The Athletic Hockey Show - Why can't the Hurricanes make playoff adjustments?

Episode Date: May 26, 2025

The Carolina Hurricanes, on the verge of being swept again in the conference final, seem unable or unwilling to adjust to playoff hockey. Max and Laz dig in to find out why? Ray Ferraro from ESPN joins the boys to discuss the Western Final. Are the Stars cooked vs the Oilers, or does this series have a chance to go long? Plus the guys take a look at the favorites for the Conn Smythe Trophy.Hosts: Max Bultman and Mark LazerusWith: Ray FerraroExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Jeff Domet Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show. Hey, everybody, Max Boltman here alongside Mark Lazarus for another episode of the athletic hockey show. Really fun show today. We got a special guest coming on in segment two, ESPN's Ray Ferraro. But first, Laz, I want to talk about the Eastern Conference Final. I'm getting worried it might be our last chance to talk about the Eastern Conference Final. The Panther is obviously in a commanding 3-0 hold on the Carolina Hurricanes. God, it feels that way with Bowl Series right now.

not the conference finals that we were looking for, is it? But yeah, I mean, out east, it's pretty bleak in Carolina right now. I'm 15, like, it's almost unfathomable that a team could be this good, this consistently, and beyond the verge of 16 consecutive conference final losses. It's stark. And I don't know if there is a smoking gun, right?

Like, when we talk about the Leafs playoff, playoff, it's great. They're earlier. I'm not saying it's the same thing. But it feels like everyone's kind of zeroed in on this one thing, right? it's a mental thing for them. With the hurricanes, I don't think it's that simple.

Now, you can point to a bunch of different things. There's the, oh, do they have that one true star? There's the goaltending thing. I think in the wake of this, Matthew Kachukuk, Sebastian Ahu, I don't know what you want to call that drama. There's got to be some questions about the pushback, the fight in them. But I don't know that we've settled on just kind of one narrative around him. It's just they're consistently not finding a way to even really win a game, obviously,

is the damning part. You know, this is the first year I haven't covered the hurricanes in the playoffs in a while, the last few years I was there. I covered the conference final two years ago against Florida where they got swept and Rod Brindamore was adamant. This wasn't a sweep because the games were close, including a quite droopal overtime game. But every year you hear a little bit more rumblings about questions about Rod Brindamore's ability to take this team to the next level.

There's a stubbornness behind Brindamore and behind the hurricanes in general where they don't make adjustments. they are so confident in what they do in their style of play that they believe that it will win out in the end. And that works over 82 games. But over a four to seven game series, the sample size isn't big enough for shot volume and chaos at the net to play itself out. And I think that's kind of what we're seeing is the hurricanes play every game the exact same way. They don't adjust based on what the Panthers are doing. They didn't do it in 2023 and they're not doing it now. They're going out there and damn it, we're going to play Carolina Hurricane.

into hockey and it's going to win. And it's not proving good enough at this stage of the playoffs year after year. And they're still not making any adjustments. Is it as simple as a really bad matchup though? Like, I mean, the Panthers do seem like about as bad a matchup for Carolina as they could draw. Yeah, I mean, obviously, I mean, the Panthers are a bad matchup for just about anybody these days.

They are a playoff team. They are built for the playoffs. All regular season, people were like, oh, no, the Panthers, they don't look like themselves anymore. And it was like, no, this was like the early 2010s kings where they just put it on cruise control through the playoffs, knowing that their style of play can't be maintained for 82 games. And then at the playoffs, they go, okay, let's go. And they just just destroy everybody. But if you think about like the Leafs and the Panthers went to the seven game series, and I think we would agree that if this was Leafs Cains right now, this is a much closer series. You could pick it either direction, frankly. I think you could argue it either way. But that would be a close series. That's a much better matchup, if nothing else.

