The Athletic Hockey Show - Panthers show life in Game 3 OT win over Golden Knights, Blue Jackets acquire Damon Severson from Devils, Shane Doan joins Maple Leafs front office

Episode Date: June 9, 2023

Hailey Salvian and Sean Gentille discuss the Panthers' Game 3 win over the Golden Knights Thursday night, Vegas' success through an aggressive approach to roster construction, and why the Panthers shouldn't be counted out just yet. Next discussing the sign and trade that sent Damon Severson to Columbus from New Jersey, what is the Blue Jackets' overall plan? Also, Shane Doan leaves the Coyotes to work for the Maple Leafs' front office, Pierre-Luc Dubois wants out of Winnipeg, Alex DeBrincat's future in Ottawa and more!Subscribe to The Athletic Hockey Show on YouTube: http://youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowHead to rhone.com/NHLSHOW and use promo code NHLSHOW to save 20% off your entire order.To get 15% off go to mudwtr.com/hockeyshow to support the show and use code HOCKEYSHOW for 15% off Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. Welcome everybody to this Friday edition of The Athletic Hockey Show. Taley Salve and Sean Jintilly. Stanley Cup final game three last night. Thoughts of Vegas Golden Knights were going to take a commanding lead to that one. They didn't.

It's kind of a boring game until it wasn't. We'll take a second. We'll just say hello before we get into that, though. Sean, what's up? Hi, Haley. How are you doing? Doing well. That's it. I don't think there's anything else to say.

The first two periods of that game, stunk. They stunk. Five shots on goal for each team in the first. Not great. Is that what it was? It was shots on goal were five. Yeah, and then the Panthers didn't get a shot on goal until the 11 minute mark. With 11 minutes left, so I guess nine minutes into the second period.

It's like a classic Panthers playoff. This is great. Classic Panthers playoff win. It's what they do. They're getting back to their winning ways, which is like rely on Bobrovsky heavily. Get out shot, get outplayed, and then just hope could chuck

that's something silly at the end of the game. Yeah. Or Carter Hage. Or Carter Hagee. So let's get into it because this is, yeah, people don't like when we talk about ourselves off the top of the show. Is that true?

No, I think just one person. That's okay. But yeah, Vegas Golden Knights in Florida last night, series, you know, kind of turns to sunrise. They were up to nothing before the game. It looked like Vegas was in control of it the whole time. They've had a way of doing that throughout the playoffs, by the way. Like, Vegas has never looked like they weren't in control of the hockey games that they're playing in, except for maybe the two losses against Dallas.

But even then, it didn't seem like they were totally swimming out of control. the series has gone, I want to back up a little bit before we get right into that game. I thought this was going to be a way tighter series. Vegas blows Florida out 7-2 in game two. They go up to a two-nothing lead. It looks like they're going to take that commanding 3-0 lead in the series. Obviously, Florida wins game three, makes the series again, it's 2-1. But are you surprised at how this Stanley Cup final has gone so far? No. I think this is kind of, I don't know if I would have, you know, whatever, 2-1 Vegas, 2-1 Panthers, like whatever, like say what you will about what the, but where we'd be at, like, in terms of

the overall series at this point. But like, the way these teams have played, I don't, I'm not surprised by it. Like, this is who they are. This is who they've been for the last couple rounds, at least, in the case of the Panthers, where, you know, I mentioned it off the top, but it's true. like that's I don't mean to look I don't mean to um detract or demean from how they've gotten here because it all counts like goalie play counts and you know you can only score goals when you score right so I'm not I'm not knocking how they've gotten here but they've gotten here because Bobrovsky's been superhuman and they've had timely goal scoring even though it might not necessarily manifest itself and like puck dominance or any of that stuff like

Like they're getting goals when they need them. And I think, you know, to some degree, that's what they got back to last night. But that's also a tough thing to rely on every single game. That's been the crazy part about their run so far is that they haven't able to rely on it every game. Like the first three rounds, it was Bobrovsky being, you know, being crazy and them, you know, again, hit in the back of the net when they needed to. So I'm not surprised that, you know, there were some maybe market correct. at the start of the series, as far as that was concerned. And Vegas is Vegas.

You said it yourself. Like, there hasn't been some, there hasn't been a truly, like, dominant ass-kicking series from them. But at the same time, at no point really throughout from the start of the playoffs until now, have they looked overmatched or truly out of control? It might not have manifested itself in, you know, sweeps or five-game series or whatever, but they know what they're doing and they look the part. So I think that's kind of what I expected,

and I feel like that's kind of, that's what we've gotten. I gave Dom a lot of crap for saying, who? Dom. Dom at the athletic, Dom loose chishin. Nope. I gave him a lot of crap for saying that this final was two

dark horse candidates. And then I talked to him about it, and I had a chat with Greg Waschinsky about this as well. Because I'm, I, Vegas was like the best team left that, people like weren't talking about in that way. And when I talked to Dom about it, he was saying like, yeah, they won the West in the regular season, but who picked them to go to the cup final? Everyone had Edmonton. Our whole staff, most of, except for me. I did. Except for, yeah,

who did you pick? But not me. Dallas. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Huh? Exactly. My, my sweet, sweet stars, they lost to the Vegas Golden Knights because I was underrating the Vegas Golden Knights because they just quietly went about their business all season. Like they weren't completely dominant. They had a couple, you know, slow periods when Mark Stone got hurt. Things started to dip a little bit, but they got it back on the rails in a way that they weren't able to do in years previous when Mark Stone got hurt. And they almost just, they just kept doing their thing all year. And, you know, Edmonton had a bit more of the bells and whistles because Connor McDavid's season.

And Dallas, you know, is the kind of fun team. Joe Pavelsky, everyone's behind old guy without a cup and Rupa Hints and Jason Robertson. You know, Jamie Ben and Tyler Sagan are playing great. Like, people were getting behind everyone else. Completely. Even people were like, the Kraken ate the abs. Like Vegas, in a way, people weren't saying the Cracker we're going to make the Cup final. But after they won the first round, people were like, ooh, the Cracken are good.

Who could have seen this coming? And I feel like Vegas was almost the best team that people weren't paying a time. attention to. And they've shown that through the cup final. I mean, there aren't a lot of holes. We've talked about this before. Aidan Hill is playing great. Their defense is huge and physical.

