The Athletic Hockey Show - Seattle Kraken, Vegas Golden Knights rivalry is born, TNT debuts NHL coverage and will it be fight night in DC between the Rangers and Capitals?

Episode Date: October 13, 2021

The Wednesday Athletic Hockey Show debuts with Rob Pizzo from CBC Sports and Sara Civian and Jesse Granger from the Athletic.Pizzo, Civy and Jesse look back on the debut game between the Seattle Kraken and Vegas Golden Knights in a playoff like atmosphere in Vegas, a questionable winning goal from Chandler Stephenson and a controversial goal celebration from Morgan Geekie. They discuss Nick Suzuki's contract extension with Montreal, Nathan MacKinnon missing the Avalanche season opener due to Covid-19 and how much Sara and Jesse are looking forward to interviewing players in person, after a year of connecting with players on zoom.Tarik El Bashir, the Capitals writer for the Athletic stops by to preview the grudge match between Washington and the New York Rangers with Ryan Reaves looking to settle the score yet again vs Tom Wilson. We also discuss the injury to Nik Backstrom, the acting chops of Alex Ovechkin, and his wife Nastya and Tarik gives us a sneak peak into what TNT is going to deliver during it's first night of covering hockey for the NHL. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

What's going on, guys? Welcome to the Athletic Hockey Show, the brand spanking new Wednesday Roundtable Edition. I am Rob Pizel from CBC Sports, alongside, at least virtually, Jesse Granger, who covers the Vegas Golden Knights for the Athletic, and Sarah Sivion, who covers the Carolina Hurricanes for the Athletic. Guys, welcome. Pump to be here. It's going to be fun to talk a little hockey, isn't it? now that we got a brand new season, a normal season in front of us. It's going to be fun, right?

Oh, my God, the most fun. Back to normal. Are we back to normal, though? I mean... Will we ever be? I don't know. Where are we ever? Is this just a new normal?

I mean, no matter how much we look at an 82 game season, no matter how much we look at the fact the fans are back in the stands, it's always just a little bit weird, right, Jesse? Yeah, I agree, but getting closer, getting closer. And I got to experience the home opener last night. And it was phenomenal. And I will say it felt a lot closer to normal than we have had in a long time. We're going to dive right into that. We've got a lot to talk.

But we'll talk about the first ever game for the Seattle Cracken. Already some drama on and off the ice on that one, by the way, which I absolutely love. Nathan McKinnon, testing positive for COVID-19. You got the Habs locking up Nick Suzuki for eight more years. One of his quotes kind of really made me laugh and set the Twitter world on fire. As per usual, we're also going to talk about dynasties. We'll talk about the capitals and we'll talk about hockey commercials. We're going to be joined in the second segment by TARC from the Athletic D.C.

And now a contributor to TNT's hockey coverage, all of that coming up in the next 45 minutes or so. But Jesse, you touched on a second ago. I felt the energy of that Seattle Vegas game from my couch. And I felt it just looking on Twitter. Bring us in there, man. What was it like in there? It just seemed loud and it seemed like almost a playoff atmosphere. Yeah, it did.

A couple of the players actually, Chandler Stevenson mentioned after the game that it felt like playoffs. And that's pretty much par for the course for Vegas. We've seen over the last couple years that arena is a lot of fun. And it starts outside the arena. I put my laptop up in the press box and then went for a stroll around the arena before the game just to kind of check it out. And there were so many Seattle fans, which, I guess shouldn't be that surprising. It's the first game in franchise history that's reason to make a trip to Vegas. But they showed up in droves. And I've always said, Vegas gets a lot of visiting fans, not surprising.

I always say the best atmospheres in that building are not when it's 100% Golden Knights fans. And probably the Vegas fans don't like me saying that. But I like it when it's a good contingent of the road fans because I feel like they keep each other loud. Like the Seattle fans start getting loud and the Vegas fans feel the need to drown them out. It keeps the energy up for the whole game. And we really heard that last night, and it was great. Obviously, the pregame ceremony, which everyone enjoyed on Twitter was phenomenal. What did you think of the pregame ceremony, Sarah? Well, what did that look like in real life?

From my living room, it was a whole production that was hyping me up. And it felt like, I don't know, maybe it's also with the ESPN. It just everything feels more official. And it kind of just feels like hockey is one of those big sports after watching something like that. You know what I mean? It's not often. It's not often that something on Twitter. Like, you think about when you're watching a video on Twitter on your phone.

Right. Looks that dynamic. It felt like I was wearing 3D glasses and the whole thing with the cracking coming in. And I love at the end, the night, of course, you're in Vegas. The night's supposed to win. But I was sitting there going, we haven't even hit Puck Drop yet. And this is, this is exciting. Yeah, it looked more three-dimensional in person than it did on the video.

And in the video, like you said, it looked pretty good. It was, it was spectacular. They had brand new projectors, I heard for it. and it, I think it's good. They've, they've always used on-ice projections for the Golden Knights, but we haven't had the on-ice show. Like, they've, they still do the show, but because of COVID protocols, they, the mascots weren't allowed on the ice.

So we haven't had that for like almost two years. So that was the first time bringing it back and they obviously put everything they had into it. And then the game that followed it was even more entertaining the pregame show. I was joking after the game. If we can get 81 more like that, I will be pumped. Seattle looked like they were getting blown out of the water and then stormed back to tie it up. And that's when Morgan Geeky, who Sarah knows well, decided to whip his stick around and holster it like a sword. And I didn't realize it at the time. I realized, I appreciated the

Selly at the time. I was like, man, that was a pretty good stick twirl. I didn't realize that it upset the entire Golden Knights bench, which is hilarious. After the game, we talked to Max Patcheretti, and he said, yeah, we saw him do that little Selly and stare down our bench. I went over to Chandler Stevenson and told him, we're going to score on this shift. And Mark Stone said something similar. He was like, yeah, that fired us up. So I guess they shouldn't fire us up like that. And they did score on the next shift, 35 seconds later, to retake the lead four to three.

