The Bechdel Cast - Bad Boys (1995) with Laci Mosley

Episode Date: January 23, 2020

Bad Girls Caitlin and Jamie plus special guest Laci Mosley chat about Bad Boys (1995). (This episode contains spoilers)For Bechdel bonuses, sign up for our Patreon at patreon.com/bechdelcast.Follow @DivaLaci on on Twitter. While you're there, you should also follow @BechdelCast, @caitlindurante and @jamieloftusHELP  Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th 2017 was assassinated. Crooks Everywhere unearthed the plot to murder a one-woman WikiLeaks. She exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. To listen to new episodes one week early and 100% ad-free, subscribe to the iHeart True Crime Plus channel, available exclusively on Apple Podcasts. In California during the summer of 1975, within the span of 17 days and less than 90 miles, two women did something no other woman had done before, try to assassinate the president of the United States. One was the protege of Charles Manson.

26-year-old Lynette Fromm, nicknamed Squeaky. The other, a middle-aged housewife working undercover for the FBI. Identified by police as Sarah Jean Moore. The story of one strange and violent summer, this season on the new podcast, Rip Current. Hear episodes of Rip Current early and completely ad-free and receive exclusive bonus content by subscribing to iHeartTrue Crime Plus, only on Apple Podcasts.

There's so much beauty in Mexican culture, like mariachis, delicious cuisine, and even lucha libre. Join us for the new podcast, Lucha Libre Behind the Mask, a 12-episode podcast in both English and Spanish about the history and cultural richness of lucha libre. And I'm your host, Santos Escobar, emperor of Lucha Libre and a WWE Superstar. Listen to Lucha Libre Behind the Mask on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you stream podcasts. individualism the patriarchy's effin vast start changing it with the bechdel cast bad boys bad boys what you gonna do what you gonna do when they come for you bad nope bad oh wait hang on sorry let me let me start again bad girls bad girls what you gonna do an all-female what you gonna do when we come for you oh my god kaylin i would i just like i was gonna join him but then you were doing such a good job so i'm like she's she's got it she's got a star is born

yeah that was your oh okay so here we are we are the bad girls we. Yeah, we're the bad girls this time. But we're here to talk about the bad boys because we weren't given a choice. Right. Welcome to the Bechdel cast. Yes. My name is Jamie Loftus. My name is Caitlin Durante.

And we are the bad girls. And that's what we're going to, when Alison Bechdel inevitably sues us, we'll change the name of the podcast to Bad Girls. I'm honestly surprised that the sequel for Bad Boys for Life is actually not a reboot that's an all-female, like, Bad Girls reboot. It's the trend. It's the trend. But, you know, they had to make cops cool again at the politically advantageous time to reboot this franchise.

So what can you do? And, I mean, plus the chemistry between Will Smith and Martin Lawrence. I mean, I want Martin Lawrence to get as many checks as humanly possible. what can you do and i mean plus the chemistry between will smith and martin lawrence i mean i want martin lawrence to get as many checks as humanly possible i love him so much oh man martin lawrence formative crush oh really yes but but wait what is the podcast i don't know i forget we talk about the representation of women in movies and how it usually doesn't do a very good job it doesn't see this movie. Yeah, because we just talked about men for two minutes.

Right. We use the Bechdel test as a jumping off point for discussion. The Bechdel test being a media metric invented by Alison Bechdel, sometimes called the Bechdel-Wallace test, that requires that two female identifying characters with names talk to each other about something other than a man. Can this movie do it? I was honestly on the edge of my seat. I mean, we'll talk about it, but there's a conversation to be had. I was shocked.

And so to all those haters out there who are like, do they just spend an hour trying to figure out if it passes the Bechdel test? No, we know going in. We usually have the answer. Yeah. So we are talking about Bad Boys 95. We have a guest. You know her.

You love her. Is this time three? Third time. Yes. She's an actor, comedian, host of Scam Goddess podcast. And she's been on the show twice before on our 10 Things I Hate About You episode and What Women Want. It's Laci Mosley.

Hey! Welcome back. I'm so happy to be back. I love this pod. We love you. I love all your fans. They're so nice. I mean, you're a fan favorite.

You do have the nicest. So, welcome. I love you back. I love you guys back. I'm happy to be here. Yay! And for bad boys. For bad boys. I love you guys back I'm happy to be here for Bad Boys we were thinking about doing Bad Boys

because the franchise as Caitlin was alluding to is being is it being rebooted if it's the same cast I think it's just continued I've seen a little bit of the script I can't say everything I actually turned down audition for this movie not to flex.

I was really tired. But I was working on something else and I got the audition and it was just a character that just wasn't me. It was like a badass with tattoos and like nose weapons. And I went into like I was self taping because I was shooting in Georgia. And I did the tape like six times to the point of exhaustion. And then I asked the guy who was taping, I was like, if you were me, would you send this tape? And he was like, no. I was like, you right.

Thank you for your honesty. Thank you for your honesty. I like the truth. I was like, you know what? And I won't. But it's so it's just like the third installment of this. So it's not necessarily a reboot. It's just like they made the third one very, very far away from the second and first.

They just took a long break. I mean, it's sort of like the Before Sunrise trilogy because they're almost like, they're like eight years apart. Because the first one was eight years after, or the second one was eight years after the first one. And then this one is, however, like over a decade after that. 17 years after. So they're Yeah. And then this one is, however, like over a decade after that. 17 years after. So they, you know, they're in and out, the bad boys.

They got a story to tell every once in a while. And this is their most recent story. And I guess that one of the credited writers on the new bad boys is Sally Field's son. Oh, a word. So big win for nepotism. I always love a good nepotism pick you're just like because nepotism rarely wins i i just am like who nepotism should be like a category at award shows right who did nepotism best daughter of a actor in a lead. Who did you not realize had a recognizable last name?

Is it Maya Hawke? I think Maya Hawke's one of the new nepotisms. The new nepotisms. That's my show I'm going to write. Well, sometimes it gets switched up because Judd Apatow's daughter doesn't have the same last name. Or does she? I know. I don't like a sneak attack of nepotism.

She doesn't have the same last name. Hold on. I got to go with it. Does she? No, she does. It's Maude Apatow. My bad. That one's very clear. I have the same last name. Hold on. I gotta go. Does she? I like sometimes. No, she does. It's Maude Apatow. My bad. Oh, okay.

That one's very clear. When the nepotisms sneak in on you, I'm like, I, how dare you? I mean, Jennifer Aniston, daddy was an actor. Yeah. And that snuck in on us because we really didn't. I didn't know that. Yeah. Damn it.

Well, then you got like Nick Cage who changed, who was Nick Coppola And then changed his name Because he's like I don't want nepotism Well he Yeah but it's like But we knew already Anderson Cooper Is a Vanderbilt

Yes Oh what Oh That old Nasty money honey There's like a documentary About him and his fancy fancy mommy Because his mom's Gloria Vanderbilt

Yes It's like the fanciest And it's You're just like oh no i love it i love it if i had that last name look flaunted don't be out here trying to be like i earned my stripes bitch please there's no way in hell even if you change your name bitch you can't change your area code you can't change your family connections you might as well just listen if i was lacy winfrey you would know it everywhere i went i'd be like don't make me call my mama don't make me call Oprah okay everywhere I went Lacey Winfrey I'll be at the Starbucks Lacey Winfrey

two pumps of vanilla bitch don't you forget it did you ever have the Oprah chai at Starbucks I've had the Oprah everything my mom has an Oprah room in her house oh my god I'm not even kidding that's wonderful yeah I loved the oprah chai so much i didn't have it tasted the same as the regular chai but i just richer but richer i paid 40 cents extra just for that just for the name so i'll give you a hug from a woman with large breasts and also caffeine that's what the oprah chai feels like okay so uh back to bad boys uh lacy what's your history relationship with this movie? I mean, I loved all the Bad Boys.

