The Athletic Hockey Show - Tom Fitzgerald on the improved New Jersey Devils, Jon Cooper to coach Canada at the 2022 Winter Olympics and Carter Hart's new deal with the Philadelphia Flyers

Episode Date: August 9, 2021

Tom Fitzgerald, the general manager of the New Jersey Devils joins Ian and Hailey to discuss the Devils off-season moves, led by the monster deal for free agent Dougie Hamilton, signing top 6 forward Tomas Tatar and drafting Luke Hughes.Ian and Hailey discuss Hockey Canada's announcement, naming Jon Cooper the head coach for Team Canada at the 2022 Winter Olympics and his all-star staff led by Barry Trotz, Peter Deboer and Bruce Cassidy.Mendes and Salvian take a look at the new contract signed by Philadelphia Flyers goaltender Carter Hart, who looks to have a bounce back season, after taking a step back in his sophomore season for the Orange and Black in 2021.As always, we wrap the podcast with multiple choice madness and we dip into the Hail-bag with questions on possible RFA targets and what player needs to embrace his full Nikita Kucherov, and not take himself so seriously during media availability. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome back, everybody. It's another brand new edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. Ian Mendezon, Haley Salveen, and with you to kick off your week, as always ahead on this show. We'll be joined by New Jersey Devils general manager Tom Fitzgerald to talk about major offseason improvements he's made to his club and whether or not they got playoff aspirations in New Jersey in that tough metro division. We'll discuss Carter Hart's new contract in Philly. Team Canada's coaching staff coming into picture for the Olympics. We'll open up the mailbag, answer some of your questions,

including what team would you cheer for if you were starting from scratch right now. And as always, we'll wrap up with a little multiple choice madness. Haley, hey, guess what? You know, you and I have been texting and thinking like, oh, wow, it's the dog days of summer. And maybe we're not going to have a ton to sink our teeth into. But hey, here we go on a Monday. Let's start with some significant news on the international hockey front. We're hoping that we'll have NHL players at the Olympic Games.

and Team Canada announces its bench staff for the Olympic Games in Beijing. So Haley, we're going to kick this off. John Cooper is going to be the head coach with Barry Trots, Bruce Cassidy, and Peter DeBore as the assistant. So again, John Cooper, the head coach for Team Canada, Bruce Cassidy, Barry Trots, Peter DeBore, your assistant coaches. That's a pretty stacked bench. Yeah, I mean, if those are just at least a couple of the options that you have to choose, from it's a really good problem to have when you're you're the management group for for hockey Canada and the the men's Olympic team specifically I mean that's quite the the roster of coaches

to choose from and when you have somebody like Barry Trott who you know when we do this podcast and we were talking about you know the best coach the coach of the year one of the best coaches ever or at least in the last decade or so I mean Barry Trotz is always kind of at the forefront of those conversations, and he's the assistant coach of this hockey team. So I think it just goes to show the strength of coaches that we have in this country that are coaching in the NHL. And I mean, I don't know if there was really anyone else who should have been the head coach other than John Cooper, just based on what we've seen from him the last couple of years. Surely you can have more people in the conversation.

I know I brought up Rod Brynda Moore in one of our last podcast. but I don't know how you could look at this group and have any complaints at all. You know what I think is really interesting? And now that we've got the roster for the coaching staff, like Joel Quenville is not part of it. And if you think about it for his second, Haley, this is a guy that's going to have ended up with three Stanley Cup rings as a head coach, right, with Chicago in 2010, 2013 and 2015.

And he'll never have coached Canada, likely won't coach Canada the best on best. Like, I guess maybe down the road he could, but it kind of feels like the window. a little bit as closed on him. And, and, you know, Mike Babcock was the guy in charge during those 2010, 2014 years. And I just, it's pretty interesting to me that Joel Quenville will have ended up with, like, how many guys would have coached their, you know, a team to three, multiple Stanley Cups and never had a chance to be the head coach of a best on best tournament, right?

Like, it's pretty remarkable in some ways. Yeah, it's interesting because I think, I think he was an assistant with the work. World Cup of hockey, but like never the head coach, like he never had the reins of team Canada. And again, when you think of the caliber of coach that you have in Joel Quenville, it is really strange. And I wonder if there's like, is it just the timing? Is it just that they had given Mike Babcock the reins for so long? And then, you know, now John Cooper's taken over and there just never was the window for Coach Q to step in. It is really interesting. I don't know if that's something that we really heard talked about just because again, you look at who it is and it's hard in that

moment to find kind of complaints about it, at least in this situation with John Cooper. But then, yeah, when you start to like look on the outside a little bit and think of, wait a second, there's this guy and this guy and this guy, again, I think it's a really good problem to have when you have somebody who, you know, your management group thinks is better than Joel Quenville to coach this team, or you have assistants who they think is. a better fit. I mean, it's a really good problem to have if you're Hockey Canada when when somebody like Joel Quenville doesn't quite make the cut for your coaching staff. Yeah, and Barry Trots is your assistant, like you said. This is a pretty stacked roster. But again, this is all predicated,

all predicated, like we're at the one yard line. Like, if we were going to use a football analogy, like, we're on the one yard line waiting to punch it in. But wouldn't it like, what happens if all of a sudden they're like, ah, you know what? The arrangement falls. through and NHL players don't go. The coaches don't go, obviously, because they'd be coaching their NHL teams. It'd just be kind of awkward, right?

Yeah. I guess they're kind of just announcing it now. So, and I'm sure the coach is already new, but it's probably just for the preparation stages. Or just to like generate some interest in hockey in August. And maybe just a little bit while Olympic, eyeballs are still kind of on Olympic stuff. You know, the 2020 games are now over and we're, what, six, seven months away from the winter games.

So it's a really weird period with going right from Tokyo to Beijing in such a small amount of time. But yeah, I guess it's just a preparation thing. But it is a little bit strange to announce the coaching staff before we even know if they're going to be there. Because you would think that if the NHL players don't go, the NHL coach. coaches won't go. So you're going to have to do what they did at the last Olympics and find a different coaching staff who are not NHL coaches. Yeah. Again, it leads you to believe that we're at the one yard line just waiting to punch it in. But hey, as the Seattle Seahawks will tell you, when you're at the one yard line, and sometimes you don't always put it in.

