today, the way that you wrote this here, Sean, is you get Boston, Tampa, you get Florida, Toronto, you get the Rangers Philly, you get Carolina, Washington. Now, let's just all agree that Carolina, Washington is, not really going to be something on our radar.

Okay? Can we agree? Yeah, whenever Lads ends up covering that series, whoops. I mean, those, those teams and fan bases hate each other. There could be some good fireworks in that series. I honestly,

I love old Southeast Division battles. I'm a sucker for that. I don't know if it's, I don't know if it's because I was, you know, at school in Maryland during the peak of the Cap's reign during the Southeast Division or what, but I'm a total,

I'm a total sucker for it. But yeah, that one's, it's a dud. There's a dud in every batch. Yeah, that's the one I think is a dud. But for you guys, like, what, like, I know you referred to it as like the Torch Bowl, Rangers Flyers,

like Florida, Toronto is a rematch. And then Boston Tampa's got some intrigue. Like, you guys, if you had, if you had to get parachuted in and cover one of those series, what are you guys taking? It's Florida, Toronto, right? I mean, that's by far the sexy matchup. I mean, it's the obvious answer here.

it's you know it's the the perennial storyline of the of the maples can they get through it's florida maybe the best team in the league uh it's going to be just absolute chaos and in the drama around it and and the rematch aspects of it i mean it's it's a no-brainer to me on that one it's a boring answer but i feel like that's mine too i i also like the fact that we've done kind of a 180 where the panthers are going to be coming in as the is the favorite in the leaps you know not there's always scrutiny there's always pressure, but it does feel like, you know, there's a little bit, there's a little bit, maybe they can play a little looser. I think that's what people are going to look for,

given how good the Panthers have been. I don't know. That one's, that's tough because it is, man, it's like this, it's the boilerplate standard answer. I'll say that. I think that's it for me. I'll say this. Rangers Flyers, I don't know if that would be good hockey or a good series, but if you're looking for like that old school blood feud, I mean, you're talking to a guy who grew up an Islanders fan. I hated both these teams equally, but that's like the, that's like the holy matchup of I hate you and I want to murder you hockey is Flyers, Rangers. I mean, the seats, the stands in Wells Fargo are going to have more fights. It's going to be Matt Rempey in the stands, like knocking people out.

I mean, it's absolute chaos. I tried to say when I was writing it, like, I stopped short of actually saying that I think the flyers could truly hang with the Rangers. Like, I was a coward about it. But I was like, I don't know. It's hockey, man. We spent all this time talking about how horrible the Eastern Conference playoff. races. This is hockey, man,

any one of those terrible teams is going to go out and beat Boston or something like that, because that's just how it goes. Do we not feel like, and last I chatted about, you got Islanders, Flyers, on Monday night, right? Islanders Flyers Monday night.

If the Islanders win that, is that the matchup we should be, should we be trying to will Rangers, Islanders into existence? Like, is that what we want? I think like a month ago I would have said that when there was that stretch a few weeks ago where the islanders look I don't want to say like a legit contender but it seems like they went on that hot streak and they look like the team out of that mess of mediocrity like at the bottom of the Eastern Conference playoff race they look like someone who could actually come in and do some damage they look like a group that actually was I like trying to win games you know not. not Philly in the cabs trading losses and the Red Wings collapsing and whatever. It seemed like the Islanders were heating up at the right time.

And it seemed like they were going to be the ones that kind of emerged from the muck. But now it's like, you know, they went in the tank after that, after that little hot streak too. So I don't know. That's kind of a good question. I've sold myself on the idea of Philly Rangers being fun. But I could be persuaded definitely that the islanders are worth taking seriously again for sure. I'm still scarred from that first round series Islanders Rangers in 94 where it was six love, six love in the first two games.

And Islanders went right down into the tank and the Rangers went on to win the cup. That was a very dark spring for 14 year old Mark Lazarus. I was going to say you were like prime prime age to be just like devastated by that, too. That was the most important thing going on in your life for when the Rangers won the Rangers won the Stanley Cup during finals week because we went to school into like late June. And I had to like the the walk to the bus stop that. morning, the day after the Rangers won the cup was one of the darkest days of my life.

I'm like, I had to sit here and all my friends or Rangers fans, and I had to go in here and just hear it all day long. I don't think I realize how many Rangers fans there are on Long Island. Oh, yeah. There's a lot. My brother-in-law is from Long Island, and he is a Rangers fan. Like, the first I met him, I was like, what? How did that happen?

There's four million people on Long Island. There's probably more Rangers fans than Islanders fans among them. People very confused by New York Sports. They think that if you like the Mets, you have to also like the Jets and the Nets because they rhyme? This is something I've been battling for 20 years since I left New York. It's just because the teams rhyme, there's no, there's no rhyme or reason why you have to like any of these teams.

