The Athletic Hockey Show - Fleury & Giroux headline trade deadline 22, Jay Woodcroft's Oilers are figuring it out, Zdeno Chara ties a record and did Nathan MacKinnon get away with one?

Episode Date: February 23, 2022

On the Wednesday The Athletic Hockey Show, Rob Pizzo from CBC Sports returns to the roundtable, along with Jesse Granger and Sara Civian. This week, the panel discusses the trade deadline which is now officially less than a month away. We discuss possible landing spots for Marc-Andre Fleury and Claude Giroux, we ask if Nathan MacKinnon received star treatment for not landing a suspension for making contact with an official, and we stick tap Zdeno Chara who ties Chris Chelios's all time mark for regular season games played by a defensemen.Daniel Nugent-Bowman from the Athletic joins the roundtable to give us an update on the rejuvenated Edmonton Oilers under interim head coach Jay Woodcroft who are 5-1 heading into Wednesday night's game in Tampa Bay, and we ask can the Oilers win with their current goaltending?In our twitter segment, we hear listener opinions on the ECHL's Orlando Solarbears signing noted pest Sean Avery to a contract to play in Florida. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I'm back. Welcome to the athletic roundtable. I am Rob Bezo from CBC Sports, joined as always by Sarah Sivian and Jesse Granger. And the big question, did you miss me? And how much? I missed you a lot.

On a scale of one to ten, a million. Wow. I thought, you know, I'll be honest with you. I listened to the first podcast that you guys did without me. And as I'm listening, my first reaction was, Oh shit Jesse's really good And I thought

My first thing was I thought Oh man I'm getting Wally Pipped here Like I'm absolutely getting Wally Pipped He knows what he's doing I texted our producer Jeff I'm like please still like me in three weeks Because this is this is And then Sarah texts me after the show

I think you got Wally Pipped Jesse was your guy I'm like oh I'm out of here And I'm like all right Please please please have me back But yeah I've been busy on Olympic duty for CBC and I was on Beijing time for three weeks.

So if I fall asleep halfway through this podcast, guys, please forgive me because that's what I keep doing. I keep falling asleep midway through the day and waking up in the middle of the night. The other thing I wanted to bring up about my time away, you know, obviously I was on like hardcore focus on the Olympics. So I'd kept a side eye on what's going on in the NHL, but for the first time in a long time, that was kind of secondary. So when I was getting ready to do this show, I started, you know, I got to catch up on anything I might have missed. tell me if I missed anything because it's been an eventful three weeks since I left. We've got two teams with new coaches, one of which is Marty St. Louis. Jack Eichols playing hockey again.

Crosby has 500 goals, Tuka Rask retired, Yagerger's 50, and Trevor Zegras because apparently play hockey blindfold. Did I miss anything? Or am I caught up? I think you covered it. They played hockey on the Bellagio Fountains. I guess that goes along with the blindfold thing. But yeah, it was an eventful few weeks in hockey, especially for me in Vegas.

What is going on? Yeah, for you in Vegas, it's just, it's been a crazy couple weeks. And I was like, wow, I missed a lot of good shows. And just big thanks to Mike Russo and Sean Shapiro for jumping in. But like I said, I am back. So we got a lot we're going to talk about today. And we're also going to hear from Daniel Nugia Bowman, who writes for the athletic in regards to the oilers who, oh, yeah, that's another thing that's happened over the last few weeks.

The Oilers are good again. They're actually winning hockey games again with a new coach. But we'll get to that in the second segment. I know you guys touched on this a lot last week, but trade deadline day is less than a month away. Before we even get to some of the finer points, because we're probably going to talk about trade deadline day every single show up until March 21st. How big is it on your calendar? You know, when you circle the big days of the year, how big is it for you? Is it trade deadline day?

Is that the biggest one? Is it free agency? Is it beginning of the playoffs? What's that number one day where you're like, I can't wait for that day. Sarah, we'll start with you. It's funny because the hurricanes, even as they've become perennial playoff team, they don't tend to do much at the trade deadline. They're always a big off-season team and always a big drafting team no matter what.

So the trade deadline is kind of anticlimatic, but I've been leaning into that. And I'm all like, I used to in the beginning of my career, hate writing about it because it's just like you're making things up. But now I totally lean into it. And I'm like, I'm going to make the craziest thing up. Let's do it. What do you think, Jesse? Yeah, my experience, the team I cover is a bit different.

I don't think they've used a draft pick in five years. And if they do, they just trade that player very quickly after drafting them. So yeah, the trade deadline is pretty big in Vegas. I don't know what's bigger. July 1st, the start of free agency or the trade deadline. The Golden Knights are pretty damn active in both. I'm trying to think back. So the first year, the Golden Knights,

tried to acquire Eric Carlson and couldn't. So then they traded a first, second, and third round pick for Tomash Tatar, and then got rid of him immediately. The second year in the trade deadline, they traded for Mark Stone. The third year, they traded for Robin Lennar to replace Mark Andre Fleury. So, yeah, it's been an eventful day for me in the past. I don't, this year, they have no cap space, but I'm still sitting here thinking like, yeah, they're probably going to make the biggest move because that's just what they do.

