The Athletic Hockey Show - Which Atlantic Division teams are we buying and selling on?

Episode Date: September 8, 2025

Hailey and Sean take a closer look at the 8 Atlantic Division teams, what additions and subtractions they made in the offseason, and who will improve and who will decline as we prepare for the 2025-26 NHL season.We want to hear from you! Please fill out our listener survey: https://forms.gle/CDbF51vAPngm2ZYS6Hosts: Hailey Salvian and Sean GentilleExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Jeff Domet Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the athletic hockey show. Hello, everyone. Welcome to the athletic hockey show. It's Haley Salvean and Sean Gentilly here with you. We are in the dead middle of the summer here. Player movement has safely slowed down to a crawl. Things can still change, but teams look mostly set for next season, which makes us a great time for Sean and I to pop in and assess how we feel about all 32 teams.

the NHL, that and I don't know if you know this, Sean, but there's not a whole lot of news to talk about at the moment. I feel like when stuff gets this slow, that's my brain actually flips over into next season mode. Like I've, I stopped, I stopped thinking of the Florida Panthers as this season's champion or whatever. And then, and then just kind of just kind of move forward and flip the calendar. Yeah, it's a necessary bit of a mental reset that happens here. Because before you know, man, there's going to be games back. And we're going to have to start thinking about. these in current terms. So yeah, this is

I guess kind of our attempt at getting mentally prepped for whatever comes next. What's the socially acceptable time to start calling it last season or this season? Oh, I think we were past that. It's always tough for me.

I definitely started pushing last season with Frankie and McIndoo like after free agency. And were they getting confused by that? Macandoo was because, you know, let's let's face it, he's not the, not the brightest bulb in the box. Frankie had no problem with it. He's a pros, a pros pro. Yeah. But now we, like I said, it's mental reset time. I think we're there. So we are going to be bringing back a series we did last season, or I guess two seasons ago we're going with this last year. See, that's when stuff gets your overcome. That's what stuff gets complicated. Yeah. We're bringing

back a series we did last year in terms of podcast years. It's buying or selling NHL off seasons. If you didn't listen last time around, we stole this from the athletic football show. They do a great job, especially if you're an NFL fan, you should check them out. But Sean and I are adopting this for the NHL. And we're basically going to be making calls on whether or not we are buying stock in a team based on their off season moves or selling it off. If we want to look at it more simply, which teams improve the most or decline the most this summer. Just a different way to look at how we feel about all the teams. Last year, we grouped the teams based on if they were a contender,

rebuilder, et cetera. We kind of just did four different groups of eight. This time we're going to simplify and just go by division. We'll do all four divisions over the next several episodes. Sean, do you want to explain anything else? Did I do that efficiently? I haven't been on the show for a while. Those are good ground rules.

Anything to add before we start? No, I think framing it as a stock price thing is the way to go. Because we're not, it's not just as simple as saying whether we believe in this team as a, you know, next season. Right, because then that's boring. It's new ones there. Yeah. We're going to talk about the Florida Panthers for an hour and be done. It's more like, do we more generally, holistically like the direct.

this team is going in more than we did in, you know, on June 15th, I think is the best way to frame it. So yeah, that's what you did. So, yeah, I think we're good. Okay. We're going to start with the Atlantic Division. We can say it's alphabetical order. We can say we're lazy and we're in the East Coast. I don't, I don't know.

Say what you want about me. It's fine. No one works harder. Not laziness. What are you talking about? All right, we're going to start with the Atlantic Division. We are going in the inverse order of the divisional standings from last season. So that means our first segment here.

We're going to look at the Boston Bruins, the Buffalo Sabres, and the Detroit Red Wings. Let's start with Boston, Sean, very quickly. If we look at Dom's model every year, he takes a look at what teams improve the most or not. The Bruins have a plus four net rating according to Dom's model. that's 11th overall. Pretty modest. In Victor Arvidson, Tanner, Geno, Sean Correlli,

and Michael Isamont, out, Cole, Kepke, Parker, Wether Spoon. These are just kind of the highlights. Obviously, we know a lot of the bigger things that happen with the Boston Bruins

was at the trade deadline. This is going to be a very different team this season. Do you want to start? Because for me, it's pretty simple. Other than the Arvinson edition, I don't,

I'm selling. my Bruin stock. It's pretty simple for me. I'm selling. I don't think what we're going to see as a team that's as brutal as it was down the stretch, if only because they're going to have Charlie McAvoy and Inhabis Lindel back. It's something approaching full strength. Like that's the biggest reason I can find to be down with what, you know, with the direction that the Bruins are heading in. That's a legitimate top pair that they didn't have down the stretch when they completely, you know, Let's be honest, they were they were coming from behind in the, in the tank race there at the end.

I like what they did in the draft. I think getting James Hagan's is in the spot that they got them is a nice bit of work. I think he seems like, you know, if you, if you said a year ago that James, that you drafted James Hagen's where they picked them at eighth overall. Yeah, it would have been, yeah, you'd have been psyched. And I think James Hagan's suffers a little bit from what we've seen from the Macklin Celebrinis of the world when they've gone to the NCAA and lit it up. I mean, James Higgins was fine. He wasn't the best player in college hockey like Celebrini was. But I think that doesn't, I shouldn't detract from the fact that he's a really good prospect and he's a really good get for them to have in that spot.

