The Athletic Hockey Show - WJC: Canada’s early exit, Sweden escapes Switzerland, a potential USA-Sweden gold medal game, and more

Episode Date: January 3, 2024

On a brand new Prospect Series episode of The Athletic Hockey Show, Corey Pronman, Scott Wheeler, and FloHockey’s Chris Peters discuss what went wrong for Team Canada after being eliminated in the quarterfinal, Sweden narrowly advancing past Switzerland on the strength of an Axel Sandin Pellikka power play goal, and what a potential USA-Sweden gold medal game could look like, assuming the Americans can get through Finland first. Subscribe to The Athletic Hockey Show on YouTube: http://youtube.com/@theathletichockeyshowGet a 1-year subscription to The Athletic for $2 a month when you visit http://theathletic.com/hockeyshow Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Welcome to a medal round edition of the Athletic Hockey Show's Prospect Series. I am here on location with Chris Peters from Flohockey and my athletic colleague, Scott Wheeler, as we are recording right after the quarterfinals and eventful quarterfinals just took place here in Gothenburg. Max Baldwin will not be here with us. He's on vacation. some say, some say he might be working in California, but he's not with us.

So the three of us will be chatting about the events that took place in the quarterfinals. And we have to start with the extremely dramatic and eventful Canada versus Chequya game with Chequia defeating Canada 3-2 on a last-minute goal in regulation. Gentlemen, what were your thoughts on that game? It was really the culmination of a tournament that just was a little off kilter from the start for Team Canada. This team never really had it. I think the way that the schedule actually set up and winning their two games, their first two games the way that they did, almost put them on their back foot.

Their lines never really clicked because they'd won their first two games. I think head coach Alan Latang was reluctant to change his lines. Then suddenly he needed a loss against Sweden to change the lines. Then you have an injury against the Germans. your lineup isn't your lineup. You're not able to rebuild your lines and try something new because eventually you're down to 11 forwards after the suspension for Connor Geeky.

And suddenly things sort of just got off the rails and Canada never had chemistry. They never got to the inside. We've heard a lot of that from hockey Canada. It was just at the media availability for Scott Salmon and Peter Anholt who are in charge of this year's U20 team. And there was a lot of talk of one and done and missing the net and not getting to second and third opportunities,

not getting to the inside. But I think above and beyond that, this team just wasn't good enough. I think we all agree that had they not lost to the Czechs in the quarterfinals, that they likely would have eventually lost to Sweden in a potential semi-final or even the USA in a potential gold medal game had they had they sort of summoned some demons against the Swedes. So it was just it never got going. They never got going.

Their best players weren't their best players. Matt Palatra, Matt Savoy, they disappointed. They didn't show up. and Dume, guys who were expected to score for this team in those moments didn't score in those moments. And their depth, which is what they were sort of relying on in this tournament, just wasn't where it needed to be because of the number of players that they were missing and injuries and an infection for Tristan Luno. It just, from the very beginning, it never really got going the way that they needed it to. I thought the point you made about how it never was ever clicking for them,

and Hockey Cannon made that point themselves was very interesting because I've had a few people, you know, whether scouts or people around with various federations make this point to me, too, that while, you know, post-COVID, most federations have resumed to business as normal. You know, there's the summer tournaments. Teams have November and February international tournaments. They tried to, you know, evaluate players in a normal fashion. You know, this particular age group for hockey Canada has been maybe the most affected of any of the major federations. Because this age group did not go to the Holinka.

They chose not to go to the Holinka. So they missed a massive opportunity to evaluate this age group for those age group to get international experience and familiarity with each other. There was no summer camps this summer for hockey Canada. So that was due to budget issues. So there was an opportunity then, again, to evaluate the players, for the players to come familiar with coaches, to come familiar with each other.

And I think you kind of saw towards the end of the checking game. Alan Tang, the coach said he thought that was the two best periods they played in the tournament was those last two periods. and you kind of saw that he started to recalibrate what he thought his lineup was. You know, Jordan Dumay's ice time went down a little bit. Easton Cowan's Ice Time went up a little bit. Nate Danielson's Ice Time went up a little bit. And, you know, it was probably too little too late at that point.

