The Athletic Hockey Show - How To Fix: Columbus Blue Jackets

Episode Date: July 22, 2026

The Columbus Blue Jackets and Zach Werenski put an end to trade speculation with a joint statement early in July. With Werenski recommitting to Columbus, attention is now turned to signing Adam Fantilli longterm and keeping star forward Kirill Marchenko happy, too. Aaron Portzline joins Sean McIndoe to discuss the perennially underachieving Blue Jackets and if Jet Greaves, along with new additions Valeri Nichushkin and Ryan Lomberg, can assist Werenski in leading the Jackets back to a playoff spot in 2026-27.Host: Sean McIndoeWith: Aaron PortzlineExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Jeff DometWatch full episodes on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowJoin our Discord Server: https://discord.gg/VTm9VjkFSubscribe to The Athletic: https://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. Hello, folks. Welcome back to the Athletic Hockey Show. I'm Sean McAndew, and we are rolling through our summer series here at the Athletic Hockey Show where myself and Sean Gentile and some others, we are figuring out how to fix some of the NHL teams out there. We've already fixed the Toronto Maple Leafs. So that's the good news. We got the tough one out of the way. but we're not moving the degree of difficulty too far down because today we're going to tackle the Columbus Blue Jackets and joining me as Ohio's finest airport's line.

How you doing, Portsy? Good, Sean. How you doing, man? I'm doing good. I'm doing good. I would normally ask if you're keeping busy, but I know you have been. And here's what we're going to do. Normally, when you're talking about teams and their transactions and the pluses and minuses,

there's two ways you can do it normally. You either build from the net out, then you go goalie defense forwards or very often we start with the forwards and we work our way down. Forward's defense, goalie. But the defense is always in the middle. Not today. We're breaking the rule and we're going to start with the blue line because, and I don't know if you heard about this, but there's this guy, Zach Werenski. Right.

Plays for the Columbus Blue Jackets. And the big news with him is he still plays for the Columbus Blue Jackets. How long can we count on that? And how much of this kiss and makeup is real and how much of it was maybe just hitting the pause button on a situation that seemed like it was spiraling out of control. Yeah. So, boy, there's a lot to get into here, which is probably good because the forwards and the goalies are their own issues.

He is a blue jacket. I think he will be a blue jacket well into this season. I think the next question mark pops up if the blue jackets are out of the playoff race at the trade deadline, right? I think then it will be a fair time and you'll hear questions. And of course, it's possible. I think if they're as competitive as they want to be, I think he goes into, next summer and then by July 1st of next summer we'll have a real keen idea of how real this is.

And I don't want to be naive here. I don't think I am. But I think a lot of that got out of control because of some miscommunication, either unintentional or intentional, either between Werenski and his agent, between the agent and the blue jackets. The message is that some people received about what was going on were far different from what other people received. And the best I can tell, Worensky's communication to the Blue Jackets was that he could not promise in two years that he was going to resign if he didn't start to see progress, more progress. They have made progress. They've gotten better in four straight years. But it's time to get, like, really real, not just try to get in, but pedal down, try to get in and do something.

So this certainly wasn't a direct trade request, again, as far as I can tell. And I don't ever think it was made clear directly to the blue jackets by the player that he would not resign or is planning to not resign, which is why I think when it started to spiral and get out of control, the player was taken aback by how crazy and how quickly the Blue Jacks A fan base got agitated, how quickly the league had him traded. But to say that this was a media creation, if many has said, is absolutely ludicrous.

I mean, the fact of the matter was he was traded to Dallas. Sean, before he right put his no move clause in and said, I want to, no, no, I want to stay in Columbus. The fact that he did that, I think gives what I'm telling you some heft here. Again, he is not beholden to spending the rest of his career here. I'm not saying that. I'm not even saying he's going to spend the rest of his contract here. I just don't think he sees this right now as sirens blaring, red line. lights flashing got to get out of here like some others have they have to start winning they have

to take a huge stride forward and i think they need to start being more aggressive and i think that's his feeling as well so it didn't get much done this summer that really blows you away really their summer how pleased you are i think depends on how impressed you are with valerian natuzyushkin is a player um so not huge strides this summer i don't think but there's still time between now and the trade deadline to do some things to maybe make this a team that is not just waiting to get in but actually lifting off of it.