So I like that. I like the fact that they have McAvoy and Lindelam coming back. David Posternak is, you know, an MVP tier player. when he's at his best. Like there's stuff to like there. Sure, but in terms of their off season. Yeah, I think the overall,

because the off season they had and because of, you know, bits and pieces of what we saw for them, particularly down the middle. They're always, they're always looking for centers. It feels like,

and I don't think they address that any particularly meaningful way. I'm selling them for sure. Like, yeah, I think things are going to continue getting, you know, are they going to be one of the three worst teams

in the league like they were, for the last six weeks. I don't think so, but I can't, in good conscience, pick them to make any true upward moves after the way they're offseason one. No, there's things to like at the top of the lineup for the Bruins and Arvetson. Like I said, adds to that he's a legitimate top nine player. It's the rest of the moves that don't do much for me. And like, maybe this is just me. Penny pinching with Brad Marchand and then paying Tanner Genoa and Sean Corrally combined $5.25 million.

Like, I can't get over that in terms of looking at the Bruins off season. And if we're expanding that a little bit to what happened with Marchand and trading them to the Panthers at the deadline, I just think there's a lot like better stuff you can do with $5.25 million. Maybe Brad Marchand's not taking a big pay cut. If he's staying with the Bruins, then he did with the Panthers, but that's the deal that he signed to stay in Florida. So there's just something about that that blocks out any other positives with the Bruins. But again, if we're looking at the offseason, like David Pasternak is great. Not a new addition. That is a piece of the core.

That is a reason to always be interested in the Boston Bruins. But if we're looking at what they did this summer, Janow and Coralie don't do much for me. Arvidson's fun. But I'm not looking at the Atlantic Division and saying, I am buying stock on the Boston Bruins. I'm not selling off and saying they're crap, but it's more of a soft sell, I would say.

It's going to take a lot for them to, because we're so used to, for a generation worth of NHL players, to take the Bruins seriously as a contender in that division. And I don't think, I don't think they're there anymore. And you can, again, McAvoy's back, Lindelm's back. we expect some kind of bounce back from Jeremy Swamman.

Like there, there are bits and pieces there that suggests that it's not going to be as maybe brutal as it was as it was in the last couple legs of last season. But man, if you're, if you are of the mindset that this is still a legit contender, I think you got to, I think you got to move on. And that's, that's where I'm at. And that's why I'm selling. Let's go to the Buffalo Sabres now plus nine net rating. That's seventh overall.

This is an interesting one because I think in a vacuum, you look at that. net rating and you look at maybe some of the move. So they signed Bo Byram to a two-year contract worth $6.25 million per year. That was one of the big items on the to-do list for Kevin Adams. They had the two big contracts to get done. That was Bo Byram and J.J. Paterka, we know they traded Paterka away. And they add Josh Dohn, Justin Danforth, Connor Timmons, Alex Lyon. Those are some of the highlights out.

J.J. Paturca, Sam Lafferty, Connor Clifton, and Jacob Bernard Docker, all that leads. to a plus nine net rating, which is essentially plus nine goals in. We're trying to simplify Dom's model. I don't know if that's correct. Maybe he'll yell at me, but that's how I look at it. But like the Sabres don't exist in a vacuum. So I just think this is a team that's missed the playoffs 14 years in a row. It looks good on Dom's sheet,

but it doesn't inspire much confidence in me. And I want to read this from Matt Fairburn. He's our Sabres writer. And he kind of, He wrote a great story that asked the overarching question of, like, was this enough? Did Kevin Adams do enough? And looking actually more fully at like what was the plan here?

It seems like they kind of did a lot. There's a lot in and out, but like what was the vision of you're the Buffalo Sabres? And I just think it goes back to JJ Proterka. And this is how Matt Fairburn put it. Adams entered the offseason wanting to extend him, only to realize the feeling was not mutual. So the biggest move the Sabers made this season,

was one driven by a 23-year-old who no longer wanted to be in Buffalo. Other than that, looks like a lot of minor moves. I don't feel confident in the Sabres. I don't feel confident in that direction or the soft season. That's a hard sell for me. This is the first, like, easy one for me is just, I'm selling hard. There's a lot of names on our list here. We've got a lot of ins and a lot of outs.

And no bigger name from either of those columns is J.T. JJ Petrker, right? Like they, that's, he's the best player that, they, that figured into, uh,

Buffalo's off season and he's, he's, he's playing for Utah. No, obviously that's a, that's a big thing. Yep. And you mentioned this in,

in one way or another, uh, just now, but man, every year, to some degree, we've tried to factor like, okay,

if, uh, if things go right, internal improvements. Yeah, if, if they, if the players that they have in the fold already

improve a bit and they should you know the savers are going to make some kind of climb and it hasn't happened yet so i'm i'm of the mindset daily like i think you are that until that happens i'm done i'm done predicting it um the big move like the bigger maybe a bigger move than peturca is in some ways is is keeping bow byram around for two years but we still don't know what boehiram is we talked about that on the wednesday show recently like is he a guy who is capable of playing decent minutes with Rasmus Dahlin. Yeah, I think we know that. But Rasmus Dahlin is a fringe Norris candidate at this point.

