The Athletic Hockey Show - Jarmo Kekäläinen confident Mike Babcock will bring Blue Jackets back to playoffs, goalies cashing in and winners and losers, so far in free agency

Episode Date: July 5, 2023

Jarmo Kekäläinen, the General Manager of the Columbus Blue Jackets joins Rob Pizzo, Jesse Granger and Michael Russo to discuss the Blue Jackets hiring of Mike Babcock as head coach, drafting Adam Fantilli with the third selection in the draft, acquiring Damon Severson and Ivan Proverov, and the hope that the Jackets stay in good health this season as they look to get back to the playoffs with the ultimate dream of winning a Stanley Cup.The roundtable takes a look back at the first five days of free agency with new deals for Dmitry Orlov, Alex Killorn, Ryan Reaves, Blake Wheeler, Matt Duchene, Ryan O'Reilly, Gustav Nyquist and Luke Schenn, Tyler Bertuzzi and Max Domi to name a few, and some of the players still out there looking for new deals, like Jonathan Toews, Patrick Kane and Matt Dumba. Plus the guys discuss the ongoing soap opera between Alex DeBrincat and the Ottawa Senators, and the free agent moves for goalies Joonas Korpisalo, Tristan Jarry and Ilya Sorokin.Subscribe to The Athletic Hockey Show on YouTube: http://youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is The Athletic Hockey Show. What's going on, everybody? Welcome to the Athletic Hockey Show. The Wednesday Roundtable Edition. I am Rob Beasel from CBC Sports, joined by a couple of guys who are finally back home after, at least according to your social media accounts, pretty fun time in Nashville.

Jesse Granger is back in Vegas, Mike Russo in Minnesota. How we doing, boys? Great. I'm looking forward to Jesse's wedding this weekend. And I'm heading out there, going to hand him the ring. And it's going to be a big surprise to him. Yeah, I was going to say, you're the ring, boy?

This is news. Yep. Jesse Granger, we talked about this when it, when it originally happened, you know, the proposal, getting married in a couple days. So this is going to be the last show for you in a while and the last show for Russo in a while. But we'll talk with that later because I don't know if you guys know, free agency happened. It opened up and it opened up a bit of a floodgate as it does.

each and every year. So we're going to talk about that. Yarmalkekelein and GM of the Columbus Blue Jackets is going to be joining us in the second half of the show. They've been active long before free agency open. But let's just start there, guys. I mean, it opened noon Eastern time on Canada Day for us up here. So you're trying to spend time with your family outside and barbecues and everything

else. And meanwhile, you're keeping track of what's going on. There's always one signing, one team, move, something that jumps out and sticks in your head. What was it for you guys? Maybe Jesse we'll start with you. So I guess the thing that stood out to me overall was that nobody has any money to spend. I mean, this flat cap has been obviously an issue for a few years now, but I feel like this is the first free agency period that it really caught up to everyone. You saw last year going in every, like half the teams were in LTIR. And this year, they're just,

weren't big deals to go around. And it was tough. If you're an agent out there, this was tough to get your player what they deserve on the open market because there wasn't a lot of money. And I think the one contract that stands out to me, to me, the best signing of the day. And it was a one year deal for $3 million for Matt Duchesne. And he was one of the best players on the market. And he gets one year, $3 million. If you're the Dallas stars, that's a phenomenal signing. Like I love that signing for them. The stars were so good last year. They obviously fell just short, losing in the conference final, but their depth scoring was their strength. And with some of their core players getting a little bit older, you were wondering, like, is that depth going to go away? And is it going to be just Jason Robertson

and those top guys? I think this cements that this team is going to be, once again, a really deep high-scoring team. Matt Dushan for that contract is a phenomenal deal for the Dallas Star. So to me, that was the best deal of the day for any team. And it highlights how little money anyone has to spend that Matt Dushain, who's going to score 25 goals next year, can only get $3 million one year on the open market as one of the best free agents. Like, that's crazy. Yeah, and I think part of it is that a lot of these players at this point are realizing that the cap is going to go up at least $3.5 million next year and then hopefully start to really skyrocket. And so, you know, you punt it down the line. You bet yourself, you sign a one-year deal, then you can get that big home run contract next year.

That's why I also think it's really good business by teams like Chicago and Arizona to get Jason Zooker at one year at 5-3 to get Corey Perry and Nick Folino at one year, four million, even though those crazy numbers to give them. But, you know, at the deadline, if those teams are not in playoff positions and we assume Chicago is not going to be, but Arizona is going to be a tough team to play against this year. I think they were paying for a lot of teams to play last year, and I think it's going to get better now. I love that Bill Armstrong is starting to now really build this team into actually trying to win. But if they're not in a great position, Jason Zucker on the open market is as a trade deadline piece is going to get you probably at a minimum of first round pick.

And same thing. I got to think that Chicago is going to be able to trade Perry and Flino. And I bet you that was a big selling point to them. It's like, come here, help our kids for a little bit. And then we're going to trade you to a contender at the deadline. And I think they were all in on that. And Duches is going to be the same thing. Now, Dallas is not a team that's going to be trading him at the deadline, but next summer,

he's going to get a lot of money. And Matt Dumb is another guy that hasn't signed yet. I think he's probably got a deal on the table with Arizona. And he's somebody else, depending on the term of that deal, maybe he buys him for long term or maybe he just signs for one and they can move him possibly at the deadline as well. So definitely a strange, you know, free agent period from that standpoint in terms of term. Yeah, only seven contracts. We're five years or more.

And obviously we're recording this at a certain time. Maybe other ones will come out. But it's just not what we're used to see. Like this is when free agency opens, there's seven and eight year deals flying around like, you know, all over the place. And this year just it really wasn't like you said.

