The Athletic Hockey Show - World Juniors recap: US wins gold, David Carle’s future, prospects who impressed

Episode Date: January 6, 2025

The 2025 World Juniors have come to an end with Team USA taking their first ever back-to-back gold medal over an impressive Finland squad 4-3 in overtime. Max, Corey, Scott, and FloHockey’s Chris Peters give their thoughts on the tournament moments after the final buzzer and discuss who the best players were, a potential USA three-peat next year in Minnesota, David Carle’s NHL head coaching future, prospects who raised their profiles, and more.Hosts: Max Bultman and Corey PronmanWith: Scott Wheeler and FloHockey’s Chris PetersExecutive Producer: Chris FlanneryProducer: Chris Flannery Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Hey, everybody, Max Boltman here alongside the athletic Scott Wheeler and Corey Prondman and flow hockey's Chris Peters for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Gentlemen, all three of you in Ottawa, we are recording this minutes after the conclusion of the World Junior Gold Medal game, the United States winning its first ever back-to-back gold medals. Ryan Leonard named the MVP of the tournament. And, Corey, I want to start there because I didn't know who they would pick as MVP.

in this tournament. The U.S. had plenty of good players, but I wasn't sure if there was one true standout. Did you feel the same way? Yeah, I felt the same way. And we don't get to see the results of the voting for the All-Star ballots and the MVP. But I would guess if you actually looked at that, I think it would be one of the more divided ballots. You've probably seen in a while. I would guess Petri Rinpin, the Finnish goal, he got a lot of votes. I would guess Axel Sandin Pelica, Cole Hudson probably even got some votes there. There was no clear-cut, But Ryan Leonard was the best forward on the best team in the tournament. He carried USA on his back often with his skill, his pace, his physicality.

You can tell he was the leader on this team because the local fans here seemed to get on him every time he got near the puck. Whether it was scoring goals or taking a beating, he seemed to always be involved in the play. And I think he was a deserving candidate, but I don't think there was a clear deserving candidate. I think this was a tournament that, while still a very entertaining hockey and a lot of really good players who had great tournaments, I don't think it was a tournament where you saw like a true high-end display. You saw, you know, the stars of the NHL's future, essentially, as you typically would in this year's tournament. I thought there's, you know, some really good performances, but, you know, you didn't have, say, a Conradadadak type performance or even like a performance where you would see someone put up 20, 25 points or something along.

those lines. It wasn't that kind of tournament. The winning goal comes via Teddy Stiga, which I guess kind of makes this point. See, Boeum, one of the guys we expected to be a star for Team USA, sets it up with a really beautiful stretch saucer pass and three-on-three overtime. It was a hell of a finish. But Booiam didn't have that kind of tournament to really get that already. He played a lot of minutes, but to your point, it was Lane Hudson, or sorry, Cole Hudson, who was probably the best defenseman for Team USA, Scott. Yeah, I thought Cole was tremendous. I thought, Cole was right in the mix for the MVP, frankly. He made four or five electric highlight real plays in big moments for Team USA.

Reminiscent, frankly, and it's obviously one of the historic performances, but a little reminiscent of what Connor Bedard did for Team Canada and big moments in Halifax. Like, it just felt like when they needed a big play, Cole Eisenman scored a couple of big goals in this tournament. Obviously, Teddy Stiga, the golden goal. But they're not here without Cole Hudson. Like, that's the bottom line. They needed someone to step up beyond Zy,

Boyam on that blue line. They ended up putting them together for the back half of the game today and really leaning on the two of them as a pair once they started trailing. And I thought Cole was electric offensively. I thought he was excellent defensively, frankly, all tournament. And borderline their best player in terms of defending. He's a really strong skater. I think a better skater than Lane was at the same age.

