The Athletic Hockey Show - Jarome Iginla to the Hockey Hall of Fame, Torts on Connor McDavid, Aaron Portzline talks Columbus Blue Jackets, Multiple Choice Madness, and more

Episode Date: November 15, 2021

First, Ian and Hailey talk about Hailey’s first trip back to Ottawa after leaving to cover the Calgary Flames, Ian taking Hailey for a cup of less-than-Starbucks coffee, Hailey’s great piece on Jarome Iginla’s Hall of Fame career, in 20 stories not often told, The Athletic’s 2021 Hockey Hall of Fame committee selections, John Tortorella’s comments about Connor McDavid, and more.Then, The Athletic’s own Aaron Portzline joins the show from Nationwide Arena to discuss the Columbus Blue Jackets’ surprising start to the season, how the Seth Jones trade feels around the organization now, Cole Sillinger’s stabilizing presence on the team, how the post-John Tortorella era has been so far, Patrik Laine’s resurgence, Rick Nash’s upcoming jersey retirement, and more.Plus, to close things out, Ian and Hailey run through a series of Multiple Choice Madness questions including who’s the best modern day player to never win a Stanley Cup, if the Arizona Coyotes are going to be the worst team ever in the salary cap era, and which is the most interesting team in the Pacific division.And, don’t forget, you can sign up for an annual subscription to The Athletic for just $3.99 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome back, everybody. It's another edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. Ian Mendeson, Haley, Salve, and with you to recap the weekend and get you set for the week ahead. Aaron Portsline is going to talk about a surprising start to this season in Columbus. Cole Cillinger has been impressive. The jackets, I think, have done better than many people have expected. So Aaron Portsline is going to draw by to chat all things Columbus. It's Hall of Fame induction week.

And we'll talk about Jerome Ginnla's legacy. See, Haley has a really cool piece that dropped on the athletic site earlier on Monday. And we'll debate some of the bubble players who are still waiting for their call to the hall. Hey, did John Tortorella have a point when talking about Connor McDavid on ESPN last week? We'll play that clip for you and debate whether or not Torts got it right or wrong. And we'll wrap it up as we always do with a little multiple choice madness asking, hey, who's the most interesting team of the Pacific Division? and whether or not this year's edition of the Arizona Coyotes

are going to be the worst team of the salary cap era. But we say hello on this Monday just down the street. It's the rare opportunity where we're both in the same town at the same time, but we're not doing the podcast in the same room. It's Haley Salvean back in her old stomping grounds in Ottawa. Welcome back. I was a little disappointed. There was no video tribute.

There was no flowers. Did you expect, did you expect? No, God, no, no, no. I didn't expect anything. A little bit. There was probably like 1% of you thought that during like the second TV, like what's the worst TV timeout in the game? I'd say second TV timeout of the third period.

That's like the one. Okay. Yeah. And I so shot of me in the press box eating candy. Yeah. People have started to leave. And then they're like, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome back Haley Salvean.

Yeah, you're probably, because the first TV timeout of the game. That's the important one. That's the important one. Welcome back Eric Carlson. Yeah. Clark Stone, every other player that's. Your second TV timeout of the third period,

but you didn't even get that. You didn't even get that. You know what? I didn't expect it. I was, it's fine. Was it weird, though? Was it weird coming back? Because you talked to.

the players who've been traded to other teams, they're like, oh, it was really weird coming back to the rink that I used to that kind of roll into every day. Was it weird for you? This was your first time rolling back to the Canadian Tire Center for a game day. You spent, you know, basically the better part of what, a calendar year and a bit? Two, two years. I was there for two years, but one hockey season. Yeah, one hockey season, two calendar years. Was it kind of weird rolling back in? You know what? It wasn't. It wasn't. And I don't know if that's because I'm enjoying Calgary so much. Like it was, it was nice. Like, you know, even the security guard at the front door, I think he, you know, he recognized us, I guess, us both when we walked in because he was just like, oh, yeah, you guys come on in. Like, don't worry. Come on to the media entrance. And, you know, the gentleman in the service elevator recognized me, like some of the security people. Like, those were not weird moments. It's there were just really nice moments of just like, hey, like, how are you? It's nice to see you. Like, how's Calgary? So it's nice to see people. That's the thing. It wasn't weird.

It was just nice to see people. Like, I always, whenever people ask me, like, do you miss Ottawa? How's Calgary? It's like, I really like Calgary. I really like the Spot of Man professionally, personally. The team's great. Organization's great. I love the city.

But what you miss the most about Ottawa is just the people. Sends fans are super cool. Like, there was a good media group there like you and Chris Stevenson and Graham creature and Calabokoscus, like all the, just the people, people in the arena, that's what you miss the most, not so much like the Canadian Tire Center and going, you know, it was, and it was completely locked down too, so it's not like I could have, oh, here's the old locker room or like, hi, DJ Smith or here's the, whatever, you know, there wasn't those moments of, like, doing the actual job because the job is still so different.

So it wasn't like a normal going into the rink for a morning skate, um, going. going downstairs post game into the locker room kind of thing. So I don't know. Wasn't that weird. It was just nice to be back. I got a chance to see Hangary Haley. Hangary Haley came out yesterday because you come. And this is the weird thing for fans who are going to arenas now in the National Hockey League.

Most of the stuff when you go to pay, and this happened, I was in Minnesota. I needed to get somebody to eat. And you got to use your visa, your master card, your bank card, right? everything is contactless payment. Except the Ottawa Senator's media meal, they're still taking cash. So I watched Hangary Haley roll into the arena. She goes into the media room. She's like, okay, I'd like to buy one media meal, please.

They're like, that'll be $10. Cash. Haley's like, I don't have cash. What is this? 2019. So she then goes to say, you know what? Ian, I'm going to go find an ATM and I'm going to take out some money. Why don't you explain to the listeners what is the ATM situation in the arena in Ottawa?

Because it's kind of weird. Yeah, there's no real ATMs. They're fake. They're not real. It's deceiving. It's wrong. There'll be the big money sign. Like, you know, you see the little dollar sign on the wall and you're like, ATM, I can eat something.

And you put money in, but you can't take money out. It's a reverse ATM. You can like put the cash into the machine to put it onto your little digital card to buy something like cashless at the rink, but you can't actually get money to buy food as a member of the media. So how many people are using this reverse ATM? And again, it is, let's say you go to the game, you got $60 in your pocket of cash, like $3.20 bills. You go to the game and then you realize all of the concession stands are taking. you know, credit card or debit, you're like, oh no, well, I guess I'm going to have to go convert

this $60 cash into a cart. But who's doing this? Who's putting money into an ATM inside an arena to, anyway, it just seems odd to me. I just didn't eat. Yeah. It's like, I guess I won't eat. That's why Hangary Haley. Hangary Haley was out. Yeah, you never want to see her. No, no. That's why I was so angry about the second cup. I was like, no. Is there a difference between hangary Haley and happy Haley? Yeah. I feel like the line is actually, like the gap is smaller than you would think.

I don't think that's accurate. That's just a little bit mean. You know what was mean? And just to give our listeners an idea here. So I decided out of the kindness of my heart, I was like, you know what? I'm driving to the rank. Why don't I swing by and pick up Haley on the way, pick her up from her hotel in the west end of the city, and I'll take her to the game.