Okay. So you've teed up a bunch of fun stuff here. Let's go. Maybe funds not the right word, depending on perspective. But so you're right. They had a deal with Dallas. So this is, I'm glad you mentioned that because, you know, this isn't even where there's smoke, there's fire. This is where there's fire. There was a trade here. And, you know, I'm obviously, I spent a lot of my time in Toronto Maple Leaf land. And it got to a point where it felt like there were there, there was, I guess it was, I think July 1st where it was like, okay, when are we going to hear that that not only had the Maple Leafs acquired Zach Wrenski. But they've got them at some sort of discount because the,

Blue Jackets hand is forced and they just had to move on. And then we got the, as I've said, sort of the kiss and make up statements. But I will just sort of highlight it because you talked about this. I'm looking at the statement from Zach Werenski. And it talks about Don and I have had an open and honest dialogue since the season ended. He expresses his frustration at how it's come out. And then he says, I want to win and I want to. to do that in Columbus, which is certainly reassuring when the alternative is get me out of here.

I've played my last game. But I will point out, as you kind of already have, I want to win and I want to do it in Columbus is not the same as I want to be in Columbus or I want to spend the rest of my career in Columbus. I love it. He's got to win. So given that, and given that this team didn't make the playoffs last year,

and given that there are some guys that we'll talk about it who have left. I mean, am I crazy to say on paper this team is weaker right now than they were when the season ended? So I would rather have Nichushkin in my top six than Marchmont, but I think there's a debate there. I think there's also a necessary, reliance on players that have been part of their rebuild here that it's a year early to give up on. Kent Johnson jumps off the page, Dimitri Varankov. These guys kind of disappeared last year, right?

Do you trust that they're better? On paper, I would say the idea that Boone Jenner is not here, Mason Marchman is not here, those are forward losses, big forward losses. I think the club is okay with those losses. Again, the Chushkin kind of replaces Marchman, I think improves upon him. And I think Jenner, I think they were right to not go that length of term that Washington did. And I think they've got people that can fill in admirably for him. They saw him as a fourth line center.

And I think they also want to turn their. room over. You may have heard Rick Bonas at the end of last season. Yep. And this is not putting it on Boone Jenner at all. But when you talk about a new culture, you can't just bring everything back. And they've done a lot of that. The one that really surprises me is that Elvis versus Lekins is back. I got to say, first of all, as a Leafs fan, that's very confusing to me, that you can't, oh, you don't change the culture by bringing the exact same guys back here. Yeah. That's interesting.

No. But I have to say, like, that is the other, before all the Werensky stuff happened, I used to, I do a column every year at the end of the offseason called the Pizarro meter, where I go through and I say, what team has had the weirdest off season? Yeah. Spoiler, Columbus is going to rank pretty high, I think, on that one by the time it's all said and done. But even before Werenski, the fact that Rick Bonas at that, it was the season finale, right, last game of the year. And he gets up there and he kind of goes scorched earth on his own team. At the time, not even knowing if he would be back. Yeah, yeah.

And it wasn't, you know, it wasn't really the traditional way to audition for getting your job back is to lay away. But he was talking about the team culture and specifically guys being too okay with losing. Yes. When I then see the team captain go out the door, that does make. make me kind of wonder if, okay, this is maybe less of about how does this impact on the ice and a little bit more in the room. Have they done enough to fix the room, to change the room, to, to get, you know, is Rick Bonas going to be happy?

Because he's got serious, cranky old man energy. He's not, he's not going to sit around patiently and wait. He's not happy. You won't be happy. Is he going to be happy, you think? Yeah, and it gets weirder because, so he's your captain now. Give that to Werenzky, who was like traded to Dallas in the offseason and maybe gone at the trade deadline. There's all sorts of interesting elements here.

Does Charlie Coyle, if he knew, I mean, let's go back to thinking that Werenstki wanted out, does Charlie Coyle sign for six years? and knowing that and would Zach Werenzky even allow his beloved teammate to do that? Like he would certainly inform him, hey, guy, listen, I don't want to, you know, tell you anything here. I'd do what you want to do. But, I mean, he would not. He wouldn't, right? So do you give it to coil? Is coil safe?

Do you not give it to anybody? Do you give it to Matthew Olivier? I think they really, really, really wanted the room to change. And again, I go to me that that's why it's still, and there's still time, but I'm still surprised that the goalie, the one two punch and goal hasn't changed, that Merzleikins is still here. He's almost the longest tenured player in the room, which is insane. Werenzky now is.