And we've already got a rivalry budding between, I feel like it's a natural rivalry. The two newest teams, they kind of should be, they're going to be compared to each other for years to come. But one game in, it looks like we've already built up some animosity. I love it. One time Morgan Geeky was dared to say in a Hurricanes press conference that you can't out Pizza the Hut. And I guess ever since then, he's been putting up the points. So good for him. I guess you simply cannot out Pete to the Hut, but you can beat the crack in.

But it was so, it filled me with like a warmth to see that those were the two most recent. I thought you meant the stick twirl. No. That filled you with a warmth. I mean, I don't like a good selly as much of the next guy, but I don't know if I felt warm. But yeah, sorry. I won't get too sentimental here. I'm working geeky.

But those are the two most recent expansion teams. And it's like if that's where the NHL is headed from a production standpoint and for a fun standpoint and hype, like that just makes me feel good about the sport. As someone who covered them, though, were you surprised to see the, and I feel like I talked to Jesse already even before we started recording this podcast. I feel like the stick twirl gets better and better every time we talk about it. It really just was a little stick twirl. But every time we're like this glorious stick twirl and puts the sword back in the old. It was nice. It was so nice when he did it that I literally tweeted it belonged in the pregame ceremony. He should have been dressed as a night. Like it was a noticeably, like it was a nice

Selly. Were you surprised Sarah? No. I mean, you got the storm surge in Carolina. I guess some things never die. Yeah. Here's a thing that that just blows my mind. I love hearing, you know, Mark Stone, like you said, oh, we're going to go score and that got us going and blah, blah, Why do professional athletes need something like that to get them motivated? And you hear it all the time. Like, oh, I read a quote in the paper and that got me motivated. You know, we all saw the last dance. Every time someone even looked at Michael Jordan the wrong way, well, I took that personally.

I mean, how about blowing a three-nothing lead to an expansion team's first game in the NHL? You think that would get you motivated? But I guess it's just the little things that they need and it worked, but it still blows my mind that that that. is something that they need to get themselves back in a hockey game that they really just let slip away. Yeah, a little strange. I guess the way I would think of it is like they're all already so motivated that that's just like the extra motivation on Tyler. It's not like they weren't motivated. They're just a little extra, I guess. I don't know. I think that I think that if Morgan Geeky scores that goal to make it 5-1 Vegas and does that little twirl, it doesn't bother

anyone, but the fact that it was the game tying goal and he looked over at the bench after doing it, I think that, like you said, the blowing a three-goal lead should be the motivation. I think it was the motivation. And then that was just kind of, he just added to it. Well, I'm fueled by things too. Right now I see Gretzky's jersey hanging up in Rob's situation. And that's pumping me up for this podcast. I didn't know Sarah was going to be talking about my situation on this podcast.

But yes, you can't really see it. It's part of my, some people call them Man Cave. I call it my Fortress of Solitude. Let's talk about Chandler Stevenson for a second, aka Cristiano Ronaldo. No goal. You know, and I want to talk about this because first off, I look, I watch at Global 15 times this morning. In my mind, I see a distinct kicking motion. Jesse, most people listening to this podcast follow you on Twitter.

I love the way you said, well, that's going to be no goal, guys. And then, oh, it was a goal. But let's pretend it wasn't. Let's pretend it was just directed in with his. foot. Are you guys in favor of that rule? Are you guys in favor of goals purposely going in off someone's foot? We're not talking about a deflection front. We're talking about purposely putting your foot somewhere to help it go in. Sarah? Listen, I'm in favor of anything that clarifies the rules. Just tell me what the rules actually are and stick to it. You know? What about you, Jesse?

Yeah. I guess it's, I have to go look at the rule, but talking to Chandler Stevenson and Pete DeBore after the game. They both mentioned that it going off the outside of his foot was the key. Like Stevenson said, I was skating around. I was like, how confident were you? It was going to be a goal. And he's like, I was skating around asking guys about the ruling. And apparently it being off the outside of my foot helped me. And then DeBoer said, I've never seen a goal overturned that came off the outside of a guy's foot. So apparently you can't kick something off the outside of your foot, but soccer players do it all the time. And like, it was a Danny Page on Twitter that I thought nailed it last night. And they were like,

if that was a soccer play and a soccer player made that exact motion with their foot, we'd be saying, what a play. Like, what a great kick to score that goal. But because it's hockey, it wasn't a distinct kicking motion. I was kind of debating it back and forth with Sean McIndoo. Down Goes Brown on Twitter last night. And he was mentioning that it basically has to be the Charlie Brown, like missing the field goal. Like, it's got to be a full leg up off the ground and swing through like you're kicking a 60-yard

field goal. for them to call it a kicking motion now. So I guess if that's how you're going to define it, it was a good goal. I thought it was a kicking motion pretty clearly, but apparently not. I'm all for clarification of the rule, but there are certain things,

and I know I sound like the vast majority of people on Twitter. For example, the puck over the glass delay game penalty. I've hated it since day one. I can't stand when people say that a referee shouldn't have to make that judgment call. And yet we tell linesmen, they have to determine who would get to the puck first on an icing.

So they can do that, but they can't determine if someone put it over the glass. It's one of those situations where, and I hate to sound like that cliche, we're going to see a big goal scored like that. If that's an overtime to eliminate a team in the Stanley Cup playoffs, what are we doing? Because I saw, yeah. I didn't know.

Yeah. I mean, it's, and we, the worst part is we are no longer in the age where we don't have instant replay guys. They look at these things. And somehow that still goes in. So is it better just to say that you can, can't direct it in. If it goes inadvertently off your skate, it's a goal. But as soon as you move your foot in any way, shape, or form, it can't be a goal. I mean, wasn't that how the rule

used to be written before they changed it a couple years ago? I'm honestly not sure. I think that's how it was. And then they, I guess, to allow more goals, I mean, the league is always looking for ways to have more scoring. So I guess that's another way of having a few more goals. Chandler Stevenson can Christiana Rinaldo went into the net for game winner last night. Before we move on, Jesse Lowe's read your piece about players kind of having the world before them now

on the Seattle Cracken. And it happened four years ago and you covered this team then. Players who suddenly will pick up a role like a William Carlson that you never thought existed. Just when you're covering a team like that or you're watching a team like that,

that's got to be exciting, right? Because there are a lot of players on this this Cracken team who, I mean, I wouldn't call them household names. We've heard of a lot of the players. We've followed a lot of the players, but they're certainly not an All-Star team yet, but they could be, right? Right. I think that's what a lot of people, like the rewriting of history, people forget that the Golden Knights were, quote unquote, handed this championship contender. But after they drafted all those players, everyone thought those players sucked. It wasn't like everyone watched that draft and then said, oh, my God, I can't believe you handed him this team.