You can like the Giants and the Mets and you can like the Yankees and the Jets. It doesn't make any sense to me. You're Mets and Giants, right? I am, yeah. Mets and Giants, not Mets and Jets. Ladd's, you'd appreciate this. My last year of high school was 1994 and I grew up in Vancouver. and the night of my

my graduation like prom was between games three and four I think of the Stanley Cup final and the Rangers were staying at the hotel where we had our prom. And I, you know, as I was a huge hockey fan all of us, all of us that were hockey fans. You should have punched Mark Messier in the face for me.

Yeah, that would have gone. There's a line. There's a line. I was covered in the awards back when Jonathan T. Taze was up for like the Selke every year. He was up for like the Messier leadership, that nonsense award. Yeah, the Mark Messier Award for Excellence presented by Mark Masier. Exactly.

And so there's a messier availability and I need to ask him a question about Jonathan Taze for a story for the Sun Times. And like, I'm in my mid-30s. I'm a grown-up at this point. And it's my first time ever being in the same room or talking to Mark Messier. And I could still feel the bile rising in my throat, just looking at him. I'm like three feet from him. I'm like, this man could break me with his pinky.

and I'm still like, I kind of want to punch him. I kind of want to punch him. I kind of want to punch him. You ruined my life. You ruined everything. 1994. I was 14 years old.

I cover the Blackhawks, man. I have to walk past that Michael Jordan statue every single day. I'm a Knicks fan. Those mid-90s Nix teams were my favorite teams ever. And I would have seen the Patrick Ewing would have a couple of rings if Michael Jordan never existed.

And I got to walk past that damn statue every single morning. They should have put up a Charles Smith statue next to the Jordan statue. you. Missing layups after layups. This is the other sports.

We're not talking about about hockey, apparently. This is we've got, we've got baseball, NBA and in NFL. Let's go. The NFL too. All right, yeah, we better get this back on.

Let me ask you guys, let me ask you guys this because I'd like to hit on some of these Western Conference matchups too. But I want to look at two wild card teams real quick. one is Tampa Bay. They're 8-1-1 in their last 10.

The other is Nashville, and they're on a heater, you know, a six-week heater. If you had to choose right now which team you would not want to face as a Wal-Card team, would you pick, I don't want to face Tampa

because of the pedigree, or is it Nashville because they're blazing hot? I think I don't want to face Tampa, I think. Am I right? I'm at or am I wrong? They got the pedigree. That's terrifying. Like when something last six weeks,

like is it still a heater? I've been struggling with that with the press. Like, like they're just, they're just good. That's like they're just, they're a good hockey team. Like we can stop qualifying it.

I know it's, and it is like, you two stuff is funny, whatever. That was like six weeks ago now. Like they've been, they've been, and they,

you know, of course they, on cue, they, they lose a couple, uh, this week. By the way,

it seemed like they had, major, they had a chance to jump Winnipeg's playing horribly. So Nashville, and six in a row, and they look bad in the process, too. So Nashville, you know, kind of ironically, has lost a couple games at the wrong time, because it seemed like they're going to maybe, maybe have a chance to even, to even jump into the, into the third seed in the central there. But yeah, Tampa is Tampa. Like they still have that DNA there where you're just like, get me away from them.

I don't want, I don't want any parts of them in a, in a, in a seven. in game series for as good as Nashville as his played. All that being said, Tampa's, Tampa's it for me. Yeah, it's the Vasaleski factor too. I mean, he's going to look like his old self again. And as great as UC Saros as any is, we've never really seen him do much in the postseason,

whereas we know what Vasilevsky can do in the postseason. So I think, I don't think you want to face either of them right now. I'd much rather face a team like Winnipeg, frankly. That's kind of stumbling to the finish line. But I'll tell you, yeah, I don't want to see Andre Vasilevsky. And like, and for as much credit, it as we gave the Carolinas of the world in Vegas and all these teams that went out and made

major improvements at the deadline like credit where it's deserved right Tampa deserves some too because adding Anthony Duclair has worked out really well for a variety of reasons first first of which being he himself has been good but the balance that he's that he's helped them gain by being like a opt six first line caliber player they could now drop Rainan Hagle down to that second line and play him as like kind of a matchup pair with him and Sorrelli and also mitigate how brutal Steve Samco's been at five on five this season. So they can just go out unless Stephen Samcoe's cook, let him score goals. Don't worry about, you know, about some pretty ugly defensive numbers on his end.

And the end result is like they have two legit, too legit. Their first and second lines are both really productive and kind of have a defined role. So I love what Julian Breezeball I did, even though it flew a little bit under the radar as he was doing it. Yeah, I was skeptical when Tampa was adding at the post at the trade deadline. I'm like, why are they adding? This is like a seventh or an eighth place team. Like this doesn't seem like seems like they should be transitioning into that next phase of either retooling like the Bruins and Penguins did all those years ago or tearing it down. But yeah, I mean, I mean, the east is wide open.

Like the West, the five or six best teams in the league are probably in the West right now. So there's a path out of the East for almost any team other than who has. ever wins the elephant and ranon. So you got to, if you're Tampa, you got to feel pretty good about your chances of making a run here. If they play the way that they've played since the trade deadline, which is solid defensive hockey, their goals against her down, their expected goals against her down at five on five. Like the switch has been flipped.

