The Athletic Hockey Show - World Junior Summer Showcase takeaways

Episode Date: August 5, 2024

It’s a Prospect Series takeover of the Monday show this week as Max, Corey, and FloHockey’s Chris Peters give their thoughts on how Team USA and Team Canada performed respectively at the WJSS, which players stood out, concerns for each team, and more. Plus, the guys close things out with listener questions in the mailbag.Hosts: Max Bultman and Corey PronmanWith: FloHockey’s Chris PetersExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Chris Flannery Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Hey, everybody. Max Boltman here alongside Corey Pronman and Flow Hockey's Chris Peters. For another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show's Prospect Series, a special episode, you could say, we're on a Monday. We don't usually get the primetime slot this early in the week, fellas. But coming off the World Junior Summer Showcase, prospects are in the spotlight a little bit, Corey. And nothing else is going on. Yeah, well, hey, we'll take it where we can get it. We've got the Halinka coming up, too.

it is a prospecty time of year. Chris, I know you were out at, we were all at the event, but Chris, you were there all week. Let's start with you here about Team USA. I think the big names are the ones that we knew going in. Ryan, Leonard, Gabe Perra, Zee, Bui, and all really impressive. But what was kind of your big takeaway is watching Team USA for seven or eight days here in Plymouth? Yeah, you know, I think it's going to be interesting. You can kind of see the differences between last year's team and this year's team and the different holes that they're going to

have to fill and how, you know, they're noticeable. You know, I think that they're the some of the things that the blue line, you know, how we'll talk about that a little bit more in depth. But, you know, I think that that's, that's good. There's a lot of questions on on who fills that out, what kind of players. I mean, the good news is that they actually have quite a bit of variety in terms of playstiles, size, handedness, all those different things that will, you know, help them build the blue line.

But, you know, there's also just kind of the newer players. and how are they going to fit in? I mean, we already knew the returnees were going to be solid. And I think this is Ryan Leonard's team essentially at this point. You know, Gabe Perot obviously going to have a big say in it. And Oliver Moore probably going to play a pretty sizable role himself. And then Z. Bouillon is a clear cut number one defenseman for them. So, you know, I think that the core pieces are in place.

And then not even to mention Trey Augustine, who's going to be a two-year starter coming into his third world juniors. So, you know, I think that they have the core pieces in place to be a good contending team. But there are still going to be some question marks left after this camp. And I think it'll take, you know, the first half to really solidify this roster. But, you know, in the end, I think especially with how they close the tournament out with Canada in a very impressive game where, you know, I think that Canada probably had the edge on skill, but USA was able to get enough done to come out and close camp out with a win. But I think in general, you know, it's going to be a contending team, no question about it.

I think they have the depth and the talent to be a team that will compete for a gold medal and try to be the team that is the first ever to go back to back for USA. So I think the pieces are in place. It's just going to be a matter of, you know, kind of finding where those last kind of key players or those last role players are going to fit in and who makes the most sense. And then on top of that, you also have the specter of, hey, we're going to be hosting this thing next year. So you also are trying to make sure you're servicing that roster a little bit as well by making sure key guys get experience as well. So most of those top guys, as you mentioned, got sent home pretty early in the week. Oliver Moore did not put it. But Leonard, Perrault, Bouillon, Augustine, they didn't last really even into the conjoined team phase for Team USA.

And Corey, that's right around the time that you got to Plymouth. I know you've been watching already. But I'm curious, without those guys in the picture, did this look like? like kind of the, and you expect them to lose some firepower when guys like that are not in the lineup. But did it really, you know, was there a little bit of a red flag for some of the offense for Team USA without those big names? Well, if you recall what this age group looked like at the U18 level with the NTDP, that is,

it was really a three-man show with Will Smith, Ryan Leder and Gabe Perot, getting an extremely large percentage of the offense for that age group. Obviously, All or More was a good player. but that first power play was leaned on. Those three players were leaned on. And there wasn't really a lot of secondary offense in that group. Even at the U18 level, Cole Eisenman and James Hagen's got their points of the World Championship,

but I would never have thought they were guys they were relying on. And I think that's going to be a minor question for this team. I think we expect Leonard and Perrault and Zeev Boyam to be leaders at the tournament, to be among the better players overall at the tournament. but if their top line isn't clicking for whatever reason on a given night, you know, we kind of saw this last year's tournament. The Cutter Goce line was the quote unquote top line,

but then when they weren't having their best game, then you saw the Will Smith line kind of rise up and producing key moments. I'm not sure I'd be 100% confident in Cole Eisenman to be that guy or Quentin Mustie to be that guy or Trevor Connolly to be that guy. And I think that was kind of a debate point among, some of the scouts that I talked to in the stands and even like maybe the college coaching types that were there too is like you know can you bring all three of those guys and some say yes some say no some say you can't bring maybe both of iserman and musty i think

that would be uh you know too much frustration possibly for our coaching staff at the same time but that being said you look at this team you're like are you really going to bring say from the same age group are you really going to bring brodie zemer and max plant and not bring Cole Isamant? Are you really going to bring Chris Pelosi or Brandon's Fibona and not bring Quentin Mustie? So I think at the end of the day USA's hand might be fours because they're going to need to get offense from somewhere other than their two key returning wingers. You talked about the potential for frustration and that's not a bad word for how I felt watching Cole Eisenman at a lot

of this tournament, Chris. He scores a couple of goals including a really big one against Canada. And I think if you're making the case for Cole Iserman, it's exactly that. It's that he can be, you know, he put a lot of shots, took a lot of shots in the final game on Saturday. None of them all that really close to scoring until finally there's a big goal goes in. What was your kind of read on Cole Eisenman's week? Am I wrong? Was he better than I'm giving him credit for? You know, he was better when he had a center that could give him the puck.

You know, I think that and that's the thing. That's always going to be the, you know, when he played with James Higgins, he played better. You know, so that, that's part of it. You know, he spent a lot of last year playing with Max Plant, who's a really good distributor. You know, so he needs that. And the question is going to be, you know, do you have that in your center group after James Haken's? Because James Hagan's, more than likely, if Will Smith isn't available, then James Higgins is going to be playing with Gabe Perot and Ryan Leonard. It's not going to be with Cole Eiserman.