So I'm sure there is a part of Boone Jenner that is, that is stung a little bit by this, that the place that he, I mean, sweated and blood and all of those great hockey cliches, but also truisms, played 800-plus games,

is the guy that's on his way out of town, but they weren't going to give him that term. But I also do think, and it sure sounds as if, when you say this, that they're throwing it on his lap. I think they want a louder room. I think they want more energy.

in the room. Listen, I think for more than a year now, maybe two years, it has been Werenski who has spoken for the room. Boone is so many things that hockey fans admire. He is almost finished in his stoicism. And there are times where his words, frankly, don't meet the moment as a spokesman for the club. And Werenice, Svinsky is always the guy who does, who does read the room and read the fan base and read their place in the league and speak to that. So I could definitely see that. And I do think there, I get the sense that bonus is going to find something the first day

of training camp that drives him effing crazy because he has to now, right? Yep. they also brought Ryan Longbergen, who is a fourth line guy, but he even said, oh, man, guys get tired of me. Guys get tired of me because I talk a lot. I'm super loud. It just kind of comes with it. So I think they want more of, they want to gas that room up a little bit where it's everyone's taking their cues from the captain. Again, this isn't right or wrong.

It's just, it's been a quiet room, a very respectful room, know your place. room. And I think they're trying to get Adam Fantilli louder, more engaged in being the leader of a leader of the group, Cole Cillinger part of that. And I think whenever you move a captain along or change to sea, it opens up. It takes away, it takes away some trees and lets the sun hit the ground for more, for more things to grow a little bit. That's a, that's a, it's an interesting way of putting it. Let's talk about Fantilli a little bit. Yeah. He fascinates me because Because, you know, I'm not watching every Blue Jackets game like you are. But I feel like whenever I do watch them, Adam Fantilli always pops to me.

And I mean, he had one game in Toronto this year. I mean, if you're going to have a game, that's the place to do it if you want people to notice, where he looked like a certified first light stud out there. And then you kind of at the end of the year, you look at the numbers and they're good, but they're, you know, they're maybe not there yet. So it feels like there's another level there, another gear. What's the contract situation? How much there had been like some offer sheet talk.

Do you think that was ever in play or something they were worried about is, how do they lock this guy in as a long-term piece of what feels like an uncertain future? Yeah. Well, I think he's a lot like Carlson and a lot like Bedard. his numbers are really similar to Carlson, Breddard's in his own realm, I think still. But those guys didn't want to get to the table. Like for Beeks taking some heat for not signing Carlson last summer

or earlier this summer. What else taking some fray here for not getting Fantilli signed last summer to a long-term deal, not getting him signed earlier to summer. I don't think those guys, I know they didn't. They didn't want to be at the table. Now, maybe a five-year-18 just negates all of that talk before you even get to an offer sheet. But hitting July 1st has become part of the strategy now for high-end RFAs because offer sheets are much more a reality now. And so I think Fantilli wanted to get to July 1.

Why not negotiate with 31 teams or 32 teams instead of just yours? I think when he saw the offer sheet to Carlson, signed with Carlson, I told myself he's not going to sign until we find out what the ducks are doing because there's certainly a consideration. People say, well, Fantilli's nowhere near Carlson. I know numbers aren't everything, but their numbers are almost identical. They're almost identical. It's not out of the question that the Flyers or another team would have looked at Fantilli. So you want to expose yourself. You want to create a marketplace for you.

I think the line between UFA and RFA has gotten smaller than I ever could have believed. And it's so far removed now from the here's your best offer, take it or leave it, or we'll see you in camp because you don't have arbitration rights. You're in that in between where you're out of your ELC and you're not yet in arbitration rights. and the blue jackets used to try to drop the hammer on players in that scenario. So I think Fantilli gets done. I think every day we move along here, there's probably less of a chance that he gets offer sheeted. The blue jackets have left cap room, much like the duct, where they can match any offer. I think they'd rather do it on their own, obviously, rather than face that.

They have two other RFAs, Jet Greaves, Cole Cylinger, who have filed for arbitration, They'll try to get them done before arbitration. But Fantilli is the lead guy here. And last I heard the Blue Jackets were waiting on a callback from Fantilli's agent. So talks are continuing. And I would suspect once this becomes clear that there's no offer sheet coming, that's when you get the deal done. Fair enough. A name that we haven't mentioned very much.