They can box out. They block shots. They keep guys to the perimeter. They can be active in the offensive zone. And then they've got the star power and the depth at the top of the lineup on their forward group. I mean, Ivan Barbachev has fit in perfect.

with Jonathan Marchstone and Jack Eichel. Some nights Mark Stone's almost like on the third line depending on the deployment of things. I mean, he gets second line minutes, I would say. But lines one through four are effective for the Golden Knights. So there's a lot to like, it's weird for me to say this because I think I was like very much on the I'm sick of Vegas and maybe it was just because their tweets were annoying me.

But it's really, it's hard for me to admit right now there's a lot to like about the Vegas Golden Knights. I feel like you're saying that half as a joke, but I think that mindset is part of why people slept on them coming into, like people. Yeah, because people were sick of them. We're sick of them. And also last season was a huge failure for them.

Like they missed the playoffs for the first time. I think there was, whether people realized it or not, collectively, I think we were like, yeah, okay, like we're going to stick them in a drawer. And even though they end up is the first, the first overall seat in the west, that still kind of persisted.

I think part of that had to do with the goalie situation because, I mean, we're talking about Lorraine Persuade at the start of the playoffs. I don't think anybody was sold on him, let alone Aiden Hill. So I think that had a lot to do with it. And people want an excuse to pick Connor McDavid and Leon Dreisdahl. I think that's a big part of it.

And it's not, It sounds like revisionist history. Like we were doing something, like we were given the oil or something. Maybe they didn't deserve. And I don't think that's true either, right? Like you... That's a better Oilers team than we've seen in the last five years. 100%.

So you have a significant amount of people who are like, no, this team is better. They're better at five on five. They're better defensively because of Matthias Eccolm. Like, there's plenty of reasons to like the oilers. I think with a wild part, even if you just look at the people we have on staff, is that everybody was, like, nearly everyone was thinking that same way. And that's, that's the, that's, you know, that's the crazy part.

Yep. Okay. This is just like a very small off track. Was that the first time the Oilers have lost a series that they should have won? Yes. Like, I think there's reason to believe that that's the gut punch before. Like if we're, if we're thinking the Oilers are going to win a Stanley Cup here in the next couple of years, like, that's the one.

If you're- That the Oilers were like, oh, shit. Like, they should have had that one. And then they move on and have more success. Like, every team's had that before they go on to the ultimate success, right? I don't think Edmonton had it yet until this year. If you, if you're trying to subscribe to that, like, kind of classic narrative where, and it's a narrative for a reason because it's, it's been born.

out in fact over the years that every team has to have some gut punch series loss before they can actually slay the dragon. I think you can make the argument that that's the first time we've seen it for Edmonton, absolutely, because losing to the abs last season before they go to to win the cup. But I mean, losing to Vegas before they potentially go on to win the cup. Maybe that's, Like, I'm saying that now while also saying, like, we totally underrated the Vegas Golden Knights, and they were beast against the Oilers. So I think it's going to be interesting to see how they grow from that, though. I want to say something about Ivan Barbashev specifically. I was going to get it back on the rails back to the Vegas Golden Knights, yes.

So, yeah, you go ahead. What do you want to say about Barbershev? I love, love, love what Ivan Barbashev is doing for her. And not just because everyone likes to watch heavy hockey and all that. that sort of stuff. I also love seeing guys going a run that gets them paid, right? Like, Ivan Barbashev has made himself, God knows how much money over the last, over the last month or so, and that's great. I love seeing that from a labor standpoint. Absolutely. Get the bag. What Barbashav is doing is reminding us that the trade deadline is still relevant and still matters,

because I think there is a desire after we've seen so many teams. load up over the last bunch of years and have it not pay off, whether it's the Leafs in any of the last, either the last two years, really gone, Nick Felino, whatever. The fact of the matter is Vegas went out and added the physical playoff tested, big body forward rental and is paying off in the biggest way imaginable, right? And I think too often in this sport, we're just, resigned to just be like, ah, it's random.

It's just random bullshit. If a goalie goes on a heater, that's all that matters. You don't have that much control over anything. So just, you know, grab on and enjoy the ride. Like,

don't bother. It's nice to have stuff like that happens where teams go out and make relevant additions. Because regardless of what you think of Ivan Barbechev as a player in St. Louis, and I think he was,

to some degree, overrated. I think people, you know, looked at a year where he had a 23% shooting percentage and, you know, is not, is he a consistent 30 goal score or whatever? No. Whatever you think about the run he had in St. Louis,

what he's done in Vegas is impressive and important and they're not here without him. So it's a nice reminder that, you know, for fans in media, as we watch the trade deadline, that yes, sometimes this shit does, matter because I feel like we get too locked up in it you know too consistent where it's like oh who cares like this is just we're all just kind of rearranging deck chairs here it's not the case barbachev is a barb I keep going on barbishop for some reason I don't know why I mean you okay

you know probably probably because I honestly probably because I haven prover of because I have him on the brain he's but barbachev is a reminder that this stuff matters right and that that kind of player matters and that you can go out and meaningfully improve your team to a point where go from, that wins you a Stanley Cup at the deadline. It's cool. He's done it in different ways, too. In Edmonton in the second round, or I guess against Edmonton the second round, he was getting timely goals, you know, answering. There was the one game where it was like every time the Oilers scored on the power play, like Barbishov came back with a goal of his own. So he was doing it with timely scoring in the second round. And then now, in the Stanley Cup fun, he was like, he was doing it. And the

Stanley Cup final, like he's just throwing the body around. He invented the reverse hit. I don't know if you knew this, but Ivan Barbershev actually invented the reverse hit. I never seen that before. I mean, you'd ever want to see like Radcoe Gutis get hurt in that moment, but the reverse hit on Gudis was unbelievable. He, it was a huge moment. Something about the way, something about the way you said Radcoo Gutis made me think you said Brad Kuku. I don't know what you're talking. That's the way it sounded when it hit my ears. Yeah, Brad Cuckoo. What are you talking about?

I said Rad Cogoodis. I know. I know that's what you said. Did I pronounce it wrong? No, it's just the way it hit my ears. Sometimes that happens. Brad Cuckoo. Brad Cuckoo.

