The Athletic Hockey Show - U23 Draft: Who picked the best team?

Episode Date: September 4, 2026

On today’s episode, the guys put their money where their mouth is on their best under-23 player debates, drafting their own 11-player rosters comprised of six forwards, four defensemen and a goalie. Who ended up with the best squad? Check out the episode and let us know in the comments.Hosts: Max Bultman, Corey Pronman, and Scott WheelerWith: FloHockey’s Chris PetersExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Chris FlanneryWatch full episodes on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowJoin our Discord Server: https://discord.gg/VTm9VjkFSubscribe to The Athletic: https://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Hey, everybody, Max Goldman here alongside the athletics, Corey Prondman and Scott Wheeler and Flohockey's Chris Peters for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Fun one on tap today, our annual U23 player draft. These include both NHL players and players who have yet to make the NHL. But we're going to build out a team of six forwards, two forward lines, and two defense pairs, and a goalie for each of us. 44 players in total. It's well-timed, right? We're coming on the heels of Corey's U-23 ranking. We are, I believe, on the release day as we record this, Scott, of the Prospect Tears article that you do every year. Maybe it gives Chris and I a little bit of an edge because we kind of have

your two boards a little bit, and we can get right into it. Corey, not only did you win the lottery on our little sheet that we're keeping track of here, you've already made the pick. We haven't even started the draft. Yeah, we got the draft order a couple of days ago, and I think I announced right then there. Maclin-Selabrini's coming to Impranman. I don't think that's very controversial. We can move on to the second pick here. All right. Well, the second pick is me. I don't think this will be too controversial either, but I'm going to take Matthew Schaefer. I just think the premium of a do-it-all defenseman like him. There's some great centers. I'm a little worried that the center may become a weakness for me later in the draft, but I cannot pass up on someone as good as

Matthew Schaefer and as young as Matthew Schaefer. I saw Peter's purse his lips there. I think he was hoping you were going to take Connor Bedard so that he could take Matthew Schaefer. Am I correct in that? Well, yeah, but I mean, I don't mind. I don't mind. Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense to me. And it's kind of interesting how we had those Conor Bedard versus McLan Celebrating conversations and how quaint those seem now.

But yes, but even so, I'm happy to take Conor Bedard third because that would be He's still a tremendous goal score. I think that there is a lot of development that he's shown at the NHL level, which I think is really, maybe he hasn't gotten enough credit for. Maybe he has, I don't know, but I think that, you know, we kind of look at some of these other guys that have come in as freaks of nature and have defied all expectations of players of their ability. And maybe they're a little bit in a better position.

But either way, Connor Bedard, still a high-end goal score. I think with a better supporting cast in Chicago, we'd probably see better results. But either way, I think that there's a lot of potential there for Connor Bedard. Easy to forget that Bedard and Celebrini were playing at an identical pace before the shoulder injury last year, like basically identical. Any debate here for you, Chris, just because I know quite a few NHL people who think if it was Bedard versus Leo Carlson, they'd be closer. I think some people would even lean towards Carlson right now. Yeah, I think that's fair. I mean, you know, Carlson obviously has a lot of ability in terms of the, you know, the size, the two-way scent, you know, that helps.

I just think that for me, the offensive ceiling on Bedard is going to end up being much higher. Not, I shouldn't say much higher, but I just feel it's higher than what you're getting out of Carlson. And I think you can overlook some of the defensive deficiencies just because of the clear offensive sense that I feel like Badard has. I think that's a special tool in his arsenal. It's funny because even if you kind of took each of them to their kind of sealing comps that you hear thrown around and you had Copatar and Patrick Kane, you can pick either way you choose. You're getting multiple Stanley Cups out of those runs for those players.

Yeah, absolutely. Patrick Kane as a center, though, is a little different. Yes. All right. And that gives me in this snake format that gives me back-to-back picks here. And I kind of begrudged in our little group chat when, when our editor Israel gave us the order that I was drafting last here and I wasn't going to get any of the three top names that we got here. But to Corey's point, I think the league views Leo Carlson and Connor Bedard is quite close at the moment.

That was reflected in prospect tiers where they both ended up with the same projection and the same tier when I did my survey of scouts. And so I'm going to take Leo Carlson here. And then I'm going to take the player who I believe is the second. I believe there's two franchise sort of Norris. caliber elite defensemen in this age cohort. And I'm going to take Lane Hudson the second of those two with my second pick. So I'll start with Leo Carlson and Lane Hudson here. Yeah.

I was wondering if you'd make it back to me. Yeah, that's, that is, that is a pretty solid, uh, pretty solid group there. I can't, I can't, I can't, uh, you know, one C and a one D. Yeah, it's, it's pretty, uh, pretty helpful for it to any team. They did McKenna. Yeah. And a couple others, but I felt like I had to get Lane here. I think as you map it out, too, I mean, I'm sure you guys did the same thing I did

and kind of look at the board and see what ranges do I have to go for what players. You can make cases for a couple different defensemen, but none is as proven as Lane Hudson. And I think that the variance there is much wider if you start talking about a Cole Hudson or a Zeev Bouillon of what could happen. I think taking Lane here, I think he's the clear for me, number two. and with much closer to be a number one than he is to be at number three. Even those guys from this year, the Chase Reeds and those types, it's, I think there's a big, there's a big gap there.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, Chris, back to you. Yeah, no doubt about it. So I think by picking Connor Bader that informs my next pick, because I think that a lot of people would look at Gavin McKenna, Evar Stenberg, as the next possible guys. I'm actually going to go with Porter Martone here. I'm going to stick with a wing.

I want to get a little bit of size. I want to get a little bit of, you know, kind of what I saw from Porter over the last season were some of the things that I was concerned about coming in. I thought the hockey sense looked better. I thought that the compete was more consistent. I thought that there was a lot of things that he did over the course of the last season that gave me a lot of more faith. And since we are picking positionally here, and I'm not just picking a bunch of centers in this stage, I got to go with Martone here. make sure I get myself a premium winger, a guy that I think can compliment my top center. And this is one that kind of reinforces, right?

Like, we're not drafting this as a team that's going to play against each other this year. We're drafting for the long term. We're building here. So Chris can make a pick on a guy who's only played a handful NHL games right now, and it can still make a lot of sense even over guys who are more proven. There's other even wingers who are more proven. But Porter Martone, you bet on the upside. Yeah.

I thought you were going to take the player that I'm not. now going to take. And that's Logan Cooley. And I was thinking, man, centers are going to get real tight here. And I know Chris loves Logan Cooley. I don't think he's going to get back to me. But now I'm going to take him. I think there's still another step in Logan Cooley's game to come. He's an electric player, great skater. I love the skating base of my team to start between Schaefer and Cooley. And I think I think Logan Cooley, especially on this Utah team that is ascending. I think this is the year that he's going to really assert himself into that kind of top center conversation. And how do you feel about him getting into fights in summer league hockey?

makes me like him even more. No days off. I was going to say, yeah. No days off. I love it. All right. So that brings it back to Corey for the eighth and ninth picks. I'm going to take Uriis Levkovsky with my next pick here.