So, you know, I mean, it was a great time for black people in cinema. Big action films, lots of baddies. Loved Gabrielle Union in one of them. Bad Boys 2. I'm into it. I've been into Bad Boys. So watching it again with this eye for feminism, you know, I was very nervous because I was like, oh, I can't. Don't put a bad taste on my bad boys so watching it again with this eye for uh feminism you know i was very nervous because i was like oh i can't don't put a bad taste on my bad boys yeah i was really rooting for it i mean there were moments where i was pleasantly surprised but but also for the time period though

i feel like it was doing a lot more than the time period was doing in context and I'm this is the last time I'll jump to the defense I promise but for Michael Bay we've seen much worse that's what I was gonna say we've seen much worse from Michael Bay yeah but it's also not that's not a fair yardstick no it's it's totally not oh okay uh Jamie what's your history i saw bad boys 2 at a drive-in movie theater when i was 10 i really liked it didn't go back to get the other vhs this is the first time i've seen the first one i've seen the second one before i don't know like i all my cousins really liked bad boys and i knew the song but it was another one of those things where my family was kind of like that's not a movie for girls boys is in the title so so like if if i had

i would have had to really make an effort to to see the first one just because if boys was in the title i wasn't going to be able to see it really but uh yeah i saw it at the drive-in liked it and and for all of this movie's faults caitlin you admitted it in the text thread too it's a fun wrong it's a fun wrong fun rom I was not bored Which is saying a lot because the movie That Michael Bay makes after this The Rock a lot happens and I'm so bored So this movie is

The performances are solid The chemistry I'm telling you The chemistry they're on fire the whole time So yeah it's good I had never seen any of these movies Until prepping for the episode i watched bad boys one twice i watched the first half hour of bad boys two didn't finish it in time before we had to start recording and uh yeah that's my very short history but like i said it's

i never thought i would sort of like a michael bay movie and yet here I am. I'm like, this is fun. I didn't realize it was a Michael Bay movie until we were starting to prep for it. I don't know whose movie I thought this was, but this is also Michael Bay's first movie. Yeah, directorial debut for a feature, yeah. I realized it from the shots. It's definitely a movie that you need to watch in theaters

for it to make sense. Because on your television. Boy oh boy. All those slow circular camera pans. Angle up to the sky. You know. He goes full corny so many times. So many times.

I'm really excited for Context Corner for this. Because I have a bunch of quotes about the production of this movie. And as with all Michael Bay projects. It's like. You can't imagine uh but but yeah just like how he like orchestrates somehow the corniest possible shot every single time we're like suddenly will smith is shirtless why is he's like running and then his chest is just out there's a whole story story. I'm very excited. All right. Well, should I do the recap? Yeah. Is it time?

Okay. Mike Lowry. That's Will Smith. And Marcus Burnett. That's Martin Lawrence. They are cops in Miami. It's very yellow at the beginning. It's very nice.

Or Michael Bay. Is that like a Michael Bay thing? I guess I just think of them as on fire right he he does a lot of like post-production coloring of his footage but they're driving around and then some criminals try to carjack mike lowry's car marcus fat shames one of them and then uh but here's the thing they're bad boys so they stop the criminals or is okay bad boys and they say so they okay early on for a minute i was like wait are they the bad boys or does the bad boys refer to the bad guys that the cops are trying to capture i wasn't

super clear on that they're the bad boys they are the bad boys for life they're the bad boys for life you're right it took them 25 years to admit it but they're the bad boys for life so they stop the bad guys not to be confused with the bad boys the bad boys are the good guys yeah but the bad guys are the bad guys yeah okay i get it so then we learn more about uh marcus and mike marcus has a his wife theresa and boy is she his wife oh boy here's what we know about this woman she is his wife wife and he wants to have sex with her but she's mean frigid she's a fridge you don't want to have sex you know how wives be uh her name is teresa at least we know her name we know what her name is what does she do all day god only knows simply don't know um and they have three kids together but mike lowry on the other hand he's a bachelor womanizer playboy who has a lot

of sex with the ladies and that first scene where he goes to Martin Lawrence's house and then he's like, hey, kids, want to hear about this lady I fucked last night? And then the wife is like, no. And we're supposed to be like, oh, she's such a buzzkill. You're like, no, don't. They're like small children. They weren't teenagers.

Come here, little eight-year-old. You want to hear about this ass I got into last night? Like, what? The kid was like, like uncle mike did you go on a date he's like oh i went on a date you're like no make this stop right now oh yes okay so then we cut to the bad guys again not to be confused with the bad boys the bad guys are breaking into somewhere and stealing something. And now things are very blue. Then Marcus and Mike, a.k.a. the bad boys, they head to work at the precinct. And it turns out that the robbery that we just saw was heroin being stolen out of their evidence locker. At least it's not DVDs.

I thought it might be something really silly like the first Fast and the Furious where they're like, DVDs were stolen. Bodies were rolled. It's like many millions of dollars worth of heroin. Yeah. And it was from Mike and Marcus's biggest drug bust. Joey Pantoliano is their police captain. And then this other captain, a woman.

Watch out. Alison Sinclairlair another captain i loved all 45 seconds of that she is like breathing down joey pants's neck and she's like this might be an inside job figure it out before the press gets involved so then the bad boys start trying to figure out who stole the drugs and they go to this boxing gym where a woman named max she like mike lowry is like hey max let me know if you hear anything on the streets and she has a crush on him so she's like okay and then she's like, yeah, we'll see. Anyway, she dies. Right. Yeah.

Then they go to this rich guy's house. And he, I think, was the one who installed the ventilation system that the bad guys snuck through to steal the heroin. When they get inside the house he's dead so mike and marcus who reminder are cops they just start rifling through the crime scene getting their fingerprints everywhere before any sort of like crime scene photos are taken you know just spoiling the whole thing also lots of banter about the dead guy yes they keep it funny when there's a body in the room. You know? Like, let's keep it light. Yeah, like Martin Lawrence is like,

oh, it's stinky, I don't like it. Yeah. He like almost pukes all over the body. We're supposed to be like, why you gotta act this way every time we round a dead body? You know every day we be dead, nigga. Like, what? Why?

And then they just have a banter, and I'm like, this man is dead here. Okay. Yeah, okay. So then, Max, who we find out is a sex worker and her best friend julie that's tayleone go to a guy's house because max thinks that he might be in on this like drug heist thing and then he brings out a package of the heroin on a platter. And we're like, oh, yes, he is in on it. But then suddenly a bunch of bad guys show up and they shoot and kill Max.

After a long monologue and lots of like making them dance around. It was like, if you were going to kill everybody in here, why you got to talk so much beforehand? They're going to die. And before you die, let me tell you this. Like what? They could be dead. Just kill them and go right but then okay so julie who had gone to the bathroom and missed out on the killing spree witnesses all of this and manages to escape escape on her own on her own i was like okay

michael bay movie yeah you got to do thing yeah okay it's surprising yep so now jump in a pool right so now the bad boys have to figure out who this witness is and they have to find her but she calls them first but and she wants to talk to mike lowry because her friend max had like talked him up so much yeah but he's not at his desk and she's like well i only want to talk to mike lowry so then marcus pretends to be mike over the phone the weirder plot points in the movie because it like they could have bailed on this lie pretty early on and probably like with no consequence right i think it seems like it wouldn't with it right they really like keep doubling down on it. It's funny, but why? You gotta trick a woman.

It's the 90s. What do you mean? Every movie in the 90s is about tricking a woman. They're just doing it to do it after a while. Yeah, it becomes this weird Shakespearean comedy of errors thing. We're like, okay, fine. It's weird. It's weird, but it's a michael bay movie anyway right so then marcus

goes over to her apartment still pretending to be mike lowry and the bad guys show up he helps her escape this time then marcus she refuses to go anywhere for protective custody except for Mike Lowry's condo so which is like hard to trace the logic there I think maybe because her best friend trusted him yeah also the guy who got murdered in the heroin thing, who was also a criminal, was a cop. So she was like, oh, the cops are dirty. I can't go there. They're gonna give me up. So let's go to your house, Mike Lowry.

Okay, she makes sense. You have to say his name. That's how all black people say his name. Mike Lowry. Mike Lowry's season. So now they gotta do this whole switcheroo where Mike has to pretend to be Marcus and stay with Marcus's his wife and they don't but they do for some reason and then Marcus stays at Mike's place pretending to be Mike and he's protecting Julie the witness then

he starts showing Julie mugshots to see if any of the people are someone that she recognizes as one of Max's killers. And there's this one guy that she does recognize, Noah. So then Mike and Marcus go to a nightclub called Club Hell. You know it's lit. That was a big one for me i loved it and it and it follows through on the name that club i can't wait scary yeah i mean there's like brown piss in the urinals like who goes here there are like bodies hanging from the ceiling that are wrapped in aluminum foil that's where you go when you want something bad to happen to you. That's where you go when you have a death wish.