He plays a more physical competitive style in some ways than Lane did at the same age. And my takeaway from this tournament, one of my big takeaways from this tournament is just that Cole is legit. Like I think we're talking about a very, very high-end borderline star prospect here. And I think he looks like he's on track to be a very, very talented NHL player. You know, it's funny that you kind of confused Cole with Lane Max and that I think when you watch them, there is just also many similarities from the skating style and how they use their edges, how they, you know, the weaves, the fakes, and the way they walk the blue line

and try and make plays. There are a lot of similarities. I don't know if, you know, I think this tournament might actually be the debate point because I think a lot of scouts would say that Cole's brain was not a special of lanes was at the same point in time, but I think that's going to be a debate going forward,

although Cole isn't quite having the year at BU, that Lane had at BU in terms of just production. But, you know, you mentioned Zee Boyam, and he didn't have the production, I think, at this year's tournament. but man, he was, I thought, just fantastic. I thought from the games I saw, he was the best defenseman in this tournament

in terms, just impact, just how he tilted the ice when he was out there. And it just felt like he never got his big moment really until the very end of the tournament when he made that play to set up Stiga. But it always felt like he was a half inch away from making some big plays. I felt like he had the puck a lot.

He was making scoring chances. He was creating things for himself. self and for others, and he just, the plays just weren't connecting. But I thought Hudson, Boyum, and Axel Sand and Pelica, for me, were the true standout defensemen in this year's tournament. You could argue other than Leonard, the best, in terms of those guys collectively, were the true standouts overall in this year's tournament. And, Corey, you made the point on our live blog that at one point in the second period,

David Carl put Hudson and William together. If you go look, that's right around where this game started turning. I believe it was 3-1 Finland at that point. That's right around where USA took. control of this game. Chris, you could probably speak to that too. Yeah, absolutely. I think that there was one thing that we talked about repeatedly going into this tournament was the fact that Team USA lacked depth on defense. They lacked clear puck movers. But when Zev Boull Buhiam and Cole Hudson were on the ice together, Team USA owned the puck

in a way that they had not in really any other game. And so that really did turn the tie of the game. It allowed them to control possession. They outshot the Finns in the second period, 15 to 4, I believe. and that's really where you started seeing it. So they needed that. And quite frankly, those guys didn't have a choice, but to step up. And they did. And I mean, really, this goes down as one of the great gold medal performances. And just Zee, Booiam, let's think about this right now.

Every single championship game, the kid has played in he's won, including conference championship in college, NCAA championship in college, under 18 worlds, two world juniors. Kid doesn't lose. And this time, he was one of the most significant players as a part of it. the amount of minutes that he played, that pass that he made. There was only one player that was going to get that pass. It was in the perfect spot.

And Teddy Stiga just right in the right spot for him to skate into it. So really impressive showing Team USA's top two defensemen. I mean, history making, both of them. I want to stick with you here, Chris, because you're so plugged in with Team USA. And we set it right off the top, their first ever back-to-back gold medals. Can you kind of put into perspective for people what that means for USA hockey? I mean, yeah, there was a time. Max, when USA was just hoping to medal at this tournament. And the tide turned in 2004. They won their first gold medal until in 2004. So it's really recent history, the last 21 years of USA having success at this tournament. They now have seven gold medals. And to go back to back, this was not only the first time they went back to back. It's the first time they've ever had the chance because they had never made it back to the gold medal game. And so, you know, it says a lot.

lot about the group. It says a lot about the fact they had a lot of returning players from the previous season. And it says a lot about the team that they did end up selecting because this was not an easy team to put together. Last year's team was very, I think, easy to put together. This one was not. They had to make a lot of the right decisions. They needed depth. And that's one of the things that I think came through today. They had all four lines going. In the third period, they extended the bench. They got guys like Austin Bernovic a ship. Having depth matters. And so you look back, They've continued to win. This is, what, three straight medals because you go back to the bronze in Halifax and then two golds.

That doesn't happen very often. So USA hockey has now gotten to the point where it is an expectation to win the gold medal. It is no longer a hope. And that's what we have really only been able to say about Canada for so many years. And now USA goes into every tournament believing that they can win. And I think that they've kind of gotten rid of some of the mystique that had existed before, that we are the underdog. Ryan Leonard was asked about being the underdog.

