The Athletic Hockey Show - The always elite Sidney Crosby like a fine wine, Tage Thompson leading Kevin Adams' Buffalo Sabres back to respectability, Connor McDavid putting up Gretzky/Lemieux numbers

Episode Date: December 21, 2022

Rob, Jesse and Russo praise Sidney Crosby who hasn't let age affect his play as the former 'kid' is 8th in NHL scoring, Carolina Hurricanes goalie Pyotr Kochetkov who has led the Canes to a 10-0-2 record in their past 12 games and Connor McDavid who is putting up Gretzky/Lemieux type numbers.Mike had a chance to sit down with Tage Thompson and Kevyn Adams from the Buffalo Sabres about the Sabres continued development and Tage's massive start to the season which sees him third in NHL scoring.Plus we address the aggressive manner in which NHL linesmen Dan Kelly removed Michael Bunting off the ice in Toronto, Cale Makar's honest plea to the refs in the Colorado / Islanders game, John Tortorella benching Kevin Hayes and a lot more on the final roundtable ahead of the Christmas break. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic hockey show. What's going on, everybody, and happy holidays. Welcome to another athletic hockey show, a Wednesday roundtable edition, the first one. Before we all start tipping back the eggnog. I am Rob Pizzo from CBC Sports, joined as always by Jesse Granger, who is in Vegas. How are you, Jesse?

I'm doing well. And Rousseau, who is just enjoying the sunshine in Anaheim, You both are just loving the hot weather while I'm sitting here awaiting a massive storm to hit the Toronto area. So, so thanks for rubbing it in, Russell. Yeah, it's a brisk about 58 degrees right now, which, you know, this time of year feels about about 95. I would feel bad. Every time I see Jeremy Rutherford on the West Coast doing a podcast, he always is doing it on his patio with some palm trees behind them. So I figured I'd do the same thing.

Yeah, just just rub it in for all of us. So I appreciate it, but I hate you at the same time. Lots of stuff to get through. And, you know, we got stuff from last night. We got stuff from the week as we always do. And I do want to mention a couple of guests that are coming up in segment number two. It's the Buffalo edition of segment number two, Kevin Adams, the general manager, the Buffalo Sabres, and the Beast, Tage Thompson. They're not going to be coming on live.

You actually got a chance to chat with them, Russo. And we're going to be playing that tape. and just, just, just, I love listening to Kevin Adams talk. He's just such a great interview, isn't he? Yeah, I covered him in Florida, so I've always had a good rapport with him. And, yeah, it's a, Savers fans will like this. We touch on basically a lot of his playing career, but obviously his managerial style, the future of the Savers, not skipping processes.

And then the perfect timing to do this podcast with Tage Thompson, just absolutely on fire. Second star of the week, you know, just second leading goal score. league third leading point getter has been the second leading score in the league right behind Connor McDavid since the end of October. So yeah, I got a chance to catch up with both of them the other day and it'll be a fun couple interviews with them. I did it from inside Mullet Arena, which was a treat to finally be in there. We could talk a little bit more about that later. All right. We'll get to those in segment number two. So let's get some of the things that happened last night, guys. It was a busy night as it usually is on Tuesday night. Streaks were

extended, streaks were ending, so let's start there. Penguins. They snapped the Rangers winning streak at 7 with a 3-2 win, getting a little bit of revenge from that playoff run. It was the first time they face them since that playoff series. Not only that, I mean, Sydney Crosby, goal and assist, guys. I know we talk a lot about OV and the ageless wonder and what he's doing, but are we not talking about Sidney Crosby enough and what he's doing? He's now eight in NHL scoring. He now has 100 points against three different teams, the Rangers, the Islanders, and the Flyers, only active player to have that. Are we just so used to seeing Sid do what Sid does that we're not impressed that even at, you know, at this stage of his career, he's still not only a good player, an elite player.

Jesse, will start with you. Yeah, I think our bar is a little too high. I agree. I think we just are, like you said, I think we're just used to him dominating 42 points already this season. That goal he scored last night was nice. the one Malkin scored, I thought was even better. But yeah, he's the, I mean, overall best player of this generation. And I think that we, I agree.

I think we have maybe gotten a little too caught up with the OV chase and all that. And we don't give Crosby nearly enough credit, especially. I didn't realize he was that high on the, on the NHL leaderboard in terms of points either. Yeah. And, you know, the other thing is like we talked so much about all the young talent in this league, justifiably so. There's just so many great, great players, but these older guys are still performing. I mean,

Patrice Bergeron is still, you know, an elite, elite player, had a huge week as well. You know, we see it at times with Malkin, obviously, Ovi. I was watching a game the other day where Kopitar looked like he was still like about, you know, 10 years ago when they were winning cups. I just think that

that sometimes we get caught up, understandably with all these young, great, great players and we kind of forget that you still have these future Hall of Famers in the game, there continue to impress. And Crosby is that guy. He's a machine every single night. He works the same way. He still has the same talent level. He is keeping himself healthy. And that team, you know, I talk to scouts all the time too. They say don't, don't sleep on the Pittsburgh Penguins. That this team is a really, really good team that could be a contender in the Eastern Conference. And a big, big reason for that is obviously Sid.

Their power play is just ridiculous right now. 13 for 35. They've scored at least one power play goal in nine straight games, longest streak since 2013. And quickly, you heard me mention that he's got 100 career points against three different teams. The NHL record is 15 teams. That's Wayne Gretzky. He has 100 points against 15 different damn teams. Every time I bring up a Gretzky record, it's just, it's a stupid record.

But yeah, Sydney Crosby is still doing it. Penguins don't sleep on them like Russo said. Another streak that got extended, the hurricanes. their point streak now at 12. They've won six in a row, longest active streak in the NHL, 10, 0, and 2 in their last 12. And I'm going to start again with you, Jesse, because, you know, you look at Peorter, Kachekhov, who I keep always stumbling when I say his name, but we'll just bring it up anyway. Another big game, 37 saves on 38 shots, his point streak at 10 games.

And he's just loving life. He's one of those goalies, one of those players just with an ear-to-ear grin every time he's in that. Yeah, he's been phenomenal. I mean, his numbers are through the roof. The hurricanes do make it easy on their goalies. So, like, sometimes I feel like the numbers aren't always telling the story. He's got a 928 save percentage, and he's 8.8 goals saved above average. But when I watched the games, he, I mean, the eye test matches the numbers.

He's been so good. And this hurricane's team, they're finally looking like what we, most of us, expected them to be in the beginning of the season. I mean, they were my pick to win the Stanley Cup at the beginning of the season. and I just loved all the veterans that they added Paul Stasney down that lineup. Max Patcheretti still obviously hasn't played, but he's going to be there eventually. They control territory so well, and I love the Brent Burns edition. I just think that they added the right type of pieces to a team that was already really good,

and it took some time to get going. They weren't great early on, but I think they finally recently started to look like that team that everyone expected. And they're just so balanced. Like they don't have a guy that's scoring every single night, Tage Thompson, Sidney Crosby, but like Martin Naches, Shvachnikov, Aho, Burns is piling up the points, Seth Jarvis. Like, they've got so many B plus, A minus level players on that team. You don't really know who to focus on. They're a really good hockey team.

What do you think, Michael? Yeah, well said. First of all, is Freddie Anderson alive? Like, what is the deal here? Like, is he ever going to be able to even play for this? team again. Like, I don't, I don't see, I don't see this goalie, uh, seizing the net anytime soon. And, um, you know, thank goodness they have them. And he is one as, you know, as Jesse just mentioned, he is one affable guy. I mean, I got to be behind the scenes with them about a month,

month and a half ago just, uh, when Carolina was in town in Minnesota and just watching him kind of learn English. Like right in front of me, they were teaching him what glove dryer meant. I mean, you know, it was just funny, funny stuff. Um, and, uh, and, uh, and, you know, him just learning English and he just seems like the happy-go-lucky guy. You know who really takes good care of him, too, is Auntie Ranta. Ante is one of the nicest guys in the league, and he's like the perfect mentor for somebody like that. And I just, I agree with you. I think Carolina is just starting to hit their peak here.

And, you know, as Jesse also alluded to, you know, Max Petruetti is skating now. This is going to be a huge pickup for them in a month, month, you know, at some point here in the next little while. and they got them for free. And while doing that in that win last night, four won over the Devils, Devils now lost five straight after that huge start for them. Yeah, did you see now, remember we're talking the other day,

Rob, about the, you know, the, we're sorry, Lindy chance now that people are saying maybe they were premature. It's just, you got to love fans, man.