Not always a guarantee. No. I'm curious. You mentioned the summer Olympics. Now, you would definitely be too young for this. But there was actually one year in the 90s where we had this. summer and the Winter Olympics in the same year. In 1992, we had the Summer Olympics. I think we're in boy, I'm even blank a way. I know that the winter games were in Albertville, Albertville, France. And then they started switching them. And then, because back in the day, Haley, again, this is a story time for for Haley. Like the Olympics, the summer, the Winter Olympics used to be in the same year. Like, 1984, 88, always in the same year. And then they switched and started going. And started going. every two years, which I like.

But this is kind of cool that we're almost getting summer and winter Olympics back to back. And I don't know about you. And maybe it's because of the cycle. But I felt like I was really invested in the Summer Olympics this year. Like I was in. I was watching it a little bit more.

And I got to tell you, it was pretty cool. And our producer, Jeff, is telling us, yeah, the 92 Olympics were in Spain, in Barcelona. That's where the dream team, Michael Jordan and Larry Bird and Magic Johnson, that was the Dream team. The dream team. They were dunking on everybody. That was in 92 in Barcelona.

But I got to tell you, I was all in on the Olympics this year. And I'm kind of excited at the Winter Olympics, potentially with NHL or is like you said, like seven months down the road. Yeah, no, I was really invested too. You know, it was interesting. I ran in cross-country. and university and a lot of the women who would have raced in U-sports were actually named the Olympic team.

So I was really invested in a lot of the track events just because it was really cool to see people who like just completely destroyed me in cross country tolling the line at the Olympics. So that was really cool to see that and just, you know, have that degree of separation from some really incredible athletes. and the women's soccer was awesome. Like, you know, you even see the Americans who just wanted it so badly for Christine St. Clair, like to have Abby Wambach almost in tears watching Christine St. Clair win gold. Like, that is so meaningful.

And even Megan Rapino was hugging Christine Sinclair and saying congratulations. And we know that Megan Rapino does not like Canada. And she loves Christine Sinclair. They did play together in the National Women Soccer League. but like no American wants to lose to Canada but I think it just speaks volumes for the amount of respect that players internationally have for Canada's captain and the leading goal score and international soccer

so that was really cool to watch because you never had I never had those moments when I was young in Ontario playing soccer like I would watch like I had me a hand posters in my room like she was my she was my idol and that's an American because you saw the Americans winning the world Cup and playing deep into the medal rounds in different international events, and you didn't really see Canada in those spaces. So you didn't really see that opportunity for yourself in this country

when I was young. But now, this next generation, even just seeing like Julia Grosso score that goal, she's 20 years old, she grew up watching Christine Sinclair. And then she scored the goal to get Christine Sinclair her first gold medal. It was quite poetic. So I was very invested in some of the events. And it'll be good to see the Winter Olympics coming. And even in the next 10 days, we have women's world championships starting, which is going to be really unique for these women because they haven't played in 10 days. They haven't played in an international tournament in, you know, over two years now. And then they're going to have a world championships.

And then an Olympics six, seven months later, which is really unique. So it's going to be pretty packed schedule this year with lots of great men's and women's hockey. Yeah. And you know what? Later in the show, I got a shootout related question that kind of ties into soccer at the Olympics, but we'll make it into a hockey theme because, hey, this is a hockey podcast. And I'm sure some people are like, why are you guys talking about soccer? But, hey, listen, I do want to talk about the fact that we're into August, and we actually have some legitimate news.

Like I said, we talked about Team Canada naming their head coach and the coaching staff for the Olympic Games with John Cooper. and the Philadelphia Flyers drop a little bit of news on us, Haley on a Monday, inking a goaltender, Carter Hart to a three-year deal. Now, I'm going to ask you something here. You tell me what you think. So Carter-Hart signs a deal. It's a three-year deal for $11,937,000. Okay.

Why don't they just get to 11 years, 12 million? Like, what's the negotiation behind getting to 11,937,000? Like, like, how did that? How do you settle on that number? Do you ever wonder about that? Like, sometimes you see odd contracts with like, you know, this guy signed for $861,000. Like what leads you to sign for $11,937,000?

Yeah, I mean, sometimes you see it with players who want, like their lucky number involved, like with Sidney Crosby with the 8-7-8-7. I think Mitch Marner had a bit of like his number and his contract as well. I don't know. Like I don't know. Cardhart where's 79, but you think he was like. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, there is. Oh, in his AV. But do you think he was like, yeah, you got to get me seven. Wouldn't you be like, why don't you start with seven nine? Like I'll take a $7.9 million. But like, does it matter when your jersey? AAB?

That's funny. But your jersey number, I remember Sidney Crosby had a signed for 8.7 was the cap head. And, you know, my question is when you have your jersey number hidden. hidden in the middle of the contract number. Does that still, like, is that a thing? Did Carter Hart just do something here that I guess he was like, I want seven nine in the, in the contract? 3.979 is the AAV.

Yeah, I guess it's looking like it in the AAV. And I guess it's just they could have gone to four million. It could have stayed at 3.9, but he wanted that kind of superstitious number in there. And that's how the AAB worked out. And that's how you got to that weird. little combination there, I guess. Yeah, exactly. So I'm curious, though, like Carter Hart had a really tough season in, in, in, in, in, in,

in, uh, in, in, uh, in Philly. Right? Where he kind of rode the roller coaster. And I thought, when I was like at a Carter heart, I thought, hey, okay, this guy it's a one year deal. Carter Hart will sign for one year like a let's see where we're at, but he gets a three year deal. And I think that that shows some, a little bit of faith and trust from management in

Philly like, you're our guy, but it's not a. you know, four, five, six million dollar deal. It's three point, like I said, three point nine seven nine million. Are you surprised at the term on a goalie that struggled a little bit last year? Does it surprise you, Haley, that Philly went in on three years? Or does this, like it seems reasonable to me, but I also would have understood a one year, let's see where we're at deal for Carter. Yeah, I guess I think that this, like you just mentioned, I think it shows a confidence in

Carter Hart that he's still going to be the guy in Philadelphia. and I think kind of striking that bridge contract. I mean, it kind of sets Carter Hart up to be paid quite well if he ends up being what they hope he would be because his qualifying offer will need to be $4.479 million in 2024. So, I mean, it's a good deal for for Carter Hart for sure because it sets him up with that kind of flexibility in his career for his next contract. Once this three-year deal is up. But I don't know. I just think that is one difficult year enough to make you question what you have in Carter Hart? And is that enough to make you potentially put yourself in a weird, in a bad position with who could be the goalie of the future? These negotiations now,

sometimes they seem to get so personal and it's not just business all the time. So if you're offering Carter Hart, you know, a smaller one-year bridge deal, what is that doing for Carter Hart in terms of the way that he, Carter Hart and his agent, what does that do for the way that he trusts the GM for the next contract negotiation or for the way that he plays the next season? So I think maybe a little bit of that goes into it. But I think they're kind of just striking that. Here's a bridge deal. Show us what you can do.