So, yeah, trade deadline, honestly, I don't have a choice. Like the trade deadline is a big day for me just because I'm in Vegas. I have no other choice. The golden ice are going to do something. It's crazy. It's been one of those days as a Canadian. For a while, it was not that big of a deal. Then it became like the wars between TSN and Sportsnet, where I remember where it was like,

well, we're going to be on for three hours. And then Sportsnet comes, well, we're going to be on for four hours, five hours, six hours. It was a game of whose hockey stick is bigger. And suddenly it turned into like 15 hours of coverage. And it got blown up so big that it felt a lot to me like, like New Year's. Like it's big because we're saying it's big and it's supposed to be big. And how many trade deadlines have we had, especially lately where all the big deals tend to happen in the last two weeks leading up to the deadline.

But how many trade deadlines do you have? And you're like, oh, yeah, there were like 42 trades made. Oh, really? Who moved? I don't know. A bunch of picks, a bunch of prospects. I'm not as excited as I used to be about trade. It's the salary cap.

Yeah. It's the salary cap. And you bring up a good point, though, about coverage. I wonder what ESPN's going to do this year. Maybe it'll be a big event in America now. Yeah, I notice a lot on their website. I do notice, you know, it's suddenly like, well, this is a big deal. And, you know, this year's an interesting one because it's kind of like you mentioned Sarah,

a free agency day. I love how certain free agents suddenly become Wayne Gretzky because they are the best person available. Nothing against Claudeaureau, but I mean, you would think Claudeau just won the heart trophy by how much I've seen Clodgeru's name, you know, in the last week or so. But given you've had a week since you guys discussed this last time and certain names have kind of been brought up and shot down as well, who's the person you can't wait to see if or where they get traded to, Jesse?

Mark Andre Fleury. Yeah. As the goalie. It's the goalie answer. It's the guy who I covered for four years. But also it's just to me, that's the, like, Claude Jureux can make an impact wherever he goes. Klingberg, that's an impact. But I feel like Flurry is the one where if Colorado or Edmonton or Boston or some contender, you add Mark Andre Flurry, it completely changes the entire

outlook of that team going into the stretch run in the postseason. Like I feel like just because goalie is so important and Flurry is who he is, I feel like that's the move that Juru, like if the avs add Juru, it's like, oh my God, another sick forward. Like, are you kidding me? But I feel like Flurry has the, like, he can swing the momentum the most just to me. That's the way I view it. Wherever he goes, that'll be the big move to me in the deadline. Yeah, it's also an unusual circumstance where you don't, we've talked about this before, you don't see goalies being traded mid-season every day and it's bound to happen this season. So obviously that, but I'd say Drew, just because I love a good story and it's kind of like the Ray Bork situation.

Like, I want to see this guy win a cup. Yeah, he's been there for so long. Final year of eight-year deal too. And it's, it's one of those situations where if he wins the cup, it'll still look weird. Like when Bork raised the cup as an ablo, it looked great to me. No, that, yeah, come on. I was a lifelong Bruins fan. I'm weeping. I was a lifelong Avs fan, so it looked great, looked great to me when he lifted that thing. Joe Sackick handed it to him. It's my favorite one. Yeah. One of the classiest moves ever. I mean, how often does the captain be like, here you go, you lift it up first? But I don't remember a trade deadline where so many teams are on that need a goalie list.

you know, capitals, oilers, penguins, avalanche, wild. And I mean, any update on what's going on with Robin Leonard for Vegas. I mean, yeah, I mean, he hasn't skated. A lot of teams need a goalie. Yeah, it's, and they, and like, to me, what makes you, you mentioned the salary, like, the trade deadline, like things don't happen. It's the, it's salary cap. And these last few years, because the flat cap and because teams that expected it to go up,

it hasn't and they're in tougher spots than they expected. I think there are so many contenders in the league. sitting there saying, okay, we want to add this and this and this. And we've got $3.15 to add to add all that. So I feel like that's like the hardest part is making the money work. So these teams are going to be trying to get these like Arizona, ship them through Arizona or the team that's trading the guys got to retain salary. Like there's going to be so many cap gymnastics around this trade deadline. Like that's, to me, that's what makes it not quite as exciting. Like teams just aren't able to, you can't just go out and fix your team. It's you've got all this money.

to worry about. And that's why I think a lot of the deals happen within the two weeks leading up to it. Because I think in the past, when you didn't have that cap to worry about, you were more just worried about the price you're going to give up as far as actual players going the other way. You want the price to go down. You want to do it like a farmer's market in the last hour. Like, all right, we want to get rid of everything. Whereas now GMs are not, they're not going to wait till that last minute. And we talked earlier about the battle between networks. Now, it's just them tippy towing saying, I can't believe all these deals are done already. What God's neighbor we're going to talk about for 13 consecutive hours?