Y'all trying to get Natalie Holloway tonight? We're going to club hell. There's also like this giant fish tank that serves as a window into the men's restroom. Okay. But to be fair, if there's not a fish tank at the club at the movie are you even at a club at the right and then also what are they gonna smash into yes that's true you gotta break the fish tank that's the rule that's the rule of fish yeah that's the new rule rule of fish so they're at club hell to look for noah the bad guy and julie decides that she's

gonna go to and she brings a gun that she gets i guess out of mike's apartment and the bad guys and the bad boys they all spot each other there's there's this big fight that breaks out then there's a car chase the bad boys and julie get away once again but they still don't have any real leads then there's this whole thing where like Julie pretends to be horny for Marcus and then she's like wow Will Smith is so hot and then it leads to this misunderstanding where Marcus thinks that Mike is having sex with his wife it's all so unnecessary and then they have a fight this is. In a kiddie pool. Right. Because the thing about Mike and Marcus is that they're bad boys for life,

but they also fight a lot. They have so much testosterone. My favorite part of that is when they finish the fight, a gun slides out of the kiddie pool, so they've been fighting like armed. They could have killed each other. I never even thought of that.

They were just wrestling with guns. Yeah. Uh-huh. So masculine. I won even thought of that. They were just wrestling with guns. Yeah. Uh-huh. So masculine. I won't date a man who hasn't wrestled once with a live firearm. Okay. So then. That is ridiculous.

So they're still trying to figure out who was behind stealing the heroin and like what they planned to do with it. Then Marcus's wife, wife his wife shows up and she's mad at marcus for lying to her about going to cleveland but it's still framed like oh she's such an obstacle right exactly she's why is she so mad believe the lies i told you theresa why god but then this also means that the jig is up and Julie now knows that Marcus was lying about being Mike Lowry.

Just then the bad guys show up again. Another gunfight ensues and the... We gotta damsel this Taylor. Yes. We gotta damsel her. They kidnap her and they get away with her. Because she's emotional and that's why she decided to become a damsel. Mm-hmmsel she was so smart the rest of this time and now she's like i'm just

gonna walk the streets by myself because i'm mad at you cops right right bye her excuse her excuse is like well if marcus's wife can find us then the bad guys can find us too and it's like that doesn't track i don't think like marcus's wife would know where mike lowry lives anyway so they've kidnapped her and they're getting away so now mike and marcus only have a couple hours before the big deal goes down and suddenly there's another important female character francine she is i think like a secretary yes at the precinct i thought they were maybe a little mean to fran they were a little hard on francine because francine they the the bad guys go to get information from her and they're like we'll kill your son if you don't give us the information so obviously she gives it to them

and then she reports this to mike and mike's like okay like he's like he's like what what choice did she have will smith yeah she's being blackmailed i think with like photograph they like nude yeah they took nudes of her and then they were threatening to post them at her son's school oh so they weren't even threatened i don't even think they were threatening to get so it was like a horny blackmail and also very low-stakes blackmail in the 90s. Because like how far could you get with some nudes online? You know? It's not like now we can put them on Twitter.

Back then it was like old timey. Like what did you have to scan them into the computer? You're going to scan a Polaroid of me to my son's school? I Xeroxed this Polaroid. That's worth committing felonies. Yeah, they should have tried to kill the son. That makes more sense. Oh, maybe I was just...

You were trying to sympathize with her. I was just trying to... Yeah, okay, that's... She was like, they said they was going to upload my Fuji nudes. My grainy Fuji nudes. Yeah, that's Francine. She, so, but like, yeah, she's been blackmailed. So she was like giving the bad guys some information,

but then she helps out Mike and Marcus and then they know where to go now. So they go to this airplane hangar because that's where like the big, the drug deal is going to go down. Then there's another big fight. And I honestly stopped writing the recap here. so i don't totally remember what happens i feel like they just they win and then they rescue julie and everything they rescue her they're fine then will smith is able to

say i love you to martin lawrence which is his i kind of actually really liked that little arc anyway over a dead guy's body also over Over a dead guy's body and really not concerned about it. That's where their moments happen. Over a dead guy's body, Will Smith is like, I love you, my friend. And he's like, wow. And then Taylor Leone is like,

am I cool? And they're like, yes. And there's a dead man there, though. Cool. And then Martin Lawrence handcuffs Will Smith to Tay. And then he's like,

I gotta go see my wife, Teresa. I got to go have sex. And now at last, I'm going to fuck my wife, who as far as we know, is still mad at him. Right. So, and that's the end of the movie. All right, cool. Bad boys, bad boys. What you gonna do?

What you gonna do when they come for you? Let's take a quick break. Yeah, let's do it Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th 2017 was murdered there are crooks everywhere you look now the situation is desperate. My name is Manuel Delia. I am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhearts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks. Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. And she paid the ultimate price. Listen to Crooks everywhere on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. To listen to new episodes one week early and 100% ad-free, subscribe to the iHeart True Crime Plus channel, available exclusively on Apple Podcasts. This summer, the nation watched as the Republican nominee for president was the target of two assassination attempts, separated by two months. These events were mirrored nearly 50 years ago,

when President Gerald Ford faced two attempts on his life in less than three weeks. President Gerald R. Ford came stunningly close to being the victim of an assassin today. And these are the only two times we know of that a woman has tried to assassinate a U.S. president. One was the protege of infamous cult leader Charles Manson. I always felt like Lynette was kind of his right-hand woman. The other, a middle-aged housewife working undercover for the FBI in a violent revolutionary underground.

Identified by police as Sarah Jean Moore. The story of one strange and violent summer. This is Rip Current. Available now with new episodes every Thursday. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. mental health or figuring out what you're truly here to do. This week, I welcomed back Dr. Andrew Huberman, a neuroscientist and professor at Stanford University, known for his insightful

work on brain development, neuroplasticity, and the intricate connection between the brain and body. Letting go and not trying to control everything, but also pushing oneself to be more resilient and tenacious and things of that sort. I feel like all of life is like that. All of life is about, yes, you need to take care of your physiology. You need to get your sleep at night, but it's also okay to get a bad night's sleep every once in a while. It's okay to not do every protocol. In fact, it's encouraged to not do every protocol. The expectation on us is not perfection, right? It's being able to toggle between these different states. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Trust me, you won't want to miss this one. And we're back. We're back and we're bad. We're back and we're bad boys. We're

back. We're bad. We're boys. Can I do a little bit of context corner? Please. Yes. Okay. Okay. context please yes okay okay so this is michael bay's directorial debut he has directed some music videos at this point he's famously directed a meatloaf that music video and so he's coming in and but even though it's his first movie he's very confident about his ability to direct this movie so there is this great i think we talked about it in The Rock and Trance. This is the third Michael Bay movie we're covering. And that's maybe something that we should keep in mind about our dignity. That's true.

But so we've used this article a bunch, but it is an oral history published in GQ in 2011 called An Oral History of Michael Bay, the most explosive director of all time sure so I pulled some quotes about bad boys um so one of the producers of the movie Jennifer Klein said quote there was no script when they started filming bad boys oh um so that's something it's not shocking uh no Martin Lawrence does a lot of improv It did seem like

Hey we need to fill up two minutes Before we get to the plot point So Martin you just let it rip Okay fam We'll figure it out in the edit room It's just like say things There was like a moment where Martin Lawrence Should have told Mike Lowry

That he had the woman in his apartment But instead of saying that He's like why you ain't come home last night for work where was you and he does that for like a solid three minutes and I was like why won't you just tell him there's a woman in his house he's like yeah and another thing my ass is hurting today because of that bullet

and I'm like Martin are you gonna get to the woman in the house that was Michael Bay like being like no we need more screen time more I was like we just gotta fill the time I mean there's like that all Like, no, we need more screen time. More. I was like, we just got to fill the time. And I mean, there's like that all like weirdly half improvised scenes in Michael Bay movies are weird or offensive. But like in this one, there was a weird like conversation they had about like, who were

they? Were they two other detectives who were like, Lucille Ball is stupid. Oh, yeah. And then they said something like racist about Desi Arnaz. And then the scene starts. There's always some black and Latino conflict because it's in Miami. So they're like, we've got to keep it true to Miami. The blacks and Latinos got to argue with each other.