He's like, we're not anymore, so I guess we'll just have to deal with that. So it is an important thing. David Carl also spoke to the fact that demographics of the game continue to shift. More and more people are playing hockey in the United States. There will be some down years. There's going to be some, you know, we're looking at an under 18 year where it's one of the weakest teams we've ever seen at the National Team Development Program. This goes in cycles.

So I'm not saying that USA hockey. is the new dominant nation in hockey. But what it is showing at this level in particular, where it was so difficult to compete, they have turned that corner, even after they went away from the 97s and the 0-1s, the great birth years that had such tremendous talent, now they're doing it in other years as well.

So even when they don't have the best talent, that's when you know things are starting to turn because you have the depth to compete now. All right, before the break, Corey, Chris mentioned something. thing about the cycles that can happen for countries. And I think the obvious follow-up here is, after going back to back, does the talent line up that Team USA has a serious shot at a three-peat next year? They're the host country.

It's going to be in Minneapolis, St. Paul. What are their odds of a three-peat? Well, there's a couple of variables that players are always, isn't it? We don't know exactly who's going to be available. The big one will be James Higgins. You know, I think he's been very good in college this year. If I was advising him, I probably would advise him. what advised him to come back for another year of college where he can truly dominate the college level.

I don't think he's quite been at that level yet in the first half of the season, although we'll see how the second half goes from at Boston College. But even presuming that he is back, I think you look at this team, and there's going to be some really good depth on the wing. They'll have some good defensemen. I think in gold there'll be a minor question. Down the middle, there'll definitely be a minor question. Chris mentioned the NTP team this year, the 07s.

I think you talked to any scout. They'll say this is one of the weakest NTP teams that they've seen in a long time. And it's going to impact next year's team. I think it's really going to impact the following year's team. The 2007 USA team is really going to, I think, feel the tailwinds of this current group. By going to 26, you could still have Higgins. You could still have Cole Eisenman coming back. You could have Trevor Connolly coming back.

You can have Cole Hudson, one of the stars of this year's tournament coming in to play a big role in this year's tournament. You'll have Hensler coming back. You'll have probably E.J. Emery on the team. you'll have, you know, Stiga, Max Plant, Brody, Zemer. There's going to be a lot of returning players from this team. So even if they're not getting a lot of help from the 07s, I still think they have a decent jense. On paper, just looking forward,

it's really going to depend who's in the NHL. I think Canada's going to have a lot of candidates for guys who are going to be in the NHL next year. But they have a very deep age group, and I think they would be the clear favorite right now to just put it in their roster. see based on who's in the NHL, is Katie and Litcham or Roger McQueen come back from their injuries by then.

Those would be the question marks. I think you look at Sweden, you look at Finland. I don't think their rosters next year look overly strong. Quite frankly, I think the strongest roster and one of the constant surprises right now at the tournament would be Czechia. I think Czech is going to have a very nice team going to next year's tournament presuming health

for a lot of their top players. So I think USA could they win a gold medal? I don't know. I probably wouldn't call them the favorite. I think they will definitely be right in the mix Just as Chris said before. I've got a question for someone who I wonder if they'll be returning or if they'll be in the NHL next year, but it's a 35-year-old, and that's the head coach, David Carle.

And Scott, you had a tweet earlier tonight that kind of blew my mind. I knew all of this information, but to just see it like this, 35 years old, David Carl, two NCAA titles, two World Junior Golds. You might be the biggest question of if he's back with this team next year or if he is behind an NHL bench. Yeah, and he was predictably non-committal in postgame. I believe it was Kevin Dubay, one of the local reporters here who asked him, are you interested in coming back? Do you want to give it a go on home soil for the three-peat, which is obviously an even

rarer feat? And another thing that USA hockey has never done, and predictably he said, I'm just going to sit in this and we'll cross that bridge when we get there. But just in terms of the young coaches in the sport, if you were to do a poll entering this tournament of the top young coaches outside of the pro ranks, I think some of the names that would have come up were actually several who were involved in this tournament. It's David Carl. It's Sylvain Favre. It's Chris Lazzery. And two of those men were on a bench for a Canadian team that disappointed in a big, big way. Favreau, a little bit more removed from that as an eye