And these poor GMs come out like, we told we're done. We've been done for five days. We told you we're done. And that's why people like us have jobs because we're going to talk about how maybe they're not done. I'm always curious to see how someone like Tampa Bay does because they always seem to add that little third line element that ends up being huge on their playoff run. So like I said, we've got till March 21st, it's what February 23rd. We're probably going to talk trade deadline at some point during every single podcast

between now and then. So get used to it. Nathan McKinnon, not going to get suspended in any way, shape, or form or any kind of supplementary discipline for this. I know we're on a podcast so people can't see the air quotes, but slash on on alignments. Did you guys see this? And did you at any point think in your right minds that Nathan

McKinnon was trying to slash an official because he was upset, Sarah? No, but I do think he's getting star treatment. Like, I don't think it's acceptable. And I don't know. Maybe I just know linesmen and refs quite well. So I get upset when they get hurt or like anything like that happens. But I think you got to be careful. I don't know, Jesse, what you think.

Yeah, I agree with you. I think you can argue that it wasn't intentional, but also you did slash the referee. Like you, maybe you weren't trying to slash him, but you did. And that's not allowed. And you're just like if you didn't mean to high stick the guy, but you did on accident and it cut his lip open, you're sitting in the penalty box for four minutes. So like, it doesn't matter if you wanted to do it or not. So I don't, I'm confused where like that kind of, oh, well, well, you'll get the

penalty because you're in, you have to be in control of your stick. But we're not going to find you because you didn't mean to or we're not going to suspend you because to me that part's confusing. I will say Nathan McKinnon. I'm not going to call Nathan McKinn. and a dirty player, but he gets into those kind of things a lot more off. Like, the more abs hockey I watch, it seems like every night, there's something with Nathan McKinnon where he's like not quite like Brad Marshan level, but he likes to tow that line.

And he's a powerful dude. Like he's like Nathan McKinnon, when he wants to like give you a little shot, like that's a big powerful, strong guy. Like he like Nathan McKinnon's scary sometimes, man. It's a good point though. And that, you know, you're right. He did it. but I remember just seeing it and this is the online world we live in now, you know,

all that had like Nathan McKinnon, attacks official, Nathan McKinnon. And I'm going, holy jeez, like I said, I was in such Olympic mode. I was like, what did I miss here? And I went, watch it. I'm like, okay, he did. But it's kind of like, you know, maybe an errant punch during a fight just happens to clock the linesman on the jaw. Like I just didn't, you know, the complete outrage that came with it was kind of like,

all right, but you're right. He did. He did. He's got to be in control of his stick. It's funny how what we see in the media kind of shapes our opinions because I saw opposite media saying it wasn't a big deal or whatever. And now I'm like, it was kind of a bit. Like I'm playing devil's advocate with that.

You're playing devil's advocate with what you saw. And it all boils down to something in the middle, right? Yeah. I mean, look, clickbait. It exists for a reason. People want, you know, and people were angry. I saw all the anger. That's what I saw.

And I thought, holy jeez, what the hell did Nathan McKinnon do? when I went and watched it and I went, oh, okay. But yes. It was a pretty small play in the end. It wasn't that big of a deal. It wasn't even a slashing penalty if he had hit no sick. Like it just wasn't. Like it's just what happens in every hockey game that you watch.

But it just happened to hit. I wonder if the official defended him. I wonder if the official's like, you know, he just saw a leg and he thought it was, you know, I thought it was somebody else. And he did it. Anyways, no supplementary discipline there. Zadano Chara. We got to talk about Chara.

16151 games ties Chris Chelyos for the most among defensemen. I'm going to do that age-old thing we do when we talk about a player who's been around for a long time. I still had my learner's permit when he was drafted and I looked it up. Independence Day was the number one movie in the box office when he was drafted. He's been around for a long time. When you think it's a Dan O'Chara, any memories that kind of pops in your head when you think of Chara? Yeah, I was a lifelong Bruins fan. I play defense because of Chara.