You know? So I pick her up and on the way, she's texted and said, hey, do you think we have time for Starbies? Not Arby's, Starvees, which is Starbucks. Yeah. So I'm like, yeah, for sure. I know there's a Starbucks drive-through kind of around the corner. So I take her and I have forgotten that this Starbucks has converted into a different

coffee chain, which is called Second Cup. And I could see for like the whole block that. it's a second cup. Like, I'm literally staring at the second cup for like 500 meters. And I'm like, is he taking me to a second cup right now? And I take her, I take her, okay, listeners, I take her to the drive-thru and she's like, it's a second cup. I'm like, oh, no, I forgot.

I forgot. They changed it. So clearly not a Starbucks. Okay. But I said that there's a Starbucks 60 seconds away. Okay. So no sooner do I do a U-turn to go to the Starbucks? Haley's tweeting about it.

She's like, I got to tweet about this. I'm like, you got a tweet that I wasted 60 seconds of your time by, and I, and she was just laughing it up

and having fun and thinking this was the greatest thing ever. This moron took me to a different coffee shop. Like, laughing it up. Oh,

it was funny, okay? It was, it's funny because like I actually really like second cups coffee. Like, their drip coffee is really good.

But I, because I didn't eat and because I didn't know if the medium meal was going to be bad, my like, my toxic trait when I'm not, if didn't eat anything, is like, I guess I'll get a latte. That'll time me over for a little bit. And I am lactose intolerant. I like oat milk lattes. And I didn't know if second cup had that. Otherwise, if we were just getting a drip coffee, I'm like, oh, second cup's great. I was like, no, I need a latte.

and I think I'm mildly addicted to the holiday collection from Starbucks. The sugar cookie oat milk latte is so good. And I know your daughter likes it too. She does. I feel like I relate more to your teenage daughter than due to you, but that's fine. Yeah. We should get her on the pod one day. We'll bring her on the pod to bridge this guy.

But no, I appreciated it. And I thought it was just, I just thought it was funny because it was just like, we're, we're driving into this place and it's so clearly a second cup it just says second cup it's the big sign it's it is not a Starbucks and you didn't realize you're like staring like yeah here's a Starbucks like that is a second cup Ian it's maybe this very it was funny to me and I yeah I tweeted about it like you were literally tweeting before I even executed the U-turn to get out of the parking lot anyway There was just something so funny about the way I made it seem like second cup was like, like Sean McKenzie said like coffee time, you know, like some old, like terrible coffee shop.

Just like, how dare this man pick me up to go to the rink and take me to a second cup? I thought it was really funny. I thought I looked worse in that tweet than you did. I think it was split. I just looked like an ass. You look like you don't understand coffee shops. I look like a brat. Pick your battle, I guess.

Both things can be true at the same time. That's nice. Let's move on. By the way, yeah, let's move on. And we are going to, yeah, we're going to have a jam-pack show here. And I want to get into your Jerome McGilleyliss stuff too because it's a really cool column that you dropped today. But real quick, you are coming at us from your hotel in Ottawa. And now you've got your camera on.

Now, obviously, 99.9% of this is going to be audio. And, yeah, the odd time we throw out the video clip on social media. But your bed behind you is made. and I got to ask you this because now in the COVID world this happened to me last week or a couple weeks ago is on the road and they got this new thing. They were like, okay, because of COVID, we were not going to make up your bed and you're not going to come and clean your room, which I get it. I understand. Yeah. Do you make your bed in a hotel room now that there's no kind of housekeeping service?

No. Do you make your bed? No, so, you know, I'm like getting everything set up. I was packing my bag. So there was like a bunch of clothes everywhere because I'm trying. I'm a, when I travel, I take everything out and then I repack it all. I don't know why. It's not efficient. But I like to repack everything in my bag before I leave to make sure it's like packed in tight and there's, you know, room for stuff. Whatever, it's weird. I think I have some little OCD tendencies there. But but with the bed, I was like, okay, I'm not going to have this like messy bed behind me on screen and I'm making the bed and I'm thinking in my head like, do people make their own beds in their hotel rooms? Like, if you're staying at a hotel for a couple days and you don't have housekeeping and you're going out to get something in a city like, do you make your hotel bed or do you just leave it in the whatever lump of blankets that it always is?

I was like, I don't know. Alaskian, I'm the listeners. This is the ice cube conundrum. It is the ice cream. Do you make the bed or do you just leave it? Because you're just going to jump in it later. I leave it. But when you're at home, you make your bed.

It really depends. It's like 50-50. Like, you sometimes make the bed. Yeah. For me, it's like I'm not going to make my bed just to mess it up later when I go to bed. I'm going to go take a nap in a couple hours anyway, so I'm not going to make the bed. That's how I feel about it. But I'm curious to know what people think.

Do you make your hotel bed? Yes. Hit us up on Twitter with this one. But we did say, hey, this is a hockey podcast. And people are like, where's my hockey talk? It's coming right now. So you did the game last night on Sunday night, Ottawa and Calgary, but you had a story kind of waiting in the hopper, which I think is really cool.

So obviously hockey Hall of Fame induction ceremonies go. And Jerome McGill is going into the Hall of Fame. And you decided to do a really cool story, which was 20 different kind of anecdotes, interesting tidbits about Jerome McGinla through the eyes of the people who know him the best, like a good circle of friends and different stories. So how long did this, how long did this one take like to start putting together? Did you start a month ago, a couple weeks ago, longer than that? Like how did this all come together? Yeah, you know what? It took a long time and just for

context, like in this market here in Calgary, I think, and even for outside of the market like I was really struggling so I think I started talking about this with an editor in probably probably October after so training camp comes through I'm like okay let's get through September October camp season starts okay we're in it and I was like okay Jerome McGinth is getting into the hockey hall of fame in a month what the heck am I supposed to do what is there to say about Jerome McGinla that we don't already know that we didn't talk about when he was a player, that we didn't talk about when he retired, when he had his jersey retirement, when he officially got announced into the hockey hall fame 18 months ago, and then now. So it's

just like, what the heck? Like, how do you write the Jerome McGilless story differently? Because at the athletic, we have a paywall and you want to try to give people value that you can't get for free or that you haven't heard already. And so I was really struggling with that. And I think something that's worked a lot for different teams, like untold stories or oral history. So I was like, okay, I'll just start talking to people and see how much I can pull together. And I will give credit, Stephen Nesbitt. He's in Pittsburgh. He's done some really, really great features in Pittsburgh. And he did this format previously. It was just like, you know, 20 stories or 16 stories, 12 stories about X player. You know, who is the format we were looking at is like,

who is Drell McGinnla? Here's 20 stories from people who know them best. And I was like, that's cool because you can do it in like a really bite-sized way. You can scroll through this 4,200-word story. And there's all these little bits. And it's really digestible. And it's really easy to scroll through and just learn different things about Drome and Ginla through the whole thing. So that was this kind of format we ended up choosing. and I talked to probably seven people who either played with Jerome or were friends with Jerome, coach Jerome, GM, Tim, et cetera, et cetera. And it took a long time.

I was working on it for a couple weeks. Just transcribing the interviews was a lot because I think you see the stories and you see the quotes you get like, okay, yeah, Jamie McClennan's in this story or Jason Strudwick's in this story like five times. But how long was that interview? I think I talked to Shane Dome for like almost an hour. And trying to transcribe seven interviews that range between 20 to 30 to 45 minutes to an hour. I was like, oh my God.