He's really, really good. And if you're worth anything, you probably should look competent next to, next to Rasmus Daly. The question for Byram is whether he can anchor his own pair. And if he doesn't do that, what's he worth? So still a ton of outstanding questions. I think they're similar to a lot of the ones that we've asked around Buffalo over the last few years. And I think it just makes it impossible for them to be anything other than a cell online. end. Yeah. I mean, we should say they sign Jack Quinn to to a two-year contract. That's a nice bit of

work for a higher draft pick. If you're the Sabres, 23-year-old who did want to stay 14 goals last season. I think 14, 15, 15 goals last season, excuse me. So that's, that's nice. There's just an intangible quality with Buffalo, man, where you're like, I just need to see more than that. We've heard this. We've heard this to some extent. And we need it to actually happen. You need it to need to see the jump from Owen power. It seems like he's stagnated. You need to see, you know. I need to see more than that, though.

It's not even about, to me, it's not about internal development anymore. Oh, for sure. More to make this team relevant. I think not to sound corny, but you owe fans that at this point. Completely. You can't. You can't bank on internal improvement when that's what you've done year after year after year.

Like, show some initiative, show some gumption, make a, make a meaningful move that isn't trading away J.J. Patyrka or, you know, the Sam Ryanhearts of the world. Like, like, too many off seasons for Buffalo have been marked by that kind of stuff. And I think that this is really just just been another one. So yeah, it's impossible to buy them. Yeah. Because I think at least last season, we're like, yeah, Jason Zucker, I don't hate that. That's fun. Ryan McLeod, nice. You guys went out and did some things. So we're two of the top five scoring players on the Sabres last year. Like we're talking about a team that wants all this internal development.

Like, our top players are 27, 29, and in their 30s at this point. Spend some money, man. That's really what it boils down to. Yeah, I felt better about them last season than I do right now. So. Yeah. And how did that turn out feeling good about the Buffalo Sabres last year? I didn't feel great.

I just said better than right now. I got, I've been, fool me once. Shame on me. if we'll meet two or three or four times. A bunch of minor moves for a team that hasn't made the playoffs in 14 years. Again, to Matt's point, this is what really did it for me. Millions and millions of dollars. The biggest move the Sabres made was trading a 23-year-old who didn't want to be there.

It's not good. Sell. Let's go to the Detroit Red Wings. This is one of the more interesting teams in the Atlantic to me. I feel like we talk about them all the time. We've been asking the same question about the Red Wings. When are they going to make a move in the Atlantic? how do they stack up against Ottawa, Montreal,

the other kind of rebuilding teams. They have a plus six net rating. That's ninth overall. In James Van Riemsdike, Mason Appleton, Jacob Bernard Docker, and John Gibson, some pretty good additions out,

Vladimir Tarasanko, Tyler Mott, Jeff Petrie, Alex Lyon, and Peter Marazek. I think I'm more interested in the Red Wings than either of the teams we've discussed so far, Sean,

John Gibson's obviously the big one. I don't think Van Riemstike and Appleton are huge names, but they are probably upgrades over a Tyler Mott. I'd rather have Jacob Bernard Docker than Petrie or even Justin Hall in the third pair. So kind of window dressing or work around the edges. But I think the Red Wing should look more competitive this season. I think whether or not they're going to be a top team in the Atlantic is a bigger debate. But in terms of like, let's start with what they did so far before we zoom out.

Do you like what the Red Wings did this summer? I think they did just enough to keep me on board with the way things are going. You're still hooked on the Izer plan. He gave you just enough. No, I'm, I guess that's kind of the question is like in a vacuum, I think they're better. I think there's still reason for true concern over what the long-term direction of things are. But I think Detroit's a better team now than they were six months ago, which ultimately is enough to make them kind of a soft, a soft buy for me. I think John Gibson at various points over the last couple years has shown that he is capable of,

still capable of starting a bunch of games for plenty of teams in the league. I think that he's also going to benefit from getting away from the Ducks who, you know, over the last few years have been varying degrees of horrendous defensively. And I think that's going to help him. I think someone like Marco Casper, who was really, really good down the stretch for them last year, as a rookie, I think a lot of it hinges on him. And that makes me nervous. Like, I don't know if you want, you know, your team's playoff aspirations to hinge

on a young second-line center who, you know, has not quite put as good as he was down the stretch. I don't think he's got all that, all that large of a body of work. And I still think, based on their offseason, that they have too much on the plate of Moritz-Sider and Simon Edvinson. I really would have liked to have seen them go out and find some other solution defensively outside of, outside of Bernard Docker and guys like that. So there's there's holes there. I think some of their problems remain, but ultimately the fact that they got is, is that they really did improve in net in the form of John Gibson is enough to make me, you know, I see the arrow.

I see the arrow pointing the right direction for them. And for me, that's enough to make them a buy. Max did a pretty good look at their depth chart. And, you know, will internal growth be enough to push the Red Wings into the playoffs? That was another story that Max did. He did a couple mailbag looking at. Pardon me? It's a scary headline.