I don't know what it was, but I loved him. Like I, he was my, he was like my, I feel like I'm getting old if he retires. And I feel like I'm old because he's not on the Bruins anymore. But when I first started covering the Bruins, I was so intimidated and scared. And my Facebook picture is still a picture of me interviewing him. But he was the first guy I ever talked to. And I kind of ran to him at the end of one of the games. And I was like panicking because I was the first one there.

scrum and then the TV people come and he turns to me and he goes, I think we're going to be on TV. He was joking. He has this very calm. He's so tall and intimidating and scary, but he is the most calm guy ever. And it's just like he's such a classy person. I was in first grade when Zadano Char was drafted. So I don't even remember that. But I'm aged, that really aged me even worse. What stands out. Yeah, what stands out to me is like, so I don't, I haven't watched a ton of Islanders hockey this year. But like when the Golden Knights were on Long Island, I watched, and I'm watching the guy play. And I'm like, this guy can barely move. And he's still playing all these minutes in the end. And like, these coaches aren't like, yes, he, he's a Dano Char. So maybe he gets

lineup treatment, maybe a little better than, but like they're, they're not playing him if they, if he's not usable. And it just goes to show how well he understands the game that obviously his reach helps. But the guy is in the right position all the time. And he can barely move out there. You watch him skate and he's not, he wasn't the most limber guy when he was drafted, however many years ago. And now he's this age and he's still out there. And the guy's hockey sense is just incredible. He just, he knows where the puck's going before anyone else does. That way he can get to the spot he needs to be at on time. Like I'm very impressed with with just his hockey sense. And that's what has allowed him to stay around this long.

Nicholas Lidstrom-esque, I always say, especially now in his career where it's not a matter of if you watch an Islander Highlight Pack, you're not going to see a whole bunch of Zedano Charo. but he doesn't give up the goals because he's in the right spot at the right time. And apparently just, you know, his workout regimen is the stuff of legend. And that's why he's still doing this. And you know what? Going back to trade deadline day, yeah, you need a little depth on that blue line. Somebody who's been there before.

And I remember thinking when he won that cup with Boston, the Stanley Cup has never been higher. And he put it over his head. You know what I mean? Just the gentle giant that sometimes can be really, really mean. Anyways, congratulations. He's got a game that's, unless something really bad happens, he's going to have that record all to himself. I'm not jinxing.

I'm not jinxed it. Do you imagine? Yeah, I'm going to retire now at 1651. We've got the, and I'm going to read it exactly the way the NHL keeps putting it. The 2002 Naval Federal Credit Union NHL Stadium Series coming up on Saturday. These names are getting longer and longer outdoor game, Nashville versus Tampa Bay. Did you guys even know what's coming up? Yeah, because some of us live in America and follow the American teams.

They're American teams in the NHL. Yes, in the South even. Have outdoor games lost their luster for you guys yet? I know it sounds like something we bring up all the time, but for me, I could not care less. So I went around the Hurricanes locker room and asked them if they're sick of, if there's too many outdoor games. And one of them said, maybe for Chicago. They're all still hype about it as long as they get to play in them. From a national perspective, they have lost their luster.

But they also don't, every outdoor game doesn't have to be huge for everyone. Like, this one can just, like, just being huge for Tampa Bay and Nashville is good enough. And every team should get their turn. And like, as long as it's big for that market, it serves its purpose because they're trying to sell all those tickets. They're trying to get that market excited about the hockey game. I think, yes, they have lost their luster a national perspective, but they still serve a very good purpose. I just remember it being such a big deal. You know, I remember when when they started doing it, that,

was a get your buddies together to watch the game big deal. And when I saw it was this Saturday, I'm like, oh, really? I didn't even, you know, snap in. But maybe Jesse's right. Oh, God. I'm always the Baham bug guy on this one, aren't I? Just like, who cares about outdoor games? Jesse's like, let them enjoy the damn outdoor game.

The Edmonton Oilers are winning again. And we're going to talk about after the break with Daniel Nudja Bowman, who writes about the Oilers, Poor, the Athletic. Don't go anywhere. We'll go right back. So I guess it was all Dave Tippett's fault. Edmond Oilers, five and one. I wish people could see Jesse's face right now.

He's just blown away. I'm just throwing it out there. The Oilers, five and one since making their change from behind the bench, even though they did come off that kind of tough loss of Minnesota while, but it was a fifth game in seven nights. And we're very pleased to be joined by Daniel Nudja Bowman, who writes about the Oilers for the Athletic. How are you, Daniel?

I'm great, Rob. But if you ask Oilers fans, a lot of it is Dave Tippett's fault. So you might have hit the nail on the head in their minds anyway. All right. Well, just early impressions that you've seen the last six games. Like I said, that wild game was a little bit. It's a tough one to judge on five games and seven nights will tire out anybody. But six games in, what are you seeing that has at least turned the tide a little bit?

Well, they've definitely got the new coach bump, which happens in a lot of cases, obviously. And with Jay Woodcroft, this is a guy that Oilers fans have been. clamoring to see coach the big team for quite a while now. He's done a tremendous job over the last three and a half years, kind of cultivating a, you know, not only a positive environment, Baker's Field to bring up a lot of prospects to the, the others. I think they've used 13 prospects in the last 13, sorry, three and a half years, you know, getting them to Edmonton. And a lot of them have made a big difference, or made a difference, I should say, and kind of helping this team, you know, get to get some wins and get to where it is.