And then, and, you know, of course, with improved team defensive play, it comes better goaltending usually. One follows the other. And that's been the case with Vasilevsky, too. You guys said he's looked more. like himself now too. So if they're a good defensive team and they're getting like B plus Vasilevsky

in that conference like during during the playoffs like they're going to be scary. If you're Florida, if you're the Panthers, is the nightmare scenario not Tampa Bay who's four back in Toronto but they have two head to head games with the leads? If you're the Panthers,

isn't that your nightmare scenario that Tampa Clause Toronto pulls them into a wild card spot and jumps into the the three spot and its first round, Tampa, Florida. Wouldn't that be yours? You would much rather face Toronto than face Tampa right now if you're Florida. 100%.

I'll take, I'll take, I'll take, I'll take, I'll take, I'll take, I'll take, all this last ground in the next 17 or 18 days. It's going to be because Vaselowski went nuclear. clear, right? It's going to be because he was the best guy on the ice for it for two straight weeks. And that is terrifying. Yeah, big time. One other thing before we look at some of those Western matchups, and we're talking about Nashville. And look, and like you said, Sean, like we've all had some fun with ha ha, ha, Andrew Brunette took away the YouTube concert, whatever. But, you know, in hindsight, clearly it was a turning point for that team, or at least

it seemed to galvanize them. And I guess my question is, where does Brunette fall for you guys in the coach of the year conversation? Because I think most of us at the halfway mark, but it's Tockeets, there's nobody else, maybe Torella, but still what Tocke did in Vancouver is remarkable. I mean, does Brunette get some love here? And is it enough? Just the singular U-2 thing because it became a talking point and because it literally looked like a coach pushing the buttons, does that push him into the mix here?

I think it does largely because broadcasters vote on the Jack Adams, and they love a narrative. Absolutely. They love it. I mean, Rick Tocket should be the, I'm not here to slag on Brunette. Rick Tockett should be the coach of the year, and that pressure cooker situation in Vancouver, to have that team be one of the best in the league, he's got a plus 50-something goal differential. He's done the best coaching job. But, oh, man, do broadcasters love a narrative?

And it's going to be Tortorella and Brunette, you know, if the flyers make the playoffs, Tortorale is going to siphon a lot of those votes. And if the predators keep this up, they're going, oh, man, they eat that stuff up. So I think that's the X factor here. Rennett's like 2B for me right now. But who knows what happens over the next 18 days? I, like, Laz, I think you kind of alluded to this. I think like, I feel like even more than most awards, the Jack Adams, is a narrative-based,

even though that's true of all these awards. Let's get real. Oh, yeah. But also kind of set pretty early on, especially when some. someone like Tuckett, who was a broadcaster himself, an extremely well-like personable dude who has a rep of, you know, being willing to talk and all that sort of stuff. He as a coach was good to broadcasters, which which always helps. And then the fact that Vancouver just kind of, you know, they came out as hot as they did.

I think that kind of calcified pretty early on where it's like, this is, this is the guy. But if you're looking for number two, I think it's going to be a really interesting race between Torts and Brunette for sure. And like Brunette's 2B for me right now, but I think there's enough time left where that could change. Is Spencer Carberry even in the mix for anybody? And I ask that because, you know,

I'm just double-checking, yeah, minus 31 gold differential. Can you win the Jack Adams of the minus 31 goal differential? No, Washington's there by default. This is not a, I mean, he's done a nice job. I don't want to diminish it, but they're there by default.

This is not a good team that he has been coaching. Here's why he could pop up pretty high on ballots. It's because the caps are probably going to make the playoffs, almost certainly going to make the playoffs at this point. And people are going to be looking to explain how it happened. They're going to be like, what the hell? Like, what went down in Washington this year to create a scenario where they end up in third place in the men's,

or whatever they are. There's no logical explanation to it. You know, Charlie Lindgren was hot for a while. They won a bunch of one goal games. That's why the caps are here more than anything, right? Their record in one goal games is sick. And whether that's luck or skill or whatever combination of it is, you know, that's that's why they are where they are. But people are going to say like, who did this? Why are we looking at a playoff bracket that has the caps in it? And it's like not completely out of the question that Spencer Carberry did have like a major. a major part to play here. And people are going to be like, yeah, sure,

it must be the coach because it sure as hell isn't like the mix of players or the or the performance. So yeah, yeah, we'll put him number three on the ballot. Why not? Hockey coaching is so random. I don't want to say these guys are a dime a dozen other than like every now and then you have a Barry Trots who can come in and fundamentally change the way a team plays hockey.

Like when he came to the islanders, they went from literally the worst defensive team in the league to the best in his first year. Very few coaches have that kind of impact. It's so much of this is random. and it's so dependent on the players. I mean, you look at like a Jay Woodcroft situation where he was like the best coach and then he was the worst coach.

Was either of them really his fault? I don't really know. So I feel like most of these guys, you know, you have to look at the bigger picture and what Tocket has done in a very difficult situation to be successful. Vancouver is very hard to win in. It just is.