But I think it's an interesting thing in the context of this tournament for Canada is the fact that they really haven't given that particular age group a lot of international experience. The other thing for Canada, I think, is something that's worth talking about is the goal. I don't think Matt this Rousseau was bad in this tournament. But this is yet another year that Hockey Canada goes to maybe not the most highly touted name in net. Last year was Thomas Millich. The year before is Dylan Garin.

Year before it was Devon Levi. Some of years for them, it has worked out. But hockey Canada's goaltending issues is a long-term issue. And this is not a problem that will be solved next year or the year after that. But it is quite startling when you see. that other nations can consistently turn out quality goaltending prospects and that hockey can't have to turn into a 5-foot-10 undrafted goalie essentially be their starter. It's not an ideal situation, especially as given this,

has become a consistent theme for their junior program. And not just to be their starter, but to play in every game. Actually, one of the questions I regret not asking Scott Salmon this morning was about Matthew Slussoe and their decision to play him in every game. that almost none of the federations at this tournament run their goaltenders it's been a long time since a goaltender has played all seven games at this tournament it's been even longer since that was successful you really do have to go back to justin pokey who was coincidentally actually the goalie coach for this team to find a tournament where a goalie played all seven games and was

successful for hockey Canada and he looked tired like i think we all agree he he he looked tired by the end of it i know that they they their fallback throughout the tournament when asked about playing Russo and not giving a look to Samuel, St. Hilaire, which there was an opportunity to do in the Latvia game in the third period in which hockey Canada has done in the past in third periods of blowouts, just to get a goalie familiar with the rink, familiar with playing in front of the crowd, a crowd he's never played in front of.

So he's not cold and falling back on his last start, which is December 8th at this point. But it's tough when you've got to play every game. Their fallback was Russo played 21 straight games in the playoffs last year for Halifax in the QMJHL, and he has not been pulled in a single game in Halifax in the last two seasons, which speaks to just how consistent he's been. But in the end, there were a couple of shots in that game that looked scary, and one of them beat him.

I think he'd like to have at least one of yesterday's goals back. And that was the difference in the game when Michael Harabble at the other end of the ice was fresher and played better and outperformed him. I think he played as hard as he could, and he's a good junior goalie, but I think Chris and I were having this conversation. Does that third goal, which wasn't an easy goal to stop, does that third goal get by Michael Harabo, who is 6 foot 6 as opposed to 5 foot 10? Yeah, it's an interesting dynamic. And I think, you know, it's unfortunate that Hockey Canada, you know, they thought they had their best two periods of that last two.

And then they didn't get the saves when they needed them from their goaltender. And so nothing really, really clicked. But, you know, I think in the end, you know, when they look back on this, you know, they can unfortunately, probably, to evaluate it, they're going to have so many excuses that they can lean on to say that they didn't win this tournament. But in the end, everybody has their own issues. Everybody's missing players. Everybody has injuries. Everybody has those things that they deal with. And the fact of the matter is is that this team probably underachieved, even though it was not a great Canadian roster, I still feel like they, especially against this particular tournament field, should have done better

than they did, and especially against that check team where, you know, basically you had to slow down one big line, which they did for the most part, and then you also had to, you know, find a way to be a quality goaltender, which they didn't do. That point about

the field is something I've heard from a lot of Canadian scouts in the post-mormon of this tournament for Canada, is that, yes, you didn't get some players from the NHL, they expected you didn't get Zach Benz, they didn't get Kevin Kiermank, Kovic, you had the injuries to Lino and to Mollandek, but their point is, you are still hockey Canada. Even if you are getting your Shane Wright or your

Adam Fantilli's back, there should still be enough good players in any age group that you should be able to be checking in a medal in a medal round game. And not just check you, but the way they played against the Germans. Scott Salmon's talking this morning about how tough it was against the Germans and how they clogged the net and they couldn't get inside. You have to get inside against the Germany roster that looks like that. Yeah, a German roster that's going to be playing for their relegation lives tomorrow. I mean, like that was that was another sign. I mean, and I feel like really, Scott, you said it with, they never got on the right foot, even in pre-tournament.