Point for game, power winger, physicality, great skill, great scoring ability. You know, I like the potential chemistry. He had him and Macklin-Sell would bring you there on my top line. and this is where it gets a little tough. I think Slavkovsky wasn't that tough for me here. This is where it gets tough because you got a lot of really good wingers off on the board, but the centers are starting to dwindle here a little bit. And I think I'm going to go slightly off my list here and take a center,

even though it's not the clear BPA for me here. Just to make sure I secure two legit centers from my team. I'll take Adam Fantilli with my next pick. All right. So let's talk to that. You talked about going away from your list, but you have Macklin Celebrating. So we're talking about a two center. How do you kind of parse them?

And the next guy in your list is no secret. It's public. It was back at Seneca or Ivan Demmov in a tier. Yeah. Yeah. And I look at what I think might come back to me. I think I'm going to have a chance to get a really good winger in the next round. But there's a lot of picks in between here and there.

And I think Misa's going to go. I think Fantilia, there was no way he's getting back to me. I think this is obviously. the issues that teams have when they're drafting in the actual draft is, we might say that winger is a better hockey player, but I feel like there's always good wingers to be had. I mean, we look at the public discourse on Luke Evangelista right now. Everyone's like freaking out.

How could they get a Luke evangelista for a future first? And it's like, well, wingers are always available for a price. Getting those elite centers, those elite defensemen, those are the real tough ones to acquire. Yeah, I think it's a good point, and it's very illustrative of the dilemma teams often have, including in the draft. That puts it back to me. I am going to take back at Seneca. I shared your concern about the centers, and I was really sweating it when I didn't think Cooley was going to be there. But now that he's off the board, I'm going to happily take the big-bodied winger. I don't know that he's quite as much a power winger as Porter Martone, but he does have some edge to his game, and he's got tons of skill. Loved how he looked last year, including I thought he had a much better first run at the NHL playoffs, the Stealing the Cup playoffs,

than I was expecting him to. You don't know how a guy like that is going to step into those games, and I thought he handled himself quite well in them. So that'll send it back to Chris. Yeah, so, you know, I think as we continue to look up and down this board, there's a lot of good options here for me still. And I think that, you know, if I'm looking at kind of how I'm trying to build my team, you know, I'm going to go ahead and make sure that I still continue to have that,

that offensive firepower on this team. And, you know, I think at this point, I look at the goal scoring ability of both of my players that I have already and the guy that can get to the net. I'm going to go ahead and jump out and take Gavin McKenna here, you know, make sure I secure a premium wing, a playmaker. You know, do I think McKenna and Bedard on the same team is my favorite thing? Probably not, but that's why I made sure I got Porter Martone to be a guy that can clear the road a little bit. bit. So I'm going to go ahead and make sure that I get my guy there with Gavin. And then with my back-to-back picks here, I'm going to take my two wingers to play alongside Leo Carlson, and I'm going to take Ivan Demadov and Ivar Stenberg, who I think are the two BPAs here.

I was really hoping Stenberg would make it back a little bit. I don't know that he would have made it all the way back to me. Chris might have swooped him up. But that's a nice blend, too. I mean, when you have Demidov in the offense there, and certainly Stenberg has offense, but I think even though he's smaller, like he can still kind of play that gritty or retrieving role. And that that's a nice balance that Scott's kind of putting together with Leo. Yeah, no question about it. I thought that that was, that was probably the debate for me was McKenna and Stenberg just stylistically. You know, but I did ultimately go with the, you know, continue to go on that offensive upside tick here. And, yeah, I mean, like, it's really, you know, we talked about it already about how it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's,

really hard to find the defensemen that you're, you know, that you're going to want to to add to this, to this mix when you look at all these forwards. And you consider how many great defensemen we saw get picked in the last draft. But I'm not going to go with a defenseman here. I am, I am going to continue with making sure I fill out my forwards properly. And the next guy I'm going to bring into the mix is to bring some size and scoring. And that's Cutter Gocchier. He's going to be my next, my next pick there to make sure that we have some good scoring ability. Does Cutter Gochet get underrated here in this process?

He scored 40 goals in the NHL last season. I feel like there is, I think part of Cutter's entire NHL story, which obviously includes the situation with Philadelphia, obviously now in a contract, you know, we're not sure what his contract's going to look like. I feel like he is deeply unpopular with fans. But when you actually see what he does. And not Ducks fans, but obviously the NHL fan base at large. And I do think that that contributes to his underrating of things a little bit.

But if you watch, like we were talking last year as like, hey, can he play his way like into World Cup contention? Like those kinds of things. Like he is definitely on that trajectory now as a 40 goal score at young age. He's ahead of schedule where I thought he was going to be, Corey. I don't know about you. But like, you know, I did not expect him to be a 40 goal score this soon. I thought he was going to score goals. but I didn't think that this would be, you know, his trajectory at this point.

I only ask that because, and I understand we're talking about the future, like, but like if you look at his goal scoring, I think he has more goals scored last season in the NHL than like the last, whatever, five or six picks before him combined. So, you know, it's a very interesting for those other guys. I don't understand, but like I said, he's, he, you, I think you're hoping some of those players have the year that he had last season. Yeah.

Well, you should have picked him then. I wonder if I was, if he had gone in there, he was, I was honestly struggled with him versus Lofkowski versus Seneca. Like I think like he, that's a, it was a very, that was a tight group there for me. Yeah. I wonder if the Anaheim of it plays a part two, right? And not just the Anaheim of it, but how, but how shiny Seneca and, and Carlson are, right? Like, they, they just have that sort of that flashier quality.

Look at all those duck. in the stage of our giraffe. It's pretty good. Corey, how would you compare Cutter Goethe to Adrian Kempe? Because I think that's kind of the player that I kind of mentally associate with, just the scoring and the straight line speed. But like Scott said, it's not really dangles. It's not really like kind of open ice creation.

But he's going to go north-south and he's going to score a goal. Yeah, I think there's a little bit more skill of creativity in his game than Kempe. And Kempey a little bit more well-rounded, a little bit more like play driving. But I get the comp, like it's reasonable. And I don't know if Cutter's going to do 40 again. Like, I think that's, I wouldn't bet on that this season. But I just was making a, you know, kind of a devil's advocate point there. Yeah.

Obviously, I didn't take him, so I didn't have him rated as highly. Yeah, understood. All right. So that sends it back to me. And I'm between two players here. I think Corey's taken whoever I don't. So I'm going to take the defenseman here. and compliment Matthew Schaefer with Chase Reed.

I thought, you know, Chase Reed obviously didn't go as high in the draft as we expected him to, but when we saw all those guys on the same sheet of ice in Windsor for a week, I thought he was the best of the group. And you still saw all the things that you wanted to see out of him. The mobility was the offense like elite? No, I don't think any of us have really said he's going to have elite offense. But there was enough puck moving. There was enough flashes of the offense.