Brad Coooooooooooo? I'm glad he's okay. Who is Brad Cogoodis? I'm moving on from this. I think it's been great to see Barbashev contributing in so many different parts of the game, right? And he's one of those perfect examples of the guy that you put on the line with Jack Eichol and John Kham Marches so because he's a big hitter.

He opens up a lot of space for those two guys with that physicality. And he's also capable of scoring the goals too. The puck's on his stick and the slot. He can score it. He can make the play. He can make the hit. He can dig it out of the corner. Barbashev checks a ton of boxes.

He's been helping swing the tide and vague's favor throughout this postseason. Traits matter. Context matters for where you put a player to. in who you play them with. And honestly, I think that's something that we can all afford to remember from time to time.

And he's given us a good one here. So I think the final thought on Vegas before we kind of dive in a little bit more on game three, it's the revisionist history part that you mentioned, Sean. And now we're talking about the roster construction and bringing in Ivan Barbashev. Like a lot of people last year, when the Golden Knights were hurt and missed the playoffs,

started looking at what they did and said, well, like you screwed up, your roster construction, like you messed up the chemistry in that room, or you did too much and look at their cap situation. It was just like, what did the Vegas Golden Knights do?

They did too much. And now so quickly we're looking at the Vegas Golden Knights and saying, oh my God, is this about to pay off? Because this is a team that's been built in a way that no other team has, right? In part by virtue of the expansion rule,

being completely different. And then the fact that they did it differently than the Seattle Cracken did. Like I don't think I've ever, they went, they had this big expansion draft that had never been done before, like literally because of the rules.

And then they went big game hunting for five years. Aggressive acquisitions, proven experienced players in their prime, taking big swings at free agency. You know, Bill Foley went up and everyone laughed and laughed. He's like, we're going to win a Stanley Cup in the first six years. Or we're going to make the playoffs. we're going to make the playoffs in three years.

We're going to win a Stanley Cup in six. He's on track to hit both of those marks. And that organization has, they've taken the big swings in a way that I don't think we've really seen before. And I think it was easy last year to look at them and say, you did too much, you overdid it.

Because they might have, though. Like I think we internalized the idea that they screwed up them. Because they, that the mix was off, because it kind of was. But they were hurt. They were hurt, but like,

but you also, we're talking about going on and adding. The mix is like the same now. This is the mix this season. It took, it took a while for everything to settle when you're, because Jack Eichael's neck was still all right. Exactly.

I mean, sure, sure. I just think it was really easy for everyone to write them off last season. And then now we're looking at them and saying, like, no, we need to credit like that aggressive approach because it's working. I don't want to get ahead of myself. because obviously the series is 2-1.

The series is 2-1, but here's a fun little factoid for you. Heading into the game 3 last night, teams that with a 2-0-0 lead in a Best of 7-Cup final have won the series 90.6% of the time. Only five teams have come back to win from that deficit. When the smoke settled on all that stuff, right, on Ikel, on whatever, Stone's been there for years now, but it took some time for everything to work out,

the way that they intended and it took another trade deadline worth of additions for that for them to for them to get it right totally but when stuff but when the smoke cleared and you look at this roster and I feel like I feel like it almost happened too late because we weren't used to seeing them healthy you look at it and you're like what is what's this team what's this team supposed to be bad at yeah yeah it's like what's their fault maybe their power play and that gets us to last night they had multiple power play opportunities. Did not capitalize on enough of them. Uh-huh.

Florida Panthers win two to one. So we talked about it a little bit. Panthers win 2-1 in OT, or was it 3-2? No, it was 3-2. Waiting for you to correct yourself. The series is 2-1. The Panthers win 3-2 in overtime. as we mentioned, pretty boring game until it wasn't.

And it's Matthew Kachuk who plays the hero, Matthew Kachuk and Carter Verhagie, we should say. So Kachuk got rocked from a huge hit from Kagan Kolsar in the first period pretty early on. He got up, immediately fell back down, stayed in the game. He went and played a power play shift and then he left the game for the final like 12 and a half minutes of the first period, and then he missed the first, like, five-minute chunk of the second. So in all, he missed probably around, like, 17 minutes of the game.

It came out after the fact that he was pulled by concussion spotters. I assume they saw him, like, you know, get a little bit wobbly after the hit and said, not get him out. We got to check things over. So Matthew could check misses 17 minutes of that hockey game. And then he comes in and he ties the game with a goal he pulled in the final. in the final few minutes of regulation

to send the Panthers to overtime. And then he's on the ice. I believe he had a secondary assist on Carter Verhage's O.T. winner. So he continues to show up in the big moments for this Panthers team. And no, I will not be calling him Matthew Klitschuk. I hate

it. I think it's dumb. Don't do it. Were you doing that again last night? Like, was there another round of that? Yes. I specifically tweeted, do not say Kla-chuk. I don't want to Everybody listened to you. Okay.

Yeah. No, they didn't. Do you have thoughts on the Panthers game? I think we had a Brandon Montor appearance last night. That's something that they were missing for the last little bit, right? Like, you remember going back to the Bruin series? It was like, is this, is this the cons might? Like, who is this?

Who is this guy, right? No. I haven't thought that, people thought Brandon Montour should win the cons might. he was a huge difference maker against Boston in a way that... That was months ago. Uh-huh. In a way that we haven't seen over the last little bit. So I think that's an important kind of development for Florida.

They, that's... I mean, their D was terrible in the first two games. Pretty whatever defensive group. So they need that kind of offensive, that offensive contribution for that, for that unit overall to be holding up you know, their end of things, right? So if you have Brandon Montour out there, looking like Brain and Montoris,

uh-huh. I think that, I think that bodes well for them. And we're sitting here. You got the new baby bump, by the way. Brain and Montor did, that's right. Yes. Shout out baby Kai.

And Montour said, should have had twins. Ha-ha. Ha-ha. Ask your wife about that. You're not the one pushing out two babies. We're, I know you see.

said it like there's a we're going on a 90% historical historical percentage there right for a team that wins the first two games going on to win the series so I don't think it's unreasonable for us sit here and talk about how great Vegas is but got to remember this is a team that came back on the Boston Bruins in round one I mean it's been done before and we've seen Florida do it this year against mind you not in the cup final but in the first three rounds We sought signs from Bobrovsky last night. He looked, this looked like previous series Bob, right? This looks like good playoff Bob instead of bad playoff Bob.