They're just going to chant whatever's going on at the moment, right? I'll tell you what, you know that. You know that reporter that asked the question to Jack Hughes about being more consistent? He's like, well, we're on a nine game heater. If she had any sense of humor, she would go right up to that and ask it again. Hey, what's the opposite of heater since you made a fool out of me on national TV?

What is the opposite of heater? Because you're on one of those now. So how do you get more consistent? I would take some guts to do that. That'd be pretty great, though. You know, someone will put it back to back and throw it up on Twitter and, you know, you're a star. These next two topics I want to bring up, I'm going to be honest. When they both happened, I was very much excited to talk to both you about it because I really don't know your opinions.

And I want to know how you feel about both these. They both deal with referees too, which anyone who listens to this show with any kind of regularity knows. I hate shitting on referees. I hate doing it. But I'm going to in a second. Or officials, we'll say. Dan Kelly, in last night's Leaf's lightning game, there was a skirmish at the end of the period. There was a hit on Austin Matthews and, you know, your star gets hit.

Stuff always happens. And he's trying to send Michael Bunting to the dressing room. And he did it in a, we'll call it aggressive, but I don't even think that's the right word. He was shoving him off the ice. And to a point where Bunting almost fell. And if you're good at reading lips, you saw Michael Bunting say, what the fuck was that? And of course, that clip went bananas online. a lot of people say what's going on here

and since then we found out that they actually played against each other in the American Hockey League. Don't know if there's any history there. But when you saw Dan Kelly shoving Michael Bunting off the ice like that, I immediately texted our producer Jeff Do Metz. We're talking about this tomorrow. What did you think? We'll start with you, Russo.

Well, I think it was absolutely unacceptable. And I know that a lot of fans, especially my critics out there, think that I love shitting on referees. I actually don't. I'm tight with a lot of these guys. we, you know, we were just talking about the hotel before we came on live here that I'm staying at. I mean, you see all these guys at the same hotel, so you develop relationships with them. I just had breakfast with a couple this morning.

But it was unacceptable. You know, if Michael Bunting did that to Dan Kelly, he would not play for the next 10 games. All right. Michael, it was, I don't know what led up to it that led to the fireworks, but it certainly seemed overly aggressive and completely out of line by this linesman. and if Michael Bunting had fallen through that door, that linesman would not work again. It's that simple. And so, you know, a young guy that, you know, I think sometimes a lot of these young officials, they come into the league and they want to show right away that they're, you know,

it's almost like a power trip situation. This is one, whatever happens with this linesman, Stephen Walken needs to coach him now and tell him that what he did was absolutely unacceptable and don't put your hand. on a player like that. You have to break up these fights. You have to sometimes get these guys to the door to de-escalate things. And again, I don't know what was said, what led up to it. I just saw the clips.

But what I saw was dangerous. This guy almost went right through the door for no reason. He wasn't doing anything other than talking, you know, that I saw. So it needs to be changed right away with this lines. Yeah, I totally agree with all that. I think it's, they have a tough job, right? They're around a bunch of aggression and guys that are bad-mouthing them and being aggressive towards them. Obviously, not physically.

But the refs have a tough job, but you just can't do that. And you never see anything like that. I agree with Rob. Like, when I saw the clip, I wasn't watching the game live, but I saw the clip on Twitter. And he didn't just like push him. He grabbed his jersey and almost like shook him. Yeah. It was, it was shockingly aggressive.

Like, this was not a small little, like, pushed toward the wall. Like he, it looked like he was in a scrum with him like players would get in after someone ran into somebody's goalie. It was, yeah, it was shocking.

And like Michael said, if he had fallen, this would be a huge, huge topic. If Bunting would have fallen backwards when that door opened, like he said, he probably wouldn't be refing in this league again. He got lucky that that didn't happen.

Like I said, I have some sympathy. They have a tough job. And you, You can imagine the abuse these guys go through with the players, the verbal abuse, but you have, I mean, that's part of the job is being able to take that and, and not try to shove the guy through the door. It was, that was very strange. Rob, what, like, what was your initial thought on it? I said, what the fuck am I looking at. I'm not going to lie. Like, I've, I've, you, the, between the three of us, we've probably watched 17 billion hockey games. I've never seen anything like that. And I acknowledge exactly everything that you guys said, especially what Russo said, there's times where they do need to get physical with these players. If you've got a player trying to jump back into a fight, you've got to hold him back. That's part of their job. I saw nothing that indicated that Michael Bunting was trying to get back in that scrimmage.

I saw nothing that indicated that physical force was needed. And we're not just talking physical force. That to me felt like an official with a power trip. An official with a power trip that said, you can't touch me. I can touch you, but you can't touch me. almost, you know, when you hear anyone with authority that abuses it, I think, I think he definitely, Stephen Walkum definitely has to, at the very least, reprimand him, even in private, just to say, this is, you can't do this. This absolutely cannot happen, especially in the age, like I said, now we're at a point where, you know, something like that, that went, that was, it was a close up. You know what I mean on the Leaf game? And it went everywhere.

I don't get it. I don't even understand. Like I said, even if he said something really horrible to him, it still doesn't warrant what we saw. You know, and the discipline that a lot of these officials get is always behind closed doors. And I actually think that that is not the way to operate.

I think that things need to be public. That's why I always, I laughed when Tim Peel was kicked out of the league. And the league put out the press release, like they were being these upstanding, you know, this upstanding league, and we're not going to, you know, accept Tim Peel, you know, basically saying that he owed a call. I can't remember exact thing that everything went down, even though I did a podcast with him a year ago. But the reason why that was such a BS fallacy

was that he was retiring in a couple of weeks. He only had like three games left on his docket. He was an easy mark for the league to make an example of, you know, pretend like they were firing, and even though his career was over anyway in a couple weeks. And, put out something to basically say that, hey, we don't let our referees manipulate games here. This is one where to me there should be a press release. This guy is not working for the next, you know, he is not working for the next month, whatever. You know, sometimes, because then it leads us to wonder, like if all of a sudden we see

him doing an NHL game, and I think he is one of the linesmen, I don't know if he's full time or if he goes up and down. But if he's back working in a day or two, that to me does not say what they did to this kid. And I just think that, I'm not saying that he should lose his job. job or anything like that. But this is an opportunity to coach him up, but also for Stephen Walken to say publicly, like, hey, this was a mistake by the kid. We think he's this rising start. Whatever is there. There's a reason why he is one of the top officials in the, in the world

that's actually now going to have a chance to work in this league full time. So this is an opportunity to coach him. But I think that that needs to be a public sentiment here for fans to have a confidence that these guys are actually, when they mess up, are being dealt with. And hats off the bunting for handling that the best that he could. You talked to Jesse about like testosterone's through the roof. You know, he's probably jacked up and he sees this, you know, their best player get hit. And this referee or excuse me, linesman's shoving you like that. It would have been easy just to give another little shove back.

Right. So he handled it. He handled it really well. Topic number two. We talked a lot about kale McCar on this show. We all are big Cal McCar fans. and he made news this week on a play that I don't know if we're all going to be in agreement on this one goes behind the net getting chased by Matthew Barzell who gives him a little whack he does make

contact with him and McCar blows a tire which we don't ordinarily see referee raises his hand immediately penalties coming and McCar gets up signals right away no no no that was me a blue attire talks to the referee and gets the penalty they declined the penalty essentially. They rescinded. Everyone kind of jumped, oh, what a nice guy. You know, Lady Bing, this and that. Your thoughts, if you were a teammate, if you were a coach of Kail McCar, and he said,

no, no, no, we're good in this tie game to not have a power play. What would you do, Jesse? Yeah, probably not too happy. It reminded me of, this isn't the first time I've seen this. Ovechkin did it in Vegas a couple years ago. He, he, like, gave the, like, throat, like, wave, like, no, no, no, no. It's good to, to, and the end, it was the same situation. The referee, like, rescind it.

Okay, never mind. No penalty. But, but back to your question, yeah, if I'm, if I'm on the Aves powerplay and I'm getting ready to go out there and try to get me a power play goal, I'm pretty pissed off that he, that he, that he waived that off. They make tons of bad calls every game. They're going to make a bad call on us, like, in the next 20s. minutes. There's a pretty good chance. That's it. Why would we wave away the one bad call?