You know, like if you're a Red Wings fan, that sets off some kind of alarm bells. Because we just talked about the Sabres in those same terms. Like, you can't bet entirely on internal growth. That's a tough proposition. Yeah. It almost makes me feel like I'm contradicting myself a little bit because I do think that a little bit of internal development plus Gibson being a legitimate upgrade and that is enough for me to buy on the Detroit Red Wings in terms of the offseason that they had. Whereas with the Sabres, I said like, no, internal development is not enough anymore. Detroit signed Van Ramesdike, Bernard Docker, Appleton. So, like, they did something.

And they should help the Red Wings to varying degrees. But it feels like the biggest needle mover is going to be Marco Casper and Edwomen, and taking steps in a positive direction next season. Yeah, I know it's contradicted, but I'm okay with that when we're talking about Detroit versus Buffalo. It's the bare minimum. I think that's kind of it. it's the bare minimum. Like if they,

you would have liked to have seen them do more. If they didn't get Gibson, I probably feel different. If they don't get John Gibson, I'm probably sitting here being like it's another year where the Red Wings are working around the fringes. And that's not enough for me anymore.

But they did go out and they improved an important position. I think the big question, and maybe, I don't know if that changes your mind about to buy or sell in the Red Wings, but do you think they did? enough to move up in the Atlantic. Do you think the Red Wings can finish ahead of a Montreal or an Ottawa and hold off Boston and Buffalo? Or is them just being competitive in the division enough to buy?

I think they probably kept pace with another team on our list, which we'll get to in a minute. And I think they probably moved themselves comfortably. This is a team that came really close to making the playoffs last year for as for as much. They were right there till the bitter end, thanks to like kind of a late hot streak. So I look at that, and I know you don't want to just assume that best case scenario comes to pass because it because it so rarely does. But I look at what they did down the stretch there with those contributions from Casper, you know, and then the idea of having a full season's worth of John Gibbs. And I can, if you squint, you can see it. And for me, that's enough to make them, that's enough to make them a soft buy.

Yep. Yep. They missed the playoffs by five points for looking at the HABs in the division in the East. I'm still a soft buy on the Red Wings. I don't know if they're going to end up being better than Montreal or Ottawa next season, but I think they'll be competitive. I think they'll probably be better than the Sabres. I'm curious if they'll be better than the Bruins.

But they've intrigued me enough, again, mostly with John Gibson. They re-signed Patrick Kane, too. So I'm- I'll take Detroit. roster long term and in their system long term over over Boston's at this point. And that's why that's why I like them more for this exercise. Okay. Let's take a break. When we come back, we're going to get into the middle of the division, probably two of the more interesting teams on the list. That's the Montreal Canadiens and the Ottawa Senators. That's coming up next

on the athletic hockey show. Greetings, listeners, we want to hear from you. Check out the link in the description to give us your feedback on the show. That means tell us the content that you've enjoyed the most. Tell us what you would like us to do differently next season. If you've got an opinion, we want to hear it. So thank you for it. Thanks for your continued support. And we'll talk to you again real soon. All right. Welcome back to the athletic hockey show. The fourth team in the Atlantic division that we're buying or selling on here. The next team on the block. I don't know what like the stock market word would be here. You ring it. You're ringing the bell. The market's open, baby. Well, yeah, markets open on the Montreal Canadian.

Open for trading. Yeah, the Canadians are open for trade. Plus 23 net rating added second overall in the league, which usually when Dom does this exercise, it's like San Jose, Anaheim, those are teams that just, you know, have no choice but to get better every year kind of thing. Most value added in the division, Noah Dobson, obviously the highlight. they add Zach Bullduke as well. Out is Emil Heimann, Logan Mayu, David Savard, Christian Dvorak, and Yuel Armiya.

Dobson is, I mean, I would be a buy on the HABs anyways because for a couple years in a row saying they're like my favorite slash most fun bad team to watch. And then they make the playoffs last season. That series against Washington was unbelievable. like I like watching the Montreal Canadians. I think it is fun when they are relevant and not just bad but fun.

And then they go out and they add Noah Dobson, a true top pair defender, good puck mover. He's a huge get on his own. And then you think of how big of an improvement he is on someone like David Savard. And then you think that he could pair really well with Elaine Hudson. I saw Dom say like, could he be

the Devon Taves to Lane Hudson for them? Montreal Canadians. There's a lot to be excited about in adding Noah Dobson. Bull Duke's a good player as well. It's a team that made the playoffs last season, had a splashy summer. It's pretty simple. I'm buying on the Montreal Canadians very easily from this off season. Noah Dobson would have been good for any team to add. But I think the fact that it was Montreal who ends up reeling him in makes it even more impressive because every team needs a right shot defenseman, right? We say it all the time. Montreal really, really needed a right shot defense

And we saw the lack of options that they had on that, you know, at that positional group, come back and bite them against Washington. There is a game there where Alex Carrey got taken out by Tom Wilson. And then you have a bunch of left shots running around out of necessity and they did not look comfortable, right? So they go out and get Dobson, who's, you know, as good of an open option as you're going to find on the right side. and you add him to the mix. Yeah, it's really interesting because now, because Hudson can move back to the left full time now. You have a right side option,

whether you pair those two together, whether you keep Gully with, with Lane Hudson, those two looked like they knew what they were doing at various points last season, obviously. And then have Dobson anchor his own pair. I think it gives them a ton of options. And him alone,

like, it's just such, it's such a perfect fit of player and organization and where they're at in their life cycle that it's impossible. it's impossible not to love. And we haven't said anything, we've said barely anything about Zach Bouldick so far, right? Like he's a player who last year showed a lot of defensive value based on Dom's model, clearly knows how to score.

