The Athletic Hockey Show - Vegas Golden Knights-Colorado Avalanche series living up to the hype, Aaron Portzline on the state of the Columbus Blue Jackets, Multiple Choice Madness, and much more

Episode Date: June 7, 2021

First, Ian and Hailey discuss the electric Vegas Golden Knights-Colorado Avalanche series, now tied at two games apiece heading back to Colorado for Game 5, Jeff Petry’s freak injury, catching his right pinky finger in a camera hole during the second period of Game 3 against the Winnipeg Jets, whether the NHL’s Department of Player Safety got it right or not fining Boston Bruins center David Krejci $5,000 for slashing the New York Islanders’ Mathew Barzal in the groin during the second period of Game 4 Saturday night, and more.Then, The Athletic’s Aaron Portzline joins the show to talk about what promises to be a busy and potentially tumultuous offseason for the Columbus Blue Jackets, including Seth Jones requesting a trade, who could be the best choice to replace departing head coach John Tortorella, John Davidson’s return to the organization, how Max Domi’s shoulder surgery impacts the start of next season for the team, and much more.Plus, in Multiple Choice Madness, Ian and Hailey choose their best Stanley Cup Final matchup, which fan-filled playoff venue they’d most like to attend, and which NHL position could be filled by a woman in the next 20 years.And, don’t forget, you can sign up for an annual subscription to The Athletic for just $3.99 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

And we're back. It's another edition of The Athletic Hockey Show to kick out for week. Ian Mendez-Hilly Salvean with you for the next hour or so. So coming up on this episode, our Blue Jackets Beat reporter Aaron Poetsline joins us to chat about a tumultuous offseason in Columbus, including what the trade market might look like for Seth Jones and who are the candidates maybe to replace torts behind the bench. We'll update round two of the Stanley Cup playoffs. Try to wrap our heads around the fact the Montreal Canadians could be the first team to punch. their ticket to the final four.

And after a lopsided start, Vegas and Colorado is living up to the hype. As always, we will wrap up with a little multiple choice madness, asking what venue you'd like to watch a playoff game in this month? And what's the dream matchup for the NHL in the Stanley

Cup final? But I got to ask you this, Haley, to kick off the show Haley Salvean. Did you waste any time or money? Because I think I saw you tweeting about this. Did Haley waste time or money on Mayweather fighting Logan Paul on the weekend? I wasted an hour of my life that I will never get back. What was that?

How did he get to eight, how did Floyd Mayweather not take this guy out? Well, I think when you like heard Floyd talk after, like he didn't even look like he broke a sweat. Like he had a light misting. Like he had a face mist on to be fresh. And he was like, yeah, that was a lot of fun. He was smiling.

just he kept on saying that was fun. So this was like a fun little spar for $50 million for Floyd Mayweather. But for Logan Paul, it was like I went eight rounds against, you know, what many people or some people believe is the goat in boxing. And I don't think that Floyd Mayweather was going to knock him out. I think, I don't even know. The first couple rounds were so boring. And then he just started, Logan Paul just started bear hugging him all the time.

Like the commentators were the best part. They were the funniest part. But it was a waste of my time. I did not spend money on it. Okay. Good. Good to know. Waste of time, but not a waste of time.

I don't know if it was a real tweet or not. Like, I don't know if somebody made it or if he tweeted it and deleted it. But like somebody posted a screenshot of Elon Musk saying like my link broke. I don't know if it was real. But then if that is real, like, even Elon Musk didn't pay for the fight. That's pretty funny. Okay, no, I didn't. I hope it was real.

I don't know if it was, though. Because I checked his Twitter and it wasn't there. So maybe somebody just, like, Photoshopped it, but it was pretty funny. Oh, man. Okay, well, tell you what, why don't we talk about a real heavyweight fight here? Yeah, let's not. Heavyweight battle, Vegas and Colorado. I'll tell you what, when Vegas got small.

smoked in game one. And Nate McKinnon was running wild. I think we were all like, holy smokes. The aves look unbeatable. And Vegas responded in game two, ended up losing that game, but they've been the better team now three games in a row. And it's on. It's a best of three series.

It feels like maybe it's a flip of the coin. But I feel like now this series is living up to the hype. And this is going to be the thing to watch this week in the NHL. Vegas, Colorado, this is exactly what we wanted. Yeah, I think after game one with the, with the huge win by the abs, it was, it was easy to think like, wow, are they just going to steam, roll them in four. And we had the discussion and I said, you know, if they come out flat in game two and game two is another, you know, blowout, then I don't think this, they'll make a series of it. But obviously game two wasn't a blowout. It was a, it was a very good game. Game three, game four, now the series is tied. And yeah, I think this is what most people expected this to be. And it's been a really fun series to watch. Mark Andrege Flurry's been, you know, incredible. Nate McKinnon's still been great. I mean, Mark Stone is Mark Stone.

There's just so much firepower and star power on both sides. It's, it really is such a great series. And I don't know what to expect. I think, you know, you have, I saw this kind of comparison. I believe someone made it in the comment section, actually, of Jesse Granger's piece analyzing what happened in the last game. And Jesse made some really great points about, you know, Vegas has been able to subdue the abs high octane offense just with this intense pressure,

this forecheck, this just commitment to playing that kind of cliche right way, you know, just waves and waves, the five man unit going at them with the forecheck with pressure, you know, really good defensive structured play. And somebody made this comment saying like this series is a really great example of like pure skill with the pure like workhorse going up against each other. And it's been really interesting to watch. And of course, Vegas has skill too. But, you know, the way that the style of play that they're playing to try to shut down the abs,

they're not trying to play a high flying dance around, get your cookies kind of style against the abs. They're just trying to shut them down and they're creating offense because of, you know, really strong defensive play. And it's been, I mean, it's just been great. Last night was a great game March. So played Unreal with the Hat Trick. it was really cool to see all the hats flying down too.