Like, if you're going to do that, then every team needs to do it. And then half the penalties won't actually happen. So I think it's a case of like, this isn't something that gets reviewed and we make sure that it's right. Like, they make wrong calls all the time. Every single hockey game, there's a call that if you were asked the players and the coaches after and they were honest, they'd be like, yeah, that was a terrible call. So I think you just kind of take the ones that you're given and you kind of deal with the ones that you aren't. It's hockey. It's a fast sport. Calls are going to be wrong. Giving up one of the bad calls that goes your way seems not smart.

What do you think, Michael? Yeah, I agree with you. I mean, I thought it was a cool moment. When I vote for the Lady Bing at the end of the year, it's something I'll be definitely in my head. You know, luckily for the abs, they wound up winning the game anyway in a shootout. And obviously, the Islanders get a point there, but it doesn't affect the abs because it's different conference. and they're starting to heat up, by the way.

They've won four of their last five with a ton of injuries. But in terms of back to this subject, it's something that I've never seen before. In fact, a couple games, a couple days before that, I covered the Wild, played Detroit. Jake Middleton was called for a tripping penalty by Chris Rooney, and it was a total phantom call. The Detroit player jumped over Middleton, who was sliding toward him and just fell. And trust me, Detroit took that power play. The guy didn't get up and say, no, no, no, no.

I'm the one that caused myself falling there. But it was an interesting story because I was just reading Peter Baugh's story about it. And Kale said he regretted it. And you could see the video when he got back to the bench and him looking back at Bednar. You know, you could tell that he felt bad and there was probably like a lot of confusion in the bench. Like, what did you just do? The fans certainly didn't like it because obviously they didn't know the context at the time. but when the referee, who to his credit didn't announce that, by the way,

Kail McCar told me that he just fell. He just said, we're overturning the call. There's no penalty on the play. We're pulling, we're picking up the flag. And essentially, the fans at the ball center, ball arena just absolutely scorched the reps. But again, they didn't know the context. So it made for an interesting moment.

I'm sure Kale will probably not do it again. But I have, I don't, I don't blame them. It's heat of the moment. I admire it. But the irony of this. one is that it wasn't a phantom call he actually did you know as he was circling that lean into him which is what caused in the fall and blow the tire but either way um i respect it but i'm sure uh kale learned a lesson there um to not do it again but i admire it i think it's a cool

thing i think it says a lot about his character and integrity most impressive thing that happened in that game by the way we're not even going to bring up the double shut out come on rob double shut out both goalies got a shut out in that game one time In time, don't pump the tires of every goalie in the league. Just one episode. When's the last time we saw a double shutout? It was great. Come on.

We were watching in the press box and of course everyone's coming up to me. They're like, do they both get shutouts? And I'm like, I'm like 99% sure. That's the case. Yeah. So I had a double shutout. Yeah, I remember I covered a zero, zero. I've covered a couple of them.

But one of my favorite zero zero tie stories was in the year 2000. It was Roberto Longo's first year with the Florida Panthers. they're like seven, eight games into the season. They're winless. We go to Minnesota, coincidentally, where I work now, and they have a zero-zero-zero-tie Tye Jamie McClennon versus Roberto Luongo. And we go in the locker room after the game, and Roberto Luongo had the greatest quote of all time.

He goes, because I never, ever imagined in my wildest dreams that I would get my first shutout before my first win with the Panthers. And it was just, like, all of a sudden, I'm like, wait a bit. Yeah, you're right. That's crazy. But yeah, zero-zero-zero shut. I knew you'd like that, Jesse. Love it.

Yep. Um, for the record, if one of my teammates did this in beer league, I'd be pissed off. Okay, I'm just going to say it. I'd be like, dude, that ref puts his hand up. You say, P, P.B1 get on the ice. Not that we have power play lines in Men's league. It's whoever's next. Um, he said like, you know, it's a karma.

Good karma. And I bet you that I bet you he's going to win a lot of points with the reps too. Sure. If it's six one in the third period, I can buy it more. it was a tie game you don't do that but i mean i can't believe i'm getting angry at someone for being a super nice guy is just i i can't i can't see his teammates saying to the set of the temper to press oh yeah he's a great guy that's the guy he is shut the door going kale don't ever yeah the most confused guy in the arena by the way was on that islanders bench they showed

matthew burzel and he was like you could see him he was talking to his teammates telling what happened with it's like a stottish look on his face so all right a couple more things guys before we get to break and some of those interviews, we're hearing talk that the league is possibly looking at an 84 game season yet again as a way to offer more division rival games. You know, they want teams that hate each other, the Battle of Alberta's and such,

to get more games against each other for or against. Jesse, I saw you shake your head as soon as I said it. Yeah, I have mixed emotions because it's like part of me says, sure more hockey like I like I don't want less hockey I definitely will take all the hockey I can get but at the same time I feel like 82 is already enough a lot in terms of like yeah like we're like every game you add you're minimizing the importance of each regular season game and like you look at a sport like football that only has 16 and how important every single game is and I think that's a big part of why it's so popular and then you look at baseball and where you can start the season oh and 30 and your like perfectly fine. Like we're in great shape. We'll still be okay. Hockey's kind of in the middle of that. I don't necessarily think that going from 82 to

84 really changes it that bad, but it just, it's strange. If they were going to change the number of games in the regular season, I would expect it to go the other way. Yeah, I think it's a little weird. I mean, to me, the biggest, the bigger problem and the overarching problem here is the schedule matrix as a whole. I think it's a little messed up. If you want more games, just play the East once and then divvy up the rest in your, or, again, if you're listening to this and you're a fan of the East, play the West ones. And then divvy up the rest. You know, to me that leaves the 82 minus 16 to just play inside division, inside your conference

and things like that, to add two more games just to get four games each inside your division, where just because you have playing two others only, what, is it three times? I don't know how that's creating a bunch of different drama and hate and things like that by just adding essentially a fourth game for two other teams. You know, to me it makes very little sense. First of all, I think the league and the PA are going to have to get on the same page with this to see if the PA would even entertain something like this, knowing the players are going on a little extra bucks for this to accept this, which is not a slight on the players, by the way. But to me, if you want to, if you want to get more rivalries, if you want these teams to play more against each other,

then just go back to the way it used to be where, you know, you're playing 16 games against the other conference and then just the rest inside your conference. and that'll create it. But just adding two more games to allow now every team in the division to play each other an equal amount of times, to me, what's that really achieved? So I just find it interesting. I could see the PA saying, let's shorten the other side too. You know, the one thing I keep seeing is less preseason, shorter training camp. Maybe we'll talk about it.

But like Jesse said, 84 games. And then, oh, by the way, to win the cup, you need to win four rounds. That's a lot of hawk. Right. And in terms of playing the same teams like more, maybe I'm just wrong. I thought that season where they had to play the same teams every game, the COVID season where they were playing with their. That was the worst regular season in the history of the NHL. It was horrible watching them play the same teams over and over again. I don't think anybody wants that. And by the way, if you have the conferences, that would, what, 16 games, that would allow you to play the other division in your conference three times and everybody in your division six times if I'm doing the math. It's too many. And to me, that's a better, that's a, you're achieving what they're trying to do with this 84 game. So again, that's what I'm just so confused about is to add two games to just allow you to play everybody in your division four times rather than two teams in your division three times.

I just don't see the purpose of it. Again, I could be doing the math, but the one thing I know I'm not doing the math wrong on is if you have the games, you can play three in the other conference and six inside your division. And that achieves what it seems like the league is trying to achieve here and what the GMs want. So I just find adding two more games doesn't really do anything. But what they're also trying to achieve is something they look at in only the best case scenario, the Battle of Alberta's of the world, right? So if you don't have a rival or if you have two teams that are rebuilding or whatever, reason, now you've got essentially more games that are, for lack of a better term, boring. You know what I mean? So you can't always look at the high end and go, we need more of that

because if you're going to get more of that, you're going to get more of the shit as well. Yeah, by the way, I went to the Arizona and Montreal game the other day. If those teams only played one time a year as opposed to two, I don't think anybody would complain. Exactly. Last thing before we go to break, guys, John Todorella, up to his old tricks, made Kevin Hayes, the leading scorer on the team, by the way, a healthy scratch in Saturday 6-3 loss to the Rangers. A quick quote from Hayes, I wasn't happy, but it's not my decision. I'm never going to say there's a benefit of being benched.

