The Athletic Hockey Show - Panthers repeat as Stanley Cup champions | Instant Reaction

Episode Date: June 18, 2025

The Florida Panthers are once again the Stanley Cup champions, dominating their way through the playoffs en route to a second consecutive victory over the Edmonton Oilers. Max and Laz give their instant reaction to the Panthers’ Game 6 win and discuss what’s next for Connor McDavid’s Oilers.Hosts: Max Bultman and Mark LazerusExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Chris Flannery Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. Hey, everybody, Max Boltman here alongside Mark Lazarus for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show. And Laz, we've got a Stanley Cup champion. The Florida Panthers have repeated. It was not the game that I think we wanted to see. It was a blowout. But it's a pretty special accomplishment for the Panthers here.

I think it's quintessential Florida Panthers, right? The way this game played out with this is what Florida does to you. chokes the life out of you. They just, they're so suffocating on the forecheck. They don't let you do anything past the blue line. I mean, two periods into this game, Florida had three goals and Edmonton, the Edmonton Oilers had three high danger chances. They just gave up nothing over these last three or four games, aside from that second period in game four, this just total utter domination by a team that's as good as, you know, we've seen a lot of repeat champions over the years, a lot of teams that stay in the mix for a long time,

This is as impressive as any of them. Yeah, I mean, we talked about it last episode, and we talked about, you know, does this series belong among the greatest Stanley Cup finals of the cap era? And one of the things we said was if there's another blowout by Florida, you're going to look back on this series and go, hey, there was some overtime games that Edmonton won, but that was the best they could do against a team that was just better. And ultimately, I do think that is how this will be remembered. I mean, the Florida Panthers are just this good.

Yeah, I mean, games one and two were spectacular. Game four was great, but the rest of it was just the Florida Panthers being the Florida Panthers. I mean, they led in this series more than any team has ever led in a Stanley Cup final, and it didn't even go seven games. So it wasn't really as close as it appeared. The Oilers popped a couple of great games and had a couple of comebacks, but very rarely was Florida not in control of this series, just, you know, from Sergey

Bobroski to Gustav Orsling and Seth Jones, Aaron Ekblad, to, you know, Sasha Barco, just closing it out defensively. Reinhardt with four goals in an elimination game in the Stanley Cup final. Sam Bennett leading the league in goals scored, winning the cons might, the Brad Marchand experience. I mean, it's all Florida all the way. Yeah, our guy, Sam Bennett that we were banging the table for. Let's start with Barkov, though, because early in the series, he was one of the players that I

singled out on the show and I said, I wanted to see a little bit more from him. I think I saw the more from him. And part of it, Las, was by doing exactly what you talked about in that episode. It wasn't that he had to score. It was that his presence on the ice took away the greatest weapon in the NHL, Connor McDavid, and neutralized him at five-on-five. McDavid gets his looks. I mean, he makes the incredible pass to Cory Perry,

the Perry can't quite finish. But, I mean, he also had a swat late in the game that I thought would have been a really impressive play. But by McDavid standards, Barkov locked him up. Yeah, and look, Connor. McDavid is going to get some heat. You know, he had no goals in game six and seven last year, and he had one goal in six games this year. Like, that's not up to his standards. But we have to factor in the Barkov part, right? Like, it's not Connor McDavid disappearing. It's Connor

McDavid being neutralized by another great, you know, world-class, possibly probable future Hall of Fame player. I mean, this is as elite a two-way center as we've seen in the game's history, up there with the Patrice Bergeron's and your Jonathan Taves and some of the greats of the past. So, I mean, We could talk about Connor McDavid, but you have to give credit where it's due. And Barkov is just this relentless presence on the ice. He's just all over you. He can skate with McDavid. And when you can skate with McDavid and you have the defensive acumen that Barkoff has,

you shut him down. There's no probably about it. He is a slam dunk Hall of Famer. He's got the three Selkies to his name. He should have the 2024 Khan Smyth to his name. He's got the two cups to his name. That's the bottom line. He is the engine that powers.

