The Athletic Hockey Show - Revisiting the 2017 NHL Draft

Episode Date: March 20, 2026

Today, the guys revisit one of the most interesting, and debated, drafts in recent history, the 2017 NHL Draft, and reflect on how it has panned out nine years later. The class featured some of the best players currently in the league including Cale Makar, Nico Hischier, Nick Suzuki, Miro Heiskanen, and Jason Robertson, as well as some picks that just didn’t pan out like Nolan Patrick and Lias Andersson. Plus, to close things out, the guys break down Scott’s latest NHL Draft rankings.Hosts: Max Bultman, Corey Pronman, and Scott WheelerWith: FloHockey’s Chris PetersExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Chris FlanneryWatch full episodes on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowJoin our Discord Server: https://discord.gg/VTm9VjkFSubscribe to The Athletic: https://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Hey, everybody, Max Bolman here alongside the athletics. Corey Prominent and Scott Wheeler and Flohockeys, Chris Peters, for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. We got a fun show on tap today. Scott's got a new 2026 draft list out. We're going to talk about that a little bit later on. But first, we're going to turn back the clock a little bit.

And it's been nine years since the 2017 NHL draft. It was one of the more interesting NHL drafts in recent memory, Corey, because there wasn't a slam dunk, number one overall pick. And I think that makes it a really fun one to revisit for a couple reasons. One, to see how that's all played out. But two is just a little bit of a case study in how, you know, these things are always snapshots in time. You guys always talk about that.

And this one in particular, the way it's evolved, I think the way that we look at the 2017 class, particularly at the top of it, is different now than it was two years ago, let alone four years ago, let alone nine years ago. And so I think that makes it a very interesting sample. At the time, the whole discussion was Neek, versus Nolan, that one's not really the conversation anymore. No, and it's been interesting. I think you've seen over the last decade a lot of leaks from teams to reporters

about how they perceived the draft and how they loved Mero Hayskin and they loved Kail McCar. Up until a couple of years ago, how much they loved Elias Pedersen. You never hear from the teams that had Nico Heeshire won, of which there were plenty, the ones who had Nolan Patrick at one, which at least I know there was a couple. But yeah, that draft has evolved in a couple of ways. But back then, it was definitely NICO versus Nolan.

That was a legitimate debate. I think there were definitely people. Nesslon Patterson, I know, I mean, I know there were scouts and teams that had Hayskinnan up there and had McCar up there. But those were minority opinions. It was definitely between those two senators. They were prolific CHL centers with a rich history of success.

He sure was tremendous that year as World Juniors. He was tremendous in the queue that year. Nolan Patrick had had three great years in the Western League, although he was injured at times. And there were some questions on his game too still. I mean, it was a legitimate debate. But obviously, that's not how things have played out since then. It's interesting, too, because I completely understand why that was the debate at the time, right?

Everyone's looking for the franchise center. You had two guys who kind of looked like what we envisioned that as. This has turned out to be an unbelievable center class in hindsight when you look at the names in it. He sure has panned out to be a very good center. Maybe more of like a high end number two, low end number one. Elias Pedersen. He's been a hundred point player. You can say what you want about where he's been the last couple of years.

He's still in all day, a top six forward. He's been a 100 point center in the NHL. Robert Thomas, number one center in the NHL. Nick Suzuki, Scott, might be the best of the bunch at this point. Yeah, the defenseman kind of defined that class in hindsight, but if you were to rank the forwards from that class, I think Nick Suzuki on March 18th, 2026 as we record this, has as compelling a case as any of those guys. Martin Natchez, who you didn't mention in that group. More of a winger.

More of a winger. But has had a heck of a couple of years. and I think NACIS probably has a case to be right there with Suzuki with the way that he's played in Colorado. But it's still probably Suzuki with the two-way impact, with the position, with what he means to the Montreal Canadians who are now a playoff team again. He's probably the, like, you're taking him over Hescher, I think,

and probably over Natchez, too. Those feel like the three big boys have forward in that group. Although Pedersen still leading the draft of the score, right now. Yep. He is. Not this season, but in the overall,

like, total points, I think it's 497 is what Pedersen's at at the time of this recording and right behind him is McCarr. We will get to the defenseman here, but just sticking on the center or on the centers and the forwards here, Corey.

It was an interesting class because some of these names that we talked about, Suzuki, Thomas, those guys were not picked in the top 10. And even NACIS was a little bit later. And over time, Robert Thomas. Yeah, exactly.

Thomas Suzuki. We were talking more about names like Gabe Valardi. at the top about Michael Rasmussen at the top. And it's shifted. There's a complicated assessment to be done, Corey, about what to take away from this. And that'll kind of lead in when we get to the 2026 draft segment, some of these takeaways. But when you kind of reflect back on that, do you have a, I know every year you do the

what I got wrong list. Is there an overriding lesson here? Well, Valardi is his own unique case because he's actually become quite a good NHL player, not a great NHL player, but he's become a very useful piece in the National Hockey League. It took a very long time, though. I mean, his injury situation was so complicated back then. And, you know, he was the name that kept coming up when people were talking about Kaden Lindstrom in the 20204 draft. And then Roger McQueen in the 2025 draft.