I think that's as much of the X's and O's, it's about the vibe you create for a hockey team. Like here in Chicago, Luke Richardson has one of the worst records in NHL history after two years. But everyone thinks he's doing a fantastic job because as bad as it's been here, the vibe's been pretty good among the players. And that's like the coach's number one job is to just create a good situation.

And I feel like Talk gets done the best job of that. Luke Richardson, head coach of the Chicago Blackhawks and head vibe curator. He's doing a great job. You might have the best job security in the league. And he's coming off two worst seasons in the NHL history. You know what's funny too? that and Sean, you guys mentioned this last week on the pod. It's kind of crazy that Peter LaViolette in his first year with the Rangers

could win the president's trophy and not a single person has been like, oh, yeah, Peter LaViolette should be in the, in the, like, imagine winning a president's trophy in your first year and nobody talks about you. Everyone's just decided like, yeah, we're like, LaVolet, he's, he's fine, B plus. Like, they're just hired of him. Yeah, exactly, totally. well look the other thing that i did want to hit on before we let you go is the western conference playoff picture because we we chat a little bit about the east and

the west is a little bit more interesting like last said it feels like there's six heavy weights there that you all think that they could you know potentially win the stanley cup and and and you know it's going to be tough to get out of the first round for some of these some of these teams and as we look at the matchups again all the subject to change but as we wake up on Monday, it's Dallas against the LA Kings, it's Colorado against the suddenly slumping Winnipeg jets,

Vancouver, Nashville feels like everyone's picking Nashville and admitted to Vegas, which could be a conference final in an alternate universe, but it's a first rounder. I mean, these are all really weirdly, I think Dallas, L.A. for me,

has the least kind of interest or cachet. I agree. But you could talk me into any one or the other three because of Hellebuck, Soros, you know, all these things, all those other series could go seven games, right? Totally. And you said it about Vancouver Nashville. I hope that happens. I hope that's what the matchup is.

And I would love to see some kind of quantification of how many people pick against the Pacific Division winning Vancouver Canucks in the first round. because it'll be 70s, 80s, like, it's going to be, the consensus choice is going to be, it's going to be Nashville. But yeah, I still think the potential drama of Edmonton, Vegas is going to be fascinating, right? Because we're going to have the question, will Mark Stone come back? Like, is he going to, you know, come out, come out for pregame skate? Like, you can just see that kind of rolling down, kind of rolling downhill, right? And I think the fact that that was a Western Conference final last year, that there is so much,

star power there that starts with McDavid. I think the fact that we're getting a true, potentially a true conference final caliber matchup in the first round is, is going to be fun. So that's, that's the, that's the pick for me. Yeah, the series I want is Dallas, Colorado. And we might just have to wait around for that. I think that's the two best teams in the conference for me. Yeah. And that's

the series I want to see. That series I want to cover, frankly. I want to be part of that series. But I, Eminton Vegas has, I'm sure that the Edmonton press court, and I have a lot of good friends in the Edmonton press court, they're delightful people. I'm sure that they won't mind at all about the salary captioned at against of the Vegas Golden Knights, and that won't be a storyline at all if Mark Stone returns. Nobody will even mention it, I don't think.

It'll be they're going to be tripping over themselves to write that story. There's going to be nine columns coming out of Edmonton about captioning against. Vegas wins the first two games in Edmonton. Can you imagine? Oh, my God. story. The story is this. The league the NHL is a shambles. Oh, and the, the Vegas

Golden Knights leap out to a 2-0 series lead behind Mark Stone and Tamas Hurtle. They've combined for five goals and nine points in the first two games. It'll be fine. They'll be referred to as the 97 million dollar Vegas golden night

because you can just see it. And just like you can totally see the path where Nashville wins game one. Vancouver and like like Vancouver like out shoots Nashville 52 35 and PDOs finally catch it up to them. Nashville wins three to one with an empty netter and you could just like all these things that you can just see happening right. It's, uh, I'm with you. I,

I would love to know if it's Vancouver, Nashville and all the experts and we make all our picks. I'm with you. I think 65% of people will pick Nashville. No joke. I think that's probably, I think that's probably the overrun. The overrunner will set it at like 66.5% or whatever. And it would be a smart pick.

I mean, let's face it. The hot hand, the better, the better goalie. I don't know if it was the better goalie, but equal goalies at the very, at the very least. I mean, especially if Demko is, you know, he's dealing with a lower body injury. He's missed a bunch of time. And you know who knows, who knows how that looks.

