The Bechdel Cast - Titanic: VHS Tape 2

Episode Date: February 23, 2023

A continuation of last week's episode, here is Titanic VHS Tape 2 to celebrate the 25th Anniversary of James Cameron's Titanic. Let's take her to sea, Caitlin and Jamie... let's stretch her legs! For Bechdel bonuses, sign up for our Patreon at patreon.com/bechdelcast. Follow @BechdelCast, @caitlindurante and @jamieloftusHELP on Twitter.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey everybody, this is Matt Rogers. And Bowen Yang. We've got some exciting news for you. You know we're always bringing you the best guests, right? Well, this week we're taking it to the next level. The one, the only, Katherine Hahn is joining us on Las Culturistas. That's right, the queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories, and of course, the culture.

Don't miss Katherine Hahn on Las Culturistas. Listen to Las Culturistas on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. And I'm Jermaine Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. There's a lot to figure out when you're just starting your career. That's where we come in. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice.

And if we don't know the answer, we bring in people who do, like negotiation expert Mori Tahiripour. If you start thinking about negotiations as just a conversation, then I think it sort of eases us a little bit. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. into a mafia state. Listen to Crooks everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the Bechtelcast, the questions asked

if movies have women in them. Are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands or do they have individualism? The patriarchy's effing vast. Oh, I was going to try to quote Titanic, but. But you couldn't? I just couldn't choose. I just couldn't. Oh, okay.

Choose which thing. I was like, wait, what's going on? I was going to say like, oh, i'm king of the world but that's like honestly maybe the worst quote from the movie whoa i mean i can't say i agree with that oh okay that seems sick and i think the worst quote from the movie would be oh something that you don't even remember like something you don't oh here it is gotcha who oh when exactly not memorable not memorable no but i know what you're talking about it's when the two guys were looking for jack and rose in the cargo hold and they open the door and they're

like they think they're gonna see them like mid coitus yes oh okay so first of all welcome to the best old cast um yes hello my name is jamie loftus my name is caitlin durante and this is our uh normally it's our podcast where we give an intersectional feminist analysis of your favorite movies this week we are for the second week in the row once again covering titanic for i believe the seventh time so it is the most wonderful time of the year and uh as we briefed you on in last week's episode we are doing a two-parter for this as a way to both say that first the episode was unexpectedly so long because we will never run out of things to say about this and to to uh to just sort of pay homage to the two vhs tit. So this is VHS 2.

Yes. But I feel like we should update. We have Titanic news since last episode. Since we last released an episode. I had my wedding, so to speak, which is I invited all my friends to an AMC in Burbank, California to watch Titanic. Yesanic like any good wedding

zach thank you and a lot of people came and we had the best time there was cheering it was beautiful friend of the cast sarah june booed the iceberg when it came on screen and we all loved it it was an an extremely Titanic screening. That it was. Is how I felt about it. And yes, Caitlin, thank you for coordinating it. I will say of Titanic 3D, it doesn't need to be 3D. Thank you.

There wasn't a lot of 3D. I wanted to see every pore on Bruce Esme's face. Wow. I just didn't. Yeah. I know. Well, that's a me thing. Sure. That's because I'm a little pervert. I don't love 3D movies. In fact, I avoid them. Me too. And I was worried that it was going to be like headache inducing. But the 3D was like kind

of underwhelming, which I actually liked. Because I was like, like oh i'm not being given a headache i would but but you wouldn't have liked it if you had paid a premium and didn't have an amc stubs pass sure that's what i was thinking of the non-stubs heads um if i were a non-stubs head which of course i'm not i would be fucking pissed if i paid 26 to not even be hit in the face with an iceberg which i think is like low-key kind of morbid and disrespectful but anyways we went we did do that yes and speaking of amc stubs i mean we would be remiss not to acknowledge that we come to this place for magic we come to this place to laugh to cry to care etc and also also AMC can eat shit. I mean, obviously we're not based on what I just said.

We're obviously not sponsored by them. Right. They can eat shit. Did you see how they are trying to introduce a tiered movie seat program? That is the most elitist garbage pee pee poo poo thing I've ever seen in my life. Like movies are supposed to be in equal space they're for the people you know twelve dollars times three these days I don't know I'm a stubs head so I don't know and then you know I just think that's so fucking ridiculous infuriating

pisses me off we're not sponsored by them so we're saying that yeah anyone who doesn't sponsor us we have to find an active insult for anyways it rocked we laughed we cried we cared sarah boot the iceberg it was it was really special it was wonderful i had the best time thank you for coming with me jamie oh i mean and thanks to all who attended indeed titanic. And that resulted in a little bit of James Cameron history where Titanic has now eclipsed Avatar. Avatar 2 overtook Titanic as a higher grossing movie. But then when Titanic re-released, Titanic is back up on top.

It overtook Avatar 2. Now, who knows what will happen? James Cameron's kind of like the Joey Chestnut of movie grosses. He's really mostly in competition with himself. And you're just like, well, yes, good for that white guy. In any case, shall we get to the episode? Yes. So without much further ado, here is VHS tape number two. And by that we mean the rest of the episode that we didn't have time to include last week so it's uh a recap of the movie plus jamie's fun facts suicide at the top of this recap and sinking boat and for a sinking boat yes all right and then i'm gonna pipe in it's kind of hard

because i have two long lists of notes for the two different three-hour commentary tracks. I'm going to do my best, but I'll try to interject with useful information and not just having a meltdown. And anything that you don't get to during the recap, we can touch on afterward. We can zip through, yeah. Oh, yeah. Okay, here we go. The movie begins in present day

with Brock Lovett, played by Bill Paxton, who Jim Cameron admits is his self-insert character. I mean, that makes sense. He's like Brock on the phone with his financiers, more like me on the phone with Paramount. He he ha ha. He also says that he edited the intro sequence like with the title and like the waves and stuff he edited that himself wow in the space of 20 hours and one bottle of tequila

oh wow i know he drunk edited the opening sequence love Love that. Okay. Love that. So Brock Lovett is in, speaking of Lovett, Brock Lovett is in a submarine searching the wreckage of the Titanic because he is trying to find a diamond necklace called the Heart of the Ocean. He believes it went down with the ship when it sunk in 1912 yes he finds this safe he brings it to the surface he opens it but oops the diamond is not in the safe i learned a little bit about how they shot the underwater sequences and that was really interesting because they it was kind of like a whatever a combination of crew members sort of telling you exactly what shots were actually from the wreckage of titanic and which ones were reproductions that they did match shots for in escondido fun facts that i learned included and i i think i sort of knew that but i don't this but i don't know if like we've ever

talked about on the show so like all of those like the underwater cameras like they're called ROVs they had to develop a version of existing technology that could be used for the movies because there's so few of that equipment available that they wouldn't lend it to James Cameron for his little movie it reminded me of how like in I, Tonya like famous figure skaters wouldn't lend it to James Cameron for his little movie. It reminded me of how like in I, Tanya, like famous figure skaters wouldn't be stunt people because they're like, yeah, it's not worth it. Sorry, movie. It's not because it's like if you're doing a triple axel in figure skating

and then you fuck your ankle up, then your career is over and all you did was a stunt on I, Tanya. You know, I think that that's how they're like, these cameras are so valuable that like, if you break it making a movie, we will kill you. Like, so they had to like develop technology for the movie specifically. And then also that piano that they see,

James Cameron, sometimes he claims to have done things where I'm just like like I don't believe you but anyways he that piano he's like I made that myself I took a drill to it and it took all night I was like what are you talking about but he started in the art department and he claims to just really have like raw dogged that piano and made it look old and threw it underwater wow okay all right who knows well so brock has opened the safe the diamond is not there but what is there is a nude drawing of a woman who is wearing the diamond necklace in the drawing so we know that james cameron drew that what i never heard before this was that he drew it semi from life like it wasn't just like and not from the scene in the movie the

drawing was like done or like storyboarded before kate winslet ever you know posed for it in the movie sure but yeah he said that like he had Kate Winslet pose for him and a few artists from a few different angles but she was wearing she was not nude she was wearing a bikini and then he sounded really creepy dad and he was like I had to use my imagination to draw her nude we didn't know each other well enough for her to pose nude for me which I'm like yeah true but why did you say that you know but there's a lot of like bizarre I don't know there's a lot of like 90s because the the two commentary tracks I listened to were recorded for the 10th anniversary dvd so it was recorded sometime in like 2006 for the 2007 release right but there's all sorts of like bizarre 90s sounding like there's a story about how like when kate winslet like she didn't

want leonardo dicaprio to see her naked for the first time like on the set for that scene so she according to her like left her makeup trailer door unlocked and like called him in while she was getting full body makeup for that scene and like didn't tell him she was going to be naked and like jump scared him and then he was like whoa and she's like ha ha ha it's it's more comfortable this way we're just co-workers and then leonardo dicCaprio was like cool and I guess everyone was fine with it but I was like this is a weird you guys are most stories about Kate Winslet and Leonardo DiCaprio are weird like she just says it like it's a I mean whatever they had a jokey relationship they're obviously still friends but she was like ha ha ha this is where leo would fart in his jacket and stick it in my face oh i was like yucky but she's like we'd love

to have a laugh i'm like well you know they really found each other because i would hate that what a bunch of goofs i guess um okay so this exploring of the wreckage of Titanic, this whole thing is like being televised. Yes. And an old woman sees the drawing that Brock Lovett has uncovered from the safe. She sees it on TV and she says, well, I'll be goddamned. And we're crying. Yeah. She then calls Brock Lovett and says, the woman in the picture is me.