one of the great teams that we've seen of the last 15 years. The Florida Panthers are a dominant force. Do we talk about that for a second? The fact that we're talking about the Florida freaking Panthers as one of the greatest teams we've ever seen as a dominant force as the standard bearer for the National Hockey League. The Florida Panthers? The biggest joke of a franchise in the Big Four sports

in North America for damn near quarter century? Like, what a time to be alive, man. Here's what amazes me about them is we do this every year a team wins a Stanley Cup and some group of the hockey media sphere some group of the hockey fan base

gets to pound their chest and go see my way is the way that you have to do it to win right? With the St. Louis Blues it was it's got to be gritty it's got to be defense first with the avalanche it was it's got to have the stars you got to have McKinnon and McCarr

good luck trying to do that with the Florida Panthers because they check every single box. The Florida Panthers are mean. They are gritty, but they are so skilled. They are so deep. They have so many stars. They've got high draft picks,

first and second overall guys that they drafted. They've got reclamation projects. They pulled off the scrap heap. They've done it every single which way, and it's all working for them. There is no narrative that can drive this bus. They check every single box, and every single one of them can be trumpeted.

Yeah, and you've got to give a lot of credit to Bill Zito, obviously for what they've done and Vinnie Viola in ownership and Paul Maurice as a coach. But not all of this is even them. I mean, a lot of it is you just, if you're so bad for so long, you're going to acquire a few great players over the years through the draft. But you're absolutely, the reclamation projects

is the biggest thing to me. Sam Bennett, Sam Reinhardt, Forzlin, Cardiff, Hagee. Gustav Forzling. Gustav Forsling was cast aside by three teams. He was on the Carolina Hurricanes for a year and they didn't even play him in the NHL. He was in Charlotte the entire season.

Now he's a two-time Stanley Cup champion and one of the biggest reasons why. Time and again, you can talk about the no taxes and you can talk about the nice weather and the palm trees, you know, if you're up in Buffalo, you can talk about all that. But the fact of the matter is they routinely pick up guys and get the most out of them.

Brad Marchand was not this player in Boston this year. He became this player again in Florida. There's something about that system. There's something about that locker room. There's something about this team that brings out the best in guys and you have to just tip your hat to them because it's just incredible what they've accomplished.

Yeah, and I don't know exactly what that is, right? You'd love to say that that's just some ineffable locker room quality, right? This culture thing. And that is probably part of it. I'm sure there's a ton of guys in that room, starting with Alexander Barkov who set that standard, right? I think at the same time, part of it is they have so much already going right that nobody has to try and be something that they're not.

Sam Bennett in Calgary was the fourth overall pick. He's supposed to be this headline. number one center. For the Florida Panthers, if he's a 50.2c, hey, that's just fine. And that's more than he was in Calgary. I get it, but that is just fine in Florida. And in the playoffs, he can be an absolute menace. Brad Marchand, he's a third-line player on this Florida Panthers, right? He's not producing like a third-line player. He's producing like an all-star for them in these playoffs, but he doesn't have to. That pressure goes away. Everyone can just kind of be who they are. Anton Lindell, you know, this is a guy who I think if he were

in a lineup would be even better, even more productive. But he doesn't have the pressure to be. He's a 3C and he's a lead at it. He's the best 3C in the league. Baby Barkov, right? All these guys are in the perfect situations for themselves because everything in Florida is slotted so well already. Seth Jones is a perfect example of that.

Here in Chicago, he was, he felt the weight of the world on his shoulders. He had this huge contract. Everyone around him was 12 years old and he felt so much pressure to perform night after night, he goes to Florida, he's theoretically their number three defensemen, right? Because Aaron Eckblad and Gustav Forzinger there, he was their number one defenseman in these playoffs because he didn't feel the weight of that. He was able to just to be his best self. And he just, you know, naturally emerges as their, you know, top minutes guy and playing, you know, heavy, heavy, you know, high leverage minutes and just dominating when he was on the ice.

He's just something about that system. It's so deep and there's so many good players on your right. It just allows guys to relax and play hockey, which is, you know, know, Sam Bennett, someone's going to throw a lot of money at him this year. He's smart. He's going to stay in Florida of whatever they can afford because that's where he's going to be able to be maximized. If you expect him to be your 1C or your 2C, be an 80 point guy because you're paying him $9 million, you're probably going to be disappointed.