You can't discount the pressure factor. Like, no, you know, we're joking about all these Canadian markets in Edmonton and Vancouver in Toronto, but it really is different. Like, you know, nobody in Dallas is sweating the stars right now. Like they're not, you know, they're not under that same kind of pressure in Denver as they are in Edmonton, as they are in Vancouver, as they are in Toronto. And that really does, I don't think it makes as big a difference as sometimes we like to make it out to be. But it's there. It's felt. It's noticed. Definitely. Yeah. Sean, before we let you go, a couple things. First of all, you're a Pittsburgh guy. and Rob Rossi had the story on the weekend of they finally tracked down the Yager

bobbleheads. And I'm wondering, like, what was the actual interest level for people in Pittsburgh, like Penguins fans about the origin of what happened? Like, well, how do that story actually play out in Pittsburgh? If first things first, I would like to dispel the rumor that the extortion call came from my home on the, on the, on the, on the, on the, on the, on the, that was not. true. I had no role in the in the in the in the in the theft. Um, that was the biggest story in town for three days, let's say. Like it was it was it was it was like leads the local news level,

you know, uh, like a that caliber of, uh, of, of, of story here. So yeah, for Rob the for Rob to for Rob to, for Rob to lock that down, man. I, I knew it was in the works too, because of course, you know, Rossi keeps me abreast on all facets of his life at all time. So I, so I knew that he was working on, on the story. And man, he delivered, he delivered in a big way. I love it. I'm just glad. I'm glad it works out for Kevin Acklin, honestly. He was the president of business ops for the Penguins. He's a good dude. And, you know, this was like the whole, the whole thing was his baby. It was Kevin Acklin's idea to bring back Yager to, you know, have the, have the ceremony set up the way that it was to create the bobbleheads and whatever. So it's, so to see,

that go down, I felt my initial thought was like, I feel bad for Kevin. So for it to work out for him and for everybody to get the thing that they signed up for, which is a huge deal, especially with the team going in the tank like it has over the last month or so. It's, you know, all as well, it ends well. It's a great story. I would have happily traded one of my 14 Alexei Marozo bobbleheads that I got in the early 2000s. If you have a, I, that reminds me, if you have any actors laying around, I'll shoot you my address. I got, I got, I got Rick Eho, Johann Headberg, Joey Mullen, I think. Just bubble wrap it.

Bubble wrap the Morozov. Bubble has very carefully and send it east. I love it. Hey, all right. Well, we'll send you on your way. Wednesday edition of the pod coming up with you and Macandoo. And it's this, I can't remember now. Is this a Frank Corrado week or not a Frank Corrado?

This is a Frankie week. Congrats everybody. Yeah, you get Frank this week. Because God knows me and me and Macandoo. I need you to ask him why he's blocked me on Twitter. I've never met or interacted with him, but I'm blocked by him. I need to know. I'll text him.

I'll text him when we hang up here. I'll have an answer. No if he's reaching with the man whatsoever. I'll be efforting for an answer shortly. Yes. Yeah. Love it. All right.

Well, we'll look forward to listening to you guys on Wednesday. And thanks for dropped by the Monday pot. Awesome. Thank you guys. All right. Las, let's bring in our pal, Jesse Granger. As we always do on a Monday, a little segment, we like to call Granger Things. Brought to you by Bet MGM.

the exclusive betting partner with the athletic. And, you know, Jesse, last and I were talking earlier in the show about hockey pranks. It's April Fool's Day. Hockey pranks and things that you could do to teammates or whatever. And I got a legitimate question for you. Because last and I were talking about how, you know, sometimes guys would put scotch tape at the bottom of skate blades

and somebody would go out and they wipe out. You're a goalie. You can never prank a goalie's equipment. Can you? Like, that's off. That should be off limits, right? I mean, I feel like as long as it's obvious enough that the goalie's going to find out before the game starts, I think it should be fair game. You can't have the guy going out there with like, like, and finding it out halfway through the game that the lace is on his glove. Yeah, yeah. But gloves got a hole in it. In my experience, the goalies are usually the ones doing the prankings. So they're, they're always on the other side of that.

I did cover Mark Andre Fleury for five years. So, um, he. We were talking about that. Do you think that if anyone, literally any other player in the entire NHL pulled the crap that Flurry pulls, he'd be the least popular player in the league. Only Flurry can get away with this stuff. He,

there is something special about that guy being able to get away with because he's kind of like, like not dirty, but he borderlines it even on the ice. Like if you're, anyone who's tried to screen Mark Andre Fleury can tell you that the back of their legs doesn't feel great afterwards.

He, yeah, he does get away. way with some stuff that maybe other guys couldn't just because like he just and when you ask him about it like I remember in the playoffs one year he was he gave the guy a wet willy in the middle of the like stuck his finger in the player's ear and we asked him after the game like what the heck are you doing right there and he's like oh I just I thought I'd have a little fun over by myself and it's like well how are you going to be mad at that like he just giggles in that little high-bitched voice of his it's

like oh mark yep yep yeah I remember one time he taped all of Jonathan Marshall so sticks together, like 50 of them, a giant bundle of sticks and threw him out on the ice. So, Marcia still had to skate out on the ice and cut all of his sticks apart before he could practice that day. That's what I mean, like, like, this is kind of jerky stuff to do. Like, it's once in a while. It's funny. He's really getting relentlessly.

And if it was literally any other player, they wouldn't be able to get a job in the NHL. But I was like, oh, flower. Yeah. See, he can give a wet willy to somebody on the ice. Brad Marchand licks a guy. And it's like, wow, this is awful. This is terrible. Oh, man.