And yeah, I know all about the diamond you're looking for. Okay. I definitely didn't know this. Let me know if you do this. So when James Cameron was writing this iconically okay script, he was looking for like to build out old Rose. He was looking for like a, god i'm i never say this word right like centenarian someone who was around 100 who he like wanted to find a really

interesting older woman who had like lived a wild life to sort of like build old Rose around or just like have in mind. And Bill Paxton's, his wife, Louise Paxton suggested this artist she knew of who lived in Ojai, who was like in her night. I think she was like 101 when the movie came out. And she was like, Oh, you should check out this artist,

Beatrice Wood. She sounds exactly like the kind of person you're looking for and she gave James Cameron a copy of Beatrice Wood's autobiography which is called I Shock Myself and James Cameron met with her before writing the character of Old Rose got a feel for who she was a lot of the like lines that old rose has were based on her cadence and jokiness um the fact that rose does pottery is based on beatrice wood because that was what beatrice wood was most famous for in her later career and gloria stewart met with her too like she's just like this fascinating person and if you're into art history at all, listeners, she was like, she was like a really important

artist who I'd never heard of. But she like, was with like Marcel Duchamp, like championing his work at like the very, very beginning of his work. Like she's considered like the mother of Dada art, but is obviously not brought up half as much as Duchamp was but she was a huge advocate and like she worked alongside him she did a lot of drawings and then later did like sculpture and then even later in her career to pottery she was like the subject of this famous Dada art love triangle with Duchamp and this other artist I don't know she was really really fascinating and um I was excited to even get to like I ordered a copy of her autobiography because she just sounds really freaking cool and I love that uh Louise Paxton was the one that was just like hey

check this out yeah and then i think most iconically after titanic came out beatrice wood awarded the fifth annual beatrice wood film award to james cameron reciprocity but yeah so okay last and so like gloria stewart and james cam Cameron went to Beatrice Wood's 101st birthday luncheon when they were getting to know her. And I guess that she turned down dessert at the table and everyone's like, why didn't you want dessert, Beatrice? And she said, I only like chocolate and young men. So, wow. I know. Shout out Beatrice Wood. I just had like a really fun side quest learning about her she's really cool hell yeah yeah i didn't know okay so brock love it invites this woman who had

called him rose calvert played by gloria stewart and he invites her aboard the keldish which is the ship they are operating this search of the titanic wreckage from a real ship so that rose can tell him what she knows about the diamond and she starts to tell her story she iconically says it's been 84 years and I can still smell the fresh paint. The china had never been used. The sheets had never been slept in. Titanic was called the ship of dreams. And it was. It really was.

Also, another fun meeting was Gloria Stewart requested to meet with Kate Winslet when they first got cast as Rose so that Gloria Stewart would know how to like, whatever, like the way that you would, but like to fix her mannerisms. And there's like video footage of that meeting. And it's really, really sweet. And it's Gloria Stewart showing. They're both like drinking champagne and they're a little tipsy. And Gloria Stewart is showing because she was like an old Hollywood star she's showing Kate Winslet these pictures of her when she was like she's like I was having sex with every Marx brother and none of that is my real hair and Kate Winslet's like I want to be just like you someday it's very sweet oh that's awesome i know um so as old rose starts to tell her story

we flash back to 1912 titanic is about to embark on its maiden voyage people are boarding the ship including rose played by kate winslet her fiancee cal her fiancee. Cal Hockley, played by Billy Zane. Her mother Ruth, that's Frances Fisher. And they are all fabulously wealthy with first class tickets. We cut to Jack Dawson, played by Leonardo DiCaprio. Of course, he is playing poker with his best friend Fabrizio. Oh my gosh. That's Danny Nucci. I have a fun Danny. I have two fun Danny Nucci facts.

Hit me. Danny Nucci is also in the commentary track and he's just a kick. Things about Danny Nucci include he was able to. So Danny Nucci lived in Italy for the first seven years of his life, but did not speak Italian. I personally, I think what I've learned in the last couple of years is that like sometimes when Italian accents sound fake,

they're actually not. Case in point, Lady Gaga and House of Gucci. Her accent sounds extremely fake, but then if you listen to the person that she's playing, it's sometimes they just sound weird. I don't know. But like apparently Danny nucci like fudged a little bit and like little white lie was like yeah i'm italian but like spoke in an accent at his audition and was able to fool james cameron and the producers and then when he got the part he was like i'm not actually italian and they're like well can you speak

italian and then he had to like take classes really abruptly so he could do the because he occasionally speaks in italian in the movie also another evil james cameron anecdote danny nucci had his first kid while titanic was in production and he was given one and a half days off yikes um and finally iconic Danny Nucci said there's good anecdotes about the two bands that appear in this movie the Irish band below decks and then the band that plays to the end on the top deck and they're like a Swiss band. But apparently like Danny Nucci. And the Irish band. Got along famously. And Danny Nucci would bring out his guitar.

And they would play Oasis together. Like between takes. Okay. It's great. Love it. Yeah. Okay. So Jack and Fabrizio are playing poker.

Against these two Swedish guys. Who have bet their third class tickets to Titanic. And Jack wins the hand of poker because he's got a full house, boys. Woo! And so he wins the tickets, but Titanic is leaving in five minutes. Five minutes! So Jack and Fabrizio make a mad dash and board the titanic we are also seeing the extravagance of rose and cal in first class juxtaposed against the bare bones conditions of third class where jack and fabrizio are yeah there's a fun little anecdote about like just

i don't know, like little things that I was like, oh, I wouldn't think about who would be doing that. But like James Cameron, cause he's just like kind of a weird guy, was really like, there's a scene where it's like Rose has her Picassos and her Degas and all this stuff.

And like James Cameron, like spent a bizarre amount of time looking for someone to do that and like ended up finding this obscure artist that lived in the middle of Canada and like hired her to do it's like all the same artist who did all of those paintings interesting also the dog old rose has the dog oh the little Pomeranian yeah which i guess is a nod to there were three dogs that survived the titanic and there two of them were pomeranians and one was a pekinese and no one ever talks about the titanic dogs it might be the the only angle from which that story has not been um

exploited well titanic puppies guess i've got a screenplay to write who would be the titanic puppies it would be like anya taylor joy kevin hart and dave batista are the titanic puppies wow food for thought okay i'm not mad about it yep um okay so we see first class passengers third class passengers we also see no no second class passengers really not a lot of interest in the second class wow second class erasure gee wow middle class erasure much hello well hey you're telling me folks um we also see the people in the boiler rooms who are like shoveling coal to power the ship we're seeing wild fact about the boiler room due to something something the budget they couldn't afford to build the boiler room to the full size they wanted to so there's like a lot of things done in the boiler room set to make the boilers appear

like there's more they use like a mirror effect to make it seem like there are twice as many as there actually were but also they couldn't afford to build the boilers as big as they should have been so instead they hired shorter actors to play the boiler room guys so they were like i don't know if this was hyperbole or not but like john landau was like yeah we we we just had to make the boilers like we were positioning the camera as if the actors were like six foot four but i don't think we hired an actor who was like above five foot three we just hired a lot of like shorter actors so that the boilers would look bigger that's some like forced perspective hobbit lord of the rings stuff it's it's pretty brilliant um but that's boiler room facts with jamie

beautiful love it um so yeah we're seeing just like the scale and the glory that is titanic shortly after this is when we see the scene where Jack is like looking at dolphins and then he goes, I'm king of the world. And on that note, let's take a quick break and then we will come right back. Hey, everybody, this is Matt Rogers. And Bowen Yang. We've got some exciting news for you. You know, we're always bringing you the best guests, right? Hey, everybody. This is Matt Rogers. And Bowen Yang. We've got some exciting news for you. You know we're always bringing you the best guests, right?

Well, this week we're taking it to the next level. The one, the only, Catherine Han is joining us on Lost Culture East. That's right. The queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories, and of course, the culture. I feel some Sandra Bernhardt in you. Oh my God, I would love it. I have to watch Lost.

Oh, you have to. No, I know, I'm so behind. Katherine Hahn can sing. Oh, I'm really good at karaoke. What's your song? Yeah, what's your song? Oh, I love a ballad. I felt Bjork's music.

I just was like, who is this person? I got to hawk this slalom, Luge. I'm not going to hawk this slalom. I absolutely love it. It was somehow Shakespearean when you said it. It was somehow gorgeous.

Yee, my slok, you hollum. Listen to Las Culturistas on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. And I'm Jemay Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline, a new podcast from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. When you're just starting out in your career, you have a lot of questions like, how do I speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed? Or can I negotiate a higher salary if this is my first real job? Girl, yes. Each week, we answer your unfiltered work questions. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice.

And if we don't know the answer, we bring in experts who do, like resume specialist Morgan Sanner. The only difference between the person who doesn't get the job and the person who gets the job is usually who applies. Yeah, I think a lot about that quote. What is it like you miss 100% of the shots you never take? Yeah, rejection is scary, but it's better than you rejecting yourself. Together, we'll share what it really takes to thrive in the early years of your career without sacrificing your sanity or sleep. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th, 2017, was murdered. There are crooks everywhere you look now. The situation is desperate. My name is Manuel Delia. I am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhearts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks. Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. And she paid the ultimate price. Listen to Crooks everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

And we are back. Okay, so then we meet the unsinkable Molly Brown, played by Kathy Bates. We meet Mr. Andrews, that's Victor Garber, who almost didn't get the part because the casting director sent was like Jim you got to check out this guy he looks like Thomas Andrews and he's very talented

and then she sent him the wrong video she sent him like a video of some guy in a bow tie that looked nothing like Thomas Andrews and James Cameron was like um I'm not seeing it and and she was like oh no wrong. And then he got the part. Oh, and we're so glad. It's true. Mr. Andrews, of course, is the, like, engineer who designed the ship. We also meet Bruce Ismay, played by Jonathan Hyde. He was the chairman and managing director of the White Star Line.