The way you have these complicated back and hip injuries, that those are things that can really drag out for years. I know when back then, the assessment of Valardi, when he went to 11th overall to the Kings, was that this is a problematic injury, but I remember the time, because I've been doing this for a long time, I'm getting a little bit old. I remember talking to scouts back then. The assessment was from a lot of their doctors was, is it going to be one, maybe two rough years here, but we can get him back. He's going to be fine. He's going to be playing hockey regularly in two years. That was not the case. It was a lot of ups and downs and stops and starts and is his career over, you know,

hypothesizing and obviously he comes back and is good, but just not for the team that drafted him. It's still still something that he's dealing with too. Like my understanding is Volardi in terms of stretching and preparing his back. And like it's a career long thing that he's just managing now. if you look, at least in the top 15, the names that probably didn't pan out, Calfoot, although obviously complicated other issues with Calfoot.

You know, Leas Anderson at 7, Cody Glass at 6, and to a degree, middle stat at 8, although he's still playing, he's a good player. A lot of guys there are heavy feet. A lot of guys there who really struggled with the pace of the NHL, but you can't use that as like a definitive rule. because I don't think Suzuki is the fastest player in the world, but he's got tremendous stick and brain and competitiveness.

But that'd be probably one of the most common traits there. Max, you know, you've probably covered Rasmussen's career, you know, a lot. And I know there was a lot of debate in nine of, yeah, he's big, yeah, he skates okay. But like he was a pointed game player in the Western League, was this the biggest upside swing, yada, yada. And it's fair because obviously net just goes ahead of him. you know, Suzuki, even you could have a conversation of him versus Tippett. I think you still might, you could take Raspis and over Tippet, though. But, I mean, there's a lot of guys in those 10, 12 picks that went right after Rasmussen

that outside of those couple that became prolific players that he probably ends up being better than though, right? Yeah, it's always an interesting one for me to discuss with fans because it's a pick that, I think to this day, frustrates Red Wings fans. They see the success of Suzuki of Thomas of Natchez. I think there was a lot of love for Natchez. a lot of love for Gabe Valardi, who played in Windsor, and so was very close to Detroit and a lot of interest in him. So he's always kind of had kind of carried the burden of having been the ninth pick who went ahead of those guys.

But I'm interested in it because you look at him and we sort these by points, right? And I wouldn't say scoring has been a defining feature of Michael Rasmussen's game in his NHL career. He's still top 20 in this class and scoring. And that's while being, you know, a defensive center, a penalty killer. I don't know where he goes in a redraft here, but it's probably. somewhere around there, 20 to 25. There's some goalies and defensemen who you'd take ahead of him that are lower on the scoring list.

But it's funny. Like I was looking at it. He's the same number of points as A2 Lusturainen. And I think the way we talk about A2 Lusturainen is much more glowing. And there's a reason for that. Luster Rhinns been on winning team. I think he skates better than Rasmussen. I'd take him over him.

But it is interesting every time I go back to this class to look at like, you know, Red Wings fans' frustration on one hand. And the reality of it that this is kind of what the, you know, you probably, you probably should have gone 10 to 15 picks later, but it's not like he was a, you know, a Leis Anderson situation here. Loester Ryan is one of the more interesting players from that draft because he was a draft plus one that year, that this was the second draft eligible year. If you look back at his stats, it wasn't glowing numbers he put up in league,

even in that second draft season. But he kind of like took off right towards the end of the year. He was the definition of a late riser. I remember like talking to head scouts who like in the month of, March and April. So, you know, peak CHL playoff season, U-A teens. There's a lot going on. And they were popping over to Europe to go watch this kid. So he was a really fascinating case of just pure athleticism and a guy whose offense kind of developed late. Totally. And you talked about the heavy feet. I think that's kind of a theme too when I look at some

of the wingers here. And some of them started out as centers. And the reason that they are now wingers is because of the feet. And that's, you know, geeky and Valardi. But Jason Robertson, Not the fastest guy, but he's going to end up as one of the highest scoring players in this class. Has a chance by the end of it all to be the highest scoring player in this class. He's only about 20 points. Jake Bathison, another great example there, right? So I don't know if there's a takeaway here, but it is interesting to contrast that versus some of the more like shifty wingers that were in this class. You're Kyler Yamamoto's, your Ely Tolvonans, and see kind of who rose to the top of this, Chris.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, Robertson was one of those guys. I think there's other, it wasn't, you know, just the feat that put them outside of the first round here. But in the end, I think that was a defining factor. But, you know, I think Robertson in particular is one of the great lessons in the equalizing factor of hockey sense and the ability to understand how to create offense and how to use time and space to your advantage and other things like that. But, yeah, I mean, I think for a lot of these guys, you know, some of them also, it wasn't necessarily the straightest, their quickest. path to the NHL in order for them to, you know, to be a factor needed, you know, all of their junior eligibility, maybe some time in the AHL, different things like that. And then you have guys like geeky who have just, it's been a much later kind of explosion towards the end. And so they're,

you know, with players that have the skill level, you know, as as one of their defining traits, in addition to being a little bit on the bigger side, I think there are a lot of things that you can look at to, you know, put together a picture of what an NHL player looks like. And I think the 2017 class in particular is a great lesson in the, you know, the varying ways that you can reach and reach the league and have an impact in the league. It's a really compelling class in that way. Lots of guys that were first round picks that are, you know, kind of bottom of the lineup guys or tweeners.