William Carlson's going to be a superstar. He was playing fourth line minutes doing pretty much. nothing in Columbus. And I've been talking to the Golden Knights players about it for this, like the last couple weeks of camp, just talking about what it was like that time period. Because in 99.9% of training camps, you come in with these are the six guys who are the top six forwards on this team. And there's a chance if I play well enough and one of them doesn't play well that I could take that spot. But they come in with the spot and that they have to lose or that you have to gain. Whereas when it's a brand new team, it's just an empty whiteboard. and guys are being shifted all around.

And it's not just the preseason. That's kind of what I was focused on is these Seattle players are fighting for this for like the first half of this season. William Carlson did not start on the Golden Knights first line on opening night in Dallas four years ago. It was Cody Eakin was the number one center. And he and Jonathan Marshall, so and Riley Smith, who have now played together for four years. They didn't play together, I think, until the eighth game of the season. And Riley Smith even mentioned, he's like, I think the, the, the, the, the, narrative was very much about like the revenge factor. Oh, we have chips on our shoulders.

These teams didn't want us. And while yeah, that kind of did, he thinks that more so what worked to their advantage that year was everyone on that team thought, look, I've been a bottom six guy. I've been a penalty killer that plays eight minutes a night. But on this team, we don't have enough top six guys that are locked in there. If I can be that guy, all I have to do is show it. And William Carlson's the best example. But there are plenty of others I showed in the story. All five of their top defensemen, their minutes went skyrocketed from what they were on their previous team. Nate Schmidt was a bottom-paring guy in Washington who was kind of in the rotation. Suddenly, he was their number one defenseman. Braden McNabb wasn't sure if he was going to be

on the team out of camp, and he played the number one pair for three straight seasons. So I don't know who it's going to be for Seattle. I think Morgan Geeky's a guy who had a hell of a shot last night. He's a young kid. He's playing on their third line. Would it surprise me if he's a regular top six player, not at all. So I think, for me at least, just getting to see it happen here in Vegas, I'm excited to watch these Seattle players and there are going to be a couple of them. Maybe not a William Carlson that scores 43 goals. That was insane. But there are going to be some players on that team that are not the player you thought they were on their last team. And it's all just opportunity. Anyways, here's Wonderwall. No, I'm just kidding. But geeky,

people forget that he scored two goals on his first two shots. Like he is actually pretty confident and he could do that, I believe. It's interesting how the narrative has changed joining an expansion team. You remember when the Ottawa's and the San Jose's and came in, nobody wanted to be picked in that expansion draft because you knew you were going to lose for multiple seasons. And Vegas really did change all that. Yes, were they given more advantages than those previous teams?

Of course they were. but at least it's given players maybe a different attitude towards I can go there, get a fresh start. As you mentioned, my minutes will go up. I can prove what I've done as opposed to I'm going to go there and win six games all season. So I think it's done a good thing. And obviously in building a market, they don't want that anymore. They don't want the 12 win teams anymore because it's impossible to build a market when you say, hey, come watch this new hockey team.

They're going to get their butts kicked every single night. I know. Pete DeBoer mentioned that the other day. He's like, you have to give these markets competitive teams if you want to build the fan base. And like saying it now, it seems so obvious. Like, obviously that's the case. But forever, we did it the other way in every sport. I have no idea how to transition to this next topic. Nathan McKinnon has COVID-19. And I saw that and I thought, oh, geez, I made the face that you both made. Oh, geez. But then I heard Joe Sackick say, you know, he's not going to play in the old. opener and possibly on Saturday. And it got me thinking about how different this world is. And we talked about this off the top, about the new normal and the, if we had had somebody test positive for COVID-19 just, you know, months ago, the quarantining, the, you know, the shutdown.

You look at what happened with Vancouver last year. And when that just kind of ravaged their entire team, how surprised are yet how we deal with with COVID-19? Sarah, maybe we'll start with you because to me it just seemed hilarious. like, oh, yeah, almost as if lower body injury, he's day to day. You know what? He's going to miss the season opener, possibly for Saturday. And we're talking about a very serious virus.

Yeah, no, well, remember in the bubble when nobody got COVID because everybody followed the rules, it's kind of the same thing here now with this can be a model for what life could be like if everybody got vaccinated. You know what I mean? Like, okay, yes, this is a serious virus, but it's a very, very, very low chance it's going to kill you if you're vaccinated. And now that all these teams are vaccinated, except for NHL players, it kind of can proceed more normally than the year before.

And then the next year, maybe completely normally, right? Like, this is how we progress. So kudos to McKinnon and everybody for getting vaccinated and moving this along. I think we saw it last night with Seattle, too. I mean, they woke up that morning thinking they were going to have five guys missing. And then suddenly they were all playing. And we were just like, all right, cool. Let's go.

Let them in. Yeah, it would have caused such panic in the past. Now, it is Nathan McKinnon. So anytime something like that happens, you kind of go, okay. But the Joe Sackett quote just made me just laugh and how far this virus and the treatment of it has come over the last year. Stocknik Suzuki, inked an eight-year, $63 million contract with the Montreal Canadians. Before we even get into what I wanted to talk about, which is his quote that really, really made me laugh. How important is it now, just teams getting this done before?

we get into situations like Brady Kuchuk or, you know, or, well, really any, like any RFA that is going to cause a bit of a delay in getting back. How important is it? You know what? Let's get this done even with that last year of the entry level contract. Sarah? Well, first of all, I'm all for to some extent players kind of sitting out and getting their money.

Like in this flat cap era that hasn't been great, especially for the NHL, I feel like it's important to get your money while you're still playing. But with that said, it's also important to get to training camp and work something out. So I feel like owners should be kind of more realistic and stop mobileing so much. Maybe I know that billionaires aren't going to take my money advice. But like I do think in the era of, I guess we're off-sheeting each other and getting revenge and everything like that, it is super important to get these things done, especially as a vote of confidence. Like it's a new age, not that people are soft.