We never saw this team. And to Corey's point, too, about not having camps, just not having that familiarity with deployment, how to use the players. You know, all these other teams can't, you know, Sweden and Finland come to the United States every summer. And they all have a very intense a week where they're basically all playing against each other. Mind you, my favorite one of those camps are the ones when Canada has shown up. Yeah, it's been amazing. We had Russia in there one year two. I mean, like there were all these different situations where, you know, it allows these teams to prepare and they actually prepare each other. It's that whole iron sharpens iron thing. And then, you know, but they all do it. And hockey Canada's, you know, basic refusal, not real refusal,

but, you know, with whatever budgetary constraints there may have been for obvious reasons, you know, that, that didn't happen. So in the end, I think there's a lot of lessons that that hockey Canada can take away. The one thing that I don't think is the lesson is, you know, I don't think that this means that there is a dramatic Canadian downturn coming. They've been to four straight gold medal games. And just taking a peek forward, 12 months. I did see that.

I think their roster next year is going to look quite good. But it's, you know, every couple of years this happens, you know, on home ice in Vancouver, they got not down on the quarters, you know. Sometimes you have it, don't have the best age group in the world. But like I said, there's a sort of reason why this is. Yeah. Well, I think we've kicked Canada enough on this podcast. But really, it was a wild day at the quarterfinals in general. We're going to turn our attention to the tournament hosts right now because Sweden had a significant scare.

They had to go to overtime against the Swiss team that only beat Norway in the preliminary round. and this was a tough game. It ends on a power play goal from Axel Sandin Pellica. They win the game. They advance. I can only imagine what everyone in that building was thinking as, you know, the Swiss got a couple of good looks in overtime. Sweden has always had this stigma at the World Junior Championship in particular that they

get over the hump, that they can't win the big one. Only two gold medals in this event all time. But now they're on home ice. the pressure is higher. And throughout that overtime period, I was not in the building. You guys were. I was covering games at the other building,

but you could sense that palpable nervousness of this team. And you wonder, is this a hump that they just got over? Or is this a problem that could persist as the games only get tougher from here on out? And I'll start with you, Scott, because, I mean, that was a wild finish to that game.

Yeah, and you mentioned what it would have meant for Sweden and the Federation had they lost. What would it have meant for the semi-finals? picture had this Swiss advance. I've had a couple. How about the organizing committee if they lost Sweden and Canada the same day? And TSN for that matter with the rights holders, et cetera. But I've had a couple of people sort of from hockey, sort of scouts, etc. I did have joke that had Switzerland in advance.

They might as well have handed the gold medal to the United States and played a silver metal game, some kind of silver medal tournament between the other three teams. But no, it was, they looked, they looked nervous. That happens on home ice at this tournament. We've seen that several times over the years. There were some moments when we were in Ostrava, where the Czech team with a strong roster just looked like they were sort of crumbling under the weight

of what that crowd meant and the pressures that came with games at Ostravar Arena in Ostrava. Last night it felt a little bit the same for the Swedes. A couple of favorable penalty calls that went their way to. I know the bench was hot in the third period about some calls that had also been missed. So maybe there was some good karma that was coming back to the juju airway. But it was almost the brink of a disaster.

And it would have almost soften the blow on hockey Canada had they lost because it wouldn't have been the only sort of significant upset of the day. And this is on a day where Slovakia also upset in sort of air quotes, if you will, also upset the Finns. Or the other way around, the Finns also upset Slovakia. So yeah, it was, I'm not sure what to make of. it in terms of takeaways. I still think this Swedish team is a gold medal favorite here and one of the two best teams left in the tournament alongside the Americans. But it was just one of those games at the World Juniors.

And they happened where it's tight for just long enough. And that, as that overtime clicked on, I mean, it wasn't an early goal in overtime. They had to play five minutes of three on three OT. And it felt like every minute that passed, it was getting more and more dangerous for the Swedes. We had talked all tournament about the lack of scoring that Canada was getting at crucial times and just the overall lack of depth scoring in their lineup. As we talk right now, Canada has more goals in the tournament than Sweden. And I think that is the biggest concern on the Sweden team is that it's a very talented lineup.