And so, you know, do you have those playmakers? I mean, you look at a guy like Oliver Moore, who's probably Team USA's number two center, and he's a, he's a, very fast player. He is, he can create offense, but he's not necessarily a driver or a playmaker that is going to be able to distribute, you know, to a goal score like Cole Eiserman. So you're, you're now trying to figure out where does he fit? In the end, you know, would Cole Eisenman be comfortable being the 13th forward and a power play specialist? You know, like that's the other kind of thing that you talk about. And on top of that, your first power, he's not going to be on your first power play unit because the wings on that.

unit are going to be Perrault and Leonard again. So, you know, that's the other thing. And I think in this camp, that was one of those kind of question marks. Is he going to be able to be part of, you know, that team beyond, that team at five on five. And so, and that was the thing where musty, I think, had his best game against Canada. And then that allowed, you know, then all of a sudden you're saying, okay, well, if it comes down to between those two guys, which one do I, do I want more? And, you you might say musty at that point. So, you know, that's, that's the thing. Because he also brings a size element to him, you know, there's some power in his game.

He's, you know, there's, there's certainly a lot there. But, yeah, I mean, you know, that's, that's what it comes down to. I think Cole Eisenman and his goal scoring talent, you just are going to need it. So you're going to need it somewhere and whether, but you have to find the right mix to play with them. And if that means, you know, we're going to have them with Max Plant or we're going to have them with, you know, and maybe Danny Nelson's in the middle of those two guys, you know, there's a lot of different things that you can kind of do with your roster to work a player like him in.

But the thing is, is that you don't want to necessarily have players like that where we need to have them with the right guy. Otherwise, it's not going to work. And so you don't get much time in the world juniors to heat up. So that's the other, you know, if he's not scoring and is he helping and that's going to be the real question. I did think it was interesting on that on that size note real quick, Chris. I thought Eisenman threw as many hits as I've seen him throw in like a concentrated period of time. Like that seemed like a real focus for him at this event. Yeah, he actually, I mean, that's kind of been when he feels like he's got to make something happen.

He will and get he's he can be a physical player and that's helpful. But, you know, I also think it's not necessarily the best use of his of his time and his game. But yeah, but he did he definitely. he's become a more aggressive physical player in the last year. Yeah, I thought there were definitely some moments where I thought he competed well, where I thought he was making plays. I don't think, I think he's an easy player to beat up on because you see the 75 goals and you think like this guy should be dynamic and then there you watch the games

and there are times he has inter isn't very noticeable. So he could be frustrating in that way, but I still think he's a valuable player. But those frustrating moments can definitely be frustrating. I think there was one moment. I think it might have been in the game. against Canada, actually, where he got a prime opportunity set up by James Hagen's, and I think the shot either went wide or the goal,

it deflected it wide, and the puck starts going quickly the other way, and he's just standing there in the slot, like kind of like looking up at the sky, frustrated. And if I was his coach, I would be, you know, kind of carving him out on his way back to the bench there. There's some stuff like that in his game that could be very frustrating, but I don't see where in their secondary scoring, be it musty, be it at Connolly,

be in any of their other options, where they're going to get that kind of offense from on a second or third line, and I think you might have to bite the bullet and take him. The secondary scoring for me is a question, but I also wonder, looking at this lineup, how do we feel about James Higgins as the first line center? And not how do we feel about James Higgins as a hockey player?

I think anybody agrees he's an outstanding pro prospect. He's in the mix to be the first overall pick in the 2025 NHL draft. But when we could think of some of the most recent elite prospects who were in college and how they fared the world juniors, I don't think Annan Fantilli had a fantastic world juniors. I thought Macklin-Selabrini had a good world juniors. I don't think it was a dominant world juniors by any means. And I think like James Hagan's at this level, I thought he was fine, good. I don't think he was incredible.

And one of my takeaways coming out of this is, given how bad we expect the San Jose Sharks to be this upcoming season it is, you know, how big part of this team's plans is them getting Will Smith back. Yeah, you know, I think that's the thing is I have a feeling it's as, it's probably, to me, it's probably 50-50 at this point that they get Will Smith in, in, in December because of what Corey said. The sharks are going to be bad. I don't know.

Like, you know, I've, I've kind of said it before. like I think Will Smith between, you know, him and Celebrini. Celebrity is the more NHL ready player, even though Smith is a year older. You know, I think that there's, there's, it'll just kind of come down to what San Jose wants to do. Because I also think if, if all the sudden Will Smith is released, he obviously goes right back between Perot and Leonard. And then that frees up Higgins to be your number two center.

But to Corey's point about him. whether or not he's ready to be a number one center. What I saw when the first two games that he played, they had him with Perrault and Leonard, and Perrault and Leonard owned the puck. So James Higgins, who is a play driving center, who is a guy that wants to distribute, who is a guy that wants to have the puck,

didn't have the puck a lot. And so that was moderately, you know, like that to me is the adjustment that they're going to have to get through. The good news is that they're going to have a couple months to do it at Boston College, because I'm pretty certain that they're going to be the trio that plays at the top of their lineup.

I do think once he gets more involved in that, because I thought, and, you know, David Carl said the same thing. He thought that Higgins was good against Canada. I thought it was one of his best games of the camp. And he was more assertive. You know, he was distributing pucks well. He was digging pucks out. He was playing engaged.

He's not a very strong guy yet. He still needs to attack on weight, but he was engaging in the hard areas of the ice and being physical. But, you know, do I believe? that I think he'll be fine in the end. I think that there's enough time to build that chemistry with those two guys. But I also think that, you know, as he gets it further into the season, you know, we do have to take some of this with a grain of salt with the summer hockey element to it as well. But at the same time, I think he'll be, you know, he'll be fine.

And he's obviously the clear option to be the guy. But I do think it's more like, hey, this is, like I said earlier, this is Ryan Leonard's team. It was just more of a commentary. not less on Hagan's a moron putting a draft eligible player into such a premium role. Like you think of what Jack Hughes looked like at his world juniors. I don't think he dominated by any means. Like it's really hard to expect that young a player to be your first line center, your go-to player, your play driving, top line option and win a gold medal. I'm not saying that's impossible.