It's been a long time since I think we've seen that much. Even Robin Leonard threw his hat out. So it's good. I don't know what to expect. I think the fans probably, like we talk, you know, just how great the fan base is with the Golden Knights

and that home arena is so electric. That probably plays a bit of a role. So it'll be interesting to see what happens when the series gets back to Colorado. Yeah. And I think what's interesting is now it's a best, to three. So this series is going to go at least six games. And I think if we're all hoping and wishing and betting, it would go seven games. So here's the question now. I think a lot of us thought, man, Vegas, Colorado, the winner of that series, they get the winner of the North

Division and it's going to be Winnipeg or the Habs. They're just going to steamroll them. But let me throw this kind of scenario out at you. And let's say the Montreal Canadians finish off the Jets, Haley, either in four or five games. The Habs are going to be pretty well rested. The Habs are to have a ton of time to kind of sit back and and recover. Is there any way that the winner of Vegas in Colorado is so beaten up now after six or seven games that they might be susceptible to kind of a rope, a dope team like the Habs that has great goaltending that maybe just maybe this is all lining up for Montreal? I think understandably there's been skepticism about the Canadian success because they beat a

Leafs team who didn't have John Tavares. Now they're beating the Jets who don't have Demello. I think Paul Stasney's been out. Mark Schaifley's suspended. So, you know, they're beating teams who are missing pieces. But I think like Carrie Price has been unbelievable, I think as expected. I think most people said like if there, even Leafs fans knew it. They're like, if there's one reason to be worried about this, it's it's playoff Carrie Price. And he's really shown. exactly why whenever we do those, you know, player polls at the athletic, we always say game seven,

you need one goalie to win the Stanley Cup, who are you choosing? And most players will always say Carrie Price or Mark Andre Fleury. And it was interesting because players would still be saying that even when Carrie was having a down season in the regular season or he was playing poorly for a stretch, but they would still always say Carrie Price

because this is what he does. And he's playing incredible through these playoffs And again, we're really seeing the reason he has the pedigree that he does. He's he's clutch. He's really taking control. And even that being said, there doesn't seem to be much optimism that the Canadians can stand up to the abs or the Golden Knights in the semifinals. And they might be right.

It might absolutely be right because we haven't seen the HABs play against anyone but the North Division. And lots of people have their theory that the North Division was the worst division in the league this year. So we don't know because it's kind of comparing apples to oranges because we haven't seen them play anybody else. And watching the Vegas Ave series and watching some of the other series in the U.S.,

the tempo is higher, the skill level is higher. It just, you're watching different hockey to me. I don't know if that's just me, but watching, you know, the Islanders, the Bruins, as it's just, it looks like a different pace. So I don't know if I would say, like I don't, I don't see the HABs getting by one of those two teams. But again, those games still have to be played.

And if Carrie Price does this thing, who knows. But yeah, just watching the two different series that are multiple series, but looking at the north and looking at what's happening in the U.S. It just, it's a different level, I think. You know, and I mentioned Haley that, hey, maybe the HABs will have some time to recuperate. because even if you sweep an opponent, it's very hard to get through a playoff series unscath.

And on Sunday, Jeff Petrie, Montreal Canadian's defensemen, suffered what appeared to be kind of a, let's say it's a freak injury. And the replay on SportsNet up here in Canada showed that Petrie was kind of skating by the glass and ended up having his glove kind of got caught in the camera hole and his pinky finger got stuck there.

And you're like, ooh, it felt like he probably maybe dislocated it or something. But are you surprised that? I mean, that camera hole is in kind of the corners of the arena. You're surprised that actually doesn't happen more often where somebody gets a digit, a finger or something, even a stick, something caught in the camera hole that results in a, kind of a significant injury? I mean, kind of.

I was also a little bit surprised that it wasn't covered. Like most camera holes have the little thing that you can put over it. And then when the camera person is actually there, take the picture, they'll move it out of the way and they can have their camera there. So yeah, I guess I am a little surprised that it doesn't happen more often. We've seen some of those really funny moments. Like, I don't remember what player it was, but do you remember when like the team got scored on and then all of a sudden the player like stands up in front of the camera hole with their reaction? Do you know what Giff I'm talking about?

No. I sound kind of crazy. I'll send it to you. People, people send it to Ian. I didn't explain it well at all. So never mind. But I guess I am a little bit. surprised. I also think players probably have an awareness that it's there, but also the game

happens so fast that I don't think they're thinking, like, watch for the camera hole in the middle of a high base hockey game. So I guess I'm a little bit surprised, but, you know, just the way that it happened, it was his pinky finger specifically that got caught and like pulled back, which was really unfortunate to look at. You've had a rash of injuries yourself lately. You've never had a dislocated, dislocated pinky? Um, I mean, probably my pinky, my one pinky looks a little bit crooked. I played basketball, so you're always like jamming your fingers up. So you played against Kia, you, you played against Kia nurse, didn't you? Yeah, I was actually thinking the other day about how you threw me under the bus with her on the radio. Why would she ever remember playing against me?

You threw me under the bus so hard on the radio. But that's bigger than me, like, I never play, and I played a whole bunch of sports as a kid or like went to school like I never played against anybody who made it big or even went to school with anybody I went to school with one guy who ended up playing in the CFL Canadian Football League but that's it like but I never like your story of you actually got on the court I always love the stories from and I'd love to hear from listeners too like if you played as a kid or went to the same high school as somebody who like made it big like that to me, I know I was joking with you, but you played basketball. You were on the same court as Kia Nurse, who's one of the best players on the planet.

And I'm sorry, but I'd be talking about that all the time, if I were you. Yeah, I mean, like I played at a pretty high level, obviously, if I was playing against Kia. So, yeah, it was like, I think it was, there was always big tournaments and we would always play against the teams in Hamilton because I was in, I played for Guelph and she was in Hamilton for the Transway teams. There's Transway A and B. And at the time, there was no, like, AAU.

So there was just, like, one place for everyone to play. There wasn't really the travel scouting circuit like they have in America. And then the Jewelie got launched and then a lot of, like, players played there and stuff. So, yeah, I played against Kia when we were younger. She was obviously way better than me. I got to the point in my basketball career where I was like, yeah, I'm good. but I'm not going to play in the WMBA. I'm not going to play for Team Canada.