Listen, we are going to hire three white male writers, but let's make it authentic. You're like, yikes uh so the most interesting part of the oral history for this movie is uh that surprise surprise martin lawrence not a big fan of michael bay's when this movie was being made but i guess later he was like i guess i don't care hard to say this is 2011 maybe know, he has since made a hard turn on Michael Bay. So I'll just read this exchange. So Michael Bay says, quote, By week two, Martin was being a dick to me. And I was like, what is this attitude? He didn't trust the white man. That was the deal. Unquote.

Martin Lawrence says, quote, that's exactly what it was. You know, Michael, he has a certain bravado. One time he said to me, I need your notes on the script. And I looked at him. I said, Michael, yeah, I'll get you the notes when I get to it. And he looked at me with this blank stare like, oh, he did not. So they're just like, OK. Michael Bay says, quote, eventually I took Martin aside and said, dude, what's your deal?

I'm busting my ass to make you look good, make you look funny. And you just keep belittling me. Make you look funny to Martin Lawrence? Music video director? Okay. And then here's the speech, almost like it was ready to come out. Martin says, I'm a black man that made it from nothing. And this is, okay, this is the wild. Okay and i said michael bay said you know what i'm a white guy who made it from nothing too i grew up

in the fucking valley slavery i grew up in the fucking valley and then the quote ends instant respect unquote and then martin lauren says quote i had to get to know him we grew to be the coolest this i uh uh we we don't know we don't know it was i grew up in the fucking valley it's just like being a black man in america let me tell you the fuck this fucking man he's horrible um so so that's some background where where everyone's coming from but alley the vat i mean the valley so he's really experienced a lot of hardship coming from pasadena um anyways um and then there's like some other stuff just about how like this is Michael Bay's movie where he basically establishes his corny over the top style. And Will Smith didn't.

OK, so Will Smith says, quote, Michael Bay was like, oh, take your shirt off and run with the gun. And I was like, come on, man. That's that's just on the edge of corny. But Michael can take things you think of as corny and make it super galactic, iconic. Unfortunately, I would contest this. Let's not forget that Will Smith is a Libra. Michael can take things you'd think of as corny and make it super galactic iconic unfortunately I would contest this I mean let's not forget that Will Smith is a Libra so you know he's honestly just trying to keep the scales balanced he knows Martin's over here like I'm a black man who is this music video director he's like all right Michael

geez if it's gonna keep everybody unsaid, I'll pull out these six abs. Come on now. I'm not mad at it. No, I mean, I'm glad this shot was there. I mean, I wasn't unhappy with it. I will see Will Smith's abs any time you want to give them to me. It's formative. So that's the production background.

And this movie did incredibly well oh yeah um it had what it had a 19 million dollar budget which i guess michael bay ended up sinking a bunch of his own money in it to make the explosions bigger whatever of course but it made almost 150 million dollars at the box office did really well meant that he could make the rock i mean basically this is the reason that we're stuck with him. Another thing I thought was interesting about the background of this movie is that originally the people

that were going to be cast, but there was some sort of scheduling thing, was John Lovett and Dana Carvey. That movie would have sucked. Who would have seen that? And what would that movie have even would that John Lovett as what Dana Carvey as what oh wait

them as the bad boys as the bad boys yeah no instead of Will Smith and Martin Lawrence what isn't that

that's like you know everything ended up better Wayne's world everything ended up better yeah Garth

oh hell no Will Smith was also not supposed to be in it. They wanted Arsenio Hall. Yes, I read that. And he said no, and then they're like, alright, Will Smith. Because this was like Will Smith's movie where they're like, oh, he's like hot. A movie star.

Yeah, like he's not just like a TV boy. So this was like big for him. They got very lucky that that casting fell through because Jesus, did they have it wrong. This is supposed to be a sexy Miami movie and you were going to have these corn balls. Like SNL actors. This movie would have been horrible. I mean, the combo of Michael Bay's corny ass shots and then these corny ass men.

Oh my God. Yeah. It would have been really bad. Yeah. Really bad. Y'all got so lucky. So that's a little bit of the context I got for you. Thank you, Jamie.

You're welcome. So let's talk about The Ladies, shall we? Yeah. Well, this is a movie that has- Boys in the title. Boys in the title. So it is not too concerned with women, unfortunately. Women are generally framed as either being nagging, frigid shrews, or just meddlesome police captains. Or, if we're talking about Taya Leone, the main female character of the movie is constantly damseled, harassed.

Anytime a woman shows emotions, there's a disproportionate consequence. Like Lacey was saying, Taylor Leone shows emotion really one time when she storms out, and then she's immediately abducted. Taylor Leone also seems to be putting moisturizer on her legs a lot of this movie. Yes.

Her legs were very dry. The most arid legs of a movie. So this is nothing new for Michael Bay but he loves to objectify and overly sexualize women's bodies in his movie. Something that

stood out to me was Taylor Leone seemed to have a bunch of sexy changes of clothes at a place she did not live. Right. Yes a place she did not live. Yes. And she did not pack at the other place. They were shot out of there by gunfire. So the assumption is that Mike Lowry just has sexy women clothes at his house.

Which actually could track. He's like, I hope you're a size four. Like, she's wearing like a leather dress when she meets him. I'm like, where did this come from? Well, there's that scene where a masseuse shows up at his apartment ready to give Will Smith a massage and then Martin Lawrence has to be like, go away! Honestly, my dream role. So I think we're meant to believe that women are just showing up at Mike Lowry's apartment

all the time and presumably leaving items of clothing behind. And Taya's like, I'll wear these things. And every time, you know, Martin comes back to the apartment, Taya's like, oh, I was just lotioning my pussy. What's up? Sorry, I was just lubing myself up in case something happened. I have a quick list, though, of all the of the main moments in which women's bodies are overly sexualized we've got the opening shot where a scantily clad woman gets out of the car with the other criminals the bad guys she just like walks past the bad boys to distract them so that the

criminals can carjack them so it's just like a woman there as a prop basically to distract the bad boys then there's the scene where you that you talked about lacy where she's just like putting lotion on in this very sexy way even though she's alone in a stranger's apartment yeah i do it every day it was just there was another one where like i guess they're about to go to bed and my martin lawrence is pretending to be my Larry. So he's like she's like come to bed. And then she's like got her feet up. And she's got like a belt around her feet or something.

And she's just like playing with her legs. Yes. And that's weird too because it's like we haven't really been given any indication that she's like into him. She seems very mistrustful of him. And. Right. indication that she's like into him she seems very mistrustful of him and right so i think what's happening here is that she's starting to catch on to the fact she's a callous bluff yeah but it's not totally clear because the first time i watched it i was like oh she's just really horny for him all of a sudden and then the second time i was like oh wait no i think she's actually trying to like call his bluff but it's not clear one way or the other.

So they're still making her stupid because the second that she sees Will Smith, she should be like, oh, I went to a house where all of your photos were there. That's your house. Two and two real quick. But they're like, no, she's a stupid lady with boobs. So she'll believe this man. Oh, shit. leave this man oh she and then there's like that in that same scene there's like i mean there's there's a bunch of like no homo moments in this movie that do not age well and weren't good then but like i think that's another way she sort of tries to call his bluff and then it's like

he you know they immediately go full no homo and then you're just like right because she sees all these photos of will smith in the apartment and she's like oh who's that i thought he might be your lover and martin lawrence is like um no he's not my lover i'm not gay he's my police partner yeah it's just like totally a no homo moment martin lawrence is horrified by the idea that someone might think he's gay yeah well that's one horrible way to approach this yeah yeah so i know that using michael bay as a yardstick is unwise and we can't but but i i mean it it is interesting just like because we've seen so much of his filmography now for some reason

to see someone's attitude towards women get worse over time like expert like there there's a lot I mean there's a lot of hallmarks of like how badly Michael Bay treats his female characters in this movie but like she's being treated like a queen compared to how Megan Fox is treated. It's a power dynamic. As soon as Michael Bay had the power, then it was like, oh, okay, come here, you skank bitch. I'm gonna make you a star. You better say thank you and maybe give me some sex.

And he's also just one of those guys who, before he had things in the Valley, I'm sure in his life when he was a black man in the Valley, a big struggle for him was he couldn't get bitches. He's not like a good looking guy. And by bitches I mean, that's what Michael Bay calls women. And I mean I've seen him at restaurants and shit and he's always with the youngest girls.