This was like it was a monster to get through everything and then to distill it down to little moments that people hadn't heard before or little moments that people might be interested in. It was a really big process. But I'm really happy with it. I think there is some stuff in there that people may. didn't know about Jerome McGinla, like he is a maniac fantasy baseball manager. Maniac. Like I was told, you know, when the waiver wire opens at midnight on Wednesday night or whatever, it's just like a Ginla, Ginla, Ginnla, Ginnla, Ginnla. He made the most transactions in their league because his team's bad. It's a keeper league. And so he's trying really hard to make his team good. And he's like

trying to make bad trades. Like Jerome McGinla is the typical like, oh, let me tell you about this prospect that I want to trade you for like the best player on your team like he's really good really really good like he's going into salesman mode and it was little things like that that I thought like these are the stories I want to tell because we we saw the golden assist we saw the shift in 04 we saw how good he was but there's lots of these little things about Jerome that we maybe don't know and I just wanted to kind of approach it that way like here's a little inside baseball peek behind the curtain into a little bit more of who Jerome is well also we're respecting his privacy because he has been a very private person. And I didn't want to like

pry back too far and do things that might be uncomfortable and just, you know, you know what I mean with that? Like it's always a balance trying to do the behind the scene story while also respecting the fact that that's a human being with a family and their private person. But it was really fun. To answer your question, it took long time. But I'm really happy with it and I hope people read it because there's some really cool and fun little stories about Jerome. and everyone was so gracious with their time. And I think that's really telling about who Jerome McGinnla is too. Like, Shane Don't's not talking for an hour with a media member about someone he doesn't genuinely really care about and want to talk about.

All these guys aren't picking up the phone to talk to someone they don't know if they don't genuinely love and respect and admire Jerome and want to share how great of a person he is. So that's always something that's not lost on me when I'm doing stories like this is people being great. with their time and how much they must like that person if they're willing to talk to me for an hour because that's probably not always fun, as you can attest to. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Listen, I can feel Shane Don's pain. I spend an hour a week talking to you.

It's not great. Yeah. But look, and I encourage everybody to go check out Haley's piece. Again, some cool anecdotes about Jerome McGinnla, headed to the Hall of Fame. And I always remember, I was lucky enough to do, you mentioned Jamie McClennon, and I helped Jamie put his book together, you know, whatever, eight or nine years ago, kind of looking back. And Jamie's such a good guy.

Noodle is such a good guy with great stories. And I remember in that book, he's got a great anecdote about Jerome McGinla and him and all of his buddies. And Jamie was, is tight with Jerome. And they're all at a hotel in Vegas. And they're sitting around the pool. And I think they're like, man. this is nuts. Like the best, like, and I think this was at like the peak of a giddler's powers.

Like so kind of 03, 04, 05, like kind of that window. And these guys are sitting around. They're like, man, isn't it crazy? Like the, like arguably one of the best hockey players in the world is sitting here. And nobody knows, you know, who he is. And I guess they had some fun with it. And they're like, hey, you think Jerome could put on his own jersey and do a lap of like the pool area and anybody would notice? So I guess Jerome had a jersey with him.

I think they were there for like some sort of awards or something. And he puts on the jersey and does a lap of the pool in Vegas. And I think somebody at the very end were like, hey, you Jerome McGinnler? And but it's just, it goes to show you that there's some great little anecdotes and stories. And it's great that you got guys like Jason Sredwick and Jamie McClennan to pull back the curtain a little bit because those are the stories that people like. Like you said, everyone knows setting up Crosby for. the goal and the fight with the cavalier and all the things that made Jerome McGillard. It's the anecdotes and the little stories.

And I love the way you actually started that column about, you know, Calgary making the trade with Joe Nuneck. I will argue, I think that's the most fair, even trade in the history of the NHL. Like, I don't think you could ever find a deal that, you know, usually something is lopsided or at the end of it, you're like, I don't know, this team, this is the only trade in hockey history. I think I look at it and like, you know what? Both teams won the deal. Jerome McGinnla goes to Calgary, has a Hall of Fame career and basically spends 13 plus years being the phase of the franchise.

Joe Nguendai goes to Dallas, helps them win a Stanley Cup. They don't win that cup with a New Indy. So it's like everything was accomplished. It's like one of the rare trades where everything works out for everybody. Yeah, I think so. And I put that in the piece, too. And it was interesting to hear Al Coates talking about it because he was kind of the one who was, like he was in charge of, you know, making that deal. Because there was, I think the, the GM had been fired.

The GM before him had been fired. And then he's, like there was, it was a lot of stuff that happened to Calgary that year, you know. And with Joe Neuendike sitting out and they knew he wasn't going to sign, it's Christmas time. And they're like, we've got to do something. And, but they were very specific, like they did not want a package. They did not want a bunch of stuff for Joe Newendike. They wanted one can't miss blue chip prospect. They didn't know it was going to become a hockey hall famer.

And he's like, nobody could have known that. Jerome had a good junior career. Nobody could have known what he was going to do in Calgary. So they wanted one blue chip prospect. He said there was 13 teams interested at first. It got dwindled down to three. And I tried. I was like, who were the other three?

please tell me. And he was like, I've never disclosed that. I'm not going to do it now. So I was like, I wanted to know who are the other two people they could have gotten in Calgary. But like I said, he wouldn't tell me. But it ended up being like three blue trip, can't miss prospects. And they chose the Jerome deal that was on the table with Dallas. And yeah, like in hindsight, most deals in the NHL have a winner and a loser.

This one didn't. Yeah. You know, because New Indy got the cup. New Indy got what he wanted. and Dallas got what they wanted, and he won a cons smite trophy. And yeah, Calgary got a hockey hall famer face of the franchise and overall great dude. Like you, it's both teams won, and it's, I don't know how many deals you can go. I think Sean McIndood did a story about the best win-win trades in history, but I don't think there's that many.

No, no, not, but I always think that that deal should be a little bit of a framework. and I know like Vegas traded, or, sorry, Buffalo traded Ikel away to Vegas a couple weeks ago. And what was the thing you always heard? Buffalo wants four first round assets, kind of like, you know, they want. I wish more teams looked at it like the flames did with New and Dyke and say, you know what, okay, we got a Hall of Famer here, like a frontline star. He wants out, we, it's time to move on.

Instead of getting three things back and what if we just took, like, give me your best, guy who's 19 years old. And if that doesn't work, okay, then great. But then let's move on. But sometimes I wonder if teams water down the package too much by asking for three or four things. Like wouldn't you rather just have one, I know there's no such thing as a surefire thing, but I almost feel like I'd rather have the high, high end prospect rather than, you know,

three or four things. Yeah, somebody that you're for sure going to hit on. That's what you want, right? Yeah, exactly. Now, I got to ask you, as we just to wrap up our holiday. of Fame conversation. Eric DeHocchick has a brand new column that dropped today as, you know, Eric used to be, of course, for people who know, a part of the Hockey Hall of Fame selection committee back in the day. So he's got tremendous insight into how the process works

and, you know, how everything kind of comes together. And for the second straight year, he kind of put together a shadow committee of athletic writers to say, okay, let's see if we can figure out who's going to, you know, who's on the bubble, who we would vote in. And you were part of this process. And in terms of the male hockey players that were voted in, this process led you to Alexander Mulgillney, who was pretty much a slam dunk, he's in, and then Daniel and Hendrik Sedeen, the Sadeen twins get in. Could you walk our listeners through Haley a little bit about the shadow committee and was it contentious? And how did you How did everybody get to a place where it was McGilney and the Sadeen twins?

Yeah. So the way that it worked is there was the nominees. And then we kind of went through the first ballot. And if you make it onto the first ballot, I think it was like you need 16 votes to get into the hall out of our 18 person committee. And if you get a certain amount of ballots right away, you get in. and then there'll be the runaway ballot of people who had gotten, you know, a majority of the vote, so then they'll do a second ballot.