You know, obviously Connor Bernard did it. But it's, I think it's a tall ask. Yeah. And very often, Corey, those guys have had a. year of experience. Many times they've played as an underager, that did not happen with James Hagan's last year. So, I mean, that's the other thing is that he's going to be coming into this tournament cold. And, you know, without that prior experience, even though he has had two very successful runs at the world under 18s. To Corey's point, there's a couple other candidates for first overall,

expected to be at this world juniors. And I don't think we expect either Anton Frundel or Porter Martone to play quite as big a role as we expect James Higgins to have to play. So even at this one event, that could be a little bit of a standout. Let's move a little bit into guys who helped themselves that are not kind of as roster locky as some of the guys we've talked about so far. Anyone who really jumps out to you, Chris, right away? Yeah, so this tournament was, or, you know, the event,

I keep calling a tournament, but really it's just a camp. You know, the event itself really did lend itself well for a couple guys to kind of like raise their hand and say, I got to be here. I got to be on this team. You know, one of the guys that I think, thought surprised me the most. And even though I really liked him in the USHL last year, I was Noah Powell. Noah Powell kind of played in a more of a

fourth line role, a banging crash, penalty kill. But David Carl has said he wants all four lines to score. This is a guy that had 43 goals in the USHL last season. I expect him to play a significant role for Ohio State early in the year. He was physical. He's not an attractive skater by any means, but he gets to where he needs to go. And he He's able to bang and crash, and he closes on pucks extremely well, and he has a great work ethic. But then he also has a tremendous shot. He scored some in camp, made some plays. That's a guy that really stood out to me.

You know, as well, Brandon's Foboda, who played in the, in the U.S.HL, another guy where I think you're going to play him in the depth of your lineup. He has size. He has speed. He scored against Canada. you know, he actually scored was the top score in camp, oddly enough, and was not a reliable point producer last year in the USHL in terms of his overall, you know, he produced, but it wasn't like, you know, being a top score in this and a camp like this. So I think those are two guys that really helped themselves this week.

I think that Chris Pelosi got a lot of opportunities as well in key spots in the lineup and kind of showed some versatility. He also showed tremendous speed. So you can see the hallmarks of what this team is going to be. They want to be fast. They want to be physical. They want to have all four lines that can score. You know, I think really when it came to the forwards, those were some of the guys where I was like, wow. And I also would be remiss to not mention Brody Zemer, but I want to leave some meat on the bone for Corey, too.

Well, that's kind of what I was kind of mentioning at earlier is that when we were looking at the 06 age group, we think of James Hagen's. We think of Cole Eisenman. And on that first power play, you know, they drove up the bus along with Cole Hudson, who I thought also had a good camp. But I think Brody Zemer and Max Plont were kind of not always at the forefront of our minds when talking about that age group. But when you look at this team and how they performed this week, I thought it was Plont and particularly Zemer who stood out among the. those players in a different environment, although they actually did quite put that power play together, those five guys, quite a few times probably for familiarity purposes. But I thought, you know, Zemer playing against bigger players showed how, you know, his excellent compete level, he won a lot of battles, he was creating offense, about Plont II was creating quite a bit of offense. So I think it's an interesting dynamic where you have, I think, these guys who may not have had these sterling score numbers, I say, a Coiseman had last year.

but I would argue particularly in the case of Zemer, I think his case to make the team is much more solid than say a Cole Eisenman is right now. One other guy I'd throw in there was Beckett Hendrickson. I thought he was noticeable start to finish all week. I really liked him next to Kerry Terrence. There's kind of some similarities, I think, in their two games and complimented each other really well.

But I think the unanswered question guys coming out of this, and we'll go to you here, Corey, is the blue line. And I feel like it's the second year in a row at this time of year we're saying it. I felt like maybe they found some answers as it got closer to the tournament last time around. But I do feel like there's still some question marks on this USA Blue Line. Yeah, I think it's, I think Zeev Boyan's spot is locked in. I think Cole Hudson spot is locked in. And I think Drew Ford iskew as a returning member spot is pretty secure.

And otherwise, I can't tell you confidently who the other three defensemen in those top six are going to be. I think there's all there's strong candidates. You know, I think E.J. Emery is a strong candidate. I think Paul Fisher is a strong candidate. I think Zach Scholes and Aaron Minician are strong candidates. I can't sit here and tell you which one of those guys confidently are going to be getting regular shifts in a tournament. Chris, of that group that Corey just mentioned, who were your guys that really impressed you? Anybody that you felt like actually didn't help their case this week?

Yeah, it was, you know, it was interesting to watch that blue line because I was, you know, I kind of came in very intrigued by where this was going to go. because they had, you know, six, five guys like Adam Kleber, on a right-shot guy. They had, you know, size, they had speed. They had a lot of different things. And, you know, it was interesting. Like, like Aaron Menetian did not have a good camp as a guy that, you know, was in the roster last year. But I also look back to how he played at the end of the last season with Boston College. And I'm like, you know, if he plays that way, he's clearly on the team, you know, like no doubt on the team.

And no doubt, you know, could potentially even be, I wouldn't say no doubt, but could be a, a top four guy. You know, I think that the other thing that this camp that I didn't love about it, I think there were too many defensemen in camp, for one. I didn't love the way that, like, you know, guys were getting skipped over on shifts and like, you know, it just didn't get a chance to see certain guys get into a rhythm. So they would often play eight defensemen in a game. I just don't think that that was particularly helpful for, for the cause. But, you know, guys that I think did, I was harping on him earlier in the camp, but, you know, I, I, I was impressed by how Colin Ralph grew over the course of camp.

He had his best game against Canada. He's huge. He's physical. I don't think he's going to be on this roster, but I do think that he did some good things. I think Adam Kleber was a guy to me that kept himself firmly in the mix for a spot on this team. He has mobility size. I think that he's got to get a little meaner.

He's got to play a little more aggressively at times, but there's a lot to like about his game. You know, so I think as a six, he's a good six. You know, like that's a really good six. But yeah, and so, you know, they're going to take eight defensemen with them. I had a hard time picking eight that I would bring. You know, if I were to look right now, as Corey said, I agree with the three locks. I think Zach Scholes, it'll basically Zach Scholes and Paul Fisher are the same exact player.

So you take one of those two guys. Shulls was the captain of their under 18 team that won gold. And then, you know, I think Minetti and E.J. Emery, Cleber, you know, the bubble is going to be large for this spot. You know, I think even Logan Hensler had flashes, but I thought he struggled in the game against Canada. He also got a little bit banged up in camp. So, you know, there are different things that you're kind of looking at to see what would happen. But I think that you're going to want to have an older blue line if you can. And with William Schultz, Fortescue, Menetian, you know, I think those are going to be guys that play for you.