Like the youngest little 20 somethings even, you know 19s and 20s and stuff so i think it's a thing of like as soon as he started getting more power it's like okay now i can say how i'm gonna teach you how's a lesson god she it's that does not surprise me at all um yeah i mean the way even in this movie where he probably because this is his first feature like he's probably not given a whole enormous ton of creative freedom at least in terms of like how he treats the female characters right i mean but even in this movie there's still so much like objectification and mistreatment of women but i think that's just

like the action franchise it's like true you're gonna have cars you're gonna have explosions and you're gonna have legs and acid titties there's a scene where like they're running there there's like a chase one of many chase scenes but one of them they run through like a photography shoot where women are just like in bikinis and they just like interrupt this shoot that like just didn't have to be in the movie at all there's one there's that scene where they run outside and there's a bunch of people in wheelchairs and they just knock someone over. Oh, yeah. They're just like, why do that? What are you doing?

Right. People with disabilities are treated as an obstacle in this movie. And that's like Michael Bay bread and butter shit, too. It sucks because it's like I didn't dislike Julie's character, at least in the abstract. I feel like she at least and it sucks because I'm just comparing it to other action movies and Michael Bay movies. So we're not operating in, you know, like women in action franchises. Still, there's really not that much. And if there are, it's just a reboot of an all male franchise.

And then everyone gets upset. But I did think that Julie participated more than your average action sideline. I mean, she's still largely sidelined, but at least she contributes in some moments. And like there was like there's that scene towards the end where she like insists on being allowed to be there and be involved and i mean she's basically wrong because she doesn't have a weapon or any way to defend herself skills or ability right but i was just like i guess that that huh i don't i mean i feel like she does more than your average like woman in a 1990s era action movie is allowed to do but that's not saying that's not saying yeah there yeah she also she like finds because they the bad boys aka the good guys are constantly handcuffing her to a vehicle um they can't stop so at one point she finds the handcuff keys and like steals

it and hides it so that the next time they do that she's like no i'm not gonna let them uh handcuff me to the steering wheel which pays off like after she gets kidnapped she's put in handcuffs and then she's able to use those keys to free herself and then she does something and i don't totally remember i think she like drives the truck into some of the barrels of ether or something i got pretty confused i loved the barrels of ether or something. I almost got pretty confused for a second. I loved the barrels of ether, especially because there was a conversation between like, I love the evil guy just for purely being evil

and really not being that smart. He goes down to the chemist's lab where they're cooking up the drugs, and he's like, why are my drugs taking so long? And they're like, it's very humid in here, so it's hard to cook the drugs. And he's like, I don't care, I'll kill you both. And he's like, well, then you won here so it's hard to cook the drugs. I don't care. I'll kill you both.

And he's like, well then you won't get the drugs. I don't care. I'll kill you. It's like, this is not a productive conversation, sir. I just love how brazenly

evil he is. I enjoyed it thoroughly. And so he talks to the guy at the ether truck and he's like, hey man, watch the truck and be careful.

And then he's going to walk away and the guy's lighting a cigarette and he comes back and slaps him. He's like, there's ether back there. And it's like, well you didn't tell the guy who was running the truck and be careful. And then he's going to walk away. And then the guy's lighting a cigarette and he comes back and slaps him. He's like, there's Ethan back there. And it's like, well, you didn't tell the guy who was running the truck that he had explosives. Like, what do you expect? I loved him. He was just so like one note villain.

I did like, I mean, it is like in an action movie like this. It is fun when the only smart people are the heroes and everyone else is aggressively dumb as rocks like uh martin lawrence and will smith are smart and everyone else is dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb and in the way yeah yeah that including several of the female characters who get not that much screen time but like his wife is treated as usually just an obstacle true withholding uh i think that the withholding of sex is like more hit on than usual oh that's because this becomes like a running joke yeah because the the first exchange of dialogue in the entire movie is martin lawrence basically saying like my wife is a shrew who will not fuck me so i have to eat this big mac in your porsche instead and

then will smith's like well she's hot right and then it's like martin lawrence is regarded as a good man because he doesn't try to fuck anybody else even though his wife is withholding sex right and then a few minutes after that uh we see him try to have sex with his wife and she's like no you didn't come home early enough last night it's also like 7 a.m and their kids have to get to school but yeah she's such a bitch right and then like uh mike keeps teasing marcus about like not getting any from his wife he keeps teasing himself about it like it's just a like a running gag there's like a phone call or two with her where he'll like it seems like there's at least one example of martin lawrence calling his wife and being like hey can, can I come home and you will fuck me?

And like, like, this is a call that happens between spouses. And she's like, no. And he is like, oh, why not? And then and then like his like boss will be like, hey, stop asking your wife to fuck you. We've got police work to do. Just like like what is this also like what a like manual for like if he wanted to cheat he should have been able to because she would never look he tried seven times to get some coochie during this movie and but then she

shows up all mad when she's not sleeping with him like what are you trying what is this narrative right she's raising his three children. She's busy. Yeah. There's also that scene where, I think it's after Will Smith got like thrown out of a window and got concussed. And it's when Martin Lawrence is supposed to be telling him about the woman that's in his apartment.

But instead he's like, he's just yelling at him and being like, where were you? And then Will Smith is like, Oh, listen to you yelling. You're like a nagging wife. And it's like he's just yelling at him and being like where were you and then will smith is like oh listen to you yelling you're like a nagging wife and it's like oh this movie hates doesn't think highly of women um we gotta take another quick break but let's come back soon and talk more okay caitlin don't make it weird. Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th, 2017, was murdered.

There are crooks everywhere you look now. The situation is desperate. My name is Manuel Delia. I am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhurts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks. Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. And she paid the ultimate price.

Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. To listen to new episodes one week early and 100% ad-free, subscribe to the iHeart True Crime Plus channel, available exclusively on Apple Podcasts. This summer, the nation watched as the Republican nominee for president was the target of two assassination attempts, separated by two months. These events were mirrored nearly 50 years ago, when President Gerald Ford faced two attempts on his life in less than three weeks. President Gerald R. Ford came stunningly close to being the victim

of an assassin today. And these are the only two times we know of that a woman has tried to assassinate a U.S. president. One was the protege of infamous cult leader Charles Manson. I always felt like Lynette was kind of his right-hand woman. The other, a middle-aged housewife working undercover for the FBI in a violent revolutionary underground. Identified by police as Sarah Jean Moore. The story of one strange and violent summer. This is Rip Current, available now with new episodes every Thursday. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's Jay Shetty and welcome to On Purpose. I started this podcast to

have real conversations that help you live with more meaning, whether it's navigating relationships, working on your mental health, or figuring out what you're truly here to do. This week, I welcomed back Dr. Andrew Huberman, a neuroscientist and professor at Stanford University, known for his insightful work on brain development, neuroplasticity, and the intricate connection between the brain and body. Letting go and not trying to control everything, but also pushing oneself to be more resilient and tenacious and things of that sort. I feel like all of life is like that. All of life is about, yes, you need to take care of your physiology. You need to get your sleep at night, but it's also okay to get a bad night's sleep every once in a while. It's okay to not do every

protocol. In fact, it's encouraged to not do every protocol. The expectation on us is not perfection, right? It's being able to toggle between these different states. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Trust me, And we're back. Yeah. I want to say one more thing about Julie while we're still talking about her. Things that I liked that she did was rescued herself at the beginning when her friend was killed. She doesn't need to be rescued by some nameless male character yeah i like that she calls the cops and is like hey this is what i need blah blah blah and um maybe that's it oh and i like

that it seems like again it's like lacy i think you're totally spot on with like just michael bay doesn't have enough power yet to make the movie as sexist as he would want to. But even though it's like they're well, they do chain Taylor and Will Smith together at the end. They handcuff them together, but they don't kiss. And I thought that that was a lot of restraint for Michael Bay was that there was a woman in the movie the whole time and she didn't even kiss anyone. True. That's some Bay restraint. Also fascinating that,

so Mike Lowry knew that the boxing girl in the gym was a call girl. Yes. So when he finds out that she dies and pulls up the sheet and he's like all hurt and shit, cut to Martin Lawrence being like,

hey, I got the other girl's friend in your apartment. He's like, you have a hooker in my house? Right. You have a hooker in my house. And it was like,

the other girl was technically a hooker too, but you seem to be very nice to her. Like, what's with one sex worker worse than the other? Yeah.