So I'll let people know my ballot, who I thought should have been in the Hockey Hall of Fame this year. I voted for Bosa Dean Twins, Alex McGilney, and Daniel Alpharton. I think Alphardson should be in the Hockey Hall fame. People make the Hockey Hall of very good quips. There are so many people in the Hockey Hall of Fame now. that I think we can argue it's already the hockey hall of very good. Can't you say? Like, and there's so, how many times have we seen the Hall of Fame induction group and been like,

how is that guy in? Like, it's already the Hall of Very Good. There's people in there that were very good hockey players a long, long time ago. So to say that very good argument for Daniel Alpherson, it's like, okay, well, look at some of the people who are in who were behind him on the stats, but they won one cup. Like they, anyways, we can talk, we can talk about this more. We're doing the behind the scenes look. But basically the way it worked this year is that everyone, we did our votes.

And then there was a runaway ballot. So the way that the runaway ballot was the only people who got enough votes to move on to the second ballot was the Siddens. I think Zederb. No, not even Zetterberg. Sergei Gonschar. Yeah, it was the Sadeens and Sergey Gantchar. And so the way a runaway ballot work. is you can vote for, so if one guy already gets in, then you can vote for up to three.

You don't have to. And then because Gonshire made the runaway ballot, was like, you know what, he should be in the – he had a great career. And so on the runaway ballot, I just voted for all three. So instead of Alpherson, I voted for Gontr. Gonshire didn't get enough votes. The Sadeens did. So then our Hockey Hall of Fame class included the Sadeens and Alex McGilney.

And it's interesting because I think there's that real – separation of what qualifies as a hockey hallfamer. I think there's, there was a huge argument about Rod Brindmore, led by our Sarasivian. I think she was pretty ticked off that he, I think Rod got two votes for the hockey hall fame. And that was a big one that came out of it, was Rod. He revolutionized what it means to be a pro. He had, more points than a lot of these people. He won a Stanley Cup. And what I said in our group chat, the way we had this discussion, was this is a four-person ballot. It's not that Rod Brindamor wasn't a great hockey player. It's not that he doesn't have a Hall of Fame case, because you can

argue a case for him if you would like to. But are you really going to look at this list of players and say that Rod Brindamore is top four. Is Rod Brindamore better than Alex McGilney, Daniel Sadeen, Henrik Sidene, Henrik Zetterberg, Sergei Gonschar, Theo Flurry, Keith Kachuk, Daniel Alfordson, Vinnie La Caviéviere, Mike Vernon. Alex McGillney, Steve Larmer. Like, are we going to look at that group

and say Rod Brindamore's top four? That's the problem, not the problem, but that's the thing with the Hockey Hall of Fame. It's a four-person ballot. So it's not that he's not great. It's not that he doesn't have a case. It's just, is he top four? And that's, I think, been the argument with Daniel Alfordson is people, I don't think,

people think Daniel Offerton was a top four player out of previous classes, obviously, because he's still in the Hall of Fame. And it's going to keep getting harder because Roberto Luongo's up next year. And Yonker's going to retire eventually. Datsook's going to be available eventually. Like, the pool of players is going to keep getting bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. Guys like that are going to keep getting pushed back. And I think with Elfridson, with people like Daniel Elfretzen, I think it's the four-person ballot and it's the overvaluation of Stanley Cups for the Hockey Hall of Fame case.

This is talking about an individual player and you're dinging them for not having a team one trophy. Like I think we've seen enough that like one player doesn't win you a Stanley Cup. Like, it's not like the NBA where if you get LeBron James, you're going to have a really good chance to win a championship. Look at Connor McDavid. So I think we overvalue Stanley Cups in the Hockey Hall of Fame process. And I think we see that in stuff like this with Daniel Effortson. It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Very Good.

He didn't win a cup. Okay, but wasn't Alfredson like, at one point he was in the conversation for, he was a dominant player. He was a very, very good hockey player. It's weird. What's your take on all this, Ian? Like, I know I just rambled for a long time, but I think the hockey hall fame is interesting.

Like, the way that people view and value players in this context is, it's strange, I think. It's a little, I don't know. It is. And, like, I don't understand why the Siddins would be automatic and not Alpherson. For example, right? Because, you know, Alfredson has more career points, better playoff resume, all that stuff. And yet people are like, oh, the Sadiens are slam dung.

I do find it funny. Wouldn't it be hilarious of, like, let's say they elected Daniel but not Henrik or vice versa. Like, wouldn't that just be peak awkwardness? Isn't it kind of possible, though, because each person in the Hall of Fame, you're only allowed to nominate one player. So it's the point that Eric made. It's the point that DeHatchik made. Brian Burke has to choose one of them. He's the one that made that trade in Vancouver.

He's the one that orchestrated the trade to get up. both. Brian Burke only gets to nominate one. And what if the 17 other people in that room don't like the other one that much? I don't see it. Like, no, I, you know what? I don't see it. Like, I think they both get on the ballot, like kind of in that finalist, you know, ballot in the same year. And I think they're going to get the exact same number of votes. I think if you vote for Daniel, you vote for Henrik and vice versa. But it would be hilarious if somehow one of them got in. and the other guy didn't. Like to me, of all the people that are out,

Alexander McGilney should be in. And it's a crime. Alexander McGilney, at his peak, was a 50 goal. I mean, heck, he had a 76 goal season, multiple 50 goals score. If you want to go down the road of did he win a cup? Yeah, he won his Stanley Cup and was a big part of that New Jersey team in 2000. And I like the fact, like Alex McGilney, you got to remember,

He came over. He had to defect. He risked his life to come over and play hockey. And then was one of the best damn players for a decade. Like, how's this guy not in? Like, he was everybody's talented as Sergey Federov and Pubble Beret. Was dominant. Get him in already.

Like, honestly. Like, I'd like to make a passionate plea for Daniel Alpherson, but I'd also like to, I'd make a stronger one for McGilney. I'd make a strong one for Keith Kachuk. You know, these are guys that deserve to be in. And it's, I just don't like the fact that this thing is shrouded in secrecy. It's like, you know, when they elect like a new pope in the Vatican and nobody knows what's going on until you see some plumes of smoke. Like, this is what I feel like the Hockey Hall of Fame is.

Like I don't know what it is. And then all of a sudden somebody randomly makes it in like, like Rogi Vashon. And I'm like, I guess so. So, and I hate the fact that we end up tearing down people. I don't want to tear down the Sadiens. I don't want to tear down Daniel Alphards. And I want to, I think these, Rod Brindamore, whoever you think is deserving to be in there needs to be celebrated.

But it's, it's an awkward, sticky, weird situation that feels like, oh, it's peak NHL. Like, we're just going to be hidden shrouded in secrecy. Yeah. And when you look at the people who are on the board, like it's 17 men and Cassie Campbell, I think. Yeah. So you wonder why. There's a lot of times. It's why, you know, people wonder, like, you know, two women can get into the Hockey Hall of Fame every year.

There are two spots. Yep. A lot of times we just get one. And, you know, because what the people in that room can't cough up a second name. Yeah. There's way more women who should be. There are some women with incredible, incredible careers, not just from Canada and the U.S. who should be in the hockey hall fame.

And we just get one per year, typically. because we're arguing over, you know, a guy who played in the 80s. Totally. Hey, listen, you brought up McDavid there early. I want to get to something that John Totorella said last week on ESPN. You know, we haven't, I don't believe we've had a podcast on the athletic side since John Totorella said this about Connor McDavid. But I just want to, you know, point this out.