I'll never say that like players are soft. But at the same time, like, it just works better when there's total confidence in the player and like a money incentive and things like that. What Sarah's trying to say is it's a good thing Montreal locked him up before Carolina offer sheets in. In conclusion, because they got Ryan Suzuki. And Ryan Suzuki signed his ELC a few years ago. And I was talking to him about it. I'm like, what's the first thing you're going to buy?

And he was like, Christmas presents for my family. So I guess Nick's got to get him back now. Yeah. And now the whole thing in the NHL now is getting the brothers on the same team, right? So, so, yeah. Luckily, Montreal locked up Nick Suzuki before Carolina could offer shoot him. It's so funny, too, in the age of keeping very, very close tabs on who's making what, when they do sign that extension and still have one year left on that entry level contract,

this year he's making $832,000, which trust me, none of us would sneeze at. But next year, that jumps up to $10 million. Like, his paychecks this year must almost hurt. You know what I mean? Like, almost like, can we just lump it in now? Can I get it now? Because that is, you know, your paychecks are going to go up 10 times next year. I'll be honest.

When the news came out and then, you know, Montreal announced we were going to have a press conference, I was busy doing something else with work. And I said, oh, I'm going to watch that later. I jump on Twitter. And I see this quote from Suzuki. And I'm just going to read it the way I read it on Twitter. And this is sometimes the problem with social media. Quote, I was just saying to my brother, it was like I was playing NH20.

and I could just give myself whatever contract. Yeah, Sarah is laughing because that's the way I read it. I read it as Mark Bergeman was just going to open up his checkbook. And whatever I wanted, the guy was going to give it to me. Isn't that? I'm not worth this much. Give it to me. And then I watched the presser.

It sounded very, very different. You two are both very active on Twitter. Have you ever done that? Or are you afraid sometimes that like it's kind of like reading an email from somebody. who just says, hey, good morning. But if you don't like that person, it sounds like, hey, good morning. You just don't even know the connotation. But yesterday, I remember thinking, is he taking a shot at Bershomint?

And then I listened to it as basically a kid who's just happy because of all the zeros he's going to have on his paycheck. It's just safe to say, like, nobody's taking a shot at anybody through a media press conference. Like, usually that's the case. Sometimes it isn't, but like especially a younger kid. And I know the Suzuki's kind of at this point, like covering Ryan. And they're just a very humble family. So while knowing them kind of, like, listening to that, it's like, okay, because they are humble and they, like, don't use their money all in one place, that it kind of sounded like the world is his oyster.

But, oh, my God, I kind of wish I could go back to the days, not that I ever was in those days of when Twitter didn't exist when people were reporting, so I could just use the full quote with context. And I love that we can do that at the athletic, but it's just kind of like, I get why players are kind of shorter with us sometimes because they're going to end up on Twitter and there's going to be some outweigh. about some stupid thing they didn't even mean. So to be clear, I didn't, I didn't think that he was taking a shot. I think it was more the way I read almost inadvertent. Like he said something, you know when you say something and you go, ooh, could they have taken that badly? I mean, did you see the quote Jesse or did you actually hear it for the first time?

No, no, no, I read it on Twitter and I thought the same thing as you. But I also, like Sarah said, I know Nick. I covered him for two development camps here in Vegas before they traded him for Max Petruetti to Montreal. So I got to know him and I know Nick and I know he. he wouldn't be taking a shot at the GM that just signed him to this deal. It did come across that way. When I read it, I laughed.

I was like, that doesn't sound great for Mark Bergevin. But yeah, Twitter, it's easy for quotes to be misinterpreted on Twitter. I know just covering the Golden Knights and all of the Pete DeBoer drama and this fan base was not a huge fan of Pete DeBore when they first hired him. I remember like every quote I would tweet out from Pete DeBore. The fans would be like, oh, he's saying this. And it's like, no, no, no, no, no. Let me give you the context. He was just joking.

it's funny. So yes, it's definitely aware of the Twitter misrepresentation of quotes. It's difficult out there. It's gone online because, you know, it used to be in newspapers the headline. People would read a headline and think that's the whole story and not read the whole story. Now it's turned into Twitter and I fell for it. I shouldn't fall for this stuff, guys. I shouldn't. I've been doing this long enough to know that, but I just remember thinking, well, maybe it was just kind of talking and said it and then thought, oh, and then I have listened to it. You know what? If my paycheck was going to go up like 10 times, I'd be pretty excited about it as well.

We all love a little bit of drama, Rob. It's okay. It gives us stuff to talk about. That's what we get paid to do is talk about drama. Speaking of drama, the Washington Capitol is going to open up their season tonight against the New York Rangers. Dun, done, done. And we're going to speak to Tarik, Elbashir from the Athletic D.

and now a contributor to TNT's hockey coverage. We'll talk a little bit about that as well. Last year, the Washington Capitals and the New York Rangers became Must-C-TV. Some people think for all the right reasons. Some people think for all the wrong reasons. And now they get to open up the season against each other. And Tark, Ophashir is going to be covering it for the Athletic D.C. And also now a contributor for TNT's hockey coverage.

Tark, thanks for doing this. Thanks for having me on. What are we expecting tonight? I'm just going to ask. Are we expecting any kind of fireworks? You know, it's funny. You listen to what the Rangers are saying, and yeah, there's some potential for fireworks. And then you listen to what the capitals are saying, and they don't really want to get dragged into all that stuff.

I mean, it's almost like, I feel like today the vibe, the message was, hey, if they want to start something, you know, we're game, but that's not what we're about. We're trying to get two points. It should also be noted that Gary Bettman, the commissioner, is going to be in the house. tonight. Now, he typically makes his tour, especially of cities that are close to New York, early in the season to talk to media and just kind of schmooze with owners and whatnot. But there have been times in the past, I've covered this league since the late 90s where he would occasionally pop up if there was the potential for something going sideways. And I don't think it's by any accident that he's going to be in the building tonight.

You feel like the discrepancy of kind of like the ranger saying one thing and the cap saying and the other thing has to do with kind of the age differences of the team at all? I think it also has something to do with what happened last year, right? I mean, the capals got the better of them, you know, a couple of times. And I think, you know, it's, they spent a lot of their offseason retooling and kind of, you know, getting a little tougher. So when they face the capitals or the islanders or teams that push them around in recent years, they'd be able to handle it.