It's like, so this movie has a strong contempt for sex workers and sex work yes and and i so on the wikipedia for this movie scholar coming at this from a scholarly perspective of course max is described as both a sex worker and his ex-girlfriend oh um which i don't know if maybe it was like a line of dialogue we missed or this could be inaccurate but that was how i was trying to contextualize that relationship is that they knew each other possibly through sex work but also they'd had some sort of relationship and then i think that this movie like it's very non-specific sex work they're like

it seems like escorty yeah it's not very specific about what it is but it was like pretty egregious that there's two black women with significant roles or i mean significant being a stretch but there's martin lawrence's wife and then there's max who's killed off almost right away she does a twirl though she does get one one good spin in honey i was trying to figure out who the um actor who played her was and it was karen alexander who was uh like she has like a pretty cool story she is like a she is a model for sure actor yeah which i mean i think you can always tell when it when it's a model turned actor but she's a model turned actor she like uh did a lot of like cool activism work to get black models more accepted in american mainstream culture in the 80s acted for a little while and now she's represented by trump model

management so you know life is crazy life comes at you fast very fast yeah um but yeah that was so like and then also the like madame who she has a conversation with madame lois yeah they're they're both murdered so all the uh sex workers we see on screen in this movie are punished by being murdered for being sex workers and they make it and they go out of their way even though it is not plot relevant, to not make Taylor Leone a sex worker as well. They go out of their way to make it clear. She's like, well, I'm not a sex worker, but I'll be an escort for tonight because you're my best friend.

I'm a photographer and I'm struggling. The scene that passes the Bechdel test, spoiler alert, in this movie is so horribly written. It is like it passes the Bechdel test because it's Julie and Max talking to each other about general stuff they're just screaming exposition but like they're not even looking at each other like like that's how you know they're acting like when are you making full eye contact with someone in a scene you're explaining your job and like look I am not a sex worker I don't condone sex work however I am a beautiful white woman who does photography and art and is worthy of life. So I will go with you to this event, but know that I'm an unwilling participant.

And then Max is like, OK, I still have feelings for Will Smith. And Taylor Leone is like, OK. And then they walk in and you're just like, Taylor Leonelor leone is basically screaming like yeah i am a white woman who is not a sex worker like she's screaming to the audience i'm going to live like it's just oh it's so much uh i i forgot that we learned that she's a photographer it's not relevant so at least we know what she does. It doesn't matter. Photographer is also just like this. It's still like the stock photo of like film jobs for wafey women. I mean, are you just a beautiful woman who's skating her way through life?

Photography. Give her a Polaroid. She's got this. Somehow this is a job. Like, well, do you think she took the photos of Francine? No, that's not how she would use her skills. Oh, that would be really funny, though. She was a bad guy.

But yeah, I guess, I mean, we learn, again, not to give this movie any credit whatsoever, but I was surprised that we learn a little bit about Julie in that we get a sense of some of her sort of like code of ethics and that she uh does not eat meat she's a vegetarian i liked that i thought that that was like fun and also it was like cute because you're like oh the boy writers are like what should we say about her i don't eat flesh she goes on this rant about baloney you're just like okay sure i guess i don't know no baloney taleoni baby i love it sorry about that um so yeah we get two facts about her but yeah they they did

max's character so dirty it sucked like and and just on top of that where they it's just like that thing where a writer knows that this character is going to die obviously so they don't even bother to characterize her they're like oh okay well uh we don't need to say anything we don't even need to say if she has an interest in anything except will smith because we need her death to move forward the narrative of will sm and Martin Lawrence like the narrative just like sacrifices her so that the movie can happen and it's also the scene where she gets shot

Michael Bay the corniness jumped out like truly it's like she spins in a circle he grabs a pillow and it's behind his back and then the evil guy shoots her through the pillow and then the music's like, and then it zooms in on her eyeball,

which is like the expression of an eyeball that's just been shot. And then it wasn't enough that she's like falling in slow-mo. Of course, there's a glass table behind her because why not? Why not? And then that scene, she also never comes up again, really.

After, like, you get that shot of, like, Martin Lawrence. He's like, oh, no, it's Will Smith's ex. And then he's like, and then Will Smith goes, oh, no. But then they sort of stop talking about it. Like, it becomes about the crime and the bad guys, but it sort of stops being about her. There's one moment when they're like, it's like after a chase scene where the bad guys get away. And they're like, darn it, we still don't know when the big drug bust is happening. And then Julie's like, who cares about that?

What about us letting the killers of Max get away? Like, that should be our motivation. And they're just like, oh, right, Max. Yes, i remember her yes yes yes we knew it it's coming back to me yeah yeah yeah also that was the only dead body that they were somber around every other dead body was like a comedy jam yeah martin lawrence being like and we'll be like come on man this is a dead body look i'm gonna play with his mouth like you know just really and not caring and they kill her like the her she's like laid out

shot to death in the most model like way ever she looks like a angel there's like the smallest bit of blood on the side of her face and was like oh my girlfriend oh my god and then forgets about her two seconds later right i'm glad that at least taylor leone is like hey that's my friend i'm not here for no reason right she at least sticks up for her although i thought the bad guy's plot was a little stupid it just seems like you guys got the heroin the girl's already with the cops so she's talked she's already talked why are y'all so focused on killing her like go do the drug deal what why why she don't literally she's already with the cops like it just seems like we should just do our thing our drug thing

instead of showing up everywhere that you could potentially get caught to try to kill her there's not a lot of logic perhaps logic that plays no role i'm gonna talk about alice and sinclair for a second what the fuck was that there i liked i mean i again it's just like another kind of empty gesture or like they accidentally wrote in a female character or something where she's like another like she's a little bit above them right or is she a detective like captain okay and i she she right she she comes from like internal affairs or something that. So she's presented as an obstacle, as many of the other female characters in this movie are. But she's breathing down Joey Pantoliano's neck about like,

we gotta solve this case or else the press is gonna have a field day with us. I mean, she's definitely written to be a bitchy obstacle. Like a ball buster. I want to make sure it says bitchy obstacle. New merch. But then she's just. Right. She shows up every once in a while.

And then it's like Idris Elba comes up to her and cats and goes. And then she just disappears from this theme. Yeah. Inevitable. Inevitable goes and then she just disappears from this theme yeah inevitable and then she disappears she so she's there and you're just like okay uh also also like they i feel like i don't know if this was just the 90s but both the women who work for the police department have the same severe blonde haircut like it was confusing Allison and Francine because they had the same haircut. It was like bleach, bleach, blonde.

Some kind of girly? How do you describe that haircut? I'm not sure. Hair doesn't fall that way anymore. I don't know what... It was a different time. Hair felt different The gravitational pull of the earth is different now. The air quality has changed.

The air simply doesn't. It must have been, maybe was Cyndi Lauper popular then? I don't know. That was in the 80s. I don't remember. Was it Madonna? Maybe it was Madonna. It was Madonna.

It was Madonna. Bleach blonde, weird hair. Was that what she was doing? Like Express Yourself? Yeah, that's around that time. That song was like, Express Yourself, don't rep song was like, express yourself, don't repress yourself. Express yourself, don't repress yourself. It was that hair.

It was that haircut. Yeah. Okay. It was the human nature haircut. There was. Yes. So they're just like trying to be Madonna, but it's confusing. They were like, give me two Madonnas who work in the precinct.

One of them gets a few lines. The other one's a traitor. The other one's a traitor. Yeah, exactly. Benedict Francine. Yep, yep. That's it. And they were also wearing 90s type clothes, like, which actually isn't weird to have in

a Miami PD, like women dressed not like police officers per se, because that's like a thing in Miami is like the suit leggings is what we call them. Like everyone dresses like a little more hypersexualized at the workplace. So that's actually not a weird thing for the movie. Okay. Interesting. Good to know. You're both like, really?

I'm like, yeah. I lived in Miami. It's just that, you know, you get a highlighter palette wardrobe and everything's tight. I've never been to Miami. Because it's hot. It's just hot. And humid. It's just hot.