So I hung it up. Just play for fun. Then I ended up running cross-country and track at university, and I raced one of the players, one of the runners, one of the athletes that I raced against in my year. She's my age as Gabriella DeBue Stafford, and she's an Olympian. I'm the mediocre athlete that goes up against the really good ones.

that's my claim to fame. It's like pros versus Joe's. Exactly. Yeah. But I was tech, yeah, I was just kind of in the middle. Yeah. You know, you mentioned the Boston Islander series earlier too and how there's been intensity in that one.

Do you think the Department of Player Safety got it right? David Crachie got a $5,000 fine for, we'll call it a slash to the nether regions of Matt Bargell. Now, Barzell, he did. He did initiate the exchange, right? There's like three or four consecutive cross checks that Barzell delivers to Creachian. Finally, Crachie is like, you know what? I've had it.

But he gave him that stick tap right to the Netherlands. Barzell goes down. Crachie gets a $5,000 fine. I'm always a believer. I hate the fine. I hate the fine because it doesn't amount. It's almost like the league is acknowledging. We know you did something wrong.

we don't think it's that bad that we need to suspend you, but we need to do something. I don't love it, but do you think this was the right thing? Or should you have gotten a game for that? You torn? I've kind of given up trying to agree or disagree or understand some of these things because I think it's different on any given team,

any given play. Yeah, I mean, when I see stuff like that, like when I see what Crachie did, my first is just like, why? Like, why do players always hit each other there when he obviously knows, like, the pain he'd probably be in? I guess that's why he does it because he knows how bad it would hurt. So he's like, well, I'm going to inflict this upon you.

Like, that's what I always think. I was like, why do you hit each other there? Why? It was obviously blatant. You saw the path of a stick. Yeah. It was a full pitch for. That's probably why he got the max fine because you could see he was like shoveling.

there was clear intent to hit that region. Yeah. Please, Chris, our producer, please don't clip this for video. Nobody needs to see. For those listening. Yeah. I'm doing the motion. Yeah, I don't know.

I think I looked at that and I didn't really think anything of it. Honestly, that was my first reaction when I saw the fine. I was like, oh, okay. He got fine for hitting him there. Okay. Makes sense. Like that was one of the ones where if people are going to debate. about it and people are going to be enraged or say it's not enough. I just, there's way worse hits

that have happened that weren't fined or suspended enough than David Creachie. I think it was David Amber. I saw on Twitter, someone posted that David Amber said it was $2,500 for each. Yeah. So that's what I found funny. That was my takeaway from the whole thing. Yeah, that is pretty good. Okay, as we wrap up this part of the conversation, let me ask you, what do you have a harder time kind of predicting or guessing? Is it the length of suspension or, you know, whatever from Department of Player Safety or whether or not there's going to be a goal based on goalie interference? Like, what do you have a better handle of? Neither.

When I'm in these situations, I'm like, am I bad at my job? For me, it's the suspension. Yeah, I think so, too. I think I have a pretty good idea on goalie interference. I think I can go with about 70% accuracy. But the other one feels like a roulette wheel that you spin. Oh, for sure. Yeah.

Like I think I could actually look at a goal, tender interference call, whether it's confirmed or pulled back, whatever it may be. I think I can look at those in either side of mine. I can actually have an intelligent response and say like, this is what happened. This is where he was in the crease. He pushed the pads, you know? I can actually look at that and understand.

understand why or why not. But with suspensions, and as people clearly can see with the cratesy question, I'm just like, yeah, I don't know. Why do he do that? Why do he got fined? Okay. I don't know what's going to happen. So I've kind of just, I'm resigned to the fact that I will never understand suspensions and fines, but I can at least understand a little bit. Coley interference calls. Yeah. I'm very good at my job. Thanks to the athletic. Thank you. Please subscribe. All right, Haley. Listen, I think, you know, we've had a lot of play talk here on the show. And what I think is interesting is I think the most compelling team in the national

hockey league isn't in the Stanley Cup playoffs. And what I love about, I feel like, and Haley, you spent the year in Ottawa, I feel like we're kindred spirits with Columbus, these wonderful little towns that I think they're great hockey markets. And yet people seem to want out. The players always want out. There's a soap opera simmering at every corner, right? Doesn't it?

Doesn't it feel like Columbus and Ottawa? Haley or like a, you know, kind of like we should be sister cities or sibling cities, whatever that term is. It's Ottawa adjacent. Yeah. I like it. They're very similar, yeah, in some ways. And I would say throughout the course of this hockey season, I don't think anybody had

better stories with kind of meteor storylines than Aaron Portsline. And it's great to bring Aaron into the show because Haley, you don't know this because as we opened up the Zoom call, you said, this is the first time that you're meeting Aaron Portsline. How about this? Aaron Portsline and I go back. daily 20 years to minor league baseball. Yeah.

How about that? Columbus Clippers beat writer Aaron Portsline. Welcome to the show. Well, thank you. Ian, I think it's like 26 years maybe. We were talking mid-90s. Late 90s. I was with the Ottawa Links in the late 90s

and you used to come into town for the Columbus dispatch covering the Clippers. Think about that. AAA baseball traveling. like we used to go on the road with the triple a baseball team which seems it's unfathomable now but we used to do every game on the road and i love that trip because it was so for a i was not that far out of my hometown of my vernon ohio to go to ottawa was like so freaking exotic beautiful city i loved it i needed a passport to travel for the first time for work it was the greatest it's so funny it my like, I guess my high school trips, like the grad trip would always be to Ottawa and that would

be the fun, exciting trip from Fergus, Ontario. We're going to go spend a couple days in, in Ottawa to celebrate graduating high school. Yeah. I mean, I loved it. I loved it. I love the bilingual box. It was just so awesome, such a different flavor, especially from the typical baseball game. So yeah. And like I said, I think Ottawa and Columbus are very similar. These kind of small market. in the market, NHL cities that have had a hard time retaining star players recently. And I think the fan bases in both cities are probably like, oh, my gosh, I'm so tired of this.