The two historical characters that both the producers and james cameron seem to have like repeatedly acknowledged that they felt like the only historical figures that they felt that they potentially did a disservice to were bruce ismay who i think was like a bad guy but not as bad as the movie makes him out to be. And James Cameron sort of was like, yeah, I took a lot of dramatic license there. Like he did get into a boat. It was rumored that he had put some pressure to make the boat go faster,

but also he stayed on the boat until the very last minute and rescued a lot of people. And like, there were like, there's a lot of gray area, I guess. I see. So,

which I don't really care about the officer murdoch conversation's a little more interesting because officer murdoch is um for i mean i guess for the it's hard to keep all the officers straight he's the one that kills tommy and then takes his own life in the movie that is also a lot of creative license and his family reached out to james cameron and was like what the fuck and james cameron was like um yeah like it technically could have happened because apparently historically usually when something's in like creative license james cameron has done the work to make it like well you can't say it didn't happen like even the room that Rose stays in in the movie was technically empty so it's like well that's where I'm gonna put them because you can't prove someone else was there but in that case it was like there

were rumors of like several gunshots that went off in an area where officer murdoch was but obviously tommy ryan is a fictional character so he was not killed by officer murdoch he didn't exist but there is like no i think that there is like one speculation that murdoch may have taken his own life but there's like basically no historical precedent for it so his family was rather upset that that was the narrative imposed on him yeah and taking bribes as well there was no evidence that he took bribes sure right he kind of he kind of got fucked a little that sucks um but yeah hollywood loves embellishing facts. Yeah. I mean, dramatic effect.

But as far as like, as far as historical movies, getting things right, this movie gets more right than it doesn't. So there you go. And we love that. Yeah. Speaking of Tommy, we meet Tommy. He befriends Jack and Fabrizio. He's played by Jason Barry. I never bothered to look up who played Tommy before this and I was like oh it's a guy named Jason Barry he was on the commentary

track and he just said like he's actually Irish wow authenticity yeah I'm like Danny Nucci over here who's like um bonjour question mark like um okay so we meet a few of these characters we're hanging out with jack and fabrizio on deck and this is when jack sees rose across the deck of the ship and he's like hubba hubba schwing a wuga speaking of a wuga oh my god that's a james cameron story that has nothing i thought i thought yeah caitlin had nothing to do with titanic i thought that there is listeners there is i think i probably referenced it in our avatar episode as well james cameron whenever he goes on a press tour he says a bunch of stuff that's awful and then a bunch of stuff that is incoherent one of the things he said on this press tour that was

incoherent was that at times when he's on set the set for Avatar he will not respond to anyone unless they first use a deafening awooga sound and that's how he knows that it's important enough that it requires his precious baby boy attention so when i was watching behind the scene featurettes of this movie i can't prove that the thing has been true for a long time but in the big the ship is sunk everyone's flailing around that was filmed i think in like a i think it was burbank like it was somewhere close by like it was just a large tank in burbank with like four feet of water and that's where the i'll never let go scene was filmed and all that there is a moment in the featurette it's not called attention to but

knowing what we know now about james cameron and awuga james cameron is not talking to anybody a loud a wuga sound sent it like is sounded and then all of a sudden he goes what i think the awuga system has been in place for decades wow look is any are any of james cameron's longtime employees listening to this show can we get some confirmation on the awuga i i was shocked i was knocked on my ass by this that's fascinating i'm not surprised though it's it sounds like he's been an absolute tyrant for a very long time but but the awuga system specifically i'm like that is some evil genius shit like what on earth i i i think we can date a wuga back to 96 i support it yeah so jack is seeing rose and he's like hubba hubba who's that and his friends are like yeah right dude she's rich and

you're poor it'll never work out you'll have angels flying out of your arse etc before you get next to the likes of her says tommy um classic tommy there's also there was like a fight with james cameron and the costume designer for that scene where i guess rose like woman would wear hat if outside that is like a thing of the time and so they were kind of getting into it because james carman's like i don't want a floppy old hat on kate winslet's hat like it would look goofy if she was wearing a big floppy hat when jack sees her but he said well she's already rebelled against everything else and then he took the hat off kate winslet's head and threw it into the ocean because he's a drama queen. And the costume designer, I think, was like, OK.

And that was and then they shot the scene. Wow. Oh, Jim. I know he's a piece of work. I don't know what to make of the man. He's really a piece of work. Into the ocean? Like, so not necessary.

Very dramatic, yeah. Okay, so Jack has spotted Rose, but they don't meet until that night when Rose attempts suicide by jumping off the ship. She feels trapped by her position in life. She feels trapped in this relationship with Cal, who is controlling and abusive. So she makes this attempt, but Jack sees her, realizes what's happening, and he stops her. He saves her. Here's what James Cameron had to say about this. It made me laugh. When you think about it, it's sort of a risky proposition for two people to meet in the middle of an attempted suicide.

But that's long pause. That's what happens here. I mean, there's no arguing that. Sometimes he talks about his own movies as if he has no control over what happens in them. In a way that makes me laugh. He's like, I don't know. i guess that's just how it went his argument for a long time before he commissioned this scientific study to figure out if two people could have actually fit on the door and survived his argument before that was jack dies in the

script so he has to die it's like yeah you wrote that in the script you literally have control over this but like i guess whatever you want there there was also kind of a because i think at the time this movie came out it's it's kind of interesting how like kate winslet and james cameron's relationship seems to have changed over time. Because at the time the movie came out, I kind of forgot. It was heavily rumored that Kate Winslet hated him, never wanted to work with him again, because she got hypothermia on set. Who would want to work with him again after that? But then time passed, and now she's in Avatar 2.

She got into a tank for the man again. So it seems like their relationship repaired over time. But it's interesting to hear, like, there are a couple of anecdotes that Kate Winslet shares on this commentary track where you're like, she was not having a good time. With the scene where she is attempting suicide, she's talking about how they had to shoot it so many times because that was a green screen in a way that you can tell too but like whatever it's 1997 but like they had to shoot it over and over and over to the point where she like couldn't get herself to cry as much like she just was like spent and couldn't get herself to cry and so someone on the production i have a guess as to who was like just blow air in her face until she starts crying and and so they like blew a fan in her face until her eyes

watered and then they're like all right start again and you're like jesus christ this poor and she's like 20 years old you know it's like they're no one talks back in those situations and i just was like bless that's not my mayor of east town tell you what i love that lady she seems so great yeah the abuse that actors and performers have to endure not cool yeah okay so jack saves rose saying if you jump i'm going to have to jump in there after you she goes that's absurd then cal and some of the crew show up to the scene and they're like what's going on and rose is like oh i was just leaning over and i slipped and jack saved me i was leaning far over for the propellers they had a hard time finding cal and then you know what they did what they saw the phantom is that a movie that billy zane is the movie that billy zane was

in okay i haven't which he plays a super he plays a superhero called the phantom and then i've never seen it either i just think it is a very if you look at like the visuals and like the trailer for that movie it's very weird to be like, I would see that movie and be like, yep, he should be in Titanic. Cause it's like just a super campy superhero movie where he's like, I am the phantom.

Like it's very, it's so Billy Zane is so iconic. Like I'll never get over it. He was, wait, I need to tell you the Billy Zane arts and crafts story he was just really like people seem to everyone who talked about Billy Zane seemed to be like and he is just what a character they're like Leo and Billy just had us rolling 25-8. John Lando said, Billy is an artiste. And then Billy Zane says that he turned,

so like the whole, as you know, Caitlin, and maybe some of our listeners know, the way that the Titanic set was built was that they built half of it in Mexico. And then a lot of it is like reverse shots.

But so they had to like move the entire cast and crew to Mexico for months so Billy Zane turned his apartment in Mexico into it sounds sort of like he is slowly losing his grasp on reality but you let me know he he sort of seems to feel that way too he's like yeah you know just these long days you're in a place you don't know anybody and I just sort of like I like to express myself and I turned my apartment into't know anybody and I just sort of like I like to express myself and I turned my apartment into an art studio and I started make I started quote doing a lot of

abstract expressionism okay and he says like I was going very Pollock at the time it was rough you know it got a little weird out there but arts and crafts pulled me through okay which I think is a beautiful outlook on life and a lot of people billy's we i think we sent them to each other at the time but billy zane took all these amazing candids on the set of titanic because he was an artiste and he like will occasionally post them to instagram and they're all the best oh billy king king of the world even that's true okay so they're like wow jack you saved rose you're a hero and you should come have dinner with us tomorrow night and he's like okay and then later that evening when cal and rose are back in their rooms, Cal gives Rose the heart of the ocean.

And he's like, I know you've been melancholy and I don't pretend to understand why. But here's a very expensive diamond necklace. And she's like, oh. The next day, Rose pays Jack a visit to thank him for saving her and for his discretion. And he's like, do you even love Cal? And she's like, you're being very rude. And then they argue a bit. But then she sees his drawings because Jack is an artiste and they are drawings of naked sex workers in paris he was not getting into

abstract expressionism he was pretty straightforward oh that'd be so funny if they if you cut to like billy zane's abstract expressionist paintings like in his binder you mean in jack's binder yeah he's like um i don't know i guess i just sort of don't know anyone here and i'm just trying some stuff out. That deck scene, I guess that, I mean, I've seen, I'm sure we've both seen audition tapes. Like that was like the audition scene for Titanic for one of them. But the way that the scene is was rewritten the night before. And there were all of these cool, like for every pee-pee-poo-poo naked story that kate winslet and leonardo dicaprio share of which there are many there's fart in the jacket stick it in the face

surprise naked at him there's uh we would pee in the tanks all the time like she was like leo would eat a ton of garlic on days we had to kiss to prank me i was just like you guys are weird you guys are you guys are it sounds very like weird sibling kind of like antagonism but but they also it was kind of cool to like they were always especially kate winslet who i just love her so much but like they were always trying to like add in little things into the movie because it sounds like kate and leonardo dicaprio both felt that the movie they were worried that the movie was going to be too corny and too earnest and i think that especially because it was like whatever dicaprio was like like he almost didn't take the part because he's like he's too perfect like where's his damage blah

blah blah and like kate winslet had played a bunch of like complicated roles and it's not I mean Rose is kind of a meatier role than Jack but yeah whatever like I think that they were both trying to add in they're trying to get their little Gen X two cents in sure where they could and so they went to James Cameron when that scene was being like in the process of being rewritten. And I guess that it was at their insistence that Jack says like, well, do you love the guy or not? Like stuff like that. Like there's a few lines in this movie that the way they would rehearse. I also loved the way that they would rehearse them where like they would do it as written

and then James Cameron would have them do the scene again the way that they would just talk to each other to get like the cadence down for like, well, how would you actually have this conversation? And then you would do it as written again with the correct cadence, which is a pretty smart way to rehearse people. But like they occasionally would like, Kate Winslet got like a lot of stuff into this movie.