There's something about where he is that works for him. It's why I would not leave if I were him. I would take less. I would stay in Florida and I'd keep a good thing going. Another Sam, Sam Reinhart. Number two overall pick. Nobody was ever questioning Sam Ryanhart's talent, but he never top of it. 25 goals in Buffalo. He's gone, he's gone way past that every single year in Florida, 57 a year ago.

I mean, you put him in the right circumstance. It's amazing what that can do. So I think truly a historic team. I won't use the word that I know you don't want me to use, partly because I think you're swaying me a little bit, but really truly an impressive team. I think the athletic already used it in the headline. So I've got some editors to talk to. But yeah, no, there's an inertia to it. That's kind of what we're getting at is like, once you start that ball rolling downhill and you create an environment that is good for players, you just get better and better. And then you bring in talented people that are able to maximize their ability. And all of a sudden, you have this just absolute juggernaut of a team from, you know, scraps that you built. It's just, it's Tony Stark in a cave, man. It's just incredible what they're able to do. And that's how you get a team of this magnitude. I mean, who's who who thinks they're not going to be good next year either? Maybe they do become an actual dynasty. They could, you know, the amount of miles logged on them is ridiculous. But, you know, you got Sergey Bobrovsky and that he's just cruising. The coolest cucumber on the planet.

That guy never seems phased by anything. You know, you've got all these guys, you know, locked up for the most part. A few pieces you got to make fit. But, hey, you got no taxes. Make it fit. And run it back again next year. They're not going anywhere. How many people, speaking of reclamations, now this one, they didn't go out and get,

how many people were already calling Sergey Brabrovsky one of the worst, most unmovable contracts in the NHL four or five years ago. I probably did at least once. I mean, it looks pretty good now. Oh, yeah. I mean, people were like, that was the summer. They tried to get Artemmy Panarin and Bobrovsky, right? And everyone's like, oh, you got the wrong guy.

You didn't get Benarine and you got Bobrosky. That's a $10 million albatross. You can't win a Stanley Cup with a $10 million contract. You certainly can't win with a $10 million goalie. Well, shows what we all know because Sergey Bobowski is a two-time Stanley Cup champion. The first guy Barkov passed the cup to it tonight, just to kind of bring it all home, is a guy that I think if you asked me in November, fairly early still in the season, where he played, I would have no idea. And that was Nate Schmidt. I mean, it was none of these big names that we're talking about. And I think Barcoff passing the cup first to Nate Schmidt speaks to exactly what we're talking about. I think they make everyone feel important. I think they make everyone feel like they have a role and what they do on the team is valued. And I don't think you can, I don't think you talk about that enough. And I don't, I don't think that's all that unusual in the NHL.

I don't, just to be clear, you know, there are good captains all over the NHL and there are, you know, I was in Dallas for six weeks in these playoffs. And everyone always talked about, you know, the Joe Pavelski lesson they took from it about making everybody feel welcome. And I covered Chicago and, you know, every time a new player would come in or a rookie would get called up, Jonathan Taves would invite him out to dinner, make him feel part of the team. Like, that's standard operating procedure to a degree in the NHL. This is generally speaking, most of these locker rooms are welcoming to new guys. But the amount of talent that has come into that locker room in the last two or three years, for it to gel this quickly, it certainly does speak to that kind of ineffable thing, as you said. Absolutely.

All right. All right, let's take a quick break right there. We're going to come back and talk about the other side of this, and there is a lot to unpack there. All right, we're back. And we're going to get to the Oilers now on the heels. And kind of let's start before we get to where they go from here. And there's a lot of meat on that bone. Let's do a little bit of an obit here on the Oilers, an autopsy, if you will.

I think the easy place to point to blame is Stuart Skinner, but I'm not sure after scoring as few goals as they scored in each of the last two games, that that's really even the place to start. Yeah, what, they had one goal, two goals, one goal, one goal over the last of the last three or four games of this series, other than that third period in game four, I mean, this is a disaster. And Stuart Skinner's going to get a lot of the blame. He deserves a lot of the blame. trying to absolve him here.