You've played hockey a long time. You've been a goalie for a long time. Has anybody ever pranked you? Man, not that I can remember. Maybe when I was young, nothing as an adult sticks out. I can't remember anything as a kid either. Maybe a long time ago,

I can't remember ever getting pranked. I didn't have anyone on my team clever enough, I guess. One time I put my goalie pads on backwards, not even prank. That was just, I just wasn't panicked. attention when I put them on and I stood up and started walking out to the ice and I'm like, this feels so weird.

What's going on? I realized, yeah, no, these are on the wrong legs. That's got to be hard to do the way that goalie pads are structured. Yeah. This is a long time ago. This is when I was younger. They didn't have the butterfly pads. It wasn't the, you didn't have the landing plates like they do now.

It would be very difficult to do it nowadays. Yeah. Yeah. Would it almost be impossible, wouldn't it? Yeah. Yeah. It would almost be like putting your left shoe in the right sneaker type of. Jesse was a big crisscross fan growing up.

Oh, man. Hey, Jesse, we love talking goaltending with you. And on the weekend, you had a really interesting piece about goaltending, you know, using Jonathan Quick as kind of a leaping off point. Can you actually just tell the listeners a little bit about, one of the things that's most fascinated in your story is that USA hockey is hosting, and I think it's in at the end of May, early June, a goalie symposium, like a summit of goalies.

And they've never done this before. I actually think it's a brilliant idea. Yeah, it's going to be a lot of fun. I'm hoping to be there. I'm already registered for it. We'll see how the Golden Knights playoff run goes. That could run into that. So we'll see.

But hoping to be at the symposium in Minnesota. And so they do goalie camps every summer USA hockey. But this is the first time they've done a big goalie-specific symposium. They have had hockey symposiums where they bring a goalie guest or two. But this one is going to be just goalies. They're going to have. pro goalie coaches, Division 1 college goalie coaches, junior goalie coaches, and some retired NHL or some retired Olympians who actually were out on the ice. So basically the best and brightest

minds in goaltending for the U.S. are all going to get together in Minnesota and just talk about the direction of the position. And one of the big things that USA hockey has been pushing since 2016 is they've got this goal in mind that they're calling the 51 and 30. And a Essentially what that means is they, USA wants to have 51% of the total ice time played in the NHL by goalies, by American goalies, which is an incredibly lofty goal to have 51% of the ice time. And you mentioned how much maybe progress they've made in that. And it's pretty impressive.

I mean, you look at like, I entered this story looking at the U.S. goalies. And the U.S. is stacked in net right now. I mean, Connor Hellebuck is going to win the Vezina. He's the best goal. in the world right now at this moment. And then they've got Jake Ottinger, Jeremy Swayman, Thatcher Demko, John Gibson, who's an excellent goalie, like has no shot at making a three goalie team

when he would be, there's plenty of countries out there that would love to have John Gibson as their starting goalie, and he won't even... Including Canada. When I was up in Toronto, man, this is all they think about in Canada is what the Olympic teams are going to look like. They are terrified of the American goalie situation

because they have a terrible goalie situation up north right now. Yeah, a Jordan Bennington, bounce back. That's very important for Canada because he is their hope right now. I mean, it was Aiden Hill going into the year after an injury riddled season for him. He hasn't, he hasn't had the season he hoped. Look to me, if they had a, if they had a best on best tournament, it would probably be Jordan Bittington in net for Canada right now. But yeah, the U.S. is stacked. And it's funny to me because I go to U.S. I'm talking to the goalie coaches and goalie personnel at USA hockey. And they're like, yeah, we're really pumped with how we're doing

at the top of the statistics. Like, we've got some really elite goalie. right now, but we still don't have the depth that we want. And they're trying to get to that 51% arc by 2030. So I went back and looked, 2007 was when the USA, team USA hired a full-time goalie coach. And they really said, look, we're like back then, it was pretty ugly, the goalies the U.S. had. And they made a point of trying to improve that position in 2007. And at that point, Canada had 47% of the ice time in the NHL for goalies.

And the U.S. was all the way down at 11%. And then I threw Russia in there because Russia's had quite the resurgence also. So Russia had 7%. So 47% for Canada, 11% for the U.S. and 7% for Russia. You fast forward to this season and it is drastically different. Canada has dropped down to 29% of the goalie minutes in the NHL. The U.S. is all the way up to 21.7%. So not quite at Canada's level, but basically doubled what they were at.

And then Russia is all the way up to 16% from 7%. So Russia and the U.S. have made huge gains in terms of total ice time for goalies in the NHL, while Canada has kind of, I guess those gains have taken away from Canada's dominance. Canada is still number one there, but not anywhere close to the share that they used to have. So for the U.S. to say we want 51%, and Canada didn't even have that in 2007, like that's a really, probably an unrealistic goal. But I guess it's one of those things where like, let's just shoot for the highest goal we can. and we'll see how high we can get that number. But it is impressive what USA hockey is done with the goalies lately. What do you chalk that up to besides, you know, just hockey becoming more and more popular in the States?