I don't think I should have been benched, but it's not my decision. He's the coach. I'm the player. He makes the lineup. When Torts was asked about it, he did the old. I don't want to talk about that guys. But then also said, we have a standard here, and everyone leads to live up to the standard. I think I've talked to you guys.

about what I think when Torts does this stuff, it just, it doesn't feel like a message to me. It just feels like torts. What did you guys think when you saw this? Rousseau? I just, yeah, that's exactly what I just thought. It was just Torts being torts. Now, to be fair, I don't watch the Philadelphia. We don't need to be fair.

Yeah. But I don't watch, you know, I don't watch, like, he didn't do it for no reason, right? I don't watch the Philadelphia Flyers every single night. So I don't know what led up to this. I don't know how he's playing away. from the puck, all that stuff. I hear, you know, readings a lot that he's scoring goals, but there has been deficiencies in his game. I don't think he just does it to do it. You know, this is torts. I mean, you know, there are certain coaches in the history of time that

try to, that just don't pick on the fourth liners. They, they will go straight on after the, the leading top guys of the game. The Mike Keenan was the way that, that way. You know, obviously, torts is longed in that way as well. I mean, didn't the Flyers also have somebody that just recently quit, like just literally the other day, just said, I'm done playing hockey. Like, he played, who was the guy? He played for towards in Columbus and the other guy's like, I'm out of here. So, I mean, there's just, you know, that's just the way that the, that the guy is. But, and I don't expect Kevin Hayes to say anything different. You know, he's a prideful guy. And I'm sure that he was not happy being scratched.

So to Rousseau's point about, we don't watch the Flyers every day, thankfully. because they play, I watched them play the Golden Knights the other night and it's like, they're trying to take the hockey out of hockey. They want this hockey game to have as little of hockey as they possibly can. It's absolutely terrible to watch. So thankfully we don't have to. But I like when I am trying to see if a player, like you said, away from the puck, what's he doing? I go to evolving hockey.

I go to their goals above replacement. And then they split it between offense and defense. And it's not perfect. It's not a perfect metric. But for the most part, if a player is on the, one high end of the spectrum or one low end of the spectrum, they're either really good defensively or they're really bad. And Kevin Hayes is the third worst player on the team in terms of defense. He's minus 3.3 goals above replacement defensively. He's, he's 4.8 goals above

replacement offensively. So he's, he's one of their better offensive players, but his defense is almost so bad that it completely wipes out all of the points that he's racking up. So yes, there is a reason that he's doing this. He's probably a liability in his own end. But at the same time, it's just torts beating torts. And they are four, 12, and five in their last 21 games. So seems to be going well. Yeah. I mean, this wouldn't happen on a team that's winning, obviously. I don't think you're pulling your leading scorer out. But look, you know, sometimes you have to get guys attention. Bruce Boudreau did it with Kevin Fiala here in Minnesota, you know, for a while. I mean, it just, you know, we talked a couple weeks ago about how Bruce Bueger came very close

to scratching Brock Besser. You know, again, torts is not doing it just for absolutely no reason. And by the way the player I was referring to is Lucas Sedlick. And again, I'm just hearing, you know, I know that he said he went back for personal reasons, but, you know, if you read the quotes and read between the lines, he's just not loving playing hockey right now and everything that I've heard behind the scenes was this was him just saying, I can't, I can't be coached anymore by this guy. John Tortorella has killed his will to play hockey. Yeah.

Wow. He took the hockey out of hockey and he's killing people's will to play hockey. That is John Tororella in a nutshell. shell. After the break, we're to hear from Tage Thompson and the general manager of the Buffalo Sabres, Kevin Adams. So don't go anywhere. All right, guys, we've talked a lot about Tage Thompson. I said last week, we used the term beast too often, but I think it's very appropriate to use it with Tage Thompson. And you caught up with him, Airy, so. Yeah, I did. And it really, shout out to Nicole, the PR person for the Buffalo Sabers, just so incredible to deal with, to help set up

these interviews with Tage and Kevin Adams. And Tage, we did it in a special. We did it in a stairwell at Molot Arena. There's not too many, let's put it this way. We will all learn when we go to Molot Arena. There's not exactly many auxiliary rooms in places that you could just sit down and do podcast. So we did it about, you know, for six or seven minutes before he was heading out to the boss. He's absolutely on fire. Second star of the week. And we talk a lot about his upbringing, you know, his dad, his mom, he's from Arizona. He had a ton of family at the game that night. And he wound up having it just a monster game as well, scoring the winning goal in the third period. a few hours after this podcast.

Well, really happy to be joined by Tage Thompson. And what a year you were having, Tage, coming into tonight's game here in Arizona, second in the NHL with 24 goals after a 38 goal breakout season last year. And you get the big extension as well. And, you know,

first of all, welcome back to your home playing this well. I mean, this is where you live in the off season, where you were born. Yeah, thank you. I appreciate it.

It's always nice coming home and seeing the family and being able to play in front of them. It's always cool. Yeah, So your mom is from here. You're obviously born here when your dad was playing with the coyotes. So what does it like to kind of come back to this building knowing you're going to have so many people here tonight and as well as you've been playing? Yeah, it's a great feeling. I mean, you don't get to see them too often, especially, you know, during the season.

So it's really only the time you can visit and hang out with them is, you know, the one time you do come out west in the summers. So don't get to see them a whole lot. So it is nice to, you know, be able to play in front of them and see them after the game. You know, you come into this year, you have the big season last year. Was there any nerves coming into this year? Like, can I do it again? Or are you starting to feel like, hey, this is me now? No, I don't, I mean, there's obviously a little pressure.

You know, you sign the contract and you want to live up to it. You want to make sure you're doing what you can to help the team. And there is that little bit of pressure. But I think that's something that drives me. And that's something that probably helps my game more than anything else. So, you know, it's just something that pushes you. and drives you to be better. Just talking to a bunch of your teammates,

I mean, Kyle Keposa says the greatest thing about you is that you've earned it. You know, it was not an easy road for you to get here. Is there a pride in that? Yeah, it's definitely a good feeling. You know, just having the, you know, the hard work start to pay off. It's a good feeling because it has been. It's been a tough road and tough journey

and a lot of things you had to, you know, grind through. So to get to this point now is pretty special. What was your father's impact? I mean, I covered your dad. I told you in Florida. He was his tough a player. as there was at every level he's ever played at. And I mean, what did that do for your game,

for you growing up and his impact? Yeah, it was awesome. I mean, obviously, he's got a ton of passion for the game. And, you know, he still coaches. So just a really good hockey mind, knows the game really well. And I think for me and my brother both growing up, just to be able to have that is something that's such a big advantage that not a lot of other kids had.

And just to have them be able to watch our games and give us little insight and tips. what he sees maybe from an outside perspective has always been good for us. You know, whether or not we wanted to hear it, it's definitely benefited us. I remember when I covered him, he had just been a black ace, actually, and with the L.A. Kings, when they went at all, and he was really pals with Gretzky and all that stuff. I mean, do you have any memories of Gretzky at all and just their friendship still? I mean, I've heard stories and stuff like that.

It's obviously really cool and really special to be able to say you played with the greatest hockey player to ever play. Um, you know, it's cool. I hear a lot of stories and it's just something, you know, from a young age hearing those stories and, you know, going to the rink and hanging out with some of the guys, um, you know, when my brother and I were, you know, four or five years old is just something that that gave us such a love for the game. And, um, you know, it was really cool to share that bond with him. 11 cities you grew up in, right? And what was the longest you're at? Was it, it was Alaska? Was it? Yeah, I think, um, Illinois actually was probably the longest. We were there for four years

in Illinois, he coached the Riverman there. And four years is probably the longest we've been put in one place until he got out in Connecticut. And he's been with the Sound Tigers for, I don't know, maybe nine or ten years now. So I guess that's now the longest. But since we've moved out to Connecticut, my brother and I have kind of gotten older and moved away from home. So I don't really consider Connecticut a home base or where we grew up. So I'd say probably Illinois is the longest that my brother, our whole full. family's been put in one place. Right. And Alaska, he won it all there, right? Yeah, they won

a Kelly Cup up there. And that was cool. That was a lot of fun, Alaska. It was a great spot for for our whole family. And my brother and I had a ton of fun up there. Yeah, but what do you think at the daylight? You probably came out of games and it was still light out, right? No, the opposite. Okay. It was, uh, the winters is always pitch black. So it's a little, a little different, getting used to that. Um, you know, the sun only comes up for a couple hours during the winter, but in the summertime, it never goes down. So it's a great summer spot. to be at. And for us too, it was awesome for the winter. Everyone's got outdoor rinks and, you know, hockey was our life there. So, um, it was hockey everywhere, which was great.