I would hope so. I mean, because this is about as bad a matchup as we've gotten. I can't remember a conference finals that was this just lobsided. We've had sweeps before. I mean, we did have the 2020-3 Hurricanes Panthers. We had Colorado swept Edmonton, but that was a really tight series too a few years ago. This just seems that Carolina has no answer for the physicality of Florida, for the depth of Florida, for Sergey Mabrofsky. It does seem like a terrible matchup.

I don't know if it's any different if Toronto comes. We'll never know because Toronto can't get out of the first or the second round and Carolina can. But it just seems really poor matchup for Carolina. And to your point about poor matchup from anyone, because I'm running through these things, I'm getting ready to make my point. Oh, the three things that we just talked about, you know, goaltending weakness, lack of scoring toughness. Well, yeah, Florida is a terrible team to face when you have those struggles because they're going to get in front of your goal tender, put a ton of traffic around and make life hard on them.

They have a great goalie. So if you don't have a tremendous goal score, he is going. to stuff you. And number three, they're maybe the most physical team in the league. And yet, to your point, that is a bad matchup for anyone. Nobody reacts well to any of those three things.

Yeah, who's good at handling really physical play and a really good goalie and really talented players and really good coaching? I mean, there's not a lot of weaknesses. This is as perfect a team as we've seen since, I saw somebody say this since the,

maybe since the Blackhawks, when they were that team that could just kind of play any style because Chicago could beat you with skill like they did Tampa. They could beat you with physicality like they did with Anaheim. they could grind out a boring game like they did against Minnesota. And Florida kind of has that vibe where it's like,

whatever you throw at us, we know how to handle this and we can do it better than you. And that's the sign of a really good team. That was Prime Tampa too, right? I mean, they won so many games, two to one. And all the while at the top of that lineup was Stephen Stamcoast, Nikita Kutrov and Braden Point, they didn't care if you took a lead on them.

They would come back from that. But they could also just choke you over the course of 60 minutes and win a one goal game. And that's it. That's the versatility you need in the playoffs. And that's what Carolina doesn't have. Carolina is going to play Carolina hockey. And they don't have those megastars up front that can take over a game. They don't have those kind of grinding physical guys that could just wear a team out.

And they don't have the goalie. I mean, people got mad at me throughout the first two rounds. I'm like, I don't trust Freddie Anderson. You can't win a cup with Freddie Anderson. He's going to turn into a pumpkin in the conference final. And what happens? Freddie Anderson turns into a pumpkin in the conference finals. We've seen this movie before over and over again.

I don't want to call anybody out, but I saw one series preview, which it was like their. confidence in each team's goalies. And they had Freddie Anderson above Jake Ottinger and above Stuart Skinner and above Sergey Bobrovsky. I'm like, are you people insane? Have you ever watched Freddie Anderson in a big game before? This always happens.

Yeah, I mean, and I, we did this with Edmonton for years. And we could argue people are still doing this with Edmonton as just hammering like, well, why haven't you gotten a goalie? The one thing that's hard about that is there's so few goalies out there right now that you could say would be an upgrade on Freddie Anderson. Certainly on this coming free agent market, they had no choice but to lock him, but he was it on this market. But even if you go back a year or two, I guess you could say should have jumped the line and traded for Linus Allmark before the senators could or something like that. But it's the same deal with the Oilers.

Where is this mythical goalie that they're supposed to find? Well, that's just it. There's a handful of guys you really trust. And one of them is Jake Ottinger and he just got run out of the building yesterday. So, I mean, goaltending is not a perfect science as we talk about with Jesse Granger all the time. But I just, it's the old, the cliche, the definition of insanity is running it back over and over again. The Maple Leafs just kept running it back and they got the same result. And Carolina, you know, they're trying.

They went out and they got Jake Gensel because they needed that top end skill and he was great, but then he left. And they went out and they got Miko Renton because he's got that big toughness and that top end skill. And it wasn't going to work out. So, I mean, give Carolina credit. They are trying to address this from the outside. But, yeah, it's difficult. It's really hard to find your Matthew Kachuk, to find your Connor McDavid.