in the sky for Hockey Canada. But Carl just keeps winning. I remember speaking to him in advance of that first national title that they won in Boston and sort of going back to some phone calls that we had and some transcripts that we had before that tournament even started for just picking his brain on some of his guys. And you could just tell in some of the very early conversations I had with Carl when he was 29, 30 years old, that he thinks about it a little bit differently. Even this week, hearing him talk about the way that they practice, why they chose to practice, the decisions that they made about their lineup, bringing guys in and out of their lineup, very fluid outside of Drew Fortescue, sort of being stapled to Zev, William,

until the very end of the tournament and the top line, very fluid in terms of things that they tried. Cole Eisenman's buy-in as the 13th forward, that would have been incomprehensible a year or two ago in knowing Cole Eisenman and just the way that he operates and how unique of a cat he is. So it seems like all of the pieces are there in terms of NHL head coach category.

He's accomplished a whole lot. He's clearly a very intellectual coach. He clearly understands the X's and O's, but also just the buy. has been really impressive over the last two years. This was a very talented back-to-back age groups for him to coach, but he coached this team in particular in particular in a pretty unique way and seemed to get the most out of a very, as Corey alluded to off the top, a very complicated group. Yeah, I mean, I think this is kind of solidified, David, as the premier

prospect in all of hockey, in the coaching community. He is a winner. He has been a winner. He was bred for this. You know, you think about the fact that what he had to overcome, having his career end as a player at 18 years old through, you know, no fault of his own. He had a heart condition and that was it. What did he do? He immediately went to work and started on his next phase. That's somebody who loves the game, who's passionate about the game. And I remember him telling me and he's told this story before, so it's not unique to me, but he's told the story about how he didn't really believe. that, you know, what was next for him until he saw what his brother Matthew had said about him in a newspaper saying that whatever David wants to do, he's going to be great at it. And he didn't, you know, so somebody believed in him before he could believe in himself. Now you see him at this stage, two NCAA championships, two World Junior Championships. USA has gone to repeat coaches twice in their previous two gold medals. And they did not, they did not win. And so that is a pretty significant thing. David actually asked USA Hockey, this hasn't worked before. Why do we want to do it again?

What's different this time? What he didn't say, but what I'm going to say, he's different. That's the thing that's different. And so you look at the way that this game went to, and I think it's such an important, you know, Scott touched on this as well. The adjustments that were made, how bad they were in the first period, to where they finish the game, I think that has a lot to do with, coaching. And you look at, they have been in tight games. The NCAA championship was tight last year. He knows how to make the in-game adjustments. He puts his faith in the players. He lets his assistant coaches do their job and doesn't micromanage. And on top of that, he gets results. The players believe in him. They like him. Even like Cole Eiserman didn't play and he bought in. That's like, imagine being the top line player that you've been forever. And, and, and,

And the coach tells you you need to do this to win and you buy in that. I don't think every coach gets that out of a cool iceman, although he has matured as well. So pretty impressive stuff from David. And one thing I would probably want to add is that when you look at, you know, should, will David come back to be a world junior coach again? And will David even advance to the National Hockey League? Something to keep in mind is that the college hockey landscape is about to change

quite significantly going into next season with a CHL players coming in and recruiting about we become a massive thing for premier players with a lot of these major players like a Denver trying to compete for high-end talent. And that doesn't mean that that's a reason why he will stay or won't stay at the college level, but it is something in the background of any decision he's going to make. All right, guys, a lot of our listeners are going to want to hear about specific prospects here. So I want to ask you a couple questions, and I want to kind of just go around the horn with all of you. Let's start with Scott on this.