And this would have, in it. In off seasons, it didn't register maybe quite as high on the Pizarro meter, we probably would have been talking this as the first story. But Carl Marchenko, the leading scorer on the team among forwards, also kind of at the same time as Zach Werenski. Yeah. There was some question about his future. Now, because no disrespect to Marchenko, who's a very good player,

but because Werensky is a legit superstar in this league, that kind of sucked all the energy up. And Marchenko just sort of got slapped onto it. Talk a little bit about what that situation actually is and isn't. And where does it stand now? Because we didn't get a happy statement from Coral Marchenko saying everything's fine and I'm going to stick around. Yeah. So work this into Bizarro meter world because not only did it be,

only was that announced at the worst time in terms of blue jackets fans were still many of them in denial about the truth of the Werenzky story but others coming to terms with it but literally the blue jackets are on the clock at the draft number 14 overall and that's when the agent texts uh kevin weeks and says hey uh here's the situation with Marchenko and weeks as he should do reporter NHL network slash ESPN throws that out literally as the blue jackets are on the clock in seconds before they draft Oscar Hemming a first round pick so there goes that moment for the young lad and bluejackets fans who I don't think they they were wise to not have a draft party this year because that night was an absolute debacle for them yeah

Anyways, that sent them into an absolute tizzy. Where it stands with that, I think the Blue Jackets took that as the agent Dan Mills team doing his job, frankly, and driving up the temperature on Marchenko even more. He has a contract for this coming year. He's an absolute bargain at 3.85. He's an RFA after this year. So basically, and the Blue Jackets do not expect that he's going to be under contract before this season starts. Again, I think he wants to go to July 1st and see what's out there as well. I think RFAs now have the power to change the market more than UFAs do.

Because offer sheets have to be so over the top as to get the player. I think that's a real interesting wrinkle that's coming into this. Lee. And Marchenko is a guy, I think he's got 40 goal, absolutely 40 goal potential. That's a guy that some teams will break the bank for. So you get to July 1st, you see what's out there. They don't think he's going to be signed this year, but to their knowledge, he's going to show up. He's going to show up. He's going to play. And we were, some of us were joking that Marchenko was probably in Moscow the night of the draft when that report came out. And of all people, Markenko was probably like, did I say that? That's a thing? Like, who's talking about that?

Yeah. Because I do, it's smacked of a negotiating ploy, but why not? When you've got all this fur flying, why not use that to your advantage? So are the blue jackets, I'm sure they're not happy with the timing and the publicity, but are they okay with him walking to July 1 next year? Is there any thought that they may try to get ahead of this and say, look, if you're not willing to put pen to paper, maybe we explore trade options, or is this C in September? I think you, I don't think there would be making that move right now. I think they, because again, he's RFA after this coming season. So to me, if they're out of it, that's a trade deadline consideration. If you've put a huge offer before him and he's not willing to sign it, otherwise,

I think they carry him through the year and deal with him as an RFA next year. And if, you know, before you get to July 1st, if all of this is still in play and you've made a huge offer that he won't sign, I think GMs talk about these things more than we realize, perhaps, some of us. Teams that would legit put an offer sheet in front of them would contact the Blue Jackets and say it's either offer sheet and four of her next five first, or is there something else you'd like to do? We'll get it done earlier because they may not want to. to give up for first either. So, yeah, it's not ideal.

You'd like it to be a situation like Montreal where these guys are signing on in advance. I think if Demadov had to do over again, I'm not sure he signs that because, boy, things have jumped here. I mean, you talk about all the marketplace changes week to week, month to month. It was two hours for Demadoff. Right. I hope he finished his round of golf. I'll go hit up Sportsnet and see what's on the front page. Uh-oh.

I mean, he's going to be okay. He'll be all right. He's not, he won't be, he'll still be able to afford steemies in in Montreal to stay. But, uh, you won't be 18 years. Okay, but he'll be good. It is, I tell you, the secret sauce of which teams can get the players to buy into this salary structure idea and which ones. Which ones don't is fascinating. We've sort of hinted at it, but let's move to the last position, goaltending.

Yep. And this one, boy, talk about your ups and downs. We got, I mean, I'll start complimentary. This is, I believe, and people can argue with me if they want, but I think this is the best goaltending duo I've ever seen made up of a guy named Jet and a guy named Elvis. Does that fit, do you think, with your knowledge of hockey history? No, let me go back through the years and think of all the other options. Yeah.