And so when you spend that kind of money and you spend that kind of energy, you know, revamping your roster, I think, you know, a guy like Ryan Reeves, he wants to show that he got paid to do a job, right? Tom Wilson's like, I'm on the first line. I play on the power play in the penalty deal. I don't have time for you.

You're a fourth liner. I mean, he didn't say that, but I'm sure that's what he's thinking. I mean, you know, anytime a guy who plays 19, 20 minutes a night gets into a fight with someone who plays nine minutes a night, the team that's losing their first line player is losing that tradeoff. And so Wilson has to be aware of that, and he is aware of that. So I think the discrepancy has dates back to last year, and just what happened over the summer.

You know, I've known Tom since he was a rookie. And, you know, just listening to him this morning, you know, he wasn't rolling his eyes, but he's kind of over this. He kind of just wants to get through this night. At the same time, also having known him for a long time, a willing combatant. You know, he's a co-owner of a boxing gym. He loves this stuff. You want to go. He's, he will happily engage. And that's where if you're Coach Peter Lobulet, you probably got to pull him inside and go, listen, you know, we're not going to be as dominant as we were last year. We're going to need every point we can get. Let's not put ourselves at a disadvantage by having you spend 20 minutes in the penalty box tonight. And he's going to go, yeah, coach. And then we'll see what happens. That's what I was going to ask you. It was like, what do you think Tom is going to do when?

Because covering Ryan Reeves, I know for sure he's going to engage. Like you said, when I saw the Tom Wilson quote and I heard him saying, I'm here to score goals, I'm here to win games. And it's like, yeah, but Ryan Reeves is only here for one thing. Like, he's not here to score goals. They traded for him and then they signed him to an extension for literally one thing. It's all he does. And he's going to try to do that job. Yeah.

So that's where I'm curious. to see tonight if Wilson does engage him right off the bat. And so, again, having known Tom for a long time, there's kind of this inner struggle, right? I mean, he's developed into this 20 goal score, and he has a outsized impact on games because of, you know, he's a six foot four, 220-pound guy who gets around the rink better than anyone at that size. You know, he opens space for his linemates, one of whom is Alex Obechka and the other is, Evgeny Kuznetsov. He's got a huge role on this team. But he likes this stuff too, right?

So that's going to be a part of them. You know, it's like the angel on one shoulder and the devil on the other. It's going to be who does he give into? I think at 27, he's probably a little more well equipped to kind of sort through those feelings. I think if Reeves just follows him around for a shift and let's go, let's go, let's go. I think he engages. You know, what I'm also curious about, Jess, he is going to be, you know, the other guys. Like, is Jared Tenority going to want to go with Garnet Hathaway?

Is this going to turn into a line brawl situation like we saw last year? Something tells me it's not. I mean, how many times have we covered something and was overhyped and everyone's paying attention and then it's just a dud, right? It's just, there was one fight. Two punches are thrown. The line's been jumped in and it was a three, two, captain. You know, I could see it easily unfold that way too.

Sometimes, yeah, that's what diffuses it, right? That's what diffuses it when it happens early on. but it wasn't a dud last year with these two teams on after. I'll tell you this, guys, I'll tell you this. Like, I feel like it's already settled, right? They've already had the crazy fight-filled game. To do it now is more for show. Getting back to what Jesse was saying, you know,

Reeves was signed for, you know, for one reason. And he wants to show that, you know, this is what I bring to the table and this is what I do. I'm a deterrent. You know, I will keep big, bad, mean guys like Tom Wilson from, running rough shot over our team. So he's going to want to send a message tonight. So I think there is going to be at least one scrap.

I just, something tells me, and this goes back to what Sarah was saying, so something tells me that this is not going to be fight night in D.C. I remember when the Golden Knights first traded for Ryan Reeves from the Pittsburgh Penguins in the inaugural season. And his first game as a Golden Knight, he got in a fight and he was hitting everyone. It was like over the top, even for Ryan Reeves. And I remember, like, talking to him like a year after it, and he's like, yeah, like, I needed to cool it down. But, like, I felt like that's what they brought me in here for.

So I had to show. So, like, that's stuck in my head right now. And then the fact that this is even more, like, the Golden Knights didn't have this rivalry or any dramatics like that. So I. It takes a special guy that likes getting punched in the head. That's what I would say. You know what I mean? Like, you mentioned Wilson, like, he lives for this stuff.

We've all known people like that who actively enjoy not necessarily even. punching, but getting punched in the head and they make millions of dollars doing it. And when I see Ryan Reeves and when I see Tom Wilson, sometimes I think, yeah, they fall in that category. Yeah, I do think he enjoys that side of the game. You know, I've asked him in the past, you know, about fighting kind of being, I don't say legislated out of the game, but it certainly isn't the game we grew up watching, right? There are definitely fewer fighters.

They're fewer enforcers. And I've asked him about that. And, you know, he's intimated in the past. And he's kind of sad to see that go at part of the game. You know, he thinks there's a place for it. And I think he understands kind of his role within that place. That said, he's just, he's a different player now than he was before. And you look at this roster, it's not quite as deep as it was in past years.

Nicholas Baxter is going to be out tonight. You know, Tom Wilson is hurting his team if he's sitting in the penalty box for for extended amounts of time for a couple of reasons. He's on the second power play unit. He's on the first line. He's also one of their best penalty killers. So when the guy who's one of your best penalty killers is sitting in the box, it's a double whammy, right?

So he's got to be aware of that as well. Something tells me, as I've repeated here a couple of times, this is going to be a lot of hype followed by maybe a couple of scraps and mostly normal hockey game. So you mentioned backstrom's out. I know everyone's looking at the grade eight. I listen to his press conference after the morning skate, and I love how he joked it.

Oh, yeah, I hurt my pinky. Game time decision. I mean, is this just a precaution you think with Ovi? So look, I've covered Ovi every day of his NHL career since his rookie year. And when he goes through a practice the day before, coming off, you know, before a game after coming off injury, and then goes through the morning skate a hundred times out of a hundred. playing in that game.