And that's the single biggest thing. Like I know we're sitting here talking about like, oh, it's nice to get a reminder that it doesn't just matter. The gold tenning isn't the only thing that matters, whatever. But we do need to remember how good that guy was and how, you know, he more than Kachuk is the reason that they're here in the first place. because that's just the nature of the position, right? So if they get a couple more games out of him, like last night, and if Vegas's power play, which has been bad for on and off, really, for the entire season, Jack Eichael, great five-on-five player does not look right out there with that particular power play unit.

If that's something that keeps happening, then, you know, we might be having a different conversation in six days or whatever. It's possible. It just seemed like the three days between game two and game three really helped the Panthers regain some of that composure. I mean, they did still take quite a few penalties. Their PK was better than it was to the first two games. But Matthew, I was going to say, Chuck was on the ice more than he was in the box.

He was, you know, in the locker room for a bit. But we didn't see. He was available more than he was. He was not in the box for a relevant amount of time. Yeah. And yes. Bobrovsky was was big. He was particularly great in the second period

when the Panthers had one shot on goal in the first half of the second. He was pretty big. Vegas was pressing and he kept he kept it to a one goal lead for the Golden Knights for a while. All this extra

rest that they're getting throughout, that's scheduled throughout the series, it's not going to benefit anybody more than him. Except the rest between the the third round in the cup final. See, that's like too much, right? Like that tilt's over into like, okay, nobody's, that's a tough thing to bounce back from.

I think, I think, no matter what. This is a good coach matchup too. I feel like those days probably help Paul Maurice, like get the game plan and sort out the blue line, get the guys better in front of a Brofsky. It's a good coach matchup between Paul Maurice and Bruce Cassidy. Oh, God, definitely. I like it.

All right. I feel like we're good. So the series is 2-1. Game 4 will be on. on Saturday night, 8 o'clock Eastern, on TNT, TBS, True TV, CBC, Sportsnet, TVAS. Is that French?

It's also on E and... And that's on Disney Channel. ESPN 6. Yeah. Nickelodeon. Let's go to a break when we come back. We want to... We have things to say about the Columbus Blue Jackets after a quick little brain.

All right. Sean had a moment. He had a glass of water. There's no more Bradley Cuckoo. It's not true. I don't know what. You're the one who said it. It's not me. No, I didn't.

Anyways, we had a sign and trade this morning, reportedly. I don't think it's official yet from the Devils or the Blue Jackets. But according to insiders, Frank Saravali, Elliot Friedman. I was like, who's the other one? The other one? Yeah. It's your close friend, Elliot Friedman. He is, yes.

Anyways. There's been a sign in trade. trade. Is it Brad Cuckoo? No, stop with, stop it. I said you had a glass of water. There's no more Brad Cuckoo. It's Damon Severson, you idiot.

Yeah. Well, much, okay. They don't stay babies forever, idiot. You ugly, dumbass. It's Damon Severson. You stupid, dumb, dumb. I was watching too much I think you should leave. Never heard of that.

Yeah, you're not like smart enough to understand the humor. Okay, all right. Anyways, the New Jersey Devils traded Damon Severson to the Blue Jackets in exchange for a third round pick in the 2023 NHL draft. So that's the 80th overall pick. Severson was set to become a UFA on July 1st. He signed an eight-year deal prior to the trade. So we got a fun little sign and trade.

looks like it's a six year, no, an eight year, excuse me, $6.25 million contract for Damon Severson. So he goes to Columbus. The Devils get that third round pick, as mentioned. I mean, I like it for the Devils. He was going to be an unrestricted pre-agent. They have a crowded blue line in New Jersey. Severson was probably never going to get the kind of ice time

or role that he wanted or might deserve. in New Jersey. And the devil's got a little pick from it. Yeah, that's a solid bit of... By leveraging that extra year that they have. Solid bit of business for Tom Fitzgerald, because Damon Severson was... Even if they wanted him around,

he'd price himself out. Totally. He'd price himself out of their, you know, internal kind of structure there because they have other stuff to worry about. Like, Damon Severson, solid player for them. if you're the New Jersey Devils, are you going to pay him six and a quarter for eight years?

Absolutely not. And also, they have other business to worry about. They got a Tima Meyer out there. They got a Jesper Brad out there. There's other stuff that they need to do to the point where having a $6 million or $6.5 million version of Damon Severson

was just not in the cards for them. So the fact that they go out and get the 80th pick in the draft for it. I mean, that's, I, it's solid. There is another end of this, there is another end of this deal though, you know? Before we get to the other end of the deal.

The devils have 13 free agents. Oh. And that's, including RFA's with arbitration rights, unrestricted free agents who are probably just going to walk. You know, Jonathan Bernier. Sure. But they've got like little interesting cases.

That's right. Jonathan Bernier. Sorry. Good for him. Yeah. He's the fourth best available UFA goalie or whatever. When I was doing that UFA board, I had this really stupid idiot moment where I was like, wow, Jonathan Bernier had the exact same stats this season as last year.

That's crazy. And I was like, oh, wait. He hasn't played a single game. It was like, 2020. I mean, that's how brutal the goal market is. Time is not real anymore because I looked at 2021-22 season. Like, yeah, that's happening right now. It's not 2023.

And you're just like... Halfway through 2023. You're just like in your scraping the pot, basically. Yeah. Oh, that's why I included... For who to talk about the bottom. You're like, what's Jonathan Bernie up to? And because that's a legitimate route to take because of how bad the goalie market is.

That's why I included restricted free agent goalies. That's why I zoomed out a little bit. And some people were like, this is dumb. I was like, no, it's not. No, it's not. It's an indicator of how brutal, of how rough the market is. Totally. But now the market's almost getting a little bit saturated as we go on a little off ramp here.