So just walk us through because this was a pretty big bombshell in the last 10 days or so. Seth Jones wanting out of Columbus, what's the market reaction been like in Columbus? Well, I think for this one, you know, it was, there's a sense of finality to it for sure. but I really don't think many people were that surprised by it. I think they'd almost expected it. Honestly, I think there's enough people on the fan base now that if you put yourself in Seth Jones's shoes, you'd say, yeah, I'd make that call to 27 years old. You're going to break the bank with your next contract.

It's going to be down here for a couple of years. Who wouldn't make that choice? But one thing I'll say, and I think this holds for Ottawa, too. I think the club here gets a pass because when when people say nobody wants to, why doesn't anybody want to stay with the blue jackets? The answer from the club was always, listen, it's a great city. It's actually a really good city. And I go, whoa, whoa, whoa, that's not what people, that's, no player has ever left the blue jackets and said,

I just can't stay in the city. I got to get out of that city. It isn't the city. Like that's like someone saying to me, you're an idiot, you're a fool, and me saying, don't talk about my wife that way. They're not talking about your wife. They're talking about you. Don't defend the city. When people are saying nobody wants to be a blue jacket, they say, actually Columbus is a great city.

It's not the city. And we have to draw that line. It's the organization that people are leaving. As hard as it is for the organization to accept, that is what the truth is. And do you think, and I read the great piece that you did where you spoke with former Columbus players who had been there for the Tortorella and Keckleinen era. In doing that piece and in other conversations that you've had, what do you think are the main reasons why people leave the organization? I think, yeah, it's a great question. We should look at each of these situations individually because it's really easy to.

draw a blanket. This is what it is. And, you know, there are cases like Matthew Shane, who was here, obviously a hell of a player, but they didn't attempt to keep him. He was a pure rental. He moved on to Nashville by his own desire. That's where he wanted to be. So that, and he actually loved Columbus. He was surprised by how much he loved it, which is like what most people's response. They didn't want, they didn't want to pay Sergei Bergrovsky $10 million a year. I think you can look at that situation now and say really good call because what's Florida going to do there? Now, there are other situations, Artemmy Panarin, but his wasn't, get me out of the city, it was I've always dreamed of being a New York ranger.

If you've read his life story, you realize he grew up with almost nothing except the love of his grandparents. And he's in a place now where he wants everything. He wants the everything. He wants to play in Madison Square Garden and be a ranger. That's his dream. The really troubling ones are the more recent ones, the Josh Anderson, basically deciding that as soon as he can get out of this organization, he's going to.

And so they traded him to Montreal. They didn't want to trade Josh Anderson. Who would want to trade Josh Anderson? That was about Pierre-Luc Dubois, absolutely, I mean, a disastrous turn of events for them early. and he still hasn't said exactly what that is. Is it Tortorella? He says no. Is it the contract negotiations he had with Keckleinen?

He says no. Kecklein says no. Something happened where Pierre-Luc Dubois said, I got to get out of here. So I think there are lots of different answers to that question. Ultimately, it matters and that they have to fix it. But what's killed this organization is they've not replaced those. players who have wanted to leave. And so what do they do now? They're at a huge crossroads with the Seth Jones situation where they've got to decide, do they even try to keep this going? Are they

making a trade for current help, for immediate help? Or are they cashing their chips in and finally rebuilding, which is something this organization, believe it or not, is never done? You know, Aaron, what I think is interesting about the Seth Jones situation is, and you alluded to it with Pierre Luke Dubois, there was always whispers of, man, Tortorella grinds people, grinds them, grinds them, guys don't want to do it anymore. And now you can't draw that line to Seth Jones, right? I think that to me is what's really fascinating is that there is no excuse that the coach was the reason why Seth Jones wanted out, right?

Seth Jones loved John Tortor. Loves John Tortorella, really, really loves John Torterella. Zach Werensky likes Torterella. This is one of the stories that as a writer, it's kind of frustrating because no matter how many young players say, I don't love him every day of the season. He drives me crazy sometimes, but I love playing for this coach. I love how much better he's made me. There are 30 of those guys for every guy who says, I can't stand that guy. I got to get out of here.

get me away from him. It's hard to find guys who long-term can't stand John Tortorella. There are certain guys, frankly, who have had issues at many stops with many coaches where you start to say, is it all the coaches or is it maybe this player? And there's some valid critiques of John Tortorella for sure. But I can tell you, this team overwhelmingly at all, at some point they all couldn't stand him but on the whole, they love this guy,

they admire him. A lot of people don't know this. He tried to step down after the bubble in Toronto, so a year ago, and was basically persuaded to come back by players in the room who didn't want him to leave.

That doesn't happen for a coach that nobody can stand. It's the greatest, it's the biggest fallacy out there that every player can't stand tortera. It just is. Well, you hear so much of, oh, he lost the room. He lost the room, but it was the room telling him, hey, like, don't leave, which is really interesting. But obviously, we know that the relationship did end this offseason. And again, you did a great piece explaining that.

What do you think is the, or who do you think is the best fit to replace John Tortorella? Yeah, that's a great question. And that kind of gets back to the earlier question of what are they doing with Seth Jones. It sort of all relates to the same way. Are they still a competitive team? Do they still view themselves in that brism? Or are they bringing it down to the studs and starting over again? And I think that's two very different coaches.

You know, Brad Larson is a guy who's been John Tortorella's assistant here the whole time. John Tortorella has basically told the organization for years now when I'm gone, this should be your next coach. The organization holds Brad Larson in very high regard. I think they would do it. I don't think it's for sure, but I think they would do it. They've also talked to Gerard Goulon. They've talked to David Quinn.

They've talked to Rick Tockett. So what they need, I think, no matter where this goes in the short term as a teaching coach, I think you're going to see the temperature turn down. It's kind of hard to not turn it down when you go from Tortoella to a different coach. the temperature is going to be turned down, but I don't think it's going to be the classic

good cop, bad cop rotation that a lot of teams do because Yarmou Kekalainen, as much as Torderella drove him crazy at times, he liked and actually admired the way Torderella held people accountable. Not always the means, not always the extent that he did it, the very public way that he did.

he did it, but he liked that approach in John Torterell. So I think it's going to be a coach that's pretty tough on players, though maybe not as vocally difficult as John Tortorow. So again, I mean, so many storylines, like you said, finally the new head coach, we kind of hit on like Seth Jones, finding a trade partner. How difficult is that going to be? I would imagine Seth Jones is going to be a highly sought-after commodity, Aaron, but from your discussions, either with his camp or kind of trying to read the, the T-Leaves, so to speak, is Seth Jones hell-bent on getting to UFA status next summer? Or is he willing to kind of do a sign and trade with somebody, which could theoretically help out the jackets.