And then, you know, it comes down in Hudson, Emery, was a great pairing at the under 18. So I think they have, I don't think it's going to be like a problem. I want to say that. I don't think that like it's just, it's just hard to see which of those guys really do end up standing out. Real quick, Cori, you could tell me if I'm crazy for this. If there's not a collection of 7 or 8D that you feel really passionate about, does it strengthen the argument to bring a guy? like Hensler and just start thinking future focused with that? Or is that a little too, getting a little too precious with things?

Maybe he has like a seven or an eight, but I mean, I don't think he's played well enough in the last 12 months to give him the benefit of the doubt. All right. Let's take a break right there. We'll come back. We'll talk about Canada. All right. Moving on now to Canada.

They didn't get to the World Junior Summer Showcase until the last couple of days of it. but they did also have a camp of their own prior to that, a little intrasquod scrimmage. And when they did arrive, there were a lot of talented players on display, Corey. We're talking some of the top names of the 2024 draft class. When you looked at all those players, we're talking Berkeley Cat and Tija, Beckett, Seneca, Zane Perak, Sam Dickinson, Carter, Yakumchuk. Your takeaway was that they will have a lot of difficult decisions to make. And as always is with the team of Canada roster,

I think somebody very, very talented is probably going to be left home when it comes to making this final roster. You know, I didn't get to see the red-white game that they played or the game against Sweden. I only got to see the game against Finland where it was mostly a composition of the guys who were on the bubble. And then the game against the USA where they sent the returnees home, but a lot of the stronger candidates played against the U.S. And I thought there were three of the most recently highly drafted players that set out on that game, that being the Seattle pick, Berkeley, Cadden, who I thought was Canada's best overall player in that game. I thought Jetlachenko was excellent in that game as well,

the Philadelphia 13th overall pick. And then I thought Zane Parrick was the best of the highly picked defenseman in that game, Calgary's ninth overall pick. I thought quite frankly, Sam Dickinson and Carter Yakimchuk struggled. I thought Beckett Seneca and T. Gingla struggled. And Zell, you know, those are four top 11 picks. But that being said, it was one game. And when I talked to some of the scouts who were at the games in Windsor,

that being the red-white game against Sweden, they thought that Yakim Chuck Dickinson and Seneca played a lot better in those games. And then Ginnla had two goals in the game against Finland. So you don't want to extrapolate too much from one game. But I definitely thought, and Berkeley had to my knowledge, when I heard played really well in the earlier games too. And I thought he was just outstanding, showed a lot of pace, a lot of playmaking.

I think there is no doubt. I think with all the other players, there's always doubt. He has to see how their first half goes, how December camp goes. But I think with Cadden, there is no doubt. I think he's a top two-line player on this team. He's going to be one of the most important players on this team. The captain of the Hillingkogreski team and the leading score in that tournament show that he can excel again at the international level.

And I think he was definitely a significant bright spot for him. team Canada. What about the blue line, Chris? Because we just talked about three guys that went really high in this last draft class between Perak, Yakub-Chuk Dickinson. Who was the best of the bunch for you? Yeah, I mean, I thought in the games that I saw Perak had the most moments. You know, I think that there's, you can see like the foundation of Sam Dickinson's game with the skating and that, you know, the, I think some of the decisions that he made were questionable. But, you know, Perak was the guy that had the smoothest kind of thing,

smoothest kind of game. Actually, I like Andrew Gibson as a defender as well. You know, I think like he plays in like the tough shutdown kind of role for them. He was on the PK. He was playing physical. He was tough to get around. You know, so that, but but of the of the highly drafted guys, you know, I think Perak did the most to help himself in that time just because there's that smoothness to

his offensive game. They're going to need guys like him. You look, you know, USA has a couple of guys like. that in in in in in in hughiam and and and you know i think of all the draft eligible defensemen or draft recently drafted defensemen that i saw in camp zev bouillon was heads above everybody um based on what i saw um you know so that was you know kind of interesting to to see that dynamic obviously is a bit on the older side as a late birthday as well but you know i i think canada's blue line will be fine you know in the end they're going to have a lot of good options they're

going to have a variety of players. You know, there weren't, I think, kind of some of the lesser heralded guys didn't necessarily do much to, you know, make me say, get real excited about them. But, but, yeah, but I mean, to Corey's point, you know, Yakum Chuck kind of got lost in that USA game. I didn't really think he impacted it much at all. And then Dickinson had some key mistakes and got burned on a couple of plays that, you know, led to goals.

So in the end, you know, I think that they'll all be fine. And like I always say with this event, you do have to take it with a grain of salt given that, you know, the timeline. These guys have, you think about the draft eligible players and the season that they've had. They went, you know, like in Dickinson's case and Perix case, they're playing in the Memorial Cup. They go do the combine. They go do the draft. They go to do development camp. And then they basically have two weeks off.

And then they're playing in a highly competitive summer event. So we do have to take that with a bit of a grain of salt. remind ourselves that while this is a high, high level and it was exceptionally played by many of the players, you know, some guys do, I think, have to be created on a slight curve. Maybe one of the last hell of the guys that I thought helped himself was the Kinnuck's third-round pick Sawyer media who played on the pair with Perrek. I don't think really stood out in any notable way. I don't think he'd create a ton of offense or it was like a super physical player.

I thought he was steady, dependable, you know, made good decisions, made enough stops. enough to keep himself in the mix to make the final team. One more forward, Corey, who I guess I just didn't mention when we were talking about the 2024 high picks was Jet Lucenko. And he scored in the game against USA, but he was also just getting a lot of important usage, it seemed like, for Team Canada. What were your thoughts on how Lucchenco played? And does he have a legit chance here to make this team?

I think he does just because the skating is so good. The competitiveness is so good. And I think if he's showing offense, which he did at this level. and he did at the U-18 level enough, even though I don't think he's going to be a powerplay guy for the final team. I think he can put himself in a mix to be a bottom six forward, a guy who the coach is going to lean on to provide energy and speed

and hopefully maybe get a couple of points here or there. I think putting together this roster will be interesting, particularly down the middle, because I feel like as a returning member, Braden Yeager, is almost all but assured to be on this team. I think the way Berkeley can has played historically for Team Canada, and again, here at this tournament, I think he is more or less a lock to be on this team. And I think the way Jet Lechenko has played, made a strong argument for him to be on the team.

So those are three centers and they're all 511 or shorter. And now you start going to the other center options. Is it Matthew Caterford, also 511? Is it Riley Heights? Also 510, 511. And that's where I start wondering how this team will come together. Caden Lindstrom, I think, should be on this team if healthy. He was not healthy again at this camp despite looking moderately healthy at the Columbus development camp.