He was bad tonight and he gave up one of the worst goals I've ever seen in a big money game on that third Panthers tally. The rebound. Basically, the rebound. And there's a lot of blame. I don't know if you watch Kulak, Henrique, and Frederick were all around that play. And the, look, they were a minute into their shifts. I get it.

You're tired. But you look at, they're barely even moving toward that puck. That was such an easy goal for the Panthers. That was not digging the F in right effing now. by any stretch. I don't care if you're in mid-in-in-to-your-shift. You do not let that happen with those little half-hearted stick swings. There's plenty of blame to go around.

But yeah, this is a total disaster from Edmonton. They were so good and so deep, and we're like, this year it's different. And then essentially the same thing happened. They got just shut down when it mattered most by a better team. I have to wonder, and it's tough to say one guy would have made all the difference when you just gave the stat that they led more than any team has ever led in a Stanley Cup final. but the most suited player on the Edmonton Oilers to play against the Florida Panthers did not dress for this series. And that's Zach Hyman.

And it's one guy, and he's not one of their two biggest guys, obviously. But I really will probably forever wonder what might have been different with Zach Hyman in this series. He is the best equipped to handle this Florida Panthers forecheck and to kind of give back, right? He's a gritty guy around the net. He was doing that earlier in the playoffs. He wasn't quite scoring at the rate he scored. last year, but he was making his presence felt like in that Vegas series, you know, just getting in on the four check, doing Florida Panthers things. He was doing the things that Sam Bennett

and Sam Reinhardt do so well for the Panthers. So yeah, certainly not having Zach Hyman was a huge factor, but I don't think he single-handedly wins this series for them either. No, I don't either. And maybe it may not even change the game score ultimately, right? It may still have been a four-two series, but I will just always wonder that. I think where it comes back to is, is there something and I know we probably focused, we talked about this with Toronto a little bit, we probably focused too much on these two guys, as special as they are, probably a little too much blame falls their way a little bit. But I don't think that McDavid, and I thought Drys had it was really good in this series.

So I'm going to zero it on McDavid here. I think there was a little bit of snake bitness to it, but I got to wonder, is there something he could have done differently to yield a different result? Because the Edmonton Oilers are not going to win a series like this without Connor McDavid being special. I mean, other than getting the referees to call penalties tonight, I'm not sure what else he could have done. I mean, there were no power plays in an elimination game,

which is wild given how this whole playoffs has been officiated. It's been like over-officiated night after night, and all of a sudden it was fair game until, you know, Evander Kane becomes a sore loser and takes a whack at Matthew Kichuk. I don't know what these guys could have done for them, but this is the problem. When you are one of the greatest players on the planet, maybe two of the greatest players we've ever seen,

this is the bar to clear, and they didn't clear it. McDavid and Drysidal had, he did, I don't think he scored neither of the last two games either. He had two of the last three games he didn't score. McDavid has one goal this whole playoffs. It's not good enough. As good as they are, and if you look at their underlying metrics, you know, we talked about it on the last show. McDavid's led the entire postseason in scoring chances, individual scoring chances, and individual high danger scoring chances.

Nobody cares. You don't get a Stanley Cup for what's on natural statrick. You got to put the puck in the net. And these two guys are two of the best players we've ever seen, and they didn't produce when they needed to for the second straight year. Yeah, and that's where I wonder where they go from here, because you look at the Oilers' cap sheet. I think this was a real enticing year to try to get it done.

Going forward, there's some decisions to make this year, but the big decisions are really one year out. I mean, McDavid can start negotiating a new contract. I guess he can start negotiating whatever he wants. He could sign an extension as early as two weeks from now. And the question is, are you going to, I mean, I still think if I'm him, I'm coming back. But the questions around it, dry settles making $14 million. Now, you got to think McDavid's clearing that.