What would be your top priority? You know, and I don't want to write their obituary too soon, but they're down three, oh, it's looked really ugly. We're talking about them big picture. When we talk about, okay, just running it back, maybe doesn't seem like it's going to be good enough. Where would you be turning this summer? I still think they need the high end skill more than anything.

Like, Freddie Anderson is fine for the regular season. He's a good regular season goalie, and he was fabulous in the first round. I'm not trying to just like, you know, kick Freddie Anderson while he's down. down. But you know, you got to decide if Kachekhov is your guy long term, you got to figure that out, but they still need high end skill. And the problem is there's one guy. There's a one guy out there that's truly high end. It's Mitch Marner and he's going to have a ton of suitors. And I don't know if Carolina is high or low on his list. I have no idea. But we've talked over the last two months, we've probably mentioned 10 teams like, oh, Mitch Marner would look really good on this team. Yeah.

There's going to be a ton of people going after him and most teams aren't going to get them. So there's not that answer. It's going to come down to the trade deadline again, where Eric, Eric Tulski is going to have to try to get someone big time, which he's done two straight playoff series of trade deadlines in a row to his credit. He's done a really good job getting those guys, but those guys haven't wanted to stay. And until you have that, those real difference makers,

Caroline is one of those teams that they are loaded with really good players, but do they have any great players besides maybe Jacob Sleven? Do they have a guy who can take over a game? They just don't. Ajo is not that guy. Svetichov's not that guy. Ranton is that guy. you know, Gensel can be that guy.

And they're trying. They know, they recognize the deficiency. They see the weakness and they're trying to address it. But, you know, it just hasn't been able to, they haven't been able to lock it in long term. Yeah. And it's obviously not the end all, B.L that Marner blocked a trade there.

But it is worth noting. The only thing we know about Mitch Marner's feelings toward Carolina is that he blocked a trade there. So, right. It's a tough one. Any path for them, you see, get to getting back into this series. I mean, it's hockey, right? There's always a path.

is that, you know, Kachcock could go great and someone can get hot. Maybe the system does click in. Maybe four games is the sample size they need instead of three. We saw it last year when Edmonton came back from three O'Down and forced the game seven. This does happen. We've had a couple of reverse sweeps. But you can't see the Florida Panthers losing four straight games at this point, can you? This is the most rested team in the playoffs.

They've hardly had to play anybody. Every game has been a blowout. Like, I've never seen a team in the conference final that is this just chill, right? They are so on top of everything and confident and rested and not stressed. It's almost impossible to envision that team losing four games in a row. What do you mean they've hardly played anybody? They've probably played the next two best teams in the East. The last like three or four weeks, though, they've lost like one game and they've been blowouts.

These have this has not been a stressful playoffs for the Florida Panthers. It is not. It has not. They had the hole for the Maple Leafs that for, I don't know, 36 hours looked a little scary. and then they erase that and now they look terrifying, frankly. Yeah, no, it's Florida looks outstanding. And I wonder if maybe we even underappreciated them as the year when. I know you've harped on do not get lulled by these teams that have been through it as they kind of look a little unfocused or whatever.

Look at the teams that were kind of blonde in the regular season. It was Florida. It was Edmonton. It was Dallas. It was Colorado to some extent, but they were changing things on the fly. but the teams that we thought we're going to be here are here and almost all of them were kind of just going through the motions all regular season.

People have to accept that when you reach a certain level of playoff testedness, which is not a word, but that is what I've just said. And you have that kind of veteran leadership and skill. You know that seeding doesn't matter, that home ice doesn't matter. All that matters is getting into the playoffs feeling good, feeling healthy, feeling rested, and then flipping that switch. And everybody hates hearing that, the regular season is so long that we want to believe it carries meaning.