And that's why the drugs won't cook. Because of the humidity. Okay, I just want to talk about cop movies just for a moment. Because this is one of many, many, many that it's for the boys. The target audience is men. The characters are mostly men these movies can't envision a world where women would be participants in the story in the context of anything besides them being like the damsels who get dragged along yeah in terms of cop movies that prominently feature a woman as an officer i can think of silence of the lambs i can think of

zootopia i can think of oh no the heat and it kind of the list kind of stops there for at least off the top of my head and any and if you're a listener that's like i need to tweet another movie that's not the point of what she was saying right there's not a lot don't add us uh and on the other hand there are dozens and dozens and dozens of cop movies about boys yes um but the fact that this uh is a big budget movie with two black leads is great yeah also i don't think that people look at Bad Boys as a police movie. They don't really act like police. They don't ever drive a police car. They're perhaps not very good at being police.

Yeah, no. This is like just two homeboys who I guess work in the police department, you know, just kicking it, having a good time, maybe being sexy, maybe solving a crime. Like, I've never looked at bad boys movies and been like oh the cops look so cool however i know that's how they're looked at by people who are in law enforcement and by men sometimes because like there was recently like maybe a month and a

half ago there was a shootout in miami where they were trying to act like fake ass bad boys and everybody's about to go down for this shit i'll pull up the specific incident but it was with a ups truck oh they stole a ups truck these criminals and they also kidnapped the guy who was driving the ups truck so then miami pd thought this was they bad boys moment so they out on the motherfucking highway shooting at the ups truck the ups truck shooting back they are high they are shielding themselves i wish this was a lot shielding themselves with real civilians who are in cars they're like hiding behind the cars and shooting i'm like bitch i'm about to be your

shit the fuck like they thought they were in bad boys so unfortunately this does really influence a lot of dumb ass police officers uh who want to get their kicks on route 66 but i've never regarded bad boys movies as like oh cops like i don't think that my cop movie i honestly forgot that this was a cop movie before i started what like they just have guns they really could be rogue vigilantes and the movie and the movie also has the character specifically remind you that they're cops several times and i don't think that that's a mistake because yeah they don't they don't dress like cops they don't uh travel and i mean there's this and i think that the movie is mistake because, yeah, they don't they don't dress like cops. They don't travel in.

I mean, there's this. And I think that the movie is more like fun that way. Like no one wants to watch a cop. They also kill a lot of people. So many people. A lot of people. And Martin Lawrence at one point is like to Julie. He's like, you know, the bad guys probably already know where you live. So I'll just leave now and let them come find you and kill you.

And good luck with that that and then she's like no wait please protect me and he's like okay fine but like yeah it's like that stuff they're like rifling through all the crime scenes like messing up crime scenes like they're not good cops it's wild

and I love the trope of their boss just yelling at them like every day is their last day you know but it never every day is their last day, you know? But it never is. This is the last time. You're like, no, it's not. One thing I did like was, and it was, was it deeply couched in no homo rhetoric, particularly at the beginning? You dug it out?

Yes. But when, when, at the beginning, when Martin Lawrence tells Will Smith that he loves him, he's like, you're my partner. I love you. Will Smith is like, no homo, no homo, no homo. And we're like, oh, I hate 1995 so much. And then but then at the end, there's a little friendship arc where Will Smith in the first and only time any sort of toxic masculinity is overcome in a Michael Bay movie. Will Smith tells Martin Lawrence, you're my partner. I love you. Are they standing over a dead body?

Of course they are. That makes it no homo. As long as there's a man that they've just killed, then we know that they're straight. Can be true. Can be true. I mean, if there wasn't a dead body there, then how do we know they're not lovers? You know what I mean? There's also, so between this, in the middle of this arc,

there is another weird no homo scene where I think you wouldn't even necessarily catch it unless you had the subtitles on, which is why I watch all my movies with subtitles. Brag. I get it. You can read. I do have a master's degree in screenwriting from Boston University.

Which means you can read. Which means I need to learn how to read. You're like, you want to see how I can read? So good. I love watching Caitlin read, honestly. It's a pleasure. I could watch it all day. You could watch it all day?

They say you can make money out of anything. I watch Caitlin read. I pay her for it. Thank you for that. No, but there's this scene where they go into like a bodega and notable actor sean taub i'm not entirely sure how to say his name but he plays like the bodega owner and he sees that martin lawrence and will smith both have guns and he thinks he's about to get robbed so he pulls out a gun on them but because he um english isn't his first language the actor is iranian i don't know who what the character is

supposed to be but it feels like there's some racist stereotypes happening there fully troped out yeah and that's like i mean another i'm, I was surprised there wasn't more of that in a Michael Bay movie. Because if like in a Transformers movie, there'll be 25 scenes like that in a row. Right. Also, it's Miami. So they were ripe for making those scenes because it's such a cultural melting pot that you can, you know, insert whatever racial trope you want, wherever you want. Right.

So they really went limited. They really like pulled back yeah and i think still to date the transformers franchise is the worst example of the highest concentration of michael bay racism and like not coincidentally that's the franchise he has the most power over um but yeah that yeah um but any case so in in this in this scene where uh we've got this bodega owner who he's saying something like he's holding a gun to them. And he's like, I will blow you, meaning like I will blow you away with my gun. And then Martin Lawrence is like, blow me.

No, you can hump me, but blow me. Like, it's really weird. It's really hard to arrive at the offensive joke they're trying to make. It's called improv. Yes. Yes. Oh, wait. Martinch just had that at the top of his head how incredible there although at the end of that scene i like how that scene

ends when will smith has the gun and he's like get me was like and you're like damn it michael bay you got me You got me at the end. It was racist and homophobic, and then they somehow stuck the landing? Horrible. I think those lines were improvised, so it has nothing to do with Michael Bay. It was, yeah. It was all Will and Martin. And Skittles. I laughed.

I laughed. A similar racist joke is made in this movie that is made in transformers where a character speaks a few words of spanish and then a character who does not speak spanish is like what the hell did you say um english please especially in miami this is especially ridiculous especially working for the police right like so y'all you ain't never had to speak to nobody in spanish you don't know what the word cojones means you've never heard that word before okay one time for the xenophobes so they need content too uh but it is michael bay's favorite joke because he keeps using it over and over again he thinks it's hilarious he tells he

regales all the 19 yearyear-olds he hangs out with with this hilarious joke he came up with 30 years ago. Literally. Oh, my God. My favorite part of the movie is, here we go, ready for this? Okay, at the very beginning, when Martin Lawrence and Will Smith are being carjacked,

they're like, hey, we're cops. You're messing with cops right now. And the carjacker's like, oh, yeah, well, I'm a stand-up comedian. And I suck. I liked that, too. I was just like, what? Representation of a man, of a stand-up comedian who's a man, admitting that he sucks at stand-up comedy.

That hasn't happened before or since. I know. We need to see more of it. Incredible. I forgot. I really did like that, too. That's excellent did you guys know that michael bay's first job in film was working on raiders of the lost ark no no where does that he was like an

intern on raiders of the lost ark oh my gosh do you think he met alfred melina he better not have he better stay the fuck away from him i i would be so pissed if they've met um just the meeting if they met in passing i'm fucking done uh but so i guess this is another just like michael bay has always been the worst so he's living his really difficult life in the valley and he gets this internship. Horrible for him on one of the most famous movies of all time. Oh, so difficult. He's struggling.

He's an intern on Raiders of the Lost Ark. And I guess he spends his whole time on that movie being like, this movie is going to fucking suck. And then when it comes out, he said, oh, it was good. I want to be a film director now, too. And George Lucas actually contributed to the Michael Bay oral history and he was he was shady in a way that I thought

was funny he said Michael's films are identifiable I was like good for you George Lucas you know when you see trash you know when you're on the New York sidewalk and then you just get a whiff of something. That's like Michael Bay movies. They're identifiable.

You know when you pass into Shorma and you know when you pass into Michael Bay movies. George Lucas out here being a bitchy obstacle to Michael Bay. Can't believe it. You better be Teresa wife, George Lucas. Channel that energy. I can't believe it. I love it. You better be Teresa wife George Lucas. Channel that energy. Oh, I thought that was really funny. Well, I hate that this movie

is fun to watch. I know. But now I'm like, should I see the new one? It's not, Michael Bay doesn't appear to be involved at all. Is it still written

by three white guys? As far as I can tell, yes. It's a time honored bad voice tradition. Yes. It has to be written by people who do not know what they're talking about. If the formula works.