And if you show that you are the goalie of the future here, you're setting yourself up for, you know, a pretty lucrative contract in 2024. Yeah. Like, it seems like a super reasonable deal, right? Like, it's like the definition, if you want to look at the definition of a bridge deal, this should be it. It's the, you need to show us, but we'll pay you a little bit. Like, to me, Haley, last year, Carter Hart was atrocious in the month of March.

He played 10 games. His save percentage in March was 815. His goals against was north of five, okay? So he was, he was an unmitigated disaster in March. But he did bounce back. I double-checked. I was like, I feel like Carter Hart ended okay. his last five starts of the year,

9-10 save percentage, 231 goals again. So maybe he kind of ends on a pretty good note. I think if you're Philadelphia, this has been your guy. You know, this is the guy that you've thought was going to be your guy

in the blue paint for the next decade. So I don't hate this deal. I was just curious, hey, would it have made sense to do a one year, you know, $3 million deal? Let's see where you're at. But yeah, like you said,

this could be a heck of a deal. for Philadelphia. If Carter Hart turns into the goalie that we thought he was, in fact, remember last year there was some talk that when we didn't know like kind of how Kerry Price was playing, and we were looking at goalies for Team Canada at the Olympic Games. Like people were talking about Carter Hart maybe being in the mix, right? Yeah. Well, imagine what this contract would have looked like if Carter Hart didn't take a step back next season, this last season. So it's interesting to see just the way that things change year over year. And while I think we both think that it's kind of a reasonable deal,

Frank Saravali did tweet that this is one of the highest AABs for a goalie second contract. You know, Henrik Lungwisps, obviously him and Babrofski both had really big deals, 4.25 million, 5.6 to 5 million on their second contracts. Matt Murray had 3.75. Vasilleschi had 3.5. So I guess when you're looking at the group there and seeing, you know, the kind of contract comparables for Carter Hart, you're probably hoping that he ends up leaning more towards the Vasseliske's, that kind of career trajectory with that contract and hoping he ends up playing like the guys that he's being paid like. All right. Tell you what, Haley, we're just talking about Carter Hart and his deal with the Philadelphia Flores. Why don't we stick in that metropolitan division? Bring in the general manager. of the New Jersey Devils, Tom Fitzgerald,

joining us here on the athletic hockey show. Tom, thanks so much, thanks so much for doing this. How are you today? I'm doing great, thanks, guys. It's my pleasure to be on with you. Hey, listen, first question, we've got to ask,

because it feels like it's a quiet time in the NHL cycle, the new cycle draft is past, expansion draft free agency. Does Tom Fitzgerald actually get to take some quiet time in August? Do you have, like, vacation plans here, or what? It should be known.

The reason why I had to delay you guys was because I went for a run and I was sweating. So I just had to cool down a bit. But you know what? It is a slower time right now. Yes, I would say the second half of August coming up, really slow down and try to get away. You know, my family vacation was smack dab in the middle of draft because of the obviously, everything was pushed back.

But yeah, I'd like to kind of get away from the office, relax, unwind, stop drinking out of a fire hose hair and just get ready for the season. Well, we appreciate the post-run shower. I mean, it is on Zoom, so, you know, it wasn't in person, so it would have been fine if you didn't. But that's great. You know, just mentioning everything being so tight, packed in this year, I mean, you've been, you started as the interim GM in January 2020. So this has kind of been a strange one and a half years for you as general manager of the New Jersey Devils. Are you looking forward to an 82 game season?

a year with a little bit more normalcy? For sure. Yeah, you're right. It's been a whirlwind going back to that day in January. And, you know, but all I could do is embrace it and do my best with the opportunity and the responsibilities of the organization. Yeah, it's been, you know, you have a shortened season because of the COVID and then another shortened season because of COVID and things aren't, things aren't normal. Now we see things, you know, getting back to normalcy.

and I think everyone is welcoming normal back, seeing fans in all the arenas, the travel restrictions, not just being with your team, getting out and scouting, watching other players, other teams, your own prospects, things that we're all accustomed to. So, yeah, I would say I'm not the only one looking forward to. I'd say my brother and general managers are all looking for the same change and normalcy back into our life. You know, Tom, one of the biggest reasons why Haley and I wanted to have you on the podcast

is I think a lot of people look at New Jersey and say, the devils are the most improved team year over year. And I think a lot of people look at the signing of Dougie Hamilton as kind of the reason for that. And I think our listeners would love to kind of get a, I guess, a little peek behind the curtain, so to speak, on how you sold Dougie Hamilton on coming to New Jersey. Well, he definitely was a big fish that we really were out hunting for. You know what? We've got a really good young core players that the future looks very bright for New Jersey.

I think we're drafting well, we're developing well. But the end of the day, you have to, you really have to surround these young prospects, these young budding stars with experience in the league. We believe we've got some really good young D coming. They're not ready, of course. It did take a little bit longer. We feel where we're really, we felt very comfortable. goal with what we have today and what we have coming.

On the back end, like I mentioned, we've got some good young players coming. But at the end of the day, we saw the growth in Jack Hughes' game. You know, we saw glimpses of Nico in between injuries, you know, like, okay, this is really what we have. And we're going to build around these two guys. But how do we do that? How do we, I don't want to say, you know, propel this thing forward, but give it a little kickstart, you know, support these guys.