She is the person who said that rose should spit in cal's face originally she was poking him with a hairpin but she was like i already learned how to spit and then james cameron was like shit that should have been my idea she and francis fisher also suggest in their scene together where francis fisher's like tying the corset originally it was the reverse and kate winslet was tying francis fisher's corset and they were like it makes way more sense thematically if it's the other way around and james cameron was like oh shit maybe i'm not that good of a screenwriter it's like yeah not really but like i just i thought it was fun where every time there was

a point where it's like oh i got that in i was like that's so cool that is very cool and I'm glad that James Cameron like listens to reason and lets his yeah he seems grouchy but it's like it it seems like when someone else has a better idea this is like not a huge compliment but it's like if someone else has a better idea he will go with that idea that's good yeah let's take another quick break and then we will come back for more titanic hey everybody this is matt rogers and bowen yang we've got some exciting news for you you know we're always bringing you the best guests right well this week we're taking it to the next level the one the only k Katherine Hahn is joining us

on Lost Culture East. That's right. The queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories,

and of course, the culture. I feel some Sandra Bernhardt in you. Oh, my God. I would love it. I have to watch Lost. Oh, you have to. No, I know. I would love it. I have to watch Lost. Oh, you have to.

No, I know. I'm so behind. Katherine Hahn can sing. Oh, I'm really good at karaoke. What's your song? Yeah, what's your song? Oh, I love a ballad. I felt Bjork's music.

I just was like, who is this person? I got to hawk this slalom, Rudy. I'm not hawk the slalom. I absolutely love it. It was somehow Shakespearean when you said it. It was somehow gorgeous. Yee, my slok, you hollum. Listen to Las Culturistas on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network

on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Gianna Prudente. And I'm Jemay Jackson-Gatz. Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I speak up when I'm feeling overwhelmed. Or can I negotiate a higher salary if this is my first real job? Girl, yes. Each week we answer your unfiltered work questions. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in experts who do like resume specialist Morgan Saner. The only difference between the person who doesn't get the job and the person who gets the job is usually who applies. Yeah, I think a lot about that quote. What is it like you miss 100% of the shots you never take? Yeah, rejection is scary, but it's better than you rejecting yourself. Together, we'll share what it really takes to thrive in the early years of your career without sacrificing your sanity or sleep.

Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th, 2017, was murdered. There are crooks everywhere you look now. The situation is desperate. My name is Manuel Delia. I am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhearts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks. Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state.

And she paid the ultimate price. Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And we're back. Okay, so we have this scene with Jack and Rose, and it's a little rocky here and there, but then she's like, let me look at your sexy drawings. And then she's like, awooga.

And then they're kind of like bonding and flirting, and he teaches her how to spit. Speaking of spitting. I guess that they were spitting, the water CG'd in in that scene, and they were spitting onto the water cg'd in in that scene and they were spitting onto like the floor of a parking lot okay and leonardo dicaprio like set up these little targets on the ground it would be like to try to hit my hit my little target wow i love fun facts okay so meanwhile bruce ismay

is pressuring captain ej smith. Smith, played by Bernard Hill. I want them to marvel at her speed. Yeah. And he wants the captain to light the last four boilers so that the ship goes really fast and gets to New York City early. Ever heard of New York City? Yeah. Because the maiden voyage of Titanic must make headlines. That actor fucking rules.

Apparently he and Francis Fisher are good friends. And so even in scenes that he wasn't in, that Francis Fisher was in, he would come to set those days and watch her work. So I was like, oh, it's kind of fun. Mr. Ismay was sitting just off screen for that whole mother-daughter corset scene. He was there. That's nice. I know.

He's just supporting his friend. Okay, so then it's time for dinner. Molly Brown dresses Jack in her son's tuxedo. And then Jack joins Rose and Cal and Ruth and a bunch of other rich first class people for dinner. Ruth and Cal think Jack is gross. But Rose is like, wow, I like him. What a free spirit. Here's a Molly Brown fact, please.

So Molly Brown, she's very characterized as new money. And James Cameron takes a little bit of creative license with her in this where it's like she was a big personality. But also she was, I guess, in real life was like pretty dead set on fitting in and would not speak out as quite as much as she does in the movie. I'm glad she does in the movie. But there is like a fun and not I mean, cares it's just like rich people shit but there's like a brief conversation with john jacob astor who was like the richest man in america at the time and his teenage wife and every account is like he doted on his wife and you're like okay like she was a teenager but i guess he died but apparently they were like really good friends and so like james cameron tried to add in like there's like a scene there's like an

exchange where kathy bates is like hey master yeah so that is a reference to like how she used to talk to him and i guess that like the reason that he liked her was because everyone treated him like you know god and she was like really she treated him like a person and he's like going they had like been on vacations together there's a picture of them on camels um so it turns out i mean it's like i know whatever you know that like people knew each other on this boat but i was like oh molly brown actually lost like a dear friend and it was just some rich guy with a teenage wife. So ultimately, who cares?

Ultimately, I don't feel that bad. But personally, it must have been hard for her. Yeah, that's true. Poor Molly. Yeah. Okay. So after dinner, Jack to Rose is like, so you want to go to a real party? And he invites Rose to a third class party below deck

and it's a good ass time rose is chugging beer she's smoking cigarettes she's doing this tippy toe ballet thing where she was on wires for that oh Ooh, okay. Quick dancing facts with Jamie. Kate Winslet and DiCaprio had to be trained to dance. It is them doing all the dancing. Kate Winslet, all of the stories are like, Kate Winslet was lovely and so great. Leonardo DiCaprio was like pretty good, which I would also describe their caliber of performances in this movie.

But apparently like, I don't know. It just sounds like Leonardo DiCaprio is in his, like, pussy posse, I'm a little shit era during this. Because he, like, I guess would really avoid the dance lessons. He, like, didn't want to do them. And I know. I'm just like, you fucking brat. But this is a fun story where the dance coach also, like, the is on the commentary track it's very comprehensive wow but the dance coach was like yeah like kate was having a hard

time but she worked really hard at it and she picked on it up on it pretty quickly i was proud of her and i was like leo uh was always avoiding me and he didn't want to go to the lessons and every time and she was like i would have to come to his trailer between takes to like help him learn like the clogging dance that he does because that was like i mean it wouldn't have been easy and she was like and he eventually learned but i would always have to knock on his trailer for a while and tell him to put his pet lizard away before i could come in he had a pet lizard on set all the time he had a lizard named blizzard that like lived with him in mexico and i guess that the dance every time the dance instructor came by she'd have to like pound on his trailer door and be like put the lizard away it's dancing time and he'd be like no like what it really like in i i have no particular

attachment to leonardo dicaprio i'm too old for him but i was really endeared to him when i found out that he had a lizard friend with him the whole time i'm like wow people really were it sounds like people were really in a strange place mentally on the set of billy zane's making abstract art leo is spooning his lizard lizard it sounds like everyone's in a very very like weird place when they're but i was like i wonder whatever became of blizzard the lizard i haven't been able to find pictures of him damn her i don't know i don't know them i don't i i don't know what was going on with blizzard but i just wanted to say of course there wouldn't be a record of blizzard the lizard but he saved leonardo dicaprio in every way a person can be saved. Okay.

Okay, so we're below deck at the party. Jack and Rose are really having a blast. They're spinning. The scene ends in what is essentially a conga line. The next day... Wait. Caitlin, I found a picture of Leo and Blizzard. Whoa. I'm texting it to you right now wait they're

actually oh god why was he so hot during this time why is the picture of him and Blizzard sexy wow he actually there's actually like a bunch of pictures of him on the set of Titanic with Blizzard okay he like loves this it reminds me of men are so like something is so wrong with them where like i read i read recently i forget what i watched oh i watched ticket to paradise with julia roberts and george clooney yeah i didn't finish it to be honest but i was reading about george clooney and george clooney ended a marriage because one of his why one of his ex-wives was like i'm really sick of your pet pig and i guess that it reached the he has i think the pig is no longer with us but he had a pet pig forever and it was big and at one point allegedly one of his marriages pre-amal someone said it's me or the pig and he said get out he said i choose the pig he chose the pig

wow which i would never recover from that but all that to say yeah, Leo and his lizard, George and his pig. Great. I love that there's pictures of Leo and Blizzard. That actually makes me happy. They're very nice. Oh, no. We'll post the pictures on the Instagram when this episode comes out. Okay.

So the next morning after this party, Cal and Rose are having breakfast and Cal screams at her and he flips the table for hanging out with Jack instead of him because he had his undertaker of a manservant follow Rose, this guy named Lovejoy. Yeah. Ruth also gets on Rose's case saying, you cannot see that boy again. Because it turns out that Rose and Ruth's family money is gone and that Rose needs to marry Cal and like have access to his fortune to ensure Rose and Ruth's survival. Right.