But Jay Woodcroft's kind of known as being a bit more, I would say, innovative, a bit more open-minded, you know, known for being a communicator, trying to get his message across it in a lot of different ways to different players. And so far we've seen some pretty positive results. I mean, they're back-checking a lot better throughout the neutral zone. They're standing up, their defensemen are standing up opponents off the rush at the blue line a lot better than what happened under the previous coaching staff. you know, with, you should also note that Jim Playfair, the associate coach who ran the defense

was also fired along with Dave Tippett. And, you know, the results have been really positive. Woodcroft has used a lot of guys that he's known in Bakersfield a lot more than Dave Tippett did. I'm talking about some of the defensemen down there, Marcus Niemelainen,

William Laggason has got a bit of a bump. Tyler Benson for sure. But he's, you know, and having to bring in, some younger defenseman on the left side with Duncan Keith being out over the last little while. He's used seven defensemen and 11 forwards consistently. And he's found ways to get everyone engaged, which a lot of players have talked about here, you know, that didn't happen enough under Dave Tippett.

So there's been a lot of positive changes, I would say, in the last, you know, five, six games under Jay Woodcroft and Dave Manson, the assistant coach that came in with him. Are we going to get a truer picture on this road trip? I mean, you look at their six wins and they weren't necessarily taken on teams that are near the top of the standings. But as you called it in your piece, the murder is row coming up. You've got Tampa Bay. You've got Florida. You've got Carolina.

Everything's fine in Dandy when you're beating up on the bottom, you know, end of the league. Is this really going to give us a true picture as to what this team holds, what this team holds for the next little bit? Yeah, that's exactly right. I mean, the first five games were against teams, maybe Los Angeles notwithstanding that aren't going to make the playoffs. And obviously we saw what happened when they played a very good team in the Minnesota Wild. Again, as you've referenced, and I did in my piece, that it was, you know, five games in seven nights. And they clearly just looked out of gas in that one. But yeah, I mean, they're facing three of the top, I think five teams in the league.

You know, at the start of this road trip that, you know, it ends in a little bit easier fashion with Philadelphia and Chicago. But the start of the road trip is definitely a challenging one. They're lucky in the sense they flew up Monday. They had a full practice yesterday being Tuesday and today before the game. got a morning skate. So they should be well-rested and ready to go. But there's no question. This is a much bigger test that they're facing than they have faced under Woodcroft in the previous, well, the first five games anyway. You mentioned the coaching bump. And I feel like the main thing that gets improved when you get a new coach is just details like players, like you mentioned,

their back check in the neutral zone. That, to me, that's what's held the Oilers back. Like, they have so much top-end talent and they just, the details aren't there. The defensive structure isn't there. What has, what have you seen over these six games that like, that, that leads you down the road of like, this team can be this for the rest of the season. And, and obviously that changes. And like, they're, they're a real legitimate contender if they can do that. Yeah, I think the biggest thing. And you know, it's funny because Zach Hyman, who's a forward noted this, um, is, and I mentioned this earlier, it's just the defenseman standing up, uh, you know, the rush from the opponents at the blue line. Uh, there were countless times you'd watch during a game

where the defense would back up to the top of the circles to the half. hash marks even and allow really quality chances from from the opponents. You know, obviously that there's still been a few of those examples, but it has changed dramatically under the, under Dave Manson, who's coaching the defense and J. Woodcroft, the head coach. You know, not only that, but as I mentioned, there's a lot more players engaged kind of in what's going on here. And, you know, the most outspoken guy has been Derek Ryan, who was getting, you know,

a handful of minutes, six, seven, eight minutes on a lot of nights under, under Dave Tippett and now it has a very prominent role on the third line alongside Ryan Nugent Hopkins and Warren Fogel. He's finding ways to get a lot more players engaged and kind of invested in what's going on here. Another example would be the last win that they had. The second power play unit scored a goal, which is very rare here in Mountain. I think it's happened about five times.

And that second power play started the next power play, which, is unheard of. I don't know if it ever happened in the Dave Tippett era. That McDavid, uh, drive Cytle and Nuggen Hopkins trio basically plays the whole power player or good 130 of it anyway. Uh, you know, and there's good reason for that, uh, up until this little slide that they've had recently, this power play has been the best power play in the league for the last three years. So, you know, there's, there's certain reasons there of that, but I think they're going to hold, um, the new coaching staff is going to hold those top players accountable a little bit more, which to some degree is good.

obviously you want them to have their their kind of slack because they're tremendous players and they're they drive the bus for the oilers. But, you know, with a guy like a Vander Kain coming in and getting some some depth contributions throughout the lineup, I think there is a little bit more room for this team to grow. And I think there's the, there's the opportunity for that to happen under this coaching staff. When Dave Tippett was hired, I heard a lot of people and in my opinion, right, so kind of say, here we go again. Same old coaching carousel, the same old, you know, the old school type of coach.