The mobility was excellent. So I think he's a great compliment to Matthew Schaefer. Well, I said in my last round, I didn't. think Michael Misa was getting back to me, and obviously I was wrong. But I think, you know, great, you look at these great U.S. national teams, Canadian national teams, they're built by putting great centers on the wing. So whether it's Fantilli or Misa, I'm fine putting one of those guys on the wing. I'll take Michael Misa here with my next pick.

He's a year removed from being the second overall pick, and I know he's not the shiny new toy right now, but, like, it's completely conceivable that McKenner, Estenberg's going to have the year that Mesa just had, which I think was like a little bit of an adjustment and then a really good second half. And I think with his skating and his skills, his play driving ability to compete, like I think there's a lot there to like. And whether that pushes him to the wing or pushes Van Tilly to the wing, I like my options. I like the speed and the skill I have down the middle right now.

Are you the kind of sports fan that wants to dig into the story behind the stats? Join the Athletic Live on YouTube to cover all the sports stories you can't stop talking about. On game days, we'll watch the biggest matchups alongside the athletics most tapped in reporters, and you can now become part of the show in the interactive chat. The athletic live is presented by Google Gemini, and you can check it out starting September 8th and subscribe now on YouTube. All right, so we're through four rounds, guys, and here's what we're at so far. So Corey's got down the middle, Macklin-Sellibrini and Adam Fantilli, and Yerislovakovsky

and Michael Misa both on the left wing. No D, no goalie, no right-wingers, yeah. I've got Logan Cooley and Beckett Seneca up front, and I've got half my blue line filled out with Matthew Schaefer and Chase Reed. Chris Peters has a full forward line going with Porter Martone, Connor Bedard, Gavin McKenna. And then he's also got another forward as well in Cutter-Goti. So he's loaded heavy forward, just like Corey. And then Scott's got a little bit of everything. He's got a full forward line with Demidov, Leo Carlson, and Yvars Stenberg, and he's got his number one defenseman in Lane Hudson. That brings us back to the top of round five, where Corpard.

Corey, you've got another pick. Yeah, and I mentioned I was hoping to get Lane Hudson with my second pick, and Scott snatches him up, but I'll take the brother. I think Cole Hudson's going to have a monster year in the NHL. He's going to run the Capitol's power play that has a lot of firepower right now. He's been really, you know, he's done basically what Lane did in college, and he had looked really good to start his NHL career last spring. So I'll take Cole Hudson here. All right. This is great for me.

I was between two players last time, and I thought Corey was taken, whichever one I didn't. I'm going to get both of them, and that means I'm going to get Will Smith from the San Jose Sharks. I feel like I need a playmaker with what I have so far, and Will Smith can be that. In fact, I don't know what you guys think. I don't think the drop off from Gavin McKenna to Will Smith as much, if any. I think they're very equivalent kind of playmakers, McKenna, a little more size. I agree with that. Are you drafting Smith as a center or a wink?

I'm going to draft him on the wing, and I'm going to play him. from there and I'll find my second line center elsewhere. But he'll round out the top line for me with Logan Coley and with Beckett Seneca. And yeah, I think it's a nice blend. Will was my next target. So I like the pick, max. Yeah. All right.

That sends it to Chris Peters. Yeah. So glad to be back in. And I think, you know, I'm starting to get a little bit nervous as I look at the D class, thinning out a little bit more. And, you know, as I, I think you need to have a guy that. it's going to make a lot of plays on the blue line for you. And I know that he's coming off of a down year,

but I'm still a big believer in Zeev Bouillon. You know, with Chase Reed off the board, it would have been my, you know, my first choice on D. But I look and I see an opportunity here to, you know, take Zeev Bouem. I know that the, the, the, the shine is off the star a little bit there following the trade. And obviously it's going to be a tough situation in Vancouver. But to me, you know, Zeebubium still brings a lot.

lot of the traits that I think in modern NHL defensemen needs to have for you to have success. And I want to make sure that I get some high-octane offensive performer into my mix here. Let's talk about that situation for a second for Bouillon, because it is an interesting one for him this year. And he's going to be a big spotlight player. It's not easy to be the guy who got traded for Quinn Hughes. And I think there's a pressure to that. He's also in a situation where in terms of immediate success, I don't think that anyone in

Vancouver is under the illusion that they need to be a playoff team anytime in the next couple years. And maybe I shouldn't say anyone. I don't think most people in Vancouver are of that belief. Anyone. I would hope. So what is fair to expect from Zeev Bouillon this year? What are you looking for as you watch him?

I think I'm looking for a guy that is, you know, able to make plays even, even in this tough situation, a guy that's moving pucks up the ice quickly. The things that we saw when he was, you know, a standout player at Denver, you know, certainly thought he was as deserving as anybody to. to win the hobie, didn't win it. But, you know, I think that he is probably one of those guys that that is going to have to, you know, still perform, still produce some points here. The question is going to be, you know, is there enough firepower on that group for, for him to really produce? But it's going to come down to, you know, visibly seeing, can he still make the

plays? Is he still making the reads? Does he still have that aggressiveness? Is he still, you know, handling himself defensively as well as he did, you know, at times in college? And I think at times in the NHL, that was a bit of a concern. So, you know, to me, you know, obviously the situation is the situation. It's always tough. I'm not really drafting him out of, you know, the current situation. I think I'm drafting him for what I think he ultimately can be, which is to say a top pairing defenseman with power play capabilities. And, you know, we're still, I still feel like we may be a little bit further away from, you know, him ultimately reaching that. But at the same time, I think there's still a special quality in the player.

I think he's a better defender than he's shown to. I agree. Dom's model, for example, looks really, really harshly on him. And his numbers defensively have been very poor, not just in Vancouver, but even before that this year in Minnesota. And I think there's more there. Like, he played, in college, he played such a tight game against everybody, just like playing guys right on their hips.

And that's really hard to do against NHL players. And then suddenly, if you don't have the confidence to play, play guys super tightly and that's always been your style of defending. Then you start to give and then you're giving too much. And I think he's sort of figuring that out at his size and it's it's going to continue to be a hard style, I think, for him to play. But I think he needs to play that way and he needs to trust that if it comes with some mistakes that he's still going to be breaking up a lot of plays, he's still going to be making life more difficult on guys than he has so far just with his feet and his stick. And so that, that to me is like the offense is going to come. If he can if he can,

if he can show the kind of defending that he showed at the world junior level, at the college level, et cetera, uh, and sort of take some steps defensively, that's what will actually raise his ceiling into the sort of top end of the league, right? Yeah.

Yeah. All right, Scott, I believe you're on the clock here now for two. Yeah. And I'm going to, uh, I'm going to take Matt Vaymichikov's BPA on my board. So I'm going to take Matt Bay,

mechkov. I know he had a tough year. Even, even his floor as a tough year was what, 51 points or whatever. was, I think he's going to come back and have a big, big bounce back third season in the NHL, and I'm still a huge believer that Michikov is one of the premium skill guys in this age group.