But for these teams, it does not carry meaning. And you got to accept it. It didn't for Tampa. It didn't for Chicago. It didn't for L.A. It doesn't for Florida. And it doesn't for Edmonton. Let's take a quick break right there.

I'll be right back with Ray Ferraro. All right. We are back and we are joined now by ESPN hockey analyst. Ray Ferraro. Ray, thanks so much for coming on with us. I want to start with the series you've been on, which, man, Edmonton just suddenly looks like a complete wagon. man they uh somewhere in the middle of that la series like right around uh the goal challenge and uh you know

the game three in edmonton they they found their game and um i mean obviously they've got the highest of high end and but it's the they just seem like they just roll along now like it's you know until yesterday, McDavid had three goals. It's not like they're hanging on his bootstraps or it's not like dry sidles carried the team. These guys are amazing difference makers, but it's been everything else for them. And, you know, somehow they got through the, you know, the Stewart Skinner, what's turning into an annual side ditch. And now he's back and looks great again. I mean, they, they looked for most of this series, I would say period two of game three, they were completely outplayed. But other than that, I mean, I threw away the first game one, like that third period. That was all power play.

But that's the only period they've been outplayed in. I've been really impressed. Have you been surprised by the lack of pushback physically by Dallas? I mean, it's funny, you pop on here and I immediately was like transported to 1993. I'm a 13-year-old Islanders fan. and Dale Hunter takes out Pierre Turgeon. And I wanted to, like, assemble a posse and go track him down. Like, you know, Dardell Nurse slashes Rupert Hints on the foot, injures him. And a game and a half in, we have not really seen any pushback at all. Dallas just doesn't seem engaged in this series all of a sudden.

They, I don't know anymore if, like, like, certainly if you look at that clip from when Hunter hit Turgeon, I mean, like, it's absolute mayhem right away. you know, Turs just hurt in the corner and here comes Richie Peel on flying over the top. Like I can see that like it was yesterday. And times were different. Like Dallas is not built like that. But what I think in that,

sort of in that vein, like of pushback or they just haven't looked fast or aggressive or confident in their game. It really, at very few points in the series, have I seen that? Like yesterday in the first period, the line that was the best for them, which to borrow an old line from a coach, good for them, bad for the team, was Sam Steele and Colin Blackwell and Oscar Beck. And I'm like, they were terrific.

And I'm like, okay, the other nine guys need to catch up here. Like, otherwise, they don't have a chance. Like, whatever we think of, I mean, Dallas was built on depth, right? In the season, we like, oh, look at this. team, they just kind of roll over, 20 goal guy, 20 goal guy. So you can go right through. Dushan's got one goal. Ben's got one goal. Marchman's got one goal. The Donoff, I think he's got two. Jason Robertson hasn't, he got credited with one yesterday. He didn't even know he got credited for it. Like, they've, those guys have been of zero impact in the series. Like, whatever the other

stories are you can't win if half of your forwards that you count on aren't even in the series yet. It's pretty wild too. I mean, they're like minus eight at five on five in these playoffs. They've been dominated in a lot of games that they've won. It's been basically Ottinger and those five games where Miko Renton went thermonuclear kind of got him to this point. But you're right. Like even Renton and he's got three assists and no goals in the last six games now. He is, I mean, they're so far their best line like by a mile. But if I look at it, like Granlin's been the best player this series, like by a long shot. By the way, of the guys that I forgot and I don't know how I did is Wyatt Johnston.

I love that kid. He's a fantastic player. But he looks young and which he's not looked before. You know, he looks like he's searching for his game. One thing that I thought they would do yesterday and they didn't. And trust me, I think Pete DeBoer is one of the best coaches there is. I don't know how you can get to the Western Conference finals so much and get fired twice like he has. But I think he's really good.