I want one guy who raised your evaluation of him for this tournament. And I'm going to take Cole Hudson off the table because I think everyone agreed with it unanimously at the very top. I'll go with Erics Matako with the Latvian national team. I've spent a lot of time learning about Erics. I know the staff in St. John really well. And I was a fan of Erick's game coming into this tournament. He's come a long way. They call him the moose in St. John because he was sort of Bambi when he first got there,

six foot five, six foot six kid who really struggled with his coordination. He didn't look like that at all in this tournament. He scored five of the ten goals that Latvia scored in this tournament, including both of their goals in a tight three two quarter final with the Swedes, nearly dragged them into their first ever semifinal, did drag them to their first ever tournament with two wins. I put them on my tournament all-star team in this tournament, and that's a very, very, I wasn't sure about it, but in sort of watching the way that this tournament played out, I just felt like he, despite not being in the semifinals, like he was deserving for how important he was to that Latvian team. This was their best team ever. And he was that,

he is one of the best players and had one of the best performances that that country has ever had at this tournament. And I think he looks like an NHLer. He was competitive. He played in the guts of the ice. He was around the net. He showed skill. His skating looks average, Frank. frankly, I think for the NHL at this point. I don't think it's an issue whatsoever. He played with good pace. Calm and big moments, including a shootout winner that doesn't show up in the sort of point tallies, but the shootout winner as well, obviously, against Team Canada and one of the biggest upsets in tournament history. So I'll go with Erics. The Capitals had a bevy of prospects.

We've already talked about Ryan Leonard and Cole Hudson, who played very well at this tournament. Peter So Ciccora played very well at this tournament. So it was a nice showing for a lot of the Caps kids, but I thought Eric's had a really, really positive tournament. It looks like he's got a real chance to be a bottom six NHLer. Chris, how about you? Who raised their evaluation? Yeah, I'm going to go with Edward Shala.

You know, he was awful last year, quite frankly. To put it, his draft minus one season or draft plus one season was bad. And this was a tournament where he really raised his stock in a major way. I think that he had six goals in the tournament. He scored the shootout winner that gave Chequia the gold or the bronze medal. And this is a continuation of what we've been seeing from him at the AHL level as well with Coachella Valley. And that's the thing that I think was important. He was the captain of the Czech team.

They go back to back. They beat Canada. He's scoring big goals in the most important games. He showed up in the biggest moments of many of these games. And so that was something where when games got harder and more physical, He faded. That is not happening as much anymore. He is able to get his, you know, kind of imposes will a little bit. He's not the strongest guy. He's not the biggest guy. But when he has chances, he finishes. That to me was one of the biggest things that I saw was

that he was taking this over a little bit more. And I've always been waiting for him to take charge and be the guy because he's always been able to defer to Yuri Kulich or somebody else on this check team. This was his team. He took that and he owned it. I feel much stronger about his pro projection now, not just because of the world juniors, but because of this entire season and where he's heading, I think he's heading towards being, you know, a guy that could one day challenge to be a top six NHLer, but I think it's still an outside shot of that, but at the same time, I thought there was no shot at that coming into the season. Corey, how about you?

I'm going to continue on the topic for Chequieu, who I don't think we thought of coming into this tournament as a team that was, you know, we thought they had a chance to upset teams, but we thought it would be an upset. And I think when we got to the end of this term, we thought Czechia could beat anybody. And they can beat him down because Michael Harabo, their goalie had a big term, but because this roster was very competitive.

They outplayed Canada. At times today, they outplayed Sweden in the bronze medal game. I think it's because some of these names, like Edward Shale, performed better than we thought. And I looked down the roster, a couple of guys really stood out to me, particularly on their second line, bullish tech Herodic,

who was a sixth round pick by Utah last summer. I think he's going to play in the NHL. I don't say it often for guys who were six-round picks six months ago. But watching him this season and watching him in this tournament, he's a six-four-setterman. He skates well. I think he provided a lot of offense for this team. He played 20 minutes a night for them.

First power play, penalty killing. He takes a lot of boxes. I'm not saying he's a sexy prospect, but I think he's going to play in the NHL. And then I look at Jakub Stansel, who was named to the tournament All-Star team. You know, Chris was talking about how bad Edward Shale's year was last year.