I do think it's important that this group understands what meaningful games are. And that's our goal this year is to play those meaningful games right down to the end. Whatever happens happens. But I do think those meaningful games will pay off and experience. And, you know, Dougie Hamilton, you know what? It just, we sold them on, you know, where we are currently, where we want to go and how he can help us and actually make a legacy for himself and join some of the greats that are, that have played for the New Jersey Doves and get us back to help us get us back. to relevancy and, you know, get us back to playing meaningful games to have a chance to play

for championships. So I personally, you know, really pushed New Jersey as a hidden gem. It's a great place to live. We've got a great fan base. If you're into New York City, you could live in Hoboken, New Jersey City. The suburbs are fantastic golf courses. One-stop shopping with our arena. We practice and play there. The travel is incredible. in our area. You can add on some time at the back end of your career. So there's a lot of positives that we try to sell all the prospects on or all the free agents on.

And we were lucky he picked us and we're very fortunate. And you mentioned, you know, not fully propelling forward, but, you know, having, you know, the next steps taken. Do you see Dougie as being part of your leadership group that can kind of help your younger core? take those steps forward and also kind of bring that kind of veteran experience to the room while still being quite young in his prime? For sure.

I mean, he played, he played as a 19-year-old in the league. He's played for a great organization in Boston, experience, culture, and what a strong culture is all about. And, you know, I'm sure he parlayed that and took that experience to Calgary and right on to Carolina. So, yeah, that's exactly what I personally, with every player's responsibilities. are to lead and share their experiences from past teams to help our young kids. You know, Jack, Nico, all they know is this. You know, if someone can bring in something different from the outside and help, you know, educate these young kids on culture and winning

and just doing the right things, playing the right way, treating your body the right way to fully, fully, you know, utilize your skill set. I just think that's part of every new player's responsibility and especially experienced guys. So, yeah, we expect that from him. And I don't expect anything less. A lot of focus, Tom, on Dougie Hamilton being the big, splashy, free agent. But, you know, I think you guys made a pretty shrewd signing in Thomas Tatar. He's a guy that a lot of people look at, analytics community.

They love him. He's a little bit of a darling. Why was Thomas Tatar on the market so long? And were you surprised that he was hanging around into August? Yeah, I mean, I'm surprised he's a good player. I think for our strategy was more patience, you know, just, you know, find the right fit, the right player that we feel can help elevate our young sentiment's game. And Thomas fit that.

Like, he's not old. He's very experienced. He's played in markets like Montreal and Detroit, Vegas for a short time. He's experienced playoffs. He's had ups and downs in playoffs. So, you know, I think that experience itself has a lot of weight. We're just lucky because we were looking for top six winner, versatile top six winner, one who has the ability to produce,

one who can think the game well and think with the players that we have, one who respected, you know, a 200-foot game like Thomas does. Yeah, to us it was a no-brainer. But again, like Thomas chose us. like we just went after him and try to sell him on what we can offer him. And at the end of the day, he chose us. He saw the good in us and felt that he could really help us move this thing forward. And I mean, just to go a little bit further back to the draft,

and I mean, it's not too far back because everything was so packed in together in about a 10-day stretch. But I think most of us saw Jack Hughes's reaction when you stepped up to the podium and drafted his brother. I thought it was one of the best parts of the draft, just seeing how excited he was. But what made Luke Hughes the right selection for the New Jersey Devils at number four? There are a lot of good players we could have chosen.

With that being said, you know, I've always preached highest sailing. You know, who's got the highest upside? And when you look at his age, he's the youngest player in the draft, barely making this year's draft. He's going to play in a great program at Michigan with great players, which will push him. And it's not just big games. It's practicing against the Matt Gineers in the Johnson's and obviously being pushed by own power.

And all the other great players that they have at Michigan and they have a great coaching staff. So that first was something we're extremely comfortable with. But at the end of the day, this was all about Luke Hughes and his upside and his sailing. He's six foot two and he's all of that. He can skate. He's a transitional defenseman.

you know, someone who has great offensive instincts, just puck moving in all three zones. And I think the age played into it. And then on top of it, he's a leader. You know, he is a leader. And those are characteristics that we look for in our players as well. You know, I think what a lot of people may not realize is that you were teammates way back in the day, Providence College with the Hughes Boys father, Jim.

And I'm wondering, like, what is that like in terms of, I'm sure you would need to separate any personal connection you have with a family with the professional side, but at the same time, I would imagine having some extra intel and knowing the family a little bit may help you in a in a scouting situation. Well, you're right. Jim Hughes was a, not only a teammate, but he was a good friend in college. And quite honestly, a big reason why I went to Providence on my recruiting trip. He just, he helped sell me on the school. And we instantly became friends.

And, you know, I spent two years at Providence College. always had a relationship with Jim. And yeah, the irony here is these are his kids. And his wife, Ellen, they've done a great job, raising the three boys and not only great hockey players, but, you know, really good character young men. And that's a tip to that to the parents. But, yeah, this is business. Like, this had nothing to do with a relationship I had 30-plus years ago with his dad.

these two players make New Jersey Devils much better being in the organization. And we know what they're going to bring. You know, I look forward to that day, you know, when both brothers play, take the ice together at the Prudential Center. So it's going to be an exciting time. But Luke also knows, like, he's got to put the time and effort in the work. And this is just the start of the pro career. The rest is all up to him.

But we trust the fact that, you know, with the family lineage and the, work and pride they take and a passion and have for honky, that we'll hit that ceiling to work because it's just, why wouldn't he? Like the brothers. So last one from me here, Tom, and it is a little bit of an aside, but just sticking with Providence College, looks like Lou Lamarillo was your director of player personnel during the last season you would have spent there. Was the Lou Lamarillo in 86, 80s? the same one that you kind of deal with here in the NHL? Well, ironically, Lou was our athletic director of Providence.

He was a long-time coach prior to me going there. Another reason why I went to Providence was because of the program that he built. And the amount of National Hockey League players that came from Providence College at that time was a big draw for me because I just wanted to be in the National Hockey League. I wanted to go to a program that helped, you know, get to, you know, help you make that next step. And I felt Lou's program always did that. Now, Mike McChain was my coach,

but he was handpicked by Lou Lammarillo. So it was some, some tendencies of Mike that I'm sure Lou looked at himself or saw himself. But yeah, he was my athletic director of my freshman year, and that spring of 87, he left for New Jersey. Seeing Mr. Lamarolo, it was really, all the years I played and just a, just a fantastic person. And I got to say, like, my transition into managing, Lou was the first call I got, you know, to anything he could help

me with. And he's been a, he's been a mentor that way. We've done a couple of deals. And, you know, if, if I had any questions, like, he would pick up the phone in a heartbeat. So I really, I really appreciate that. But it is ironic that he was my athletic director back in 1986. Is he one of the most maybe misunderstood people from our side of the fence? I think a lot of people look at Lou Lamarillo and they think here's this sort of iron-fisted guy that rules in a certain way. And yet when you're on your side of the fence, here's a man who's willing to share some experience and help people in the industry. And maybe we don't see the Lou Lamarillo that you see. You know what?