So obviously we'll see where he is by December with his health. And I started looking at this roster. I wonder, do they have to put Callum Ritchie in the middle, even though he was on the wing versus U.S., and he was on the wing at the Hulinkogretsky versus his age group? So that's a point of debate for me. Do you have to find a center somewhere else that has a little bit more size? Or do you just run for small centers, which would be very strange for Team Canada,

especially given that they do have plenty of options that I have size? It would have been nice to see Caden Lindstrom at this camp, too. I mean, that's a tough one. I know he skated at Columbus's. I think that being able to at least see him with this group, I think would make you feel a little better about that conversation. whereas now there just seems like there's kind of uncertainty. Right.

And now it's going to be, you know, as always with Canada, good players are going to go home. But if Lindstrom's in, then you're definitely talking about, okay, where does Seneca fit? Where does it get Ginnla fit? And without him, I think maybe there's, you can get one of those guys into the roster. Who would you take based on what you saw between Seneca and Gynla? It would be close. Probably Seneca, just because he has the size edge. and I think he's pretty dynamic offensively.

But I think there's a chance where they take neither. I think Seneca's on the roster, for sure. I don't know for sure. I thought he was invisible against the U.S. He was. But he was excellent in the previous game. Yeah, he was really good against Philly. He's so talented.

I love Seneca. The skill is outstanding. Yeah. I mean, I think he should. And I think he's going to have such a good first half and like he'll force his way into the conversation. But, I mean, it's not the first time we've had this conversation with a team Canada. that they've had to leave a really talented player at home, particularly an 18-year-old.

So it'll really depend on how all their first halfs go and how their December camps go, I think. Let's take a quick break right there. We'll come back with a mailbag. All right, we'll wrap things up today with a quick mailbag. Been a while since we did one of these. So we'll start with Charlie Douglas, who says, given they hired their general managers around the same time,

how would you compare the progress of the Sharks and Blackhawks current rebuilds, which do you think is best set up to win a Stanley Cup at this point? Corey. I think it's close, and I'm not sure I'm pegging either of them to win a Stanley Cup anytime in the next three, four years. Rebuilding a hockey team is very difficult, and even when you get the most difficult pieces, be it Connor Bedard for Chicago or San Jose, you get Maclin Celebrini. Those are the hardest pieces to get, but you still need 10 more really good players

in order to win a Stanley Cup. That's just the way hockey teams are built. it's never about one player or otherwise Connor McDavid would have several rings by now. If I had to lean one way, I would lean towards Chicago, I think. With the caveat thought, I think there's still going to be pretty bad next year, probably still be bad the year after that. And I like the direction both organizations are trending in, but there is still a lot of work to be done with both of those franchises.

It's interesting how different the approach is, too. You look at Chicago's projected lineup. You got like six serious veterans on the wings. You look at San Jose. It's like the opposite. There's like two veterans projected in their opening night lineup. So they are kind of taking different approaches to how they do this thing. Well, I think people in Chicago think they're going to win more games this season.

And I think they could, but the bar was pretty low to start with. Yeah, I think they're going to win. I think they will win more games next year, but I still think they're going to be a lottery team. And I think they need to be. I mean, quite frankly, when you look at both of these teams, let's talk about, you know, kind of where they're at and their rebuilds in terms of the prospects that they have. And, you know, as Corey said, you've got the blue chips. You've got, you've got your celebrini in San Jose. You know, you have Will Smith.

You've got in Chicago. You've got Connor Bedard. You think you have your number one defense in the future in Arden, Lever. of neither team has a goalie of the future a credible goalie of the future at this point. You know, I think that that's, that's, you know, guys like Drew Commesso, you know, that he can, he can continue to develop, you know, Adam Gyan has, you know, a chance to continue to develop. But, I mean, I think they're both so far away and so, so, so hard to really project

as starters at this point, you know, and so it's going to come down to kind of the, the balance. And I think San Jose does have a number of intriguing pieces of the, younger guys that are going to be there. But still, I mean, there is so much left to be done. And I think some of that will have to be, you can't, you really can't draft an entire lineup. Most teams will never draft an entire lineup. So, you know, you're going to have to continue to build with free agency trades and different things of that nature.

But, yeah, I mean, I think, as Corey said, neither are close, you know. So that's the thing. Even with those things, they got the hardest pieces that you have. that any team can get with that true number one center that's going to produce for you and do those things. But there is a long way to go. And I would also lean Chicago. I think there's just a few more pieces there. But they're still looking. They need like, you know, the one thing that San Jose has that they don't. And I feel like this is true of Will Smith is that they have that running mate, elite forward running mate for Celebrini. And Chicago is going to need to find that for

Badard. Well, Chicago also has Artem Lift shootoff and I don't think San Jose is anything close to that. Correct. And their defense. Nor Kortinski. I would say Dickinson

and Kortinski are close to each other. Comparable, yeah. But I would agree with Chris that I don't think drafting is the you can't just rebuild the team into a contender through the draft with the caveat that I don't think you can rebuild through the first round into a contender.

I think at some point you have to find someone in the second or the third round who's going to become an important player of your lineup and, you know, maybe there might be somebody in the last few drafts or Chicago or San Jose who can fit that criteria. I'm not sure I see anybody they've drafted recently who I would qualify as a true premium prospect. And that's no criticism in those organizations. Those come around one every three years maybe in the entire league.

So Chris's point about kind of the running mate. There's another question from the mailbag I want to pull up. from Blackhawks fanatic. If you were in the Chicago Blackhawks position at 18th overall this year, who would you have drafted and who is the better pick in general between Bovair and Cole Eisen. You know, I mean, going back to the rankings, for me, you know, Cole, Cole is kind of, you know, obviously trended downward where Bovaire has trended up. So I think they are kind of going in opposite directions in terms of where I think they're

going to be. You know, looking back, I had Cole Eisenman ranked ahead of Sasha Boehiver at the draft. And so, but the thing is, is what Sasha Boisbe does, he is a goal score. He is a true two-way player. He has a competitive bent to him. He still is growing into his body. I think that the upside there is spectacular. I remember when we were talking about Cole Eisenman as a potential number two pick in this draft. And I was, you know,

Black Ox fans were like, we'd love to get him and have him in Bedard. And I was like, okay, well, like, who's going to, who's going to share the puck on that and that duo,

you know, like how they both want it, you know, so like you wouldn't, I don't think you'd ever have them playing together. I don't think it would make any sense. But. And Isamahs probably a second line winger anyway.