And it all comes back to that cap eventually going up. I'm always curious to see how new GMs do and rolls. And we had a couple of them who certainly rolled up their sleeves and got busy. Nashville with Barry Trots, who officially took over now. Like, I know it's kind of been a slow transition with, with Poyle on his way out. Signs Ryan O'Reilly.

Signs Luke Shen. Signs Nyquist. Traded Johansson. Brought in Matt Duchesne, as you guys mentioned. You know, he said he wanted to change the culture of this team. So obviously he wants to make this a Barry Trots team. Your thoughts on what Barry Trots and Nashville did and what kind of team really they're going to play with, Duchyne assigned.

I know you already touched on that, Jesse. Just this team to me is one of the ones that improved the most from July 1st. Russo. Yeah, that's exactly it. Like, you know, if you remember at the trade deadline, David Poyle was basically saying that they're going to go into a rebuild situation, but this seems like a, you know, more than a rebuild situation. This seems like a retooling on the fly.

And, you know, he, he is able to trade obviously or get rid of Duchen in that capacity, pretty much trade Johansson for nothing, but he changes the culture. But then instead of doing nothing. nothing or just adding a couple veterans that aren't going to really add anything. Ryan O'Reilly and Luke Shen and Gus Nyquist are going to be actual impactful players on a team that is, has a lot of young kids coming up, you know, with Novak and some of these guys. And obviously you have, you know, Saras, Annette entering, I think the last year of his deal. You have Yossi there as well. But O'Reilly Shen, Nyquist, these are going to be functional players.

Nyquist was one of the, when he played in the playoffs and down the stretch for the wild after he came back from his shoulder injury. He was as impactful of players that they had with Marcus Johansson as a trade deadline pickup. We know what Ryan O'Reilly could do and his pedigree of bringing a leadership and a real quality two-way forward. Very Joe Pavelski-like, which is the way that Barry Trots described him. And then Luke Shen, who just keeps on getting better with age. I mean, man, has Ben Hankinson, the agent and Luke Shen done really good work for this guy. He's making more money now than he's ever made. Leads the league and hits pretty much every year.

and he's turned himself into a real wanted professional. I mean, there were a lot of teams circling on Luke Shen, offering him anything from a million dollars to the 2.75 that he got. So I love the work that Nashville is going to do. And it seemed to me that pretty much most teams in the Central Division improved remarkably between the draft and free agency. Before it gets you, Jesse, you got to love the buyout too. You know what I mean? You buyout, Dushain. He gets that deal with Dallas.

no one's going to feel sorry for these players, but I mean, get paid twice. It always seems like a good thing. Right. And that's probably part of the reason Duchenne didn't get paid anything. Like I was talking about earlier, like $3 million. That's insane for a guy. He scored like 40-something goals the year before last year. But I think when I look at all these moves Toronto made, I'm sorry, Nashville made.

And you mentioned like it won't, Barry Trots wants it to be a Barry Trots team. When I think of Barry Trots teams, I think of structured, defense. We're going to try to win two to one and then let our best player score goals. And I think you look at Ryan O'Reilly, great defensive forward. Luke Shen, good on the back end. I think they're playing to their strengths. And I think you saw last year a team that didn't defend worth a crap, to be honest, and UC Soros having to stand on his head every night and make 45 saves to win.

And I think Troth says, look, we've got a superstar goalie back here. let's play a little bit better structured around him and he's not going to give up any goals. And we can win games three to two, two to one. So I think it's a shift in mentality for a team that has obviously some fabulous scores. Bill Forsberg is one of the best in the league. Let those guys make a player to a game that get you your goals and then play really structured defensive hockey around one of the best goalies in the league. So I agree with Michael. I really like what they did.

And I think that a shift in mentality. when you've got a goalie as good as Soros is, I think is a good thing. By the way, Matt Duches, getting paid in two states with no state income tax. That's the bigger coup. The guys didn't even think of that. Beauty. Didn't even think of that. That really is genius.

Another new GM, maybe under a bit of a brighter spotlight in Toronto. You mentioned, Jesse, it seemed like you wanted to jump to the Leafs already. Let's get the Leafs now. Brad Trilliving out. Ryan O'Reilly, Luke Shen. Noel O'Hari, Michael Bunting. In, you got Ryan Reeves, John Klingberg, Tyler Bertuzi, and Max Domi. So it was a quiet first day for true living, but then it all kind of came through the next couple of days.

Are the least better or worse than they were as they were having that handshake against Florida in the second round of the playoffs? Jesse? Well, you lose Ryan O'Reilly and that hurts, but I love Bertuzzi as a play. To me, I can't answer this question until I figure out what they're doing. in net because you hear all the reports that they're trying to shed Matt Murray's contract. And if they do that, are they in play for a Hellebuck or a Gibson or anybody that's an upgrade over what they have because their goleys are terrible. So if they can get a goalie, and it doesn't have to be Hellebuck, if they get Hellebuck, they're probably the favorites to win the East. I don't think that's

going to happen. It's going to be tough to fit in the cap. But if they just get a goalie who's not a Vezna candidate, but just not awful, I think the Leafs are better. I think they can be a better team. I like the Bertuzi signing. I love his game. I loved him in Detroit. I thought he did well in Boston. He plays that net front that I think Toronto could use, right? Like, Vegas won the Stanley Cup with skilled guys on a line around a guy that will crash the net and let the skilled guys make their plays on the perimeter of the zone and someone crashed the net. I think Toronto obviously has plenty of those players. They need the guys that can get to the front of the net and Bertuzi is one of those players. So I love that signing for them. I think it's a perfect fit. I like his game.

they still need a goalie. They've got to find someone back there. I don't know what they're going to do. The cap situation is what it is. I think if they can somehow find a way to pay someone to take Matt Murray's contract, suddenly maybe you can squeeze a trade for Carter Hellebuck because, man, that would be fun. But I need to see what they do in that before I can say whether they're better or not. By the way, not a Vezna trophy candidate, but not awful.