It used to be like every goalie was Finnish or French Canadian. What is it about Americans now that that seems to be feeding this kind of goalie pipeline? Well, I think the US NDT, that whole program, you're seeing better hockey players, period, coming out of America. Like I think, I think America has figured out hockey development in general, the sport development. And then with that, you're going to get some good goalies. So I think that's a big part of it. To me, when I, so I wrote a story last year about how Russia was kind of dominating with Vaselowski and Shasturkin and Sorokin and Bob Brovsky.

So I talked to a lot of people about maybe the Russian like theories and development for goalies, just their overall big picture, what they think about the position. And then I did a story with Eric DeHajek earlier this year about why Canada hasn't produced as many. And now I've talked to the U.S. goalie people. And like, all of that information is fan is so interesting to me because when I talk to people in Canada about why Canada hasn't produced as many good goleys, a lot of them say that the position has become over technicalized. And we're too worried about being in the exact right position. And you've got coaches that are holding kids hands a little too much saying this is exactly how you're supposed to make every save. And then when the kid gets out there on the ice and they don't have the goalie coach in their ear telling them everything, they don't know how to solve the puzzle themselves because they've been told how to solve the puzzle.

puzzle too many times and they haven't had to figure it out. And then I talked to USA goalie coaches and it was interesting to me that they, I asked them, what do you think is going so right in goalie development? And they basically said, they're doing the opposite. They said, we, we want these goalies to be individuals. We tell our goalie coaches, like from the very top, like the goal, the director of goaltending for USA hockey, they hold all these clinics and it obviously filters down to the coaches at every level. And what they're saying is we're telling our goalie coaches, there isn't a magical, like, this isn't exactly where the glove is supposed to be held for every goalie in the world. This isn't the exact time you're supposed to go down to the butterfly.

You have to get to know your goalie and let them do the things that make them good. And I asked, what do you, I asked the goalie coaches, like, when you look at Hellebuck and Demko and Ottinger, what, what like commonalities do you see in their game? And he said, none really. I think they're all different style goalies. And that's the point. That's what we're hoping for. sometimes you can tell a goalie's nationality just by the way he plays, oh, that's a Swedish guy. Oh, that's a Russian goalie. And that's what they don't want to happen

with USA hockey. They want their goalies to keep their individuality. And I think it's admirable. It's tough. I think when a parent is paying a goalie coach to coach their kid and the goalie coach isn't giving them specific. Like you're not seeing like actual the goalie coach changing his technique. I think it can be a tough sell. And I think maybe that's why in Canada, some of the private goalie coaches have gone. so technical because they're trying to prove that they're doing something, they're making money. So it is a very difficult thing, I think, developing young goalies. And I think that USA has found some interesting things that seem to be working right now.

But I do think it's cyclical. I think Canada is going to have their day not too long from now. Now, Jesse, you mentioned you're registered for the goalie symposium. Is Jesse Granger registered as a journalist? or is Jesse Granger registered as a goalie? It's so it's actually not. This one is there's no on-ice stuff. So you can't register as a player,

but you can't register as a coach. So I am not a coach. I even ask the guy, like, when I register, like, what do I, because it asks you like, what team do you coach? I do not have one of those,

I do not coach a team. So I had to explain to them that I'll just be there as a journalist. But yeah, it's going to be a lot of fun. I think they're going to like put us in groups and it's just going to be kind of a, a brainstorming of the position and how it can get better. It should be a lot of fun.

I'm really looking forward to it. That's very cool. Very cool. I got to take a little bit of issue with something Laz said a few minutes ago. When Laz said, you know, all they talk about is in Canada is the Olympic team and who's going to be on it. Sure. You guys are obsessed with the Olympic team.

No, we are obsessed with when are we going to win a Stanley Cup again? When is it coming back north of the border? This is the year, though, right, guys? this is it. No. Probably not. But also in all seriousness, nobody in Canada,

we don't care about not. Like if you're a fan of Toronto, you're not thinking, okay, if the Leafs get knocked out, why gee, I hope Vancouver wins the cup so the cup comes home.

Yeah, nobody's rooting for Toronto, that's for sure up there. Nobody thinks like that up here. I do want to make that clear. Nobody actually, except for Winnipeg, I kind of feel like everyone's had a bit of a soft spot for Winnipe.

I was just going to say, what about the Jets? Because even not being in Canada, to me, it feels like it's hard to hate on that team. Yes, it is. Yeah. They're likable. They're likable. But guys, is this the, like, and Jesse, maybe you got the odds there. You can lay this out for us.

Is this the year actually that if we're going to say that there's a chance, this is the year because there's a number of good teams? I mean, the odds suggest it. So on BEDMGM, you can actually bet which country will win the standard. the Cup. And right now, the USA is minus 350 favorite. Makes sense. They have most of the teams and they've won quite a few in a row. Canada plus 250. So plus 250, you're only getting two and a half to one odds to bet that Canada will win the cup. And I mean, there's four of the top 10 teams. You're really getting those four, right? Vancouver, Edmonton, Toronto, and Winnipeg. To me, I agree with you. It does feel like the best chance Canada's had because I think all four of those teams can

legitimately win the cup. I think normally you're saying in most years it's, well, Toronto, they're really talented. We'll see what they can do. And then you've got like an eight seed here or there that might like maybe maybe, maybe Winnipeg will surprise people. This year, Vancouver has been the best team in the West for most of the season. Edmonton is hitting its stride at the right moment. Toronto, they haven't been as good, but maybe this is the year that we don't expect as much out of them and they actually overperforming the playoffs. And then you've got Winnipeg that they get no respect, but they have the best goal in the league and they're strong from top to bottom. I, I think there's four legitimate teams that can win the cup in Canada.