But when Hintz was out, I would have put Johnston in that spot. Because at the end of game two, he was, like they moved Granland into the middle. I would have put Granland on and Ranton and on the side of him. I think that's the one place they could get a spark. And I would even consider it if Hintz is back for game four because, well, mainly because it just hasn't worked any other way. And, you know, your power play's not going to score at a 40% clip, but eventually that flattens out at some point.

And they've been the second best team in the series for sure. On the Edmonton side of things, I mean, you talked about the support that McDavid and Dry Settle are getting, and it is huge. I think that's the story of this team over the last two years, really, as they've found a way that it doesn't all have to fall on Connor and Leon. But you do have this interesting perch during games that I think gives you a unique perspective on the growth of a guy like Connor McDavid in 10 years in the league. And now that he's been here for so like,

you're around him kind of closer than almost anyone else who's not on that team. What do you see is the biggest differences in him now at this stage of his career? I would say for both him and Leon, like both of them. Leon's more outwardly emotional. like you can you can see from leon's body language how things are going um and and i i mean lots of people recognize it i recognize it because i was like like the easiest open book of all time when when things were going well i i look back and i'm like holy smokes was i a rollercoaster like i was so happy or i was so grumpy and leon is closer to that i think that's part of

his nature but both of those guys have i think they've flattened out emotionally. Like they, they just take the body punches. And when things are going great, you can feel an energy. But they don't, like, there's no, the ups and downs don't seem to wear on them as much. I'm really impressed. Like, outside of, outside of Cory Perry, they, they don't engage a lot with the officials. Like, Corey's always talking to somebody. And, and again, I kind of am entertained by that. I, you know, like that, that really, I just get a chuckle out of that because that's what I used to do. And they don't argue a lot.

They don't complain a lot. They, they just seem like they're in, they're in the peak zone right now of what, what they can do. Like, I look at McDavid had three goals till yesterday. Like, that's not going to stay like that. Like eventually, we keep waiting for Dallas to break out. Like, did anybody think, Leon? or Connor McDavid was going to finish with three goals in the playoffs. Like not a chance.

Now he's got two look out for game four, right? Drysidels somehow, they're in this position. They've got these two wingers have 13 goals combined in the regular season. Like how does that even work, except it does? You know, we get shifts here with McDavid and they put McDavid in Drysiddle and Perry or Hyman. And like they, I think Noblock does a really good job of manipulating. around the weak spots of their lineup. Max and I were talking in the first segment.

We were talking about Carolina, Florida. And I was saying how Florida has reached a stage of their development where they know the regular season means absolutely nothing. And they just kind of conserve themselves. And they know that seating doesn't matter and home ice doesn't matter. They just need to be healthy and ready to go and flip that switch. You look at this Final Four and Carolina's troubles aside, these are four of the most proven teams in the league.

These are all teams that maybe underperformed a little bit in the regular season. And we're all, you know, renting our garments over, oh, what's wrong with the Edmonton Oilers? They were preseason favorites to win the cup. Is there something as a player to, do you reach a stage where it's like, yeah, don't worry about any of this? Well, I think you'd like to. But you also have to be on the right team.

Right. Because, like, Mark, I'm sure you came across, Max, probably yourself too, like come across Maurice during the season when they come through, right? And he never, whether it's an act or not, He never seems too bothered by any of it. We had them in a stretch. I can't even remember when, and they weren't playing particularly well.

And he went through it like a guy that's been coaching for 30 years. He's like, yeah, we've played 12 games in 19 days. We've missing this guy and that guy and so-and-so's here. So I'm bringing his minutes back now. It's not about now. We're worried about March and April. Like the whole thing is tailored to the end of the year. the problem most teams have is that they look at Florida and they tell themselves, yeah, see, all we have to do is get in.

No, if you get in, you lose. Like, you're not good enough. Florida just has to get in. Edmonton just has to get in because they're good enough. And so this is why I never subscribe to looking at a team and saying, that's the model we have to beat. because you don't have the same players. You don't have the same pieces. And you could go get a guy like Alexander that looks like Alexander Barkoff, same size.