Yeah. And so right now, when asked that question, the blue jackets are saying, you're asking the wrong person. And I've communicated with Seth Jones. He is, he's somewhere staring at an ocean and not really thinking about this or at least not wanting to acknowledge that he's thinking about this. So no clear answer on that. obviously if you're the blue jackets, that changes the return immensely if he is willing to sign an extension. Now, I always wonder about these things. If you're Seth Jones, and let's just say the Kings who make a ton of sense to me, if you're going to go to the Kings and you're Seth Jones,

is the play here, I'll sign an extension with you so that my old team can get a better return, or is the play here, let's not talk extension right now. I'll sign one with you, but keep the young pieces that you would have to give up to the blue jackets for me. This is what's better for you, and it's what's better for your new player, Seth Jones. So I'm not sure how all of that comes together. I do think these back channel discussions happen. I think it would behoove the blue jackets. Obviously, if he's willing to sign an extension, it's just unclear where that's going to go.

The one thing that is interesting here is Yermilkeleinan spoke a month ago, probably now, that even if Seth Jones didn't sign an extension with him, he would be willing, and this was incredibly stupefying to me, willing to take him into next year and see if maybe he changes his mind, see what comes up with the trade deadline, and really sort of push this thing to the limit.

And then John Davidson's hired and basically says, you know, that is not going to happen because the 2021 Blue Jackets are not, the 2019 blue jackets with Benarine. Totally different situation. We're not doing that. So you see kind of a change in how this might be handled. He's going to be traded this summer, but your question is a fair money, and will he sign an extension before he goes? How big of a boost is bringing John Davidson back into the organization? Yeah, Haley, you know what? That is so it's different now than it was when he first got here,

but it's not entirely different. And the level of frustration and worry here among the fan base is immense. When they headed into the summer, you just look at the list of things and you're like, that might be too much for any, any NHL executive. And there were becoming trust issues between the fans and the front office here. John Davidson, when he says something, damn it, people believe it. And he is soothing, he is calming, he is trustworthy. It's almost like he puts his arm around the fan base and says,

and pats him on the head and says, this is going to be okay. We can do this. And people go, all right, boss, you got it. I think they just feel better about it. I'm curious about where this goes because John Davidson seems to be speaking in terms of a rebuild. This is kind of what he does. He's kind of a house flipper.

If you look at what he did with the blues, you look at what he started to do with the Rangers. He was going to do that with the Blue Jackets his first time here, and the team was a little bit better than he anticipated when he started. I think this time he is compelled to go that direction, whereas when you listen to Yarmal Kekalainen, I think there's more of a today focus. So I think they've got some things to sort out here

before they move too much further into the summer. Was there a push? Like obviously there's a brand new ESPN and TNT broadcasting deal on the horizon. John Davidson, for a lot of hockey fans, Aaron, was one of the best analysts in the game. Yeah. Was there a push, do you know, from either of those networks or desire from JD to get back into broadcasting? Or is he just kind of said, you know what, I am now an executive? Yeah.

Well, he did have an offer. The offer would have included him moving to Florida, which I'm going to assume means he would have been part of. the Turner panel. There's a lot of those guys live in Florida and fly to Atlanta for the show and then fly right back to Florida. That was on the table for him pretty quickly. I think him getting a taste of the management side of, it's a former player.

This is a guy who's used to being involved in the wins and the losses and the angst of it. And as great a broadcaster he was, That is a drug that just that former players and former executives just have a hard time getting over, that win and lose proposition on a hourly basis. I don't think he gave it serious thought. I think he was very honored by the offer. I think it was probably a hell of an offer.

But he likes to be in the thick of things and be part of a competitive situation. So as Ian and I have both kind of mentioned, just how much has been going on for the blue jackets during the season, this off season. It's going to be a really busy summer for you. One of the other kind of storylines that we hadn't touched on yet was Max Domi's injury. It seems like he's going to be out. He's going to miss the first month or he's going to miss training camp. How significant is the news that Max Domi was, you know, had to have surgery and we'll miss a significant amount of time. Yeah, well, it's a kick. I mean, this team doesn't have center depth to begin with. And so, you know, we don't even really know if Max Dome, I just want to call him Tye Domi, how

to mind. If Max Domey is a center for this team, he was sort of in and out of that position all of last season. Say this, he was a ghost for the first three months of last season. Just his adjustment to it was, if it was the system, it was the teammates, whatever it was, it just didn't jive. And then the last, I want to say, month of the season, he was a pretty good player, pretty productive. And much of that was back in the middle again. So I think they're counting on him as a center. They almost have to. And so this is a, this is a big blow for them. He's going to be out until early November at the earliest. Shoulders can take a while. I think it's probably safe to not count on him until December. And, and again, the crossroads question here, do they go out and find a center to remain competitive

of this coming season for the first two months of the season? Or is this a situation where you say, you know what? Jack Roscovick, you're the number one center, liver die. Alexander Texier, you went in and out of the position. You're a centerman now. We're going to take our lumps, but you're going to learn and you're going to grow, yada, yada. I think it's a huge question for them.

But Max Domi, and now he's coming into his last year before he hits UFA status. So we've already got big stories for next summer, guys. Yeah, no, it is remarkable to watch it. Like I said, it's this wonderful contrast between this nice, quiet town and a soap opera of a hockey team. It's just like, like I said, just like Ottawa, wonderful town, quiet, and yet it just seems to be, it's almost like you would expect this stuff to be like in New York or like the tabloid type of stuff. But it's going to be an interesting summer for you here coming up here. Yeah, it is. I've already blown off one vacation.

That's just not happening. this summer. I mean, we used to take some pretty exotic trips. My wife and daughters still are. Good for them. But I'm not. It's, I'm done. I'm done.