Like he's got offensive ability that we saw from him in St. Louis last season as well. He's already a really good, well-rounded player who they get to add to the mix there on the middle six. Because, again, adding Dobson, you don't have to worry about Logan Mayhew anymore, right? You can use him as a chip to go out and get Zach Bulldoch. So I love the off season they had. I love what their lineup looks like moving forward. We're already talking about a team that, you know, captured a lot of attention and a lot of imaginations down the stretch last season for sure.

So yeah. And they're, it's fun, it's fun to imagine what they're going to look like in a year or two. You know, you think about, you think about the power play. You think about, you know, Yvonne Demi Dov out there full time, what he's going to look like after. after a full season's worth of seasoning, man. It's, um, it's fun. It's, it's got to be a fun time to be a Canadians fan.

I think the Bullduke move is interesting because they, you know, trade a controversial player in Mayu. He was the 31 overall pick in 2021, Bullduke is 17th overall pick. Um, and when we look at last season, you know, the, the rookie class was dominated by Lane Hudson, Matt Bay Michikov, Will Smith, from the 2024, 25 class. But Bull Duke delivered in terms of he was eighth in points and tied for fourth in goals among all first year players last season. He had one power play goal, fewer or one less power play goal than Michigov and Celebrini last season.

So it's a kid who can add offense to the middle six. He's six feet tall, not to be like big hockey man vibes, but six feet, 187 pounds, only 22 years old. That's just really savvy GMing by the Montreal, Canadian. he's got potential breakout, breakout potential, excuse me. I like it. He played center and junior, but was mostly on the wing in St. Louis.

So I don't know if you maybe eventually move him over as a middle six center. Like he's probably not your two C in Montreal, but maybe he could get there eventually. So you can just have him as a middle six forward. I don't know. I like it. Like I said, it's pretty simple.

I'm buying on the Habs off season. I think that's a fun, fun team last season. They're going to be really interesting to watch this year. We can move on to the Ottawa senators who are a little bit more complicated, Sean, I think. In Lars Eller and Jordan Spence, plus seven net rating, eighth overall out Adam Goddette, Travis Hammannick, Anton Forsberg. To me, this just looks like Steve Steyos, general managers, doubling down on the core with a

very quiet free agency class. They re-signed Clow Drew. That's a big bit of business. for the Sends and for Sends fans. I saw this in Julian McKenzie's story. Steve Seo said he went into free agency with their site set on one player, and that was Lars Eller. They got him.

Congratulations to me. Like on one hand, they check the box of what they want on the other. I'm like, is that really the only thing you think the Ottawa senators needed this offseason? But it's clear to me that Staeos is believing in this core and giving the team some cap flexibility. Maybe you want to keep some space open.

you can go make a big move if the team's in the mix and by the trade deadline come around. So I think whether or not to buy or sell on the Sends really depends on the level of belief you have in the core. And Brady Kachuk, Drake Batherson, Tim Stutzla, Clod Drew, Jake Sanderson, Thomas Shabbat, Lena Sallmark ended up, you know, playing very, very well late in the season. I don't love that they didn't add someone to help them score at five on five. But I also think it's fair to give Travis Green another year with the young core that they have to say, okay, will this new coach take us in the next direction? I think it's enough to keep up with the division.

I think Lars Eller being like your big get is a little weird still. But I feel fine about the Ottawa senators. What do you think, Sean? It's a big commitment to Fabian Zetterland. They signed him to an extension pretty early on. Didn't do a ton after they added him to the mix there. But we've also seen him start slow with new teams in the past, which is what happened in him in San Jose.

So, you know, if he's an answer there on the wing, I think things look a lot better for them. You just look at their lineup, though, man. And you still got David, David Perron remains a good power play guy, for sure. He's going to be that until he decides to hang it up. permanently. But you have him slotted as your is your second line left wing with Dylan cousins. I think that's, I think that's rough. And I don't think that's contender stuff, right? So, you know, if the question is, I think they treaded water. I think they came as close to anybody

in this division to treading water because we do like the core. I think I think most people do like stuff so like Brady. Jake Sanderson, obviously, he's taking some serious serious steps over the last couple years. Haley, you can do another victory lap on him. I know how much you like to. I wrote that story like six years ago and I'm going to, no one's going to forget it. If the alternative for them was signing a bad contract and rolling the dice on a player who was unlikely to work out and caping themselves out a little bit further than I get it. You mentioned the caps base that they're probably going to have moving into the season. I think that's a positive thing. where they can add. It'll be easier with them to add at the deadline if they want to.

But yeah, I'm, um, unenthused, I think is probably the best way to put it. Yeah. For, from their off season.

It's, it's as close to just like a, it's a, it's a, it's a no sell. Can I do that? Is this a hold? I don't want to sell.