So I'm going to take Matt Vae Michikov as my first second line winger here. And then this might be off the board a little bit, but I wanted to make sure, and I think there's the defensemen that are left, the centers that are left. I think they're about all in the same tier. I'm confident I'm going to get them when they come back around or someone of a sort of comparable quality. And so I'm going to take the first goalie of the draft. I set out and I wanted to get Jacob Fowler.

I think Jacob Fowler is the best goalie in this in this group. And I'm going to take Jacob here. All right. What do we think about the goalie pick? Is it a little early for that or are we good with it? I mean, I think you got to get it. Is he even going to play like 20 games this year? Yes.

I don't think. I don't think Dobish is playing 60 games. Well, well, they got to figure out what to do with a Montebbeau, though, right? I don't think Montego is, even a part of the mix. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. And we're also drafting for the future still, right?

Right. And I, yeah, I think the, I, yeah, I mean, I think to me, like, I was starting to think about, you know, when you want to secure the goalie. You know, when do you want to secure the goalie? I think that we've got, we're entering a bit of a volatile time, you know, just for goalies in general. I feel like, you know, we've, we've had a number of really good ones, but I don't think that we've had the ability to have a lot of confidence in the most recent class. There have been a lot of goalies picked in the last couple of years. I haven't seen a ton of guys that I get super excited about in that mix. So I think, you know, looking at the goalies to me, you know, Fowler and a few others,

I don't want to give it away, you know, I don't want to give the game away there, although I'm sure everybody already knows who I'm going to pick. But the fact that is like, I think, you know, securing the goalie, especially at this range where, you know, we've got, we've picked over the very top forwards, you know, we're already kind of struggling to figure out which D should be the next guy to go. I have no problem with the goalie better here. What's the gap between Augustine and Fowler in your mind, Scott? I think Fowler has just shown a higher level across different levels.

Like, Augustine has been extremely consistent. The stylistically tool-wise are similar, right? Similar. I think there's a little more power to Fowler's game, a little more size to Fowler's game. but in terms of, yeah, the control, the habits, the consistency, a lot of that is pretty similar. And the actual listed height is pretty similar. Obviously, Fowler's a very big guy. I only ask that because by taking Fowler here, you're saying that you think like he's clearly ahead of everybody else, that you'll want to nav him. And I just wonder if him versus Augustine might be a little closer, essentially.

Yeah, I do have him in a bit of a tier of his own, amongst, these goleys and I would include Parabal and Kosa and all of those guys in that. And I just feel like the D, there were a number of D that I was considering here and they're all in the same group for me. Like I didn't feel like there was a separation. After Michikov, I didn't feel like there was a separation

between any of the wingers and centers and sort of that next group of wingers and centers and sort of similar for the D like I view Smiths and Rudolph and all those guys sort of comparably. do you think like the Rangers wouldn't would do smits for foulor one for one or buffalo would do Rudolph for faller one for one no but we're not I mean we're not playing like I've already got lane Hudson I've already drafted my my forwards like I need a goalie more than I need any of

yeah the available pool of defensemen here is definitely more robust than like there's a lot of D on the board as I'm looking at that I'm like, oh, I'd be happy if I got Maltigustis and Kishan, you know, later in the draft, which I think I can wait. Sure. Several rounds for. Like, I would, a goalie would probably be at the bottom of my, like, if we're just drafting off of BPA and sort of like who has the highest value as a prospect, I'd probably take a goalie towards the end of the draft, but I wanted to make sure that I got Fowler.

Yeah. Makes sense. Yeah. And I think strategy wise, like, that's what you, you should, you know, if we're really truly trying to build a team. You know, I think that the goalies are probably going to, even though they're harder to predict, I think carry, you know, plenty of value relative to the rest of your group. So, yeah. All right, Chris.

That takes it to you. Yeah, and I, I'm debating playing with the fire that I want to play with here. But I'm going to do it anyway. You know, obviously love the offense that Zee brings to the table. I want somebody with a little bit of snarl and a little bit more, you know, what I'm a lot. I feel a defensive acumen. And I'm going to go with Carson Carl's here. Obviously, I think there are some, there were some concerns around the draft around, you know, health and other things.

It seems like things are kind of figuring themselves out here. You know, hopefully he's going to be able to have a really solid freshman season here at North Dakota. It's an upside pick. I feel like he's an incredibly intelligent defenseman. I love the skating ability. You know, it was really for me at this point. It was kind of between him and Albert Smith's as to who I was going to go with next. just with my most recent projection, Carl's was my guy at that point.

So I'm going to stick with Carl's here. And I've got a pretty young team, a pretty unproven team at this point. But I still think that Carl's is a safe pick for me here. All right. Any issues with that guys? Are we all good? No, I think he's in that group of D. Yeah.

All right. I'm going to fill out my center spot then, my last center spot and take Anton Frundell. super encouraging close to the year in Chicago. I don't know that I expect to be quite that smooth the entire year next season. I mean, we saw certainly in evaluating Frundel's draft year. Like there's some ups, there's some downs, consistency, not always the strength. But I really like the profile and I think where it's headed with him, he at least has a chance to be a kind of complete two-way player who can really shoot the puck, really score goals and also be used in a matchup capacity. I don't know that I see another guy anywhere on the board who I think has that.

kind of potential. So I'm going to jump on Frundell here. I was worried you were going to thank this guy for me. Max, but the center argument makes a lot of sense. Best power winger on the board by a clear margin, taking Ryan Leonard here. Yeah. Adds offense, add some snarl, gives me my right winger, a lot to liken the way he plays. And I think him on that top line with me with Celebrating this Lafcovsky. That's going to be a very tough line

to play against. My next pick I'm going to add a defenseman. I'm going to take Smiths here. Just, you know, really well-rounded

defensemen, size, skating, offense, compete. You know, he might play in the NHL this year. We'll see how his camp goes at the Rangers.

But I like getting him at this point in the draft. I think he's got major pro upside. And I like his potential chemistry with Cole Hudson on our top pair.

All right. I like that too. I think that's a very nice pick. Back to me then, I'm going to take Vigo Bjork, and I know I just said I filled out my center spot. I'm going to put Vigo Bjork on the wing, but I do like that if I should need him to move to the middle and need Frundel to go out wide, I can do that too. Again, two players, I think complement each other really well. Bjork, not the biggest guy, but I very much see retrieving capability with him. And I think there's offense there, too, that he hasn't even fully tapped into him. So devil's I would actually here again, I was going to say

if they were playing on the same national team right now, I would guess the Swedish coaches would have Frondell on the wing and Bjork at center. Yes. And I prefer them that way. Like I like Frondell on the, I've always liked Frundel better on the wing than at center. But to Max's point, he can do it. I can do either way. Yeah, Max, it's

Max's call. I'm building the roster. I'll let my coach decide how he wants to play him. Yeah, there you go. There you go. See, that's good. That's good. All right, Chris, to you. All right, yeah. So I think I, judging by some of the commentary before, I think I'm going to go ahead and not do what you think I'm going to do because that's how I roll. I'm going to take Caleb Dunaue with my next pick here. So I'm getting another center here. Dunaue is that mix of, you know, kind of solid two-way capabilities. I think he can make plays.