Yeah, exactly. They have two new directors on. I mean, who knows? Maybe it will be great. I'll use my AMC A-list Stubbs membership to see it for free. I tried to unsign up from that, and then they were like, you have to stay for three months. I'm like, well, now I have to see Bad Boys 3. It makes it worthwhile. will see also i do love just like the grotesque waste of money in these movies because in bad boys 2 they have one of those carports that you like

deliver cars in so you'll have like 12 cars kind of stacked upon each other on a big rig they have one in bad boys 2 where they like unload it and then all the cars just start shooting off of the truck and then they're dodging the cars that are just flying in the road and i was like this is so much money um you know and it's it's horrible to think about how much money it is the new the new bad i want to see how they top it what are they gonna do now 90 million dollar budget so i actually thought it would have more than that i'm like like, that's cat's level budget. Can they blow up a building with that much money? I don't know. Probably with a computer.

Yeah. But they used to blow a real building. Michael Bay blew so much. That was one of the things that he mentioned was he put $25,000 of his own money to make a couple extra cars explode. He worked outside the budget. He spent his meatloaf money. He's a black man. He spent his meatloaf money he's a black man he spent his meatloaf money on bad boys explosions that's what black people have to do

they were like we'll put you in a movie but you gotta bring some of your own money so he gets it Michael Bay gets it he's got that valley mentality I just I had the fact the fact well are there any other final thoughts I hate that this movie's fun I know but it's fun it's bad in in so many ways so bad and yet not Michael Bay's worst as we've said before I would honestly say of what I've seen one of his best yeah I would

say this is my favorite Michael Bay movie that's and and that's saying nothing yeah i never thought i would say that sentence and i'm horrified please never like if anyone's out there trying to isolate that clip you're gonna get canceled um yeah yeah we we we hope that we've demonstrated that we understand why the shortcomings and the and the of its but it's fun to watch what can you do so uh we alluded earlier that it i guess does pass the bechdel test i think even without asterisks it passes in that scene because i i was ready to be like oh like the scene prior where max and lois are talking there's like two lines where they're not explicitly talking about a man but the context of the conversation is still about a man so i'm like

oh maybe it doesn't pass but then the next scene i'm pretty sure they're talking about uh their relationship with each other about being roommates i'm a photographer i owe you one what does she owe her for we don't know but it's referenced yeah true but then they do start talking about will smith's character toward the end of that conversation, but there is, yeah, that two-line exchange at least that technically passes. And then also Julie and Teresa talk to each other, but I think they're talking only about men because Teresa shows up at Mike Lowry's condo

and she's like, is my husband here? And Julie's like, is he the short one or the tall one? Objectifying men. Love it. Michael Bay, a woke king. You heard it here first on the special guest. And probably has good politics too. You can quote us on it.

All right. That brings us to our nipple scale. Zero to five nipples based on its representation of women it still gets like a point two five yeah like you can't give it really I'll give it the I'll give it and

keep in mind sliding scale give it point five because Talioni got to make a few decisions she drove the truck for 10 seconds she shot a gun once did it ruin club hell yes we didn't talk about that she shot a gun one time she in a club in miami it's called club hell

it's on brand but anyway so 0.5 because taylor leone made decisions and they didn't make her kiss at the end everything Everything else, bad, bad, bad, bad, bad. Yes. Boys, boys, boys, boys, boys. Bad boys. Bad boys, bad boys, bad boys. Look, man, I gotta give it a one nipple. Okay.

All right. Okay, because it's got a special place in my heart. I'm gonna even make the nipple maybe slightly darkened areola for black man Michael Bay. Stay strong, King. man Michael Bay and stay strong king I did enjoy that she didn't have to kiss she got to talk a good deal I mean there is one scene unfortunately it's very sad it doesn't

truly like surpass the Bechdel test but it does pass the bare minimum requirements and then also you know I never saw Taya's titties. I mean, she did have to oil her legs up. We see her underwear. She falls down at one point, and she's wearing a really short skirt, and then, like, her skirt flies up, and you see her underwear.

Okay, well, I'm going to blame that on the wind. Okay. But, again, she's still styled more respectfully than we see in later Michael Bay movies. Yeah. It's not like, oh, I'm running from the cartel in my bra for some reason. No, Will Smith is the objectified one in that one. His shirt is somehow always unbuttoned and the wind is billowing and he's oiled up. Well, he's single.

He's got to always be oily. Aren't all single people just oily? I am. I'm trying to let the people know I'm out here. You know what I mean? You've got to be lubed up. You gotta be catching sun rays. She's lubing herself as we speak. Sam Icke,

friend of the show Sam Icke, brought up in our Men in Black episode something that I think about often because he said that the female lead in that movie does not kiss Tessa? Is that her name? Tessa Thompson. No,pson no no sorry not the oh the oh yeah so the not yeah the 98 or 97 first men in black movie 97 and it's uh linda florentino

right so she we do not see her kiss anyone in that movie either but sam ike speculated that it's because the male lead that would have been the made the most sense to pair her with was black and he speculated that audiences wouldn't have wanted to see a interracial kiss so i wonder if that is why there's no kissing in this movie because it's the same actor, Will Smith. That would be. Damn. God damn it. Am I going to have to take some of my nipple back?

I'm taking back the hairs at least. I mean, this is speculation, but it's not far fetched. But I remember Sam saying that as well. Yeah. I don't think it's far fetched. I mean, also in the 90s. Was it the 2000s or the 90s when Save the Last Dance came out? I think it was maybe 2000. Early 2000s was it the 2000s or the 90s when Save the Last Dance came out I think it was

maybe 2000 early 2000 yeah but that was still when the plot of a movie was we're in an interracial relationship that was the whole plot of the movie

yeah 2001 so like thank you Sophie so like that's you know still like the 90s 2001 is still super close

in time period so that makes sense at the end of the movie they were like look white people will watch two negroes it's just like how they let a black man be president they're like he's still a

man but we don't want to see him sucking our women okay we'll see his big old lips on our women so that makes sense to me i yeah oh that's shitty i thought they were just respecting her no i wouldn't doubt always go with racism that yeah all right well a shout out to sam mike for probably correctly calling that we thought that maybe that uh michael bay had made a choice that was nice to women but it turns out it was racist yeah so uh fuck uh so yeah my nipple i'm gonna give it i'm gonna give 2.5 or sorry what oh my god what 0.25 oh my god cancel me i gotta go down the half okay yeah i'll stick at half yeah i'm gonna go 0.25 because of like the two things that the julie character gets to do but everything as we've discussed is just like framing women as obstacles framing women as damsels framing

women as frigid shrews a lot of you know racist stereotypes are employed in this movie yeah a lot of no homo moments i mean just runs the whole gamut of problematic stuff uh and it is a michael bay movie so we are not surprised but it is fun so and I hate but I think that it's yeah uh yeah so you know not and I think it's mostly fun because of Martin Lawrence and Will Smith like it's fully the performances that make this movie fun let's not give Michael Bay deserves you know you know what I really think it was the extra car exploding that really took it over the top for me yeah but yeah yeah it doesn't fare well this movie um lacy thank you so much for being here thank you for having me back it's always such a treat yes i love you come back

anytime where can we where can we find you online guys you can find me at d-i-v-a-l-a-c-i diva lacy on all platforms and guys if you uh want to hear more of my voice scam goddess pod um and if you have any scams you want to email me scam goddess pod at gmail.com and scam goddess pod on all platforms yay so good uh you can follow us bad boys oh god take that back right now leave it uh at bechtel cast on social media platforms you can subscribe to our patreon aka matreon it's five dollars a month you get two bonus episodes plus our entire backlog of episodes uh bad boy backlog our bad boy backlog say that three times fast and what else do we got rate and review us on

Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts and check our website for upcoming tour dates merch as well merch as well but look out for that bitchy obstacle t-shirt someone remind me to make that and yeah we love you so much bad boys bad boys.

What you gonna do? What you gonna do when they come for you? Bye. Bye. There's so much beauty in Mexican culture. Like mariachis, delicious cuisine, and even lucha libre. Join us for the new podcast, Lucha Libre Behind the Mask, a 12-episode podcast in both English and Spanish about the history and cultural richness of Lucha Libre.

And I'm your host, Santos Escobar, emperor of Lucha Libre and a WWE superstar. Listen to Lucha Libre Behind the Mask on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you stream podcasts. In California during the summer of 1975, within the span of 17 days and less than 90 miles, two women did something no other woman had done before, try to assassinate the president of the United States. One was the protege of Charles Manson. 26-year-old Lynette Fromm, nickname Squeaky. The other, a middle-aged housewife working undercover for the FBI.

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