I don't want to buy. Like I, I'm, I'm just. Yeah, like a soft buy. Like you'll sprinkle. I'll buy,

I'll buy a little bit. I feel like, I don't think, I don't, things to cop out. Should we allow that? Is there anyone else that you would have held on? I just don't, I don't think they got meaningful. I don't think they got meaningfully better. And I, and I think that's kind of what makes them a soft. You bought on the Red Wing.

So do you think the Red Wings did more than the Sends? Yeah, because they added John Gibson. I think that's the very little there for me. You can know sell. You don't need to pick up more stock, but you don't need to sell your stock. I'll allow it. I think it's, I think it's possible. There is a world in,

which Detroit passes Ottawa in this division, I think, based on the way things have trended over the last six months. So I'll go soft sell in Ottawa because I just don't see, I don't see where they got better. And I think Detroit did improve meaningfully in at least one spot. Yeah. You know what I think is really funny. And I say this as someone who's, who's now in my early 30s. Wow. Congratulations. I know. It's crazy. It's my birthday. It's my birthday. they weak be nice to me. Lars Elmer said on Capp's breakup day on May 17th, I'll definitely keep playing. My body feels good.

So I'm going to keep playing. And that just always makes me laugh at like when old guys start getting older. That's like, how are you feeling? He's like, my body feels okay. So think about that. It always makes me laugh. Really instills confidence. Yeah, my body feels fine.

Yeah, sense, fans feel great about that. Is their big off season, their big off season? He said on May 17th, my body feels good. All right. let's go. How many times? He's only making $1.25 million. The cap went up.

Like, who cares? I just would have maybe liked to see an attempt. Washington, hegged a decent bit on him being a passable three C for them last year. And he wasn't even close. So drops down the lineup a little bit. You pay him less. Like, I get it.

But I don't know how much is left in the tank for Lars. Ler. Good as a player, as he's been for a long time. Caps fans will always have his performance during that, during that cup run on and on. But I think if you're expecting him to make a difference for you, for you as you put it in bold, underline it,

here's the guy we want day one acquisition. I think you're, I think you set yourself up for a pretty bad time. Dom's model went crazy for Jordan Spence over Travis Hammondix. That's something too. Like their third pair was just, I thought that was a mess last year. He did some interesting stuff for the Kings last year, for sure.

I think that's a interesting one to, to clean up the decor a little bit. Yep. So I'll hold, if we're allowing it, I'll hold on the sense. I'm not selling on them. Soft sell, but the, but the, I'm not soft selling. I would more be a soft pie.

What the difference, really? You know? I think Travis Green is a good coach. So we shall see. They're, they're interesting yet again. The Ottawa Senator is a variable in the Atlantic Division for the, for the six you're running.

Yeah. It's going to be interesting. So you like, yeah, I don't know. I like Detroit more than Ottawa right now. Every other team, I'm like, nope, this is how I feel. I like the Sends core. I think the offseason is kind of boring. But if we believe that it's just Steyo saying, I believe in the core, we're not

going to go do something crazy. Then I'm okay with that. So I'll be, I'll, I will soft buy on the Ottawa centers. I'm not going to hold. I'm not going to. I'm going to soft buy. We're going to take one more break and we're going to wrap up with the top three teams in the division. We've saved the best for last.

The Toronto mate, please, the Tampa Lightning. Andy Florida Panthers. We'll be right back on the athletic hockey show. Welcome back to the athletic hockey show. I say we saved the best for last and we did. These are the top three teams in the Atlantic Division last season. I don't know how interesting two of the three teams are in terms of buying or selling. They're pretty easy answers for me, Sean.

And unfortunately, the Maple Leafs might be the most interesting of the trio. But let's start with the Florida Panthers, negative two net rating, 23rd overall in terms of their additions. But like, who cares? They'll get a fork in them. They're cooked. This is a team that won back-to-back Stanley Cup. They've been the three straight cup finals. They only lost two goals of value and kept all three key free agents.

We know that by now. Sam Bennett, Brad Marshan, Aaron Eckblad. Technically, that loss is that Jeff Petrie is a downgrade versus Nate Schmidt in that depth role. But literally, who cares? I was going to say, they're done like dinner because they let Nate Schmidt walk. He was, he was, he was the guy. That's a, yeah, it's an upsetting sound. I wonder what would have needed to have happened.

I think this maybe is the more interesting question. Who would have needed to have left for you to truly, and how many of the big three would it needed to go for you to be like, I'm out, I'm out on the Panthers as legit contender. I wouldn't have been out on them, but if they would have lost, like if they would have signed Bennett,

actually, if they lost Bennett and Eckblad, I'd been like, I wouldn't have been out on them still because they would still have Barkov and Kachuk, like maybe if they lost all three, I'd be like, whoa, that's crazy.

It sounds crazy. I think Bennett would have been the one that would have made me revisit a little bit. Is replacing him as the 2C is, you know, from the crop of- that was for the abs after losing Audrey, losing your perfect 2C

who performs in the playoffs. Exactly. If they lost Bennett, I would have been like, however, I feel like Zito would have done something to make that better. And ultimately it doesn't matter. That's not a question they have to answer because Zito made it happen. He kept all those guys around.