I think that he can also really, you know, add an element to your team. I like what he brings to the table in general. You know, I think that I'm getting a little bit more variety with my forward group as I, as I bring that, you know, somebody with with that two-way capability there. So, you know, I think that Caleb's going to have a very interesting year. It sounds like, you know, no matter what, if he doesn't make Utah, he's going to play with Tucson this year. I think it's going to be a good thing for him to get reps against men because, you know, he was obviously a dominant player over the last little while here.

All right. Caleb Dinoje, off the board. Center's really flying now, Scott. Yeah, and I've got back to back here, and I'm going to take actually with the first pick here, I'm going to take the center who was just drafted five slots ahead of Vigo Bjork, and I had them very close on my board, but I'm happy to get Caleb Mel Holtra as my two-see. I think he's kind of the perfect fit for that role. I think he's going to be a tremendous version of that kind of player in the NHL. He was just one of the very best players in the OHL, virtually all season long, including into the playoffs.

And then beyond that, he, I think, is going to be an integral part of the Canadian World Junior team and probably the top center this season for Boston University as a freshman in college. And I just think he's well on his way to being an excellent, excellent sort of complete winning center. who will maybe even wear a letter for my team down the line. All right. So that takes us to the end of round seven here. We have four picks left each. Just go through them one more time.

So Corey's got Macklin-Celevkowski, Ryan Leonard, Michael Misa, Adam Fantilius as his forwards, and Cole Hudson and Albert Smith as his defenseman. Chris has a forward group so far of Connor Bedard, Gavin McKenna, Porter-Marton, Cotier, Caleb Dinoe, and a pair of defense. Z. Bouillon and Carson Carls. I have five of my six four words, Logan Cooley, Will Smith, Beckett Seneca, Anton Frundel, and Vigo Bjork, and a pair of defenseman, Matthew Schaefer,

and Chase Reed. And Scott has five of his six forwards. Evar Stenberg, Leo Carlson, Ivan Demyt of, Caleb Malhotra, Motvay Michkov, only one defenseman in Lane Hudson, but he's also got the only goalie off the board in Jacob Fowler. And Scott, that brings it back to you with the first pick of round eight. Yeah, and I'm going to take another defendant here and have debated between, really, there's four or five guys that I'd like to round out my D-Corps with here, and I'm hopeful to get three of them to round them out over the course of the next couple of rounds here. But I'm going to start with a righty to pair with my lefty,

and I'm going to take Daxon Rudolph here. All right. That was a guy I kind of had circled. I was presuming you were going to say Parick there. I have a sneaking suspicion that Perrick might be a potential ready to be down the line. He knows us too well. He's like, I'm going to get him. I'm going to get him late.

But yeah, that's, no, that's totally. Yeah, totally fine. So, yeah, so it comes to me, I'll go ahead and take my goalie now. I'm going to get Trey Augustine here. Similar to Scott, I feel like, you know, we're talking about two of the best goaltenders that are not full-time, you know, haven't really been full-time NHLers yet. I think they're really similar in the hockey sense department. I think they're really similar in the technique department.

There's just a lot to like about both of them. Trey is, you know, I would suggest likely going to play the bulk of the season in Grand Rapids this year. That's, you know, obviously the Red Wings moved on from Sebastian Cosa, making, you know, a little bit more room and a clearer path for Trey Augustine to really be their goalie of the future. I think that that is ultimately going to be one of the more important players in that organization. And I think he's going to be one of the most important players for me. I think Tri Augustine is, you know, despite the fact that Michigan State fell short in multiple years, you know, he's got back-to-back gold medals at the world juniors.

He's done a lot of things that have shown that he's got the capability to be consistent, to be predictable in some of the best ways. And, you know, you give him the right opportunities he can steal a game for. you. Yeah. I like that. I'm very curious to see what Augustine does as he turns pro this year and goes to Grand Rapids. They have another goalie there, Michael Postava, Chris. How would you apportion the starts there? I feel like you're going probably 50-50 there or would you give Augustine a bulk? Yeah, I would probably go like a 60-40 split like in terms of percentage and try to give Augustine more reps. I would also, you know, the Red Wings and a lot of other teams have also used in order to make sure that the goalie gets the most amount of

reps. They have been very liberal with their use of the ECHL. It's been very proven for a lot of goalies to go to the ECHL, get those extra reps. Costa played a full season there. They kind of slow played his development all the way up. I'm saying like maybe five, five, five games max for for Augustine at that level if you're needing to get him more starts. But I just think that you have to prioritize your future. And as good as Postava has been, Augustine is your future. You need to make sure that you're prioritizing that player because they did not do that with Sebastian Kosa. And I think that ultimately led to his departure. Yeah. All right, that sends it back to me here. I'm going to take, we've been talked a lot about kind of positional value.

And I don't think that, you know, my board is such that I have enough D though, that I really like that I think I can just wait. And I'm going to take a guy who I don't see an analog to anywhere on this board. That's Ilya Protoz. When you talk about the size and the talent level there is pretty significant. Scott, I think, I don't know if it was you or Corey. One of you guys wrote up recently that you just think he's gotten kind of lost in the public discourse. Yeah, Protis has been one of the very best players in two of the most prominent leagues outside

the NHL and the OHL and the HL over the last two years. And he's a mutant physically like his brother, extremely skilled for his size in terms of like the actual like hands. I actually think he's a touch skill, more skilled than his brother, who's obviously like a proven 60 point player in the NHL at this point. I don't think he quite has that sort of presence of his size

that his brother has, but yeah, sneaky, sneaky good, good player and can play center and the wing. You've actually got three players on your second line now who can play center or the wing. I don't know that he's going to be quite the like matchup nightmare that Alexia is, but it's at least possible.

So we're going to take the shot on Ilya Proto. For what it's worth, he wasn't lost in the public discourse because that was my pick if you weren't taking him. Yeah, me too. That was actually my next. I very much debated taking him there. And I think, you know, and I think part of it is, you know, pay more attention to the HL people. There's a lot of good hockey being played down there. And yes, I say that with a vested interest in your interest in the HL at Flow hockey.

But, you know, this year is going to be the first year with the 19-year-olds being in. able to be there, like guys like Dinoe likely there, other players that wouldn't have necessarily been there in years past due to the CHL agreement are going to have that opportunity. I think what we saw with Ily Proto's over the last year plus was a player that has just been on a rocket ship in terms of his developmental trajectory to go from USHL immediately into being a top score in the OHL, immediately being into one of the best rookies in the AHA. That's a progression.

We don't necessarily see all that often. and that makes him, that's why he's risen up the board so much. And to think, you know, you go from that trajectory, basically three years of rapid growth. And the finishing school for many of these guys is ultimately going to be the AHL. So you're getting a really good glimpse of what's to come. And I think Protis is a guy that has nothing but potential at this point. Yeah. All right, Corey, that's to you for two more picks.