And then you have some of these mid-round guys like Batherson and, and, and, you know, and Robertson, but again, I think sometimes in cases like Batherson and Robertson in particular, sometimes you just have to allow yourself to believe that what they're doing at the level they're at is impressive. You know, like it's like, oh, yeah, he's got all these points, but will that translate in certain, you know, and not all cases it is, but when you look at the size profile, the, you know, the mitigating factors, whether it be their hockey, sense or their, you know, their physicality or something of that nature, you know, the players with some size and some skill have a great, a pretty long runway and it might not be right away, but, you know, those are guys that I think are great examples of the power of patience and also,

you know, hockey sense can take you a long way. Robertson and Bathurston are, I think, are a little different for me, too. Like, Robertson was a prolific junior score. Yes. Like the entire time he was in the OHL. He was, what do you have, like, 80, 90 points in his draft? year he had a strong underage profile too. Like there was always, there was no doubt on his skill.

His brain is just, is the brain and stick leaked enough given his problematic skating stride? He kind of is gangly on an athletic skating stride to make it. Obviously, the answer was yes. And with an emphatic yes, actually, given how good he's been in the NHL. Batherson, on the other hand, was like Lewis Wren in a late bloomer. Scott might know this detail better than me, but I believe he had a significant growth spurt right around the time, but that's his draft plus one year. Like, this was not a, I think he was like 510 or 511 when he came into the,

when he came into the queue. And obviously now he's like close to 6.3. So that one was just like identifying some traits, some intriguing skill, developing body by Ottawa in the mid-round. And then obviously Bathison became that year after his draft. He was one of the more dominant cue players, I could remember. He, yeah, he, I think he was like 5-11, 6 feet in his, listed in his draft here by NHL Central Scouting, I'd have to go back and check. And he was still very productive in his draft here in the queue. But that step he took post draft was something else.

Like that was, okay, we've got a different cat here now. You're never going to like solve how to draft based on just looking back at one class. But it's interesting because we're talking about some of this profile. And you might think, okay, so always draft like the skilled, highly productive score, like even if they're a little slow-footed. But then you have Liam Graintree, Colby Barlow, Arthur Calliyev. Like there's other counter examples to kind of this similar profile of the prolific scorers here. And I wonder, like, is there a trait that jumps out that's like, yeah, but those guys had elite sense or more compete or something like that, Corey. Well, Tovanan is one from that year who everyone loved. Like he was a world junior player at 17. He had a tremendous

international track record. Didn't have a great year in the USHL that year. But he had been very good as underage. That was the skill guy that everybody loved. And then even in his draft plus one year, he goes with the KHL, he rips it up. It's obviously he's in the NHL now. He is an NHL player, but his size skating profile was very problematic.

And he was never really good. I think when you have that issue, you want to have the high compete because that's what Suzuki is. Like he's not the biggest or the fastest, but he's a warrior. Like I was watching the game of his the other night and the way he could win battles for a guy his size. It's just so impressive.

Like that was probably Tolvan's issue. So, I mean, it's always a balancing act, right? Like you go back to that draft and, you know, a small guy with prolific feet would have been Brandstrom. Like, holy hell can Eric Brandstrom skate. But he still couldn't defend at the pro level. Like, he wasn't hard enough.

He wasn't competitive enough. It's like when you're that size or you're big and you're slow, you've got to have some other trait there to really hang your head on. Yeah. You didn't even mention Oliver Wallstrom, Kiefer Bellows there, Max, off the top. Absolutely. It's a very long list of that. No, he's saying, like, recent guys who were prolific scorers and maybe you would go, okay, you got to trust what's there.

Like, those guys lost it too. The toolsiest guy in this draft, who I believe why he didn't make it, but goddamn I thought he was going to make it was Veselainen. I'm not sure if you guys remember watching Veselainen when he was a teenager. like that guy was so talented like six four he could fly he had good skill he could rip a puck um like he was just like just lazy like avatockey sense but like so like it makes you kind of think of rubric a little bit like from guys this year like a linden lack of it like that profile a little bit but like he was so so talented so much fun to watch at the junior level he played pro all year between Sweden, Finland, and his draft year.

But at the junior level, he looked like a, like a, like a, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, a, like, like, a, like, he could, yeah, he couldn't even do it in the, at the H.L level when he got over here. Owen, too. Like, I, I know a few people around Owen and watched him a lot in, in, in Mississauga back then. And, like, like, just the athleticism, the ability to shoot it, the skating. And yet for a long time, Owen had no clue how to play hockey. And it just took him, took him a long, long, long time to figure it out between the ears. And Tippetts have now signed what almost $8 million player with the Flyers. But he's figured it out.