I mean, it's not going to happen. This summer's going to be chaos. At least you're accepting it and you're prepared for it, you know? I've embraced it. Yeah. Now, did you,

as we wrap up here, did you actually have a trip booked and then, like, you used travel insurance or you just didn't even bother booking this trip? Well, COVID sort of prevented that sort of aggressive planning, I would say. But yeah, I mean, you know, we kind of do it big in the summertime. The last half of, you know how it is. The last half of July and the first half of August is like, you're gone.

You're comfortable not being within cell service. So National Park, we went to Italy a couple years ago. We tried to get away, get away, get away. But yeah, that's not going to have. Well, hey, listen, fingers crossed, you do get a little bit of downtime here because you deserve it. Like Haley and I said, your coverage all season long in the Blue Jackets, top-notch stuff. Appreciate the visit. And listen, hopefully fingers crossed at some point we'll actually all get to see each other in person here down the road.

That sounds great. Thanks for the kind words. I really appreciate it. I get to be with you guys. All right, Haley, all I could think about when Aaron Portsline was wrapping up there, he says, you know, we're thin at center. You and I just did a collab piece on the Sean Monaghan fit in Ottawa. I'm smelling a Salvean port's line combo.

Is Sean Monaghan a fit in Columbus? I mean, now that you mentioned it, I'm a little pissed that you didn't mention it. Well, he was on the podcast because we could have publicly pressured him to do the story. Now I have to privately message him about it. He doesn't sound like he's got a lot on his plate, too. No, not at all. So the public pressure, you know, wouldn't have been helpful whatsoever.

You know, we get it on the podcast, then the fans are talking about it, then they want it. They're asking Aaron, why haven't you done the story with Haley yet? Yeah. But now we can do this here. Yeah. We can publicly shame him if he doesn't do the story with me. Oh, he'll do it with you. And I think it's, what's interesting is I actually think that that could make sense, right,

depending on what Columbus's mindset is. But you look at the offseason and you look at the market for centermen. there's not going to be very many. And I know Sean Monaghan has some health issues and some productivity decline circling around them. But in terms of the straight up resume of Sean Monaghan being available, Haley, you're not going to find too many centermen available this summer with Sean Monaghan at his age and his productivity in the past that are going to be on the market, right?

Yeah. And that was one of the things that I pointed out in the piece that we did. and I even linked to the list of UFA centermen from cat friendly. And, you know, it's Ryan Getslav, David Creachie, Ryan Nugent Hopkins, Derek Stepan, Artimenev. Like, there's not a ton of really high-end centers that are going to be available on the free agent market. Of course, there's going to be some. But it's not, you know, it's not going to be an overly rich market. It's a fairly soft market.

I mean soft in terms of what's available, not soft in terms of who needs centers because I think every year there's going to be at least a dozen teams who are saying our center depth isn't that strong. I know around the trade deadline, you can even go back to the teams who would have been interested in Sam Bennett because they had center depth problems. The Pittsburgh Penguins, the Florida Panthers obviously acquired Sam Bennett. There was a lot of teams who needed pieces up the middle and that's only going to, you know, that's going to remain true here this summer. And again, like we said, there's not too, too many elite centers who are going to be available on the free agent market. And again, you know, the Calgary Flames are presumed to be open for business. I'm not saying that they're, you know, we need to trade Sean Monaghan this summer because they're only going to do it if they can get an impactful piece back. I don't think the Flames would trade Sean Monaghan for a couple of picks because then they just don't have a player to put in their top six, which they obviously need.

I mean, unless they have another big deal up their sleeve and then they do it for cap relief purposes, of course, there's lots of different things that can happen here. But I think the ideal move is Sean Monaghan for another top six piece or a top four defensemen. So Columbus could be an interesting one if they need a centerman. And I know Sean Monaghan, like you said, has had some, he has an injury history. And he did have a down year this year. But I, you know what? I think it was such a strange season. in the league as a whole and for the flames specifically,

uh, with the, whatever happened at the start of the season. It was, you know, really high expectations and they fall off a cliff after the first three games. Really, really bad up and down.

Jekyll and Hyde kind of season. Then you have the coaching change. You've got the injuries. You've got the, you know, the rumored rift that happened in the room after the puck flip. And you've got Sam Bennett requesting a trade. Like it was just such a weird year in Calgary.

And in the league. that I don't know how many people are going to put too much weight in this season. So if you just look at the rest of Sean Monahan's body of work, he was a 20 goal guarantee every single year of his career until this year. And that is a mark of consistency. That's, you know, a testament to his skill level. So I think, you know, his value might not be as high as it was after he had 84 points in 2018, 19, and 34 goals.

But I do think that there is still some value for Sean Monaghan. and it'll be interesting to see what happens this summer with teams looking for centers. Yeah, and it's going to be an interesting summer because you got, as we just had Aaron Ports line on, going to have Seth Jones on the market, Jack Eichael on the market, Sean Monaghan. So this is going to be a pretty big, pretty big offseason

and maybe we'll see some significant moves in and around the draft. All right, Haley, as we always do. We're going to wrap up the show with a little multiple choice madness here on this Monday. They got three questions for the two of us to tackle. Now, I'm going to throw this first one your way. Okay, there's eight teams. still standing in the Stanley Cup playoffs as we record these episodes.

So here's my question for you, Haley. Which potential Stanley Cup final matchup do you think would be best for the NHL right now just from like a marketing or like a promotional standpoint? Okay. Is it A, Colorado Avalanche Tampa Bay Lightning, B, Vegas Golden Knights, Tampa Bay Lightning. C, the Boston Bruins against the Montreal, Canadians, or D, something else.