I said it was between Protis and another player who I was debating, also another winger. But since he's still here, I'll take Igor Churnishchev, who was just fantastic in the American League as a very young player. I think one of the youngest players in the American League. And also very good at the sharks. He's big. He's powerful. He can skate. He's got a ton of skill.

And I think he runs up my four group. And I think we're going to make life very difficult on our opposition here with all the size and the compete and all the offense I have up front. I like it. All right, and you got one more at the start of the ninth round. One more defenseman here. Again, I don't need a power play guy. Cole Hudson's going to run my power play. But I like getting Keaton-Ferhoff here to go at Smiths.

I got a couple, you know, pillars here who can skate, who can make a pass, who can play hard on opposing forwards. And this is going to be a very difficult blue line for opposing forwards to handle. All right. That puts it back to me. I honestly was I was talking earlier about looking down the board of the defensemen. I didn't think Sam Dickinson was going to be someone that I ended up with. I thought he would go before this, but I'm happy to take Sam Dickinson here. And the sharks, just like the ducks, very well represented in our draft here.

But Dickinson, the size, the skating, we'll see what the offense looks like ultimately at the next level. Sharks just went back to back to back. That's right. Extremely well represented in our draft here. And I wonder if anyone's written about how bright their future is lately, Corey. All right. back to Chris. All right.

So this is where things are starting to get a little bit trickier, um, across the board here. Um, but I got to put my money where my mouth is because I've been talking this guy up on this podcast. And I've got an, a true sniper and cutter goatea on one of the wings. I've got,

you know, my two-way stalwart and denouet. I'm going to go with Gabe Perrault here. maybe early, but I'm going Gabe Perrault for all the reasons I've said on previous podcasts. I think that there is a high offensive ceiling in this player. I definitely think that I've got, you know, the mix of size that I want now. And you'll probably see that continue to carry through in these next couple of picks here. But to get a guy like Gabe Perra who thinks it at the level that he does, you know,

I feel like I have the best hockey sense on my team right now, even though I've got guys like McKenna Bedard, you know, Denoy, I think that Perot thinks the game at a level that is as far above his peers. Do I think we need to have some more snarl? Well, yeah, that's what I would have building out in these other lines, but we're not building that deep of a team. So I do think that Perot, to me, is a compliment to what I have on my second line. Imagine if Chris didn't take Gabe Perot after some of the names and territory that was lobbed out a month ago on this show. it would have been rough for me. Corey would have jumped on that.

Corey would have had the receipt a mile long for that one. You said 100 points. You said Kuturav. You said. I'm also going to follow in Chris's footsteps and put my money where my mouth is and go to another player. Gabe was circled as my potential last winger. And the other guy who was circled as my potential last winger is Zach Benson. And I love the idea of Zach Benson and Caleb Malholtry.

sort of go-getters to play with a Matt Vei Michikov. Meechkov gets to avoid a lot of the dirty work on that line, and Benson and Mal Hultra can make things happen for him, and then Matt Vey can finish it. So I really like the shape of that second line. And I was sort of hoping that Gabe would be there. I had Gabe slightly ahead of Zach, but I think Zach's, as I've said repeatedly,

I think Zach's a potential future Selke conversation, two-way winger in the league. And I would say I was strongly considering the troll pick over the receipt pick. So that tells you where our priorities lie on this podcast. And then I'm going to take the player that everybody expected would come back around. And wo and behold, he has come back around. And I'm going to take Zane Perrek. All right.

Scott getting very close to the finish line here. Yeah. And look at how much, like, like I will say, so Scott's D now is Hudson, Rudolph, and Perak. That's a heck of a lot of offense. And I mean, I think Lane's a fine defender and everything. And I think Rudolph will grow into one. But yeah, it's going to be interesting to see what those last, what that last D man is going to be, Scott.

I'm looking forward to seeing that because we are thinning out. It will also be the last pick of the, my last pick will be the last pick of the draft. There it is. There it is. All right, Chris, that sends it back to you. Yeah. So I'm full up on forwards right now.

now. You know, I feel like this is another money where my mouth is kind of, uh, of pick here. And, um, you know, it's, it's, uh, it's, it's definitely, you know, I'm, I'm, I understand a lot of the consternation around this player. I still believe in the upside. I'm going to take Arte Leveshanov here. Um, you know, size right shot. I've got two left shots here. Um, I am what, you know, as concerned as a lot of people are in terms of the defensive sense and different things that we've seen. But I still have seen this player in the athletic toolkit and what he is capable of at the top of his game. And if he can find that, which is a big risk I'm taking here, he's going to, you know, really make that that next move. So I, you know, by, it's a tough one because I, I see all the

arguments against it. And I understand it. But I'm going to go ahead and just continue to believe in a player that I've put a lot of stock in over the last couple of years. I like this pick. I think it's the most upside of any potential option out there. Like there's a little boom bust to it still. But even the bust, I think, is going to be a pretty significant player for Chicago. Like, I think the offense is going to be there. I was considering him with my next pick too. Yeah. And yeah, he's, he's a real interesting one. No question about it. I think there's there's genuine when, you know, alarm bells going off, but I also think that there's a lot to like about them. That brings it to me. And I've got another defenseman that I need to take. I have a bunch of D here

that I like guys. And I think what I'm going to do is just gravitate for the style that I think I need. I think I just need the most stable defenseman here. Dickinson, like I said, I think it's really good tools. But if there's a question on him, it's probably the brain. I'm going to go with a guy who I think is always kind of very in control out there in multi-gustifson. We talked about all those D at the summer showcase, would I be crazy, Scott, to say that I might have liked Maltie Gustafson the second most behind Chase Reed at that event? No, I don't think that's crazy. I think there was a, I would have the way that Malti played kind of bunched in with those,

those other D a little more. Like, I thought, I thought that Reed was the only one of that group that kind of separated himself. But Maltese, I mean, the package is different than all of those other D. Yeah. All right, Corey. You also, you got, you had two picks here. close out. Yeah, I need one more

defenseman and I'm extremely happy and somewhat surprised that a 6-5-6-6 defensemen who can skate, who had 35 points in 40 games in the American League last year. It's still on the board. I'm taking Dimmishev here as my last defenseman. Oh, that's a great

pick. Yeah, that was I think I lost track of him. That was my next one if he survived, but of course he wasn't going to survive past Corey. I knew going into this. I was like, who are some people that other people. I was trying to sort of figure out who guys were going to target. I was like, there's no

way that Simashev doesn't end up on Corey's team here. Not surprised. But I feel like I like, I know we're not actually playing the playoffs, but I feel like if I have like, when you think of like one of the kind of blue lines you want to build around a Hudson kind of type of defenseman, if you, if it's Verhof, Smith's and Simishev, like, that's like kind of like the

architect of like that kind of blue line where you've got like the elite offensive guy and like these like the towers of terror behind him. essentially. Yes. And then the goalie is Ravensbergen, who I think is going to be a starting goal in the NHL, who's 65, 6-6-6-6-6-Twichy, makes a lot of difficult saves. I think he's going to have a very bright pro future.