So basically Rose needs to stop jeopardizing her relationship with Cal Francis Fisher had like a really nice or I guess like a just like a very thoughtful kind of like meditation on that scene and she like uh she she seems really sweet she's saying that how like in the 10 years since Titanic had come out there were a a lot of like younger fans. And I know I was in this, I think that like early in this show, we weren't even quite at like comprehension place where it's like, why is the mom so mean? And like Francis Fisher was like fielding questions

like this from young fans of Titanic for years who viewed her as a villain, which there are villainous, you know, whatever. But she did a really i think like concise way of just like talking about how she would talk to younger fans of the movie and she's like no i understand why you feel that way you have to understand like she's like it doesn't make what she did right but women had no options at this time they couldn't vote they were already in a precarious position.

She should have been thinking about her daughter's mental well-being, but she was thinking about immediacy. And she said, quote, Ruth's pain is that her daughter will not be able to experience safety, unquote. And I thought that was a very empathetic view of that character. Yeah, I agree. Yeah. Okay. So with all this pressure from her mom, Rose relents. And she tells Jack that she cannot see him again.

And he is like, they've got you trapped, Rose. And you need to break free. You can do it. You're the most amazing, wonderful girl. I mean, woman. I've ever known. And then we're like, wow, King. Just kidding, just kidding, just kidding.

But she's not having it and she leaves. Meanwhile, Mr. Andrews is giving a little tour to the rich people. And Rose figures out that there are not enough lifeboats on board for all the passengers also captain ej smith is getting iceberg warnings and we're like um foreshadowing much and and history fact apparently for this for this movie the original like manufacturers of the titanic harland and wolf or one of the original manufacturers gave james cameron access to thomas andrews earlier drawings and like gave him access to his journals and and process and so this production was the first to confirm even before

history books that there had been versions of the titanic in which there were enough lifeboats but that like like he says in the movie like it was considered to make the deck look too cluttered and so they were gotten rid of so that was actually breaking freaking news wow i know kind of cool um okay so then after having told jack that she can't see him anymore she's like wait a minute fuck this and then she goes back to jack he's at the i believe the bow of the ship the front of it he's brooding but she's like jack i changed my mind and it's sunset and he's like get up here so she like climbs on the railing of the ship and he's like close your eyes and then he like spreads out her arms and she opens her eyes and she's like i'm flying and then i'm and

then i'm crying and it's all a lot this is a very commonly circulated anecdote but for that scene some of the shots are done with a matte painting of the sunset but the big kissing shot was done with an actual sunset and they waited for forever they were like whatever it was like they had two chances at the shot and Kate Winslet it was what I don't know I feel like Kate Winslet and James Cameron their relationship is so confusing but like this was a positive anecdote with them where Kate and Leo are up on the railing and then there's one one of the takes where Kate Winslet was like we need to go right now and James Cameron like listened to her and started shooting and that is the shot

that's used in the movie and apparently it's a little bit out of focus because it was so like she was like you need to do it right now and he had them start shooting before they were fully focus checked yeah i can't tell like i couldn't tell but like apparently that shot is a little bit out of focus but they both talk about that and they're like that was a beautiful collaborative moment i know and then she and jack kiss kiss kiss yeah and it's nice and then they go to her room and she shows him the heart of the ocean and she's like i want you to draw me like one of your french girls wearing this wearing only this and then he goes and he's like the abuga sounds and then james cameron goes what what fun fact about the the drawing scene so rose is nude jack's drawing her everyone knows that's

actually james cameron drawing it we will not rehash that a new thing i learned was that you know how like in the music in that scene is like just a single piano playing the rose theme yeah a fun oh i love fun facts so james horner may he rest in peace huge collaborator of james cameron amongst others but there was like a file confusion where so i guess that like james horner had recorded himself playing this track on the piano himself as like a test of like it would sound something like this and like i don't know what the 1996 version of the cloud was but uploaded it to like a mutual server with with the file name sketch sketch meaning this isn't finished this is a rough draft yeah right james cameron sees a file named sketch and thinks it's for the sketching scene and so because i guess james cameron did a lot of editing or like

pre-editing for this movie and there was like he was trying to get this scene together and was like no this isn't quite syncing up like i don't really know what he's thinking with this but then figures it out and then is like wait i love this this like is perfect it's so like spare and beautiful and he like called james horner he's like i love sketch and james horner's like what are you talking about and i guess that like guess that James Horner had to really be talked into letting them use that in the final cut of the movie because he was like, I had a whole plan. And James Cameron's like, no, this is good.

I love sketch. Wow. I know, isn't that sweet? It's very sweet, yeah. The movies. The movie really feeling like a movie in this scene tell you what it really is um okay so she's like draw me like one of your french girls and then he draws her like one of his french girls it's the drawing we saw at the beginning and it was the most erotic moment of rose's life up until then at least and then you cut to bill paxton

horny okay then lovejoy who is still following rose at cal's behest comes in and starts chasing rose and jack around the ship they end up in like the storage compartments where all of like the big crates and cars are being stored and they get into a car and jack is like beep beep where to miss and she's like to the stars and then she pulls him into the back seat and she says put your hands on me jack and then she cheering to quote the script slides under his welcome weight now that's something that comes up in all seven episodes and it should it is just not okay that that's the way that that was written down no one should have said that no one should have thought that and james cameron should have had to pay some sort of fine. He should have to chop all of his fingers off.

He, oh my God. What, what is, give me James Cameron's Banshees of Innisharen, honestly. Like, who is he sending his damn fingers to? Like, who is, I wonder if, there has to be a director that james cameron can't stand right like i know that del toro is one of his best friends and he has a lot of good seems like in terms of like i mean and this means nothing because it's like among male auteurs he seems to be pretty well liked but i'm like there has to be someone who's on his shit list oh sure who is he mailing those fingers to i want to know or or banshees of inisharen where del toro is colin farrell and james cameron is brendan gleason where one day james cameron's

like i don't want to be your friend anymore and del toro's like why that would be so sad well it was so sad when it happened to colin farrell i know it's always so sad it's the saddest story uh about friends who are boys okay so so jack and rose have sex in the back of the car and this is when we get the hand slapping the steamy window moment iconic love it then they go back up to the deck of the ship and rose is like when the ship docks i'm getting off with you and he's like oh my god what and then they're kissing and they're giggling and it's distracting the two lookouts who are in like the crow's nest area and that is like a brilliant writing decision of like um they saw people

kissing and they got horny therefore they're they have blood on their hands before the titanic sunk um yeah yeah so they're too distracted to notice the iceberg that is directly ahead of them but then they look up and they see the iceberg and they sound the alarm then there is in my opinion maybe the best and most tension-filled sequence ever committed to film i agree where all of the crew is scrambling around they're trying to prevent the ship from hitting the iceberg there's this moment of is it gonna hit is it gonna miss well i don't know which is wild because you know how it ends but he still makes you feel that way like it's so good and my my already very high opinion of the sequence was further improved there's like a million little bit it's like that scene is also full of like historical references too like that sequence specifically there was a lot of care taken to like reference survivors who were very helpful in

piecing together a cohesive account of what actually happened and so there's like one of the men that worked in the engine room who was like a huge source for like giving insight into what was going on there he like appears and like has a line of dialogue and then like there's just like all of these like incidental players in the story that like helped build out this clear picture that this movie is even able to exist because of and i just i just i love shit like that i'm so glad that it's like you take the time to like have this or even shit like the fucking pomeranian you're like movie feels like a movie folks i love it james cameron does his research he goes to the library he and he reads those books he stay he and

and and he stays for more than a day i actually don't think he goes to the library someone goes on his behalf and they photocopy a lot of stuff i don't know how much he leaves his house brings a library to him but he consumes it is the point yes yes so anyway so there's this very tension filled moment and ultimately historically famously the titanic hits the iceberg and it is chaos. It goes boink. The Foley artist was on the thing being like, so not a lot of people know this, but when they hit the iceberg, it kind of went boink. What if it was like, what's the like, I'm thinking of like an old timey,

like a Hanna-Barbera sound effect of like clunk. Like when Fred Flintstone gets hit on the head. What if it was like that? That should be a thing. Maybe that's a project I will undergo where I, cause I'm already knee deep in my re-editing the endings of movies to make them far more Shrekian. Maybe I will re-edit famous scenes of movies to make them far more shrekian maybe i will read and fully work re-edit famous scenes of movies changing the foley around to make it really well exciting

that's what i did with figure skaters during the olympics and it got it ruined my life for a while so just be careful who you're fucking with okay yeah yeah yeah yeah I watched an interview with James Camp I'm just I'm in the zone like I know he's not a good person I cannot stop watching there I was watching an interview he did at the time yeah in like 97 with um famously disgraced Charlie Rose but there were two things he said in the interview that made me laugh with the not because I'm from the future and they're not. But two things he said in the interview that made me laugh was that he said several times like, oh, like he was talking about how whatever, like you will not get engaged into the story of the Titanic unless you care about the characters. And you also can like fully appreciate what the ship was in its heyday, like what it meant.

And he was like, well, you know, you can go on and on and on about the power of the love between two people until you're blue in the face, but I don't know why you'd do that. And I was like, blue in the face, interesting.