McDavid hit the 600 point plateau on the weekend. sixth fastest player in NHL history to get to that plateau, 600 points. The only ones to beat him there are all the guys who played in the bananas 80s era, right? Uatsky, Lemieux,

Peter Stasney, Mike Bossie, and Yari Curry. Those are the only players of the history of the game. Five players who played in a different generation all got to 600 points faster than McDavid and then Connor is next.

So the separation between McDavid and his peers is unbelievable, but I want people to listen to this. This is John Totorella last week, Thursday night, I believe, talking about how maybe, yeah, listen, it's great. McDavid is a statistical anomaly, but maybe he needs to change his game if he wants a little more postseason success.

What's the next step, though, to become a winning player, a playoff winning player? Because you're not going to get the calls you do in the regular season. He didn't last year, and that was a bit of an issue. Yeah, and he complained about it a little bit. He wasn't getting the calls. I, you know, quite honestly, and I hope I say it, just shut up. Don't talk about it.

I do think he has to change his game a bit. Not turn into a checker, obviously. He's talked about culture. He's talked about standard. He's talked about winning. You're not going to outscore. You're not just going to fill the net during playoffs and outscore teams. You have to play on the other side of the puck.

You have to have that business-type attitude of nothing's going to bother me. No matter how you're going to check me, don't talk about it just. Play hard, play through it, but the other side of the puck is that important, too, come playoff time. I think he's learning. Tips going to have to get that whole group. If they're talking about a Stanley Cup, they're all going to have to play a little bit of a different way, not just try to out score teams. There is motivation because you never want to be the guy that is the best hockey player in the world that didn't win a Stanley Cup.

Marcel D.on, you could see how much it affected him when that was being talked about with him. It's something you don't want. Well, it took Mario a long time. Yep. Sackack a long time. It took Eisenman a long time. Just early on here. Ovechkin, I didn't think they were ever going to win in Washington, but Ovi changed his game a bit and they end up winning a cup.

All right, Haley. So that clip from Torre certainly took social media by storm. Now that everybody's had a chance to listen to it, maybe have a couple of days to kind of let it marinate. What do you think of John Totorelli is saying that Connor McDavid might need to change his game a little bit if he wants to win a Stanley Cup? Yeah, I will say I didn't think the full clip was as bad as it seemed to be on social media. Like when I initially just saw the tweets about this clip, it sounded like Tortorella was like torching McDavid saying he's like terrible and you need to change the way you play or you're never going to be successful.

I don't know if that's exactly what he was saying. Like I didn't think the full clip with all the context was as bad. Like he even says like Dave Tippett's going to need to get the whole team, like all those guys to play a little bit different. And, um, which is true. Like, the oilers have not won anything. So like, obviously something does need to change there. What I don't like about the clip and what I'm sure a lot of people didn't like about the clip is making it seem like it's Connor McDavid's fault or like the problem with the Edmonton Oilers is something that Connor McDavid could change. Because he hasn't been the problem. Like, we know that. Like, we know Connor McDavid's not the problem in Edmonton.

And do I think that having a guy, like, once the playoffs get harder and faster and time and space goes away and, yeah, you can't really outscore your problems in the Stanley Cup playoffs. I do think, though, like if there is a team who can outscore their problems, they're showing they can do that in the regular season. This is tough because you say that and then you think, like, that's, hasn't that been the Edmonton Oilers thing the last couple of years? They can outscore their problems in the regular season. They get to the playoffs and they can't do it anymore. And I think that's what John Tortorale was trying to say. Yeah. Is like, look at the body of work that we've seen from the Edmonton Oilers.

Look at what they can do in the regular season. And then all of a sudden that goes away. Is the refereeing part of it? Absolutely. Like, Connor McDavid didn't draw any penalties in the playoffs last year, even though people were all over him. That cannot happen. That is embarrassing.

It's a joke. Like, the refereeing in the playoffs is a joke. Time and space goes away, but you should still call across. You should still call a trip and a hook. But do I think that you can't outscore your problems in the playoffs? Absolutely. Like, we've seen it. You can't.

The game gets different. And I think the Oilers as a team will need to adjust to that. But is it on Connor McDavid to be better in the playoffs? No. That's my problem with the clip is making it seem like it's a Connor McDavid problem. I agree with a lot of what he said, though. Okay. But here's what I want to know from you.

And I'd love to hear from our listeners on this too. Like, and you can always drop, by the way, you can drop a comment in our comment section there on the podcast page or, you know, hit us up on Twitter. Do you buy what Tororella says that, you know, Alex Ovechkin changed the way he played? And I asked that Haley because in the year that the Capitals won the Stanley Cup, Alex Ovechkin scored 15 goals in the playoffs. He didn't become this like lock it down guy. They won because he was scoring goals. And the regular season that year, I believe, yeah, he scored 49 goals in the regular season

and then 15 in the playoffs. He didn't become this kind of, well, two-way. Like sometimes I think what I hate is we look to, like we look to explain things. Like, like, oh, you know, finally, oh, he finally got it. Well, what if just finally there was some luck for Ovechkin? Like the guy was so good for so long,

it just wasn't his time. And then he got the breaks. And now all of a sudden we're like, well, that guy's a winner. But he was always a winner. Like, he just didn't have the breaks go his way. And I ask you this too on, like Steve Eisenman's the other one

where people will say, you know, Steve Eisenman used to just be about the points back of the day. And then later on, he became responsible. And I'm not disagreeing with that. But the Steve Eisenman that played in the 80s, like the game was so wide open. When Eisenman won those cups in the late 90s,

early 2000s, it was the dead puck era. He wasn't, nobody was getting, you know, 150 points, unless you were, you know, Lemieux, the odd time. But like, the game changed. I think sometimes we, we like to say that, you know, players, they got, they changed the way they play. Sometimes it's just their time and they get lucky. I don't think Alex Ovechkin changed the way he played.

I don't think Ovechkin is a different guy now. I think he's the same guy. He just happens to have a Stanley Cup. That's all. Yeah, I mean, I wish I had like an example, but I remember, I remember, and, you know, plus minus is like a really old stat. But I remember the one year I think he won the rocket. He had like 50 something goals and he was like a dash 35. And I was like, what? Like, like, you scored over 50 goals and won the rocket Richard, but you're still a minus 35. Like, I think there was a time when like, I think there, what people, like, Ovechkin wasn't. great on the other side of the puck. And I don't think he completely overhauled his game, but I think he was more defensive,

maybe more responsible, or maybe he was just on a different line. Like, I wish I had a better example to use right now. I don't think he overhauled his game, like Tortorella said. Did he play with a coach who had a better defensive structure? Right. Yes. That's the system you're playing within.

That's not on Alex Ovechkin. That's on the system that your coach has implemented. that makes the entire team more structured and more responsible. There's more emphasis on puck possession and ozone time and you're better in transition. You know, F3 is coming back. F1's in this spot, you know, like that's a systematic thing, I think, more than anything. But it also takes the player buying into that system. And we saw that and he obviously won a Stanley Cup within that system.

So that's where I think with Tortorello, what he was saying is like Tippett needs to get them into that, you know? Like, that's a, that's on the players to buy in, but it's on the coach, too, to, to, to, to, the coach and the assistants, the associates, whatever, to implement, implement a system that's going to work for your stars, but also, you know, not get five goals against. Because, yeah, like, it's, Darry Sutter was talking about it, um, in the preseason. Like, we, we, the Calgary Flames cannot outscore their problems. We do, I'm saying we, because it's Darrell talking. Like, we do not have the elite. Star Power to score as many goals as you need to outscore your problems. Like Darrell said it, he's like, we don't have, we don't have elite goal scores on the Calgary Flames. We can outscore our problems. Nathan McKinnon can outscore his problems.