And yeah, keep in mind, technically Jets Hurricanes is on the, board. So what do you think, Kaylee? Best from a marketing promotional standpoint, Aves Lightning, Knights Lightning, Habs Bruins, something else. My initial thought is Aves Tampa just because of the star power that would be in that series in Nathan McKinnon, Kail McCar. And but again, like those aren't, when you look at Aves Tampa, but then you bring up Boston, Montreal, like the sheer marketing power and fan bases behind those two teams. They might not have Nate McKinnon on one of those teams. I mean, the Boston Bruins have a ton of firepower. So it's kind of hard

to go against the Bruins and Habs. I don't know if it would, I mean, old rivalry renewed, lots of good players, the whole Taylor Hall angle, you've got Kerry Price on the Habs. So at first, I'm thinking Avs and Tampa because you've got Kutrov and Stamcoast, Nate McKinnon, in Cam O'Car, but the institutions that are Boston and Montreal are hard to say no to in terms of marketing and fans, et cetera. I know. Like, I'm torn on this one, too, because I do think there's a historical kind of reason why Boston Montreal would be great.

And the fact of the matter is, when we go back to the old form or the usual format next year, we may never see this again, right? Like, we may never have a Canadian's brilliant stay on the cup. I am going to go with what your initial gut was, which is Colorado Tampa, and I'll tell you why. I think, Haley, you're going to see a huge push. If you haven't seen it already, you're starting to see a bigger push from ESPN on the hockey realm. And they're talking about hockey a little bit more. And I think to myself, if you're trying to attract viewers and show off what's the best possible result from an entertainment standpoint, like what could sell the game.

You want to show off your product. Yeah. And I kind of like what you said about, Macon. McCar and McKinnon because right now I think Kail McCar might be the most creative and fun defensemen in the game. I think Nate McKinnon might be in the conversation of the best forward of the game. And then you look at Tampa. Again, Nikita Kutcherov. You got a former first overall pick in Stephen Stamcoach who's been dynamite.

Victor Headman, arguably the best goalie in the game in Vasilevsky. Like I think if you're... So much star power. Yeah, at Braden Point, we forget about Braden Point. Like, I guess you look at this and I think you understand, you understand that we're headed to a very important stage for the NHL next fall where they're going to be having that new deal. I feel like going in on a Colorado Tampa six or seven game series, some really entertaining games. Personally, I think, I think that might be better for the game. Yep, I agree.

Like I said, that was my initial thought. And then I kind of reversed chorus with the kind of Boston Montreal idea. But I agree with you, Ian. I think it would be, you know, such a great product, so much star power. And that's when you think about, you know, what's a game that we want to show fans, brand new fans who've never watched hockey before. What do you want to show them? And I think that's Avs, Tampa would be a really great example of what you'd want to show people

who are new to hockey. Yeah. Okay. On the question number two in a little multiple choice. this Monday. Haley, we've seen some fans be allowed into venues and kind of playoff atmosphere has been rekindled

this spring. Here's my question. You could pick one playoff venue to watch a game with fans right now. What do you choose? Are you going, A, the Nassau Coliseum in New York with the Islanders play. B, T-Mobile Arena in Vegas, home of the gold of night. C. PNC

Arena and Raleigh, home of the Hurricanes, has been dynamite, or D, maybe you would want to be one of the 2,500 fans inside the bell center. Yeah, it's limited capacity and yeah, it's cavernous. But hey, it's playoff hockey in Montreal. So tell you what, I'm going to go first on this one. And I'm torn.

Haley, I've actually had the privilege of being inside the Nassau Coliseum for a playoff game. This was way back when early 2000s, Ottawa played the Islanders. It was electric. It was amazing. And it's an old barn, but it just comes alive at springtime. But I think because I've had that experience, I don't know, I'm torn because I also know this is it, right?

Like, this is going to be the last time the Islanders probably play playoff games at Nassau. There's kind of a sentimental feel. But I'll tell you, watching the Vegas Golden Knights, I think it might be there. There's a leather answer. It's full capacity, right? I think that's the answer, although I'm torn because I think the Islanders venue would be great because of the nostalgia.

But you turn on your TV, you see the Vegas T-Mobile Arena and it's sold out. And you're like, man, that might be the best place to be in the sporting world right now, right? Yeah. Well, I have an axe to grind with the athletic. Oh. No, not really. It's my first, last year was my first season on the Sends beat. The first road trip the Sends went on was Arizona, Dallas, and Vegas, and in some kind of order. And I was like, I'd like to go on that road trip, obviously. And they're like, uh, why? No. And so I was, I'm just seeing everything that Vegas did. first couple of years that they had, you know, the team and just the energy and the environment at that arena in the regular season that was so awesome that I like begged. I was like,

please, hey, like, I'd love to go on this road trip. Love to go to Vegas. You're like, do you have a reason? Do you have a story idea? No, just want to go. So that's my ax to grind that they didn't, you know, let me just go to Vegas for no reason. I just sound like a snotty millennial. You didn't even have, like, you didn't have some fake story or feature to pitch. No, I was just like, hey, so these are the road trips I'd like to go on this year. And they're probably like, of course she wants to do the Arizona, Vegas trip. Yeah. And then probably what, California just happens to be when it's cold weather in Ottawa.

Yeah. Yeah. No, when the Sends went on the California trip, it was winter and I didn't go on it. And I just sat there in my snowsuit. But again, the whole point is, is like, this everything about a game with the Vegas Golden Knights looks incredible. And the playoff atmosphere, the fact that they tied the series up, it's just taking it to another level. So that's at the top of my list. But I will say that NASA Coliseum has looked unreal.

Like the environment, the energy, the fan base looks so passionate. You've got the guys crushing the beers against their heads, which is always fun. That's always great. So I'm with you on those two, but for me, Vegas is an absolute to-do list arena for me. Yeah. Seeing Clark Gillies, former Islander Great crushed that beer can on his head. That was next level. So good.

Final question in multiple choice bad news for you, Haley. We had a little history on the weekend. Taya Curry became the first young woman drafted into the O HL, selected by the sarniest thing, terrific young goaltender. So here's my question, Haley. Let's look ahead. In the next 20 years, which of the following positions do you think we might see filled by a woman at the NHL level? Okay, so here are your options.

A, a player, B, a head coach, C, a general manager, D, we're going to say all of the above, or E, we're going to say none of the above. Haley, let's look ahead 20 years from now in the NHL. Will we have a woman that's been a player, a head coach, a GM, all of the above? Not any above. It's such a tough one because, you know, even the Florence Schelling was the first woman to be a GM of a men's team and she got fired for lack of experience this offseason. And for me, it's like, okay, well, how is she supposed to get the experience? Like, okay, so how's she going to get it?