Until you're blue in the face. And thus Avatar was born. And he was foreshadowing himself hard and then like at the end famously disgraced charlie rose asks like oh are you gonna keep making epics after this and he says he it's pretty funny he was like yeah no i don't think i'm ever gonna make another like three hour movie i don't think that i would do that and i was like wow well you're gonna say that until you're blue in the face my friend because you're about to make avatar one one and then two and then three other and then four and then five we're never gonna escape all right okay moving on so the ship hits the iceberg it's chaos as water starts cascading into the lower decks of the ship and into the

boiler room where the workers are trying desperately to escape water starts seeping onto the floors of the third class rooms meanwhile first, first class people are like, Teehee, what's going on? Stop. Then Jack and Rose go to tell Ruth and Cal about the ship hitting the iceberg and the gravity of the situation. But Cal is busy framing Jack for stealing the heart of the ocean and jack gets arrested and handcuffed to a pipe in the master at arms office and rose is like damn i guess my boyfriend who i met two days ago is a thief that sucks life comes at you fast like yeah and then mr andrews is having a meeting with bruce ismay and the captain and some other end of vhs tape one we're in it baby he's saying the ship will sink it's a mathematical certainty

we've got an hour two at the most and then the captain turns to bruce ismay and says i believe you may get your headlines mr ismay and then we go because it's like the most iconic i may like there's so many amazing lines but i do think that that's my favorite it's really good because it has like this like generational significance too like i understand like if a 17 year old watched this movie there's no way that would be their favorite line but i feel like the vhs split it has a generational significance it's true it's my favorite line in the movie and also i'm like bitchy much captain smith what are you like you did it like uh okay quick fun fact i think maybe we've i feel like maybe we've referenced this before but bernard hill who plays captain smith was the only cast member which is like this makes sense but he

was the only cast member to have previously also been in a different titanic movie have we ever talked about that whoa oh you mean kind of like how oh what's the spongebob voice actor who was in both pinocchios tom kenny tom kenny yes it's tom kenny it's the tom kenny pinocchio syndrome the ground was set by bernard hill and titanic properties what other titanic movie was he in he was in a night to remember i think the second most famous titanic movie that came out i believe in the 50s he would have been a small child yeah no he was a young man i think that he is like in the because this is the 90s. He would have been a small child, yeah? No, he was a young man. I think that he is like in the,

because this is the 90s, this is like 40 years later. So I think, you know, Bernard Hill is like in his maybe late 60s or like sometime somewhere in his 60s. So he was in his early 20s. But he plays the part of Officer Fleet, who I believe is one of the guys

that spots the iceberg in A Night to Remember. And he, I guess there's like a fun i keep thinking there's a fun anecdote but they but i'm right um one of the producers was talking about how like bernard hill you know he was like he'd played officer fleet and now he's playing the captain 45 years later how wild and so he spoke with the actor who plays officer fleet in this movie and again i just i'm like the more you you just hear about the actors it just sounds like they are really like it felt like it sounds like they were going through what we as a world would go through during lockdown where you're just like kind of stuck somewhere and you're just kind of like something is different in your brain but you can't but there's no one

like completely with it to verify that with um so the guy who played officer fleet had been in mexico where he didn't know anybody for six weeks and then met bernard hill and he was like hey how long were you on set waiting to do your scenes for a night to remember and bernard hill was like two hours you know this poor guy is like losing it and is like not himself anymore and bernard hill is like i don't know kind of back then you were just gonna go to burbank and like say your lines and get the fuck out like and it just sounded um very i don't know i guess if i was an older actor i would um i would clown on younger actors in a similar way i'd be like yeah must suck for you uh anyways anyways do the part that i formerly played justice or else i'm gonna bully you i don't know why aren't they turning uh i wonder if it was that

guy or the other guy i don't know don't know yeah okay so the crew starts loading the first class passengers into the lifeboats. Women and children first, of course. Which was not maritime law. That was unusual. Oh. Generally, it was every man for himself. Oh.

Yeah. So that's happening. The string quartet is playing. Rose is about to get on a lifeboat with her mom and Molly and the other rich women. And then Cal says something very Cal and shitty. Is this when he says, I should have kept that drawing. It would have been worth a lot more by morning. Yeah.

And so once again, she's like, fuck this. She says my favorite line of the movie to Cal, which is you unimaginable bastard you and then she spits in his face kate winslet baby oh it wouldn't have worked with with a hairpin grow up yeah right oh it's so good the way she does it it's so cathartic it's wonderful and then she runs off to go find jack who is still handcuffed to a pipe and the room that he's in is filling with

water rose finds him but oh no there's no key to the handcuffs so she goes and gets an axe she chops the handcuff chain uh freeing him and then they have to swim through the freezing cold water back to safety jack and rose then link up with fabrizio and tommy they're still below deck because at this point has she already punched the employee in the face yes because she does that right before she finds the axe right okay i wanted to just share a quick anecdote about that before we get because the third class fact that is like included in the movie is that in the movie it's like tommy runs the charge of like the bench through the um you know so apparently that actually did happen and there was a bunch of irish third class passengers who did something very similar which i didn't know i

thought that was really cool that they included that. But I wanted to share a fun James Cameron, another just James Cameron sitting in a room talking line. Because again, he talks about all of his characters as if someone else has written them. But in a way where it's like, he really likes the movie. He enjoys watching it. So after Rose, whatever, when Rose is coming back down it's like he really likes the movie he enjoys watching it um so after rose whatever when rose

is coming back down looking for the axe and there's like a panicked employee who's like you have to come with me and she punches him in the face she said listen james cameron says quote rose is all about getting people to listen to her and that's what you get long pause if you don't listen to rose he's kind of he's kind of talking about nothing for most of it but i was just i was so delighted i was like it you just sound like a guy watching the movie i mean i imagine it's very difficult to have to comment basically non-stop during a three hour and 14 minute movie but you know he insisted on doing it by himself like i'm just like why didn't you just like invite a second person you know why is why are there 14 people on one commentary track and then you doing this for the other one

but it was but but it was literally just like random things like that and then just like facts james cameron knows about the titanic because ultimately that is why he did it he really just wanted an excuse to go explore the wreckage of titanic and that is why the movie exists dude i respect the hell out of that as like as someone who has made their living just like getting other people to pay for things that I wanted to do anyways and then making something about it. It is the perfect crime. Pretty cool. Yeah.

Works for everyone. Okay. So Jack and Rose link up with Fabrizio and Tommy. They are still below deck because while the first class people are being loaded onto the lifeboats, the third class passengers are being locked behind gates. So Jack and Tommy and the other guys break down a gate. Back on deck, it's chaos as people are trying to get on lifeboats because there are famously not enough. Jack gets Rose to a lifeboat and cal is there and he's like i've arranged for both jack and i to get on a boat so she's like okay i'll get on this lifeboat

but then she looks up at jack and once again she's like fuck this and she jumps and billy zane gives another one of my like top 10 line reads of the movie. He's pretty heavily featured in my top 10 line reads. He goes, one way or another. He says one way or another. I'm like, how did you even do that with your mouth? I always win, Jack. One way or another.

One way or another. He says one way or another as if it is like a single word. Like you're just like, how did he do that? That is so wild okay quick thing about dicaprio that based on because we've covered a number of leonardo dicaprio flims yes on this podcast we i believe it was the summer of 2020 i remember where i was you know we covered inception and we bravely made the connection that leonardo dicaprio is constantly wet in clothes in his movies yeah all the time it happens with alarming frequency it happens in

almost every single one it's kind of like it's in his contract or something like i have to be in clothes submerged in water so imagine my shock when i'm listening to the producer slash everybody who's not james cameron commentary track that decap like leonardo dicaprio is glaringly missing he was not available he was inside of a bear or whatever he was doing like uh yeah but producer john landau says very matter-of-factly leon Leonardo DiCaprio hates acting in the water. Wow. And I was like, now that's a shock. No, from all of his movies.

And then Kate Winslet jumps onto that and says that he was such a baby every time he had to be in the water. And I think she sounded, 10 years years later annoyed about it because she was just like she's like and it's just interesting because you know he was in the water for a lot of scenes but not even half as many scenes as i was in the water and i got hypothermia and i just like kind of really didn't complain as much as he did on set but apparently like even though the water scenes were interesting to hear about again it's like kate winslet is just like left in the fucking trenches in this because in spite of not letting king to act in the water leonardo dicaprio is scuba certified for some reason okay probably because he's in the water

all the time um even before this movie so he's already scuba certified but kate winslet there's like an anecdote in the in the scene where they're trying to unlock the gate so that they don't drown yes in that scene Kate Winslet had like a panic attack on set because they were filling the set with water like practical effect style yeah and so there were only a couple of inches to breathe but to James Cameron's credit like it seems like he did everything he could to set up safety protocols and like there were rescue divers like no one was significantly injured or died it sounds like the PCP thing was about as bad as it got but like the safety instructor showed Kate Winslet like

it is gonna feel scary because there only will be a couple of inches to breathe but if you push up on the ceiling there is a ton of space and you're fine and that was like how the scene was set up and so she felt comfortable with that but then it happened that like when they were doing a take she pushed up on the scene and the ceiling stuck and so there was not infinite space and she had like a panic attack and then like had to take some time during the day. I know it just shooting this movie sounded like it sounded like everything was done that was possible. But still, it's like you're sinking a boat every day. It just sounded fucking terrible.

I yeah, I could not um sorry i was looking through our instagram to find the post that we made of all of the like screen grabs from movies where leonardo dicaprio is in water he had been in water many times at this point the fact that he's still complaining about it is unprofessional and many times after um because we've got inception obviously titanic the beach shutter island great gatsby romeo and juliet he's in the water is he not romeo and juliet that was pre-titanic he falls in a pool in wolf of wall street he's in water in the revenant he falls into water and what's eating gilbert grape it's just like he's always in water and he's always in his clothes in water it's honestly like with that in mind it's absolutely shocking that kate winslet is an avatar way of water and

he isn't right like if there's anyone who's primed for being in the water it's dicaprio but apparently i was just i was truly like shocked and appalled to hear that he didn't like it. Because, not to empathize with him, because who cares? But you're also like, wow, if he really truly doesn't like acting in water, his life is a nightmare. Like, he, little does he know, he's going to be in the water for another 15 years, minimum. You know, like, they're not going to take him out of the tank like i assumed he liked being in the water or why would this be happening to him so much but apparently as of 97 he did not like being in the water he was peeing in the water he was complaining about

the water blizzard starving to death off screen who knows what's going on with Blizzard? It's a mess. Oh, Blizzard the lizard. Right, right, right. Blizzard the lizard. Yeah. Who knows? Okay. So Rose is in this lifeboat, but then she's looking up at Jack and she's like, actually, no, I'm going to jump off the lifeboat, jump onto Titanic and be with Jack.