Connor McDavid can outscore his problems. And we see that in the regular season. We don't see that so much in the playoffs, again, for all those reasons. So is it on Connor McDavid to overhaul his game and be better? Like, he's the best player in the world. I think it's on maybe Connor to buy in to some of those defensive things, but it's also on like the coaching staff to implement a system that's going to work in the playoffs. And it's on the depth pieces too. It's on the checking line.

It's on the defensive matchup line. Like is Connor McDavid going over the boards to match up on the defensive side of the puck? No. No. It's not his role. It's a collective thing. Can Connor McDavid be better defensively? Sure.

So can Leon Dreidel. so can the entire Edmonton Oilers. That's not on Connor McDavid. All right, Haley. When we were putting our heads together last week and we said, you know, what's some compelling stories that need a little bit more coverage here? We thought of the Columbus Blue Jackets.

We book Aaron Portsline and then the jackets go out and lose two games in the meantime. But hey, listen, still off to a great start. We say hello to Aaron Portsline coming at us from the nationwide arena. You can hear some pucks in the background. Hey, Aaron, thanks for doing this. Well, you bet, and it's great to be with you, although there is, I think suspicion is the word that maybe you have jinxed the proceedings here in Columbus. Seven and three kind of under the radar, and then the two stars come along and want to show a little spotlight on this thing. And then two tough weekend losses to the Rangers and the Caps.

But way she goes. Good to be with you, though. But hey, listen, let's talk a little bit about this because I think a lot of people figured Aaron in the offseason, and Columbus is going to be a bottom five team. Like lock it in, they're probably going to struggle. So how big of a surprise is this off to a, you know, seven wins already this season and kind of hanging around? Yeah, well, I mean, I remember thinking,

am I missing something or other people missing something when they look at this because, and I get it, there's a perception, and it's not even a perception, it's the reality that so much talent has left Columbus. I think the wrong perception is that there was nothing left in Columbus, that it was taken down all the way to the wood, as they talk about with the rebuild. It was never that. They're not tanking.

They don't have it in themselves to tank, I don't think. But it's a better team than maybe people realize. However, there are two major roster. flaws or question marks coming into the season, you wondered big time about center ice. Just there's so many questions at center ice. There still are, but Cole Cillinger, the 18-year-old, has stabilized that a bit. Now, I don't know how confident you can be as a team when you're stabilizing player in a position is an 18-year-old, but he has really helped them immensely down the middle. The other big question was on the right side of the defense. Any team in this league could

take Seth Jones and David Savard out of their mix going back to the trade deadline last year. That's, those are, that's 45 minutes of the game right there on the right side of your D. So what does that look like? Jake Bean comes in from Carolina. He's never played in that capacity before. He's played a lot of NHL games, but not against top opponents, not on the top pair. So big question marks. Bean's been pretty good. Cillinger's been pretty darn good. One of the bright stories

among the young players in this league this year. But there are still some question marks with this team and you started to see him pop up over the weekend. But I do think they will be competitive. There's a fighting spirit about this team. They do have some players. Vorichek, Linaid, Jenner, Bjorkstrand, Werensky. This is not a bare-bones operation.

But there's some big, question marks on the roster. It's a very young team. And there's a long way to go as I think a lot of people started to see this weekend. You mentioned Seth Jones there, Aaron. I mean, is anybody missing Seth Jones right now? And, you know, do the fans feel like the Jackets won that trade in hindsight now looking at some of his underlying numbers and just, I mean, the eye test of what he's kind of looked like in Chicago? Yeah. Well, I mean, it's a great question. I think, I don't think there is vitriol around Jones like there was, Bobrovsky, Panarin, and those guys. I think people here recognize the tremendous, really the favor that Jones did by letting them know

he wasn't going to sign here a year out. Like that is, that just changes things so dramatically. You know what? The fact that they started as they have, I don't hear a lot of people pining for Seth Jones, but I also don't want to be that guy because Seth Jones is a really, really strong two-way hockey player. Chicago's off for a rough star, but I think even if you talk to people in Chicago, they would not pin that start on Seth Jones, certainly not solely on Seth Jones. There's been a ripple effect to him not being here for sure,

but I also think they've moved on pretty quickly. They're excited about being, they're excited about Bogfest. They're really excited about Cole Cillinger. he's not here if they don't trade Seth Jones. And they're excited about the prospects that are coming as part of that trade as well. So I think it's been a really good trade for Columbus, but it's probably a little early in the process to say who won it yet or not. Well, and I think, Aaron, a lot of it could be dictated by the first round pick that they get back from Chicago.

Could you walk us through, how does that work in terms of, obviously, Chicago is really struggling. So all of a sudden you're looking at what could be a high pick. How is that protected from a Chicago perspective? And at what point does Columbus maybe have to take a pick in the following year? Yeah. So after the lottery, if Chicago has the first or second overall pick, they get to keep it this year.

Which I love that Chicago's basically said this is a two-person draft at the top. I like that they also kind of put their cards on the table. We think we're going to be good, but let's edge our bets a little bit with this. Anyways, if it's the first or the second pick for Chicago, the Blackhawks keep it. If it's the third or higher, the Blue Jackets get it this year. In the event that Chicago keeps their pick this year, the Blue Jackets get their pick in 23 with no lottery protection. So, but on. And Aaron, you've mentioned Cole Cillinger a couple of times.

Here in Calgary, I will say he was at the top of my draft board that I built for the flames at the last draft. So I was very ticked off, very ticked off. I mean, Matt Coronado is a great player, and he's been doing really well in college to start the season at Harvard. But Cole Cillinger is in the NHL, and he's been really impressive. You've mentioned him a few times just how good has he been. Can you expand on that a bit for us? Yeah. Well, Haley, they should listen to you.

They should listen to you on the draft floor. So it's interesting because the blue jackets, they took Kent Johnson at number five overall, a kid who's tearing up in Michigan right now. And then they settled into just a nerve-wracking experience, hoping that Cillinger would be there at 12. And the draft is such a strange and odd event. They felt like this kid from the moment they drafted him, they had some thought that maybe just maybe he would be ready. And that was more about his physical presence.

He's really good shape. Obviously, he's the son of a former NHL player, so he's grown up around the game. They loved this kid for so many reasons. The skill, for sure, but the way he carries himself, the honest two-way game that he plays. It's rare.

In Columbus, Ohio, we've seen a ton of 18-year-olds come into Kansas. camp, big time prospects, top 10 picks, what have you. And many of them can really wow you with their skills, sometimes with their skating. The thing that's so special about Cilinger is he can affect the game in the positive. If there is no highlight assist or highlight goal, he wins face-offs. He's a really responsible two-way player. They're playing him on the power play, the top power play.

He's been sort of protected a little bit at the start of the season. They had Boone Jenner up top. But everybody's known from the first day of camp, this is the best two-way centerman in Columbus right now. And so it felt like a matter of time before he moved up. Now he's playing with Jake Voracek. Lining has hurt, so he's got Chena Kalv on his left, another young guy, 20 years old.