Exactly. I mean, and that's the thing is, he's got to prove that now. I think it's the more you watch, like, you know, obviously Cole's last impression was a world under 18s where he scored eight goals, but it was still like, even then you weren't feeling like super positive about where his game was at that point.

You go to the world, the evaluation camp, you're like, you know, he's going to have a lot of work to do. He's got, and I think part of it is, is there's going to have to be an approach change in his game. You don't want him to lose that scoring edge, but just, you know, it seems like when he's not impacting the game, he tries too hard and then does the wrong thing. So it's like there's a lot of different things that go there. So, you know, in the end, I think it's still way too early to say one way or the other.

I do think that they are players heading in different directions developmentally. You know, Cole, it's not that he's going backwards. It's that he's just kind of staying at a level that, you know, we wanted to see growth this year. other elements of his game that I don't think we did. I think we did see that kind of growth in Sasha Boehiver, who is now going to the University of North Dakota, where they're going to really maximize the way that he plays. They play that style that he really thrives in. And they play a much more NHL kind of game than most college programs do. So I think it'll be really interesting to watch. That's going to be a fascinating kind of question. There are obviously

players on a similar path right now. but with very different kind of ways that they play. I would have probably taken Eisenman. He was ahead of him in my list. I think he's a better player. I think he projects on the top six wing. I think Bois-Vare projects as a third-line center. I do think anybody who was ever going to take Eisenman

was always going to bite their tongue as they were announced in that pick for the reasons we've discussed ad nauseum over the last 12 months. But that being said, I still think he's a ton of skill. He's got a great shot. I think he's going to play in the NHL. I think he's going to score in the NHL. I think he's a valuable player in the right spot of the draft. I don't think if you look at Chicago's recent draft record,

you ever thought that they were going to be the team that's going to draft Cole Eisenman. I think if you look at every single four, they've drafted since Kyle Davis in his ticking over. Those fours all need to have speed and compete in bunches in order to be drafted. And that was definitely, and with Boyver, he checks those boxes, and Eisenman did not check those boxes. I mean, I think he's a good skater. I think he's a great skater. he's definitely not big and he's definitely not competitive.

So I don't think he was probably going to fit their criteria. And whether you agree or disagree with that is your opinion, but I don't think the way Chicago has targeted forwards that he would fit what they would tend to prefer in a draft pick. And I personally have some issues when you have such a rigid system in terms of criteria because I think you might get players that you value and that play a certain way that you value. Then I think three years go by and you look at,

Chicago's system that has had a ton of high picks in the last few years. And I have serious questions other than Carter-Bredart if any of these guys are playing on a power play in the NHL in five years' time. So that would have been my stance. All right. Next one is also talking about the 24 draft from Howris Rondack. What's the latest on why Zeev Bouillon fell in the draft? Well, going into the draft, I think we had talked about a lot how there was this top group of players, however many deep 10, 11, 12, 13. And we had discussed, at least I had plenty of times, about how there was not a consensus in the league on who was the top defenseman, who was the second best center in the draft. How will the top seven defensemen in this draft go?

You know, where does Demadov go? Where does Seleev go? I think those were all open questions going into the draft. And yes, well, and so there was always going to be a really, really talented player available in at 11, 12, 13 range of the draft. And it just so happened to be Zeev Boyum. Before the draft, I said it could be Zane Perret. I thought Zane Perrette could go 12 or 13. And if we just had, if Boyum goes nine, maybe Perak does go 12 or 13. And it's the same conversation.

You know, maybe, you know, I don't think a lot of us, but to Sam Dickinson to be available at 11. I think maybe one of the mock draft you did towards the end, we had him going in that, I had him going in that range. but that wasn't always an expected outcome. Maybe Yakimchuk would have gone into the teams. If you'd Berkeley Caton could have gone into the teens or a Gidla, one of those great players were going to be available late. And it just so happened that Boyam was the odd man out.

But in my post-draft research, I haven't heard of any medical flags. I haven't heard of any character flags. As far as I can tell, it was just the way the list worked out with the particular teams. going into the draft, I had thought there was a good chance one of the top Russian prospects were going to slide. I think in the last mock draft they did, I had Demadov going at 9 to Calgary, and I had Salehav going in the top 5. Because my hunt was, I thought one of those guys were going to tumble, and I happened to get that wrong. It was Saleh who tumbled and not Demadov, but there were plenty of teams in the league that had Saleh as a top 5 prospect. You know, just the way it works out that some teams have certain players in different orders.

And I really felt that if you would have reordered that draft order and just like a randomizer, that the order of the selections would have been wildly different in the top top. Yeah. Yeah. And I, you know, there's a couple of other things too that I think not just how the board worked, but, you know, like let's look at Calgary and specifically. Calgary is picking Perek over Vium

Not the way I would have done it But certainly they're their right to do it And they they if that's how their list was That's how their list was But I also say how is Calgary Who has lost Noah Hanofin Who has lost Johnny Gujarro Matthew Kuchuk

Routinely losing American players At the end of either at the end of their deals Or before or they're forcing trades out Or whatever happens How are they going to go? down that road again with a kid from San Diego, California. You know, like that's just like, and I also think that we will see there, to a certain extent, not the big market teams in Canada, Vancouver, Montreal, and Toronto, but in these

high leverage situations, these high risk picks, these high picks, I don't think they're going to be picking as many American collegiate players. Same thing with Ottawa, even though they have Brady Kachuk as their captain, you know, like those different things, there are factors that exist that would suggest, well, they should just do it anyway. But I do think, you know, I was in talking with scouts after the draft, there is a feeling of some kind of, you know, kind of just being a little gun shy about putting that kind of investment in a player that you anticipate you'd have for a maximum of seven years.

So it's just a real interesting dynamic. And so having those two teams in the top, you know, again, that pushes a player like William down where if it's close, go to the Canadian, you know, like that. And which, again, is an investment. It's a risk assessment on top of a player evaluation. So there's a lot of different things that go into it. I've heard that point, too, from some people in the league about Calgary and American players in regards to Boyham. And I'm fine with the, if it's close, take the Canadian argument. And it just like I am with Russian players in general. I think that's how most teams tend to approach Russian players too.