But it's okay. Ride the wave. The goalie market's almost getting a little bit saturated with the amount of goalies that might be available by a trade. You know, we're looking at the UFA markets, Freddie Anderson, Tristadjari. Those are kind of the top top two guys, I would say, that are unrestricted free agents. We're looking at the offer sheet candidates. Jeremy Swayman. I hate talking about offer sheets because I think it's overdone, but if there is a legitimate offer sheet candidate this summer, it is Jeremy Swamon

because the Bruins are screwed. They're going to need to address the goal. I mean, they have a million things of work. Even Bill Gustafson is maybe a candidate, but I do think he's a priority for the Minnesota Wild to sign. And then we're looking at the trade candidates too. Sorry, Sean. I'm finishing my list here. Then there's the trade candidates, which include Connor Hellebuck, John Gibson and now maybe Carter Hart. I definitely Carter Hart. Yeah.

So. I mean, the Bruins are going to have to address it in one way or another, address that situation one way or another, whether it's, whether it's O'Mark, whether it's, you know, whether it's trading O'Mark, figuring out something to do with Swamen. I think that's almost gotten brushed under the rug

because of how much we talk about their forward group with Bergeron, Crachy, whatever, that like people, their cap crunch affects every single element of that, of that roster. And it's crazy. Like when I was doing that goalie story, I ended up getting like a second wind at two in the morning. So I just started like looking into the Boston Bruins at 3 a.m. Once I got to that point, I was like, oh my God, this is really bad. Does everyone know how bad this is?

Like, this is terrible. they are projected to have $4.9 million in Capspace right now and they have nobody signed. So they currently have where is it here?

Part of it's because of the bonus overages with the Pasternak contract that's $4.5 million on the books for them. They have $4.9 million in cap space right now and only 15 players signed. So even if you can like get rid of Mike Riley, you're still not going to be able to field a full

competitive roster. Like they've got they've got stuff to do in Boston. But back with the devils, they have a lot of... I had a drip coffee this morning instead of my usual

Americana with oat milk and vanilla. So I'm like, there's caffeine coursing through my veins. I'm all over the place. I want to talk about all the hockey teams. Clearly. All the things. 13.

How about you find an organ, how about you find an organ. antiquated get us back to the devils after talking about the Bruins. Build a segue. Let's go. Can you do it? Start the clock. Five, four, three, two, one. And from one team in the east back to the other. That's a C plus, okay. You know who doesn't have cap problems? The New Jersey Devils. They have $49 million. Oh, that's her cap hit. I'm sorry. They do have cap problems.

Yeah. We're down to a D plus after that. Okay. There have $34 million in projected cap space, but again, 13 free agents to sign. And there's some big ones, obviously, with Jasper Bratt, Timo Meyer. And it sounds like they're having a bit of issues with, you know, they want to have like a salary hierarchy, right? They don't want to pay Tim O'Mire more than Jack. Hughes, however, then you might lose Tim O'Meyer.

I get why they don't. I mean, that's the role of a general manager, right? Is to get as many good players on our contract for as long as possible, for as little money as possible. So, sure. But it's unfortunate that they're trying to apply. It seems like they are at least trying to apply the Jack Hughes model to. Meyer and to Brad because it's just not it's not comparable they bought a bunch of years of restricted

free agency for jack hughes he's making eight million dollars for the next eight seasons he's gonna hit free agency when he's what 28 or 29 like he's at a different point in his career than those guys are so it's not the same thing to pay two guys that close to free agency eight million versus someone when you're buying you know years and years of of uh of of uh of uh our uh our uh our our our our of like of our FAA years and in RB years. So I get why superficially you're like, yeah, we can't pay anybody more than Jack, but also Jack's 20 and these guys are,

these guys are 27, 28. But it is tough. I get why he's their best player. They should want to pay him more money than everybody else, but that's just not the world we live in, right? Like, Timo Meyer is not going to make, it's not going to sign a six and a half million. annual deal.

Maybe he will. It's not going to happen. Maybe he will. Sure. Anything's possible, you know. It's a gift. Damon Severson was not going to sign for six and a quarter for them. I can guarantee you that.

That's a big number. Big number for a second pair of defensemen. That's right. What are the blue jackets doing? Can we talk about that? I'm like foaming at the mouth to talk about this. Oh, Sean has things that he wants. to say about the blue jackets.

So, yeah, we talked about the New Jersey side. On the surface, I like this for Columbus. I'm going to get this out of the way first. This individual move, I like it for the blue jackets. They get Severson before he hits the market. They get that extra year by doing the sign and trade, and it only cost them the third round pick. They're going to be fine because they've got, you know, a high first.

that they're probably going to use to get, you know, Fantilly or Leo Carlson or whoever ends up being number three. Will Smith. Yeah. Sure. Hell he is. Totally. He's American.

Come on. And then you look at, like, they needed to improve on their, their blue line last season. There were a lot of problems. They were a lot. Bad and hurt. Right?

I was saying that. Yeah, whatever. There were a lot of problems with the Columbus Blue Jackets last season. but their blue line was particularly awful. So they allowed 3.47 goals against per 60. That was worse than a league. And then when you look at just straight goals against, 231 goals against,

worse than the league, worse than Danielle Zanaheim Ducks. That's right. That's bad. That's amazing. That's really bad. And they, so they were outscored all season.

And that's just at, that's just at 5 on 5. Brittle. Brittle, brutal. They were outscored at 5-on-5, 231 to 143. That's just at 5-on-5. Let's look at all situations here, folks. Oh, the ducks were worse.

Sorry, Danielle. But the blue jackets were scored on 329 times. Well, here's, everybody talks about, so in terms of the effect that their skaters had on goals, if you want to go by goals against versus expected goals against, The ducks were far and away the worst, right? They were historically bad. That's why someone's going to trade for John Gibson.

Uh-huh, because they're going to be able to explain that away. Also, but if anybody wants, I know this is like, this is like John Gibson week. It feels like Dallas Aiken's had some really interesting things to say about him on a, on, uh, when, when Craig and I talk, well, I mean, I think it's, I think it's relevant. Like, people are, people are having the John Gibson discussion. And we don't, we don't need to go into that. Everybody's talking about how the ducks are horrific defense. defensively and that affected, you know, perception of Gibson unfairly, and that's true. But right behind them are the Columbus Blue Jackets.

Yeah, so they had 3.67 expected goals against per 60 in all situations last year. In actual goals against, they're at 4.02, right? So that was, it's an instance of, they're getting terrible. You're getting terrible defense and terrible goaltending. Yeah, it's a double whammy. Yep. And that's what I like about the Severson move, though, is that they're clearly trying to beef up their blue line. They're going to get a guy who can go in and play top pair, top four minutes.