Last couple for you, uh, like, it's just unbelievable watching this year. I mean, you do feel like you look like a man amongst boys, but you guys went through that tough, tough stretch here recently, but you seems to be slowly getting your game back together, guys getting healthy, uh, things like that. Do you feel like things are now back on the rise with the Sabres? Yeah, for, I mean, I think obviously that stretch is tough, right? You don't want to lose eight in a row. But through that stretch, I think there were some games where we played really good hockey, and I think you can't lose sight of that.

Obviously, the results aren't what you want, but throughout that journey there, you learn things along the way, and you pick up pieces, you know, from certain games that you can take with you. And I think you look at Colorado last night, right? Like, we get a lead early there and we're able to hold on and finish it out and get the win. And that's something that we haven't been able to do. in the past. And I think that that was a big testament, that game yesterday. Just learning how to hold on to leads and close out games. I think that's something we're going to continue to growing

to be better at. And just lastly, I know you got to catch the bus here. But Don Granado's impact and just the future of this team, because, you know, I was just talking to Tyson Jost. And he said that the room is unbelievable. Yeah, the room is awesome. I mean, we got some of the best guys. You know, it's a fun, fun atmosphere. You have fun every day. You come to the rink. There's never a dull moment. So it's been great. Donnie's been awesome for everyone, not just me. He's so good with the young guys. And just the style of game, he wants us to play is, you know, it's exciting hockey,

fast-paced, a lot of offense. And the great thing about it is if you make a mistake, he's not going to be grilling you. He lets you know that that can't happen again, but he gives you an opportunity to get back out there and, you know, make up for that mistake. And just play. I think that's the biggest thing for us is we have a lot of young guys with a lot of talent

He just makes it pretty simple, you know. Doesn't overcomplicate things and just lets us go play and have fun and let the skill take over. So as long as we're working, I think that's all he really cares about. Yeah, well, Tage, you have many things. It's been an absolute blast watching you. This year, last year. My favorite goal, still, by the way, is the one where you broke your stick last year. Oh, yeah.

You're going to the bench. You can even see it. I don't think that'll ever happen again. That was a bizarre one for sure. Yeah, it hit the end boards and came back at the goalie. Yeah, that was crazy. Yep. So, hey, thanks.

Tage. I appreciate and good luck tonight. Thank you. Thanks for having. Tage Thompson, second star of the week and a guy who's just terrorizing goalies all over the league, which makes everybody except for Jesse extremely happy. And I guarantee you, you're going to hear his name again, Kevin Adams, general manager of the Buffalo Sabres. I gave this a listen before the show, Rousseau, and I don't want to give anything away so people listen. But I really like when he talked about the culture of the Buffalo Sabers because you could put the best coach and the best team and that best everything on the ice, unless a culture improves, your team is not going to improve. Yeah. And right now they have guys that want to be there, right? And they've got some other

big contracts that they're going to have to work on. You know, Dahlene's not long from needing to be extended, Dylan Cousins. And we talk about a lot about Tage Thompson, right? Seven years, $50 million, $50 million signed in August. I think a lot of people wondered, hey, was that a one hit wonder last year when he scored 38 goals? He's definitely not crumbling under the pressure. That's for sure. We talk a lot about Kevin Adams. playing career, winning a Stanley Cup with the Carolina Hurricanes. The Florida Panthers were the gift that kept on giving the Carolina Hurricanes for their puck run. They gave him Matt Cullen, gave him Brett Hediken, gave him Kevin Adams.

And just a really fun sit down to talk about a lot of these great players that the Buffalo Savers have. By the way, Dahlene, that game was as good as I've ever seen him play. He was so, so good. But we sat down right before the game in the GM's booth at Muller Arena. Well, welcome to Kevin Adams, the three-year, third-year, GM of the Kevin of the Buffalo Sabres and played a long long time in the National Hockey League including with the Florida Panthers where I got to know you and cover you many years ago

Kevin but it's still to me one of the best trades that Jim Rutherford ever made. You have three, four years before you win a Stanley Cup in Carolina he acquires Brett Hedekin and Kevin Adams and a deal for Sandus O's Lynch and you guys won a cup out of it. Yeah, you know, it's funny you bring that up. I was just at the Board of Governors

meetings and Chuck Fletcher and I were talking about when I was in Florida and talking about that trade. And you know what? It was one of those things where, you know, Mike Keenan had come in. And I think I became a little bit of the whipping boy there for Mike. And then it just ended up working out. But for me personally, I ended up playing in the Stanley Cup that year. We ended up losing to Detroit, four years later, won the cup and spent whatever it was six years in Carolina. It's a big part of my career. So that certainly worked out. I think Mike Keenan was the gift that kept on giving the Carolina Hurricanes because Matt Cohen, who was also in the doghouse in Florida under Mike Keenan.

Remember he was on the doghouse line with Christian Nuselius and Val Beret. Remember it well? Yeah, that's right. And he was another huge part of our team there in Carolina and the Cup team. And you play, I mean, the thing I remember, because I covered that series, is you play with a broken wrist and had a huge, I mean, a huge series, huge game seven. it just felt like, you know, you were going to do anything to stay in that lineup. Yeah, it was, you know what, it was such a special year.

Like, obviously, anybody who wins a Stanley Cup and would say, but from start to finish, it was one of those teams that we had a really good bond. We had a team that we knew we were really good, but nobody else did. It was one of those kind of things. And then as the year went on, I think people started realizing, like, whoa, this team's pretty talented. And Eric Stahl is 20 years old, and all of a sudden, you know, he's got 100 points, and you have Cam Ward, and we just kind of had one of those teams that you could feel, and I was fortunate enough to have an important role on the team.

And, yeah, I mean, you know, those don't come along very often as a player. So no matter what, I was going to try to do what I could to help that team win. Ray Whitney was on that team too, Ray Whitney was there, yeah. And you were acquired for Ray Whitney. So, I mean, the dots connected. It's crazy. Yeah, and I'll tell you really quick Ray Whitney's story is funny. And if you know them well, you know how funny is, but started to,

training camp, he stood up in front of the team and said, hey, I just want to make sure everybody knows that Kevin Adams and I, it wasn't a real hockey trade. It was more of a money dump. You know, it wasn't like a one-for-one type thing. It was pretty good. So anyone who knows Witt knows his sense of you. Yeah, and that was the year where they got rid of so much money in Florida. It was a lot was changing there at that time. Definitely. It was an interesting time. The other thing that people don't, I don't think, know about you is you were a poet. Tell this story. Because I learned this today. Okay.

And I don't know if this has ever been told because I googled it and could not find this anywhere, but you wrote poems about that Stanley Cup winner and then actually sort of redid it a couple years ago at the big party? Yeah, so, yeah, it's funny to bring that up. So it's something I had always just been interested in and used to write a little bit here and there. And then I kind of had a tradition during the season a couple times, wherever. it might be at a team, team function, or at the end of the year party or the rookie dinner, I would write a poem and I would, you know, sit in front of all the guys. And it kind of became one of these things.

And so after we won the cup, yeah, I wrote a special poem for that group. And actually, it was kind of cool. They had, after I recited it, they asked for a copy of it. And then they ended up putting it for a while there in the Hall of Fame as part of our team, you know, a team celebrating that team. And then they ended up making a plaque. with the poem on it and a big team picture, which I thought was kind of, still down to my basement. It's really cool.

And every time I go to the RBC Arena, there's you in the press box there. I mean, again, it's just amazing to me what you played with that series. And I think it just shows everything that's- Yeah, everything that takes to win a Stanley Cup. So, Kevin, let's talk about the Sabres here. I mean, huge win. We're recording this before your game here at Molot Arena against Arizona. This is going to probably run on Wednesday, so obviously things can happen up until them.

but a huge win last night, our two nights ago in Colorado. And it seems like you've started to come back on the other side. After a really good start, you had a little bit of a dip, and then obviously playing much better lately. Yeah, I like the way we've played on this last, you know, one of 10, 12 games. I like the way we've practiced, too, to be honest with you.