It's a deep lineup. All six of their defensemen are very quality defensemen. They have three lines that they can roll and they're a good line. Hugo Havill is an excellent junior goaltender who carried them to a goal medal at the U-18 level two years ago. but there is no game breaker on this team. Jonathan Lekker and Mackie is probably the closest thing they have to in terms of just how talented he is, as a goal score and the high and skill he has,

but he's not a guy who can just create a goal out of nothing. They don't really have that. And I think you kind of saw that in this game where it was a tight checking game, and they really needed a goal, and there's just nothing. There's no one guy on that team or even a set of guys they can go to

to really lean on for offense, like say USA could for the go-to. Rochay line or BC line. So I think that's going to be an interesting thing for Sweden going forward here into the tough games is does the offense elevate in those tight checking games, in those hard games, you know, against a semi-final opponent and potentially a gold medal opponent. It did feel yesterday like if it wasn't going to be No Aston and Jonathan Lecker-Mackie, that they might not have got it and who were the two players who set up Axel Sandin-Pelika

when it mattered. Like those two guys in particular have been the two that have really, sort of driven the bus in terms of offensively power play even five on five let kermak he's been much better at five on five in this tournament and he's been at the pro level typically uh but yeah if if those two guys aren't going in a in a metal game it's it might be tough for them yeah yeah yeah they've been their best for i just mean like you know you look at the scoring in the tournament for example they i wouldn't say you know they are contributing the way say that caroche is yeah yeah for us yeah and he's not even contributing on the goal

scoring like he normally would, but he's leading the tournament with 10 points. And the one thing that I also bring up, and I thought Ocelain was the guy where it looked like in the overtime, where he was one of the guys that was really going. But even Lekkaramaki in that in that overtime period, or even towards the end of regulation, where he was passing up shots, where he was not, like, I wanted somebody to take that game by the reins and get control of it. And we didn't necessarily see that. And they're going to need that at this stage of the tournament. We've seen Lekarimak do that. We've seen Ogren do that at times at other age groups. Now they have to find a way to do it here. So that was an interesting result in the end. And now we've got the way it's set up, you have

Sweden playing Czechia. Now you've got USA playing Finland. And Finland end up, you know, like you said, Scott, air quotes, upset Slovakia. And, you know, I think the Slovakia game, I was in that building. I was watching the game. I know Scott was there as well. And we, we, It was a crazy finish to that one. Finland ends up winning it 24 seconds. And overtime, Uri Lassila, who's been awesome for Finland in this tournament, scores the... One of the things that this comes back to is that Slovakia decided that they would not play Adam Gaon

against Team USA, essentially conceding the group. I mean, that was basically what they did. It ends up, instead of playing Latvia, they play if they would have beaten the Americans, which is certainly not a guarantee even if Guyon was playing. They end up playing Finland, and it becomes a much tougher quarter. final one. So for the second straight year, Slovakia is out in the quarters on an overtime goal. Yeah. I mean, any other takeaways from that. It wasn't a guarantee, but that game was really tight up until the third period. Right. And I know, I know the final score ended up being lost

side. Yeah. If Guyon is in net. Yeah, USA is four five in the third. So yeah, so that was not a pleasant game for that. But yeah, it could have been a lot worse. I think the other thing, too, is now Finland has this opportunity after having lost to Germany in the prelims for the first time ever. They lost their first two preliminary round games. They end up beating Lafayette, beat Sweden in overtime, and then they win again in overtime, nearly giving that game away. Slovakia did get a late goal. I think we might have jinx Maxim Sturback too on this podcast a few days ago,

and we just heap praise on him. And I do think he had a very good tournament. And it is a very impressive performance by him overall. and I think if you are a fan of the Buffalo Sabres, you are ecstatic with 99% of what you saw from Maxim Sturvac here, but it just so happened that he had about, you know, in his final three shifts of his tournament. Two big mistakes.