Definitely top five on the Mount Rushmore. Pretty good name great. Pretty good name pairing too. Excellent name pairing. And that might be sort of where the similarities in because you've got the young guy, up and coming, lots of optimism, I would assume. And then you've got the other guy who, as you pointed out, is still here. Yeah.

What's the plan going forward with this duo and how confident should Blue Jackets fans feel? Because I feel like we maybe bummed them out a little bit on the skaters, but there is some genuine room for positivity here. Yeah, you know what? I think Jet Grieves probably deserves a lot more attention for the season he had last year than he has gotten. I think there is an outside chance that he is a team Canada goalie here. I'm not talking for the world. He was that and he played very well. I'm talking for some bigger events.

Damning with faint praise here. I mean, come on now. That's, I mean, I'm, I'm number seven on the gold tending chart up here in Canada. I think. Well, you know what? But you know what? You're absolutely right. I mean, this kid looked great last year.

And goaltending is weird. And we've seen guys look great. one year and not look great the next and that happens all the time. But it's different when you're talking about a 31 year old coming off a good year after six bad ones versus someone who is not technically a rookie, but kind of coming in under that situation. So, I mean, is this kid as good as he certainly looks to be as a long-term answer here? If the blue jackets really got themselves a guy here. Yeah. So I think they do.

I think there's still some question with people if he's a number one or a number two. I think sometimes your second full year in the NHL is more difficult than your first because there is a familiarity now with your game, a real specific familiarity. He has played, I think, maybe in four separate seasons now in the NHL. And the strange thing, Sean, is he's never looked out of place. and he's never gone through a drought. And I want to say yet with that, but last year he really didn't have a stretch.

He had a game here, game there where you thought, that was a tough game there. But he never went through a two or three week period where he's fighting the puck. So there's something to be said for that. He is clearly the number one here. And it's a great story because he wasn't drafted. He wasn't a particularly noteworthy goaltender.

in the Ontario Hockey League with Barry, came to Traverse City with them as an extra goalie in a rookie tournament and impressed them enough and has literally just taken every little bit that they've given him with still plenty of doubt at every stage surrounding him and just absolutely passed the test in flying colors. And it's such a strange world and such a strange position. If he were a high draft pick, he would have never been given the opportunity to develop as long as he did in the American Hockey League. But the fact that people continued to doubt him, continued to question whether he could really do it, they just parked him there.

They just parked him there until he demanded the opportunity, frankly. And it allowed him to develop the right way. He's beloved in the Cleveland organization. He's beloved in the room here. clearly the number one guy. The big issue here is the backup goalie has been way sub-900 save percentage for four straight years. In that span, he's every year, he's been statistically one of the worst goaltenders in the league. So you've got this huge gap between one and two.

And to me, that is for Elvis's sake and for the Blue Jackets, Sague, I think something should have been done to change that this offseason. Rather, that's a buyout, whether that is a trade where you take a bit of a hit and send a draft pick with them. It feels like the goaltending musical chairs have filled again this year. So I don't know where this is going. They signed Phoenix Copley, who is mostly an AHL guy. It is a one-way contract.

there will be competition in camp, but I think unless there is a clear, unless something dramatic happens, then Copley goes on with Abrison plays in Cleveland. But they would love it if they could create some sort of competition for that number two job at Jet Greaves clearly is the guy in Columbus now. And real quick on Greaves, just turn 25 at the end of the season,

which, I mean, for a lot of guys, a lot of goaltenders are only kind of making their way to the NHL at this age. So he's maybe ahead of the game there. Started 52 games last year. Is this a guy like, what do you think they're looking at for him this year? Is he going to be a 60-start guy? Is he going to be one of these 65-start guys? I think he's probably a 55-60-start guy.

I don't think they'll start the season planning to give him 60. But I think if they're in it, are making a push at the end. Each of the last two years, they've leaned hard on him. He would have been hired this year, but he started the year under Drew, Dean Avicen, who wanted a competition. And it was sort of a, what's the word I'm looking for, a time share for the first couple of months of the season when Jet was clearly the better goalie.

It Greaves finally won out the number one job. and started to be used like that. Then they changed coaches. Bonus came in and sort of brought back the timeshare a bit to see which one of these guys was his guy. And it really wasn't until a few weeks in the bonus that he settled on Greaves again. So I think given stability in the coaching, a more regular number one role from the start, I think 60 starts. even though they won't start out that way, I think that's possible. So as we move towards wrapping up here, we sort of pitch this as we're going to fix the blue jackets.