How much is Evan Bouchard going to command? Nurses on the books for nine and change. I mean, you got a couple other players still on the books for a few years at really good contracts. Nugent Hopkins and Hyman are both in the fives. But you got pretty much a blank canvas, except for the fact that your big guys are going to eat up just an unprecedented amount of it. Well, let's start with Boucher. shard here because this is a guy who had, I don't know what you do with him. He is confounding. He had one of the most productive playoffs we've ever seen by a defenseman points wise.

He also was horrible in game six. Like truly abysmal, you know, his, he was at fault, at least partially for a couple of these goals. You know, the turnover on the first goal was, was egregious. Well, that was at Combs. Atcom's pass was really bad. That's fair. But he could have put a body in the guy. That's what I'm saying. And it's just like, we've seen this time and again with Bouchard where he's so good offensively and he's so dicey defensively. I don't know how you put money on that. I don't know what, you know, does he get $9 or $10 million because he's a potential 80 point guy? But he's not Kail McCar.

He doesn't control the way, the game the way Kail McCar does. He's a great power play guy. That's important. But how is he at five on five? I don't know how you value that. And I don't know how you handle the McDavid contract until you figure out the Bouchard one. Well, McCar, I don't think is really the comparable here, but I wonder if Houchard's people will point to Rasmus Dahlene, who's in the 11s, right? I mean, McCar's deal was signed out of ELC, right?

So, and his next one is going to be a huge number. There's no doubt. But Bouchard's coming out as an RFA much closer to UFA, and that is more in line with when Rasmus Dahlene signed his extension. I don't think he's as good as Rasmus Dahlene. I wouldn't put him on that level, but the cap has gone up. And I could see Bouchard. I mean, I certainly think Bouchard is going to want eight figures. I think he's going to want over $10 million.

And that is a tough one to hand out if you're already going to pay Dricidal and McDavid, a combined like, let's call it $29 million. Let's say McDavid takes an even $15 to go $1 million above dry saddle. Already just a staggering number. McDavid should be taking a lot more than $15, but I could see where he might do that sign of Sidney Cros. He wants to win. Right.

He wants to win, right. But that's the question here, right, as much as anything is, you know, McDavid wants to win, he can resign as soon as July 1st, and the Oilers will be very happy to give him whatever he wants as of July 1st. Does he start thinking about this and wait? If he waits, that becomes the story in the NHL every single day until the decision is made. You know, through the regular season, through the trade deadline, through the playoffs. If he doesn't sign by July 2nd, Edmonton is going to just devolve.

into Panic City. Like, I don't know what you do if you're Connor MacDavit because there's probably not a better team to be on right now. Like, you made a Stanley Cup final, two straight years, right? And you don't want to look like a coward like, oh, I can't beat him with this team. I'm going to go run to some other team and see if I can do it there. Like, there's a lot of factors here. I don't think he wants to, I think he believes he can win in Edmonton.

But he's, it's kind of counterintuitive because by taking the money that he well deserves and it'll sure be less than he deserves, he makes it harder for his team to win. it's it's kind of the quarterback curse right i mean the the next guy always gets paid and when you're actually the best and you're the next guy there's kind of this pressure that you have to keep the bar going higher for everybody else and crosbie defied it i think that's one of the things that makes sidney crosbie a special uh kind of rare star in this league in that he decided you know this is what's best you know could he take i think probably the lowest you could go is take the exact same is dry-sidal and just go, we're going to go 14-14, tie it for the highest ever, let everything

go from there. But it's tough. I mean, part of the conversation is what is going to change going forward? Because the supporting cast is going to, the guys who are there taking like veteran chase a cup deals are starting to get a little too old to probably be major, major factors here for you. There will be another wave of those guys coming, I suppose, and that's something you can always hang your hat on.

But they don't really have that many young prospects that are going to be. boost them here. And they lost the two young guys coming up a summer ago in Holloway and Broberg that you could kind of go, well, but these guys are here. And those guys are even making big money. So maybe it doesn't even matter by this point anyway. They also need a goalie. I mean, there's these questions, right? Like, you're going to have the core still intact. McDavid, if McDavid stays, it's still McDavid, Drysidal, Nugent Hopkins, Hyman, if Bouchard stays Bouchard, and Nurse. And then what else? It's kind of amazing to say for a team that made it to the Stanley Cup final for the second straight year.