We've been really sharp. We've been carrying over the details and practice into our games. We're learning. You know, we're one of these teams that you obviously know how young we are. We're talented. We play fast, but we're learning a lot of lessons. We're learning how to go into Colorado

and we're up three goals and then they make a push and we're learning how to manage those games where I felt like there was a stretch during the year this year when we weren't winning. We were finding, we would play well in pockets but then we were finding ways to lose, meaning like turning over a puck at the wrong time

or taking a bad penalty. So that's just part of the maturation process of it. I like where we are. We got a long way to go. We're not where we need to be yet, but we're definitely trending in the right direction. A lot of it, you know, I talk to GMs all the time, and the work culture has thrown out a lot.

But when I was walking around your visiting room today, everybody was talking about what a great group you guys. Yeah, I mean, Tyson Jost went on and on about the type of group that you have in there. You know, Ocposo said the same thing, Tage Thompson. How much is that something that you prioritize? Critical. I mean, it was very intentional a couple years ago. when it became very clear to me that, you know, we were going to have to kind of reset this and

get it going, you know, in a different direction. And for me, you know, I've said this many times publicly, we have to have players that want to be a Buffalo Sabre that get up every day and just truly love this organization and want to be part of the solution and respect the jersey. And I feel like when we started to put the pieces in place and draft the players, that culture now is happening. and these guys love each other, they care about each other, but they also love the organization. And that's why you see guys like Tage Thompson and Matthias Samuelson last summer make that long-term commitment to us. You know, we certainly, people talk about us making the commitment to them. Well, they made a commitment to us too.

And that is something that for us to start to turn the corner here is really important. I watched a game about maybe three weeks ago you guys were up in Montreal, and Tate Thompson looked like he could have scored five goals that game. Coincidentally, about a week and a half later, he does score five. five goals in a game. But he is just an absolute monster on ice. To be that big and skate that well and have a shot that incredible, I mean, he looks like he is going to be something special. Yeah, you know, Tage, I'm really happy for Tage in terms of where he is at right now. And, you know, I mean, a lot of people now in the hockey world understand what he's gone through in the

journey he's been on. I remember sitting with him a couple years ago and he was out of the lineup He was on the taxi squad during COVID and just saying this is part of your process. You got to just compete, put the work in, be patient. But you could see the talent. So for me, it was just how do we make sure that we're not losing him, that we're showing him love? And then when he gets the opportunity, I know the work ethic and the character he has. So I'm not surprised what he's doing. He's one of these guys, you know, we talked about in the summer when we signed him to long contract.

Like we really feel he has, he's going to get better. Yeah. Like he's got more, more levels to go, which is exciting for us. And especially, Kevin, like, you know, you sign that big deal as a young player, not that he's super young, but you sign that deal and now there's pressure. And we saw it with Jason Robertson. He gets the almost $9 million a year. And what does he do? He comes out and he's already got 23 goals.

Here, Tage could have cowered, could have crumbled. And he comes out here and just, you know, just looks like he, that one, he made the right. decision, but definitely you made the right decision. I appreciate that. And I'll say about Tage, you know, he, he appreciates every day in this league and he works. Yeah. He works. I mean, he just competes. He's got a great family, you know. He has great people around him, his wife, and he's got a baby now, and he's got, obviously, his dad's in the hockey world, and his brother. And I just think he's one of these guys that's very grounded. He's very level-headed, and he doesn't take a day for granted in this league. And when you have that talent and that

work ethic, you know, special things can say that. Were you on those Florida teams when Brent was part of those Florida? No, okay, yeah, I covered him a little bit. I played against his dad, but never with him. I mean, totally a different player. Oh, yeah. You know, Tage has a little meat streak in him, to be honest with you, but I think his dad probably realized, like, okay,

I'm going to try to get my boys to be a little different players, which is what all of us hope. We all want our boys to, you know, that play hockey to be better than we were. You know, you talk long-term contracts. It seems like right away out of now entry-level deals, people are getting big-time contracts. Like, how do you now assess guys like Dylan Cousins and players like that that are, you know, Dylan's having a great year? Yeah, well, what we've talked a lot about over the last couple of years is what we had to first start to do is identify our core. Who were those young players?

We knew we had talent, but who were they going to be? How are we going to move forward and identify that? And what, so certainly that, you know, we talked about a couple of them already. but, you know, Rasmus Stalline, obviously, as a guy that's a huge part of our future and take care of that. Obviously, Dylan Cousins, another one that, just a really glue type guy. You know, he's just a competitive leader in our locker room and he's extremely talented. So, yeah, we'll work on getting those guys done. But it goes back to what I said earlier.

When we identify the players that appreciate the organization, want to be part of it, you know, we want to figure out how to get that done with them. That whole line, Paterka and Quinn on there with Cousins as well. I mean, they're starting to perform for you. Well, they're very, they complement each other really well. You know, Quinn and Paterka played together last year in the American Ocoy League a lot, so they have a good feel for each other, and they had great success at a really young age in that league, which is tough to do. And they've meshed well with Dylan.

I just think the way they all feel the game, see the ice, use their speed, and they're really good off the rush. They're talented guys who make plays. And they have fun. You could see it in practice. They're smiling. They love to be at the rink. And they feed off each other. And I think someone told me recently they're the youngest line on the NHL,

which is great because you're seeing them take steps. No doubt. I wanted to ask you about, like, you know, one thing I will say Sabres fans want me to ask you is Rochester and who would you see is next in line to maybe get to Buffalo. Well, you know, like there's a group of young players down there that are, I don't even know if some of our fans realize how young. they are. Like Kulich is there.

He's only 18. Right. He was just drafted this past year. He's having a great year. And he looks a lot like, he looks a lot like where J.J. Buterka was last year at this time. The way he's starting to understand the game and adjust to the pro game over here in North America.

His details in practice have been better and better. So he's certainly a guy we're excited about, but Brandon Byro is taking a big step this year. He's the guy that's knocking on the door to the NHL. And then we got guys like Kiss a Coss. and Kozak that are really young talent. Cedarquist has been done a nice job. Weissbach, another one that's done a nice job.

So Rusek, Lucas Ruchak, C, I could go on. There's a group of guys that we feel are really close to taking the next step. But I really appreciate the job that Seth Apert and the coach Michael Peca and Mike Weber have done in there. They've done a really nice job. Coach Michael Peck. I love that. It's awesome. Let me ask you about Savoy.

I mean, he's a prospect that a lot of Sabre fans are excited about. for some reason wasn't invited to Team Canada's development or evaluation camp for the world juniors. Wild, the team that I cover have also on Winnipeg Ice Carson Lambo's who was cut from the team. But he's having a good year. He's in a great situation for a team that could win the Memorial Cup. Where do you see his evaluation level? And how surprised were you about Team Canada? Yeah, I mean, I was surprised.

He's had a real good season. I mean, he plays with a high motor. He competes. He's got, he loves the game. He's electric when he's on the ice. So, yeah, I was certainly a little surprised, but to be honest with you, I actually think he's the type of kid that this will help because he will be motivated even more. He's a type of player that just he wants to show that he's great every day.

And when you take a little bit of that, like, okay, you take it the right way, they didn't believe I should be on the team. And, you know, how do you use that in a positive way? So we're really excited about him. He plays for James Patrick, who I know really well when I was coaching. here with the Sabres. James and I were assistants together, so that was part of the pre-draft due diligence that

we were doing, and we think we got a real good player there. Yeah, and Sabers fans, you probably know that Alex Tuck was once cut from the American team for U.S. I think he's pretty good player as well. So that's just the way where there's so many incredible players in National Hoculate that didn't play for the World Game's team. Especially at 18, you know, he's still got

next year, but you know, it's just not it's a great tournament and I always want our guys to play. I was fortunate enough to plan it. It's a great experience, but hey it's a journey too you know everybody's at different places in their in their development journey a couple more for you Kevin um as a GM now like when do you know when's the time maybe to make an external move to maybe speed up the rebuild or do you have to continue to be patient yeah well I think it's a great question like honestly like when I think about a lot is um we have to be in every

conversation and around you know the league to understand where things are at to be open to doing whatever we can to help our team. In saying that, we can't fast forward the process we're in. You can't try to jump skip steps and jump things. We have to stay true to our process and make sure that we allow guys to develop the right way. And the example I'll give you would be in the summer, you know, we could have identified a guy or two, a winger, say, that would maybe have be, you know, eight, ten years in the league. Maybe we're a little bit ahead of where Quinn and Butyrka would have been at training camp. But I just, you know, Donnie and I talk about this every day.