That's analyzing. That's analyzing goalies, Rousseau. So that's why we got him on this show. He is. He's our goalie writer at the athletic. athletic now. So, uh, not now, everywhere, all the time. Um, I could, to Jesse's point, you know where they are better? Quotes. Um, big win for the sports writers. Getting Ryan Reeves and Max Domey, two of the best quotes in the league. Unfair. Unfair. Uh, really huge loss for us here in

Minnesota losing Ryan Reeves. And Max Domi, as I mentioned to you guys on my first very show with you on the athletic hockey show back in September, Max Dolmy might have been my favorite person to talk to it, that NHMedia tour in Vegas, just a really charismatic guy, colorful, no cliches, things like that. And then you have the added storyline of him going to the place where he grew up essentially as Thai's kid. So really cool. You know, in terms, I'm not a big, I liked him as a guy. I thought John Klingberg was, you know, really erratic here in Minnesota. I, you know, am curious if, and I do think that, that my gut says that Toronto made a play for Matt Dumba and was told that the 4.1 that they gave John Klingberg was not going to be enough for Matt Dumba.

So I'll be curious to see what Matt Dumbah eventually gets on his contract. You know, so to now have John Klingberg as your plan B, I know it's only a year. He's going to have to be a lot better than he was at the end of his Dallas career, certainly. in Anaheim and certainly here in Minnesota. The Ryan Reeves signing, and you've dealt with them, Jesse. Is there a need for a Ryan Reeves on a Stanley Cup contending team anymore?

You know, I've watched every league playoff game for a long time being in the area and seen it get analyzed left, right, and center. And I understand this team probably needs a bit of grit, sandpaper, whatever cliche word you want to use. But is Ryan Reeves the type of guy to do that. I know he's a great guy. I've never heard anyone say anything bad about having Ryan Reeves in a dressing room. As Rousseau just kind of said now, what a great quote,

what a great guy to have around. But is he the guy who's going to quote unquote protect Austin Matthews in the playoffs from being pushed around? I just don't know if in the 20, 23 game, he's the guy to do something like that. Jesse? Absolutely not. Absolutely not. He's not protecting Austin Matthews in any way, shape, or form. He's only on the ice, eight minutes and and he's never on the ice when anything happens to any of the star players because he's not playing with them. And then even if he, if two shifts later, if you send him out there, they're just going to decline to fight him. There's no repercussion for any, that does not exist anymore. I think when you talk about sandpaper and grit, Bertuzi is the sandpaper and grit that a team like Toronto needs.

Reeves, like you said, in the room, great. Great guy. They're all going to love him. And we were kind of talking about it off the air. maybe a locker room that's a little tight and a little business-like and not having as much fun as maybe they should, Ryan Reeves will bring the fun. I guarantee that. He's going to lighten that room up. He's hilarious. But I don't think he's suddenly nobody's going to check Austin Matthews because Ryan Reeves is on the bench. I don't think that's happening at all. Yeah, completely

concur. Didn't happen here in Minnesota. Carol Capricef was targeted all series against Dallas, and there was absolutely no repercussions from Ryan Reeves who played every game. But in the locker room is where I think Brad Tree Living probably felt it was valued. My gut says, without knowing for sure, that in Brad Tree Living's due diligence of what this locker room is like, my gut says is that he felt that it was quiet and tight, as Jesse said, and recognize that maybe somebody like Ryan Reeves can sort of loosen that up and bring the energy in that locker room. And I think that's probably an accurate statement just based on Ryan Reeves's interview where he said that he heard that the locker room is tight and loose and quiet, tight and quiet. So I think that's the reason for the signing.

But you got to play him. And again, eight minutes a night, you're going to, that does, you know, I do think that he's a better player than people give him credit for. But at this stage in his career, and especially on a three-year term, he just doesn't get there nearly as often. But I will say he's one of the most honest, cleanest enforcers that I've ever covered. He went something like 40-something games in Minnesota without taking a minor penalty. He took one in his first ever game with the Wild and then didn't take another one. So he plays extremely disciplined, doesn't take stupid penalties. And as Jesse said, at this stage, not a lot of people want to fight him.

So his value's got to be other places. And I know that sometimes people poo-poo that and say, well, if you're not, you know, showing you that showing us that impact on the ice and if Austin Matthews winds up taking a big hit that Ryan Reeves is useless, but a lot of the value that he brings is inside the room where a lot of us don't get our eyeballs on it. It's a lot of money for value in the room though. And I just wonder, there's no way to quantify it. You know what I mean? Just if they win the Stanley Cup next year, there's no way to be able to say, well, Ryan Reeves just loosened us up, you know. I think it's 100% quantifying it. They went first cup in 67 years. It was 100% because it.

brought Ryan Reeves in. I think that quantifies it right there. I mean, the first cup in like a thousand years right out, it can't be a coincidence. The first day, Tiberis just gives the cup to Ryan Reeves second because he's the reason that the curse has been broken. Oh, come on. So that's a stretch. We have to talk goalies because Jesse won't let us leave until we talk about goalies. Quite a few of them change.

Well, signing on the dotted line. Trista Jari didn't go anywhere. And they're paying these guys. My God. Yeah. $27 million for five. Corpusallo. That one is the one I really want your opinion on, Jesse.