You know how, you know, and he was, I think about what he's a point per game and better than the OHL. Jakob Stonsa was a half point per game guy last season

in the Swedish J20 league as a draft plus one. And he's playing very well this year in the WHL. He comes here, not just gets the points, because sometimes you get points and then it's like phantom points

or whatever, but he was making plays. He was scoring big goals. He was imposing himself with his size and his skills. Skating's just okay. So I'm not saying he's a top prospect. But like,

the third round picked by St. Louis. Could I see him maybe be a bottom six forward for St. Louis in a few years? I think he at least has a decent chance to be on that trajectory. All right. How about one prospect from each of you who fell short of your expectations or maybe even lowered your evaluation of them at this tournament, Scott? I'll go with Easton Cowan. I feel like that's the low-hanging fruit after how much conversation there's been around Easton Cowan in this tournament. But I truly did, especially coming out of pre-tournament play where he was excellent and not just because he scored that hat-trick against

Switzerland, but I thought Easton played very well against the checks and pre-tournament as well. I thought he was going to be a big part of this Canadian team and a leader on this Canadian team. We heard ad nauseum about the 56 game point street coming in. We're talking about the reigning OHL most outstanding player, the reigning OHL playoff MVP, a player who stood out again at the Memorial Cup, the London came just short. It felt like his stock was just crescendoing and Christian doing and that there was maybe going to be this bubble that popped with Easton and then it popped abruptly and loudly at this tournament. I thought he really struggled with his play selection. He overshot. He looked off some clear passes and the big one that people

always zero back to is Oliver Bonk with a backdoor tap in that could have changed Canada's entire fate in this tournament. But even prior to that, forcing shots, a lot of wristers from the half wall just didn't look himself, some selfish penalties, frankly, some extremely selfish penalties. And the big question with Easton, I've spoken with Rob Simpson, the assistant general manager with the one of the nights about this and some others who've sort of coached and worked with him over the years. The big question about Easton has always been the decision making on the puck. He has the puck a lot in the OHL and has made a lot of mistakes in the last couple of years with the puck on his stick in the OHL. But you can't make those mistakes when the stakes are this

quiet and it just felt like it it became a little bit too much for him in the moment just the pressure to be a top guy the pressure to lead this team which was a disappointing team in a lot of ways and he just wasn't wasn't up to it and i think as a result he has taken at least a little bit of a hit in terms of just questions now about does he have does he have the IQ piece the decision-making piece is he may be the gamer that that everybody thought he was yeah scott you know i think yeah that is it was a tough one for for for for east although I will say it was a bit much on the vitriol on Twitter as we get so many times or wherever it is.

So people leave time. Yeah, let's not do that. But one guy that I actually thought had a nice point total but didn't necessarily rise to the occasion is a guy that just played in the gold medal game. That's Consta Hellenius. I think in the last couple of World Junior or last couple of international events that we have seen him in, he has not really delivered.

And part of the reason is he's not a consistent guy. He doesn't have a consistent effort level. He doesn't have a consistent approach to the game. He's a smart hockey player. When he is competitive, he is very good. But when he is not, he is very not. And that's my curiosity with him is that he can see it well. He can find plays.

He can make plays. But if he's not engaged, they have a hard time with them. Now, he's playing in the AHL this year. He's playing with Rochester. And I think that that is going to be a learning process for him. I think it's good that those sabres are taking that slower approach with him because he's going to need it. He's going to need more time.

He's probably going to need the full year and the HAL and probably more of next year before he's ready to take that jump. He did come to North America this year. But even though he had points in this tournament, he disappeared. into games all the time. And I thought that happened, quite frankly, today in the gold medal game. It was horrible. Yeah, there was just nothing there.

Helens was going to be the guy I was going to name just because I was out. No, no, you only apologize. Is that, you know, I didn't, I can't even think of time. I noticed him at all during this game. I think I can't even think of time to touch the pocket. I'm sure he got plenty of minutes. He was their first line centerman. It just, you know, he's a good player.

but when you're that size, you're not any elite skater, your compete level needs to be super high. And I just, I don't think he's soft or doesn't compete it, but I don't, I wouldn't call his compete level super high. No, or consistent, really.