If we block those guys from the minutes that now they're getting, you're almost stifling. So you have to find that sweet spot of making sure you provide opportunity of the guys that earn it, but also be open to when there's the right move to make. You're going to make it. And Tyson Joost on waiver is a perfect example. Yeah. He was there. We felt like, you know what, here's a talented kid that still young in a good spot.

We think there's upside. High character. Let's take a shot at it. Yeah, and it's been a great waiver pickup for you. And it just shows, I was talking to him this morning. It just shows what happens when you actually play. I mean, you know, unfortunately, he fell out of favorites a little bit in Minnesota, but he just needed that opportunity to get back into a role.

And he's obviously embraced it. He even fought for you on his first shift. Yeah, exactly. Just two more for you. One is, you know, I get questions from kids all the time on how to get into hockey ops. How, like, you know, like, whether you're play or not play, Like if you're somebody that's an analytics expert, like how do you advise young people that really just want to work for a team to sort of get their foot in the door? Well, I'd say a couple things.

First of all, young, young boys or girls shouldn't feel that the only way to get into hockey is if you played at a high level. Like there's a lot of different jobs. And, you know, for me, I like to identify people that are talented. You know, they can do a lot of different things. And they're willing to learn. And they're willing to do whatever they can to be part of a team. So I would say, you know, for people that are looking, you know, what do I need, you know, can do, you know what? Be open to anything.

Send your, you know, send the phone or the texts and the emails and, you know, make sure people know who you are. But then even if you get your foot in the door in any way, maybe it's not what you think exactly you want to do. Do it. Right. And the big thing for me is I really believe no matter what you're doing, if you're kind of, I call it, be where your feet are. You know, like you're all in and you're present. You're going to learn. And then other doors will open.

if you're doing the right job. So don't be focused on the finish line. You know, go kind of what I was saying earlier. You got to go through the steps and the process to get there and be open and be willing to do that. When you were first elevated to this role, how long did it take you to sort of get comfortable in your skin, maybe not be intimidated? Like what's the difference between Kevin Adams and year three compared to maybe one? Yeah, you know what? It's interesting. I think for me, from day one, I try to make sure I'm asking a lot of questions around the people around me, former GMs, current GMs, other people in the hockey world just pick their brain and learn.

So I don't think that'll ever change. If I do this job for 30 years, I'm going to try to learn every day. So I don't know if I am different, but what I will say is I don't feel at this point where I'm at pressure that I have to justify anything or have to do this. Yeah, yeah, I've learned a lot, gone through some tough times. and some of the different trades and different intense negotiations. It's all learning for me, but I'm going to continue to be myself. The one thing I did promise myself was no matter what, from day one of this job, I have to be me.

I can't try to be someone else. I can't try to, oh, this is how you're supposed to do it because this is, you know, I just have to be myself and that's the best I can do. Yeah, well, I've covered this league a long time. And the one thing, you know, Sabers fans, you have such a great fan base there. And they just got to be patient because, I mean, we're going to see such. It's such a cycle, right? I mean, this team that we're going to watch tonight, Arizona's got a ton of young kids that are going to be coming on the horizon.

And they're going to be a really good team and a handful for teams. All the California teams that may be on the downturn now are on their way up. And I think the Sabres are the same way. Well, I appreciate that. You know, we do have a great fan base. And I think that's one thing for me. Like, the Savers, it's in my DNA. Yeah.

I grew up at the old auditorium and watching Gilbert Proe and sitting up in the oranges with my dad. You know, it's special to me. And I'm so thankful for. for the opportunity and it's for me it's just it's personal yeah you know it's it's a lot more than a job it's personal and i'm very fortunate well kevin you know i really appreciate you doing this especially on a game night um and uh you really i mean honestly i tell people all the time you're one of my favorite players to ever cover in florida that means just the way you are now you're always so welcoming and you know it's a lot of times players could be a little scared of the media or hate

the media but you never at least showed that to us and i appreciate you saying that you know what it's it's uh we're all lucky what we get to do every day treat people the right way do your best that's all you can do. So big thanks to Tage Thompson and Kevin Adams for putting up with Russo. We have to do it each and every week and they only had to do it for about 10 minutes and 20 minutes. So thanks for doing that, guys. After the break, rapid fire. It's an appointment. Okay, boys, my favorite time of the show and yours, rapid fire. We're going to start with, oh, shocking turn of events. We're going to have a player honored when he returns to a place where he played. P.K. Subang, going to be honored by the haves in January. You know how I feel about all these video tributes and everything else. What do you guys think of the Sub-Ban news? Jesse? I love player return videos. I think they should do it for everyone who's ever... No, I really don't care.

I really like the Victor Rask one in Minnesota last year. Oh, man. Yeah. It's, I mean, I don't... The Sub-Ban thing is kind of weird just because I felt like, like, you don't trade a top player like that in the prime of their career, maybe even before the prime of their career, like right when they're at their peak that often. So it was, it was weird. But I guess, I mean, Jack Eichel got one when he went back to Buffalo and he was even younger when he got

traded and there was obviously a lot more controversy there. So sure, yeah, give Suban one. Even though he's not playing anymore, I don't know. It's, it is all just a very weird situation. I don't have strong feelings on it the way you do, Rob. I don't have strong feelings. I'm just tired of it. Enough. Like, I don't know if P. K. Zuban necessarily deserves this, but okay, Russo, your thoughts? Cam Talbot came back to Minnesota the other day. They just acknowledged him on the video board. You would have loved it, Rob.

And they call it. And they welcome back Cam Tablot on the video board. So not only didn't they give him a video tribute, they disrespected him by misspelling his name. So that would have been your absolute dream tribute right there. That's awesome. Rapid Fire number two, the Hamburgler. Andrew Hammond retired, if you remember back in the 2014-15,

season went on that ridiculous 21 and 2 run after getting called up from the HL and all the burgers being thrown on the ice. But an injury just ended up, you know, making the decision for him. Jesse will start with you because all you want to do is talk about goals. Yeah, yes, sucks to see. But like, he's one of those guys that was probably never actually good enough to be like, like, he reached the, I feel like he reached his potential. The guy got one shot and took as big advantage of as he possibly could. Got his 15 minutes of fame. Good for him.

Ended up kind of falling back into not being the great goalie that he looked like he was there for a while. But I think that's kind of closer to what he was. It was cool for a guy like that to, like there are so many goalies that are career AHLers that get waived a million times. I know Mike McKenna really well. He was out here in Vegas working for the team. And like he's a guy who bounced around from 50 different teams.

and like you can make a good living doing that, but it's not the most glorious. So it's cool. Like I feel like Hammond's one of those guys, maybe a little step above, but he got his 15 minutes of fame, and that was cool. He took advantage of the one shot he got. Yeah, I covered him in Florida for two or three, excuse me, in Minnesota for two or three years. Never actually played a game with Minnesota, but they signed him as their third goalie, and he was outstanding in Iowa during their one of their playoff runs. Actually, Capo Caconin hit the wall, and he took over and was just tremendous in the playoffs. And then he thought his career was over and then come all of a sudden in December Alex Steylock has myocarditis

from having COVID and they call him out of the blue essentially get him right out of the scrap heat and they sign them to play on their taxi squad the rest of that year of the shortened season in the in the NHL and then he wound up playing a couple years after that both in the national hockey league and then out out in the KHL as well so congratulations to a good guy on a good career as you mentioned he definitely made the most of it. A couple signings to pass your way. We'll start in Edmonton. Stuart Skinner signs a three-year extension with the Oilers

AAB of 2.6 million bucks. I love seeing guys play with a city where they were born and developed as a hockey player and get to do it in front of the hometown crowd. Russo will start with you. Yeah, and he's, you know, look, hey, I think he's got the ability to be a really, really good goalie. And they didn't give him, what was it, the Koskin? It was the Koskin a couple years ago where all of a sudden they have Mike

Smith there and then throw like four to half million bucks. This is, I think, a really good price. You know, you have, hopefully Jack Campbell gets his act together. He plays a lot more consistency consistently over the next little time, but I like the signing by Edmonton. I agree that the money amount is a lot more palatable, but like, how many times this team going to do this? Where the goal he had, we just talked about the hamburger. If the hamburger would have played for the Edmonton Oilers, they, they, would assign him to a 10-year, $10 million contract. Like, how many times are they going to have to do this where, like, these goalies don't have to prove much to get a contract in editing?