But just in the way that this kid handles himself on the ice. off the ice and interviews. And I go back to John Butchagros, the great broadcaster with ESPN. When Cillinger was drafted, Bucchagros' comment was, it's like he was born to do it. And that's just how it seems. It comes so naturally to him. Again, his father being improved for so long helps, of course. But this kid, he's one of those kids that you just look at in Marvel at 18 years old.

he's got a grip on things that some guys never quite get a handle on. He's been very, very impressive. It's, uh, Aaron, it's funny you bring up John Butgera Gras's name because, uh, we just played a clip earlier in this podcast, uh,

with, with, uh, his conversation with John Tortorella, where Tortorella kind of went at Connor McDavid. And I got to ask you, uh, what's the post-Torts era been like in Columbus? Because I think John Totorella really kind of had his fingerprints all over that

organization for a number of years. Brad Larson's in there now. Are you noticing, is there anything different that you're noticing, hey, in the first 15-some-odd games of the post-torts era in Columbus? Yeah, I think he could say that John Tortoella still has his fingerprints here. He left a hell of a mark here in Columbus, Ohio. Brad Larson was his assistant for his entire time here. So there are parts of Larson's coaching approach that are absolutely from the Tortorella

handbook, you would say. Having said that, it's different. It's not, I think you're starting to see guys, you're starting to recognize guys who maybe did need a different voice. And then there are other guys who you thought needed a different voice and may really awaken without Tortorella around who just have gone the other direction. Maybe they missed that voice.

Maybe they missed Tororella. I'm thinking of Jack Roslovak, who has really fallen off the map here. the first month of the season. Tortorella is still kind of present here in the way a lot of these, I think of the way Boone Jenner goes about his work. That's always kind of been Boone, but I think I think Tortorella left an indelible mark on him for sure.

Bjorkstrand for sure, Werenski. There's this feeling, I think, from a lot of people that the players here couldn't wait for him to go. I think it was time for him to go. I think he realized it was time for him to go. But it was not a situation here where the players couldn't stand him. It's not a situation where they'd grown tired of him. A lot of these guys owe a lot to him, and we'll speak freely about that.

But yeah, it's a bit of a different system. I think there's less, I don't want to say walking on eggshells, but I think there's a feeling of it being a little more loose around here. Maybe not good cop, bad cop, because I think Larson's tried to continue some of the stuff that Tortorella established. But, yeah, Tortorella is still very present in a lot of these guys' career in a lot of the way that they do things around. Patrick Lainet, out four to six weeks with an oblique strain, I believe that was the report last week. Is that still an accurate timetable? And is he still one of the more intriguing pieces on that roster in Columbus right now?

he definitely is yeah it's been 10 days since that injury so unless something changes two and a half to four and a half weeks he's had his whole i think he's had a half of finland in here but i'm told it's just his family while he's been injured they were at the game the other night a big crew of people and i'm not sure how much of this uh to to uh to aan's question about a tordrella moving along it coincides for sure but is it coincidental i'm not i'm not positive liney came to camp in a much better space than he was before both mentally i'm told physically um he has been i almost fell out of my chair i think is the way to say it in the press box during the preseason when line a skated about 80 feet 100 feet on a back check and most people

in the press box were looking each other like, I'm not sure I've seen him backchecked before. That was impressive. He's skating hard. He's using his frame. He's actually playing like the power forward at times that Tortorella pushed him to be last season. Last season was a debacle for so many people. He was the poster child of that. This did not look like an engaged, an impressive NHL player and got it together this offseason apparently because he's been one of the better players. Point-of-game guy. He's got the big shot, but he's been as effective as a passer as he has been shooting the puck.

So he's been one of the really bright stories of the early going. I'm sure they're hoping he can keep it going on the other side of his injury. A final one for you here, Aaron. Over the weekend, the jackets announcing, or late last week announcing, Rick Nash's number 61. and is going to be taken up to the rafters at Nationwide Arena in March. And I'm wondering now what's the legacy for Rick Nash? Because I think when we think about the jackets, we think of so many star players leaving town.

And Nash was arguably the first to do it. And I know that when star players leave, there's often a period of bitterness and, you know, tension between the parties. I guess it's safe to assume that's all buried and in the past. and this now feels like the closure that Rick Nash needs to say goodbye? Yeah, it's a fascinating thing. He was the first, well, he was not the first guy to leave.

Adam Foote basically orchestrated his trade out of town when they were five points out of a playoff spot in 0708, unconscionable. Why he's, Adam Foote's been a bit of a bry in Columbus ever since. Nash was the one that really, really hurt because he was the Mr. Everything. Like Mr. Everything here. He's the kid that inspired so many kids to pick up hockey. So many young hockey players wanted to be Rick Nash. There are two that play for the Blue Jackets now.

Sean Corolli, Jack Roslitt. He was their guy growing up in Columbus, Ohio. And then it became public that he had asked for a trade. I think there's a bunch of things to go into this, but when people look back now, there were raw feelings at the time. When people look back now at that team and that state, and you remember it's before they went to the playoffs four years in a row,

before they started this run of pretty respectable play. So people didn't have this to, they didn't know this was coming. All they knew is that they thought they were getting somewhere, here's their best player saying I'd like to be traded on. So there was some anger there. I think the passage of time helps a lot of things. Nash came back to the organization. He would have played here again at the end of his career

if his concussion symptoms would have allowed. I think they were close to signing a contract. I think he just came to terms with the fact that for his long-term health, he probably shouldn't play anymore. and so he couldn't come back as a player and I think that really bothered him because he is a guy who takes this sort of stuff really personally

and I think the getting booed here I think that really ate him alive but the opportunity to come back and work for the organization he was welcomed back on the ice with his family kids the crowd welcomed him back there are going to be booze

I won't talk those people out of their feelings go for it whatever but I think that is the vast, vast minority now. I think people understand where he was coming from. I think people appreciate the situation he was in. Certainly they appreciate the work he did for this organization, really putting Columbus on the map as much as any one player could.

Never won a playoff game here. Did ask to be traded. So are there going to be hard feelings for some people? Sure, sure. But I would suspect on March 5th when his number goes up, against Boston. And you're talking about an unbelievable photo opportunity. So you're going to have Boone Jenner taking the ceremonial puck drop,

Nash dropping the puck, and I'm guessing the Bruins are going to send Felino up to take that ceremonial puck drop. You'll have the last three blue jackets, or captains, taking that face off. That picture is going to be all over basements and playrooms in Columbus, Ohio, for time and memorial. I think the scene on March 5 is going to be welcoming him back, overwhelmingly positive. Well, that's sort of.

We look forward to that, kind of the first big date to circle after the Olympic break in Columbus. Aaron Portsline, I appreciate you dropping by the podcast. I think our listeners appreciate not only your insight, but the sounds of the rink in the background. It made it feel real authentic. Thanks for this. Totally organic. Hey, thanks, guys. Thanks for having me.

All right. I'm going to wrap up the show. That was a great conversation with Aaron Portsline, with the Columbus Blue Jackets. I'm going to wrap it up, Haley, with a little multiple-choice madness. Always love it when the listeners play along here as well. But I've got three questions to wrap up this Monday edition of the podcast.

Here we go. We're talking about Jerome McGinler earlier in the show. Here's my question. Who's the best modern-day player who's never won the Stanley Cup? So I'm looking for, what if we just did guys who have played the majority? of their careers in the 2000s. Like, so since the year 2000, you know, they kind of had the best part of their career in the 2000s.