$20 million, five-year contract in Ottawa. Sorokin gets 66 for eight years to stay on Long Island. Ranta, quick, Rimer, they all got one-year deal. So goalies seem to be cashing in on this one. I love the corpusola signing. And it's funny because I've seen columns writing both ways. I've seen people write that they love it. I've seen people write that this is an office.

deal. Here's my take on it. I think goalies are the toughest to project when they switch teams because goalie stats, more than any other player's stats, are reliant on their environment. So I always argue this. A goalie's stats are more a product of the team playing in front of him than they are the goalie himself. You have to watch the game to see which goalies are actually playing well, in my opinion. And I think why I feel confident with Corpusalo is he played really well last year in two very different environments. So he played in Columbus where they gave up maybe the most high danger chances of any team in the league. It was it was like men's league out there. It's just a shooting gallery. And he's standing on his head and he made a ton of saves. And you look at

his like his advanced metrics in Columbus. He saved a ton of goals above expected. He gave them a better chance than they should have had most nights playing behind a wreck of defense. Then he goes to L.A. And it's like, okay, well, how's he going to adapt? Because this is a very different game now that you're playing with a structured defense. The Kings have one of the best defenses in the league. And you just need good positioning. You need rebound control. It's a totally different style of hockey.

And he played really well there, too. He was great. And yes, he had a couple bad games in the playoffs, but it was against the Oilers who score on everyone. So I'm not going to kill him for that. I think he played really well behind two very different defenses. And now you look, and Ottawa played good defense last year. They gave a bunch of goals and they had some, like, I feel like every time I watched an Ottawa game, it was like six to five. So I kind of like, in my head, I'm like, okay, they don't play

defense. But they were 10th in the league in scoring chances allowed. They were top 10 in most defensive metrics. They just had the worst safe percentage at five on five of any team in the league. So they gave up a bunch of goals. I think you put Corpusallo in there. I think he's going to be above average. I think with that the way they played defense last year and the fact that they're getting a year older. I like that deal. I think Corpusalo is going to do well in Ottawa and I think it's a good fit. Yeah, I agree with you and I trust you. There were times last year I watched Carpasolo and he looked as good as anybody in the league. I mean, he makes some unbelievable saves, athletic, well positioned. And, you know what, like Ottawa to me was one of the most surprising

teams in the league last year just based that they weren't better because I saw them early in the year and that like Pierre Dorian is building something really good there. You know, they have really quality veterans. They have a lot of young kids. They have guys on the rise. power. They just got to bring it together and they need to take care of that goaltending position and hopefully Corpus Sala could do it. I thought the most crazy signings of the day and not crazy from a like, you know, like what are they doing standpoint, but how amazing is it that Varlamov and Sorokin are willing to play together for X. Like, you know, for like Sorokin signs the eight year deal. You think, all right, that's a sign that Varley's gone and they go and sign him to four years.

And the fact that they're comfortable, the two of them too, not just the team, but being a tag team there, because they believe in that system and that team, you know, if they could just get themselves some sort of goal score, I think that's a team that's going to be a real player in the East for a long time just based on the quality goaltending that they get in net from both of those goalies. To me, just real quick, that is the perfect scenario in today's NHL where goalies are no longer playing 65, 7.000. games. That's a thing of the past. You want your starting goalie playing 55 games. But that's not always easy. Like to find two guys that are willing to play together and aren't threatened by the other guy getting 35 games and what if he outplays me? Like that's a real thing. Like goalie pairs, they're obviously buddies. They spend all day every day together. But you're at the same time, you're competing against each other for playing time. I think those two, they're obviously very close. and the fact that they've played together for so long,

there's no, there's no, like, weird dynamic of is he trying, like everybody knows Sorokin's the guy. No matter how great Varlamov is, they know Sorokin's the guy. And Verlamov is equally okay with that. He's okay with Sorokin being the guy. I'm here to help us win in the 30 starts I get. And I just think that that is the model. That is the perfect goalie situation in today's NHL.

Rob, I can't wait until 88-year-old Lou Lamarillo assigned Sorokin to his next eight-year deal. Yeah, it's funny, though, because some goalies really thrive in that situation, Jesse, and some crumble. Because you talk about the pressure, is he going to take my number one job? Even though that, of course, comes down to what the coach thinks, it's guys like us that create that pressure. You know what I mean? If suddenly the quote unquote backup goaltender plays well in every situation that he's given and the quote unquote starting goaltender is faltering, It's people like us on roundtable saying, what are we doing here? Put this guy in.

And when you've got two guys that really do embrace it like that, it's only good for the team. And it really has transitioned. I mean, I grew up with Grant Fierer playing, you know, 70, 78, I think is the NHL record that he played that one year. 78 games. Marty Broder, 60 games was absolutely nothing for him. And there were goalies that were lifelong backups. We just don't see it anymore. And when teams embrace it, it's more to me, more about the longevity of the year, having a fresh guy.

Because when it comes to playoff time, we know that goes right the fuck out the window. Like you've got your guy and you're sticking with them. But if your guy's only played, you know, 50 games, he's a heck of a lot fresher than he would be if he played. That's 70 games that a Grant Fier would play, right? 100%. Correct. So goalies, goalies. goalies, goleys, they're getting paid and Jesse will talk about them until the day they died.

Before we go, um, is that was there one deal that was either a super big head scratcher for you, like what the hell's going on or a really good deal as far as value goes. Like I can't believe they only paid that for him and I think he'll really fit in well. Rousseau. Um, all right. The one that was, I thought a little bit excessive was Demetri Orly. off. I love him as a player, but man, seven and a half for almost eight million that he got from Carolina. It just seems like an awful lot for a blue line that's really good that apparently is still

going after Eric Carlson. And then, you know, to me, if you can get Blake Wheeler on the Rangers at 800 grand. That's my. I know, yeah, like, like, like to me, like, I know that people look at him and is washed up and all that stuff. I think that you put him in a new situation. I think he's going to help in that situation. The other one that was, it was really good, it was Clorne. Huge price, don't you think? But, man, is he a quality player? I like what they're doing in Anaheim. There's a lot of teams that are going to be good in the next couple years as they continue to build through the process.