Call him a 200-foot player, whatever you want. Same demeanor. But he's not Alexander Barkoff. And so chasing somebody else's model in my mind is a race you can never win. It's like you get halfway there and you're like, oh, they've moved to a different place because those players are more mature and your guys are growing. And like if I'm a team like Anaheim, I look at Vegas and Edmonton and all this and,

okay, I don't have Jack Eichael. I don't have Connor McDavid, but what do I have? I've got a bunch of young players that have talent and skill and they're going to mold their team with what they have. I think these four teams, they had the luxury for the most part of knowing they were good teams and being able to just piece it together to get through the, you know, the marathon of the regular season. That comment you made on Maurice is interesting and you guys have such an interest.

Honestly, I think it's tougher because you guys aren't around the same teams every day. You get these little snapshots of them throughout the year. And I wonder when you get into a series like this and you finally get to sink your teeth in and be around a whole series for two weeks. Like how does that change your process here? Funny you say that last year. Mark, were you at the finals last year? No, just the conference final. Okay, so in the finals, Edmonton or Florida's up 3-0, every Moray's press conference was Comedy Central. It was a joke-a-thon. It was, I mean, what was not to like, right? They were up 3-0. He's a witty, sharp guy and he plays in the media really well. And they lost one game and it was a little different two games by the time. time we got to game six, jokes were over. Like it was now, okay, because he said, oh, yeah,

they've never had to play. We've never had the chance to play for a championship. And we probably were distracted with family coming in or whatever. Then they went back to game five. And he said, yeah, see, they, they've had one chance of playing with their backs to the wall. And, but the jokes were stopping. And then they went to Edmonton and they got throttled again. And now, it's like, so like that everyday thing, that changes. It's, it's really easy when things are rolling or he sees us guys here and there and, but every day is, every day is different. And you can see why coaches get tired of the same 12 people asking them the same question or, well, if you're, if you're watching the Detroit Red Wings every day, the issues are apparent. And after a while, no matter where

you start your questioning, you're going to get back to, is there a way we can fix this penalty killing? Right? And they probably, they probably get tired of, or what they'd like to say is, no, I don't have an idea right now because every time we turn around, it's in our net. And like, I'm sure they'd like to say that at some point. Yeah, no difference. What I want to know is, asked me three days ago, basically. Well, I want to know is what happens in those rights holders, scrums for our for our listeners you know all those press conferences you always see where we ask our dumb questions and we get our bad answers after that's over every morning the coach goes off and talks to the tv guys they talk to ray and i want to know like are you getting all the answers that we can't

get are they are they being more honest with you than they're being with us i think uh to a certain degree they would they would offer up a little bit more but they're pretty protective of anything that that might I don't really know what they're worried about but they might be that we might say that would be informational to another team

and the reason I say I don't know what they're worried about it's just like this I think it's a joke that you ask a team in the regular season who's starting in goal and they'll say well we can't tell you nobody cares I played 1,250 games nobody cares who's in the other net unless it was Marty Brodour or Chris Perterrary because we'd say, oh, if Marty's not in, then we maybe could dump the puck a little different. Because when you get down there, you're not cataloging

the scouting catalog in your head. You got a chance. You shoot it where he's not. And it happens like in a heartbeat. So they worry about way too much. Now, I'm not in it. So maybe that's easy for me to say. But I had a coach this year in the in the rights holders, Mark, they, one team, they were, they were playing and I asked their coach a couple of questions. I asked the other coach about his power play. And he said, well, why don't you ask him about his power play? And I said, you have no idea what I just asked him. I said, and why would I ask him about your power play that's not scoring? And, and I think there's, you know, like, they try. to the coaches try to put us into their framing.