How many sharks does that bring us to? We've got Salabrini. Corey's got five just on his team. Verhof, Misa, Ravensbergen. Is that it? Churnishov. Dickinson. Dinkinsh.

Churnishov. Dickinson, eight. It's a lot. It's a lot of sharks. Eight in 40, 40 picks, I think. 41. 41 so far. Holy smokes.

Good time to be in San Jose. I'll close out with my goalie, and I was pretty sure I could wait on this guy. But I do want to understand why. Like, what am I missing? Sergei Miroshov had an unreal year in the American League. I know he's not huge. What am I missing here? Why is he not in this conversation with Fowler and some of the rest of these guys?

Same reason why when we did this draft three years ago, Devin Levi went first. I get it. He's not that small. He's bigger than Devin. Yeah, he's 6-1, right? He's like 6-0 now, I think. I think he's like 60-6-1, but that's the high. But that's why.

I'll take the shot on the guy who had like the, I mean, of the guys who played at least 20 games, I think he had the third best save percentage to the American League last year. He had a monster year. Like, he's really talented, like really, like really athletic, really smart. He's. And he might be, like, 1A this year, too, like Pittsburgh plans to play. to play. He's going to be at least in a tandem this year there.

Yeah. All right, Chris Peters, your last pick. Yeah, and this one's hard because I am just trying to figure out what the best, what the best way to round this group out is. And I've got a few ideas of where I could potentially go with it. But I'm going to throw a little, like I've already got, I've got two left shot defensive and I'm not allowing that to rattle me further. I'm going to go with a little bit of napalm and get Kishon at this range here. I like the physicality, obviously. I think that there are definitely things that he's going to have to clean up in the pro game.

I think he's another guy where you're going to see a lot of him. I feel like he probably should be in the HL to start. We'll see if he ends up on the Islander's roster. You've got a goal scoring component to him. But just to get that nastiness, and I talked a little bit about how I've got some lightness. up front that I would definitely want to, you know, it's not that the Aitchison is a tower of a human, but he plays the game with ferocity. And I need that on my team. All right, Kishon, Acheson, off the board. And Scott, that brings the last pick to you. Yeah. And there are two Scott Wheeler

favorites that I kind of pegged for the end here, but both are right shot D. And because of Perak and Rudolph, I already have two right shot D. And those guys were Simon Nemich, who I think is going to take a big step in Calgary here in a more prominent role. We'll see whether the defending holds up quite to the level that he'll probably need it to be in order to take a significant step, but I think there's going to be a lot of offense there, and I think he's going to be a better defender than he has shown at times in New Jersey previously. And then Ryan Lynn was obviously the other one, but another righty. Instead, I'm going to go to the player who I think after Matthew Schaefer is, and Wayne Hudson is the most proven NHL defense.

defenseman in this group and is a lefty, and I'm going to take Denton Matechuk, who I thought was excellent in Columbus last year and who I think is just generally excellent in a lot of important areas. So Denton Matechuk's going to round out my blue line here. All right, and that is the last pick of this draft. So I'm going to read these teams here. I do want to know, especially for those of you who are watching on YouTube, let us know in the comments how we did here. And not just in terms of accumulating the best roster. I do want people to judge here, like how these different teams would hold up against one another. There's definitely some style of play. I want to see Corey's team against Scott's team, Corey's behemoths against Scott's puck movers and see what wins out in that

group. But so team Pranman. So line one, you've got Yerislavkovsky, Macklin Celebrini, Ryan Leonard. Line two, you've got Michael Mesa, Adam Fantilli, Igor Chernoshov, top defense pair of Cole Hudson and Albert Smiths. Or are you going Hudson and Vancouver? We're going to Verhoff, Corey. Let's put a Verhoff there because he's the righty. All right, Cole Hudson and Keaton Verhoff, and then Albert Smiths and Dmitri Simashev as the number two defense pair with Josh Ravensburg and in net. Team Peters, we've got Gavin McKenna, Connor Bedard, Porter Martone, Cotier, Caleb D'Noye, Gabe Perrault,

Zee, Boeum, and Carson Carl's, and Kayshon Aitchison and Artem Levchenov with Trey Augustine in net. Team Boltman, we've got Logan Cooley between Will Smith and Beckett Seneca, Anton Frundel, between Vigo Bjork and Ilya Protoz. We've got a top pair of Matt Schaefer and Chase Reed and a second pair of Sam Dickinson and Malti Gustafson with Sergey Murshov in net. And Team Wheeler is Leo Carlson between Evar Stenberg and Ivan Damedov, Caleb Malhutra between Zach Benson and Motiv, with a top pair of Lane Hutz and Zane Pirek, all. in front of Jacob Fowler. We'll let the fans decide kind of who won the draft, but I do want to know

like, who did we miss here? There's one name that's standing out to me, Corey, but anyone that's coming out to you that you can't believe didn't get picked in these 44 picks. Well, Scott Powers is saying that Roman Kansrov's going to be Chicago's first line center to start the season. You get 36 goals in the KHL

last season. Issue is he's a winger, so like there's a lot of good winger. So like you're looking at our lists right now. It's like you take him over Protoise, you take him over Chertochev or Perrault or Benson, like all of our last winger picks. Like, I think you can make a case

for him in a lot of those conversations. Like, I think he's going to be a top six forward for Chicago this season. And he was really good. And he basically did what Kappersoff did in the KHL production-wise. So, like, I think that's the one that stood out to me. I'm not sure who stood out to anybody else. I thought

about Jimmy Snugg or Rood would get picked here. Yeah, Jimmy. I thought about Wyatt Cullen. a little bit. I know Sabres fans would probably make the case, and I think I thought he was just outside of it for me, but the way Consta Heleneas looked in the playoffs and then into men's worlds, I think Consta's stock is high right now. Yeah.

My next pick would have been Jake O'Brien or Roger McQueen for what it's worth. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, high picks. Mine would have been Cullen and T. Gingla, I think, probably. But Kansarov would have been in that mix for me too. Yeah. Yeah, I actually, I'm still pretty high on Frank Nazar too, is like, I just think he's going to be a really natural number two center over the course of his career and a really solid player overall.

But the one that I wanted to give some love to the goalies and the one goalie that I thought we might see go here is Michael Harabal. You know, and that's he's he's, you know, we look at Augustine. We look at Fowler Harabell's numbers in college very, you know, close in terms of what he what he produced. and I don't know what, you know, what Mikhail Yagorov's personal statistics platform would say about Michael Harabal, but I bet that it'd be very strong. Because we, I think Yagorov was picked last year by me, I believe, not on this list this year. He had a great year that year. Didn't have a good year. Yeah, he had a great year and not, not so good this year, depending on what stat form you read. But, you know, I would say that this is, we're in an interesting time for the goalies. I think there's a lot. lot of there's a lot of really intriguing guys.

Miroshov being one of those guys, like after the season that he had, it's going to be really interesting to see where these guys slot in. And as we start talking about more expansion, I think one of the areas that we're going to be looking closest at is, do we have enough NHL caliber goalies to go around for these teams? No. I think we do, but like only at the number one level and not, yeah, so we'll see. But it's not.