He was a top 10 pick. It took a while to come around. I still don't know if it's top 10, what you're looking for. But he's 40 to 50 point guy. Like, that's a useful top half of the first round player. He was in the, they gave him the early tryout too in the NHL right after his draft. Yeah. And then he didn't get that for a couple of years.

It's like, oh, oh, what happened there? You know, so yeah, it was interesting. Klim Koston is another one who really toolsy. He struggled in his raft year, you know, play 11 minutes in the KHL, but 6'4, heavy, skilled Russian winger. It's tough with guys like that because, like, there was a lot of, like, talk at the time about, like, as he too over physically developed, the usual tropes about Russians, about,

How old is he really, et cetera, et cetera, but which obviously you could ever verify any troops to it. But I remember watching him when he was a junior player, especially as an underage player, and like he thought like this guy has all the tools. I remember even like St. Louis was like at the draft table, they were bragging about him. Like they couldn't believe they got him at 31, yada, yada.

Not the only thing time you've seen teams do that, but that was one that I couldn't believe he couldn't add a little bit more offense. Same thing with, it's a lot of when the American League. a struggle right away. Like he couldn't score in North America. At the level that I thought he was going to be able to score, that is, which was at least a reasonable middle six winger.

I'll never forget Koston at the draft that year. They had the top six or seven guys from NHL Central, from both of NHL Central Scouting's list in a room sort of backstage at the draft. And Koston was one of those 12 or 13 players that they sat there. And then they got to walk on stage as their names were picked. And then suddenly everybody in the room is gone. because they've already been selected, and Koston's just sitting there until pick 31,

and in hindsight, probably sitting for a good reason. Which at the time was the last pick of the first round. Yep. Corey, a little bit ago, you mentioned Eric Brandstrom, and that's where I want to start kind of as we pivot to the D here, because from 14 to 18 in this class, there was a run of five straight defensemen,

and I think I'm clear to say that none of them hit. Cal foot at 14, Eric Brandstrom 15, Yusovallamaki, 16, Timothy Lilligrin at 17, and Erho Vakenayn and at 18. To go 0 for 5 like that in a run of defensemen, normally would mean, oh, this D-Class bombed. But it is saved by Cal McCar and Miro Haskinen going, well, four and three, respectively. And I think there's a very real case.

They would go one and two in a redraft on this, Corey. Yes, and I think there's a lot of people, especially with McCar, there's always kind of been the debate since then is why didn't he go one because he's so good and he's become such a dominant force in the nchel obviously hayeskin and has two but by mccar's you know stanley cup winner elite offense uh kind of the anchor there for team canada at the olympics he's just a very special player and you go back to that draft like we've mentioned at the top that you had these two really good centers you know very toolsy great CHL careers

do you realize the balls it would have taken to take a late birth date, 5-11 defenseman in the AJHL ahead of those guys? And I know teams were thinking of that. I know New Jersey was thinking about it. They didn't end up doing it, but they did a lot of research on McCar. You're with the first overall pick. That was a serious debate in that room.

But to pass on a guy who you felt really confident was going to be a top six center in the NHL, a really good top six center. You know, like, McCar, there was questions on how I was going to translate. There was questions on how I was going to translate even in the year after his draft. He wasn't even the top scoring defenseman at UMass

from his draft in that draft plus one year. It was Mario Ferraro outscored him that first year. That obviously the second year, goes off, ridiculous college year, goes the NHL, you know, the rest is his history. but there was some significant risks in that projection. Despite the great feat, the great skill, the great hockey sense, you know, the AGHL is very far removed from the CHL,

never mind from NHL. So those were the risks there. I think with Hayeskin, I think he was kind of viewed more as like a defense version of each year, just really well-rounded, probably a better skater. But I think the chance to get a guy you thought had a chance to be a first-line center won the day there,

but I think that was more of a conversation at least in terms of risks. I don't know. Am I, you guys think I'm misremembering anything there? Because I feel like, I think everyone's, everybody,

I think Central had McCar, what, like seventh in North America or something that year. Yeah, it was, like, it was all over the map with kale. Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, it's easy to say now and easy to say, oh yeah, I love to remember watching with the World Junior Ray Challenge. He was incredible and he was,

like he was dominant at that junior event and dominant in the, and Brooks. but I mean, can you imagine like in this draft? Like we're talking about McKenna and Stenberg and if I told you,

there's this guy in the BCHL who I adore. He's so talented. Let's take him over McKenna. Like you guys would like laugh at me. Like, you know, it would. Yeah. And even then like then it was like the AJ was still like, you know,

they would have players. They would have, they would have guys that you would draft. But very rarely were they in the first round. And I, you know, I think we kind of saw some of that this year where like Tyne and Lawrence was like, I probably need to go to BU if I'm going to have any chance at being the number one pick because people are, you know, whatever. They may not take a USHL player first overall.

And, you know, that's the thing. It's like if McCar was in a different league, maybe we are having a different discussion, but that was a big part of it. And Corey, I remember even like talking to you before because this was actually the year that I did not cover the 2017 draft. I was out of hockey at this point for my one year out of it. And I remember the conversation we had. I was like, because you mocked him there at the end, didn't you? At number one? Yeah.