They just, the loses a battle to a 17-year-old that ends up with a puck going right into the front of his net and to the back of the net on a shot by Alexander Kaskamaki and then just gets absolutely danced by Yari Lassala in the overtime. I said very unfortunate end to a tournament for Sturback, who I think was everyone's consensus top defensement in the tournament, but I don't expect he'll be getting that not any time soon. No, I don't think so.

And before we move on, we should just quickly, we don't have to harp on it too much, but the U.S. has scored 36 goals in the tournament so far. They roll S-Lot via in the quarterfinal, and, you know, they are the top scoring team in the tournament by a lot. They've outshot teams by 20 shots on goal as well in terms of, the total shots that they've directed towards the net. The only unbeaten team remaining, I mean, you know,

Corey, we talked about it yesterday. If they don't win this tournament now, it's about as big a failure as, you know, it feels like the road's cleared a little bit. Now, that being said, Sweden is no slouch, and it's not a given that they can beat them, but they also now have to get past Finland. Wouldn't you have said the same thing, though,

two years ago at the UA team level with this age group? 100%. There was no way they were losing that game. There was no way they were losing. And they were, they dominated everybody they played against. And then Hugo Havlet happened. Hugo Havlet happened. And Hugo Havlet is back.

Yes. And while we do not have a direct USA versus Sweden matchup yet, it could potentially be the gold medal game. And for a lot of players on this Sweden and USA team, they would have a lot of familiarity with each other in that context. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that this is, that's probably the matchup that they want at this point now, especially given that Canada is out there.

I think they want to slay that final drag. And the 2004 birth year is now gold medalists. They're still looking for it. They've had many opportunities. A bunch of those guys played in multiple under 18 world championships. A lot of them played, you know, had that heartbreaking loss to Ewe Havillett. They were on a team last year that lost to Canada in the semifinals. Now they have an opportunity in front of them.

And they're saying all the right things. They haven't facing this tournament yet. And that's coming at some point. So do you see them rolling through Finland? I think it's a close game. It's a closer game. I think it will be a closer game. We saw against Chequia that, you know, a tighter checking game against bigger forwards can be a more difficult game for them in their defense.

They're going to have to possess the puck more than and not turn it over. That finish team is heavy too. Yeah. And, you know, just like how like in the NHL, when the real game starts, things change. The officiating standard, even though it's not supposed to change, it changes. Man, where there's some stuff in that Canada check game that should have been called that were not called. And Sweden, Switzerland. Exactly.

They're a little bit more cognizant of making sure that the tap hook doesn't get called as much. So even though we all agree that USA is by far the most talented offensive team here, I do not, there are no guarantees. Finland has a lot of great players.

It may not be the deepest finish line we've ever seen in our lives. Even for Czech, it wasn't the deepest check line we've ever seen in our lives either. But you can't disrespect your opponent. No. Where do, you can answer this. Chris, but where do things stand on the goaltending front?

Trey Augustine and Jacob Fowler have both had good seasons this year. I know there were a couple of NHL scouts who were surprised to see Jacob Fowler to get the cornerfied a match up just because of the way that Trey has played in his two starts. Do we have any sort of concrete answer in terms of who the starting goalie is the rest of the way? Yeah, I mean, USA will not confirm who the starting goalie is. They have done that the whole way, really. They have never said that either one of them is the number one.

However, I don't think that Jacob Fowler starting the quarterfinal was an indication that he's for sure the number one. I would not be surprised to see Trey Augustine take the net in the semifinal. Latvia was an opponent that I think USA was pretty confident. They were going to comfortably get passed. And, you know, these guys do play back-to-backs in college, but it's usually within, you know, about a week between those back-to-back. So I think giving Trey, who also had missed a game due to illness in this tournament,

an opportunity to rest is probably what happened. But that's only an inference because USA will not confirm, and it was not a clear in practice, of the two goalie is just going to be the guy going. So I could definitely see that USA does this. And I know that's certainly not impressive. As always, when we record in the middle of the tournament, anything we say right now may get outdated extremely quickly

and or look ridiculous, extremely quickly. But we'll be back with our next episode right after the conclusion of the gold medal game. Max usually says some stuff here about subscribing and rating. And I forgot exactly what he says here. But do all that. And we'll see you in a few days. Thank you for listening.