Like what the message they want to get there, that's what they're going to tell us. And then you have to hopefully dig just around the edge a bit that you could get something that might be useful for the broadcast. There is no more neurotic human on the planet than an HL coach during the Stanley Cup playoffs. I'm telling you the the lengths they go to for the dumbest subterfuge to like say, oh, maybe. he's not going to play. Maybe he'll be in warm-ups. I don't know. Like, okay, so if, if Pete DeBoer had said Rope Hintz is going to be, he's coming to Edmonton, I have no idea if he's going to play or not. Like, would that have been, would that have been too much? Because he was going to play or not play, but whether he was

in Edmonton, who cares? Like it, but it, it's not just Pete. Like, and I don't say, Pete's actually, Pete's very, actually quite honest, I think. And most of them, it's like the, like the state secret just, it's so tight. Have you ever seen, have you ever walked by a coach's office before a game? And they've got a table in the middle of it. And the coaches are all working at their computer still like, you know, they're breaking down a last power play clip or a penalty killer, breakout. There's nothing the other team can do that they don't know. And this is the crazy part

about hockey is at the end of the day, all that information comes in. We all have watched enough games. The puck is not round. It bounces funny. The ice is different. Your team could be dead set, ready to go. And then your goalie whiffs on a shot. You give up a power play goal. You're down to nothing. And none of that scouting really matters. Now it's just survival. Like the game is so erratic. It's, I, I often wonder, like, I wonder why they're so protective of all that stuff. I loved in the, in the first round, you know, there was a lot of that going on with Muriel Hayskin and DeBore was being cagey about it.

And one of the Colorado reporters asked Jared Benner, is like, does this bother you that you don't know what there's going? And Benner goes, I am going to take my nap tonight and I will not be thinking of Pete or this afternoon. I will not be thinking of anything that Pete DeBore has said this morning. Right. Because they know, like, as much as I'm full of it, they are too. at this time of here. Awesome. Great stuff, Ray.

You can catch ESPN's exclusive coverage of the Western Conference final on Tuesday with a primetime matchup on both ESPN and ESPN Plus, Dallas and Edmonton for game four in oil country. And of course, Ray will be between the benches on the call for that game. Ray, thanks so much for joining us. Thanks, guys. Have a great day. We'll talk to you soon.

All right. We are back. And thanks again to Ray Ferrer. He was so good. I love talking to Ray. I want to close today, Las, on the Kahn-Smith situation here, because the odds from our friends at BEDMGM paint a very interesting picture that I'm curious to get your thoughts on.

I don't think we're surprised to see Connor McDavid at plus 180. After that, I'm kind of fascinated by how this all shook out. Next up is Sergei Brabowski at plus 200. I don't have an issue with that. Barkov down at plus 800, Leon Drysaitle, who's one point back of McDavid and has scored one more. more goal plus 1100 that shocks me and sam bennett who is tied for the lead in playoff scoring with nine goals and one off his team lead and points plus three thousand last these are these shocks me

that i would think sam bennett would be right up there in the top three or four leon dry saddle certainly would be much closer to mac david yeah i mean when when you're betting on you know when you're predicting something like the con smite you're predicting who's going to win right because like last year, not always. That's the exception. That doesn't happen. And McDavid's not having that kind of a postseason.

He's great as he always is. We take him for granted how great he is. But he's not going to be like at 45 points or whatever he was last year. So I think most of us are looking at the Florida Panthers and saying that's the team to beat. So not only are you lumping a bunch of guys in there that are ahead of him, but that Sam Bennett one is fascinating because he's he's scoring big goals. He plays an important game. His style is like everything.