What do you think, Mark? I agree, but the problem is this year, and we talked about this a lot last week, is there's like 11 or 12 teams that can win the Stanley Cup overall. So the odds are still heavily in America's favor. I still think Colorado and Dallas, for my money are the two best teams in the league. They're the teams that if I were a gambling man, I would give money on. You got to worry about the Rangers with Shasturkin.

You got to worry about L.A. can make a run. Yeah, this is Nashville the way they're playing. like there are teams all over the place that can win. So yeah, this is the most Canadian teams we've had in a while that feel like legitimate contenders, but this is the most teams overall that feel like legitimate contenders. So I still think the math plays out similarly as it has in recent seasons. Yeah, that's a good point. And really Vancouver is the great disruptor in this, right?

Because Edmonton and Toronto have kind of been perennial cup contenders last three, four years. Winnipeg even at times last year people thought were pretty good it's Vancouver that just kind of came out of nowhere and all of a sudden they could win the president's trophy or win their division and man I

so 250 so basically two and a half to one is what you're saying I don't know I think I would want better odds just again just yeah exactly it all yeah based on how long it's been yeah and the thing I would look at also is like if you look at the actual bracket

of the playoffs. It's almost, we're almost certainly going to get Vancouver versus the wild card in the Pacific side. And then Edmonton and Vegas, I think Edmonton can beat Vegas. Vegas beat them last year. That to me, that's a, I've never had a more coin toss series in my life than Vegas Edmonton. I think it's either of those teams going. But if you get Edmonton through, Vancouver should beat the wild card. You've now got, Edmonton, Vancouver. You've got one of them in the conference final right there, just no matter what happens. So I do think that like you're going to, if you were to make this bet, you're going to have a live team for a while. Unless something crazy happens in Vancouver loses to the wild card.

I do think that like that, just the bracket of it kind of helps you on that. But we were talking about this earlier with Gentilly. Nashville, if they play Vancouver, don't you kind of feel like a lot of people will lean towards taking the predators given they're on a heater or like that again, maybe they're not on a heater. This is who they are. But they're going to come in with momentum. They're going to have a goalie that can at least match Demko, if not, you know, outplay them.

Maybe, you know, Quinn Hughes might win the Norris, but there's a lot of people to tell you, Romaniosi, like, it's almost like you can see the argument for this being a sawoff. Don't you feel like Nashville could really push Vancouver? I mean, yeah, with UCSaurus, you could always win. I do think Vancouver's the better team. I think they have more scores. I think that Nashville seems like the kind of team that they could go on a scoring drought in the playoffs, just because teams kind of tighten up and start focusing on matchups.

And they don't have a ton of depth scoring at the top of their lineup. They've got, like obviously, Forsberg's amazing. But they don't have the same depth as Vancouver does in terms of putting the puck in the net. But I do think that Nashville plays the style of hockey that lends itself to the playoffs. They're physical. They're super intense. They roll four lines. They pressure you on the forecheck.

I think that that translates well to the playoffs. And I think while Vancouver has gotten better at that, like that seems to be the style that gives them issues is pressure and physicality. Yeah. Listen, this is going to be a lot of fun as we were talking about this kicking this off in April, finally it feels like the playoffs are around the corner. And I love the fact, too, that you're not sure if you can go to a goalie symposium at the end of May because the team that you cover might still be playing. Whereas Las and I started on 20th.

Yeah, we're wide open. I've covered six seasons. I mean, I've covered six seasons, and they've been in the conference final, four of them. So like, I'm playing the odds here. It's, it's, they've been there more than. Jesse, my first three years on this, in this job, I went, Stanley Cup, overtime of game seven of the conference final, Stanley Cup.

So it'll happen to you. Yeah. Well, I mean. Considering the age and health of all the players on the Golden Knights and the prospect pool, I have no doubt that it eventually will happen. But right now, I'm pretty busy deep into the summer most. Absolutely. All right.

We'll leave it there. Guys, this was a lot of fun, as always. And we're leaving this on a bit of a cliffhanger. Because coming up on Wednesday, we're going to find out. Why did Frank Carrotto block Mark Lazarus on Twitter? We'll get the answer. inquiring minds want to know. Inquiring minds want to know.

That's your next edition of the athletic hockey show Wednesday. Gentilly McIndoo, Carado. That comes your way on Wednesday. And thanks for listening to the Monday edition of the pod. We had a lot of fun putting this one together. Leave us a five-star rating and review. If you are enjoying the show, have a great week, and Laz and I'll hit you up again.

Next month.