Or around there. That's not where I had him rated. But I said I had heard New Jersey was doing homework there and I was wrong ultimately on that front. But I thought he was going to go first overall, yes. Yeah. I mean, and that was so like, yeah. And that was a legitimate thing. And that was certainly something that I was hearing too is like all of a sudden, like,

you know, there, there's, there's a lot of teams. And, and the debate came back to league strength, different things, like, how do you project that out? And, you know, ultimately, you know, if they would have done it, they would, you know, would have a generational defenseman. But, you know, it's, it's really like, you're thinking back to that. And to Corey's point, the jump from the AJ to NCAA for Kail McCar was not managed very well in the first year. He was, I was going back and looking at some of my other things. And it really wasn't until his sophomore season where it looked like, oh my God, this is a different human here. You know, and so, and, and think about how little he was utilized at the world juniors that

year, too, where he was a power play guy, like a specialist, the seven, he was, he was a second power play guy. He had to sit behind Kale Clegg, who was running. That's right. And, and he ended up still, I think, what, he had a point per game in the tournament as well. And so, like, yeah, it's just like, you know, there, there are some people that are just different.

And it's real, like, I, I feel like it's hard. to allow yourself to believe it in certain settings. And I feel like that's really what ended up happening with Kail Makar is that the fact that he went forth from the AJ is still a really impressive thing. And then, you know, yeah, that one will, that is always going to be one of the most fascinating things. And in the current landscape, it'll never happen again. So we don't have to worry about that, I guess. With Hayeskin, and it's interesting because I feel like he's having one of the best seasons of his career, year and yet I've never heard less about Miro Hayskin than I am right now.

I think the problem with that is that on top of what Kale and Quinn have become in the league, you've also now got Werenski and Lane Hudson and these other guys who've just really, really elevated and it almost feels like what Miro is has become, he's been way better. There was even talk last year of maybe he's being replaced as the number one defenseman on his team. Like he has been way better than Thomas Harley this year. So I think part of it is just time and there's new shiny toys. Like with what Lane's doing, with what Zah, with what Wrenski's done the last couple of years,

with what Siders doing this year, there have just been other players that have risen to that sort of level. And lo and behold, the Dallas Stars are one of the best teams in the league. And Miro Heiskin is still one of the best defensemen in the league. You know, a couple months ago I pitched to Dom and Shana. I was like, this is the year of the true two-way defenseman between Sider, Sanderson, and Hayskin. skin and I was like all three of those guys are going to end up, I think, in the top five. And just as the years gone on, Quinn got out of Vancouver and recaptured the magic in Minnesota. Werenski is somehow at or outshining the level that he did last year, which was outstanding. And then Lane

Hudson is is right there as well, to your point that. Evan Bouchard has like 200 points. That's right. Exactly. So somehow these two-way D get lost every year. And it's, it drives me a little bit crazy because I do think that that that player type is so coveted in the NHL and it just gets lost over and over again. Well, some of those two-way guys are better than some of those other guys. There's just a reality. I agree. I'm just saying that they get lost in the conversation, you know? Right. You mean that the voters just sort by points? You will not get me to say that on the record. That's okay. All right. Any other thoughts on this class before we get to 2026? I mean, the goalie class here, Jake Ottinger is kind of the shining star.

that regard. Ukapakalukinen shut out last night or Tuesday night in Vegas. Anyone else here that stands out that you want to talk about? I mean, there's so many things you can go on. We didn't even mention, like, Luligran. There was such a hype train for that guy going into his draft. And ultimately, he runs into issues, average hockey sense, I think, like really doomed him there towards the end.

But, like, that was one. You know, we didn't even mention the guy in the top team who didn't play at all. He had monode out here, too. And, like, Leah's Anderson. Yeah. Like, that's got, that's just, you know, probably, you know, probably the most disastrous pick from that draft was Anderson. And like, they thought he was going to be their captain.

Yeah, I know. And I remember, go back to that time. He was a world junior player that year, probably played better than Pedersen did at the World Junior that year. Pedersen didn't play well at all at that tournament. And I think he even got invited. Did he play World Championships? I think he got invited to like pre-termine games with the world championship team.

I think you're right. Yeah. And like he got like, like, but there was always like, yeah, he's 5-11. Yeah, he's not that fast. Like, yeah, he's not super skill. But everyone who loves him, like, he's a warrior. He's Mike Richards. Like this is what this guy is going to be.

And then, but like, yeah, like, well, you're picking top 10. Like, as competitive as a guy is, like, you've got to like have at least some sort of, like, high-end. and traits to hang, you know, to be hopeful about. Like, he's got to be able to skate. He's got to be able to score. It's got to at least have some sort of athletic projection there. Like, that's, I always struggled with that one. Like, I got a lot wrong with that year.