That being said, I also look at, like you said, Ottawa with Brady Kachuk and Jake Sanderson signed. You know, in Winnipeg, they can get Kyle Conner and Connor Hillebuck done there. I don't think it's impossible to get American players to sign long-term contracts in Canada, even without being in the big market cities, you just got to do a couple of things. Obviously, although Winnipeg is having issues with a record right now, is you have to, freedom well and that includes paying them and you might pay them more than someone else wants to pay them and also with the with the prospects you need to give them a clear path into your lineup I think that was one of the reasons why also you know Calgary did lose Adam Fox a long time ago

as they had a lot of deep prospects at the time and I think that he also was never going to play in Calgary so there's that no there was that too but I off by what I was going with that I think what's going on Rick Rorty in Winnipeg now is they have drafted a lot of wingers high in the draft I think. I'm not saying that's the only reason, just like with Fox not the only reason, but I think it's a compounding variable there. And, but I think if it's close, you could go the other way. But I think if you think he's clearly the guy, then you got to suck it up and find a way to make it work. All right. Next one is from Josh Python, who wants to know what the next step is, Corey, for the Montreal Canadiens rebuild. Obviously, they've got their number one overall pick in Urissevkovsky. They've got some talented young roster players in Suzuki and Caulfield. They just draft the flashy I have Demadov. What's next? So I think, you know, I like a lot of things going on the rebuild. Obviously, Slavkovsky looked really, really positive in the second half at the season. And I think he looks like he's going to, he's a guy trending towards being a star in the league.

I think you look at Ivan Demadov and you think this guy can be a star in the league as well. And then you kind of look at their current other roster players. And I think you can make a reasonable debate between Nick Suzuki and Cole Coughfield in terms of who is the better long-term asset. let's just say, for argument's sake, let's say you would argue Cole Caulfield in that instance. I think you can look at their rebuild and make a pretty reasonable argument that their three most talented players are all wingers in Slavkovsky, Demadov, and Caulfield. Maybe you put Suzuki into that argument.

We'll see how Kirby Doc does when he comes back this year, but I don't think he would elevate into that tier just quite yet. So when I'm looking at this rebuild, I think they have talent, and they're training in a good direction, but I do think there is still a pressing need to add elite talent at the premium positions here. We had this conversation with Montreal when it came to defensemen in this year's draft.

They have defensemen. Caden Goole is a really good player. David Reimbacher is a really good player. Lane Hudson is a really good player. I'm not sure any of them project as number one defensemen in the NHL or guys that you can lean on in all situations on a team that's going to win. So that's where I have that issues.

I like Nick Suzuki a lot. I like Kirby Doc a lot. I'm not sure any of them are number one centers on teams that are winning, despite Suzuki playing big minutes on that kind of miracles down the Cup final run a few years ago. So that's where I look at this organization in. And, you know, what's upcoming draft? I think you have some really good centers, obviously. You have James Higgins.

You have Anton Ferndel potentially coming down, Roger McQueen. Although I think the Roger McQueen, Kirby, Doc being on the same team would be kind of interesting. I think there's a lot of similarities there. And I think maybe Matt Schaefer could elevate to being the number one defenseman. I mean, we got a long way to go until we got to start having those conversations. But I don't think it's an insane conversation to have. I think Schaefer could be a top five pick in next year's draft. That would be for me the next big step to Montreal rebuild is they need more of the premium positions.

All right, Chris, rank these hockey skills by order of difficulty to improve on. skating puck skills hockey sense compete and shot and give you them again if you need them uh in how to improve them a difficulty to improve upon so like i think what he's getting at is like which one is the one that you can't replace if they don't have it come draft day kind of thing yeah yeah yeah i mean i i i think i think hockey sense is one of those things like it that it gets better with reps but it takes so much time to get better that i just don't, I think that that would be, if you didn't have it, you're not going to get it, probably at this stage. If you didn't have it at 17, 18, at least to some degree, you probably

aren't going to get it. Um, you know, and then on top of that, like, like things like hockey sense and compete, it's kind of one of those things where you can't really manufacture it, necessarily. Um, so, but I mean, you can certainly work harder and do all those things. But yeah, um, You know, I think we've seen that skating is improvable as well. So if I were to rank them, I would probably say hockey sense. I would say, um, uh, puck skills, skating. Um, shot and compete were the last two. Yeah, compete and then shot.

I mean, I think the shot is just, it's, it's another one of those things where you work on it enough. It'll get better. but yeah i would say that that that's how i would go how would you go core well it's this time of year that we always hear about guys getting faster everybody's faster now everybody's strong everybody's faster everybody's in the best shape of their life um but i don't know in my time doing this when it comes to skating i do agree that of the major traits skating is the one that can be improved the most but more than shot um i would say i don't conclude shot in the major traits but I would say, you know, like that's the one I think that can be improved the most,

but I think the degree to which it can be improved and the frequency by which is it can be improved is still pretty small in that like, you know, I can see a guy, like I say, you're going on a one to five scale. I can see a guy go from a three to a three point two five or from a three to like a maybe a three and a half if things go really really well but i can really tell you a really small number of instance where i saw a guy go from a three to a four or from a three to a four point five i mean because i think skating for the most part is tied to natural athleticism and the guys who i do think take massive steps forward have tend to have something really structurally wrong in their skating that coaching somehow finds a way to work out of them like i remember

with John Tavares talking to people who work with his skating, said they had to completely break him down and kind of reteach him how to skate, essentially, from how he was doing it in junior. But for the most part, I think if you're, if you can't run fast, you're not skating fast. I just think it's just natural athleticism for the most part. In terms of hockey sense, I agree with you. I think it's the hardest to get better.

I think a lot of, just like with skating athleticism, I think a lot of hockey sense is just tied to how intelligent a person is and not just intelligent as a human, but in terms of just their reaction speed and how quickly they make decisions. I also think it could be the most difficult to assess. So I think that's the one trait that I often change my grades on, not because I think a guy gets materially better,

but because maybe I mis-evaluated the trait. You know, I look at, say, this past year's draft, I have no idea of Dean Latterno is a smart player or no. I don't. I have no idea because that level he played at at the prep level in Ontario is just so bad that it's hard to tell whether he can make plays or not. I mean, he has a puck-all game. He's 10 times better than everybody else on the ice.