Lou's been successful for a reason. You know, he's a culture-driven person who, I would think he treats people right. He treats people right. And he's a true gentleman. And the only regret I have, actually, is never being able to play for him, you know, in my 17 years. I think it would have been a fantastic experience. It would have been a winning experience because of the program he built. I can't speak to, you know, what he does with the media.

All I know is he's treated me extremely well. I'm very appreciative of that, and he's a true gentleman. And a final question for you here, Tom, have you allowed yourself the opportunity to think about, let's say two or three years from now, you've got this great young corps that is building towards hopefully a championship. And then across the Hudson River,

you've got the New York Rangers who are also building, a great young core towards a champion. pitch of have you thought about three years from now, four years from now, what this rivalry might look like if both these teams hit their ceilings?

I'll be honest if that happened. The only thing I worry about is in Jersey doubles. And I live in the present and I try not to get too far ahead of myself. I like to live day to day. But with that being said, when you're drafting and developing, you're doing it for the future. So

there's a part of that can't wait for that to really come to fruition and these young kids become men. And they finally grow into their man body. And they're playing the game at the level that we all expect them to play. And the team across the river is on the same path as us, so be it. I'm just worried about our young team in New Jersey

and completely excited about this as well. Well, yeah, and you should be. It's a pretty exciting time to be a New Jersey devil. We appreciate the time. Tom, thanks for joining us, Haley and I, on the athletic hockey show. And best of luck, and fingers crossed, the New Jersey Devils are playing some meaningful games this season.

So my pleasure, guys, anytime. Thank you. Thank you, so much. All right. Yeah, you too. Thank you. Thanks so much. Yeah.

All right, Haley, that fun conversation with Tom Fitzgeral, general manager of the New Jersey Devils, and I hope you appreciate. I had an internal struggle going on, Haley, during that conversation. Oh, God. Because he talked about Dougie Hamilton being the big fish in free agency. And then I had a segue.

to Thomas Tatar. And I thought, oh, it's sitting right there. A fish to tar. And I left it alone. I left it alone because I didn't want to get a wawt, from Tom Fitzgerald. Yeah, I'm very proud of you. So I have to have to like,

I would have had to like, I would have had to like shame you in front of an NHL general manager if he would have made that pun. So then it would have been really awkward because you would have been like, what's wrong with these two? Because you would have been, I wouldn't be able to hide my,

disdain on my face if you made a pun like that to Tom at G. I just would have been like, no, I would have apologized on your behalf. But I just need you to know that there is restraint. There is restraint. Maybe he's a pun guy. Maybe he listens to this and he hears this chat. Maybe he hears me, oh, that would have been a good pun. Maybe he's a fun guy.

We don't know. Yeah. Imagine making, I'm sorry. I'm going on a tangent here. What? G like what G. M. Or coach,

it's August. It's fine. What GM or coach would like, like, obliterate you the most if you made like a dad joke or pun to. Lou? Yeah. You would make like a joke and he'd be like,

uh, uh, it'd be like the laser eyes. And I feel like like Kyle, Kyle Dubas would give me a courtesy laugh. He's just too polite. Yeah, super fake laugh though.

Like a fake laugh. Like ha ha ha. And then that, I feel like John Cooper you can have some fun with a little bit. I don't know if anyone's a pun guy. Sorry, Ian. Yeah, I don't think. We're going to have to have more GMs and coaches on the show to keep you in check. No, I think, yeah, exactly.

How do you stop Ian from making bad puns? Just have high ranking hockey officials join the show at all times. Let's open up the mailbag here because we got some questions to answer from social media. And this is actually a really interesting one, okay? This comes in from Andre Haley on Twitter, who said, here's a hypothetical question for the gang at the athletic hockey show. If you were just introduced to the sport of hockey today

and you had to pick an NHL team to be a fan of and you had no pre-existing history that connected you to any team, what team would you pick and why? Would you pick someone because of their players and their personality, the style of play, outreach, PR work, etc., etc., So, Haley, let's wipe the slate clean.

Okay? And you've talked about this when you were growing up. You were a Pittsburgh Penguins fan. And I think once you start covering the game, we kind of put our allegiances on the back burner. And we don't really cheer for a team so much as we cheer for people. But let's indulge Andre with a hypothetical. Haley is brand new.

And I'll answer this after you, too. But you're brand new. You're being parachuted into the NHL. You got free reign. Who you pick in? Yeah. And don't say Tampa. Don't say Tampa.

No, it's such a tough question because I do think it depends like, like, and you have no preexisting like information. Like, do you know who Sidney Crosby is? Do you know who Alex Ovechkin is? Like, it's such a hard question because I feel like if you're brand new, you're going to be drawn towards, you know, a specific player that you like or that you've heard about. Maybe you've seen an interview. Maybe you just know who this person is.

I do think that, like, a team like Pittsburgh is an easy one to choose because you have somebody like Sidney Crosby on that roster. A team like Seattle, if you're parachuting in right now, like you're brand new. We talked about this on the live show before, right? Like, if you're brand new, you're parachuting in, why not start with a team that is like one day old? Yeah. They haven't even played yet.

That's a really natural starting point. Yeah. you can just choose the back-to-back Stanley Cup champions, but like I don't recommend you doing that. I don't know. You've got to find something a little bit more fun than that. Like I'm sure there's people who are going to pick like Edmonton because of Connor McDavid. Yeah. Like that's an easy one for people. They just say, okay, who am I going to cheer for? Who's the best player in the world right now? Colorado is a really easy team to jump on the bandwagon for.