That was one I just never fully understood the hype for. Yeah. Now in Switzerland, now playing professionally in Switzerland after two of his most successful HL seasons after not panning out as an NHL player. So just it, yeah, that one is, and, you know, he was such a central part of Sweden's, you know, they went on that run the following year in 2018, where he was the captain, you know, all those, all those different things. And man, it just, it never, I mean, like he was in, the other thing, too, so he started the season,

then he started the season with for London. And then he moved to the AHL and then the Rangers like, oh, we got to get him in. Like he played, he played games that following year, you know, in the NHL. So it's just, it's, it's very strange. He had two of his 17 points that year, by the way, 17 points in 110 NHL games for the seventh overall pick. This was the Vegas expansion draft. And it is amazing to me how badly this should have gone by, by what happened with their,

with their three picks in the top 15. They take Cody Glass at six, Suzuki at 13, but then trade him. for Max Patcheretti, and then they trade Eric Brandstrom. To recover from having that been your first draft, you have this amazing opportunity with three top 15 picks to start your franchise on. You nail one of them, but trade the one you nail, and to somehow recover from that in a,

like, Willy Wonka-esque fashion, is magic. Well, I do remember when they trade it, Bransom, that was the Mark Stone trade. Yep. Good player to get back. Kind of been important for them the last little while. I remember Pierre Dorian, then the senator's general manager, like, talking about just the glowing review of Eric Branstrom. He's like, well, we traded Mark Stone, but the reason we did we got, because we got, I can't believe I just got Eric Branchstrom.

That was, he was effusive in his praise of that player. And obviously, just complete disaster after that. He was kind of the start of the 5-11 puck-moving D-Man in the first round that doesn't work out trend that followed for. eight or nine years basically. Bochfuss the next year. Unlike some of those guys like Veselaine and Lillegrin and Koston, Ranchrin came over. He was really good right away.

Like that first year in Chicago, he was excellent in the American League. I think he was we came over at 19, I think. But he was really, really good. You're like, oh, it's going to work. It's going to translate. And then he gets to the NHL. And that's, you know, not really a novel. Take the NHL is a little bit better than

the American League. And he just couldn't defend. And the offense was just never really truly lead enough to compensate. Yeah. And you know what? I do think looking back at the Vegas thing real quick, like how good of a lesson was that for them to just be like draft picks are commodities. They are not for our future.

Like it's like, hey, if we, and the thing is is that, you know, teams constantly overvalue their prospects. They constantly do it. And, and we'll hold on to them for too long. And, you know, basically, you know, Vegas will have no qualms about it because it did eventually lead to a Stanley Cup, you know, and with, especially with Mark Stone being a central figure and all those different things. Like, that's, that works, you know. But yeah, that could have been, that could have been a complete disaster. You also wonder, what is, what do they look like with Nick Suzuki at the center of everything? But then you probably don't have Jack Eichel at that point, you know, all these different things. There's, there's lots of what ifs that you could play. in there. But in the end, you know, this is a team that has basically made there every single year. You can pretty much guarantee if like, you know, hey, Trevor Connolly, I think has lasted longer than any first round draft pick that they've had. So, uh, kudos to him. Ironically enough,

they also ended up with Nick Haig from this draft class who they didn't pick. There you go. Yeah. At some point, you feel like the, you know, it's going to come due for them, right? Like, like, Oh, yeah, it always does. This is a pretty old team. I wasn't about Pittsburgh last year, but obviously, Sydney Crosby and Eric Carlson seemed to have, you know, truly special players seem to extend

the window there a little bit, but I think with Vegas when when it comes due for them, it's going to hurt. The thing is, though, like, Vegas is going to, their ability to recruit as both a no-tax state, the destination in a place with his reputation, eventually, yes, they're going to need some young players. I do still

think as many players as because, available on the trade deadline, Vegas is going to be in the top two or three on their list. So yes, you probably won't have the assets to chase after them in trades forever. But to the extent that there even is free agency going forward, they're always going to be a player in that too. Can we do a quick? I want to see how you guys would draft the top 10. If we can, are we unanimous, Corey?

Do you want to just go in a square here? You want to pick number one and we'll just see how this would shake out in a top 10? All right. First overall pick, I will fall on that grenade and take kill McCorme. are. Scott? I think it's Miro 2. Chris?

Why is this shouldn't be? I don't like it. You'll me to go third? I can go third. No, okay, yeah, you go third. I think Nick Suzuki has a very real case to go three. Yeah. Yeah, I think you're right.

I think you're right. Nick Suzuki. Because I didn't want to take him three. I'll take him four. Jason Robertson. Okay. Corey. Five.

Yeah. This is where I think. get tough here because I think he sure is now in the conversation Pedersen's in the conversation Thomas is in the conversation here. Netches is the better talent but I'll take he's sure I think. Okay. Scott? I'll go I'll go Nettius over Rob Thomas. And I would say Thomas at seven then. by process of elimination Chris has had the only two hard picks here I think has Petters

did Pedersen get picked you? He just did at number eight He just did Petterson Okay All right so nine Corey Audinger Yeah And then a 10 Scott if you want to round it out

I don't know man Is it is it Batherson Hmm I depend how much you like Do you do you do you I don't really love Swayman, but I guess he could be considered in the argument. Yeah. Yeah, it's probably Swamen.