I like Skinner. I do. This is not me saying he's going to turn into a pumpkin. I like Skinner. And this, this money amount, like Russo said, this isn't giving Hoskin and an insane amount of money. But at the same time, it does feel like, here we go again. Like, the goalie has a good two months. and they're like, goalie of the future, sign him. So he's outplayed Campbell to this point. You obviously hope, like Rousseau said, that Campbell can eventually get his game back and be the guy or at least be 1B,

and it's not the Skinner show. But yeah, it's, I don't think this contract's terrible, but I also think it's a troubling, it goes along with the pattern that they've shown in the past. Yeah, and to your point, you know, the one area to me that they, you know, I think we always talk about Blue Line, there is areas that they've got to fix.

But, you know, one area they've got to invest some money in is their bottom six. I mean, their bottom six doesn't scare anyone. Their top six does, and especially when they get a Vander Kaine back. But they've got, you know, some issues on that bottom six. Like, I've watched the Wilde play them a lot lately. They've played them three times in ten days. And the wild's bottom six just ate them for breakfast. So I think, you know, that's the one area is that they're trying to invest a lot of money in that one position.

And they should probably spread the wealth around a little bit. The other signing coming out of Ottawa as the sentence agreed to a four-year deal, $18.4 million with defenseman Artemu. Any thoughts on this one, guys? Russo. Well, you know, the one thing, like I look at that team with Ottawa, and they've got a lot of really quality pieces that are going to be parts of the future. But they've got to figure out what happened this year. Like, this should be a much, much better team. And I think a lot of times with rebuilds, you know, there are always those points where you sit there and,

And you feel like you're on a raft in the middle of the ocean and there's no wind and did all of a sudden we mess up. And that's the one thing. If Ottawa feels that this is the right path, they've got to continue to stay the course and not panic. And clearly they're doing that with a contract like this for Zub and some of the other guys that they brought in this summer. But it's been a disappointing year for them. But clearly they think that this is still a team that is on the rise and is going to be good in the future. But they've got to figure out what happened this year. And I do think that they can't panic to what a lot of those.

us look at as a disappointment. If they feel like this is the right course to continue on, and they've got to do it and not change the process last second because they've had a bad year. Yeah, they've been super disappointing this year compared to what, like, I thought they'd challenge for a playoff spot. Zub, I mean, he's, he's like your classic, like, stay-at-home guy. I think he's got, like, two goals this season. He's actually injured right now. I don't know how long he's been out, but it's, it's kind of strange to see a guy to get a contract extension while he's hurt. But, yeah, I mean, he, I think he's a solid guy on the back end. I think the senators have plenty of like Eric Brandstrom and guys that can can push the pace,

can jump into the play, can activate in the offensive zone. And I think it's good to have cheap options for stay-at-home guys that you can pair with those guys to kind of let those hiring guys do their job. And I think Zub's the ideal player in that role for them. So I think it's good signing. Last one, guys, and I just threw this in because, you know, I have a friend of mind Jesse who I work with at CBC and he sends me a message yesterday. Can you believe Connor McDavid's numbers? And I remember thinking, yeah, Jesse, I follow hockey. I know he's really good. But he broke it down and he is on pace right now for 159 points. I know people slow down by the end of the season, but if he ends up keeping up with his pace, which wouldn't be shocking

either, only two players have ever put up a number like that, Gretzky and Lemieux. He hit his 60-point plateau last week in his 31st game, which is the quickest since Mario Lemieux did it in 95, 96, in just 21 games. And McDavid and Leon both on pace for 130 points, the last teammates to do that, Mario and Yager. I mean, we joked about taking for granted in the bars too high with Crosby. The very fact that this guy's going to flirt with 160 points, how are we not talking about this every single day of our lives? It's crazy.

And it is, you know, isn't it funny? I think we've talked about a little on this show, too. It's like we are starting to take Connor for granted. It's like when Jason Robertson was absolutely on fire, there were already people like, well, he's the MVP of the league. Granted a quarter way through. Now Tage Thompson is on fire. Well, Buffalo makes some noise.

Now Tage, it. Look, Connor McDavid is just on a different level than everybody else. And the irony is that he's got a sidekick that's just freaking, like if he was on any other team, we'd be looking at him as like the best guy, but sometimes we just take it for granted and hold it against Connor. because Leon is right there with him. These are two unbelievably special players,

and they are on different planets, but especially, Connor. And it is going to be, it's just fascinating to watch him work, and I just pray that he stays healthy the rest of the way because it's just, to me, it's a benefit for all of us hockey fans to be able to watch greatness like this.

Yeah, I mean, he's brilliant. And he's, like, you, Rob, you brought up all the numbers. Like, he's doing, he's the first person to do it since X, the first person to do it since then. when all those things happen, the league safe percentage was in the 800s. Every one of those years, the league save percentage was in the 800s. And the save percentage has been going down consistently the last few years. We're not quite to the 800s.

We're still in the 900s. To put up these numbers when it's as hard to score as it is currently in the NHL is just insane. And he does it on a nightly basis. And it's not, I mean, every night it seems like it's a highlight real goal where he goes through three guys and roofs it over the goalie from in tight. Like, he's unbelievable. Yeah, for so long, we would almost ignore stats from the 80s slash early 90s because we just go, well, that was the era.

You know what I mean? Like, you know, even the Gretzky numbers, everything would go, well, no one's ever going to do that again. And yes, by saying Connor McDavid is going to score 200 points in his career, no. But when you're putting up a possible number that only two guys have ever done, in a stat like points in a season, we should be. thanking our lucky stars. We get to watch this, this player every single day. Just incredible. It's it for another show, guys. Christmas coming up. I don't know if you guys are just taking some time off or do you got something you're working on this week. Jesse?

Yeah, I've got a few things. I'm finishing up my Martin Brodoer NHL 99 piece. So as Rob would be, it would expect. It's another goalie piece. I'm pretty excited about that one. really, really good stuff for Martin and some of his old teammates. And then I'm also doing one on just a fun piece on warmups. And like I watch Golden Knights warmups and see what each guy's like thing that they do is. Each guy's kind of got a weird thing that they do. And then I've been going around the room and asking the guys like, well, who's got like something weirder than you? And they're giving me even stuff that like I wouldn't be able to see from the press box. And now I'm watching it.

So I've almost got like a like a guide to the Golden Knights warmups. This is all the weird stuff that everything. player in the ice does. And it's, it's actually been way more entertaining than I expected it to be when I started it. So, yeah, that'll be coming out pretty soon. And it's coincidental that you, you're doing that story because I pitched the same story to my editor yesterday about doing it with the wild stuff because it's just, it's crazy the stuff that they do. And I've been talking to players on other teams, you know, you know, you have always that guy in the middle right before line rushes that has to fish out the pucks from the net. And, you know, there was one game recently where one of

the players on another team was hurt. And all of a sudden, they realized they hadn't picked nobody to go do that. And, you know, there's, there's all types of stuff like that, you know, that happens during warmups. I'm working on some really cool stories. I'm doing one similar to what Jesse was doing, only a national story on intermissions and what it's like to be in an HL locker room during intermissions. And I've gotten some great stuff from basically every single locker room that I've been in. That will run at some point in January. I also, I had an incredible interview last week with Tanya Bassey, the daughter of Mike Bossi for my NHL 99 story I'm doing on one of my favorite players growing up as a kid. So looking forward to that.

Believe it or not, I did a Ryan Reeve story today, which Jesse I think you'll get a kick out of. But that long-awaited Jake Middleton story, it's running right after the break. I promise everybody there. Someday. Yeah, so I promise that will be out eventually. And then next Wednesday, the December 28th,

the day that we have Bill Armstrong on the show, I'll also be doing a story that is coupled with that on the Arizona Coyotes. So that Middleton story coming out early in 2024, I think is what is actually eventually going to come out. Guys, enjoy the time. off. We'll talk to you next week. I want to let everybody else know before we go. There's a lot of other great hockey talk now that you're done listening to us.

Chris Terry and joined Craig Custins on the Tuesday edition of The Athletic Hockey Show. Go give that a listen. And Luke Hughes is going to be with Haley Salvean and Sean Gentilly on the Friday edition of the Athletic Show. And if you still don't have everybody off your list as far as buying gifts, go get them an annual subscription to The Athletic for just $2 a month for a year when you visit Theathletic.com. slash hockey show. The Athletic Hockey Show returns Thursday with Ian Mendez and down goes Brown. We will be back next week. Our guest, Bill Armstrong, the general manager of the Arizona

Coyotes. For Jesse, Peruso, I'm Rob, happy whatever it is you celebrate. We'll see you next week.