So he's going to go to school next year, and I'm going to kind of learn whether that's, you know, get better information anyways as to whether he has hockey sense or not, even though I do like the player a lot. I think he's, you know, a first-round caliber player, but I say they are with extreme reservations that if I undershoot the hockey sense, he may not be a first-round player. might just be a second, third round guy. If he gets to Boston College next year and he starts making plays left and right, he'll be like, holy hell, this guy might be like a lottery pick level prospect. All right, speaking of guys who have improved after their draft, you could argue Alexei Lafranier's skating would fall into that category. Jim wants to know how, if at all, has your last assessment of Lafranier changed,

given his playoff showing, especially against Florida? I don't know if it's improved that much. I just think with guys who have those skating, issues, it takes longer for them to adjust to the level because they need to bulk up. It's not, you know, they can't beat NHL defensemen with speed so they have to be able to win battles. And Alexi was not being able to do that as a teenager. And as time has gone on, as he's learned to adjust to the pace, I think he has shown that

he can be an impactful player because of his tremendous skill, a tremendous hockey sense. And he showed last year during the regular season, but especially the playoffs, that he can be an impactful forward. I still think looking at that draft, I would still take Tim Stutzla ahead of him. I think once Stutzla goes in a say redraft, and I think Alexi is right in that conversation. All right. Last one, we'll close with this from Rogue 5. Why does there seem to be a trend of players in the mid-20s outperforming guys taken in the early teens?

He lists Wyatt Johnson and possibly Yuri Kulich's examples. Chris, first of all, do you agree with the premise? I mean, Yuri Kulich hasn't played much in the end. NHL yet. So, you know, I don't know that he's outperformed. He's obviously had a great HL run. You know, so just on using that as an example, you know, just that's one thing I'll point out. But, you know, I mean, it certainly happens. I mean, the best players still are the guys that are picked within the, you know, the first bit of the draft. And then, you know, really, the separation between those players gets smaller and smaller the further down you go. And so, you know,

if you're talking about a guy that goes in the top 10 versus a guy that goes 25th, you know, there's always going to be things that happen. I mean, it's just the natural progression of players. You know, it's not something I've spent a whole lot of time on. But then, yeah,

I mean, you have your, your David Pasternak's. You have your different kind of players that, that outperform. But, I mean, I think that's just the natural progression of,

of players. I mean, there's so much, because players are drafted at 17 and 18 years old, you know, at this level, there is, so much more to gain.

And there's so much more that's unknown about a player. Like for Corey's example with Dean Latterno, we like, you are guessing, really you are guessing if, if that hockey sense is going to translate. I frankly don't think he should be in college next year. I think he should have gone to the USHL as was the plan, but Will Smith signs and then the spot opens up and VC's like,

well, you come in. I think it's going to be a struggle for him to adjust to the pace and the different things. And so, but then you still have to stay patient with that player because he still has, you know, possibly three years of school to prove that he's going to be better. So, you know, I don't think it's really necessarily a trend so much as it is the nature of drafting and developing. Different players are going to learn at different rates. You're making a projection based on that.

And what we find is that a lot of times those guys are still found in the first round. the fact that you're still getting those players in the first round as opposed to, you know, later in the draft is, is good, good on the scouts because it's actually hard to do that. But, yeah, so, I mean, it's a tough, it's a tough question to answer just because I think that the volatility of development is, is really a major factor that, you know, can't be overlooked. I would say, you know, with Wyatt Johnson, he's a pick we've talked about a lot. And we, you know, we talked about, you know, he missed his whole draft year. he didn't play the PowerPont at the A You're a general championship. I obviously liked the player. I thought he showed more offense.

Previously, we never thought it was to be this level of offense, yada, yada, yada. But what I think is most interesting about that draft that he went in is how that draft as a whole has aged in the three years since that draft, where that was really the year of the COVID draft. I know 2020 draft was abbreviated due to COVID, but I didn't have the stops and startages and didn't have leagues not playing for the

entire season. You didn't have to worry about players getting pulled out for weeks because of positive tests. And now you really look at that 2021 draft and how it's aged in the last three years. You know, the top players, the guys we've known about for years, Mattie Baneers, Owen Power, Luke Hughes, Simon Evanson, they've aged fine. They're still very good players. But like half of that first round looks ugly right now. There's a lot of players who, since they've turned pro, have looked average at best. And some of them look like very mediocre pro prospect.

And that is the draft in which Johnston went. And I think it just goes to show, you know, not really a hot take here by any means, how important getting a full draft season is in terms of evaluating these players, how important getting the full cycle of events and viewings is over the course of their junior careers. And, you know, obviously great pick by Dallas, great way of identifying him in Johnston. But man, there was a lot of players in that draft that went high. I do wonder that if we would have gotten a little bit more data on them,

if that draft, maybe Johnson, if he would have played a full draft, maybe he would have had 100 points in the OHL and he goes way higher. Where's he going to redraft? Top three? Yeah, I think so. I think that's, you know, probably for me, he's in that same. conversations with Maddie Baneers in terms of who's the best forward in that draft. Yeah, production is actually strikingly similar.

Baneers 103 points and 167 games, Johnson 106 and 164. Yeah, and I think Johnson has more skill, but Baneers is a better skater. I think long term, probably a better two-way player, but it would be close for me. Yeah, and Luke Hughes is going to get in that discussion real soon, too, the way that he's looked so far in his young career, not as a forward, but as a defenseman. Some might call him a forward some nights. Some nights, yeah, exactly. But I mean, like, you know, he's, there's a lot there.

But yeah, I mean, and it is one thing that Corey said is having the full cycle of events. That's another thing that we're still missing because the full cycle of events is no, like without Russia, it really is less, you know, prominent, I feel like. And we move, we lose that with Demadov, too. We talked, how much did we talk about, you know, well, we didn't see him against this. his own age group. We didn't see him, you know, all these different things. And because that's the thing is like, we, we believe that he's really good, but we're, we're just going off of the MHL, you know, and, and, and some preseason KHL games and things like that. So, um, it is important. And having, you always want more information, um, on a player. And, but yeah, Wyatt Johnson will forever

be one of those just amazing draft stories where, you know, I just, you just wonder how, how Dallas got that right and sometimes it is just luck right and i think it's also the player and the person that quiet johnson is that he continued to work and develop so um but man what a what a what an interesting thing to look on i i can't wait to see what 2021 looks like in like five more years and how many guys just just did not pan out at all i mean it's it's trending pretty poorly uh at this point so uh it'll be interesting to watch all right that's going to do it for us thanks to listen to this episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect series. You can of course catch more of Chris over at Flow Hockey and on his podcast talking Hockey Sense. And if you're a Spotify listener,

you can now leave comments on our episodes. So do that and do so on The Athletic as always. We'll talk to you soon.