Nathan McKinnon, Kale McCar, Gabe Landiscaug. Hold on, though. Hold on. Nathan McKinnon's eating habits may have turned some people off. I'm gluten intolerance, so I like the chickpea pasta behind them. Like I am, it's so funny. Like some of the memes that were coming out of that were hilarious. I thoroughly enjoyed the Nathan McKinnon chippe pasta discourse over the weekend. Like that's peak August trending on Twitter stuff.

Oh, it was awesome. Yeah. So would you ever pick? I don't have an answer. or like, I don't have one team. I'm not doing it. But you throw out some pretty good examples to me, like Seattle, get in on the ground floor,

Crosby, McDavid, you're going to pick a favorite team or McKinnon. Would you ever pick, okay, let me ask it to you this way. Let's say you didn't know much about hockey and you just started watching and you were inclined to pick like a jersey that look cool to you. What would that be? Like, what's the one jersey that you're like, yeah, you know what?

I can start cheering for them because I think a lot of kids do that. Oh, 100%. sort of get kind of pulled into the game as they like a certain jerseys there are a jersey now that you're like yeah i could i could see a kid getting getting drawn in by a certain jersey i mean if we're talking reverse retroes um the blasty jerseys in calgary were like the full blasty kit is like i know it probably sounds biased but like that's a really cool um full uniform especially when you saw like jacob markstrom and dave riddick's like full goalie gear and they had the blasty pads and the mask and everything,

like that is something that I think a lot of people can get behind. The 2D sense logo is really cool. The all-black 2D sense jerseys are pretty awesome, but it's not like an animal. Like, I'm sure if you're a kid, you're going to look at the penguins because you think the penguins or like the sharks because you think sharks are cool. Like if you're a kid and you're just looking at the,

The mascot, kids love Carlton the Bear and stuff. But in terms of a really cool jersey, I'm trying to think, because all I see is the reverse retroes because I just thought they were, most of them were so much better than the regular jerseys. Like the Kings one was really cool. I actually thought the L.A. Kings might have been the best reverse retro. Especially if you're like a basketball fan transitioning into hockey, you get like the L.A. The L.A. Lakers kind of style.

Like that's really cool. if you're a big basketball fan, you like Kobe Bryant. Nowadays, if you want LeBron because he's with the Lakers, like, that's really cool too. But yeah, I don't, I think this is a, again, I'm saying this is my like phrase the day, but it's a good problem to have when you have a number of teams that you could kind of hand select for a brand new fan to say, take your pick. You know, it's not just one team right now where it's like, this is probably the only one you should be looking at.

You know, we have quite the selection if you're looking to, hop on a bandwagon and start fresh with an organization. But don't pick Vegas. I don't know why, but I just don't find them likable. Like, don't. No, they're not likable anymore.

They've lost their... I don't know what I don't like it. I don't... What happened? It was cute and fun. Yeah. To like I, they're like the evil empire already within five years.

Okay, what about this? I thought you and I were driving the boss in the Florida Panthers. Like, wouldn't you love, like Florida Panthers are a fun team? Super fun. Yeah.

I'm just a little upset about it still. To the Panthers. I'm hurt. Fun team. Good Young Corps, kind of forward-thinking organization. I like the Florida Panthers. I think they'd be a fun team to get behind. Yeah, I'm just a little hurt about the way they blew up my bracket still.

They blew up my bracket, too. You're a little more forgiving than I am. Yeah. Okay, let's read one more question from the mailbag this week on Twitter. This one comes in from Dan who says, hey, here's a fun question for you guys. Hockey Twitter seems to lose its collective mind when a player shows even a touch of person think of Nikita Kucherov and his post Stanley Cup press conference, people were saying it's in poor taste, yada, yada, yada.

Here's the question from Dan saying, name a player who you think could be a little bit more fun and show off some personality. Because I think what's actually really cool about Dan's question, I don't know, maybe you knew this about Nikita Kuturov? I didn't. I didn't know until this year's playoffs that Nikita Kuturov was this like larger than life, outgoing personality. And all I was thinking,

Haley, was how many more guys are like Nikita Kutrov? Who are like these awesome characters and willing to play the part of like the black hat villain that, like, but they just never get interviewed on a national stage or we don't hear from them.

Like, I didn't know this was Kutrov. So Dan is asking, who would you like to see a little bit more personality and fun from in the national hockey league? I mean, I think that it would be really good for the game if we stop. having the, like, look at how miserable Connor McDavid looks, or, like, is he always this bored, or is he always this, like, cranky?

Because I think most of the times when we see Connor McDavid, it's the same kind of interview or it's the same facial expressions. And I get it. He's a competitor, and he really cares about winning. And obviously, that hasn't quite happened in Edmonton the way that they would have hoped. But I think having, like, the star of the league showing personality is, like, never going to be a bad thing. I'm sure people who don't like the Edmonton Oilers will find things to nitpick about if Connor McDavid says something fun, but it could be good for the game if you have your star

player showing their personality a little bit more instead of just people talking about, yeah, he's really good at hockey, but like he's so boring or he's so cranky or whatever. I just, you know, I'm sure Connor McDavid has a personality. He just doesn't show it. And I think a lot of that starts with the media training that these players get at a really young age coming into the OHL. It's kind of drilled into, or really anywhere that they're playing, not just the OHL, but it's kind of drilled into them, the can dancers, the way to act, the way to portray yourself.

And I think it's unfortunate because maybe he does have a great personality. Maybe Connor McDavid's really funny. We don't get to see that. And I think that would be a good thing for the marketability of the game and even just the marketability of Connor McDavid, even though he does have some, I'm sure, lucrative sponsorship deals. But I mean, Sidney Crosby kind of. laid the foundation for that too. He was never the most fun and exciting person in interviews.

So really, like, I don't know if there's one player that I would pick. I just think that it would be really good for the game if the stars were able to show that kind of personality. And really anybody. Like, you see it's so often in other leagues, in other sports, the personality that these players show. And we don't really get to see that unless they're on, like, a player's only podcast. It would be nice to be able to see these players' personalities on a more widely viewed platform. Yeah, but I think part of it is on us too, right? Like we got to ask some questions. Yes, for sure.

That make athletes comfortable. But a lot of that, too, is you've got to develop a rapport with them. If all of a sudden, Connor McDavid dropped in on the podcast, we'd have a harder time doing this than somebody who covers the Oilers on a regular beat. But yeah, I'd love to see those guys. I even feel like Nate McKinnon has some personality. Although the only thing we see is like McKinnon and Crosby, they do those Tim Horton's commercials.