This is a team that missed the playoffs last year. They missed by six points, but they were a 92 point team last year. In a league where a 95-point team was in the Stanley Cup final. So I think there's there's a case to be made that they're not that far and there's a case to be made that they're miles away. But as I said, I'm not convinced that they're better than they were last year based on the moves they've made. So, I mean, I guess walk me through, where does, have they done enough to not just make the playoffs, but to basically convince Zach Werenski to stick around? have they done enough to set the stage for that already?

Is there more to do? What do they need to do? What do you do? How do we deliver on the premise here and actually fix this team if they need fixing? Yeah. So I think at this date, we'd have to say, no, they have not done enough. I think they are in a situation here where they started a rebuild four years ago. and I've always said the easiest part of a rebuild is to decide to do it.

And that first year's kind of fun. First year's fun. Look at all these guys. Look at all these guys. Great. And then it gets hard. It gets really hard because you're just expecting everybody on the straight upward trajectory and it never goes that way. They're in a position where they have to rely on some of those pieces, some of those rebuild pieces to be.

to be better than they were a year ago. And this isn't asking a player to be something he's never been before. This is asking Kent Johnson to be back to the player he was the year before last year, 24 goals. This is asking Dimitri Voronkov to maybe take another step with the offseason conditioning. And there's a sign that that's happening. I'm not going to say it's been done. who knows until the season starts and really you get into the season. But he has stayed in North America this offseason to train with the guy in Connecticut

to hopefully show up in camp, not just in better shape at the start of camp, but be able to be who he is as a player well into the season. He's supposed to be a physically imposing player. And by the end of November, December, his hands are on his knees during stoppages because it's too much. He can't get to hits because he's out of gas at the end of shifts. He's got 20 seconds in him. So the coaches say this is not my opinion. Those guys being better makes them dramatically better.

Top six better. I've got Varankov on the fourth line right now, but certainly has the potential to move up. I do think Nchuschen helps. I think Sean Monaghan, who had a really, really good season two years ago and was not very good last year, in part because of injuries. You wouldn't make that excuse, but others around him will. There's some reason to believe that just them being an improved version of themselves makes them better.

And who are the real blue jackets? Are they that team that muddled for three months under Eveson? Are they that team that for two months looked unbeatable under Rick Bonas? like they looked like they had depth, like they knew who they were. Jet Grieves was the goalie and really had taken charge there. There's so much to like about that team. And then it's almost like they looked at the scoreboard with the minute left

and thought, okay, we're good, like we did it. And all the air came out of them. And they looked completely lost. I don't know who Connor Garland is based upon last season. because that fiery, battly, grindy guy that you're

undersized guy you're root for just wasn't present the last three weeks of the season. Hell Werensky wasn't very good the last three weeks

of the season. The entire team just completely collapsed. Marchenko looked like it was too rich for him at times. So again, when you're talking guys

two years, three years into their playoff or in their NHL careers, those stretch drives where you're in it and teams are battling for playoff spots. That is such a rich experience. They did not handle it well. Is that

who they are or is that a learning curve that they needed to pick up on? So I think they are mildly better because I think I believe in Kent Johnson as a player. I think he brings life to this team as a playmaker. But have they done enough to for sure catapult them into playoff realm. No, I can't say that.

I mean, there's some teams that missed last year that I think most people think are going to be back this year. So who are they taken out? Are they taking out Philadelphia? Possible. They've taken out Pittsburgh. I think that's possible. I think you could certainly justify picking them as a playoff team.

I'm not a betting person anyways, but I wouldn't throw any money on it because there's just too much up in the air. So I don't even know if that answers your question or if that just ducks it completely. I think ducking maybe does answer the question because there's just a lot up in the air on this team. And they've certainly got ground to cover, I think, to get where they want to go. Porsi, thank you so much. We will, of course, keep an eye on you and all your Blue Jackets coverage this summer leading up to training camp, which is not all that far away.

So I will. Thank you very much, though. Appreciate the insight. Thanks also to producer Jeff and to you for watching, listening, and to this episode of The Athletic Hockey Show, Sean Gentile and Max Boltman are going to try to fix the Detroit Red Wings. Speaking of American superstars who won out.

This one without the big makeup yet. That'll be our next show. That's on Monday. And so we will see you next time at the Athletics Show hockey show. Thanks again for watching and listening. Talk to you next time.