Yeah. So you see some, you see at least a minus on the overall number for them because Nate Schmidt, by the way, was really good for them. Jeff Petriek comes in as the obligatory veteran without a ring who's hoping, you know,

to contribute down the stretch there. He'll probably be better than he was last year because he'll be in a sheltered role, limited role. He'll be the depth veteran. He'll probably end up looking or having better numbers in Florida. And if it's not him,

it'll be someone else. Like you remember ahead of last season, they brought it a bunch of guys. They brought in, you know, yes, they brought in Nate Schmidt. They also brought it Adam Bokvis. They brought in some other options

to try to find someone who made sense down there at the bottom of that defensive lineup. And Nate Schmidt was the one who stuck, the great acclaim. So, you know, if it's not a pretender or someone who could. It's very, very strange. Well, I mean, maybe. Hey, maybe he'll come in and be unbelievable.

They needed a backup. You never know. But yeah. Do they have any cap space though? Probably not. Maybe literally none. I think is probably, is probably, yeah, they have negative. No, they're almost four million over.

We'll figure it out. We're done. We're done. We're done worrying about them. They'll find some way to find some way to work it out because the hard stuff got done. They keep Bennett, they keep back glad, they keep Marchand, you know, as long as that core is around and not, you know, once Barkavages out, things will get a little bit different. But for the time being, man, it's impossible to look at them and see anything other than a juggernaut. Yeah, they're running it back.

They're an easy buy. Tampa Bay Lightning in Pontus Holmberg, Jacob Peltier, out, Lucas. Luke Glenn Denning, excuse me, I don't know if he's ever gone by Lucas. I don't know why I said that. I hope that's a name. Nicholas Purbix, uh,

elite top six still in place. Decent adds to the depth. That's enough for me. That's a plus six net rating. That's 10th overall. Modest gains for a team that has an elite core. We pick them to win the cup. I don't know what you're talking about.

Who's his we? Everyone took them to win the cup and beat the Panthers of the first round. I'd still buy in the Tampa Bay Lightning because I think the fact that adding Pontes Holmberg and Jacob Paltier makes them a plus six net reading just shows us how horrific their death was last season. So it's like, woohoo! This is way better.

Yeah, also some of that bakes in a full season's worth of Yanni Gordon, Oliver Bjorkshire, who are their two big deadline additions. They're going to get full, you know, in a perfect world, they'll get full seasons and major contributions from those guys. Those were necessary ads at the deadline for them. Everybody liked them when it happened.

and it didn't quite play out the way they intended. But those are the kind of players that they were short on. Outside of the Kutra of Point, Gensel, Brandon Hagle, you know, top of the top of the lineup, they were short on legit contributors on a middle six, let's say, or a bottom six, bottom nine. They just needed to find guys who are capable of bringing something to the mix. I think Bjorkstrand and Gord are both capable of that.

So yeah, full seasons worth of them is legit. depth options. And then, you know, the top four are still strong. We know that Hedman and J.J. Moser, are, they work together. We learned that last season. Chernak and Ryan McDonough did their job again, which is eating toughs and freeing up headman, you know, to, to succeed, you know, at this point in his career.

I like, I like the way things shook out for them because I ultimately like Gordon Bjorks turned on this is, is some, you know, medium term plays, let's say. So, yeah, I'm still buying on them. Yeah, if we want to include them as additions from year over year, sure. Ponte-Tolberg, five, bottom six player, adding Jacob Peltier, another undersized player who didn't get a shot in Calgary is very interesting. Marty St. Louis, welcome back. I see what you're doing here.

You weren't picking up on it, so I had to spell out the joke, which really stinks. It's interesting. We'll see if that works out. If it doesn't, it doesn't really matter because they, you know, if anything, you could maybe see him being like a top six winger on the Nick Paul Hegel line. Oh, this has Nick the line, the line, the depth chart has Nick Paul as the second and the third line center. I'm very confused. I think they're far with just one of him, is Anthony Sorrelli or Asia. If Jacob Heltier works out, he could be an interesting middle six winger, I can say.

But yeah, I think they're an easy. buy for me. And the more difficult team maybe depends on how you feel about Mitch Marner is Toronto. Negative 13 net ratings. It's worst in the division. Second worst overall, 31st overall in the league. They add Matthias Machelli, Nicholas Roy and Dakota Joshua out obviously Mitch Morner. They don't add a top line winger back in a Mitch Marner. Like they don't adequately replace him. But I think if you buy or sell on the Leafs really just depends on how you feel about this whole changing of the DNA. And if you buy on the Leafs, because you believe that there's going to be a bit of addition by subtraction with moving on from Mitch

Marner. How do you feel about that, Sean? I don't think that's going to happen. I think they're going to be, I think they're going to be worse this year than last. I think, I think Nicholas Roy is a useful player and I think in some regard he's the kind of player that they that they've chased for the last however many years they're adding him to some extent at the expense of Mitch Marner you know you're adding a decent a decent bottom six center and while in the same in the same breath is sending out one of the five best wingers in the league and I get that I get that things needed to change it should have happened two years ago or a year ago or six months ago like we don't need to relitigate the

the Marner situation, but this is still a team, and it's markedly worse because they sent him out. And also, they, that's still much as we might like Nicholas Roy as an option

on the bottom six, um, they needed a two C, whether it was P. Souter, whether it was someone like that. You have Tavares. What are you talking about? That Tavares deal was good. It's a good pay cut.