And frankly, shocking after what he did in the league of playoffs last year and how he looked in the league of playoffs, the way that he's played at U-18 worlds and now U-20s, I don't think you can really knock him for men's worlds because he's the 17, 18, year old kid. But the way he's played at U-18s and U-20s now and back-to-back international.

events after the way that he looked in league of playoffs. I remember speaking with Oliokin shortly after that league of playoff that he had. And he was talking about him as their energy guy and their heart and soul and up and under sticks and leading their team in takeaways. And he scored and created a couple of big goals in league late last season right before the draft just through sheer will by stealing pucks and taking them to the net. And we watch him this week. He didn't score a single goal in the tournament. I believe he finished with seven assist in seven games, but just outside of the four assists night in the semifinal, and even in that game, I don't think he dominated in line with a four point night,

just gave us very little offensively. Yeah, I agree, Scott. When I'm going to the draft, I had his compete grade as a significant asset, and now I would probably waver on that and turn to change my evaluation. I want to name somebody different from my end, and he didn't play a lot, so I don't want to drag him too hard, especially since he's a young kid, but I thought after the year he was having the O HL. I thought Porter-Martin was going to make a difference for Team Canada. And his tournament started out really rough.

I thought the pace of the tournament seemed real fast for him. Like you saw, like, he just was forcing plays. It just seemed uncomfortable at a time. He was turning pucks over in the defensive zone. And ultimately, their coach, Dave Cameron, lost trust in him. Came back to him towards the end. It actually played him a decent amount in the quarterfinal against Chequette. But by then it was too late.

and just a very mediocre tournament. And I think you look at him, you look across, you know, at James Hagan's, who has such a major impact for Team USA. And I don't, and I think if the draft happened today, I think Matt Schaefer would be the first overall pick in the draft. But I think if you, after Schaefer, I think you started looking at Martone versus Hagan's, Martone versus Michael Mesa, or the other top players in this year's draft. If you just looked at Martone versus Hagan's, it wasn't even close in terms of the impact

at the tournament, although Hagan's only had, I think, one point against the top teams, but it was a massive goal today in the gold medal gave a huge second effort played by him. In just general, playing 20 minutes night, I'm centering the first line for a team that won the gold medal. I would guess a lot of teams, even though there's a significant size difference between the two of them, the fact that Hagan's skating is way better, he is a center, and he just rose to a much higher level here. I would guess a lot of teams have Hagan's ahead of Martone right now.

Yeah, and I would be one of the people that, I mean, I've been ahead of them. And what I saw from James Hagan's in this tournament, yes, the points weren't necessarily there. But as you mentioned, he had that goal. That was a goal he could not score a year ago. He couldn't make that power play, that power move to the net, eat a guy, outmussel him, and will that puck over the line. The other thing, too, that I thought we saw from James in this tournament throughout, very decisive with the puck, calm with the puck, poised, made a lot of plays,

got pucks to open ice and wasn't just a passenger with Leonard and Perrault who have been together. I thought he could drive a little bit more. He let those guys do their thing without getting in the way. But I thought, Higgins, that's definitely a takeaway for me, is that Higgins did what he needed to do in this tournament. Honestly, I thought he was a second best player on that line. If he really wanted to go into maybe mild disappointments, I thought Gabe Perrault would probably be he was good. I thought he could dominate and I didn't really think he rose to that level quite. I thought Hagan's after Leonard was a second best player, aren't lying.