They're getting Zach Wrenski back. And regardless of how you feel about Ivan Proverov, like he is going to improve that blue line based on last season. And I mean what you think about him as a defender, not as a person. just to be clear. I mean, regardless of what you think about what he did this year, he's still good D. That's not what I'm saying.

That's not what I meant. We've made it very clear how we feel about what he did. We're anti-Ivan Proverov's, yes. Politics and, you know, stance on the LDP community. It's Pride Month, so we're not really going to, like, get into Ivan Proverov much here. And, like, his blue line prowess, I'll just say he's going to be better.

than what they had last season. So getting Rorensky back, Proverov and Severson, it's good for the Blue Jackets. However, Sean, you have things that you want to say about Columbus, so they're still not good. They're still not good. This is a team that has convinced themselves

that they're like a Damon Severson away from being a relevant playoff team and they're just not. I know like, and part of it is that I'm sure Yarmor will kick a line and is feeling the heat. as he should be. This is

their time frame change last year whenever Johnny Godreau surprised everybody and took the money. Well, he actually left money on the table. I, you know what I'm saying? Yes, I know. We all got away. And that brings back to the Calgary Flames,

20-22 off-season. What does this team think they're doing? Being good. No, they're not like this, this is, I've never in my life seen a more first round exit playoff Ross. Like, congratulations. You got, you added two second pair of defensemen for more than, for 10 million dollars against the cap or whatever it turns out to be more than that, even though they did save some money on ProVrov, great. Um, who's playing center for that team? Cole Schillinger. I just got, yeah, I'm pretty sure you got dumped by Tate,

also. Poor guy. He's going to have a big comeback year. First line. Tate McCrae is going to drop a breakup album and then Cole Cillinger's going to score 60 goals. Or it'll just be it for Cole Cillinger. What is that roster? What are we talking about? Why is any of this happening outside of the fact that, you know, yeah, you do feel the need to improve your team. I'm not saying that, but this is just...

Oh my God, he only had three goals this season. Yeah, he was awful. He was awful. He was awful. And also they hired Mike Babcock to coach these guys up who buried the lead a pit. I forgot about it. I was so focused on Pro of Robin Severson. You hire a coach who after he was let go by the Toronto Maple Leafs like was, what other way can we say this? He was like a maniac. He was an abusive maniac?

You know what? Kind of bothered me, and we've had this conversation before, is how much came out after he got fired. Would love to know how many people knew that that was happening the whole time and just held it close to that because they needed to get in a locker room. I think it was a lot. But back to the Blue Jackets, honestly,

or back to the guys on the roster. I, Damon Severson's 29 years old and you're, and you're paying him top pair money. And I don't, he's, he's a, he's a good guy to have on your team. But what they have now, they're back in that situation where you have, everybody is like a little bit overextended, right? Like, I don't know. You know, I, I, I'm not as down on them and I will be happily, like, proven wrong.

But you've got Johnny Goddrow, Patrick Linae, Jack, Rosslovick has shown in the past that he can be like an effective player when he plays with skilled players. I mean, he was the center on the Matthew Kachuk and Austin Matthews line. I know that was years ago now, but put him with Johnny Godrow and see what happens. Give the guy a shot to play with the skilled guys. I get it. Boone Jenner's not a one C. But they've got some interesting young players too. Like Cole Cillinger should be an effective NHL player. Kent Johnson has shown that he's going to be an exciting player. I'm not bullish on them by any means.

But I also don't think there's no way they're going to be as bad as they were last season. No, no. I'm not saying that at all. This is not a bad hockey team. It's just like what's the direction, like what's the plan? You want like you said,

what's the plan? You want to make it, you want to make playoffs and lose? This is a capped out hockey team that, you know, seems on talent. They're five games in the first round. Yeah. I'm sorry.

And Kekelein has already said, like, he's not done. What else you know? How about this? If the Columbus Blue Jackets go out and add a legitimate first-line center, all is forgiven. I will eat my words and apologize to Tiarmo Kekelein. But if they go in to this, to the upcoming season where we're talking about Cole Cillinger and Boone Jenner and Jack Roslavik is their top three, like, good. good luck. Good luck and enjoy your 89 point season or whatever it ends up being. It's not going to work. It's a lot of action and a lot of money spent for a first round exit. And I'm just,

I'm not, I'm not down with it. I'm not down with that method of team of team building right now. What would you rather see them do though, sell off while you have Johnny Godreau sign for six more years or whatever? I would have rather seen them not sign Johnny Godro last year. But, but now that they have them like I get it like what's like what other choice you have like this is this is you get rid of York strand and then sign Johnny Godreau because you feel an obligation like whatever because that's what because they're they were cap crunch already and needed to need it needed to do the line of deal so you figure how do we make this happen and you toss a 20 or 25 goal score on the on you know out for next to nothing I don't I don't I don't understand it and like there it's

just a weird mix of a bunch of 30-year-olds who make a ton of money and then like B-grade prospects. I don't, I don't understand it. I get it. Like you want to try to, I get it on some level because, you know, you want to sell like, hey, this is a relevant hockey team and you want to, and you don't want things that completely go in the tank the way that they did last year. But like, if you, if you can look at that team, which is clearly in win now mode, again, this is going to be a cap team.

And if you think that's a legit contender, like, God bless you, I just don't, I don't feel that way. Okay, so to wrap up the Damon Severson sign-in trade, that's a win for the Devils, right? The winners are the New Jersey Devils and Damon Severson. Well, I hope he likes Ohio. But he wins because he gets money.

Columbus is a fine place. I love Columbus. You know that. I really think that's an underrated. you know, spot to go and watch hockey. I love the spot around the arena. We can't have another summer

of debating the merits of Columbus. I'm not debating anything. I'm just saying he wins. I hope he enjoys Ohio, but he wins because he's about to make $6.25 million over the next eight years. And then the Devils win because they were going to lose him anyways

and they lost him for a third round pick instead. And Blue Jacket's fans who are going to be satisfied seeing something better than what we got from them last season. like okay but sorry not a not a legit contender losers could be yarmo if this ends up going poorly you gotta get things on the rails pretty quick here for that team it's a lot of a lot of money spent on a lot of on two top on two middle pair defensemen and then and then the aforementioned

deeply problematic mike babcock mubly good luck yeah maybe not okay we're gonna have a fun segment called News You Can Use. That's coming up next. So I guess the whole show has been news you can use. That's kind of the whole point of a podcast. I guess we didn't have news in the first segment. That was just us talking about the Vegas Golden Knights, who we love now.