He's like emblematic. He's the personification of the Florida Panthers in so many ways. He's still a long shot to win it. You know, but 3,000, that's, I don't know, Stuart Skinner is a plus 4,000. If Edmonton wins this thing, the way Skinner is playing, he's going to have a case. Because remember, when people vote on this, the way it does is it's, it's always like half local people who have been covering the two finalists, all playoffs, and then half national people who tend to parachute in in the conference final or the Stanley Cup final. So it's always heavily weighted toward the last. two rounds. So someone like Miko Ranton, who is the clear frontrunner through two rounds,

even if Dallas goes on to somehow win, if he doesn't really pick it up, he has not been overly impressive. He's been fine. He's just been a guy, right? So you have to really weigh those back, that back two rounds. And Stuart Skinner right now might be the most important oiler since the conference final have started. So I mean, that's a good one. Bennett's a good one. It kind of depends, though, on who you think is going to win the cup, because we're not going to have a loser MVP again this year. But that was kind of one of my theories for why the gap was so wide is that we've already seen McDavid win it without winning the cup. And so maybe that explains how he's that far ahead. Otherwise, I just don't think there's that much daylight between his postseason

and dry settle's postseason. Well, it's just predictive, right? Everyone assumes that Connor McDavid is going to explode at some point and just have a five point game followed by a four point game. And all of a sudden, he's got a seven point lead in the scoring race. That's just what he does. This is an assumption as much as it is as a referendum on what he's done. so far. To me, it's the Bennett one because he would be my top pick on Florida. Similar to the Jonathan Marchesau winning it for Vegas, a couple years back, where he's not the best player on the team, but he's scored the big goals. And he's so clearly a heart and soul identity piece that there's just something that kind of feels right about that to be.

Yeah, I mean, he's only one, like you say, is one point behind Barkoff. He's ahead of Kachuk. He's ahead of Verhege. He's ahead of Marshan, he's ahead of, you know, what, Losterinen. in like the the panthers are doing this the way the Dallas stars are supposed to be doing this, right? With everybody scoring at a kind of a similar clip. So it's really hard to single out one guy. This is how a goalie wins a lot of times, right? Like if everyone's doing the base and that's why Bobrovsky's leading.

Bobrovsky's second on this list because he's easy to pluck Bobrofsky out of there and say, well, let's just give it to him, right? I mean, you can look at Seth Jones. Seth Jones has been one of the most important Florida Panthers. He's been fabulous in these playoffs. So like there's six, seven guys. that you can almost make a case for it for Florida. That's maybe why Bennett is so high

because it's really difficult to just pluck one guy out of here. It's a good point. If you went with the second round series, Brad Marchand was probably their best player in that series. And I don't even think we've mentioned him yet, right? Plus 4,000, certainly capable of getting hot on another series and making another run like that. He has, he's been kind of the darling.

Did you like the Blizzard gate situation, whether or not he was eating a blizzard? He just plays the media like a fiddle, doesn't he? Like he just knows everything he says, like, oh, they'll talk about this for stupid that's for two days now. And it's unbelievable. The things that, the, the, the cars we chase, the puppies that we are running down the road. It's so dumb the things that we care about.

You're not buying Blizzard, right? No, he wasn't eating a Blizzard. Come on. I would love if he were. It's Brad Marchand, don't get me wrong, but this is a highly, you know, performative professional athletes. He's not having heavy. Have you ever had a Blizzard?

I love a Blizzard. I'm lactose intolerant. I'll still eat a blizzard. You can't move for like four hours after you eat a blizzard. There's no way. way he had a blizzard at intermission. Come on, man. Peanut butter. I think that's what Rousseau and Sean were theorizing in their story today. Yeah, everyone, peanut butter is energy. That's a easy energy boost. You have a peanut butter bar or

something like that. Yeah, he ate the things that Brent Seabrook once called it, fruit and crap. What are you having in the locker room between periods? Ah, you know, fruit and crap. That's what he had. You did not have a freaking blizzard. Come on. Well, whatever it is, it's working. And that's going to do it for us. Thanks for listening to this episode of The Athletic Hockey Show. Please, if you're enjoying the show, show, leave us a rating and a review, preferably five stars. Everyone's favorite Sean and also the other Sean and also Frankie Corrado will be with you on Wednesday. We'll talk to you soon.