On the goal note, too, I'm speaking with a few scouts this week and a couple in advance of this week, one of the most common refrains I heard when talking about, I was going to do a piece on Schaefer, and Merton and Hagen's, which never materialized after the Schaefer injury, but one of the common refrains of that was a desire to see him score more and to just put the puck in the net more. He hasn't actually put the puck in the net a whole lot early on. this season. You think he's got five goals and 20 points through 16 games with BC. And so to just see him have what was a five goal tournament in the end, I think was important. And the way that he scored the fifth of those five goals, just by going to the net, the second

effort, I think that was important as well. And now he's got to go back and have a big second half and do more of that. All right. Final thoughts here, guys, before we sign off from the World Juniors, any burning thoughts on anything else we haven't addressed today? I believe that's the least we've ever talked about Team Canada on a World Beacon's podcast. Yeah, I think that's kind of the story of this tournament for me was that it was a great tournament, really entertaining medal rounds and some really good games. But I didn't come away, as I said, the very start of this podcast, coming away, seeing I saw the stars of the NHL, the future stars of the NHL, and I think a large part of that just because how disappointing Team Canada was.

And even though they have some high-profile prospects on that team, like Schaefer and Porter Martone, Berkeley Cannon, Gavin McKenna, Sam Dickinson, all guys who were having great junior years, and we think are going to be really impactful NHL players. They just didn't really play that well, or frankly, play that long in the tournament. So that really impacted, I think, my perception of just how many of these guys were going to go on to become really impactful NHL players.

I think there's a couple on Team USA. You mentioned the BC Kids Z. Boyum. maybe now at Cole Hudson. I'm not sure I get all the way there with him, but I think definitely Boyham and maybe you have a stand in Pelican on Sweden. We'll see, you know, is he next Neal's Lunkfist or is he going to rise and be something special in the NHO?

We'll see, but that's kind of the takeaway for me is I saw good players here. I don't know if I saw great players in this tournament. Yeah, you know, my takeaway from this is that there were, while we didn't have the stars of the NHL, like you said, I think we came away with a lot of different personalities to know, players that we know more about now, and players that we're going to remember, quite frankly.

You know, Scott talked about Eric Smetako having this tremendous tournament. When we asked Eric's Mateco, how would he describe the tournament in one word? He said, Feldbergs. And so Linnards Feldbergs coming back, going back to back against Canada and the USA, stopping over 90 shots in between those two games. and the warrior mentality he had. He also made Sweden work for it in the quarterfinals as well. So Lopia was a team that, you know, we're going to remember, obviously,

they won two games for the first time ever in this tournament. Beat Canada. You know, Feldberg's had eight saves in that tournament. You know, Finland's goalie, Petrie Rimpinen. I mean, that kid did everything he could to will that team to a gold medal. You know, they call him Mr. Showtime, and he was absolutely. that. You know, getting beaten on a breakaway and overtime, you really can't put that against him, especially when he stopped Ryan Leonard, not, you know, just before that as well.

Finland barely had the puck in it. They really did. And so, you know, those are the moments, you know, Trey Augustine becoming the all-time wins leader for Team USA. And really not, he, he helped kind of steal them, not really steal them the game, but, I mean, they needed him to be awesome against Czechia and he was. You know, they needed him to be awesome against Canada, and he was. He was pretty good today. I don't think it was his best game, but, you know, seeing that. So a lot of very interesting things. You know, Teddy Stiga is scoring on the only goal, only shot he took all tournament, or only shot on goal he got on tournament. We had an IHF record shootout today.

That's right. That's right. So all this crazy stuff. I'll say I missed opportunity for Sweden as well. Oh, yeah, for sure, for sure. Especially with Canada being knocked out or does not having the greatest team. We thought going into the mound, it could be any one of those four between Sweden, Finland, Czechia and the U.S. who could win this tournament.

And Sweden, you know, often talked about the lack of gold medals. It felt like the door was wide open for them. They weren't the favorite, but they were very much in that mix. And this could be the year where they can kind of get that monkey off their back. And monkey remains right there. Another 4-0 round robin for them that results in nothing from their whole ice last change all the way through all of it. I changed my pick to them for gold mid-tournament.

I was that impressed with how they were through pool play. And then, you know, it's always the fins. The fins just get you. They do. And that's how they roll. And it was, I mean, it was kind of amazing. So pretty impressive stuff as they continue to break down the arena around us. All right.

That's going to do it for us. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. You can catch more of Chris over at Flow Hockey and on his podcast called up. We'll talk to you soon.