Yeah, I totally agree with you on Wheeler. I mean, 800,000, like we washed up, to me is ridiculous. This guy has played 15 years in the NHL. Guess how many times he hasn't scored 15 goals? Zero. Yeah. Zero times in 15 years has he not scored 15 goals. Like that is in, this guy's getting $800,000.

Are you kidding me? Ryan Reeves is getting over a million dollars a year. Has he scored 15 goals in the last like 15 years combined? Crazy to me that they can get Blake Wheeler for that price. I love him on that team. I don't know. Like I think him being in a smaller role and not having to be one of the like core cap, like big pieces to a team.

Just let him do his thing. Let him score his 20 goals. They've got a lot of young players that can probably learn things from him. I like the Wheeler signing, and I think it's, to me, crazy that a guy that he has not had one drop-off seat. I mean, yes, 15 goals is a drop-off when you're scoring 30, but it's still 15 goals. Like, the dude's never had a drop-off. I love him at 800,000. I think Jesse hit the nail right on the head.

Obviously, the deal, 800K, which is kind of hilarious. I don't know what you two make, but 800K, I love the way we keep making it sound like it's minimum wage. But 800K, but he's no longer. going to be looked upon to speak about every loss, about every losing streak, but he's not that guy. He's not going to be looked upon to score the big goal. He's not going to be, he gets to blend with a very good hockey team.

That's, I'm really curious to see because he could be that guy. You, we talked about the cliche of the missing puzzle piece for a team to make a deep run. He's the guy who scores that triple overtime goal in game five of the second round that, you know, top. So, you guys, or serves the puck on a platter for that goal. Like, he's such a good playmaker for a big guy, you know. Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, fun time. And the other thing that really

baffled me, all the reports that came out there, Ryan O'Reilly was offered the same amount of money to stay in Toronto that he got in Nashville and said, no, I'm good. I'm going to Nashville. How much of that is truth we don't know, but I think that goes to show that sometimes people just don't like playing in huge markets like this. After the break, we're to speak to Yarmou Kekyllian and the general manager of the Columbus Blue Jackets. He's been a busy man and we'll talk to him about all the moves coming up. Well, boys, our next guest, he's had a busy few months.

He's pulling off deals. He had the third overall pick in the draft. He got free agency and not to mention hiring a new coach for next season. The general manager of the Columbus Blue Jackets, Yarmoukeklein, and joining us on the athletic hockey show. Thanks so much for doing this, Yarmu. I appreciate it. My pleasure.

You got to start with the draft. I mean, I know some GMs will say don't put any stock into those mock drafts. We all knew who was going to go number one, but most of the mock drafts had Fantilli going at number two. You were sitting at three. How surprised slash excited were you to see him drop down to your spot? I wasn't really surprised. I thought that we had a next group of guys, probably three players that we thought could go in any order, basically. So we appreciate and respect everybody's work for the mock draft,

but we have our own list. And that's what we, you know, we try to always sniff around and see if anybody would leak information, but that usually doesn't happen. So we were prepared to take the next player available that we had on our list, and we were extremely happy to get Adam Fantilli. Yeah, Yarmu, talk a little bit about Fantilli as a player. I remember when we were there in Mara Chashi was just blown away by your crowd that game.

And I know that you, I think you sold out eight of your last nine games. And it just seems like you always have this incredible support from your fans. I remember tweeting, I'm like, if anybody deserves Connor Bader, this is the fan base. And to have Adam Fantilli be your consolation prize, not too shabby. What do you expect that you're going to get from Adam Fintilly, who coincidentally, we had on the podcast a couple months ago? But just getting to know him a little bit better this week at the development camp, I think we're getting a fairly mature young man at the age of 18 here, turning 19 on our opening night. And, you know, he's physically mature, but he's also seems like he's a mentally mature young man

that took a leadership role right away in our development camp. And had some great showings here on the ice as well. we obviously watched him a ton during the season even myself that I don't usually get to do a whole lot of amateurs going but Michigan was just down the road and I got to see him at the World Junior and the men's World Championship so I probably saw him live about 15 times this year which is a lot more than I usually get to see the top guys if it's somebody in Western Canada or in Europe and I saw most of the the top guys play quite a few times. So Adam's been everything we expect so far, but I think that you always want to temporary expectations for young players going into the NHL playing against the best players in the world.

So our expectation for him is to just keep getting better every day. And he has the right mindset, and he's a driven young man. He does everything right on and off the ice, and we're not going to put any, any heavy expectations on his shoulders. We just expect them to come to the rink every day to get better. Yarmal, one more on Fantilli before we move on from him.

We noticed that too on the interview. We talked to him before and after we did the interview. You said maturity and that's exactly what we all talked about. He seems as though he's almost a veteran already having not even played. But how much do things like that and say the interview before the draft, how much do they come into play? because obviously you're going to try to pick the best player available. But when you interview a player like Adam Fantilli

and see that he's so far ahead of some of the other players as far as maturity goes, how much is that coming to play and making your pick? Getting to know the player, the Combine interview is not really the best opportunity. You've got 15 minutes to try to figure out the player how he is as a person. But we do our interviews during the year. The Area Scout is always responsible.

for getting to know everything about the player on and off the ice. Talk to the trainers, talk to the massage therapist, talk to teachers, talk to an ex-girlfriend if needed and go through his social media. All that stuff, the detective work goes into it. But at the combine, we also had a chance to have dinner with him and sit down in a more relaxed setting and get to know him a little bit better. So especially at the top of the draft, I think it's really important to get to know the character of the player.