I don't know if we have enough number ones now before expansion. mansion. That's true. I mean, there's the play only like 10 or 15, I think are the legend number one right now that I would be comfortable like riding. But I mean like like guys that how I would say like if they're playing 50, 60 games for me,

I'm happy. Like how many of those guys can you really say are in the league right now? Yeah. Not a lot. Definitely not a lot. I mentioned Nazar. Wasn't it like two years ago everybody was yelling and me about that one? Yes.

Yeah, interesting. A couple more that I've taken note of too. Not only did we not pick these guys. Nobody brought them up. Teach a Ginglin James Hagan's. I just mentioned, he just mentioned,

he did, he did it. And Higgins, Higgins wouldn't have been, wouldn't have been that far behind for me. I thought Corey was going to pick Carter. We were on a money where your mouth is, well,

train there. I thought Corey might pick Carter, Yakubchuck. He hasn't been good enough the last two years. So, I mean, it's just, you got to adjust,

just like Lawrence to be a terrible second half. You know, like you got to, you got to adjust. You bet, should we mention the Benson, crap like let's do it let's do it yeah it was a lot it was a lot last week it was guys guys guys

he was like tied for like 200th in the league and goals so like that like this is not like the lane hudson thing where he won the calder and i was like i don't know about it still and like i understand the projection there and you can say he should have been higher like he's as like a really good player he's really competitive really smart but like i don't know like how much different is isn't he than evangelista who just got traded stylistically tools-wise? I think he's way better than Luke personally. Maybe, but Luke's had a, he hasn't had the year that Luke's had yet. He was better than Luke in the NHL last year.

Yeah, I mean, and showed it again in the playoffs. No, he's a better player, but I guess my point is like, the way that people were getting outraged by this one, I'm like, come on, guys. like like I think I think I think uh I think I think I think I do think there it was it was outsized relative to the actual like there's typically not that much passion about 14 goal scores in the NHL typically not I I and I kind of wondered where like I mean part of it I think is how our podcast was clipped for one hello you know like I think and and yeah I was like wow look at Peters he must hate Prondman I was like

like, yeah, okay, sure. We disagree. Like, we, this is how we talk to each other. Yeah, I was in his damn wet. I was like, he's like, we're like, we've been friends for, you know, what, like close to 20 years. But it's like, you know, I'd say that the, the thing about these debates is that we are often talking about infinitesimal separations between players, especially when you get to the

NHL level. And so, you know, the way it looks on a list is always going to be more jarring than, you know, the actual nuanced discussion about these players. So, you know, I think it's kind of funny. And yes, we were making, you know, we like to yell at each other. We like to get in each other's grill about our opinions. But I think at the same time, you know, we're probably not all that separate from where we're at. But I was absolutely 100% ready to make the troll pick. but I realized that I would be then trolled by Corey if I didn't take Gay-Piro.

So I did not want that to happen. To your point, though, like I just want to, so Corey's, that list is divided into tiers. And Corey, I don't think you would say there's a huge gap within that tier, which began at 57. And if the ranking of Benson had been 57 or 58, it doesn't go nearly. I think it's the 124 that people were like, whoa, whoa, whoa, like that was what. Yeah. Well, this is the point I was trying to make earlier. If it was 60 or 70 or 80, it would be.

I'm making the Evangelista of comparison, not because I think Benson's a better player than Evangelista, but small, slow wingers don't have a ton of value in the NHL. They just don't. And you look at other guys that I have ranked in that tier, like Minchikov and Nemich. They basically got paid what Benson got paid on their second contracts. And I had Mitchikov lower than Benson,

and I had Nemich like 20, 30 spots higher, but all within the same tier. So you could have reasonable disagreements. Like if you think Benson's going to be a second contract, Selke can, like Scott thinks, and yes, obviously you would say, like, okay, he deserves to be in a significantly higher tier. He's a way better player, yada, yada, yada. But my argument, which I made the other week, and I'll make again, is that 510 average foot speed wingers just to me are not foundational pieces that you build around unless they're going to be like 80, 90 point guys.

Like that to me is just harder for me to wrap my head around. He might get there. I have some mild reservations still do. Time will tell. Everybody just take a, and chill pill. Let's see how he does next season. I get your point too, Corey, because it's like if you had ranked him, let's say you ranked him at the very top of that tier, which is still in the same tier, you ranked him at 57. Like, I think I was arguing him around where Nazer was, which was around 40. And that's a small gap. But like with Hudson, people were arguing top 10 versus wherever he had of that.

My rankings show, I would rather take a bet on a center of defenseman who is less proven than on a proven winger. That's just how I approach that process. Yeah. And you could have Which And that you saw it in even how we were doing this. I personally thought that Beckett Seneca and Cutter Gochier were better talents than Fantilli.

But I took Fantilli in this draft because I'm very happy having him as my second line center. And I look at some of your second line centers. And I'm like, I'm much happier with my center depth than your center depth. You know what, though? Scott mentioned Cullen at the end of that. And I was like, I probably should have just waited and took Cullen in like the last round or second last round because I really like the trajectory on Wyatt Cullen right now. And you could have slot, like, if you needed a center, you could have slotted him at

center too potentially. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Suddenly now we're going to be talking a lot more about Wyatt Cullen, the center. We are. The way things are going at Minnesota and for Team USA at the world. We may be talking about all kinds of Cullins on this show.

There's going to be a lot of Cullen. This is, this is the new Cullen podcast. I don't love Joey the Halenka. Like I thought I had higher. Two Canadian kids looked like they were in a different tier. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

We're going to talk. People were telling me, like, people from USA hockey circles were telling me coming in that he was in that, like he was a first overall conversation guy. We'll see. There's a ton of hockey over the next two years, but I thought the two Regina kids looked a clear above. It is interesting, though, that he was the first.

Literally, yeah, Schultz is unbelievable. But the, but Colin, it is like crazy that for the first time ever, and there have definitely been better playing. players in the past, but for the first time ever, they took a U-17 player to the Halenka for USA. Never had happened before. And that was the first one. And you could say, well, there's a lot of other guys that probably would have been ahead on that list. This is the new world we're living in.

And I think players are starting to wield a little bit more of that. Like, hey, you got to take care of me so I can do whatever, you know. So, Joey looks small too. Like, if he has that gross birth, that Wyatt has, like, there's things can be. change right his skating's high end though like he's yeah big talented like he's craft just like I was like

that was my first live viewings of him and I was like waiting to like see like the holy hell what a talent and he's like yeah he's pretty good like great skater great skill but like yeah yeah but like that wasn't like uh you know there were often games where he wasn't one of their two to three best players on on US so yeah well much more to come on all of that

great show today guys and that is going to do for us today on this episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Remember, you can catch more of Chris over at Flow Hockey and on his podcast called up and much more of Scott and Corey's work on Theathletic.com. Scott's NHL Prospect Tears out Thursday, September 3rd. Make sure you check those out. Talk to you soon.