And everything I've heard you say right now leads me to believe that maybe that sort of thinking can be transitioned into this new style of coaching. And if I can use an old term, the player's type of coach, a player's coach, a guy who gives people an opportunity to shine. And when they do, they take that opportunity and run with it. Do you see that in Edmonton? Do you see that? It's a matter of we're getting rid of the old coming in with a more, quote, new style. A little bit. I would say Dave Tippett to me was a very surprising hire at the time.

He was known more as a defensive coach. But I would say that talking to people when he was hired, you know, he's a guy that did coach or does coach to the personnel that he has on the team. And you look at, you know, Dallas and Arizona, Phoenix when he's coaching those two spots. in those two teams. Those were the types of lineups that he traditionally had. But he had no relationship with Ken Holland. He,

you know, he was kind of like, let's get a very veteran coach to work with some of these superstars. And Tibbitt's known for being a bit more kind of old school in his approach, you know, kind of set in his ways. He prefers the veteran players. Again,

guys like, you know, Devin Shore, you know, who's very much a journeyman player, getting a lot more responsibility than I think a lot of fans we're hoping he would get here. Jay Woodcroft, on the other hand, I think is known a lot more for being a player's coach. And again, I know some of the things I touched on being more of an innovator, communicator.

He's very, you know, he likes to get a lot of different opinions and kind of consult with people around the hockey world and kind of tailor his message to the needs of the players on an individual basis. So Jay Woodcroft is certainly a lot more new school. He's only 45 years old. He hasn't been around nearly as long as Dave Tippett, who is 60. I think this has the potential to be, you know, very good hire and a very, you know, very interesting hire for the Oilers. Can this team win with who's in that?

I mean, I know that seems like such a simple question. With the trade deadline less than a month away, Mike Smith and Miko Koskinan, can this team win with those guys? they can will they probably not I mean you look at the

goaltending in this team it's been a problem for the better part of three years since Ken Holland came on in fairness to him he was kind of saddled

with that contract of Miko Koskin which was just a baffling contract he played 27 games in his first year back in the NHL after a nine year hiatus

or seven year hiatus I forget And that's when they decided they would, they would, you know, retain him, extend him. And that happened the day before Peter Shirelli was fired. So it was just the most baffling deal. It obviously comes with a with a no trade clause to half the teams in the league too. So it's really hard for Ken Holland to move that contract. I mean, he's, you know, at this point, though, he should have done something about it.

Let's be real. I mean, you can't go into this. it was unfathomable to go into this season with McDavid Drysiddle, you know, where they are in their career is the types of season that they had last year, you know, with this goaltending tandem. You know, in fairness to Mike Smith, you know, he did finish seventh in the league in Vesna Trophy voting last year. He was a tremendous player for the Oilers. He's a year older though. And he turns 40 in March. He's a guy who was hurt for the first 13, 15 games of last season. And this year, he's been hurt.

He's had three different injury stints. And Miko Koskenen has proven time and time again that he cannot handle the number one load. He does fine in a tandem. But, you know, when you give him the number one responsibility unfettered, it just does not work out. And that's the biggest, I mean, there, you know, there are some areas that this team could use some upgrades. We're talking, you know, probably another winger in the top nine. Definitely another defenseman would certainly help. but the goaltending is the biggest one.

And, you know, I would say it's going to be very hard for Ken Holland to acquire a goaltender at this point. There's, you know, I wouldn't say some slim pickings out there, but the acquisition cost, I think, is very high. And the oilers have some serious cap issues. But it's certainly the biggest need that they have and the biggest thing that they could do to upgrade this team ahead of the deadline. You mentioned the cap issues.

Like, what are the oilers sitting at right now? looking at the goalies around like obviously Flurie is the name that comes to mind but he's very expensive. Yeah. His cap hits one of the biggest in the league. So like when you're looking at the deadline coming up in a month, like what are there options? Like I guess not like not trying to predict which goalie they're going to get, but like where can they go? What do they have to work with? Sure.

So they have about $716,000. I was looking at this up for a story. Per PakPedia anyway. Available in CapS face. Now that's for everyone that knows, that's less. a league minimum salary. So they're carrying 22 players at that. So they're very tight against the salary cap. Part of that is Zach Cassian, who, you know, everyone knows is a little bit overpaid here is, is that $3.2 million and he's on LTIR. It's an injury, a broken jaw that is not expected to carry him

or a three of the playoffs. So they're going to have to find room to add him back to the lineup at some point before the end of the playoffs or before the playoffs begin too. So yeah, there's some major cap issues. And so when we're talking about trying to add a goaltender, they're going to have to move out money to be able to do that. Evander Kane, you know, has been a nice addition. He's got nine points in an 11 games so far with the Oilers. I think there's room for him to grow as well. And he certainly comes in at a $2.1 million cap it that is considerably less than the $7 million that he, that he made in San Jose.