I mean, it is a pretty, like, between, there's a cup final game last night. There's a big time trade that's involving, you know, kind of one of the early splash teams of the offseason and a guy who would have been maybe the best you of it. defenseman, which is a major, major indictment of the market. And then all this other stuff we're about the, we're about to get into. There's a lot of stuff happening.

Yeah, news you can use. News you can use on Friday, June 9th. How many times have you said news you can use in the last 90 seconds? Six times, I think. Six. Maybe four. Okay, this one's fun. Shane Don't.

You are a Maple Leaf. good for him it sounds like according to our old buddy Craig Morgan like Dillon wanted some actual say in an organization rather than whatever

the specifics of his jobs were with his job was with the coyotes right so if he's getting that in Toronto good for him A and good for Austin Matthews good for the Toronto Maple Leafs is that where we landed on?

Is that where we landed on? Yesterday after the report started coming out that Shane Dome was going to be joining the Maple Leafs, leaving the Arizona Coyotes to join the Maple Leafs. Yeah, this is good for the Maple Leafs. Austin Matthews, big Shane Done guy. So lots of tweets popping up. Lots of tweets popping up yesterday of Austin Matthews tweeting about his love for Shaneone.

So this can probably only be a good thing if you're a Leafs fan. Take whatever you can get, right? Totally. And I do think it's important to say, too, that Brad Tree Living has had a relationship with Shane Dohn for a long time as well. Brad obviously would have worked with Donne when he was with the Arizona Coyotes. Tree Living was in AGM in Arizona for a while before going to Calgary. And Shane Done, as you mentioned, Sean, this was from Craig Morgan,

who's with Phoenix Sports Now. said, it's no secret that Donne has wanted to be more involved in hockey ops than he was with the coyotes, his experience working for the league and hockey Canada help build his knowledge base. Obviously, it is the coyote's ownership group's prerogative to structure their executive staff as they see fit, but Donne was not content with what was perceived as more of a ceremonial role. And it's another blow, a big one, to watch the franchise's greatest icon walk away. So as we stick with the winners and losers theme here, winner, Shane Donne, losers. coyotes fans, winner, potentially Austin Matthews and the Toronto Maple Leafs? Definitely, definitely the Maple Leafs. Like, well, it depends on your perspective, I guess, as far as, as far as Matthews is concerned.

But yeah, it's another, it's another hit. If it's impossible not to look at this and say if Shane Donne is backing up and leaving now, like, what does that mean for the rest, for the rest of it? And you do have that, the personal on the things where it's like, hey, I would like, I would like more say. and in personnel matters. I don't want to just go out and kiss babies and drop pucks. So that's like a decent and that's as good

that's as good an explanation as any, but also given what's gone on there and what is going on there, it's tough to look at it and think like, oh boy, this doesn't bode well. Sure. And there is reporting from Craig and from Steve Peters

who are on the ground in Arizona, both with Phoenix Sports, saying like his position with the Leafs doesn't have it isn't because of the arena and the tempi vote it's because he wanted this opportunity in a front office like i i think it's fair to just say like he didn't want to be the ceremonial guy anymore he wants to work in a front office i mean he's been working in that kind of role with hockey canada he wants to have a little bit of say so like whatever i you're not going to convince me that this stuff doesn't wear on people like where the constant the constant uh

the constant uncertainty of their overall situation, like, I don't know, man. If you're Shane Don't and you're like, all right, you have the disappointment of the Tempe Arena vote going against you guys. And then Brad Treeliven, who he's known forever and has a good relationship with, says like, hey, you want to come actually make some decisions for an organization that doesn't have, you know, the sword of Damocles hanging over their head as far as the arena's concerned. Like you're, you're Shane Don't. You're an act like that doesn't have.

have any kind of, any kind of bearing on making that decision? I think that's, I think that's short-sighted. And it looks like it's going to be as assistant to brought true living. Cool. Yeah, that makes sense. You give him the Spatz a job? I'm sure, call it that. Just give him the office and everything. He's the same chair. All right. The other little bit I think we could just touch on is Pierre-Luc Dubois, looks like he wants out. This is from our pal. The athletic peer LeBron.

Pierre LeBron. Pierre Leaparteau does not want to stay in Winnipeg. Shocker. Who could have seen that coming? He's only been like broadcasting it for the last, you know, for the last 18, 18 months out. We did all this last year. Like this popped up at the draft where it's like,

oh, boy, it'd be great if we'd be great if I found some way to play for the Canadians. It's like, okay. Understandable. I wouldn't want to play for the Jets either. that's another one like what are what are we doing it's a blue jacket situation ironically for pierre luke dubois that he goes from the blue jackets of the goes from the jets of the eastern conference to the blue jackets of the west sure um

i'd want to get out of there too and to be clear that's not you dumping on the city of winnipeg it's the situation with that team i just i think i think i I know that I know that's what you mean, but I think sometimes when these conversations happen, like people are like, why do you hate Winnipe? It's not that. It's like, where are the teams at? Whatever. I'll just, I'll say this.

Like, I don't, I don't shit on cities or locations or whatever stuff in that way. As a rule, I don't like it's not, I don't, it's, there's no reason to do it. Nobody you can't, right, I'm anti, strong that. I'm strongly there. I'm more. just talking about the direction of that franchise. Totally. We've been talking about how...

We've just stuff stuck in neutral. I just get out of there. We've been talking about how this could be the year where the Winnipeg Jets makes some changes for a while now. I think this year probably should be the year. And to be clear, Dubois is a restricted free agent with arbitration rights. So the Jets are well within their rights to control his player rights for another year before he hits unrestricted free agency. For sure.