You get comfortable with that side of them. It's not just about being a good hockey key player. It's about being a good athlete and a good teammate as well. Those are really important things, and we put a lot of value in those. Rob mentioned how busy you've been, and Adam Fantelli's probably the biggest player acquisition. I'd say the second was Dave and Severson and that sign and trade. And I'm kind of a two-part question. What do you like in Severson and what do you hope he brings to the team?

but also how do you weigh the options of waiting for him to hit free agency and then going ahead and making that sign and trade to get him before then? And obviously you only give up a third round pick, but just how do you come about that decision? Oh, we've been in that in that office on July 1st, many times where 32 teams are competing against some of the guys that are top free agents that year. We felt that Damon Severson was one of them. He was actually a number one target. So we wanted to make sure that we get aggressive and secure his services before we have to battle against 31 other teams. And we like everything about David. We like, as I mentioned, those three areas, we like him as an hockey player.

We like him as an athlete and a teammate and an leader that he can be for our group. So he checks all those boxes for us. We did a lot of homework on him talking to his. former teammates and Rick Nash had him at the Worlds with Team Canada. And so we feel like we had a really good knowledge on him, both on and off the ice. And he's a great addition to our group. Yarmwell, as I mentioned off the top,

obviously you got a new head coach in Mike Babcock. I was watching your press conference when you introduced him, and you said it was a long process. I wonder if you could kind of walk us through that process. And obviously, his story over the last three years has been pretty, well documented. I'm wondering how much of your chats with him before making that hiring really focused on that. And maybe has he changed some of his ways that got him to where he is right now and what happened at the tail end of his time in Toronto?

Yeah, I've known Mike since I think I met him 1999 for the first time when he's coaching Spokane Chiefs and I was on the road scouting games in Colonna and, you know, chatted with him. Every time I saw him, I lived in Michigan where he coached Detroit Red Wings. I saw him at the Worlds where he was coaching Canada or showed up just to watch. We've been in the same Olympics in 2014 in Sochi when I was part of Team Finland. So I think I got a pretty good feel for his personality and what kind of man he is. Everybody knows that he's a great coach. That's well documented. He's the most decorated coach we've ever had with the Columbus Blue Jackets.

He's won everything. For me, the due diligence, the long process was about talking to people that might know them even a lot better than I do. And people that I trust, people that have credibility. I'm not a big fan of the Twitter court or the social media court that I call it. And when I talk to my daughters about it, it's, to me, it's a sad world these days. people make mistakes. You learn from them.

You move on. You might even be making a couple of mistakes. And I think in my world, you can make three, four mistakes as long as you keep learning and get better. And the people that I talk to that I trust that have a lot of that credibility all said that he's a great coach, but he's a good person too. He can push you hard. And the guys that want to get better, appreciate that. I think with every successful coach, there's going to be a disgruntled player that's going to say. that you know what he was an a-hole because he pushed me and did this and said this and that and

hurt my feelings but at the end of the day i think coaching is about pushing people to get better every single day it's relentless and i can see that might now that i've gotten to know him even better every day that he's not going to give you uh okay well let's take it a little easier today no he's going to push you every single day and because that's what he does too when he goes about his work and comes to the coaching part of it and preparing his staff. I see the same exact demand for himself that he's going to have for the players. He's going to have that for the entire staff, too. And I think that's exactly what we needed.

But I just wanted to make sure that we did our due diligence, making sure that we talked to people that are, as I mentioned in the press conference, I talked to Hall of Fame players, but most importantly, Hall of Fame people in my books that vouched for them. and they all said positive things and not just about how he is as a coach, but how he is as a person and a great family man. Yarmah, you mentioned the social media world,

and you're one of the rare GMs that is publicly out there on Twitter where fans can essentially write you, text you essentially. And I got to tell you, when you made the trade for Proveroff, I looked at to see some of the messages that you were getting, and they were aggressive. I know that you probably see those. How hard was that to take? How much do you weigh that when you're making a decision like that,

that just certain people have their opinions about everybody's stance in the world? And sometimes that reflects on the organization. How hard was that time and how much did you guys talk about that behind the scenes? Well, I think for every decision, we weigh all the pros and cons and positives and negatives And when you say that I'm on Twitter, yeah, and very, very carefully. And I don't read that. These are the ads and the insults that I'm getting my daughters. Sometimes read, I've sent me screenshots and telling me how mean people can be.

And I said, well, please don't read it. And if you do, please don't send it to me. But, yeah, every decision has the pluses and minuses. And we take that into consideration. at the end of the day, we're hired to do a job here. So we got to have the strong moral code here and the values as an organization that we know what's right and what's wrong. And that's the most important thing for us. I think people, as I said at the time when we made the trade, you're entitled to have your opinions.

I think that's the great part of America that you have the freedom of speech. and freedom to have your own opinion without getting executed for them, as long as they're not criminal or totally wrong. People have strong beliefs, and I respect that. I don't always agree with them, but I don't go insult them either. You've mentioned the negatives to social media, but like Mike said, you are on there. What do you like about being on Twitter and being able to interact with some fans?

And just like, what do you get out of that? I don't really interact with the fans on Twitter. I think it's a good information source until they started limiting the, how many times you can scroll through it. I'm not sure where that's at right now. For me, it's mainly an information source where I can follow the right people and get the information and digest that. As I said, I'm very careful about what I tweet.

And I try to tweet about things that are very important to me, or my family or, you know, how my moral code and values are. But, you know, I weigh every single word and every single letter very carefully before I send it. Yarmou, when I think of your team last year, I mean, there's one every single year in the NHL. I just think of a team ravaged by injuries and serious ones. I know it's July 5th. I know we still have an offseason, but can you update us on some of the major injuries that, you know, the Werenskis of the world that, you know, miss so much time.

Are you going to have a healthy team? Maybe it's a long way to ask that question come training camp. Yeah, we're pretty healthy now. So keep the fingers crossed there. So, but it is July. So we don't miss any games in July. So we're working hard this offseason as a team and as a staff to make sure that we're very, very well prepared.

I think Mike Babcock is going to be huge part of that. Players know what to expect. He's already been in contact with, with our core group and getting through the whole team. And they all know that you better be in the best shape of your life coming into this year's camp. And that's going to bring the best out in your performance, but also keep you healthy and injury-free.