And then she and Jack are running toward each other. I love this sequence so much. And then she and Jack are running toward each other. I love this sequence so much. And then they meet up and then they're kissing. It's so beautiful. She's like, you jump, I jump. And he's like, yeah. God, they're so ridiculous. I really, I really love them.

That sequence never doesn't get me big time. See, I'm just like, romance romance is dead i have no feelings and i only have feelings it's ruining my life it gets me every time if you want to feel some technical distance from it there's a fun they had to like shoot that upshot of leonardo dicaprio like when the boat is lowering from both angles because they only have one side of the boat. Right. And so apparently there's a few cuts in the back and forth where Leonardo DiCaprio's part will shift just so. Because so much of this movie was shot in reverse that I sent to you something that I think should be Bechtelcast merch. Where something that wasn't completely symmetrical in its costuming or whatever it was.

Such as lettering. Lettering. So like a white starline uniform that says white starline. something that wasn't completely symmetrical in in its costuming or whatever it was such as lettering lettering so like a white starline uniform that says white starline they would have to shoot it not for but for certain scenes they would have to shoot it with a regular costume and then they would also have to shoot it with a costume that just said everything backwards because they're like oh well this is for this side of the boat so we're just going to reverse shot everything so this will make things easier and I want a backwards white starline sweatshirt so bad I Jamie really you can design that I know and I and I feel like our listeners will value it as well and it's it's the best kind of piece of clothing because it's like a little annoying but not too annoying which is my favorite

my favorite and it's like when you know you know yeah and it's also a conversation starter but if you don't like that's fine and i'll keep walking yeah i'm an adult right um okay so rose has jumped off the lifeboat and met back up with jack which makes Cal very upset that Rose chose Jack over him. I hope you're happy together. He grabs Lovejoy's gun and starts shooting at them. So they have to escape and run back down into the bowels of the ship, which are very full of water. And there's this little boy that Jack and Rose try to save.

They almost get trapped behind another gate, but they make it out at the last second. Quick thing about the little boy that Jack and Rose try to save they almost get trapped behind another gate but they make it out at the last second quick thing about the little boy that was shot obviously so that like there was no little boy stunt double that was knocked over by 50,000 tons of water yeah but in any case like the way that that scene was shot I just thought it was so interesting where in that scene a stuntman and a little dummy of a little boy are knocked over by a ton of water and then the cast off of that water like a ton of water also hits jack and rose yeah that shot is one of the first face swapping like deep fake shots ever committed to film that is not the actors that's their stunt doubles because it was like

you couldn't ask an actor to be hit with that amount of force those are stunt doubles and yeah Leonardo DiCaprio and Kate Winslet's face are deep faked onto that and I watched it to try to see if like how obvious it was it didn't feel super obvious to me but I think we should go back and watch it together sometime but apparently that's like one of the first deep fake shots ever done interesting i know it's wild well jamie come over literally whenever to watch titanic i mean like we will probably watch it on tour and then also at the movies yeah the movies yeah we come to this place for titanic oh baby we're going to that place to laugh to cry to watch titanic we are going to that place um okay meanwhile cal is trying to get on a lifeboat

and he uses a lost child as an excuse to get on i have a child i have a child he's so iconic i love it nearby captain ej smith is disassociating yes which is a creative choice by bernard hill interesting the band stops playing but then one of them keeps playing by himself and then they all join back in it's beautiful then there's this montage where you see the old couple in bed together isadora strauss and his wife real people yes in the scene with the irish woman and her children that is we've talked about this before that was an actor named i don't remember but she was like a james cameron yes standby character she had previously acted in brown face for him which is in Italy we had that discussion in aliens our aliens episode but fun fact for Titanic I feel

like it is very very well remembered that she talks to her children about the land of Tir Nanog and an Irish folktale and she came up with that that was not a james cameron original that was her doing research on a bedtime story that an irish woman of that time would have told her kids which i thought was really sweet cool that was nice yeah um okay so we yeah we see the old couple. We see the Irish mummy with her kids. We see all this chaos continuing to ensue as half of the boat is now completely underwater. People are falling off the ship into the water. The captain's room floods. A smokestack falls over and crushes Fabrizio.

Okay, quick thing there. I'm sorry. I know we've been recording this for 900 years. It's been 84 years. Yes. Okay. So are you aware of the alternate Fabrizio death? Yes, because it's in the screenplay.

Okay. So I just wanted to rehash it. Fabrizio, apparently it was shot so that they had multiple options for Fabrizio to die. Between the script between the script and the shooting they were like we're not sure we know this character is going to die yeah we're not sure how tragic Danny Nucci had some fun quotes about it he was just like I died five or six different times and then I just had to go see the movie and see what they chose wow because in the

original like the smokestack is cg'd in so like that shot very easily could have been him being like oh no it's so wet or like whatever uh you know um okay this did sound familiar so you've probably told me before but it was just like fun to revisit there is a version of it that they shot that i haven't seen before but i'm sure it is somewhere uh fabrizio gets out of the wreck paddles over to the lifeboat the cal is in gets up and says you don't understand i have to go to america like in his italian accent that's definitely real whatever and then cal whacks him with an oar on the head and says it's that way and that's how he dies he dies via blunt trauma with cal and i think that everyone decided that like cal was maybe bad enough already and that was maybe not necessary to commit murder even though he already

tried to murder his fiancee and jack um yeah right he was bad enough but that was like i just it was wild i i think i had forgotten about that and it was a wild thing to revisit that's the version that's in the draft of the screenplay that's readily available. If you download the screenplay of Titanic, which you can find online, it's very similar to the finished movie that we all know and love. But there are a few scenes, such as the Fabrizio death scene, that are pretty different in this version of the script than what ends up in the movie. Yeah.

Yeah. That's the version of his death that is in that draft of the script. Pretty funny. Yeah. Yeah. So Fabrizio tragically dies via smokestack. Also, Tommy had been shot a while back. I didn't put that in when it actually happened.

Yeah. Jack and Rose are running to the other end of the ship, the stern, trying to stay on the ship as long as possible. And Rose is like, Jack, this is where we first met. And he goes, okay. Kate Winslet, for those scenes, because they were like chained or like harnessed to the side of the boat. Like there was like a set that was called like the rotating poop deck for like those ending scenes where it would just be like mechanically up and down yeah but it was so difficult to navigate that Kate Winslet took it upon herself again icon to put like basically a full makeup kit in the pocket of her, the big jacket where the heart of the ocean is supposed to be.

And she would do her makeup touch ups and Leonardo DiCaprio's makeup touch ups so that a makeup artist wouldn't have to get like harnessed up onto the boat to fix them before shots. She's the best. She rocks. I know. She's so cool. Love it. Brock love it. it brock love it okay the stern the stern is rising up and up as the bow sinks this is when a guy falls off the ship and hits the propeller and spins which everyone remembers i cannot even count yeah how many people everyone

i've been like i love the movie titanic and someone will be like wow the only thing i remember from that movie is when the guy hits the propeller we talked about this very briefly in our avatar episode where like when push comes to shove james cameron knows how to kill someone in an interesting way yeah because i i didn't because avatar i think this is not controversial at all but like it's just like not as memorable a movie as titanic is but there are a number of kills at the peak of avatar's action that are equally like oh my god what like people are being ripped in half and you're just like holy shit like yeah when when the moment comes, he is not afraid to really let people die. I mean, the guilty and the innocent because it's not like, I mean, at least in Avatar,

it's a little more cathartic because it's like the colonizers. So they're asking for it. They're asking to be torn in half. Propeller guy, I i mean tell me what he did wrong we don't know we don't know we don't know who that is can you imagine how horrific i mean i don't think this would be the stronger creative choice but like in a world where we had met like there had been some plant and payoff with propeller guy like we had met him before oh my god i would be devastated yeah yeah i know i know fabrizio's girlfriend she's nuked yeah you know she got on the wrong

side of the rails sorry babe it's so sad it's sad um okay then the ship breaks in half and the back half of the ship sinks and rose and jack end up in the water among hundreds of other people they swim over to a door and they both try to get on it it flips over because it's not about size it's about buoyancy as we've said um so just rose ends up on the door jack is in the freezing water they are waiting for the lifeboats to come back and save the people in the water rose is like i'm really cold and i can't feel my body and i feel like i might die and jack is like you're not gonna die here you're gonna live a full life promise me you'll do that and never let go of that promise almost like that's setting it up for a scene that's gonna happen shortly where she does that and then she dies and i don't but you know i think it's hard to say i do have one quick thing i wanted

to add in that i forgot i i just am toggling between my commentary notes something i thought was interesting about when the ship is going down the like all those poop deck shots yeah when when the ship is like submerging for the final time again just like there's so many like early i don't know like again he's a bad man but but but boy did he get results you know like there are all all of these like CG things that are now so normal in movies that like James Cameron was like innovating on the set of Titanic where instead of because like CG was still very much whatever in process, like there were all of these shots when the boat was straight up and sinking, the last section of it,

that they would call toilet paper shots because they would have the human extras and like, you know, Jack and Rose and the chef and the girlfriend and all this stuff. For actors who would have to fall and get hurt in CG that you couldn't do in a way that was safe for a stunt actor they would have an actor sometimes actually kate winslet drop a roll of toilet paper from their mark so that the post production editor could go back and cg in the green screen shot of someone falling and like hitting something or whatever it was and so there were all these

things called toilet paper shots and you could see some of them online of just like famous actors dropping a roll of toilet paper um it's kind of fun that's fun i like it okay so jack is like never let go of that promise and she says says, I'll never let go, Jack. Some time passes. A lifeboat finally shows up with sexy crew member number 12 or whatever. Played by... Eon Griffith as 5th Officer Harold Lowe. Yes.