I would take, I would, I would probably, I don't know. I think if any of those goalies that have gone in that 10 to 15 range in recent years became Swamen, their teams would be very happy. Swamon's one of Vezna. It's, it's probably Swamon. On a per game basis is probably Josh Norris, but obviously there's a major asterisk there. I think, I think Buffalo would love to trade Josh Norris for Jeremy Swayman if they could do it, right? I think Josh Norris, when he's healthy, is an outstanding hockey player.

But it's been a rough go of that late. The last too big of an event. Pretty much, pretty much his whole career. Not bad for a class that had all that chaos at the top back in 2017. Turned out they had no number one overall pick to maybe like three or four, number one overall pick worthy players in that class. Let's take a quick break right there. We'll circle back and we'll talk about the 2026 class.

And maybe if there's anything we can take from 2017, as we analyze it. All right, we are back. And Scott, you had a 2026 draft list come out this week. And I wonder, with everything we just talked about, kind of looking back at the 17 class, is there anything that you think really applies in how you're analyzing or expect to be analyzing

this year's draft class? There's always certain debates that are kind of universal here. Yeah, I think the two universal debates that come to mind in the conversation we just had is the smaller group of D, where we've talked a lot about last year, year, no sub six foot D. Cam Reed's the only six foot D taken in the first round. This group has a number of those guys all of a sudden. And frankly, next year's draft, I just started sort of putting

the finishing touches on my first list for next year's draft, which will be out next week. And it's, it looks similar, like the top D in next year's class led by Landon DuPont, or kind of fit into that, that sort of size category. And then Corey and I have had some interesting conversations about the sort of late first second round 80, 90 point CHL wing types that are in that 511 range and where they fit in this class. We almost, we couldn't quite settle on a number, but we almost settled on a number for whether one of Mathis Preston, Igor Shilov, Thomas Cherenko, and Nikita Klepov, whether one of those guys sort of goes in the first round or where those guys fit once

the big names, once the true premium guys are off the board, I think that's going to be a conversation that we're having on draft day and coming out of draft day and into next year. Some of those guys are going to put up big numbers in junior hockey next year. There's a chance that Klieb of goes to Michigan State next year and has a good year on a good team. And so that conversation is always interesting for me because you get through the 6-2, 6-1 centers with skill, you get through the premium D. and then what happens with that sort of second tier,

and we had Yamamoto in 2017, and Tolvenin in 2017 that we just talked about, and then Brantstrom on the D side in 2017 that we chatted about, that for me is an interesting sort of second layer to the draft conversation this year, because those players are, like, we've had some highs with Nikita Klappobbies, he might actually lead the OHL, depending on how this weekend goes.

He might lead the OHL in scoring this year. Preston's been banged up, But Preston's had some real highs with Hockey Canada. That conversation around those kids, I think, is an interesting layer once you get through the Chase Reads and the true sort of big boys. I believe the exact words wasn't a conversation. I believe you had a wager, which I offered that you declined. I offered top 32. Corey insisted on top 30, and I offered top 32 that one of those guys goes top 32.

And Corey also declined. Yeah, but I think now, well, I think. I think club off's probably going top 32. So I think that this wage was back in November. I should have taken the bet is what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah, I think it was a mistake. I don't know if she loves him maybe.

I think Preston's a big maybe. Where do you have him on your list right now? I have Preston right at the back end like 30, 29, 30. 27. I got it. I'm looking. I have him like way later than that. Like I think he was just.

He's not going in the first round. Yeah. I think he was really bad this year. He's been, compared to what I thought. He's been good in Vancouver. And Spokane was tough. Like Spokane was a tough situation for him, I think. He's really talented.

The feat, the skill are tremendous, but he's just, there's a lot of holes in his game. I think he'll be at U-18s and have a nice U-18s as well. Yeah. On the small defenseman point, Scott, a guy that you've loved this whole draft cycle is Ryan Lynn. And I wonder, like, as we talk about some of the guys of that profile who didn't pan out. What do you see in Lynn that makes you confident enough that he is different from those guys to rank him as highly as you do? I just think the combination of the smarts and the competitiveness. Some of those guys had the smarts. None of them really had the competitiveness. He's got the offense. He's

got the statistical track record, the pedigree, all of that. But it's how hard he plays, how hard he competes, how smart he is on both sides of it, the way that he defends. We've talked about that a lot already on the show, but that for me is what sort of distinguishes him from your late first or early second round, D at that size. Like, I just think he's one of the very best players in this age group right now. Now, that doesn't mean he will be one of the very best NHL players, but I think because of how intelligent he is on both sides of it and because of how hard he plays, I have more confidence that he will remain sort of as one of the better players.

players in this class. And I think he's also another, he's like, he's going to go to you 18s, and they're going to play him 25 minutes a night on that blue line for Canada. And I think that will also help his case after playing on a pretty poor Vancouver team this year. A couple of players on your list that we haven't spent a ton of time on yet this draft cycle. And I'm sure we will as it gets closer, but now's as as as good a time as any is, you know, with so much focus on Yvar Stenberg and on Vigo Bjork out of Sweden. But Marcus Nordmark and Elton Hermanson are also lottery pick range guys for you. I don't think we've talked about it maybe more than a minute or two so far.