So it's tough. And I think a player is difficult. I think the way that the women's game and the men's game is played is very, very different. there's a reason why you see young girls leaving boys hockey. I think it's around Bantam where boys hockey introduces more checking. I think it's Bantam level and that's when most of the girls who are playing boys hockey will leave and go into the girls hockey circuit. There's also, I don't know if many people know this,

but the like hockey Canada, when they do their scouting for the girls and women's teams, they do not look at boys hockey. So if you are a girl who's good enough to play boys hockey, you're not always going to be, you might not have national team opportunities because you're not being scouted the same way as the girls playing in girls. So that's why you don't really see too many girls going very far in boys hockey. Because the game's different and, you know,

you also need to show what you can do in the OWHA or, you know, the different bodies for the girls and women's games. So I don't, I don't think we should. see a player first. I would see, part of me is leaning towards none of the above because I think the first big position will be something, but I guess they're already there.

You have developmental coaches. You have player development. Those roles are already filled. So I guess if I had to choose, I would maybe say, this is hard. I'm really waffling on this. at the NHL level, I would maybe say that we would see a coach first, but it's going to take a lot.

It's going to take some time. But I say coach because we already have people like Haley Wickenheiser, Kendall Coyne, in those positions that are in player development on ice. You have skate coaches, et cetera. So there's already women getting the notches in their belt to go towards a position like that. You also have some scouts and some agents who could, you know, get into the GM's fear, but I do think that will take quite a bit longer. So after my 20 minutes of rambling, I'm going to say a head coach.

Yeah. You know what? I think it might be a general manager. And I think part of it is the landscape is shifting. You look at Major League Baseball and Kim Ang with the Miami Marlins, ended up becoming the first woman to be a general manager in one of the four big, the big four. And I do look at, and I see, like, and you pointed out the Toronto Maple Leafs have brought in Haley Wickenhizer.

I think Seattle has been very progressive in some of their hiring. rings. I think you're seeing a shift. And I agree with you. I think if there's ever going to be a woman who's a player in the pro level on the men's side, it'll likely be a goalie, just like we're seeing with Taya Curry. But I think if I had to lay down bets, I'm going to say general manager. And I do think because you've seen a lot of women really be at the forefront of analytics. You've seen a lot of women kind of really move into scouting. And that, it feels to me like it might happen at some point. So if I had to lay down some money, Haley, I'm going to say in the next 20 years. But just to wrap up the show, that was a really cool story, though, seeing young Taya Curry

getting drafted in Sarnia. It was awesome. And, you know, she earned it with good play, strong play. Like, she got drafted. That was a great story. And I think it was really unfortunate seeing some of the people, you know, take time out of their day to bash the accomplishment. This is a young girl who like she is a girl like she's a young like she's a young woman like this is how old was she like 16. Sorry I don't have it right from you. I think she's 15 but yeah about to turn 16. You're taking time out of your day to tell a 15 year old girl that she sucks or this is stupid like you know get something better to do with your time. This is somebody who loves to play hockey. This is probably what she's always wanted to do is play hockey and it's a notch in her belt.

and there's nothing but positive things that can come of this. Like, this is, there is no way that you can take this as a negative because it's just a 15-year-old girl who's good at what she does and she got rewarded for it by getting drafted to the OHL. Yeah, no, I agree with you. Well said. You know what, Haley, that's a perfect place to leave off with a little bit of optimism there on that front.

So listen, have yourself a great week. Had a lot of fun actually working with you on the weekend and that collab piece between the Sends and the Calgary Flame. So the good news for you is now you can go bug Portsline to do a collab piece with him in the next seven. I think I'm just going to bug everyone. Hey, who needs to center? Hey, do you want to do the exact same story? And I'll just copy and paste my responses.

But I'll just add different assets. Yeah, we got to have some sort of like a mass email that you can just change it up and have the name personalized. Yeah. Hey, hope all is good with you. Yeah. Hope you had a good weekend. Do you copy and paste emails like that? Like when you're doing a story, like if you're doing a.

feature story and you need like four people to talk about like Connor Brown. Do you email all of them? But just like, hey, blank. My name's Ian Mendez from the Athletic Ottawa working on a story about Connor Brown would love to talk to you. Please let me know. Thanks, Ian. And then you just change the name. No, I don't do that. Do you? You write like a fresh email for everybody. Yeah. For sure. I do. It only takes like 90 seconds. Do you type with one hand? No? One finger, I mean?

No? Like, what do you mean? Like, what do you mean? No, I'm just wondering if you're like an old man who types with one finger. What? Am I giving you old man one finger typing vibes? You were working in AAA baseball before I was born. So a little bit.

No, I was. I was working in 1998. I think you were around in 1990. Okay. Yeah. I was alive. Yeah. But no, I don't do that for emails.

But I mean, I've done something similar. Like I've taken like, if I really hit like a good sentence in my email, you know, I'll just kind of copy and paste that part, but I'll do the rest of it. You know, we should have ended this show before you accuse me of being a one-finger typing old man. Okay? We're going to leave it there. I think we've been working together too much. Exactly.

It's all come out. Hey, listen, this was a lot of fun. though. And have a great week and looking forward to doing you again next Monday. Thanks, Ian. All right. Hey, thanks, everybody for listening to the Athletic Hockey Show. I want to remind you, if you didn't get a chance to listen to them on Friday,

Max Boltman, Corey Pranman. They got a draft, kind of prospect edition of the Athletic Hockey Show. That's going to run Fridays right through the NHL draft. So all summer long, June and into July, five days a week of the Athletic Hockey Show, A reminder, the USA edition, or whatever they're calling it these days. Customs Gentile, they come your way on Tuesday.

Thanks again for listening. Subscribe on your favorite podcast platform. Leave us a rating and review. We'd certainly appreciate that. And an annual subscription to join us at The Athletic. It's just $3.99 a month when you visit theathletic.com slash hockey show.