I mean, just imagine he just took all these reps from rookie Connor McMichael, who would have been his replacement. He's played one game. And then he gets to the game and goes, ah, you know what? I'm going to pull the shoot here. You're in, kid. I mean, he's not going to do that. Not to mention, it's against the Rangers. It's opening night in D.C.

In front of a full building for the first time. And he loved, I mean, I can't tell you how crushing it was for him to play in empty and, you know, buildings that were sparsely filled. I mean, he's a showman to the nth degree. He loves, he lives for playing in front of these big full buildings. And he knows this is on national TV. And he knows that the Rangers have put the spotlight on this game. So I can, I can't really afford to bet my mortgage, but I will bet my mortgage that he will be in the lineup. That's an interesting way, you're betting the mortgage.

You mentioned that he's a showman. yesterday that commercial with him and backstroke um i want it's the it might be the first time ever that i watched a commercial with two hockey players and physically laughed out loud i mean i know that ovi's always been a kind of a fun loving guy but that was usually hockey commercials are so cheesy and chintzy they're wearing their jerseys they're doing something ridiculous that was just it was oscar worthy acting i'll say it Oscar worthy acting from Ovi and everyone involved, but I mean, that made its round spirit pretty quick. Are you surprised that he did a job of him and Baxter, man, of course, Ovi's wife?

So Ovi has a really good sense of humor. I mean, he's definitely more reserved now than he was in his first two or three years. I think when he put himself out there and was dancing in commercials and giving all those crazy quotes, Russian machine never break and all those things. He's not like that anymore. But that personality is still there. he just doesn't show it publicly anymore. So the fact that he got out there and agreed to do this,

and I talked to him about it this morning, he enjoyed it. I said, who screwed up their lines the most? He said, oh, by me, me by far. You know, his wife is kind of a model actress anyway. So I thought she kind of stole the show a little bit, kind of overshadowed the two players a little bit. But, you know, getting back to what you said, this is what the NHL needs to market itself,

not those cheese commercials where guys are, wearing their jerseys and, you know, their, you know, forcing smiles. And like, that was a good, funny commercial. And, you know, I showed it to my wife who couldn't care anything about sports. She's, you know, does, she is aware of who Alex Oveldefat and Nicholas back. And she laughed. I mean, like, she laughed. He was like, that was great.

That was really funny. The league needs to, needs to seek out guys who are willing to put themselves out there and do more of that. and take the silly jerseys off of these commercials and, you know, do it kind of NBA style a little bit. And I think that'll go a long way. Yeah, speaking of that, kind of the ushering in of ESPN and T&T, and you get to be a part of that. What has that been like? Fun, fun. So my first and only assignment to this point, so I'm a contributor.

I'm not a full-time staffer. So, you know, the athletic is still my primary job. So I can't do everything that they want me to do. Like, for example, you know, they probably would have rather me be somewhere else tonight. But, I mean, I can't miss this game for my primary employer. But my first assignment was about a week ago. I did Golden Knights and Kings in Salt Lake City. And that was a blast.

It was a lot of fun. So, you know, I'm a writer who can do a little TV, right? So they had to kind of talk me through a few things. but I love the challenge. And once that light goes on, I've always just been kind of comfortable doing it. You know, I need more reps probably to get really, really comfortable doing it.

But it's a lot of fun. You know, it's just telling stories in a different way, as opposed to, you know, using your words and, you know, throwing some alliteration in there and trying to, you know, paint a picture with words. You're doing it with your, you know, with your mouth, right? I mean, you're telling it a different. way. So I hope what I bring to the table in the long run to TNT is just being able to kind of

tell some stories. I was using a sideline reporter role in that first game, which is fine. I'm totally cool with that. But I hope, you know, as kind of everyone settles into what they do best, I get to do some sit down interviews and, you know, some packages where I get to interview players, whether it's the Capitals or, you know, some other team around the league. All I do is watch hockey, so I'm good on. You know, I literally don't watch Netflix or anything. Once the season begins, I probably watch three games a night. So I'm hoping that I can just kind of bring a little bit different,

a little bit of a different flavor and angle, and, you know, bring my personality to the camera and just have a lot of fun with it. We've talked a lot about the league becoming big time and like the commercial, doing things like the NBA. Just the entire ESPN and TNT broadcast so far have really felt like they're helping that along. I guess as part of it, what has what has impressed you the most, surprised you the most? What have you enjoyed the most about what ESPN and Turner are doing with this new rights deal? So it's just they're doing things that NBC didn't.

And I worked for NBC for a long time. So I have nothing really bad to say about them that they were just more of a, they took them more of a traditional tact to telling the game. stories of hockey. And let's be honest, hockey can be a kind of stuffy and stayed sport. You know, I feel like for it to take that next level, it's got to grow. They got to stop saying now he's not available today and going out, you know what, he's a rookie. Put him, put him on camera. You just got to start letting these guys be themselves and let them, let these players kind of show their personality a little more. You know, I think I was reading about one team that's,

you know, you don't have to wear a gray suit with a gray tie to games anymore. Like, they're going to start letting guys, you know, for their arrival shots, wear whatever they wanted to. I forget which team it was. Coyotes. Yeah, I was going to say Arizona. Thank you, Sarah. Thank you. And so, actually, that's the one team I never see on TV. So I wouldn't know. But, you know, we need more of that. And so what I've seen, you know, watching both games on ESPN last night, I love the fact that they're taking some risks. You know, ESPN used a different type of camera, you know. It would,

was weird at first. I was like, whoa, I'm disoriented. Why am I so alive? I feel like you're in a press box. And then I was like, you know what? Okay, give it a try. I kind of like this. You're seeing three quarters of the ice as opposed to being, you know, tightly zoomed in on where the puck is. I kind of like being able to see the play develop. Um, TNT is going to bring the same energy. They're going to, they're going to do things differently. I, I've, I've seen some of the stuff they've done with drones. I mean, some of the, some of the, some of the, the, the, the rejoins and other things you're going to be like, whoa, that was awesome. So the fact that, you know, they're willing to take some risk, both ESPN and T&T,

I think that's going to kind of push this sport forward. And, you know, and this isn't a shot at NBC, but I mean, look, we all travel. Some hotels still don't even have NBC Sports Network. I mean, I can't tell you sometimes I checked into a hotel either for one of my assignments or one of my sons travel hockey games, and I'm like, oh, big game tonight. Oh, they don't have it. Well, everyone has T&T or ESPN, right?