So I don't think I've ever seen a year like we had last year. I hope I never see it again. Injuries are part of the game. Every team hasn't. But we just couldn't as a young group, young team that we had, We just couldn't get over that amount of injuries. It was impossible for us. And I'm looking forward to having a healthier season next year.

Yaron, you know, one of the coolest parts of today's NHL is the inside glimpses that media and fans get to the way that the businesses run, the locker room, things like that. And you did an incredible job last year of really bringing all of us into the Johnny Gujarro, So, you know, courting and all that stuff. And one of my favorite parts of that video, by the way, was when you called Todd Chirac to let him know that he was, that you guys signed Goudreau and just his reaction. Todd's one of the great media relations people in the business for a couple decades now. How, how, like, bring us into that courting. When did it start?

And how just, you know, how cool was that whole process and for your fans in Columbus to land such a incredible player? Yeah, it was. It was interesting because obviously the top players are always on the top of the list for a free agency that you're open for. And he was probably the most sought after free agent and the market. And we made our pitch. And then they called us back. And we were kind of like, well, you know what? They probably call everybody back at least a courtesy call.

And we're kind of like, well, you know what? There may be some hope here. And then when they call later in the afternoon and it started really nice. looking like, okay, this is serious, this is genuine, and we might be able to get them. It was pretty exciting. I think it was exciting for us as a staff, but it was also exciting for our fan base. And, you know, but it was one of those things that, you know, in your teenage years, you're courting the best-looking girl in the party, and you think you have a chance, but might not be as good as you like. And but then when it's coming,

it comes to reality, it's great. Yarmo, a lot of times when you have the second overall pick and you get to pick a player as good as Adam Fantilli, you're a long way from winning. But as you mentioned earlier, you had a lot of injuries. The team can look a lot different this year. I'm just curious what the expectations are for this year. I covered a team in Vegas that a year ago missed the playoffs, largely because of all those injuries. And their expectations were that they were going to return to, and obviously that ended up working out for them.

I'm curious, how do you view the team and do you view the team? and do you view that there's a big step to be taken there if they can stay healthy? Yeah, absolutely. And I think it's amazing. You mentioned Vegas there how good they are and how deep they are. We did a study a few years ago that if you miss, if you get 300 men games lost, that basically nobody has a chance to make the playoffs. And so it would have been done like once in the last 15 years, something like that.

So it just goes to show you how much they can really hurt a team. But I think with the young group that we have, our expectation still to just keep improving every day. We have so many young players. But we want to get back into that competition where we're playing meaningful games all year long. We want to have that playoffs in sight until the last game, if we're not in it already. And then once you get into the big dance, you've seen many times what can happen. Anybody can get in.

Stanley Cup's been won from 16th place getting into the playoffs. and what a great story Florida had this year. So we just want to have that opportunity again. We were tasting it for four years in a row here. We're good enough to get any further, but we want to get back there. So whether it happens this year already, we'll see. But we want to at least be a team that's in that competition every single day

and until the end of the year where hopefully we'll clinch or at least be so close that the guys get taste of what it means to play all those meaningful games when it really counts for the big price, which is first the playoffs and then trying to get to the dream. Well, Yarmot, like I said, off the top, you've been a busy man trying to make that happen over the last couple of months. We really appreciate you taking some time out of your busy schedule to chat with us. Thanks so much for doing this.

Good luck this year. Hopefully we'll be talking to you later on in the season when you are talking about a playoff run. Thanks guys. Thanks for having me. Thanks, Yarmu Kekalayan and the general manager of the Columbus Blue Jackets. Rapid Fire coming up. All right, boys, we spent this whole show talking about signings. We like signings. We didn't like teams.

What moves they made. There are still players sticking around out there. So before we go, I mean, I'm looking at the list right now. Dumba's still out there. Nick Holden, as far as blue liners go. Patrice Bergeron, I mean, if he does sign, we know where he's going. But Patrick King, Crici, Parise, Teresenko. As far as goaltenders go, Halak, Martin Jones, Daylock.

I mentioned some names. If you've got an off-the-board name, please feel free to bring it up. But any indication or any guesses as to where we might see any of those players land. Rousseau. Well, I think Dumba has got some options. I think that Dumba has a deal on the table from Arizona right now. That's what I've been led to believe by sources. But I also think that maybe they're being a little patient with that based on the Carolina San Jose talks

and maybe one of those teams being a potential option if say, you know, maybe Carolina looks at Dumba if they don't get the deal done or maybe San Jose looks at Dumba if they do get the deal done. But Arizona seems to make sense to me because he has a place down there. The other one that's interesting is Zach Perisi. You know, for a while, usually Lulameralo doesn't announce contracts until the end of the year. The big difference this year is that he is, which tells me that the league has told him that that is no longer kosher. and if that's the case, maybe that Zach Preezy has actually not made a decision, and there's not just a contract waiting for him and that they're just going to announce at the end of the year. You know, Lou likes to be a little cloak and dagger with this type of stuff to make sure that people don't know his cap space.

But right now, maybe Zach is actually thinking, which is shocking to me for a gamer like him that scored 21 last year of whether or not he was going to continue to plug. Yeah, I agree with all that. So, Rob, you mentioned all these like veteran forwards that are kind of maybe looking for a landing, spot. Obviously, Bergeron, we know where he's going. Kane, Craychi, Parise, Teresenko. To me, Jonathan Taves is an interesting one because I think he can be had for pretty cheap, and I think he can bring a lot to a team. And if I were looking at a team that needs a Jonathan Taves, the Edmonton Oilers would make a ton of sense if those two could make that work. I think, like in vague, I keep going back to Vegas. They just won the Stanley Cup. I think there are lessons to be learned from every

team that wins the Stanley Cup. And I watched this one closely. They leaned so heavily. on the Alec Martinez's, the Alex Petrangelo's, the guys that have done it in the playoffs. And every day I'm talking to the guys in the room after a tough loss, after a big win, they're constantly saying, yeah, those guys talk to us and they kind of put it in perspective. Like, they just, they lean on those guys. And I think the Oilers have so much talent. They're, like, that team, if they had beaten Vegas in that series, maybe they won the Stanley Cup. I think they've got what it takes to win the Stanley Cup.