They shouldn't. Stop dragging this. Stop. Stop dragging this out. Stop. No, stop it. Winnipeg? The other thing too, though, is if you're,

Kevin, if you're a team that's trying to trade for Pierre-Luc Dubois with one year left. Well, this is a Matthew Kuckechuk situation, right? You probably want to sign him. Sure. Or if you're the Montreal Canadians or whatever team or wherever, wherever Alice Pierlet de Bois would want to end up like you're saying I don't okay

you can low ball the jets you can say like we're we'll give you something but we're not going to give you everything you want here because he's going to be gone in here anyways so good luck tough tough deal I don't have a problem with players deciding where they want to be

it's not a thing that I get angry about it's just it's more just from an, it's just interesting from a, from a, from a narrative like storyline standpoint. Because then it, because then it turns into like, where does he end up? How much do the jet get back from? I don't, like, I will never rag on a player for, for trying to choose his own destiny. The thing that I think is always lacking, maybe not always lacking, but whenever this stuff happens, like, we're already seeing a bunch of memes and jokes about Pierre-Luc Dubois. And it's just like, you know, after Pierre-Luc de Bois has been in a city for six months, he's like, we're like, we're. ready to move on. Have we ever just stopped to think about why he might not want to be there? Maybe there's some turmoil.

Maybe there's some things that he doesn't like in that organization. Definitely. The Winnipeg Jets organization has not been in the best state for the last year. Like, look at what. Can you blame the guy? You know, just think for a second. Some of the stuff Rick Bonas alluded to all the drama last season where your captain gets the sea script.

The C and like there's Shifley. Like that was a weird dynamic public lead between Shifley and Wheeler. Uh-huh. You got bonus, you know, demolishing those guys on his way out after the playoffs. Yeah, it's a, I, it doesn't seem like a good situation. No. Other bit of news, it's Alex De Brinkett. It's Pierre LeBron's understanding that De Brinkett's camp has,

given the senators a short list of preferred destinations, a la Matthew Cachuk, in case Ottawa decides to go the trade route with De Brinket. So very much like Cichuk last year, he's got a pretty big qualifying offer in this final year. He's a restricted free agent with arbitration rights, and he's one year away from unrestricted free agency. So the sense basically have three paths forward, the same way that the flames have three paths forward.

You either sign him to a long-term contract extension. You sign him to the one-year qualifying offer, go to arbitration, sign him for a one-year deal, hope he wants to stay, but also potentially risk him leaving an unrestricted free agency a year later, or you can trade Alex to Brinkett to one of those preferred teams to maximize the return. They could sign him wherever they want, but they're probably not going to get a great return if DeBrinke's telling that team, I'm not going to stay here.

So we know that Matthew Kuch chose option three, gave the flames a list of his preferred teams. They trade him to Florida. So we'll see how that plays out With the Ottawa senators and Alex to Brinket But it looks at the very least I don't think it trades imminent right now But it looks like they have provided those destinations In case they go that route

So we'll see what happens there Timing's interesting on all this I think it makes you wonder Send them to Detroit I'm sorry I sense fans I need I want Maxie to get a win here always we always we always we always root for max boltman's boltman um what it's the it's max's it's max's staying army we've been over this before nope must have been with krele salvean seal team

six i don't know what you're talking about okay this is this was this was this was from me and it's fine yeah must have been your tuesday tuesday listeners no yeah to brinkets from Michigan, by the way. At this point, though, I wonder, because it's June 9th. If we're talking about the sale of the Senate is not getting wrapped up for another couple weeks, like, is there going to be enough time for

whoever comes in to sell Alex DeBrenkin on? Well, I don't think they're going to be changing the GM this season because of the way, like those owners, once the sales and now, like, once they pick the preferred bidder, and then once it all gets done, like they're not going to have time to do this like full house cleaning. So I'm pretty like, and I'm, and I'm sure that Pierre Dorian is operating as if like he's still doing his job right now. You can't not with the draft coming up in free agency.

So I don't think that's going to be a problem. But what I'm saying is like, but maybe he's not going to be able to give a, sorry, sorry, Sean. What I would wonder about though is like, are you going to be allowed to be handing out like massive contract extension? Sure. To Brinket if you don't know what the new owner's MO is. right and if you're Alex to brink it like it's hard to imagine him seeing nearly enough from whether it's Dorian new owners or whatever like we're down to crunch time here and if you're Alex to brink it like I think there's a reason that this is time the way that it is right I think

there's a reason that pier reported that yesterday it seems like his mind is pretty close to being made up and I don't blame him for it yeah um he said there's no question the prolonged process and the sale of the senators has impacted the Brinkett's situation. Because if you're, as you kind of said here, Sean, if you're Alex DeBrinquit, how do you entertain the notion of a long-term contract with the sends without knowing who owns the team? What's the vision of the team after new owners take over? Who's the GM going to be? Whether Dorian gets replaced

immediately or gets another year to prove himself to ownership and gets extended or replaced in the summer? I think there's too many questions for a guy who probably wants to get his game back on track to the level that it was at a year before joining the Ottawa senators. Right? And he probably wants to get a big ticket. He's still a young player. Had a bit of a down year. I think the fit in Ottawa was maybe a little bit funky.

And he probably is sitting there watching what Matthew Kuchukh's doing and being like, oh, like we talk about the league as a copycat league. There isn't going to be a team who can go and get Matthew Kuchuk, but I bet there's players who are looking at a guy taking his, you know, future into his own hands that way and being like, yeah, I'm going to use the situation and go where I want to go and play how I want to play with with a different team. Yeah. That's no disrespect to the Ottawa senators, but.

You can't, you can't do it. You can't do it. And it's, it's the same line of, you know, discussion. Senator Detroit. It's the same line of discussion we had with, we had with, with Dubus a couple weeks ago, right? Where people are like, well, he's, like, could this be, people have to make decisions on their future.

And you can't do it when you don't know who your bosses are going to, are going to be, or the owners of your employer is going to be. It's crazy. It's impossible. Send him to Detroit. Send him to Detroit. Okay, let's go. That's enough.

We've been talking for an hour and half of this has been just utter nonsense. I apologize to anyone who's listened. But if you like the show, you want more content from Sean and I. If you're not an athletic subscriber, you can join us at the athletic.com slash hockey show to get an annual subscription. for $2 a month for 12 months.

Thanks, everyone. Sorry. Thanks, sorry.