And there's going to be more cross-pollination and cross-promotion. You know, Greg Woshenki from ESPN, like, literally just left here a minute ago. So, you know, there's going to be more writers and more people on TV. And there's going to be more exposure for the sport. And I think that's what this is. great game needs to kind of, you know, get it out of that number four spot, number five spot that's kind of been stuck in for decades. I mean, this is, to me, this is like auto racing a little like once you take someone to a hockey game, they're hooked, right? Once someone watches a hockey

game and really gets into it, they're hooked. You just got to get them to see it. And, you know, as a media consumer that probably watches way too much sports television on a daily basis, like ESPN was talking about that night's slate from four o'clock on. I don't know if they're going to do that. Yeah. I thought I was in Canada. I turned on SportsCenter. There was hockey on.

I saw you tweet that and that was an excellent point. It was like when you check into the Weston and Toronto when you turn the TV on at 3 o'clock, and they're talking about last night's, you know, Coyotes, Winnipeg Jets game. And you're like, oh, that guy's still in the Coyotes. Wow. Forgot. Nobody. That's the kind of coverage.

I think you're going to get, right? I mean, you know, T&T kind of made its bones with, you know, NBA coverage. And I think they're going to bring some of that risk-taking and storytelling to their hockey coverage. I think fans are going to be the better for it. And I think it's going to bring in some more casual folks. You poor bastards, what do you watch at 3 o'clock if you're not watching Arizona, Winnipeg highlights? I mean, I feel like you guys are just deprived. I'm here in Toronto.

I'm going to like, yeah, this is exactly what we do every single day. Kiole's fans, we love you. I feel like I've kind of taken a crap on them twice, and that was not intentional. Like their new look, it's kind of neat. You know, I actually, I kind of want to get to the get out west. I haven't traveled in a year and a half. I'm looking forward to my trip to Glendale, which is not something else. I also love the risk taking.

And I know Down Goes Brown was talking about this with you and Mendez, about, you know, if you're a hardcore hockey fan or you're in the media and you, been watching hockey for a long time. Don't be so quick to just jump on. I don't like that. I don't like that. That's not the way I've always watched my hockey. I saw a lot of that last night on Twitter too.

You're going to. You're going to. But the other thing I want to ask you about, and this is something I've been, you know, beating the drum about for a long time. And a lot of these people are my friends. So I'm not slamming anyone the same way you're not slamming NBC. Hockey's always had, when it comes to analysts,

more times than not, they were hard-nosed role players. And last night, I watched Mark Messier, Chris Chelyos, and tonight I'm going to watch the greatest hockey player in the history of the game analyzed. Whether or not they're going to be a hardcore analyst, I know Wayne Gradsky's publicly said, I told TNT, I'm not going to go on TV and slam players, so if that's what you want, don't hire me. I want to hear the best to ever do it break things down. And even if that's in a storytelling way, I want to hear that. How excited are you to be on a crew, and I know you mention your contributor, but how excited are you to be on a crew with Wayne Friggin' Griskey?

It's really cool. So early on in my career, I worked for the New York Times back in the late 90s, and I was like second or third on the Rangers beat. So every once in a while, I got to cover practice. And growing up, I played the game. I've loved the game since I was a little boy. And every once in a while, and look, there's a handful of athletes I can say that every time they walk by, you just go, that was Tiger Woods. That was Wayne Gretzky. And so I would go to their Rye practice facility because Joe Lappoint, who was the beatwriter, needed a day off. And I had to write 600 words on, you know, whatever was the story of the day.

And he'd walk by and it'd be like, that was Wayne Gretzky. That was Mark Messier. Like, what is going on? This is the coolest thing ever, right? So being on, you know, calling him a teammate, you know, it's really cool. I was on an internal conference call the other day, and he was just sharing stories. And it was just like, and then what happened? Really?

That's crazy. You know, so that's what I think people are going to get from Wayne. Like you said, and he said it. You know, he's not going to be publicly critiquing guys for, you know, missing assignments or, you know, dogging it on the back check. That's not what he's here for. And we saw that last night. We saw that last night with Bessie.

At one point, Barry Melrose kind of said, is there he Peter Kutrov playing today? And he said, oh, I like Kutrov. I'm not going to say anything bad about him. And I thought, okay, well, maybe not as a studio analyst, but I want to hear Mark Messier stories or like you said, Wayne Gretzky stories. Have Wayne tell us like Grandpa Wayne, what happened in 1985?

That's what I want to hear. Yes, 100%. So my son played, I'm actually sitting in a rink where my son used to play a long time ago. Mark Messier's son was his coach. And so every once in my mom, I would end up at the bar at a hotel, you know, on a road trip. And he would tell me stories about his dad. So the stories are what are going, is what I think are going to draw people to the TV to watch Wayne Gretzky.

And look, this year for a guy I've covered for a long time, Alex Ovechkin, this is a big year. He could pass with 37 goals. He could pass Marcel Dion, Brett Hall, and then Yarm Riyahar. And he'll be third place all alone. And then it's going to be a long time before he catches Gordy Howe, right? So this year could be a big year for him. And to have the guy that he's pursuing kind of break things down and tell story. I mean, if you're a hockey fan, especially if you're a Caps fan,

how can you not tune in to listen to what he's got to say, right? Absolutely. Tarc, thanks so much for doing this. Of course. Looking forward to see if tonight is, like you said, we get all excited about it, or it's an absolute done, one of those two. And really looking forward to watching you on TNT. So congrats on that.

Thanks so much for doing. We'll talk to you soon. Anytime, guys. See ya. Okay, guys, before we go, Sarah, I was reading your piece on The Athletic. And one thing kind of jumped out to me, and it's so crazy. We've talked a lot about this pandemic. And you talked about worrying about getting face-to-face with these players again.

And it's funny how something we've done for so long you're so comfortable with. And suddenly it's like, oh, my God. are these players going to give us the old pucks in deep? Are they going to give us the old clichés? We're so used to. And I wanted to ask both of you because you both are covering one team. Would you rather have the virtual, were they better virtually? It's basically what I'm trying to ask.