So who's the best modern day guy with no cup? Is it A, Jerome Ginnla, be Joe Thornton, or C, Henrik Lundquist? Haley, who is your answer there? Oh, man. I mean, that's tough. It's tough. For me, it comes, Joe Thornt was a great player. But for me, it comes down to Ginnla and Lundquist because I think, like, a Ginnla

was for like a three to five year span like probably the best power for in the game if not like there was an argument for him as the best player in the world like from that 2002 where he scored 50 for the first time and ended up losing the heart to Jose Theodore which is still controversial to this day it's in the story I wrote from there to like you know he was great that season then there was the 04 cup run then there was a lockout the year after like

there was a span where like there was a span where like there was a very, very fair argument to be made that Jerome McGinnla was the best player in the world. And then I think Henrik Lundquist, there was, like, he was one of the best goalies. And, you know, it was the kind of, I remember the playoffs, it's just like, oh, man, you don't want to play the Rangers because of Henrik Lunkwis, like he could steal a series, he could steal a game. So that's a really tough one. But I guess it's just because I just spent weeks and weeks and weeks talking to people about

how great Jerome McGinla is. I'm going to have to go with Jerome McGinla. I think I might go Joe Thornton. And I think it's because you look at, like, he's got, you know, that 0506 season. He was so dominant, what a heart trophy. Like, I think there was a window there where Joe was the best playmaking center in the game, like, you know, three, four, five years where he made people better around him. And I think at the end of it, you're going to look at Joe Thornton's career.

You're going to see, you know, 15, 16, whatever it is, 15,600 points. Like, statistically, this guy is going to go down as one of the all-time grades. and I think you can't go wrong with any of them. But I'll give my vote to Joe Thornton because I think he, boy, he was so, he was so dominant there for a little window. Okay, next question, Haley. The Arizona Coyotes have one counted one win so far this season. Here's my question.

Are they going to be the worst team of the salary cap era? Haley, are the Arizona Coyotes going to be the worst team of the salary cap era? Yes or no? Probably. Like, I'm trying to... Okay, so, I mean, it's a hard one. I'm trying to think of what... I wish I did the math beforehand.

One win. How many games they played in? Twelve? They are, yeah. They are one, ten, and one, I believe, right? Sorry. No, sorry. Sorry, they've played, sorry, they've played 15 games and they've won one.

Oh, no. Sorry, they're 1, 13 and 1. Oh, my God. So if you're winning one game every 15. Yeah. Yeah, you're on pace for six, basically six wins. I know, I just did the math. They're not going to win six games, but I'm asking.

I'm just like, oh my God, that'd be so bad. Yeah, I'm sorry. The low bar, by the way, it's 48 points. The avalanche of 2017. finish the year with 48 points. Are they going to have fewer than 48 points? Do you think they would? I know this is not how multiple choice madness is supposed to go,

but now I'm just like, oh my God, they're really bad. Yeah, I know. Heavy. Because what if they sell whatever they have? What if they're sellers at the deadline? Like, what if they have a few pieces that they still sell and they get even worse? I don't see how, I don't, ah. I mean, that's probably a pretty good bet to make that they're going to be the worst.

That's really bad. Yeah, I think I agree with you. I think getting the 48 points now seems monumental. Just for the listeners' sake, fewest points ever by a team of the salary cap era, 48. That's Colorado in 2017. Worst gold differential? Buffalo Sabres, when they were trying to tank for Jack Eichael,

they had a negative 113 gold differential. So that's pretty bad. So these are all things that unfortunately might be attainable for Arizona. I think I got a new idea for us, Haley. for the podcast. Because we do the Monday show. We need to look ahead each week. What's the winnable game for Arizona on the schedule?

So I'm going to give you this week, okay? This week with the coyotes. They got a Tuesday date against St. Louis, Thursday against Columbus, Saturday against Detroit, Sunday against L.A. So Columbus, St. Louis, Detroit, L.A. pick your game Arizona's going to win which one

I mean Detroit's not an easy out none of those are particularly easy LA's been pretty hot but they've got some injuries I don't know I don't like this game it's a new game I don't like it I'm just going to say

LA LA they won like six in a row but I'm going to say You know, I'm not, this isn't me analyzing which one's winnable. I'm just guessing. Like, if I had to bet, I'm saying, L.A. I'm going to say Columbus because we just had ports line on. And we've probably, we've probably, uh, hexed or done something to, to ruin things.

We're not the Tuesday show. We're not the Tuesday show having Jack Hughes on and then he's out. Yeah, good point. Good point. Hey, let me sneak one more question in here to wrap it up. the Pacific Division to me right now, I didn't think it was going to be a super intriguing division to start the year. It kind of felt like it might be a little bit vanilla,

but it's been anything but here's my question. And listen, feel free if you want to go off the board and if you think Seattle's the answer or San Jose or L.A. Right now, who's the most interesting team in the Pacific Division? Is it Edmonton, Calgary, Anaheim, Vegas, or Vancouver? Who is it for you? It's Vancouver. I think this offseason there was so much talk about look at everything Jim Benning did. He was one of the more active general managers in the NHL during the summer. Lots of things made. They, you know, Quinn Hughes and Lice Pedersen, they're holding out and then they get locked in. You've got the Ekman-Larsen deal. You've got all these moves that the Vancouver Canucks made to try to be better. And I mean, last night, everyone's talking like the Canucks.

You know, Twitter is, I think the nicest thing I've seen said about the Vancouver Canucks is that they're a disaster right now. And I think what makes them interesting is like, why? How did this roster construction happen? Like the one thing with the Canucks, and I think a lot of people were talking about this, is like, their window to really do something when they had the cat flexibility was when they had Hughes and Patterson on their entry level contracts. When you had two elite players and you had TANF and you had Markstrom and you have these two really good players on their ELC, so you could have used the money that's going to, that you're saving on having guys on ELC to bring in like good big players for the pocket of time to make a run for it. Because I think that is always a piece of the recipe to win a cup is if you have really good players on their entry level or like league minimum deals. So you can use that money elsewhere. and they didn't do that.

They locked in like older, more expensive players that are still there, not doing a whole lot. And I just think, like, I don't know, I don't know what's going on in Vancouver. I think people were talking about, you know, the last time a team got scored on this many times, coach got fired. And I don't know if I blame Travis Green for what's happening in Vancouver. But like, is Travis Green going to lose his job after getting a contract extension

and everyone talking about how great he is. Or was it going to be Jim Benning? Is this a clean house situation? Like, I don't know what's going on in Vancouver, how that roster got constructed that way, and what's going to happen next. But like I said, I think the nicest thing I saw on Twitter last night after their 5-1 loss to Anaheim was this team's a disaster.

You know what? I think it's Anaheim for me. I thought Anaheim was going to be this bottom feeding. And look, there's plenty of time for them to kind of slide this. There's not a better story than Troy Terry right now. He's got a, whatever, 14-game point streak, 11 goals to start the season. Ryan Getslough is playing like in 2010. He's got 16 assists.

Like, it's, and I think that Mason McTavish and Jamie Drysdale and Trevor Zegris give them this kind of fun element. John Gibson's giving them some good goal tennis. They're fun. The Anaheim docs are worth staying up to watch. if you're an East Coast person. They're really interesting to me. And the longer they hang around,

the more interested I am in the Anaheim duck. So I think they would get my vote for early season, kind of compelling team out of that division. All right, listen, Haley, we're going to have to leave it there because you've got to jet out of my town. You've got to head to the airport here. Yep.

Heading back to Calgary. Yeah. Back to my dog. Safe travels. I'll send you a second cup gift card. Just say thanks for stopping. Your next coffee is on me. There you go.

Hey, listen, it was. Honestly, great to see you in person this week. It is, you know, always a pleasure to do the podcast with you, but certainly great to see in person. Safe travels, and we'll do it again next week. Thanks, Ian. All righty. Thanks, everybody, for listening to the Athletic Hockey Show.

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