I'm like, oh. You see it a little bit. You see it. It's just there, but it's not quite, I don't know, it's just quite, it doesn't quite reach,

you know, doesn't quite reach the threshold of what we would think. But I do think that there's lots of room in the game. And you always hope that, like, I don't know much about Alexis Lafranier. Yeah. But I feel like you're in New York City, your first overall pick.

I'd love to know more about Lafranier, right? Like, I don't really feel like that's, you know, part of the thing with him, you know? Yeah. And I think you look at some of the players, and I will say, obviously, again, and it comes down to the rapport thing. But there's some really good personalities in that Senator's locker room. And, like, there are some players who have. great personalities and they aren't afraid to show it on off camera, on, off the record. And that's just so huge for the fan base and for the team. Like Brady Kachuk is, he's not afraid to show

who he is, whether or not someone's recording and, you know, that can't be, like, looked at highly enough. I think it's great. And there's even more players than just Brady who, who have great personalities in that room and some of that comes with just being there and seeing it. But again, you know, how many gifts have we seen of Brady doing something on the bench that just go viral, him flossing, him doing certain things in the community? I mean, that's a great thing that the Sends have there and Brady. But flossing is done now, right? Like, help me up because you're the flossing. I feel like flossing is like the new dabbing where it's like it, that feels like it's 2015. Oh, no? No, I still do it. Oh, yeah. I'm starting to question.

you now. I thought flossing and dabbing were out. Yeah, I, I, I flossed at when I worked in Ashwa as the inn arena host. We would have like the floss cam and, and they would always put me on it embarrass me. And we have it. There's a clip of me flossing and I did the dab too. And, uh, I posted the clip a couple years ago along with the, um, the one little thing like, how do you do fellow kids? Oh, I love that. Yeah, with the backwards hat and skateboard. That's me. That's me. That's me flossing. How do you do fellow kids? Yeah. It's terrible. Okay. I'll never do it again. I'm going to encourage

our listeners to go on to social media and just search Haley Salvian flossing and hopefully that video pops up. All right. Let's wrap up the show, Haley, this Monday podcast, as we always do with a little multiple choice badness here. So I've got a couple of questions for us to tackle to wrap up this Monday edition of the show. Here's question number one. Which non-playoff team from last season are you the most certain will make the playoffs next season? is it A, the New Jersey Devils, B, the New York Rangers,

see the Dallas stars, D, the Calgary Flames, or E, you can go off the board, pick somebody else. So we're looking for a team that missed the playoffs last year that you think will make it this year. And of course, just giving you the heads up, Tom Fitzgerald may still be listening at this point in the podcast. Keep that in mind, the Devils are an option. Yeah.

You know, I think you could realistically go for anyone A through D. you know, I don't know what else the Rangers have up their sleeves. I know that they're, they had reportedly been interested in Jack Eichel. I mean, if they, they go out and make a move for Ikel, it, you know, we can probably say the Rangers for sure. Um, the flames have been in and out on Jack Eichel too. So it's hard to answer this one right now and we still feel like there's maybe some more moves to come. I do think that the, the devils have, have added the most to their roster when you look at it right now. Like they're, you know, if it's all on paper right now. So we have to keep that in mind.

But I think if the devils can take what they have on paper and actually, you know, take the right steps and play the right way, I think the devils do have a good chance at making the playoffs. But they are in a difficult division. So part of me wants to say the Calgary Flames just because they are going to be in that Pacific division. I know they haven't made the big splash that people want them to.

I mean, Blake Coleman is a nice addition for that team, especially coming after two back-to-back Stanley Cups with Tampa. And they added some pieces that will make them harder to play against, especially with Darrell Sutter as the coach. But really at the end of the day, they're in a pretty weak Pacific division. And really the only team that we can say is going to make the playoffs is Vegas. And after that, it's pretty open between, you know,

Calgary, Seattle, Edmonton, maybe Vancouver. So I think it'll be, I think that'll be the easiest team out of these ones to get a playoff spot because of how easy that Pacific division is going to be. Yeah, I think I think you're right. I think I almost think I'm going to steal a soccer term from you and say that that metro division is like the group of death. Honestly, like that's a murderous row where Philly the Rangers and the Devils. There's three really good teams who all missed the playoffs last year.

You know, I guess Philadelphia is another team that I think of. And we were talking about Carter Hart earlier in the show. If he plays well, I could see Philly making the playoffs next year. But, man, I think I'm going to agree with you on Calgary because Vegas is a lock-ed-in-in-in-in playoff team. I think Edmonton is a playoff team, all things being equal, but the defense has some question marks. Gold-hining is always a question mark. But I think Vancouver's a better team year over year. But are they better than Calgary?

I don't know. And I don't know what to make of those California teams. So I'm with you. I think if I have to pick amongst them. the Devils Rangers, Stars, Flames, or any non-playoff team? I think Calgary might have the best chance to make the playoffs. Okay, on to question number two. Multiple Choice Madness here, Haley.

I'm going to give you a list of $10 million players for next season. These are all players whose cap hit and their salaries 10 million next year. Which one of these guys is facing the most pressure next season? Is it A, Jack Eichael, B, Mitchell Marner, C, Sergey Bobrovsky, or D, Eric? Carlson. Haley, they're all $10 million players. Who's got the most heat on them for next season? Probably Mitch Marner just because the nature of playing in Toronto and just based on what happened in the playoffs last year, how much he struggled. I think even if Mitch Marner comes out and has an incredible regular season, there's still going to be pressure on him because it's going to say, okay, great. Yeah, you did in the regular season again, but what about the playoffs?

So I feel like we're in this place where it doesn't really matter what Mitch Marner does in the regular season anymore. He's just expected to be good, but that doesn't matter because he's been good in the regular season and bad in the playoffs in the past. So I think Mitch Martin is going to have the most pressure. And Toronto's just a huge market. You look at some of these players, I mean, Jack Eichael's going to have pressure coming off that injury, starting with whatever new team he's on, depending on what market he ends up in. There's going to be pressure on all these players. But I don't know if there's anything that's going to add. more than what Leafs fans will put on Mitch Marner.