But that in bringing him in, they didn't, you know, subtract anything from the lineup. So that was another kind of addition that has been thrown into the mix here. really I guess if we're talking about moving out money Koskinin at $4.5 million would if you're going to especially at a goaltender would seemingly have to be part of any trade again he's got a no no trade clause to half the teams in the league so that that makes things a little bit more challenging there but again if you're looking you know aside from

Koskin and the other kind of big ticket players on the team are Geng Kassian at 3.2 Kyle Taurus at 1.6 or 1.65 and the other one oh Tyson Barry at 4.5. But if you're moving out Tyson Barry, who is the kind of public enemy number one here in Edmonton with the way he's played and with Evan Bouchard with, you know, similar skill sets and eating into his minutes, you've got to find somebody to replace, you know, a top six defenseman, which they already need one anyway. So I would say, Ken Hall and the general manager is in some, is in a sticky situation. He's going to do something, I'm sure. But I would. I would. would kind of expect him to make one move and anything more than that is probably wishful thinking just given the kind of the parameters he's working under right now. Pay me a picture of what it's like with the fan base right now.

I mean, I'm near Toronto. You're near, you're from the Toronto area. When stuff like this happens, there's over exaggeration each way, good and bad. But this team has underachieved for so long with two of the best players in the game. how high is the frustration level right now? Oh, it's pretty high. I mean, people are kind of fed up with the seemingly lack of progress that's happened here. And, you know, we're in year six or seven of the McDavid era.

And they've won one playoff round. They've won one playoff game in the last two years. And I was DMing with Jesse earlier in the year because the others got off to a 9-1 star. They were 16 and 5, you know, the best team in the league through 21 games, but there were just so many smoke and mirrors in terms of what had happened. And, you know, they were playing way over their head. I mean, McDavid and Drive Settle were, you know, playing,

recording almost two points a game through those first 21 games, power play at that just before that, you know, the 21 game stretch had ended was clipping at 40%. It was really unsustainable. And they don't have enough depth. up front and the blue line has its issues and we've already talked about goaltending at nauseam. So for the Oilers to be where they are with Connor McDavid and Leon Dreisdell at their age, at their points of their career and putting up the types of points that they have been,

is quite frankly ridiculous. And the fan base is frustrated. You know, you hear you talk about Rob being in Toronto and there's that narrative almost every year that when is McDavid going to run out? And people in Edmonton cannot stand that narrative. But, you know, right around the time that this team is going through its 2-11 and 2 stretch, tensions were incredibly high with the players. And, you know, we saw some clashes with the media.

The fan base was really starting to kind of almost get it, almost feel bad for those two players and say, yeah, if they want it out, I can totally understand that. Obviously, if that end up happening, it would be a lot of stories for me to write and quite the turn of events here. But I think, you know, something needs to happen pretty soon, whether, you know, ideally for the team and for the fan base this year, but certainly within the next year to kind of write the ship here and get this thing going in a positive direction. And people are very frustrated with ownership, with hockey operations, and quite frankly with Ken Holland. because this, you know, I think he got a free pass and he certainly did for me over the first two years of his tenure because he did not have much to work with.

He was saddled with some terrible contracts from his predecessor Peter Shirelli. But this past off season, he had about $25 million to reshape the roster. And the jury is, you know, putting it mildly, the jury is still out. I would say a lot of the moves haven't turned out incredibly well. And there was some kind of frustration. what the asset cost of some of these players, whether I think the biggest one obviously was paying full price to get Duncan Keith,

who had a no move clause and really only wanted to go to Edmonton, that has certainly eaten into some cap, you know, cap constraints here. So fan base is obviously frustrated and there's only so much time left to kind of get things figured out. I feel like the clock's been ticking for a while in Edmonton, but like you said,

we're going to find out a lot over this road trip. Tampa Bay, and Carolina. Daniel, thanks for doing this. Appreciate it. Oh, you're very welcome. Anytime, guys. Daniel Nudja Bowman, who writes about the Oilers and has had plenty to write about over the last a couple of years. And as he said, if something big does happen, guys, he's going to have a lot to write about over the years to come. We're going to get your Twitter questions after the break, so don't go anywhere. All right, I don't know if this is considered huge breaking news,

guys, but it was good enough for us to ask for our Twitter question. Sean Avery, 41 years old, has signed a deal with the Orlando Solar Bears of the ECHL. And first off, your thoughts while I go and grab our Twitter responses when you hear that Sean Avery is going to be actually playing professional hockey again. Ultimate Troll, ultimate pest turned ultimate social media troll, turned ultimate pest again. Like he's able to get an ECHL contract out of being a, test on Twitter. I feel like that's ultimately what this came down to. And the Orlando