They didn't lose them. I think they needed a 2C other than John Tavares, who just had a career year. 3C. They needed some other option down the middle that can drive some play and provide some offense. And I think for, you know, Nicholas Roy, he adds something to the lineup,

but I think if you are slotting him in, is your 3C on, you know, opening night, then you're operating out of a deficit. I still, I just don't. I don't think there's enough offense there. Whether that, whether like, take your pick as to where it could come from.

You know, whether it, whether it's because they don't have marner around anymore, whether it's because their depth chart of center is not great, whatever. I struggle to see enough goals there

for a contending team. And, you know, ultimately that makes them a pretty easy, a pretty easy sell for me. So I'm actually going to tentatively buy on Toronto. And I'm doing this because there's a couple of things

that Tree did that I liked, Broad Tree Living. I appreciate that they got something for Mitch Moffner, like doing the sign and trade. I don't know. Like I think Nicholas Roy looks like he could be a good 3C for them on paper. I think he's an upgrade on what they'd had in terms of their bottom six centers on paper over the last couple years. You don't have to keep trying Kelly Yarn Croke up the middle.

You don't like, you know, you push Scott Long. gotten down the depth chart. I think that works better for me. Dakota Joshua looks like he could be a fine third line player. You have Bobby McMahon, Nicholas Roy, Dakota Joshua. That is a totally fine third line. The Tavares deal is good value. I think the Matthew Nye's deal was great.

I like their blue line. You keep Brandon Carlo for another year. Will Chris Tannenickman-Larsen be as good next season? Because they are getting older, I don't know, but I do like the defense core interest. Toronto. And I do wonder if we are going to see some addition by subtraction with losing Mitch Marner. I don't think Matthias Machelli is going to be as good as Mitch Marner was in Toronto. He's not as good. Yeah, me neither. Right wing. But when you, like, so when we saw,

I was always on the, the side of like, Mitch Marner probably takes too much crap. from the fans in the media. And I say this as someone who was given him as fair share of stuff in the postseason. And like I've sat on this podcast and said like, just do something, dude. Like that is kind of, but I've also felt like it goes a bit too far.

And I was so ready to defend Mitch Marner's decision to like leave, go somewhere else with your wife and your family. And then I see him sit there in Vegas and say, I've been, I was talking to the guys at four nations about, living in Vegas. Like this is a player who had one foot out the door and arguably the Leafs best chance at winning a cup over this last like decade.

And we're talking about last season. So if I'm looking at the Leafs, sure, you're losing a ton of offense. You're losing one of the greatest players the organizations had. But I do wonder if the vibe with the team is going to be better. If you don't have your first line right wing or being like, I think I'm going to maybe move to Vegas all season. So we'll see if that ends up working. Maybe I've just drank some Kool-Aid.

Maybe I live in Toronto. But I am soft buying. Like if I could hold, I would. I think that's lame. I'm going to tentatively buy on the Leafs because I am at the very least interested to see how this is going to work out.

And that's my long speech about the Toronto Maple Leafs 50 minutes into the podcast in the middle of the summer. I've been good. We don't talk about them that often. We try. And if you didn't care about the Leafs, You could have ended the pot early. Okay.

That's how I feel. I don't know. Maybe I'm nuts. I get what they're doing. They try to replace them with depth. I just, I don't, I don't disagree with the concept.

I disagree with the execution. It's more about the vibe. It's not, it's not the depth chart. It's not, it's more about like, and this is where it's tough because we don't know

what was happening there. But I just think, like it seems like this is a player who's made his mind up two years ago. I don't know how that impacts a locker room and what kind of vibe that set in the room. I hate that I keep saying that. But I'm interested to see if things are better there without him and the cloud that happens around him. Is Austin Matthews now just going to become the guy that everyone pooos and turns it into a weird vibe all over again? Maybe.

They're going to need a new sin eater. and I think there's a very real chance that that's what happens with Matthews but yeah probably have to wait for the playoffs too. Yeah, right, exactly. We got nine months to wait and see about that. Yeah, I don't know. This is probably the most interested I've been in the leaves

because they actually did something different. Like I was so sick of being like, well, are they going to make a change this year? They did it. You've piqued my interest, Broadtree Living. I will watch with popcorn on opening day. Good luck scoring more goals. in the playoffs. Like I still, that was a problem before. Did Mitch Martin score any of them?

Did Mitch Martin scoring them? It was a problem before and I think it's still going to be a problem. I don't know. You still got William Nealander in the postseason. That's all you need. That's all you need, baby. Playoff Willie. Tons success there. That's it. All right. Thanks. Thank you, everyone for listening to this episode of the athletic hockey show. Like we said, if you didn't want the Leafs talk, I'm not. going to, you know, you could have just turned the podcast off earlier.

We saved it for the end. No one can be pissed. Next time, Sean and I are going to take a look at the Metropolitan Division as we continue to buy and sell on the NHL off season ahead of 2025, 26. I guess I could just say as we continue to buy and sell on next season. I thought we just this season. This season? That's all right.

We'll be back for the Metro. And then we're obviously going to take a look at the Western Conference next. Thanks, everyone for listening.