He's the person I have a story about. So like, Kathy bates in the commentary because he goes on to have a bit of a career which even james cameron says in his commentary he's like this guy's he's he's in fantastic four i mean i think that that's about it but you know he's done a thing or two right and kathy bates said like on in the day like where they're in the fucking tank in Burbank. But that day specifically where it's a bunch of extras literally lying motionless pretending to be dead. And that was like a really emotional day. And that she was so moved by his performance that she was like sobbing on set in a way that was like she wasn't supposed to be

and it isn't in the movie but like she just had a really emotionally difficult time and she said that like she she just she was like i gotta hand it to him i cried myself to sleep that night when he's like doing the is there anyone out there oh it's tough can anybody hear me can anybody hear me and you're just like oh they freaking can't except for rose of course and she's not real and those pomeranians and the two pomeranians fucking dog paddling for their oh my god i feel like if honestly i mean and i say that because he's in my lap right now but like if flea was on the titanic i would die and he would live. You would put him on the door and you would sacrifice yourself? No, I would get on the door and leave him for dead and I would still die and he would still live.

He's just very strong. I would be like, listen. Cats are survivors. Life expectancy wise, you gotta go. And he'd be like, I understand. But then I would just not be strong enough. I would die. And he would be like, all right then i would i would just not be strong enough i would die and he would be like all right let me hop up on this also if it was me and flea on the door

i feel like the buoyancy would you know flea weighs nine pounds he'd be fine that's true that's so true yeah um okay so ewan graffola it's ewan mcgregor all over again. Ewan McGregor? I don't know. I mean, I bullshitted my way through it and you did not call me out, which I thought was really kind of you. I said Ewan Griffith. It might be something kind of close to that. I feel like people have tried to tell us what it is before. Because it's a Welsh name spelled I-O-A-N.

That's his first name. G-R-U-F-F-O-A-N. That's his first name. G-R-U-F-F-U-D-D. I simply don't know how it's pronounced. Anyway. It's just a lot of vowels. It's hard to know. Yeah. But he shows up on a lifeboat and Rose is like, Jack, there's a boat.

There's a boat, Jack. But Jack is dead. Oops. And she calls out. She says that goes oops and then she's like i'll never let go my promise and then she tries to call out and get mr lifeboat's attention then she swims over and blows on a whistle and she is saved cut back to the keldish where old rose and brock love it and all those people are having a feeling for the first time in his life he's having a hard time yeah and rose says

i never spoke about jack before this because a woman's heart is a deep ocean of secrets and brock is like damn i never really appreciated titanic before i never let it in but now I get it then we see Rose on the deck of the Keldysh she has the heart of the ocean in her hand we have talked through previously the alternate ending to this movie which sucks we will not rehash it here yeah there's a long garbagey Susie Amos Bill Paxton like what what, what, what, hey, old Rose, please restate the moral of the movie version that absolutely sucks. But this version, I just feel like

this just happens to be the one movie where every right choice was made because the ending to this movie is perfect. I do hate that she throws the necklace in the water but i mean ideally would she you know like sell it and then redistribute the funds yes symbolically for a person who never existed with a mcguffin it doesn't bother me and it makes me cry yeah because she was like ultimately this because it's like whatever ultimately this was meaningless it was the love that mattered and now having done this i can die or i can fall asleep and have a dream about it okay so yeah rose has the heart of the ocean

boring because of that scene earlier where cal is like i put the diamond in the coat and i put the coat on her put the coat on her so rose and then let's not forget that the depression hit him pretty hard and he put a pistol in his mouth this year or so she read yeah or so she read we don't know we don't know yeah he could be like a pomeranian he could still be around so rose has the heart of the ocean and she's had it this whole time and she throws it in the water and she goes ah and i'm annoyed then no she's iconic then we see rose in bed with all of her pictures of the full life that she lived because she never let go of her promise to jack all of these photos were photoshopped except for kate winslet on the horse because kate and bika which james cameron pointed out because he's like and kate is afraid of horses oh i know my friend um and then what happens okay

so some people will interpret this as rose dying and going to heaven. Other really cool and really smart people will interpret this as Rose falling asleep and having a dream. But what we see people who like haven't really grappled with their mortality. I have something to I have something to share here because James Cameron has a bonanza with this thing. He makes it. He has a little bit of fun. Okay with this.

So he says quote the big ambiguity here is, is she alive and dreaming or is she dead and on her way to Titanic heaven here? And of course, I'll never tell. I mean, I know what was intended at the time, but that doesn't mean I have to go blurting it out. I know you bought this expensive special edition DVD, which I did, and you were hoping for the answer. But the answer is that has to be something that you supply personally and as an individual. Wow. Isn't that awesome and so it says something about people

based on their interpretation of what happens it says that everyone it says that he i think what my in my opinion like genuinely in my opinion it says that whatever creative choice he made didn't read as strongly as he thought it would and then he's like um so that's kind of art right like which is what i would do in the same situation where i'm like oh yeah i made an unclear choice um that was on purpose and i think it's kind of iconic and i hope he never tells us and i hope that we both think that we're right until we either fall asleep or die which means i'm right we will one day. We will not just keep falling asleep. But I liked. I was frantically transcribing that.

Because I was so excited to be like. He said something. And it was nothing. And it was nothing. It was great. I love that he refuses to be clearer. It's great. So the dream or heaven.

Based on your interpretation. yes and james cameron says this scene i cry at my own movie which is so which is so i was like i cry at your own movie so good for you good for you so we see young rose she's like entering the big like grand staircase area of titanic jack is waiting for her at the big like grand staircase area of Titanic. Jack is waiting for her at the top of the staircase. Just like you said. They're surrounded by everyone who was on the ship. Rose walks up the staircase and she and Jack kiss.

The end. Yay. I love it. Caitlin, great job. My last fun fact to share is that James Cameron's. Oh, actually, no, I have two more fun. I'm sorry. I loved it. My last fun fact to share is that James Cameron's... Well, actually, no, I have two more fun... I'm sorry. It's okay.

My last James Cameron fun fact is that they shot that last... First of all, everyone who shot the staircase dream slash death sequence did not think it would be included in the final cut. It was something that Kate Winslet and Leonardo DiCaprio thought was far too corny to make the final cut but then it did but they also shot it with them applauding and without them applauding and we're back and forth pretty close but they chose applauding and I think that was the right choice the final thing is the last the true last sequence in this movie is the Celine Dion my heart will go on sequence I did not know the story attached to this and I love it so tell me I'm gonna share it and then we can explode

we can sink into the depths of the Atlantic Ocean I'm ready um so I guess that there was like a shared opinion of James Cameron andames horner that they did not like when movies ended with a song they both thought it was goofy and corny and they didn't like it but when james horner was thinking about ways to end the movie he started thinking about a song and so he like privately started working on something he privately not telling james cameron hired a lyricist put together this song he went to vegas he saw celine and he was like i'm gonna hit her up i have enough like and they secretly recorded this song unbeknownst to james cameron in new york and james horner was like hey like

it's pretty like unlikely that this will be included in the movie but like here's your money and like thanks for doing this like then after it was recorded james horner who sounded like a very like quiet man who like chose his moments kind of person so once he has the song of the century like v recording he sits on it for six weeks waiting for james cameron to be in the right mood to be receptive to the idea of a song ending the movie yeah and then six weeks later james horner's like so i tried something out and like just let me know what you think and he plays a song and then james cameron's like is this celine dion and james horner's like yeah it's celine dion i just kind of threw it together over the course of several

months and James Cameron to his again I feel like when the idea is really good he will acknowledge it and he was like let me just think about this and then he brought the song to his I guess at that time teenage daughter and was like what do you think and his teenage daughter was like it's the song of the century you fool and that's how the song got it into the movie wow isn't that what like it like there were so many everything perfect happened with titanic it's the best movie ever movie making is magical and horrible and nasty. Yes. Two things can be true. That's our

seventh Titanic episode, everyone. You came to this place. You came to this place for multiple Titanic episodes. Most of them are on the Matreon. So if you want to hear more, scoot on over to the Matreon.

But yeah, that'll do it for this year but you better believe your ass oh my god we really 2024 oh you better believe your ass and and we yeah I mean next year I mean next year at very least we will talk about a movie

we watched a full year ago Titanic 666 yeah and that's a damn promise we love you so much thank you so much for listening um you can find us over on most importantly our patreon aka matreon that's patreon.com slash bechtel cast five dollars a month we'll get you access to all but one of the other titanic episodes we've recorded and if that is a deterrent and not a reason to sign up there's also uh well over 100 episodes on other movies we've covered there

you can check us out on instagram or twitter at bechtelcast or on tpublic.com slash the bechtelcast for all the merch we currently have but also i think there's a chance that you'll see reverse image white star line stuff there love it very soon i hope so brock love it yeah so thanks for listening and i'll never let go will you jamie i will never let go okay Okay. Ever, ever. Bye. Bye. Hey everybody, this is Matt Rogers. And Bowen Yang. We've got some exciting news for you. You know we're always bringing you the best guests, right? Well, this week we're taking it to the next level. The one,

the only, Katherine Hahn is joining us on Lost Culture East. That's right. The queen of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories, and of course, the culture of comedy herself. Get ready for a conversation that's as hilarious as it is insightful. Tune in for all the laughs, the stories, and of course, the culture. Don't miss Katherine Hahn on Las Culturistas. Listen to Las Culturistas on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, I'm Gianna Pradenti. And I'm Jermaine Jackson-Gadsden. We're the hosts of Let's Talk Offline from LinkedIn News and iHeart Podcasts. There's a lot to figure out when you're just starting your career. That's where we come in. Think of us as your work besties you can turn to for advice. And if we don't know the answer, we bring in people who do, like negotiation expert Maury Tahiripour.

If you start thinking about negotiations as just a conversation, then I think it sort of eases us a little bit. Listen to Let's Talk Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th, 2017, was assassinated. Crooks everywhere unearthed the plot to murder a one-woman WikiLeaks. She exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. Listen to Crooks everywhere on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.