But did the Oilers have just the worst summer ever last year? They lose Broberg and Holloway for nothing on offer sheets. And they didn't get the obvious thing they needed a goalie. Like Stan Bowman doesn't look, you know, two weeks ago, everyone in Emmettin is pending these payons to Stan Bowman and what a great job he did assembling this team. And he made a lot of nice savvy moves around the edges, just like he always did in Chicago. But he swung and missed last summer badly. Like everybody knew.

Like I tweeted something during the game like hindsight is 2020, but clearly the not getting another goalie last summer was going to haunt the Oilers. And like a million Oilers fans immediately say hindsight, we've been talking about this for 10 years. And it's true. Look at the goalies that have played for Connor McDavid. He has never had a good goalie in his entire career.

Who's the best goalie? Mike Smith? Where are they going to find that guy, though, is my thing. I'm not trying to make excuse. I know Jacob Markstrom got moved a year ago. I don't think Calgary was trading him to Edmontonementon. Linus Allmark got moved a year ago. I guess maybe you could have tried to get into those waters.

In hindsight, I mean, maybe you try to just like trade Holloway and Broberg for Linus Allmark if you're going to lose him anyway. And that might have actually gotten it done. But do you go after John Gibson or someone like that? That's the only guy. Yeah, you have to. Laurent Brasois in Chicago because there's too many guys there now.

I mean, these aren't guys that are really that exciting. And they don't feel like Stanley Cup different. difference makers. I agree. I don't think John Gibson is a top 10 to 12 goalie in the league at this point, although we haven't seen him on a good team in quite some time. Maybe that could change things. The problem with goalies is no one who has a good one is letting him get away unless there's a very unique circumstance, right? And we just talked about two situations. I guess I can't say never, but it's very rare. And they certainly aren't going to have the cap space to do what Florida did and go throw a huge bag at one, not with the stars that they have up front. They probably needed

to draft one in 2021. I mean, they had a chance to take Yesper Walsdett, but yeah, they're in a tough spot. Yeah, and that's the problem is like, you've got this team that's really, really, really good and you know what they need to be great potentially, but the math doesn't work, the, you know, availability isn't there. I don't know what you do if you just, or you just say, hey, let McDavid and Drysaddle go again and let's see if we can just win two more games next year. I don't, I don't know. If you're Edmonton, you have to be so frustrated because, you know, this has been a decade in the making since you've won that lottery and got Connor

McDavid. This is what you've been building for. And it's entirely possible that they peeped, that this was as close as they're going to get as currently constituted. And that's a harrowing thought as a fan. And it's a really harrowing thought if you're Connor McDavid. It is. I mean, he is the best player in the league.

And I think he's only going to keep climbing the best all time charts. And the tag that nobody ever wants to be stuck with is the best player who never won it. And I don't think he's at risk quite yet, like serious risk of it. Like I think there's still plenty of time in his prime to do it. But it's at least a conversation that I guess we're having right now. So there's something to that. Yeah, you don't want to be Dan Marino, right? You want to be Joe Montana or Tom Brady.

Find a way, maybe he finds a way to do it late. I mean, some guys do it late. Steve Eisenman took him forever. Maybe that's the path. And I think that those can be some of the best moments is when it takes a guy forever. Alex Ovechkin, yeah. That's right, exactly. And I think that's very much in play for him.

He's got a lot of really good years left. But you only get these chances so many times, and it's never a guarantee to come back. And there's a lot of uncertainty for the Oilers. So it is a, yeah, really huge swings of emotion on either side of these. I mean, you have the Panthers kind of cementing their place as one of the defining teams of this generation of hockey.

And you have the Edmonton Oilers kind of going to have to grapple with where they fit into this, with the defining player of this generation of hockey in Connor McDavid. So a lot to unpack from what was a spectacular Stanley Cup final. We'll have a lot more later this week, but that is going to do it for us. Thanks for listening to this episode of The Athletic Hockey Show. We'll talk to you soon.