Maybe a guy like Jonathan Taves that can come in there, he can be a third liner or maybe put him on the wing with a McDavid or with a dry sidle. I think he can teach that team how to win. I think there's a lot he could bring there, and I think it could be had for a reasonable price. I just, whoever gets him, it's going to be a value, but I think Edmonton would be a perfect fit. We see a 775 deal for him, one of those,

775,000 were. It's another player Ryan Reeves is making more money than Jesse's going to bring up in a future show. Before we go, I want to get your opinions on the Alex De Brinket, Ottawa senators, war of words, saga, whatever you want to call it going down right now. Always fun to have a little back and forth in the media. Rousseau.

Yeah. How about Kurt Overhart and Frank Saravelli this week on John Gibson too? That was unreal. Yeah. You know, like I get the frustration here. You know, one side has to negotiate the deal with the new team. The other side has to make the trade. both have their own interests here.

I just think it's something that obviously, I think Pierre Dorian has every right to find the right deal first and then make the trade. And I think there are teams out there that have interest in them, but there's a certain price for talent this good. And, you know, Detroit's, I'm sure, in it. I think Anaheim makes a lot of sense for him. There's a number of teams that I think would give anything to have a talent

like Alex DeBrinke on their team. So to me, you know, I think I know Todd Reynolds and that whole group obviously are getting a little bit frustrated here. And I'm sure the narrative that is making Alex look poor in a contract dispute, which often happens, you know, it's business. And I just think that once it's all settled, it'll be good for both parties. But clearly I think we're heading for a divorce here. It's such an interesting dynamic in terms of like what it does to the trade value. when you talk about, do you let them negotiate the contract before we figure out a trade? Because I think if you tell them no, you're not allowed to talk to the player about contracts until we agree on a trade.

I think that kills the trade market because a lot of teams are like, well, I'm not, absolutely not. Like, I'm not even interested. Don't even call me. I'm not talking about a trade until I know what I'm going to have to sign the player for. So it hurts that. But then also, if you let the teams negotiate with him, suddenly De Brinket comes to a deal with a team essentially. And now that team, it's him or nothing. Sorry, it's that team or nothing.

And now that team can say, well, we already got to deal with him. He wants to come here. You don't have any other competition. Their handcuffs. Right. So now you're screwed as a gym. So it's like, it's not an enviable position to be in. It's very interesting.

And it's like, it's a tough, tightrope to walk. How much do you let him talk to the other teams to open the trade market up? But you also don't want to get cornered into having one team you can trade them to and losing all your leverage. It's very tough. Right. And by the way, way, I think I said Todd Reynolds. I think his agent is actually Jeff Jackson. There you go.

I'll ordinarily at this point of the show, guys, we're wrapping up. I'll ask you what you're working on, but you're both going to be taken off and abandoning me for a little while, but I guess they're pretty good reasons. And Jesse, we'll start with you. We touched on it on the top of the show. Jesse's getting hitched in a couple of days. You nervous, buddy? No, not at all. No, ready for it. It should be fun. And then going to Cabo. It'd be a good couple weeks. They have internet in Kabul. You can do the show from there.

Right. But I won't. I can, but I won't. And Russo, you're taking off too. Yeah, I'm heading to Sicily on Friday to see my homeland, my people. I'm Sicilian. Been to Italy two or three or four times, but never down to Sicily. So super, super, super excited.

And got a ton of really cool things in the next couple days, too, doing a podcast, a season ending straight from the source. with Bill Guerin. And I'm also doing a podcast on Friday. The Wilder are doing this crazy game of hockey with the lead singer of OAR, crazy game of poker. They're doing this whole charity weekend here. And so I'm doing a podcast actually Friday night with a bunch of wild players and Eric Stolhansky, the actor.

So that'll be a blast. I'm doing a couple stories before I take off as well. Just talk to Dan O'Rourke, the referee for a half hour. Dan O'Rourke, to raise money for the National Federation of the Blind. His dad is a couple of, is blind, 75 years old. It's really near and dear to his heart. He's biking 2,700 miles along Route 66 from Santa Monica to California starting July 27th, ending in early September right before referees training camp in Chicago. Really great cause. I'm going to be doing a really cool story

on that in the coming days as well. If anyone's wondering how Michael Russo is the best beatwriter on the planet, Rob just asked him to talk about his vacation, and he mentioned 17 different things. he's working on. So that's how it happens right there. I think a few times I heard him say before I go. Yeah. He goes in two days. Before I go, I'll do this. And Jesse? I'm not doing anything, man. I'm going on my honeymoon and just enjoying life. Well, both of you enjoy life. Congratulations, Jesse. I'm sure I speak for all our listeners as well. And Russo and Sicily say hi to some of my family too, because I got a ton of family in Sicily as well. And we're going to have a lot of fill in hosts. We're not stopping the show because these two want a jet set around the world.

Joe Smith's going to be joining the show next week. Shana Goldman, Jeremy Rutherford, both will be taking turns filling in for these guys. So the show will continue and the show will continue on YouTube as well. Be sure to subscribe. YouTube.com slash the athletic hockey show if you want to see our ugly mugs. And of course, the athletic hockey show continues Thursday with Ian Mendez and down goes brown. I want to say a big thanks to Yarmou Keklainen for joining us.

For Russo, for Jesse, I'm Paiso. I will talk to you next week.