Yeah, Corey talked last week on the show about his sort of top eight group. I've got a top 12 group. And then right behind that top 12 group is Nordmark and Hermanson. Nordmark is as talented a winger as there is in this class after the big two. Like extremely, extremely talented. Has had some real highs at five or six different events now with the Swedish national team, Five Nations, go back all the way back to U-17s in Sarnia a year ago. The numbers haven't quite popped domestically like they have internationally with Nordmark,

but just very, very high-end skill package. And then Hermanson's got the pro track record, also a very skilled player, a little bit bigger, a little bit stronger than Nordmark, maybe not quite as dynamic with the puck, but can score. And Hermanson has the track record of having done it at a pro level in Hockey Al Spenskin this year. and been a really strong contributor for them. I think he scored almost 15 goals for them at that level this year, 13 or 14 goals, if I'm not mistaken.

Those two guys, I'll be interested to see where they go on draft day. I had a conversation with an amateur scout last week when I was doing a poll for a McKenna piece, and I got talking with him about some of the other wingers, and he posed that same question to me of, like, where do you think Nordmark and Hermanson go? Because I like them a lot, and they're very, very talented. but those guys are tricky to sort of slot. And I think they're probably going to both end up sort of in the middle of the first round somewhere, maybe one of them in the early 20s. But they're, they're like, once you get past the premium guys, they're among the only players that you can look at and say, okay, this kid has top six potential, power play potential, that those kind of tools.

Well, then the one last thing I want to get you with, Scott, is there is a name on this list that first of all, I hope I get correctly. Seamus Ignatavitious. and he's from Lithuania. And I know that our listeners really love when guys pop up from unexpected places here. So tell me a little bit about Seamus Ignatavicious, please. Talk about an unexpected place, right? Like, this isn't even a kid from Bel-R... Like, this isn't already Lev Shunov.

This isn't some of the Latvians that have come through in recent years. This is a kid from Lithuania. They aren't just like a second or third-tier hockey-playing country. They're a fourth- or fifth-tier hockey-playing country. has played a lot of hockey in Switzerland, obviously, is now playing pro in the NL with Genev Servet over there and has been a good player, like a regular contributing player for them. He's big, he's strong, he skates well, he's very, very competitive, he's heavy. I don't think there's like, I've seen him make some skill plays this year when I've watched

him on Instat. I don't think he's like a skill guy, but he's got quick hands and he's got a decent release and another guy who scored some goals at a very good pro level in the NL this year. But yeah, just where he comes from makes it as interesting as anything because he's he's a unicorn in a lot of ways. And maybe we had that a little bit with Bransag-Neegard and Solberg, but even Norway seems to be producing kids, maybe not for the NHL draft, but there are a lot of top scores in the J20 level, for example, who are from Norway now and they're feeding players into

the Swedish junior ranks at a decent clip and Lithuania obviously is not that. And they're a world championship too, too. Like I know they're not like a top 10 country, but they, you know, top 15 hockey country, Norway is like, is Lithuania even in the B pool for the men's world championship? I don't, I think they are. I think they are. I couldn't tell you 100% off top of my head. It kind of reminds of Liam, like God bless him, but Liam Kirk.

who obviously was from England and yeah he was interesting but I think like ignatavish was a guy that is a good prospect yeah scouts were definitely going yes making special trips to they are in the B pool just so with our Lithuanian listeners aren't aren't yeah but the B pool like that's that's a pretty it's still they're they haven't been up in the senior division for for some time and yeah I mean like it's it's a really interesting I I personally always find it interesting to see where players are kind of coming from and different, you know, guys that kind of beat the odds and, and,

and, and, and, and, and, and, and, like, scouts were, were definitely taking special trips to go see him, um,

in Switzerland. I'm sure you had to twist their arm to go over to Switzerland. But, you know, either way, like, it's really, um, you know, when you see players like this,

and especially in a year like this where we're, we're, you know, we're really scraping around for prospects, I feel like when we get in outside of this, this first round, I think when you start looking at depth, there's always going to be,

guys that pop. But, you know, when you have this, a player with this athletic profile that's playing aggressively as he is in pro and with some maturity in his game, I think that that's, that's always going to resonate. So, you know, hey, yeah, I, I, I definitely, you know, I talked to teams a while back that we're talking about him as a potential, you know, late first, early second round draft pick, which is probably where he ends up. And so, yeah, if you're, if you're a Lithuanian hockey player by way of Texas by birth, I believe. But, you know, those are, it's a pretty special thing. So he's definitely one of those players.

I'm going to be intrigued to see ultimately what happens with him. Yeah, a name and a story to learn as we start getting closer to the 2026 NHL draft. That is going to do it for us today. Thanks for listening to this episode of the athletic hockey show Prospect Series. You can, of course, catch more of Chris over at Flow Hockey on his podcast called up, and more of Scott and Corey's stuff on this draft class and many more on the athletic.com. We'll talk to you soon.