Or do you think it's better face-to-face? Do you get more what you need face-to-face? Yeah, absolutely not better virtually. And I know there's a lot of fans that just don't kind of understand why that is. I get that and I get that. Like, I like that, like, they like that they have access to kind of see exactly what was said, but they don't know where we're going with questions sometimes. Like, I've asked repetitive questions for like a while.

Sometimes some people are tweeting at me, like, why are you doing this? Like, we get it. And then it all comes together in a story. And then there's a lot that goes into these day-to-day interactions when you're just walking around, like, and you know the tone, you know how that guy's feeling that day, like, and he might say something, like, as a one-off question or whatever. like and I was kind of nervous to get back to that to be honest just because I didn't know like I don't know so much has changed it's been a year and a half since I've seen these people there's so

many new faces on the canes but I like walk into training camp and aha like throws a puck and waves at me I'm like all right that's fine and then he was kind of nervous to do our first interview too he's kind of like wait should I sit down like what's what's the deal I'm like all right it's going to be fine and we just all need to get our reps back in I think but um it's so much better in person just to kind of catch a and maybe like, I wrote a story that was kind of like I had people do a poll to see like who was going to be the breakout player, like their teammate. And it's one of those things where when it all comes together, it reminded me of something I used to write and the comments were all like, oh, wow, you seem like yourself again,

like with your writing. And I'm like, this is because I'm doing face to face things. And you don't really understand how that works, but it's just a better product. And it's a better, like, if you write something critical about a player, I forget, who told me this, but the main advice was always show up the next day. And you can't really do that on Zoom. So it's like you never get to repair that relationship. Yeah, I completely agree with Sarah on all of that. It's so much better in person. One, you get follow-up questions. Like I don't know how it's probably different for every team, but it was so frustrating for me on Zoom asking a question and then

you're immediately muted. And even if the player doesn't understand the question, like the communication staff explains what you were asking, that part is bad. And then also like, I like to ask a lot of questions that don't need to be broadcast on Zoom. Like, I'll go up to Paul Stasney. Game ends. I'll go up to Paul Stasney and I'll say, look, Paul, who was supposed to have that guy? He was wide open on the back door? What, like, was it, was it you? Was it the defenseman? And I'm not going to put this quote in the story. I'm trying to understand what's happening with the team better. It's helping me understand the game. So those questions are completely gone because the guy would never answer that question on video knowing it's going to be tweeted out.

When they answer those questions to me in person, they know it's not being put out there. I'm not putting them on blast. So, like, you get, you get a lot more in person. And, and also just, it's nice to talk to people like human beings and not just have. And it, like, it's not only that. Like, as you guys know, the art of interviewing somebody or getting the quote you need sometimes means you have to ask those three throwaway questions to loosen them up. And you don't get that. And I've heard those press conferences you're talking about, Jesse, where someone asks a question, the player clearly didn't understand what the heck they were saying.

And then they're like, okay, your next question is. from Chris Johnston. You're like, well, wait a minute. What happened to that question? But I will say this, it's interesting because both of you, a huge part of your job is cultivating relationships with the players. And like you said, Sarah, you know, Sebastian Hau's all of a sudden throwing you puck. A lot of what I've done during the pandemic has been a little more feature-type things.

And I found it's been the complete opposite. I've talked to players on a 45-minute Zoom call one-on-one, and they forget that they're talking to a reporter at times. And all of a sudden they go, oh, don't put that in there. Please don't put that in there. You know, they get so comfortable. So it's kind of different when you're talking about features versus following a team. You're in kind of a mecca of hockey.

And I think it's kind of different in that way. And I feel like it's so interesting to see like market to market what people are doing and how that's possible. But I could definitely see that. And stories I've done, like I did a story where I kind of interviewed a lot of Keynes on the 06 team. And that was amazing, not even face to face. because it was just different. But I feel like the players these days in Carolina, it's easier to just kind of have a casual relationship with them.

I will say the one benefit of the virtual is I was able to see other teams' press conferences. Like it was nice in the playoffs when the Golden Knights are playing the Avalanche. I can just turn on Jared Bednar's press conference and ask him a question if I want. Like that part of it was cool. But 99% of the, I'd rather do it in person. Yeah. And it's funny because, and really the other thing is you've got your place. where there's no almost battling, like we've all been in that scrum where you just want to get something in there and everybody's, and then the player walks away and you think I didn't get, once you got your place, you got your place.

But I can see that Sarah's a lot more, enjoying it a lot more, even though there was a little apprehension, a little, you're enjoying the face-to-face. Yeah, I'll tell a story about that quickly. One time during the playoffs, when people actually started coming to report on the hurricanes, somebody was interviewing a certain player and he just kind of gave. gave him one word answers, and then he comes up to me and goes, who was that guy? So it's like, it's funny their relationships in Carolina. It's more like they respect you for showing up. And then when you're on Zoom, you're just kind of like one random person. But that's just not the case at all in somewhere like Toronto or Montreal.

Yeah, we get to watch a lot of hockey here. You're right. Guys, it's been a fun for a show. We're going to do this each and every week. And Sarah's going to tell us a different story about the differences between the Canadian and American hockey media. So many stories, guys. I'm just waiting to unleash.

Thanks so much, guys. And we've got a lot more coming up. Don't forget, NHL Deputy Commissioner Bill Daley, is going to join Craig Custins and Sean Gentilly on the Athletic Hockey Show of the Americans this week at the Athletic. So be sure to tune into that. Thanks so much for listening. This was episode one of the Wednesday roundtable of the Athletic Hockey Show.

Give us a follow on your favorite podcast platform. Don't forget a rating and a review. It really helps. And subscribe to the Athletic Audio Plus on Apple Podcast to get all the bonus content from the entire network. You start with a 30-day free trial, and then it's 99 cents a month after that right now. Annual subscriptions at the Athletic are 50% off when you visit theathletic.com slash hockey show. The Athletic Hockey Show continues Thursday with Ian Mendez, and down goes round.

I am Rapizo. Sarah, for Jesse. Thanks so much. Talk to you next week.