Solar Bears love a money grab, which they should as a Coast team. Jesse, what do you think? I love having fun with like the third leagues. Like the minor league baseball, the minor league hockey, like have fun with it. Name the team the most ridiculous thing you can name like the Solar Bears and just do ridiculous things like this because it gets attention and like it brings in more money for the players who are like in those leagues, like legitimately trying to like make a hockey career. Like it brings in money for those guys. It's good for everything. I'm all for stupid things in like minor league sports. Be as ridiculous as you can. And he's just that guy. You know what I mean? This isn't just an aging former player who could put like he's going to put

butts in the seats because he's going to say things at the press conference. He's going to say things as Sarah mentioned on social media. This is from Deb. who says, did they provide him with new skates or did he have to get his own? It'll likely sell a few more tickets. So in the name of capitalism, go get him, I guess. And somebody named Brendan's step said he probably got someone else's sloppy seconds, which, yeah, one of the most famous Sean Avery quotes of all time. Pete Krupsky says, simply an older athlete looking for something familiar to do.

Maybe the media business slash media influencing business isn't as lucrative as one thought. Bob Cameron says, how many games will he play before he gets banned for doing or saying something ridiculous? Eric K.A. said, is he fighting a Paul brother next? That was my favorite one. Because that's exactly what this is. It's basically fighting Logan Paul. Yeah. Is there any of these that you guys saw that really jumped out?

Well, I saw Matt Barnaby. I know they had like a little feud going on. He said he's going to sign to a team now so they can fight. And I'm like, as a wag of a minor league player, I love this for the minor leagues. I have to be honest, like it's very, the minor leagues need to go with this and let it become a spectacle because they need more money. Trust me. They're dying for money right now. Yeah. Kenny Naylor says, I wonder what he's selling. That's always the other thing, too. Is there something? Is there a new book coming out? Is there this or that? I love a good meme response to Tyler Gething has the Ryan Reynolds. But why? And I think we've, expressed why we think that. I mean, it's, it's Shawnee. If you're going to get somebody

who's old and done, get somebody who's going to be a sound bite. So big thanks to everybody for writing the, in the responses you keep writing them. We'll keep reading them. Guys, wraps up another show. As always, what do we got working on this week? Jesse? Yeah, it's, it's, Pete DeBoer is coming up on his 500th career win as a head coach. He's at 499 right now and they play the Arizona coyotes next. So I'm not saying it's for sure his 500th win, but I'm saying there's a good chance that happens. So I'm actually, as soon as I leave here, I'm going to sit down with Pete for a fun conversation

about how he was almost a lawyer and not an NHL coach. So look for that this week on the athletic. I love stories like that, by the way. I love how, you know, people thought they were going to do this and they're like, no, no, no, I got to get back into the game. Sarah, what do you got? Shades of John Cooper there. I am about to publish something with Scott Wheeler.

The prospect extraordinaire, kind of about what the hurricanes have in the cupboard right now they could possibly use at the trade deadline because that's the talk of the town. So stay tuned for that later today. Be sure to jump on and read with these people, right? Because I'm always entertained by it. You should be soon. I want to let you guys know about some other great coverage we got on the athletic hockey show. You got to check out Arthur Staples, New Rangers podcast, the Garden Faithful, wherever you find your podcast.

We've got Ian Mendez and Julian McKenzie, welcome being Olympic analyst and two-time Olympic. medalist Cheryl Pounder to the athletic hockey show on Monday. I've been working with Cheryl a lot over the last two Winter Olympic games. She is so much fun. And the best part of what Cheryl Pounder is she doesn't sugarcoat anything. Her and I were talking after that round-roving game, Canada and U.S., about how Canada was terrible in their own zone. And she was the only one to say it.

Everyone in Canada was like, it's great. They beat two Americans. She's like, wait a minute. They were terrible in their own zone. Craig Custin's and Sean Gentile. they pay off their Olympic bet with the Monday show with their rendition of O Canada and they welcome Everett Fitzhue

Radio Play-by-Play Guy for the Seattle Cracken Tuesday on the Athletic Hockey Show. And remember for us, follow us on your favorite podcast platform. Don't forget to leave a rating in a review. It helps us out a lot. And you can subscribe to the Athletic Plus on Apple Podcast

to get all the bonus content from our entire network. And it's our turn this week to provide bonus content. We're going to talk about what makes you circle a game on your calendar. You start with a 30-day free trial,

then it's 99 cents a month after that. Right now, you get annual subscriptions to the athletic for just $1 a month for six months when you visit theathletic.com slash hockey show. The athletic hockey show returns Thursday with Ian Mendez and down goes brown for Sarah, for Jesse. I'm Rob. We'll see you next week.