Boy, like I guess if you're going to account for the market in this one, Marner is probably the leader. But I mean, you could make a case for Sergey Bobrovsky because Spencer Knight is breathing down that guy's neck and Bob's got the $10 million contract. But I'm going to say Ikel. Haley, I do think it's Jack Eichol because no matter what side of the fence that you sit on if you're pro-Ikel, you're pro-sabors or you don't even have a horse in the race, it's a bad

situation and it has become toxic and wherever he goes there's going to be pressure or people say you want it out of Buffalo now let's see what you can do right like you want it out you wanted you wanted it like

let's see who is the problem was it Jack Eichel or was it the Buffalo Sabres and Buffalo fans are going to be like what if the answer is both what if they're both the problem right like that's just how Sabres fans are conditioned to think

but I think wherever Ikele ends up Haley he's going to have the most pressure on his shoulders. Okay, on the question number three, multiple choice madness. Okay? We're going to put you in a fictitious

hockey pool fantasy draft for like a few weeks from now. And let's say it's your turn to draft a goalie and Haley, your friend, they have selected Andrei Vasilowski. So Vazelowski's off the board and now it's Haley's choice to pick a goalie for her fantasy hockey team. Who are you taking if Vazelofsky's off the board? Is it A, Darcy Kemper in Colorado, B, Robin Lennar in Vegas. C. Andre, Igor, Schasturkin in New York, D. Conner Hellebuck in Winnipeg.

E, the Flower, Mark Andre Fleury in Chicago, or F, you can go anywhere else. If you think there's another goalie somewhere, Freddie Anderson in Carolina, or Kerry Price in Montreal, or, you know, whatever else you want to go, you go. But Vasilewski's off the board. Who you take it in a fantasy hockey draft that you? you know is going to get you 30, 35 wins, a couple of shutouts and maybe get the 50 starts that you need. Connor Hellebuck for me, I think that when you even just look at the numbers that he, I mean, he plays a lot for one.

You know, last year he had most of the net with Laurent Beauxois backing him up. And you look at the struggles that that Jets defense has had the last couple years. And Hellebuck is still one of the top goalies in the league. despite, you know, maybe a difficult-looking decor in front of him. You know, that was one of the biggest things that Winnipeg was addressing this off-season was trying to, you know, make their defense better. And Hellebuck was still playing great. So I think that's a credit to how good he is and how dominant he is as a goaltender.

And they went out and made some moves to make their blue line better this off-season. So how good is Hellebuck going to be with a better defense in front of him? you know, he was on my heart ballot a year of last year. Yeah. That's how good he was with Winnipeg and, you know, winning the Vesna too. So I think Connor Halebuck's an easy choice for me just because he gets the wins and he gets a lot of the minutes. You know what?

Give me Darcy Kemper. And I think it's because obviously the Avalanche realized we need to get a goalie, so they paid a premium, paid a first-round pick to Arizona. He's had a couple of really good seasons with the coyotes. A couple of years ago, same percentage was around 925. If that's the Darcy Kemper, the avalanche are getting, and the avalanche come back and they're firing on all cylinders and they're like a 50 win team. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility. Darcy Kemper wins 35, 40 games, 35, I think.

So I like them, but that's partially a function of I think the a V's might be the best team in this group of goalies. Okay. Last question. And we brought up the fact that, you know, the Canadian women's. soccer team won a gold medal, but they did so, Haley, in a shootout. Now, I noticed my timeline was not filled with people belly aching and complaining about the shootout on this side of the border because I think here's what happens. Do you agree or disagree?

So here's the final question, multiple choice madness. Basically, it's this. I'm going to boil it down in simple terms. Do you think that people only complain about the shootout when their favorite team loses? Agree or disagree? This is my theory. I think when your favorite team, and let's use hockey as an example, when your team wins in a shootout, you're like, ah, this is awesome, this is great. But when you lose, you're like, ah, stupid loser point.

This is dumb. Do you agree with that? I think people only complain about the shootout when they're on the wrong end of it. Agree or disagree? Yeah, well, I think it makes it easier to stomach that there's a shootout if your team wins. They win a gold medal. They get the two points. But then, yeah, like if they lose, you have this hatred for the shootout plus your hatred of losing.

So you get just like extra mad. Whereas if you win, you're not going to complain about it as much. Like I don't like the shootout, but I just think it's been there for so long, like we're used to it by now. But like even if, like if they lose, I'm going to be even more cranky about it. Because it's just like, well, I've hated this for so long. And then they just lost and now I'm even more angry about it. But yeah, I think I'd agree with that.

But I think for me, like if you still hate them, you're not going to complain about hating them if your team wins. So I agree. Yeah, I think so. I think we need to figure this out from people because I don't see people complaining about the shootout when you win. And then it goes for hockey. Like I remember when the Flyers beat the Rangers to get into the playoffs the last day

of the regular season, I think it was 2010. Like it was all like, people are like, this is awesome. This is great. But those were Flyers fans. Rangers fans are like, this is stupid. We lost out on the playoffs because of a shootout. And I always think it always is in the back of my mind like, man, people like when, when Canada lost in the, uh,

Olympics in Nagano on a shootout. We're like, oh, the stupid shootout. I can tell you, if we had won that shootout, nobody would complain. Nobody would complain. That's my theory. All right, Haley, we're going to have to leave it there. This was a jam pack. Hey, for an August edition of the Athletic hockey show.

Not bad. Not bad. Not bad. Not bad. All right. Hey, listen, have a great week. Enjoy hopefully a little bit of a nice weather in Calgary. I know your schedule is about to get super busy on the print side of things with the women.

you know, world championships taking place in about 10 days or so in Calgary. So listen, looking forward to next week's show. Have a great week and we'll get you next time. Thank you. You too. I know you're on vacation. So you're finally working on when you're off. Yeah.

Like I did for like three weeks. Exactly. All right. Enjoy a week. We'll leave it there. We want to remind our listeners that Travis Green, head coach of the Vancouver Canucks, is joining Thomas Trans on a brand new Vancast podcast coming out. this week at the Athletic.

Thanks for listening to Haley and I on this Monday edition of The Athletic Hockey Show. Follow us in your favorite podcast platform. Leave us a rating, leave us a review. You know we appreciate that. And annual subscriptions at the Athletic on the print side, there's just $3.99 a month

when you visit theathletic.com slash hockey show.